Just to clarify, Bungie did that, yes?
#lore-and-universe
versed helm
craggy sierra
I don’t care cause that would imply I care about 6 as a character
limpid meadow
Bungie never officially did, they just used the male N6 in their ads.
Which I have a problem with as well, but those are ads. Easy enough to disregard.
versed helm
Oh, so you're telling me that people assumed that he was a male based on ads?
limpid meadow
The first printed mention of N6's gender was New Blood
craggy sierra
I liked Mass Effect 3 having the reversible box art with fem shep on the other side.
limpid meadow
ME3 embracing Fem-Shep was a great move by Bioware!
queen otter
Oh, so you're telling me that people assumed that he was a male based on ads?
No people actually know he’s male as of 2018
versed helm
That's not what I was referring to, Rome.
We are talking about the period around Reach's release.
queen otter
I know. But yes back then people prolly did assume.
queen otter
Ok
limpid meadow
Bungie always considered N6 to be canonically Male and we knew that thanks to Stephen Loftus. Still, it was never printed until New Blood
versed helm
Do you have a source for Stephen Loftus' quote?
queen otter
Well I remember when it said it in New Blood. Jun referred to Noble Six as an honorable man or a good man, something along the lines of that.
limpid meadow
I'll have to check as the quote says that N6 was referred to as male in the Essential Visual Guide, which I don't recall.
But still, there you go
versed helm
Thanks, interestingly enough, the Bungie page keeps his gender redacted.
limpid meadow
Yep. I wish it had stayed that way.
carmine sleet
Aye, agreed
versed helm
Anyway, we went on a tangent, I'm mainly afraid of what 343i will do with his character.
limpid meadow
Why? They haven't done anything with him yet and likely never will.
versed helm
They already established which planet he is from.
I'm afraid that they will add too much lore for him.
queen otter
Establishing where he was born makes you worry what they will do with him?
versed helm
Yes, because he is supposed to remain mysterious.
queen otter
He still does.
limpid meadow
Establishing what planet he's from doesn't ruin any mystery.
versed helm
It's because of what I mentioned earlier, I'm pessimistic with 343i.
queen otter
If anything that just makes me wonder even more about his character.
versed helm
This massively subjective discussion is probably just a waste of our time.
queen otter
Then don’t continue it.
versed helm
You literally kept responding to questions that were not directed to you, I don't want to hear it.
queen otter
That got defensive real quick, for some odd reason.
carmine sleet
Anyhow! New topic! Unggoy Farmer! What type of game do people think it is?
carmine sleet
Unggoy Farmer is something that exists, it's mentioned in Hunt the Truth season 2
versed helm
I just realised something about the nickname for the H2A BDU, it doesn't make sense to call it the "Insurrection Era BDU" if the Reach variant resembles the H3 ODST one more.
queen otter
Ok
versed helm
HW2 doesn't use the H2A BDU.
limpid meadow
It does
versed helm
Which 3D model are you referring to?
limpid meadow
versed helm
I like the balaclava and shooting glasses combo
That's just a trailer though, I don't remember any cutscenes including ODSTs.
Nah, sadly they didn’t have any
It’d be cool to see properly what ODSTs are like in a Blur combat scene
And yes, I love the balaclava with the visor combination.
👌
Always liked it as a kid playing the first Halo Wars. It made me happy to see that Halo’s good guys look cool unlike any other franchise out there LOL
My favourite design for the Marines.
Big Agree. The.. 5-marked production Swiss cheese holes
Iconic design queue right there. Also the three pattern
It just looks so awesome to me.
Also looks like it could take a couple rounds
The body armour does, not so much for the helmets.
Like they’re ready for what’s coming
Yeah the helmets have the big bulbous glasses in that trailer
Which I still think looks cool
A goofy stance, but it looks like he is wearing a hoodie.
YES. I was literally picturing that guy
Lmao.
I also really like the ridge-y accent below the eye lining
They all make the Spartans feel like they’re cut from the same crop, increasing the sense of heroism with them
When they have similar design queues
Indeed, they look pretty heroic and professional.
obsidian thistle
@versed helm note Halopedias nickname for that BDU is only a "description based" one cause we have no name for it.
Tbh we very seldom get names for Marine armor like we did in great detail in og Halo 2.
versed helm
Oh, I wasn't referring to what Halopedia calls it.
carmine sleet
Brutes have had quite a few things happen, some are part of the Banished, a major faction in the post war era, while others are part of various Covenant splinter groups or went back to their homeworld
With the Banished specifically, they're quite important going forward given that they're going to be in Halo Infinite, likely because of how well received they were after their first appearance in Halo Wars 2
idle reef
So we might fight brutes in infinite
carmine sleet
I'd say it's highly likely
Like, I'd be surprised if with all the Banished Mega Construx sets featuring Brutes for Halo Infinite that have been revealed, only for the final game to not feature Brutes
cedar surge
I hope a lot of halo wars stuff transfers into infinite
Like for the unsc and banished
Vulture vs banished scarab would he awesome to see
Maybe in the background?
lethal comet
slipstream technician you know about the halo reach mega construx
cedar surge
Like how the unsc and covenant were fighting in the background in reach
Do you think there are still unsc holdouts on reach?
versed helm
Vulture would be overpowered for multiplayer.
lethal comet
areas around forerunner structures survived on reach
ornate hinge
take the vulture in customs
hybrid junco
vague scroll
the majority of Reach was glassed, at it's worst in visual media - if you have ever played the Reach map Condemned, Reach looks like a second sun
at the same time, unlike other human colonies under Covenant attack - Reach saw one of the largest invasion fleets on record
carmine sleet
I think the visual of Reach on Condemned isn't lore accurate. The Covenant didn't turn Reach into what is basically a star. That would require a whole load more energy than glassing
limpid meadow
I hate how the glassing of Reach is visualized on Condemned. It's definitely not lore-accurate to anything at that time.
Though we can see from the Halo: The Fall of Reach animated series that it seems to be the canon end of Reach at this point :\
vague scroll
it's certainly not a favorite depiction but as you said it seems to be the widely accepted one
limpid meadow
As I recall, Reach's glassing as described in, I believe, *First Strike * (might have been TFoR though) was said to be lighter than some other planets.
The way Reach looks at the start of Halo Reach is absolute perfection
west silo
Meridean kinda looks like glassed reach in the Conan fodder
limpid meadow
I'd argue it's the other way around, but yeah
Current depictions of glassed Reach are on the heavy-damage side.
vague scroll
most glassed colonies tend to look like blackened orbs so that's to be expected
limpid meadow
Yeah, but Reach wasn't supposed to be like that.
vague scroll
I find Harvest's glassed surface in Warfleet interesting in that it looks like the markings across it surface are more ritualistic in a manner similar to Kholo in The Return, though it could just be repeated bombardment has covered it in rounded craters
limpid meadow
I love the way Meridian looks, but I feel Reach was a bit much
vague scroll
I'm still grumpy about Meridian having an Earth-like gravity but being smaller than our moon
vague scroll
very true
limpid meadow
Earth-normal, but it's the size of Mars (roughly)
I generally chalk that up to the Forerunners messing with those planets.
west silo
I love the way Meridian looks, but I feel Reach was a bit much
@limpid meadow
Wasn't that the point?
Reach was total annihilation while Meridean was a rushed job
limpid meadow
Imagine how confused human scientists must have been, lol
vague scroll
in some of the Halopedia discussions I've had, I've reached a point where I've come to push the idea of large gravity plate generators under colonial settlements on low-g worlds
limpid meadow
Wasn't that the point?
