#h1-builds-and-combat | Supergiant Games | Page 665

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:30 AM

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Depends on if you're measuring real time or in game time

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:30 AM

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8 mins game time

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13-14 min real time

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:30 AM

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There's a 5 minute in game time clear with a seeded run

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 5:30 AM

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https://www.speedrun.com/hades

speedrun.com

Speedrunning leaderboards, resources, forums, and more!

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:30 AM

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I once got a 12 min clear time with unseeded

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But it was like 25 min real time

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Big sad

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I actually never did seeded

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:31 AM

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I'm just a pretty methodical player, most my runs are 17-24 minutes

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:31 AM

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Yes the 12 min clear was with Rama Zeus special

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:31 AM

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I get sloppy if I rush too hard

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:31 AM

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I always play with Tight Deadline 3 on

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:32 AM

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It's nice that tight deadline doesn't instantly end the run

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 5:32 AM

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When do we get the Aspect of Sparda (feat. Dante from Devil May Cry)?

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:32 AM

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I kinda enjoy imagining Hades looking at his watch condescendingly

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:32 AM

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Not that 5 hp lost per second over is ignorable

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:33 AM

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"Junior is late"

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And I still consider myself to be pretty casual ngl

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The fastest clear I got was pretty insane

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I got relentless voley and splitting bolt in Tartarus

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As well as swift flourish

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And I just breezed through asphodel in under a minute

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 5:35 AM

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I think at 32 Heat and below, my clears are all like 13~18 minutes? Depending on aspect.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:36 AM

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i too am a speedrunner

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once i did a sub 1 hour run

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 5:36 AM

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I'm not a speedrunner lol.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:36 AM

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yeah jks ofc

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:36 AM

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The worst hades runs imo are the ones you just don't get damage in where no matter how good you play it's going to take almost 3 minutes just to beat asterius in his mini boss room

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 5:36 AM

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My times would be pretty bad for speedruns probably. thanthink

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:37 AM

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Nah it's pretty good

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My average is 17

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:37 AM

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Though fated persuasion helps a ton with that not happening

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:37 AM

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I think

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:37 AM

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i don’t think 13-18 is bad at all for unseeded

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:37 AM

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It's mostly Elysium killing my time

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:37 AM

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tho i wouldn’t know lol

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:38 AM

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Including the bull

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Sub boss bull is the worst

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:38 AM

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I lose a lot of time in Asphodel just trying to figure out where that damned burn flinger jumped away too lmao

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:38 AM

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It's mostly Elysium killing my time
@olive badge It’s mostly Elysium killing ~~my time~~ me

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:38 AM

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When he does the beyblade

true linden Oct 12, 2020, 5:38 AM

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I strike back my statement

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Hades spear is alright

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:38 AM

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You either lose time or HP

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Or both

true linden Oct 12, 2020, 5:38 AM

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I agree with it's existence

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 5:39 AM

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Peerless strategy for minotaur: Ares dash + like +3 dashes from Hermes and then just run in circles for ten minutes until he eventually dies

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:39 AM

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I... kinda don't have 10 minutes...

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 5:39 AM

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Nah, unseeded speedruns should be sub-13 consistently at least. The slowest on the board is 14:08.

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:39 AM

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Tight Deadline give me 20 to clear the game

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:39 AM

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fair enough

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:40 AM

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I'm kinda casual

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The only reason I do sub 20 is because I'm practically required to

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Cuz TD3

cosmic vale Oct 12, 2020, 5:40 AM

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how do you get the thing where you get some gemstones and +5 max health when you kill a boss

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if they drop darkness

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:41 AM

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House contractor upgrades

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:41 AM

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JS amuses me too much for me to run much TD lol

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:41 AM

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JS?

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:41 AM

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i’m tryna just do TD2 consistently

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Just Summons

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:41 AM

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Jury sunmons

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:41 AM

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extra enemies

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:41 AM

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Oh

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At least imo

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 5:41 AM

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Why not JS3 + TD3. squirtdevious

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:42 AM

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Current TD 3 is better than old td2

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:42 AM

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great idea

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:42 AM

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Old TD2 was like

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:42 AM

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if you max both, they prolly cancel each other out

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:42 AM

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Oh I cleared Asphodel in 45s

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 5:42 AM

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In one of my previous runs I had a really Zeus chain lightning heavy build and then one of Chaos' boons' "downsides" was "more enemies for X rooms"

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"Downside"

pseudo iron Oct 12, 2020, 5:42 AM

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is fists+dionysus attack good

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:42 AM

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Lose the run in Styx because 5 sack

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 5:42 AM

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TD3 now is a lot harder than TD2 was pre-1.0.

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:42 AM

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Time to run out of time in Ely

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I mean it's harder alright

pseudo iron Oct 12, 2020, 5:43 AM

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because id imagine you could stack rly easily

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:43 AM

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It's less annoying though

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Fist dio or fist zeuss are both p good

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Pick purple seizure or yellow seizure

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Your choice

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 5:43 AM

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Drunken Strike is not good on Malphon, no. thanthink

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:43 AM

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i find TD3 and old TD2 about the same, but i think that’s just because i’m less rubbish now

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:44 AM

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Yeah listen to Nya and build Ares

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 5:44 AM

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You'll want Divine Strike, Curse of Agony, or Lightning Strike.

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I do mostly Divine Strike on Malphon lol.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:44 AM

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Dio is like, desperate for damage mode on fists

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It works but it's slow

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:44 AM

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Get support fire!

