#lore-and-universe | Halo | Page 182

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:36 AM

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if you already played halo 5

terse gale May 6, 2019, 3:36 AM

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(Besides the random AI on Ascendant Justice)

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 3:36 AM

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I guess they're just really good at it.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:37 AM

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well you know how to kill the eternal warden easily methods ???

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 3:38 AM

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What.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 3:38 AM

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@versed helm Try asking in #471767281072865300

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:38 AM

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wrong chat sorry

terse gale May 6, 2019, 3:40 AM

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@gilded mason Their ship's bridges are set up deep in their ships too, I'd imagine they just have hella good communication systems set up to coordinate all over the ship but still, AI would be so helpful.

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 3:40 AM

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Their ship's bridges are set up deep in their ships too
Man, I am so glad they do that, too. Not many starships do that, it feels like.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 3:41 AM

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They make fun of humans for having their bridges exposed on ships, lol

sudden eagle May 6, 2019, 4:04 AM

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The covenant have engineers so that probably helps a lot

last anchor May 6, 2019, 4:16 AM

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The UNSC could these days, but it didnt really matter during the Human-Covenant war cause a well-aimed shot from a Covenant lance would still cook them anyway

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Its an honor and tradition thing

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:16 AM

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I think it may have to do with MACs as well.

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For one, MACs are spinal, so a centrally located bridge puts your command centre very near the magazine and mechanisms of your main weapon.

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For two, when a MAC penetrates your ship, it tends to go all the way through. If your bridge is in the centre of the ship, mathematically speaking - and I'm not sure about this, it's just a passing thought - but you're increasing the risk of a skewering hit passing through your bridge.

last anchor May 6, 2019, 4:21 AM

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The Covenant also liked to aim for the center mass of a UNSC ship whenever possible. They were kind of large, flat-sided boxes so that wasnt too hard

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:24 AM

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I think there's also the fact that if a UNSC ship's bridge is destroyed, it is also probably capable of continuing the fight. First off, you've got an AI lingering in the ship's systems - it probably wouldn't be optimal or ethical, but minus the bridge an AI could probably still manoeuvre the ship and operate the primary weapons. So disarming a ship may be more important.

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Real life warships have a separate bridge and CIC - it doesn't seem to be a common thing in Halo, but it's easy to imagine larger ships having that sort of configuration, with the XO on the secondary bridge in battle.

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And finally, I doubt UNSC bridges are as exposed as they seem. There is no doubt in my mind that the glass-like panels they use are of equivalent or greater protective value than the titanium-A plating around them - probably a crazy transparent alloy or reinforced crystalline substance. Plus, protective shutters also exist, so the bridge of a UNSC ship is probably pretty safe from impacts of things like archer missiles, especially factoring in point defence.

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So in a human vs human context, UNSC ships can probably be rationalized.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 4:31 AM

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Covenant ships wreck them, sadly. Humans won ground battles but ship battles were basically hosed from the start, besides the rare ones people like Keyes won

remote spruce May 6, 2019, 4:33 AM

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UNSC didn't get enough leader points to upgrade to Mac Blast III.

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 4:33 AM

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Humans won ground battles
At least when Spartans were there. Otherwise, it was grim on the ground as well.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 4:36 AM

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Idk, things weren't THAT bad on the ground. John even mentions ground battles being much easier in general compared to space ones

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 4:37 AM

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Was he saying that in general, or in reference to his own battles as a Spartan?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:37 AM

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I mean, if we're analysing how human and Covenant forces actually fight on the ground, I can imagine UNSC troops being able to make some headway.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 4:38 AM

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In general. He doesn't say it like Spartans have to be involved, he just says ground battles were much easier for the UNSC than space ones

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:38 AM

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The Covenant are different to us. They kinda had, I dunno. Ideals and ideas that echoed around in their collective echo chamber for thousands of years and created a way of war that was split somewhere between incredibly powerful tech and something almost medieval.

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That's not to say their tactics aren't effective - the simple fact that they've got troops who small arms can't efficiently bring down, and weapons that no armour can protect you from is a decided advantage.

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But humans are very, very accustomed to fighting dirty. We kinda always had to, by virtue of what we are both physically and mentally.

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 4:39 AM

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In general. He doesn't say it like Spartans have to be involved, he just says ground battles were much easier for the UNSC than space ones
Ah. Do you remember which book this was in? Not calling you a liar or anything, I just wanna see it for myself.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:39 AM

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TFoR, sounds like.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 4:40 AM

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UNSC adapted decently to Covenant ground-tactics, unfortunately our space tech was so far behind theirs that we basically lost from the start

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Yee, was in Reach. He sorta mentions that once at the beginning when he watches a planet get glassed and later a few other characters mention space battles being way harder than ground ones

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:41 AM

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I mean, at the end of the day, doesn't matter how strong an infantry-based energy shield or alloy bullwark is, it ain't gonna save you from a 102mm rocket packed with explosives from the 26th century. And if it somehow does, jackhammer tubes come in pairs.

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 4:41 AM

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The problem was, the Spartans couldn’t take their fight into space. Every minor victory on the ground turned into a major defeat in orbit.```
This what you're talkin' about?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:42 AM

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While that seems damning, I think the ethos in question would carry over to non-Spartan ground troops.

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A Marine can take the fight into his own two hands just as much as a Spartan can, outmanoeuvring and destroying an enemy that is at the end of the day just as vulnerable as he.

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Naval combat is dictated almost entirely by tech, on the other hand.

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 4:43 AM

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Eh, in The Flood, there's talk of how there would generally be scores more dead UNSC in comparison to Covenant, except when a Spartan was there

terse gale May 6, 2019, 4:43 AM

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Yeah, that's the part I remembered. There's a few parts where Marines are mad about winning ground battles and losing space ones too

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:44 AM

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There's also moments in The Flood of Helljumpers and regular Marines absolutely humiliating Covenant crack troops, Ostral.

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So I'd be careful about your sources if you're trying to make that point.

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 4:44 AM

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True

terse gale May 6, 2019, 4:45 AM

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Hell, I think Keyes is even mad about it at one point

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 4:52 AM

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Tried looking for more in TFoR, but could only find more mention of Spartans being the best at ground battles.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 4:52 AM

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Covenant do this weird semi-medievel thing where they'll have squads with like an Elite leading 5 Grunts, UNSC doesn't do that. If you get a squad of Marines they're all basically trained the same, Covenant squads aren't remotely 😄

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I'm with @versed helm on UNSC probably holding ground advantage

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:53 AM

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Well not to get all armchair general on you, but you can envision a Covenant infantry lance as the Grunts providing a base of fire while the Elite acts as an assault element.

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Like, they're not inferior by any means. In a stand-up firefight, a Covenant lance would probably obliterate a UNSC fireteam with rockets and everything.

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But since when is war ever fair, y'know?

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Think of The Winter War.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 4:55 AM

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Elites don't tho, especially Elite Minors. They'll gladly ignore their moronic little Grunts and try to kill as many humans as possible

last anchor May 6, 2019, 4:55 AM

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That got THEM killed more often than not. John mentions that in The Flood

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Covenant forces fought with dreams of honor and glory.
The UNSC fought for survival with tactics and plans.

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Not to say the Covenant LACKED them but their backing was, and always has been, religious fevor

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:55 AM

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Man, that is a very medieval perspective.

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There are accounts of younger freshly-spurred knights causing trouble to the chagrin of their more experienced peers, I think.

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Breaking out of their formations and such.

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Out of their batailles, which were like 100-120 man horizontal columns.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 4:58 AM

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That definitely happened with Covenant troops. It's mentioned plenty in the books that unless you had higher up Elites involved in a battle the Minors would just rush everywhere trying to get the first kill

last anchor May 6, 2019, 4:58 AM

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And when the Elite leading them is killed, most lower races panic and flee

terse gale May 6, 2019, 4:58 AM

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Not to mention Minors were crap at leading Grunt or Jackal squads cuz they thought the smaller species were inferior cannon fodder

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:58 AM

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Hence why jackhammer tubes would be such a critical tool in the UNSC fight on the ground.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 4:59 AM

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So yeah, I'd say Marines did better on the ground

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:59 AM

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Man, it's kinda funny how that's represented in game. Even though I know it's just shield strength, it's never a worry to take on a minor.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:00 AM

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Younger Shipmasters in space battles fought the same way, unfortunately they had the tech and numbers to back it

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:00 AM

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But majors and above can cause serious trouble, especially in Halo 2 and Reach.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:02 AM

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Another thing with the Covenant is that most Elites no matter their rank thought Jackals and Grunts were inferior and treated them like cannon fodder, which only worked if they heavily outnumbered the opposing UNSC forces. Though some Generals were at least smart with how they used them as fodder.

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 5:04 AM

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Like how Rtas would have Grunts be situated in the back so that they can cover the Elites up front?