Reach was total annihilation while Meridean was a rushed job
@west silo I don't recall any lore that said Meridian was rushed.
vague scroll
it's a headcanon that probably will never have any merit in the wider universe but it's at least a thematically-appropriate answer
the Meridian conflict lasted on and off limited engagements for 3 years
it certainly wasn't rushed
west silo
I think it was in the Conan fodder for Meridean
it certainly wasn't rushed
@vague scroll
The fleet was able to defend Meridean for the 3 years
vague scroll
checking halopedia, it's sourced from Halo 5's mission intel @limpid meadow - apparently it was rushed, only a third of the planet was covered in glassed material
*air force technically
west silo
*air force technically
@vague scroll
The space force
checking halopedia, it's sourced from Halo 5's mission intel @limpid meadow - apparently it was rushed, only a third of the planet was covered in glassed material
@vague scroll
Haha
limpid meadow
Well there you go
vague scroll
easily overlooked info I guess
limpid meadow
But the part that was glassed seems to have been hit really hard
west silo
To be honest we rarely actually see glassed planets in visual media for halo so maybe its different fleets having different standards
cedar surge
If the unsc had ship shielding during the start of the war would have the war gone on longer?
gilded mason
Perhaps a tiny bit longer.
Or maybe getting past the shielding is so negligible to actually finding colonies that nothing actually changes at all.
steep pewter
So guys how many total Spartans were dispatched to Reach to defend the Generator stations?
gilded mason
It might delay stuff near very beginning of the war, but once the Covenant see slightly more resistance, they would in turn provide more ships to cover the difference.
ornate hinge
is it true that the UNSC was getting groups of ships just to destroy one covenant cruiser?
gilded mason
Yeah
ornate hinge
thats scary ngl
full forge
If the UNSC had ship shielding equal to the covenant's, then they would have actually had an advantage during the war.
Reach never would have happened.
The Covenant's biggest advantage was in their ship to ship combat, UNSC ships just didn't have the defenses to last a volley of torpedoes. If they could survive long enough for their MAC to recharge for a second shot, then the war would at least have put humanity on a level playing field.
gilded mason
If the UNSC had ship shielding equal to the covenant's, then they would have actually had an advantage during the war.```
And the Covenant would do nothing in response to this? Make no changes to strategy or troop deployment?I don't see what you're trying to get at.
gilded mason
What I mean is, the UNSC having better tech would ripple out to how the Covenant interact with them. One change causes another change, etc.
full forge
Okay, but the tech was the covenant's biggest advantage. And the shielding was arguably the biggest tech advantage.
gilded mason
Okay, but the tech was the covenant's biggest advantage.
And numbers
full forge
Shields take a lot more punishment than titanium-A
Actually at the beginning of the war I don't think they really had a massive numbers advantage.
Remember Halo Wars?
The Covenant was literally searching forerunner relics for ships because they didn't have enough.
feral perch
That’s not exactly true.
craggy sierra
Given how they first attack I don’t even think human numbers are that relevant.
feral perch
They were searching for Forerunner relics because that’s their Modus Operandi
They stumbled upon the ships. They weren’t specifically looking for warships to bolster their fleet.
full forge
Listen to Regret's discussion with the Arbiter again.
craggy sierra
They kinda just spook into a solar system one minute and head out the next. Maybe if at the start if the war it was a massive assault in open space we could’ve had numbers but that’s never been how encounters play out.
feral perch
I know what they say.
craggy sierra
Most if the time a system never knew the covenant was there until stuff started exploding
feral perch
It’s just dramatic dialogue. Regret has always been worried about threats to High Charity.
craggy sierra
And at that time all the covenant ever had to worry themselves with were the current system’s defenses
Because the UNSC is not always everywhere at once
I’m not even sure what was determining the covenant’s war path through the galaxy tbh or if they just kept showing up at places we just happened to be to look for forerunner stuff.
gilded mason
I feel like it was the latter
craggy sierra
Cause they didn’t even know about earth.
Until some forerunner stuff told them there was some other forerunner stuff there
So they weren’t even there because of us
So it’s hard to strategize an effective defense against a massive force that can just appear where it whims.
vague scroll
fictional space warfare tends to be comparable to minesweeper, there so much empty space and unimportant targets and the area is so big you don't know where anything is
versed helm
Did you know? Master Chief can stick it. https://youtu.be/xnitoUF8WfI?t=118
vague scroll
the Covenant struggled with this very situation
most of the time when discovering human colonies - they came across them by accident, pursued human starships that made it back to a colony, or captured human ships and used the intelligence aboard to find colonies
it's why the war lasted so long and was even prolonged thanks to simple military recommendations like the Cole Protocol in destroying navigational information in the event that a starship was to be boarded by Covenant forces
on the record of how the Covenant found Earth, Regret himself encountered a Forerunner luminary that informed him of the location of Earth and wasn't aware of its significance to humans - that's why he brought such a small expeditionary fleet and wasn't aware of it's status as the human homeworld. At the same time, Truth already knew of Earth's location and importance and was preparing an invasion fleet magnitudes larger for invasion but this fleet was destroyed during the events of First Strike through intervention by Blue Team.
full forge
Cole Protocol was much more than a recommendation 😉
vague scroll
I call it a simple recommendation more in terms of the very simple manner it was in. Yeah it was law but the concept behind it is very simple tbh, something that seems like a no brainer
versed helm
can ai's like cortana get 'bored' during large amounts of time? because at the end of halo 3 it was weird because she says it could be years and chief is just like 'oh wake me when u need me' and she kinda just stands there.
or can cortana also put herself to 'sleep' like chief did?
vague scroll
AIs cannot shut themselves down
and Smart AIs as they're often aptly described in lore "think themselves to death"
in the Halo 4: Forward Unto Dawn film Cortana scenes, she says for the entire 4 years they spent drifting she says she's been thinking and then later she tells herself "thinking is what's killing you."
versed helm
@vague scroll i haven't played halo 4 yet so im not going to read that last bit.
im playing halo wars right now after playing 1 2 3 and reach
gilded mason
Forward Unto Dawn was released before Halo 4 came out, just as an FYI
last anchor
Aye, and a nice look into the non-Spartan side of things.
sullen badger
soft granite
Just noticed that Halo Fall of Reach was actually released a month before Combat Evolved.
Always thought it released after for some reason.
humble yacht
MS commissioned Nylund to write the novel before the release of the game so the novel could drum up interest for the game
bungie wasn't too happy with this decision, and Nylund ultimately wrote the novel in like 6 weeks
soft granite
Still pretty good for 6 weeks of writing.
versed helm
i thought the flood only came when the covalent messed with halo but im playing wars and theres flood???
soft granite
@versed helm https://www.halopedia.org/Forerunner-Flood_war
@versed helm https://www.halopedia.org/Etran_Harborage
versed helm
@soft granite i thought the forerunners killed everone got rid of flood etc. but it remained onboard halo and covalent released it when they where messing with halo?
halo wars is only 50 years before tho not thousands.
soft granite
Same with that Shield World but it was something else that released it there.
An outbreak happened there long before the Spirit Of Fire or the Covenant arrived there.
versed helm
oh and thats the world they have went too?
soft granite
Yea second link is the Shield World for Halo Wars
carmine sleet
halo wars is only 50 years before tho not thousands.
Halo Wars 1 was just over 20 years before CE
soft granite
@versed helm The lore reasons for why the Flood are in Halo Wars is more or less the same reason they are in Combat Evolved. There was a Flood Research facility on the Shield World that had an outbreak although it happened long before the Spirit Of Fire ever got there since the whole surface was already covered in Flood Biomass and Spores when they got there.
vague scroll
no that's wrong, @soft granite Shield Worlds were used as glorified bomb shelters against the Flood and later the Halos. The reason for the presence of Flood on Etran Harborage remains unexplained but they've been there for a long time. Long before the Covenant or Humans arrived by the looks of it given that their units in Halo Wars are mostly based on the local wildlife rather than infected Covenant and human forces.