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For barely different dps

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:45 AM

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just do what i did once and fail at punch dps then accidentally put a cast build together in styx instead

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ez

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:45 AM

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My fav is athena attack Arthur

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D e f l e c t

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:46 AM

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I've had a handful of terrible runs turn into hunting blades spam in styx

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:46 AM

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Do you take regen cast on HB

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Or are you normal

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:47 AM

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I mean, consider the context. That's always gonna be 3 casts instead of regen lol

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Hunting blades was never the journey but it was the destination

mossy light Oct 12, 2020, 5:47 AM

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TFW you open a health chest and lose more health than you gain zaglol

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:47 AM

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walking into styx on 3 hp with no DDs being like “welp, i guess i’ll die” then you find hunting blades and suddenly you have the option to take a nap while killing hades

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:47 AM

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How good is Dem Beam now btw

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:48 AM

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It's reasonably ok and good fun

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:48 AM

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Turret mode

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Time to play engineer

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 5:48 AM

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I solve problems.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:48 AM

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Still lacks aoe or piercing so not good overall

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:49 AM

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there’s a kinda rng heavy way to give it aoe

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:49 AM

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Even with Crystal clarity + whatever the boon is that makes the beam apply chill it's not particularly insane

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:49 AM

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but ye i never got it working

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:49 AM

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Also how's lightning phalanx now

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Last I checked it was p busted

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:49 AM

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Still a glorified styx clear button

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:50 AM

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nothing wrong with a glorified styx clear button

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that is, after all, basically the entire point of poseidon

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:51 AM

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I wonder if I'd bother with Firey Presence if it was buffed again to 150% thanthink

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 5:51 AM

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I would argue the whole point of poseidon is for sea storm lmao

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:52 AM

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What's current bonus?

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:52 AM

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The number is going up on it but not my excitement

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It's 100% now

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Was 50%

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 5:52 AM

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I never switched off of Firey lmao.

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:52 AM

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Gonna be good for ice wine

solid portal Oct 12, 2020, 5:52 AM

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is there an animation for the double dash strike?

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:52 AM

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Yeahhhhhhhhh

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:52 AM

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unless they fixed it it’s actually 50% now

solid portal Oct 12, 2020, 5:52 AM

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"double edge"

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:52 AM

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says 100%, but it’s bugged

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 5:53 AM

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oh, wait, no, I thought we were talking about boiling blood for some reason, I just don't see a reason to use fiery

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 5:55 AM

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Boiling blood is kind of pointless if you are going for a cast focused build anyway

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 5:56 AM

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Aren't they both kinda so-so?

mossy light Oct 12, 2020, 5:56 AM

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it never FEELS effective

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i wish there was a dps bar or something. floating numbers doesnt really mean much to me

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:58 AM

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Boiling blood is good if you use regen cast

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Throw it on bosses and you'll feel it

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Sadly the 50% sound big but it's just additive

mossy light Oct 12, 2020, 5:58 AM

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yeah, all of these additive percents.

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:58 AM

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So say, regularly you do 50 damage

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Boiling only add 25

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Boiling is most obvious when you have some special build

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Like Guanyu

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:59 AM

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boiling blood is noticeable imo

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 5:59 AM

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With charged skewer

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 5:59 AM

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not ridiculous, but noticeable

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:00 AM

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Yeah Hades's boiling blood definitely is

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shadegrief

mossy light Oct 12, 2020, 6:00 AM

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failbag

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:00 AM

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How can you notice something you never get hit by

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:00 AM

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Yeah, just don't get hit by skulls.

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:01 AM

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But I'm a scrub

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:01 AM

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ah, don’t get hit

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i see

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:01 AM

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~~I say that knowing full well how many times I've dashed directly into one of the skulls in flight~~

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:01 AM

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feel like hypnos told me that once...

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:01 AM

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works everytime

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:01 AM

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@olive badge https://discordapp.com/channels/456889434672201729/520688402958516254/520688527412035584

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:01 AM

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brilliant idea

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also what I hate is him dash up to me

mossy light Oct 12, 2020, 6:02 AM

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im learning hell mode. the lack of tick invulnerability is kicking my bum

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:02 AM

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and bash the skull in my face melee range

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:02 AM

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Broken spearpoint

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Don't leave Elysium without it kids

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:02 AM

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well you heard the man

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it's literally named broken

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:02 AM

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Unless you are actually good at the game and don't need it

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:02 AM

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how could it not be

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:03 AM

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i mean, broken spearpoint did used to be broken

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when it had no cool down

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:03 AM

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It's still pretty good

solid portal Oct 12, 2020, 6:03 AM

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wow, I love every weapon so much except the sword. I really struggle with it. I need to practice more I guess. Such an uninspiring weapon though. I go all the way to stx no issue then don't even get to hades. I think that's a first. Sword is just no good for me. Any tips appreciated.

I took second aspect and went with % to DMG

mossy light Oct 12, 2020, 6:03 AM

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if i continue to get killed in theory ill gitgud right? zaglol

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:04 AM

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To be completely fair sword has the most mediocre and bad hammers of all the weapons

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:04 AM

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honestly sword is the "basic" weapon

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:04 AM

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you get good at what you do a lot of

so if you die a lot, you’ll get really proficient at dying

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:04 AM

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so it has terrible hammer

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:04 AM

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wait no

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that can’t be right

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:04 AM

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and not much flavor

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the only thing I am good at now

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is killing myself to reroll boons

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residentzag

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:05 AM

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Would be fun if there were a warhammer weapon

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Just completely knock back based

mossy light Oct 12, 2020, 6:05 AM

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sword beam attack failbag

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:05 AM

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I'd point you to Bastion

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:05 AM

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I mean you literally have excalibur

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or in the word of a certain blonde girl

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Ekkusu

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CAAARRRRIBAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:06 AM

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I want a scythe weapon so thanatos can feel insecure and drop lines like "well mine hits for 9999" poof

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:07 AM

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All I want is a switch peripheral that measures sunlight and an Exagryph aspect that turns it into the Gun Del Sol

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I miss Boktai...