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:04 AM

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I don't wanna say the UNSC had better tactics but they certainly used their troops better

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:04 AM

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It's kinda hard to be cannon fodder when you've got a weapon that can instantly drop the enemy and a near-impervious energy gauntlet.

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Like I said, tactically speaking, it's probably more a "base of fire" thing than a "you're all worthless" thing, though some Elites wouldn't have that straight in their heads.

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Though I think you can point to the disposition of energy shields to figure out who's meant to be taking fire.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:05 AM

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humanity‘s best, and possibly only, hope when faced with the threat of extinction from an advanced
alien collective bent on our eradication in the name of false prophecies and hidden agendas.```

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Evolutions

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:06 AM

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Nobody's arguing that the Spartans aren't absolutely superior.

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What I am saying is that having better tech doesn't decide the battle when it's infantry-on-infantry.

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I mean, sure, there's huge gaps that need to be crossed. Look at the colonial conflicts of humanity's past.

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:07 AM

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Look at the Insurrection

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:07 AM

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But once everyone involved can reach out and touch everyone else, and has the tools to neutralize the other's assets, it's a pretty level field.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:08 AM

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@versed helm Jackals weren't cannon fodder quite as much, Grunts definitely were though. So small squads of Grunts lead by an Elite were basically "5 easy targets and a big one rushing you to get glory kills"

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:09 AM

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It seems to me that jackals with gauntlets were intended to provide mobile cover for Grunts.

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:09 AM

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Kill the leader, the rest scatter.
Kill the Grunts, then flank and grenade the jackels

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:10 AM

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Not exactly a conclusion supported by Halo Wars, but then again, Halo Wars has spaceborne healy-beams and seems to think Pelican dropships are unarmed.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:10 AM

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Ten years after the Covenant war had begun, the advancing Covenant forces had destroyed nearly all of the Outer Worlds. The war fell into a predictable pattern; Humans won isolated battles, usually during ground engagements, but always at great, great cost.```

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Halo Encloclopedia

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:10 AM

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Vien, what point exactly are you trying to make?

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:10 AM

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Probably, but Jackals also thought Grunts were fodder. So no matter what squad unity was rarely a thing, lol. Which to be fair smarter Generals accounted for when sending out troops.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:11 AM

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Spamming out quotes without detailing what those quotes are intended to support is a poor method of debate.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:11 AM

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So where are yours?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:12 AM

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I think most of what I've said is supported by common knowledge.

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:12 AM

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Yeah pretty much.
Also, Halo Wars is nothing close to accurate, cause its also got stuff like bits of a scorpion being delivered in tiny crates and buildings literally springing out of the ground

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:12 AM

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With no backing, your words have as much meaning as a fart in a wind tunnel.

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:12 AM

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Someones mad that the UNSC could hold their own on the ground...

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I mean thers always the nuclear option.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:12 AM

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For example, The Flood, UNSC troops repeatedly fend off large-scale Covenant attempts to contain their presence on Installation 04, most of which utilize superior numbers.

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Sure, Thel was occupied keeping The Flood in check, but if Covenant troops have a decisive ground advantage Silva and McKay should not have been able to pull off what they did.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:13 AM

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dangerous individual who is largely responsible for the six-score casualties
inflicted during this raid alone, not to mention the loss of a valuable
prisoner, and six Shades which the enemy managed to steal.”
“And the humans?” ’Zamamee inquired. “How many of them were our
warriors able to kill?”

“The body count is incomplete,” the other Elite replied, “but the preliminary
total is thirty-six.”
’Zamamee was shocked. The numbers should have been reversed.Would
have been reversed had it not been for the alien in the special armor.```

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The Flood

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A score is 20

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:14 AM

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How about the bit in The Flood where what appears to be a large company-sized force of Covenant cavalry with air support get destroyed by a couple of Helljumpers on a hill?

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Or the battle to retrieve material and equipment from the Pillar of Autumn?

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:15 AM

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This is infantry, no?

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:15 AM

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UNSC is also good at thinking outside the box, which you see a lot of in The Flood. Especially with the semi-buried Scorpions being used as artillery and AA, lol. Covenant were a bit stiff in their ways.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:15 AM

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Ground forces, of which infantry are a large part.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:15 AM

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Yeah, what I posted was

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:15 AM

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Religious doctorine, my man. Thinking outside the box makes you a heretic.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:15 AM

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Your quotes are pretty general to be exclusive to infantry either.

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:16 AM

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The covenant wouldnt even invent new stuff on their own.
They're imitative like Fall of Reach said.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:16 AM

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Look, everyone's got a horse in this race. It's what makes Halo fun. But the very fact that humanity can be a horse in that race in Halo is because UNSC troops are not helpless on the ground.

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Spartans can't be everywhere, and Spartans are not responsible for 100% of UNSC victories.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:16 AM

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They were counting bodies through infantry and stated that (6*20) kills per death on their side is normal

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For covenant infantry

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:16 AM

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They weren't even thinking religiously with their tactics, it was a "We're the superior species and foul little humans aren't worthy of us trying anything else"

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:16 AM

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Sooo

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:17 AM

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Bluster happens - by that perspective, let's look at Silva's confidence that UNSC Marines would be entirely capable of handling the Installation 04 incident without Chief's support.

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Everybody's biased.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:17 AM

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You do realize a Covenant person made up those numbers, lol. Pretty sure there's at least a little padding stuck in there to look better 😄 @fickle holly

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:18 AM

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Religious propoganda

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Also, hes a Covenant spy. He believes their stuff more than anyone, hence his job

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:19 AM

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UNSC adapted tactics many times to account for the Covenant having multiple different species, the Covenant rarely changed anything because "Inferior humans".

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:19 AM

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Did you completely miss a quote I posted earlier where humans only won isolated ground engagements?

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At a great cost

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:19 AM

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Yeah, cause if they started winning on the ground the Covenant rolled in battleships from above

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Often times glassing their own soldiers

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:19 AM

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Humans won isolated ground engagements, usually during ground battles.

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That's what it said.

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You're interpreting it in your favour.

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But by the way, I'm not saying UNSC troops are better than Covenant troops.

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:20 AM

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Humanity held on the ground. In space they couldn't.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:20 AM

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Yeah, why do you think the Covenant glassed so many planets instead of conquering them. They'd cost too many Covie ground troops to take.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:20 AM

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What I am saying is that an energy shield isn't going to stop a Sangheili warrior getting turned into purple ribbons by a jackhammer rocket, Vien.

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I'm saying that a Grunt's body armour won't protect them from 7.62 AP ammunition.

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I'm saying that cover and concealment can mitigate the risk posed by plasma weaponry.

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 5:21 AM

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Winning isolated battles usually means it's not a common thing.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:21 AM

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Carbine

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:21 AM

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War is not a calculable thing.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:21 AM

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Explosives

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I'm saying that cover and concealment can mitigate the risk posed by plasma weaponry.
Like how cover and concealment can stop conventional weapons?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:22 AM

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Cover and concealment doesn't stop conventional weapons.

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It enables you to shoot first.

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:22 AM

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Plasmas a conventional weapon for the most part. They do the same thing

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Just gas instead of rounds

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:22 AM

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Marines figured out tactics to deal with all Covenant. Grenades and overlapping fields of fire and snipers on Elites and Jackals, rockets on large groups of Grunts and on Hunters, etc

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:22 AM

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A wall will still stop a plasma round as good as it would a bullet really

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:23 AM

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^

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:23 AM

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Covenant didn't figure out squat, which cost them tons of ground troops

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:23 AM

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Someone's never touched a gun if you think rounds can easily penetrate walls like that

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:24 AM

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I never thought that they could - I'm saying that plasma weapons have a tendency to burn through what they hit.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:24 AM

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And plus, they've stated that Halo's arsenal and vehicles never focused on realism a few times.

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Because it's not fun otherwise.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:24 AM

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Which is a point supported by the books.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:24 AM

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Where's the quote and book, please?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:24 AM

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Alright, so let's say I'm wrong - Covenant weapons are now less effective than I'm positing.

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What does that do for your argument, Vien?

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:25 AM

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I mean do you have instances where it is?

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:25 AM

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About the cover thing, I'm pretty sure the big metal portable covers the UNSC deployed were definitely thick enough to stop plasma.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:25 AM

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Because it wouldn't be an issue for the humans if it was less effective.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:25 AM

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Y'know, I don't have any to hand. I fully admit that I'm wrong.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:25 AM

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Plasma in Halo isn't like real life plasma

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if you haven't noticed how it can travel a distance

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:25 AM

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Covenant weapons are not necessarily more effective than human weapons.

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There we go.

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:26 AM

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Also if I remember right, certain rocks like basalt were pretty much immune to plasma.
Like that castle the UNSC holed up in in Dirt

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:26 AM

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Man, makes you wonder where this decisive ground advantage they seem to have stems from, then? 🤔

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:26 AM

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~~Orbital advantage. If the humans start winning call in a glassing beam~~

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:26 AM

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That one Marine sniper in The Flood that shot the red Elite instead of the gold one still pains me to this day, smh

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:27 AM

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This, Vien, is why you actually lay out your point instead of arguing purely based on sources.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:27 AM

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Well to be fair, it's good to display your sources. Otherwise, it wouldn't be an educated opinion.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:28 AM

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I agree 100%.