You're correct about the Flood research facilities on the Halos though, those were certainly caused by an outbreak.
cedar surge
So do you think the unsc only exists on run away ships right now or are conducting guerrilla warfare
And from the ONI halo 3 archive it seems ONI is still kicking around.
fair hazel
We don't know when it takes place.
cedar surge
Man earth must have gotten wrecked by the created. Cortana cleary doesn't care about civilian casualties. She would probably massacre half the planet before she got the planet since the population would fight back
vague scroll
it's a bit of everything right now, mostly just hints through little lore info we got from some of the books, lore drops, and armor descriptions that at least paint a picture of post-Created announcement to the galaxy
we don't know that, and tbh, we've already seen large groups join up with the Created due to their promise of utopia. The Unggoy of Balaho all joined on readily.
on Earth, there's mention of ONI recon teams still fighting a guerrilla war against the Created occupation according to the Recon helmet description in H5
but on the other hand, you got some of the URF featured in Bad Blood surrendering to the Created because it was the best option at the time for them
even for all the loss of life, the Created has already managed to at least improve things for some communities that have submitted to them
terse lava
Who would that be besides the unggoy
cedar surge
Can't imagine the jackles would submit
fair hazel
logically everyone who cooperates, i bet Aleria is in a good spot
cedar surge
Maybe canon fodder races like the drones
The unsc is going to have to start mass producing AI to fight AI
humble yacht
lol, that's not happening
cedar surge
Any talks of giving AI's rights will probably be massively set back after the huge loss of life
Oh right
You don't have to make AI to fight AI
But the unsc could have avoided the entire created crises if they just did one thing
humble yacht
bad joke incoming...
cedar surge
download nordVPN!
terse lava
I just feel bad for the loyal AI
cedar surge
use the link in the description to get a 30 day free trial
Oh yea
Because nobody is gonna trust them for decades
terse lava
Even more so that one AI from black team who did a trial for AI rights
Decades? Likely centuries
cedar surge
The AI I feel bad for the most
Are the ones in the assembly
They were planning on revealing themselves but because of cortana they cant
Nobody would trust them
Especially after learning the assembly was "guiding" humanity
Cortana and her created messed everything up
terse lava
Just wait till humanity learns of the logic plague properly
They will go thr way of the Covenant
cedar surge
They are going to start making smarter dumb AI so they don't have to rely on smart AI
terse lava
Possible
cedar surge
I really hope 343 doesn't do a "after the war the unsc and created worked together to find solutions to the AIs limited life span"
No
Nope
humble yacht
when i actually think about the logic plague critically, i find it pretty dumb
terse lava
Funny that I did not consider that before
cedar surge
That's like having the unsc and covenant just put aside their differences and just becoming friends
terse lava
Well yes the logic plague is pretty much magic
humble yacht
it was more compelling when the Gravemind convinced MB to defect through pure debate skills, and then MB chose willingly to defect based on that, only realizing his errors after the fact
instead of just making it so that MB got sick
cedar surge
The unsc would likely terminate hundreds maybe thousands of AI for turning traitor
Anti AI measures and heavy AI regulations would be put in place
terse lava
I agree Chimera, the original way was better
Thinking on it now, it seems more the same, the debate part but you are secretly re-writing their brain while they talked with you
Such a dumb idea
cedar surge
Humanity would rarely put a AI into a position of such high power again
AI in halo used to be different in that they mostly tried to help their creators (except when the flood get involved) and now they are just another AI dictatorship hellbent on domination
terse lava
Sadly true
cedar surge
Just because Bungie thought of it does not mean its a good idea
terse lava
Well it was a nice change of pace from typical AI in a scifi
terse lava
I doubt a "usual" unless we dive into the forerunner era
cedar surge
Well that is unless the unsc terminates every AI that did not stay loyal
And I don't think a lot of people would defend those AI now
After all they've done
terse lava
I am actually curious how the remaining thousands of San shyuum are taking all this and if they have a guardian chasing them
cedar surge
They are probably dancing around from getting a visit from a worker of the gods
But yea AI in halo or specifically the created have massively messed up
Though we do know that 40 years after the fall of reach human colonists have re colonized reach with not a guardian in sight
So the unsc will probably come back
I can't see any other organisations replacing the unsc
And maybe the unsc will learn not. To treat the outer colonies like trash or innies stop being so trigger happy
terse lava
Or the sangheili say "enough of this crap" and just put humanity in a new covenant/citadel alliance
cedar surge
Pls no
Humanity already are inheritors of the mantle
I don't want them at the head of any galactic government
vague scroll
the Assembly isn't considered canonical at the moment, given that Grim isn't a fan of them and treats the data logs from Reach canon-dubious
humble yacht
humanity should dissolve the idea of the mantle after claiming it
vague scroll
the Mantle of Responsibility is a doctrine held by the most powerful civilization in the galaxy at a time and they assume guardianship and control over all affairs within their domain
cedar surge
"...powerful civilization in the galaxy..."
vague scroll
if something doesn't fit with the holder of the Mantle's views, the holders of the Mantle are obligated to intervene
vague scroll
not at all
terse lava
We accept
Though even being a holder of the mantle is bonk due to the precursors can just pop in and say no
humble yacht
screw the Swords of Sanghelios
cedar surge
I feel like humanity in sci fi are given to many advantages
humble yacht
give me the Halberds of Hesduros anyday
vague scroll
Created directly subverted control of the remaining Forerunner tech scattered through the galaxy, being an adopted Tier 1 faction they are now the kings of the galaxy
cedar surge
@humble yacht ONI will oblidge
terse lava
Why you do this Chimera :(
humble yacht
the created don't control all forerunner tech
vague scroll
they control what matters, I should clarify 😐
terse lava
We only know they control guardians
cedar surge
We should have nuked mantels approach multiple times
humble yacht
and a couple halos
terse lava
I dont see any fortresses flying around again
Ok yes couple halos too but I mean regular forerunner vessels of war
humble yacht
mantle's approach wouldn't have allowed nukes to get close enough to do damage
vague scroll
we don't have enough info to go off of but one way or another they've completely destabilized current galactic affairs
cedar surge
Point defense are down
vague scroll
if they're not the most powerful faction in the galaxy right now, I don't know who is
cedar surge
Yap Yap the destroyer obviously
vague scroll
he's a meme character, doesn't count 😛
especially when we still don't know where he sits in canon
cedar surge
Do you think cortana is forcing colonization efforts?
vague scroll
plus his only real influence is among the rebel Unggoy on the Ark that once served the banished
what do you mean forcing?
cedar surge
Making species make new colonies
humble yacht
no
cedar surge
Don't see why she would terraform planets otherwise
vague scroll
I don't know about you but that's what humans have been wanting this entire time
humans were already trying to
humble yacht
more likely offering new territory to obedient species
"you been good so here's a planet"
vague scroll
they've inspired a nationalism in the Unggoy we haven't seen since the Unggoy rebellions
Balaho actually has functioning war factories after centuries without activity
humble yacht
and replinishable food
terse lava
True
vague scroll
aye, they're no longer a backwater - under the Created, they've been revitalized
cedar surge
So what characters do you think are more worthy of the mantle than cortana? Atriox,arbiter,Johnson?
