#vehicles-discussion | WoT Blitz Official | Page 221

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:13 PM

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The scorp and wz have essentially the same mobility

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:13 PM

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If you think that dispersion is broken look at the T-44's

tiny bone Dec 10, 2018, 10:14 PM

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I hate to say it but the wz is just an overall better tank for this game now maybe in future with larger maps will change

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:14 PM

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It's easily the best tier 8 in general

tiny bone Dec 10, 2018, 10:14 PM

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T44 best tier 8 😂

crude zinc Dec 10, 2018, 10:14 PM

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I don’t think any tank that is HE-able can be OP. OP means it can 1 v many and come out on top.

cunning hearth Dec 10, 2018, 10:15 PM

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59 Patton is best MT, shut your mouth

crude zinc Dec 10, 2018, 10:15 PM

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I would rather 1 v many in a lot of tanks before the scorpion.

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:15 PM

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laughs in type 62

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:15 PM

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the difference between the WZ-120-1 FT and the Skorpion is that you need to shoot prammo and do less damage to the WZ while you can shoot HE and get more damage and dpm when brawling a Skorpion

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:16 PM

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But will they?

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:16 PM

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Nah it's pretty well balanced right now

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:16 PM

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Look at the camo of grille vs FV183

crude zinc Dec 10, 2018, 10:17 PM

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I see more unicums spamming the 120-1 FT than the scorpion. That’s all I need to know.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:17 PM

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Have fun if they're not stupid and hide the lower plate or face hug

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Because a WZ can shred any heavy tank in a 1v1, as well as any medium tank, most light tanks, and almost all TDs, while the Skorpion can be wrecked by HE from almost everyone

tiny bone Dec 10, 2018, 10:18 PM

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If only the wz had 7 degrees of depression like obj 268 😭

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True

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:18 PM

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It still has the dpm to completely destroy you

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and if they hide the lower plate on it you should honestly just hide and give up

cunning hearth Dec 10, 2018, 10:18 PM

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WZ-120-1 FT = SU-122-44 HMMMMM

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:20 PM

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I'd rather be in a JPanther II than a Skorpion, better mobility, armor, and gun

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I meant if they face hug or are far away and hide the lower plate, not both at the same time

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Either

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It doesn't matter what tank you're in you're just not winning that unless you're in a tier 9

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If they face hug they'll just dpm you anyways

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Skorpion you can fight back with HE

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Only it's also huge and has terrible camo

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While I'd say the Skorpion is the best tier 8 turreted TD it's in no way overpowered

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"Skorpion is OP buff the armor" Bloody genius.

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:25 PM

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We need a tank. Called the T-50-2, or an april fools event where u get a tog and u turn into submarines/whales

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:26 PM

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I think the Skorpion right now should stay as is

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:26 PM

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Yes yes yes

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 10:26 PM

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Scorpion is op and buff the armor....
https://media.giphy.com/media/kYHi5ST45AzNC/giphy.gif

Giphy

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:26 PM

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😂

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:26 PM

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#PCstatsneedtostay

cunning hearth Dec 10, 2018, 10:26 PM

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Press X to doubt

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 10:26 PM

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Or they could just leave it alone... It's fine as is.

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:26 PM

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yes

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:28 PM

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Or just leave it as is

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:28 PM

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Skorp G is known for its DPM

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u change it u f up the game and make more nabs

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:29 PM

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JPanther II has better dpm mobility and armor at the cost of a turret but apparently that's fine according to you

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:29 PM

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yeah i dont understand that

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nerf Jpan II?

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:29 PM

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😂

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🤦

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:30 PM

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he dont get it IS

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:31 PM

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You described the Obj. 268 v5 from pc but with less armor

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people mount derp on it because the tank is pointless if you use the 90mm

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:31 PM

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its a lethal tank and WHAT ABOUT THE JPAN II

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:32 PM

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Or just leave it as is

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:33 PM

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question have u ever played Pc fridge?

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 10:33 PM

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It only lethal when players use it right. I'm tired of the game being dumbed down to the average nub. The tank is fine as is. There are plenty of counters to it and it is a easy kill once it is spotted. Just stop already.

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:34 PM

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Fake tank?

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:34 PM

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Personally a tank isn't OP if idiots can't do well in it. There's a few tanks that idiots can go well in but the Skorpion isn't one of them

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:34 PM

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agreed

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:35 PM

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Also changing subject after realizing he lost on the Skorpion 😂

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:35 PM

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lmao

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:36 PM

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No, you brought up the same points so many times that we eventually ran out and had to re use them.

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Your points
It's kinda mobile
turret
The DPM is too much
Our points
The DPM is nothing special on tier 8 TDs
the thing has no armor
the thing is massive
the thing has bad camouflage
It's really not that fast

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:39 PM

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Nani!?

The scorp is definitely not as mobile as a leopard, nor does it have a gun equivalent to a 170mm at tier 10

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:39 PM

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Nah the Leopard 1 is too mobile to be like the Skorpion, and a 150mm gun seems closer to that level of performance

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:39 PM

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^

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:39 PM

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It'd be more like a turreted Grille with 300-400 less DPM

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Which sounds good but not completely broken like you claim it would be

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:41 PM

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No, it really isnt

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:41 PM

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Nope, 128mm at tier 8 is about equivalent to 150mm in tier 10

daring relic Dec 10, 2018, 10:41 PM

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Y r u dum@nits still going

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:42 PM

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Leopard is too fast for that, it'd be a Grille with a turret and less dpm which seems a bit strong but not op

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:43 PM

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Not only that, but the huge hull of the scorpion leaves it as a huge he magnet

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:43 PM

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ah yes it's be like a Grille that shoots slower and is the size of the Leopard 1

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but hey turret

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It's not even that fast

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:44 PM

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^

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Its fast enough to get around, but not enough to really COD many tanks (if any tbh) or dodge incoming fire

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:45 PM

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Lets say we compare it to tier 8 mediums. It's more mobile than the Mod 1 and Centurion but slower than literally everything else

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Yes but it's the size of a leopard 1 and has 40mm armor at the most and 20 on the turret

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There we go that sounds vaguely skorpion like

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:47 PM

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what

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:47 PM

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Nah that'd make the tank instantly bad

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Do you have any clue how trash that would be

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:47 PM

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the tank already seems pretty mediocre

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:47 PM

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Go on tank compare right now and compare the Skorpion to the JPanther II

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Because there would be literally no reason to drive the Skorpion if they did that

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It's not that mobile, the gun isn't that good, terrible armor, it would be bad at everything compared to other tier 8 TDs

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 10:49 PM

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This is a great example of why players don't get to balance the game 😂

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 10:49 PM

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^

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:49 PM

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I feel I could actually do a decent job at balance but yeah pretty much 😂

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The Skorpion's mobility is nowhere near any medium, it's actually about on par with the IS-8's mobility if you check the stats on tank compare

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Because with limited turret traverse the main reason to drive the tank would be gone

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Without the turret, It's a bad JPanther II with some gun arc

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Underpowered*

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 10:53 PM

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It's balanced now. And this is coming from a player who despises TD's and what they bring to the game.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:54 PM

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Only the Grille has actual good DPM compared to other tier 10 TDs while the Skorpion's DPM compared to others in tier 8 is quite bad

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and if they buffed the DPM you'd just come back whining about DPM again

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Nope because it'd have bad dpm still

vague sail Dec 10, 2018, 10:55 PM

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Ppl mad at the state of skorpion g
Why?
Cause they don’t have one
👌

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:56 PM

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Honestly when can WG buff the Ferdinand already

vague sail Dec 10, 2018, 10:56 PM

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They buffed it
It was over cooked
Then they nerfed it again

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 10:56 PM

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That thing is actually so absolute trash

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The special thing about it is it trades just bout everything good about the other TDs for that turret

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Compared to the JPanther II it does trade mobility and don't forget the ISU-152 has over 280mm penetration

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Guess what it actually has better dpm than the skorpion fun fact

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The only nerf I'd give to the skorpion is buffing the 128mm on the Borsig, thus power creeping it

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Only if you count the Black Prince and TIger (P) as normal tier 7 heavies

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Anyways the Skorpion is a pretty piece of Origami with IS-8 mobility

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Top speed is 10% higher, the effective power to weight ratios are only about 5% higher

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I'm comparing them because the mobility on them isn't that different and I was shocked to see how similar the mobility on them was

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Well the IS-8 is still slower than almost every tier 8 medium, just like the Skorpion

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the Skorpion's mobility isn't anything like you hype it up as

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:05 PM

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Ugh, comparing a turret TD with a non-turreted one? Compare the Skorpion with the Borsig. The Borsig has better camo, larger gun and is very low to the ground.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:06 PM

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What I said was counting terrain resistance, I check stats on blitzstars where they have the effective amounts

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:06 PM

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Again, Borsig wins in terms of camo.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:06 PM

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Again, the only thing I'd do to bring the Skorpion in check is buff the Borsig 128mm

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:08 PM

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But it’s never meant to run the 12.8cm. Its speciality lies in the 15cm gun.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:09 PM

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I said it before I'll say it again, I'd buff the Borsig 128 to deal with the Skorpion

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Only balance change I'd make

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I'd rather buff the tank the premium tank is competing with to bring the frankly struggling 128mm gun borsig to the level of the Skorpion's gun

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:11 PM

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Just look how tall the Skorp is compared the Borsig. The Borsig has HEAT to deal with superheavies.

📎 image0.png 📎 image1.png

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:12 PM

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the Borsig doesn't get instaspotted the moment it's in view range unlike the Skorpion

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Skorpion is balanced but the Borsig 128mm is underpowered, just make them equally good

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:13 PM

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Effective P/W ratio is higher on Borsig compared to Skorpion. 14 vs 13.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:13 PM

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WG made Skorpion camo terrible on purpose as a balancing factor

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:14 PM

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Despite the hard stats having 11 and 15 respectively.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:14 PM

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👌 GG WG hiding stats from us as always lmao

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:15 PM

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Lol. The soft stats can be found on Armor Inspector or Blitz Stars lol

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:15 PM

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I know that but it's still annoying to not be in game

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150mm is the gun you should be using on the Borsig and is lighter so probably that

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:17 PM

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Borsig has 0.8 on hard
Skorpion has 1.1 on hard.
15.2/1.1=13.8
11.4/0.8=14.25

woeful dagger Dec 10, 2018, 11:18 PM

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Yeah but better damage per shot though

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:18 PM

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The Skorp is just marginally better in medium terrain.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:18 PM

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Skorpion is surprisingly not that fast, it's faster than the russian heavies but slower than tier 8 mediums

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:18 PM

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Of 12.67 vs 11.4 on Borsig.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:19 PM

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The Skorpion is seriously not that fast

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:19 PM

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That’s only useful if you have to relocate.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:20 PM

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it's not even that good when you are relocating

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:21 PM

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I love the connor and I kinda feel bad about this one though. How do you guys think of it

📎 Screenshot_20181210-182048_Gallery.jpg

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:22 PM

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Connor’s a gem. Broken credit coefficient, good DPM, and really good reverse speed to get out of harm’s way.

