in the words of zag,
"how else can i show you how i feel other than by giving you these bottles every once in a while"
#h1-story-discussion
visual laurel
bleak osprey
zag is relatable because i, too, don't know how to show affection to my loved ones in ways other than giving them things.
merry sorrel
I can imagine the loved ones with a collection of empty bottles and stuff
That sounds sweet actually
visual laurel
what if they don't drink all of them....gotta save one at least
hollow garden
It doesn't have any purpose gameplay wise. It doesn't help you in a run.
So if you only care about Hades for the gameplay, I understand the mentality.
However, I do question what you're doing here if you have absolutely no care for lore and story in a Supergiant title. (No offense, that above came off as a bit harsh. It's just... Kinda interesting to me tbh)
That's... Kinda in the deal, tbh.
And the broker does offer trades for other currencies you'd likely find more useful (for your Ambrosia)
visual laurel
Y'know, if people want to order a multi-course meal and then only eat like, half the steak, that's their prerogative
it's not like the gameplay is bad! it's just that it is only like half the experience one is paying for here
I feel like it's valid to want ambrosia to have a gameplay purpose, but there are for example gameplay elements I might never make use of, but I don't argue their purpose in the game or their right to be there either
Like heat gates
Or actually just heat in general lol
Not for me! I understand why it's there tho
dry lodge
It just doesn't feel like ambrosia does anything after you've encountered all the gods and given them 1. It sometimes is useful for deals with the broker. But other than that it just stops being relevant. Story trumps gameplay in my mind, but having an mainstream currency just not do anything past a certain point is something overlooked in the design.
digital crag
It's the not do anything part that's subjective
west moat
comeon sir, what's a priceless bottle of the necter of the gods between friends?
atomic forge
I feel like the Wretched Broker is the fix for the situation of a "mainstream currency" lose a purpose.
Since running a few Dio builds, I've started to appreciate Premium Vintage for a little bit of defense in what would otherwise be a wash room.
It's not like Heat, which is actually-factually useless once you have more than 200. Again, the Broke is the fix for this situation. It's not super efficient, I suppose.
hollow garden
yeah thats more what i was trying to say venhediss, just didnt really come out the way i wanted it to
its not that it does nothing past 1 per everyone, its just what it does doesn't change the gameplay at all
and atm at least I don't really have an issue with that. Ambrosia is a great reward for me to go after considering I've unlocked everything that has a key or darkness cost. I'll even take it over everything else just cause its something to put things into and I get rewarded for doing so (but not in a way that changes the game, just lets me uncover cool new interactions)
candid bear
with 500% dmg as well nice
dire adder
Interesting, because Ambrosia is the only currency I am invested in. I am stockpiling it for all those locked hearts in the Codex and will buy it from Broker whenever possible.
dawn ore
I'm pretty sure 100 ambrosia is plenty to unlock the rest of the hearts when they are available
hollow garden
Since I have everything upgraded, I'm doing the same with Ambrosia
cosmic crescent
I am somehow stuck at 50 ambrosia.
Somehow, the broker offers just enough to keep me at around that number
while my heat just keeps rising and rising, no matter how much I spend >,>
verbal magnet
I made it to the minotaur on my 5th run or so but can't even get past the hydra now lol 😦
does the game just end after the theseus fight?
ivory spire
For now, yes, but the next update will add a new zone
frozen jolt
well, it returns you to the house
you can keep playing as much as youd like, theres just nowhere to progress after elysium. but yeah, there will be soon!
lyric zinc
how long did it take for yall to get the meg getting her clothes from ur room conversation im on like my 77th run but u still havent gotten it
cosmic crescent
I did not anticipate it so I did not count.
I would guess that the amount of attempted runs does not count. It's probably more along the lines of "killing her X times" and/or having a certain level of affection with her.
somber gull
Yes affection with Meg is important if you want that event
atomic forge
Where does she live
If she has a place to put her stuff
Where is it
This is critical lore aaaaaaaaaa
visual laurel
behind the forbidden doors probably gkdfhgj
hollow garden
I'm pretty sure that's what you get for maxxing her ambrosia count, but I could be wrong
dawn ore
I just want to have the option to max out the hearts already!
somber gull
hey does anyone have any screenshots of Megaera's bullet hell attack? I need it for Reasons
strange plaza
so I just got tisiphone instead of megaera for the first time
what triggered that?
visual laurel
After you've beaten meg a certain number of times, her sisters begin to show up at random
waxen crater
I though it had to do with Heat
Beyond 60 Heat almost 70% of my 1st Boss Enounters are with Tysiphone
somber gull
Purely a coincidence haha
atomic forge
Tisiphone scares the bejeezus out of me, and I love Meg, but if I were going to attempt more high heat runs I'd want Tisiphone. She telegraphs her attacks more openly than any other boss in the game.
hollow garden
She's very telegraphed but her attacks can be quite annoying to dodge
I think I prefer Alecto the most, and Meg the least since playing with increased enemies increases her adds. Tisi I'd place in the middle because she doesn't feel annoying/spammy, but does feel like she's the slowest to fight.
atomic forge
Tisiphone at least will cancel her attacks with any sort of speed when you hit her Impervious phases.
Every other boss in the game will run through the rest of their attack (Enraged Alecto spamming explosions, I'm looking at you) or even start another attack (Bone Hydra, I'm looking at you) before they drop their shield.
Tisiphone does her weird thing where she'll break off in the middle of an attack and finish it after shrinking the arena.
lunar kiln
Shes like "wait a minute im hurt lemme break a pillar or twelve" "ok where was i"
stiff geyser
Tis is my favorite boss to fight
solar depot
"muuuuuuuurrrrr--wait hold on
--rrrrrderrrrrrrr"
small narwhal
To be on the safe side, I'm gonna post this here rather than in gameplay. I just finished a heatless (because I'm not THAT good yet to challenge myself) run with the sword and this is the build path I went for this time around. I got THREE chaos boons which was absolutely crazy good luck. I even got a legendary tier upgrade which I didn't know was possible. Any critiques on this build? What could I have alternatively chosen to improve it?
https://imgur.com/NPFIkor
digital crag
it's safe for gameplay dw
small narwhal
Oh and frankly, I'm doing my best currently to clear without biases like "xyz is broken" or "abc is a must have"
small narwhal
This is true lol, I just meant in the grand scheme of what is typically available from the gods I chose like Zeus and Aphrodite
lemme pull it up
hollow garden
For a no heat run I'd say nearly everything works tbh
Dio + Aphrodite is usually a solid combo if you can get Low Tolerance and a weak duration extender
atomic forge
I still cannot believe they put in an ending where Zagreus dies running into a wall painted to look like the exit like he's Wile E. Coyote.
bleak osprey
that's one of my favourites
hollow garden
wait they did
cosmic crescent
They did.
sour hollow
I shouldn't have searched certain names on Wikipedia lol, were enough spoilers to me
waxen crater
guys
guys
GUYS!!!
so much happened in these last 5 runs
can I show some screenshots???
stable magnet
Go ahead
somber gull
upload them to imgur or a similar webhost first!
stable magnet
I will gladly keep that a secret until I get it myself
waxen crater
could you open that alright?
Im so happy to have gotten this, I though it was a myth/not-implemented yet x3
stable magnet
yea
waxen crater
I ALMOST got Asterius/Theseu with 75 Heat in this run
never got so far before with this much heat
1405 Darkness in a single run! x3
waxen crater
oh, Im mixing up the heat values all the time
right before my 100th run, I went 138 Heat (current maximum)
500% Damage
2 Life Insurance
80% Convenience Fee
50% Pain Tolerance
50% Whipped Frenzy
50% Shared Misery
I got 2 hits on Megaera before she insta-killed me XD
also, one thing I find funny on Frenzy runs
as soon as I see a Glutton or a Crystal
i must IMMEDIATELY GET OUT OF THE WAY
doesnt matter if I think they havent seen me yet
they just TELEPORT onto me XD (as for the crystal, their beams seem automatic)
like, crystals dealing 16dmg a second
with insta-lock
that was scary XD
I try something really high for a few runs
than later I try 60 or 75 again
ah
and I think its really unfair that Whipped Frenzy affects Thanatos
it was like
Thanatos: 27
Zagreus: 3
last time I played a non-heat run, it was
Thanatos: 4
Zagreus: 28
hollow garden
Does it actually affect him cause that explains why he always beat me when I was running it
Tho I definitely don't recommend Frenzy in general. Try outrunning the Minotaur on Frenzy, or the god attacks from Theseus.
