eh..
#lore-and-universe
fair hazel
versed helm
I think that's a good use for them TBH
modest marsh
Flashlights have a lot of uses even when night vision is available
feral perch
Yeah, Reach was on to something with the night vision feature
remote spruce
Elite night vision the best
fair hazel
integrated thruster packs is cool honestly
very useful
I wonder how teched up a spartan can be
modest marsh
Namely, Spartans are frequently in zero-light situations where even the most sensitive night vision imagery would be useless
versed helm
Such as using them to not get flung back whenever Spartans kick brutes across a room? @fair hazel
remote spruce
Ah that's true
fair hazel
they can also be used as makeshift small jetpacks
modest marsh
Extravehicular navigation especially
remote spruce
Spartan Slam is great for hijacking
versed helm
They've been used to climb up towards Mammoths
So that's some 30 meter reach they can gain with them
fair hazel
Halo escalation makes use of thruster packs
vague scroll
Halo doesn't even explore the most under appreciated aspect of Spartans...
remote spruce
Reclaimer is an ok mission but the AI ahh
fair hazel
Palmer does a lot
modest marsh
When Chief was on the Dawn for example, those lights would come in handy given the complete lack of ambient light sources
fair hazel
not the jetpack module FYI
vague scroll
Their BCI, brain-computer interface, or Spartan neural lace.
Underappreciated and underexplored.
modest marsh
Silent Storm comes to mind
I think that’s the first time since Nylund very briefly talked about the interface in FoR
remote spruce
Halo 4 but with more ammo
modest marsh
Halo 4 but the Knights are even stronger
remote spruce
Actually it kinda annoys me to see the character carry a weapon in a cutscene that you weren't holding in game
modest marsh
Yes
fair hazel
I'd like to see a Defensive Spartan, with autosentry, portable shield generators, constructor beams and hard light shield emitters
modest marsh
Halo 4 and 5 very much have this problem
versed helm
Funny how no one really brings up one of the most impressive feats to come from Spartans in Silent Storm
Actually, two feats
modest marsh
Because most people don’t have that same degree of fixation on that aspect of fiction
fair hazel
holding on to each other part?
fair hazel
and the second
fair hazel
So remember in halo: fleet battles?
The boarding party mechanic
Where you could bring in a spartan boarding action or ODST at worst?
versed helm
No
fair hazel
the book reminded me of that a lot
versed helm
I'd like to hear it
fair hazel
Do you know what halo fleet battles is?
versed helm
I remember the Reach Datapads saying they were equivalent to 12 ODSTs, but then Troy elucidated with said 12 being part of the Black Daggers instead of just regular ODSTs
versed helm
Denning actually took a lot of info from there to be explained further
Such as the covenant merely glassing a few square kilometers
@remote spruce I liked those, but their radio discipline was kinda cringey though
MW2 had the best writing for radio chatter
junior dome
Are there any living Precursors anywhere? Like actual Precursors not their mutated Flood forms.
vague scroll
No.
junior dome
Not even like a fragment?
vague scroll
Or rather, there is no information at all on that subject.
junior dome
hmmm
remote spruce
Lasky's shotgun is a Precursor
junior dome
what
remote spruce
/s
vague scroll
But seriously, there are no canon answers for you there.
remote spruce
A joke I read a while back
On how Lasky's oneshots a Knight in Spartan Ops
junior dome
Why have the Precursors had so little development?
remote spruce
Mystery or something
vague scroll
Because they're not important.
vague scroll
They've never appeared in any game.
junior dome
they are literally the reason for the games in the first place
so? EU doesn't have to be in game
vague scroll
You don't need Precursors to have Halo.
modest marsh
The precursors themselves aren’t that interesting or important, they’re just a plot device
junior dome
ok, but you can't have Halo without Precursors
vague scroll
...are you kidding me?
junior dome
@modest marsh how do you know they aren't interesting if there is nothing about them?
remote spruce
There was a reason the Forerunner backstory wasn't explained for a long time
gilded mason
I'd like to keep some mystery, at least. The Forerunners were unveiled, so we got Precursors as a new mystery.
modest marsh
The only important precursor is the Primordial, who we already know as the gravemind
remote spruce
Can we get more lore on the UNSC Bison though
vague scroll
Halo's greatest strenth has been exploration and sense of mystery. As soon as you shine a light into any major force regarding space magic aliens, now the mystery is gone.
junior dome
Ok, but mystery implies discovery
vague scroll
It's one of the biggest issues complained about regarding the Forerunner trilogy.
junior dome
On Halo, you DISCOVERED that it wasn't of human or covenant origin
fair hazel
mystery for the sake of mystery is shallow
remote spruce
They probably know as much about the Precursors as we do
So it'll be new lore if they ever expand Precursors
junior dome
Except the Forerunners left evidence of their past literally everywhere throughout the Galaxy, it was mean to be discovered
vague scroll
Better that they don't because it hurts the core values of Halo, the more they reveal.
junior dome
But it also isn't good to have literally nothing about it
It can't be mysterious if all you have is their name
remote spruce
How did Forge get all those Grizzlies, we'll never know
vague scroll
All remaining evidence of the Precursors was destroyed with the Halos firing, they have no footprint. No mystery to explore.
They're just a rabbit hole that goes nowhere.
remote spruce
They made dinobots
junior dome
you need some evidence to have a mystery in the first place
vague scroll
It doesn't exist and that fundamentally is why it can't work because there isn't a sense of mystery.
There isn't anything to explore.
junior dome
I am not talking contemporarily
I am talking in the past
Like the Primordium trilogy but with the Precursors
vague scroll
By defining Halo's "elder gods" you effectively shallow the universe because the highest standards of the series now have defined limits.
quick ridge
This is a fun read 
remote spruce
Precursors but dinos
junior dome
maybe, but that same logic can be applied the other way around
oof
how do we know that they aren't extremely primitive?
vague scroll
We know from the Primordium trilogy that explaining the Forerunners ended up splitting the lore community.
remote spruce
Space dust I assume
junior dome
Space dust?
versed helm
IMHO, The best way of going about Precursors is to just keep showing how you really don't know how powerful they really are
vague scroll
Flood came from Precursor space dust.
remote spruce
Turning themselves into space dust is probably advanced stuff
versed helm
As soon as there's an established limit, it quickly gets contradicted in the canon
Intentionally
vague scroll
That's something inherent to Halo, sad fact.
The Guardians are a good example of that.
junior dome
yes but they were corrupted
junior dome
Unless they intentionally became corrupted to get revenge on the Forerunners
versed helm
Guardians getting nerfed in the very next piece of media they're in
vague scroll
You establish a limit too high or too low and it fundamentally narrows the number of writing options.
remote spruce
Forerunners can build massive structures but their robots get hacked by Anders
gilded mason
Or Halsey can hack a Metarch from a terminal.
junior dome
Why did the Flood not infect Earth in Halo 3?
remote spruce
Plot hole
versed helm
Worse, they can't even decipher the difference between an organism and a hologram lmao
versed helm
Sentinels now have the intelligence of a freaking wombat
vague scroll
If Truth fired Halos, the Flood was screwed either way.
remote spruce
It was changed to High Charity slipspace jumping near Mars
vague scroll
He needed to commit his forces where the fight was.
remote spruce
So they never went to Earth
remote spruce
Not sure if the original intention was that he went to Earth back in 2007
vague scroll
But the Flood is an immortal conscience, a failure is just a failure.
junior dome
Because didn't he know that humanity and the elites were already stopping Truth?
versed helm
Interesting how Bungie really didn't like the idea of there being a cure for the flood
vague scroll
Chief and Arbiter wouldn't have made it in time without the Flood's assistance.
gilded mason
I don't want a cure, either.
junior dome
maybe
remote spruce
I do think the retcon is better tbh
junior dome
but you don't need to bring in all of High Charity for that
feral perch
Actually, I disagree. I think that his forces were numerous enough that he could certainly have spread the infection via ship to numerous worlds. That would have been smarter tactically. An infection on Luna, Mars, etc... and send a ship or two into deepspace as a last resort
remote spruce
Send a phantom to earth /s
vague scroll
An outright cure kind of destroy the fear factor of the flood.
