And iirc,wasn't the reason as to why the Covenant do not utilize A.I to the extent that the UNSC does was because they heard of the stories of what MB did to the Forerunners
#lore-and-universe
versed helm
terse lava
Ai yes, I mean the rest
abstract venture
I dont think it was taboo
it was just a way for prophets to keep control of the covenant
by restricting other species advancement of tech unless it had their approval
I think thats canonically true actually
terse lava
I cant recall the source, but I remember a book or waypoint article commenting on some type of covenant power generator. The san shyuum could have advanced it further, but such advances would have been on the level of the forerunner so they didn't
gilded mason
Feels a bit inconsistent, considering stuff they've upgraded to be better than Forerunner counterparts.
terse lava
That's what brought the question to my mind
abstract venture
what did they upgrade to be better?
quiet umbra
Covenant tech is very inconsistent, their reliance on Forerunner reverse engineering has stunted their culture
gilded mason
what did they upgrade to be better?```
Focus Rifle, at leastUnlike UNSC soldiers, your average covenant warrior is not able to field repair their weapon
they don't really know how it even works, save for Elites and their energy swords
abstract venture
They have engineers for that
gilded mason
Unlike UNSC soldiers, your average covenant warrior is not able to field repair their weapon
Huh, was that said anywhere?
quiet umbra
Not explicitly but I mean it's true: San Shyuum handle the Covenant's entire industry and engineering sectors
abstract venture
Not really
quiet umbra
They're a sectarian caste-based society which is a huge military weakness
gilded mason
Sangheili are also explicitly said to be engineers and manufacturers.
abstract venture
They have a huge influence but there's many Elite manufacturers
terse lava
There are indeed plenty of sangheili who know how to craft from forerunner tech
quiet umbra
For lack of a better comparison Covenant tech is built like Apple products
designed to be replaced not repaired
gilded mason
And while San'Shyuum don't like it when modifcations and advancements happen without their approval, they apparently don't do much about it besides clicking their tongues. At least in the case of some Sangheili engineers that did a bunch of upgrades to several weapon types.
terse lava
Oh yea if halo 5 was anything to go by
I am guessing san shyuum have no authority over that
As it is a military affair, something sangheili were soley in charge of
quiet umbra
Honestly the Brutes facilitate the best weapons use doctrine in the covenant
idk why they get to use their own stuff
terse lava
Likely due to it just being around
The other races had been in the covenant long enough their own primitive tech had likely been improved and replaced
Or used I guess by the covenant
gilded mason
Oh yeah, Hunters in the Dark also had the Elites on the Mayhem know how to repair the ship. (Though the damage was much too extensive for them to actually make it flyable once more)
terse lava
The fact they know how to do that I love, compared to a human soldier who would have no clue
abstract venture
How many planets do you guys think the Covenant had
gilded mason
Well, we know they controlled thousands of systems, so I assume many thousands of planets.
terse lava
Would make sense, the fact 343 never nailed down a number yet I would say means something
Forerunner: 3 million worlds
Ancient humans: ten thousand systems
Modern humans: 400 colonies
Covenant???
obsidian thistle
The Covenant is interesting
The Covenant Fringe would imply numerous planets/systems under their control.
terse lava
Mhm, and those would be beings that wernt even considered officially part of the empire
It's just something I always found interestinfnthat even ancientbhumanity gets sort of a number nailed down but not the covenant
gilded mason
It makes sense that ancient human worlds are nailed down, since that whole thing went kaput
But Covenant worlds are still here.
So I assume 343 doesn't wanna give hard numbers and back themselves into a corner
terse lava
My thoughts exactly
obsidian thistle
Hard Numbers lock stuff down. xD
The 50 Halcyon-class cruisers built I bet has caused some minor annoyance in the lore.
gilded mason
Hey CIA.
terse lava
Likely
gilded mason
I'm gonna be a broken record
obsidian thistle
I hope its skipping on a good part 😉
gilded mason
And ask: Did ya do anything regarding that "Another Day at the Beach" page? 😋
gilded mason
lol
terse lava
Heh
obsidian thistle
*While I kill it
gilded mason
Golly
terse lava
Btw, I feel the answer may be no but since the topic had come up before
obsidian thistle
Fixed.
terse lava
Would it be fair to compare the covensnt, in population, to the Citadel races from Mass Effect? They are said to have trillions of beings, though they were founded around 10AD, where the Covenant was founded 850BC
obsidian thistle
If ya find a source. Feel free to add it back 🙂 @gilded mason
gilded mason
Righteo. 😉
abstract venture
It's likely but we have no clue one way or another
gilded mason
They are said to have trillions of beings, though they were founded around 10AD, where the Covenant was founded 850BC
Then again, they're all throughout the galaxy, while Halo has everyone in the Orion Arm
Actually, maybe that doesn't matter
abstract venture
They've had 3500+ years to colonize the galaxy and we know within the last ~100 years of Halo they are still actively colonizing
terse lava
Well the population growth is what made me ponder on it
gilded mason
Yeah, I just realized there's probably not a lack of planets to go around
abstract venture
Personally I'd put it at tens of thousands of planets and low trillions in total population
terse lava
Ditto, just bothers me we have no canon population for them
Low trillions would work perfect for the covenant
abstract venture
We have some ideas
Hesduros had a population of 1.9 billion and it was basically a backwater
terse lava
Yea
abstract venture
Not in contact with the covenant and no post schism faction bothered with them
Also Glyke had billions and the elites didn't care when it blew up
gilded mason
Well, the Sangheili that lived there had a bit of an issue. 😏
abstract venture
Elites not from Glyke atleast
gilded mason
lol
abstract venture
The Brutes only joined the Covenant within its last 50 years or so
And other species were still heavily colonizing at the time so the number of planets they had is probably on the higher end
terse lava
Maybe tens of thousands of world? I am not sure I see the covenant having 1 million under their control
quiet umbra
Covenant fringe is narrative shorthand for their ability to introduce a new covenant species whenever it's convenient
so thats why we're probably never going to find out all their species
terse lava
Yea sadly
torpid flare
What species in the halo games is the closest to humans genetically.
terse lava
Forerunners
jolly furnace
it seems covie empire could have approached AH empire size then?
gilded mason
AH?
jolly furnace
ancient human
gilded mason
Ah.
jolly furnace
they had at least 20,000 worlds in a 1000 systems
and covies had 1000s of worlds i think
in only 3000 years
and AH had at least 50,000 years to colonize space
terse lava
1 million years actually
abstract venture
AH had to avoid the Forerunners who had galactic supremecy though
The Covenant didn't have any restrictions, they could easily have way more colonies than them
torpid flare
where the forerunners cruel
terse lava
Would depend on who you ask
hasty locust
They were arrogant
sacred dew
Wasn't it 20,000 systems not worlds
gilded mason
For these dreams spoke of leave-taking and farewell, of the last night before a grand battle that would spread across a hundred thousand light-years to determine the fate of a thousand suns and twenty thousand worlds.