Since the final room is still a huge difficulty spike compared to the rest of the game (imo) and Frenzy just makes it incredibly difficult (esp since no slow effects work on bosses)
candid bear
Run the bull into the walls, if you need more time, you can dash back through him because he has a fixed turn radius
waxen crater
oh, I never though about dashing back through him!
usually I just keep dashing until he hits something
wish he could hit Theseus tho XD
I normally have Aphro, Dio or Ares dash, so he always gets damage from following me
very rarely do I get Zeus Dash
Artemis, Athena and Poseidon dash I avoid
west moat
athena dash is pretty good tbh
waxen crater
I normally avoid Artemis like the plague
but this last run
my god
she was EVERYWHERE
and always giving me Epics
ended up with +3 Amo, 300 Damage when Dislodged from Artemis
+63% Cast Damage from Chaos
165 Damage from Zeus Epic Cast + the one from him that makes eletric stuff bounce 6 more times
like
I was throwing those around like popcorn, killing mobs effortlessly
it was a really fun, really rare built to come across
yeah, I took athena dash once, wasnt bad
just
wasnt fun also
I really hated her cast at first too, Im better at it now
I really like her Wrath tho
6 seconds Impervious, really quick charging ~~ me likes
hollow garden
Deflect really counters that Minotaur charge if you can land one at the right time.
Athena dash is imo the best dash in the game. It's basically an immunity shield while dashing and coming out of dash, extending the amount of i-frames you get
atomic forge
Divine Dash is best Dash, Aphro is right behind with Artemis being a contender for Dashing Wallop Shield, Spread Fire Rail, and Coronacht.
waxen crater
hmmmmm.... I really start learning skill names....
everyone uses skill names here ><
hollow garden
It's helpful to remember that Primary boons are typically called "Something Strike" and Special boons are typically called "Something Flourish"
And given the adjective you can usually guess
Don't be afraid to go "what boon is that again" cause I definitely still do it.
Lots of us have just played way too much :p
waxen crater
oh!!! thx x3
drifting citrus
alternatively, refer to old boons that have been removed so you can confuse new players
y'all, lifedrinker is so good??? like wth
west moat
titan toppler!
waxen crater
I have 106 runs in
but that honestly feels like just the tip of the eventual iceberg XD
what are those?? owo
atomic forge
I broke 300 a little while ago. I've only been playing three months.
drifting citrus
titan toppler was the old athena dash, before the dash rework
waxen crater
I've been playying since january
drifting citrus
lifedrinker was a hammer boon for sword that restored HP on a hit, removed a long, long time ago
upper vigil
i still miss when it was called titan toppler
waxen crater
but honestly didnt play the full month of Dio update, only came back when the Beefy Update hit
west moat
it was called titan toppler for a while post-rework
waxen crater
oh my, lifedrinker sounds like a dream ❤
west moat
which is why I remember it
upper vigil
divine dash fits the system but titan toppler had its own flavor and feel
waxen crater
oh yeah, I remember the ancient athena dash!
gosh, the dash is so much better now x3
west moat
divine dash has no flavour! it needs... defending dash. yes.
atomic forge
I miss three dashes, but wooow not having the stick at the end is huge.
west moat
(no.)
runic terrace
oh are we talking abt titan toppler? i miss it every day
atomic forge
Didn't they just rename Titan Toppler?
drifting citrus
petition to bring back titan toppler
runic terrace
titan toppler was GOOD and the pause let you PLAN YOUR DEFLECTS AHEAD OF TIME
waxen crater
does anyone have a gif or video of the titan toppler animation?
runic terrace
if i wanna deflect something now i gotta run around and just Hope i meet it
drifting citrus
@atomic forge i mean, you can say that since it was still "titan toppler" for a bit after the rework
runic terrace
ok basically the old dash had a pause and then you'd move
hollow garden
Titan Toppler's delay was good when the dash wasn't instant. Now though ugh that would be awful
runic terrace
so if like...you saw a witch projectile coming, you could try to meet it
hollow garden
The radius on Divine Dash is actually fairly generous from what I've found, so I try to dash near or thru projectiles.
upper vigil
i didn't like the pause at all
pause to plan your next move? more like pause to get Hit
cunning needle
i picked old titan toppler Once before it got reworked to be instant
never again. it messes up my whole rhythm and makes even just moving across a map a chore
shy socket
Old titan toppler was fresh, its the rhythm change that made it fair
This one is just flat out strong
neon yarrow
does anyone know what that fully automatic part means?
digital crag
it means you can just hold down the cast button
digital crag
well the automatic part comes with every tier
rapid zinc
It's really strong
neon yarrow
is it really?
digital crag
if you have 7 bloodstones and aphrodite cast absolutely
hollow garden
Its normal variant? Personally, I think that one's not very strong.
Its Epic variant is insane however
Its epic variant is like 80% cast time reduction
neon yarrow
I've never gone a cast run, I only pickk it if it's the only thing left
hollow garden
Combine that with any kind of Artemis cast focused build and you just found "Bloodstone Minigun: The Adventure of Hermes"
neon yarrow
I should try it tho
digital crag
ares legendary cast run
do it
hollow garden
Just imagine Rapid Fire Cast, True Shot, Burst Fire, Quick Reload, Exit Wounds, and Support Fire. Its hilariously broken fun.
and it all bypasses poor Theseus's shield :kappa:
neon yarrow
which one specifically?
hollow garden
All Artemis projectiles ignore shields
neon yarrow
NANI?!
neon yarrow
I had 4 death defieds, ran into a shield warrior room, went down to 1
hollow garden
and her wrath
neon yarrow
I hate those guys with a passion
hollow garden
Its one of the reasons I find Artemis casts generally just nice if I don't have anything better when Elysium rolls around
Although in all honesty Aphrodite's cast right now is so strong it ought to be hit with a nerf hammer cause it kinda makes all the other casts look pale in comparison.
Even though I love it so much, its honestly way too good compared to some of the others
neon yarrow
how so?
hollow garden
(That or just some of them need buffs, personally I prefer buffs why did I suggest nerfs)
neon yarrow
its just a blast
digital crag
the range isn't much of a downside when everything dies in 3 blasts
neon yarrow
huh
the way I look at picking upgrades is "if it doesnt help me with Theseus, dont bother"
I can't beat him for the life of me
only twice
digital crag
honestly that's why i don't go with zeus or poseidon casts
hollow garden
Hades is a game with lots of fast mobility. The shorter/mid range of Aphrodite's cast isn't as much of an issue when you simply don't need to be sniping enemies across the map (and if you do, you don't really use Casts for that since they're limited ammo)
Combine that with the fact that it inflicts one of the best debuffs in the game (if not the best tbh) and that it can hit multiple times and you got yourself a bonafide meta option there.
Weak is one of the better curse effects in the game since its easy to get, and lasts a very long time compared to other effects
Which makes it great to proc Privileged Status if you have unlocked it.