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:23 PM

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Dont forget great penn for a t5

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:24 PM

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Too bad I don’t have one.
It mounts a very powerful 17pdr on a Valentine. But they installed it incorrectly, so it goes faster backwards than forwards.

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:25 PM

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@regal zealot actually they did that on purpose

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:25 PM

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So they can retreat like the French? How un-British!

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:26 PM

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@worldly crown I was using the restroom

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:26 PM

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As a turtles td had no place in the British doctrine they made it into an ambush td

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:27 PM

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But then, they failed to defend our homeland against the Japanese in WW2

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:27 PM

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The Skorpion G can reach it's top speed... on flat ground in a straight line after about 12 seconds of accelerating

low elk Dec 10, 2018, 11:27 PM

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the skorpion g in the pc wot has great camo but in blitz its horrble

vague sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:28 PM

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Yea
If the angry Conor is there in the blitz fair
I’m picking one up

low elk Dec 10, 2018, 11:28 PM

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connor makes gud creds

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:28 PM

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But it fell out of favor because they were constantly on the attack as well as the heavier British tanks started to be able to be used

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:28 PM

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12 seconds of going in a straight line for just 55 kph is not good lol

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So does the JPanther II only that can actually hull down and bounce some shots

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:30 PM

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Unfortunately for the Brits, The Tortoise came too late in the war.

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But at least the Churchills and Cromwells have a lot of use in other forms, like the Funnies.

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:30 PM

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The tortoise was certainly interesting

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:31 PM

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Compare it to the JPanther II which beats it at literally everything but gun arc

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:31 PM

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Yeah the funnies are always fun to learn about

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:31 PM

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Skorpion trades away a lot for the turret

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Actually the JPanther II is slightly less accurate but you get the point

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:32 PM

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Floating Shermans, bridgelaying Churchills, ramp Churchills and much more.

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 11:32 PM

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Sherman Catylope

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:32 PM

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if you don't know how to avoid being bullied you don't know how to use your surroundings well

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:32 PM

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@solid gate actually that wasnt a funnie but is needed in blitz

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:32 PM

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^^^

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 11:32 PM

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It cant they'll just throw HE at the grub

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@tulip sail tbh i dont know what the hell we're doing

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:33 PM

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Talking about vehicles

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:34 PM

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@solid gate we're listening to fridge whine about the Skorpion G

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 11:34 PM

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SIGHHHH @keen mantle

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:34 PM

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The Jpanther has better mobility than the Skorp too.
16.6 vs 13.8

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:34 PM

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If you think the IS-6 takes no skill then you have never played the IS-6 post +1/-1 lmao

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 11:34 PM

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Does he even know the Skorpion has no armor at all and is extremely HE prone?

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:34 PM

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That’s on Hard

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:35 PM

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medium matters more and the JP still wins

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:35 PM

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True.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:35 PM

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camo and size

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:36 PM

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I actually enjoy fighting the skorp it always feels like a fair fight

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:36 PM

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Again, you forget about camo every single time.

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 11:36 PM

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In my opinion ill taake the Skorpion over it. @worldly crown so what doesnt mean anything

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:36 PM

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Unless I flank em

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:36 PM

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literally everything but accuracy and gun arc

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:36 PM

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Almost impenetrable hulldown

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:37 PM

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^^^ the JPanther II can bounce the BL-10's shells if used correctly

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:37 PM

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Needs 350mm to effectively pen that area

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 11:37 PM

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True. I bounced it from my MBT-70 with HEAT which is retarded

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:37 PM

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Or maybe he thinks it fits his playstyle better

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:37 PM

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But the jpanther ii has nothing on the scorp when name and looks come into play

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 11:37 PM

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Exactly doesn't mean it's overpowered

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:38 PM

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I personally prefer the IS-6 over the IS-5 for example but people constantly talk about how the IS-5 is better

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JPanther II can do it reliably when hull down

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:38 PM

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JPanther II can do that with far greater reliability.

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 11:38 PM

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I like the IS5 trolly armor aand Russian Bias gun i cant tell you how many times ive hit a penetrating shot full bloom from 260m away

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:39 PM

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meh I get better with the IS-6

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 11:39 PM

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Personal preference

tulip sail Dec 10, 2018, 11:39 PM

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I like both and most t8 premis I have

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:39 PM

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nah I'm talking about the glorious snap shots I get in the IS-6

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full bloom 180m into the lower plate of a Tiger (P) lmao

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:40 PM

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📎 image0.png 📎 image1.png

median oak Dec 10, 2018, 11:40 PM

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IS-6 is a significantly better tank than the IS-5 if you play it’s strengths.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:40 PM

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😂

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 11:40 PM

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Im my IS i hit a tiger 1 full bloom from 150m away and ammo racked him im not exaggerating

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:41 PM

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Don’t bother peeking if an ISU is in play in the ltwt.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:41 PM

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Nice typo @median oak quality content

quaint jetty Dec 10, 2018, 11:41 PM

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@keen mantle IS5 is more idiot resistant

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:41 PM

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That's not pathetic, and more alpha makes dpm easier to use

quaint jetty Dec 10, 2018, 11:42 PM

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@median oak IS6 is better than the IS6? Who wins then? IS6?

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:42 PM

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Or we could leave it as is and buff the Borsig 128mm

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That gun could use a buff anyways

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:43 PM

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Meh, 215mm is enough for tier VIII. I’m running the top 100mm of the SU-101 and it can pen reliably without prammo.

quaint jetty Dec 10, 2018, 11:43 PM

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So far the mutz is fun

solid gate Dec 10, 2018, 11:43 PM

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Exactly. The Skorpion doesnt need a nerf at all am i right?

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:43 PM

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Yeet

quaint jetty Dec 10, 2018, 11:43 PM

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Play like a sniper on the flank

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:43 PM

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Skorpion doesn't need a nerf, Borsig 128mm needs a buff though

oblique pollen Dec 10, 2018, 11:45 PM

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I send a message with a picture, but it didn't appear on my screen

median oak Dec 10, 2018, 11:45 PM

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IS-6>IS-5

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:45 PM

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yes

oblique pollen Dec 10, 2018, 11:45 PM

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What's happening?

median oak Dec 10, 2018, 11:45 PM

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Typo as dog was jumping on me

prime vale Dec 10, 2018, 11:45 PM

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Is-7> Is-6&5

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:45 PM

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100%
But IS-3=IS-6

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:45 PM

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lol

oblique pollen Dec 10, 2018, 11:45 PM

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IS-4 > IS-7 > IS-6&5

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:46 PM

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You don't want to argue with facts not the other way around @worldly crown

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the fact is that the Skorpion is balanced and the Borsig's 128mm gun could use a buff

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jk that's an opinion

oblique pollen Dec 10, 2018, 11:46 PM

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Agree. 12s for a TD with as huge as JpII gun just can't be right

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:47 PM

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No, I brought up points that I believed were stronger

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Lets be honest, no one came here ready to accept what the other side was saying

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 11:48 PM

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@worldly crown why’d you delete all your messages?

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:49 PM

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He does that every time he loses an argument and doesn't want to admit it, get used to it

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I've said it before, it's not that the Skorpion needs a nerf, but rather that the Borsig 128mm needs buffs

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Maybe push it to 2950 dpm to put it square between the Skorpion and JPanther II

torpid charm Dec 10, 2018, 11:50 PM

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Alpha dmg, and a much much smaller profile @worldly crown

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:50 PM

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Soft gun stats are exactly the same for Borsig and Skorp.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:51 PM

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I think both guns should be viable like the way it is on PC

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If I want to go for long range sniping then I can use the 128mm, if I want medium range derping grab the 150mm is how I want the borsig, so it caters to two playstyles. If the 128mm is buffed to be between the dpm of the Skorpion and JPanther II (2900-2950 dpm) I think everything's going to be fine.

short flame Dec 10, 2018, 11:53 PM

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and also turret traverse

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:53 PM

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Okay? the Borsig is harder to hit and has way way better camo

short flame Dec 10, 2018, 11:54 PM

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skorpion G has broke camo rate

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:54 PM

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I think WG left that on purpose

short flame Dec 10, 2018, 11:54 PM

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still, that's what i tis

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Skorpion G has a hull that can absorb some He shelle

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:55 PM

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Skorpion doesn't need nerfing, Borsig 128mm needs buffing

short flame Dec 10, 2018, 11:55 PM

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rhm needs better camo rate, fine.

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:55 PM

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Soft stats are dispersion on the move, dispersion while hull traverse and dispersion while turret traverse. They both have 0.18, 0.18 for the first two, but 0.1 for skorp and 0.12 for Borsig. So very negligible @worldly crown

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:56 PM

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The armor on both is equally paper, small caliber HE doesn't pen the hull front but it pens literally everywhere also on the tank

short flame Dec 10, 2018, 11:57 PM

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skorp g is faster

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:57 PM

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Still, only -1° difference. It’s nullified if you consider the height of the two tanks.

short flame Dec 10, 2018, 11:58 PM

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probably skorp g has also better camo rate

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:58 PM

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I think both should have distinct advantages, and that the Borsig should be the sneakier one with slightly more dpm while the Skorpion should be able to relocate

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Skorpion has terrible camo u wat

short flame Dec 10, 2018, 11:58 PM

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still i cant spot it in a fking t44100

regal zealot Dec 10, 2018, 11:59 PM

#

Never found the Skorp powerful actually, when against one. But Borsigs are nightmare fuel for Heavies.

