@austere solstice the Vengeful Spirit will also be there
#lore-and-universe
versed helm
austere solstice
you know the more you say the more i feel like you want the all life in the Orion arm just to die or become some weird daemon
versed helm
I still wonder..how did the SOF get to the Lesser Ark?
Now that i think about it,how did the Banished get to the Lesser Ark?
People of some lore repute have told me that the assumption is that the Banished travelled there.
As in, the long way.
Would've taken them a few years, probably.
On the other hand, it seems more likely to me that they just managed to open a portal from another site like Voi, and are prevented from using the same method to leave because their carrier got destroyed.
They're keeping the method that they arrived secret from the SoF. If the SoF ever escapes, that'll probably be how.
versed helm
How do we know for sure?
Pheonix Logs?
I also wonder what the status of Earth is post H5,i would love to see it through the eyes of a civilian
remote spruce
A log states that they straight up disappeared in March 2558
So assume that means they started slipspace jumping at that month
UNSC Rubicon took almost a year to get to the Ark
versed helm
Speaking of the Rubicon,i wonder how it might return
stable seal
Chief:Permission to leave the PIZZA HUT.
Captain:May i ask why?
Chief:To give the cov's back their pizza
Captain:permission granted!
Heroic music intensifies
spiral jewel
Assuming that he was active at the time, I wonder if John manage to hear about Jorge's death on the LNOS and what his reaction to it was.
brisk cape
According to Halopedia, Jorge’s reassignment from Navy to Army may have been under the guise of being too heavily wounded to continue active duty. So if that’s the case then John and the rest of them wouldn’t have any clue about Jorge still being active or his death. Halsey herself seems surprised to see him when they meet at Castle Base, so if she was unaware he was still active, it’s a safe bet that the other S-IIs would be unaware.
spiral jewel
Interesting to know
thorny wyvern
Can someone briefly summarize for me why Fred, Linda, and Kelly are back in H5 and how that happened?? @me when you respond please
subtle depot
@thorny wyvern they never were killed just separated from the chief. Linda is actually canonically semi-present during halo CE but that’s a story for another time. Halo 1-3 happened in a very short busy time. Most likely the rest of blue time was off doing other stuff at the time. With everything calming down and more organized post-war blue team had the chance to link back up
thorny wyvern
Gotcha. In the original lore I thought it was pretty much established that Chief was the last Spartan
Until the new generation program hit
subtle depot
No that was just bungies little gimmick
subtle depot
After reach it felt to him like he was the last spartan after so many died but even by the time of halo 2 he had heard of more survivors
thorny wyvern
Gotcha
subtle depot
If I am correct there are about 15? surviving twos
thorny wyvern
I miss mark v armor
versed helm
same
thorny wyvern
I liked the look a lot more. And I liked that they all wore it or something similar
Jorge's armor is modified but you can still see the roots of the mkV beneath the changes to body and helmet
Versus Linda's
thorny wyvern
Right but
the ORIGINAL idea of Mk 5 is that they all looked the same
OG fall of Reach and other books had spartans in uniformed armor
that said, I love Reach's armor
Reach's armor is my fave in the whole series
But I love the aesthetic of Jorge, Jun, and Carter soooo much
remote spruce
Yeah that changed by Reach (argubly 3)
halcyon kestrel
Am I in the minority in liking Master Chief's 343 redesign more than his Halo CE and Halo 2 design?
gilded mason
Possibly. Don't think any official poll regarding the suit was ever done, though I think I recall an unofficial one with a couple thousands votes that had people liking the 343 armor less.
halcyon kestrel
😔
gilded mason
Though I myself am not a fan of the 2 and 3 armor. Mark V from CE is the best out of all of them for me.
halcyon kestrel
I would go 343, Halo 2 Mark VI, and then CE Mark V
radiant sphinx
Mark V is definitely my favorite, followed by the current Infinite design
remote spruce
@lunar temple Frank O' Conner helped write some of the terminals, but he was at Bungie at the time.
versed helm
Mine is halo 3, halo reach, halo 2, Halo CE, and lastly Halo 4
Halo 4 Master Chief is too fat
lunar temple
Who wrote the rest @remote spruce ?
remote spruce
Unknown, it's possible it was all Frankie
I think the IRIS ARG was by another company?
obsidian thistle
IRIS is esentially the first half of the Halo 3 Terminals
A lot of the terminals dont make sense or are incomplete without them.
sly spindle
oooooh thats the ilovebees thing i remember that
well ike similar to that
not that exact thing
obsidian thistle
ILBs the ARG that made Windows 95 canon. Yes I love that.
feral perch
Am I the only one who wants James to resurface?
vivid dust
He's likely dead
lunar temple
james being the person from hunt the truth?
gilded mason
You mean the journalist? That was Ben.
wispy harness
what are the chances of halo 5 being non-canon
wispy harness
:(
rose matrix
as a guy that's been mostly a casual Halo fans, played through the games over the years, usually way after they released, but did pretty much read all of the novels and comics+watch all animated series the last 4 months, what is wrong about Halo 5?
wispy harness
sorry
rose matrix
although I did at one point end up on halopedia reading the summaries of a bunch of novels and characters, which prompted me to finally get through H4 and H5, and those two are actually my favorite games in the series
mystic trail
Reading about all these WWII ships being found in the Pacific, it'd be cool if we got a story about people discovering the wrecks of frigates after the war
carmine sleet
That's already happened in a few novels, such as Smoke and Shadow where they scavenge one
halcyon remnant
I really like the lore 343 has come up with about the forerunners
I recently started reading Halo Cryptum, are the books that came out afterwards good as well?
versed helm
Well just go-dark and power through it.
And stay away from any region of Halopedia that relates to the Forerunners xD
versed helm
I can confidently tell you he is not xD
versed helm
And that's no lie. You'll understand everything once you finish the trilogy.
Which you should go and do
Right now
halcyon remnant
Wait
does it explain what the primordial is and stuff
o:
and the forerunner ai
rose matrix
yes, those get explained
halcyon remnant
in the first book o3o ?
rose matrix
how far are you in?
rose matrix
gotta be honest, that doesn't jar anything memories, it's been a while, just keep going
brisk cape
Read zee book
junior dome
Guys what Halo installation was in Halo 4 that was shown?
Was it installation 2?
I forgot
junior dome
oh ok
gilded mason
@rose matrix
Halo 4 also featured Installation 03, as previously said.
gilded mason
Yes, you see it during Composer.