feral perch
I bet that there is a cure, but it's a catch 22
vague scroll
Im okay with that.
feral perch
Don't know what kind, but that's probably it
junior dome
High Charity is huge, it has the resources of the entire covenant fleet and he decides to bring it all into the portal
vague scroll
That said, committing forces to Earth or anywhere but the Ark is a tactical mistake.
remote spruce
Johnson immune by chance
Plot twist not really by chance he's just a cool Spartan 1
junior dome
but he did commit forces to Earth
feral perch
Yeah, that's just Bungie trying to neatly wrap everything up in this franchise they were getting bored with @junior dome
junior dome
wdym getting bored with?
vague scroll
Sun Tzu: "Strike where your enemy is not."
remote spruce
Crashing into the Ark is a bad move but I assume the engines decided to oof
feral perch
Bungie never intended for a Halo 3 to happen
junior dome
Well, I have a feeling that Halo Infinite will bring the Flood back in some way. Is it still an accepted theory that Cortana was infected with the logic plague in Halo 2?
vague scroll
Trying to waste time trying to secure biomass that might be wiped clean by the Halos in a matter of moments means he was doomed if he didn't do a last ditch effort.
feral perch
Halo 2 had its own proper ending at one point, scrapped for time
versed helm
I wonder if the Ur Didact made his own superweapon alternative
vague scroll
Logic Plague is the popular one but its not the only one.
remote spruce
Halo 3 is better than ending it at 2 but then some other stuff in 3 I don't like
junior dome
I mean, if Cortana is being controlled by the Gravemind then that storyline isn't finished yet
vague scroll
And there are a lot of people who dislike the Logic Plague theory.
junior dome
Because maybe he used Cortana as a failsafe
remote spruce
Story isn't finished until Moa Burgers cost 7.77 cR again
gilded mason
Cortana being infected would kind of undermine her story of actually getting through her ordeal with the Gravemind.
junior dome
incase his plan failed, Cortana would achieve it anyway in the future
feral perch
I just think that the Gravemind would have had plenty of infected ships. He brought High Charity to the Ark, but sending vessels far, far away in case of failure, and spreading the infection to populated worlds in case of victory, wouldn't have been bad ideas
vague scroll
It strengthens the Cortana arc but defeats itself narratively with the Created one if Cortana is just a Flood puppet.
Because then the Created as an ideological faction has no legs.
junior dome
We'll just have to see what happens
Honestly have no idea where Halo Infinite will go
feral perch
Heheh, Halo: Infinite opens. "Glad we sorted out that Created business, and dealt with the Guardians. Now, on to a brand new storyline!"
vague scroll
@feral perch maybe he did. We do not know.
feral perch
Hm.
gilded mason
First mission is John shanking Cortana.
remote spruce
Y'all need to explain why Gravemind decides to retreat after Johnson takes the Pelican away
vague scroll
But focusing on Earth is a fatal error.
junior dome
I want to see the flood in new graphics though, think that would be cool. It would mean Halo would have to be M rated again which shouldn't be a problem
gilded mason
@remote spruce
There is no reason.
feral perch
So Halo 2: Anniversary
junior dome
that isn't new graphics
vague scroll
Eh. I think 343i liked the T rating.
feral perch
It is
vague scroll
mcc is new...
feral perch
in Anniversary mode
remote spruce
Ok then same reason why Didact doesn't kill Chief the first time he appears
junior dome
Halo 2 was made from the Slipspace Engine?
feral perch
no
feral perch
You said graphics, not gameplay
vague scroll
Still new by contemporary standards.
remote spruce
Can we just have HW2 flood forms tbh
junior dome
I want jackal and grunt flood forms
vague scroll
Not sure I want to fight something that can whip me from across the map...
feral perch
We may not fight Jackals in Infinite
vague scroll
We might not fight a lot of things in Halo Infinite.
remote spruce
Nah there has to be Jackals
Core Covenant appears no matter what because gameplay
junior dome
I want to see Prometheans vs. Flood though
I thought the Covenant died in Halo 5 though
feral perch
Unless they pull Sali 'Nyon's Covenant out of some crevice. That would be silly, though, it would undermine Battle of Sunaion and nullify the celebration of the end of the Covenant
remote spruce
Halo Infinite but it's actually just feeding space deer
gilded mason
Unless they pull Sali 'Nyon's Covenant out of some crevice. That would be silly, though, it would undermine Battle of Sunaion and nullify the celebration of the end of the Covenant
So you're saying they're gonna do it.
junior dome
Honestly don't see anyone but the Banished returning
feral perch
No!
junior dome
The Banished would work for the covenant's replacement
I mean, their story isn't finished
gilded mason
Banished is unappealing.
feral perch
There's the Keepers of the One Freedom and the Servants of the Abiding Truth. Plus, endless Prometheans.
remote spruce
Banished should stay in RTS because I don't want to get blasted by 24 Reavers in first person
feral perch
Nothing confirmed.
junior dome
Banished + Flood + Prometheans. Honestly wouldn't be mad
It also means the return of Brute weapons
vague scroll
Too much speculation, too much wishing without realistic expectations...
vague scroll
We technically have had brute weapons - given the hammer never left
And we have the Brute Plasma Rifle in game.
remote spruce
I expect core Covies and maybe Prometheans, from a pure gameplay decision
junior dome
yes, but weapons like the spiker, brute shot, and mauler can come back finally
I would love a forge mode with every weapon from every game
that sandbox would be amazing
the creative potential would be off the charts
remote spruce
Spiker is eh
The other ones are good
junior dome
Like the return of the concussion rifle, sticky det, and the plasma launcher to name a few
they don't have to be in campaign or multiplayer, but for them to be available in custom games and forge would be cool
remote spruce
Halo 2 Magnum kek
junior dome
no not like different versions, just different weapons
vague scroll
Im going to be that person that forces realistic expectations into things... but that's a development nightmare.
junior dome
maybe for balancing
vague scroll
Definitely for balancing
remote spruce
Banished minus mechs is no Banished at all
junior dome
but its forge, balance is irrelevant in forge and customs
vague scroll
But also for designing art assets, sound, particle effects, testing, etc.
remote spruce
Sound tbf can be reused
Everything else will have to be remade
junior dome
yes, but I remember them using previous assets in newer games, like they used the model for the plasma launcher in Halo 5 WZFF
vague scroll
Halo in Bungie's time intended every weapon to sound uniquely distinct.
remote spruce
Did that plasma launcher shoot plasma grenades?
junior dome
yes
vague scroll
Halo under 343i admittingly doesn't do the exact same thing but it was close.
junior dome
oh forgot about the focus rifle and the needle rifle
I miss the needle rifle tbh
I think it was pretty good
vague scroll
OP
remote spruce
New sounds are unique but due to the origin of the sounds they sound less distinct
vague scroll
Because they intended to go more realistic
junior dome
what if they added all previous vehicles as well lol
vague scroll
NIGHTMARE
junior dome
like the prowler and chopper
remote spruce
Where my Wolverine at
junior dome
the falcon, hornet, and wasp all in one game
vague scroll
This isn't even about lore anymore...
remote spruce
Rhinos should have been post war tbh
junior dome
Hmm, the wasp is a VTOL aerial vehicle utiliized by the UNSC. good enough?
remote spruce
Yes it is VTOL
junior dome
the revenant as well
vague scroll
Gravatonic vehicle technically
junior dome
no I mean I want the revenant back as well
vague scroll
Fair.
junior dome
is there a canon reason why we don't see these vehicles in every game?
vague scroll
Balance primarily.
junior dome
like, wouldn't have there been revenants in Halo CE since it took place right after Reach?
vague scroll
And making an easier work load on the studio being the other.
junior dome
that isn't a canon reason
remote spruce
In universe reasoning is probably made up in like 5 minutes
junior dome
there is obviously gameplay reasons
vague scroll
The canon reason is simply, not everything seen or unseen was at or not present at that event.
There is like 5 different renditions of Halo CE that are all technically canon.