#

Again, consider the height differences between the two.

keen mantle Dec 10, 2018, 11:59 PM

#

I find the Skorpion and Borsig equally scary generally

short flame Dec 10, 2018, 11:59 PM

#

and also skorpion G has a cool name and super cool camo

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 12:00 AM

#

Lets be honest that's not a real reason lol

tulip sail Dec 11, 2018, 12:00 AM

#

@short flame that it does

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 12:01 AM

#

Borsig players aren't stupid generally though, they're generally more experienced with positioning and ammo selection than the Skorpion G drivers I find

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 12:01 AM

#

guys i have that offer for the hell flames camo in t44100... that"s so good...

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 12:01 AM

#

And you can bounce everything, just the other match I had a BL-10 ping off my IS-6

#

I actually had a Skorpion G bounce off the Centurion 1 turret twice one match

hollow relic Dec 11, 2018, 12:02 AM

#

How about we fix the IS 7 damage to 600 per shot 😄

regal zealot Dec 11, 2018, 12:03 AM

#

You still can bounce shots if you don’t aim, but then, that is what would happen if you don’t aim.

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 12:03 AM

#

centurion 1 turret + 10 degrees of depression = unpenetrable

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 12:03 AM

#

Not really massive forehead

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 12:04 AM

#

nah, go check

regal zealot Dec 11, 2018, 12:04 AM

#

Not really, forehead at autobounce angle.

marble hazel Dec 11, 2018, 12:04 AM

#

📎 image0.png

#

1.2k

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 12:04 AM

#

eh idk I hull down a bunch in the Cent and get whacked regardless a lot of times

marble hazel Dec 11, 2018, 12:05 AM

#

📎 image0.png

#

📎 image0.png

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 12:05 AM

#

79° for top of the turret, and saying isnt good? lol

marble hazel Dec 11, 2018, 12:05 AM

#

📎 image0.png

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 12:05 AM

#

Skorpion G is fine but the Borsig's 128mm gun needs a buff. That's what I'm gonna leave this at since no one is going to budge on the Skorpion talk

marble hazel Dec 11, 2018, 12:06 AM

#

Same game

oak lily Dec 11, 2018, 12:06 AM

#

hey im new here and racking kills quick. any tips to get better?

marble hazel Dec 11, 2018, 12:06 AM

#

Im so happy

regal zealot Dec 11, 2018, 12:06 AM

#

Both HE pen? @marble hazel

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 12:06 AM

#

@oak lily expect the game to get about 5x harder after your 5000th game

marble hazel Dec 11, 2018, 12:06 AM

#

Yup, look at is5 hot dough! IKD HOW IT PED

oak lily Dec 11, 2018, 12:07 AM

#

as in 3 dam zeros? holy indian cow

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 12:07 AM

#

wow... and thinkinf that i was so lucky penning Chieftain Mk6's frontal turret witu e100's he from 80 meters

regal zealot Dec 11, 2018, 12:07 AM

#

Must’ve hit the engine deck. Doesn’t have much armor.

marble hazel Dec 11, 2018, 12:07 AM

#

Oh

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 12:08 AM

#

i hitted mk6's frontal cupola and penned with he xd ez 1100 dmg

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:08 AM

#

Actually Rhm' derp is fun to use, despite the awful 15s reload

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 12:08 AM

#

ISU>>> rhm with derp

oak lily Dec 11, 2018, 12:08 AM

#

okay, ill brace and throw the jupes better. kinda helps playen on a omen computer

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:08 AM

#

You can just sit back, if you are not sure to pen, HEAT will do the job

oak lily Dec 11, 2018, 12:09 AM

#

Zero lag, straight kills

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:09 AM

#

Rhm >>>> ISU

📎 20180427083736_1.jpg

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 12:10 AM

#

well, isu can do same

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:10 AM

#

You won't spot stationary Rhm, even within 51m away

#

But you can spot ISU from 200m away xD

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 12:10 AM

#

that isu was sure a bot -_-

marble hazel Dec 11, 2018, 12:12 AM

#

📎 image0.png

regal zealot Dec 11, 2018, 12:12 AM

#

Oof

marble hazel Dec 11, 2018, 12:12 AM

#

📎 image0.png

#

📎 image0.png

#

Thous were all form a week ago!

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:13 AM

#

I am sitting behind that bush. This is from my Friend's POV

📎 received_839039406306526.png

marble hazel Dec 11, 2018, 12:14 AM

#

Lamo, RHM (borsig) has too much camo, but needs a small nerf, bec you dont wanna be spammed while campin

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:14 AM

#

And this is where I am

📎 Screenshot_2018-05-02-02-55-29-682_net.wargaming.wot.blitz.png

#

I told you, you won't see Rhm even from 51m away xD

regal zealot Dec 11, 2018, 12:16 AM

#

Camo net and bushing will make any TD hard to spot.

#

If it fires, instaspot

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:16 AM

#

Not all TD is hard to spot, ISU and Obj 704 is pretty easy to spot

#

Well in terms, heavy TD is easier to spot than Light TD

regal zealot Dec 11, 2018, 12:17 AM

#

If that’s the case, why the Grille is easier to spot than the DT? It’s slightly taller than the DT.

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:18 AM

#

Well in fact, Grille has worse camo than WT IV and Rhm

#

But still good enough for sniping

regal zealot Dec 11, 2018, 12:19 AM

#

That’s true. Usually, camo correlates to height. The taller the tank, the lower the camo value. The shorter the tank, the higher the camo value.

#

UE is good at tier III. Not many tanks can spot you, even while moving, so you can just farm up the dmg.

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:22 AM

#

There are 3 TDs with highest camo rating in this game. First one is Rhm, second is E25, third is UE-57

regal zealot Dec 11, 2018, 12:22 AM

#

Loved it to bits, even now.

#

Wait, thought that the UE has the highest camo in game?

#

It’s the smallest and lowest tank in the game.

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:24 AM

#

Also high camo rate due to low tier has low view range

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 12:25 AM

#

NISHIZYMI how to get this reticle

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:38 AM

#

Idk, I don't use that mod.

rigid flower Dec 11, 2018, 12:58 AM

#

wut do u guys think the next 2018 christmas tencc will be?

lost python Dec 11, 2018, 12:58 AM

#

Best Marks man tank?

rigid flower Dec 11, 2018, 12:58 AM

#

Wut will et bee tho?

#

Tell meh!

lost python Dec 11, 2018, 1:00 AM

#

Snow?

#

Maybe?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 1:15 AM

#

Can't wait for the Pz. IV Schmalturm event though

#

Since that is hinted on the play store

rigid flower Dec 11, 2018, 1:32 AM

#

dang

#

how much will it be?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 1:34 AM

#

Not sure but I think it's gonna be a grind able event

rigid flower Dec 11, 2018, 1:46 AM

#

no M? wth

📎 unknown.png

crisp ember Dec 11, 2018, 1:47 AM

#

yea you didn't win

rigid flower Dec 11, 2018, 1:47 AM

#

true

crisp ember Dec 11, 2018, 1:48 AM

#

jk idk if that even factors in

rigid flower Dec 11, 2018, 1:48 AM

#

it was rlly close to win tho im triggerd

#

barely any exp

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 1:49 AM

#

Draw counts as a defeat

snow onyx Dec 11, 2018, 1:54 AM

#

Hey guys what do you think about wt AUF PZIV?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 1:55 AM

#

It's nice I guess

tulip sail Dec 11, 2018, 1:55 AM

#

its a pain

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 1:55 AM

#

It's like a faster borsig

tulip sail Dec 11, 2018, 1:55 AM

#

to fight

snow onyx Dec 11, 2018, 1:57 AM

#

Really I think it’s a good tank but only if you snipe

torpid charm Dec 11, 2018, 2:03 AM

#

It’s an amazing tank @snow onyx

lost tangle Dec 11, 2018, 2:03 AM

#

Hello

snow onyx Dec 11, 2018, 2:05 AM

#

I know I got 1000 xp average per match and 2200 damage I just don’t understand why people hate it

zinc marlin Dec 11, 2018, 2:07 AM

#

Can this have the Name of "Hellfire T44-100"?

📎 Screenshot_20181210-200518_World_of_Tanks.jpg

tulip sail Dec 11, 2018, 2:07 AM

#

why not just hellfire

zinc marlin Dec 11, 2018, 2:08 AM

#

Both work

tulip sail Dec 11, 2018, 2:09 AM

#

true but hellfire seems to roll off the tongue better

dark socket Dec 11, 2018, 2:10 AM

#

if KV-5 had a legendary camo what would it's name be

zinc marlin Dec 11, 2018, 2:10 AM

#

KV-No

tulip sail Dec 11, 2018, 2:10 AM

#

depends on the camo look

autumn thistle Dec 11, 2018, 2:11 AM

#

The famished Maus

dark socket Dec 11, 2018, 2:11 AM

#

it's quite a juggernaut, so like battle damage or hull dent, because ramming

#

as in what the camo would look like not the name

tulip sail Dec 11, 2018, 2:14 AM

#

oh lol reinforced armour plating

#

kinda like the iorn willl but only at the front

dark socket Dec 11, 2018, 2:17 AM

#

eh

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 2:36 AM

#

How is the playerbase of Wot blitz? Steady, declining or increasing?

tulip sail Dec 11, 2018, 2:36 AM

#

in skill or numarically?

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 2:36 AM

#

Just numbers

tulip sail Dec 11, 2018, 2:37 AM

#

oh i think pretty steady not sure on exacts

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 2:37 AM

#

It's steady mainly

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 3:04 AM

#

yeah always steady but i saw some kind of increasing in last months

#

in the 5.4 patch we had one of the highest peaks in ru server (125k)

valid lodge Dec 11, 2018, 3:06 AM

#

Steady in what way?
The same number of old players leaving as the number of new joining? Or The number of new players joining is roughly the same as the new players who quit?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 3:07 AM

#

yes

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 3:07 AM

#

yeah

#

probably most of 2014 players left the game

#

wrong channel

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 3:18 AM

#

Add IKEA tech tree plz

floral thunder Dec 11, 2018, 3:25 AM

#

Why is grinding tier 4 s a hassle its so dumb I can't do anything

vague berry Dec 11, 2018, 3:26 AM

#

free exp

floral thunder Dec 11, 2018, 3:27 AM

#

From the beginning

vague berry Dec 11, 2018, 3:31 AM

#

free exp

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 3:56 AM

#

Maybe its a new player

#

Also Scavenger is so dumb, I cant even play lower tiers because of these dumb tanks

valid lodge Dec 11, 2018, 4:11 AM

#

Which gun is better on Scavenger?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 4:12 AM

#

second

valid lodge Dec 11, 2018, 4:15 AM

#

Ah thank ya

lusty nacelle Dec 11, 2018, 4:32 AM

#

The VK 100.01 P is OVERPOWERED

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 4:33 AM

#

nah fam

hollow notch Dec 11, 2018, 4:55 AM

#

Kv4>vk100

mighty bone Dec 11, 2018, 4:59 AM

#

Nothing can pen a KV 4 while hes sidescraping right? Cuz he has 150mm armor in sides..

