Maybe SolCore could be brought into canon from the Cortana Letters for AH before they made charum hakkor their central world
#lore-and-universe
jolly furnace
terse lava
Didnt think of that before, good point
I am willing to bet though 343 will name them something like the "imperium"
Hm..how that I consider it, we sont even know what the sangheili were before the Covenant
versed helm
at the ending of halo wars, not the post credits ending because i haven't played 4 and 5 yet, but anders is on halo and teleports somewhere then we see the monkey guy still alive making a new army
i dont understand - what happens? where is monkey man did he survive and their plan fail?
humble yacht
Atriox wasn’t making a new army, it was just showing us that he still had a large army remaining even after the Spirit of Fire fought them
versed helm
@humble yacht so what did the spirit of fire actually achieve in the last 5 missions i just played apart from get on the circle and teleport away? what where they trying to do and what did they actually even do?
i thought they wanted to use the ark to kill atriox or something
versed helm
i thought they put him on the rock
the one they shot up into orbit
and they used the ark to shoot him up into orbit
sonic mica
?
carmine sleet
Atriox was not on the Halo
versed helm
That was his army, not him
but actually rather than try and kill him they just teleported the halo away
to some other threat
dumb
carmine sleet
And it wasn't his whole army, just those that managed to get onto the ring
versed helm
they should've just blasted them all with the arks defences
carmine sleet
And they were using the Halo to try and get a signal out to the UNSC to say that the Ark is under siege from the Banished
This is stuff explained in the cutscenes quite clearly
versed helm
i recall her saying gimme a few weeks to get into the solar system and i will send a beacon i didnt know she meant to unsc
they should've just lit atriox up with ark defences
humble yacht
The halo teleported on its own
Because that’s what happens when the halo is ready
It goes to its intended position in the galaxy
carmine sleet
Being the Soell system which they believed would be close enough to get a signal to the UNSC
they should've just lit atriox up with ark defences
They don't have complete control over the Ark's defences and likely won't be able to for quite some time given that Anders was their best shot at trying to do that
versed helm
i mean she could lift dirt up out the ground
so she could have just done that to wherever atriox was
versed helm
uh
uh oh
i think i understand where im getting confused
so there is a halo in the middle of the ark?
and even the halo has loads of dirt on it?
fair hazel
The ark has a few things scattered around
feral perch
There is a forge in the middle of the Ark that has made all the Halos, and can make new Halos when needed
versed helm
did she accidentally make a halo?
gilded mason
No, it was already there
feral perch
She intentionally made a new Halo... didn’t she?
versed helm
and then it teleported to some random place with a big triangular robot dude
gilded mason
Oh, that then
fair hazel
No. It was already there.
versed helm
cant atriox just make another halo then?
fair hazel
She like activated it
gilded mason
i have to wait years to find out what that was
Just watch a playthrough if you're really curious
feral perch
No.
versed helm
i have to wait years to find out what that was
Just watch a playthrough if you're really curious
@gilded mason i have considered it but it might ruin it
feral perch
Only humans can interact with Forerunner technology to that extent
humble yacht
Anders didn’t make the halo, the ark makes replacements on its own
fair hazel
Maybe it was his goal but he wouldn’t be able to
gilded mason
i have considered it but it might ruin it
Nah, it's Halo 5. Can't make it any worse! eyyyy
versed helm
Only humans can interact with Forerunner technology to that extent
@feral perch but atriox still would have been able to use the halo? just not make a halo?
i have considered it but it might ruin it
Nah, it's Halo 5. Can't make it any worse! eyyyy
@gilded mason hmm tempting maybe ill play halo 4 then when it comes out later this year and watch 5 then buy infinite
feral perch
Only humans can activate a Halo. Even the Ark’s caretaker, 000 Tragic Solitude, couldn’t fire them on his own
versed helm
Only humans can activate a Halo. Even the Ark’s caretaker, 000 Tragic Solitude, couldn’t fire them on his own
@feral perch then what was the point of taking away the halo if atriox couldn't use it anyway?
fair hazel
Solution? Raise a little girl into your alien faction and use her when you need stuff
gilded mason
then what was the point of taking away the halo if atriox couldn't use it anyway?
Because they were using it to get to Soell
feral perch
He could kidnap a human and force it to fire the Halo
versed helm
He could kidnap a human and force it to fire the Halo
@feral perch but he can do that anyway
kidnap a human make them make a halo then fire it
feral perch
he can’t make a Halo
versed helm
why?
humble yacht
Only the ark makes halos
versed helm
they where on the ark no?
feral perch
They can’t make the Ark make Halos
humble yacht
Yes but Atriox has no control of when the ark makes the halo
feral perch
Except by destroying another Halo ring
humble yacht
When a replacement is needed, the ark makes one
gilded mason
When there's less than 7 rings
versed helm
so is there always 7 no matter what?
feral perch
Yes
versed helm
ahh
carmine sleet
They were using the Halo to try and get a signal out to the UNSC about what is happening on the Ark
terse lava
Correct, the ark only makes halos when an existing halo is destroyed
versed helm
is halo 4 worth playing? or should i just watch a playthrough on that too?
carmine sleet
Play Halo 4
humble yacht
Every halo is worth playing at least once
terse lava
Just not the mp😛
feral perch
So the Installation in HW2 is Halo Installation 09, a replacement for the installation destroyed in Halo 3, which was Installation 08, and Installation 08 was a replacement for the ring destroyed in Halo 1, which was Installation 04
feral perch
wow why?
gilded mason
You talking about H4 360 MP, or H4 MCC MP?
feral perch
Halo 5 mp is the goat
versed helm
i wont play multiplayer just campaign
humble yacht
Welp that’s your choice I guess
terse lava
Yep
fair hazel
I much prefer 5 MP above any other so far
feral perch
Shame we can’t get pre-weapon balance modes
fair hazel
You could try spartan ops if you play it torrent
Watching the cutscenes you get overall story but you miss a lot of smaller scale stuff without
sharp adder
Do halo 4 and terrible 5 and hw2 in that order
terse lava
You forgot halo wars
jolly furnace
Is it me or does anyone think the H3 map Assembly resembles the interior of the SoulStorm Brewery factory from Abe's Exoddus?
versed helm
Lmao, that is so specific and random.
jolly furnace
I know right.
Just came to me while watchin Xperia's H3 MP map lore vid
and I was lookin at Assembly and i was like huh that looks like a bit like or reminds of Soulstorm brewary of abe's exoddus.
Its the purple interiors and certain architecture style in parts
versed helm
Good Lord, let me guess, he simply described the maps, said things were "creepy" and said it was "lore".
jolly furnace
Some of them yeah
I know he's just speculatin
and theorizing
But i do love those maps
fair hazel
I don’t know what that between is
Storm soul brewery
There’s a bit too much theorizing that is not properly identified as such
jolly furnace
Huh? @fair hazel
fair hazel
Hidden Xperia in the map lore@video I watched did a bit too much theorizing that wasn’t identified as such properly
fair hazel
Well when you’re in a lore video to learn. Maybe good to not spread too much speculation so people@end up misinformed
terse lava
Agreed, find those types annoying or worse, just reads right off halopedia verbatim
versed helm
I just use Halopedia now.
ornate hinge
how did truth land its dreadnought on the voi teleport?
gilded mason
By manuevering it there.
ornate hinge
we know that those ships land straight
ah ok
it felt kinda weird cus he was landing with a 45° curvature
cedar surge
It amuses and infuriates me that people think noble 6 is still alive
We see elites ganging up on him,has a confirmed date of death,along with reach getting glassed
even in the slimest chance he survived what would he have eaten
Entire ecosystems of reach would have been destroyed after the glassing
Canned food is limited to the places not glassed
terse lava
It was equally likely mendicant bias's shard who landed it
jolly furnace
still hopin MB fragment is on Epitaph map
And as cool as it wud be for another part of MB to be on Zeta Halo, there is no reason for it to be there as forerunners logically would have moved it from there after retakin that ring
terse lava
Mhm
versed helm
It amuses and infuriates me that people think noble 6 is still alive
@cedar surge People just can't accept the reality of things sometimes.
cedar surge
Its all because they didn't show his body
They won't count it as a real Darth until they show the body
Even if six was still alive
There are unsc all over reach
Yet jun never said a thing about finding six?
soft mango
can we get an f in the chatf for sif
craggy sierra
It annoys me that people like him enough as a character to want to hope that.