And it's where they found the device itself, I believe.
obsidian thistle
You can actually go on I03 in Spartan Strike however.
rose matrix
I know I came to it super crazy late because I didn't play Halo 4 until MCC, but I really like Spartan Ops, it's essentially a second co-op only campaign
plus splashing out the cash for Blur CG videos
halcyon remnant
Well it's getting a bit confusing, Im at a part where Chakas, Riser and born are at a place where there's sphinxes, old battle suits that are apparently huge, and born thinks it's a tomb of some sort
No idea why someone would burry a forerunner in a human populated world 
Also the shenanigans that they pull of to get there is even more confusing
Trails of rocks and stuff
And ilussions
rose matrix
it makes more sense by the next few chapters
and basically becomes crystal by the end of the trilogy
versed helm
Been wondering; Is it possible to create a grenade using Needler crystals? Like, a fist sized object that sprays shards of crystal around an area, any that are close enough together on impact then superbombine explode
yes
anything is possible
To that end, where are Needler crystals made?
gilded mason
Blamite
versed helm
in a factory, duhhhh
versed helm
versed helm
There's blamite mines.
Like bumping-betties that track you. Or jumping betties? The type of mine that almost blows you up towards the end of MW2 before you get burnt as Roach.
They were in Spartan Strike.
Sent out needle shrapnel everywhere.
last anchor
Doesnt surprise me. Blamite is surprisingly maluable
versed helm
Is there a Spartan team that specializes in stealth?
Yes, delta team
if ya catch my drift
versed helm
The only sneaky thing they're doing
Is decomposing
Spoilers, I guess.
maybe a few years ago
last anchor
Black Team was asymetrical deep strike warfare and skunkworks testing mostly
strong sage
Fam , i want to know just how powerfull or strong metarch class a.i? I haven’t read the forerunner trilogy series yet and nor understand regarding ai
versed helm
What's that one Spartan team that just shows up whenever other USNC forces least expect it, then no one hears a peep from them for a few years or more?
versed helm
UNSC (before the fall of Reach) vs the CIS (Confederacy of Independent Systems), who wins?
paper lava
Hmm, I'd go with CIS.
versed helm
The guys leading the CIS are Count Dooku, General Grievous, and Darth Maul
The UNSC also has some great leaders too
I can picture Master Chief fighting Grievous and winning
paper lava
What are the army sizes?
versed helm
100k each
paper lava
Yeah but like, 100k of what?
vivid dust
paper lava
I mean, is this the defensive fleet above Reach vs the attackers that kidnapped Palpatine?
versed helm
For the CIS, they'll have battle droids, super battle droids, droidekas, tanks, artillery, and starfighters
paper lava
Well, in an even fight, the droids might have issues. They usually do better as they have the numbers and overwhelming firepower without the need of near as much supplies like food or ammunition.
versed helm
UNSC has marines, Spartan IIs and IIIs, ODSTs, warthogs, scorpions, hornets, longswords, and broadswords
Marines with a lot of jackhammer tubes.
Plus, don't forget about the Pelicans with their anvil rocket pods and 70mm autocannons.
paper lava
But shot for shot, the UNSC Marine would take a droid, and UNSC ballistic weapons reach farther than blasters.
Vultures and droid gunships would beat Pelicans quite easily.
versed helm
I wouldn't be so sure about that. The UNSC has a lot of pelicans.
paper lava
Too fast and maneuverable to combat. The UNSC doesn't have any good fighters in number that can keep air superiority.
versed helm
And they're used basically as IFVs.
Plus, I dunno if you've ever heard of "longswords".
There may not be swarms of them, but they've got coilguns.
paper lava
Starfighters, how well do they handle in atmo?
versed helm
Well, two of em chased off a corvette.
paper lava
How well can a coilgun effectively deal with a swarm of vultures?
versed helm
In Reach.
What was the name of the ship that chased after that super carrier in Halo 2? I forgot
By spraying them down with an absurd amount of high-velocity slugs.
I'm just saying. The UNSC's military strength often comes in places you don't expect.
paper lava
Could be possible, I don't know how long they could hold up.
versed helm
Realistically, having a vehicle like the pelican is a tremendous asset.
That ship would go one on one with separatist flagship
paper lava
The CIS used a ton of fighters, even superior designs and pilots get bogged down by them.
versed helm
Ah, well. That's what wolverines, rocket hogs and jackhammer tubes are for, amirite?
paper lava
I'm just imagining all the Pelican wrecks through the series.
They're not exactly durable either.
versed helm
They don't get enough credit.
Mobility trumps durability, and they're not pushovers.
versed helm
What would happen if a UNSC cruiser gets boarded by someone like Darth Maul?
But you can smash it with an anvil rocket.
I dunno - how good is Maul at dealing with high velocity FMJ ammunition?
paper lava
Saber wielders would have a hard time against slug throwers. As shown in Star Wars lore.
Hogs versus Hailfire tanks, I'm going with the Hailfires.
Spider droids would slice open canopy FAVs easily.
versed helm
Hogs aren't battle tanks.
That's not a valid comparison.
Hogs are mobile un-armoured gun platforms used for light infantry support.
paper lava
You said mobility vs durability.
paper lava
So if you're talking about a scorpion versus an AAT, I think the scorpion would win on that front.
versed helm
UNSC vehicles and weapons don't have the same roles as droid equipment.
you can't just say "this is equal to this because we see them roughly the same amount".
paper lava
I know that's why I'm giving the examples that I am.
versed helm
The UNSC's lore is built a lot more like a functional modern military.
paper lava
I never once said that the occurrence of the unit changes its effectiveness.
versed helm
I'm uh, not gonna have much luck explaining this.
It's like.
Just curious could an energy sword be a viable weapon to use against a lightsaber wielding enemy?
paper lava
Yeah you're doing a very poor job explaining my argument to me.
versed helm
Like, alright. Star Wars is an incredibly deep universe with a lot of lore, right?
But it's, y'know. The way tactics and military forces work in it are kinda simplistic.
They don't really reflect the way vehicles and equipment are deployed and used realistically speaking.
paper lava
You're arguing themes
versed helm
And where you certainly see depictions - like Halo Wars - where stuff from Halo works in the same way
Canonically, the UNSC functions in a way that's a lot more subtle.
Like, straight-up choosing equivalent vehicles, weapons and gear to compare isn't productive in a discussion like this, because even though they might seem similar and on a surface level of like, hey, this is the most common UNSC vehicle and this is the most common CIS vehicle.
