which is... fun
#h1-story-discussion
pale grail
atomic forge
Everybody talking about legendary chaos boon that I had gotten and here I am not getting a single fishing opportunity in Chaos ever.
At this point I think it's bugged or just an elaborate April Fools joke.
sudden tulip
it happens like every 15 runs
normal kiln
the issue for me is that it’s just rare enough that half the time when it does come up i’m not expecting it and don’t notice the fish until after i’ve hit the exit
sudden tulip
worst thing is missing the fish or pulling it too early
i wish zag said the line every time there's a fish
I remember someone saying there'll be some new alternate boss in 1.0
is that true
normal kiln
i think they’ve confirmed that, tho i don’t remember where
sudden tulip
i just hope it's EM4
and I very much hope it's not just some arena change like lernie
I never felt like I was really fighting the 'god of the dead'
normal kiln
the general consensus seems to be that it’ll be EM4, but they haven’t said specifics
sudden tulip
thats probably my only major complaint in the game
normal kiln
what would you add to it?
sudden tulip
idek
I feel like the boss design is really good
still doesnt feel like it's Hades
normal kiln
i think i get what you mean
sudden tulip
But from a gameplay perspective balance is also important
they've done a good job with that
normal kiln
particularly with EM3, he doesn’t seem much more of a threat than theseus (maybe less, build depending) and like
he’s a god
sudden tulip
i'd like the laser attack to be replaced with something else
like the tri-laser is so dumb
its just an opportunity for you to get in damage
normal kiln
yeah i thought it was a bug the first time it came up lol
sudden tulip
and full laser is ok, just requires half-decent positioning
but feels outta place for the fight imo
i highly doubt they'll rework or remove an entire boss move though
normal kiln
honestly, who knows
pale grail
tri laser is like a small breathing windows for newbie like me
hide behind a rock to slow down a bit
normal kiln
there may actually be a very different version of him tied to some endgame story or something
sudden tulip
tri laser is like a small breathing windows for newbie like me
I feel like it shouldnt be there
glad stag
Could be EM4 adds a 3rd form to him...
sudden tulip
like the first phase is slow enough, but also balanced
glad stag
Which they could add many new moves to.
sudden tulip
the music matches it so well too
ost picks up for second phase
which is pretty fast-paced
glad stag
By 3rd form I mean 3rd phase..
normal kiln
this games soundtrack is just amazing all round
sudden tulip
the tri-laser can also be stunlocked
By 3rd form I mean 3rd phase..
i feel like that would make the fight way too long
glad stag
I would enjoy a Cerberus fight.
normal kiln
i’ve been a fan of Korb for years, but he knocked it out of the park here
normal kiln
I would enjoy a Cerberus fight.
honestly i kinda wouldn’t enjoy a cerberus fight, especially if you had to kill him
he is good doggo
glad stag
I mean... everything is immortal so are you really killing him?
sudden tulip
i just want a badass hades fight
3 heat addition maybe
to get that nice 60 heat
lol
pale grail
well, we slay our dad, so ....
glad stag
Could also do a Asterius or Charon thing and make him run away after X damage if you're opposed to killing doggo
sudden tulip
cerberus fight would feel outta place
pale grail
and our girlfriend
sudden tulip
imo
normal kiln
it’s different with a doggo idk
glad stag
I think you're being overly sensitive.. Anhlong is right.. the entire premise of the game is that you die every run and come back.
Prince even talks about the difference in feeling of killing shades vs killing rats and satyrs.
sudden tulip
zag mentions that even hades cant turn cerberus against him or something like that
glad stag
Doggo is a 3 headed demon dog that guards the gates of Hades.. he's not a pomeranian.
normal kiln
i mean, it’s not like i’m gonna ditch the game if they make you fight cerberus, i’m just not sure it’d be in theme for the game
glad stag
Thats true. From a lore perspective it makes sense.
sudden tulip
doesnt seem right for him to fight the dog he pets :(
glad stag
He sexes Mag and kills her though?
open berry
theyve said rigging cerb is kinda difficult so even on a technical scale it likely wouldnt be considered
glad stag
Meg*
normal kiln
doesnt seem right for him to fight the dog he pets :(
yeah this
sudden tulip
Meg is a fury and bound to do whatever Hades says
glad stag
Similar argument could be made about Cerberus
open berry
he takes up so much of the screen im really not sure what you'd have him do even if he were aggressive. theres more to think about here besides the logistics of whether it fits lore or not
pale grail
on that fated day, the prince pickup a fake Satyr sack...
stark raven
We started the game with Meg as an enemy and Cerberus as friendly doggo. It makes sense to "warm up" to Meg and be friends&more with her, but have Cerberus turning into an enemy out of the blue makes no sense
sudden tulip
its super clear that zag wouldnt hurt cerberus either lol
normal kiln
i saw him when I entered styx and my heart dropped
yeah same i was so happy when i realised you were supposed to bypass him rather than fight him
clever oasis
maybe a friendly sparring fight?
glad stag
Nah I underestimated how attached people are to the hell hound.
clear oracle
It's a dog in a video game
azure needle
I pet him every time I'm in the house
stark raven
Okay okay.. it was just a thought. I get it.
@glad stag It's just a normal discussion, it's nice to talk about these things
clear oracle
That's an automatic god tier
pale grail
Nah I underestimated how attached people are to the hell hound.
you get that when they put in the option to pet him
open berry
tbh i think im one of the few thats indifferent to cerb lol. but i dont want a cerb fight purely bc it feels like a nightmare setting one up
atomic forge
who is EM4?
pale grail
not yet
normal kiln
I pet him every time I'm in the house
same. every time. 230 hours in. i can’t stop.
clever oasis
extreme measures
open berry
em4 doesnt exist. yet.
sudden tulip
the petting is too repetitive for me lol
but it definitely is satisfying
just wish they'd have like 2-3 more animations for it
just like with the laughs when you romance meg and than
open berry
well again, i remember seeing mention once about cerb being difficult to rig
clear oracle
My body isn't ready for EM4.
glad stag
Personally I do not get emotionally attached to any character in any video game.
sudden tulip
My body isn't ready for EM4.