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There's not really any sun in Hades though

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:07 AM

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how is kinetic launcher with Demeter

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is it good or just meme

unkempt pagoda Oct 12, 2020, 6:08 AM

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you shoot extra projectiles

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:08 AM

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@mossy light just followed the pinned guide in this channel and you'll git gud. it's the very first pin.

unkempt pagoda Oct 12, 2020, 6:08 AM

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it works how one thinks it should

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:08 AM

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I mean in term of viability

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:08 AM

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@cunning urchin ive got the git part, but I'm struggling with the gud

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:08 AM

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although

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:08 AM

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Gitting there.

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:08 AM

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I did think it just shoot a multi hit projectile

unkempt pagoda Oct 12, 2020, 6:09 AM

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it's a delete button, but ranged and can power shot

mossy light Oct 12, 2020, 6:09 AM

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@cunning urchin amazing. i feel it working already dusa

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:09 AM

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I got stuck at G

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:09 AM

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waittttttttttttt

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:09 AM

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Just get through H and you'll have the I

mossy light Oct 12, 2020, 6:09 AM

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@tranquil violet it helps if youre a git. the gud takes longer

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:10 AM

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Kinetic Launcher can power shot?????

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I just thought it's a generic 50 dmg projectile

solid portal Oct 12, 2020, 6:10 AM

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Well I accidentally unlocked Guan Yu

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That was awesome

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is it any good?

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:10 AM

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It's my favorite spear.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:10 AM

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Power shot shield with the ranged attack is just block bow

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:10 AM

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it's the glass cannon weapon

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by that I mean you're the glass and enemies are cannon

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:11 AM

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Guan Yu was the first aspect to clear 40 Heat. So it's certainly not bad.

unkempt pagoda Oct 12, 2020, 6:11 AM

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minotaur rush is surprisingly stronk

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:11 AM

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it's what I took to reroll boons

unkempt pagoda Oct 12, 2020, 6:11 AM

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unupgraded is 240 damage

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:11 AM

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But its Special base damage was still 50 then. It's 45 now. Still very good, though.

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:11 AM

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jokes aside charged skewer guan yu

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shadeohboy

solid portal Oct 12, 2020, 6:11 AM

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by that I mean you're the glass and enemies are cannon
@olive badge LMFAO

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:11 AM

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poggers build

solid portal Oct 12, 2020, 6:12 AM

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well if @cunning urchin likes it, it must be good

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omg there's a spider in my office, time to burn my house to the ground! wtf is that thing!!!

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:12 AM

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Guan yu no spin no special 53 heat

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:12 AM

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So, I just get Serrated Point for 53 Heat, you mean? Alright.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:13 AM

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omg there's a spider in my office, time to burn my house to the ground! wtf is that thing!!!
@solid portal
me, an australian: ... where do you keep your spiders usually?

solid portal Oct 12, 2020, 6:13 AM

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in Australia

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with the rest of the things that can kill you

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:13 AM

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Ok. You also have to use ruthless reflex and hermes dash boon not allowed

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How's serrated point now

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:13 AM

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the one thing I love about guan yu is how quickly I got to the next run

solid portal Oct 12, 2020, 6:13 AM

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?

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like cause you died quickly

robust anchor Oct 12, 2020, 6:14 AM

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yes

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:14 AM

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yes

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:14 AM

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How about you do 50+ at all first. squirtdevious

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:14 AM

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in Australia
@solid portal hmm touché

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:14 AM

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I'm too casul. I'm happy with a 36 clear on shield and mid 20s on everything else

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:15 AM

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high confidence guanyu

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got to ely in 6 minutes

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die to beyblade in 30s

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:15 AM

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36 on shield and mid 20s everywhere else is the natural order of things tbh

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:15 AM

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thanks, Asterios

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:15 AM

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High Confidence on Guan Yu is fun.

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:15 AM

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get hit by beyblade

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die

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get up

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:15 AM

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It's not 52 on Shield and 40+ on everything else?

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:15 AM

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the spin isn't over

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die

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repeat x3

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:16 AM

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I must be doing something wrong. squirtooh

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:16 AM

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It's not 52 on Shield and 40+ on everything else?
@cunning urchin that’s the supernatural order of things

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for people who actually gud

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:16 AM

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Friendly reminder that 50% forced overtime no telegraph beyblade asterius was a thing

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:16 AM

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I was playing on FO yes

robust anchor Oct 12, 2020, 6:16 AM

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max every pact on chaos shield besides td and bam ez win!!!!

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:16 AM

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I saw the beyblade coming

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I couldn't escape

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:16 AM

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FO2 is +40% lol.

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:17 AM

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(yes I had ruthless on)

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:17 AM

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W a s

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FO got bumped down 5% a level

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:17 AM

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that must’ve been a while ago

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:17 AM

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the worst thing about FO is untelegraphed redacted spin

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:17 AM

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i only remember 20 per level

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:18 AM

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esp on EM4

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:18 AM

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It was before long winter so yeah

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:18 AM

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nah the worst thing is asterius

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:18 AM

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beyblade

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and the rush

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:18 AM

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i swear the only way to dodge FO2 EM3 asterius charging is witchcraft

olive badge Oct 12, 2020, 6:18 AM

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or

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or

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ruthless and second wind

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you literally dodge

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:19 AM

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Asterius is whatever. EM or no EM. FO2 or no FO.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:19 AM

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EM4 Hades should summon beyblade Asterius instead of good boy Cerberus

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:19 AM

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ye, asterius is whatever and i am dead

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he still win

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whatever beats dead

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:19 AM

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Well, you're not following the git gud guide I linked. That's why.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:20 AM

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ohhh

tight cypress Oct 12, 2020, 6:20 AM

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"Wretches of the underworld, heed my authority and LET 'ER RIP"

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:20 AM

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GGG.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:20 AM

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i knew i was doing something wrong

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:20 AM

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G3.