But it's not a very deep examination because that's now how the UNSC - at least as I see it, after years buried neck-deep in Halo novels and technical speculation - functions.
Like, let's take your comparison.
paper lava
I'm not saying they would fight standing in a straight line on a flat plain.
I'm comparing the unit strengths and weaknesses to each other that both factions would have to take into account.
The UNSC wouldn't fight the cis the way they fight the covenant.
versed helm
Alright, so Warthog versus Hailfire tank.
Let's look at the way the Warthog is used, right?
swift igloo
Depends on what type of warthog
versed helm
The UNSC functions based on an almost entirely airborne doctrine - their pelicans are the equivalent of a modern day Bradley IFV.
They provide transport, protection, extra firepower.
swift igloo
Guass haug would win if the hailfire failed to get a missile lock
versed helm
But, there are things an airborne vehicle cannot accomplish. AA fire can drive them off.
paper lava
That's a stretch of a comparison.
versed helm
It's the closest analogue. We don't have anything like pelicans today.
paper lava
Pelicans don't keep the same defensive presence of armored ground vehicles.
Then you don't have to make the comparison.
versed helm
No, but that's my point!
swift igloo
An osprey is similar
swift igloo
True
versed helm
They can perform ground-to-orbital transit, which is vital to the UNSC strategy.
They have better armour and more sophisticated defensive systems than modern airborne vehicles.
swift igloo
Also very good at crashing 😂
versed helm
They've got awesome transport capabilities - they can airlift and infantry squad and a tank.
paper lava
Naturally a vehicle 500 years in the future would be better than our current ones, yes.
versed helm
Their armament is about equivalent to a modern IFV - heavy autocannon, multi-purpose missiles.
paper lava
Closer to attack helicopters
versed helm
They can manoeuvre unlike any modern aircraft thanks to their grav-assist flight units.
paper lava
Autocannon and rocket pods.
swift igloo
Pelican in H4 has a Spartan laser
versed helm
That's a postwar gunship model, aye.
swift igloo
You're just referring to the dropships then?
paper lava
Someone was saying pre-Reach UNSC vs CIS from Star Wars
versed helm
But
paper lava
Then this guy got into this disambiguation of the Pelican.
paper lava
I don't know how or why but it's where we are.
swift igloo
The Republic struggled hard against the Separatist
versed helm
Right, so the UNSC eschews things like IFVs because of their usage of craft like the pelican.
That's where the warthog comes in, right?
UNSC infantry clearly favour a doctrine of point suppression, facilitated by their smart-linked weapons with their high-calibre match-grade ammo.
It means that, because they lack squad-integrated LMGs, they may come into situations where they lack overwhelming suppressive firepower.
Imagine if the UNSC managed to track General Grievous back to his hideout and launched an invasion
Warthogs are, at their core, un-armoured but sturdy colonial utility vehicles.
They are not intended to take hits.
They're a little like WW2 jeeps, which would mount heavy weapons as an anti-air precaution.
swift igloo
mac rounds
versed helm
They exist for two sole purposes, at least in their most common form.
swift igloo
The warthog lacks armor protection for the gunner
versed helm
I can picture pelicans descending onto the surface of Utapau and marines coming into contact with droids
Ground recon, and to serve as a mobile weapons platform to facilitate heavy suppression with a vulcan, or depending on the situation, other weapon capabilities such as light anti-armour and missile capability.
Right!
The Warthog isn't typically intended to be shot at.
swift igloo
It would be a bad day for battledroids
versed helm
It's not like a humvee or an MRAP.
paper lava
I think you're going way too deep with this. I think you're missing the point.
strong sage
How about the Gunship support on Halo wars 2 fam
versed helm
Master Chief would be fighting Grievous
It's a tool with a very special function intended to supplement the UNSC's combined arms combat doctrine.
swift igloo
Godly support
strong sage
The way they circling around similiar like a specter gunship
versed helm
It's not just something like a Hellfire droid, which is a mass-produced weapons platform. A plastic tank for your plastic army men without much deep integration.
strong sage
Except that there are four of em and they are the older models as well ^^
versed helm
Realistic military strategy makes use of tools, not units.
paper lava
That's incredibly shortsighted lol
versed helm
A direct comparison between a warthog and a hellfire, like they're somehow equivalent, just serves no purpose.
paper lava
It's not far off from covenant doctrine.
And the humans didn't win a ground war.
They won with plot armor in a campaign.
versed helm
Well, they won it more than the space war xD
paper lava
They held out longer*
versed helm
Ah, well. These are just the ramblings of a military nerd who's put far too much realistic thought into the UNSC.
swift igloo
If it wasn't for the arbiter being betrayed humanity would've lost
versed helm
Carry on with your fun, friends xD
paper lava
You did a lot of explaining what pelicans are and didn't contribute to much of the actual conversation.
swift igloo
I'm about to carry on either my grind for thorn in D2 or play the division 2
paper lava
Now that we know you think Pelicans are flying IFVs, we can file 13 that and backtrack.
versed helm
I'm just trying to say that picking and choosing "equivalent" units to compare is a horrible act of neglect towards wider notions of strategy
paper lava
I'd think the hardest part if anything would be getting each and every matchup compared.
versed helm
or how these things might actually be used.
paper lava
No one said that.
versed helm
It's what you're doing, tho xD
paper lava
I brought up a single scenario.
versed helm
At least, did.
Which I vehemently object to.
On the basis of the whole theoretical tactical doctrine I explained.
And the idea that Halo is really just kinda a deeper and more grounded universe than Star Wars
paper lava
You came in after I had said one thing about effectiveness of mobile units in both armies in an arbitrary stackup and gave the disambiguation of the unit role.
Which, as I said, we can now file 13 and go back to the discussion.
paper lava
Apply it to the discussion.
paper lava
Or at least just link a wiki page to save room on the screen
But to say mobility > durability is wrong
versed helm
I explicitly stated a long list of justifications as to why its role and whole tactical orientation of the UNSC fundamentally differs from the CIS in such a way as to render such a comparison fundamentally unhelpful to any comparison of capability.
You need to look at systems, not at individual units.
At overarching capabilities and how the many pieces come together.
paper lava
So I gave an example of a fast unit versus a heavy attack unit to show that you can't stack mobility and hope you can use subversion long enough to win a war.
versed helm
I didn't say anything about stacking mobility and using subversion.