#

Still nothing can pen..

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 5:01 AM

#

um pretty sure the KV-4 has 150mm

mighty bone Dec 11, 2018, 5:01 AM

#

Yeah

#

It have look on stats...

lusty nacelle Dec 11, 2018, 5:06 AM

#

But the VK 100.01 P can sidescrape as well

#

And if the person driving the VK wiggles the tank, it becomes very hard to pen

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 5:09 AM

#

VK is too tall though russian tanks can side hug it

primal thistle Dec 11, 2018, 5:24 AM

#

But then vk can shoot through the roof of the turret easily

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 5:26 AM

#

the VK can barely hit the russian's turret if the russian tank sits still, the VK isn't going to hit a moving one

primal thistle Dec 11, 2018, 5:29 AM

#

I dont have any problem hitting side hugging tanks but thats just me

lost python Dec 11, 2018, 6:11 AM

#

Does the Dracula have Camo?

plucky junco Dec 11, 2018, 6:11 AM

#

I think so

lost python Dec 11, 2018, 6:12 AM

#

I want to see it.

#

I don't have the Drac.

primal thistle Dec 11, 2018, 6:12 AM

#

Its just black camo on the tank

lost python Dec 11, 2018, 6:13 AM

#

Cool.

jaunty nymph Dec 11, 2018, 6:34 AM

#

For the AMX M4 (t7 heavy) should i take 105mm are 90 mm ?

pine mason Dec 11, 2018, 6:59 AM

#

Both are good and can rival even tier 7s

jaunty nymph Dec 11, 2018, 7:33 AM

#

Thx

inland osprey Dec 11, 2018, 9:20 AM

#

I suggest getting the 90mm
Better pen for those IS tanks
And VK100s

hollow moth Dec 11, 2018, 9:54 AM

#

We need more armor in the Tiger's ammo rack

📎 20181211_073656.gif

#

It's the third in last week

inland osprey Dec 11, 2018, 10:02 AM

#

Dem unlucky last week huh

regal charm Dec 11, 2018, 10:14 AM

#

📎 Screenshot_2018-12-10-23-50-55.png 📎 Screenshot_2018-12-10-23-50-52.png

#

Can wot bring out new camo or attatchments for the vindicator UM

regal zealot Dec 11, 2018, 11:06 AM

#

No, probably. They are event tanks and they tend to have a preset camo.

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 11:51 AM

#

Just finished grinding this fat boi. Any thought?

📎 20181211183336_1.jpg

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 11:53 AM

#

The Hellcat... I've been playing around a bit and I'm on the fence about which gun to run. Sure the alpha and pen of the 90mm are nice but I've got to be honest the DPM of the 76mm is nothing to shy away from. I'm not concerned about the armor loss with the tier V turret since I'm not out to bounce shots anyway. What say you?

📎 Screenshot_6.png

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 11:55 AM

#

I prefer Jackson over Hellcat. 90mm and 7s reload is just as fast as T-34/85 or VK 30 P

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 11:58 AM

#

@oblique pollen not the question I asked.

short flame Dec 11, 2018, 11:59 AM

#

E100 is my fav tier X so yeah,z

oblique pollen Dec 11, 2018, 12:06 PM

#

That 76mm can outmatch most tanks on tier 5&6, just hope they don't throw HE at you.

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 12:08 PM

#

True but if I'm getting shot in a hellcat I'm doing it wrong. Not exactly HE friendly even with the top turret.

mystic ether Dec 11, 2018, 1:38 PM

#

WG sell sta Rin camouflage

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 1:39 PM

#

Is that a polish flag i see next to the chinese td names

torpid lagoon Dec 11, 2018, 1:40 PM

#

Chinese TDs coming soon oh boy I hate Low Tier now

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 1:43 PM

#

Hello guys

#

I dont really care for Chinese tanks

zinc condor Dec 11, 2018, 1:45 PM

#

Since they made of plastic?

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 1:53 PM

#

why is the t20 so bad

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 1:55 PM

#

T20 isn't bad

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 1:56 PM

#

why not then

#

no armour bad dpm mediocre speed

#

bad pen

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 1:57 PM

#

Agile tank. Punchy 90mm. Good gun handling. Great gun depression. It's a great tank to teach you how to play the tanks farther up the line.

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 1:57 PM

#

yeah i saw bushkas vid as well but still...

#

the 90mm has bad pen

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 2:00 PM

#

It has the 3rd best pen of all the tier 7 tech tree mediums.

#

Use it as a ridge fighter and don't get shot.

#

You aren't a brawler. Don't try to be one.

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 2:04 PM

#

forget what i just said

📎 unknown.png

#

📎 unknown.png

vague berry Dec 11, 2018, 2:04 PM

#

Meduims arent suppose to have magical pen and with spock stated it has 3rd best pen of t7s,that being said, ur suppose to abuse its key advantages.u have 90mm which is very unique and second highest

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 2:06 PM

#

it feels like my panther defenitively has more pen but it also feels like the t43 has better pen

smoky dune Dec 11, 2018, 2:49 PM

#

@solid gate I can’t even consider giving up the pen and alpha of the 90mm. The Hellcat using the 76mm has to keep popping out to take those weenie little 160 alpha shots giving your enemy more chances to get in that one lucky HE shell. Makes me nervous.

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 2:55 PM

#

@smoky dune. Well I played 8 battles with that setup this morning. I've attached the results.

A couple of points.

A. I enjoyed the slight buff to agility I gained by running the lighter setup of what would be a historical Hellcat.
B. I missed the alpha of the 90mm but really enjoyed hitting for 160 every 5 seconds or something
C. The biggest thing I missed was the increased HP that comes with the top turret.

Summary. It was fun but I'll probably end up going back to the 90mm.

📎 Screenshot_20181211-095144_Chrome.jpg

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 3:24 PM

#

alright you told me about the t20 can you tell me something about the t25/2 or is it actually like super bad

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:27 PM

#

buff t34-3 reload plz

#

13.6 is too long is6 do 10s

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

T25/2 is a seudo med

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

but slower and without armour

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

But good gun

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 3:29 PM

#

yes

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:29 PM

#

Not that slow

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 3:29 PM

#

no but still slower than most meds

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:30 PM

#

30km is meh

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:30 PM

#

is6 : good armmor good gun good penetration good speed, t34-3 slower than other med , armor just on the turret and 14s reload

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 3:30 PM

#

yeah but hat first engine is a nightmare

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:30 PM

#

Stock is always bad most tanks

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 3:30 PM

#

@blissful quarry the t343 is a med with a big gun its one of the only ones

#

it can peekaboom better

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:31 PM

#

You have the 122 or 100?

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:31 PM

#

t34*3 just need a little buff of reload

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 3:31 PM

#

T-34-3 is the prem one

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:32 PM

#

Face palme

#

I thought it was t34 2

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 3:32 PM

#

T-34-2 is tech tree

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 3:32 PM

#

@mint ridge nice profile pic

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:32 PM

#

14s is too long

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:33 PM

#

Ye I know

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 3:33 PM

#

It’s a med and it has an armored turret it can work quite well for a copy ripoff T-54

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:34 PM

#

They always camp for a reason t34 3

compact hemlock Dec 11, 2018, 3:35 PM

#

.

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:35 PM

#

minimum reload is 13.6 s so 13.6 x 4 = 54.4s, 4 shoot for 1 minute 1600 dmg per minute its very low

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:35 PM

#

And miss their shots

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:35 PM

#

for do a good game your allies need to be alive for 3 minute

#

so just buff t34-3

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:36 PM

#

They buf primiames? Sry eng

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:37 PM

#

premiums ?

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:37 PM

#

Y

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:37 PM

#

yes

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:37 PM

#

I know they cant nerf

#

Lowe was a especial case it had a holl in the turret

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:38 PM

#

need to buff reload of the t34-3 : 13.6s to 11s

#

@solid gate

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:40 PM

#

The cheifeten tier 8 needs a buff

#

Or t44

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:40 PM

#

no

#

the su101 too need a reload buff

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:40 PM

#

Lol

#

That ting is good

#

The su 122 54 is a beast now

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:42 PM

#

su 122 44 has 8s reload for 400 dmg and the level8 su101 have 12s --"

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:42 PM

#

Su 122 44 is Stalins hammer

blissful quarry Dec 11, 2018, 3:42 PM

#

is a level 7

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:43 PM

#

Yea

#

I already have the obj263

#

That thing is a beast vs meds

pseudo hamlet Dec 11, 2018, 3:55 PM

#

When are chinese lights coming to the game?

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 3:56 PM

#

is the tiger2 any good?

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:56 PM

#

Meh

#

Too many ISs and the vk the lowe is way better

hollow delta Dec 11, 2018, 3:58 PM

#

Yeah it is. But the IS tanks appeal to new players because they look cool and have a big gun

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 3:58 PM

#

You can pen easily a tiger 2

#

In turret I can pen whit my is5

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 4:00 PM

#

but it is good at sidescraping i think

steel basin Dec 11, 2018, 4:01 PM

#

Tiger II’s armor is actually effective if you use it right judt gotta angle, most idiots just sit straight and expose lower plate

hollow delta Dec 11, 2018, 4:01 PM

#

Not against everything

steel basin Dec 11, 2018, 4:01 PM

#

you dont sidescrape in a Tiger II

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 4:01 PM

#

why not

hollow delta Dec 11, 2018, 4:01 PM

#

You can tho

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 4:02 PM

#

Lowe maby

hollow delta Dec 11, 2018, 4:02 PM

#

Wiggle the turret and you're fine

steel basin Dec 11, 2018, 4:02 PM

#

you gotta use that front plate to angle

hollow delta Dec 11, 2018, 4:02 PM

#

If you come out showing that plate ppl will pen the lower plate

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 4:02 PM

#

is the vk4502a basically the same but weaker armour

hollow delta Dec 11, 2018, 4:03 PM

#

The VK sucks

steel basin Dec 11, 2018, 4:03 PM

#

sorta but not really

hollow delta Dec 11, 2018, 4:03 PM

#

Don't buy it, it's an excuse for a tier 8

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 4:03 PM

#

it might suck but i gotta go through it

hollow delta Dec 11, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

I free XP'd it with those collector tanks

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

for vk4502b

zealous knot Dec 11, 2018, 4:24 PM

#

📎 FB_IMG_1544545144045.jpg

wintry shell Dec 11, 2018, 4:24 PM

#

NO

zealous knot Dec 11, 2018, 4:24 PM

#

Its real ? @keen jay

wintry shell Dec 11, 2018, 4:27 PM

#

NO

#

📎 Screenshot_174.png

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:29 PM

#

@blissful quarry You have to be joking.

