rare torrent
Immmm special!
#h1-story-discussion
sick grove
I always assumed we'd be receiving more than one Lament of Orpheus after the second song was released. Lament of Orpheus has (Underworld Mix) beside it, so I assumed there would be more. Then, with Ashley was singing beside him at those awards I went 'oh, there's the other version. wonder why persephone is singing that with him'.
And now I realize I'm a dummy and was totally wrong on that point. My brain wants to assume it's Eurydice and we see some closure for these two, but that's just me being hopeful!
But that's all just speculation on my silly part :V
visual laurel
So I noticed something, which is that if you die during a Thanatos room, whatever counter it is that keeps him from showing up in consecutive runs doesn't reset...but he does show up back at the house
So you're essentially guaranteed to see him in back to back runs, and even if you die each time he'll still be back at the house so you can gift him ambrosia and see his conversations
idk if that's intended - i get the feeling it isn't - but there ya go
neat crow
Than is also the only one you can gift "twice" — once in the Encounter and then again back at the House
visual laurel
i did like three runs where i died in thanatos rooms and every time he would show up again in the next run
he wants to give me a second chance to do it properly i guess 😂
snow brook
Between the initial patch and the secondary patch, they changed MinRunsSinceThanatosSpawn from 2 to 1
So it is just how it is now.
visual laurel
This is the first time I've gotten him in consecutive runs even after the patch tho, not to mention three times in a row
it could be wacky RNG
i can keep testing it
normal talon
i found than for the SECOND time finally
proceeded to totally whoop him 48 - 29
and got his keepsake which is actually pretty sweet
as soon as the lighting in the room changed i was like BOY HERE WE GO
also i found him in tartarus this time so that was nice
molten pike
I just beat Bone Hydra for the first time. I noticed that when fighting the smaller heads, aiming for their heads directly didn't always work and sometimes I had to attack the little shadow area just below their heads - especially if I'm using Wrath.
Is that intentional? Do the little heads go up and down and I'm supposed to wait for when they go closer to the ground to beat them up?
I thought it was really cute that the conversation with Hades after is about how parts of the realm are still under renovation 
snow brook
Yeah his lines after you beat Hydra change a lot, sometimes they are quite nice, though he might just be being sarcastic. And as for having to aim a little below the heads, I am not positive, but that may just be an issue due to the camera angle.
ember goblet
Yeah I have that problem too. Lol I have the problem where I killed the bone hydra enough times that I have this voice in my head “this time I will get to a new boss” because I think renovation won’t take 2 months ...but like I know it’s still developing so I don’t know what really goes in my head ...if that makes sense
kind raft
marsh prawn
That would be nice actually
Who voiced persephone’s line tho?
I never checked
Oh it was Kelly Moore
north sand
god it’s really bugging me how we know so little about perse 
frozen jolt
take comfort in the fact that youre not the only one who knows little of her, zag also doesnt :P
north sand
@frozen jolt the way you say that really reminds me of Nyx 
north sand
I dunno “take comfort” is a really strong phrase
aww sweet 
Nyx un-hood waiting room 
tardy tundra
i got hypnos and than interaction
and now ill fckijn die for hypnos that sweet bby boi
marsh prawn
Welcome to the club
livid arch
Guys, is there any way to see which hydra head will do what? Aside from waiting an seeing its attacks
north sand
@livid arch the head’s color will tell what type of attacks it’ll do
amber canyon
Though it can be hard to tell
Off the top of my head, red one spews fireballs, radioactive (sickly green) one does the new wave attack
livid arch
Killed her about 6 times and haven't even noticed
bleak osprey
green? it looks yellow to me
i keep mixing it up with the slammy head and panicking
north sand
pink is lava puddle, green is summon, yellow is wave
amber canyon
The proper green one spawns the Bloodless eggs I believe?
bleak osprey
yeah
amber canyon
And the white-ish one slams
bleak osprey
hydra teeth!
north sand
there’s also a normal white one which has no special ability
amber canyon
That really dont look like thieves
Yeah thats the one that slams
And welcomes you to the Jam
bleak osprey
i think they may have also given back the hydra's bite attack after the first phase
but i'd have to poke around more to check that
north sand
you mean they can bite during 100-75%?
bleak osprey
oh it definitely can then
but it used to be that once you were past 75% health the main head could no longer use the bite attack
but if i'm reading it right then they changed it and now it can bite you any time
bleak osprey
ghdkfj
amber canyon
The slam attack would then be a boop
spring scaffold
I hope they'll change how the Hydra head spawns work. A bit of randomness is nice, but having only one type of head in the last phase is awful. All stomps means no safe spot, all waves is horrendous, all spawn means you can't get rid of them fast enough and get swarmed and all red means so much lava you have to wait a lot.
bleak osprey
before the mdk update i'd done some poking and found out what combinations of heads could spawn when, but i didn't get it written down before this update came in with the new head type
i'll have to go back and see
harsh sleet
i feel like we’re gonna find eurydice and she’s gonna be played by ashley but i was also hoping we’d get like ,,, a lullaby persephone sang to zag or something 
harsh sleet
as more people get the hypnos and thanatos dialogue i’m gonna have to stand my ground and love than through it all
im@sure he doesn’t me a n to neglect his brother yall works hard
spring scaffold
Unlocked Orpheus' second song. So good.
marsh prawn
Dont worry syd dont think people will turn to hypnos lmao
Hypnos Casul Fans
Uuuuh second song I need that
spring scaffold
It's the Hymn to Zagreus. Awesome song and awesome dialogue with Orpheus about it 
limber sage
Yeah, I don't get the impression Thanatos is being super unreasonable to Hypnos...