I am definitely ready
open berry
sudden tulip
and I wont take any other heat while on EM4
i feel like an alternate hades fight if it were to exist shouldnt be on EM lol
cuz having to do both EM3 and EM4
boy
who knows it might even be a necessary heat condition to beat for the epilogue 👀
open berry
its confirmed we're getting an alt boss fight, theres no one left to choose besides the final boss. theyre not gonna alt the secret boss thats already tough as nails
sudden tulip
or the ending
atomic forge
Who do you think would be the last NPC that they talked about? And do you think he will appear in Styx?
sudden tulip
she*
clear oracle
Just look at the roadmap
sudden tulip
and persephone
open berry
last npc should be obvious if you've followed the story
clear oracle
That's all we know for sure for now.
glad stag
@open berry Mom?
open berry
ya
glad stag
That's what I have been thinking.
stark raven
If they don't put Persephone in I would be like: wait what??
open berry
they cant add in a brand new character for launch that has no build up in the story, it has to be perse
open berry
what reason would they have tho. theyre largely content not being involved outside assisting zag
normal kiln
wait, how would you justify a boss fight v. achilles and patroclus
open berry
thats stupid
normal kiln
oof
sudden tulip
Achilles is bound to hades
pale grail
you want to meet each other?
Beat my boi first
open berry
you can say that but it would feel shoehorned in
clear oracle
Hades can only force people to do stuff via contracts
That's clear for Orpheus and Achilles
open berry
using 'hades can force people into doing things' doesnt mean that he should, or that it would fit within the story and not feel shoved in just to have it be a thing
clear oracle
(unless they are willing employees like Meg)
normal kiln
yeah i don’t think hades can just make achilles do whatever he wants
pure belfry
idk about a boss fight but it would be cool for them to help train Zag and test boon builds out like a practice room
glad stag
I was just mentioning something about that @pure belfry
sudden tulip
Now that i think about it
glad stag
I think there should be a testing area where you can pick different boons and Hammer upgrades and try them out.
sudden tulip
they're just too tired for it
so nah
I remembered divine dashing on them
and they're like 'we're done with fighting'
now i feel bad
open berry
you can accidentally dash cerb too, which ive done in a hurry before and cerb just whines and zag apologizes
pale grail
i havent finish the Achilles and patroclus quest yet, so i dont know what are their feeling after that
open berry
the proof is in the roadmap friend
glad stag
Okay, here's one.. IF Pers is added to the game, what would her boons look like?
glad stag
And would she be an "Others"?
sudden tulip
the proof is in the roadmap friend
wat
open berry
on the main menu
stark raven
"others" or "chtonic god" too
open berry
where is says next update is 1.0
sudden tulip
that doesnt say boss fight does it
open berry
click that
pale grail
but Zag can certainly help Patroclus get back his feel for battle 😄
clear oracle
One variant for boss fight
tired pier
But there already is an alternate boss fight.
tired pier
lol
clear oracle
So no new boss, but one more variant is what I interpret
sudden tulip
huh
i must've missed that
i just saw true ending a lot more dialogue and more surprises lol
tired pier
Yeah probably Extreme Measures for the last boss.
clear oracle
And I can't wait for more music!
sudden tulip
anyone got a roadmap link?
tired pier
Open your game, click bottom right.
sudden tulip
And I can't wait for more music!
where would they add that
open berry
ofc my screenshot is from blood price beta but they havent changed that
they dont have a roadmap to look at online
sudden tulip
I actually did, but I didnt see the variant thing
thx
My pc is ded so I couldnt go in-game
normal kiln
hey i just realised it says “with more still to come” after keepsakes, rather than “with 1 still to come” like all the rest
open berry
yeah people have been pondering over that
normal kiln
dya’ll reckon there might be more than one more keepsake?
pale grail
well, there is 1 person in the house that didnt give us anything
clear oracle
Who?
pale grail
Hades himself
open berry
maybe mom will give us something 
sudden tulip
👀
glad stag
Also Hades and Demeters Bond meters are on a timer
clear oracle
Right
glad stag
Which means eventually you will be able to give them more.
sudden tulip
I hope 9 ambrosia is enough
normal kiln
oohhh yeah i forgot hades hasn’t yet
glad stag
And open up a lot of stuff and probably favors/quests associated with them
sudden tulip
turned the rest into titan blood :/
clear oracle
Hades is locked since 4ever
normal kiln
so it’s prolly one for hades and one for persephone
open berry
im betting hades and demeter bonds will be tied to the true ending, esp since demeter didnt get unlocked with the rest of the olympians
clear oracle
Guess Dad doesn't like drinking on the job
sudden tulip
ye
sudden tulip
what if you can only forge bonds with one of them 👀
open berry
ew
sudden tulip
take her to olympus or take her to the house
glad stag
I doubt that.
sudden tulip
I know they're not gonna make us do multiple saves
glad stag
The Devs seem to have the philosophy that you should be able to do everything on a single save.