"Stacking mobility" is a puerile concept.
paper lava
You do that by looking at individual unit strengths and weaknesses to identify how they would fit into that bigger picture.
versed helm
And here's how the Warthog fits into the bigger picture.
it is an air-transported light gun platform used to supplement the capabilities of infantry squads working in conjunction with their expected aerial support.
It is not whatever the hellfire is supposed to be.
paper lava
Not as a counter to a durable enemy.
versed helm
Like, what do you mean by "counter to a durable enemy?"
Like, as an anti-armour vehicle?
paper lava
The CIS units don't work individual to each other, either.
versed helm
I imagine so!
paper lava
You imagine wrongly.
versed helm
So why don't we examine their overarching tactics and strategic systems instead of taking a warthog and a hellfire and saying that one could blow up the other.
How do CIS units work?
What are their core elements?
What are their support elements?
How do they screen for aircraft? How do they deploy mobile firepower?
paper lava
A droid army that shares a single network that can work well in tandem and have no delay in transmitting new orders.
You're so matter of factly about this it's painful to read.
sage sequoia
There is always a delay in such comms
versed helm
I'm sorry, I feel strongly about the UNSC 😛
paper lava
I'd ask the same things of the UNSC, how much do you actually know about them?
I know you do. You can't stand the thought that something else might be able to beat them, so you don't have the discussion about it.
versed helm
Maybe.
sage sequoia
Also, hi, don't mind me barging in, whats the discussion here about?
paper lava
You're playing up the intricacies of the UNSC, while dismissing the entirety of the CIS.
paper lava
It was initially a conversation about a made-up battle between pre-Reach UNSC vs CIS from Star Wars and then this guy came in and gave us the handbook on pelicans and how they relate to modern aircraft and Bradley ifvs.
versed helm
Let's do it like this.
paper lava
I don't think I'm going to have a conversation with you anymore.
paper lava
You didn't, it's just kind of pointless because it's not a discussion.
versed helm
And I wish I could take back some of the arrogant stuff I said.
sage sequoia
pre-reach UNSC being before the covenant invasion?
paper lava
I don't know, the other guy already bailed.
versed helm
I think it was, like, pre-Fall UNSC defences of Reach versus the force that kidnapped Palpatine.
So, like, the droid forces in the battle of Corsuscant (how the f do you spell that) versus UNSC forces during the battle of Reach.
What happened is FunFact made a comparison between hellfire drones and warthogs, and I got triggered and went off about wider tactical systems and combined arms xD
sage sequoia
Hmm
My guess would be that the CIS would win because the droid army is pretty strong
But would do less well compared to the covenant.
But my starwars knowledge is vastly lacking in this regard
An interesting discussion to have at the very least
versed helm
Yee, well RIP to that.
sage sequoia
Seems like funfact may have blocked you, making it impossible for you to provide him with your genuine apology... That's a shame
versed helm
Well, some kinds of nerds are just incompatible.
sage sequoia
Fair enough xD
versed helm
Though I will admit, a lot of my suppositions regarding how the UNSC works are just that, suppositions.
I kinda look at what the UNSC has and how we read about and see it being used, and form conclusions about how these structures would work if Halo was real.
It's quite a fun mental exercise for, like, a long drive.
sage sequoia
I getya
Not my cup a tea. I am more about analyzing software/coming up with software structures
versed helm
Sounds interesting. How do you mean?
Like, just thinking about real software? or theorizing about, like, Halo software or something?
paper lava
Eckhart's ladder has so many who would win videos lol
sage sequoia
Bit of both tbh grim
paper lava
I search it on YouTube to see if anyone's dabbled in it, and of course there's a million videos of every fleet and army matched up.
sage sequoia
Could analyze how hologram software actually works. Or further how the AI core's actually work and exactly why rampancy is a common occurrence
But also frequently more mundane things. Like how does the actual game code behind Halo look like
What are the shaders used ect
versed helm
Those videos always start an s-storm of some kind in the comments. Maybe you can see me yelling at someone about tactical integration and pelicans being IFVs if you look deep enough xD
And that's probably more productive that being like "how might a Warthog actually be useful?", TDSrock.
So good on ya, tbh
sage sequoia
It's fun to me especially since I aim to be a game dev or at least a dev in the future.
strong sage
Make a game of Halo but in a marine perspective like uh planetside/battlefield thingy and the settings will be on Harvest since thats the first major battles between us and covies fam ty 😮
sage sequoia
Halo 3 odst was my favorite campaign
sage sequoia
No, thats your oppinion
sage sequoia
To be fun and entertaining, which for me, it was
halcyon remnant
The main character had no personality whatsoever
He looked and acted like a zombie
sage sequoia
You realize you don't play the main character in that game right?
halcyon remnant
Rookie is the main character
sage sequoia
The main characters were buck and the girl
The entire story is about them and what they discover for ONI
halcyon remnant
He's inspector gadget in that game
sage sequoia
Rookie doesn't get a character arc
halcyon remnant
Lol you mean that stupid romance?
sage sequoia
Because he isn't important
Partly yes. but more so how they interact with the ODST group
halcyon remnant
The only ground breakini discoverment they make is to find that engineer
Breaking
sage sequoia
To show us how an ONI member sees other soldiers
sage sequoia
Exactly
sage sequoia
Deserved in most cases
They simply are better then most other soldiers due to their training
halcyon remnant
And they rarely get stuff done
sage sequoia
No?
sage sequoia
They didn't
They aided a bunch of marines in the destruction of important human intelegince preventing the convenant from gaining it.
They SAVED tons of marines in the process
They aided in slowing the invasion force, even if just a little
halcyon remnant
It was a filler game
Lol
Saved a bunch of marines
The only good odsts were on reach
Those guys werw badass
sage sequoia
Like I said, you can dislike that game, thats fine. But give the game some of the merrits it deserves.