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Git Gud Guide.

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G^3.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:20 AM

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Step 1: hold block with shield
Step 2: ????

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:20 AM

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Step 3: profit

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:21 AM

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Can't confirm. I only used block vs Hades at 52.

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And maybe a couple times vs EM3? thanthink

unkempt pagoda Oct 12, 2020, 6:21 AM

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wait for power rush
profit

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:21 AM

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It's kind of ridiculous how much you're allowed to block

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:22 AM

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Blocking is not the safest thing to do.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:22 AM

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wish you could block TD damage

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:22 AM

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Ironically.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:22 AM

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And now there's a hammer that gives you move speed and damage for doing so

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:22 AM

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then chaos would be legit good

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:22 AM

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And yeah it's not the safest because you can get shoved around still

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But it's easy

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:23 AM

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You also can't block all directions, and you can't cancel out of it. You're commited to bull rush.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:24 AM

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Generally that's still better than eating a hit you couldn't have dodged safely for a casul

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:24 AM

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dashing is faster than blocking tho

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:24 AM

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Charged shot so I don't dash at the enemy is cool too

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:24 AM

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i think it is, anyway

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sometimes i go for a block and get hit when if i’d dashed i swear i could’ve i-framed it

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:25 AM

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It's faster but for casual players less consistent on damage blocking

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:25 AM

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the attack animation comes first tho

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whereas dashes happen straight off

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:27 AM

#

Just keep holding attack instead of rushing for casual play on blocks

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:27 AM

#

I wonder if there's a vid out there of 32+ heat dashless shield

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:27 AM

#

Sometimes I dash to i-frame on reaction and get hit on dash startup and get mad, but then I remind myself I'm reacting to stuff most people wouldn't hope or dare to react to and it just happened to be slow this one time. 👀

#

I've been thinking of doing no-dash 32 sometime just for fun. Still wanna do boonless 32 lol.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:29 AM

#

Call up Theseus at his day job and order a boonless pizza

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:36 AM

#

Something I noticed, is there a reason I should pick a Doom oriented build all the way through because without Dire Misfortune (or whichever boon that gives extra damage on stacking Doom effect) it just can't beat Hangover or other effects that I can make use of Privileged Status on

#

My best builds so far always seem to involve Aphrodite/Dionysus boons

#

fwiw I only won once (the other time with god mode on for Hades so that doesn't count) so I'm a total scrub

graceful perch Oct 12, 2020, 6:37 AM

#

Guan Yu is very fun but I do not like being so fragile

solid portal Oct 12, 2020, 6:37 AM

#

I love that build too hax

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:37 AM

#

Curse of Agony is the best DPS Attack on Malphon.

robust anchor Oct 12, 2020, 6:38 AM

#

any merciful end gamers in chat

#

pogchampion

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:38 AM

#

If I get Hermes' extra dashes can I abuse the iframes to reliably dodge Hades' triple attack combo in his second phase

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:38 AM

#

The ideal build for Doom isn't Dire Misfortune or whatever but Merciful End.

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:38 AM

#

Or any boss AoE attack

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:38 AM

#

Merciful end is fantastic

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:38 AM

#

if you wanna boost your doom dps you prolly want impending doom, not dire misfortune

#

and ME ofc

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:38 AM

#

huh

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:39 AM

#

You can i-frame any attack from Hades with just 1 dash.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:39 AM

#

merciful end is the athena/ares duo btw

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:39 AM

#

The Athena ares duo

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:39 AM

#

Yeah, thank the gods SG added the ingame boon codex

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:39 AM

#

Merciful end makes doom leap from passable to fantastic

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:39 AM

#

I don't like looking up a wiki that much

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:39 AM

#

oh man for sure

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:40 AM

#

Wiki is wrong half the time right now anyway

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:40 AM

#

i used to have to play with the wiki open on another monitor

#

this is easier

#

Wiki is wrong half the time right now anyway
also this

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:40 AM

#

Dash through Hades when he goes for the two swipes, then just keep running. You'll be clear from the spin.

stray frigate Oct 12, 2020, 6:40 AM

#

So Rama in general like reversed Chiron?

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:41 AM

#

I can fight Hades better if I run something with range like shield or bow

#

😔

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:41 AM

#

FO0 timing might be different from FO2. I've practiced the fight with a single dash only really with FO2.

stray frigate Oct 12, 2020, 6:41 AM

#

i mark them all with Q and deal damage with attack?

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:41 AM

#

I can fight Hades better if I run something with range like shield or bow
That's everyone except dedicated melee mains lol.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:42 AM

#

I don't really struggle with Hades himself so much as the rng of what he summons in phase 1 if my build doesn't like, instantly end phase 1

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:42 AM

#

Sword is the most fun but wow it's tough

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:42 AM

#

@stray frigate pretty much.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:42 AM

#

i can’t fight hades in melee and i also can’t aim a bow

#

so my only choice is ~~death~~ shields

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:42 AM

#

Aspect of Supergiant:

Game is rebalanced every time you enter a chamber.

stray frigate Oct 12, 2020, 6:42 AM

#

so what can i choose for it? Aphro for attack and some status for Q?