They kinda remind me of any banter two close siblings could have, honestly.
harsh sleet
does anyone have any idea how much you have to gift dionysus to get hymn to zagreus
harsh sleet
i keep forgetting to gift him when i see him so this is gonna take ages 
frozen jolt
you dont have to gift him, i dont think
bleak osprey
you need max on orpheus but only one on dionysus
frozen jolt
oh
bleak osprey
orpheus won't sing hymn to zagreus unless he can already sing lament of orpheus, and he won't sing at all until you've given him max ambrosia
harsh sleet
welp
frozen jolt
i did find that. if you encounter him later in the run his dialogue will always be about the other god boons you have. so you gotta equip his keepsake to get it
so 1 gift sounds about right
harsh sleet
luckily im v stocked up on ambrosia,, lets go bois
bleak osprey
i'm literally looking at it right now and i can tell you it is right :P
digital crag
dio needs one ambrosia to trigger that convo?
bleak osprey
yup
DionysusAboutOrpheus01 = RequiredTextLines = { "DionysusFirstPickUp", "DionysusGift01", "OrpheusTallTale03", "OrpheusGift01" },
harsh sleet
2 more hearts with orpheus 
bleak osprey
i don't know why it specifies that you need to have given one gift with orpheus at the end there
digital crag
eh, coding
bleak osprey
OrpheusTallTale03 won't trigger until you've gotten OrpheusSingsAgain01, and that doesn't trigger until you've given him 5 gifts and therefore gotten the talk with him in the lounge
eh well
¯_(ツ)_/¯
harsh sleet
this is bc ive been focusing on thanatos too much
im full hearts with than now tho so i can focus on other people
hm,,
the room w the green bombers in tartarus also glows a slight green
this is the second time.. ive been tricked
digital crag
wiki still lacks onion page 😔
runic terrace
let sparrow play the game 🙏 blease...
bleak osprey
in my defense i've been poking at the wiki here and there to try and get it into shape a bit
bleak osprey
but yeah like......... the wiki is right there, anyone can edit it
I Am Not The Only Person
;P
runic terrace
here jan ill give you the codex from memory (clears throat)
ONIONS..........SUUUUUUUUUCK
bleak osprey
god.
runic terrace
hjfghjfhjfhj sory sparow i just feel the urge to samurai cat u whenever the word wiki is uttered in here
bleak osprey
it is Appreciated tho
I would prefer to fade to nothingness far more than be required to consume one of those foul plants, which tainted too many a meal of mine while I was living, and goad me even now that I am dead.
anyway, onion page shall happen
runic terrace
me but with avocado
bleak osprey
oh mood
digital crag
i've been editing the wiki out of procrastination i'd do it for fun i just don't have the full codex entry
runic terrace
achilles and onions like one of those 'sneak brownies into your kids spinach!' recipes
wait. wait i may have mixed up some words.
cold canopy
kdflklkasdf
runic terrace
you know what i mean.
digital crag
🤔
runic terrace
anyway "wow odysseus this broth is so good whats in it" "meat" (caramalized onions)
harsh sleet
fdgdjg
if someone told me there was just 'meat' in my food
id be a little freaked out
bleak osprey
runic terrace
what if it were a burger
digital crag
onion borger.........
runic terrace
onion borger...
bleak osprey
onion page exists now
bleak osprey
onions on burgers.... good cronch
zenith lichen
I love onions
digital crag
onions good
zenith lichen
But garlic is mvp
digital crag
okay but...... onions + garlic
cold canopy
^^^^
zenith lichen
Oh hell yeah
cold canopy
name a better aroma than cooking onions and garlic in a pan
cold canopy
ginger + garlic is really good too
digital crag
it's okay syd you are not alone
runic terrace
i cant stand the smell of onions cooking but once they are done? DEAL LICIOUS
digital crag
you get to share your onion hate with the greatest warrior not alive
runic terrace
i wish onions grew in the ground pre-sauteed 😔
harsh sleet
i rlly wanna make a welcome to the bread bank video with hades characters but.
digital crag
there are plenty of vegetables i don't like raw but are gr8 cooked
harsh sleet
- i cant edit
- i dont think the bread bank video is legal here
digital crag
oh prolly not
digital crag
i do like how the codex entry just grows increasingly angry
or, not angry, idk, grumpy
bleak osprey
he's just so angry about onions being in the underworld
digital crag
the cat with the banana but it's onion
bleak osprey
of all the food that could possibly be down here it was ONIONS
cold canopy
heeee not like
the onion
runic terrace
thats the only newpaper down there
rustic pewter
i finally got the orpheus singing scene
spring scaffold
About Dionysus, you don't need him to be your first god for it to trigger. He won't necessarily talk about the other boons you have. I got the talk about Orpheus after murder boat.
lunar kiln
hades in a gardener outfit happily growing onions
that's his secret past time when he's not busy working
hades: (talking to his onions to make them grow) i hope you make my son cry
drifting citrus
he grows onions because it reminds him of persephone
and of course he'd cry while growing onions, no other reason
proud basin
Who's perspective are the codex entries written from? Is it Achilles? I can't remember who gave it to Zagreus.
neat crow
Achilles, yeah
bleak osprey
mhm
neat crow
Though Zagreus is supposed to be finishing it
So... both?
Not entirely clear on that, since the voice appears to maintain Achilles' perspective
bleak osprey
they're all from achilles' perspective right now
lunar kiln
what if the base entries were achilles' work but the parts you unlock were from zagreus
bleak osprey
they're not, but i kinda hope that if we get Future Codex Entries then it's, like... zagnotes
neat crow
See, that's what I was expecting deathpacito
lunar kiln
achilles' entry in the codex: '...What else is there to say about the Master? Master not just of the House in which I work, but of the entirety of the domain beneath the earth, the place we all end up after we die. He is a god of character, I have to give him tha-
zagreus adding his own notes: yeah nah screw that old bag
and then he hands the codex back to achilles after he escapes somehow and achilles reads it all
bleak osprey
[There are several crudely-drawn doodles in the margin. One of them depicts Hades with stink lines coming off of him.]
spring scaffold
Zag uses Hermes to send the codex back after he escapes.
digital crag
What are antioxidants? We just don't know
runic terrace
aunty oxidents shes my moms sister
zenith flume
can we change the song orpheus sings?