For example it set an stunning ambiance
halcyon remnant
They knew they had no chance of winning and still helped the Spartans
Oh yea the ambiance was great
I can give you that
But Reach did a lot better
It was dark
Grim
Seemed hopeless
No matter how good your team was, the covenant was always 5 steps ahead
sage sequoia
In terms of story I think Reach blows all the halo games out of the watter
Except for maybe a odd few missions that game was really something else(in a good sense)
halcyon remnant
It's like the moment they appear, you know you're screwed
sage sequoia
Some of the deaths still feel stupid(Not sure if this part should be moved to #485883236430512168 )
halcyon remnant
They were even hoping that it was rebels and not the covenant
sage sequoia
For example: ||Kat's death makes no sense. A needler rifle one-shot her. While in full armor. If it was a beam rifle it would've been fine, but a needle rifle, cmon||
halcyon remnant
I don't know if you notice but in Reach the marines don't make jokes
Like in previous halo games
sage sequoia
They do with cowbell on 😛
halcyon remnant
She had her shields off
sage sequoia
Like I get that, thats the ONLY way it makes sense, but honestly why would she have them off?
halcyon remnant
Because her armour wasn't properly strapped in
sage sequoia
They are headed into battle once more, in area they know is dangerous
sage sequoia
Seems to me like the most stupid mistake any spartan makes in all of the lore I have seen
halcyon remnant
She was stressed
It was her first glassing
She says it
And the same time she was looking for the bunker to hide
She had a lot on her shoulders
Plus Jorge just had died
halcyon remnant
And she was seeing reach fall
She had little to no hope
Pretty sure all of Noble team knew what was going to happen
sage sequoia
They all would figure it out sooner or later
halcyon remnant
And were thinking of the best they could do in the meantime
sage sequoia
The only one thinking they may win was Jorge
halcyon remnant
Yea
They thought it was a recon carrier or something
And then nope
It's a full scale invasion
How many carriers were on Reach invasion
sage sequoia
Enough
halcyon remnant
Found it
315 ships
UNSC had 100 to 152 and 20 ODPS
They managed to bring 250 covenant ships down
versed helm
How does slipspace work?
versed helm
I wonder what would happen if Tyranids were in the Halo universe
versed helm
Space Hulk with Spartans would be interesting
versed helm
I feel like the UNSC would try to mass produce Spartans in order to try and counter the tyranid threat
im curious though
Basically the UNSC would go full Defcon 1 and triple their strength
Master Chief vs RE enemies
like....spartan vs Tyrant
how would that go down
Necrons vs Forerunners
Chief vs Nemesis would be even better
strong sage
I read in debates that uhh war on heaven necrom wons but the current necrons forerunner can win
versed helm
I think it'll be pretty even since they're both pretty similar
I honestly think there's more living forerunners than just the Didact.
How screwed would everyone be if the forerunners somehow returned to full strength?
halcyon remnant
Precursors would destroy everything
carmine sleet
They didn't bring up the Precursors. They were talking about if the Forerunners suddenly return
versed helm
I'd like to see a Precursor in Halo Infinite
that'd be.....rather difficult
considering they all fled the galaxy and then turned themselves into a DNA-Recombinant Species we know as the Flood
So the forerunners returning are more likely?
more likely than the precursors, that's for sure
but i dont think there's any forerunner left overall, even outside of the galaxy
but that's me personally
it could be possible to see precursors in terminals though
we could have a visualization
versed helm
I have a theory that some shield worlds have some forerunners that still inhabit them. The Didact was awoken by the Chief after messing with their technology
versed helm
Kinda like Necron tomb worlds from Warhammer 40,000
That's my theory
didact (plural didacts)
a didactic person
a person gifted, trained, or intending to instruct``` @halcyon remnantAren't there some Forerunners other than the Didact somewhere?
versed helm
I've been saying that for years
Personally I think it'll be awesome if they returned and went full on crusade mode, waging a war against the entire galaxy
The Banished and whatever's left of the Covenant would go down pretty quickly, so it would be humanity vs the forerunners and Flood
versed helm
If the forerunners returned in full strength then it would most likely be the last game in the series
vivid dust
They'll never return in full strength though
the war with the Flood made sure of that
versed helm
I'd like to see the precursors return
versed helm
What do you guys think of a forerunner faction similar to the Banished possibly becoming a threat?
it would have to be forerunners
not prometheans
at least not in their current state
Prometheans would be controlled by them
i'd like to actually fight forerunner warriors
maybe using lower grade tech due to their civilization collapsing 100,000 years ago
versed helm
I'd like to see a Halo game that takes place in Andromeda
obsidian thistle
I'd like to see a post-2610 universe.
versed helm
That'd be interesting. Maybe the 2630s possibly
Chief would likely be dead by then and a huge monument would be built in memory of him
Or do Spartans live incredibly long lives?
carmine sleet
Well, they've yet to have a Spartan die of old age so we don't know how long they'll live
Also, I have an idea for Andromeda within the Halo Universe which has been on the backburner for a while now. I should really continue working on it when I have more free time
versed helm
I could see the lore going as far as the year 3000
By then humanity would reach the same technological level as the forerunners
robust osprey
When did the human covenant war start?
gilded mason
2525
robust osprey
It’s not 2552?
gilded mason
That is when it ended.
robust osprey
Ok
When did halo 5 take place
I never knew the covenant collapsed
Was this when we killed the prophets?
gilded mason
When did halo 5 take place
2558
Was this when we killed the prophets?
The battle on the Ark in Halo 3, yes.
robust osprey
Ok thx
spiral jewel
@carmine sleet I'm just hoping we as Halo fans get to see the Infinity crew and the Swords of Sangheilos celebrate John-117's 100th birthday.
odd nexus
so whats with the covenant species having such thicc necks now?
seems like a common feature in elites jackals and grunts
mint thorn
Thicc
quasi ferry
Don't you mean thiccs change?
paper lava
It's really weird. I like the new Forerunner look but the UNSC looks waaay more fantasy for five years. Guess they're that good at reverse engineering.
quasi ferry
I hate the UNSC Marine armor in Halo 4-5, the bulky white stuff
Looks like it's made out of Styrofoam
versed helm
Look again.
it looks like soft body armour.
As in, real ballistic armour.
The plating I won't comment on, though Halo 4 has an odd way of rendering metal. I find, at least.
The colouring I also won't comment on 😛
Never forsake olive drab.
carmine sleet
I mean, the colour of the armour was never an issue for me, nor was the new design. It showed humanity was progressing from their older armour
Plus, having different camo for different environments is a logical decision for them as well
odd nexus
i thought it was neat how in Reach the marines could be seen with brownish plating over the green articles, kind of resembling the original depiction in Halo CE
remote spruce
There are like 5 marine variants in Halo 4
The most common one seen should have not been the most common one
odd nexus
i think the white marines look okay on a spaceship. it looks like a spacesuit
it seems like starting with Reach they became a little pugdier
versed helm
some of the marines in reach were actually from the army
Most of em were.
