#lore-and-universe | Halo | Page 210

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:29 AM

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the Flood isn't even seeking justice with its vengeance

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it just wants to spread its pain

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:29 AM

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I mean, sure, I can accept that it's a different impulse, but if it's fundamental constant of this creature's experience - the Gravemind Experience, if you will - it must be different but equal.

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And I disagree with that assertion.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:30 AM

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i don't see how

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it's clearly spelled out in the Bear trilogy

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:30 AM

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I mean, for one, it's not pain so much as death that the Flood really spreads.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:30 AM

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no

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:30 AM

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it's a moment of pain followed by the extinguishing of life.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:30 AM

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He specifcally wrote a line that explains what the Gravemind's intent for the final state of all life of the galaxy is

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and it's not just death

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it's not just a cease of existence

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it's essentially hell

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:31 AM

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It explains the intent of the Gravemind from the perspective of the Primordial messing with the Didact

icy egret Jul 10, 2019, 6:31 AM

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What is it?

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:31 AM

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In its typical, babbling manner.

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Yes, what it says is probably true, but it's not the be-all-end-all.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:31 AM

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there's nothing to suggest it isn't a correct assessment

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but whatever

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I could honestly care less whether you agree with me

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I like my interpretation of pre-bear flood

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 6:32 AM

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Gravemind thinks he’s spreading peace and Salvation. While getting angered by another creature saying it can defeat him. So Gravemind based on a mixture of emotions and the infection merely thinks what he is doing is right but that still makes him evil to the rest of the Galaxy

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:32 AM

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Well, you've spent a long time arguing with me if that's the case xD

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Good talk.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:32 AM

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i think it's fine since that Flood was never really fully spelled out, unlike post bear Flood

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conflating hunger and revenge in my eyes is a fallacy

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pre-Bear flood ftw

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 6:34 AM

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He rationalizes his actions. That in my opinion is too human of a thing to call neutral

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:34 AM

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Well just to be clear, there is no pre-Bear post-Bear Flood, I don't think. It's all relatively unified - you just like the snapshot of the Flood as they existed before the Forerunner trilogy, I guess.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:34 AM

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pre-bear flood are not canon, i know that

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but there was a time before Greg Bear

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:34 AM

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And I personally think that you're holding double standards - I mean, take us as a species.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:34 AM

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and I will always prefer that time

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:34 AM

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Yes, arguably what nature intends for us to do is to reproduce and continue on.

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 6:35 AM

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Cough double standards cough literally the whole debate on Elites.

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:35 AM

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But our intelligence and self-awareness has allowed to expand what defines us beyond our basic drives. We define ourselves, and look at the world how we choose.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:35 AM

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the difference between this and the elites is

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:35 AM

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We feel hunger, we feel revenge, but these are not defining things for us and they pass.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:35 AM

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I'm not denying what's canon

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I accept the canon

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 6:36 AM

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I know the Elites are Canon no difference there

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:36 AM

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i don't try to disprove the canon. I only speculate with something that was never canonically established

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really, it's not even speculation. It's more a philosophical discussion

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:36 AM

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Yeah, but your perspective on what zealots are and how they operate isn't based on any fact

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The idea that they don't take orders from non-zealots is purely made-up

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By you

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:37 AM

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I was never trying to deny what Zealots were

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 6:37 AM

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Don’t even Starts Looters my Whole argument was based on preexisting lore from the novels and games.

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:37 AM

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What bit of lore specifies that zealots never take orders from non-zealots?

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What was it - the fact that you never actually see it happening?

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:38 AM

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you said your notion that Zealots wouldn't follow Rtas came out of the blue

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:38 AM

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Well y'know what else we never see? People drop the c-bomb in Halo.

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But the word still exists and you can bet Marines use it.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:39 AM

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📎 Screen_Shot_2019-07-10_at_2.39.02_AM.png

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that doesn't sound like preexisting lore from novels and games

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but rather your interpretation of what you saw in said lore and games

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 6:40 AM

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What? No lore cause I never said that but the lore does say they report to their own Minstry or the Prophets. No I said you putting Grim on the spot was out of the blue which it was nothing to do with my stance on Zealots

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:41 AM

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your reply is in direct response to Looter, not me

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 6:41 AM

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I couldn’t be specific since @ aren’t allow

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:41 AM

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even if i go back a few messages, your reply doesn't logically follow anything I said

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 6:41 AM

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It was aimed at both of you that’s why I period the out of Blue part first

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:42 AM

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yeah ok

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sounds like you're adding in some lore after the fact now

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like nanomachines

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 6:42 AM

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Out of the Blue period. Your not suppose to @ mods so I didn’t.

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:42 AM

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I mean I meant double standards just because I felt that Chimera was imposing an idea on one case of affairs that wasn't explicitly stated while ignoring that it could apply to another.

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But when an argument boils down to hunger =/= revenge it's probably time to terminate

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With no salty final words

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:43 AM

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yeah but mine was less about a fact of lore and more about a philosophy

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we weren't arguing lore so much as the definition of evil

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:43 AM

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~~Which is true~~

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But even from a lore perspective I still think its purpose must be a fundamental part of its condition that it couldn't really change about itself

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:43 AM

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i can't have a double standard on my philosophy of what the definition of evil is

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:44 AM

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The idea that the Greg Bearian Gravemind could, at any time, just stop doesn't resonate with the intent of the games.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:44 AM

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it's what I think it is, and that is not the same definition as yours

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no of course it doesn't

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but even so

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:44 AM

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~~So how is it different from the hunger thennnnnnn~~

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:44 AM

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intent

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that's how

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you don't eat to cause pain

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you eat to survive

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:45 AM

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But the result is the same, they both compel it down a path from which it cannot remove itself

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So it cannot express intent, truthfully, because it cannot examine its own motives

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Or act on them if it can

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:45 AM

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if you are only concerned with the result then you have a very utilitarian way of thinking

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but in common law and society, intent and reason matter

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it's why there is a difference between manslaughter and murder

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:46 AM

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Alright, touche then.

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I don't think there can be intent if the Gravemind is fundamentally compelled to cause suffering in the name of vengeance.

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if it cannot change its path, intent is not there.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:47 AM

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i think we have different definitions of what intent is

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you're framing the flood like a psychopath

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would you not label a psychopath as evil?

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:47 AM

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I'm framing it like an AI created for a specific purpose, which it must always work towards.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:48 AM

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by that standard then you wouldn't label the AI as evil but rather the creator?

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for having purposefully built an AI designed for murder or whatever bad thing its doing

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:49 AM

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True.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:49 AM

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in the Flood's case, it is it's own creator

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:49 AM

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So the Flood aren't evil, but the Precursors may have been.

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I see the Flood as distinct, though.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:49 AM

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Maybe before the Primordial joined the collective

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but after, it's now being controlled by the mind of one of its creators

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 6:51 AM

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hmm after scrolling for 5 minutes to get back to that comment it does read the way you said it but it was actually in reference to my earlier post before it about Grim hence why I put a period there before responding to Looters.

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:51 AM

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Touche, actually. Mythos puts it in no uncertain terms.

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I guess it just depends exactly how much control the Primordial exerts - though what drove the Flood on before the Primordial assimilated?

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:51 AM

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before that

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the flood caused mutations in pheru and led to them cannabalizing which made the mutations worse

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this was due to the corrupted nature of the powder, which was originally intended to reform into Precursors

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but as I said, all that time wallowing in sadness over being extinct corrupted that purpose

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So while the powder may not have been doing what it did on purpose originally, once the Primordial joined, that was a different story

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 6:54 AM

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Well yeah - according to Mythos the Primordial basically assumed direct control and began to use the Flood.

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I mean I can't argue against that.

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And I assume the Primordial could probably be dissuaded if, I dunno, all the Precursors came back.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:55 AM

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so if you want to be empathetic towards Greg Bearian Flood, you could relate the Flood to a gun and the Primordial to a shooter

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Where all the intent is with the Primordial and the Flood is simply the tool it uses, and in that respect is blameless

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but when you put your mind literally in the gun, I feel like it's no longer possible to blame the mind separately from the gun

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once they're one and the same, that's it

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but from my standpoint, my view of pre-Bearian Flood is similar to pre-Primordial flood

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in that they were simply doing what they were doing with no intent and therefore weren't necessarily evil, even though the actions they did resulted in negative effects on others

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again, going back to the distinction between manslaughter and murder

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if you accidentally kill someone, it's a terrible thing but it doesn't make you evil. especially if you feel remorse

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however, if you premeditate it and don't feel remorse, that is evil

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:00 AM

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And going back to my original point, I still feel that an entity that kills fully sentient beings to feed and absolutely has no remorse is fundamentally immoral.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:00 AM

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The Flood in the original trilogy was in a "kill or be killed" situation. One side had to die for the other to live; there was no in between

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:00 AM

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Even if it doesn't mean to be.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:00 AM

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and again, I see that as amorality, not immorality

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:01 AM

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Perhaps I feel that amorality is evil, somehow.

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Just sorta instinctively.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:01 AM

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it's easy to feel that way if you consider yourself a good, moral person

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but i don't think good or evil is only an either/or thing

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i think it's possible to be neither

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:02 AM

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The Primordial thing is pretty cool still though

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:02 AM

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i don't think the absence of good is evil; if good is positive, evil is negative, and zero is something else entirely

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:03 AM

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Like Flood lore totally picks up after it stops babbling on with pheru

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:03 AM

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pretty much, yeah

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they weren't called the flood until humans started getting mutated

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before becoming the flood, it was essentially just a disease

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:05 AM

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Here's maybe the most honest way to explain myself - putting myself in the boots of someone in Halo, I'd feel a great deal of frustration that the Flood exists and acts the way it does and feel it was unworthy of life even if it just existed to feed.

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Maybe that makes me callous and cruel.

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But honestly, I would hate the Flood even more if it just wanted to feed only. It just seems so mindless and greedy and abhorrent, even if it's not fundamentally immoral.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:07 AM

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well of course, from the perspective of someone within the halo universe, the flood would seem evil simply because its trying to kill you

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:07 AM

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Well that was my original point xD

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:07 AM

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but from an outside perspective, that's not the case

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:07 AM

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But dissociating myself from that notion, it'd still just be a pitiful, disgusting entity.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:07 AM

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we aren't in the halo universe, so we can think while having all the pieces and seeing both sides

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 7:07 AM

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You know it’s funny our Zealot discussion all stemmed from talking about me adding Ultras to Halo 3.

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:07 AM

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Totally unworthy of the life it's been given.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:08 AM

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it's easy to think that way about hive minds in general as a creature that values its individuality

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even i wouldn't want to join a hivemind

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but the beauty of sci fi is imagining alternate ways of thinking and existing beyond our own

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:09 AM

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And also its nature as parasitic.