However, I think Dionysus's cast is incredibly underrated. That thing is strong.
digital crag
anyone else use dionysus for a cast based run
hollow garden
Dionysus cast is like turning your cast into a souped up version of the rail special
Not to mention it works incredibly well with the rail itself since the cast restricts enemy movement while inside, something the rail struggles to do (stunning/slowing enemies)
(and its damage is ridiculous, its like Dionysus is mixing those drinks with thermonuclear weapons)
neon yarrow
whats it do?
hollow garden
It turns your cast into a targetable bomb basically
digital crag
i need to try for scintillating feast some day
hollow garden
so you right click and it lobs it where your cursor is, once it lands, it inflicts a large amount of damage to anything within the blast radius and covers that area of the room in "festive fog" (which slows and randomly stuns enemies while inside it)
hollow garden
Dio's cast was super popular when it first came out then kinda just faded into obscurity when the Murder Death Kill Update came out (not sure why) but its still very good.
neon yarrow
but that kinda brings up my opinion
hollow garden
Dionysus is typically a strong pick, though it depends on the weapon you're using
Something like Poison is very strong on the Rail Primary, easy to upkeep and maintain. I'd say its less strong on a weapon like the bow, or the spear, perhaps the shield.
digital crag
i think dio cast strong support for other builds but for a primarily cast-based build not the best
hollow garden
in b4 i do a primary cast build with dio cast as the focus, and run it at 120 heat :kappa:
neon yarrow
yea i mianly use the bow
hollow garden
I feel like my response to anything these days is "lemme just go run that with 120 heat because I enjoy suffering"
digital crag
still good it's just that aphro and ares outclass him
hollow garden
i mean if I was going Ares cast I would go the duo tbh
digital crag
either the duo or legendary tbh
hollow garden
there's really imo not much of a reason to run his cast primarily with how fast some of those late game enemies are. They don't like to stay put into the effects. (without the duo or legendary)
digital crag
yeah you either go all in on ares cast or don't take it
bleak osprey
false
hollow garden
in b4 i get bigbrained
bleak osprey
in some runs i've taken ares cast as late as elysium just so i can throw it at theseus's face
digital crag
maybe if you have the hermes slow legendary
hollow garden
doesnt he block it if its in front of him tho
bleak osprey
no? i haven't noticed him blocking it
digital crag
pretty sure he can't block aoe casts
hollow garden
See I thought that too
digital crag
i mean he can block poseidon
hollow garden
he can block Dio cast if the center of the effect is in front of him
just like greatshields
digital crag
he can block projectile casts but blade rift goes on the ground
hollow garden
ok what shields can block is a bit uh strange
because id assume blade rift is like every other AoE and shields in the game (where they block it if you draw a line from the epicenter to the shield and if that line hits the shield and not the enemy its a block)
digital crag
i don't remember him blocking last time i had blade rifts but i didn't also have hunting blades not sure if that makes a difference
waxen crater
what things pass by Theseu's shield?
So far I've used Festive Lobs, Super Nova, Triple Bomb and Zeus Wratch/Dash
they're like, the only ones I know he absolutely cant defend against
digital crag
piercing fire and piercing barrage hammer upgrades
rapid zinc
Piercing Fire is for Rail attack, Piercing Barrage is for Bow special
atomic forge
Theseus is completely vulnerable to Blade Rifts, can confirm.
hollow garden
To my knowledge, Theseus is only vulnerable to the rail special if you land the center of the explosion behind his shield. Otherwise he will block it. (Just like the Greatshields)
And I've played a lot of the rail. Way too much of it.
I would assume Festive Fog Cast Bombs work the same way, but I don't remember since I've only had a couple fights against him with Dionysus casts.
atomic forge
Theseus blocking Nasty and Passion Dash always bug me.
hollow garden
He blocks the dashes but not the wraths is what bugs me tbh
atomic forge
Doesn't bug me. Popping an Epic Dio Wrath right after he invokes an Olympian and he eats all the damage is very cathartic.
hollow garden
What bugs me isnt that it works, but more that it feels inconsistent
atomic forge
Fair.
hollow garden
like it should work, its a hard to use expensive ability
digital crag
eh i mean wrath should be more powerful
hollow garden
its just an inconsistency that really isnt very clear to the user (which is kind of a personal axe to grind for me in games, but /shrug)
lost gorge
@digital crag some wraths are ok, others are a little too niche, i feel a simple change would be increasing the rate at which the wrath meter filled up, i feel they only really come into effect in mini/normal boss rooms, so some more mob specific ones feel a little useless
digital crag
i agree that 100 charge wraths don't get activated enough in regular rooms
maybe they'll be fine after the fourth zone
candid bear
I think it’s fine to have wrath’s that only activate on bosses
Just make sure it’s worth it
lost gorge
It depends, aphro’s is very geared towards mob enemies, not bosses, yet it requires enough charge to only activate in bosses, making it not great. Some wrath’s simply aren’t good for bosses
waxen crater
last run I got an Epic Last Stand from Athena, recover 20% of Max HP
I also had a ton of money and was very lucky,
3 Initial Death Stands, 2 Additional Athena AND Charon Death Stands
all the while wearing Cerberus Colar for +60HP and got 2 Centaur Hearts in sequence in Erebus, so I was rocking a good 405 HP
each death stand was recovering about 115 HP XD
It was for a failed 75 Heat Run, still one of my most fun ones so far x3
also
should I start learning what boons unlock Duos and Legendaries?
hollow garden
Definitely. I build around duo boons all the time
The wiki has all of them detailed, as well as what boons you need to unlock em
hollow garden
Particular favorites of mine are Low Tolerance (Aphro/Dio) Hunting Blades (Ares/Artemis) and Curse of Longing (Aphro/Ares)
icy vale
wait a minute what are duo boons? I think I've maybe seen one once
but i don't remember how or why
somber gull
when you have certain boons from two gods, it's possible that either of them will offer you a duo boon that combines their power
so like if you have artemis attack and zeus dash, they could offer freak accident, which makes lightning strike on crits as well
brazen kestrel
i can't find the duo wiki details .. someone can link it please?
hollow garden
They're on each individual god page
There's no page with all of them (come to think of it that might be a good idea, if I ever get the time to do wiki edits maybe I'll make that page)
Since the poor mods here do enough wiki work :p
digital crag
If anyone Gud wants to add to the guide that'd be great too I can only Git so Gud
brazen kestrel
yep could be great to know all the combos
hollow garden
Is there a new player guide on the wiki?
That being said strategies and tips for bosses might also be very helpful.
frank glade
Wait, does the last biome being added mean we get to see the story's ending? Or is that still the last update before full release?
frank glade
Oh FIDDLESTICK, it is
stable magnet
DON'T HURT THE TRIPLE BOI
neon arch
IS THAT FENRIR?
warm grove
i dnt wanna hurt the pupster
frank glade
The reason he's the final boss is because no one wants to hurt him
Basically a reverse Theseus
stable magnet
IS THAT LYCAON?
cosmic crescent
IT'S CERBERUS!
stable magnet
fenrir is norse
atomic shale
they wouldn't make us kill cerberus would they
cosmic crescent
They would.
stable magnet
That's the SGG way
cosmic crescent
And it would not matter because nobody dies forever in Hell
atomic shale
im glad im not good enough at the game
to win
but in the mythology doesn't cerberus guard the gates to hades
so
that means
..
west moat
they can't do this to us
stable magnet
Bloody hell
west moat
this is a fakeout right? right?
atomic shale
hopefully
bleak osprey
the silhouettes exactly line up with cerberus's sprite and zag's main menu art
west moat
worrying
atomic shale
.
bleak osprey
as in, i'm looking at it right now in photoshop
atomic shale
yea u can also count
the teeth shines
and it's from 3 heads
but it's ok
cuz he won't die forever
so it's ok
west moat
(it's not okay!)
stable magnet
It's absolutely not okay
atomic shale
it's my way to cope
stable magnet
The times I've useb the Spiked Collar for Elysium without knowing how good the bracer is...
faint socket
yeah, the silhouettes were pretty recognizable too
here's hoping we just get to pet the dog
atomic shale
ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
bleak osprey
actually that gif is annoying me lemme just.....