Like even if he did hypothetically survive, literally what would he add to a story. He has like negative personality.
hardy axle
Don’t think people like him as a character, they like him as an avatar
As in he must be alive, because I was him
craggy sierra
Yeah but so many people are like "wouldn't it be cool if like chief and 6 teamed up" and I'm like "literally what would be interesting about that."
hardy axle
Well chief chatting with a Spartan 3 about their different training would be cool. But that could be any 3
craggy sierra
I don't think 3s training were that much different
hardy axle
Not hugely, but certainly different
craggy sierra
Their biggest difference is that 3s were orphans before hand while 2s were kidnapped from families
He'd probably have more to talk about with a Spartan 4 if I'm being honest because they actually had relatively normal lives to adulthood before getting trained in as Spartans willingly.
hardy axle
Talking to a Spartan 4 is like talking with any old average joe 😂
carmine sleet
Not for Chief
hardy axle
I kid of course
craggy sierra
Which is something chief has done very little of if ever in any of the games
Marines pretty much just talk at chief. Not to him. The only words he ever really shared has been with COs.
hardy axle
Hardly in a position to chat in any moment in the games like
craggy sierra
Tbh that's kinda why I'm interested in Brohammer as a character. He's just a dude for once.
carmine sleet
When the marine approaches Chief on the Ark near the crashed Pelican, Chief could've easily replied
craggy sierra
So chief will actually have to play off of someone with a relatively mundane outlook on things.
tbh he kinda did that with Tilson in H4 also
But that never ended that great
carmine sleet
There never was a next time...
hardy axle
Yeah halo 4 chief was a chatter
Wasn’t enough of that in 5
Especially as seen as he was with blue team!
craggy sierra
I feel like Halo 4 had something a lot of other Halo's lacked and that was a feeling of agency in the plot.
Like classic Halo was a lot of "go here, do this" at the behest of someone else. Be it Cortana, or Keyes, or Guilty Spark, etc etc.
H4 chief is kinda the one trying to solve the problems on his own initiative.
hardy axle
Gotta do what you gotta do when del Rio is being a complete tool
carmine sleet
Even before meeting Del Rio, Chief was trying to solve problems himself, specifically when it comes to getting Cortana to Halsey
queen otter
He said “Arrest that man” and legit everyone stood still lol.
hardy axle
Yeah giving chief character was a great choice by 343 in my opinion. Wish they had carried on pushing it in 5 more and hope we get more in infinite.
craggy sierra
Yeah no Chief was very much taking his own initiative to try to figure things out for himself as soon as the dawn crashed.
People talk about immersion in Halo stories and Bungie’s approach to characters but what makes me immersed is when the character you play as moves the story forward through their own initiative and not because someone else told them to.
hardy axle
Giving the covenant back their bomb was a good example of his own initiative from the bungie era.
queen otter
There was a lot of things in the bungie era that was like that.
craggy sierra
That was also like the one instance of it in all of H2
And also CE. And most of 3.
hardy axle
I’m struggling to think of any more
quasi shore
Where was MC during Halo 4 spartan ops
gilded mason
Doing other stuff
quasi shore
shouldnt the guy with the most experience with forerunner stuff be with the crew on the forerunner planet
gilded mason
Missions with Blue Team, things like that
quasi shore
ah ok
hardy axle
A lengthy debrief too I’d imagine
versed helm
Thinking about it, they should have included the drop pods at the end of Metropolis in H2A.
craggy sierra
That would’ve been a nice touch
Since they slapped Vergil all over the place anyways.
versed helm
Yeah, by the way, are there two space elevators that collapse during H2 and ODST?
last anchor
Technically one elevator, however, around the same time, Blue Team blows up the Black Stalk of Corn in Cuba
So two space elevators collapse around that same time.
versed helm
That's an inconsistency then, in the cutscene, a space elevator collapses. If that's supposed to be the same one in ODST then there's a continuity error.
gilded mason
That's an inconsistency then, in the cutscene, a space elevator collapses.
When was this?
gilded mason
Ah. I'm guessing it was able to spring back up, but doing that in the first place got it weak enough that it actually collapses several hours later
versed helm
But it shifts to the left from the bottom too.
I can't see that just springing right back up.
gilded mason
I dunno man, chalk it up to a Blur inconsistency. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Since it didn't do that in the original cutscene
hardy axle
And a space elevator would for sure be designed to flex to some degree
Albeit not to that degree, hence why it later collapses
last anchor
Yeah.
If I remember right, the blast weakened it, and then the fighting near its base that we see in Uplift Reserve finally snapped it completely and it comes crashing down.
My guess is that the cables higher up finally lost their grip on the counterweight sat and let go
versed helm
That's very impressive though.
last anchor
that it held up?
last anchor
Actually...no
Uplift Reserve begins with Dutch stepping out of his pod in Uplift Reserve at the base of the elevator 30 minutes after Alpha 9 was deployed
Canonically it probably took him like, half an hour at most to make it about the 2/3rds of the level hes in when the elevator finally comes down so...about an hour, maybe 45 minutes later
Still, pretty impressive your right
But then again its a space elevator, they're designed to withstand tropical storms, bombing attacks, impacts by low atmospheric ships...
last anchor
Fair.
versed helm
Hey, speaking of elevators and ODSTs, that reminds me of the scene in FUD.
rotund lintel
How many combat personnel such as Marines and ODST's do you guys think were stationed on Valiant-class cruisers?
cedar surge
Don't know
cedar surge
Don't know why so many unsc ships need drop pods
What does a battleship or cruiser need a drop pod
hardy axle
Ship to ship boarding
Beginning of ODST their initial plan is to drop pod onto the covenant carrier
unique rune
What does a battleship or cruiser need a drop pod
probably for flexibility
planetside operations might require troops to be deployed quickly
no need to rely on some other ship for orbital drops if capital ships are already fitted with drop pod equipment
fallen portal
Most Navy ships had personnel of all sorts. Battles were not just about space combat. For a long time the battles were about the Insurrectionists and they didn't have large fleets...all the time
cedar surge
Is a scorpion better than the wrath?
unique rune
Ehh. Can't really compare them since they're functionally pretty different.
Tech-wise the Wraith is far ahead of the Scorpion though.
Anti-grav drive, plasma mortar, Covenant nanolaminate plating...
cedar surge
Would say the anti gravity technology on the Wraith is worse than using wheels or tracks
If you start going fast you have nothing but air to slow you down
And your using extra power to keep the vehicle in the air
unique rune
I mean I'd imagine the fact that it's pretty much omnidirectional means it can stop pretty easily.
The fact that it hovers in the air also helps it traverse more varied terrain simply because it doesn't have to actually traverse it.
Power is... potentially a concern, but you have to also remember directed energy weapons are a Covenant staple, so I doubt it's that big of an issue to begin with.
severe snow
@cedar surge I imagine UNSC ships are equivalent to mixing the ideas behind multiple types of modern sea going ships into single hulls
troop deployment/transport like an ampib
carrying the vehicles/aircraft required to support that
spacecraft for similar roles to carriers
and weaponry on par with cruisers
cedar surge
Well if your going into space for 5 months
Might as well have a few tanks and warthogs
severe snow
true as well
plus the scale is absurd
(not saying its bad)
frigates are insanely large
so carrying large compliments isn't crazy
considering the UNSCs main combatant in the Insurrection was on average outclassed
having multiroled ships is much better
last anchor
The UNSC is flexible
Also for the Wraith; pretty sure that rotating power core thing on the back you attack to plant a grenade in is some kind of Forerunner retrofitted vacuum generator.
severe snow
prob
cedar surge
Vacuum generator?
last anchor
Forerunner power device that basically draws energy from other universes I think.
Hang on
Okay basically its underlying background energy thats baqsically EVERYWHERE
last anchor
Mind you this is only a theory on my part, but the back of it DOES look like its drawing something in as it turns.