vague scroll
apparently that's more valuable than a UEG embassy Chimera
humble yacht
nobody is worthy of the mantle
vague scroll
the mantle doesn't belong to anyone, it's an idea - it doesn't belong to an individual
cedar surge
Yea the mantle is a stupid concept
humble yacht
everybody is flawed, nobody is worthy of ruling over everyone else
vague scroll
it's a bad idea, sure, but it's not 'stupid' in that sense
cedar surge
@vague scroll tell that to the forerunners
cedar surge
Your telling one civilization that they rule over all others
vague scroll
they had the power to back it up, it was their state religion, that's what they stood for and for centuries they controlled the galaxy without challenge
cedar surge
Many things go wrong
vague scroll
apparently it worked for the Forerunners for a long, long time
humble yacht
at what cost
cedar surge
Oh and
humble yacht
no i mean at what cost to other species
cedar surge
Trillioms
humble yacht
think about what the forerunners did to humanity, and the prophets
vague scroll
oh, absolutely good question - there's no good answer there
cedar surge
Yea the forerunners did not care
vague scroll
oh they did care
humble yacht
the forerunners were just the biggest kid on the block, but they were still just another kid
cedar surge
Deevolved humans and shunned the prophets
vague scroll
if they didn't care they would have just forced those species into extinction
they cared a lot
it's a lot harder to 'devolve' human society to make them successfully start from scratch
cedar surge
Forerunners were the biggest kid before the flood came
humble yacht
the flood wasn't a kid on the block
vague scroll
the Flood wasn't a new threat, it was just a continuation of the old great threat
cedar surge
It was a adult
humble yacht
nope
it was more like the car that comes down the street too fast and runs over all the kids
cedar surge
I see
vague scroll
the Flood was the legacy of the Precursor existence, as it currently stands - Forerunners and Humans were created by the Precursors
cedar surge
This is why you don't put 6 pedals for 4 directions
vague scroll
the Flood according to the Ancient One is a continuation of the Precursor's will
humble yacht
lol, tide we are speaking in metaphors, we don't need an actual definition of the flood
vague scroll
though how much you can actually trust the words of a gravemind is... well
😛
sorry
cedar surge
"Yes human,take of your protective armor,I just want to give you cookies"
vague scroll
I just feel like the metaphorical discussion over simplifies how complicated the actual situation was
humble yacht
that's intentional
cedar surge
So all of halo can be summed up to "forerunners fault"
vague scroll
yeah that could be a way to look at it,
humble yacht
kind of, sure
cedar surge
You know what would be cool
humble yacht
frost grenades
vague scroll
blamite powder gun
cedar surge
If another faction came who made their own FTL that's not slipspace
Also grunt launcher
humble yacht
pretty sure slipspace was invented to give a fictional justification to FTL travel
because halo wants to be grounded enough in science
vague scroll
^
humble yacht
most sci fi makes FTL involve alternate dimensions because of the scientific fact that anything with mass cannot achieve a velocity of c
cedar surge
A millinuem old alien using "telekinesis" to hold up a guy in a 1000 pound green suit
vague scroll
when halo has artificial gravity that's not hard to believe for Forerunner tech
cedar surge
Oh yea on the topic of the suit
humble yacht
constraint fields could be explained as an application of gravity
vague scroll
heck, the Covenant pretty much achieve a rudimentary version of telekinesis
cedar surge
I think 343 nailed the new design
vague scroll
gravity hammer, fist of rukt, the restraining field that held Guilty Spark in place on High Charity
cedar surge
It looks like it could weigh 1000 pounds
vague scroll
GEN2 is half the weight of GEN1, still waiting for what makes GEN3 different
cedar surge
And it actually looks like a suit and not that the body is the suit
GEN3 is 1/4th the weight?
Wait no
The new suit looks heavier than anything we seen
humble yacht
gen3 took the increased strength enchancement from GEN2 and the increased protection of GEN1 and combined them
vague scroll
if it was a quarter, you'd have an armor of 250 pounds, that doesn't sound right at all
humble yacht
in all likelihood GEN3 weighs the same as GEN1, maybe slightly more/less
vague scroll
I'd be happy with that assessment till we learn a bit more about it Chimera
humble yacht
pretty sure it says that in the Spartan Field Manual
vague scroll
I haven't checked my SFM in a while so I can't recall exactly but I do remember a vague description of GEN3 kinda
west silo
gen3 took the increased strength enchancement from GEN2 and the increased protection of GEN1 and combined them
@humble yacht.
Soo no thrusters for increased mobility
vague scroll
nah that's still in, it's a basic function of MJOLNIR
even GEN1 had it
it may just not appear as it does in Halo 5
humble yacht
yep
west silo
nah that's still in, it's a basic function of MJOLNIR
@vague scroll
I hope it does because I kinda like them and it would create a lore problem
vague scroll
just because you don't see something, doesn't mean that it is/isn't there
versed helm
This has probably been clarified before, but does 343 Guilty Spark’s line towards Chief in Halo 3: ”You are the child of my makers, inheritor of all they’ve left behind. You ARE Forerunner.” contradict following lore in games and books about Forerunners and humans being separate species?
humble yacht
reclaimers are metaphorically forerunners
versed helm
So can this GEN 3 synthesise oxygen intake or something? Chief’s survival mode was on for at least a few months
humble yacht
by the time of Halo 3, bungie had decided behind the scenes that forerunners and humans were separate
So can this GEN 3 synthesise oxygen intake or something? Chief’s survival mode was on for at least a few months
source?
versed helm
Ah, I see. So GS wasn’t literally calling Chief a Forerunner?
humble yacht
no
versed helm
Just the Halo Infinite e3 trailer
humble yacht
what makes you think he was out there for months?
versed helm
Well, lost in space, after a battle that went silent enough for Echo 216 to sit around waiting in
humble yacht
Echo 216 wouldn't notice battles happening around him because sound doesn't travel in space
versed helm
And Chief implied to not be aware of anything that happened
Also I’m aware that the Didact and the Librarian are mentioned in Halo 3’s terminals. But is there anything in them that explicitly says that humans and Forerunners are a separate species? AFAIK humanity is never even specifically mentioned in the terminals.
humble yacht
the closest thing is a message from Librarian where she's on earth and talks about the native species (humans)
vague scroll
there's too little information to support any assumptions @versed helm
humble yacht
the way she refers to them suggests they are different from her
vague scroll
in the H3 terminals there wasn't really a distinction between Forerunners and Humans @versed helm
at least in terms of species
craggy sierra
Also I’m aware that the Didact and the Librarian are mentioned in Halo 3’s terminals. But is there anything in them that explicitly says that humans and Forerunners are a separate species? AFAIK humanity is never even specifically mentioned in the terminals.
Look at what the librarian and didact look like then look at what a normal person looks like
vague scroll
the hard distinction came later with 343i
humble yacht
as I said, bungie decided they were different before making H3
vague scroll
@craggy sierra we didn't get a visual representation of the Librarian and Didact till years after Halo 3 came out
west silo
Look at what the librarian and didact look like then look at what a normal person looks like
@craggy sierra.
Hey at least it's not titan
vague scroll
Project Titan had some interesting concepts, I'm not the biggest fan of a Halo MMO styled after Warcraft but it had some beautiful world designs
west silo
Project Titan had some interesting concepts, I'm not the biggest fan of a Halo MMO styled after Warcraft but it had some beautiful world designs
@vague scroll
Exposed breast masterchief still makes me chuckle
versed helm
Honestly I always read Spark’s line as saying that Chief was Forerunner due to his armor and augmentations.
cedar surge
Cuse me what
humble yacht
more like because of his status as a reclaimer and his inherent craziness
versed helm
This might just be the boomer inside of me but I kind of miss the air of mystery and ambiguity the first three Halo games had, there was a very show don’t tell approach taken which engaged the imagination and allowed it to become as much of the universe as the lore itself.
queen otter
I actually saw a lot of this with the new halos too, if I’m understanding what you are saying.
Tbh I’ve been pretty happy with how 343 makes halo. I really liked H4 and HW2 was pretty amazing when I first saw played. Apart from the fact that’s it’s rts of course.
humble yacht
Going deeper into the forerunners was a logical next step for the halo series if it wanted to continue after 3
versed helm
I think in an interview Marty O’Donnell said that Bungie considered the extended universe canon for the most part, but the games always took precedent due to wanting to make the campaign easy to follow/understand and more importantly, fun to play. 343 seems to have taken the opposite approach.
humble yacht
otherwise we'd just have repeating covenant over and over
gilded mason
Not really. They had a whole new post-war world to explore.
humble yacht
which we still kind of get anyway
west silo
This might just be the boomer inside of me but I kind of miss the air of mystery and ambiguity the first three Halo games had, there was a very show don’t tell approach taken which engaged the imagination and allowed it to become as much of the universe as the lore itself.
@versed helm
There's still Alot of mysteries
versed helm
Neither approach is innately good or bad honestly.