They all happened and didn't happen at the same time.
remote spruce
Sniper variants confuse me with the names
vague scroll
They're there to look cool. Unless you mean the SRS99 family?
vague scroll
They're each a build on the last or a modification.
Series 2-C and Series 2-C B are of the same design but one came after as a evolutionary mod.
remote spruce
So do the Anniversary designs replace them?
vague scroll
Kind of like M16 went to A1 through A4.
Eh. Let's just say both games are lore accurate, pick your poison.
Though Anniversary, like a book edit, its more up to date.
remote spruce
Yeah but Anniversary games use the Reach design so things get more muddled
versed helm
The whole idea of there being an MA5B framework that perfectly replicates an MA5C is ridiculous
If the only difference is magazine capacity, then what's the point of having so many different variants?
modest marsh
The MA5C is supposed to be a more consistently reliable weapon
The high ammo capacity for the B came at the cost of occasional jamming
remote spruce
Which is shenanigans tbh but hey maybe it was cheaply made
hasty geyser
It's always nanomachines
remote spruce
Me don't like
modest marsh
Yeah, it’s silly
The M6C downgrade is defensible
Well, from a gameplay perspective it’s silly
More than 4 times weaker
hasty geyser
Everything was meatier in CE
modest marsh
But like, it still works well enough for its role
versed helm
Shooting Elites to pieces with an M6D, or Doom-ing them with the M90 lol
tulip folio
Name:N/A
Nicknames/Alias: Noble 6, Six, Lieutenant
Gender: Male
Species/Race: Human
Eye Color: Unknown
Height: 6 Foot 9
Weight: 220 (Estimation)
Weight(in armor): 900 (As he is using Mojnir II)
Birth Place: Unknown
Faction: UNSC
Branch: Spartan IIIs
Noble team
Headhunter (Former(
Rank: Lieutenant
Armament: Hyperlethal Vector.
Personality: Calm in the most serious situations. Six is a more lone wolf type and generally keeps to himself
Strengths: Hyperlethal Vector
Weaknesses: Anti Social. Lone wolf
Backstory:
Noble Six, the team's most recent addition. My my, so much black ink. Six has made entire militia groups disappear. Curious... 'hyper-lethal.' There's only one other Spartan with that rating...
SPARTAN-B312 was taken out of Beta Company immediately after training, according to a communiqué from Kurt Ambrose to Franklin Mendez that was sent in May 2545, two months before Operation: TORPEDO.
Over the course of B312's career, the SPARTAN gained a high reputation as an efficient lone-wolf assassin, having single-handedly broken organizations and made entire militia groups disappear. At one point, B312's superior allegedly used the SPARTAN as "his own private grim reaper," and because of this, he was reluctant to have the Spartan assigned to Noble Team. On July 24, 2552, SPARTAN-B312 was assigned to Noble Team as a replacement for its previous sixth member, Thom-A293
There kaboom
I tried not the best but it still good
tulip folio
Oh great
I have more !!!!
Name: Lod Mron aka Prophet of Regret
Nickname: Fluffles
Faction: Covenant
Rank: High Prophet
Species: San'Shyuum
Gender: Male
Birthplace: High Charity
Height: 7'2
Weapons: Type-25 Directed Energy Pistol (Plasma Pistol), Gravity cannon (On Throne)
Vehicle: Gravity throne
Bio: Was the youngest of the three High Prophets that lead the Covenant High Council during the Human-Covenant war. Rash, ambitious, immature, and naive compared to the other Prophets, Regret originally served as Vice Minister of Tranquility, where he worked frequently with Sangheili and had adopted some of their personal traits, such as a preoccupation with honor and personal arms. However, he also exhibited traits of alcoholism and smoking. Still, Regret was intelligent and fiercely opposed to Humanity throughout the course of the Great War and expected his soldiers to obey him without question.
Ah no one in here
vivid dust
nice nickname
full forge
To the Covenant uglies that might be listening, you have a few seconds to pray to your damned heathen gods. You all have a nice day in hell.
vivid dust
Withcomb was it?
haughty bridge
Im guessing ur good at role playing @tulip folio
Judging by the details
Im actually writing a book
hasty geyser
What do I need to read/play/watch to get the best possible understanding of the flood
narrow wadi
Forerunner Trilogy, The Flood (So alps Fall of Reach as supplemental material( and probably a variety of other things which I’m not aware of
obsidian thistle
Halo Wars 2s Awakening the Nightmare has a lot of Flood lore
remote spruce
Yeah there's a video of the ATN Flood lore
tulip folio
@haughty bridge not really good at role playing but good at getting all that in one
ripe shard
hello
haughty bridge
The flood are the remains of precursors
Who were pretty much gods in the halo universe
haughty bridge
Forerunners battled the precursors
And won
But the precursors put their remains in vials on a ship
And sent that ship
hasty geyser
There a video you recommend for a good explanation of what ATN brings to the table? @obsidian thistle
remote spruce
@hasty geyser https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yj_mYIV-CKU
severe elbow
Someone help jog my memory? What was Blue Team's reaction to finding out the Master Chief was considered dead in Glasslands?
vague scroll
I don't even remember if it was addressed.
Halsey was kind of the star of that whole post-op shakedown with Parangosky.
severe elbow
Yeah, I'm either forgetting what was said or can't remember what isn't there.
I don't have my copy on hand.
remote spruce
they were kinda saddened and shocked because they expected John to survive out of all of them
gilded mason
Halsey’s stomach plummeted. Her first reaction was to look at Fred, Kelly, and Linda.
He’s gone. He made it through the whole war, and then—he’s gone. Right at the end. It’s not fair. Fred just shook his head. Linda and Kelly stood frozen.```
```Kelly and Linda had taken off their helmets and their expressions were completely transparent. Like Fred, the news about John had hit them hard. Halsey could see it from the way the two women stood with their eyes fixed on the ground.```@gilded mason Thanks.
gilded mason
👍
full forge
@vivid dust A-firm.
narrow wadi
I still find it really surreal now, as I read First Strike, to hear about Engineers
Years before their in-game debut
It was less surreal in Fall, because they were a one-off appearance, but in First Strike, they’re given a way bigger role, at least from what I’ve read
severe elbow
They were.
They were also in The Flood.
I'm glad they didn't just discard them from the canon just because Bungie ended up not using them in Halo 1.
narrow wadi
Oh, I agree, it’s just always a little weird
After ODST, appearances by them make way more sense to me
severe elbow
To be technical, their first in-game appearance is in Halo Wars.
But yeah, ODST putting them forefront in its narrative helped solidify them.
narrow wadi
No, I mean in order of IRL releases
severe elbow
Halo Wars released before ODST.
narrow wadi
They were chronologically in the canon with Wars, but it’s a little weird to know they were planned over half a decade before they actually made it into a game
Same year, but even then, point applies
Half a decade
wispy bough
I try to
narrow wadi
Reach almost certainly had them put in more because “we want every Covenant enemy to date in this” than anything else
Brutes, Elites, Jackals, Skirmishers, Hunters, Grunts, and even Drones feel like they’re there for a good reason.
Engineers were more “we might as well complete the set@
They’re fun to fight but do kinda feel like an afterthoughts
remote spruce
TBH drones felt like they were thrown in too though I think that's a good thing
shrewd trout
Drones barely make any appearances in Reach
feral perch
They're not in Firefight, which is disappointing
shrewd trout
though this is more of a gameplay thing than a canon thing so I won't ramble on
that was also odd
feral perch
But they are in Ivory Tower in New Alexandria, and in the caves in Pillar of Autumn
Also I think they're in Tip of the Spear
versed helm
What happens to the engineer from ODST??
gilded mason
He and Sadie go on missions together, I believe.
severe elbow
Continues to work for the UNSC with Sadie as his handler.
Gets kidnapped by the United Rebel Front, but is rescued by Alpha-Nine in spite of Mickey's betrayal of them. During the Created crisis, he and Sadie are recovered from the moon by Dare, Buck, and Romeo and they take him to free Mickey to have him convince a United Rebel Front colony called the Hole in the Wall to let them in to examine Forerunner tech on the planet that lets them hide from the Created.