I doubt they'd lock out one side of things.
open berry
we know hades story is largely more light-hearted than other sgg games so idk if they would pull something like that
sudden tulip
I just have no idea how you can satisfy both of them lol
open berry
well we're missing a chunk of the story still
normal kiln
so what’re the top theories re: why persephone is in hiding?
sudden tulip
And also satisfy persephone who clearly doesnt wanna go anywhere
normal kiln
i legit have zero clue
open berry
ultimately we can only theorize so much because we're still missing a part of the story that would help explain some of these things
drifting citrus
yesss
normal kiln
sooo many hype
pale grail
Maybe because it not winter yet
glad stag
Worth noting...
fierce tendon
Could always just let Persephone stay where she is, which if I were a betting man would be this game's rendition of the Isle of the Blessed
glad stag
Is that in Greek Mythology, Persephone returned to the underworld for 3 months a year.
pale grail
Persephone only come to the Underworld in the Winter right
sudden tulip
I think Hades doesnt want persephone to come back either, because he knows she hates it there
fierce tendon
On account of the Isle not being part of the underworld
stark raven
Wasn't it 6 months?
sudden tulip
That's why he says boy you'll understand why im not letting you go to persephone
glad stag
Maybe? I think it was 3..
pale grail
I believe it is 3
clever oasis
hades is always yelling at zag to not talk about persephone, and all the gods say hades has been ignoring them, so maybe there's a twist where hades has been protecting persephone all along and did it for love
glad stag
It represented the time that grain was stored underground.
stark raven
I read the myth recently but let me check on internet
sudden tulip
oh yeah
fierce tendon
That's what I'm thinking, Totoro
sudden tulip
there's the she can go to both places every once in a while
and everyone lives happily ever after
fierce tendon
Especially as Hades does say that she hates her original name when you press him about it
open berry
he has been respectful of that and demeter hasnt, you can at least say that much
glad stag
Also worth noting is that Persephone is the goddess of Grain and Agriculture... The Olympians have not seen her, and "Great wars" are mentioned as taking place in the land of the living.
clever oasis
demeter final final boss??
clear oracle
That would be nice. But unlikely per road map.
glad stag
If Demeter was final boss, how would you use her boons?
open berry
the final boss isnt changing
clever oasis
every time i see demeter allude to her daughter, i'm always like ???!?
open berry
there is no bait and switch final boss
clever oasis
do demeter and zag know they're related??
clear oracle
Didn't Greg confirm that there is no new boss himself?
drifting citrus
dem doesn't
normal kiln
i suspect we beat demeter using diplomacy
open berry
greg said there is no further gameplay past the current point
sudden tulip
everybody's related
normal kiln
(by diplomacy i of course mean alcohol)
drifting citrus
zag eventually finds out in-game
open berry
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1145360/discussions/0/2568689796938951223/#c2568689796939013056 "Further, the story we have had planned and been working on since the start of this project does not involve additional battles and such past the current point."
sudden tulip
if you fight her then there's no way you're gonna forge a bond
clever oasis
maybe no new boss fight but maybe new enemies/twists/people with new motives
sudden tulip
cuz you'll be too dead to
sudden tulip
She'll probably steal malphon from you and punch you back to the house
stark raven
About the myth: different site says different thing, so I'm unsure :c some say it's winter months, some say it's half a year, so I dunno the answer
open berry
i dont see why there would be a bait and switch boss. zag's goal is purely getting to the surface. what is standing in his way of getting to the surface? his father.
i think people forget this isnt a typical roguelike with a bunch of extra features and twists and this is still a narrative story
sudden tulip
question is what hades is protecting zag from 👀
clear oracle
Almost like myths are supposed to be obscured
normal kiln
do demeter and zag know they're related??
yes, she knows she’s his aunt
she doesn’t know she’s his grandmother
greek myth be like this
fierce tendon
Meg, it's largely the same story either way, just based on the perception of the agricultural calendar
And also a difference is marking the seasons
stark raven
Makes sense 
glad stag
@sudden tulip See my point above about wars on earth and a lack of agriculture.
Which also explains why the Olympians are looking for Persephone.
clear oracle
Also Hades takes a lot of liberty in interpreting myths
drifting citrus
if you want to be technical by in-game canon, she thinks she's his foster aunt 
clear oracle
Case in point: we have a machine gun
open berry
wait in the story? im p sure the olympians dont even know perse is missing
sudden tulip
are there actually bounds for underworld doods to prevent them from going to the surface
only than and charon do
drifting citrus
it's funny bc the underworld is more technologically advanced than the surface
fierce tendon
Given how old the myths are and how many conflicting accounts there are it's impossible to not take liberties here and there with myths
drifting citrus
see: the macedonia
sudden tulip
thats cuz Daedalus is OP
clever oasis
lol yeah, zag is like "this gun is scary" and achilles was like "good thing the surface people don't have tech like that"
pale grail
Thanks to Zeus
drifting citrus
me wondering if daedalus ever found his son
fierce tendon
Daedalus is very busy trying to not think about the man he threw off a cliff or his son
clear oracle
Who is Daedalus?
clear oracle
Yeah, but myth wise, what's he known for?
open berry
made the labyrinth
sudden tulip
its mentioned that daedalus built the macedonian chariot
pale grail
A very famous engineer
sudden tulip
that theseus loves
drifting citrus
built the wings for his son icarus, who then flew too close to the sun and fell into the ocean
clear oracle
Ohhhh
open berry
i like how everyone gave different answers lol
stark raven
He should have also made Ariadne's Yarn if Im correct
normal kiln
icarus was smart boi
sudden tulip
also made the labyrinth
clear oracle
I knew about Icarus, never made connection
sudden tulip
where the minotaur was supposed to be
clear oracle
Makes sense.
sudden tulip
and where theseus ended up
pale grail
Talking about Daedelus, i wonder why they choose him instead of Hephatus for our weapon upgrade
drifting citrus
if i had to guess, daedalus got himself wrapped up into a Hades Deal in order to be reconnected with his son
stark raven
Also pushed off Talos from Athena's temple roof and had to flee Athene because she was angry
pale grail
Talos is a greek myth character ? 