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:43 AM

#

Hmm, more questions abound, is it just me or Chaos aspect extra shields is just kinda there and doesn't attack, how do they work anyway

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:43 AM

#

And the urns with heightened security. Sometimes I feel like I get hit after the urn aoe is visually gone

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:43 AM

#

Aspect of Supergiant:

Game is rebalanced every time you enter a chamber.
@tranquil violet if you’re referring to pre 1.0 balance patches, that’s just kinda how early access works

#

if they didn’t change stuff, it would just be regular access

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:43 AM

#

Yeah chaos shield got shafted for 1.0

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:43 AM

#

But part of that is they're freaking green and there is no red/green colorblindbess option

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:43 AM

#

@spare scaffold whenever you do the shield charge attack you get purple sparks at your feet

#

And then your next special has more shields

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:44 AM

#

Ah yeah I get how they work, I'm curious about the extra shields part because a lot of times they don't seem to do anything and just shadows the 'main' shield'

#

Might be a visual bug idk

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:44 AM

#

No they changed how they worked

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:44 AM

#

Yeah chaos shield got shafted for 1.0
how's that

#

I was there before 1.0 for a while

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:45 AM

#

the shields don’t bounce/seek out enemies like they used to

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:45 AM

#

awww

#

No wonder why

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:45 AM

#

also they all fire forwards in a shotgun style, rather than every which way

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:45 AM

#

Yeah you have to point blank them now

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:45 AM

#

honestly i don’t think it’s that bad

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:45 AM

#

Yeah it used to actually be extra shield now it's just a shotgun blast I hate it

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:45 AM

#

That's not very ~~cash money~~ chaos of them smh

graceful perch Oct 12, 2020, 6:45 AM

#

pretty underwhelming even if I really like the way chaos aspect shield looks

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:45 AM

#

it went from “plays the game for you” to “makes the game easier” imo

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:45 AM

#

So they just adds extra damage procs on the main shield throw?

graceful perch Oct 12, 2020, 6:45 AM

#

eyeball is cool design

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:46 AM

#

It's very flavorless for the chaos aspect

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:46 AM

#

Oh yeah that's true I wasn't very far into the game after they added Aspects but Chaos for a while was pretty busted I heard

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:46 AM

#

So they just adds extra damage procs on the main shield throw?
@spare scaffold there are still extra shields

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:46 AM

#

They nerfed them because speed runners were using it for 50 heat almost exclusively

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:47 AM

#

dunno if 50 heat runs can really be called speedruns lol

#

the difficulty there is winning at all, not winning fast

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:47 AM

#

It's a category, currently 25 minutes is the only time on this update

timber orchid Oct 12, 2020, 6:48 AM

#

how does the shattered shackles interact with hydraulic pressure ?

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:48 AM

#

Speed runners will try to speed run anything tbh

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:48 AM

#

and it wasn’t exclusive chaos shield in the meta; there was actually a surprising amount of variety

timber orchid Oct 12, 2020, 6:48 AM

#

does the boons negates the keep sakes ?

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:48 AM

#

Even if it doesn't make any sense

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:48 AM

#

but ye chaos shield was certainly pretty strong

#

it’s just really safe

#

still is, tbh

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:48 AM

#

Yeah but honestly I hate it now

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:48 AM

#

They nerfed them because speed runners were using it for 50 heat almost exclusively
Had nothing to do with 50+ lol.

timber orchid Oct 12, 2020, 6:48 AM

#

cuz I don't understand if its effects cancel with any boons that affect the technic, attack or throw

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:49 AM

#

regarding bounties for heat runs am I kinda shafted if I can only win with one weapon

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:49 AM

#

We're 5 people who did 50+ pre-1.0.

#

They don't balance for 5 people.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:49 AM

#

It's a category, currently 25 minutes is the only time on this update
@tawny meadow i mean, sure, but at ridiculous heat the chief concern is still just staying alive

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:49 AM

#

Since the bounties aren't refreshed (? - lack of a better term) for the rest when I increase the heat

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:49 AM

#

Clearly not because eris went from 60% bonus to 75%

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:49 AM

#

which does include beating TD, to be fair

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:50 AM

#

Yeah eris buff was like wtf

spare scaffold Oct 12, 2020, 6:50 AM

#

Like in particular I won with Shield at Heat 0 and 1 and the rest no wins

#

I can go to Heat 2 but only get Heat 2 bounties with shield, the rest are stuck at Heat 1

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:50 AM

#

People were sleeping on Eris. It never needed buffs. The few people who played it typically built it wrong, focusing on Special instead of Lightning Strike or Drunken Strike for crazy DPS.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:51 AM

#

yeah that eris thing is crazy to me

#

if any aspect didn’t need buffing it was eris lol

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:51 AM

#

All those excited people posting victory screens of their 1.0 Chiron sub 10 heat runs, meanwhile..

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:51 AM

#

Yeah but like it basically invalidates all other rail aspects now

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:51 AM

#

They still might do some fine-tuning there.

#

It makes rail 1 and 4 obsolete. Hestia is still different enough.

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:52 AM

#

If they really wanted to have Eris/Chaos flavor they should randomize the buff %s every update

#

residentzag

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:52 AM

#

lmao

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:52 AM

#

Hestia is different enough but not viable enough for elysium and styx

timber orchid Oct 12, 2020, 6:52 AM

#

Can someone help me about the shattered shackles please ? T.T

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:52 AM

#

?