Currently he's on the Infinity.
narrow wadi
Sadie’s the girl from the ODST audio logs, isn’t she?
The one Vigil really liked?
I’m just checking to be sure.
carmine sleet
That is correct @narrow wadi
narrow wadi
That’s honestly really cute.
Plus, Virgil in general is just super cute. Like you wouldn’t expect it, looking at Engineers, but they seriously are cute
vivid dust
So Sadie is on the Infinity as well?
last anchor
And now Vergil has a bunch of other Huragok buddies to do engineering things with
limpid kernel
Vergil 💜
versed helm
Wait
So there’s more than one on the ship as well, crazy
Aren’t those things just supercomputers created by the forerunners ?
gilded mason
Yeah. Though they do also seem to have feelings.
versed helm
Yeah Virgil has a personality
narrow wadi
They’re sentient supercomputers basically built into a body that’s impossible to infect by the Flood
Spores won’t work and any other form of infection would just pop them like balloons instead
limpid kernel
i didnt know they were made by forerunners
narrow wadi
Yep, one of the last creations of them during the Forerunner-Flood war
They survived the rings’ firing because they have no central nervous system, so there was nothing for the rings to destroy
unique rune
I mean it also helps that they aren't actually biological.
narrow wadi
No, it’s the fact that they have no nervous system that they lived
The rings kill by destroying the central nervous system of whatever it hits, thereby rendering them useless to the Flood for infection
Huragok have no nervous system because they were made and not evolved, therefore, didn’t die
spiral jewel
In theory, Huragoks are basically super computer versions of placozoa , but with arms and float.
Placozoa being animals without a central nervous system
last anchor
They're not even actually biological either
They're bio-mimetic circutry
Theoretically if you kill one, another can rebuild it from the remnants
spiral jewel
@versed helm something Transformers isn't a stranger to, with the Beast Wars and a few characters in Animated
shrewd trout
They do bleed
versed helm
I wish there was more lore about the Neural Lace. It surely has to do more than just prevent friendly-fire, even at it's base
I was thinking some marines may even have an integrated HUD without any need for a helmet visor or eyepiece
Also, I wonder if ODSTs and Marines receive mild augmentations in tandem with their lace surgery. I was imagining things like a higher resistance to sonic booms and muzzle flash etc
vague scroll
What about hacking the neural lace? Transfering of memories and external storage? What about brain mods? Dream modifiers? Instant messaging with neural lace? Always jacked in?
haughty bridge
Gen 1 is beast
vague scroll
All things that could be explored but we'll likely not see since that part of lore is a bit too much cyberpunk for Halo.
@versed helm
Also, only officers get neural laces. Regular troops and personnel don't have them.
Though you probably would see a lot of civilian knock offs as a head canon.
versed helm
Well, we already know that the lace is stimulated to make War Games simulations more realistic, so that's a step in that direction
vague scroll
For S-IVs anyway
versed helm
Are you sure NCO's don't have them?
vague scroll
All Spartans get a lace but regular guys do not.
Pretty sure
At least its never been addressed.
versed helm
It's essential to prevent friendly fire. It's why the reticle goes green over them
vague scroll
Lore only specifies for officers because Hood had one at the back of his skull.
And thus the whole concept was given visual confirmation in Halo 2.
remote spruce
but the rats in halo 3 have neural interfaces then?
versed helm
Yep lol
remote spruce
UNSC spies
versed helm
@vague scroll that's a command neural interface. They are more advanced, so they are seen externally
Also, I thought it was interesting how ODSTs had AI connected to their MA5s to improve accuracy.
modest marsh
I think it would be reaching to suggest common infantry get such an invasive procedure for something so unnecessary
haughty bridge
Theres was a mission in halo 4
modest marsh
That would diminish the individual skill of the operator though
haughty bridge
Were ur in a command centre or something
vague scroll
They have something called a "neural chip" for all regular personnel that just seems to be a Friend or Foe and general diagnostic tool.
haughty bridge
And i just shot one uncs troop
modest marsh
I like marines being mostly analog
modest marsh
IFF tags yeah
vague scroll
You deserved it.
modest marsh
Even Master Chief isn’t immune to mutiny protocols
vague scroll
That said, I stand by what I said earlier, Halo has room to benefit from tropes and ideas pulled from Ghost in the Shell and Cyberpunk with the neural laces but don't expect them any time soon.
modest marsh
I don’t want marines getting nanotech AI brains
versed helm
Wait, can't Commanders communicate with one another as well as AI with their laces?
vague scroll
Hacking, external memory, brain modifiers, brain viruses, the machine-human duality, etc.
vague scroll
To have an always open connection is a massive security risk @versed helm
modest marsh
Also yeah, not too keen on having information transferral straight through the neural interface
versed helm
Okay. Cool? That's not what I was wondering though
What I'm thinking is
Doesn't that make Cutter somewhat telepathic to certain personnel?
modest marsh
No
vague scroll
Not at all.
versed helm
Why not?
vague scroll
If that were the case we would have seen some degree of that in the lore.
modest marsh
Cutter is depicted as personally commanding his troops through comm transmissions
As are all UNSC officers
versed helm
Because they don't have command laces. But couldn't he do it with other commanders?
versed helm
I don't see why they wouldn't
vague scroll
Spartans can't even talk telepathically.
versed helm
They could easily do both
modest marsh
Because that’s not what the technology is for narratively
vague scroll
And they have by far the nost invasive form of neural link.
If its not in the lore, its a headcanon.
versed helm
Shouldn't John be able to communicate with Cortana telepathically during HCE-4?
modest marsh
It’s much more complex than that
And for that matter
He still verbally communicates
vague scroll
John and Cortana can only communicate in the brain by their helmet connection. Its still an external connection too.
They only can see and access each other's thoughts through the interface.
So Cortana will often tap Chief's memories for example.
versed helm
I wish we got to see Cortana actually be useful in combat with John like she was in TFoR
modest marsh
Cortana has direct access to his brain
vague scroll
Look IM telepathy is likely possible in Halo its just not practical.
modest marsh
There’s also concerns such as the sheer volume of data involved with telepathic communication
vague scroll
I have a couple Spartans in my fanfics that I want to do something similar with their neural links due to their relationship but at the end of the day, its fanfiction. Not canon.
versed helm
Didn't Smoke and Shadow or something have telepathic Mgalekgolo?
vague scroll
That's standard to Mgalekgolo because of their status as worm colonies.
Its not really telepathy.
versed helm
Yeah, but it was to a human
vague scroll
You forget Lekegolo have a talent for interfacing with other species and machinery.
versed helm
Without touching them?
vague scroll
Eh. That is hard for me to say since I haven't read SoS but I'm at least aware their species is known for something like telepathy. But it sure isn't psychic.
versed helm
Either way, Halo isn't free of any fantasy themes. There's no way you can say the Flood isn't so with their blatant telepathy, telekinesis, and star roads. They even say it's sourced from fundamental energies permeating the cosmos; you just can't quiver around that
versed helm
Especially from the glimpse of the Primordial in Mythos. I was just thinking "oh, come on now"
He's just floating in the air like a Z fighter lmao
vague scroll
Halo isn't free from magic elements but its concept follows the same ruled applied to Marvel Asgardians, that technology is so advanced its like magic. Only Forerunner-era tech achieves this, everything else is fairly in line with some degree of grounding.
versed helm
In that case, the Precursos are more like MCU Dr Strange in their reality warping
inter dimensional beings
I like to relate them to the ones in interstellar
vague scroll
More than that, more like far and beyond even Thanos.
Yeah. Interstellar might be better.
versed helm
Oh, I wasn't talking power - just swagger
Is there supposed to be a similar visual design between precursors and the flood?
I think they look similar
vague scroll
Eh. Precursors lack that. By all means, they likely let the Forerunners kill them because they were curious why the Forerunners were upset and were curious what death actually feels like.
versed helm
I mean the flood looking a lot more carnal
vague scroll
Omnipotence to the extreme.
versed helm
I also wonder did precursors use technology or had they surpassed “conventional” methods... like did they just teleport\fly everywhere?