atomic shale
doesnt work
tardy cedar
hey guys i have a game theory
wide wind
tbh i feel like fighting Cerberus is unlikely bc it seems like.... so unnecessarily dark
west moat
just use the ||spoiler tags|| on it
bleak osprey
oh duh it's. hang on.
tardy cedar
the ocean you can see in the teaser image means we'll run into persephone
wide wind
like what's to be gained from it?
stable magnet
welp
hollow garden
hnnngh intensifies
atomic shale
i really wish theseus would get some kind of nerf
cuz he takes all my death defies
and im spooked
tardy cedar
i mean like, after enough trial and error, theseus becomes a lot less scary
tall ingot
tardy cedar
what if skelly is the true final boss
tall ingot
This can look like 2 or 3heads
fast idol
you just need to pay him all the money
tardy cedar
what if supergiant did a countermove to our detective work
bleak osprey
The Fluffy Update
Main Feature: Pettable Cerberus
tall ingot
Cerberus, the last weapon :O
stark tulip
if I have to stab cerb this WILL be the update I cry
stark tulip
then he can catch it and we just play fetch
west moat
gently push past cerb with shield blocking...
amber canyon
Fetch with the explosive throw upgrade
west moat
no!
digital crag
catcry.png
cosmic crescent
I think a few weeks ago, they spoiled an Cerberus Pet animation
on twitter I believe
amber canyon
Pretty sure that was months ago
somber gull
It was for National Pets Day
amber canyon
Speaking of which, Hades has a clear lack of cats
I want cat shades in the new Biome
digital crag
Can You Pet The Dog is gonna be so disappointed
amber canyon
Specifically, cat shades that knock over pots
west moat
"you cannot pet the dog. you are obligated to fight the dog. -100/10."
amber canyon
Technically fighting is just very aggressive petting
atomic forge
I... Actually might have to put the game down for a minute if I have to fight Cerb.
hollow garden
I mean sure but that doesn't mean it would hurt less
amber canyon
Fair enough
I cant imagine they let us fight against Cerberus
Still want him as a flail weapon
hollow garden
I mean I want an independent wrath ability that's a dog whistle
Where Cerberus shows up and just mows everything down
atomic forge
YO.
waxen crater
honestly, if in the end, we must fight Cerberus...
I'd let him kill me without even moving
for that extra teatrical flair, that Zagreus is in shock and cant bring himself to fight his beloved doggo
I dont want to fight him either, but I will if its part of the game ...
shy glade
sgg pls hurt me and not the dog https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/487892582870024201/605962222002503691/1.jpg
bright void
Guys, I told you a while ago that's how this would end
You never actually escape and cerberus tries to stop you and you just run into a <WALL> and start over
And one day you hope you'll find cerberus not there
atomic forge
I hope these ending (specially Spears? or Fungus?) stay in the game somehow at version 1.0.
bright void
I just want that one line that Hades and Zag have about; "Ongoing Underworld renovations?"
left flume
Yeah, losing that one is gonna suck. It's funny
somber gull
Us: I would die for Cerberus
Devs, loading the rail: are you sure about that
atomic forge
Me, strapping on helmet: Yes.
somber gull
Staying in Hell for the sake of your loved ones who care about you and don’t want to see you throw yourself at someone who abandoned you? Nah
Staying for your dog? Yah
cosmic crescent
I mean, Zagreus has made it pretty clear that not even Cerberus can make him stay.
somber gull
Zag: I want to leave Hell even if it means I have to fight my dog
The player base: interesting point! Interesting point. But no
cosmic crescent
So, do we know what the next Biome is going to be?
I still think it's going to be the River Styx
And in that place, it's usually Charon and Cerberus who are the most prominent figures.
somber gull
There’s the Mourning Fields, Styx, and Isle of the Blessed all as options
I’d be surprised if it was the last one though
hollow garden
yeah same since that is usually considered just part of elysium
somber gull
I think the entrance/the rivers in all make sense
lyric zinc
do yall have any story theories
so far the only narrative parallels ive noticed is love and separation ie persephone/hades, orpheus/eurydice, and achilles/pat
stark tulip
I mean. We know the olympians will probably turn out to be bad somehow right. I feel like everything hints towards that
atomic forge
No shut up Artemis is perfect and we're gonna be friends forever.
hollow garden
Isn't Heracles confirmed to be in Olympus though
Hades has a line where he says "if not for Zeus Heracles would be down here where he really belongs"
cosmic crescent
Never heard that one.
@atomic forge I mean, Artemis has pretty much shown herself to be racist.
And unreasonably racist, too!
atomic forge
This about the "half-god" lines when you spurn her at a Trial?
cosmic crescent
Yes.
atomic forge
Got it.
cosmic crescent
The funny part about that one is that it does not make sense either way.
Zagreus father is Hades, the mother Persephone, so he is, in theory, a full fledged god. But the Olympians don't know that.
They think that the Mother is Nox
Who is still also a goddess, so calling him off for being a half god does not make sense.
The only reason I could come up with would be that Nyx is a primordial goddess in the lore and being considered a Cthonic Goddess according to Achilles' Codex.
Not sure if that qualifies as a reason for considering Zagreus a half-god though.
hollow garden
I mean Aphro calls you godling and Dio calls you a demigod. I'm pretty sure all the gods think you're lesser than them.
Artemis is just way less tactful in how she handles it.
I realize that's kinda like saying "all the Olympians are racist, Artemis is just honest about it" but I mean okay, the Olympain gods were not exactly quality individuals.
Maybe they are here though, but not historically.
lyric zinc
wait do they know that nyx was his "mother" (but not really obv) i forget
cosmic crescent
Yes.
It was Nox who got in contact with the Olympians, asking for their help
and as farf as they know, they recognize her as his mother.
A lot of conversation where that is discussed too
lyric zinc
o ok its been a while
my take on the olympic gods is that they think everyone who isnt them are lesser beings and theyre just bored af and helping zag is fun the same way getting in his way (via theseus, trial) is fun
lunar kiln
Remember the times before elysium when we jokingly suggested skelly was patroclus but then figured out far-fetched but ultimately plausible evidence that he was indeed pat
cosmic crescent
No.
runic terrace
those were the days
stark tulip
It would’ve been really funny if Patroclus was putting giant statues of himself outside of Achilles’ house
RIGHT in the training ground
runic terrace
i think id still like to put some statues of pat around the house actually
stark tulip
byhjbcf yeah
sinful peak
I am so conflicted
Huh
I’m sorry bot
Either way I refuse to believe Artemis is mean because I already scheduled a prepaid, non refundable full back tattoo of her symbol
runic terrace
that is Extremely cool
sinful peak
(Sorry to disappoint but it’s a joke :( )
runic terrace
aww
nimble stone
Hey I remember them saying in the roadmap that they had plans for 5 biomes. But they said with this update we’ll be able to battle out of hell. Did that change?
ivory spire
afaik it was always 4 biomes not counting Chaos, Erebus and the house.
nimble stone
Oh guess I misremembered then
Do we know who the guy in picture for the update is yet?
amber canyon
Zag and Cerberus
rapid zinc
We don't know that for certain (I don't think) but the sillhouettes fit almost perfectly
amber canyon
They fit exactly perfectly
lost gorge
It totally is zag and Cerberus, so if we have to fight cerb we may finally get some explanation for the skulls on zags shoulder, like hades made him fight cerb when they were younger
amber canyon
Down to the little hair spikes
drifting citrus
idk it kinda looks like zag's petting cerby
maybe they'll introduce a new mechanic with him instead
wide wind
the 4th biome is just dog petting zone
stark tulip
Annoying Dog Theme Undertale intensifies
hollow garden
Pet Capacity is at 50%
frank glade
They did say they were making a petting animation at a certain point
Oh god, it's going to be after we beat Cerb isn't it?
west moat
oh no
hollow garden
I can't even think about that 😭
west moat
god I hope they don't do that I would literally die
lunar kiln
"You can pet the dog... but at what cost"
shy socket
Wonder if we'll get Nyx or Charon art this update
frank glade
I really hope we get a song by Sysiphus this update, since we're getting to the end of the game and songs with vocals tend to be near the game's ending in Supergiant's stuff
somber gull
The Iliad
runic terrace
we had the patch notes in storyteller voice, now lets have logan sing the iliad in achilles voice
lunar kiln
my my it's only 4 days until the Day
runic terrace
i know its gonna be life changing i KNOW IT
stark tulip
I’m calling a shot now that we get Orpheus art
bleak osprey
i think orpheus will get art, and if not him then maybe........ nyx?
somber gull
Charon gets art but it’s just the hooded figure at 3/4 view
runic terrace
charon and cerberus have the same sillouette
zag and orpheus have the same sillouette
jen zee draws within those lines to mess with us
visual laurel
its chaos again but they changed their look
stark tulip
chaos..... 2!
winged latch
So will this next update complete the game?