The only marines - which you can identify by dark grey urban pattern utilities and dark brown plating - pop up in Long Night of Solace cutscenes and the last level.
Well, strictly speaking, the ones from LNoS could have been from another branch, we only know for sure the ones from the last level are marines from their ranks you can see when they join your fireteam.
paper lava
It makes sense for you to see Marines from the ship around soon after the crash. They wouldn't have time to change their clothing.
odd nexus
i dont really understand how any of this works or what the difference between marine and army means in the context of halo
versed helm
army is ground based warfare in human space and marine are an expeditionary force that work alongside the navy
versed helm
The army works with the air force right?
fair hazel
army and air force tend to usually be more defensive
odd nexus
do we ever see non-marine soldiers in the games other than spartans?
fair hazel
yes...
versed helm
In Reach
You see Airforce and Army
Airforce have blue uniforms
Army are the soldiers you see most.
and considering the air force handles the orbital platforms wouldn’t they have a ton of army soldiers on them
It works just like it does with the US military today, if you're confused.
in halo 2 we see air force and marines
idk if we actually saw any army
Army forces were heavily involved in the battle of New Mombasa
Palace Hotel tells us
But we don't see them in-game.
Though Chief canonically saw the remains of a mechanized unit during the mission with the Scarab. Metropolis?
Imagine if the CIS invaded Reach
Palace Hotel is a story in Halo Evolutions.
the halo 3 co-op elites are canon right?
gilded mason
Yes.
versed helm
2nd volume if you get the split version.
It'll be UNSC ground forces vs battle droids, super battle droids, and droidekas
Just FYI
odd nexus
was it marines who were with us on the orbital and came with us to New Mombasa, and comprising the soldiers we saw on the ground?
versed helm
Yes, in-game, marines all the way through.
as far as i know the army first showed up in reach and halo wars
The invasion force would be similar in size to the one that invaded Naboo
I don't believe the Army are in Halo Wars.
Their first mention was Ghosts of Onyx.
odd nexus
is army just military might local to a planet and is apart from anything in the sky?
versed helm
More or less, though they have some Airborne units.
remote spruce
I thought the Sabre pilots were from the Air Force?
versed helm
Here, @odd nexus I'll read you out the exact differences in purpose from the Spartan Field Manual if you want.
odd nexus
sure
versed helm
aren’t all pilots from the air force, frigates piloted by the navy, and staffed by marines?
The Marine Corps are responsible for;
- Maintaining an expeditionary force-in-readiness which can seize and defend terrestrial and extra-terrestrial strategic locales in advance of the main UNSC effort.
- Enforcement of emergency military law in designated crisis areas.
- The development of doctrine, procedures and equipment of common interest to the Army and Navy.
- Furnishing security teams for the protection of UNSC property and high-value personnel.
- Deployment of security detachments and organizations for service on Navy ships.
- Development of doctrine, tactics, techniques and equipment for the rapid deployment and utilization of interstellar combat power.
The Army are responsible for;
- The defence of UEG terrestrial holdings and the occupation of enemy territories.
- Conducting civial works that have strategic application, including projects for improvement of navigation and follow-on terraforming.
- Development of doctrine, procedures, and equipment that are of common interest to the Air Force and Marine Corps.
- Organization and training of civil defence units ("militias") - (side point not from the text, the UNSC Marine Corps does that too, as seen in Contact Harvest).
- Providing forces for joint aerospace and space operations, in accordance with UNSC doctrines.
@odd nexus if you were interested, that's why both branches exist and what they do.
Because in most of the games you play as a Spartan II, and in others as an ODST or in Halo Wars as an officer aboard a Navy vessel, in-game you see marines a hell of a lot more often than you do members of the Army.
From a theoretical standpoint, one can also make the assumption that because of the pre-eminence of spaceborne forces and the need for interstellar mobility and operations with orbital support, the Marine Corps is also arguably more useful.
odd nexus
i suppose implicitly the ODST would be marines as they deploy from above?
versed helm
They are a special formation within the Marine Corps.
Just like marine raiders today - MARSOC, I think they're called?
So all ODSTs are technically marines.
i mean they belong to the marine corps
mint thorn
As MC once said “not yet”
odd nexus
does the navy still do anything in actual water
remote spruce
yes, though not as much
remote spruce
they have like, some ships
versed helm
They're basically big seaborne drones
odd nexus
im asking about the fake navy from halo world
mint thorn
Oh
versed helm
That fire other drones like the F99 wombat
mint thorn
Fair enough
odd nexus
would airforce be a thing local to planets like the armies?
versed helm
Yes, certainly.
Think of it like this - the Army and Air Force are assigned to protect a planet and the local airspace, even orbit.
The Navy and Marine Corps are fully mobile, and they swing in to provide reinforcements and orbital support when a planet gets hit.
gaunt karma
-casually uses this channel for help with writing-
versed helm
I've heard a theory that the Army and Air Force are part of the UNSCDF - Defence Force - and the Marine Corps and Navy are part of the UNSCEF - Expeditionary Force.
It's fairly compelling, and certain visual retcons to UNSC badges make it work.
Like Cutter's hat used to say UNSCDF, now it just says UNSC.
And he's part of the Navy.
gaunt karma
I like these ideas/observations
remote spruce
hmm there's a H2A Scorpion render that has UNSCDF on it
versed helm
I have seen that.
Have to check the in-game one, though. It's a little different, I think.
If it is - and this is a stretch - Johnson appropriated the scorpion from an Army unit in the city to give to Chief.
remote spruce
right that render is the Blur one, not ingame
versed helm
It makes sense if you think about it.
remote spruce
paper lava
Halo is not known for its continuity.
versed helm
You can imagine the cigar-chompin legend landing on top of the scorpion
Jumping out on the hull of the tank
Being like
"You wanna be a hero, son?"
"Then get out."
gaunt karma
speaking of Johnson, I've always wondered about what the human lifespan is in Halo
versed helm
Clarification is key
Me too.
Johnson is approx 70.
He is also a marine, and as such, has spent a lot of his life cryo frozen.
He was also an ORION candidate, so who knows what that does to a lifespan.
gaunt karma
true
don't Spartan-IV modifications say that they'll keep you in fighting shape well into your 100s or something?
in the Spartan Field Manual
I think
versed helm
I remember something like that in Bad Blood, with Buck wondering if he would stay active to 100
And not really knowing for sure.
gilded mason
I think he was asking a technician, with the latter just shrugging and saying there haven't been any Spartans old enough to see yet.
versed helm
Well, there ya go.