terse lava
Which book was that?
gilded mason
Primordium
terse lava
Thought so
sacred dew
Oh
torpid flare
I would like to play a halo game that explores ancient humanity and the forerunners
glossy shard
That would be awesome!
jolly furnace
@terse lava Yeah their earliest known spacefaring empire was back in at least 1.1 million BCE. But i got the impression that between then and 150,000 BCE, that whatever empires or cultures they had then had long since fallen and vanished and that they went into dark ages until around 150,000 BCE and then they achieved their 20,000 worlds in a 1000 systems empire until the FR's destroyed it
terse lava
Quite likely
half apex
wait a minute
wasn't precurser tech still available around the time when the halos were fired?
terse lava
Up until then yed
half apex
because the forunners, humans, etc could have used the tech to go the Andromeda galaxy
well even better the forunners could have created a remote firing mechanism, back away a good bit to the Andromeda, destroy the flood, and come back
we would still have forunners
i guess
terse lava
They were out of range on the ark
torpid flare
assuming that the milky way is 105 thousand light years, the andromeda galaxy is around 2.5 million light years away. So the forerunners would be safe.
assuming that the halo ring firing distance is around 100 thousand ly
but the forerunners would take a long time, even with the advanced tech.
terse lava
Well the galaxy is105,700 LY wide
torpid flare
i used estimation, silly 4 splitted mandible guy
terse lava
Either way they were perfectly safe on the ark
fast panther
wow
that was a spectacular convertation
why you two know all this about the galaxy
???
gilded mason
terse lava
You know, I wonder if the black hole at the galaxy's center could have been used against the precursor relics
torpid flare
it could work, but you have to be very close to the black hole in order to be useful
terse lava
Well we know some battles did take place around it
torpid flare
i had a question
abstract venture
i think oblivion mentioned the galaxies central black hole
a covenant fleet jumped in there looking for the halos and never came back
torpid flare
Were the split jaw of the Sangheili beneficial for survival over the closed jaw of a human? I am confused on how the mandibles disproved Darwin's theory.
terse lava
@abstract ventureit was mentioned in Silentium as the "Central Eater." Oblivion only mentions the luminal beacon ended up in the center of the galaxy where gravity and star density prevented the Covenant from retrieving it.
The mandibles of sangheili were likely useful in different ways. We know ancient sangheili would carry their young by the neck in them. From a natural point of view, would have allowed an easy way to tear flesh from an animal
@torpid flare
terse lava
Welcome
reef cobalt
Thats very intresting
terse lava
Well it's likely that, like humans, they would have hunted in groups, unlike humans however they could their teeth as a weapon too. We see a small example of that in broken circle when some ussan sangheili attack a covenant spy
reef cobalt
thank you for this information
terse lava
Mhm
reef cobalt
always good to learn more about the second best species in halo
terse lava
You mean first 🙂
reef cobalt
Human ftw
wanton ravine
Halo Infinite
dusk karma
how do you guys.
terse lava
Pardon?
cobalt quiver
Is the Fall of Reach comic a good adaption of the novel?
versed helm
So are Chief and Six still some of the best spartans?
terse lava
Wouldn't say so
versed helm
Well that sucks Big time
gilded mason
It's perfectly fine not being the best.
versed helm
But it sucks not even being in the few best
versed helm
Honestly
I always have been firmly in the camp of "Chief is evidently the "best" Spartan (even though deciding the "best" Spartan is dumb in the first place) just by virtue of his protagonist status and what he's accomplished".
I think he has the most experience given the wild events he's been through, and in-universe he is regarded as an exceptional lucky individual (though it's likely down to near-preternatural tactical analysis and quick decision-making skills).
So while I disagree firmly with the idea of there being some kind of "hyper-lethal" skill classification (unless it's a classification bestowed on Spartans in general), I do maintain that Chief is probably the Spartan most likely to emerge from any and every situation.
U sir are my hero
"Hyper-lethal" might be good UNSC propaganda, actually.
The term has little tactical application
But a UNSC officer mentioning it in some sort of public briefing would certainly be a morale booster
"Oh man, we've have hyper lethal assets? How can humanity lose?"
The civilians might think
It'd inspire patriotism
Its possible, they already have the whole "Spartans Never die" propaganda going on.
versed helm
versed helm
So what is Vinnevra's real name?
glossy vapor
versed helm
How do you measure badassery?
You can't.
There is no Spartan who is "more badass than Chief" in any canonical sense, though.
jovial temple
badassery can usually be measured by how many times one jumps out of a ship in orbit and then re enters the planet's atmosphere
Without ODST drop pods
But seriously though, yeah I think chief's luck and quick-witted skills are what make him the best spartan as he wasn't the strongest of the spartan 2's nor the fastest. He did, however, develop great leadership abilities. His feats that he's accomplished at this point also blow any other spartan out of the water in comparison.
dim vapor
or literally fly in outerspace, give the covies back their bomb and land on a spaceship
jovial temple
It's worth nothing that S-092 also has a high rank of badassery
versed helm
Yeah, Jerome is definitely pretty high on the badass list.
I'd argue Linda's definitely there as well.
Alice gives off some awesome Pvt. Vasquez vibes.
Also because she shares a VO with Ventress, something @jovial temple should be able to appreciate.
low haven
Ngl Jun too
Pretty solid
Only spartan to survive Reach, pretty badass if you ask me
Besides chief ofc
safe siren
And Blue team, and a bunch of other spartans
abstract venture
Some other Spartans survived reach too
I'm curious if someone can figure out how many based on who we know is alive after reach
hasty locust
That’s a hard question cause at the rime of FoR I think they said all “remaining” S2’s except gray came to reach which was like 25 or something but if you look at all expanded lore past that point more S2’S have died or went missing than 7 since 2552 the most common explanation also to the fact we know of 42/32 spartan II’s is due to rehabs of failed aug Spartans, like red team
abstract venture
I think total there's 55 confirmed Spartan 2s lol
stoic hamlet
Well Red Team were rehabs so not counted. Black Team are also likely Rehabs. Jorge And Omega probably are as well.
So that’s 14 right there.
versed helm
Rule #1 of modern Halo lore - don't be too attached to the original intent of TFoR.
carmine sleet
Black Team operated under ONI, opposed to Naval Special Weapons, which the rest of the S-IIs operated under. Which explains why Black Team, outside of already being preoccupied with Operation Blowback, likely wouldn't have been part of the team intended for Red Flag
abstract venture
Wym not counted?