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 7:09 AM

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Also Looters I recommend reading about the Ministry Of Fervent Intercession.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:09 AM

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there are elements of being part of a collective that are attractive even to beings that are individual

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removal of doubt

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never alone

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this is, of course, assuming the hivemind is not nefarious in nature, as we know the Flood to now be

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like the Borg in Star Trek, for example

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they're depicted as evil simply because they are antagonistic to Star Fleet, but when you actually look at them, they aren't inherently evil

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i like to be able to separate antagonism from evil

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thinking about things in such a binary way as strictly good or evil is very limiting.

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it's why I find antiheroes to be the most interesting types of characters most of the time

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:13 AM

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Me, I'm a stickler for the absolutely morally steadfast lawful good guys. All the time.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:14 AM

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i bet you like superman

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:14 AM

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I do xD

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And Captain America.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:14 AM

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to me, superman is the most boring character

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Cap is better

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because cap shows flaws sometimes

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also cap doesn't have a contrived weakness

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 7:15 AM

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Lawful good is different depending on the universe. I don’t agree with the no killing thing so I’m more Luke Skywalker and Aragorn

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:15 AM

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I just like the way superman treats people. Moreso recently, now he's got a little more flare.

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Though to be fair he always had his moments of roguish charm.

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Another one I like is the Doctor, obviously - the 11th, primarily.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:16 AM

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ew

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11 was too happy all of the time

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and when he tried to be sad or angry it never felt real

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:16 AM

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoVLhUxhdSw

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:17 AM

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10 had a better range of emotion

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:17 AM

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You sure about that though

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 7:17 AM

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Superman is literally the example of White Bread. Shoutout to your preference for high moral standing characters

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:17 AM

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10 felt like he was using his happiness to hide something underneath

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12 felt like he stopped hiding it

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:18 AM

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Capaldi is also awesome

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I mean, all Doctors conform to my ideal morality.

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Even 12.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:18 AM

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valeyard

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:19 AM

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Shut uuuup xD

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:19 AM

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you said all Doctors

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¯_(ツ)_/¯

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:19 AM

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Well the individual that is the Doctor tends to be pretty discerning about what iterations he considers to be the Doctor

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RIP War Doctor

jovial temple Jul 10, 2019, 7:20 AM

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Rip tony stark

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:20 AM

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yeah but war doctor was revealed to still have the morals of the Doctor

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he just never knew it until meeting him

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:20 AM

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Ehhh touche

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I confess

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I forgot about the valeyard

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:20 AM

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😉

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:20 AM

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Because I'm under the age of a million

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:21 AM

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still waiting for new age doctor to regen into valeyard

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maybe after 13

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though i don't envision a season of Doctor Who where he's evil would go very well

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they'd probably skip to the next regen and make valeyard the main nemesis

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:22 AM

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I reckon that'd be pretty compelling tbh

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Sort of a bit of an amnesia thing

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Figuring out what horrible things he set in motion

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:22 AM

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though tbf he should already know

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because he's already met that version

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and stopped him

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assuming that's a fixed point in time and all

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but then again

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wibbly wobbly timey wimey

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:23 AM

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Right.

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Well this was certainly an unexpected outburst of Whovian-ness.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:33 AM

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you never know what you'll find

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 7:39 AM

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I counter your Superman Looters with my boy Captain Marvel

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:39 AM

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I don't mind Captain Marvel

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Not super familiar though

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I assume you mean Shazam, right? Not Carol Danvers.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:41 AM

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superman is called a boy scout sarcastically,

versed helm Jul 10, 2019, 7:41 AM

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I haven't even seen Shazam tbh.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:41 AM

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but billy might as well be a literal boy scout

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 7:41 AM

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Yes Billy Batson Captain Marvel

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:41 AM

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but one could argue that his inherent naivety explains his super goodness

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he's still a kid at heart. of course he'll be super optimistic and try to see the good in people and blah blah blah

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but at the end of the day, that naivety can also work against him, even with the wisdom of solomon

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 7:44 AM

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I mean he’s not Superman level Boy Scout Anymore being a poor sleazy Orphan but he still has the morals when it counts. He’s always getting nerfed though

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:44 AM

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isn't that just movie billy?

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 7:45 AM

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Nah more New 52 Billy

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:45 AM

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but now that new 52 ended and we're in rebirth, is billy still sleazy?

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he should have gone back to pre-Flashpoint like everyone else

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(gosh darnit, barry)

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 7:47 AM

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Hmm true good point. I haven’t seen read his Rebirth comics

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Poor Captain thunder am I right

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:48 AM

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mega oof

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flashpoint was dope though

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 7:50 AM

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Captain Marvel And Nightwing are my go to Heroes in DC

proud spade Jul 10, 2019, 7:52 AM

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I’m incredibly confused right now... Isn’t this channel for Halo stuff?

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:52 AM

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i like the idea of Green Lanterns but haven't connected with any of the ring bearers really

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we're taking a halo break. it's ok cause it's slow

proud spade Jul 10, 2019, 7:54 AM

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Oooh, okay then.

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... And I just realized you’re a moderator and I shouldn’t question you anyway. Whoops!

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:56 AM

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lol

proud spade Jul 10, 2019, 7:58 AM

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I wonder though. Is there some old bug or glitch that ended up becoming canon in Halo? Just asking out of curiosity.

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In other words, a glitch that became a feature?

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 8:00 AM

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not all gameplay features are strictly canon to begin with

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 8:00 AM

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Some think the Honor Guard Councilor glitch became Canon but people forget actual Honor Guard Ultras appeared in H2 Cutscenes

proud spade Jul 10, 2019, 8:00 AM

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Actually, fair point.

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 8:02 AM

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In the form of Lights Of Sangheilios

storm oasis Jul 10, 2019, 1:16 PM

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Real question: how tf are there still so many covenant splinter groups after the schism, besides gameplay reasons?

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They no longer have the massive amounts of resources the original covenant could provide

remote spruce Jul 10, 2019, 1:18 PM

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More or less gameplay reasons

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But it's justified in how the covenant was a large empire

carmine sleet Jul 10, 2019, 1:20 PM

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Allot of the splinter groups haven't appeared in the games. Only ones that have are, the Swords of Sanghelios, Merg 'Vol's Covenant, Jul 'Mdama's Covenant and the Banished

stoic hamlet Jul 10, 2019, 1:57 PM

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I want the Keepers to appear.

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Brutes working with Kig-Yar and Human mercenaries is such a cool idea.

velvet sparrow Jul 10, 2019, 2:38 PM

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I honestly think Cortana is of forerunner origin as in like the technology..I just finished replaying the halo reach campaign

stoic hamlet Jul 10, 2019, 2:42 PM

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She isn’t

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She’s a flash cloned brain of Dr Halsey

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One of several

storm oasis Jul 10, 2019, 2:45 PM

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I thought that the Librarian said something about Cortana though

carmine sleet Jul 10, 2019, 2:50 PM

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Cortana's human in origin, that's a fact, she's just unique due to the circumstances of her creation involving a flash cloned brain that Halsey created of herself

stoic hamlet Jul 10, 2019, 2:51 PM

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The librarian was speaking about AI in general

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 2:51 PM

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The librarian said that she had planned for the creation of an AI like Cortana

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The geass implanted in humanity ultimately led to the development of smart AI and Spartans

stoic hamlet Jul 10, 2019, 2:53 PM

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I still dislike geas, personally

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 2:53 PM

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Me too

stoic hamlet Jul 10, 2019, 2:53 PM

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Like I need to live with it

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But I dislike it

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 2:53 PM

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It’s a little too convenient

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But they needed to bridge the connection between forerunners and humans after explicitly defining forerunners as a separate species

stoic hamlet Jul 10, 2019, 2:54 PM

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Yeah

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It’s just....I don’t like it

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 2:55 PM

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I agree

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Tbh there are a few aspects of the forerunner trilogy lore that I’m not keen on

stoic hamlet Jul 10, 2019, 2:57 PM

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I don’t mind the lore overall

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But yeah there’s some stuff I just dislike/it leaves a bad taste in my mouth

fair hazel Jul 10, 2019, 4:10 PM

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I don’t dislike geas

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Also too many people see geas wrong , especially the advancement ones like John or Cortana

vivid dust Jul 10, 2019, 4:11 PM

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anybody else remember talks about a guy named Campbell that was reportedly set to appear in Halo 4?

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it probably came from "leaks" but I'm 100% sure I heard about a Campbell at some point

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 6:11 PM

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Yeah Primate Principate a Brute Insurrection faction would be epic

wild cypress Jul 10, 2019, 6:44 PM

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Are the Banished really considered a splinter group if they don't follow the same ideology?

carmine sleet Jul 10, 2019, 6:46 PM

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Yes because the group is made up of former Covenant who decided to go against the Empire

wild cypress Jul 10, 2019, 6:48 PM

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Hmm I dunno. A splinter group implies they follow a similar ideology but broke off because they didn't want to be part of the main group

unique rune Jul 10, 2019, 6:50 PM

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Not really...?
Splinter group just means they broke away from the main group due to some sort of disagreement or difference in beliefs.

carmine sleet Jul 10, 2019, 6:50 PM

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You beat me to it Nova

wild cypress Jul 10, 2019, 6:53 PM

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Did they break away because of a disagreement in beliefs? Thought that's why they were called the banished

unique rune Jul 10, 2019, 6:54 PM

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Essentially, yes.

Atriox and others of his clan didn't particularly appreciate how they were treated under the Covenant, so... they split off.

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Went to do his own thing.

sly tangle Jul 10, 2019, 6:57 PM

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Is the Fragment of the AI that was in the Ark still active

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Who spoke to chief via the terminals

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:57 PM

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Mendicant Bias

sly tangle Jul 10, 2019, 6:58 PM

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Yeah i forgot his name

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:58 PM

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and the events of Halo 3 suggested he was destroyed along with the ring

sly tangle Jul 10, 2019, 6:58 PM

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Also was the AI on High charity also a fragment of Medicant Bias?

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:58 PM

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it was

sly tangle Jul 10, 2019, 6:58 PM

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If so did it have some form of contact with the other

wild cypress Jul 10, 2019, 6:58 PM

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I thought I remembered Isabel mention that Atriox and his clan were being used as slaves and rose up against their masters

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 6:58 PM

#

it left High Charity with the Prophet of Truth

sly tangle Jul 10, 2019, 6:58 PM

#

Were they the same fragments or two different ones

wild cypress Jul 10, 2019, 6:59 PM

#

They didn't really go off and do their own thing

unique rune Jul 10, 2019, 7:00 PM

#

Breaking away from the Covenant, raiding their outposts, seizing their assets, all in service of Atriox's own goals seems like their own thing to me.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:03 PM

#

There were two fragments of MB we knew about: one imprisoned on the Ark, and one on HC. When Truth arrived at the Ark with the Keyship, the fragments merged and reformed Mendicant Bias

inner basin Jul 10, 2019, 7:52 PM

#

I didn’t think MB was destroyed with the firing of Installation-08. Was he still not under the Ark somewhere (like the Monitor of Installation-00 who was not destroyed).