I ask because there seems to be an a number of unresolved threads:
- What is behind the doors Achilles is guarding?
- Will Nyx, Sisyphus, and Charon get character art updates?
- The Patroculus/Achilles situation
- Is there a war happening on the surface?
- Will Zagreus find Persephone? How will Olympian entities react once they learn the truth?
- Will Zagreus join his extended family on Olympus?
- Will Zagreus and Artemis be BFFs?
meager shoal
I mean, they said they would develop the game at least for 1 year and a half after the early access release so I doubt there isn't more content coming in the way in the next months
winged latch
"I doubt there isn't"
I...uh...struggle with double negatives. In my mind, that reads like a double negative.
atomic forge
Yeah production will go on for quite awhile
They aren't particularly close to being finished yet
Iirc they said that early access will end sometime next year?
I could be mistaken
winged latch
Yeah, this game can unfold in many ways (partly because Greek mythology is expansive). I feel this game is far from completing its story.
cosmic crescent
They did say that the next biome will actually be the floor where we will get out of hell
but being out of hell does not mean that the game is or will be over at that point, for one.
frank glade
My money is on it being a Binding of Isaac kind of arrangement, Cerberus is going to be the "first" final boss and they'll add more down the line
cosmic crescent
Then there is all the things they could still add to the game to make it more broad.
More gods to add, more boons to pick, more weapons to play with, more enemies and bosses
maybe more secret rooms too
More ways to make the game more challenging
frank glade
Oh by the way, I'm calling it now: the narrating voice is Homer
cosmic crescent
Oh by the way, I'm calling it now; the narrating voice is Hades
Just changing his voice for comedic purposes.
frank glade
That would be hilarious
cosmic crescent
Pretty sure it's the same VA, isn't it?
frank glade
I have no idea
cosmic crescent
He is.
He apparently voices a lot of people, actually.
Hades, Poseidon, Charon, Achilles and the Narrator
frozen jolt
yes, the next update will have the last biome, but it wont have the ending. pretty sure greg said at some point the ending will only be in the game on release
cosmic crescent
I mean, if we go by this tweet
It explicitly says "Next Biome"
Not "Last Biome"
I still think that the next biome will be the river styx
After that, Zag may very well be on the surface, but what then? Maybe he get's betrayed by the Olympians then and has to fight again anyway.
And then after that, he actually has to go to Olympus to really show these guys who the man is.
And after that, he has to go punch one of Chaos' many faces.
And after that!
It turns out that Nyx has been the main antagonist all along.
Add in a fight against Hades in between as additional seasoning
and breakfast is ready for serving.,
atomic forge
Or... or... we get the Gainax Ending. Zag steps into the overworld, suddenly everthing explodes into bright shards of light, after which he finds himself in the center of a stage and all the characters from the game congratulate him. Gotta play to the otaku demographic!
(Reference for the uninitiated: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GainaxEnding)
tame sierra
And maybe when he needs to battle the olympians Hades finally decides to help Zag with his own boons!!
winged latch
I'm rooting for Zag (and Thanatos) to scorch Olympus into a wasteland.
#CheerfulNihilist
frank glade
I wouldn't be surprised at all if it ends up being a fight between Hades and Olympus, so that the last biome is Olympus itself
onyx spoke
every time someone mentions the phrase Gainax Ending I think it says "Gygax Ending"
I'm rooting for the reveal that the game is just a dnd campaign but Hades is a really bad DM
frank glade
But Hades is a really GOOD DM you mean
onyx spoke
idk killing us because we went too far in his campaign seems pretty rude
atomic forge
The narrator is Hades. On your first trip through an area, when you interact with the sparkles to get a description of the area, Zag will respond to it and refer to the voice as "old man."
visual laurel
But every other time he talks to/addresses his dad, he calls him "father", so why use a different term of address here?
He also doesn't seem to like...entirely know who the narrator is
He tries to call the narrator out at one point
as if he wants to actually see who's always taunting him
slash giving run-on descriptions of stuff
visual laurel
tbh i also thought it was hades early on bc logan voices both of them and they sound similar fhdkgk so you're valid
atomic forge
I heard "old man" and instantly leapt to the slang. I'm pretty sure Hades is his narrator voice but a little less raspy and dropped in pitch.
visual laurel
Yeah, they're pretty close, tho out of everything logan's done it's probably closest to the archjustice from Pyre
By "the storyteller is grown-up zag and this is all him recollecting his earlier life" theory, something something zag grows up to sound similar to his dad, lol
cosmic crescent
It's a fun idea, but that would basically be a no to the interactions between Zag and the Narrator.
visual laurel
characters in stories do break the fourth wall sometimes
i dont personally think it's the case, but i dont think its impossible either! fun to speculate
cosmic crescent
The story and character development in Hades has been a lot more lighthearted in Hades than in Bastion from what I can tell.
A very different tone.
merry sorrel
where is the New Game + mode where Thanatos narrates the story instead
cosmic crescent
Hopefully coming out in Fall 20Never.
The less I see or hear of Thanatos the better
stable magnet
The ending will show Danny DeVito as a Satyr, change my mind
bleak osprey
that seems a little out of left field
frank glade
Now that you say it the fact that we haven't seen any satyr is almost suspect
winged latch
"The less I see or hear of Thanatos the better"
https://tenor.com/view/jalen-rose-towel-made-it-gif-14554386
Thanatos is Sephiroth 2.0 but better. He's the older brother Cloud Strife never had...
west moat
he's responsible
digital crag
than stans coming out of the well to shame mankind
bleak osprey
i would die for thanatos
onyx spoke
I'd be more fond of Thanos Toes if he didn't have a seizure whenever someone breathes on him
I can be doing literally nothing and he'd still yell "NOT ME, ZAGREUS"
winged latch
<Circle of Death - 9999 damage>
sour hollow
um I beat Elysium on my 20th run with like ~20 health left feeling like genius then I realize I haven't met Thanatos yet
stark tulip
Thanatos is based on number of runs I think
He’ll start appearing after a certain time
visual laurel
Yep, after 23 completed runs
merry sorrel
Look I want new game plus to be narrated by than because he is so neurotic okay
He would be stressed over zag getting hurt or too close to escape
full basin
Hey did anyone else get a seemingly unrelated conversation with Patroclus when you delivered Achilles' message? I gave the dude a gift, had a normal convo, and since then the convos I've had with them act like I've continued the storyline properly.