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But let's have an example on Covenant weapons being more powerful.

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The Mona Lisa.

terse gale May 6, 2019, 5:29 AM

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Also, him killing an Elite in one shot proves human weapons are just as effective as Covenant ones (though the books I read never mentioned beam rifles, which is weird now that I think about it).

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:29 AM

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Lopez takes three 7.62 AP rounds to the chest - two fail to penetrate, one ricochets off the buckle securing her chestplate.

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Halo Wars introductory cinematic

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Marines are shown going down after a single bolt of plasma strikes them in the chestplate - the plasma visibly continues to burn.

last anchor May 6, 2019, 5:30 AM

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Thats mentioned elsewhere in the lore too, especially in the Flood

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Also Needler rounds kill Marines in the Relic Interior cinematic

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No supercombine even, they jsut go right through

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:31 AM

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This too

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 5:31 AM

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Got filtered

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:31 AM

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How

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For what reason

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:31 AM

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The bot's a bit over-protective.

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Maybe spoilers for a certain movie it thinks it's picked up on.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:32 AM

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Nope

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:32 AM

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Watch out for stuff like that.

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It might be a rude word in Spanish.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:32 AM

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https://pastebin.com/7Dd2PJhG

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:32 AM

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Hidden in an English word.

fickle holly May 6, 2019, 5:33 AM

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Too lazy to space it

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:33 AM

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So reading that, it shows me that plasma mortars have a canonically deadly effect due to their plasma-based nature.

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Is that supporting the superiority of Covenant plasma weapon's destructive capabilities?

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Like, I mean, I don't want to go through the books right now but there are absolutely instances of plasma fire being described as burning away bits of anatomy and inflicting horrible wounds.

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You can probably remember some right now.

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The Cole Protocol, during the downed Pelican skirmish I think. Someone dies pretty horribly to one of those "commercial" plasma rifles xD

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The Flood never misses an opportunity to be grizzly - you wouldn't have to look far.

last anchor May 6, 2019, 6:27 AM

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Indeed not.

turbid brook May 6, 2019, 11:04 AM

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There are many many instances of plasma weapons being quite deadly to humans, even Spartans, in at least the first trilogy of books (The Fall of Reach, The Flood and First Strike)

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I did have proof, but apparently I've got a warning for the message being too long. If you're interested, DM me.

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 11:16 AM

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Good morning lore bois

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:28 AM

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Tbf the only reason Sam died was because it breached his suit

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Yeah he wouldn’t have been able to leave the ship because his suit’s seal was compromised

modest marsh May 6, 2019, 11:31 AM

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https://gfycat.com/shrilldirtyimago same as irl guns tbh

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:31 AM

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Idk how tho iirc the MK IV had full shielding

modest marsh May 6, 2019, 11:31 AM

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It didn’t

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:31 AM

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Oh

modest marsh May 6, 2019, 11:32 AM

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That’s a primary reason why his suit was compromised

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:32 AM

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Didn’t Noble team wear MK IV

carmine sleet May 6, 2019, 11:32 AM

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Mark IV had no shielding outside of a few experimental suits that helped lay down the basis for the Mark V

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NOBLE had Mark V

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:32 AM

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Oh

modest marsh May 6, 2019, 11:32 AM

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Another being, as Silent Storm clarifies, a weak spot in the armor was hit

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:33 AM

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NOBLE wears MK V Beta right?

modest marsh May 6, 2019, 11:33 AM

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Jorge may have been wearing a modified set of his old armor

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Dialogue implies as such anyway

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:34 AM

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I have a low IQ when it comes to the MJOLNIR lore

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 11:38 AM

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Oh Noble team are wearing Mark V [B] a Mark V set that is very modular and is compatable with a wide assortment of armor.

Mark IV [G] parts for example were compatable on the armor

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:38 AM

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@versed helm Jorge simply painted his armor

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@modest marsh for you too

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 11:39 AM

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Mark IV [G] being Grenadier. Aka most of Jorges armor.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:39 AM

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Yeah. Wasn’t his a multi-compounded armor though

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Multiple variants

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 11:39 AM

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Most of Noble team mixed and matched armor xD

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:40 AM

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Yeah. But Jorge was especially...flagrant with his choices. Even Halsey had to comment . Haha

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I won’t say they were bad choices. But definitely interesting

#

I like Carter’s armor

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 11:41 AM

#

Regardless it was deffo Mark V [B] but with Mark IV [G] parts used on it.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:42 AM

#

Jorge’s?

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 11:43 AM

#

Yes.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:43 AM

#

I don’t think Jorge has a single Mk-V[B] permutation attached

#

Going through the armory

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 11:43 AM

#

Mark V [B] is the suit itself also lol

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:44 AM

#

Eh.

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 11:44 AM

#

As said its a very modular set of armor.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:44 AM

#

I guess Ye

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 11:45 AM

#

Its also the main real world excuse to why Mark V in Halo CE/CEA doesnt look like Mark V in Reach.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:46 AM

#

I just want a game with the Blur Studio Mk-IV armor from Wars/Wars2

#

Of the recent designs that’s def my favorite

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 11:46 AM

#

So you mean the close but not exact Halo 5 Mark IV set.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:46 AM

#

I mean the exact model Blur Studio made

#

Techsuit and all

#

Imo it is the single best looking armor in the franchise. They did such a good job on it

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 11:47 AM

#

Well the Halo 5 set is weird. Its based on the Halo Wars 1 set. But has the pre-launch Crotch armor that was cut from the game.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 11:51 AM

#

and the techsuit from 5

#

http://www.eklettica.com/pictures/Halowars/Halo_Character_Spartan_Render_01.jpg im referring to this tho. look at this gorgeous CHONK

#

walking tanks

restive meadow May 6, 2019, 12:02 PM

#

I feel like human weapons work better then covenant weapons on the flood

versed helm May 6, 2019, 12:03 PM

#

Anyone else remember the prototype exo skeleton from Halo Legends

#

That thing was chad

#

In gameplay yes but in lore no @restive meadow

#

Since covenant weapons shoot plasma

#

And plasma burns

#

Since the flood are organic the plasma just chews through them

modest marsh May 6, 2019, 12:05 PM

#

Well

#

The flood also benefit from a healing factor so tissue damage alone from projectiles isn’t a permanent solution

#

Recall in CE where often killed flood forms would come back to life after being gunned down

versed helm May 6, 2019, 12:07 PM

#

Plasma is most effective

#

Other than the shotguns

modest marsh May 6, 2019, 12:07 PM

#

Weapons that boil away biological matter would logically be more effective at keeping them dead

restive meadow May 6, 2019, 12:09 PM

#

So the UNSC should be required to carry covenant weapons Incase of a flood encounter

carmine sleet May 6, 2019, 12:10 PM

#

I mean, not every planet the UNSC visits would have Flood somewhere. Plus they're still trying to reverse engineer allot of Covie tech

restive meadow May 6, 2019, 12:11 PM

#

Well I mean if they’re going to visit a halo

#

They should

#

Perhaps we should shoot the floods arms off and they can’t do anything

carmine sleet May 6, 2019, 12:50 PM

#

Taking the arms off of a combat form wouldn't slow the Flood down

versed helm May 6, 2019, 12:55 PM

#

ye. not a single bit

#

it's usually just an in-game mechanic that they die if they dont have a way to attack you

autumn urchin May 6, 2019, 1:02 PM

#

dead space flashbacks

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 1:04 PM

#

Hmmmm

#

I dont want to remember dead space

versed helm May 6, 2019, 1:05 PM

#

If a combat form has a mouth it can bite and transmit the flood pathogen

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 1:07 PM

#

Yes

versed helm May 6, 2019, 1:08 PM

#

So taking its arms doesn’t do anything

versed helm May 6, 2019, 1:57 PM

#

So these people are trying to tell me Serena purposly infected her crew on the SoF

carmine sleet May 6, 2019, 2:01 PM

#

That is definitely not what happened, she wasn't aware of a Flood Infection Form being on board until someone had already been infected

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:02 PM

#

i know, they’re saying rampancy has nothing to do with it, and she was trying to experiment on the crew

#

and they’re saying rampancy doesn’t affect their logic

#

Serina is about as good as AIs get, to be honest. All of the intelligence, all of the compassion, all of the sense of duty none of that patented Halsey ego which more recognizable Halo AIs might have. She kept that combat form around to watch its life cycle, under the belief that it could not escape its situation.

#

Like the Forerunners themselves, and especially in her deteriorating state, she underestimated it.