I like the one Im hearing now but I want to hear all of them
bleak osprey
he only sings two
marsh prawn
thanks for not telling me about that convo hades has with hypnos because hey hades uncool
bleak osprey
:D
marsh prawn
u n c o o l
harsh sleet
marsh prawn
just got it and im Sad
harsh sleet
hypnos deserves better
marsh prawn
basically yeah way better than this
not even zag is nice please
please be nice to sleep man
digital crag
nyx be nice to your sleepy son once in a while
harsh sleet
middle child syndrome strikes again
digital crag
😔
marsh prawn
oh than came
hell-o
and that was an ex conversation if i've ever seen one so sad to know that later on it's brother time. i did read what greg said but yeah
runic terrace
(animaniacs voice) helllOOOooooOOOOOOooooo death!
harsh sleet
hewwo
atomic forge
runic terrace
baby hypnos: (puts a bird to sleep)
baby thanatos: haha i can do that too (kills a bird)
baby hypnos: (starts crying)
and they never hung out again.
harsh sleet
I
marsh prawn
uh oh
but maybe its cause of hades, that convo than has with zag made me think that. maybe not
just hang with hypnos hes chill
will let you ruin his dark souls game
harsh sleet
what do u mean
marsh prawn
he talks to than and refers to them hanging or at least helping him
as taking a risk
and not letting hades know
something like that
so maybe hades just dont want the kids to hang
harsh sleet
sick grove
^
digital crag
-killsteals from you and gives you 25 hp if he feels like it- i'm helping
sick grove
Than just doesn't like Hypnos, from what I've seen. Whether there's a reason for their distance has yet to be seen, other than their clashing personalities.
spring scaffold
Had my second loss against him, in a 25 heat run. The two Death Insurance only insured that I couldn't kill faster than him 😛
spring scaffold
Hypnos is the superior brother here though.
He's responsible for the list of people in Hell and more dead people would mean more work for him. Having all mortals die at the same time would rid Thanatos of work forever, but push a ton more on Hypnos. And he'd be ready to do it for his brother.
drifting citrus
finally got the aphrodite wall scroll ye boi
spring scaffold
Hypnos helps so much. Have not lost against Meg since the time he told me to dodge her attacks 
... wait, I have never gotten killed by the new enemies, I should do it to get his new tips 
harsh sleet
dodging.. i didnt think about that before he told me to
spring scaffold
And then Meg has the gall to mock him when he gives her advice to beat me.
That's why you can't beat me, Meg. You gotta trust in the sleepy boy.
marsh prawn
Meg literally if you had dodged me at least once
Only once maybe
We wouldn't be here
harsh sleet
hypnos: hey thanatos?
thanatos: did yall hear sumn
granite pebble
Now that I think about it, do you think that Hypnos x Meg will in future be something more than just platonic crush?
spring scaffold
Doubt it. They don't seem compatible.
stark tulip
Thinking about Thanatos but even more edgy in that he only uses zeros lines from bl2
All haiku speak
granite pebble
He´s just waiting for run where his appearance angers you the most.
harsh sleet
his appearance would never anger me
granite pebble
Not even just with 5 HP?
harsh sleet
absolutely not
granite pebble
*with just
harsh sleet
he could kill me and i’d thank him
drifting citrus
i don't think he kills people
harsh sleet
DAMN
bleak osprey
OTL i should have gotten that one last run but artemis offered me a bunch of cast boons instead...
feral hamlet
that's so violent
zenith lichen
Every boon from Artemis is a blessing 
granite pebble
Ares and Dionysus are better
harsh sleet
pressure points is my favourite boon
sick grove
Pressure points ftw
mossy spear
@feral hamlet i had that boon with the adamant rail and more ammo upgrade, emptying my clip gave me 18 extra projectiles every time
feral hamlet
i had it with the adamant rail too
mossy spear
neat
spring scaffold
Gotcha, Than. Lost a ton on health on this one, though, pushing wave-makers in the lava out of reach of Than worked well to kill them but they still managed to send more waves to me before dying ><
harsh sleet
gottem,,
mystic tusk
I've rapidly learned that an extra centaur heart isn't typically worth the effort of trying to beat thanatos on big armored enemies in asphodel
sick grove
Let than help! Gather em all up in his big AOE of death.
mossy spear
on high heat, and with bad boons, nope
spring scaffold
Meh, it's a fun challenge.
I don't mind losing health on it even if it ruins my run.
bleak osprey
i felt so bad last time i had him show up because i had zeus dash with double-zap and increased radius
i was constantly zapping him and he kept yelling about it
lunar kiln
zag: i will do everything in my power to get to the surface and reunite with her
sisyphus: who?
zag: the girl reading this
digital crag
stop hitting yourself, thanatos
spring scaffold
Don't feel bad for hitting Than, he tries to guilt-trip you into staying.
harsh sleet
spring scaffold
"Nyx did her best to be your mother you ungrateful twink" and the like.
harsh sleet
PFF
digital crag
insulting
bleak osprey
digital crag
zag worked for those pecs
harsh sleet
ugh i love u than
frozen jolt
thanatos calls you an idiot asmr
harsh sleet
sorry i just saw that emote for the first time
bleak osprey
and then i Die
digital crag
thanatos deals 9999 damage to you ASMR
frozen jolt
harsh sleet
GAME THEORISTS UPLOADED A NEW VIDEO:
thanatos is sans?????????
digital crag
not on my watch
digital crag
syd inhales
spring scaffold
- arrogant
- guilt-trips you
- is mean to dear precious Hypnos
- complains about taking risks for you when his presence usually leads to more health lost than a regular room and nobody asked for his help
sweet eagle
basically he's a teenager
harsh sleet
hes emo what more would you expect
sweet eagle
something like "Hey Zag, since we're not actually brother i will ask you out and stop being a tsundere, what do you say?"