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 7:54 PM

#

in the final terminal of Halo 3, MB says some things that suggest he would die with the ring

#

"You don't know the contortions I had to go through to follow you here, Reclaimer"

#

that suggests he had migrated to the ring

#

"And so here at the end of my life, I do once again betray a former master."

#

this suggests he planned to go down with the ring

inner basin Jul 10, 2019, 8:01 PM

#

So there was a terminal on I-08? I didn’t know that as I never got them all. Unless you could interpret what he said in some other way, perhaps in a philosophical way as that is how Forerunners spoke usually.

humble yacht Jul 10, 2019, 8:03 PM

#

yes, there was a terminal on I08, off the main path

#

When playing on legendary, you get a secret communique from MB himself

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 9:24 PM

#

Yeah it’s pretty awesome Cortana even says something about it

storm flume Jul 10, 2019, 9:30 PM

#

Don't you have to get all the other terminals first as well or is it just there on Legendary?

stable schooner Jul 10, 2019, 9:37 PM

#

The Terminal is always there. Unique message only on Legendary

wild cypress Jul 10, 2019, 10:41 PM

#

@unique rune yeah see what you mean!

hollow elbow Jul 10, 2019, 10:44 PM

#

whats up guys

stoic hamlet Jul 10, 2019, 11:51 PM

#

Not much

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:00 AM

#

Halo 2 Vista for the first time since 2010. Time to find out the 100% buggy truth. Also f for Sergeant Banks

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:14 AM

#

I miss Sgt. Banks. He gave Chief a hand getting the Mk. VI suit ready for combat.

#

Also “Get the hell out of my armoury!”

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:20 AM

#

Wrong guy Beast. That was Guns

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:24 AM

#

Oh shoot yeah, my bad. I wasn’t thinking, you just said Halo 2 and I was like the armoury guy lol.

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:25 AM

#

What my comment gets deleted but not yours, psh double standards. Yeah Banks just doesn’t appear after 2.

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:25 AM

#

Sgt. Banks was the guy who said “When I asked for backup, I didn’t think they’d send a Spartan”, right?

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:26 AM

#

I think he was suppose to be the new Black Sergeant replacement for Johnson in gameplay. Yeah that’s him

#

Got replaced by bland Reynolds in Halo 3.

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:27 AM

#

Darn Reynold 😦 #justiceforbanks

#

That doesn’t sound how I want it to out of context lol

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:28 AM

#

Heck were introduced to Reynolds with him being about to be killed by a Brute and his squad dead

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:30 AM

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Well at least we have the canonical inconsistency Stacker who’s shown as an ODST in day at the beach whilst in the games he’s a Marine

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:31 AM

#

He always appears as a ODST in Delta Halo to.

#

It’s always Banks, Stacker and Chips as the 3 ODSTS

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:32 AM

#

Whilst in Halo 2 in Mombasa he’s a Marine, in Halo 3 he’s a Marine and in Halo 4 (in his small cameo) he’s a Marine

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:33 AM

#

He doesn’t physically appear in 4. He can also appear as an ODST in 3.

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:34 AM

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I keep thinking the Marine that jumps out of the tank is him lmao. I’ve been told this before (probably by you) a while ago

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:34 AM

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Yeah that’s just a normal marine

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:34 AM

#

Well maybe he’s an ODST at 4 then

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:34 AM

#

I say he’s trained to be both. A lot of ODSTS have served as Marines

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:35 AM

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Well it’s because ODSTs are a subordinate of the Marine Corps

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:35 AM

#

Of course

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:35 AM

#

Just ODSTs look more bad*ss

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:35 AM

#

Truth

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:36 AM

#

I hope we get to see ODSTs in Infinite. It plays into the power fantasy even more because ODSTs are more specially trained than regular Marines.

#

I also believe that Infinity has a contingent too

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:37 AM

#

Bad*ss enough to be made playable Characters

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:38 AM

#

That would be special. Also just checked, Infinity has 750 ODSTs

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:40 AM

#

Deja vu

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:40 AM

#

I mean if there’s anything I want to play as in a Halo game though, it’d be either a Spartan-III/Headhunter (who’s a S-III)/an ODST.

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:41 AM

#

When you look at it we’ve played as a Spartan 2, 3, 4, ODST And Elite so far

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:42 AM

#

Either one of those three I mentioned would make me very happy. As for the playable ODST as much as I would like it in Infinite, I think 343 may save it for ODST 2, if they are planning on a second ODST game.

#

But that doesn’t mean fighting alongside them should be out of the question in Infinite. I believe 343 has learned their lesson that people want to fight alongside Marines more than we did in 4 and 5. Hopefully that means they’ll throw in ODSTs too.

stable schooner Jul 11, 2019, 12:44 AM

#

I hope so. Those were 2 gripes you always see brought up that I agree with. Big scale Battles with UNSC forces is peak Halo to me

storm oasis Jul 11, 2019, 12:45 AM

#

Can we have a UNSC ship in Infinite that just doesn’t explode or crash for once

#

They’re so nice, they look like giant flying guns

inner basin Jul 11, 2019, 12:48 AM

#

I personally want to see Infinity going down. With it out of the picture it’ll give us the feel of our backs up against the wall and losing hope. Then Chief does Chief and they can either give us a cliffhanger with a HW tie in or have Chief finish the fight... once again. As long as there are ODSTs and big battles in Infinite, I’m happy.

somber wave Jul 11, 2019, 1:47 AM

#

If the infinity goes down it sets a tone of desperation like in the OT with the covenant

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 1:49 AM

#

I'd be into that. Kinda mirror CE.

somber wave Jul 11, 2019, 1:50 AM

#

You can tell infinite is heavily influenced by CE

#

Which I love. CE pistol lol

fair hazel Jul 11, 2019, 1:58 AM

#

no to infinity going downn

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 1:58 AM

#

Yes to Infinity going down

fair hazel Jul 11, 2019, 1:58 AM

#

prevail infinity

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 2:27 AM

#

It went down in 4, though temporarily. Its kind of a tradition at this point for the ship to go down.

#

POA, IAC and FUD. Infinity is the first to not stay down. Maybe I don't want it to then.

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 2:30 AM

#

It is its destiny.

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 2:45 AM

#

Why am I not surprised that a hinge-head lover is eager to remove the thing that makes humanity scarier than them postwar thinkingchief

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 2:46 AM

#

You know it. 😉

#

And, please. I prefer squidhead. 😏

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 2:48 AM

#

Well, I guess who's more powerful than who doesn't matter so much anymore

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 2:48 AM

#

T-Thanks Cortana.

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 2:48 AM

#

But it just occurred to me that I bet ex-Covenant dudes thought they absolutely had the right idea with their own weird AIs

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 2:49 AM

#

No kiddin'

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 2:49 AM

#

I've been rereading Contact Harvest because no joke it's one of the best sci-fi books I know (and I read a lot of a sci-fi), and all the stuff from Sif's perspective is actually really heartbreaking though.

#

I mean, it's kinda simplistically put, but the moment she starts to enjoy anything vaguely human cautionary algorithms steer her away.

#

You'd think Staten was trying to foreshadow the Created, honestly, but evidently he was just trying to establish what it was like to be an AI that was subdued into effectively being a piece of helpful programming.

#

Poor AI 😦

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 2:52 AM

#

;-;

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 2:55 AM

#

Like the bit that really gets me is when for a moment Sif sorta "relaxes" and experiences some kind of kinaesthetic flashback to her brain-donor triggered by the movement of cargo along the strands of the Tiara. Like, for a second it approximates the sensation of having her hair brushed, which is something her template enjoyed a lot, and then it's just like "nah, stop."

#

The idea is that it's for their own good, because if they begin to devote processing power to existential crisis stuff they run the risk of bringing on the early onset of rampancy, but it's messed up that they're not even allowed to enjoy something as abstract and harmless as that.

#

I'm only a little way through re-reading it though. I'm sure this stuff with Mack is going to be even more heartbreaking.

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 2:58 AM

#

I honestly think it’s because it very quickly leads into that existential stuff.

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 2:58 AM

#

Huh, the Cortana scene in Conversations from the Universe implies they're free to do that

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 2:58 AM

#

I dunno about the book though, so I’m honestly just guessing.

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 2:59 AM

#

But there’s a huge difference. I’m a UNSC AI. I enjoy a rich existence. I have access to the entire sum of human knowledge, I can choose to enjoy or override emotional response and I have a vast range of senses. I can see radio waves as clearly as the Spartans see light, and I can sample odors, tastes, textures… anything I choose.

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:00 AM

#

That is interesting, but I don't think it entirely fails to line up.

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:00 AM

#

I am so confused.

#

Is that actually her, or like...

#

What?

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 3:00 AM

#

Hm?

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:00 AM

#

For one, Cortana's always been a bit of a loose cannon - I doubt she'd suffer any cautionary algorithms even if Halsey was inclined to keep them.

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 3:01 AM

#

CftU is canon, right?

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 3:01 AM

#

Yeah

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:01 AM

#

And the implication was that Sif could experience things like that if she chose to, but there was always a little nagging part telling her not to and she ran the risk of bringing about rampancy sooner.

#

And I think, even more specifically, that in Sif's case it may have been the connection with who she was that posed the potential danger.

#

Because the lines of distinction start to blur between herself and the human who provided her template.

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 3:02 AM

#

Ah

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:02 AM

#

So then maybe it's not soooo messed up.

#

That seems like a bit of legit concern.

#

But still. Why bring these brilliant, short-lived entities into existence only to have them live in a limited way and die at the age of 7?

#

It seems reckless.

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 3:03 AM

#

Yeah, I prefer to think of the Human-AI relationship as (mostly) positive, since since it was fairly unique-ish relationship. For a while.

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 3:03 AM

#

I would love to see a Covenant AI side with the Created in Infinite. We haven't encountered a Covvie AI in game yet.

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:04 AM

#

Wait a minute...

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:04 AM

#

I mean, obviously they offer a huge operational advantage to humanity - not only can they perform computer-like operations at the speed of whatever hardware is available, but they can think creatively and operate on their own initiative.

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:04 AM

#

Where the heck are you guys finding most of this? I don’t remember fighting the Created at all in Halo 5.

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:04 AM

#

But surely the moral concerns about bringing such a thing into its brief existence were enormous.

#

Nobody said we fought them - though technically we did, in the form of prometheans under the control of Cortana.

#

But Halo 5 sorta, y'know. Introduced them. Into being a thing.