#

Though it is kinda important to remember that, despite being a sentient being, she's an AI. That means all the things that we as humans have - y'know, growing up, mirth, love, social experiences, self-betterment - all of that for her is replaced by a quest for knowledge. That's how she derives moment-to-moment meaning, despite having the same purpose as any other UNSC soldier.

#

In her slightly compromised state, she probably lacked impulse control - like an alcoholic, I guess. But she obviously never meant to hurt anyone.

#

That's my take, anyways.

#

Isabelle's best

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:18 PM

#

Nah serina best girl

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:18 PM

#

Serina's ok.

#

Isabelle's better

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:19 PM

#

Nah

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:19 PM

#

Serina was my fave before

#

but she doesnt even come close

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:19 PM

#

If I had to choose I'd say roland

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:19 PM

#

Roland is...Roland

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:19 PM

#

Yes

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:19 PM

#

he's Roland

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:19 PM

#

That's why I like him

#

Hes a smart aleck and he didnt turn to the created

#

Hes somewhat like serina

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:20 PM

#

I see Isabelle, and everything just screams Protec

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:21 PM

#

Hmmm

#

What do you mean

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:21 PM

#

smh

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:21 PM

#

I'm kinda confused now dont know why

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:21 PM

#

it's hard to explain Protec

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:21 PM

#

Stop

#

I get it now

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:22 PM

#

See, when it comes to isabelle and the spirit of fire

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:23 PM

#

I like her dont get me wrong but I just like roland and that one A.I form lone wolf that has all of humanity's history stored inside of it

#

But she also glass the brutes bac

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:25 PM

#

yus

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:26 PM

#

I just noticed reading defender of the storm that the forerunners didnt have systems on their ships that would detect flood spores

#

I'd think that knowing the flood could spread through the air that they would have built something so they knew when their ships were contaminated

#

Than the conversation died cause I'm the only one on right now who knows stuff about flood

autumn urchin May 6, 2019, 2:32 PM

#

aunty dot best

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:34 PM

#

auntie dot was dumb

#

in the literal sense, she was a dumb AI

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:37 PM

#

Yes

#

And my flood question got ignored

#

I will ask agian were there filters on forerunner shops to stop flood spores

versed helm May 6, 2019, 2:38 PM

#

there's a lot unknown about forerunner tech to begin with

#

so hard to say

quartz willow May 6, 2019, 2:39 PM

#

I'm only asking that because of defender of the storm

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:22 PM

#

Forerunner combat skins likely prevented infection by flood spores on an individual basis

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:23 PM

#

That's an interesting question. Flood spores are not treated consistently in the series. For instance, in Halo 3, you can see a marine start to turn into a combat form despite not having interacted with an Infection Form. But in Halo 2, the Arbiter spends a lot of time in areas filled with Flood spores, and is not infected, despite having no known filter.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:23 PM

#

Which marine in Halo 3?

#

The one in the beginning of the Floodgate level?

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:23 PM

#

Beginning of Floodgate, right where the first encounter takes place

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:23 PM

#

yeah he gets infected by a popcorn

#

it's scripted though so that even if you pop the popcorn, he still turns

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:24 PM

#

No, he starts to turn just before the pods drop down.

#

He's with a group of Marines

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:24 PM

#

I've always seen a popcorn turn him

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:24 PM

#

not by himself

#

I think you're thinking of the one room where infection forms swarm a single marini

#

*marine

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:25 PM

#

Yes

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:26 PM

#

I'm talking about outside, just before that. Although it's also quite possible to save that marine with a well-placed grenade.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:26 PM

#

That sounds like a scripting error on the game's part

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:26 PM

#

I don't recall if he's on a timer to turn anyway, but the combat forms would probably get him anyway

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:26 PM

#

I doubt he's turning because of spore density in the air

#

esp if it's possible to save him.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:28 PM

#

Again, two different Marines. The one you were talking about can be saved, but not the other one.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:29 PM

#

If you're an absolute wizard at automatic fire, I think it's fairly possible to save at least some of the Marines on the incline.

#

I've seen two survive before, and then get killed by other combat forms that drop in.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:29 PM

#

Probably.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:29 PM

#

I think the point is that all marine conversions in that level were due to infection forms, and anything that suggests otherwise can be attributed to game bugginess

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:30 PM

#

Especially if you are playing on mcc.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:30 PM

#

It's more fun for the lore to think it was Flood spores though, heh.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:30 PM

#

I agree

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:31 PM

#

I think people kinda tend to think there's a flood spores in places where there aren't.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:31 PM

#

Your headcanon can be whatever you like, I guess

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:31 PM

#

The sentinel wall in H2, for instance.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:31 PM

#

Did not know what flood spores were till I beat halo 2.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:31 PM

#

There were clouds of Flood spores hanging in the hallways.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:31 PM

#

H2's quarantine zone would be the kind of area where heavy spore density would make sense

#

given how long the infestation had been there

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:32 PM

#

The ending with Cortana talking to the gravemind.

#

Up close with one.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:32 PM

#

Y'know, I guess you're right. The way I'd previously conceptualized that whole outbreak in my head didn't leave much room for it.

#

I'd guessed the entire outbreak went kinda dormant for a very long time before a bunch of new biomass blundered in and stirred the hornet's nest.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:33 PM

#

I think HiddenXperia made a video about how they Arbiter spent lots of time with Flood spores and no known protection, and didn't turn. Basically plot armor.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:33 PM

#

That video is an absolute atrocity.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:33 PM

#

lol

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:33 PM

#

Why?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:34 PM

#

He clearly went, like, halfway through and was "well, I don't really care enough to actually try and rationalize this, so I'm not gonna bother."

#

For one, gameplay does not equal canon.

#

An Arbiter used a respirator in a literal H2A terminal when he was dealing with the lekgolo.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:34 PM

#

with the heretic elites, their harnesses have these gas masks that one could say justifies them not turning due to spore exposure. But standard elite harnesses have open mouth areas, so it seems very likely that they'd breath whatever is in the air

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:34 PM

#

Or, how about this -

#

Sangheili can hold their breath for an extended period of time.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:34 PM

#

What about energy shields?

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:35 PM

#

that sounds silly

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:35 PM

#

We don't have any confirmation from the lore. That's why I want novelizations of Halo 2 and Halo 3.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:35 PM

#

esp when Arbiter cries out whenever his shields burst

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:35 PM

#

Gameplay does not equal canon, Chimera.

#

Rule number one.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:35 PM

#

Even so

#

any time he speaks would negate that theory

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:35 PM

#

Except when it does (War Games)

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:36 PM

#

and at the very least, cutscenes are canon

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:36 PM

#

He doesn't ever speak when he's in the middle of a cloud of spores, does he?

#

Look, if they don't detail ammunition on a Spartan's armour

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:36 PM

#

Gameplay does not equal canon.. so maybe he was muttering to himself heh

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:36 PM

#

They wouldn't detail a respirator on the Arbiter's armour

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:36 PM

#

Sure, that's possible

#

but the hold breath theory just sounds silly

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:37 PM

#

Flood spores are big enough to bee seen with naked eyes and shields detect infection forms so energy shields?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:37 PM

#

I mean, there were only pockets of spores.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:38 PM

#

Ammunition goes inside pouches and slots in the armor

#

for Mark VI

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:38 PM

#

If he moved quickly, cleanly, and used his camo (like he probably canonically would have since he's really not a combatant with the same raw capability as a Spartan), he could've moved from place to place without inhaling.

#

On, and by the way, BS on that. At least from my perspective.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:38 PM

#

very polite

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:39 PM

#

When it comes down to raw physics failing to work the way it should, I think if it bothers you you're perfectly entitled to use your headcanon, as I do.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:39 PM

#

Well we'll never really know, I guess

#

we'll all just have our own headcanons

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:39 PM

#

Case in point, an MA5's magazine could never hold 32 or 36 7.62 bottlenecked NATO rounds. So they've gotta be some futuristic 7.62 UNSC straightwall thingo.

#

I think that's fair enough.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:39 PM

#

Well, the Arbiter took on Jai-006. I'd say he's pretty capable as a warrior.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:40 PM

#

I think in a modern interpretation of the canon, it's pretty clear that physically speaking, Spartans have a considerable edge on elites.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:40 PM

#

well, standard elites, I'd agree

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:40 PM

#

Jerome punched an Elite across a room in Halo Wars 2.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:40 PM

#

That's very subjective.

#

Not the punching

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:41 PM

#

Well, sure, you could chalk it up to Elites having a greater degree of physical disparity than humans.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:41 PM

#

But I was talking about the Arbiter specifically, not just any Elites

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:41 PM

#

given that the strength between individuals of a species can vary greatly, I'd say it depends on the individual

#

case and point, Atriox compared to any one Brute

#

except maybe tartarus

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:42 PM

#

I do think that both Arbiter and Chief would have used camo as often as possible in that situation, not because of their combat prowess, but because it's the wisest choice.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:43 PM

#

There has to be a reason these individuals climbed the chain as far as they did. And for a warrior race like the Sanghelei, I imagine that Thel's rank was correlated to his combat prowess

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:43 PM

#

Well, maybe I'm being too harsh. But to play out what I was saying, I could buy that Chief could shoot his way through that situation if needed. Thel probably couldn't quite take on the same odds.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:44 PM

#

Doesn't Thel evenly match Chief in The Package?