#

IS-6? Good armor?

#

Good speed?

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 4:30 PM

#

it bounces the regular IS shell allways

zealous knot Dec 11, 2018, 4:30 PM

#

Thx

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:30 PM

#

Man you are on serious stuff if you think IS-6 has good armor.

honest pivot Dec 11, 2018, 4:31 PM

#

against tier7 its relatively good

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:31 PM

#

T-34-3 isn't a rip off T-54, it's China looking at a picture of the T-54 and designing a tank around it.

#

IS-6 armor pushes good against tier 7 but the Tiger I is the bane of your existence

#

You're using the wrong gun if you choose the penetration cannon

#

That is. If you can play a Tiger I properly, then yes it is tier 8 heavy tank clubber

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:37 PM

#

Almost all Chinese tanks are rip off T-54s, others are rip off IS tanks. I hate that tech tree and hope WG will release some useful tanks like Swedish ones

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:40 PM

#

Actually Chinese tanks are not rip offs

#

What WG did to the Chinese tree was a travesty however

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:40 PM

#

If Chinese tanks are not rip offs, what are they? Oh, yeah, tanks bought to other nations

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:41 PM

#

Type 59 is China's discount T-54, that is a premium

#

T-34-1 is when you rebuild a T-34 76 to house a 100mm gun

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:41 PM

#

Isn’t that basically rip off

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:41 PM

#

T-34-2 is T-34-1 all over again

#

No, it's not. They completely rebuilt the entire hull.

#

If you argue the T-34-1 is a rip off of the T-34 76, then you can argue the T95 medium tank is a rip off of the M48 patton

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:42 PM

#

Ok lemme check the definition of a rip off
PS T-34-1 is a rip off T-54

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:43 PM

#

No, it is not, it has nothing to do with T-54, except for the gun

#

Which I'd like to point out was the medium tank equivalent of the death star for a long time, beating the British 105mm L7 in raw power

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:43 PM

#

cough turret

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:44 PM

#

Just because the turret shape is remotely the same does not mean it is a 'rip off'

#

You aren't even using the word rip off correctly, because the deal is no fraud. You can argue it is a clone tech tree, but it's not that either

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:45 PM

#

My English is not good that’s why
But it’s still garbage

#

A failed copy

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:45 PM

#

The real Chinese tech tree actually got screwed by World of tanks

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:46 PM

#

Actually they were built 20 years later sure they were more powerful in terms of gun

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:46 PM

#

China actually experimented with smoothbore guns on light tanks. Specifically, a version of the Type 62 with a 100mm smoothbore gun. This is well within timeline, but if the 115mm U-5TS is any indication, they are beyond tech level, and for very good reason

#

STB-1 is from the late 1960's, the 100mm armed Type 62 is within timeline.

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:48 PM

#

STB-1 is actually way better
Light armor of M551 Sheridan was its main flaw Type 62 is a T-54 without armor and 10 years later what timeline

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:48 PM

#

Type 62 is a very light light tank

#

It was developed for the purpose of making a light tank that could operate outside of better paved areas in China, and be combat useful. Hence, it's 300mm penetration HEAT shell can kill any NATO tank that could have been fielded at the time, through their best armor

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:50 PM

#

It cannot kill Merkava

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:50 PM

#

STB-1 is not an especially good tank contrary to your imagination

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:50 PM

#

At least it can’t be destroyed by throwing some rock on it

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:50 PM

#

Merkava actually has really shitty hull armor. Even a 1949 T-54 can shoot up the merkava frontally

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:51 PM

#

We’re not talking about the same model I think
Mk2 has spaced armor

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:51 PM

#

Only the Mk 4 has the physical possibility of having some mediocre armor, but it'll get buttered

#

Spaced armor is actually not a good option against HEAT shells. It requires incredible size to be effective, and can result in optimum stand off, improving the performance of the shaped charge

#

Fuel tanks however, are very mass effective* protection against HEAT shells. But ERA is just amazing

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:53 PM

#

Ok but I don’t understand nothing now my English is too low

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:54 PM

#

You can destroy any tank by throwing a big rock at it.

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:54 PM

#

No I’m talking about some small rock

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:54 PM

#

Main flaw of the Sheridan was that it pushed a prototype gun system into service and said gun system was very questionable.

#

Type 62 actually has very good armor for a light tank

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:55 PM

#

It worked anyways
USA lost against Vietnam but not cause of the tank

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:56 PM

#

It's resilient to 40mm APDS shot I think

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:56 PM

#

Simpler plz I don’t understand

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:56 PM

#

It's front armor can stop 40mm Armor Piercing Discarding Sabot

#

57mm shot is too much, but I think 40mm shot can be resisted

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:57 PM

#

Who builds 40mm shells in 60´s?

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:57 PM

#

I do not believe any.

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 4:58 PM

#

._.

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 4:58 PM

#

Sheridan on the other hand can't even stop a certain Soviet machine gun

#

14.5mm KPVT

#

Type 62 frontal armor is capable of messing up the fusing action of all NATO HEAT shot of 1950's-mid 1960?

#

the entire UFP can induce the critical angle required to cause them to fail to fuse. It is merely a matter of slightly angling the tank a few degrees to either side

#

Thus in a way it is completely immune to HEAT shot for a very brief interval of time

#

This issue showed up in the Yugoslav tests

#

Soviet HEAT shells because of a different fuse design, did not suffer from this flaw, and accordingly, could easily defeat tanks like the Chieftain

#

enabling a 'lowly' T-54 to kill a chieftain from over 1.5 kilometers through it's precious turret with 3BM8, and all feasible combat ranges with 3BK-5 and 3BK-5M

#

Even a 'lowly' T-34 85 could kill a Chieftain with it's own HEAT shells, through the turret

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 5:07 PM

#

Yes because the Russian tanks have done so well in armored combat since WWII

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 5:13 PM

#

😂

#

I mean to be fair they're not bad per say, but they aren't the greatest tanks. Maybe the T-14 Armata is going to get up there with the best tanks the NATO nations have

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 5:28 PM

#

I don’t think HEAT existed yet during WW2

tawdry sphinx Dec 11, 2018, 5:42 PM

#

It did

#

Finland used HEAT on BT42s Howitzer but the fuses broke during transport

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 5:43 PM

#

not to say it worked well though

tawdry sphinx Dec 11, 2018, 5:44 PM

#

Swedish HEAT shells made the BT42 ineffective against tanks but it worked against bunkers and Howitzers

#

So Finland kinda left only one BT42 survive

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 5:54 PM

#

We already have bt7 art we don't need a other one whit a 105 mm

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 6:01 PM

#

Bello

#

Fv183 deathstar worth it

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 6:02 PM

#

If you don't get spoted

dark grotto Dec 11, 2018, 6:03 PM

#

No.

mint ridge Dec 11, 2018, 6:03 PM

#

O-O

#

One shot 1000 dmg

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 6:07 PM

#

I can free xp up till the tortoise

#

Im just gonna do it

#

Bye 300k exp

jolly olive Dec 11, 2018, 6:12 PM

#

Is-3 or Lowe?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 6:12 PM

#

yes

south estuary Dec 11, 2018, 6:12 PM

#

Yes

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 6:12 PM

#

IS-3 is a great heavium Lowe currently takes no skill to drive

jolly olive Dec 11, 2018, 6:14 PM

#

Every time I’ve tried to 1v1 him the lowe pens everywhere, and my dpm can’t match it

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 6:15 PM

#

don't try to use dpm against a Lowe

jolly olive Dec 11, 2018, 6:16 PM

#

What’s the best strat against it?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 6:18 PM

#

I found side hugging to work somewhat well, and you can shot trade with them

#

you can't sit still when side hugging though It's not as tall as the VK 100

jolly olive Dec 11, 2018, 6:19 PM

#

And it’s much faster

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 6:43 PM

#

@median oak What you are saying is a logical fallacy and you know it

#

When equally incompetent forces clashed (Iraq vs Iran) the results were approximately equal. It also showed precious Chieftain tanks couldn't stop a T-62's steel 'training' shot, with even their precious turret armor. It also showed Chieftain tanks are very much capable of being butchered. And M60A1's burn like a boss

#

Middle East couldn't beat farmers with a modern army, much less Israel. Their terrorist organizations are better at fighting wars than they are.

#

And no, they aren't Russian, they are Soviet, and very specifically, Polish/Czechslovakian/still not Russia

#

@keen mantle They are some of the greatest tanks ever made. T-54 is way up there for example. T-14 Armata is likely better than the M1 Abrams, based on what we know about Soviet 1970's-end tank projects

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:04 PM

#

The problem is that with the state of the Russian economy, almost all of their tank designs either get canceled or end up being about 80% as good at half the cost. Russia's military generally goes for cost effectiveness rather than being overall best.

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:08 PM

#

The reason most of the Soviet 1970's projects were cancelled, was because A Kremlin isn't as stupid as Pentagon for experimental tech

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:11 PM

#

Also because they have money issues and are forced to maximize cost effectiveness rather than make the best possible tank

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:11 PM

#

T-90 is a very good tank and can still kill every NATO MBT frontally

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:12 PM

#

T-90 is actually just a T-72 with a T-80 turret

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:12 PM

#

And a T-72 could already kill every NATO MBT

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:12 PM

#

Doubt

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:13 PM

#

You realize the T-72M's in Iraq are just downgraded T-72A's with training shot for it's best AP ammo selection, right?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:13 PM

#

The T-72 is very common in the middle east and it's performance suffers against the much more expensive and technologically advanced NATO tanks

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:13 PM

#

training shot that can kill a Chieftain but not an M1 Abrams

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:14 PM

#

And while export T-72s are worse, the difference is in the armor package

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:14 PM

#

the difference is actually quite huge in ammunition selection

#

the best the middle east can hope to buy for a 125mm is really bad ammo. Or steel training shot. That is, if they actually buy a T-72 in the first place. One of the most common Iraqi tanks was a Type 69, and just like Soviet Union, China was not selling good shot

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:15 PM

#

Almost every tank can kill another tank, the problem is mobility, accuracy, and visibility

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:15 PM

#

T-72 has the accuracy and targeting abilities...