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:52 AM

#

chaos shoots between 1 and 10 shields, chosen randomly each time

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:53 AM

#

Rail 1 has never been relevant and rail 4 is a great concept with terrible values and some issues like the laser having 0 interactions with enemy projectiles

#

Athena attack literally cannot declect

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:53 AM

#

Hestia is perfectly viable for Elysium and Styx lol. I dunno what you're talking about. One of the best aspects in the game.

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:53 AM

#

Tbh I'd love some kind of chaos aspect that's just insanely RNG based

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:53 AM

#

Rail 1 has never been relevant
That's not true. Zag Aspect Spread Fire used to be insane.

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:53 AM

#

If you don't have a attack/cast/special specific boons then you still get bonus

timber orchid Oct 12, 2020, 6:54 AM

#

specific ?

#

so if it only affect the attack or cast or special ?

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:54 AM

#

What about the Ares boon that boosts all three?

#

The flat damage one

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:54 AM

#

shattered shackle only effects attack/cast/special ye

timber orchid Oct 12, 2020, 6:54 AM

#

or hydraulic pressure ?

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:54 AM

#

It does list attack, cast and special in the flavor

timber orchid Oct 12, 2020, 6:54 AM

#

it boost all three for a couple of seconds

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:54 AM

#

I think hydraulic pressure doesn't affect shackles

timber orchid Oct 12, 2020, 6:54 AM

#

ok

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:55 AM

#

Stacks with shackle until you get a boon in that slot

timber orchid Oct 12, 2020, 6:55 AM

#

ok

#

thanks !

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:55 AM

#

Is a Shackles build even viable though?

#

Seems like it would only be good in Tartarus so far?

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:55 AM

#

I mean, boonless runs have been done

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:55 AM

#

yeah i’m pretty sure shackles is only invalidated by core boons

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:56 AM

#

Yeah that's why you swap going into aspho

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:56 AM

#

it exists for boonless runs imho lol

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:56 AM

#

Aspect of Berlusconi:

No boons only Boonga Boonga

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:56 AM

#

But it's not really that good of a keepsake if you're playing the game like it was meant to be

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:56 AM

#

it can be okay in tartarus, tho it’s basically just gonna be worse than a god keepsake

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:57 AM

#

I'm too lazy to actually use keep sakes other than Cosmic Egg and Lucky Tooth so far

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:57 AM

#

Also rail 4 feels awful because if it's non interaction and removal of iframes on dash attack

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:57 AM

#

I usually run cosmic egg the first two areas and then switch to the tooth if I'm doing poorly

#

I cant not take every chaos boon >_>

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:57 AM

#

i was the same for a long time lol

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:57 AM

#

Perhaps next the shackle will make the "reward" for failing an erebus gate challenge heal 3x more health in the future as its new effect

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:57 AM

#

Chaos boons too stronk

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 6:58 AM

#

I have to try really hard to avoid running three god keepsakes then ||pom ||in styx

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 6:58 AM

#

Shackle is pretty good.

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 6:58 AM

#

It works really well but makes runs kinda end up samey

reef galleon Oct 12, 2020, 6:58 AM

#

Is it a viable strategy to try to get the ||charon fight|| to spawn in Tartarus by running through it, dying in asphodel and going back again until it spawns? Or is there some detail that I don't know about?

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 6:59 AM

#

I mean your build would be weak and it can't happen before the boss room but yeah

#

Like final room is what I meant

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 6:59 AM

#

But is it really any better that just taking a god keepsake to influence the build as early as tartarus

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 6:59 AM

#

I mean, you wouldn't have to clear tartarus, just check the first shop

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:59 AM

#

I seem to be unable to consistently ever get Duo boons

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 6:59 AM

#

farming charon in tartarus actually is one situation where the shackles might be worth it

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 6:59 AM

#

Even when I'm loaded to the gills with only two Gods' boons

reef galleon Oct 12, 2020, 7:00 AM

#

@jade rover yeah I meant just encountering the first ship

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:00 AM

#

mimic, do you have the duo talent?

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:00 AM

#

Some duos have very specific requirements

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:00 AM

#

Ah no I only have the first 3/4 sections of the mirror

#

Still need to unlock the last chunk

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:00 AM

#

You can check them in the codex with the upgrade

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:00 AM

#

Yeah mirror helped A lot with duos

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:00 AM

#

That helps tremendously

reef galleon Oct 12, 2020, 7:00 AM

#

farming charon in tartarus actually is one situation where the shackles might be worth it
athena dash + shackles is my plan at the moment

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:01 AM

#

solid plan, tbh

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:01 AM

#

god, how do you not fish for athena dash

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:01 AM

#

Honestly is there ever a time when Athena Dash isn't good?

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:01 AM

#

it's so hard to avoid

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:01 AM

#

Like a lot of the duos need a specific cast

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:01 AM

#

Posi dash for damage?

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:01 AM

#

Honestly is there ever a time when Athena Dash isn't good?
@tranquil violet yes; a no dash run

#

also: a boonless run

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:02 AM

#

I try not to take Athena dash. The others are just more fun

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:02 AM

#

Athena dash breaks so many bosses so far

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:02 AM

#

fr tho hunter dash and splash dash both have a place in the meta

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:02 AM

#

A speed run that doesn't use merciful end

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:02 AM

#

Just dash through a bullet hell and watch the health bar go down

reef galleon Oct 12, 2020, 7:02 AM

#

It's honestly too good

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:02 AM

#

but divine dash is stronk

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:02 AM

#

Divine dash wreck Tisiphone

#

Like, completely

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:02 AM

#

Athena dash does similar damage, exposes if you have that, and makes so many random things just not bother you. Like, for some reason it disables asterius swings if you mistime your dash a bit

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:02 AM

#

Divine dash wreck game

#

Fixed

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:03 AM

#

But is it really any better that just taking a god keepsake to influence the build as early as tartarus
Odds of getting what you want are greatly reduced with AP CF and UC.