open berry
@pale grail this is why https://discordapp.com/channels/456889434672201729/477164376496013323/672871913193996293
stark raven
Apparently yes!
normal kiln
Hephaestus is an olympian, so it wouldn’t make sense for him to be doing stuff down in the underworld
pale grail
I have always thought he is from Skyrim lol
drifting citrus
robots? in my ancient greek myth? it's more likely than you think
stark raven
I have always thought he is from Skyrim lol
@pale grail Same! I knew abotu Skyrim's Talos before the Greek Talos
clever oasis
lol me too
normal kiln
Daedalus was not a nice guy, in case it isn’t obvious
open berry
honestly a lot of popular figures in myth were not nice, and have simply been glorified to the point a lot of people dont realize that
sudden tulip
I dont think asterius is supposed to be nice either
clear oracle
Neither is Sisyphus
tired pier
Sisyphus wasn't either, yet he is super chill in game.
normal kiln
oh yeah most of them are terrible people
tired pier
jinx
normal kiln
it’s great
sudden tulip
I think daedalus is a nice guy in game
clear oracle
So the Underworld does a great job at rehabilitating people
normal kiln
Sisyphus wasn't either, yet he is super chill in game.
sooooo chill i love him
sudden tulip
just because of the theseus mask
clear oracle
Good job Hades
pale grail
Medusa and Meg are not that nice also 
drifting citrus
daed is nice enough to leave his hammers around for us
sudden tulip
dusa !=medusa
drifting citrus
but also he built the underworld lol
clear oracle
He even marks which chamber has his stuff
stark raven
Dedalus should also be involved with Asterius' birth... but I'm not sure we're ready for that convo
drifting citrus
daedalus, inventor of the roguelike
sudden tulip
im sure they wanted daedalus to be in-game since they started working on it
because it was supposed to be a theseus -labyrinth - minotaur game 👀
stark raven
^ true!!
pale grail
dusa !=medusa
I guess Medusa wouldnt friendzone me 😦
normal kiln
Daedalus: I’ll just mark this room as having my tools in it, so no one messes with them!
Zagreus: Hammers, you say?
sudden tulip
i know thats a joke but lore-wise isnt he trying to help
glad stag
Speaking of which: || At what point are you considered "romanced" with Dusa? Only after she's given back the Ambrosia? ||
I ask because I am attempting to unlock Aphrodite's final heart.
drifting citrus
ayo, where'd my hammer go
sudden tulip
Speaking of which: || At what point are you considered "romanced" with Dusa? Only after she's given back the Ambrosia? ||
probably
||she doesnt keep the ambrosia either way?||
stark raven
ayo, where'd my hammer go
||It's like with Charon's coins, we're just borrowing them||
drifting citrus
lorewise he built the macedonia, so it's half and half
normal kiln
i know thats a joke but lore-wise isnt he trying to help
oh wait really? must’ve missed that
clear oracle
Question: Did you take the Ambrosia back?
normal kiln
thought we just found hammers lying around
glad stag
I haven't yet.. That dialogue hasn't opened up to me yet.
drifting citrus
yes
clear oracle
I wonder if SGG will ever release the number
feral flower
I took it back.
glad stag
I have given her all of the Ambrosia.
feral flower
I thought it would be rude to insist on her keeping it.
drifting citrus
- dusa will remember that
clear oracle
I let her keep it.
sudden tulip
thought we just found hammers lying around
idk either
i mean the hammers do VERY specific things
pale grail
I took it back and start giving them to Meg
sudden tulip
so it would be weird for them to just be 'lying around' and helping you win the game
lol
drifting citrus
she specifically wanted to fill up the shelves herself, without outside help, so i took them back
glad stag
Also, I gave all of the Ambrosia I could to ||Than|| but then "Eased off" when approached.. I am wondering if that qualifies me for Aphrodite's last star or not.
normal kiln
Question: Did you take the Ambrosia back?
nah told her to keep it
sudden tulip
I let her keep it.
what happened
sudden tulip
that should be enough to get out of the friendzone 
drifting citrus
there's no gotcha moment lol
clear oracle
You have excess Ambrosia in the end anyhow
normal kiln
it’s only 6 lol
sudden tulip
i thought it was 3+4+5
clear oracle
It was 15 for me
drifting citrus
if you're frugal you'd take them back and feed em to cerby 🤧
sudden tulip
or something
clear oracle
Unless they changed that
sudden tulip
You have excess Ambrosia in the end anyhow
If you get all the rewards
glad stag
yes
sudden tulip
which is very far away
glad stag
He's counting Nectar also..
normal kiln
huh
sudden tulip
I give most of my ambrosia for titan blood
pale grail
More that 10 for me, i am sure
glad stag
@clear oracle I think you're counting Nectar also..
clear oracle
Because that delayed my companion level up
normal kiln
i do remember it taking a while, so maybe it was 15
sudden tulip
ive left some ambrosia for 1.0
cuz 3 characters
also gotta get 11 titan blood for malphon 👀
(because I have 4)
fierce tendon
Stocking up on all them gemstones too
sudden tulip
stocking up?
normal kiln
i still have two exagryph aspects to max lol
sudden tulip
im not even close to getting all of the stuff
normal kiln
sooo much titan blood to farm
sudden tulip
sooo much titan blood to farm
not really
nectar -> diamonds -> ambrosia -> titan blood
there you go
tired pier
but you need the diamonds and ambrosia also
normal kiln
yeah i’m doing that
sudden tulip
you'll have a lotta diamonds if youre not trading em
pale grail
Diamond for the house also
normal kiln
still got 39 more to get
sudden tulip
39 what?
normal kiln
blood
tired pier
I want my revolting disco ball.
sudden tulip
wth
pale grail
I want my revolting disco ball.