I don't see why they couldn't have been part of the remaining Spartans at reach
Like by the end of the war I doubt they would be picky
carmine sleet
Red Team from HW and HW2 were MIA for most of the war
carmine sleet
I just explained Black Team
abstract venture
Yeah I wrote 2 lines, first one was for eternalcandians statement
For black team I mean they wouldn't be picky so they could potentially use them
It's a possibility atleast
But we know gray team for example couldn't have been there sow e can count them out
carmine sleet
They weren't able to use them as Black Team was involved in Operation Blowback, like I already said
The operation didn't go to plan though thanks to a Line Installation
carmine sleet
It took place mid August 2552 but it's likely they didn't get off of the Line Installation for quite some time
abstract venture
hmm
from what i remember there aren't many spartans left alive by reach which is why I thought black team was probably a part of it
stoic hamlet
There aren’t many II’s. But there are hundreds of III’s, though obviously they wouldn’t take part in RED FLAG.
stoic hamlet
14, I believe is the count off the top of my head.
abstract venture
I think blue team (4), red team (3), Omega team (3), gray team (3) and Naomi are all thats confirmed
so yeah 14
stoic hamlet
Red Team (3)
Grey Team (3)
Naomi (1)
Omega Group (3)
Blue Team (4)
(Potentially) Maria (1)
So 15 maybe
But 14 confirmed
obsidian thistle
Omega is 6
abstract venture
we only have 3 confirmed ppl still alive from omega though
hasty locust
As i always say:
Alive unless thrown away by the didact in two panels
obsidian thistle
The rule of sci-fi is.
Did you see a body?
If you cant answer that with a yes.
versed helm
that's just a general rule really
obsidian thistle
Still a rule of fiction 😉
And one I lurve to mention.
Only exception being an outright statement
Or clones
Everyone loves dem their clones in sci-fi
deep pewter
Especially flash clones, even the parents loved those
stoic hamlet
I mean, if the unit had 6 members during the war but post war we know of only 3, I feel like that’s saying something.
hasty locust
Could just be due to the fact 6 spartans would be OP
carmine sleet
It's crazy enough that they are called in as a leader power opposed to being hero units for Jerome in HW2. And that's not even mentioning that Jerome is his own hero unit and comes with a Mantis. Having 7 Spartans plus a mech would've made Jerome so overpowered
stoic hamlet
I mean, you could of had them be like SUNRAY 1-1 from theDLC. All one squad.
jovial temple
Gotta love the clones
I mean if the other 3 Spartans from omega are never mentioned again then it’s safe to assume they are m.i.a.
Or worst case scenario retconned
abstract venture
they could have just been reassigned early in the war
to a different squad or split up
jovial temple
That’s quite possible
It’s on the table of things the universe has yet to explore
I just get the feeling that something bad probably happened to them for some reason
unique rune
obviously they're gonna be revealed as killed off panel for some comic with really bad art in the future
obsidian thistle
Well here is a fairly recent find for anyone interested.
Lore on the Active Camo Pyramids from the older games.
Aka these things https://www.halopedia.org/images/5/5e/H2A-ActiveCamo.png
abstract venture
isnt toy lore though not actual canon?
feral perch
I hope it's actual canon.
obsidian thistle
Toy Lore is what some would dub "Semi-Canon".
I wrote a lil thing to help explain it.
terse lava
👍 sounds good to me
obsidian thistle
There is more complex terms.
But squishy is the easier way to describe it.
Non-canon is a rarity.
Not many things get put under that.
(There was one recently however)
These guys. They were thought canon till yesterday.
I still plan to make the page look amazing.
terse lava
I remember those, did find the whole idea weird though
versed helm
Spawn 👀
versed helm
CIA's dedication to sniffing out the hidden gems is the stuff of lore I tell you what
terse lava
Did...you just King of The Hill that?
fair hazel
terse lava
I think it was on halopedia for a time. Maybe that's where you are thinking of?
hasty locust
@obsidian thistle “canon till yesterday”?
versed helm
Worth noting that Hellspartans were considered to be squishy canon or non-core canon up until Grim stated that they were non-canon
Meaning that 343 probably don't really see "squishy canon" as canon unless it's introduced in a core medium
hasty locust
Wait so he just said it wasn’t canon yesterday?
versed helm
Honestly
hasty locust
That seems... random
versed helm
Pretty sure he said all toy canon was basically non-canon a long time ago
To my knowledge something like REAP X for example was always meant to be a toy only space for weird and fun stuff that could be bizarre and in its own space unless otherwise brought into core canon. Other bits can be fun to assume, but I wouldnt look at "toy lore" as established.
That's a quote from his Twitter
"in its own space"
hasty locust
maybe they disregarded it so it can get new life breathed into it in infinite
I like that armor
versed helm
I don't know, man. I'd say the UNSC reached its official max "hell-" prefix count with hellbringers, which is still an incredibly goofy name.
Helljumpers is the only use of the "hell-" prefix I can really get behind
Hellspartans is one of the silliest words I've ever heard
hasty locust
Yeah maybe change the name
Like maybe you could bring them back as a pyromaniac S4 fireteam
versed helm
They're not even pyromaniacs
I think they're just psychos with some tuned augmentations and customized EVA armour
versed helm
The idea of taking one of the UNSC's most tactically flexible assets and specializing them around flamethrowers is
An interesting use of resources
hasty locust
looks at halo 5 opening where a fire team of super soldiers dives from a high altitude straight into enemy armor and aerial vehicles
carmine sleet
That's very different to giving them flamethrowers
hasty locust
Still with S4’s tactics seems to be out the window
hasty locust
Also a flamethrower unit could be a counter flood team
Cause we already know the good old flamethrower is effective against the popcorn
carmine sleet
With how rare the Flood is, it's unlikely they'd have a Spartan team dedicated to fighting Flood and nothing else
versed helm
I mean let's all just forget that Spartan IVs are like, hardened UNSC combat veterans
carmine sleet
And S-IVs do use tactics, they're just a little more unconventional
versed helm
Y'know
Just because some dude on the internet didn't like how Osiris glided in to a battlefield
They have no tactics
carmine sleet
And if I recall, aren't Spartans meant to be unconventional with their strategies? Even the S-IIs and S-IIIs
versed helm
This is true
hasty locust
The S2’s seemed to be pretty sneaky and tactical, at least in the early books
versed helm
Yeah
But also
Chief single-handedly ploughed his way through half the Covenant in straight-up firefights
carmine sleet
And stormed his way into the Truth and Reconciliation with only Cortana to help him
Then there's also the destruction of the Uneven Elephant
carmine sleet
I call it the Uneven Elephant as it's easier to spell than the actual name of the station
hasty locust
IK
versed helm
Y does the mammoth use wheels and not tracks
hasty locust
Moves quicker
carmine sleet
I don't think it has wheels because wheels move quicker
terse lava
Man a whole day of demon chat, eck
hasty locust
The tortoise was a cooler name
versed helm
I doubt that’s because of the wheels
Honestly when it comes to a vehicle like the Mammoth
Who knows what structural considerations we're not thinking of
The thing is huge
terse lava
Has it ever been said what the origin was for ancient human names
severe needle
then there could be peace
torpid flare
what rank would humanity have with the covenant
severe needle
If normal humans than probably above grunts and jackals but below the elites.