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:03 AM

#

It's honestly too good
@reef galleon so it's getting buffed next patch right?

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:03 AM

#

they can't really nerf it? It already does next to no damage overall

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:03 AM

#

do you run shackles with AP, @cunning urchin?

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:03 AM

#

Changelog:

Eris Aspect now includes Divine Dash by default

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:03 AM

#

interesting

#

never really thought of that

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:04 AM

#

Yeah I could defs see eris getting slapped back down to 60

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:04 AM

#

Ugh, right. I personally despise Approval Process

reef galleon Oct 12, 2020, 7:04 AM

#

the deflect should've been made harder to execute somehow

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:04 AM

#

Divine Dash is situational except the situations it's useful in are basically all the time

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:04 AM

#

I guess they could make it so that the dash doesn't reflect for as much of the dashes duration, like only during I frames

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:04 AM

#

I don't, personally, but it's not a bad strategy.

#

I might at some point. Plenty of strategies I haven't really tried yet.

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:05 AM

#

Athena is slow but safe

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:05 AM

#

fair enough

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:05 AM

#

Or, maybe, it adds endlag to dashes?

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:05 AM

#

lol AP is a problem for distant future me i guess

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:06 AM

#

The only speed application of Athena dash is merciful end

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:06 AM

#

?

#

Deadly Reversal says hi.

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:06 AM

#

Oh yeah forgot about that

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:07 AM

#

It's also fast without either just for the simple fact that you can be reckless with melee.

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:07 AM

#

I feel like the game wants me to have Ares Dash literally every run

#

Or maybe it's that his other boons don't usually seem to fit with what I'm going for

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:07 AM

#

Yeah but not as fast as posi dash

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:08 AM

#

Ares has so many good things, it always feels like a waste to take his dash

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:08 AM

#

Idk what other boons is it giving you

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:08 AM

#

I really like demeter's dash

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:08 AM

#

Tidal Dash is not fast if you die lol.

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:08 AM

#

That's true

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:08 AM

#

2 Furious 2 Die 2 Hard 2 Fast

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:08 AM

#

It's much better than it was in early access

obsidian mantle Oct 12, 2020, 7:08 AM

#

who is the best companion?

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:09 AM

#

Lydia

obsidian mantle Oct 12, 2020, 7:09 AM

#

I just kill lydia

#

she gets in the way

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:09 AM

#

I personally swear by bouldy, but it depends on what you're looking for

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:09 AM

#

Meg (sorry don't know the real names) is the speed running consensus rn but they're all viable

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:09 AM

#

like, if you're running LC, don't take bouldy

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:10 AM

#

I like Antos the most. But honestly, the best is whichever you're most comfortable with.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:10 AM

#

I like Bouldy because moni for stores

#

Antos is pretty good though

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 7:10 AM

#

Antos has the massive benefit of not just whiffing.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:10 AM

#

yeah

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:10 AM

#

i like, used antos once and then never again

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:10 AM

#

Speedrunners do 0 Heat or whatever anyway.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:10 AM

#

maybe should give it another shot

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:10 AM

#

Antos can just whiff too lol.

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:10 AM

#

6 heat

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:11 AM

#

Speedrunners do 0 Heat or whatever anyway.
@cunning urchin TIL I'm a speed runner

#

thanthink

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:11 AM

#

Extreme measures 2 and forced overtime

#

And tight deadline for RTA

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:11 AM

#

Same difference. That's practically 0 Heat.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:12 AM

#

I actually find EM2 to be easier because the heads group more tightly for aoe effects

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:12 AM

#

Exactly why it's used

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:12 AM

#

Yeah, that's why speedrunners tend to run EM2.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:13 AM

#

i heard some conflicting reports on whether FO is worth it for speedruns

#

is there a consensus on that yet?

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:13 AM

#

It makes enemies spawn in faster

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:13 AM

#

yeah ik

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:13 AM

#

It's good the debate is between 20-40%

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:13 AM

#

but you gotta play more defensively sometimes

#

ah, fair enough

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:14 AM

#

There's no defensive play in speedruns lol.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:14 AM

#

The debate is how many levels of it really

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:14 AM

#

Most stick to 20%

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:14 AM

#

It's not like anything can do enough damage to kill you first if you have good DPS.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:14 AM

#

And speedruns don't play defensively, you have thick skin and 0 heat in most categories

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:15 AM

#

I'm very sure the meta is High Confidence by now.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:15 AM

#

i mean, idk how defensively speedrunners play, i’m just repeating what i heard lol

#

could be wrong ofc

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:15 AM

#

It's a toss up on depending on runner

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:16 AM

#

I also don't mean 0 heat literally so much as I do effectively

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:16 AM

#

makes sense

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:16 AM

#

Well, it's effectively 0 Heat because they have the skills. For new players, it would be quite a big difference.

#

Lots of players who can't cope with just FO1 or FO2 alone.

#

Probably more players like that than there are speedrunners.