Though personally, I reckon as far as being active goes - for regular humans - I'm not sure.
I think our lifespan is probably significantly longer.
gaunt karma
I imagine it'd be at least longer than irl Earth, right?
versed helm
Gotta be.
gilded mason
You'd think so.
gaunt karma
like, even excluding cryosleep
versed helm
There's already theories about how we could make human beings functionally immortal in the relatively near future.
Which, by the way, would be an interesting addition to the world.
The real one, I mean xD
gaunt karma
pfft
versed helm
as far as we know spartans aren’t immune to alzheimers, dementia, or other kinds of brain damage
Nawww, rip.
FeelsBadMan.
Well, retcons are always a thing xD
remote spruce
cancer is cured tho
versed helm
so spartans would probably die of brain damage/deterioration
I get the feeling UNSC medical lore is getting overhauled at the moment though
After some certain nanomachines, son plot elements in Renegades
who knows maybe alzheimers and dementia have already been cured
remote spruce
Big Maggie was still kicking at like, 90
versed helm
She looked a lot older than she was, apparently.
but if those have been cured humans should be functionally immortal unless they’re killed
Was just reading her HP page.
odd nexus
i dont like nanomachines
fair hazel
what do you mean halo isnt known for its consistency?
gilded mason
Cryo and Orion tho
Yeah, that
agile lotus
Not everything has been 100% consistent, but at least we have had some recurring plot threads be coherent.
Have any of the games contradicted themselves?
versed helm
Halo has some interesting flaws in terms of visual consistency, that I will grant.
halcyon remnant
Like what
versed helm
What Halo has in abundance, however, is conceptual consistency.
agile lotus
coughcoughHalo5Arbitercough
versed helm
No matter how it looks, it always works the same way, fills the same function.
Plays by the same rules.
The phenotype, btw
cyan crag
Master chiefs armor change from 3 to 4, or wait that was nanobots
agile lotus
@halcyon remnant Halo 5 Arbiter is a different subspecies from Halo 3 Arbiter.
versed helm
He should look like he did in H2A's bookending cutscenes.
Instead he looks like an elite from M'dama's homeworld.
agile lotus
Visually.
versed helm
Which I thought was one of Sanghelios' moons.
halcyon remnant
Oh
agile lotus
Didn’t have the resources, supposedly.
halcyon remnant
Maybe there's an explanation for that
agile lotus
Apparently it’s the inverse.
versed helm
It's just not visually canon.
agile lotus
@halcyon remnant There’s no lore implications, they just didn’t have the resources.
halcyon remnant
What resources
versed helm
We just have to pretend Halo 5's arbiter looks like H2A's bookend-cutscene arbiter.
Good question.
Ask 343.
Just like we have to pretend Halo 4's FUD is a... Charon class?
Stalwart?
agile lotus
Time, money, etc.
versed helm
When am I going to remember which is a Charon and which is a Stalwart
agile lotus
@halcyon remnant Basically, 343 says they didn’t have the time to implement two subspecies of Elite.
versed helm
But I know for sure the FUD isn't Strident
versed helm
I guess they didn't want to have to rig a new skeleton for a different elite phenotype that moves and looks different
So they just put the Arbiter's armour on one of their standard elites
gaunt karma
which UNSC Navy ships would probably be the ones for scouting?
halcyon remnant
Frigates
versed helm
Prowlers, Gladius-class corvettes, or any kind of frigate.
gaunt karma
I'm most likely just going to randomly pop in every now and then to ask random questions
and that shall be my presence in this server
Spontaneous Questioner
halcyon remnant
versed helm
Hey, that's fine - but if you want dank lore, you should join the Halopedia server
@gaunt karma
There's a lot of really hardcore lore-buffs there, even if it's a little small.
halcyon remnant
Spoilers tho
gaunt karma
spoilers don't bother me
versed helm
You can find the link on Halopedia's main page
gaunt karma
I'm not saying any :o
halcyon remnant
I'm reading halo cryptum
versed helm
Well good thing we're talking about the UNSC
halcyon remnant
It's getting crazy shenanigans
gaunt karma
also, is there any baking convention to UNSC ships or nah?
versed helm
Also - the Didact is Doctor Halsey
gaunt karma
baking
versed helm
Get spoiled
versed helm
Not really. It's just whatever sounds cool.
So a famous badass or genius' name works well, the name of a place or nation works well too.
It is often related to human history, from my personal observations.
But not always.
gaunt karma
Forward Unto Dawn?
versed helm
Not always xD
gaunt karma
gotcha
weary orbit
love the ship names
gaunt karma
that was a legit question
halcyon remnant
Of all time
gaunt karma
I temporarily settled on a name for a Halberd destroyer called Elena
halcyon remnant
It's gonna be a ship class?
versed helm
That's perfect, I reckon.
weary orbit
well thats how it traditionally works lol
gaunt karma
UNSC Elena, Halberd-class Destroyer
halcyon remnant
Hm
versed helm
Or the Pillar of Autumn II being the lead ship of the Autumn-class.
gaunt karma
I assume I can find the link for the Halopedia discord on the site
gaunt karma
cause I got some weapon timeline checking to do :p
versed helm
Oooh
gaunt karma
the main thing is a certain variant of the SRS99 Series-2 being available specifically in 2550
SRS-99D, which I think is the sniper in Halo 3
versed helm
Huh, that can be a toughie.
There's not a lot of solid lore on what the exact differences even are between the models.
gaunt karma
ye
I looked a bunch on their pages
I just went with it being available, since there doesn't seem to be much difference between them
versed helm
It should be fine.
gaunt karma
from what I can tell anyways
versed helm
I wouldn't go throwing in a postwar model.
weary orbit
reach is what year?
gaunt karma
of course
versed helm
2552
weary orbit
hmm
id assume its available
its a pretty common weapon in reach, even some marines have it no?
gaunt karma
I think there's a few missions with it, ye
weary orbit
so id say some model of it was available 2 years before reach fell
versed helm
Here's my main contribution to the discussion -
All the series 2 variants are roughly 20cm longer than the series 1.