Yes. The UNSC Infinity has a Forerunner vacuum power siphon
Came with her retrofitted engines.
cedar surge
Huh everything seems to be on that ship
last anchor
Thats the point. Shes humanity's big stick, the answer to their biggest problems.
cedar surge
Wouldn't even be surprised if it could make vehicles like the Phoenix class
last anchor
Its close to 6 klicks long. They'd be stupid not to include built in manufacturing equipment.
That said one of the weapon skins in H5 mentions "minifacturing" equipment so it can most likely produce guns at least
cedar surge
Hasn't the newer ships got less weapons than the HCW ships
last anchor
No. Most of them have about the same but their equipment has been improved
For example the Autumn class has all of the RED FLAG upgrades done to the Pillar of Autumn but in a standardized format
Also updates to their missile systems and coilguns.
Archers are out, Howlers are in
Mostly anyway.
cedar surge
Hey wait a second,I just realised that cortana is likely using unsc ships to make her navy bigger
last anchor
Probably, depending on how many shipboard AIs joined her side
She may not need them thoughif she has access to Forerunner storage facilities like Etrain Harborage...
Most of those ships were fully automated or nearly so to begin with, crewing each one with a smart AI linked to the Domain would be entirely possible
cedar surge
The strident total has only 25 missiles
last anchor
And nukes as well, but remember its a light Frigate
cedar surge
While the Paris has 312
last anchor
They're skirmishers and picket defense for larger UNSC vessels that have much heavier equipment.
The Paris is also bigger I think. Over a klick in length. One sec
Hang on, Halopedia says it has 40+ Archer pods...
Thats WAY more than 25 missiles.
Scratch that, 30.
Thats still about 30x8 or so missiles per pod, possibly more depending.
And the MAC
cedar surge
Really cause where I'm reading says 2
2 archer missile pods means 12 missiles for each pod right?
It seems the mac is gonna do all the work
last anchor
Always has.
Plus again its a frigate. They're skirmishers, not line holders. They peck and poke at the enemy, stopping fighters and light ships till the Cruisers, destroyers and hulking mothers like Infinity get in and get grinding.
cedar surge
A frigate is capable of destroying ships with a good enough captain
Over at reach a mac shot could have crippled that corvette
gusty star
That's Ardent Prayer @last anchor
last anchor
Ah found it
The infos from Halo Fanon. So that most likely means your right
Still, two archer pods means upwards of 24 missiles
cedar surge
So outside of gameplay how well do elite shields stand up to bullets?
west silo
So outside of gameplay how well do elite shields stand up to bullets?
@cedar surge
Pretty good unless there in Spartan ops
last anchor
He said outside of gameplay
gilded mason
It can vary by armor "rank"
last anchor
Lot sturdier than in game thats for sure tho
gilded mason
It took Linda 5 sniper rounds to get through a ranger's shields once.
cedar surge
Is a ranger high up?
west silo
He said outside of gameplay
@last anchor
The joke is that elites don't have shields in Spartan ops
gilded mason
Is a ranger high up?```
It can beSo sometimes it can vary from "a single bullet is all it takes" to "might as well be shooting spitballs"?
west silo
It took Linda 5 sniper rounds to get through a ranger's shields once.
@gilded mason
It was a special shield
gilded mason
Basically. In other words: plot decided how well shields hold up.
west silo
So sometimes it can vary from "a single bullet is all it takes" to "might as well be shooting spitballs"?
@cedar surge. More like a dozen AR rounds to an entire mag
cedar surge
Does a which unsc weapon does the best against shields? The AR,BR, or the DMR
west silo
Does a which unsc weapon does the best against shields? The AR,BR, or the DMR
@cedar surge
I'd say br
cedar surge
Plasma hitting people sounds way more consistent. Though its hard not to when it can blow limbs off
Yea it seems the battle rifle is the most powerful
carmine sleet
Does a which unsc weapon does the best against shields? The AR,BR, or the DMR
Rocket launcher
cedar surge
I think the best example of this is when forge fires at ripa point blank yet ripa acts as if nothing happened
Not a scratch on the armor
Don't even thing the shields went down
hidden briar
Just curious, but does anyone think that, even if Red Flag worked and the Spartans captured a Prophet, it wouldn't end hostilities, given Truth's plan?
carmine sleet
Not likely, it doesn't even matter which of the three, the Covenant would likely just increase their efforts against us regardless
hidden briar
well, just thinking since he belayed the order to save regret (and blaming the Sangheili for it) and left mercy to die, Truth wouldve continued
carmine sleet
@jade axle Ok, just so that I don't fill general up with Grunt Goblin and Warzone Firefight stuff, I'll explain it here
jade axle
carmine sleet
Goblins are basically battle suits built by Grunts to give themselves a bit more of an advantage against their enemies
jade axle
but what makes one special enough to pilot it? is piloting one of those what gives us the honor of knowing their name?
carmine sleet
There's a few types, the standard which fires large Needler rounds, one equipped with a Scarab beam and also Banished Goblins
Nothing in the lore talks about needing special permission to use one
At least from everything I've checked
It's also quite likely the titles that the pilots have in Warzone Firefight aren't serious titles. These are grunts we're talking about here
Plus, the mode is a simulation
jade axle
but there is tank master rok and other names that pop up to
comander legogos or something or other
Oh yeah simulation LMAO i forgot
for all we know those names are made up
carmine sleet
As for other bosses, most are based off of a real individual in the lore, such as Warden Eternal being the obvious one
Another example would be Captain Wamik on March on Stormbreak. He's actually an Elite we see in Halo Wars 1
jade axle
wooooah I had no idea lol i never played the wars ones
carmine sleet
To be fair, he doesn't get named in the story of the first game
And he's a minor character too
jade axle
I always like knowing these random things but its a lot to remember sometimes
carmine sleet
Don't worry about remembering everything. There's quite allot
jade axle
I do have weird feelings about how the lore was handled between 4 and 5 with the comics. i feel like i missed out on so much. it felt easier to keep track of the extended lore from the games up to 4
carmine sleet
It's a weird one, I'll say that but hey, so long as Halopedia exists, there's at least that site which is helpful for reading up on these things
jade axle
and you the lore technician to get stuff fast 👀
carmine sleet
Sure but Halopedia will always be better
jade axle
I find learning from another person to be more fun. efficiency isnt always king 😉
carmine sleet
That's fair
versed helm
Why does the Halopedia Nightfall Armor source cite that ODST armor has impact-negating systems implied to be hydraulic like itself? Is that a legitimate source?
hardy axle
The comics are the only halo media I have missed and I’m often hearing things I have no idea about that were in a comic.
round comet
pfft
icy jungle
Has anyone read any of the halo books I started a free trial on audible and used me first credit on Halo: Evolutions I haven’t started it yet bc I’m not sure if there’s a certain order I should go or can I go in a random order
I’d consider myself an OG Halo fan and have always followed the game series from day one but I just feel like I know everything that’s need to know about the games and want to explore more about the Halo Lore and Universe any advice on where I should get started?
round comet
fall of reach
read the eric nylund books in release order first.
fall of reach, the flood (you can skip the flood tbh), first strike, ghosts of onyx
icy jungle
Yeah I wasn’t sure bc a friend told me he just read whatever u want I’d love it anyways but don’t wanna get mixed up with timelines and all of that
Thanks gonna but fall of reach now
Buy*
round comet
eric nylund books in release order okay?
icy jungle
Yes thanks a lot 👍
round comet
first that, then after that theres around 20 books more
from different authors and timelines
icy jungle
Yeah I seen there’s around 32 books altogether I think and didn’t know if I should read them in release order or not but thank you very much anyways
round comet
👍
versed helm
@versed helm yeah, they just say it’s from a reward package from the Halo Channel. It’s very vague, though - there’s only one source for a whole paragraph of claims
Have you looked at it on Halo Channel?