torpid flare
what about the reclaimers like Master Chief
half apex
My ancient human name is Caeruleum Stabat Mater James
severe needle
Master Chief would be super high up
half apex
according to some post, i found it like that by entering my favorite color, then my favorite planet in the halo universe, then my name, all in latin
severe needle
because he is a very elite warrior
torpid flare
above the elites but slightly below the prophets
severe needle
Yeah
because the prophets are the leaders
Master chief would probably just be under the prophets and maybe some other people
torpid flare
i would see a civil war between humanity and sangheili when the insurrectionists betrayed the covenant
gilded mason
Do you mean a war between the Covenant and insurrectionists, then? Not humanity?
torpid flare
yeah
severe needle
It'd be hard for the insurrectionists to do much damage unless they have a bunch of super weapons
torpid flare
it would be highly unlikely to find valid reasons to rebel against the Covenant unless they find the religion as a lie, or the humans blew up one of the halo rings.
severe needle
there could be race problems as well
like the brutes would just want to eat the humans or something
or the elites think humans as lesser beings
abstract venture
probably a thousand years of humans and jackals fighting over second lowest in the covenant
severe needle
the grunts just being constantly sad about being the lowest.
torpid flare
i would like the grunts attacking the prophets
and have the grunts as the new prophets
versed helm
Yap Yap is THE prophet.
torpid flare
you killed flipyap or yapflip
versed helm
Chief killed him before escaping the Pillar of Autumn
humble yacht
The first time or the second?
terse lava
If the 3 soon to be hierarchs just accept humanity unto the covenant, I would think they would make them quite a high rank to keep a close eye in them. Any reclaimer funny business would be shrugged off as help from the san shyuum and huragok
And they would be kept under the sangheili in rank
frozen spire
Has there been any word on upcoming novels to coincide or compliment Infinite?
gilded mason
Nope
gaunt oakBOT
terse lava
Ok wait, who died now?
frozen spire
pg13 game series
versed helm
Zuka and Yap Yap
frozen spire
cannot use worlds preschoolers wouldn't blink at
versed helm
I was replying to chim boys
frozen spire
Is this server run by the pope
versed helm
Yes
terse lava
Yap yap has not died, you are thinking of Yayap
frozen spire
How am I going to talk about the Kendrick Lamarr album then
versed helm
The pope thinks you're a Heretic
terse lava
Yep, Zuka was killed by grenades knocking him off his shade turret in the elevator and caused his back to snap when he landed. Meanwhile Yayap was miles away on a ghost and managed to turn around to witness the autumn vaporize
frozen spire
Do I get to be Arbiter
terse lava
No
versed helm
Nein
frozen spire
heck
terse lava
You get stripped of your honor and left behind on a lonely hot world
gilded mason
😥
versed helm
Nah u just get crucified
terse lava
Hm
gilded mason
You get stripped of your honor
Not the only thing you get stripped of...
versed helm
I see What u did there ostral 😏
frozen spire
well if a microsoft media licensing person is reading this please give us more books thanks
gilded mason
I'm sure we'll get a Nizat sequel soon
terse lava
Would be. Nice to have a 3rd book in the Chief story
gilded mason
(Please)
versed helm
Nizat is 2 old for my taste
remote spruce
we lowkey slowly running out of cool halo titles
gilded mason
Yeah, forego the "A Master Chief Story" subtitle
Nizat is 2 old for my taste```
He's a daddyhow does one top the name Halo Retribution
versed helm
He aint juicy enough
terse lava
"Atonement: A Nizat story"
gilded mason
based
terse lava
Ha and that's how I guess
Nizat was a father to his men in a way
Wonder who the oldest san shyuum was. Doubt mercy
humble yacht
Minister of Boomers
terse lava
"I say we put the jiralhanae in charge of guarding us!" Ok Boomer
frozen spire
ok, so that I may express myself without being censored in future
Do we have any sangheili curse words I can use?
hasty locust
DEMON!
humble yacht
just don't try to get creative with bypassing
terse lava
Would that counted as that Chim?
humble yacht
what?
terse lava
Using covenant curse words?
gilded mason
Chimera30 -> Chim
versed helm
Obvious in retrospect
humble yacht
Using covenant curse words?
I mean, in this case where someone is explicitly looking for a way to circumvent the word filter, maybe
have to take it case by case
torpid flare
by the rings
terse lava
Hm, I have used it in here before so didnt think much of it
Guess one of those grey areas
humble yacht
I probably wouldn't do anything over shisno
terse lava
Pardon?
humble yacht
go watch rvb
humble yacht
shisno came well before the meta
terse lava
Odd guess I simply dont remember them
terse lava
Ugh
dense falcon
Why didn't the Forerunners stay in the Ark or their shield world?
abstract venture
That was the original plan
But the surviving Forerunners wanted to start fresh in another galaxy
torpid flare
why did the forerunners wanted to be extinct
humble yacht
it's not that they wanted to be extinct. Its' that they had no other choice to beat the flood. and by using the halos, they felt they lost the right to rule the galaxy
so the survivors went into self imposed exile
torpid flare
so basically, suicide for the forerunners, but benefits the other species
terse lava
Pretty much
Though apparently their descendants thought otherwise and kept tabs on the galaxy
still falcon
They documented all DNA across the Milky Way in order to repopulate life after firing the Halos, but not themselves?
I think I got that right
terse lava
They had survivors
still falcon
The...
terse lava
No reason to index their own DNA or themselves
terse lava
What about the didact?
humble yacht
IsoDidact and his son
still falcon
Some survived the halo array? I'm-- he has a son?
humble yacht
and various others
still falcon
I'm outdated
terse lava
And his wife, and several other forerunners
humble yacht
They weren't in the galaxy when the halos fired
the ark is out of range of the halos
still falcon
Where were they when the UNSC came to the Ark? (The Greater Ark is what I assume appeared in halo 3 and Halo Wars 2?)
humble yacht
no that's the lesser ark
terse lava
They had left eons ago
still falcon
COME ON!
terse lava
The greater ark was destroyed by the flood during the war
humble yacht
no profanity
still falcon
why can't I say that
humble yacht
don't bypass
still falcon
It's profanity?
humble yacht
yep
still falcon
I guess Christians and Australians been swearing since our births then
reef cobalt
Sounds about right
still falcon
If people do consider that word as "swearing", a lot is gonna have a seizure when they enter Australia then
It's like saying Hell, but that's an actual religious location thingy
The didact liked lived?
right
How did he survive?
humble yacht
the ur didact was in a prison that was protected from the halos
torpid flare
crypton?
still falcon
I mean during the ending of Halo 4, I read he survived
Is this entering spoiler territory?
humble yacht
no
halo 4 is like 8 years old
After halo 4, Ur Didact fell into slipspace and ended up on Gamma Halo
still falcon
Ah good, cause people say "no spoilers" for something older, and I lay it out to them cause it be their fault for not seeing it
oh
humble yacht
there he tried to hatch a plan but chief stopped him by dropping him into a bunch of composers
Ur Didact was digitized and that's the last we heard
still falcon
Was the Halo that appeared in Halo 4 Gamma Halo?