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:44 PM

#

On the original topic though, I think it was an oversight by Bungie, and Arbiter wasn't infected because plot armor.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:44 PM

#

arbiter

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:44 PM

#

Thel in The Package?

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:44 PM

#

Wrong Thel. That's Thel 'Lodamee

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:44 PM

#

I thought I was going insane there for a second

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:45 PM

#

Freaking sanghelei names

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:45 PM

#

helloo

#

But Stonewall, on what you were saying, that whole out-of-universe shebang doesn't do wonders for immersion. Or wiki editing.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:45 PM

#

What is this heresy? Arbiter and chief are equal in my opinion. arbiter

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:46 PM

#

Well yeah it breaks immersion but what can you do when an actual reason isn't provided?

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:46 PM

#

Energy shields!

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:46 PM

#

You can make up your own fiction to fill in the blank, or accept that it's a plothole

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:46 PM

#

Most universes I don't care enough about. But I make something of a hobby of making Halo work at any cost using canon-adjacent headcanon.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:46 PM

#

Duh

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:46 PM

#

I know, but we just don't know. Maybe you should try asking Unyshek.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:46 PM

#

Call it a creative exercise.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:46 PM

#

If you were to ask anyone, it'd be Grimbrother One

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:47 PM

#

Energy shields!!!!!!!

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:47 PM

#

Personal full-body energy shields probably don't work like that.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:47 PM

#

I thought Uny took his role as lore guy for the community

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:47 PM

#

Otherwise, how would the person in the shields breathe?

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:48 PM

#

Work against infection forms.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:48 PM

#

That's because infection forms fling themselves at their targets at near-ballistic velocities.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:48 PM

#

Yeah, the energy shields appear to respond to kinetic energy

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:48 PM

#

Flood spores are decently big can bee seen with naked eye.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:48 PM

#

a floating spore probably would have too little kinetic energy to trigger the shields

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:49 PM

#

True

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:49 PM

#

kinetic energy is mass * velocity-squared

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:49 PM

#

Like with the Onyx Sentinels

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:49 PM

#

over 2

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:49 PM

#

I used to think that all energy shields must work like the Onyx sentinel ones.

#

hello

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:49 PM

#

Except those could be bypassed by large rocks apparently

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:49 PM

#

@versed helm You say hello a lot. What's your deal.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:49 PM

#

Favorite sentinel every one?

#

Mine are enforcers.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:50 PM

#

Are Sentinels armigers?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:50 PM

#

@versed helm you're right

#

All armigers are sentinels, but not all sentinels are armigers.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:51 PM

#

Armingers?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:51 PM

#

Promethean soldiers, basically.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:51 PM

#

Oh

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:51 PM

#

Oh, okay. Then Promethean soldiers are my favorite Sentinels.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:52 PM

#

When everyone says warhammer is stronger then halo, (cough cough forruners cough cough)

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:53 PM

#

I just ignore those people

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:53 PM

#

Warhammer's universe plays by a whole different set of rules, dawg

#

You can't compare

#

It decidedly does not work off the physics we know. Everything that happens is an epic story.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:53 PM

#

I want to know how Chips Dubbo escaped Alpha Halo.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:53 PM

#

It's like if every day was Batman vs Superman

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:53 PM

#

Warhammer puts more emphasis on the "fiction" and less on the "science"

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:54 PM

#

It's future-fantasy.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:54 PM

#

@feral perch I agree with

#

You

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:54 PM

#

But it's a universe in which any character will beat any other character with a lesser degree of faith in their respective diety. That's kinda how it goes.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 3:55 PM

#

Ok

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:55 PM

#

Unless, of course, it's a special case. Like Eisenhorn or Guilliman. More nuanced characters.

#

Basically, when you match Warhammer to Halo, whoever's ruleset we're playing by wins.

#

If we're playing by Halo's, of course the Forerunners win.

#

If we're playing by Warhammer's, a single fanatical chick in power armour without a helmet might solo-kill a great Forerunner general because she believes in the Emperor hard enough and it never occurred to anyone to shoot her in the face.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:56 PM

#

I wonder how Xenomorphs would handle the Flood

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:56 PM

#

They wouldn't

#

Xenos would be food to the Flood

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:57 PM

#

The "perfect life form"

carmine sleet May 6, 2019, 3:57 PM

#

Yeah or they'd likely be converted into Flood forms

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:57 PM

#

"perfect life form" according to Weyland-Yutani

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:57 PM

#

I wonder how they would be infected

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:57 PM

#

They'd make pretty scary combat forms.

#

You wouldn't change much, would ya?

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:57 PM

#

Probably not

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:58 PM

#

The acid blood would neutralize infection forms

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:58 PM

#

you assume

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:58 PM

#

Why wouldn't it?

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:58 PM

#

has the lore ever suggested the Flood has a weakness to caustic properties?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 3:58 PM

#

I mean, if they've got a weakness to bullets

feral perch May 6, 2019, 3:58 PM

#

^^^

#

Or the pressure of Chief's fist

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 3:59 PM

#

Xenos do too

#

but Xenos evolved an immunity to their own acid

#

not beyond the scope of belief that an infectious species could work around that evolution

#

especially one that evolves as fast as the Flood

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:00 PM

#

The infection forms that we're familiar with, the traditional pod infector, I believe would be vulnerable. Because they're not really designed to be hard to kill.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:00 PM

#

it depends where the tendrils would go in

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:00 PM

#

But if said flood outbreak got a decent keymind network up and running, it'd adapt a form to handle the problem.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:00 PM

#

The the Flood could use spores for a non-traditional infection

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:00 PM

#

It's just how the Flood works.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:01 PM

#

Yeah

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:01 PM

#

Sure.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:01 PM

#

I think a more interesting comparison would be Flood versus Necromorphs

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:01 PM

#

True.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:01 PM

#

What wins: marker signal or gravemind?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:01 PM

#

Roanoke intensifies

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:01 PM

#

Brethren Moons v Gravemind

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:01 PM

#

thinkingchief

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:01 PM

#

brethren moons are essentially planet-sized necros

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:01 PM

#

I actually don’t know

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:02 PM

#

The Flood are a little reliant on commandeering tech, to be honest.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:02 PM

#

and there is a network of them

#

oh and they're mobile

#

planet-sized Keyminds aren't mobile, afaik

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:02 PM

#

Gravemind in my opinion smarter but brethren moon bigger and more physically dangerous.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:03 PM

#

smarter, yeah, I could see that

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:03 PM

#

Potentially more interesting question - the Ecumene finds a marker.

#

How would that go down?

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:03 PM

#

But brethren moons mobile.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:03 PM

#

YES

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:03 PM

#

Forerunners too OP for the signal?

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:04 PM

#

thinkingchief

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:04 PM

#

Hmm.. I think not.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:04 PM

#

No

#

Forerunners can go insane

#

Therefore I think they're susceptible

#

as the marker would trigger insanity in them

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:04 PM

#

Didactic went insane

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:04 PM

#

But perhaps they would all hear it as a song, rather than go insane, considering their intelligence

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:04 PM

#

But they might be too big to fail, and advanced enough to respond to the outbreak that does happen.

#

The Necros don't commander tech, they just bio-recombinate.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:04 PM

#

When exposed to gray

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:05 PM

#

Could they create forms potent enough to pose a real risk to Forerunner responders?

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:05 PM

#

I mean, the marker starts out by evolving a species to a point where it makes more markers

#

once there are enough markers, then stuff goes to hell

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:05 PM

#

Dang Auto correct

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:05 PM

#

if all forerunners were compatible with the marker signal then that would just happen faster

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:06 PM

#

I guess it depends on how you alter their past, then.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:06 PM

#

But would it overcome their society?

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:06 PM

#

I think it would be a slow burn

#

because they live so gosh darn long

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:06 PM

#

I think forruners are smart enough to be resistant but not immune.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:07 PM

#

some of them would go all murdery though

#

make some dead bodies

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:07 PM

#

True

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:07 PM

#

and then those bodies would make more

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:07 PM

#

Well remember, the smarter you are, the more susceptible you are, just in different ways.

#

I think, anyway? xD

#

I guess Isaac held out.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:07 PM

#

Isaac still went crazy

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:07 PM

#

But he still got mindscrewed.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:08 PM

#

he came back from it, kind of

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:08 PM

#

Some were already murder cough cough master builder cough cough.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:08 PM

#

but Isaac's compatibility led him to make a marker

#

a big marker

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:08 PM

#

He was already kind of messed up

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:08 PM

#

Man, that just reminds me. Why the hell was Ellie seemingly totally immune again?