Wouldn't blame you if you don't want to.
versed helm
@versed helm I have not XD
I suppose I could give it a look eventually.. far away from my xbox currently lol
But that’s really cool if true - gives them a bit of a chance against H2H with Elites and Brutes.. at least, keeping them alive long enough to get out of
Well, maybe. I was also fantasising in my headcanon that VISR is implemented with it’s own projectile/flight trajectory marker, that could also be used in tandem with a strobe system to counter the speed of Brutes and Elites for unaugmented humans
versed helm
It's pretty advanced already, it can detect cloaked enemies. @versed helm
Hm.. then it should have some systems for that already haha
Cool
Okay I might hit the hay now lol
Ttyl
See you later.
cedar surge
So odsts and Spartans can see cloaked elites? Not marines?
gilded mason
If they use thermal equipment or similar things.
jolly furnace
Doesn't elite cloaking hide thermal signatures
last anchor
Not acording to The Flood. It does quite the opposite
fair hazel
There's probably different types of camo.
cedar surge
I like the amount of detail on the equipment the unsc uses
west silo
Do we know the what type of ship that was used to carry the mayhem in its cargo bay to the Ark because for a unsc ships its got to be huge
vague scroll
mayhem?
carmine sleet
The Mayhem was picked up by the UNSC Witness, a carrier
vague scroll
oooh, alright my bad - I thought he was thinking of Halo 3
west silo
The Mayhem was picked up by the UNSC Witness, a carrier
@carmine sleet
How big would it have to be to be able to do that
carmine sleet
Bigger than a SDV-class heavy corvette
vague scroll
well most UNSC carriers are 2.5 kilometers in length already so it should fit pretty well as far as we can tell
west silo
well most UNSC carriers are 2.5 kilometers in length already so it should fit pretty well as far as we can tell
@vague scroll
Yeah but there cargo bay isn't big enough to hold something 1km or more
vague scroll
the Epoch class has a relatively skeletal open underbelly so that one actually might be appropriate for a undercarriage kind of carry
not unlike the Ascendant Justice piggyback ride we saw in First Strike
just kind of vice versa
cedar surge
Wait there was other unsc ships other than frigates at the ark?
carmine sleet
We're talking about Operation Far Storm, not the events of Halo 3
cedar surge
The one where the ark was about to activate?
west silo
The one where the ark was about to activate?
@cedar surge
Hunters in the dark yes
cedar surge
The unsc knows how important the ark is,so I'm Suprised they don't have a more military power on it before the banished came
Like a fleet in orbit to fight off people trying to take it over
Or a couple of spartan 4s
west silo
The unsc knows how important the ark is,so I'm Suprised they don't have a more military power on it before the banished came
@cedar surge
To be honest they were pretty busy with rebuilding and needed all the manpower they could get
And no one but them knew the location to the Ark or would be crazy to take the long way
carmine sleet
They more than likely had some military forces there but not enough to hold of the Banished
west silo
They more than likely had some military forces there but not enough to hold of the Banished
@Slipstream Technician#81
That how they where able to repair douglas armor right they salvaged S4 armor on the Ark right?
feral perch
I think so.
cedar surge
Did they leave any ships behind though?
west silo
Did they leave any ships behind though?
@cedar surge
No clue
cedar surge
Seems strange not to
You are just giving your enemies a easier time of getting orbital supremacy
No matter how many fighters you have
spiral jewel
After the events of First strike and the early hours of Halo 2, what happened to the UNSC Gettysburg? Was it destroy during the first invasion (Regret) or second invasion (Truth) of Earth, or was it still out and about once the HCW ended (and probably received upgrades along the way)?
last anchor
Probably secreted away by ONI to try and reverse engineer the Covenant engine they slapped onto it. Its too valuable to risk in outright combat
spiral jewel
Probably
last anchor
Also @west silo The Spirit repaired Douglas's armor with the equipment they had on board using data provided by Isabel.
Remember its a colony support ship. Manufacturing new Titanium-A plates for shattered armor and even a new helmet wouldnt be too hard so long as the techsuit underneith (which is the really complicated part) would still be mostly intact
west silo
Makes sense
spiral jewel
With all the tech on the SoF, I wouldn't be surprised if they managed to reverse engineer the Gen 2 armor or managed to manufacture their own Gen 2 MK4 variant as a result of the parts gathering
cedar surge
Suprised that those old factories can still produce new tech
versed helm
They're 500 years into the future.
west silo
Must of the spirits systems are not fully functional and if they go overboard they end up getting the conviction treatment
cedar surge
How would the SoF not be fully operational
Serina fixed the spirit of fire during those 20 years
Plus its not like the archer missiles can go that deep into the ark
The glassing beam went all the way through the ark
Archer missiles would only hurt the surface
fair hazel
pretty sure the ark will start fighting back if things get too crazy
versed helm
Do you think that High Charity had emergency services?
gilded mason
Yeah
versed helm
Has it ever been covered?
gilded mason
Don't think so
versed helm
That's a shame.
merry flame
Did Johnson actually survived halo 3?
versed helm
No.
viral sundial
Where did master chief get his spartan buddies in halo 5?
unique rune
Uh.
In training. All the way back in the 2510s-20s.
west silo
Where did master chief get his spartan buddies in halo 5?
@viral sundial
From your local walmart
viral sundial
Sounds like something 343 would say
@unique rune THEN WHY DID THEY NOT SHOW UP BEFORE HALO 5!?!?
unique rune
Because they were off doing other things?
limpid meadow
THEN WHY DID THEY NOT SHOW UP BEFORE HALO 5!?!?
@viral sundial It's a long answer, but it's explained in the books.
gilded mason
CE: Linda was clinically dead, rest stuck on Reach
2: Doing other missions around Earth
3: stuck on Onyx
limpid meadow
343 did a piss-poor job of explaining Blue Team and their presence in Halo 5 (in that there was no explanation in the game).
viral sundial
Well it should be explained in the game as well
limpid meadow
But they've been around since 2001
viral sundial
343 needs to fix that for the people who havent read the books yet like myself
limpid meadow
Yes, there should be a in-game explanation.
gilded mason
^
limpid meadow
Believe me, no one is happy with how Blue Team was handled, especially not book readers.
I don't want to pretend to speak for everyone, but I can say that a lot of fans of the books and Blue Team were upset with Blue Team's handling because it created an initial negative bias against the Spartans.
gilded mason
Yeah
limpid meadow
A lot of people wanted them included as far back as Halo 2 because we love these characters and wanted others to be able to share in that love.
But now, their image has been (understandably) soured for game-only fans. It's a terrible situation all around.
cedar surge
Would say that black team got done more dirty
limpid meadow
They definitely got foxtrotted hard.
jolly furnace
Wouldn't be great if we use a War shpinx or Seeker in Infinite to take down a Guardian..,
I hope to see the Primordial and Mendicant in terminals
versed helm
Black Team were mistreated.
cedar surge
They could have used marines or odsts
jolly furnace
Yah
limpid meadow
Or the Spartan-IVs we knew from previous lore were on Installation 03
jolly furnace
But also they likely did it to show the power difference in Mjolnir and Forerunner armor systems
limpid meadow
And then when the Didact is confronted by Blue Team, he turns into a Bond villain!
jolly furnace
True again Ian
limpid meadow
It's infuriating.
cedar surge
Black team died like nameless mooks
jolly furnace
I'd love to have charum hakkor arena Primordial Prison area as an MP map in Infinite
Though I hope its accurate to Cryptum's description
cedar surge
Who actually thought. It was a good idea
jolly furnace
frank o connor?