I wish we had a full wiki of all the interactions, this is is making me . . . idk sad/annoyed/something like that
visual laurel
You gave him a gift...instead of having a normal conversation?
sorry i don't quite understand
full basin
I gave him a gift, then had the conversation seperately
visual laurel
Oh, hm
It might be an interaction/priority bug triggered by you reaching a friendship threshold or something. F10 it when in doubt
full basin
Suppose I'll just need to keep a look out for screenshots of convos. Rip
visual laurel
You'll probably get the convo the next time you talk to Pat
Oh wait sorry I just read more closely
Since then, huh 🤔 I'm really not sure off the top of my head
i can pull the conversations for you in a bit, if you'd like
I'll also double check the prereqs just to make sure you aren't missing anything
waxen crater
OH MY GOD
OHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGOD
I DID IT GUYS!!! X3
CLEARED 60 HEAT RUN WITH SHIELD AND APHRODITE X333
I finally did it, just before the update too x3
made it with this original configuration that worked A LOT better than others I tried so far
I even ended with 2 remaining Death Defiances!!
oh, and that Full Veil run, I actually managed to beat the Minotaur mid-boss and than him again in the final boss, but Theseus got me in his final HPs, it was so cloooose >< XD
somber gull
Congratulations! Great job!
hollow garden
now for 120 :kappa:
cosmic crescent
I mean, he has one and a half day, he could make it
Needs to get two quick full clears to get to 120 heat, then he is good to go.
hollow garden
or could just wait, im sure the next biome wont make 120 heat more difficult :kappa:
lunar kiln
Do it for skelly
waxen crater
I think Ill focus now on making my victory screen a little better
1 - try to get a speedrun with no heat under 25 minutes with all weapons
2 - get all weapons at least 30 Heat runs
3 - get 5 consective victories
I love my boy Skelly x3
his statues are mwah- Masterpieces!
@lunar kiln OMG, just saw your icon oh gods xD xD love it
sturdy sapphire
When the next update in spain time?
bleak osprey
nobody knows! it will be some time tomorrow, that is all anyone knows for sure.
lunar kiln
most likely tomorrow evening eu time like the other times
tall ingot
Usually I got the patch around 8PM, I'm from Poland
shy socket
In europe, it's usually 8-9PM, which is pretty much the entire day, which makes it agonizing to wait
stark tulip
happy zagsday eve
somber gull
Yeah haha, a lot of folks have pointed that out
hoary quartz
can't wait to go battle with my puppy
cosmic crescent
In before the fight is actually just intense petting for Cerberus.
hoary quartz
maybe it's Hades and Cerberus and you make his loyalty to Hades waver enough either to strike at Hades or actually turn the pup on his master
summer schooner
you pet the big bois
cosmic crescent
I honestly don't really see Hades and Zagreus fighting with one another.
Hades has been mostly annoyed or nonchalant about Zagreus' antics
atomic forge
That's largely because he doesn't believe Zagreus can escape
cosmic crescent
Imagine this
After you have beaten the next biome
Hades will increase security and you will fight against all Fury Sisters in Tartarus at once
always.
wide wind
last biome is just every boss at once
somber gull
boss rush Boss Rush BOSS RUSH BOSS RUSH
faint socket
i'm really hoping we don't have to fight the dog because i WILL cry
bright void
Boss rush doesn't feel fun in a game with 4 bosses
somber gull
technically, 6,
wide wind
i feel like fighting cerb is really unlikely. it seems unnecessarily dark for sgg and like it wouldn't really add anything to the story besides cheap angst
unless there's in game hints for it i'm doubtful
bright void
We'll find out tomorrow!
somber gull
idk man, sgg has always been on the lowkey super dark bandwagon
faint socket
and cerb is in the silhouettes for the teaser image
bright void
I've never felt happy about the ending to one of their games
faint socket
i'm just hoping we get to pet the dog instead
bright void
There is even an animation on the internet about petting the dog
cosmic crescent
I gotta say that Hades has set a much different tone than Bastion or Transistor so far.
Bastion was doom and gloom from the very beginning, Transistor I only just started but it was very somber as well.
Hades feels just playful in comparison.
Honestly, it feels like a family comedy at this point.
That would have to take a very harsh 360 in the upcoming update, if that were to happen.
amber canyon
Yknow, Im not sure SGG was "lowkey" about the dark bandwagon
atomic forge
I have no doubt Greg intends to bring on the drama when the time is right
shy socket
Pyre wasn't ever gloomy - sure, there was a race against the clock, but at no point is there a sense of gloom
wide wind
i've noticed a trend of sgg games to get less dark over time. bastion was like "hey genocide happened and also the world was destroyed" and then like, pyre was very very silly
runic terrace
i dont think hades is a particularly light game, but also don't think itll go for killing the dog
pyre was silly tho yes!!!
digital crag
honestly i don't think fighting cerb necessarily has to be dark?
it really depends on how they play it up
it could be melodrama or it could not be
everyone seems to take dying pretty much in stride
runic terrace
hades is....... very, very, VERY good at portraying the subtleties of living in an abusive environment, and part of that is "it isn't Doom And Gloom 24/7, life is still happening"
ok yeah tbh
atomic forge
Not sure I would call Hades a comedy tbh.
It surely has a quite upbeat tone, and characters like Hypnos and Dusa seem to be designed to act mostly as comic relief, but listening to the things daddy Hades, Meg, and Than are saying (both about the underworld and Zag) you could argue it's a tragedy centered around a selfish teen who never showed much interest in the world he lives in and has no sense of duty on the one side, and a bitter duty-driven father who was completely unfit to raise a child (and treated it like training an employee instead), demands obedience (and does not react well to being asked for reasons), and is really really really bad at communicating at times on the other side.
bleak osprey
i don't know why people think cerberus can actually die for reals
he's a member of the family, he'll just climb out of the pool of styx and shake himself dry (thereby covering everyone else in blood)
faint socket
i would still cry if i had to fight him
atomic forge
You can always refuse to
somber gull
I think like a lot of things, the presence of humor doesn't make something a comedy aha
runic terrace
yupp
runic terrace
hm, zag really meddles in everybody's everything trying to make things be good for them, you know? if hes going to be labeled selfish i think itd be more over the like, implications of tying himself to so many people he's going to leave, ratger than for not feeling connected to others
ahhh oopsie
shy socket
Aside from verbal abuse, I'm not really seeing how the House of Hades is an abusive environment.
Unlike Hypnos and Than, Zag doesnt have to work, has his own room, has a personal trainer, and is generally allowed to peddle contraband left and right to household members.
runic terrace
its verbal, yes!
shy socket
Sure, Hades isnt winning dad of the year awards, but abusive is too strong a description imo.
shy socket
And considering there hasnt really been a truly evil main character in SGGs games so far (the Pyre witch doesnt count), I'm really curous about what'll happen with Hades himself
somber gull
Idk, I do think that just because a character's not doing everything wrong doesn't mean they're not doing a few things horribly wrong.
On the other hand, I do believe that characters and people can grow, change, and forgive, but I don't think the answer for Zag is "have things go back to the way things were."
Staying in that situation means staying with a dad that verbally abuses him, forces him into relationships he's not ready for, and requires him to conform to a certain standard that doesn't really work for him, honestly.
I think healing for Hades and Zag's relationship probably means being willing to let him go. He's an adult now, he can make his own choices even if he regrets them.
cosmic crescent
A thing we should be noting here is that Hades isn't explicitly saying that Zag is not allowed.
He says that Zag "can't"
Maybe there are some boundaries that we are simply not aware off.
somber gull
I will clarify by "letting him go" I meant more along the lines of "giving him his own Agency" aha
shy socket
^ The last paragraph in particular.
They can make things work, but old Hades has to give our boi Zag something.
Not outright stopping him isnt good enough.
Also, yes, I really really really want SGG to make the character of Hades into something more than 'abusive patriarch'. I know they can do better, and it'd sour the story in a big way for me if they did.
digital crag
and i say cool motive, still abuse
somber gull
I'd be fine with an escaping an abusive situation honestly, I know it would mean a lot to people to be able to play a character who has control over leaving a toxic home
solar cove
hades himself cant leave (in a cutscene he says he tried - and how its futile for zag)
wide wind
verbal abuse....... still makes a home abusive
having a multitude of things doesn't stop things from being abusive
cosmic crescent
We hark a lot on Hades, but let us not leave Persephone out of the equation.