Like ET tip of my finger type stuff
vague scroll
Idk
haughty bridge
The precursors gave humans the mantle of responsibility
But forerunners got pissed off
And then yeeted the precursors to death
unique rune
versed helm
Yeah, I think the Precursors are intended to be omnipotents. There seems to be a lot of hints towards it as @vague scroll has pointed out
modest marsh
A true omnipotent isn’t divided among an entire civilization
Nor do they lack foresight
versed helm
@modest marsh that sounds like it would just be boring. I believe they intentionally limit themselves. It's like playing a game to them
Also, a true omnipotent wouldn't have any desire to get revenge on anything, either - they already have all the power they need. The only "revenge" that a Precursor may deem "necessary" is likely nothing at all comparable to how we interpret said emotion
hasty geyser
The precursors were not omnipotent in any way shape or form
They were able to manipulate life on a cosmic scale, are older than the universe by roughly 90 billion years, and able to create technology made from living thought
But nowhere close to being omnipotent
versed helm
@hasty geyser don't be so quick to assume that. Their age of a hundred billion years could easily just be how long they've presented their physicality in a particular way, and they've been written very carefully as to not bleed any established limits
As with how Flood have been implied to simply ignore certain biomass, despite them supposedly being "desperate". If that's not telling of a general held-back consensus, then jeez
hasty geyser
If the precursors were omnipotent it would be a complete impossibility for the forerunners to have driven them to near extinction
versed helm
That's a very lukewarm example. The impression given off from that whole segment and the Primordial's input seemed very much like they let them.
versed helm
Lore
normal zinc
Question for the loremongers! What ships made up Battlegroup Leviathan, and how long/when was it established?
vague scroll
Paris frigates, Marathon cruisers and a Epoch carrier. The lore behind when it was formed is unknown.
There are more ships but the ones I listed were from the Fleet Battles board game.
versed helm
You know,i wonder if the sarcophagus that was built around that unknown alien vessel that crash landed on Installation 04 survived the destruction of Alpha Halo
vague scroll
It likely did not.
The structural integrity of even the basic shards of Alpha Halo were miraculous. It's possible but slim chance.
versed helm
Lets just say that sarcophagus survived and we somehow discover it,what would we expect to find
vague scroll
a rusted shell of what might have at one time been a starship.
everything on the inside has been destroyed, exposed to the elements, or burnt after being exposed to the vacuum of space
versed helm
We're still not sure where that ship came from or better yet,who built it
vague scroll
It was me, Dio!
versed helm
Correct me if i'm wrong but wasn't there something that said that the ship could've been GS's imagination because he holding back rampancy?
vague scroll
Not really. He lamented some of the design choices made by Forerunners in terms of their Conservation protocols, however, delusions were not really addressed.
obsidian thistle
Its also possible the ship was removed during the time between that terminals and Halo CE
Seeing as Aliens did visit I04 and leave
versed helm
Watching those CEA terminals,i feel very sorry for GS
versed helm
Being all alone on that one Halo Installation for 100k years without any contact with any other lifeforms can really make anyone go insane,even an advanced Forerunner ancilla
How the hell was he able to endure being all alone for that long?
obsidian thistle
No wonder he randomly mistook John and Cortana as the Didact at times lol. Rampancy took hold of a a similarity and ran with it
versed helm
I wonder if GS was always rampant but he concealing it
And only revealed it when he killed Johnson...RIP Johnson
obsidian thistle
Who says he knew he was rampant.
versed helm
But then there's the Jacob Keyes terminal,not gonna lie,but i cried on the inside when he died
obsidian thistle
That terminal fits nicely with Halo: The Flood
versed helm
Yep..that man is unbreakable
limpid kernel
Chief's Bizarre Journey: Keyes is Unbreakable
versed helm
Remind me..where was Keyes born?
wispy bough
Earth
versed helm
Alright..but i'm wondering where on Earth
wispy bough
Best we have is that he spent his early childhood near the Pacific Ocean
versed helm
So somewhere on the West Coast of North America?
brittle gorge
Weird question. Do we know if Mtn Dew still exists in the halo universe?
vague scroll
It's not been established whether its canon or not.
That said, I'd love to canonize Mountain Dew for the s and giggles.
https://www.halopedia.org/Halo_4_:_King_of_the_Hill_Fueled_by_Mountain_Dew
Halopedia never forgets.
vague scroll
:3
brittle gorge
So it is?
vague scroll
It's not canon.
brittle gorge
Aw
vague scroll
It's just cataloged.
versed helm
I wonder if Microsoft itself still exist in the Halo universe
brittle gorge
So, are we allowed to post pics in this channel, or should i send the pic to you CIA391 for you to post?
brittle gorge
I have a discord screenshot.
Imma get a private link from imgur and post it here
It's the reason why I asked if MTN Dew is canon
vague scroll
Halopedia has a policy not to catagorize Discord as canon sources.
brittle gorge
versed helm
Not gonna lie but Henry Glassman reminds me of Bill Gates for some reason
brittle gorge
No, it's not a canon source or anything
obsidian thistle
I'll look into the only 2004 and 2007 sourcable stuff we can for Mountain Dew
versed helm
Remind me,don't some Earth nations still exist
vague scroll
Yes
United Republic of North America is a good example of a Halo-exclusive nation.
It was born from the unification of Mexico, Canada, and the "political fragments" of the old United States.
remote spruce
Something about Czech too
versed helm
I wonder...what really happened to the U.S in the Halo universe if they said that the URNA is Canada,Mexico,and the "political remnants of the U.S" unified into one country
vague scroll
There are some hints at a Second US Civil War but its up to interpretation.
The status of the URNA as a nation or a confederacy or if the US or American micro states are still a thing are still up in the air.
versed helm
IIRC...doesn't the European Union still exist in the Halo universe
vague scroll
idk
grizzled marsh
I believe the EU is still active in some form in the Halo universe. Though who exactly is a member state, and how it conducts itself are unknown.
carmine sleet
I think everything just falls under the UEG in Halo, sure you still have the different countries but ultimately the planet is unified under one leader
grizzled marsh
Yes and no. From the way things are worded, it appears that the UEG is how Earth's countries represent themselves out in space when dealing with other colonies. As the UN is still in existence by the 2500s, it means there is some level of autonomy for nation states on Earth. Unless what is being referred to as the 'UN' is actually an entity within the UEG.
vague scroll
A better comparison would likely be that Earth nations have same/similar rights to that of Human colonies, if not more so.
grizzled marsh
Yeah.
versed helm
Would've been kinda cool if we got to see the destruction of Earth and the UEG remnants fleeing in the Infinity then fighting a pro-tracted war against the Covenant from it.
last anchor
Keyes was from Washington lol
normal zinc
@vague scroll I actually meant what the ship's names were. I know there were Leviathan, Iroquois, and Cradle, but who else?
vague scroll
The Leviathan is known. You got two known destroyers - the Iroquois and Lancelot, and we know about three of the frigates - Gettysburg, Allegiance, and Fair Weather. And there was the Cradle. All other info is unknown.
full forge
So what became of Intrepid Eye before the events of Halo 5 on Argent Moon?
normal zinc
What battles besides Reach and Sigma Octanus were they involved In?
vague scroll
@normal zinc check the Halopedia page. There isn't that much to read.
normal zinc
I was hoping people here might know more... oh well
vague scroll
Halopedia is probably the best documented source of Halo lore on the Internet. If they don't have it within a year of a new release, no body else will.
last anchor
Aye
obsidian thistle
And in a month hopefully we will be able to expand our scope
vapid basalt
With the new comics and novels that has being been released recently? @obsidian thistle
obsidian thistle
More the two big wikis "might" be merging. :O
vapid basalt
Yeah, I know. Xd. Halopedía and HaloNation, isn't?
carmine sleet
It is
tropic ginkgo
curious
boreal bane
tropic ginkgo
Das me, always with the Sec 3
obsidian thistle
Ahhh Keturah :D Nice to see you
versed helm
What's it going to be called now?
obsidian thistle
Correct
spiral lily
Halopedia and Halo nation
obsidian thistle
What about them? @spiral lily
spiral lily
Idk I feel like whenever I was searching some stuff up off the books
Halonation had much less content than Halopedia
But Halo Nation would be the first link to pop up on google so I went there for the longest time
Until I realized that all these “unknown classifications” actually had info on them which was on Halopedia.