I mean 343i okays everything
So it all goes up to the top
I mean 343 okayed the traviss triloy
vague scroll
there are many writers who work on Halo, we should remember to consider 343i as a company
jolly furnace
And that had a ton of issues
vague scroll
there are many people making decisions - and not all creations are popular or good in quality
carmine sleet
They do
vague scroll
they have many people for that, and for 95% of everything that has been created in the canon - it has been accurate
they have had very little issue with maintaining the canon
most issues are small minor nitpicks in the grand scheme of things
cedar surge
Yea I think some help out on halopedia
vague scroll
no Halopedia is a free resource maintained by fans
jolly furnace
Well traviss trilogy had several issues
vague scroll
but it is also the most comprehensive collection of Halo lore anywhere on the Internet
The Kilo-5 Trilogy has got to be one of the least offensive when it comes to retcons
vague scroll
if you go back and read The Fall of Reach, it's interpretation versus Halo today is completely off base
what issues did you find in K-5?
limpid meadow
The Kilo-5 Trilogy has got to be one of the least offensive when it comes to retcons
@vague scroll I have to strongly disagree
It completely retcons Halsey's ideology towards the Spartan-II candidates to get a cheap shot at the character for the sake of the story.
jolly furnace
K-5 has a list on Halopedia for its inconsistancies. Some have been retified
vague scroll
as of these days, I find cognitive dissidents with how Traviss handled her trilogy thematically, I'm inclined to agree it didn't feel like Halo.
unique rune
someone wasnt fact checkin traviss' writing
it seems
You have to remember that Traviss is... infamous for... apparently not doing much research, if any, on the franchises that she works on.
jolly furnace
Others can't really be reconciled without retconning
limpid meadow
And the retcon and revelation are basically just there then gone. You could remove the moment when Naomi remembers Halsey lying to her and it has no negative impact on the story or trilogy.
cedar surge
What did Traviss do
gilded mason
A lot
vague scroll
and while I agree they trivialize Halsey's motivations, the protagonists that Traviss uses to phrase her arguments are honestly a little too inherently biased to Traviss's "truth"
but when I'm thinking of canonical eras - I'm thinking of technology and timeline dates
jolly furnace
Also fix that thing with BB saying he's a whatever generation AI to Halsey
vague scroll
in that respect, K-5 doesn't miss
gilded mason
She also admits she changes characters' personalities around to what she thinks makes sense
jolly furnace
Yeah she changes their personas to act as she thinks they would or should
vague scroll
If I recall, BB said "fifth generation" whereas Cortana was third generation. There's no accurate depiction on how AI generations work to begin with.
jolly furnace
Her and Troy Denning I think had wars in SW Legends novels over Mandalorian and Jedi depictions
gilded mason
I heard about that, yeah
vague scroll
It's hard to build an argument that it was breaking canon if we didn't understand how AI generations work in the first place
jolly furnace
Halsey does though
And i think she worked on the generation BB said he was part of to her
vague scroll
and? I don't see how that's a inconsistency or retcon?
vague scroll
she didn't directly work on him
jolly furnace
I'd need to find the exact source on it
I do take issue with her and Lucy's interaction at one point
vague scroll
well, I can clearly state that BB's human progenitor was a augmentation scientist employed by Halsey at one point during the S-II program
gilded mason
Oh yeah, the Lucy thing was awful
jolly furnace
Lucy should have killed Halsey if she punched her as hard as she did.
And that's not even gettin into the trauma Lucy had
prior to that
There is good stuff in that trilogy
vague scroll
The reason I pointed out that TFoR doesn't work anymore is because you have mentions of no artificial gravity aboard UNSC warships. That the Sangheili were only encountered by humans around the same time as the Fall of Reach. That the battle of Reach only took place over the course of a day.
vague scroll
Things like that fly in the face of the collective understanding of Halo's in lore history.
jolly furnace
hence a redone version was made later
vague scroll
That's not a fault of TFoR in the slightest, and that rerelease didn't change any major issues.
jolly furnace
Also bungie didnt even want that book in first place
vague scroll
Bungie and Nylund weren't on the same page in terms of how Halo lore worked, so they were always butting heads.
That's why TFoR and Reach don't line up one to one.
jolly furnace
Also MS i think got involved
limpid meadow
It's hard to build an argument that it was breaking canon if we didn't understand how AI generations work in the first place
@vague scroll AI generations are progressive, and that's all we really need to know there. BB says he was a fourth generation AI and built by other AI. That shouldn't confuse Halsey at all given her known history and work with AIs, and the fact she has met at least 1 5th gen AI
jolly furnace
Thank you Ian
limpid meadow
The reason I pointed out that TFoR doesn't work anymore is because you have mentions of no artificial gravity aboard UNSC warships. That the Sangheili were only encountered by humans around the same time as the Fall of Reach. That the battle of Reach only took place over the course of a day.
@vague scroll A lot of that was fixed in the 2010 and later prints.
jolly furnace
Also didn't she have like a micro- AI in her laptop?
vague scroll
I could of sworn a number of those issues were still in the 2010 reprint
since that was the version I read when I got in Halo lore
limpid meadow
I could of sworn a number of those issues were still in the 2010 reprint
@vague scroll They aren't. UNSC warships still generally didn't have artificial gravity in the early 26th century
Also didn't she have like a micro- AI in her laptop?
@jolly furnace Jerrod who simply disappears in Glasslands for no reason
jolly furnace
That's the one. Thanks again Ian @limpid meadow
vague scroll
So they cleaned that up, then I'll admit fault on having community memory overlapping my own readings of the books.
limpid meadow
Great thing about a community is we can all come together to augment each other's knowledge.
vague scroll
for sure
jolly furnace
So Primordial charum Hakkor MP map for Infinite? I hope so
vague scroll
that said, I find these days my lore issues come more with suspension of disbelief than an issue with the lore inherent. Me and Dab1001 completed Halo: Battleborn around the same time and he got long winded over the proliferation of holographic technology available to civilians in a little backwater world like Meridian.
cedar surge
So how advanced is holograms for civilians?
limpid meadow
I loved that aspect of Battle Born
Holograms, by the 26th century, should be a trivial form of technology.
vague scroll
it's not for everyone, I personally find it inoffensive to as much as being find with it
"should be" is kind of what Dab's issue with that
cedar surge
Holograms are not widely available?
limpid meadow
They are
cedar surge
Are they like the ones in infinite or in 4 and 5
fair hazel
In Meridian divide... that scene when they arrive at the bombed out city..
vague scroll
depends on the depiction typically
fair hazel
That was memorable. I just imagined this like, abandone but kind of destroyed city with this round-like spaceport with multiple levels and beautiful plazas
vague scroll
In the Bungie era Halo games, holograms were pretty far and few between
limpid meadow
Just look at Club Errera in Halo reach
vague scroll
New Alexandria I think was written off more due to it being an higher quality of living
limpid meadow
In the Bungie games, we didn't really get a good look at civilian life in the Halo Universe.
vague scroll
we did have access to New Mombasa, a crown jewel of Earth it seems given the ancillary lore built around it
seemed to be not so much in the way of holographic technology there though it could be argued that neon signs were just 2-D holo tech
limpid meadow
we did have access to New Mombasa, a crown jewel of Earth it seems given the ancillary lore built around it
@vague scroll It's not a crown Jewel, and we really only see it after the invasion. And Halo 2 is mostly set in Old Mombasa.
jolly furnace
I wonder if forerunners had video games
fair hazel
odst still had some cool stuff
limpid meadow
New don't get to see the newer parts of New Mombasa until Halo 3: ODST, when the city is in lockdown
jolly furnace
New Alexandria was the crown jewel i thought
limpid meadow
New Alexandria was, yes
cedar surge
Oh so That's why mombasa looked so different
vague scroll
in the early 2300s it was the busiest port on Earth and hosted the first Earth space elevator
cedar surge
We were in old mombasa in 2?
vague scroll
yes
fair hazel
an AI managing a city and its infrastructure, the lockdown measures, healthcare kits, the roads lights and control of traffic
vague scroll
Halo 3 ODST is directly in New Mombasa instead
jolly furnace
Choose Octican
limpid meadow
A shut down New Mombasa
fair hazel
optican
vague scroll
doesn't really prevent you from at least getting an idea of what civilian life looked like tbf
limpid meadow
It does though
gilded mason
We were in old mombasa in 2?```
For Outskirts. Metropolis has us cross the bridge into the new city.You get to see the city but only after the Covenant have hit it. You don't get to see what day-to-day life was like, what civilians did, what they occupied their time with, nothing like that.
jolly furnace
I just think its basically like our own modern life
Just better healthcare
less money issues
and more surviellance
limpid meadow
Our first real look at civilian life was Second Sunrise over New Mombasa, and even that's pretty brief.
vague scroll
I feel like that disregards things like the evidence of quality of life through the form of buildings, the living spaces, the offices and building interiors, etc.
fair hazel
well, old mombassa was way more rustic
limpid meadow
Any other time is post-Covenant invasion and doesn't reflect what civilian life is actually like.
jolly furnace
I imagine Covie civilian life had similarities to our own outside of the theocracy thing
vague scroll
and yeah I remember Second Sunrise over New Mombasa, great comic
fair hazel
and civilian life depended on the planet and place
jolly furnace
And Forerunner civilian life sounds boring af from what Born said in Cryptum
limpid meadow
I feel like that disregards things like the evidence of quality of life through the form of buildings, the living spaces, the offices and building interiors, etc.