Same haha
sudden tulip
that's just 5 diamonds
tired pier
10 since you have to buy the other one also.
sudden tulip
blood
im not sure how you need that many when you're so many hours ahead of me
i've maxed all
tired pier
And then there's all the songs and all the other work orders.
sudden tulip
i have like 20 diamonds and 10 ambrosia
normal kiln
wait for real? prolly cause i’ve done a lot of high heat runs, so i’m not winning consistently to get the rewards
pale grail
I am only at 72 runs for this new save file
sudden tulip
im at like 120 runs i think
wait for real? prolly cause i’ve done a lot of high heat runs, so i’m not winning consistently to get the rewards
if you've done a lot ig yeah
glad stag
I'm at 110 runs.
normal kiln
i also bought a lotta titan blood at styx
ah
pale grail
I see
sudden tulip
not a 'lot'
normal kiln
i have literally never done that
sudden tulip
but a considerable amount
pale grail
I have never bought that
sudden tulip
warning: only do it on lower heat
sudden tulip
dont do it at 15+ heat lol
sudden tulip
it REALLY hurts when you buy the titan blood and since you saved up that much money you just die to hades
and now you have to go back all the way to get the blood from hades
clever oasis
ya, gotta only buy if you're confident you don't need the money
sudden tulip
you pretty much only do it with a super strong build
pale grail
The only time i have enough money to do that i when I am using the Sword hammer that give damage 5% of gold
open berry
speaking of contractor decos reminder we're getting more 🥰 better start farming gems
sudden tulip
and take purse
speaking of contractor decos reminder we're getting more 🥰 better start farming gems
it took me so long to get that 2000 gem throne
like damn
there's so much left
but soon i'll be able to trade titan blood for gemstones too
also the throne gives like 0 dialogue :(
pale grail
Also as i am learning the lyre, I want to pick up the weight
stark raven
But can we pick up the weight?
glad stag
The easiest way is to use the 20% boost from yoru weapon and get the Chaos Boon that gives you the boost, then open all of your treasure chests containing Gems..
75 gems +20% +Chaos
pale grail
I dont think we can
glad stag
You can get a couple hundred at a time I Believe.
open berry
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1145360/discussions/0/4009846212745503492/#c4577300586766340652 he didnt mention how many but there is definitely mention of upcoming late game cosmetics
pale grail
The lyre is the only decoration you can interact with i think
glad stag
Also I believe Poseidon can give you gems.
open berry
the lyre is connected with a prophecy, there are others you can interact with, lyre isnt the sole one but the others are just for flavour text
normal kiln
yeah he also has a boon that gives you +% on gems and darkness
sudden tulip
yeah gem grind isnt too hard when your run is just about that
does the +% gems work for gaea's treasure
charon item
normal kiln
i have no idea i basically never take it lol
this... this is probably why i still have so much to unlock
all about that dying at high heat
but hey, at least there’s stuff left to do
sudden tulip
staying at higher heat keeps it more fun
normal kiln
big agree
sudden tulip
the grind is tedious
i just wanted to get it over with (for the titan blood) and move on to doing everything at 32+
wasnt very enjoyable
but at least now, I dont have to worry about dying in between
normal kiln
haha fair
yeah rn i’m trying to push all weapons to 26, then it’ll be 32 all the way i guess
sudden tulip
why 26
clear oracle
Hellmode maybr?
sudden tulip
isnt that 25?
clear oracle
Well close enough
normal kiln
no real reason
it’s halfway between 20 and 32 is all, and otherwise that’s a pretty big jump
sudden tulip
i like the big jumps tbh
clear oracle
5 - 32 gang
sudden tulip
but 40+ is gonna hurt
my jumps were like 10-23 and 20-32
23 just cuz of the weekly challenge
clear oracle
There was a guy who did 1 to 43 I think
clear oracle
Silly stuff
sudden tulip
sounds like a dead cells level difficulty jump lol
no FO to FO2 is probably crazy
i made FO1 my standard before i went to FO2
normal kiln
i more or less skipped to FO2
it was pain
not sure i recommend
but i think the learning is faster this way
split kelp
No FO to FO2 was what cost me my longest streak in the end. Turns out ol' daddy-o on FO2 is a whole different animal than without it.
normal kiln
FO2+EM3 is still my biggest roadblock v. 40 heat
oh yeah
you basically need to relearn boss fights to a certain degree
sudden tulip
i feel like i'd rather max HL than take EM3
normal kiln
i also have max HL
someday i need to learn to deal with TD and/or LC, but until then my options at 40 are limited
sudden tulip
Take TD2 but 0 JS, 0 CP
normal kiln
i play this game so slow lol
pale grail
Same here
split kelp
TD1 is usually free heat. TD2 can get tight.
open berry
as someone who does not enjoy high heat play, you all sound like masochists to me 😌
pale grail
My fastest is 22 min
sudden tulip
you do know the good ol' press escape while trying to choose rooms right
normal kiln
yeah
sudden tulip
as someone who does not enjoy high heat play, you all sound like masochists to me 😌
its all about managing the conditions of the pact
open berry
im well aware
normal kiln
i’m getting to the point now where i can/should probably start attempting TD
normal kiln
as someone who does not enjoy high heat play, you all sound like masochists to me 😌
oh no this is literally true
love me some delicious pain
split kelp
I also don't play high heat. Finished 32 once to get that statue out of the way, never gonna do that again.
sudden tulip
roguelikes are usually for masochists
open berry
once a game starts to feel more of a chore to play then i stop. high heat feels like a chore to me. pushing difficulty isnt my thing lol. im here for the characters and story, not the actual gameplay aspect
sudden tulip
but this game is different
clear oracle
I used to do high heat until it's not too much fun. I think 32 heat streak is a challenging yet fun goal.