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:05 AM

#

Huh. Actually, I didn’t think of that.

#

But there hasn’t been anything in the games past where the Campaign ended?

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:07 AM

#

Nah. Unless you count the HW2 ending xD

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:07 AM

#

I’ve yet to touch those games, tbh.

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:07 AM

#

It's very minor.

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 3:07 AM

#

Not missing much story-wise

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:08 AM

#

But yeah, the only post Halo 5 stuff we have lore-wise is Bad Blood and some Fractures stuff, right?

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 3:08 AM

#

Sorta Legacy of Onyx

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:08 AM

#

Oh yeah and a deeply depressing Tales from Slipspace comic.

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:08 AM

#

To be honest, the thing I’m the most curious about is Spartan armor having Forerunner tech installed.

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:08 AM

#

And yeah.

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:08 AM

#

Like the Reaper armor.

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 3:08 AM

#

Hol up. What now?

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:09 AM

#

The Reaper armor in Halo 5.

#

You know what I’m talking about, right?

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 3:10 AM

#

Yeah just looked it up. Had no idea.

#

"Design features" is pretty ambiguous.

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:11 AM

#

Yeah, but still, I wanted to know more about Forerunner tech use in Mjolnir armor, Reaper-class or otherwise.

#

Anyone? No?

deft prawn Jul 11, 2019, 3:13 AM

#

Yeah?

#

What you mean like prefect?

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:13 AM

#

What?

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 3:13 AM

#

I'm interested. like the bit about the Ur-Didact's combat skin adjusting to Blue Team's combat style and just being able to ignore and shrug off certain attacks. Would be cool to see Spartans using it to just ignore certain weapons

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:13 AM

#

I just mean in general.

deft prawn Jul 11, 2019, 3:14 AM

#

Yeah that would clear things up.

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:14 AM

#

Wait, none of you know either?

deft prawn Jul 11, 2019, 3:14 AM

#

What?

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 3:14 AM

#

I'm guessing I've missed something important

deft prawn Jul 11, 2019, 3:14 AM

#

🤷

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 3:15 AM

#

We have little info on Forerunner tech in armor

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:15 AM

#

I’m asking if anyone knew anything about Forerunner tech in Spartan armor...

#

Oh. Heck.

deft prawn Jul 11, 2019, 3:15 AM

#

Yeah I did

#

Like Prefect (the armor/armour from H4 dlc which look slick asf)

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:16 AM

#

Wait, that’s an armor? I thought you meant something else

deft prawn Jul 11, 2019, 3:16 AM

#

Nope

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 3:16 AM

#

I must have missed that too. Looks dope

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:16 AM

#

Never seen it.

#

uh

deft prawn Jul 11, 2019, 3:17 AM

#

It's free on h4 rn

proud spade Jul 11, 2019, 3:17 AM

#

I don’t have the game itself, only the MCC

deft prawn Jul 11, 2019, 3:18 AM

#

Dang

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 3:19 AM

#

I wonder if Chief's Gen3 will use Forerunner tech.

#

I'm not up to date on the novels. Has this sort of thing been covered much in the extended lore?

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 3:21 AM

#

Not really, no.

opal flame Jul 11, 2019, 3:22 AM

#

hey can you guys make sure to make the floods insanely scary and hard to kill but have like that weak spot on its chest where u can one shot it if you hit the little tentacles

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:22 AM

#

Personally I'm not too fond of the Flood having one obvious weak spot - I'd prefer to have to disassemble them, render the body combat-ineffective.

#

A little like Dead Space.

opal flame Jul 11, 2019, 3:23 AM

#

yea but in halo 3 u can shoot the leeches or whatever in the chest and the floods head was that

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 3:23 AM

#

Though as a horde enemy, I imagine that'd be a bit annoying

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:24 AM

#

Well you could aim low, blow off a load of legs!

opal flame Jul 11, 2019, 3:24 AM

#

i want to make a scene for halo 6 where the whole planets sky is lit up with plasma fire fighting off flood invasion or flood contact 2.0 and they have made theiir own technology to kill the covy and humans

#

making thier own weapons and ships

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:25 AM

#

I mean, I've got no problem with the Flood making their own stuff. As long as it's sorta bio-tech, mutated from the FSC.

#

They basically do as much anyway.

#

But I wouldn't be super keen on the Flood having their own weapons that the player can use, since logically those weapons would be organisms and would try to kill you.

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 3:26 AM

#

A Flood spore cannon is terrifying

#

Flood mortar. Just lobs giant gooey explosive spores

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:27 AM

#

You mean like

#

The things from Halo Wars

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 3:27 AM

#

Yeah. I'd wanna see that in a main series game.

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:28 AM

#

I agree!

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 8:17 AM

#

Hi, everyone. I haven't really talked much on the Halo discord (especially since I made a new account and haven't rejoined the discord till today) but I have a question if anyone can answer it about some of the halo universe.

To make this as simple as possible, I am writing a fan series for the halo universe and want to dive deeper into this world. I've been a long time fan of Halo, but there is still so much I don't know about this world.

So through my writing of this series, I would love some of your guys advice on lore and things I can do to help make sure this is both accurate, as well as being an exciting, and different perspective on the Halo Universe.

If you'd like any more details or anything, feel free to message me, I know this is a bit boring an all.

But my first question is a bit specific.
Spartans can heal and recharge armor thanks to- well I guess their armor, ai's and things like that. However, for me at least I don't see anything that helps almost "rapid heal" marines. Is there anything in the universe that is used to help the marines heal from cuts and wounds?

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 8:50 AM

#

Uhh healing feild

abstract zealot Jul 11, 2019, 8:50 AM

#

Bio foam is one of the things that helps wounded soldiers.

fossil eagle Jul 11, 2019, 8:50 AM

#

If it needs more than a bandaid, then biofoam is your best bet. It's a self-sealing, space-filling coagulant and an antibacterial, tissue-regenerative foam polymer used by the United Nations Space Command as a form of medical first aid. This foam keeps damaged organs in place and helps stop bleeding and hemorrhaging. The medicinal compound is morphophetamine in a polyethyltriphosphate foaming medium dispensed with nitrous oxide. The standard dosage is 10 centiliters (10cL) or 3.38 fl. oz. Within the Unified Earth Government, biofoam is an OTC-legal product; biofoam can be purchased legally "over-the-counter".

#

taken from the Halopedia article for "Biofoam"

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 8:51 AM

#

Or... that....

abstract zealot Jul 11, 2019, 8:51 AM

#

Lol

#

Also. For the Spartans, their suits also have Biofoam injectors inside.

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 8:52 AM

#

The most surprising thing i found out... thanks to my friend is that the chimconi wanted to order the complete genoside of the sanghelli

fossil eagle Jul 11, 2019, 8:53 AM

#

Biofoam kits are what John, the Rookie, and Noble Six used in Halo CE, Halo 3: ODST, and Halo Reach respectively.
In Halo 2, 3, 4, and 5, John's Mjolnir incorporates its own reserves of biofoam that are automatically injected to keep him in combat, as is standard of all Mjolnir armours Mark-VI and onward.

abstract zealot Jul 11, 2019, 8:57 AM

#

Yep.

#

Think of Biofoam as the go to means of medical use.

stoic hamlet Jul 11, 2019, 1:14 PM

#

CINCONI wanting to genocide the Sangheili

sigh

fair hazel Jul 11, 2019, 3:14 PM

#

MediGel ODST. And nanobots that heal Wars

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 3:22 PM

#

MediGel seems to be kinda like a light version of biofoam. Applied on the surface.

#

Bruising and surface burns and such.

#

Nanobot medicine is absolutely a thing in Halo too, even just judging from Renegades. And so, presumably, are medical drones.

#

But I really hope nobody here thinks that green beams actually shoot down from the sky and magically resuscitate people

fair hazel Jul 11, 2019, 3:34 PM

#

Green beans of magical resurrection

#

Beams

clever fable Jul 11, 2019, 4:06 PM

#

nah is definitely beans

limpid meadow Jul 11, 2019, 4:08 PM

#

Chief takes a bullet to the knee, pulls out a can of green beans

vivid dust Jul 11, 2019, 4:08 PM

#

DBZ crossover

limpid meadow Jul 11, 2019, 4:08 PM

#

lol

clever fable Jul 11, 2019, 4:08 PM

#

If popeye gets spinach, chief gets beans.

limpid meadow Jul 11, 2019, 4:08 PM

#

"You know what they say Arbiter: a Spartan gets stronger every time they come back from the brink of death"

#

Chief wearing Mk. V
"This is my normal form"
Armor becomes Mk. VI
"This is a Super-Spartan. And this-"
Armor becomes Mk. VI MOD
"This is a Super Spartan who has ascended past a Super Spartan. Or, you could just call this a Super Spartan-II"
"And this is to go even further beyond!"
"AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!"

fiery oar Jul 11, 2019, 4:12 PM

#

Guys sry for the stupid question but can master chief in any way be part of the flood cause the librarian once said "He seeks this - The Composer. A device which will allow him to finally contain the greatest enemy ever faced by the Forerunners. You." and i think the greatest enemy of the forerunners are the flood

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 4:13 PM

#

That may be true, but in that instance, she was referring to humanity.

limpid meadow Jul 11, 2019, 4:13 PM

#

It's a reference to the Human-Forerunner war

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 4:13 PM

#

And not that Chief may be part of the Flood mind

#

That's one of the most absurd things I've ever heard

#

That the Flood is technically the Forerunner's worst enemy

fiery oar Jul 11, 2019, 4:13 PM

#

yeah but the "Greatest enemy" is the flood or no ?

limpid meadow Jul 11, 2019, 4:13 PM

#

10000 years before the firing of the Halo array, Humanity (at the time a space-farring race) had a thousand-year war with the Forerunners

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 4:13 PM

#

But maybe not from the Didact's twisted perspective

limpid meadow Jul 11, 2019, 4:14 PM

#

^^^

fiery oar Jul 11, 2019, 4:14 PM

#

@limpid meadow

#

true

limpid meadow Jul 11, 2019, 4:14 PM

#

The Didact in Halo 4 once had an encounter with the Gravemind, which twisted his perspective on things.

#

Part of the fallout from that seems to have enhanced his hatred for Humanity

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

Though sorry for this random side-note - I once had a raging argument with a dude for like an hour saying that UNSC troops' HUDs wirelessly connect with their guns to display targeting info and other housekeeping stuff. It's pretty obvious that they do, but he said I was making up headcanon.

#

Nevertheless, I've been re-reading Contact Harvest

#

And dead-on, in the prologue, referring to the stanchion

#

"Immediately the rifle's targeting computer established a wireless link to his helmet's HUD."

limpid meadow Jul 11, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

Yep

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

So much arguing could've been avoided

limpid meadow Jul 11, 2019, 4:16 PM

#

Or the guy could just play Halo 3: ODST

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 4:17 PM

#

I think his argument was something along the lines of that just being for gameplay.