As I understand it.
gaunt karma
hm
weary orbit
series 2 is what halo 2 and 3?
gaunt karma
I'm trying to get all the ones from Halo 3
weary orbit
gotcha
versed helm
Including the classic Halo CE one, the Halo 2 and H2A one and Halo 3.
gaunt karma
which according to lore, most other guns have been before 2550 anyways, so
like M6G Magnum and MA5C Assault Rifle
weary orbit
id yes too
gaunt karma
even the Battle Rifle
remote spruce
Yea, the game they first appear in is not an indication of their first in-lore use
versed helm
^
gaunt karma
ye, I realised that very quickly
remote spruce
Grenade Launcher is like, 2300s or something
weary orbit
if he sr was developed for the UNSC in 2550 or beyond marines probably wouldnt have it yet
versed helm
Also, if you ask me, their in-game capabilities are also probably not representative of what they can do across the lore.
gaunt karma
trying to figure out Covenant weaponry was also pretty fun
versed helm
For example, I'll eat my hat if the MA5C can't receive a 60-round mag.
weary orbit
maybe Jun still would at reach but not marines
versed helm
There is a variable well in that handgrip. There has to be.
gaunt karma
MA5C with 60 mag
remote spruce
oh right the whole "MA5B jams with 60 rounds so the MA5C mag size is decreased"
versed helm
That's Bungie.net canon.
And I am very sceptical of it.
Because it claims the MA5C's barrel has a 1/7 twist, too.
remote spruce
bungie.net canon is best canon
cries when looking at it
versed helm
Which is great for a 7.62x51mm chambered rifle
If you want to hit everything around your target
gaunt karma
there's a lot of times I tend to make the fan decision of dipping a toe into the fanon instead of the canon
oh, the Spartan Laser, that in 2550 or nah?
remote spruce
nah
versed helm
At least 2531.
gaunt karma
for Splaser?
versed helm
Probably a prototype anti-tank weapon dating back to the inception of MJOLNIR.
Right.
gaunt karma
hmm
remote spruce
it's weird, because original lore implied stuff like the BR55 was new
versed helm
Well, First Strike did. but that got revised.
gaunt karma
oh, that reminds me, how long was the Insurrection going before the H-C war?
versed helm
The BR55 was introduced right at the start of the war - Contact Harvest ftw.
Like, huh. My understanding is that there had been stirrings since the early 2400s.
What was that planet the UNSC nuked again?
That happens surprisingly early-on.
gaunt karma
I'm not that well-versed in UNSC history as a whole unfortunately, most of my knowledge is in the Flood
remote spruce
wait why flood lol
gaunt karma
cause I really like the Flood
versed helm
Far Isle got nuked in 2492
fair hazel
Far isle
versed helm
So not that early.
remote spruce
Awakening the Nightmare Flood is awesome
versed helm
Trebuchet was like 2495
remote spruce
anything Halo Wars 2 related is awesome
gaunt karma
I loved that trailer because I just love the horror/creepy feeling to the Flood
versed helm
So for the Insurrection proper, I guess 2490 is a decent start date
gaunt karma
gotcha
versed helm
2480 and before if you want to be safe.
weary orbit
wow i knew nothing of far isle, interesting
gaunt karma
example of another reason why I like the Flood: when you're first playing as the Arbiter in Halo 2 and you enter that room, and Rtas sniffs and says "That stench. I've smelt it before." and the little hint of Flood music in the background
versed helm
Being a fan of the Flood is good.
They are literally Halo's antagonist.
And there is tremendous potential for real cosmic horror there.
gaunt karma
I literally got the Spartan Field Manual purely and specifically for the designator "Corruptor"
gaunt karma
I immediately just imagined the situation of that happening
remote spruce
Flood lore is cool
I still don't know much about Forerunner stuff
inland vessel
Yep Halo 4 Flood
gaunt karma
minding your own business, doing your duties, and then "Corruptor" comes over your comms
weary orbit
this slipped my mind but did UNSC know of the flood before halo ce?
remote spruce
no
versed helm
Spirit of Fire did. Not the UNSC proper.
remote spruce
aside from Spirit of Fire, which never made it back to UNSC space to warn them
gaunt karma
ye
weary orbit
spirit of fire was the rogue spartan team correct?
gaunt karma
Red Team
remote spruce
also RIP those poor marines who got infected at the Ark
inland vessel
And Omega team
gaunt karma
Jerome, Douglas and Adam
versed helm
According to The Flood, Chief had a crazy-ass precognition of the Flood while waking up from cryo on the Pillar of Autumn
unique rune
Red wasn't rogue, just out of contact.
versed helm
But we don't talk about that
weary orbit
oooh
versed helm
So I guess that technically counts xD
fair hazel
K. They were not rogue.
gaunt karma
the marines on the Ark?
fair hazel
No* not k
The Spirit of Fire is a unsc supoort ship. Originally a Phoenix class colony ship.
Retrofitted for combat support
weary orbit
gotcha
remote spruce
One of the Awakening the Nighmare missions shows Flood Scorpions.
fair hazel
Red team embarked on the sport offire and they were lost in action after he events
Flood infected scorpions
gaunt karma
a silly thing that I never noticed was the ships carrying firebases detaching from the Spirit of Fire in the opening cutscene of Halo Wars
remote spruce
It's odd how Red Team have Spirit of Fire emblems when they weren't originally stationed there.
I guess they got them during the whole Shield World conflict
inland vessel
The Flood in Wars 2 can infect all manor of units but it only seems to be core units, with some exceptions
fair hazel
Those are D20 herons. That carry fire bases
unique rune
Come to think of it... I still haven't beaten Halo Wars' campaign on any difficulty.
I should probably do that at some point.
gaunt karma
Halo Wars 1 & 2 are the only Halos I've not completed on Legendary
fair hazel
The herons were later only deployed in certain safer locales
unique rune
I think I tried going through HW2 on Legendary but lost interest about halfway through.
inland vessel
Legendary really mixes things up
gaunt karma
I honestly don't even really want to attempt it
fair hazel
And pelican and condor were used to transport the smaller fire base model and prefabbed structures
versed helm
HW2 is a colossal pain the butt on legendary.
fair hazel
Not that much.
versed helm
Enemy units immediately begin to move away if engaged by their counter.
inland vessel
They behave more aggressively not just with army’s but leader powers to
versed helm
Like, every time.
fair hazel
I handled it.
versed helm
Bloody death beams raining from the sky every 30 seconds.
gaunt karma
a Condor is a post war thing, isn't it?
versed helm
Yeah.
gaunt karma
figured
inland vessel
They first appear in Halo Nightfall
versed helm
It's based on the D79 frame
gaunt karma
ye