She left the home, she left her child alone with Hades.
Hades, who already was pretty much a stick in the mud, whom only had Persephone and, maybe, Zagreus as his bright points in life
Then his beloved wife leaves him and Zagreus is the ongoing reminder of what he may once had.
Add in all the trouble around the olympian family and it ends up being a lot to deal with.
bleak osprey
cool story, still abuse
cosmic crescent
I am not condoning what Hades is doing.
Or how he is doing it.
But I understand where he is coming from.
I mean, we only if ever are being shown Hades do bad things or doing things in an abusive way.
There might as well have been moments where that has not been the case, we simply aren't shown them.
For all we know, we don't know.
digital crag
of course you understand where he's coming from 90% of abusive parents don't wake up thinking "oh boy sure am going to abuse my kids for funsies"
lunar kiln
some of the rememberances show more than verbal abuse though
digital crag
it's "i want my kid to end up in this way that i think is better for them", still abuse
somber gull
...We are shown that Hades has done good things though?
- He employed Dusa who has trouble getting work because she's disabled
- He treats Than's time with respect and consideration
- He hired Orpheus as court musician even when he couldn't sing
The point isn't that abusive people can't do good things, the point is that he is abusive to Zagreus, and thus their relationship dynamic fundamentally needs to change.
bright void
I still think that Hades isn't all that bad. He isn't abusive. It's sort of like "we have a kingdom to run, we play an important part in the cosmos. You need to grow up boy"
lunar kiln
yeah well there are better ways to go about it
bright void
What specifically did he do that's abusive?
lunar kiln
theres one rememberance where it's implied ||he beat him up in a fight|| i think
somber gull
i'm gonna spoiler tag this list just to keep folks from reading something that may be harmful but
||- He continually belittles Zag even in his attempts to be good or be kind
- It's heavily implied that he forced Zag to have a relationship with Meg as part of "growing up into a man"
- Even though Zag's relationship with Achilles is good, that still comes from the root of "you're weak, fear is for the weak, and you need to grow up and stop being a baby"
- He intentionally tries to sabotage Zag's escape from hell (see: timed rooms)||
I'm sure there's more but that's what comes to mind
lunar kiln
thanks for wording that better than i could
somber gull
sdfjhkskhjd thank U for waiting for me to type a long post
bright void
I never got the impression he forced the relationship. Maybe I missed something at some point.
digital crag
also isolating him from the outside world
lunar kiln
it's in a rememberance
bleak osprey
things hades has called him: an oaf, a brat (specifically a witless and careless one), foolish, an aberration, disgusting
lunar kiln
something along the lines of "this is megaera, she is here to help you become a man"
bright void
I mean, there theoretically could be some cosmic reason as to why he's separated from the outside world. "Don't you think I haven't tried to escape"
bleak osprey
One thing the mortals have on us is that they quickly become men. This is the Fury, Megaera. She shall accelerate the process in your case.
bright void
I don't know, in the old days kings set up arranged marriages all the time
lunar kiln
still abuse
wide wind
and that doesn't make it ok
bright void
Oh please, it's not abuse
digital crag
you're going out of your way to defend him m8
solar depot
i definitely see a distinct lack of like... respect or recognition for meg's agency as well on hades' part
somber gull
so like, yes, cultural context matters, but there are two cultures speaking to the development of this game
one is ancient history and mythology
and the other is modern culture
the living, breathing writers of this game are informed by our cultural contexts
cosmic crescent
Real talk: People are too quick to yell "abuse" whenever something doesn't seem right to them.
lunar kiln
i swear it's not that hard to tell it's wrong
somber gull
and our modern cultural context says that forcing someone into a relationship when they aren't ready is not okay
regal dirge
Hades is cool, he tries to make Zag better but he is just misguided himself
cosmic crescent
The question is if Hades alone is the one to blame.
Which I think is not the case.
lunar kiln
he isnt but he's terrible at it as well
cosmic crescent
You may call Hades abusive if you want, that doesn't stop the fact that the mother ran off.
lunar kiln
we still dont know why
bleak osprey
that isn't a reason to take it out on zagreus
regal dirge
well ditto
lunar kiln
yeah like zag is completely innocent in the whole thing
wide wind
mom running off doesn't make hades less abusive
somber gull
Hades and Persephone aren't foils in this narrative
cosmic crescent
He still gave Zagreus a loving mother figure to grow up with.
bleak osprey
I don't CARE if his wife left him, i don't CARE if his work is really hard, boo hoo hoo, you don't take it out on your CHILDREN
digital crag
that's not a reason for me to want to see hades get all redeemed cause that's boring and overplayed and cliche as hell
solar depot
friendly reminder to keep it civil, folks
lunar kiln
his evil outweighs the few good things he's done
cosmic crescent
I hate Nyx with a burning passion, but she was, as far as we know, a loving and comforting mother for Zagreus.
Even to the point where she aids Zagreus in his escape attempts
digital crag
i don't know what point you're trying to make here
cosmic crescent
(I still think she has her own motives here, but let us leave that to the side. for the moment, all points towards her being on Zags side)
There is also the poiint to make that Zagreus isn't a good guy either.
lunar kiln
im sorry what
hollow garden
I mean... I like that Zag is escaping and think it's justified cause if he wasn't there wouldn't exactly be a game to play :kappa:
cosmic crescent
His escape attempts bring all the people that love and care for him in unfavorable positions.
digital crag
mmmmmmurderer??
cosmic crescent
Achilles, who keeps supporting him.
somber gull
mmmmmmmurderrrrr
lunar kiln
they do support him in the end
cosmic crescent
Thanatos who actively tries to help him while giving lipservice to Hades
Nyx and others who are risking their own reputations and rapport with Hades in order to help Zagreus
lunar kiln
not to mention he barely ever asked for their help
cosmic crescent
only so he can leave them all behind.
regal dirge
And he is very grateful to them
digital crag
achilles and thanatos are literally willingly helping him of their own choice, because they like him
hollow garden
It's not like Achilles isn't helping him of his own volition without a care for his circumstance. Otherwise who would be providing the weapons.
cosmic crescent
That is one way to put it.
hollow garden
Same with Thanatos, he doesn't have to help me clear rooms.
somber gull
I'm getting the sense that this conversation is getting more heated than constructive so I think I'm gonna ask everyone to cut it here
cosmic crescent
The way I see it, Zag is abusing the good nature people have towards him
solar depot
albeit thanatos with some interesting internal conflict
cosmic crescent
while not honoring the years of friend and kinship he has shared with them.
digital crag
wow
cosmic crescent
I am not saying that Zagreus is a villain
digital crag
alright i'm done
cosmic crescent
but he is not a good man either.
somber gull
this is a sensitive topic for a lot of folks and it's time to close the worm can
hollow garden
Thanatos's character arc is kinda about him growing to understand Zagreus's choices and live with them (and even like them imo)
Fair enough
lunar kiln
i'm foaming at the mouth
solar depot
yeah pear, i could see that for sure
cosmic crescent
Honestly, I am happy for Thanatos accepting Zags choices.