But I have a bit more of a preference towards how Bungie tackled lore.
humble yacht
post-war world would have just been covenant remnants in the games if not forerunners
not to mention that post-war Halo was explored in the books, but political intrigue doesn't make for blockbuster games
craggy sierra
Mass Effect wants a word
versed helm
tbh I’ve always been sympathetic towards muh political allegories. Star Trek is great.
It’s a shame new Star Trek has kind of taken the direction of more or less being a Star Wars clone, probably because people don’t like watching diplomacy now or something like that.
humble yacht
mass effect is an rpg. not sure an RPG halo is what the fans would want
majority of fans, at least
terse lava
To be honest(and yes bit biased) while I enjoyed the forerunner trilogy, would have enjoyed covenant past based books too
humble yacht
bit
lol
terse lava
Ok fine biased in general 😛
Heck you want me to round it out, we have yet to see a book set in the early UNSC days
vague scroll
Ado, this is an intervention for your love of Sangheili
We need to sit down and talk about this
You’ve stopped worshipping the Forerunners
You’ve started saying wort in your sleep
terse lava
Hey, I can stop it whenever I wa-WORT WORT WORT WORT WORT WORT
vague scroll
See! See?
terse lava
😂
versed helm
Hey guys.
vague scroll
You have a problem Ado, we’re here to help
terse lava
Why was the chief and some sangheili shooting at a overflowing river? To stop the flood
vague scroll
@humble yacht did you know Atriox doesn’t like puns? He’ll tear you to pieces for that one
queen otter
No to assert dominance, Ado.
vague scroll
Another pun!
west silo
Hey, I can stop it whenever I wa-WORT WORT WORT WORT WORT WORT
@terse lava
U need to speak human all l hear is worth worth wort
terse lava
Heh
versed helm
What’s your favourite generation of Spartan armor? I like Manure MK VI.
terse lava
If I had to choose
queen otter
Standard Mark IV.
terse lava
SPI
versed helm
I honestly feel bad for Chris of HaloFollower though lol
queen otter
He gets shredded by the halo community lol.
versed helm
Dude’s mispronunciations have made him the butt of many jokes in the community.
versed helm
That too.
queen otter
Well that and some of his clickbaity vids and absurd predictions.
versed helm
But he also doesn’t know how to pronounce things like Mjolnir.
vague scroll
It’s the misinformation specifically that had people up in arms, everything else is tangential
queen otter
What does he misinform? I don’t watch him much.
versed helm
versed helm
"But MAH NEEER!"
humble yacht
i used to pronounce it Ma-join-er
west silo
And stretching out his videos
vague scroll
The clickbait titles are just the tip of the iceberg but I don’t think it’s conducive to a good community if we turn this place into a place to pick on other members of the community
terse lava
I used to pronounce the armor as "major"
craggy sierra
He failed to pay creators who helped him make his content.
terse lava
So not that bad
queen otter
When?
queen otter
Wow.
vague scroll
It’s really old discussion points so best move on
humble yacht
good idea
west silo
Question what happened to thespearhead
humble yacht
not a topic for this server
versed helm
Sir, I'm hear to report that there's this guy named Rick.
terse lava
Sorry guns, classified
versed helm
And I kid you not he turns himself into a pickle.
terse lava
I can only hear Rtas saying that dumb line now
versed helm
Did you see the video where Steve Downes does the entire Pickle Rick line in Chief's voice? lol
humble yacht
most people saw it
terse lava
Oh dear...
versed helm
His accent seems to be getting thicker.
humble yacht
it wasn't a professional recording so it's not like he took it too serious
terse lava
Fun question here I guess, had Fortcheno, the Lord of Admirals somehow survived into the present day, think he would be much help for humanity during the war?
humble yacht
no
west silo
Fun question here I guess, had Fortcheno, the Lord of Admirals somehow survived into the present day, think he would be much help for humanity during the war?
@terse lava
The guy would be dust in a chair
vague hollow
117 times 7 is 819. 819 is Hamish Sinclair. He is a legend.
versed helm
What do you guys think of the Spartans in the Infinite toyline seemingly having Reach-era armor?
versed helm
Is it new armor that's just styled after earlier Mark V armor? Like the Noble armor set in 5?
Or did the UNSC just decide on a whim to go back to older armor?
humble yacht
i think it's just because reach armor was modular which makes for good toys
lots of potential for mix and matching
vague hollow
It's alongside the banished so technically it would be mk5. But Chimera is right about the design.
versed helm
Also is there any more officially released information regarding the mystery of the MA40?
cedar surge
So are the in construction ships just sitting there,or destroyed. Like the eternity and ships being built over mars
humble yacht
like the mega bloks sets show a H3 style elite in one of them, I don't think it can be taken at face value in terms of what we'll see in the game
no info on the MA40
versed helm
I think it's foreshadowing one thing for sure: TIME TRAVEL
Chief goes back in time and finds Noble 6, in his cave of course.
cedar surge
NO
versed helm
You then get a boss fight where you have to defeat Noble 6 as Chief, who's gone crazy after subsisting on nothing but cave fungus for years.
cedar surge
NO TIME TRAVEL,NO MORE SIX HIDING IN THE CAVE. THE COVENANT SHOULD HAVE GLASSED ALL OF REACH
terse lava
Did pretty much, left only a single rocky cavern where a forerunner relic lay. But it's all good
west silo
I think it's foreshadowing one thing for sure: TIME TRAVEL
@Just Jon#346
Cortana was skynet along
versed helm
You know what would really subvert expectations?
If Noble 6 actually kills Chief, after he travels back in time, then takes on the mantle of Chief, leading to a time paradox that destroys the entire universe.
terse lava
This was all Thel imagining worst case if he failed in slaying the demon at alpha halo ?
west silo
You know what would really subvert expectations?
@versed helm
Have master chief die in the second mission and let the killer go to show rhat were better than them
queen otter
Oh yeah. That’s great story telling.
cedar surge
No have master chief for in the 1st custscene
humble yacht
You know what would really subvert expectations?
Infinite actually continuing the plot of H5 instead of trying to course correct at the expense of a cohesive narrative
west silo
Oh yeah. That’s great story telling.
@queen otter
GOTY
versed helm
Isn't Infinite more or less a spiritual reboot according to what's been said thus far?
humble yacht
spiritual reboot refers to the feeling they're going for and not necessarily the story
craggy sierra
That doesn't mean a cannonical reboot
cedar surge
Hey guys I have as idea
versed helm
Yeah no, otherwise I would have just said reboot.
cedar surge
Mantis run
versed helm
I don't think 343 would want to wipe all of the lore pertaining to their own games.
queen otter
They wouldn’t
cedar surge
That would be as bad as the EU wipe for star wars
west silo
spiritual reboot refers to the feeling they're going for and not necessarily the story
@humble yacht
Like GOW 4
craggy sierra
I thought that EU wipe wasn't even a full thing
queen otter
I don’t see halo getting a reboot at all actually. I could just see them ending the series off.
craggy sierra
Considering literally nothing of the EU would have implications on the stories Disney's told
versed helm
Basically Disney declared everything in Star Wars non-canon save for a few things of course, like all the movies.
queen otter
Games, movies, tv series, books and all.
west silo
I thought that EU wipe wasn't even a full thing
@craggy sierra
Most of its gone
versed helm
The EU and Disney canon exist as separate continuities effectively.
west silo
Considering literally nothing of the EU would have implications on the stories Disney's told
@craggy sierra
Dark empire would
cedar surge
So are the unsc weapon manufacturers still around?
versed helm
The MA40 is manufactured by Misriah Armory.
Although it's unknown if it was made before or after the MA5D.
Personally I think it's some intermediate between the MA5B and MA5C.
Er, MA37 and MA5C.
Is it just me by the way, or should Bungie have had a little bit more influence regarding Halo Wars?
I feel like instead of the MA5B, the MA37 would have been used.