yea i ship'em and I proud u.u
harsh sleet
thats a big mood
rapid zinc
You inhale, then wait 7 seconds, then exhale as Radioactive by Imagine Dragons continues
harsh sleet
i see
potent cove
A few days ago, I posted this in the feedback thread:
Oh, and while I'm on the subject of characters and story:
We're 3 months in and you still haven't told us anything about || Persephone!!! ||
|| She's ostensibly our primary motivation for going through all of this but we (the players and Zag) know literally nothing about her, in game ||
|| All you really need is a handful of conversations wherein Nyx, Hades or Demeter (if you ever end up putting her in the game, which you totally should, if you ask me) talk about what she was like when they knew her, to inspire our curiosity and make us feel more personally invested in finding her, rather than just trying to escape the underworld because... that is what one does when one finds themselves in an underworld XD ||
|| I'm fairly confident that's, more or less, what you had planned anyway but I feel as though it's something that should be addressed sooner rather than later,
The other story events are exciting and interesting, obviously, but I'd still like to have our primary motivation to be addressed, at least a little, before we start worrying about our complicated relationships with secondary characters ||
At present, the responses have been:
👍 17, 👎 3, ❌ 38,
Not trying to start a fight over it or anything, if people disagree with me about where SGG's priorities should be, then fair enough,
But almost everyone seems to think it's not valid feedback and I don't really understand why
neat crow
Because it's complaining about incomplete story in an incomplete game? They'll release the info when it's relevant to the content of an update
digital crag
greg touched on that in the ama
neat crow
It's unfair to judge the story content that has been released as if this is an episodic game. It's not, it's Early Access and they release content as it's created and/or when it fits the development cycle
digital crag
how do you link posts
harsh sleet
yeah,, the game isn’t finished and it’s clearly not in a place to talk about it as far as they’ve developed it
digital crag
a mystery
harsh sleet
link discord?? posts??
neat crow
@digital crag You have to turn on Developer Mode in Discord, then it enables "Copy Link" in the context menu of posts
digital crag
neato
neat crow
Though it's literally the last answer in the #ask-supergiant channel, so not hard to find
digital crag
i have too much power now
potent cove
I'm not judging the story though, I'm talking about their priority list
neat crow
Perhaps I should have emphasised the content part of "story content"
potent cove
obviously the story isn't even close to finished yet but they get to decide which characters they develop first and I'd like to see, at least some, relating to our primary motivation, before the secondary characters
neat crow
Greg answers your concerns pretty directly, though, in the post linked above
potent cove
Let me see, one sec
neat crow
I've also seen feedback that we should be explaining more about Zagreus' primary motivation; I get the desire for that though think it will be more impactful to provide that later on.
potent cove
Hmm, I see, I still don't think that invalidates the feedback though
solar depot
i for one enjoy having room to speculate and perhaps see people volunteer their own takes on these things
harsh sleet
i mean persephone isnt the only motivation zag didnt even know about her until a little into the story
its not like hades just has stuff about her lying in plain view
i think it makes more sense for it to be slow
drifting citrus
...i thought she was the entire reason
harsh sleet
i mean,, he also just wants to leave
solar depot
if it looks like i'm encouraging the creation of fanworks based on what you wanna see, it's because i'm 1000% encouraging the creation of fanworks
harsh sleet
ghffjdkh
drifting citrus
i distinctly remember in-game convos about how zag was lying to the olympians about his reasons, and that he isn't going up there to join them
red anvil
I think it's more that the discovery that he's been lied to his whole life means Zagreus wants to Get Out
frozen jolt
i feel like the fact that zag (and the player) doesnt know much about persephone is going to be pretty important to the plot, and i kinda like it this way
harsh sleet
same
livid kiln
zag wants to leave cuz his dad's asking him take responsability and act like the prince of the underworld for once-- but also yh, hades an't a nice place and gotta go find mom!
drifting citrus
i've been under the impression that learning he has an unidentified mother that is not nyx was the catalyst towards his whole dying-thousands-of-times shebang
solar depot
yeah!! honestly i enjoy speculating even if it might all get jossed later
frozen jolt
jossed is a good term i should use more lol
harsh sleet
gfhg
drifting citrus
yes i know greek myth
solar depot
i think that's a powerful potential catalyst too... but also i have thought it was very interesting that the deeper i go the more evidence i see for zag to have wanted to leave at all
visual laurel
your theory gets jilted
harsh sleet
all my theories for everything get shut down when more content comes out 
potent cove
Let me rephrase my point a smidge:
In a story based game like this:
Why you are doing something is just as important as What.
Given what we know, that basically makes || Persephone || the single most important character in the entire game, possibly barring Zag and Hades himself
So, I think we should know at least a little about what she WAS like so we care about what she is like now
I guess you could say that comes down to the fact I don't value blood-relations as much as the average person, I love my family but I also know that just because someone is related to you, that doesn't mean they love or care about you and that seeking them out probably won't be worth it if they abandoned you as a baby,
they're not likely to be happy to see you after 18 years
drifting citrus
i just want more scenes in the flashback format
visual laurel
they're building and optimizing gameplay first
drifting citrus
the flashback is cool yo
potent cove
I'm sure we will but I think it should be higher up the priority list
visual laurel
and they'll probably hold some story stuff out until the game's first release
the gameplay takes longer to work out than the story
and they're uhhh well
idk how much of our feedback they're really gonna take on story anyways
so there's not a whole lot of point releasing tons of it early except to engage us
solar depot
that sounds like it would make awesome fertile ground for fanfic, patrick!!! i'd love to see that! 
potent cove
I care about Persephone because I'm a huge mythology nerd
But the game itself hasn't given me a REASON to care about her, it just keeps saying she's important without giving us much cause to believe it, unless you just feel really strongly about blood ties
So, to me, Zag is kinda fundamentally unrelatable
Which just puts a dark shroud over the entire game,
It's not a big deal but it is annoying and super easy to fix
solar depot
that sounds awesome, please write and expand upon it!!! it definitely makes for interesting speculation...!
harsh sleet
listen if i could
id write alot of fics
they'd be thanatos centric for
clear reasons
potent cove
But yeah, does that make more sense now?
potent cove
i will, but I still want a few conversations about Persephone ASAP
solar depot
i want fan content very much 
and as a creator of fan content it is a wonderful privilege to get to fill in what we as fans perceive as gaps!
potent cove
I might write my own version of the Hades and Persephone myth one day but not in the game's universe
drifting citrus
am i right in thinking the next biome is gonna be elysium? or is there another layer of the underworld? i'm not too well-versed in greek myth
digital crag
next area confirmed to be elysium
drifting citrus
then again, the little i've read says that asphodel was a meadow and now it's a lava field! so who knows :v
potent cove
that's meantioned actually:
it was a meadow but the river phlegathon (river of fire) flooded
They'll probably come up with a similar reason to...hell-ify Elysium
Not 100% thrilled about it though
runic terrace
cool! you should write that!! lots of mythy works out there
digital crag
a touching story for the ages
spring scaffold
It's supposed to be a great place. Probably won't be though 
neat crow
It's supposed to be idyllic, yeah
spring scaffold
"to the Elysian plain...where life is easiest for men. No snow is there, nor heavy storm, nor ever rain, but ever does Ocean send up blasts of the shrill-blowing West Wind that they may give cooling to men."