humble yacht
yes
still falcon
Yay, at least I got one thing right
I also read for Halo Infinite, the armour Chief wears is yet another upgraded addition?
still falcon
Only if 343 did not change absolutely everything on Foward Unto Dawn
torpid flare
nano-bot
still falcon
Yes, a nano-bot can totally restructure a entire starship to look exactly, perfectly like the upgraded versions
Along with the weapons, and know exactly what the armour is gonna be like in 4-5 years into the future
reef cobalt
And without any contact with the unsc
still falcon
Nanbot is a cheap way to say it honestly, and it took me out of me
Also there is nothing about nanotechnology used on the Mjolnir armours
Or else they would had simply used the Mk-5 to be Mk-6 without the need to actually change them entirely
They changed the art style to remove anything of Bungie and tried to use in-universe lore where it made no sense. I'd be ok with it only changing anything else but Foward Unto Dawn
past olive
it was a cheap way because they had no other explanation
terse lava
Yep
torpid flare
why did 343 change everything
still falcon
Why they couldn't keep only Foward Unto Dawn and the tech on it the same makes no sense
past olive
because they wanted to change everything
humble yacht
all they did was make the Dawn look more like the Autumn
it still looked like a UNSC ship
still falcon
At least in Halo Wars 2, the tech is still the same
Thea Mk-4 still being used by Red Team
Though the character design through me off a bit, Cutter looks alright
But Anders
They took her Asian heritage out
humble yacht
except they didn't
still falcon
She looks more Western
humble yacht
Ander's facial cap actress has asian heritage
but yeah, because they used facial cap, they're gonna look different
still falcon
She was also in cryogenic stasis, and both Cutter and Anders had entirely facial reconstruction
Then again, the cinematics made had been better and they could had been the original design
But tech could had limited that I suppose
At least we got a game that we all loved
I always wandered what shall happen now, are we finally gonna see Red with Blue team again
Spirit of Fire finally back with humanity
humble yacht
no it's not
reef cobalt
its still at the ark
still falcon
I know
humble yacht
what humans other than the crew is at the ark?
still falcon
I mean will Spirit finally get back to UNSC space
reef cobalt
hope so
still falcon
More importantly, for Halo Infinite, are we gonna be marines if we do co-op (first player as Chief, the rest as marines)
torpid flare
i hope we could play as elites or brutes
terse lava
I miss playable sangheili 😢
versed helm
... Brutes? hope not lmao
reef cobalt
i dont think brutes will be playable
torpid flare
@terse lava me too
still falcon
I'd always wanted to be a marine (not ODST), but a marine. I reckon in Halo 3, they could had made us play as marine
if we did co-op
humble yacht
no, we'll probably be extra chiefs
still falcon
3rd player marine, 4th player elit
I reckon from halo 1, the second player was Linda since she was on the Autumn
past olive
na it'll just be like the other Halo's before 5
reef cobalt
that would of been awesome
past olive
everyone is a chief clone
except for Halo 3
which had Arbiter clones
or were they just random elites
still falcon
Not even arbiter clone
torpid flare
and reach
still falcon
What?
past olive
Reach technically had noble six clones
still falcon
I liked that
past olive
but it used each person's individual spartan
still falcon
Playing as our own literal Spartan avatar
reef cobalt
we can call them noble 7,8 and 9
torpid flare
or even noble 10
still falcon
I find it funny people still believed Thel 'Vadam was on reach and killed Noble Six
He wasn't, he'd be chasing after the Autumn
versed helm
It was just a random unnamed Field Marshal lol
still falcon
The entire games (Reach-3) basically took place next to each other
Idk about Halo 2-3 though
torpid flare
i would like to see noble six's real name
still falcon
It's what we say it is
Cause Noble Six is literally our own character and I named him "Bob"
versed helm
Noble 6 is a "Self insert character"
Its the reason he/she is unnamed, because its you.
still falcon
After my scientist teacher
I wish we had a halo game that allow us to use our own avatar again
And where we can customized everything
reef cobalt
replace that last b with a t and i can agree
still falcon
Unlike Halo 5
torpid flare
why
versed helm
Because avatar customization its more visually appealing than just smol green boi with one rooty tooty point and shooty
terse lava
So if noble 6 was us, does this mean that he was a sangheili 😆
past olive
Halo 4 allowed you to use your Spartan in the campaign
humble yacht
in Spartan Ops
versed helm
In spartan ops
humble yacht
not really campaign
past olive
or was that in the GOTY eddition only
I remember playing the game of the year edition and actually using the customised spartans in campaign
torpid flare
@terse lava or even the flood
humble yacht
that wasn't a thing for halo 4
past olive
and I am 100% sure they were customised spartans
versed helm
There weren't.
past olive
we played the level where we were on the mammoth
humble yacht
again, not a thing for halo 4
versed helm
Spartan ops
past olive
and we definitely weren't chief
humble yacht
the 360 was very moddable
versed helm
Because it was spartan ops Broodles
versed helm
Then you're simply incorrect, just look it up anywhere
past olive
bruh idc if straight facts tell me no this was legit what happened
humble yacht
something like this would be a well known feature if it were real
versed helm
Thats just not how Master Chief Halos work mate
humble yacht
you're either mis-remembering or you played a mod
past olive
well then idk how he did it but we definitely were not chief
and I am definitely not mis remembering this
versed helm
Only other playable campaign characters aside from halo 3's elites is the arbiter in Halo 2.
Only ones that allowed customization was Reach, Spartan Ops and I think ODST?
still falcon
Halo Reach allowed us to use our armour, Spartan Ops..
no idea, forgot
I tried playing Spartan Ops with my armour, but for some reason, it uses default when I actually play
humble yacht
ODST did not allow campaign customization
you simply played different characters in different missions
still falcon
For obvious reasons
versed helm
I only played it for the Campaign so wouldn't know lul
still falcon
ODST was a good change of pace
versed helm
Ye
still falcon
Too bad the Rookie
Spoiler alert
Died by getting killed by some terrorist
terse lava
Not really needed anymore
still falcon
Idc for spoilers
terse lava
Book been out for a while
still falcon
Ya lot seen the Rise of Skywalker?
If not, Rey's a Skywalker, not blood related or whatever, she's Palpatine's granddaughter? What, ya didn't know and having a fet, idc cause it's a terrible movie to the point I couldn't watch more then 10 minutes
Wait wrong universe
My bad
versed helm
Don't think this classes as Halo lore bucko
reef cobalt
😐
torpid flare
😐
still falcon
I realized that, cause this is the Power Ranger--, oh wait, wrong universe again
my bad
terse lava
....?
still falcon
Actually, question on the armour lore
past olive
-_-
torpid flare
@still falcon how do you mess up that bad
still falcon
Would Spartan-IVs also use the same gen as the Chief
I meant it all as a joke
Cause to me, it starting to look like "GO, GO, GO POWER RANGERS!"
humble yacht
All SIVs have Gen 2, just like chief does in H5
still falcon
When they began to use the armour and previewed it, a single twitch killed a guy when he wasn't augmented and basically died instantly. The Spartan-IIs uses them and were perfect.