@vague scroll I'm not disregarding it, just pointing out that buildings give a very, very incomplete picture of what life is like.
Especially when you can't interact with much of what you're seeing. It's just stuff that's there.
vague scroll
I'm just talking about general quality of life and general tech, in terms of overall design and the communal spaces - it looks rather similar to New Alexandria and I think that way you can get a generally good picture of what life was like even if you don't get quite a taste of what a every day civilian experience was
jolly furnace
I imagine ancient human civilian life was like modern UNSC or are own just way more advanced tech
vague scroll
I think you can get a taste but I won't dispute you there that there are limitations.
limpid meadow
There are heavy limitations.
cedar surge
Its not like they can just make a entire book about a civilian
jolly furnace
U could
vague scroll
we'll probably have to disagree on to what degree of limitations you're going to get
I mean, Halo: Legacy of Onyx was an entire book about a civilian @cedar surge
so was Battleborn in the first phase of the story, 4 in fact
jolly furnace
I hope we get an ancient human trilogy one day
by greg bear
cause such a trilogy would be epic
craggy sierra
Don’t we mostly already know how that all plays out?
jolly furnace
You can name them - Antediluvian, Deluge and Ragnarok or something
I want a ancient human POV
craggy sierra
Is there much that needs expanding on there?
jolly furnace
Yes
Like prior to the war
I want an ancient human POV
Forerunner POV of ancient human culture is limited and biased
craggy sierra
I don’t see that really adding that much to the universe
craggy sierra
Learning the daily routine of a bunch of dead people
jolly furnace
We did that with forernners
And covies in broken cirlce
so that logic doesn't really work
craggy sierra
Forerunners and the crap they left behind still had an impact on the galaxy we know today.
Like what they left behind has a lot of mysteries attached that the books sought to answer. Ancient humans never really left behind anything that impacts much of how the current galaxy operates.
While the forerunners more or less gave us FTL travel.
And death rings
And a bunch of other tech that has shaped the galaxy as we know it in the 2500s
sharp adder
dont forget the forerunners destroyed everthing that acient humanty did all there tech and rverthing
vague scroll
there are still remenants of ancient human technology sprinkled in recent Halo lore
Warfleet shows an abandoned ancient human warship currently under study by ONI
jolly furnace
and they found another ship on a dead world
vague scroll
and then you got Hellcat armor which is based on reverse engineering of ancient human armor
jolly furnace
which they used to build hellcat armor
also Heian is ancient human
due to its ruins
craggy sierra
My outlook is that there’s a lot more stories to be written in the galaxy in the present then needing to go look at the lives of some dead people.
jolly furnace
So ancien humanity has relevence still
vague scroll
"Built of knowledge stolen from enigmatic ruins on a dead world and materials stripped from the vault of a shattered starship, the HELLCAT is both utterly alien and strangely familiar." - HELLCAT Mjolnir REQ card description
jolly furnace
Eventually Halo timeline is gonna stop going forward. At which point we will go backwards
craggy sierra
...no
craggy sierra
That would be stupid
jolly furnace
There;s lots of unexpored past to uncover
Well mate most fictional verses do that
SW
ST
etc
vague scroll
it wouldn't necessarily go backwards, we already go backwards and forwards all the time
sharp adder
oh it would be interesting if they found a acient human base or even acient humnas in some sort of cry but that would be unrealistic
vague scroll
we got the TFoR animated film before Halo 5, we received the Atriox comic books and the Denning Master Chief Story novels
jolly furnace
Ancient human tech/bases has already been found.
vague scroll
Halo lore is just generally all over the place with it's rate of creation
jolly furnace
but ancient humans themselves seem to be extinct
vague scroll
whenever something is relevant or 343i wants to fund a product, they'll go looking for someone to develop it
jolly furnace
even though logically ancient humans should have had plans to survive in event of total defeat to forerunners
prior to the war or during it
craggy sierra
The entire Halo universe as it currently sits is an evolving political landscape trying to move into a new era of peace between aliens. Halo exists in the 2550s/60s and I want to see that universe continue to evolve in meaningful ways.
jolly furnace
I can only assume forerunners discovered those plans and prevented them from being done
craggy sierra
Some dead people from 100,000 years ago aren’t exactly topping my intrigue
vague scroll
I personally think Halo's lore moved too fast and forward from Halo 4 onward with the post-war narrative
gilded mason
^
craggy sierra
Probably but there’s a lot of stories to tell based on the politics and racial relations between aliens and humans.
cedar surge
You think chief got back too soon?
craggy sierra
No
vague scroll
it's up for debate but generally the new "we are the giants now" premise for Humanity as the current galactic superpower along with somewhat forgetting about the attrocities and underlying hatred humans have for aliens and vice versa gets set aside for this rather quick pursuit towards making the post-war more open and inclusive between human and alien factions
gilded mason
You think chief got back too soon?```
More that everything advanced too quicklyI do, at least in the real-world sense.
I would have wanted more game set after Halo 3, leading in Halo 4.
craggy sierra
I don't think humans are the giants in the universe after the war
vague scroll
I am with Toa 100% here, Chief could have taken a decade or more hiatus rather than a 3 year stop gap
limpid meadow
Introduce new characters and given the proper focus and development.
cedar surge
Its a little strange people are so ready to be alongside hunans
limpid meadow
Ease people into the new era of Halo before bringing the Chief into it.
Experiment, see what works, what doesn't and all that.
craggy sierra
I think everyone's pretty mutually kicked in after the war but I will say the peace and ally ship with the aliens probably moved a bit fast
cedar surge
You are just going to work alongside people who tried to kill your entire race?
vague scroll
well, that's the million dollar question isn't it?
craggy sierra
Like it does seem odd that ONI was down for the research project from Legacy of Onyx
But whatever, it's still interesting watching the universe evolve forward from a point of war
vague scroll
for a lot of lore fans if feels like the galaxy's cultural make up moved forward and healed maybe a bit too fast
craggy sierra
Well it depends on what level we're looking at here
limpid meadow
- I remember back in the early 343 days people were upset that Humanity and the Sangheili weren't universally best buddies. Obviously different people have different opinions, but it's funny to see how the community had shifted on that.
craggy sierra
I can see governments saying "okay you don't shoot us, we don't shoot you" but I doubt racial relations would be unanimously great across all of society since, ya know, how many billions of people did they kill?
limpid meadow
- Very little, if anything, has healed between Humans and former Covenant species. However, they can't ignore each other.
I can see governments saying "okay you don't shoot us, we don't shoot you" but I doubt racial relations would be unanimously great across all of society since, ya know, how many billions of people did they kill?
@craggy sierra They aren't unanimously good. That's never been remotely implied let alone shown.
craggy sierra
true
cedar surge
"Thank you for saving us,we are just going to ignore you trying to kill all of us!"