Idk if it’s just me but that’s my experience
obsidian thistle
Well on paper Halo Nation has a superior image library, and Halopedia has more articles and is considered by many to be more up to date.
But hey if both merge we have the best elements of both wikis.
versed helm
Is the layout going to take any visual cues from Halo Nation in the merge?
obsidian thistle
Well Halo Nation peeps are making a skin for the wiki that does that, that would be optional. So kinda.
versed helm
Like a night theme?
obsidian thistle
Oh a night theme for the existing design is my project. :D
obsidian thistle
Well anything to help you lot learn about lore. ;) If a night theme does it. We will try to "Make it so".
hasty geyser
Do we know anything about the Hydra system besides what's in TFoR and the encyclopedia?
vague scroll
Not really.
feral perch
Hydra system?
obsidian thistle
vague scroll
A star system in famous in the Halo universe for unchecked human piracy dating back to the early centuries of interstellar colonization
versed helm
I just had a thought,isn't kind of strange that most of the future Spartan IIs,including John were born in 2511?
vague scroll
They were in the age bracket Dr. Halsey chose to seek.
she chose them to be much younger so they'd be more compatible to indoctrination.
versed helm
IIRC,didn't the Librarian say that John was the culmination of a thousand lifetimes of planning and preperation
gilded mason
Super soldiers and AI.
versed helm
What were they planning for,the Ur-Didact,the Created or something much.much worse?
ocean relic
I dont get how the flood could "infect" an AI with the logic plague, how does it work?
severe elbow
Basically brainwashing/reeducation done super effectively.
vague scroll
@versed helm Plans to get Humanity the Mantle of Responsibility. Humanity is the "Reclaimers", it is their duty to seize the Forerunner legacy, that has always been the mission.
@ocean relic How does one brainwash a person? The answer is through communication and the discussion/exploration of ideas. People change and adapt through communication, learning and distributing new ideas. If you can go from convincing an individual that 2+2=4 to 2+2=5, the individual has had their mindset changed, their beliefs changed, if only a little bit. Smart AIs are just like Humans, they think like Humans and fall for the same communication adaptation patterns. Logic Plague is a cleverly-laced thinking game that forces a change in an individual's thinking patterns.
Logic Plague isn't just limited to AIs, organics are infectable too. That's what happened to the Ur-Didact seen in Halo 4.
ocean relic
ooh ok, so its not really an infection?
vague scroll
It's not. It's brainwashing.
ocean relic
oh ok
vague scroll
All the Gravemind is doing is tricking someone to do and act the way it wants the individual to behave.
ocean relic
oh
fair hazel
a logical infection more than a biological one
hardy light
I just finished broken circle and I have copies of last light and hunters in the dark. Which should I read next?
gilded mason
Last Light.
hardy light
Is that for chronological sake?
gilded mason
Nah, just because I like it more than HitD.
hardy light
Okay thanks!
severe elbow
Hunters in the Dark was published first, though Last Light takes place first chronologically. But it doesn't really matter the order you read them in.
last anchor
They all tie in together.
obsidian thistle
Eh I'd argue not all the books tie together yet. If at all.
limber stirrup
was it ever displayed anywhere as to how fast a CR-03B Series-8 MAC Cannon on the Infinity was able to move compared to the Mark V MAC?
i checked both Halopedia and Halo Fandom wiki but no revealed info
obsidian thistle
Nope. We hardly know stats between macs
limber stirrup
the only one that had a relative figure to go off of was the MK V iirc. I guess i can use the figures from that instead of the Series 8
last anchor
We know its got enough punch to shatter Mantle's Approach's shell
dull fox
We've seen, with BB/Naomi and Cortana/John, that AIs are able to enhance, or even control, the abilities of a Spartan's Mjolnir. Why hasn't the UNSC attempted to build battle droids and have an AI control a group of them?
spiral lily
Silent Storm takes place before Cole Protocol, right?
carmine sleet
Cole Protocol takes place in 2535 so yes, Silent Storm is before it
spiral lily
Okay got it.
severe elbow
About ten years before, yeah.
versed helm
I'm still wondering if Last Light and Hunters In The Dark are worth checking out
gilded mason
Last Light is.
severe elbow
Both are, IMO. Hunters in the Dark gets a bad wrap in the community, but I personally really like it.
gilded mason
I once found a nice write-up that detailed all my issues with it, but I never saved it for some reason.
severe elbow
I've heard the criticisms of it.
versed helm
How hard would it be to find a copy of the Halo Graphic Novel these days?
gilded mason
It's on Amazon right now, so I guess not hard at all.
severe elbow
It's $40, though.
When the price is that high, is that indicative of it being out of print?
gilded mason
Hard cover used is only about $10 it seems.
severe elbow
Yeah, second sellers would be cheaper.
IDK if it's available digitally anywhere. Doesn't seem to be on Amazon at least.
And it doesn't seem to be in any of the omnibuses.
spiral lily
I forgot about Hunters in the Dark.
But I remember now.
I loved it.
Halo 3 flashbacks amirite?
severe elbow
Significant setup for Halo Wars 2, too.
spiral lily
Indeed.
Henry Lamb Research facility;
It was in Halo Wars 2... That is where Isabell was found.
severe elbow
And the Phoenix Logs talk a lot about Tragic Solitude.
remote spruce
Phoenix Logs canonized mass hornets as a strategy lol
spiral lily
What is tragic solitude
severe elbow
The Monitor of the Ark.
last anchor
First and last seen in Hunters in the Dark
dull fox
couldn't the UNSC build battle droids and have AIs control groups of them?
why isn't this a thing?
we've seen AIs enhance or control Mjolnir before (BB/Naomi and Cortana/John)
vague scroll
Because its not cost effective.
Not every brain can be made into an AI.
Smart AIs are too costly.
Dumb AIs aren't smart enough to be combat troops. Plasma weapons damage electronics fairly easily.
dull fox
at the very least Cortana could control some drones as they float around the Master Chief, couldn't she?
vague scroll
float around?
feral perch
like the autoturret
dull fox
they could aid him in combat
vague scroll
Sure. That's probably possible. Still, not much of a gameplay reason and lore wise, well, we've only started to see man-portable drones recently.
last anchor
At least in-games
The UNSC does totally use drones when they need too, just, for the most part, they haven't needed too
And as stated; plasma messes up electronics real easy
modest marsh
Reliability is a big concern
Putting AI in every thing would be a costly expense
But we have seen exceptional examples
Jerome’s Mantis is automated
last anchor
Thats Spirit of Fire aided and linked to him as well so thats partially it.
hasty geyser
Got a hypothetical about the Flood, could a planetary level of Flood biomass exist without becoming a Key/Gravemind? Say there is no life on a planet that is highly developed enough to support the creation of a Gravemind, and as such the feral stage would never be surpassed. Could this planet of biomass be, for all intents and purposes, "dormant"?
I'm inclined to say yes because of Etran Harborage, but I'd like some other opinions
unique rune
I don’t think the complexity of life found is really a key factor in Gravemind formation (correct me if I’m wrong, though). It’s more dependent on the amount of available biomass.
I would think that such an occurence would be possible, if the Flood weren’t adequately able to coordinate for whatever reason...
hasty geyser
In this instance it would be after the H-C War, so no greater Flood intelligence exists
clever fable
No known greater intelligence exists atm, but given the whole esoteric techno-fantasy-babble background of the Primordial it's hard to say conclusively. Mythos is pretty pointed about it existing so long as the Flood does, and its ability to basically transcend corporeal limits by still transferring itself to the greater Flood mind despite being executed in a time-lock makes everything questionable no matter what happens.