sudden tulip
I came to this game from dead cells so high heat is where im going for sure
open berry
see i wanted to like dead cells but meh
clear oracle
or you can join the speedracing community
sudden tulip
dead cells is for masochists
clear oracle
we do like 5 -11 heat, but we do it fast
open berry
actually we discussed this in this channel once, how some aspects of dead cells feel more punishing to the player while hades doesnt take that approach lol
normal kiln
30 mins before it gets hard? eh
clear oracle
dead cells was too slow paced for me
do Hades racing 😉
i'm shilling so hard for the Hermes Cup right now lmao
sudden tulip
30 mins before it gets hard? eh
Rn, 30 mins is when it gets ez
normal kiln
maybe i just played it super slow as well idk
sudden tulip
dead cells is terribly balanced compared to hades too
but i find it super fun nevertheless
sudden tulip
if you havent unlocked a boss cell you havent really gotten to the difficult part
normal kiln
i absolutely haven’t got to the difficult parts
sudden tulip
is hermes cup just one seed
normal kiln
do Hades racing 😉
wait did you just ask me to take part in a speedrunning contest
i’m pretty sure there are few people who run this game slower than me lol
normal kiln
oh they quoted me
clear oracle
it was mostly for both of you if you want something fun that's not high heat
clear oracle
that, too 😄
sudden tulip
is there any speedrun without nemesis sword
open berry
that actually is fairly fast
sudden tulip
lol mine is like 16 or 17
open berry
fast and speedrunning fast are two different things friend
sudden tulip
well it definitely depends on heat
normal kiln
i guess
sudden tulip
i take JS a lot
open berry
the average length of a run is about ~25 minutes usually, once you get into the swing of things
most people will take 30-40 minutes
sudden tulip
JS and CP make it way longer
normal kiln
that was 12 heat iirc
open berry
so yeah sub 20 is honestly decent, nothing to put yourself down over just bc its not insanely fast lol
clear oracle
speed racing is also different from speedrunning
normal kiln
i mean, it’s not too bad you’re right
sudden tulip
speedrunning wud depend a lot on RNG
normal kiln
but my runs are mostly >30 mins
clear oracle
speed racing you face head to head with another person to race to the end.
normal kiln
i’ve had runs thatve been almost an hour
open berry
i think perceptions on this server tend to get skewed too bc theres more active people that do high heat runs or speedrun and stuff when those things dont reflect on the majority at all
clear oracle
also true what tatz says
sudden tulip
all my Rama runs are >30 mins
normal kiln
yeah i haven’t broken 30 with any bow yet
sudden tulip
hera with full fog build is ez 20 min
normal kiln
honestly you’re probably right, i’m definitely not comparing myself to the average
open berry
the important thing is that you're having fun with it :v
normal kiln
indeed
clear oracle
I wonder what the average run time for people is
my guess would be around 28-30 mins.
clear oracle
misery builds character
open berry
theres probably q&a coming after 1.0 launch, someone should def ask if sgg is willing to give us an estimated avg run time
sudden tulip
I've played so many games and not had any fun
normal kiln
misery builds character
misery and FO2
sudden tulip
- the playerbase of league of legends
clear oracle
I stopped playing League and just watch its Esport scene now. Way more enjoyable.
anyhow, off topics xD
normal kiln
okay but back to speed
sudden tulip
sometimes games do become like a second job
sudden tulip
unless your job is fun which i doubt
normal kiln
i wonder what’d happen if i tried that
sudden tulip
just FO2 and TD2
clear oracle
to go fast, just put Tight Deadline on and consciously go fast.
sudden tulip
fists are best speedrun material for me
open berry
@clear oracle ||worlds later this month||
but yeah also theres a timer in settings you can turn on if you havent done that yet so you can actively see how long your runs are taking
normal kiln
honestly i kinda wanna learn TD just cause survival rooms are so annoying
clear oracle
TSM TSM TSM
clear oracle
yeah, def put on TD, even just for fun
clear oracle
that's the first heat I put on
sudden tulip
I found TD2 fun with the fists on a good build
but when the build isnt great TD really makes you feel bad
lol
clear oracle
Just put Doom on Attack, Divine Dash, and look for Merciful End
clear oracle
there you go, most OP fists build, if not the most OP build in the game
sudden tulip
^ what i used for 32 fists
all you really need to know is dont use JS and CP and also pause when choosing rooms
or items in shop
fierce tendon
I presume you like that on Zag Fists for the Dodge chance and attack speed?
clever oasis
Just put Doom on Attack, Divine Dash, and look for Merciful End
this is a fist build? i thought doom on fast attacks isn't great
open tiger
It is with Merciful End
clever oasis
so every time you dash attack, it deals 50 damage?
open tiger
I don't know exactly how it works, I haven't actually played with it before. But I've seen people talking about it enough xD
drifting citrus
you apply doom with your dash strike, and the dash itself also hits the target, setting off the doom instantly
so you do doom damage + combo damage (+ dash strike and divine dash damage), every time you dash strike
sudden tulip
I presume you like that on Zag Fists for the Dodge chance and attack speed?
should be fine on talos too ig? but using the special is clunky and prolly a reduction in dps
clever oasis
ah, got it.