I would still love to just say "No" to his "help"
bleak osprey
the worm can has been closed
hollow garden
So you could clear the room on your own and not lose to him :kappa:
cosmic crescent
I mean, it's not a matter of winning or losing
but everytime he shows up, you have to fight through 2-4 times the regular amount of enemies.
regal dirge
i think its a gameplay feature
cosmic crescent
You call it a feature, I call it a drag.
somber gull
that's something to take to #hades-feedback thanks
cosmic crescent
Already did that days ago, thanks
hollow garden
hating on my boi than when he gives me free max health on a stacked run ;-; (he doesn't offer anything on a losing run tbf, but yeah that's a feedback point there)
cosmic crescent
It's really not about the reward but the fight itself.
regal dirge
There are like 3 best bois
hollow garden
Side note: auto correct is bad
regal dirge
(One of them is not exactly boy but..)
digital crag
cerberus cerberus and cerberus
somber gull
Than doesn't offer any consolation onions cause he already ate them all
cosmic crescent
I have had plenty promising looking 120 heat runs that went down the drain because Thanatos decided to give me a room crowded with all he enemies Elysium has to offer before the final boss fight.
digital crag
three good boys
regal dirge
excluding animals
somber gull
Cerberus could host a podcast by himself
regal dirge
Dionis (how do you write it in english) Thanatos and Chaos
cold canopy
myself, myself, and me
cosmic crescent
Sometimes, when you start the game, Zagreus said that he is not going to stay, not even for Cerberus.
Get's me everytime.
So cold.
hollow garden
That's some insane bad luck on than rooms there given I struggle to find even one per run consistently, let alone 1 in one of the 10 Elysium rooms.
cosmic crescent
I'd say I find him about every 1.5 runs.
Usually fairly evenly spread over the 3 bioms
But he has a talent to appear late whenever it is the most inconvenient.
Tartarus and Elysium are the worst places for him to show up because those are the points where it is the hardest to deal with floods of enemies imo.
regal dirge
Hey do we know what height is Zag? I compared him to Meg and he seems shorter
somber gull
Zag's rage is one common to all short friends
and it's the rage of being known as the short friend
bleak osprey
he's a stubby boy
atomic forge
he’s pretty tall for a mortal, but compared to the other characters he’s a shortie
somber gull
my headcanon is that Than is actually shorter than him but floats to look taller
digital crag
no wonder than is mad all the time
somber gull
yeah baby
cosmic crescent
I'd be much more interested in Zags age.
for all we know, he could be hundreds or thousands of years old.
digital crag
Zag, I've been the same height since 10000 BC of course I'm full of rage
runic terrace
i mean, physically, yes! emotionally i see his as early 20s
like, recently became an Adult but still on wobbly legs authority wise lol 😔
and his meg stuff would've been like Happy Eighteenth Emotional Birthday, Son, right, so give him a year or so of buffer time, and!
cosmic crescent
Huh. Interesting.
Not exactly Hades related, but apparently, Smite will have Persephone in the game soon.
Looks neat
stark tulip
I know this’d never happen but now I’m flashing back on any time I talked with ANYONE about hades like “they were a beta tester and they were dropping me HINTS”
runic terrace
they would never
stark tulip
I KNOW but you can’t stop me theorizing now
bleak osprey
🔪
visual laurel
The Mods Were Always Watching
runic terrace
if anyone had breathed a word to you idve 
stark tulip
death approaches
digital crag
the punishment for leaking spoilers is eternity in tartarus
bright void
Removal of game license and permanent banning from discord.
digital crag
where you are forced to listen to bad puns being explained in excruciating detail, forever
sour pike
You mean you get to spend eternity with Sisyphus if you spoil the game?
rapid zinc
Wait so what do I have to do to get a free Bouldy?
rapid zinc
Hades beta notes [TOP SECRET]: ||Zagreus is a gun||
runic terrace
THATS IT....... GET IN TARTARUS
rapid zinc
😔
stark tulip
||pyre imps are a mob in the next area||
rapid zinc
Does somebody have :pensivebouldy: on hand
visual laurel
runic terrace
ghfhjfjfhj ali ur making me think like.....numbskull pile but imps
digital crag
explode imps
all the skeleton bombers now throw imps
when you kill an exalted an imp pops out
sour pike
you fight the narrator...who turns out to be 5 imps in a trench coat
stark tulip
CUTE
visual laurel
best ending
runic terrace
YES
harsh sleet
i havent been in here for a while so im dropping by just to say
thanatos best boy
real question tho do i get to kiss him tomorrow orr...
im asking for a friend
digital crag
one can have hope
candid bear
Your timing was imp-eccable
amber canyon
Its quite impressive how were milking this word for puns
digital crag
i implore you to stop punning
amber canyon
Unfortunately Im impervious to your pleas
So, what are the bets on tomorrows biome?
frozen jolt
i bet its going to kick my butt
amber canyon
Fair
Ive been seeing a lot of Styx guessing which I so far agree with
Hold, I have an idea
What if its the overworld
And the healing area that you get is just a fast food joint where you get the gyros and fries?
cold canopy
Impossible, the gyro and fries are made by bouldy
amber canyon
The Cashier is bouldy
visual laurel
bouldy opened a franchise, clearly
digital crag
mcbouldies
amber canyon
"Rock'n'Roll Gyros"
runic terrace
eeeeyyy
stark tulip
can I get uhhhhh large friend please
runic terrace
rapid zinc
Sysiphus rolls by with Bouldy and stops to hand you a happy meal but then Bouldy rolls away and he just looks down and sighs
amber canyon
Its a fast food chain famous for their great gyros and their novel "Bouldy-smashed burgers"
stark tulip
“The pioneers used to ride these babies for miles”
amber canyon
"Its worth the eternal torment" - Sisyphus
I gotta say its funny how a literal rock became one of the most popular characters
stark tulip
they gave him a face. that’s the secret to making a lovable character
rapid zinc
They gave him a name
Listen... when I first joined, and for a good while after, my nickname was Lemme Smooch Sisyphus And Bouldy
Bc they deserve a smooch and I deserve to be allowed to smooch them
Kam called me Smoocher for short
amber canyon
I remember that
digital crag
plush bouldy merch when
onyx spoke
hey @visual laurel I'm way late but I'd love a full size pensive bouldy
visual laurel
AH...i saw this and then spaced out for half an hour, gimme a sec
@onyx spoke
and emoji version
atomic forge
this hurts to look at 
onyx spoke
what do you mean this restored my faith in the world
atomic forge
he’s so sad..
visual laurel
that's the face of working yourself to the bone every day only to see your hard work undone in a matter of seconds
stark tulip
don’t let me just roll on, pardner....
modest dove
Who does everyone think is the silhouette in the update? It looks like Zag with the sword over his shoulder standing next to a horse?
neon yarrow
not too sure about the person
winged latch
I think it's Cereberus
neon yarrow
but people are saying the other thing is cerberus
which would make sense because the more runs you go on the less he appears
and the less he wants to talk
winged latch
Well that didn't work. I'll try again.
Google "Hades game plus Cerberus" in the search bar for images.The silhouette matches the middle head.
winged latch
Yep. The ears gave it away imo.
modest dove
Oh no! Are we going to have to fight the doggie???
west moat
just a bunch of crows! absolutely not a dog
modest dove
More importantly, are we going to be able to finally pet the dog?
Looking at you https://mobile.twitter.com/CanYouPetTheDog
hollow iris
@west moat You got the idea!
modest dove
Ball is in your court @fair light and team! 😁
And I mean actually petting the dog! None of this text or narrator saying “The Prince pets the dog. The mighty dog wags his tail, filled with happiness and contentment.” 😆
modest dove
Hahaha! The wait will be worth it. What time and in what timezone does it come out?
@neon yarrow cereberus getting sad/worried/avoidant because he knows he’s gonna have to try and stop you. 😢 ugh. The pit in my stomach! If supergiant wants to be brutal, they should play sad music while you fight your dog
valid parcel
updates usually come out around noon PST, but there's no set time @modest dove
modest dove
Thanks for that!
harsh sleet
please dont make me kill cerb
shy socket
I love it how people are ambivalent about slaughtering Meg time and time again, but when it's Cerberus everyone is like 'nooooo'
harsh sleet
but what if cerb doesnt come back like meg does
lunar kiln
beating up meg again and again is fun because both parties are okay with it
heady anchor
I tried to introduce the main update image https://imgur.com/XFNqWua
atomic forge
I want Meg to step on me, we're just being equal.