So my question is, would the Gen 3, the chief is wearing be the same thing to compensate his augmentations, or would it be lower that even Spartan-IVs can wear his armour
I am sure Spartan-IIs be physically and mentally superior with the III being just as good, but IV being more in quantity then quality
reef cobalt
???
versed helm
Pretty sure they were just asking if Chiefs armor is modified since he's a spartan II
humble yacht
it's modified because it's Gen 3
terse lava
Ok?
still falcon
I can't say it cause it's considered a swear
versed helm
?
still falcon
Ya know that word I said and I did a bypass with @
cloud trellis
big thoery six is reach 🙂
torpid flare
i know right
versed helm
Big theory, he ded boi
cloud trellis
wait so where was blue team during halo 1,2 and 3
humble yacht
onyx, i think
cloud trellis
onyx?
humble yacht
yes. it's a forerunner shield world
humble yacht
yes
still falcon
So, it wasn't even during Halo 1 then, drifting in space
idk what I typed that was considered swear
lmao
dislike
cloud trellis
i don't know what is happening
versed helm
harvest was literally the first major planet to be invaded invaded by the covenant
still falcon
I was going to say Chief is very slow in Halo 5
versed helm
lol
cloud trellis
so onyx happened before halo 1
humble yacht
Reach happens in 2552
still falcon
There we go
humble yacht
all of halo ce-3 takes place within like 2 years
cloud trellis
i'm still reading the first book the fall of reach 😦
still falcon
Told was a good book
cloud trellis
someone told the truth
versed helm
Halo infinites campaign should be Somehow revive Sgt Johnson
terse lava
Halo 1-3 took place within months
past olive
I believe there's a year or so between 1 and 2
cloud trellis
someone get me a timeline
terse lava
gilded mason
September 19 - Halo CE
October 20 - Halo 2
terse lava
gilded mason
So only a single month
terse lava
Was close
gilded mason
Ye
sharp adder
Halo infinites campaign should be Somehow revive Sgt Johnson
@versed helm no that can ner evr happen yes it was a terrblie moment when he did but he died doing what he loved if tehy brg him back it willl 10000000000000000000000x worse than halo 5
terse lava
.......what?
terse lava
Well it was obvious
sharp adder
im reall guliable
past olive
huh
terse lava
So, where would you want to be during the covenant war
terse lava
Why there?
sharp adder
becase that is one of the mi places that got it the hardest with the fewest capitulates plus it where most of the support and logistics came from also because i live in Australia
ionic mortar
Hello?
gilded mason
Yes?
golden belfry
Wrong chat bro
gilded mason
Your question might receive better answers in another channel
fervent wasp
Probably cause if an elite kills another elite unhonorably he might be put as an arbiter
sharp adder
or a elite kills the arbier becoming the arbiter
terse lava
Would think no, before Fal, when the Arbiter was thr commander of the entire Covenant, an assassin Would have been killed. After Fal, when the hierachs chose arbiters, they would have just chosen a new one if needed. No reason to pick the assassin
abstract venture
When do u guys think a new grey team novels coming out
humble yacht
Maybe never
abstract venture
envoy set up a sequel in its ending so I'm hopeful
abstract venture
its set like 3 decades later tho
terse lava
And? Could have Nizat'a tale continue from there and perhaps meet chief again..as allies
gilded mason
🤩
terse lava
I can almost imagine the amusing awkwardness of blue, grey, or whichever team meeting Nizat, Tam, and the remaining covenant and humans on the planet
noble fjord
Ok so what is the current state of the Covenant post Halo 5? Because if they could be pulled together after Truths death, I'm sure it's not hard to pull them together after Jul Mdama's death
safe siren
Covenant are disbanded.
We only have minor splinters like the Keepers and other faction like the Banished
gilded mason
Because if they could be pulled together after Truths death
They didn't, really. A bunch of different factions broke out. One of them being Jul's. And I imagine with Jul's Covenant now shattered, what was once there will go off in search of other groups to join or try to make their own faction.
terse lava
They didnt pull together, they became various painter fa toons, although there are likely chunks of original covenant out there
gilded mason
Like Sali.
safe siren
Frankie said something about a new Covenant, but it could mean Ex covenant species.
Or maybe a new Covenant with Cortana as a spiritual leader
gilded mason
Buuuuuut...I imagine forming a Covenant would be a bit harder when you've got Big Sister watching
Yeah that
terse lava
Who knows
noble fjord
Ngl despite how much of a mess Halo 5 was to keep track of... I don't want 343i to abandon the games story (mainly so HW2 remains Cannon)
terse lava
Well the Created are a bit of a pickle to deal with. Typical Ai rebellion and all that
noble fjord
So given Halo Infinite's location... who do you think will be our overarching antagonist?
gilded mason
Me
bright briar
Cortana, I reckon, with a bit of Warden.
sacred dew
Flood,didact or chips
noble fjord
I really dislike these filters . _ .
I couldn't even make a simple gameplay quote
gilded mason
Yeah, but what can ya do, eh?
noble fjord
Literally nothing
Also the Didact would be fun to see again but the question becomes "Can 343i explain his return in a short, sweet, easy to understand way without making it take like 90% of the game?"
sacred dew
Composer or domain maybe?
deep pewter
To the average Halo fan? No, because if it’s not me shoot shoot aliens it’s too much for them
noble fjord
Also could the Didact take control of his Knights and Soldiers from Cortana?
deep pewter
Under his current predicament, no
noble fjord
Well I guessed that, but I was thinking more so if he found away out of his current "Situation"
deep pewter
If he gets out, it probably won’t be of his own accord
noble fjord
so what being(s) in the Halo universe would willingly free a psychotic, forerunner "warlord" (For lack of a better term)
I've got no guesses
terse lava
Another covenant remnant. Perhaps the didact's Lt who also became a knight and 344 made a point of mentioning she was used by oni for war games
abstract venture
Yeah I don't think Cortana will be the primary antagonist, atleast not by the end
Maybe it will be revealed something is influencing her like a composed Didact, the flood or maybe even abbadon
agile dragon
As a Halo lover, the fact they made her into a villain annoys me.
I can't be the only one feeling that way.
gilded mason
I can't be the only one feeling that way.