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:15 PM

#

And yet has far worse range than NATO tanks and worse ability for firing on the move

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:17 PM

#

I don't think you realize: NATO tanks can't actually kill a T-72 past around 2 km

#

T-72B I think

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:18 PM

#

And a T-72 definitely can't kill past that either. The T-72 is an outdated tank that Russia just sells because they can make money

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:18 PM

#

T-72B has much stronger armor than T-72A

#

T-72B can resist 120mm shot at the end of cold war era

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:19 PM

#

For the T-90 they just upgraded the armor packages on a T-72 hull and slammed a T-80 turret on it

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:19 PM

#

T-72 weighs in at ~40 tons, and it's enemies weigh around 60 tons+

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:19 PM

#

Yes, that's Russia, they make small tanks to save money by making a tank that's 80% as good for half the price

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:19 PM

#

T-72 has, frontally similar LOS values as it's NATO couterparts

#

Not 80%. Almost the exact same.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:20 PM

#

Russia's first real shift away from that concept is the T-14

#

you know america experimented with something like the T-14 once?

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:21 PM

#

and the T-14 Armata is inferior to the prototype MBT concepts of the 1980's.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:22 PM

#

The T-14 only exists because Russia wants to move away from having a conscript army so they need a tank that doesn't blow up the moment someone gets a good turret hit

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:22 PM

#

Actually, turret hits are difficult to get an ammo detonation on a Soviet tank

#

a major fragment would have to do a near 60* turn and pierce a shell casing

#

As it turns out that almost never happens.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:23 PM

#

The thing is that's a possibility

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:23 PM

#

It's more like a possibility so unlikely that it will never happen

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:23 PM

#

NATO tanks generally use human loaders so they can retain the ability to use blowout panels

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:24 PM

#

That makes absolutely no sense at all.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:25 PM

#

You're saying this like the autoloader magazine isn't huge and can be hit from a lucky turret shot or a center of mass shot

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:25 PM

#

Do you even know where the autoloader is situated?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:26 PM

#

You'd have to be extremely lucky to get it through the turret
The autoloader is in the lower center of the hull

#

The T-72 is an outdated machine that only serves to be sold in large numbers to poor nations

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:26 PM

#

In red.

📎 tUskBcm.png

#

T-72 is outdated but it's much better than you give it credit for.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:28 PM

#

Well I'm not denying that it can kill an NATO tank, just that it'd struggle against most of them frontally and gets out ranged by almost all of them

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:28 PM

#

Struggle? Lol

#

Do you even know what level of armor NATO MBT's even have?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:28 PM

#

It varies a lot

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:29 PM

#

Their LOS is barely higher than T-72. In places, it is lower.

#

T-72 varies from ~580 to ~800 LOS main frontal

#

NATO is ~600 typically.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:29 PM

#

We got the heavily armored stuff like the Abrams and Challenger and we have some more nimble stuff like the Leopards

#

it's not really the same across all of them as lots of nations have opted to go for their own home made armor packages

quaint jetty Dec 11, 2018, 7:30 PM

#

Guys, you do realize that in the end NATO wins right?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:30 PM

#

yeah pretty much

quaint jetty Dec 11, 2018, 7:30 PM

#

Air support wins most battles

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:31 PM

#

Challenger has good armor?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:31 PM

#

Do you need to see the operational records of the Challenger 2?

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:31 PM

#

Some people can really dream. But in truth it's armor is not very strong. It is actually very sketchy.

quaint jetty Dec 11, 2018, 7:31 PM

#

And NATO has better long range strike capabilities

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:31 PM

#

Leopard 2 likely has highest kinetic protection of all NATO MBT's

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:32 PM

#

press x to doubt

#

If anything, of the countries with current generation MBTs the Leopard 2 is closer to the bottom end

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:32 PM

#

Challenger and Abrams were designed to be better against HEAT munitions, Leopard made use of possibly inferior armor efficiency but it was still better protection versus kinetic, simply about mass investment

#

Leclerc has dubious armor protection, Challenger is still mediocre and is by far the slowest NATO MBT

#

Oh right there is the Type 90 with it's unbelievably sketchy armor mass

quaint jetty Dec 11, 2018, 7:33 PM

#

So, what tank will you guys shoot for in the event? I'm thinking the new American for me

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:34 PM

#

Well the Challenger 2 is falling behind in terms of weaponry and engine power but the armor is still rather nice

quaint jetty Dec 11, 2018, 7:34 PM

#

Unless it's in crates, then I might wait

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:34 PM

#

Do you even know what the Challenger 2's armor is like?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:34 PM

#

@quaint jetty dude the turret can literally be penned by 75mm HE on that thing

quaint jetty Dec 11, 2018, 7:34 PM

#

@keen mantle I'm a sucker for Americans

#

Literally all my tier X is US

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:35 PM

#

There's a huge 25mm tumor on the side of that turret

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:35 PM

#

T110E5 has an ahistorical tumor and hull

#

WG checked the T110E5's real hull and decided the armor would be too weak, so they just gave it a better one out of pity.

quaint jetty Dec 11, 2018, 7:36 PM

#

Still, if I can get the tank without spending a dime, I'll try, but won't pay for crates

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:36 PM

#

IIRC it's actually 110mm @30*

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:36 PM

#

Same with the M48 and T110E5 cupola where they chopped the top in half

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:37 PM

#

M48 turret is fake armor. Real life armor is 178 LOS from 0*

#

This means the entire turret front except for auto bounce would almost be pierced by the current interpretation of 100mm D-10T

#

100mm D-10T2C with it's ingame performance would murder that turret

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:37 PM

#

the thing with it is that the flat part is rather small

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:38 PM

#

Well the problem is that the entire turrets thickness is based on 178mm LOS from zero

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:39 PM

#

If it moves around it's hard to hit the flat part and you often hit the gun mantlet or very angled parts

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:39 PM

#

So it's not actually keeping 178mm thickness across the entire turret. It's thinning.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:40 PM

#

M60A3 did fix the stupid turret shape though

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:42 PM

#

M60A1*

#

And it's armor is still not very strong as M60A1.

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 7:46 PM

#

None of the M60 turrets has much armor - 25mm TP-T goes thru it same with Leo I.

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:47 PM

#

25mm? Lol. through 254mm LOS? 178mm LOS?

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 7:47 PM

#

Yeah

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:48 PM

#

Are you high?

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 7:50 PM

#

I’ve seen it. Lots of tank hulls sitting for targets.

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:50 PM

#

Facts and fiction are two different things.

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 7:51 PM

#

Yes you live in a fictional world

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:51 PM

#

Can you show me any evidence?

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 7:53 PM

#

Do you live in Northern Virginia?

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:53 PM

#

Do you have any evidence that is physically possible?

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 7:54 PM

#

Hands on life experience

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 7:54 PM

#

👌

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 7:55 PM

#

So no evidence, alright then

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 7:56 PM

#

Is it worth getting the full length 152mm gun on the isu152, or to wait until the object 704 and grind free xp for it?

#

And is it worth getting the 44k xp 122mm on the isu152 or go straight to the 152mm?

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:02 PM

#

@leaden cedar I really don’t care what you think. I’m simply relating factual information based on my career. I wasn’t a tanker but I’ve seen a number of different systems tested and fired a lot of stuff including anti armor systems. I’ve also crawled around in a number of former Warsaw Pact captured vehicles. I don’t sit in front of Janes Defense and regurgitate stats

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:02 PM

#

@fallow shoal get it on the ISU

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:02 PM

#

Never start a nine grind with out as much you can have it on already

#

It would be really painful with the shorter done running into tier 10 tanks

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:03 PM

#

factual information? I suppose physically possible isn't necessary then?

lilac mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:03 PM

#

I wouldn't get into a reality argument with Crusader, lads

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:03 PM

#

Is the 122mm gun for 44k xp be worth getting or skip it?

lilac mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:03 PM

#

He's a veteran. So, real life experience. The rest of us are mere civvies

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:04 PM

#

@median oak would the 44k xp 122mm gun be worth getting or skip it?

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:05 PM

#

The BL-9S is in no way worth it

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:05 PM

#

K thanks

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:05 PM

#

@lilac mantle No evidence. His claim. He says 25mm shot can pierce 254mm LOS. I think he is lying. His only evidence is his claim.

lilac mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:06 PM

#

We know he's legit, Temp.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:06 PM

#

😂

lilac mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:06 PM

#

Depleted uranium? High-velocity round? Who knows? There's obviously stuff out there that can do such things.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:07 PM

#

Well he never said how much power was behind it to be fair

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:07 PM

#

That's just not how physics works.

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:07 PM

#

M910 TPDS-T will sail thru both sides of M60 turrets.

#

Let alone warshot

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:07 PM

#

Maybe he means 120mm gun 🤣

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:07 PM

#

If someone wanted to make a 25mm cannon that penetrated everything it they could if they had the money and tried hard enough

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:07 PM

#

That would be one very long tungsten rod.

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:08 PM

#

The M60 tanks armor wasn’t a great feature.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:08 PM

#

@leaden cedar Tungsten? go for DU lmao

lilac mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:10 PM

#

@median oak 25mm through the front and out the back?? 😳

#

Or through the sides?

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:11 PM

#

Penetrator length prohibits penetrating the turret frontally.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:11 PM

#

inb4 just impale the tank

lilac mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:11 PM

#

Pure steel protection obviously was never great protection for a tank.

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:13 PM

#

Steel armor is actually more volume effective than composite.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:13 PM

#

the problem with steel is that is suffers against HEAT ammo which everyone uses

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:15 PM

#

To the exception if chemical round countermeasures are involved ( know its called something but forget what )

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:15 PM

#

ERA

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:15 PM

#

It is not mass effective. Composite has slightly better performance than steel, but if same LOS steel can be defeated, generally composite will too.

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:16 PM

#

Btw @median oak what does that stand for?

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:17 PM

#

Explosive Reactive Armor

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:17 PM

#

Isnt it like 1 time use?

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:17 PM

#

ERA is a secretly a cheatcode.