Arnt some grunts going to human schools too?
vague scroll
It might be also why I have a less-critical view on the Kilo-5 trilogy because I read Ghosts of Onyx and Glasslands back to back so I didn't really have the time to think over and lock in a critical view or mindset on what certain characters were supposed to be like or think as. But the sentiments found in Kilo-5 I felt made tonal sense after the events of Halo 3 and the end of the Covenant War
cedar surge
How are they even getting along
craggy sierra
That's only one situation
gilded mason
No. It's a mixed school.
limpid meadow
And there's only 1 mixed school
vague scroll
and tbf to the mixed schools thing, that's unique to Paxapolis
craggy sierra
And it's only one school setup specifically for the families of a joint research project on Onyx i think
cedar surge
Is that a colony?
vague scroll
that's not taking place on a macro level, it's just at Trevelyan
jolly furnace
I mean people do need to move on and cooperate to survive in post war times
vague scroll
Paxapolis is the research city located inside Trevelyan, the shield world formally known as Onyx
vague scroll
it's manned by Swords of Sanghelios and UNSC-sponsored scientists from both cultures along with their families
craggy sierra
I doubt earth will be setting up a joint school anytime soon but out on Onyx where a bunch of different species got called to live with their families long term to conduct research, it makes sense.
jolly furnace
Earth no
I mean for that to work u need to have things like toilets for aliens
and special chairs and whatever
and food
vague scroll
probably the more questioning thing I'm left wondering is why was ONI willing to let a Swords detachment join in researching the Treveylan Shield World
there's easy explanations and its not a question that needs to be answered
craggy sierra
idk if Jackals and Elites even have incompatible diets with humans
gilded mason
Because the Elites knew the most about Forerunner research.
vague scroll
well yeah Ostral, it's that easy to remark - but I just mean in terms of logistics
gilded mason
That's one of the stated reasons
craggy sierra
I know grunts definitely don't
jolly furnace
Elites and Jackals couldn't eat human food i think
craggy sierra
Elites can drink booze
jolly furnace
If we go by realistic bio chemical barriers
vague scroll
you can't deny that there had to have been a lot of backroom arguments within the leadership of ONI or HIGHCOM that wasn't cool with it
gilded mason
I bet Osman was throwing a fit
jolly furnace
I mean i would imagine humans and forerunners couldn't eat certain foods for each other
depsite how similar they are
Assuming we go by realism here
Halo is soft sci-fi
compared to other works
gilded mason
Neural physics
limpid meadow
Humans and Forerunners might. They share a common ancestor
vague scroll
I still feel frustration in not being able to satisfyingly determine whether ONI is an all-powerful government cabal controlling the UEG government from the shadows, or just a really pissed off, ineffective bureaucratic heavy intelligence agency that struggles to get anything done
gilded mason
I know, right?
jolly furnace
I dont think Nueral Physics will excuse biochemical barriers this time
vague scroll
I like both premises, it's just I would like tonally to pick one
gilded mason
I'd rather the latter lol
vague scroll
very true
oh I thought you were saying factually its more the latter lol
given the back and forth, it certainly feels more like the second option - leaving ONI sometimes looking like bumbling fools
gilded mason
Yeah
vague scroll
it's not necessarily ever that bad but it does look like it at times
I think I got a good laugh at the absurdity of the CINCONI sneaking her way aboard a UNSC frigate to come visit one low-level UEG ambassador on the edge of the Joint Occupation Zone to wish the ambassador congratulations on preventing a war from boiling over
jolly furnace
Anyone think Abaddon coul show up down the line and kill Cortana?
vague scroll
I feel like it's a little too much to ask for
as the discussion earlier about Blue Team suddenly appearing in Halo 5 without a good explanation for them
the Didact had a similar reception with people asking "who is this guy" and "what's going on?"
Abbadon without some decent set up or screen time might end up in a similar mishap
jolly furnace
probably yeah
hence we may never get this great stuff in game
To be fair to Didact, what were people expecting after Covenant defeat in 3. A new main villain we didn't know or had seen before was gonna be in it
vague scroll
it might be a little hard to follow too, you got that rule in writing to "not underestimate your audience" but the opposite can be said too - the material from the Forerunner era may just be too much for most fans to follow
even back in the H3 days, most fans weren't going out of their way to hunt for the terminals or even knew of their existence
jolly furnace
Didact spent all of 4 telling the player his motives for what he was doin
vague scroll
all my understanding of H3terminals came from Halopedia rather than the game itself
jolly furnace
I mean what were people really expecting, Flood agian
west silo
all my understanding of H3terminals came from Halopedia rather than the game itself
@vague scroll
To be fair halo 3 terminals were confusing
vague scroll
you get these moments even today, in this channel too even, where we have people who are still working with a predominantly Halo CE - straight man understanding of Halo lore
hidden quail
I don't know anything about the banished but quick question, are they smart like Elites?
craggy sierra
Kinda?
gilded mason
Brutes can be intelligent, yes
vague scroll
game players have a lot of questions that can't be answered with a simple yes or no without having to get into some serious explanations to explain the entire reason and practicality behind what exists in the books and ancillary lore
jolly furnace
Banished will be covie stand ins i think
then created will show up
later
i think
craggy sierra
I mean brutes did handle military strategizing in the war quite a bit. They’re thuggish but not stupid.
hidden quail
Do the banished have grunts and jackals? Or were those covenant only
vague scroll
wait 4 days, we'll find out soon enough
@hidden quail give me a sec, let me go grab you the Halopedia page on the Banished
it will make answering your questions much easier
gilded mason
Yes. And Elites, Hunters, and possibly Drones
craggy sierra
Tbh who doesn’t have grunts at this point
hidden quail
Oh okay, thank you so much. Was not searching for the actual species names ahah
jolly furnace
please no drones
craggy sierra
I think even the UNSC has them
jolly furnace
I never was a fan of drones
vague scroll
but drones are cool, they can build massive hives the size of cities in hours 😦
vague scroll
oh yeah, they're not a fun enemy at high dfficulties
hidden quail
They are fun if you have a machinegun
jolly furnace
thank god drones didnt fly with snipers
west silo
but drones are cool, they can build massive hives the size of cities in hours 😦
@vague scroll
Sounds familiar
vague scroll
data hive, Halo 3 ODST
west silo
data hive, Halo 3 ODST
@vague scroll
No another hivemind
vague scroll
oh you mean the Flood, gotcha
west silo
Bingo
west silo
well tbf, Yanme'e aren't a hive mind collective
@vague scroll
Eh there close enough to classify as one
vague scroll
I thought a hivemind requires a central-collective intelligence, not a collective following a high order figure
vague scroll
checking the definition, actually, he's right - they're both "hiveminds" by definition
though it's an odd distinction because they're very different social structures
The Yanme'e culture is a conscious collective of individuals following a designated authority with very little argument
The Flood is an unconscious unified collective of multiple beings, by technicality, so both are hiveminds by definition
Yanme'e actually fit the traditional definition of hivemind better than the Flood
cedar surge
When the unsc deploys onto planets like sanghelios,do they deploy a wet navy onto the surface?
vague scroll
we've never seen the UNSC in a forward-invading capacity like that before so who knows. We've also never seen the UNSC wet fleet in action so that's also up in the air.
cedar surge
Maybe they deploy submarine aircraft carriers
Or just drone ships
The innsurectionists had to at least once hid underwater
ornate hinge
all ive seen of the UNSC wet navy are the aircraft carriers of halo 3
in that dock multiplayer map
vague scroll
other naval boats have been seen and mentioned in halo fiction elsewhere
though it's always a brief, unimportant background object
wet fleet is offhandedly mentioned in a radio conversation in Reach
a naval vessel is seen in the background of a panel in Halo: Collateral Damage
ornate hinge
well, they lost significant influence cus the spaceships were more useful
cedar surge
A aircraft carrier on the water would be cheaper than a space ship
If you need something to carry fighters on a p planet then the aircraft carrier would be cheaper
Hey wait a minute
In that one cutscene in halo 4
Didn't a spartan get shot by a plasma bolt directly to the helmet but was unharmed?
limpid meadow
What about it?
cedar surge
Shouldn't have they
Ya know
Gotten their head blasted off?
Considering how powerful plasma is?
Beck a near miss can being it down
stiff creek
Nah, I don't think so.
Those dudes have shields, but if they didn't, he would probably be dead, yes.
Also considering how fast that bolt was going.
gilded mason
This is the same thing that doesn't show the Elites having shields
So, I dunno if I expect it to be realistic
stiff creek
Probably hurt.
cedar surge
He is gonna have that zuko scar
He was lucky he wasn't a spartan III
But ain't that cutscene not the most lore friendly?
stiff creek
Right.
remote spruce
the prologue?
cedar surge
Its like that cutscene where the pelican is way to large next to the autumn class
limpid meadow
Even without shields, Mjolnir is coated with a ceramic coat that dissipates the heat from plasma bolts
cedar surge
Is the strident under armed?