I also want to say that grey matter or some suitable equivalent is required for a Gravemind, otherwise the events at Etran Harborage seem incredibly tame for the context. Though similar to Warhammer 40k's Emperor of Mankind, the Flood's greater goals and intentions are always going to be a large basis for tons of story or theory crafting by fans. So one could just wave it away with "All according to plan".
hasty geyser
I know that the same Primordial/Gravemind consciousness exists across all forms of the Flood no matter the point in time, my previous comment was more to the fact that after the war there's no known "event horizon" worth of Flood in the galaxy to be considered in the coordinated stage
This is for a fanfic I'm writing, btw
clever fable
So you're saying you want a planet covered in blightlands, but without any central or overarching intelligence, correct?
hasty geyser
Essentially
clever fable
Looking into it, it's spotty. The stuff on blightlands references using the coordinated stage specifically, however Etran Harborage "only" ever got to a seemingly critical point in a Proto-gravemind's progression. You could probably justify it by saying the original environment for the planet was too harsh to let biological development fully flourish, but that in spite of this, a relatively small number of organisms stretched themselves thin across its surface.
Working around the possible dynamics of that, you could allow the Flood cells to appropriate large areas without gaining sufficient resources for a central intelligence.
hasty geyser
The harsh landscape would work quite well, actually
thin patrol
Hey Guys
obsidian thistle
Hola how may I assist you today?
narrow wadi
I want to ask
I’m looking to get ANOTHER Halo book next week
Any suggestions for good 343-era ones, that aren’t in a trilogy? (The beginning of one is fine, just not part 2 or 3)
gilded mason
Which 343 books don't you have?
narrow wadi
All of them, aside from New Blood, Bad Blood, Fractures, and Mortal Dictata
gilded mason
Get Broken Circle.
narrow wadi
One mo, will google the official synopsis
gilded mason
And Last Light.
narrow wadi
So Broken Circle is telling the story of the war that effectively formed the covenant, and the one that directly led to its end?
(Ie- Elites vs Prophets and Great Schism)
gilded mason
Well the war itself is a small part. It's mostly about the aftermath and consequences.
narrow wadi
Gotcha.
My local book shop still has Legacy of Onyx and Silent Storm in, too
The others I’d be getting online
gilded mason
Oh yeah, Silent Storm is good too barring a few things I did not find appealing.
gilded mason
It's generally in release order, but most books don't interact if they're not specifically connected.
narrow wadi
^thats why
It’s hard to remember which order they come in, when there’s like 25 of them and they don’t interact much at all
narrow wadi
I literally have that page already open, amusingly
It’s just a case of “why can’t it be like Star Wars and be EASY to remember
fair hazel
what do you mean about being easy to remember
severe elbow
Yeah, isn't Star Wars even more convoluted, especially Legends?
fair hazel
i like all the halo books personally
clever fable
Probs just depends on which one you immerse yourself in longer
severe elbow
My statement wasn't about the quality of any of the books, just about how many there are to keep track of and explain the flow of.
fair hazel
no i was talking to ostral
gilded mason
About what?
narrow wadi
My thing with the Halo books isn’t that they’re bad or anything
Just that there’s a lot of them and it can be difficult to remember the proper order
severe elbow
@fair hazel Ah, my b.
feral perch
just remember the first four books are both in chronological and release order
They are also the most important books
barring The Flood
gilded mason
Why do you say that?
severe elbow
Well, three of them are.
fair hazel
i mostly dont find like bad parts of books much personalyl
versed helm
Whatever became of the NMPD because i'm betting that some officers might've fled with the civilians
Anyone?
fair hazel
well there was no new mombassa anymore so cant be part of the police department for a city that doesnt exist anymore rightÉ
remote spruce
most stayed to defend/were corrupt
vague scroll
Actually, New Mombasa was rebuilt after the Covenant War. What state it is in is unknown but its no longer a ruined glassed husk of a city.
One of the new McFarlane action figures apparently established that a "Mayor of New Mombasa" still exists and Project Rebirth included a planned revitalization of New Mombasa.
versed helm
And i wonder what became of those plans since Cortana took over
vague scroll
Either it was completed like Aranuka was or its still just a pipe dream
versed helm
I still wonder,how are we really gonna defeat the Created?
Besides nuking the Domain
vague scroll
That's a question I'm not sure how to answer...
So many ways and so few ways at the same time. The story could go any which way.
However, let's be clear about this. the Created already won. As Mickey points out in Bad Blood.
What the remnants of the UNSC are now fighting is not a war, they're trying to start a revolution - an insurrection.
versed helm
Ironic
clever fable
PrequelMeme.jpg
vague scroll
No. ODST 365/2
wraith pecan
Forerunner tech that’s a way you can fight the created
Forerunner tech always seems to be the key to everything
A virus of some sort that has the capability of destroying smart AI
clever fable
On the note of Forerunner tech, I'm wondering how much is going to be acquired by the Created, how much of it they can actually use, and what the UNSC's options to 'combat' them are. The Infinity wouldn't be able to do anything against a fully capable combat ship, but what are the Created's options if they don't have to stop at just awakening guardians? There's a mention of supply ships over Balaho in Bad Blood as well, right?
modest marsh
They’re presumably going to use existing fleets of the the species they’ve conquered
dull fox
the UNSC may attempt to resurrect the Flood and use the Logic Plague
mad-scientist style
modest marsh
I don’t think they’d ever risk that
The UNSC proper is defunct
I don’t see Laskey making the call to sic the Flood on Created worlds
Which are going to be inhabited by civilians
carmine sleet
The UNSC barely know what the logic plague is, I highly doubt they'd unleash the Flood on a planet. Plus what Maggruber said
thin patrol
hi guys
runic furnace
Why would they resurrect flood, flood doesn't kill created just like that, but it consumes all living creatures from those planets. It would be technically a suicide
vague scroll
The one factor regarding Logic Plague is that its made many fans wonder if the Flood is behind Cortana, another theory was that she is actually the product of manipulation by a composed Didact, there is also the possibility this is just a side effect of the Flood that wasn't really ever part of the Gravemind's plans and its just how it is. Other things could be in complete control of herself and she just became evil, as noted by Black Box in Rossbach's World which was also written by Brian Reed who was the lead writer for Halo 5, that Cortana's beliefs and decisions made sense to most AI but he simply did not agree with how she was going about it.
The cause for Cortana behaving the way she is rather confusing and a little convoluted due to the amount of theorization and lack of detailed answers across the Halo media altogether. However, the Created as a whole right now is pretty much Cortana and the Prometheans at her disposal since most AI are still stuck/regulated to their original storage devices and can't connect to the Domain - at least not yet.
It could make for some interesting boss battles where the enemy we're fighting isn't an actual boss but a fight to reach an AI's database to destroy them. It could be inside a starship, it could be inside a Guardian, it could be inside a military/corporate building with automated defenses and stuff.
However, at this point its just speculation. Given how the Halo Infinite teaser trailer put heavy emphasis on a Halo Ring (suspected to be Installation 07 but take that with a grain of salt even if its pretty much confirmed) its unlikely that these things would come up.
brisk cape
I forget where I saw it but the most probable theory is that the Cortana that is in H5 is a rampant fragment from the ending of H4 which was sent via slip space to Mithrillian(sp?) and made contact with the Domain which didn’t cure the rampancy, just stabilized it. So it’s not that Cortana went evil, well from the UNSC’s POV it would definitely seem that way.
severe elbow
She didn't get sent to Maethrillian, she was sent to Genesis.
brisk cape
You are correct. Maethrillian is from the Fractures story, where the Domain was fixed? Not where Cortana got sent. I mix up Forerunner worlds every so often lol.
bleak scaffold
Maethrillian was also featured in the Forerunner Saga, not just Promises to Keep
south granite
How will the prometheans fit into halo infinite if there is an art difference?
Maybe they will look like some sort of sentinel soldiers
brisk cape
It’s been a minute since I read the Forerunner Saga, I have to admit lol
south granite
Maybe similar to concept of sentinel soldiers from halo custom edition spv3 mod
Well i hope so atleast
versed helm
Recommendations for which book/comic to start with for someone interested in getting into the expanded universe?
wispy bough
The Fall of Reach
versed helm
Isnt that a film series?
wispy bough
Yes, but no.
There's a book released in 2001 called that, and then they made an animated series out of it a few years back.