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:17 PM

#

Basically small panels of attached explosive compound designed to detonate and disrupt a HEAT warhead’s charge

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:18 PM

#

Take that as a yes then lol

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:18 PM

#

One time use for that location -

#

Other issue is it causes issues on the vehicle. Dislodges other panels and generally annoys dismounted support...

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:19 PM

#

OP as sin ERA is.

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:19 PM

#

For the most part Armies have transitioned from it.

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:19 PM

#

lol wut? Are you serious?

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:19 PM

#

True i would assume the fact that people would climb over possible bombs would be a detrament.

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:19 PM

#

Preferring add on modules of composites

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:19 PM

#

Almost everyone uses a combo of ERA over composite

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:20 PM

#

ERA will wreck visions ports, thermal sights and comms gear

#

It’s really not practical in practice

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:21 PM

#

That's the main disadvantage

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:21 PM

#

But the cost of replacing the plates after combat could be another negative, as opposed to just having overall thicker armor.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:21 PM

#

it's kind of um
explosive

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:21 PM

#

BRB

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:22 PM

#

You don't want to be standing next to a tank as the tank gets shot

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:22 PM

#

Or be the external gunner if it applies.

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:24 PM

#

ERA is actually amazing. Many tanks use it nowadays. Abrams with ERA for example exists. "Tusk"

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:25 PM

#

But its integrated within the armor not just plates slapped onto the outside of the tank

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:25 PM

#

It's pretty much just bricks of ERA strapped to a tank

fallow shoal Dec 11, 2018, 8:26 PM

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Fair enough

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:32 PM

#

TUSK actually is modular. ERA can be added as part of a Theater Protection Package. - but generally ERA causes more issues than it solves. For the most part most new / LEP’s use a modular armor add on - so you can add what is relevant and it keeps the weight down on the original vehicles.

inland osprey Dec 11, 2018, 8:32 PM

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Better than having a projectile punch through the tank because you don't like ERA

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 8:33 PM

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At7 is great just got it

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:33 PM

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Concerns about enemy ERA drove dual and triple war heads - to defeat add on. As well Top Attack warheads now...

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 8:33 PM

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OFFTOPIC

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:35 PM

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Plus ERA generally can be defeated by kinetic penetration sabots - as the hypersonic signature can pre detonate and it’s generally not deflected significantly off the AOA anyway

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:35 PM

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ERA can handle dual warheads

#

ERA can also defeat kinetic sabots unless you specifically design to protect against them

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:35 PM

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struggles with APFSDS tho

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:36 PM

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Late 80’s era TowII could defeat most current ERA packages

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:36 PM

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lol struggles with APFSDS

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:36 PM

#

Stick to Janes @leaden cedar

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When I was 11 I thought I knew stuff too

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:37 PM

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Kontakt can rekt HEAT missiles and shot

inland osprey Dec 11, 2018, 8:37 PM

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Dem competition between armor and ammo

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:37 PM

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Kontakt-5 is nice but it's nothing invincible

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:37 PM

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Took you how long and you think 25mm sabot shoots holes through 254mm RHA?

#

Kontakt 5 is a heavy ERA. It's on the high end of the spectrum

#

You can shoot it with an auto cannon and it won't go off

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:38 PM

#

how big of an autocannon

inland osprey Dec 11, 2018, 8:39 PM

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What about 30mm auto

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:40 PM

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Not sure about 30mm, but I do know 20mm

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:40 PM

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@leaden cedar you remind me of folks in project offices that make great claims and base stuff off computer modeling that doesn’t pan out in the real world and refuse to admit garbage in garbage out.

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:41 PM

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who needs evidence I just need to make a claim on the internet and people will believe me

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:41 PM

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to be fair that's everyone here lol

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:41 PM

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except he refuses a source. I actually have sources

inland osprey Dec 11, 2018, 8:42 PM

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Idk about armor but modern warfare is quite one-sided, as far as modern warfare goes

#

Just pop a couple of missiles and all is well

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:42 PM

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If someone made a cannon that shot a 25mm DU dart at hypersonic speeds it would penetrate just about anything to be fair, it just wouldn't be doing a whole lot of damage

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 8:42 PM

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@inland osprey clearly you haven’t been to war

inland osprey Dec 11, 2018, 8:43 PM

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Well, yeah

lilac mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:50 PM

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Lol @leaden cedar ... you doubt a veteran seeing those rounds penetrate? Cru has years of NATO theatre experience.

leaden cedar Dec 11, 2018, 8:51 PM

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Yup

lilac mantle Dec 11, 2018, 8:51 PM

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😏

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Indoor boys lol

inland osprey Dec 11, 2018, 8:53 PM

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Lots of em'
This is a game discord server after all

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 9:04 PM

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E50 grind: first engine or turret?

#

Engine

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 9:05 PM

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mosquito gun then engine then turret then 105mm

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 9:07 PM

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I was inclined to go Egine - turret - 105 and skip the 8,8L100 alltogether

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 9:07 PM

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the thing is it's not fun to play with 200mm pen in tier 9

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 9:08 PM

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Yah, I'm suffering it like right now 😃

#

Grinding this and the wz-111 1-4 at the same time and both suffer from the same lack of pen with stock guns. But at least the WZ has great DPM

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 9:26 PM

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Tier 9’s are not for stock grinds -

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 9:26 PM

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Tier 9 stock grinds are actually hell

viscid dragon Dec 11, 2018, 9:27 PM

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Agreed

quaint jetty Dec 11, 2018, 9:45 PM

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Yeah, hurts the soul

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 10:03 PM

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well you can legit get everything on the 704 but the tracks without even playing the 704

stable parcel Dec 11, 2018, 10:10 PM

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That because Mother Russia reign supreme, comrade. We will destroy those capitalist pigs!

autumn thistle Dec 11, 2018, 10:15 PM

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Churchill GC, yum

#

@west stag hmm more gun depression on the second gun... I never knew, I guess I'll stick with the second gun if I purchase the LTTB again...

#

Less pen and dpm for gun depression, good enough

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 10:22 PM

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it's only 6mm less pen and a little less dpm but you get 10 more alpha on prammo, and 8 degrees of gun depression rather than 5

autumn thistle Dec 11, 2018, 10:24 PM

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I guess I'm stupid to overlook this info for the LTTB, poor me

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 10:25 PM

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we all know this

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 10:44 PM

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only things it lacks are dpm and pen

#

Chinese TD line looks garbage tbh

tall fox Dec 11, 2018, 10:54 PM

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I’m trying to grind the lttb now and I’m hating it. Don’t want to even drive the thing.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 10:55 PM

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It's the poor man's Dracula

tall fox Dec 11, 2018, 10:55 PM

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It’s worse as it can’t specialize in anything good. At least the drac has a decent gun.

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 11:00 PM

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The guns are actually rather comparable

#

jk I lied

#

but the LTTB has actual armor and better mobility

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 11:03 PM

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Ikr lttb was impossible to pen literally

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 11:04 PM

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you can't frontally HE the LTTB and the LTTB is a far narrower tank

tall fox Dec 11, 2018, 11:07 PM

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I thought some of the armor was nerfed frontally? Idk

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 11:08 PM

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Yeah but it's still sloped 75mm

tall fox Dec 11, 2018, 11:10 PM

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Just know any time I being grinding any tank, there’s a good chance it will get nerfed. Lol.

median oak Dec 11, 2018, 11:26 PM

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Pre nerf the LTTB could angle and autobounce a T34...

#

Granted it had to be a prefect angle while pitched up slightly - but

keen mantle Dec 11, 2018, 11:27 PM

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the armor on it is about on par with the Rudy currently

wintry patrol Dec 11, 2018, 11:29 PM

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@keen jay can you put yellow vest camo for the french tank in the game ?

solid gate Dec 11, 2018, 11:54 PM

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The LTTB was a nightmare for the T71 pre LTTB nerf and T71 buff I heard lol

#

But now I heard LTTB is no match for a T71

regal zealot Dec 12, 2018, 12:02 AM

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LTTB hasn’t got the DPM to deal with the T71, but the frontal hull armor is as trollish as a Rudy.

#

It’s the lowest DPM LT of tier VII, but it has armor as compensation.

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 12:17 AM

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I wish I had t6 drac

rotund seal Dec 12, 2018, 12:20 AM

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They’ll probably offer it again

violet geode Dec 12, 2018, 1:07 AM

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How good is the T29

quartz shadow Dec 12, 2018, 4:25 AM

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Turret is very well armored, plus gun depression is good. Play your turret and you'll be fine. I recommend the 105mm gun.

#

@violet geode

dim sail Dec 12, 2018, 7:38 AM

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@tall fox after playing it since the day's of being a noob I've got a 62% wr in it ove a month

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It's low-key OP

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Didn't get to play it when it had 90 frontal armour but it was ridiculous then

#

Lacks dpm can pen most things it's tier with ap

pine mason Dec 12, 2018, 7:39 AM

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@dim sail If i go against the t29 with M6A2E1 i will wreck it

dim sail Dec 12, 2018, 7:40 AM

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But that mobility with view range is basically giving you free shots on heavys who wonder where tf is that shot coming from

#

I'm talking about the lttb

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 8:48 AM

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Are Chinese heavy tanks any good? Anyone has experience with it?

keen mantle Dec 12, 2018, 9:46 AM

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tier 7 and 9 are bad or okay depending on who you ask, tier 8 and 10 are good

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 9:46 AM

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Ok thank you

umbral marten Dec 12, 2018, 10:43 AM

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Which is betterfor t6 on Britain med the firefly or the Cromwell

autumn thistle Dec 12, 2018, 10:49 AM

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Cromwell's better, but if you want the QQF 17-pdr Gun Mk. VII early/ likes the shermans then the firefly...

umbral marten Dec 12, 2018, 10:59 AM

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Uh?

#

Which one gives me a better chance at dodging and has a better fire rate/weapon

autumn thistle Dec 12, 2018, 11:04 AM

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Cromwell

uncut trench Dec 12, 2018, 12:03 PM

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Cromwell 🅱 🅱

umbral marten Dec 12, 2018, 12:17 PM

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Ok thanks guys

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 12:32 PM

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Hey guys I just have a question

#

It’s me or only one tank can pen the E 50 M frontal armour ??

mint ridge Dec 12, 2018, 12:35 PM

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Tds

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Lower plat meds can pen

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 12:36 PM

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I don’t think so

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If the armour is in a special angle, nothing can pen

mint ridge Dec 12, 2018, 12:38 PM

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If its jge100 firing premo ?