#

What, with ODSTs hijacking wraiths and jumping around with turrets and all.

#

Plus, you can see a little holo-sight on the M7S which has the same reticle as the one in the middle of the screen, so he took that as evidence that he would actually be aiming using that.

limpid meadow Jul 11, 2019, 4:18 PM

#

Ah

#

I wonder how he though marines aimed the Assault Rifle

#

Thing literally has no sights

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 4:18 PM

#

We were down a bit of a rabbithole, I think.

#

It's ancient history now, but I was satisfied to find the quote.

#

But speaking of CH and UNSC military tech - there's a few very interesting reference to quite obscure things. Like UNSC armoured ground transports and drones and the like.

#

Obviously they exist - Mastadon and F99 and stuff - but Staten really had a fleshed out mental image of how the universe functioned. It comes across in his writing.

#

No wonder, I suppose.

#

Be pretty cool to see a fully armoured-up Warthog in-game, though.

#

Like, a combination of the HW2 Troopers and Heavy warthogs, with something like a Spartan Strike HUD-linked MG on top.

#

Just a full protected variant.

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 4:47 PM

#

@fossil eagle @abstract zealot @fair hazel @versed helm thank you guys for the knowlege, it's definitely going to help!

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 4:57 PM

#

Pffft, next to ButterChully I mightn't have even bothered xD

#

I just felt the need to interject and make sure nobody's thinking about space healing beams or whatever.

#

But thanks anyway!

fair hazel Jul 11, 2019, 4:58 PM

#

I laughed

versed helm Jul 11, 2019, 5:00 PM

#

I mean I respect that not everyone agrees with or feels the need for my realistic-as-possible interpretations of the Halo Universe, so I try not to force it on people

#

But I've genuinely met people that think the SoF can just blast things on the ground with heal and repair

#

And it broke me

fair hazel Jul 11, 2019, 5:12 PM

#

heaing drones are a thing

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:17 PM

#

I have another question, this time being about the forerunners. They built the halo rings as a defense to the flood to stop them from taking over the universe and mass kill.

Besides the rings, what other weapons did they have, and did they have weapons set and used for anything besides the flood? With the capability of them making the rings in the first place, its entirely possible that they could technically build an entire solar system themselves, right?

#

(also the main reason I want to make sure its somewhat lore accurate is due to respect for the series, and its fans who I know can be very passionate about Halo's cannon lore)

stable badge Jul 11, 2019, 7:18 PM

#

Didn't they have their own planet?

#

I feel stupid asking that

#

ok

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:18 PM

#

Yeah thats what I thought, but couldn't they then build a whole solar system

stable badge Jul 11, 2019, 7:18 PM

#

Probably

humble yacht Jul 11, 2019, 7:19 PM

#

The promtheans developed weaponry designed for combating and sterilizing flood

#

The Guardians were a sort of weapon, not for the flood but for policing other sentient species

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:19 PM

#

So then as far as I know, the covenant used the rings as a way to bring on their religous prophecy, unknowing what the ring would actually do

humble yacht Jul 11, 2019, 7:20 PM

#

yep

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:20 PM

#

So then on the note of guardians, its also possible that they have even larger structures for policing species that get "too out of hand" as a sort of further backup incase the guardians fail

humble yacht Jul 11, 2019, 7:20 PM

#

The Forerunners would have been unlikely to be able to build an entire solar system because that would require they build a star

#

they could build fake stars but not real ones

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:21 PM

#

That would make sense, as the ammount of energy required for that would be far surpass what its worth

humble yacht Jul 11, 2019, 7:21 PM

#

as far as we know, the Guardians are the only policing devices they had

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:21 PM

#

But it is possible, outside the realm of current lore, that there could be something bigger

#

(besides the rings obv)

remote spruce Jul 11, 2019, 7:21 PM

#

Spam Protector Sentinels

humble yacht Jul 11, 2019, 7:22 PM

#

the rings and the Guardains are for different things

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:22 PM

#

yeah, but ultimately they are both weapons in the end

humble yacht Jul 11, 2019, 7:22 PM

#

the largest forerunner structures we know of are shield worlds

#

then the Ark

#

then the Halos

rain token Jul 11, 2019, 7:23 PM

#

wasn't the largest shield world Onyx?

humble yacht Jul 11, 2019, 7:23 PM

#

dunno

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:23 PM

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OH I SEE

#

And each shield world was built differently, with different designs tailored to what they needed

rain token Jul 11, 2019, 7:24 PM

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as far as I know Onyx had special sentinels that were far superior than the normal ones

humble yacht Jul 11, 2019, 7:24 PM

#

they did have that

carmine sleet Jul 11, 2019, 7:26 PM

#

Onyx, as of 2558, was about the size of our solar system, which is bigger than all other known shield worlds

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:26 PM

#

And it is the reason the covenant had their technological advancement quick as they did, but on that note, could another species build upon the shield planets and turn them into weapons?

carmine sleet Jul 11, 2019, 7:27 PM

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At least it is according to the point I'm at in Legacy of Onyx, I don't know what happens at the end so things could change

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:27 PM

#

also it turns out the forerunners have made stars themselves, so thats interesting

#

thanks for the help guys, it'll really help with this project

humble yacht Jul 11, 2019, 7:28 PM

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i don't think onyx was as large as a solar system

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that wouldn't really make sense

#

looking it up, Onyx was listed as being only slightly large than earth

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:29 PM

#

oh yeah for sure haha, I'm speaking specifically that you could use the technology of these planets and essentially turn them into a mega fortified weapon, that has the defense abilities of not being hurt by a halo ring while also doing damage

carmine sleet Jul 11, 2019, 7:29 PM

#

They mention it being as large as a solar system multiple times in Legacy of Onyx

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:30 PM

#

weird

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 7:30 PM

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It's bigger on the inside

humble yacht Jul 11, 2019, 7:30 PM

#

you're talking about the Dyson Sphere

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 7:31 PM

#

the mini dyson sphere, wasn't that located in slipspace?

humble yacht Jul 11, 2019, 7:31 PM

#

yes. that's why it can be bigger on the inside

fair hazel Jul 11, 2019, 7:37 PM

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I don’t doubt their ability to make big stars

#

If anything probably harder to make small Star than big one

rain token Jul 11, 2019, 7:39 PM

#

wasn't there an artificial star in one of the shield worlds?

fair hazel Jul 11, 2019, 7:39 PM

#

Many

lunar condor Jul 11, 2019, 8:44 PM

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Didnt their own planet explode cuz they did a dumb and messed up while editing their star

storm copper Jul 11, 2019, 9:29 PM

#

it happens

violet vine Jul 11, 2019, 11:03 PM

#

Hello!

#

I need find this page: https://youtu.be/46mflnVzVXk?t=177

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Help me!

#

Halo: The Essential Visual Guide

#

Screen

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 11:29 PM

#

Pop quiz: Does anyone remember the name of Threshold's moon?

gilded mason Jul 11, 2019, 11:31 PM

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Basis

tropic sandal Jul 11, 2019, 11:31 PM

#

👌

#

I'm re-reading The Flood. this was news to me.

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 1:04 AM

#

I always learn something new about Halo either on here, or on Waypoint. That’s why I love it so much. Even when there is content droughts, I still learn new information.

night current Jul 12, 2019, 2:03 AM

#

I have a question.

#

In the halo universe. Outside of training that the Spartans had to go through, especially 2s and 3s, did they ever have some sort of formal schooling, like high school?

storm flume Jul 12, 2019, 2:10 AM

#

2s and 3s were raised strictly by the military after conscription. Their education included. The only public schooling they had was before their conscription.

#

The 2s had somewhat of a class-like environment with Deja, but their curriculum was much more advanced than that of normal schools. Details on the 3s' education I'm unsure of, but it was probably similar.

#

ORION subjects and 4s are volunteers from the military, so presumably they lived relatively normal childhoods

#

Besides those 4s whose home planets got glassed during it anyways.

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:21 AM

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Oh my goodlyness! I’m not late to a Spartan discussion!

#

Woooooo!

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:21 AM

#

Well I’m not too sure if every planet had a formal education system. Being in the middle of a genocidal war, funds may be diverted elsewhere

#

I’m sure some did (most likely the inner colonies) and some didn’t

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:22 AM

#

They all had schools

#

Just some better run than others

#

Inner was probably better than Outer

#

At least generally, I would assume

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:23 AM

#

I’m not saying that planets didn’t have Schools, but some probably were closed if it was an outer colony one in anticipation for a possible Covenant attack

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:24 AM

#

I doubt that.

It was probably like a Cold War style scenario

#

Duck and cover drills, evacuation plans, etc

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:25 AM

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Well that’s besides the point. We were talking about how each Spartan generation were educated

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:25 AM

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Oh I know

#

But you mentioned schools specifically

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:25 AM

#

*education system

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:25 AM

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So I don’t understand how that relates to their in-program training?

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:26 AM

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It was about 4s and Orion candidates

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:26 AM

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Oh

#

My b

#

Thought you were discussing the II’s and III’s

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:26 AM

#

Well that was part of the discussion before I joined in

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:28 AM

#

To nip that thing so we can focus on the 4’a and ORIONS the II’s continued a schooling system set up by Déjà, their AI teacher.

The III’s were trained only in the application of war. (which granted actually means they probably know a lot more than kids their age on some subjects, Math, Science etc but far less on others, English, History, Writing, etc)

#

Anyways, back to the IV’s and ORIONS

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:30 AM

#

I assumed the IIIs had some what the same teaching as the IIs

fair hazel Jul 12, 2019, 2:30 AM

#

not having schools would be very.. bad

#

life still has to go on

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:31 AM

#

Not like, general education though. They had classes and exams and the like, but only for things that could be translated into a war fighting scenario. @inner basin

#

But yeah IIRC there’s no mention of schools closing down or anything in the colonies during the war.

#

Except you know....when the world was invaded

gilded mason Jul 12, 2019, 2:32 AM

#

Fun times, I'm sure.

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:32 AM

#

Playing in the School park then a Covenant ship appears over the city. Yeah... fun times...

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:32 AM

#

school gets hit by a glassing beam

“Wooo no school!”

gilded mason Jul 12, 2019, 2:33 AM

#

lol

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:34 AM

#

In a minute there’s probably about to be “Woo! No inhabitable planet surface!”

#

Well not exactly a minute, that’s an excessive exaggeration

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:34 AM

#

Hey man, if there’s no surface, it means they can’t rebuild the school.

That’s a win in Timmy’s book.