It's just so weird to me how the MA37 looks a lot more rugged and older than the MA5B, but apparently that's the opposite in-lore.
humble yacht
iirc bungie didn't want halo wars to be made
unique rune
Pretty sure they didn't yeah, considering they tended to be very unhappy about other people working on their franchise
Don't think it matters especially much either, since MA5Bs showed up in Contact Harvest, which takes place a couple years before Wars
versed helm
MA37 is more or less just an Army designation, but it's just so off-putting how in terms of looks it appears to be an older design.
humble yacht
i'm not too concerned about weapon designs, it still has that AR look
it's not like replacing the AR look with a M40
versed helm
And then there's Halo Combat Evolved Anniversary, where the M45 and M90 shotgun were apparently used at the exact same time?
vague scroll
that's because all Halo weapons have generally existed in the same time period
vehicles too, some of them have been around for a couple centuries
versed helm
Or does Halo CE: Anniversary supersede Halo CE? Meaning the M45 was canonically used by Chief instead?... It's all very odd.
vague scroll
M45 and M90 existed at the same time, they're built from the same basic shotgun frame
same designer too, and a civilian variant called the DTM series
versed helm
Yeah, but around CE did Chief use the M45 or M90?
vague scroll
I don't think it really matters but it's probably canonical to the M90 given that it was in the original CE and likely mentioned in Halo: The Flood ¯_(ツ)_/¯
it's fine if it's either
same shotgun at the end of the day
versed helm
Are CE and CE: Anniversary equally canon then?
vague scroll
both are
even when things contradict
just like how the TFOR book, the animated film, the comic book, and the Reach game are all canon
even if they have visuals that occasionally don't align or details that are odd out
cedar surge
What exactly where the marines supposed to do when they found the covenant capital "planet"? Act as canon fodder for the Spartans?
For operation red flag
The ones on the autumn
versed helm
Also Distant I just noticed your PFP is from Genocidal Organ, great film and book.
vague scroll
aye, yeah, good film - bought the book recently but found it harder to absorb
writing a crossover fanfiction with another anime tied to it but that's probably not a discussion for this chat
@cedar surge marines and the navy go hand and hand, where there are ships there are marines
terse lava
But yes had the OP gone through....goodbye the Autumn, spartans, and Keyes
cedar surge
Funny thing is all of those things are still gone except for a few spartans
So the unsc won either way
west silo
Is omega ream still around
cedar surge
Never confirmed dead
And has the unsc ever used biological weapons against the covenant?
limpid meadow
At least half of Omega Team survived the war. We learn that from their Phoenix Log entry in Halo Wars 2
cedar surge
So how many alive spartan 2s does that make
15?
Can't imagine there would be that many left
limpid meadow
Well, if you mean in general, there have always been 30+ around, just not on the battlefield.
cedar surge
The washouts right?
You know it would be cool if during infinite chief got flashbacks of foehammer when flying with the pelican pilot
gilded mason
Noooo thank you
cedar surge
So when the marines raided the autumn they didn't take the longsword there?
Yea I realise that now
terse lava
Plus foehammer was only a pilot to him, no one special like his childhood crush
cedar surge
They took coil guns but not the longsword
A working longsword would have been useful in the war for the installation
queen otter
You know it would be cool if during infinite chief got flashbacks of foehammer when flying with the pelican pilot
Nostalgia should be a go for Infinite.
Not too much.
I want Infinite to establish something good and feel nostalgic later down the line thinking back on Infinite.
cedar surge
To much nostalgia can be a bad thing
For example. Bringing back legendary halo 2 Jackal snipers for the nostalgia
terse lava
Heck want a real bad example? Duke Nukem
terse lava
Popular early-mid 90s action guy. A company decided to make a new game on the popularity(late 90s) the game didn't come out till 2011
cedar surge
Development hell?
terse lava
9th circle baby
Would have been fun in the hayday....but it apparently hadn't aged well with its nostalgia
west silo
Development hell?
@cedar surge
15 years of hell
cedar surge
Not even rose tinted glasses could save it huh
terse lava
Yep
cedar surge
How do you even work on a single game for 15 years. Shouldn't have they given up at some point
terse lava
Wanna know the funny part
versed helm
Yes
terse lava
Had heard it took so long, an employee left, made his own studio, and became so successful that he pity helped his old boss with Duke
cedar surge
Well ain't that funny
terse lava
The point is yes, nostalgia can smother a game so much that it ruins the game
versed helm
That’s almost as funny as how since the last big Halo release, the Doom franchise came back, became one of the biggest games in the FPS genre, and made a sequel and stirred controversy
cedar surge
References may be cool but getting hit with "HEY REMEMBER THIS AND THIS AND THAT?!"
yea no please
versed helm
Yikers
west silo
The point is yes, nostalgia can smother a game so much that it ruins the game
@terse lava
Actually its was more the guys ego and him wanting to one up current games in graphics
versed helm
Oh just the composer leaving and stuff
cedar surge
Oh
versed helm
Lol
So when H5 just came out, Doom wasn’t even part of the gaming ethos
Well, hardly
Now it’s huge
west silo
Oh just the composer leaving and stuff
@versed helm
And morally challenged
versed helm
Yes and the mortally challenged
cedar surge
Yea that time span reminds me of yandere simulator taking 6 years
Oh yea mortally challenged
What a so bad about that
terse lava
True 117, but the fact he appeared to rely on nostalgia to have the game be popular didnt help
west silo
What a so bad about that
@Dr.Lance#807
People took calling them demons offensive or something
cedar surge
what?
west silo
what?
@cedar surge
Exactly
terse lava
What now?
versed helm
Nothing
west silo
Am gonna hit the sack night everyone
terse lava
The mgalekgolo were treated almost as living weapons, not that they minded that much. Unless you were a sangheili they didnt bother with other covenant races
versed helm
Night man
rotund lintel
Thoughts on the Valiant class super heavy cruiser?
cedar surge
Good ship
slim thorn
Too big
ornate hinge
are ODSTs marines?
ember nexus
yes but they are obviously troopers rather than marines but they are still part of the marine corps
ornate hinge
ok thx
vague scroll
@ornate hinge @ember nexus I don't know what you mean by trooper there but that's an inaccurate description. ODSTs are a special forces organization with the UNSC Marine Corps. Trooper isn't a designation, it's essentially a synonym for Marine or soldier.
So ODSTs are indeed Marines.
ornate hinge
👌
ember nexus
what does the t in odst stand for
vague scroll
trooper but again, that is as I said - a synonym for soldier or marine. ODST is just a long descriptor, Orbital Drop Shock Trooper. That's not unlike say an acronym unit like US Navy SEALs, (SEa-Air-Land)
slim thorn
Basically ODST are BoB (Best of the Best) from the Marines.
versed helm
during entire sequence of halo 1-3 (i haven't played 4 or 5 yet) what was the spirit of fire doing
where they literally just frozen when everyone needed them?
versed helm
Couldn’t earth people go try and get them
Also which halo do they appear in?
Because quick google searches showed me spoilers about them being against cortana in halo 6
drowsy widget
The people on Earth didn't know Spirit of Fire was adrift.
It was listed MIA/KIA and they had more important things to do.
It was lost at around the first 5-10 years, they legit didn't have the time or resources or manpower to go on a manhunt for one ship
humble yacht
SoF was lost in space, and space is big
versed helm
Do they appear in halo 4 or 5?
humble yacht
the UNSC found Chief in 4 years by accident, only because they also went to Requiem for a totally unrelated reason
if not for requiem, who knows how long Chief would have been drifting
bright briar
They're not in 4 or 5, no. Just Wars and Wars 2.
versed helm
Ok hmm because I saw a thing online but I’m just going to ignore it then
humble yacht
people put all sorts of nonsense online
humble yacht
you can't really trust anyone
versed helm
against cortana it says?
and whatever prometheans are
oh
is this something to do with wars 2?
humble yacht
yeah that's just speculation
versed helm
why would they be against cortana
humble yacht
don't worry about it, it doesn't actually mean anything for the game
versed helm
ok im just going to play the game loll
Wait so like cortana
Did the spirit of fire lady forgot her name also ‘have time to think’?