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The best pen in game

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 12:39 PM

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Nop it’s FV215b (183)

mint ridge Dec 12, 2018, 12:39 PM

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No fv183 premo is HE

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 12:40 PM

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No AP with 310 pen

primal thistle Dec 12, 2018, 12:41 PM

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@solid gate jg has if i remember right 420 heat pen

mint ridge Dec 12, 2018, 12:41 PM

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Jge100 is 380

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 12:41 PM

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Mmh it’s possible

#

Ok thx for the help :3

mint ridge Dec 12, 2018, 12:42 PM

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Whit clibred shot is around 420

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 12:42 PM

#

Ok

tall fox Dec 12, 2018, 12:59 PM

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I guess I have to be that much less agressive in lttb and rely on the view range more. I think my issue is that I wish it was still op and playing it too loose. Lol.

kindred osprey Dec 12, 2018, 1:40 PM

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What about is7?

tulip edge Dec 12, 2018, 2:21 PM

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What about it?

#

Oh nvm

smoky dune Dec 12, 2018, 2:40 PM

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The Foch 155 Tier X TD with Calibrated Shells can put its HEAT round (407 pen) through almost any tank at almost any angle. I can’t think of anything with higher penetration than that. 🤔

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 2:52 PM

#

Hello lovely people

#

Obj268 and JagdPanzer E100 have 380mm pen without CS on HEAT, with CS it is 408

#

But I think that using HEAT and prammo on such high pen tanks is a nonsense

ebon merlin Dec 12, 2018, 3:05 PM

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JgPz E100 have 420

mint ridge Dec 12, 2018, 3:30 PM

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Babushka is that you? Way are you not in house making potato soup

ebon merlin Dec 12, 2018, 3:58 PM

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I'm rekting some cykas

verbal cloak Dec 12, 2018, 4:43 PM

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Just got a few App Store Gift cards from customers and I have enough to buy the Mutz or the K-91, I know a few contributors post on here so which is the best value for money, I have heard the Pz.Mutz is just an Indien in a different skin.

brisk orbit Dec 12, 2018, 4:54 PM

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K-91 looks nice

dark grotto Dec 12, 2018, 4:54 PM

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—— the 183 pos. 2 of them in a game, 1 per team. I’ll give you 2 guesses how many shots they took, and how much they contributed to their team.

If it’s not broken, let me know when you see a Foch 2 games in a row, let alone 2 in a game.

pine mason Dec 12, 2018, 4:55 PM

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@dark grotto I agree because fV is easily flankable and during the reload is helpless

dark grotto Dec 12, 2018, 4:56 PM

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Who cares? It can shove 60%+ of a tanks HP through the front of nearly every tank.

pine mason Dec 12, 2018, 4:57 PM

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And then you can absolutely aniolate it

dark grotto Dec 12, 2018, 4:57 PM

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Great! I still instantly lose credits that match, and have a much lower chance of winning. Instantly.

tulip edge Dec 12, 2018, 5:00 PM

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The fv is not easily flankable lmao

dark grotto Dec 12, 2018, 5:02 PM

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In fact. Since it has a low avg win rate, and a high avg damage, looks like a great candidate for a swap, maybe to an actual skill based tank, rather than a slot machine on tracks

soft spindle Dec 12, 2018, 5:14 PM

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Buff kpz70

verbal cloak Dec 12, 2018, 5:18 PM

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I’ve seen a lot do very well in the Kpz 70. It’s probably all down to play style.

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 5:20 PM

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Is WG going to add Centurion AX???

pine mason Dec 12, 2018, 5:20 PM

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No neither Super counquerer

#

Well at least that is hat I assume

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 5:23 PM

#

Okay Thanks

spare forge Dec 12, 2018, 6:34 PM

#

So this is a legitimate question. Does China just not care about having effective tanks to fight wars with. Because the entire medium line including the WZ120 is some of the worst tanks I’ve ever played. With all the hills and mountains in China you would think designing a tank able to shoot something 200+ meters away on slightly lower ground would be a priority. It’s a joke trying to shoot anything that isn’t on flat ground

upper kindle Dec 12, 2018, 6:38 PM

#

Help pls what ist this

#

Blue Tank what ist the

📎 Screenshot_20181212-193501.png

valid lodge Dec 12, 2018, 6:49 PM

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That's a collector tank. Most used to be tech tree tanks but they were removed from the tech tree. You can no longer get them. If you sell them they are gone for good.

median oak Dec 12, 2018, 6:54 PM

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@spare forge you don’t need gun depression to run over students...

dark grotto Dec 12, 2018, 6:55 PM

#

That one went right through

spare forge Dec 12, 2018, 7:03 PM

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Wow that’s inconsiderate @median oak. Now any Chinese citizens on this server are going to get a visit from the thought police to learn about how that didn’t happen

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 7:03 PM

#

Shots fired.

dark grotto Dec 12, 2018, 7:04 PM

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Their internet will just cut out

keen mantle Dec 12, 2018, 7:19 PM

#

You're implying their government lets them see this in the first place

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 7:46 PM

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Well we'll know something happened if suddenly the Chinese server population drops off in a few days.

keen mantle Dec 12, 2018, 7:49 PM

#

😂

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 7:50 PM

#

Guys, I have a question... T-34-85 or MT-25 ?

keen mantle Dec 12, 2018, 7:52 PM

#

yes

#

both are good lines and I highly recommend you play both

weary yacht Dec 12, 2018, 7:57 PM

#

you know tiger I is op when you can take on an entire team by yourself

📎 image0.png

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 7:58 PM

#

Gg

#

@solid gate both

spare forge Dec 12, 2018, 8:22 PM

#

📎 image0.jpg

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 8:48 PM

#

@solid gate
https://i.gifer.com/H4Vf.gif

dense cliff Dec 12, 2018, 8:49 PM

#

wont fit in the map

torn mason Dec 12, 2018, 8:51 PM

#

If warthunder is realistic. Than why did I just drift in the Lee?

keen mantle Dec 12, 2018, 9:33 PM

#

shhh

tulip sail Dec 12, 2018, 10:26 PM

#

@torn mason because it's not a sim game

fiery bear Dec 12, 2018, 10:33 PM

#

What’s your thoughts on the T110E5? I have it and I seem to like it and do good in it.

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 11:04 PM

#

@fiery bear it's a good tank

tall fox Dec 12, 2018, 11:05 PM

#

It’s good, but soviets is better 😝

keen mantle Dec 12, 2018, 11:05 PM

#

Sowjert*
It's a Calisota typo and a noice meme

solid gate Dec 12, 2018, 11:07 PM

#

For me its like a jack of all trades you know

rigid flower Dec 12, 2018, 11:45 PM

#

thots on fv4202?

leaden cedar Dec 12, 2018, 11:48 PM

#

inb4 relevant

rigid flower Dec 12, 2018, 11:50 PM

#

?

keen mantle Dec 13, 2018, 12:50 AM

#

FV4202 is a tank that goes from worse Patton with the stock gun into a good tank that needs ammo selection skills and about 3 million credits in the bank to play with the top gun

dark socket Dec 13, 2018, 2:32 AM

#

What is KV-5 had 1780 HP like it does on PC

keen mantle Dec 13, 2018, 2:35 AM

#

Do you want the ISU-152 to do 750 damage?

valid lodge Dec 13, 2018, 2:49 AM

#

No.
I like being able to one shot(or almost one shot) Rhm and Ru

keen mantle Dec 13, 2018, 2:55 AM

#

The Egyptian T-34/100 would make a neat tier 7 turreted TD

📎 1024px-T-100-latrun-2.png

fiery bear Dec 13, 2018, 3:14 AM

#

📎 image0.png

#

📎 image0.png

#

📎 image0.png

#

I have 3D printed these tanks.

steel basin Dec 13, 2018, 3:16 AM

#

those are actually pretty cool

#

someone made me a 3-D printed condom for a christmas gift joke last year but I broke it :v

fiery bear Dec 13, 2018, 3:32 AM

#

📎 image0.jpg

#

There’s also that one

regal zealot Dec 13, 2018, 4:39 AM

#

2017 Halloween Tank of PC?

tulip sail Dec 13, 2018, 4:48 AM

#

Nope

#

If only

keen mantle Dec 13, 2018, 4:53 AM

#

looks like it

tulip sail Dec 13, 2018, 4:57 AM

#

It's an FCM 1 I believe

main glacier Dec 13, 2018, 5:04 AM

#

I only recognice the stock ARL turret.

brave oak Dec 13, 2018, 5:33 AM

#

What’s better: T55A or Pz 58

rare apex Dec 13, 2018, 5:35 AM

#

T55A that Indian Pz with down syndrome got nothing on the cheeki breeki master

#

@brave oak Pz 58 is a waste of money in my opinion

brave oak Dec 13, 2018, 5:36 AM

#

I can afford only one prem but not too sure which one

rare apex Dec 13, 2018, 5:37 AM

#

@brave oak T55A all the way brother

brave oak Dec 13, 2018, 5:38 AM

#

Alright

keen mantle Dec 13, 2018, 5:38 AM

#

Pz. 58 will be cheaper some other time

rare apex Dec 13, 2018, 5:41 AM

#

wargaming: MAKES IT MORE EXPENSIVE

near rampart Dec 13, 2018, 6:24 AM

#

Kv-4 Best tank

regal zealot Dec 13, 2018, 6:27 AM

#

Yep

main plover Dec 13, 2018, 8:28 AM

#

man buff ke-ni pls

pine mason Dec 13, 2018, 8:34 AM

#

@main plover buff ke ni otsu ke ni is way too good, Ke ni otsu only has 1000 dpm at tier 3 that ks very low

regal zealot Dec 13, 2018, 8:41 AM

#

Um, I’m lost. Which Ke-Ni needs a buff again?

keen mantle Dec 13, 2018, 8:50 AM

#

Clearly the Otsu 😂

main plover Dec 13, 2018, 8:50 AM

#

the ke-ni needs a buff, otsu has 4 shells

keen mantle Dec 13, 2018, 8:51 AM

#

Otsu is overpowered tho

main plover Dec 13, 2018, 8:51 AM

#

I saw an otsu first in a battle after the nerf and he had 4 ammo bars, I had 2 :c

keen mantle Dec 13, 2018, 8:52 AM

#

Otsu is even more broken now than before