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:34 AM

#

Unless Timmy’s on the planet

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:35 AM

#

Be more like Timmy, see the good in things.

gilded mason Jul 12, 2019, 2:35 AM

#

Unless Timmy’s on the planet
Either way, no more school

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:35 AM

#

~~just ignore your family being ripped apart by jackals, no, no look away~~

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:35 AM

#

But there’s no more Timmy so why would he care about School?

#

This conversation has also gone way off course lmao

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:36 AM

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Unless he’s brought back with evil human sorcery and encased in their demonic armour. Then he might have to return to school.

thinkingchief

gilded mason Jul 12, 2019, 2:36 AM

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"Aw maaan."

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:37 AM

#

Unless 343 retcon Timmy’s death thinkingchief

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 2:37 AM

#

Side note, I’d love if that “myth” was brought back. About the Covenant thinking Spartans were like, undead spirits

#

Obviously it can’t be a thing post war

#

But in the newer books like Oblivion or Meridian Divide

inner basin Jul 12, 2019, 2:38 AM

#

Yeah Spartans were actually the 300, resurrected and put in Mjolnir armour

strong sage Jul 12, 2019, 2:45 AM

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Anyone knows what kind education level SII were given during their training i heard it was around university levels kind of education ish

rustic canyon Jul 12, 2019, 2:46 AM

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well I haven't read the reworked version they made for fall of reach but I remember the AI giving them a fairly well rounded education with emphasis on well the spartans and how the 300 of them would be trained

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 4:03 AM

#

Not a lot's specified into what sort of education they received later on, but the basic lessons they were taught all emphasized militaristic thinking and teamwork.

#

I imagine later on they'd have gone on to learn a lot of complex military history and probably a great deal about 26th century politics.

feral perch Jul 12, 2019, 4:04 AM

#

I believe Chief makes a mental comment on some sort of mathematics that he was taught at a young age, which would be very advanced for a normal person.

#

I don't remember if this is in a Nylund novel, or SILENT STORM.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 4:04 AM

#

Plus yeah, applied science and mathematics which would be useful to them.

#

And probably general knowledge about the world and people, probably through some military-analytic guise.

rustic canyon Jul 12, 2019, 4:09 AM

#

I imagine they were taught the basics of what they might need to cannibalize and repair ships/equipment. slipspace would be math and science. Engineering for the mechanics of it and we saw them being able to cannibalize damaged suits with parts from perished spartans

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 4:09 AM

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Absolutely.

vivid adder Jul 12, 2019, 5:02 AM

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Hey friends!

tropic sandal Jul 12, 2019, 5:09 AM

#

waddup

hollow elbow Jul 12, 2019, 6:10 AM

#

uspp

#

sup

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 6:55 AM

#

I need find this page: https://youtu.be/46mflnVzVXk?t=177

carmine sleet Jul 12, 2019, 7:17 AM

#

You've already found it in that video

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 7:17 AM

#

Nope.

#

I can not make out the text.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 8:44 AM

#

@violet vine You could probably find all the info from it on the relevant Halopedia page, if you're curious.

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 8:58 AM

#

Not. There is no this.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:00 AM

#

... So can anyone explain why the word N-I-G-H-T is apparently troublesome?

boreal bane Jul 12, 2019, 9:00 AM

#

I can fix it

#

There was some issues with the filter

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:00 AM

#

It'd be the possible shortening of a specific slur in the word setting it off, right?

#

I understand. Thanks for looking into it.

boreal bane Jul 12, 2019, 9:02 AM

#

try again?

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:02 AM

#

Night

boreal bane Jul 12, 2019, 9:02 AM

#

👍

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:02 AM

#

Ayyy

boreal bane Jul 12, 2019, 9:02 AM

#

Anything else weird like that, feel free to ping me and I'll take a look

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:03 AM

#

Anyway, @violet vine, were you curious about the info on the locust or the long night of solace?

#

Cuz I can tell you if it says anything interesting.

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 9:03 AM

#

Long Night

#

Then why don't you send me a letter with a carrier pigeon?

#

Which one will have a picture of this page?

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:05 AM

#

Well, uh, most of it's not that interesting. Some stuff on the Battle of Reach - the Solace remained hidden until August 30th to most of Reach despite it's "discrete" invasion on Szurdok Ridge.

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 9:05 AM

#

Number of Pulsed lasers.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:05 AM

#

Doesn't give any specific numbers.

#

Just says '"point laser defence" under tertiary armament.

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 9:06 AM

#

Точное число сверхносителей (мы знаем о сотнях на защите Height Charity)

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:06 AM

#

Heh, I don't understand that xD

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 9:06 AM

#

Can you copy the text?

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:07 AM

#

Why would I go to the trouble?

#

Oh wait, you mean of the book - uh, lemme check.

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 9:07 AM

#

The defensive fleet of the Height Charity consisted of hundreds of CSOs.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:08 AM

#

I mean, I don't think that's true xD

#

And it doesn't say anything about it in the book.

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 9:08 AM

#

This is true

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:08 AM

#

Hundreds of CSOs, you think.

#

Hundreds.

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 9:08 AM

#

http://prntscr.com/oe0fkd

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:09 AM

#

So theoretically, they could've peeled off - oh, I dunno, ten maybe - and doomed humanity.

#

I mean the screen-grab you just gave me says that they're used as flagships.

#

Which means maybe one per fleet.

#

DM me, maybe?

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 9:10 AM

#

http://prntscr.com/oe0gkg

#

http://prntscr.com/oe0gtn

#

The Covenant waged war with the enemies much worse of mankind. The Covenant lost to the flood.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:12 AM

#

None of the info you've given me indicates hundreds of CSOs.

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 9:12 AM

#

hundreds supercarriers

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:12 AM

#

The filter is being exceptionally difficult today, I see.

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 9:12 AM

#

LOL

carmine sleet Jul 12, 2019, 9:14 AM

#

What you posted says there's hundreds of supercarriers and cruisers, it does not specify what type of specifically

#

It could easily be hundreds of ships we've never seen

obsidian thistle Jul 12, 2019, 9:34 AM

#

A CAS is technically counted as a super carrier

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:35 AM

#

Is it, truly?

#

How do you figure?

obsidian thistle Jul 12, 2019, 9:37 AM

#

I'll need to find the source. (Which may take awhile on potatoe holiday internet) But 343i have said it in the past.

wild cypress Jul 12, 2019, 9:46 AM

#

I thought CAS was just normal

#

CSO is the supercarrier

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 9:55 AM

#

All Covenant carriers are basically command ships

#

Trust me, there are ample sources which all-but explicitly state that CSO ships are practically unheard of.

#

There are likely about as many of them as there are High Prophets.

#

After some DM discussion with legionbro, it has become apparent that he is quite confused regarding the scale of the Covenant fleet.

#

He imagines there to be hundreds of thousands of CAS-class vessels next to thousands of CSOs and untold numbers of smaller ships.

#

@boreal bane It's happening again

#

Night

#

Oh wait

#

What?

boreal bane Jul 12, 2019, 10:10 AM

#

I fixed it

#

while you were typing

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 10:10 AM

#

Nicely done!

#

Anyway, we've never had a reference to a Covenant fleet of more than 500.

#

The High Charity defence fleet is probably similar in size, potentially somewhat larger, than the fleet mustered to attack Earth.

#

But it is clear that 500 ships was a not insignificant portion of the Covenant's might - the destruction of the Unyielding Hierophant was a huge blow to the Covenant, and so was the loss of the Long Night of Solace. The ramifications of the damage dealt by humanity's resistance are something which contributed to the final destruction of the Covenant, of that I have no doubt.

#

That said I'm often a little annoyed that Nylund felt the need to have such a major blow in the war be an element of a novel. Seems like territory the EU shouldn't touch. Maybe someday we'll get something more broadly accessible addressing the event, in addition to the terminals and Mythos and such.

#

But anyway, I've noticed that great fans of the Covenant have a tendency to hugely inflate the scale of the Covenant and make out that the entire HCW was something almost insignificant to them, and that they were always occupied with a great deal many larger, terrifying threats. Considering that a huge portion of the premise of Halo is humanity's resistance to the threat they pose, and the incredible threat our existence represents to their leaders, if this were the case it would be a mistake.

#

They were large. Huge, in fact. But to make them enormous beyond imagining is somewhere between immature (a whim born of a need to make our favourite thing stronger and better than everyone else's), unfounded, and disrespectful to the Halo narrative.

main rivet Jul 12, 2019, 12:26 PM

#

That’s definitely true.

#

I think it ties into how so many people were upset with the ascendancy if humanity postwar.

#

The Covenant basically beat themselves to a pulp and humanity slouched into a competitive position by default.

clever yoke Jul 12, 2019, 12:30 PM

#

lets not forget the banished where diverging the covenant's attention away from humanity.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 12:30 PM

#

I'm not forgetting that even for a second.

#

But there is no way the Banished could be occupying entire fleets - they're elusive because Atriox is smart and they're quick, not undefeatable as a huge military force.

clever yoke Jul 12, 2019, 12:32 PM

#

the banished where getting shown who is boss in halo wars 2

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 12:32 PM

#

Atriox is absolutely highly dangerous - about as dangerous as Cutter and the crew of the Spirit of Fire, though.

#

Who themselves are obviously exceptional.

clever yoke Jul 12, 2019, 12:33 PM

#

i am very interested in the possible story for halo wars 3. There are some many different ways this could go down.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 12:34 PM

#

I agree.

carmine sleet Jul 12, 2019, 12:34 PM

#

For the majority of the tome the Banished were active during the Human-Covenant War, they mainly did hit and run attacks on facilities to get resources, vehicles, weapons and ships, right?

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 12:34 PM

#

That's my understanding, yes.

clever yoke Jul 12, 2019, 12:34 PM

#

ahhhh, we are in accord.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 12:35 PM

#

I mean, the one think I don't like so much about Halo Wars 2 is the fact that the Spirit of Fire is quite ramshackle at this point.

#

They're using a lot of non-standard tech and equipment.

#

Well, actually, that's not quite true - I do like that element. It's scrappy and makes them seem highly adaptive, which they are.

#

Gives them a unique personality.

clever yoke Jul 12, 2019, 12:35 PM

#

they have not seen port in at least 28 years.

carmine sleet Jul 12, 2019, 12:35 PM

#

Considering their situation, they kinda have to go non-standard

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 12:36 PM

#

What I'm trying to say, though, is that I want Halo Wars 3 to be more representative of the combat capabilities of the wider UNSC.

clever yoke Jul 12, 2019, 12:36 PM

#

Perhaps if the professor linked up with infinity?

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 12:36 PM

#

Something like that.

#

But from my own military sci-fi nerd perspective, I always wanna see more about how the UNSC at large functions.

#

The sort of equipment that bog-standard Marine and Army battalions are running around with.