Or I’m guessing she didn’t get damaged like cortana
Serina aha
carmine sleet
Serina terminated herself before she became too much of an issue
versed helm
What actually happens to ai does anyone know?
humble yacht
what do you mean?
versed helm
And I wonder if cortana can last longer because she’s more advanced
I mean the 7 year thing
humble yacht
All human smart AI go rampant after 7 years
rampancy is a terminal condition that has several symptoms
including personality changes, loss of functions, instability, and eventually death
humble yacht
Because of technological limitations
no because most smart AI are made from dead people's brains
so there is no source material to recompile the matrix
versed helm
Oh
humble yacht
Cortana is the exception because Halsey cloned her brain to make cortana
though that was illegal
last anchor
Exceedingly
versed helm
What’s wrong with that?
And where can I read about all this stuff? Where’s this from? The books?
gilded mason
What’s wrong with that?```
Because that involved making a clone, which was a no-no. (For most organizations/people)flash cloning isn't supposed to be used to make full people
because when you do the clone deteriorate quickly and die painfully
like the Spartan II child clones did
also there is the ethical dilemma of making multiple versions of the same person
versed helm
You could create a very controversial tactic with that.
last anchor
Also unethical obviously
humble yacht
It's also worth noting that Cortana only theorized that maybe her matrix could be recompiled using Halsey's brain (or another clone)
we don't know if it would have actually worked
later she seemed to think that it would result in a new Cortana rather than a fix of herself
jolly furnace
In regards to Regret's dialogue bout the forerunner ships, it seems he feared using the assets they currently had would leave the Covenant vulnurable to counterattack by humanity.
Also he may have wanted the fleet as political leverage
As to the Flood on the shield world, they may have been stored there and broke out or ended up there during a battle (which is one way to explain why debris of forerunner ships litter the outer surface)
versed helm
when did atriox i think his name is spelled (the monkey guy in halo wars 2) 'defy the covanant' and survive?
because halo 3 at the end the elites where with the humans and the rest where basically dead
but elites where about to kill the monkey guy if i saw correctlyl
so was this before halo 3?
carmine sleet
2549, about three years before the original Halo trilogy
humble yacht
Atriox wasn't in Halo 3. You're probably confusing him with Tartarus in Halo 2
versed helm
Atriox wasn't in Halo 3. You're probably confusing him with Tartarus in Halo 2
@humble yacht no i was just asking timeline wise that slipstream answered
i find it so strange tho all this crazy forerunner technology they left behind and everyone is just decimating it bit by bit until eventually nothing is gonna be left... :c
humble yacht
nobody is decimating forerunner tech on purpose
it's because someone keeps trying to destroy or take over the galaxy with that stuff
if everyone just left forerunner stuff alone then it'd be fine
versed helm
"The universe if the Covenant would mind their business."
gilded mason
Oh, Mendicant Bias, you little screw-up, you.
versed helm
I really need to look into their lore but I find it to be so boring.
versed helm
Is Isabel more advanced than serina?
She sounds it but boy is she annoying
Also she seems to feel emotion like get angry at the other ship. Are ai’s meant to do that?
gilded mason
She ain't a military AI, so she didn't really expect to have to deal with a lot of extreme-stress situations.
carmine sleet
Smart AI are also not devoid of emotion. Sure, not all of them show it but as seen with Cortana, Roland and Isabel in the games, they all show off a wide range of emotion
gilded mason
And even Dumb AI are capable of emotion
vague scroll
It's just that Smart AIs are constructed from simulated dead human brains, so they're essentially just human-computers. They're prone to extreme emotions just like humans. Probably why Isabel can appreciate a rousing military speech versus some dumb AI 😛
humble yacht
Isabel is a newer generation smart AI than serina was but we’re not sure what advancements newer gen AI have over older gen AI
For instance, cortana seemed more capable than Black Box despite being an older gen AI
Her copying/fragmenting abilities far exceeded his
slate egret
anyone knows about a site or sth similar where you can see what books were already translated and released outside the US? having a hard time finding halo books in german
craggy sierra
Amazon listings don't give that?
past olive
Isabel vs Cortana wen
humble yacht
never
feral perch
Isabel is a relatively inexperienced, very panicky AI. Cortana is almost a demigod.
there’s no contest
slate egret
listings?
humble yacht
give isabel a few years and see if she'd even want to go against Cortana
feral perch
Ah good point
humble yacht
immortality would start to look pretty good when rampancy is around the corner
vague scroll
one thing I'm still waiting to hear more on is Domain access and how exactly does loyalty within the Created work?
Organics are one thing, but taking a dip in the Domain - does that convert AIs to the Created cause? Is Cortana holding the promise of immortality over the heads of AI? What's stopping an AI from entering the Domain and coming out and deciding that Cortana's way of doing things is wrong, or that they want to take charge instead.
Smart AIs are still individuals in theory.
fair hazel
Not sure we know the specifics.
vague scroll
we don't, that's why I begin my statement regarding that I'm waiting to hear more.
azure zealot
this may be a weird question.. anyways im getting a back into halo and i saw an article about the halo game director addressing ppl wondering why Cortana is always "nude".. idk if its me personally but i always thought ( and still do ) that she was wearing a skin suit like zero suit samus does
cedar surge
Every AI has a different avatar
Some can wear cloths while others don't or they could just be a 2d circle
Does anyone else prefer the original trilogy version version of cortana?
She looks more holographic there
gilded mason
I felt H2C Cortana looked the best out of every rendition there currently is.
queen otter
Eh. I like H2As Cortana a lot better than the rest.
lethal comet
She looks more holographic there
its because she uses hardlight in h5
azure zealot
@cedar surge ah ok.. i still wonder why the majority of the other a.i wear clothes and why they decided to make Cortana the way she is with her outfit idk why the whole nudity thing came up but like i said i dont think she really is because they changed the halo 2 version of her
lethal comet
dot
sharp adder
i am intrgedto see who the brutes will side with and or if some join the created or some dont but i cant wait to see if the Yamre will join the created becase the grunts joined
cedar surge
Banished will obviously not align with the created
That goes against their entire belief
hardy axle
Surprised to see that people didn’t like Isabel! I loved her character, how traumatised she was by all her humans been slaughtered, by brutes! I recall some parts in stories where brutes are pulling limps of captives, eating them alive, playing with their food etc. She couldn’t save her friends and colleagues, she watched them get butchered. So the complaints about her acting too emotional seem bizarre to me.
It also has a massive payoff! When she is on the banished carrier and fires the ventral beam, as she prepares to get her revenge on these monsters, you hear the cries of her people on the ark “Isabel! Help us! Please!” The pain in her expression at the memories, the music, her ultimate revenge! Honestly one of my favourite halo moments, high praise when halo is overflowing with memorable moments.
past prawn
I think people think she just annoying
Idk i was just kinda meh about her but I didn’t think wow I hate this character
Also why does the banished even have a problem with humanity
cedar surge
Wait people don't like isabel
I don't see any reason to dislike her
@past prawn well in general the banished don't
Its just that with Atriox trapped on the ark likely a brute upstart is trying to destroy humanity
versed helm
I personally like her, but it's probably because she comes across as whiny.
versed helm
People overlook that.
cedar surge
Some people even complain she isn't as fast as cortana
versed helm
Which is like saying, "Gosh darn it, why can't Bro Hammer run as fast as Chief?!"
fair hazel
Isabel is great
drowsy widget
I think Isabel is a solid character.
I didn't think anyone in Halo Wars 2 was lacking.
She's a well-written character. A traumatised logistics AI who couldn't save the humans she was meant to help because she was powerless to. What was she to do? She's logistics, she has no military programming. And as the game progresses she develops. She's impressed by the willingness of Cutter to stand and fight. And when she's given the power of the Banished carrier's plasma laser you can truly see she wants to avenge her friends, the humans with her before the Banished came.
hardy axle
Yeah her and cutters relationship was great. You can tell he has a big soft spot for AIs
I’d go as far as to say he potentially loved Serina! And her him. I certainly get that feeling from the opening of HW2.
carmine sleet
If you mean romantically, no. In the way friends love one another, sure
drowsy widget
Serina and Cutter worked very well together as comrades, even if one was a bit sarcastic and snarky while the other was formal and to the point.