#

Bleh, I'm off-topic.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:09 PM

#

🤔

#

maybe Ellie wasn't smart enough for the signal to induce marker symptoms

#

or rather, compatible enough

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:09 PM

#

But then she would've just made good necromorph fodder.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:09 PM

#

except she was good at protecting herself

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:10 PM

#

Maybe she's a good mixture of really competent survivor but not such a high concept thinker, yeah.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:10 PM

#

it's not like the signal itself just killed people it contacted with

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:10 PM

#

Kinda like Chief!

#

Chief immune to the markers, confirmed?

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:10 PM

#

maybe

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:10 PM

#

Eckhart’s ladder has a video comparing the flood and the necromorphs on yt @humble yacht

#

Along with 2 other sci-fi parasites

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:10 PM

#

Halsey probably would be affected by a marker

#

I bet her Red Marker would be so big

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:11 PM

#

Man, that just makes me have other questions. For example; how short would the Dead Space series be if Clarke was substituted for Chief? xD

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:11 PM

#

one game short

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:11 PM

#

Enforcers and other heavy duty sentinel would do a good job fighting them necros.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:11 PM

#

because there was only a 2 because Isaac had marker blueprints in his mind

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:12 PM

#

And a certain guy in a green suit helmet

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:13 PM

#

It'd be called "Deader Space"

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:13 PM

#

😂 lol

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:14 PM

#

Or "Dead Space: A Green Guy Blows Up the Brethren Moons with Space Cucumbers"

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

Chief would probably need HAVOK nukes

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

Arbiter comes along... deadest space

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

Would the Halo affect destroy necromorphs?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

arbiter

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

thinkingchief

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

No

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

thinkingchief

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

They are dead

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

disrupts neural physics

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

True

#

Whatdoesthatmeantho

#

Idk then

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:15 PM

#

marker signal seems like it could fall under that category

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:16 PM

#

Nervous systems?

#

I always thought it was nervous sytems.

#

Resonating neutrinos which take out your nervous system.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:16 PM

#

For standard lifeforms, yes, it destroys the nervous system

#

but it also destroys precursor constructs which operate based on neural physics

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:16 PM

#

Yeah the halo array essentially fries the nervous systems of organisms

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:16 PM

#

which is an as-of-yet undescribed technology

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:17 PM

#

Which is how the flood infects it’s host

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:17 PM

#

What are you guys talking about?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:17 PM

#

I just assumed that Precursor artifacts must have been held together by a neuro-nervous like network.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:17 PM

#

I think a necromorph could function without a nervous system

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:17 PM

#

seems interesting.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:17 PM

#

Via nervous system

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:17 PM

#

Star road are not not described

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:17 PM

#

so if a Halo were to affect necromorphs, it would likely be by disrupting the marker signal itself

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:17 PM

#

I mean it's kinda hard for a thing to function without a nervous system.

#

Flood Infection forms, I can understand - they're just blobs.

#

But necromorphs are kinda, I dunno. More coordinated.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:18 PM

#

a necromorph functions by receiving remote signals from the marker

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:18 PM

#

Cough cough gravemind cough cough

#

@versed helm

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:18 PM

#

But once those signals are received, how does the body actually physically move

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:18 PM

#

¯_(ツ)_/¯

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:19 PM

#

I mean, at this point, it's pretty clear to me that the Gravemind is some sort of non-linear entity that exists in an esoteric kinda capacity. Cthulu stuff.

#

My bet's either the Domain or Slipspace.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:19 PM

#

destroying the head of a necromorph doesn't kill it, yet destroying the critical area of a Flood combat form does kill it

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:20 PM

#

True

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:20 PM

#

necromorphs only "die" when the body is completely unable to do anything

#

i.e. dismembered

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:20 PM

#

I mean, canonically speaking, do they have to be fully dismembered?

#

Or only lose, like, an arm and a leg as in-game.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:20 PM

#

¯_(ツ)_/¯

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:20 PM

#

Flood kill some unsc come back flame throwers

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:21 PM

#

Cuz it seems like they need some level of basic mass to function, depending on their overall construction.

#

Maybe they're dispersing their neurological functions throughout their body.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:21 PM

#

Gravemind: whose laughing now.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:21 PM

#

I think each cell in a necromorph receives the signal and acts in accordance with the rest of the body

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:22 PM

#

It seems more like the signal controlling them abandons the body when it perceives there's no more use for it

#

ah, what Chimera said.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:22 PM

#

I mean, surely the signal could make use of a detached blade-arm

#

Or a carcass with no arms but two good legs and a bitey mouth

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:22 PM

#

I think that it would try to reabsorb the flesh later.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:22 PM

#

Basically the original infection form is what controls a combat form so killing the infection form kills the combat form

#

Do flood spores grow into full infection forms as they consume the body?

#

No

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:23 PM

#

no

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:23 PM

#

Maybe

#

Idk

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:23 PM

#

spore activates, becomes FSC

#

FSC makes more FSCs

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:23 PM

#

Flood super-cell

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:23 PM

#

I suspect that in modern canon, only very recent combat forms would require the combat form.

#

Pod infector, sorry. Typo.

#

Only very recent combat forms would require the pod infector.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:24 PM

#

why?

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:24 PM

#

Flood kill some unsc come back with rockets and 🔥 throwers . Gravemind: “whose laughing now!”.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:24 PM

#

Because combat forms have been seen to operate at full-effectiveness off just spores.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:24 PM

#

pod infector is the vector that allows flood to spread quickly and efficiently, since spore infection takes awhile and isn't as effective

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:24 PM

#

The grave mind is dead iirc

#

The one from halo 2 anyway

#

So logically, after the pod has done its work, it could leave the host body with whatever infrastructure, say, Orlav in The Mona Lisa had.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:24 PM

#

True

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:25 PM

#

easy to make, guaranteed conversion (for like 99% of infectees)

unique rune May 6, 2019, 4:25 PM

#

Only in that its physical body no longer exists.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:25 PM

#

Yeah

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:25 PM

#

True @versed helm

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:25 PM

#

It’s mind still exists in the collective flood conscience

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:25 PM

#

True again

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:25 PM

#

I'm still not really sure on what happened to the gravemind. Did they kill him in Halo 3 when they activated the ring?

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:25 PM

#

well the way Halopedia describes a combat form, it's not all Flood

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:25 PM

#

Yes @stoic shale

#

I don't think you can kill him.

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:25 PM

#

oh ok

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:26 PM

#

You can destroy the keyminds it's working through.

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:26 PM

#

I always though he was still alive.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:26 PM

#

But the same entity always comes back.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:26 PM

#

It's weird too.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:26 PM

#

"Resignation is my virtue. Like water, I ebb and flow. Defeat is but the addition of time to a sentence I never deserved... but you imposed."

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:26 PM

#

What would have happened if the proto-GM had fully developed on the Truth and Reconciliation?

#

A Gravemind already existed...

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:27 PM

#

The fired it on the ark and that’s where he was located or he was on the new ring which was destroyed so either way I think he’s dead

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:27 PM

#

So would they become one? Or have been two distinct Graveminds?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:27 PM

#

A mean, a proto-GM is just a keymind.

#

They’d become one I think

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:27 PM

#

Gravemind never die only missing in action.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:27 PM

#

Same for "full-GMs". Just bigger keyminds.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:27 PM

#

Literally

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:27 PM

#

It wouldn't be two distinct GM

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:27 PM

#

I suppose.

#

I don't think I'm a fan of that change brought by AtN

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:27 PM

#

I’m not sure how grave minds work when there is more than one

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:27 PM

#

GM is just a node powerful enough to express the full intelligence of the Flood

#

it's the same hivemind every time

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:28 PM

#

I actually think it's a huge boon to a functional conceptualization of The Flood as a credible threat.

#

A plausible life cycle is beginning to emerge, I think.

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:28 PM

#

Can't there be more then one gravemind?

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:28 PM

#

There can

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:28 PM

#

or is it only one at a time.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:28 PM

#

but it's still the same GM

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:28 PM

#

oh ok

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:28 PM

#

Only one gravemind, many keyminds.

#

The gravemind does not appear to be a physical thing.

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:28 PM

#

Ah i see.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:28 PM

#

It's like a ghost.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:28 PM

#

it's like you access multiple terminals through the same network

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:29 PM

#

Oh

#

That's cool lmao

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:29 PM

#

Or access the same network through multiple terminals

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:29 PM

#

Right.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:29 PM

#

GM is physical

#

it requires a certain mass to manifest

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:29 PM

#

The grave mind is the flood in a sense

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:29 PM

#

no mass, no processing power

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:30 PM

#

Manifesting doesn't mean becoming. I think in this case, manifest means acting as a conduit for.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:30 PM

#

yeah sure

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:30 PM

#

So the Gravemind could be destroyed, dead, forever, if every single piece of Flood biomass were annihilated.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:30 PM

#

but it still requires a physical form

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:30 PM

#

Yes @feral perch

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:30 PM

#

Gravemind is technically last precursor.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:30 PM

#

The Gravemind is such an immense, boundless entity that you need a big collection of corrupted nervous systems to compute it.