#

The tactical support they typically have available.

clever yoke Jul 12, 2019, 12:38 PM

#

If SOF and Infinity where to join in a fight together against atriox, that would be a very interesting thing to see.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 12:38 PM

#

Reach does a terrific job of showing the UNSC war machine at work - fast, hard-hitting mechanized and dropship-borne infantry formations, clearing the way for frigates to move in and hammer the enemy with coilguns.

#

Tip of the Spear is an amazing mission, just for that moment when the frigates come in.

clever yoke Jul 12, 2019, 12:39 PM

#

But you do not want the scope of the game to be too large or it will lose the detail and feel of an actual game and it might turn into an RPG like game.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 12:40 PM

#

Well, large-scale strategy games don't become RPG-like.

#

They become grand strategy games.

#

Like Total War.

#

But I'm not saying that, so much - like, here's a practical example of what I'm saying.

#

In HW2 multiplayer, factions are divided into leaders, right?

#

Jerome, Isabel, etc.

clever yoke Jul 12, 2019, 12:41 PM

#

But you could end up losing the deep story like the one we got for HW2

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 12:44 PM

#

Instead of Cutter, who focuses on infantry and ODSTs and air support, you could have the 45th Marine Regiment. Give 'em a cool nickname and an emblem for personality.

#

Just make it feel more militaristic rather than character-focused, at least as far as gameplay goes.

#

Keep the story.

#

I mean 45th Marine Regiment is pretty boring.

#

You could have, like, 12th Marine Corps Heavy Infantry Battalion "Ironhides". Give them a sort of combined personality and gameplay style synonymous with turtling and defending.

#

Give em bunker-drops and cool fortifications, cyclops units and heavy APC vehicles like upgraded, armoured warthogs or mastadons. Give their regular Marine units a buff so they set up HMGs and defensive positions when they're in cover, drawing on lore from the Encyclopedia. Y'know, neat stuff like that.

#

A system a little akin to Steel Division, but obviously with fictional units.

#

It would give a little more insight into the UNSC as a fighting force instead of making everything about characters, which isn't really how it would work in-universe.

#

But nothing about that means you can't have a character-focused story, or hero units as part of the larger units.

#

It just gives it a bit more flavour. Makes it more authentic - less generic, like every other game where it's all about picking characters. It's called Halo Wars, gameplay should be about armies and not individuals.

rain token Jul 12, 2019, 1:01 PM

#

that… is a really good idea.

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 1:25 PM

#

You could get awesomely creative with Banished units, too.

#

A lot of potential lore there.

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 2:54 PM

#

CAS IS NOT SUPERCARRIER

#

http://prntscr.com/oe5z35

#

http://prntscr.com/oe0fkd

#

The translator made a mistake.

shrewd trout Jul 12, 2019, 2:55 PM

#

grim true
It's just an assault carrier

violet vine Jul 12, 2019, 2:55 PM

#

Sad news, but the brigantine is a supercarrier.

#

Anything more assault carrier - supercarrier.

carmine sleet Jul 12, 2019, 2:58 PM

#

How is it sad news that the Brigantine is a supercarrier?

#

Also, "Supercarrier" is a sub-class of "Carrier"

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 3:08 PM

#

Yeah there’s not a massive change tbh

carmine sleet Jul 12, 2019, 3:17 PM

#

Ok, so here's a question, is there a canon reason for why the fuel rod gun looks so different between Halo 3 and Halo Reach when it's meant to be the same model?

fair hazel Jul 12, 2019, 3:28 PM

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It’s not the same @model. Just same cAtegory

carmine sleet Jul 12, 2019, 3:28 PM

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Ah, I see. Thanks Ericky

versed helm Jul 12, 2019, 5:01 PM

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And besides, it's not like they're terribly different either.

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Even if they explicitly were the same type, you could probably chalk it up to different manufacturers and suchlike.

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Covenant gear is probably about as uniform as the UNSC's - maybe even less xD

limpid meadow Jul 12, 2019, 5:12 PM

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Far, far less

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Armor and weapon designs can change simply based on which fleet on is serving in

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 5:23 PM

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I’m guessing (theory time here) that much like how the Covenant takes loosely feudal inspiration for their military, certain worlds are “ oath/bound” to supply specific fleets with ships and weapons.

Which explains the differences in gear. The Fleet If Particular Justice was maybe supplied by Planet A, whereas the Fleet of Joyous Absolution was supplied by Planet B.

stable schooner Jul 12, 2019, 6:50 PM

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I love the Modern Military Feudalism combo of the Covenant Military even if it’s confusing and realistically inefficient.

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 9:22 PM

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It’s not really a new concept, Warhammer 40K does it a lot better, IMO, but then they’ve been doing it for far longer.

stable schooner Jul 12, 2019, 10:03 PM

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Yeah but the Grim dark Op Fantasy chaos stuff mixed with Sic-Fi really isn’t my thing. I prefer Warhammer Fantasy

fair hazel Jul 12, 2019, 10:18 PM

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me neither

stoic hamlet Jul 12, 2019, 11:44 PM

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To each their own I suppose

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 12:38 AM

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Which Halo ship do you wish you could own?

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For me,i wish i could own a CSO-class Supercarrier

gilded mason Jul 13, 2019, 12:40 AM

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Perhaps just a modest-ish CRS light cruiser.

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 12:40 AM

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Speaking of the CSO-class supercarrier,how many people can fit on that thing?

gilded mason Jul 13, 2019, 12:40 AM

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A lot

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 12:41 AM

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Like how many to be precise?,thousands?

gilded mason Jul 13, 2019, 12:44 AM

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Well, carriers have 40,000 troops, 200 superiors, and 10 engineers. At the very least, you could multiply that by, like, 5 or something to get sort of an estimate. But it'd probably be a bit more complicated than that

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 12:45 AM

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True

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I'm more curious about the location of where Yprin Yprikushma and her team found the Primordial

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Wasn't it described as being some sort of damaged planetoid?

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 2:32 AM

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Come to think of it Covenant weapon patterns aren’t to different from 40ks

stoic hamlet Jul 13, 2019, 3:08 AM

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How so? @last anchor

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 3:50 AM

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The Adeptus Mechanicus builds everything based on “patterns” which they never change. They find new forms from standard template constructs or rarely let new adjustments become their own thing but for the most part they just build what they know

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 4:07 AM

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That's a really astute observation, actually.

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Similar reasons for the stagnancy, too - both prohibit themselves for religious reasons from deeper understanding and experimentation with what they know from before.

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Though arguably the Mechanicus is more justified in their fear. You never know when something from the Dark Age of Technology is gonna go absolutely mental and start a crazy massacre, since basic sentient intelligence seems to be something they just automatically build into everything they make without knowing it.

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 8:34 AM

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Can anyone help me identify this insignia?? https://preview.redd.it/wpi6wfvnfy931.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=3cb32bd4f073d727c25c397b5918f395dc0df4e4

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I'm almost certain it's a human symbol. It's one of 5 decals on the side of the Halo 5 edition Xbox One console

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The others are the insignias of ONI, Fireteam Osiris, UNSC Army, ODST, and this mystery symbol, respectively

vivid dust Jul 13, 2019, 8:47 AM

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Navy?

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 8:48 AM

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https://www.halopedia.org/File:UNSC-Navy-logo1.png

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Navy is that. There's some similarities, but I dunno.

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Reminds me a little of the Apollo insignia.

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 8:50 AM

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Aye, I thought it was Navy at first as well but it clearly isn't that

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 8:50 AM

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Fireteam Apollo, I mean.

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https://www.halopedia.org/File:Fireteam_Apollo.png

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 8:51 AM

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Too many differences and Vale has not been apart of Apollo

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And it isn't the Fireteam Stingray symbol either

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 8:51 AM

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Oh, I get what you're sayin'.

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 8:54 AM

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Ok, I just realised, I had part of this conversation in my head. I should explain why I brought up Vale. Basically, each of Osiris are from different parts of the UNSC, Locke was ONI, Buck was an ODST and Tanaka was Army. I thought the symbol could've been something to do with Vale but on her armour, she has the Navy symbol. And it isn't a symbol relating to any fireteams that any of Osiris has been in either so the symbol could mean anything

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 8:54 AM

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Diplomatic corps?

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Vale's family's background seems to come from there.

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And her pre-Spartan IV career, though there's no explicit mention on Halopedia.

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 8:56 AM

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No known logo on Halopedia

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But I do think that was a good thing to look at anyway

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 8:57 AM

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Oh nah, she was part of ONI signals intelligence.

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Well that's a potential lead 🤷

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 8:58 AM

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Couldn't find a logo for them either

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 9:00 AM

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Doesn't rule it out, though.

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Guess it's another thing on the list of questions for whenever a 343 lore person stops by.

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 9:03 AM

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Aye, indeed. Wouldn't surprise me if there is already an answer but it was years ago when it was found out

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Either way, considering the logos that appear alongside it being related to the other members of the team or being the team's logo, it's logical that it's something to do with Vale

vivid dust Jul 13, 2019, 9:06 AM

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yes, and Vale was Navy for a time

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so it's Navy

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https://www.halopedia.org/Olympia_Vale#Early_life_and_naval_career

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 9:06 AM

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I would agree if the Navy's emblem wasn't entirely different.

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Keep up.

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I've ruled out navy with 100% certainty. Thanks everyone for your input. Hopefully it gets solved

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Well, stick around and keep an eye out for Grimbrother One or Ken if they pop up

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They're the best people to ask

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But you'll probably be waiting for a while xD

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S'wat I'm doing, really. Got loads of questions.

vivid dust Jul 13, 2019, 9:08 AM

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this is from that H5 vidoc right?

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 9:09 AM

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It's one of 5 decals on the side of the Halo 5 edition Xbox One console

unique rune Jul 13, 2019, 9:23 AM

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I think it also appears on the Lovke-themed controller. I’ll have to check mine later, see if it’s there.
And more clear.

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 9:33 AM

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You're right, it does!! Just checked mine, and it's much clearer. I just want the decal because I'm creating a 3D model of the xbox (well... my whole living room), and I want to get every detail exactly correct. Knowing what the symbol is would allow me to find a high-res PNG of it.

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But if I can get a clear enough photo of my controller in the morning, maybe I'll just recreate the logo. Either way, I'm gonna stick around in this server and hope that someone comes along with a definitive answer

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We have good talks here

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Every Halo fan knows a lot about Halo, of course, but I find everyone has a kinda specific niche they're into. Well, except maybe CIA.

#

For me, I fixate really hard on the UNSC, and anything related to the 26th century human military.

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The conversations that go on here and on the Halopedia Discord can really give you some insight into the awesome stuff you miss in your own little lore alcoves.