Your attacks that can Deflect immediately activate Doom effects.
this sounded like you have to deflect to trigger doom, but it's that you attack an enemy with a deflecting attack and it triggers doom
sounds strong!
sudden tulip
dire misfortune is pretty strong to get when you're using fists too
impending doom and dire misfortune are the next thing to look for after the duo
otherwise you can go defensive and take riposte and athena legendary ig
if rng allows for either
clever oasis
cool, gotta try it
supple dagger
...out of boredom, I really did just have a hilarious joke-theory on what's going on on the surface of Hades...
clear oracle
do tell :3
supple dagger
The Biggest, Most Awful, Most Tragic Event in Human History :3
open tiger
👀
supple dagger
I'm definitely being vague and not pulling this from something else entirely different/removed from something else. hehehe
open tiger
Of course not
supple dagger
Will say that I've been very distant from this server for a while. How is everyone? any minor chatter from the higher-ups? we get a sillouhette yet?
clear oracle
just an announcement that the game is coming for Switch, as well as a Fall release date. nothing else.
open berry
switch
clear oracle
but I would wager it's right around the corner
drifting citrus
we're in fall rn so
open berry
dont worry that typo gave me a laugh
supple dagger
If not late September, I hope mid-October. :3 I'd laugh if they really say "October 31, surprise! we got that update you've been asking for!"
clear oracle
I do wonder if they will release the game for the next gen console. It's a bit of a weird situation right now.
drifting citrus
hades for gameboy advance
clear oracle
that would be the day. time to dust off my little GBA
although I would 100% buy a ROM from SGG if they ever want to release a "mini" game.
drifting citrus
tamagatchi cerberus when
stark raven
I jumped from 3 heat to 8 heat and managed to finish the run! Heat is actually less scary than I thought
clear oracle
It really is.
open berry
its really intimidating when you first run into it but yeah its just genuinely funny
stark raven
Yeah at first I was like WAIT WHY DOES HE HAVE MINIGUNS ON A CHARIOT
But it was just too funny
open berry
for funzies :)
stark raven
His laugh and mask were the best things
open berry
hes just having fun
compact lake
stark raven
That feeling when your lute starts to sound better
Ah yes, when it suddently becomes a guitar
But yeah it feels good
Knowing how it all started lol
And yeah Theseus is just kind of living his days as a champion, I'm envious
Also, question: what do I need to do to unlock the bow secret aspect?
drifting citrus
check pins
stark raven
heck you're right
Thank you!
I somehow unlocked all the others without doing research, but I barely use the bow so I didn't meet the condition
I just noticed: Hypnos is not sleeping on the job???
I'm so proud of him
clever oasis
is skelly's story in the game? he told me his story but then told me he was lying and i was thrown for a loop lol. i also noticed that one of the skulls that appear after you beat a run has a coin in its mouth, just like skelly...
searching history told me some stuff 😄
crude obsidian
how do i unlock the last bit of bonding with hermes?
crude obsidian
hmm thought i just tried that
crude obsidian
alright, i'll give it another go
olive glacier
;_; Only two achievements I haven't completed ||The Lyre achievement, and getting Greater Recall boon to have received all of Hermes boons||
stark raven
You can do it!! They're not impossible 💪
I'm currently fighting the heroes and Theseus is all depressed because he thinks Zag has tainted his and Asterius' friendship
I'm laughing so hard right now
Poor Theseus
olive glacier
haha, that is one of my favorite conversation beats
stark raven
Now I can say the same!
I'm in Asphodel now, can't wait to see what happens next lol
stark raven
This is the best bromance I've ever witnessed.
manic yoke
Hey this is in the VERY spoilery section, but I read about a news leak that purported a 1.0 release date. Did anyone else see that?
sudden tulip
that nintendo thing?
open berry
there's no date
there was an article that supposedly had a date but as far as I know it was corrected
the official word is still "later this fall"
open berry
not that I'm aware of
manic yoke
So it means nothing?
open berry
I'll reword, it was just a rumour, it had no credibility, it meant nothing (that I've seen and am aware of)
the article was corrected fairly quickly after it was posted
manic yoke
Aw too bad. That leaked date was very soon
open berry
supergiant will make an announcement when the drop date is close, just wait for that
they'll prob ping everyone here, if you use twitter and follow them you can turn on notifs for when they post
date announcement would also mean we're running out of time to update the wiki before the large influx of new players oh god
sudden tulip
is there a server for wiki editing
drifting citrus
wouldn’t you need to update the wiki anyways after it releases
fierce tendon
It's easier to update it to 1.0 if everything is correct for the version beforehand
pale grail
I just realize Asterius amour is heavily inspired by Saint Seiya
open tiger
after looking up what that is, I can see the resemblance
feral flower
You mean, golden armor?
supple dagger
Aries (the constellation) is a ram. You're thinking of Taurus, the Bull.
pale grail
Taurus amour is quite different though, the Aries amour have a much better resemblance
supple dagger
Honestly, I'm out of the loop anyway; I figured that was one minor correction out of everything. We got rams, we got bulls, we got goats.
we got lions and fishes too
and a crab
ofc the more I think about it, the more I wouldn't mind someone mentioning the constellations subtly...
stark raven
Farming duo boons for the prophecy is so exhausting
atomic forge
Luckily I did it before they added a bunch of them into the game. Must suck to do it now.
stark raven
I'm only missing 5 of them but still the gods refuse to give me the duos even when I have the prerequisites and I'm like 
I think they just heard me because I just found one
4 to go
atomic forge
Just checking if you have the Mirror of night option that increases the chance of getting them? You probably do but it's the only advice that I can give.
stark raven
yep I have it maxed! It's just a matter of grinding I fear
pure belfry
I had one duo boon left on the prophecy and then they added more lmao
stark raven
Oof I'm sorry for you :c
pure belfry
Hahaha it's okay, I think duo boons are my favourite to get anyway because they feel more exciting
and I don't mind putting more hours into the game
stark raven
true!