Although since we got lava in Asphodel, where there is no lava, so Elysium will probably be equally wrecked and maybe we'll get snow. If we do, I hope there won't be snow falling all the time, it will be hard for people who already get lag from Zeus
harsh sleet
i can already picture thanatos whining about the cold and i like it
drifting citrus
so maybe the west wind is like woosh but now it's like WOOSH and everything is cold
rapid zinc
<Banging hands on table, chanting> Snow, snow, snow, snow, snow, snow
spring scaffold
Fries, fries, fries, fries, fries, fries, fries, fries
Also, I'll take my kebab with tomato, salad, but no onions
harsh sleet
yall makin me hungry
drifting citrus
zag inexplicably shows up in a waiter's outfit
spring scaffold
Every room in Elysium is a no-hit challenge. With a kebab if you win and an onion if you fail. No boons, no darkness, no poms. Just food.
spring scaffold
(although, now that I think about it, that could be a cool game mode: going as far as you can with no character upgrades at all during the run)
lunar kiln
hades commercializes his home-grown onions so sometimes an onion takes up one of charon's wares
drifting citrus
charon's wares: onion/ambrosia/food
potent cove
Is there any story content hidden behind the murder death blood void gates of punishment and hatred whythehelldoihavetospendtwentyfiveorfiftyheatjusttogetintothoseroomsomg thingies
Or is it just the reward in the icon, like Chaos gates, ...before they added Chaos?
rapid zinc
Only rewards
neat crow
You don't have to "spend" any 
, you just have to have put that amount into the Pact of Punishment. Heat is never lost, except by trading it to the Wretched Broker. There is a Codex entry related to participating in the Erebus challenge within the Infernal Gate, and you get better rewards than standard. Poms give 2x upgrade amount, god boons have higher average rarity, Centaur Hearts give 2x HP, and Obol gives x2 amount. You also always get 3 exit options, one of which is unique to Erebus exits
spring scaffold
... I kind of want to find one of those gates with one of Chaos' "get +XXX% Obol" now.
neat crow
Throw in some Ocean's Bounty while you're at it
potent cove
I know, just couldn't think of a better term than "spend"
neat crow
Active would be more descriptive
spring scaffold
Finish an Infernal Gate, +1000 Obol, you can now empty two shops and a well competely
neat crow
Jokes on you, you had Convenience Fee on and still can't afford anything 
spring scaffold
Yeah, I got that active at all times now. I'm usually just dodging shops.
neat crow
Or you forget that you have the "can't gain any 
" Chaos debuff active 
neat crow
I've done that a few times
neat crow
Take the can't gain debuff — Chaos kicks you out into an reward room
spring scaffold
Bought a "treasure trove in next room" thing from a well forgetting I had that and picked an Obol room for it 
Had Ocean's Bounty level 3 so I thought it would be awesome to get that much money. Didn't get a thing
potent cove
They should probably tweak the GUI so debuffs like that are harder to totally forget about
neat crow
I mean... you can only save players from themselves so much
spring scaffold
There's a big noise when it finally goes away. If you forgot about it, it's kinda your fault.
neat crow
I've forgotten about various debuffs plenty of times, and always felt like it was my fault and not the game's for not reminding me
spring scaffold
I only forgot because it's such an unimportant debuff. You'll never see me using my special without a good reason if I got a special debuff, those ones are harder to forget.
neat crow
If I'm talking in Discord a lot while playing, I sometimes forgot that I've taken a "take damage" debuff 
potent cove
games are meant to be played...by players,
If the player is screwing up more than they should, the game has to try and work around them, not the other way around, broadly speaking anyway
😅
neat crow
I think the game does plenty as it is to inform the player about the debuffs
At some point you have to let people make mistakes and learn from those mistakes
spring scaffold
Not really. At some point, it's the player's fault. With your argument, if a player keeps getting hit, the enemies should stop dealing damage to work around that?
As long as there's a clear way to see if your debuff is still active AND a noise when it disappears, it's good. The only more obvious way would be to put a bright red flashing warning sign in the middle of your screen.
neat crow
No thank you
potent cove
obviously there's a cut off point but Video games are meant to work around people, from a design stand point
If you get hit because you made an error in execution or evaluation, it's your responsibility
if you didn't know why you got hit though, the game has failed to convey something to you
neat crow
I see your point, but I don't think it applies here
spring scaffold
Except you do know. If you don't remember what debuff you've taken 4 rooms ago, it's your fault.
neat crow
The player, by virtue of choosing the boon, acknowledges that they have the debuff. If they forget, that's on them. The boons are visible at the press of a button
spring scaffold
Especially since you can check at any time by a press of a button.
neat crow
For the damaging ones, there's even a visual and audio cue that you've activated a debuff
potent cove
Common example is if someone gets hit by a projectile they can't see because they're colour blind - Game devs problem, not players,
Some goes for a projectile that're too small to be seen easily by normal sighted people
In this case, I think the issue is that debuffs get sorta lost among many other abilities and you can't check them without disturbing the flow of the game
neat crow
So you're absolving players of the responsibility of remembering their choices from at most 4 Encounters prior?
potent cove
They could just reorganise how abilities are displayed so debuffs are always in a certain spot, instead of being mixed in with other abilities
You'll see them at a glance instead of having to read through the whole list
spring scaffold
They have a pattern that's very visible among other ones, they are exactly as you picked them chronologically and they have an icon next to them showing how many encounters are left. Definitely visible enough.
neat crow
This is really just going in circles. I don't think there's an issue with how it is implemented currently, but that doesn't mean it's perfect either. Could it be altered? Probably. Does it have to be? Probably not. Is it broken currently? Absolutely not
I'm not trying to say your concerns aren't valid or anything, but I disagree with your reasoning, and will leave it at that
Thanks for the thoughtful and considered discussion 
(I'm surprised no mods yelled at us to move to gameplay, though )
potent cove
Okay, imagine if this happened in reverse:
The game has abilities and debuffs listed by category and has larger, clearer turn counters,
then the latest patch comes out and it suddenly gets switched to tiny text in chronological order
You honestly think that's an improvement?