24 archer missiles compared to the 312 on the Paris class
Why is there so few missiles compared to the predecessor
limpid meadow
Archer missiles are just 1 type of armament the ship has
cedar surge
And that one Hyperion launcher?
limpid meadow
And it has a heavy MAC that's likely more capable than earlier frigate MACs
coarse hedge
Here's a question, would the UNSC still have use for units like the 82nd or 101st Airborne for paratrooper insertion? Or would the Pelican/ODSTs render that sort of training obsolete?
terse lava
Would say depends on the circumstance and battle
coarse hedge
So there's still a chance for it to be legit for my OCs background
vague scroll
on Halo Fanon, the Halo fanfiction wiki, some users have gone in and brought famous American or other national units into the Halo verse and recontextualized them to fit the 26th century - some have been remade into ODST units, others were just remade into the UNSC Army Airborne. I personally think continue reference to military units 500 years from now isn't really going to happen very often.
terse lava
Heck it's a large universe. You could have your OC be battling on a planet that simply lacks ODSTS or anything fancier
vague scroll
as for the skill and capabilities like paratroopers, parafoils are used by Spartan-IIIs as part of their initiation night
but overall we almost never see the use of parachutes in the lore
coarse hedge
I've been running with the idea that the OC is a Spartan III who specialized in piloting, and was eventually transferred to the 82nd or 101st cause they needed a pilot for heavy insertion ops
I dunno, I'm doing a lot of kicking around and scared that it's not gonna fit lol
vague scroll
probably best to check Halopedia on SPARTAN-IIIs, generally S-IIIs have been used as suicide troops and never deployed along side regular forces
NOBLE Team and others like them are considered outliers
coarse hedge
So maybe use a different generation?
vague scroll
Spartans in general have almost always either fallen under Naval Intelligence or Naval Special Warfare, you'd probably get the most traction out of a temporary assignment of a Spartan along side such a unit, or have a full Spartan team work with such a large unit on an attache basis.
for example NOBLE Team was on loan from ONI to UNICOM's Army Special Warfare Group 3 under Colonel Urban Holland.
vague scroll
np, happy to help 😄
terse lava
Honestly I see nothing wrong with the OC being an s3. There were plenty of them and you can argue someone pulled rank and grabbed one or a few for other ops
coarse hedge
Now, would it be dumb to make him from Delta Company, the 'fate unknown' company?
Or would that give me more room to work with
vague scroll
it brings a lot of strings attached depending on what you're using Delta Company for, so if you want to write a fanfic with it - you might be in for a night mare of story planning on explaining how Delta Company was made and where your character fits in
coarse hedge
Cause the candidates were on the way to Onyx, but never got there if I'm remembering correctly
vague scroll
on the other hand, you could probably just leave it up to reader discretion and focus on the story you want to tell - not all details need to be addressed tbh
coarse hedge
That is a good point, it'd be a slog to make it work...
vague scroll
so, right now I'm the point man on the Halo Fanon Delta Company project and our version of it hasn't been updated in 2 years I think?
coarse hedge
Oof
vague scroll
we're long outdated for our own lore and I was freaking out last night trying to put together a working premise
that said I can give you the basic limitations of Delta if you want
personally, I'd recommend you stick to a war-time company (Alpha or Beta)
and follow the NOBLE formula because it gives you the most freedom
coarse hedge
Six members assembled for various needs?
vague scroll
yeah that would be the start
coarse hedge
Zulu-56 would be that start for me then lol
vague scroll
on the other hand, there is NOBLE Six's own secretive background
cedar surge
Could a spartan like a headhunter just survive on their own in HC feeding Intel to the unsc?
vague scroll
handpicked by an ONI officer as their own personal "grim reaper", Six was used to destroy Insurrectionist groups during the Covenant War and at one point participated in the SABRE program
coarse hedge
"You're scary, you know that?" -Emile
vague scroll
if you had a ONI officer make your Spartan similar to Six in being a personal killer, that's probably the ultimate form of freedom for a SPARTAN-III
gives you plenty of room to go anywhere and do anything, and you don't have to go through the trouble of building up fellow Spartan teammates
just pick Alpha or Beta and you can use Halopedia to establish the basics of your Spartan's backstory and then go forward from there and have them participate in the war in any time frame that generally fits to Alpha/Beta war time activities
@cedar surge Headhunters only numbered in a total of 12 operatives at any one time as I recall... they weren't permanently stationed behind enemy lines - rather they were sent out every time ONI found a target they wanted hit by a small Spartan unit
they deployed Headhunters to those missions and then retrieved them when the mission ended
coarse hedge
Get their hands dirty, then have mom pick them up to go home
vague scroll
exactly
I'm not sure how deadly the missions were but I don't think there was a high turnover in Headhunters, even though the Headhunter story says they were also suicide troops like regular S-III companies
Jun was at one time a Headhunter and he survived so it's not impossible to survive the war as one
coarse hedge
Spartan-IIIs are cooler anyway
limpid meadow
Spartan Hazel was also a Headhunter
cedar surge
Soldiers who arnt invincible are cooler than ones who are
coarse hedge
IIIs were also used against Innies, yes?
vague scroll
yes
cedar surge
No
limpid meadow
They were, yes
cedar surge
Huh
vague scroll
Alpha Company was used to put down a pretty nasty rebellion on Mamore at one point
coarse hedge
Perfect.
limpid meadow
They were designed more with Covenant targets in mind, but they have operated against Human rebellion as well
cedar surge
Thought they were made during the HCW. Must have got the dates messed up
vague scroll
no you're right
coarse hedge
IIIs were used right up until 2552
vague scroll
but the Insurrectionists never stopped fighting even when the Covenant War was going
limpid meadow
And @vague scroll there are "up to six 2-man teams at a time"
limpid meadow
AH, I see now
cedar surge
"Oh hey our species are all being killed? Lets fight one of our last hopes for survival!"
limpid meadow
It's not quite that simple.
For one thing, the Insurrection isn't a unified singular group, but a bunch of independent groups, some of which have loose associations.
cedar surge
Some innies thought the covenant were only attacking the unsc
limpid meadow
That's correct, yeah
vague scroll
wars are complex beasts, one of my favorite examples of that is that on deep interior planets like Earth - you had people that didn't even believe the Covenant was a existential threat to Humanity since the frontlines were still so far away
cedar surge
Or others that worshiped the flood
limpid meadow
Why would they think that with multiple colonies glassed
@cedar surge They aren't all going to believe the UNSC's claims of multiple glassed colonies.
cedar surge
Really. Even after colonies suddenly went offline,trading ships are not coming from there anymore
Not being able to contact people on the frontier anymore
Informanrs not coming back
gilded mason
With ONI around, you can't trust them even when they say the sky is blue
limpid meadow
Travel and communication between planets prior to and during the war is spotty already. There could be any number of reasons for lost communications and ships.
cedar surge
That Amazon box you ordered from Arcadia being very late
clever fable
Not like people were just dropping casual space-skype calls then.
coarse hedge
Or Future Discord suddenly having a server outage
vague scroll
during the Covenant War, very few communication systems were instantaneous
cedar surge
Would any companies now still be around by then?
vague scroll
500 years from now, not really
coarse hedge
Probably not
terse lava
Microsoft and Disney merge
cedar surge
Oh no
vague scroll
became Misriah Armory @terse lava
limpid meadow
And even if certain rebel groups believed everything the UNSC was telling them, they might still act out hoping to grab any resources they can and hold out until the Covenant is gone.
clever fable
Disney and Amazon aren't going anywhere.
terse lava
No they became ONI
vague scroll
oof
coarse hedge
No that's Google
terse lava
Mouse ears morphed into triangle
limpid meadow
There could be companies from today around in 500 years, but you aren't going to hear about them, generally speaking.
vague scroll
500 years from now, Disney probably won't exist
coarse hedge
Google bought Apple, resurrected Steve Jobs, then made ONI
cedar surge
The McDonald empire of harvest shall beat back the covenant
limpid meadow
Microsoft is canonically still around in the Halo Universe, the same MS that released Windows.
cedar surge
Wait really.
coarse hedge
Naturally
terse lava
Or it, hear me out, ONI used time travel to send Walt Disney back in time to start the company