Nope, only one.
agile dragon
:') I'm special.
abstract venture
I don't really care about Cortana being a villian or not, I just don't like the AI rebellion trope
Overused imo, and Prometheans are boring to fight compared to covies
gilded mason
I just don't like the AI rebellion trope
Yeah
agile dragon
fighting the flood felt much more exciting to me, with that element of horror >=D
abstract venture
Ye, odds are they will be in infinite
agile dragon
(I did mostly Halo 2 for context)
carmine sleet
What odds are saying they will be in Infinite?
terse lava
top men
deep pewter
I’d much rather fight prometheans than the flood again
noble fjord
I want to see Prometheans fight the flood
bright briar
That'd be cool, I'd take a video in a terminal if not a game.
stoic hamlet
I don’t want Flood again for a long while tbh, unless it’s like Awakening the Nightmare. Super small scale, easily dealt with.
carmine sleet
I honestly want new threats to deal with. The Flood can only be the threat so many times without it feeling derivative of the previous games
torpid flare
the flood was supposedly exterminated
terse lava
Only a single outbreak which was contained
carmine sleet
The other Halos have facilities which store Flood, but it's unlikely anyone would be going about messing with containment, given the threat the Flood pose
terse lava
looks at Governors of Contrition
carmine sleet
I hope they're not about anymore
terse lava
Who knows
abstract venture
Pug noises = flood
versed helm
Hm, perhaps a good way to reintroduce them would be to have Jul Mdama's covenant, who are pretty much dead in the water by now with the loss of both Jul and Sanghelios, release the flood as a last ditch effort and act of revenge against their enemies
carmine sleet
They really don't equal that, Shaq
carmine sleet
Now, they're fanatical, Stoze, but I don't think they'd do something that crazy
versed helm
And the pug noises, i think it's about a 50/50 it's either flood or some of the new wildlife shown in the trailers.
abstract venture
Yeah Juls covenant just hate humans and arbiters faction, they don't want to kill the galaxy
versed helm
Hm, yeah you're probably right.
carmine sleet
A random video of pug noises that's unrelated to Halo is not evidence. Yes, they recorded pug noises, but that doesn't mean they'd use it for the Flood
abstract venture
Pug spelled backwards is flood so...
versed helm
Bruh
terse lava
...what?
carmine sleet
Shaq... Really...
terse lava
Besides that bit of oddness...could easily be an unggoy noise
humble yacht
+1 vote to write the flood out of halo forever
terse lava
Well we cant do that due to the primordial's promise. Yes, now you can shake your fist ar Greg Bear
humble yacht
It’s fiction, you can do whatever you like
versed helm
I’d rather fight toddlers with guns over prometheans
humble yacht
Anything to stop all these “the flood are in infinite!” posts
terse lava
I am not fond of them either
The flood clearly wont be in infinite outside of maybe a survival type gamenor an infection varient
versed helm
I don't see why that'd warrant an entire series retcon to someone important to the story line, the reason the halos were made in the first place
humble yacht
I’d rather fight toddlers with guns over prometheans
Just play multiplayer, no prometheans there
versed helm
That’s what I do in 5 👀
humble yacht
And you might even find toddlers with guns in multiplayer
versed helm
Really i'd say promethians are less fun to fight than flood.
I have 👀
Especially role playing toddlers
humble yacht
Flood are more boring to me, for sure
versed helm
I wouldn’t say prometheans are any better, if anything they’re more cheap
Same with promethians though
deep pewter
Only in 4, in 5 they got improved dramatically
humble yacht
Prometheans require more strategy
terse lava
I think we can all agree though covenant make a good enemy to fight
versed helm
Only ever going for headshots isn't really strategy
Let’s go with that so this doesn’t become a 50 sentence argument
Those get quite tiresome
Honestly, I think the truth about the situation is that Prometheans and Flood are just fine enemies but the Covenant are probably the most compelling enemy sandbox in shooters like, ever, so the other ones seem lacklustre despite being pretty well-rounded and fun most of the time.
humble yacht
The strategy is what enemies to attack first, when to push, when to not push,
versed helm
Covenant are fun to fight
humble yacht
For flood it’s just hit hard and fast and then run
terse lava
No Chim is right on this one, I have had to use different tactics fighting the promethans compared to fighting the flood
With the flood, you just need firepower to win
versed helm
I have to play like it’s modern warfare, peak and shoot, mostly because they have godly aim
terse lava
The bots promethans can bum rush or teleport behind you or use those annoying watchers
versed helm
Covies are fun because every soldier is different and requires very different strategies, and their weapons fill different roles than the unsc weapons, which makes them vibe well with the weapon sandbox. Grunts drop plasma pistols which make it easy to kill elites, ect.
The Flood have a pretty cool basic combat loop. You got hordes of little dudes to mow down, you got big ones to shotgun, and you got bit explodey dudes who you can also use against their buddies. That's a pretty good if basic combo.
humble yacht
The pure form was the most interesting flood form by far but it was woefully underutilized
versed helm
I think Halo 3 probably moved it in some slightly unsatisfying directions with how it handled the pure forms.
Promethian weapons all do the same thing, fire the same hardlight, with the occasional one that mimics a unsc weapon like the scattershot or incineration cannon
humble yacht
For all their transforming, i rarely felt they used it tactically
I mean, UNSC guns all fire bullets, so
versed helm
I think the only good promethian weapon was the turret they added in halo 5 tbqh, since it didn't fill the same role a unsc weapon took
Ye
Difference is, you're not fighting enemies with unsc weapons
deep pewter
Seems like only the plasma pistol/needler fills a role separate from the UNSC weapons
versed helm
I think that's slightly broken logic. When you have a weapon sandbox that encapsulates multiple factions, of course there's going to be overlap in the weapon sandbox.
I don't think that's good grounds to criticize the design of a faction.
deep pewter
Carbine/BR, Beam rifle/sniper, fuel rod/rocket launcher, etc
versed helm
in CE, the plasma rifle was just a better AR
terse lava
I mean in function and design
versed helm
What Nathan said, basically
humble yacht
I suppose since all Promethean weapons fire orange rounds, that’s slightly more boring that the color spectrum of the covie weapons
versed helm
Yes, but when almost all but 1 weapon fill the exact same role as another factions weapon, it's not really that great.
And they all have the same coloration
It's not exactly the same role
The lightrifle does feel different from any UNSC precision weapon
They've got different firing patterns, different damage
Light rifle
Different than any unsc weapon
It's literally a glowing orange BR
Incremental differences are how you make weapons distinct while keeping a large and varied sandbox
Yeah, and the Carbine is just a glowing BR too
You're being overly reductive
Carbine isn't 3 round burst.
It behaves less like a BR and more like a DMR and even then it doesn’t feel as precise
And is near useless against shields
Nor is the light rifle in like, 3/4 of the ways you can use it across the series
humble yacht
Zoomed lightrifle isn’t burst either
versed helm
Scope it, it becomes DMR-ish, but it still feels smoother to shoot.
Incremental difference.
hasty locust
I preferred the way they did the light rifle in 4
humble yacht
There’s a limited number of base mechanics that weapons can have in a game, especially one with as large a sandbox a halo. That’s why the reqs were an interesting experiment, because it allowed weapons within a family to compound different secondary mechanics to make them feel unique
versed helm
I think the promethean weapons are boring since they all look kinda the same, with the same colors, same bursts, not like covie weapons which all looked different and had a different color while firing.