Good point, go there now?
spring scaffold
Depends. Large turn counters might hide projectiles. Listing by category would probably be less visible if the Chaos category is the bottom one and if it's the top one, it could go out of screen if you've got too many things.
potent cove
I'm sure the SGG guys can figure it out,
The current design already obscures the screen a huge amount so... meh
spring scaffold
You could write about it in feedback channel if you really feel that's an issue, but I won't be among the ones upvoting it though (still, wouldn't downvote it either)
sick grove
I think, something forgotten in this conversation, is that Chaos boon penalties are primarily punishments, and not just deterrents. If I wasn't allowed to open a chest because of this perk, or wasn't allowed to dash/attack/special instead of taking damage when I did, it wouldn't be as much of a punishment. This mindfulness is key to the penalties, and removing that removes a lot of their flavor from them.
It's literally Chaos slapping you on the hand and going 'haha you thought'
And I like that a lot. It's also not like the option to view these things isn't readily available, but it's obfuscated in such a way that the player must forcibly check what their penalties are. They're designed to be another thing you need to mentally juggle.
molten pike
How do I get Orpheus to sing? :|c
neat crow
Pump him full of Ambrosia
molten pike
Thanks!
harsh sleet
pump him full of ambrosia is a good phrase
also exactly how i’d describe how i think when i see thanatos
neat crow
So thirsty
neat crow
It just amuses me how thirsty people get over the characters, that's all
neat crow
Fair enough
harsh sleet
if there’s an angsty blonde/white haired boy in a video game tho
hell yea he’s my fav
neat crow
I have no idea what dhabi dn means, though 🙃
harsh sleet
it’s a keysmash im@sorry fhtbtbfn
neat crow
Oh, ha ha just seemed odd for a keymash, buttons so far apart
neat crow
Touch all of the screen! 
harsh sleet
i gotta
molten pike
Aside from Orpheus, is there anything I get out of gifting other NPCs repeated ambrosia?
visual laurel
There are several conversations with multiple characters that are locked behind hearts
it's not just orpheus!
visual laurel
I haven't dug into the requirements in detail because I don't want to spoil myself, but I know of a few convos that have heart gates, and I'm sure there are more
heheheh yesss
the number of runs i suicided because i was just trying to get ambrosia as fast as possible....
spring scaffold
Now that the broker is less unfair, it's probably easier to stockpile other resources to buy ambrosia. Could also go for Dionysus runs.
visual laurel
yeah, it's way easier now, haha
molten pike
Did they adjust the broker? I did notice I suddenly actually wanted to buy things haha
sleek cape
I have too much ambrosia
spring scaffold
Well, we now have a huge darkness sink, so you could make use of the broker to get rid of those ambrosia bottles.
sleek cape
YeH I've been getting unlucky with the broker
Keeps wanting to give me ambrosia or heat
acoustic condor
Curse of Longing really is the best thing in the game if you have an efficient way of applying both effects huh
I hope we get a whole duos upd8 sometime they're like The Best Thing (even tho I think they could use some fancier visuals but it's by the by)
snow brook
Gotta stock up on ambrosia. Who knows when SGG will add 40 more NPCs who each require 7 ambrosia to get the full story 
You don't wanna leave anyone hanging, y'know?
ebon cradle
silent prairie
Thanatos is a jerk if you're doing a shield charge run. Enemies just did nothing but spawn near him and hug him, but you can't do the charge anywhere near him because you just bounce off him if you get even vaguely close.
lunar kiln
thanatos/hades interaction where hades asks thanatos what time it is since he regularly goes to the surface for work
conversation goes wrong as the underworld technically has no precise location geographically and thanatos ends up explaining to hades the concept of timezones
visual laurel
does thanatos deal with the dead anywhere other than greece tho
lunar kiln
i mean he is death so i'd assume so
visual laurel
ancient greeks in the underworld like "what are these barbarians doing in my asphodel"
bleak osprey
barbarians? in MY asphodel? it's more likely than you think.
visual briar
Question: are zagrius and thanatos brothers ?
visual laurel
no
visual briar
Then what is their relationship nature
runic terrace
play the game n find out? 😉
visual briar
I did that's why I am asking
grand vine
Than and Hypnos are Nyx's children.
And Meg too... which made her relation with Zag quite different
marsh prawn
Greg addressed this before
In the game, the furies aren’t Nyx’ daughters
They chose one of the other furies myths
But Hypnos and Than are her sons
lyric pine
damn why does hypnos look so smug in your profile picture
marsh prawn
Because he knows nobody dodges ever
marsh prawn
Can you imagine Pain
lyric pine
distant shuddering
runic terrace
nyanatos
harsh sleet
YEA
YES
thanatos: nya
zagreus: sorry WHAT
thanatos: yknow like nya 
im@gonna die with this weeb thanatos hc
harsh sleet
PLEASE DRAW IT
i love the way u draw thanatos
thanatos is out here like “I HAVE THe POWER OF DEATH AND ANIME ON MY SIDE”
runic terrace
HDJXJFJF
i didnt get any thanny rooms on my run just now so may as well draw the boy
harsh sleet
i owe u my life
drifting citrus
i think than hates zag in my save he’s only showed up like three times
harsh sleet
he’s just shy
normal talon
i feel that he’s only shown up twice for me
lunar kiln
thanatos is a nerd bc his keepsake is a butterfly which symbolism aside could show he's into entomology
digital crag
i thought that just meant he's emo
drifting citrus
or he just likes killing butterflies
lunar kiln
that as well
normal talon
than and zag kinda remind me of that one scene in kill la kill where the teacher guy is showing off while ryuko is scowling because it’s so awkward
normal talon
okay that’s fair
but just the image of than being very showy and zag just bein like 😑
lunar kiln
ok this is forbidden territory now,
runic terrace
jfkvmvk
normal talon
than: so zagreus... you found me
zag: yeah, well i’m trying to escape so if you could just-
than: escape THIS [casts a death circle]
runic terrace
MFMXKXMCMCMCMVNVNB I GOTTA GO SOMEONE PLS MAKE THIS EDIT
harsh sleet
thanatos cries when he doesn’t win at fortnite
so hypnos and zag have to help him win
lunar kiln
thats why he stays away from hypnos
runic terrace
than plays fortnite w alecto n ares and they always beat him
normal talon
hypnos is notorious for doing the default dance as a pop off irl
lunar kiln
alecto exclusively plays tf2 as soldier w/ disciplinary action
she likes the feel of this weapon
honest coral
runic terrace
sisyphus told him on the fortnite discord "if you type your password it stars it out!" and thanny typed his password
lunar kiln
HH
harsh sleet
AHAHA
honest coral
hunter2
lunar kiln
t hanatos
normal talon
i love him so much
lunar kiln
we love him
runic terrace
its what he deserves
normal talon
sisyphus’ password: bouldofyoutoassume
normal talon
hackerman than
lunar kiln
he's a big fan of herobrine
normal talon
i’d say minecraft
lunar kiln
thanatos uses like 100+ TNT mods
harsh sleet
tbh i have been drawing than with pointy ears
lunar kiln
thanatos
harsh sleet
just bc it’s cute tho
lunar kiln
ThaNaTos
normal talon
than built the entirety of the underworld in minecraft
lunar kiln
he recreated the house of hades
runic terrace
omg...pointy ear thanny....elf
lunar kiln
hades characters who are excellent minecraft builders:
-thanatos
-tisiphone
harsh sleet
tisi and alecto aren’t allowed in the house bc they beat hades at fortnite too many times
lunar kiln
hades doesnt like video games
harsh sleet
not anymore
honest coral
hades plays candy crush and sends you invites to play
that one parent who always sends those "here's a dragon egg gift" things
lunar kiln
bouldy crush
normal talon
do you think than would play gacha games
lunar kiln
oh definitely
runic terrace
tryin to get that elusive anime guy pic
normal talon
i wish i knew what font this game uses for text
bleak osprey
i know!