#

The flood itself would be dead

#

That's basically how I envision the flood process. They collect bodies for their processing power, then when it gets smart enough, it becomes its own thing.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:31 PM

#

I wonder if Guilty Spark was right about the Flood existing in other galaxies, or floating between galaxies.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:31 PM

#

yeah, it becomes it's own thing

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:31 PM

#

Gravemind = last precursor

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:31 PM

#

but it's the same thing every time

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:31 PM

#

The only downside then is that, if that ever happens, you'd be fighting more goo-beasts than re-animated corpses.

#

The flood is corrupted precursors @ashen wharf

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:31 PM

#

it remembers everything from its previous incaration

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:31 PM

#

Which shouldn't be possible if the Gravemind exists physically

#

Because all its storage space would be getting wiped

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:32 PM

#

Unless that storage is outside of this dimension

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:32 PM

#

That is equally possible.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:32 PM

#

or all the info is stored in every FSC

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:32 PM

#

The precursors ground themselves into dust which corrupted over time and when organic inhaled it they became the flood @ashen wharf

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:32 PM

#

Ah, like with DNA.

ashen wharf May 6, 2019, 4:32 PM

#

Gravemind has knowledge and memory of primordial the last precursor @versed helm

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:32 PM

#

If that's the case, Chimera, why do they need keyminds?

#

I guess to read the data?

#

Keyminds.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:32 PM

#

it's like needing a powerful PC to run certain software

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:32 PM

#

Huh.

#

The flood is essentially a single entity

#

The keys to the code, lol.

#

That's a compelling theory.

#

So when the gravemind says I in halo 2 he is speaking for the entirety of the flood

#

Right.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:34 PM

#

I suppose that actually makes a lot of sense.

#

How could the Flood have the same vast knowledge with every reconstituted Gravemind, unless every Flood cell already contained those memories?

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:34 PM

#

it's either that or the "mind" is stored outside of the known space

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:35 PM

#

Well I was saying some esoteric entity that exists beyond the realms of what is physical or what is this dimension.

#

Yeah, exactly.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:35 PM

#

either theory is possible

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:35 PM

#

If you just had an Infection form, and began the infection anew, there would be a lot of missing data from the current sentient beings in the galaxy

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 4:35 PM

#

~Neural physics~

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:35 PM

#

I guess it depends on the last time the FSC synced up, aye.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:35 PM

#

So there should be some other store of knowledge, either in the Flood itself, or as Chimera said, in another dimension

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:35 PM

#

That's why absorbing sentient life is a critical aspect

#

it adds new intelligence to the hivemind

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:36 PM

#

Processing power.

hardy goblet May 6, 2019, 4:36 PM

#

Why not in an equivalent to the domain ?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:36 PM

#

The FSC itself is not intelligent, but it has strong impulses to gain intelligence.

#

I mean, personally, I think it's the Domain itself.

hardy goblet May 6, 2019, 4:36 PM

#

Same here

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:36 PM

#

I meant, just infecting "modern" day humans and aliens would not give it the knowledge of the Precursors and ancient humanity and all that jazz

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:36 PM

#

The Domain is connected to the Precursors.

#

It kinda makes sense.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:36 PM

#

that old knowledge remains

hardy goblet May 6, 2019, 4:36 PM

#

Even more when the Forerunner lost accept to it pieces by pieces

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:37 PM

#

once its part of the flood, it's always there, even if the flood is defeated

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:37 PM

#

It remains, but how? Either of your hypotheses could account for it

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:37 PM

#

yeah

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:37 PM

#

Plus, the weird psychic nonsense that happened in Halo 3 could be the same system as the vision in Halo 5.

#

Both the Domain.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:37 PM

#

we don't know for sure yet but we have strong theories

#

strong in the sense that they fit the existing lore

gloomy condor May 6, 2019, 4:37 PM

#

Wait the cortana moments?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:38 PM

#

Right. Which I'm fairly certain was actually the Gravemind.

hardy goblet May 6, 2019, 4:38 PM

#

The domain being flood infected would also fit with Cortana being hit by the logic plague

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:38 PM

#

So the Domain was playing a game with the Forerunners? Fighting both sides of the war?

#

The Domain is Palpatine

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:38 PM

#

🅱ortana

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:38 PM

#

plot twist

#

Cortana does not have the logic plague

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:38 PM

#

I think the Domain is separate from the Flood

hardy goblet May 6, 2019, 4:38 PM

#

Then the Domain is the Scenate ?

#

🤔

gloomy condor May 6, 2019, 4:38 PM

#

thinkingchief

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:39 PM

#

The domain is inaccessible to the flood I think

#

Sheev-spins out of a Domain portal

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:39 PM

#

The Domain is really very mysterious.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:39 PM

#

I feel like if the Flood was using the Domain, the Forerunners would have noticed somehow. Given their worship of it

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:39 PM

#

Yeah

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:39 PM

#

@versed helm if a word is filtered, don't bypass

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:39 PM

#

The flood definitely is able to use other esoteric technologies

hardy goblet May 6, 2019, 4:39 PM

#

But they didn't fully understand it

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:39 PM

#

The Forerunners were kind of stupid though.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:40 PM

#

I guess I'll find a less offensive way to depict Palpatine's screech.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:40 PM

#

Very intelligent but blind at the same time.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:40 PM

#

No not really

#

Aieee!

hardy goblet May 6, 2019, 4:40 PM

#

They used the domain the same way the covies used Huragoks

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:40 PM

#

Yes

hardy goblet May 6, 2019, 4:40 PM

#

"Ok cool, do your magic"

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:40 PM

#

The domain likely would not be accessible to the flood

#

@humble yacht Btw I assumed I got filtered for the spam inherent in the word, not the word itself. So genuine apologies.

hardy goblet May 6, 2019, 4:41 PM

#

Very much like most human with internet

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:41 PM

#

I would be very disappointed if Cortana has the plague or if the Flood is somehow behind everything

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:41 PM

#

I would like to see a conversation with the Domain, in 2560.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:41 PM

#

I doubt they are

#

I feel as if the Flood should be behind everything, or at least, connected to it.

#

They are the antagonist, after all.

#

The Covenant wipes out humanity, who cares. People still exist, just not human ones.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:42 PM

#

I'd rather them not be

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:42 PM

#

If Cortana had the plague she was cured of it when she entered the domain

#

Truth fires the rings - people still exist, it's fine.

#

The Flood win - everything's gone.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:42 PM

#

I would prefer something with the Domain. Like, an answer to some of the biggest questions.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:42 PM

#

Also, the Covenant as an antagonist was completely independent of the Flood's influence

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:42 PM

#

Maybe even find that way to stop the Flood that Cortana spoke about in Halo 3, and was never mentioned again?

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:43 PM

#

They formed simply out of a misunderstanding

#

So it's not like the Flood was behind the Covenant

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:43 PM

#

Or rather, was only mentioned by Petra the journalist

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:43 PM

#

The basis of that understanding was a misunderstanding of the Forerunner-Flood war

#

I see them as a knock-on effect

#

The flood is active on the ark and the ring in which halo infinite takes place

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:43 PM

#

yes but the Flood did not machinate the formation of the Covenant

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:44 PM

#

That is true.

#

~~You never know tho~~

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:44 PM

#

Humanity in halo is as much a consequence of the Forerunner-Flood war as the Covenant

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:44 PM

#

Maybe once the Gravemind figured out what was going on his last bet was to somehow stifle the truth for future generations of nonhuman species

#

The flood essentially receded entirely after the first firing of the array

#

Tampering with relics, etc

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:44 PM

#

I doubt that

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very much

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:44 PM

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Screwball theory, but not out of the question

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:45 PM

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it's pretty out there as far as theories go

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:45 PM

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Yeah it’s pretty out there

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It was just a silly example, everything's connected.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:45 PM

#

it's validity existing only in the sense that anything is possible because it's fiction and therefore fluid

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:45 PM

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What is chaos if not a cascade caused by order.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:45 PM

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I want to see the Didact again

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:45 PM

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Chaos is a ladder

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:46 PM

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I want to know what became of Offensive Bias

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:46 PM

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We all do, the Didact was a good lad

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Well, good to fight

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:46 PM

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I imagine Offensive Bias deconstructed itself after subjugating MB

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:46 PM

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I want to know how they're going to wrap all this up in Infinite, if indeed that's the plan... Darn it.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:46 PM

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The didact is dead my guy

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:46 PM

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The Didact is contained.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:46 PM

#

*Oddly composed

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He didn’t @humble yacht

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:46 PM

#

Not dead.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:47 PM

#

according to what source?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:47 PM

#

Wasn't it the Escalation Library Edition?