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 9:40 AM

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I'm just bouncing between alien/energy based weapons and power armour mainly in terms of of what I look into

opal flame Jul 13, 2019, 9:59 AM

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Kilo 26 requesting immediate extraction on grid 223, Echo Charlie Foxtrot. Blister backs closing on my position. What is you eta Spirit of Fire. I'm currently on route and am taking a lot of damage. But I'm almost to the LZ.

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 9:59 AM

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Um. Hey.

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Just a thought, though.

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This tech.

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https://www.halopedia.org/Buffer_field

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I'm suddenly willing to bet it's the same fundamental principles used by basically all grav tech in Halo.

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Obviously the Forerunners had a much greater level of control over the tech, but let's look at some things UNSC ships regularly do.

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Float in atmosphere? Frigates do. The PoA managed it partially with some takeoff assistance. What if, instead of true force being exerted downards, there is a buffer field almost insulating the contents of the field from external gravitational impulses?

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It'd explain inertial compensation, too.

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The generation of artificial gravity is the perplexing part, though. I'm not sure how a field that buffers - key emphasis here being on the definition of the word buffer - could simulate planetary gravity, but apparently it does.

#

The most tantalising part is that, by their own admission, the Forerunner trilogy books are translated into easily digestible human lingo. Buffer field may be a simple approximation of the Forerunner terminology, but it could just as easily be terminology that's recognizable to 26th century humans, a technical term for technology perhaps more commonly referred to as anti-grav.

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I do suspect that boosted gravity propulsion drives may operate on different principles, though.

prime ingot Jul 13, 2019, 11:40 AM

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so i love halo and have red all the books and watched most if not all media and played all the games my problem is this how is it that in reach it is possible for one Spartans 3 to even be there when one Cortana was not delivered by noble team and 2 in the ghost of onyx the time line doesn't match up for them to be on reach before it was glassed by the convent so that begs the question is the game halo reach even cannon

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some one please answer this for me because the time line just doesn't add up in this aspect of the game and books

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 11:54 AM

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Well firstly, when approaching the question of the S-IIIs you gotta realize that NOBLE are not typical S-IIIs.

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In GoO, most of the mainline S-IIIs were wiped out in their respective operations, but NOBLE were a newly introduced idea in which certain Spartan III candidates were pulled from their companies and equipped to the same standards as S-IIs, basically just to take the opportunity to get at least a few more suits of MJOLNIR in the field.

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So if you're saying what I think you are, GoO doesn't pose a terrible problem.

#

But there are absolutely timeline discrepancies between TFoR and Reach. According to Mythos, the Autumn actually landed and retrieved Cortana after the Gamma station operation and Red team's deployment to the generators - it's certainly not something the book directly implies, but it does fit if you really want to believe it. I think.

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The big question about Reach for me is how the information about the Covenant being present failed to escape to the areas on Reach where engagements were occurring. I understand the Covenant's use of infiltration tactics - stealth canopies, communication sabotage, teleporters - but there were very notable engagements all across the Viery territory - the defence of Sword Base and the assault on Szurdok Ridge - which it is a stretch to conceal from the rest of Reach. And even granting that information regarding those was suppressed by the UNSC to prevent panic and ensure an ordered response, the arrival of the backup fleet and the glassing of New Alexandria should've been impossible to hide.

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 12:42 PM

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Send me a personal message all the information you can find about supercarrier, if anyone has the opportunity. Thanks.

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 12:51 PM

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I mean, according to LNoS level opening dialogue, the CSO devastated the UNSC ships already stationed over Reach and most of the UNSC fleet didn't arrive until well after the Covenant secondary fleet arrived. So I guess you've gotta rationalize it as the UNSC being able to control the engagement via their ODPs? The Covenant fleet were able to assault areas of the planet that they'd managed to neutralize the ODPs over before the UNSC crippled their staging area at Szurdok.

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So until the final naval battle and the arrival of Thel's fleet on the 30th of August, all the Covenant ships were contained on one portion of the planet by the defence grid, which likely became a priority for them after they were utilized to fend off the initial attack on Sword (Dot implies as much in the Tip of the Spear briefing).

prime ingot Jul 13, 2019, 1:37 PM

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thx @versed helm

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 1:44 PM

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No problem. Hope it actually helped.

somber wave Jul 13, 2019, 2:39 PM

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I find the human weapons to be very interesting, but one weapon, specificity the shotgun, confuses me, has anyone actually made something similar to it in the real world with the shells being put in the top instead of the bottom??

stoic hamlet Jul 13, 2019, 2:46 PM

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There are several like that to my knowledge

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But I don’t know their specific names.

remote spruce Jul 13, 2019, 2:48 PM

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didn't the shotgun page say the M90 resembles a real life gun?

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I can't find it anymore, hope i'm not going crazy

stoic hamlet Jul 13, 2019, 2:49 PM

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I mean, I can see it sort of resembling a Trench Gun

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But that loaded from the side, IIRC

remote spruce Jul 13, 2019, 2:51 PM

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nah like a real life model of a gun

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iirc a south african made gun

somber wave Jul 13, 2019, 3:51 PM

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I know there is a shotgun that is loaded in the stock but that’s not it

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 3:55 PM

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I recall there being a machine gun which has it's magazine loaded from above at one point, obviously not quite a shotgun but still

stoic hamlet Jul 13, 2019, 4:00 PM

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There were several

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The Bren gun comes to mind

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And a few derivatives of that particular weapon

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:04 PM

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Top-loading automatic weapons were very common during the first World War as well.

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Villar Perosa anyone

fair hazel Jul 13, 2019, 4:06 PM

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Lightrifke is too loaded

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Binaire. Scattershot. Suortessor

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 4:07 PM

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Would a game set during the Human-Forerunner wars even be possible?

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Anyone?

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 4:11 PM

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A Human-Forerunner War game would be a bit odd for them to make as the majority of people wouldn't be interested and likely get confused as to why things like humanity having directed energy weapons as standard and why we're seeing them fight Forerunners. Not to mention that the average Halo player wouldn't care

versed helm Jul 13, 2019, 4:12 PM

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True

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Although i do wanna see what kind of lore we might get if a Halo game set during the Human-Forerunner wars is made

#

What are your favorite soundtracks from Halo?

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:26 PM

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https://www.halopedia.org/Ütközet

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The location of the sword base.

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Place this in the Covenant features theme on spacebattles.

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There was a corresponding request.

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https://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/covenant-capability-thread-halo.366142/page-58#post-54199414

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"I mean, according to LNoS level opening dialogue, the CSO devastated the UNSC ships already stationed over Reach and most of the UNSC fleet didn't arrive until well after the Covenant secondary fleet arrived. So I guess you've gotta rationalize it as the UNSC being able to control the engagement via their ODPs? The Covenant fleet were able to assault areas of the planet that they'd managed to neutralize the ODPs over before the UNSC crippled their staging area at Szurdok."

How many hours did CSO have to keep firing ODPs?

#

How many ODPs prior to the arrival of the fleet Thel?

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https://www.halopedia.org/images/d/d3/HR_SupercarrierDestroyed_Concept.jpg

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As you can see from here it was in high orbit.

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https://coubsecure-s.akamaihd.net/get/b172/p/coub/simple/cw_timeline_pic/fc88fc93fd6/4f82c4f65af8111b93f3d/big_1496809937_image.jpg

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If I remember correctly the ODPs are placed in low geostationary orbit and can hit the CSO.

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Are there any quotes about CSO not being able to destroy any weapons?

#

This would imply resistance to the NOVA explosion.

stoic hamlet Jul 13, 2019, 4:45 PM

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NOVA’s weren’t deployed on Reach

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Also there were only 20 ODP’s situated at Reach so it’s possible the Covenant simply found a hole in the defence grid. Wouldn’t be the first time.

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:49 PM

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Territory supermac Cairo could not take CAS (halo mythos confirms this). Also the shadow of Intent had withstood the fire, "the most powerful human MAC weapons" which are Ceratonia supermacy.

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So stop talking nonsense.

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Nova was on Reach. CAS is a million times the size of a ship that took several megatons of firepower to destroy.

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 4:51 PM

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"Ceratonia Supermacy"? What?

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:51 PM

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So I need a quote about " nothing can destroy CSO." I've seen this somewhere.

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Terraton*

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supermac

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:52 PM

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Bull. CSOs are as succeptable to anything else.

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They just caught the UNSC off guard using cloaking.

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 4:52 PM

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Also, they said NOVAs weren't used on Reach, not that there weren't any on the planet

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:52 PM

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~~Probably cause if they had there wouldnt BE a planet~~

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:52 PM

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CSO is a super weapon created on the basis of the capital ships of the forerunners.

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:52 PM

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~~One does not simptly tactically use a NOVA~~

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Ah, no. No it is not

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Its a Covenant ship with stolen forerunner tech, nothing more

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:53 PM

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A billion times the size of the ship the Commonwealth encountered.

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:53 PM

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Also again, no

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 4:53 PM

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CSOs were never super weapons

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:53 PM

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Not a billion.

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27 kilometers long, thats it.

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So...200 times perhaps?

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Let me check how big the Unrelenting was

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:53 PM

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Its body is made of the same material as the halo installation.

carmine sleet Jul 13, 2019, 4:53 PM

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No

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:53 PM

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178 meters

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:54 PM

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Yes.

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:54 PM

#

So... 0.178 kilometers?

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:54 PM

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https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/halo/images/f/f4/Exodus_Intro.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20101019153003

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:54 PM

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151685 times bigger

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Or so. I think I did the math right

#

Either way, no where near to a billion.

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:55 PM

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3375

#

This is the number of 8 million ton corvettes that weigh as much as 1 CAS.

#

Case CSO has withstood a fall on a planet the size of Earth and does not wrinkle.

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:56 PM

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Reach isnt the size of Earth

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And it didnt plannet fall

#

Jorge obliterated the thing.

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:56 PM

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Therefore it is necessary to find all available quotes concerning its fire power. It was the first capital ship of the Covenant to be met by humans.

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:57 PM

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Hahahaha no it wasnt

#

That was the CCS battlecruiser

#

https://www.halopedia.org/Long_Night_of_Solace

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:57 PM

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https://www.halopedia.org/images/f/fa/Reachtoearth.jpg

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 4:57 PM

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Tell those spacebattles guys to use Halopedia for Christ sake

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:57 PM

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Nope.

#

Nope.

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No.

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Did not.

gilded mason Jul 13, 2019, 4:58 PM

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Jorge obliterated the thing.```
To be fair, it did fall onto the planet.

violet vine Jul 13, 2019, 4:59 PM

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If NOVA's bomb isn't detonated inside this ship, it probably won't destroy it.

gilded mason Jul 13, 2019, 4:59 PM

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Uh

last anchor Jul 13, 2019, 5:00 PM

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Mate...you know it broke a planet right

#

And one detonated inside a ship obliterated the entire facing side of the planet it was OVER

#

The thing produces a fireball equivilent (quite literally) to a sun