I think that's a fair enough criticism.
They are just a bit boring in general.
hasty locust
They’re meant to look the same
versed helm
Anyways this went from Promethean vs Flood to promethean weapons
Though Halo 5 did go some way to jazzing them up by making them all pretty powerful.
humble yacht
Covie has benefit of taking weapons from multiple cultures
versed helm
Idk. I just felt the promethian weapons need a bit more variety. Like, the only forunner weapon in the OT was the sentinel beam, which was always really different than any other wepaon in the sandbox. Now, i'm not saying they should all be gimmick weapons, but i'm just saying that making them a bit more unique to use would be nice, and would be fitting of the foreunners. Like, why not have the binary rifle round ricochet several times? Or have the supressor be the only scoped fully automatic weapon?
humble yacht
But sure, aesthetically promethean weapons are a bit dull
versed helm
The shotgun secondary on the boltshot made it really fun in 4, so why not make that it's primary fire, just weaker?
hasty locust
If I made a bunch of killer brobots I wouldn’t spent all that time making their armaments look different
versed helm
Just because they’re meant to look the same doesn’t make them any more interesting spy.
I think, Valk, you might be trying to do the classic YouTuber thing of trying to find a smart, academic-sounding way of "they're a bit boring."
humble yacht
The scattershot has the richochet mechanic
versed helm
Sure it makes sense, but it’s still boring to look at spy.
I think the problems with their design, as dudebro above was saying, are kind more presentation issue than balance.
That’s the problem I have with promethean weapons myself
They all look kinda the same
Although the actual notion of the Forerunners have small arms which are in any way comparable with what the UNSC and Covenant use kinda hurts their gravitas.
From a lore perspective.
hasty locust
Who’s dudebro?
hasty locust
Ah
versed helm
And I agree
That’s the biggest issue with promethean weapons in my opinion
And yes, the scattershot had a ricochet mechanic, but that was a bit more difficult to use effectivley on a shotgun type weapon
humble yacht
You could say that game balancing hurts the gravitas of a variety of weapons, not just the Promethean ones
terse lava
Well look at the weapon presented in Origins. A pistol-like hardlight device that can fire a single beam or combine fire with otherd
versed helm
Like, before Halo 4, I was kinda imagining that they'd just be on a whole new playing field. Probably totally transcending the need for rifles and weapons of that nature, relying on hordes of powerful sentinels.
gilded mason
Yeah, I think any Forerunner weapons in the sandbox should be treated as really good power weapons, really. If we have to have them
versed helm
That would be more interesting
Of course their armour components and tools could constitute devastating power weapons.
humble yacht
If that were the case then what would Promethean forces use against you?
versed helm
Well, I said before Halo 4
hasty locust
My ONLY issue with the promethean weapons is why have a handle? Like I guess with 5 it was cleared up with soldiers, but if your robot’s arm was a shotgun why give the shotgunss a handle
versed helm
I guess what I'm implying is that the Prometheans aren't the route I'd have taken
gilded mason
I guess what I'm implying is that the Prometheans aren't the route I'd have taken
Yeah
versed helm
Not that I don't think they're pretty cool as a concept and have potential
humble yacht
I don’t see many other routes they could have taken that wouldn’t have felt contrived or redundant
versed helm
They have potential but currently I personally don’t like them, maybe if they’re in infinite 343 finds a sweet spot with them.
A new enemy faction was totally the way to go, don't get me wrong
It’s the execution u mean?
But it's not like the nuances and defining characteristics of the Prometheans were set in stone
More sentinel types would have been an interesting idea. And yes, i know technically promethians are basically sentinels with once living brains coded in them, but they're so vastly different that it doesn't feel like they're in any way connected to them, much like the new forerunner art style.
terse lava
Their lack of vehicles is rather sad too. I know technsilly it would be redundant as they are robots, but gameplay wise would have been nice
humble yacht
What other options would there have been? Human enemies? Not really the spirit of the games. More covies? Done before. More flood? Done before. Precursors? How would that even work, it wouldn’t be realistic. Some totally newly invented enemy with no connection to anything previously described? Where did they come from then and why should we care about them
versed helm
I would’ve preferred if they had their own vehicles over using covenant and UNSC ones, makes things more interesting.
Sentinels.
To be fair, speaking of sentinels, there is an argument against my original point of the Forerunners lacking gravitas on account of having these infantry weapons which are just slightly higher on the same plateau of all the other small arms in Halo, and that is that the weapons used by their sentinels weren't overwhelmingly sophisticated or deadly.
humble yacht
Forerunner enemies was a logical next step. And making them forerunner robots made it so that they could be associate with forerunners without undoing the whole “all the forerunners are dead” part of the lore
versed helm
And these are the same sentinels tasked with fighting Flood outbreaks
So clearly they're not considered sub-par as combat units
humble yacht
In a way, the prometheans could be viewed as different types of sentinels
humble yacht
They may not float but if all sentinels floated then it wouldn’t be very interesting
terse lava
Fair point Chimera
hasty locust
Legs are inefficient though, silly forerunners
humble yacht
Through the the OG trilogy we saw 3.5 types of sentinels, and one of those types were not even hostile. I don’t really see how armies of sentinels would have made for compelling enemy types
terse lava
.5?
hasty locust
I wouldn’t want that
humble yacht
Blue beam
versed helm
Nobody (in their right mind, at least) is saying forerunner enemies are a bad idea, hell i really like it. We're just saying that the promethians are a bit too different than sentinels for most people, i don't get why they had to be humanoid/animal-like. Why not have like, human sized enemies that look like, say, a compressed tank and stuff, idk. Why not have them look more mechanical, to fit with the older designs.
versed helm
Eh maybe.
Prometheans were a good idea, I’m just not a fan of the execution.
What J said, i agree.
terse lava
As if one can scare the flood
versed helm
Only the Doomslayer and Chief are capable of such thing
terse lava
Not an infection form 😋 they literally are incapable of feeling pain or fear
versed helm
Even the popcorns cower in fear
static trench
@versed helm Prometheans used to be forerunners and humans at some point
so why wouldn't they be humanoid?
versed helm
Because now they're robots
humble yacht
I mean, when you decide to continue a game after a conclusion as resolved as H3, nothing is ever gonna be perfect
static trench
didnt the Didact convert a bunch of humans into Prometheans?
versed helm
Does it say in the lore that they have to remain a humanoid shape if they were a humanoid before?
static trench
so it makes sense that they are humanoid
versed helm
But that doesn't bother me so much, it's unhealthy to be so granular about the designs of everything
humble yacht
The knights don’t really have a humanoid shape
static trench
well, no... but they USED to be human, so it makes sense
versed helm
He probably used composed essences as a cheap and easy way to get what are functionally a form of smart AI