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I'll check

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At least I’m pretty sure he didn’t

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:47 PM

#

about Offensive Bias, I mean

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:47 PM

#

Oh

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Well the Didact still is absolutely not dead

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At least, according to Brian Reed

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:48 PM

#

To me, it would be very fitting if Offensive Bias was like "ok, job's done, I'm not needed anymore" and just autodispensed itself

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:49 PM

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That does make sense.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:49 PM

#

like a Mr Meeseeks box

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:49 PM

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Cool reference my dood

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Watch the collateral damage though

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That's a high yield of cringe you're throwing around

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:50 PM

#

and I care why?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:51 PM

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I'm the one doing the caring

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I care about all my Halo lovin' brothers and sisters out there

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In a platonic, passively approving, not creepy way

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:51 PM

#

what are you talking about

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:51 PM

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lmao

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:51 PM

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I mean, there's a thread there, in that exchange.

#

At least in my mind.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:52 PM

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Must be a thin thread

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like, spider silk thin

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cause I don't see it

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:52 PM

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Well it sorta jumped. I pointed out cringe, you said you don't care

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I said you don't have to care

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Because I care about you

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:52 PM

#

:/

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:52 PM

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I'm watching out to make sure you don't cause collateral damage by referencing Rick and Morty too hard

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:53 PM

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yeah I've no idea why you went in that direction

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:53 PM

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Dangerous game my friend

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I'm sorry for overstepping my boundaries, then

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:53 PM

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well, if you don't like it, shield your eyes

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🙈

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:53 PM

#

Let's get back to Halo lore, shall we?

#

Someone say something

#

This will look strange for someone joining the chat

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:54 PM

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uhhh gravemind is cool

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:54 PM

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who would win in a battle: gravemind or rick sanchez?

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:54 PM

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My personal ideal ending for Halo Infinite involves getting every single living Spartan-II in one spot to defeat Cortana in an epic battle

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:54 PM

#

totally rick sanchez.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:54 PM

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I feel those vibes.

#

Inspired by recent flicks, perhaps?

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:54 PM

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that would a cool idea Stone.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:55 PM

#

sounds like someone saw a certain movie recently

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:55 PM

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Only coincidentally; I've wanted to see that gathering of the OG Spartans for a long time now.

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 4:55 PM

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in one spot
Oh, that sounds gross and potentially very disturbing.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:55 PM

#

gravenmind in legendary is impossible I think

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:55 PM

#

It's possible.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:55 PM

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For a long time.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:56 PM

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It'd be a slightly unorthodox hero moment, I feel

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:56 PM

#

@gilded mason I didn't mean it that way but sure, with neurophysics we could find a way

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:56 PM

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The actual battle would be a lot of sneaking around

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:56 PM

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kek

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 4:56 PM

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Good ol' neural physics.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:56 PM

#

You can't, like, punch Cortana out of the Domain or whatever

#

Unless you can

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:56 PM

#

neural physics, neurophysics

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:56 PM

#

Which is a pretty awesome idea

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:57 PM

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I hope the flood comes back in infinite.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:57 PM

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I do want to see Chief rip her out of the Domain and crush her in his fist like the Warden said

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:57 PM

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lmao

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:57 PM

#

Y'know, you could have a pretty grim scene in a Halo novel where a captured non-Spartan character gets locked up in a suit of MJOLNIR

#

As a kind of torture

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:57 PM

#

ouch

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:57 PM

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Then they get saved, obviously

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:57 PM

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No, they probably die.

gilded mason May 6, 2019, 4:57 PM

#

"Now don't move a muscle..."

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:57 PM

#

Saitama could punch her out

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 4:57 PM

#

They most likely would die.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:57 PM

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But it'd be very unpleasant, forcing yourself to be totally, utterly still

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:58 PM

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Halo novels like to kill people off.

#

Eric Nylund went crazy with it.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:58 PM

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Tell that to Forbeck

feral perch May 6, 2019, 4:58 PM

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Not Forbeck no, it's a Denning expression...

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:59 PM

#

He clearly has no desire to romanticize ODSTs

#

I respect that

#

Someone needs to balance out all the mary-sue ODST OCs that've been injected into this world

#

By, y'know.

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 4:59 PM

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:/

versed helm May 6, 2019, 4:59 PM

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Channelling their inner Dietz, reading from the gospel of Nylund, and killing off some Helljumpers miserably.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:00 PM

#

I was disturbed by how easily the Spartans-IVs in Bad Blood were willing to turn against their comrades. I don't believe Spartan-IIs would ever fall for such a trick.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:00 PM

#

Did Hamm live in the end?

#

I forget

#

I'll re-read Silent Storm before Oblivion

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:00 PM

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Unsure.

#

Nelly Hamm?

#

Did she?

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:00 PM

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I thought she did

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:00 PM

#

I actually don't remember either...

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:00 PM

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There was a badass lady ODST who died.

#

Something-Bear.

#

I'll see if Halopedia has a page.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:01 PM

#

Little Bear

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:01 PM

#

Right.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:01 PM

#

She did die.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:01 PM

#

No individual page for Hamm.

#

Nawww, she seemed cool.

#

I was getting McKay vibes from her

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:01 PM

#

Halopedia has some catching up to do.

#

McKay had more respect for Chief.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:02 PM

#

The Flood I remember very clearly because I recently hoovered it for details on UNSC equipment.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:02 PM

#

At least the Black Daggers' leader wasn't another Silva.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:03 PM

#

I remember distinctly The Flood saying that while McKay was every bit the Helljumper Silva was, she was also a woman, which was why she was more empathetic.

#

Which I found to be a very old-school line.

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 5:04 PM

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I been doing merging work ;)

#

For the wiki

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:04 PM

#

Our hero

#

Genuinely, no sarcasm

#

Sorry

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 5:04 PM

#

Its a big task.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:04 PM

#

something something social justice @versed helm

obsidian thistle May 6, 2019, 5:04 PM

#

But once thats done its onto a lot of "fun" tasks.

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 5:05 PM

#

"There is much talk, and I have listened, through rock and metal and time. Now I shall talk, and you shall listen." - Said on Gravemind. this has to be my favourite quote.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:05 PM

#

Hey, genders can have strengths.

#

We all equally cool in our own right.

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:05 PM

#

I wasn't arguing.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:05 PM

#

Nor was I

#

I was merely pontificating

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:05 PM

#

Okay.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:05 PM

#

In a sorta vaguely hood manner

#

You can tell because I said "we all" instead of "we are all"

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:05 PM

#

of course

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:06 PM

#

That is a goovy Gravemind quote.

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 5:06 PM

#

It really is.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:06 PM

#

See that's the thing. The reason I want the Flood to be back is because there's so much unexplored potential.

stoic shale May 6, 2019, 5:06 PM

#

They most likely will be back in infinite.

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:06 PM

#

Both gameplay-wise, and in terms of story as we've been discussing.

#

I want to see a broad, diverse variance in pure forms.

#

I think there needs to be a pure form that's kinda equivalent to a combat form. Just to sorta illustrate the progression of an infection.

#

A sorta Flood Soldier, if you will.

#

The problem is, how do you make a blob of FSC look visually compelling?

#

I think you could have some lit gameplay by integrating keymind war forms.

#

My solution would be to give them creepy faces.

#

Like that Flood dude from The Mona Lisa whose face opened up as he got enraged by the noise of the ship intercom.

#

Sorta did a four-way split thing, with feelers coming out from underneath

#

Really creepy stuff

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:10 PM

#

I want the textures to be like Reach, with Halo 2 A's colors

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 5:10 PM

#

I wouldn't mind the Flood returning as a threat post Created

#

but not during

#

I want the Created to be their own thing and have their own conclusion

#

independent of Flood meddling

feral perch May 6, 2019, 5:11 PM

#

I'd like to see the Corrupted Crawlers from Promises to Keep

humble yacht May 6, 2019, 5:11 PM

#

So I'm hoping for little-to-no Flood in Infinite

versed helm May 6, 2019, 5:11 PM

#

Chimera, I do get where you're coming from.

#

I guess I kinda agree, in a way.

#

Really, if they find a way to nail what we've been fighting throughout the Reclaimer saga thus-far in a truly distinct and compelling way, I'll be happy.

#

And I mean Prometheans, of course. Halo 5 was a step back for me.

#

I don't care so much about "floaty bits" or that nonsense - aesthetic is secondary to me, I guess. It's just about making an enemy that feels good to shoot and is truly canonically grounded.

#

As-is, Prometheans canonically speaking are trapped somewhere between "Forerunner robots" and "ex-humans". Much is always made of the Composer, but it's kinda silly to think it's basically just a tool for creating one type of Forerunner robot that really isn't much of a threat.

#

And gameplay wise - they're bullet sponges, and in Halo 5 they suffer from being annoying and insta-killy, as all AI in that game kinda do.

#

Eh, I guess it's what the Didact was planning to do with the Composer that was more the rub.

#

Lotta people dying and all that.