honest coral
@normal talon SpectralSCExtraLight, AlegreyaSansExtraBold, UbuntuMono16
normal talon
THANK U
honest coral
variations of extrabold, extralight, bold, etc
harsh sleet
thanatos’ cat is called goku
harsh sleet
i rlly want a voice clip of thanatos saying 'you are already dead'
runic terrace
i have amazing news
runic terrace
YEAH
bleak osprey
stares at the entire folder of thanatos voice lines i have :3c
harsh sleet
i just want it on me at all times so i can make it my notification sound
harsh sleet
im gonna need all of those pls
digital crag
Holy
bleak osprey
i mean that's not All The Lines,
harsh sleet
for scientific reasons
bleak osprey
he has 391 in total
harsh sleet
oh my gosh
digital crag
By scientific reasons do you mean making a one to the two to the two to the three remix
normal talon
he's got the trunks hair, the omae wa mo shindeiru
runic terrace
AAAAAA
normal talon
what more do you need
harsh sleet
MAYBE
runic terrace
two to the one to the two to the three. you are dead. already
harsh sleet
death is inescapable. hit them, not me!
lunar kiln
not me idiot
normal talon
hold on are we not allowed to send pictures into this chat
digital crag
Saw you hanging out with meg yesterday
bleak osprey
i mean i have the "not me, idiot" line too if you want that one
lunar kiln
i think you posted it once
harsh sleet
i downloaded it when u sent it
bleak osprey
i mean fair
lunar kiln
oh also one thing i found funny
hades has a very vague idea of your progress in your escapes, but meg? she knows Everything
youve been in contact with chaos? She Knows
thanatos helped you out? She Knows
bleak osprey
hey who wants a blessed tisiphone laugh
digital crag
Yes
bleak osprey
tisi laugh!
lunar kiln
mhhhmhmhmhm
runic terrace
BLESED
harsh sleet
mmmmmhmhmhmm mmmmurrdererrr
normal talon
a v good laugh
long portal
Just wanted to share that 'Scourge of the Furies' is now up on Spotify for your listening pleasure! https://open.spotify.com/track/4VH7q8KSvP5meFBLaTkVs0
normal talon
NICE
digital crag
👌
harsh sleet
oh yea,, does anyone have the lyrics for hymn to zagreus
runic terrace
they're on bandcamp!
digital crag
Yeh on youtube too
normal talon
wow i love this game
harsh sleet
o i didnt see them on youtube
digital crag
In the description!
fading brook
hey is someone able to help me out with the video supergiant posted of darren and ashley performing? i tried to check it out but it’s a 1.5 hour long video with the audio cut and i don’t know what part they’re actually performing at
i feel really silly that i can’t seem to crack it, it obviously worked for other people considering i can see the comments
bleak osprey
wight, they're saying the timestamped link in't working
there's no point jsut giving them the same link again ;P
neat crow
Then manually navigate to the time in the link?
bleak osprey
jump to 39 minutes and 51 seconds or so
fading brook
THANK YOU GUYS IT WORKED
feral hamlet
digital crag
link to the artist's page > https://www.artstation.com/artwork/RYqw1E
amber canyon
Zags mom has got it going on
visual laurel
as always, that is a 🅱ood
runic terrace
(wakes up) time to love thanatos
does thanny know? does thanny know how much ppl care about him? he needs it
bleak osprey
kam out here asking the real questions
rapid zinc
Why would he stop shopping at Hot Topic? That's part of why we love him
runic terrace
stop shopping for himself at hot topic and start shopping for syd at hot topic
harsh sleet
GJHFDFD
iu only wear pastel colours
i cant
imagine that
also do they have hot topic in the uk
runic terrace
they have pastel stuff too hell buy u galaxy print leggings and a cotton candy shirt
runic terrace
thats the only store he knows if he wamts food he just buys camdy shaped like ocerwatch characters or whatever
runic terrace
death aproaches
harsh sleet
thank god
runic terrace
harsh sleet
👈 👈
shy socket
...
neat crow
A thankless job, no doubt
runic terrace
you thant
harsh sleet
im handing in my funnyman card now
neat crow
When they're all out for dinner, nothing is more surprising than a toast
runic terrace
you gotta go to clown school again
AAAAAAAGHGHHHHH
reading that feels like running into a brick wall
its great
neat crow
My work here is done
runic terrace
your work here is pun
rapid zinc
I'm going to make some blackout poetry
harsh sleet
NO
runic terrace
for sale: thanatos shoes, never worn
over thanatos's nail polish
harsh sleet
oh yall this is an issue
neat crow
We don't have full body portrait, do we?