I wouldn't ship them though.
hardy axle
Hmm I dunno. You can love people without it being remotely sexual.
Don’t get me wrong I didn’t think that at all playing hw1. It’s serinas message for cutter in hw2 and when anders mentions serina in front of him she sees his reaction and winces. Like whoops too soon to talk about her
And don’t forget his epic speech about his crew been family and the ship home. At the very least I think he loved her like a family member, a daughter maybe.
And serina decommissions herself, going against ai protocol instead of waking cutter to do it by the book. Saving him the emotional anguish of putting down a loved one perhaps 😉
versed helm
I didn't think that Cutter's speech was even that good.
jolly furnace
I loved Cutter's speech in that scene in HW2
hardy axle
@versed helm Heresy!
versed helm
What?
terse lava
It was ok, but the following of his ship being able to be an actual nuisance to the Enduring Conviction was hardly believable
hardy axle
Yeah when they are actually in battle with each other. There is just waves of banshees coming at them...in space.
versed helm
I miss Sgt. Forge.
hardy axle
Couldnt even send a seraph haha and the banished carrier itself could of just obliterated it with its armament.
terse lava
Mhm
humble yacht
Yeah when they are actually in battle with each other. There is just waves of banshees coming at them...in space.
Halo Reach established that there are space variants of Banshees that the Covenant used.
versed helm
They look pretty cool.
hardy axle
No issue with them being there @humble yacht just seems highly ineffective
versed helm
How so?
humble yacht
they're easier to produce than seraphs
probably more of them available for the banished to have scavenged
versed helm
Makes me wonder if a Banished Spectre exists.
humble yacht
could also be that shipmaster underestimated SoF and didn't take the fight seriously, ultimately leading to his defeat and teh loss of the carrier
terse lava
They do not appear to be space banshees Chimera. Looking at them in the cutscene right now
hardy axle
@night forum classic covenant move that, would hope the banished were better.
humble yacht
they're still covenant at their core, no matter how many spikes they put on their stuff
lethal comet
the only difference in the banshees is that the space variant vacuum sealed and has a bigger turret
humble yacht
regular banshees need to be vacuum sealed too to function at high altitudes
otherwise elites would suffocate
versed helm
But, isn't there the Pilot armour in H3? That looks vacuum sealed to me.
humble yacht
unless a banshee is equipped with some sort of breathing tube that you connect to when inside
i don't think "pilot" was an elite armor variant
versed helm
As in, an official one?
humble yacht
as in none of the elite customization items in H3 are called "pilot"
terse lava
.they have other differences besides the longer firing cannon and being vacuum sealed. Their wings are different, longer tail too
versed helm
No, I'm pretty sure there is one, Chimera.
hardy axle
Elites can definitely have vacuum suits. They pop out into space on the corvette you jack in long night of solace
terse lava
The "flight harness" from halo 3 would have been used more likly for the seraph and space banshees yes but it wasn't a rank per say
versed helm
Ah, it's called the Flight harness.
terse lava
Just an armor type for the pilots of those craft
terse lava
It is
humble yacht
well it's not called "pilot" so that explains why i don't remember it being called pilot
terse lava
Ok
terse lava
Wonder if we will ever get more info in ancient humanity
queen otter
Like what?
humble yacht
in halo 7, Lord of Admirals returns to try and take back his empire from the unworthy descendants 
hardy axle
Isn’t a slither of guilty sparks personality the lord of admirals
humble yacht
yea
hardy axle
Because chakas had a personality imprint of forthencho
terse lava
It was at one point
hardy axle
@queen otter loads of stuff id like to learn about ancient humanity. We really know nothing, what their cultures were like, how their society was structured, the technology they used, their religious believes etc
terse lava
It was ejected with all the other personalities
Leaving just Chakas himself and the memories of spark
humble yacht
it was put back
hardy axle
I vaguely remember this. Remind me where this was?
terse lava
Well we know they apparently believed in expanding their empire, "creating more souls." And at least a few were polytheistic, the LOA being one
Put back? When?
terse lava
I'm talking Renegades Chimera
humble yacht
did librarian remove Fortencho's imprint?
hardy axle
That’s the one!
terse lava
No she didnt
humble yacht
so then how was it removed?
hardy axle
Forget renegades touched on bits from the forerunner trilogy
terse lava
Chakas at some point ejected all the other human personalities
Never really said how, just that it was done
humble yacht
but the GS personality was a combination of the other personalities in him
terse lava
Thus the only thing left was Chakas himself and the memories of he of guilty spark
The GS personality was more its own thing that suppressed Chakas and the others
hardy axle
We sure john didn’t just spartan laser his other personalities out of him 😉
terse lava
Well, he may least killed the GS one😛
Honesty a little sad in the whole thing. Would have. Even interesting to see Forthencho's reaction to the wider galaxy
Closest we ever got was him telling the Rubicon crew they were the true reclaimers
hardy axle
I’d forgotten all about the recover of GS from the ark and his hijack of the rubicon. Doesn’t he also drop the bomb that he thinks the librarian is alive?!
terse lava
Overall I enjoyed AH addition to the canon. Although wasnt fond of thier actions at the time
He thinks as such
He is proven half right
hardy axle
Ur-librarian was stood on the surface of earth when the halo array went off. Dead for sure. But one of her life workers could have been imprinted like with the didacts
carmine sleet
Ur-Librarian? I thought there was only one Librarian
hardy axle
My point is, perhaps not
terse lava
You are thinking of Chant to green, a lifeworker who worked under the librarian and the latter saw her as a daughter of sorts
hardy axle
Yeah I thought she had a fave
terse lava
She was never imprinted though like Bornstellar was with the didact
hardy axle
That we know of
terse lava
And further more...Chant is eons dead
hardy axle
Hmm a slight inconvenience that
terse lava
Mhm, she lived out the rest of her days with Bornsteller and their child on a planet in another galaxy and forsakes their old advanced technology
carmine sleet
That we know of
There's no "That we know of" with whether the Librarian imprinted herself on Chant, the Librarian did not imprint her personality onto anyone
terse lava
Correct
hardy axle
Just seems saying she didn’t imprint onto ANYONE is a statement no one can make
Does she say that?
It’s been awhile since I read the forerunner trilogy if I’m honest
terse lava
Closest we get is the didact commenting to Born that anyone imprinted with her would have been truly interesting and amazing
hardy axle
Seems like a possibility to me
jolly furnace
Forthencho's essence could still show up in another human as Chakas had sisters who likely had descendants. If any of them have intact blood lines in modern Halo then he can emerge in any current human character.
terse lava
True, though makes me wonder what happened to the real mind of the LOA. Was his the one put in Chakas? Or one of many ancient humans who were stuck being interrogated by forerunners
lethal comet
chakas wasnt homo sapien
terse lava
I still dont understandhoq we don't have a name for AH yet
jolly furnace
chakas was homo sapien. Hamanune was homo sapien
Chamanune was Riser's species
I mean what name would we give them. The human empire? I assume you refer to the name of their central government (like the UEG is for modern humans)
terse lava
Well just the fact modern humans are the UEG, the Covenant...well yes, and the forerunners were the ecumene
Yet AH gets nothing?
jolly furnace
Maybe we will get one someday
So far we only got AH from forerunner POV
A novel from AH pov will likely give us the name
of their government
terse lava
Likly, though one would think a name would be mentioned by the likes of someone like the librarian
terse lava
Pity
humble yacht
theocracy
jolly furnace
Yeah but both species should still have seperate governemnts
The alliance was military based i think
terse lava
I am unsure it was purely military
jolly furnace
San Shyuum and human governments would have a formal name for legal purposes, we just dont know them yet