(I was waiting for Poseidon-Ares boon and instead got the Ares-Athena that I already had )
pure belfry
rip (but I hear great things about that duo at least)
Curse of Drowning always makes me take a beat to rethink how to use it bc it's so different from a regular cast
atomic forge
Finally got my first Chaos fish. It's a legendary too. After what feels like 10000 years.
low blade
Ya I’ve seen one single Chaos fish ever
I almost threw the controller out of shock and joy
stark raven
My brain kindly handed me the memory of Chaos laughing when defeating dad using their keepsakes
clever oasis
tfw you choose a room and then hear the fish "ding!"
kindred forum
open tiger
Do you know what you need to do to get it?
rich sluice
there's no prerequisite as far as I'm aware, it's just super rare. Bringing a maxed out chaos egg would definitely help with farming for it
open berry
@rich sluice you need at least one other chaos boon
open tiger
ohh lol
mystic mortar
imagine
trying to get a legendary fish from chaos
open tiger
lol
normal kiln
i mean, i wouldn’t say i’m trying
i’m just kind of waiting for it to happen
has to eventually... right?
mystic mortar
probably
if you're lucky
how many thousands of hours are you planning on investing into Hades?
normal kiln
lol
open tiger
lmao
normal kiln
anyone know what the % of a fishing point is?
just absently trying to calculate how many hours that would actually take
prolly a lot
pale grail
They said 2%
normal kiln
oh oof
mystic mortar
2%, if you haven't had another fishing point recently enough to block it
normal kiln
oh man i thought this math would be easy
mystic mortar
lure forces fish regardless
and HUUUUUUUGE CATCH gets rid of the restriction
but you normally have a bunch of chambers between fish
pale grail
Huge catch... to get that one is a problem on it own
mystic mortar
it only has 2 prereqs
so you can get it on the 4th boon if you're lucky
that's usually still tartarus
normal kiln
4th boon lol
mystic mortar
but it's usually not actually going to happen perfectly
normal kiln
routed fishing run when
mystic mortar
Good idea
If I wasn't busy frantically doing literally anything but routing a fishing run I'd do that.
lofl
pale grail
I still need that fish and the membership card to fill up my codex
normal kiln
forget heat pushing or speed running
broken stratus
I wondered if there were super special fish, but I’ve also been trying not to look up info since I want to be surprised
normal kiln
fishing runs are the new thing to go for
mystic mortar
FISH%
it's better than a hundo
@broken stratus there are super special fish
but you won't find them
until you have hundreds of hours ingame like me
heh heh heh
normal kiln
or just get lucky
if you find a chaos room, and get perfect catches every time it’s
checks notes
1 in 1000
pale grail
Still no less than 100 hours in I believe
normal kiln
blasphemy
mystic mortar
My crappy laptop can't run hades
it's not like I uninstalled or anything
vast basin
cries i have to borrow a friends laptop everytime i want to play
mystic mortar
On the bright side, I should (hopefully) no longer be evacuated tomorrow
so I'll be able (probably) to access my pc and do some runs
mystic mortar
I'm working on something else rn
maybe I'll do some FISH% later
normal kiln
lol fair enough
maybe i’ll do it
this is the kind of record breaking i’m made for
doesn’t require skill, only meme
sudden tulip
just saw the hermes cup interviews
are 1.0 changes revealed by Amir spoilers
there's a nice tight deadline change
im probably late
high nacelle
achievements have icons now 👀
sudden tulip
👀
sudden tulip
they announced the blood price update release date only one day before the actual update
wonder if they'll do that this time too
open berry
wakes up
gold ares gold ares gold ares good ares
.. leaves that typo
that's funny though that works with my profile. it's gold. and ares themed. fate
frozen jolt
haha i saw that earlier and i thought wow tatz will be so happy
stark raven
same
open berry
sudden tulip
what is the icon for the had to happen achievement
frozen jolt
the three fates
crimson temple
It is probably a statue that is, or will be in the game somewhere.
sudden tulip
the three fates
three?
i guess the ones on the side are heads, cant see clearly but that would make sense
mystic mortar
does Master of Arms have an icon?
sudden tulip
nope
i just noticed the name for the final quest huh
family secrets
so i guess hades does know where she is
or something along those lines
mystic mortar
she gave a description
it's possible she was talking about a specific place that they both knew
very unlikely, though
drifting citrus
the letter she left
frozen jolt
spoilered for those who dont want to look at the achievements yet, im pretty sure those are the three fates
fierce tendon
That would almost be taken to suggest what the new contractor items would look like
crimson temple
A paperweight to hold down the increasingly growing Fated List, perhaps?
fierce tendon
It certainly has the trappings of the Moirai
sudden tulip
the letter she left
uh...i guess i havent come across it yet
mystic mortar
how many runs have you done
mystic mortar
you've seen it
mystic mortar
on D A D D Y's desk, in the first memory sequence
mystic mortar
thus did you, entirely by accident, learn the identity of your birthmother
and definitely not by the old man telling you
sudden tulip
she left a description of the place she was at?
mystic mortar
yes
iirc it's on the beach somewhere, with a nice garden
there could be a specific such beach that happens to be special to both of them
but it's pretty unlikely imo
lunar kiln
the only character design i'll accept for the fates is if they end up looking like the golden girls from the show of the same name
open berry
[theme starts up in the distance]
lunar kiln
"belgo, they're four not three" yeah well there's a secret 4th fate. there
open berry
dress up cerb
strong pilot
restored the run I almost lost due to a freeze on ||papa's|| death screen and got the "It was all a dream!" narrator dialog after I won
like DAMN DUDE IT ALMOST WAS
normal kiln
lol nice
open berry
alma doing some wiki work today i see
vivid eagle
charon could probably smack hades at the back of the head
and buy off every wretch he hired against him
as well as the entire underworld
lilac tusk
now im just imagining charon bonking hades in the face with the end of his big oar
lilac tusk
Charon companion keepsake where he just whacks someone with his oar when
stark raven
Charon goes bonk
whole heath
fierce tendon
BONK Go to Underworld Jail
topaz brook