visual laurel
we do actually? kind of
bleak osprey
https://twitter.com/artpaiges/status/1105892856177274881 there's this shot of his model
neat crow
Oh, sorry, I meant Zagreus
harsh sleet
yeah what a beautiful boy for starters
visual laurel
oh well we can tell zag's not wearing shoes, if that's the question
his feet are on fire gkjfhgkjdf
neat crow
I guess the Chthonic gods eschew that notion
visual laurel
except meg
neat crow
I'm still here
runic terrace
hjgfvhjfhj
neat crow
I'm just waiting for the yelling to start for my last line, that's all
Maybe it wasn't that punny after all, though
visual laurel
i get it now gkdfjgdf
runic terrace
oh. OH
visual laurel
gkdfjghfd yeah it takes a second
neat crow
It's not the same if I have to point it out though... I'll just be over here... depressed at what I've become
neat crow
visual laurel
eschew is pronounced like eh-shoe
harsh sleet
OH
bleak osprey
aha, went digging
bleak osprey
https://twitter.com/artpaiges/status/1085656929622315009 this is as close to a full-body shot we have of zagreus
runic terrace
and it means like, to reject
harsh sleet
SEE THANATOS HE CAN WEAR SHOES.
normal talon
sometimes we are all just babey
harsh sleet
WHY CANT YOU
runic terrace
so. reject shoes. eh shoe
neat crow
A true hero, sparrow
bleak osprey
syd those aren't shoes that's just How His Feet Be
visual laurel
hades is the same but we're not gonna talk about that
runic terrace
hades has a desk for a reason
visual laurel
i'm insulted
bleak osprey
either zag is not wearing shoes or it's those weird toe-shoes
visual laurel
you've not had a childhood if you haven't gotten used to running around barefoot
be the wild child you were always meant to be
burn your feet in august
you're tough you can take it
runic terrace
going barefoot everywhere is valid. getting splinters in your feet because you go barefoot everywhere is VALID
visual laurel
the pavement gets so hot
harsh sleet
thats why zag only takes 1 damage at a time while standing in a pit.. of.. lava
runic terrace
"ive stood in worse"
visual laurel
zag clearly grew up in alabama in the summer
visual laurel
stuck his hand in a fire
runic terrace
zag is the guy from that post with "my date made me pizza and went to the oven like OHHHHH THIS IS THE WORST PART and took it out without mitts"
harsh sleet
yknow how one side of his face is like black compared to the other gray side
runic terrace
AAAAAA
bleak osprey
ok but the green eye looks vaguely like he's wearing winged eyeliner in his portrait??
👁
harsh sleet
i stan!
bleak osprey
y'know, the downside of having Funnie Filenames for all my portrait rips is that i can never find who i'm looking for right away
harsh sleet
BEING A FUNNEYMAN WILL BE THE DEATH OF US
visual laurel
does the liner reapply itself when he pulls himself out of the pool of styx
is it permanent
or does he have to redo it before he goes out every single time
bleak osprey
good thing i'm already wearing red, i guess.
runic terrace
hes gotta redo it probably
visual laurel
dedication to the Look
harsh sleet
what else do u think he does w that massive mirror?
runic terrace
jhfvhjfhjf hes all sweaty from fighting by the time he gets to the hydra he has raccoon eyes
lime yoke
good thinking Syd @_@
harsh sleet
i,, i did thinking?
neat crow
Lashes to give the Furies a run
harsh sleet
when...
lime yoke
the mirror thing xD i was in the middle of writing that
runic terrace
OBVIOUSLY he twirls around stylin like have u seen all the clothes in his room
lime yoke
XDDD
runic terrace
hes got treasure troves full of scarves and stuff....boy mustve spent hours picking clothes before he settled on a fighting outfit
lime yoke
raccoon eyes Zag somehow sounds so cute
harsh sleet
zags tryna get to olympus so he can model for vogue
bleak osprey
zag holding up two chitons that are only a couple shades apart trying to work out what to wear
runic terrace
zag...your liners all smudged, were you crying?
nah, just sweating
oh! next time dont do that
bleak osprey
:zagthink:
harsh sleet
have you tried dodging the sweat?
runic terrace
WHY do we not have a zagthink actualy
lime yoke
a concept: when Zag was younger he kept doing those on purpose to look more like Hypnos ;w;
harsh sleet
Whos the bigger drama queen zag or thanatos
runic terrace
equally matched in different ways
visual laurel
one (1) brain cell
runic terrace
zag is messy in a trying to do everything way thanny is messy in a laser focus way
harsh sleet
i would like to hear more of than, being wholly honest
visual laurel
two months..............................
runic terrace
twom.............
iron flame
Nyx: Now now Zagreus, it's Thanatos' turn with the brain cell.
visual laurel
house of hades characters ranked by how many brain cells they have gkdfjhgfdk
harsh sleet
AHAHAVFGDH
neat crow
Trick question, Cerberus wins by default on account of having 3 brains 
harsh sleet
one time hypnos got the brain cell and it was weirdly productive no one liked it
visual laurel
cerberus is the smartest one in the house lbr
and its not just bc he has three heads gkjdfghfd
runic terrace
hypnos is the kinda guy who suddenly gets a burst of energy and does all the chores because he was restless
and then never does that ever again
harsh sleet
oh look at that! im hypnos
lime yoke
thats a mood
i just had the stupidest idea
Thanatos' braincell is stored in his scythe, soul eater style xD
harsh sleet
omg
runic terrace
tell PLEASE
harsh sleet
no thats perfect bc hes a weeb
harsh sleet
again, he has a cat named goku
runic terrace
YES
lime yoke
does he
runic terrace
oh i just realized thanny doesnt have a crop top in ingame art lol
rapid zinc
Dusa is the smartest in the house, she's just too shy and anxious to do anything with it
bleak osprey
he has a crop top in his heart, where it matters
rapid zinc
Zagreus: Nice Garfield cosplay
Thanatos: I'm literally going to kill you in real life
lime yoke
there's a very dumb pun about crops and scythes somewhere but im too tired to commit