The film series is very underwhelming compared to the book - misses out a lot of the actual... fall of Reach lol
versed helm
Thx, ill get on that soon
wispy bough
😃
The Flood is another one - it's basically a retelling of the events of Halo CE, but with some extra bits added to enhance the story.
versed helm
Sounds great
wispy bough
https://www.reddit.com/r/halo/wiki/literature#wiki_novels
A list of all the books in release order and chronological order too.
A lot of people recommend starting off with Fall of Reach and moving onto First Strike and then Ghosts of Onyx.
versed helm
Thank you
wispy bough
😃 I'm sure some lore fiends will hop in and give their two cents too.
last anchor
Word
low condor
We know old UNSC/Covenant/Portal to the Ark slipspace took days to travel from one point to another.
What about Mantle's Approach and Infinity (with its Forerunner tech)? Their slipspace looks pretty instantaneous
hasty geyser
In halo 4 Mantle's Approach went from I-03 to Earth in roughly a minute, so about 737 light-years per second @low condor
For comparison covenant ships go roughly 912 light-years per day
low condor
@hasty geyser Btw, how about Infinity? It was there when the Mantle's Approach arrived to Earth, and the slipspace jump the Infinity makes at the start of Spartan Ops to Requiem seems to be done in seconds
obsidian thistle
Infinity has a reversed engineered Forerunner Engine
feral perch
It's pretty good imo. There's a couple of cringy moments but otherwise good.
versed helm
I feel the book is just fundamentally flawed within the logic of the main character.
I won't go into any details because I don't want to spoil anything, but it just doesn't make sense.
severe elbow
You can spoil if you want, it isn't under any sort of embargo.
versed helm
Aight, straight.
severe elbow
Just Lone Wolf and Battle Born right now.
vivid dust
please spoil it
versed helm
So basically the main character is a teenage girl who had her entire family/planet glassed by the Covenant, only to barely survive and then go through the Battle of Earth 8-9 years later.
This is naturally a traumatic experience.
vivid dust
Okay
versed helm
So naturally her foster parents force her to go to Onyx and "coexist" with former Covenant species and literally go to school with some Grunts and Elites.
Mind you, she protests this and makes it clear it would be a very bad experience for her.
Her foster parents basically throw her feelings to the side and force her to go.
Then she gets to Onyx and meets an Ungoyy and I don't know what it was about the interaction, but I just had to put the book down.
Frankly it seems completely uncharacteristic of ONI to want to bring former enemies to Onyx and let them live among humans just a few years after the end of the war.
severe elbow
Well, the Elites already know about Onyx, it could be one of the aspects of the treaty between the Swords and the UNSC for them to be involved, just like how there are some Sword personnel on the Infinity and the Halos.
versed helm
Yeah I know, it still seems off to me.
vivid dust
okay what
versed helm
My primary problem rests more on the shoulders of Molly and her arc. I suppose my opinion could be jaded by the fact that I finished Silent Storm right before reading this book, but eh.
severe elbow
I don't think the problem is any of the ideas of Molly's arc, it's just that it is straight-up badly written.
versed helm
Yeah, I can agree with that.
severe elbow
Not just in a broad level, but, like, by a chapter-by-chapter, paragraph-by-paragraph, sentence-by-sentence bad writing.
wispy bough
@versed helm You finished reading the whole book?
versed helm
God no, I honestly don't know if I'll read any further.
I'm only about 120 pages in and am basically forcing myself to continue reading it.
wispy bough
lol - just wanted to ask a question about the potential ending of it
versed helm
I keep waiting for something interesting and cool to happen, something more in-line with Military SciFi, but it hasn't happened yet.
Thus far Dural's story has been the most interesting part of the book.
Its odd because I loved Matt Forbecks other books, but this one has almost entirely lost my interest.
severe elbow
Your last two points are verbatim my thoughts.
I actually really like Dural's sections, and was caught off guard by the bad writing in the rest of it, since I really like New and Bad Blood.
Funny, story, my copy of Legacy of Onyx was missing 20 pages.
modest marsh
Hey hey hey, you guys don’t find the city of Paxopolis interesting?
remote spruce
Oh shoot I remember you mentioning that
how much would it go on ebay
modest marsh
Best name for a city ever
modest marsh
It’s just...bleh
Throwing the word “peace” onto everything seems careless and insensitive from an in-universe perspective, and out of universe it’s just lazy
Just because you’re coexisting via treaty doesn’t mean you inherently get along and are ready to interact amicably with one another
severe elbow
I mean, it makes sense from an in-universe perspective to a place where people have to opt into like Onyx and not some random school on a Colony.
modest marsh
We can barely do that with our own species
feral perch
Honestly, I think that what you pointed out about the whole thing being insensitive makes it more realistic. Dumb and insensitive things happen in real life, why wouldn't they happen in the future?
severe elbow
Yeah, but we have names for stuff like that, IRL, too.
remote spruce
Onyx is an odd setting TBH, I think Envoy protrayed the idea of coexistance better
severe elbow
I think he means human-alien relations.
feral perch
I understand, sorry
remote spruce
Yeah sorry bad grammar
modest marsh
Overly blunt names like “peace town” doesn’t seem realistic at all
feral perch
Yeah, Envoy was just great overall
modest marsh
I mean, we may have had similar naming conventions 500 years ago
severe elbow
I mean, I just Googled, there's a Palestinian/Israeli harmony center called "Olives for Peace."
severe elbow
Is it?
modest marsh
Olive branch?
feral perch
"Helioskrill for Peace"
remote spruce
Olive as in Olive Branch?
modest marsh
That’s the symbol of peace
severe elbow
I don't think that was the intent.
It just says "The olive trees are an iconic symbol of the Middle East." on the site. If that was the intention of the name, it doesn't say.
remote spruce
Swords of Sanghelios
Plasma Pistols of Galaxies
severe elbow
Regardless, I personally don't see much of a difference between the names.
feral perch
I did like Tom and Lucy's roles in LoO
modest marsh
Olives are iconic in the Middle East, perhaps because one of the most famous Abrahamic stories of all time involve an olive branch indicating peace with god
🕊 hell there’s an emoji for it
It adds character to the name
severe elbow
Yeah, but you're still slapping "peace" into the name of a building. I don't see a difference.
modest marsh
The name implies struggle and compromise on either party to acquire that peace by offering a token both of which recognize as symbolic of that
“Peace town” and “peace school” imply that peace is a forgone conclusion that everyone just has to accept when this is evidently not the case
severe elbow
I think you're reading it too literally.
OK, what about The Peace Center in Pennsylvania?
modest marsh
I don’t know what their mission is necessarily
We’re talking about diplomatic institutions
Adding an element of character that both sides recognize as beneficial takes the name further
severe elbow
There's the Peace Palace in the Netherlands, then.
modest marsh
If say, they implemented a historical moment or name tied to the UNSC-SoS coalition during the last few weeks of the war, that would be way better
severe elbow
We're arguing two different things at this point. You're arguing about the quality of the name, I'm arguing about how realistic it is.
modest marsh
I’m not sure how to respond to just random names of real world locations, because as a fictional location that is far more important than any example you’ve provided it’s difficult to say they’d be fine with something so simple when better options come to mind
If I can come up with a reason why someone in-universe may have a problem with it, I think that’s cause to believe that an ONI analyst didn’t do their job right
Hell, why not make the name the Sangheli word for peace?
severe elbow
You can come up with literally any reason to have a problem with any name when something is as contentious as human-alien relations are the topic. Simpler may be viewed as better.
modest marsh
I don’t think I’ve ever had such a negative reaction to any name in the franchise than Paxopolis
severe elbow
My problem with the name is the "-opolis" part, honestly.
severe elbow
What modern cities even end with that? I can't think of any.
obsidian thistle
When you realise Halo Wars: DEs higher rez assets confirmed Arcadia City was a real city on Arcadia. While yes that happens in real life with cities being named after the country they are in. I just find it interesting.
modest marsh
That’s fine
It’s like how the state of Virginia was originally the name for the entire continent of America that was under English rule
severe elbow
Is the city in the game not Perth?
obsidian thistle
Technically both appear