Personally I don't like them for the smaller streamers. With few placers you cant go far at all. DOOMS need to be removed for sure. I would remove both. bigger captains arent getting as far and smaller captains arent getting anywhere. While i get trying to slow larger captain(i get you are trying don't like that its happening) its hindering smaller captains.
There also comes a point where not getting far enough is no fun
❤️ appreciate yall.
#Opinions on OMENS and DOOMS
grand marlin
shy tiger
Not entirely true. Some small captains are able to carry the battles with their captain unit if they are high enough level and with not many placers they can control scaling more easily.
upbeat river
🤓 thank you for sharing your feedback! We will look into it!
glossy ibex
There's a large feedback post that Immerbock started. On his stream, he invited me to add some of my feedback around this past dungeons, which personally I am hesitant because I do not appreciate that much of the discussion has gone to tribal "side-picking" and personal attacks, and I do not want to personally get involved there.
I also want to take this time, in an unrelated manner, to congratulate Rose on her success during this dungeons. As of this post, she is 5th place, and I am delighted to see new captains hit heights and see success at least once.
With respect to dooms and omens, I wouldn't mind if a Stream Raiders developer come out and talk more about the design of this dungeons and what they want to achieve. Some of that discussion could have maybe saved some of the headache, even if we don't agree with the outcomes or the design decisions.
I think for this dungeons, I think it's a shake-up, but I think the biggest thing to understand is more of a thing of what works and what doesn't. Dooms are just flat out downsides, but some of them are bigger downsides than others.
In practice, I'm personally fine with them. Some of them may be bad, but if you can make it to hell mode, at least those are boons you can get rid of to start off.
In the Hell Mode era of Dungeons, if we look at what I would call "miracle" dungeon runs (really any run that makes it deep), the only thing that really would have mattered was you basically have a small handful of boons and you picked them. I maintain "tier lists" of dungeons every dungeons event, it's more or less saying you have only 4 or 5 S-tier boons. Not just that, in the last dungeons, Immerbock was able to demonstrate even winning a few levels after having gotten rid of every single boon.
I do agree with Rose that larger captains have been struggling with this dungeons. Maybe moreso larger captains whose playstyle does not involve extreme levels of scale control.
However, I actually don't necessarily agree with the reasoning, and I actually don't necessarily agree that smaller captains are necessarily struggling - I agree with Rafipi here. A smaller captain or even a pure solo captain has the ability to start battles in the lowest scale with low-level captain units (eg. level 1, 5, or 10 units) and then scale up as you go. What has historically killed solo runs were bosses or levels that were extremely difficult in low-scale. Levels such as Shooty McShootface (who's first attack is an AOE attack which also OHKOs) or the Fume Glider boss two dungeons ago, who also has an OHKO effect. This dungeons I don't personally think has that challenge.
I think that the problem that larger-scale captains are facing is the S or A-tier boons are not as good as before. In the "spamazon" meta between Dungeons 17 and 22, all you really needed to make a very good run happen was a boon to give their attacks AOE (eg. Sword of Ruin, Living Bomb, Frostguard because reasons), and then a boon that gave huntresses range (eg. Volley Tactics, Danger Zone because reasons, or historically Pressure Fire or Dark Magic). Get both pieces and you pretty much could go deep in most runs.
Thus I don't necessarily think it is the presence of omens or dooms that is causing larger captains to struggle to have those miracle runs. However, it does make, say, the 20s a bit more difficult. However, should a captain make it to hell mode, at least you can get rid of bad omen and doom boons then.
In the other thread, the person whose feedback I personally thought resonated most with to me was @gusty thicket's. At the end of the day, I think it was a good thing that the Dungeons meta was shaken up. If it means we don't spam Huntresses, I personally think that is a good thing.
When I tried to make tier lists for more recent past dungeons, I had a high confidence that the meta was figured out day 1, because the formula did not change much. This time around, when the meta was completely shaken, it took some time watching my own runs or watching other captains' runs that we could figure out what worked and what didn't.
glossy ibex
Thinking about this a bit more though, I will make one amendment though to everything I said here.
Any boon where any unit type takes increased vulnerability taking a 30 or a 50% vulnerability boon is very harsh. I would not expect, say, rogues to be able to survive very long with a boon like Omen of the Light.
dense saffron
Very well articulated, @glossy ibex.
I agree with all things stated here. I loved the new meta being shaken up with the introduction of Omens and Dooms. I had a lot of fun this Dungeons event.
As far as the boons, I agree that the vulnerability and handicap options given were very harsh, indeed.
I like the idea of the Dooms and Omens and I do not want to see them gone. But rather used in another way. One suggestion that comes to mind is introducing them during Hell Mode, rather than removing boons or maybe having one slate of Doom/Omen boons after every boss fight, to make the Dungeons not feel so skuft the whole time. 😂
But overall I really appreciate what you're doing and I'm here for it.