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:17 AM

#

^

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:17 AM

#

I can't yet cope with Theseus

#

🙃

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:17 AM

#

Lots of players who can't cope with just FO1 or FO2 alone.
it me but i never turn FO2 off

#

otherwise i might accidentally win

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:18 AM

#

Fo2 is a bit much for me but I don't feel going from no fo to fo1 very much at all

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:19 AM

#

Yeah even some of the best speed runners say that they feel fo2 is a bit much

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:19 AM

#

I've started running only FO0 or FO1 at the low end of high heat, and it's so much easier lol.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:19 AM

#

so i’ve been told

#

i’m slowly coming to the realisation that i might just be running all the hardest pacts for no reason

#

but it’s habit now

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:20 AM

#

Turns out of having top 2 reactions at high heat and making everything slower is kinda busted. squirtdevious

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:20 AM

#

i can’t stop

#

send help

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:20 AM

#

No-hitting most chambers without really trying at 32 is kinda fun.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:20 AM

#

The enemy that consistently irks me is the drakken thing in Asphodel because it doesn't spawn in like everything else in the game

#

Just instantly there

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:20 AM

#

I call them Hydra Jr

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:21 AM

#

lol those guys have basically BP perks by default.

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:21 AM

#

I magically suck against wringers

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:21 AM

#

And I hate them

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:21 AM

#

oh wait you’re right

#

seeking fire and teleportation

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:21 AM

#

Yep.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:21 AM

#

I haven't played a lot with bp yet

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:22 AM

#

dracons are hackers confirmed

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:22 AM

#

But it's certainly not as cancer as whatever the condition was named that it replaced was

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:23 AM

#

You guys think they'll ever visit rail 4 to make e it feel viable or at least let it interact with things

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:23 AM

#

Seeing BP2 Dracons like alright, guess I'm not proccing Butterfly in this chamber.

#

They're planning some targeted balance changes like that for the test branch, so yeah, I imagine Rail 4 will get some love.

#

There's been plenty of negative feedback on Rail 4 and Fists 4, after all.

reef galleon Oct 12, 2020, 7:24 AM

#

still waiting to unlock fists 4......

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:25 AM

#

I hope so rail 4 feels fun but also feels bad

reef galleon Oct 12, 2020, 7:25 AM

#

it's been like solid 50 attempts I think, but the bull stays silent

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:25 AM

#

Wait there's negative feedback on fists 4? Just to be clear, the fists 4 with fast, arcing 60 base damage attacks

#

That has a humongous damage bonus on top of that

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:26 AM

#

yup that’s the one

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:26 AM

#

thanthink

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:26 AM

#

So I have a general balance and noob q, are the +1 new rarity boons intended not to play nice with one another? Or with minibosses

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:26 AM

#

they annoying

#

idk whether i’m just bad at them

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:26 AM

#

Yeah fists 3 kinda make other fists look awful

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:26 AM

#

but if that’s it, it’s me and half the playerbase

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:27 AM

#

Fist 2 is my favorite to play

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:27 AM

#

I have no idea what +1 new rarity boons are. thanthink

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:27 AM

#

succ

reef galleon Oct 12, 2020, 7:27 AM

#

rare crop?

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:27 AM

#

i think they mean yarn of ariadne maybe?

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:27 AM

#

The ariadne one from the well and the food item from the girl

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:27 AM

#

Some of the best players only look at fists that aren't 3 as memes

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:27 AM

#

And the all epic one

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:27 AM

#

it’s all minimum epic

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:27 AM

#

yeah they dont interact well sadly

#

i wish they stacked, i dont think itd be a significant balance concern

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:28 AM

#

so +1 doesn’t automatically give you only duos and legendaries lol

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:28 AM

#

heroic is a thing.

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:28 AM

#

Talos and Zag Aspect are fine. I don't know who those players are lol.

#

Demeter Aspect is obviously the fastest for speedruns.

prisma dove Oct 12, 2020, 7:28 AM

#

Really?

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:28 AM

#

can you get heroic boons which aren’t swaps?

prisma dove Oct 12, 2020, 7:28 AM

#

Ares isn't better than Demeter for Speedruns?

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:28 AM

#

genuine question

#

pretty sure i’ve never seen it

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:28 AM

#

Although Fists 4 with ME might beat Demeter Aspect.

reef galleon Oct 12, 2020, 7:28 AM

#

can you get heroic boons which aren’t swaps?
@half crater yes

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:28 AM

#

Also the +1 doesnt work in miniboss rooms and just rolls a regular miniboss chance while still eating the boon

#

Which is really frustrating

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

Fists 3 are demeter aspect

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

Zag aspect is just mundane and uninteresting despite how good dodge chance actually is

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

Fists 4 is Aspect of ||GIRUUUGAMESH|| yes?

untold vortex Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

Yes, but only through euradyce or rare crop iirc

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

no (besides eurydice/rare crop upgrades), but thats the point; it'd be nice if exclusive access + yarn/eurydice gave heroic boons

reef galleon Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

you can upgrade a boon to heroic

#

upgrade rarit*

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

Yes, but only through euradyce or rare crop iirc
@untold vortex yeah that’s what i thought

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

and it wouldnt be broken IMO

frigid bear Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

what is an aspect

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

you can’t get them straight from a god at heroic

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

So do you know what cross cutting concerns are?

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

@tranquil violet ||thats spoilers, but yes||

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:29 AM

#

@brisk trench Yarn of Ariadne etc. give you 100% chance for Rare boons and increased chance for Epic, Duo, and Legendary boons. The effects stack and work on miniboss boons.

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:30 AM

#

I swear I've gotten heroic non swaps

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:30 AM

#

An aspect is a way to insert code (called advice) at cutpoints

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:30 AM

#

Heroics can't be offered unless it's a swap

frigid bear Oct 12, 2020, 7:30 AM

#

thx

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:30 AM

#

They're variants of weapons you can eventually unlock and upgrade

#

They change your moveset and have unique benefits/play styles

frigid bear Oct 12, 2020, 7:31 AM

#

btw is it possible to get the same boons as my previous game i really liked the regenerate 2 hp by hiting one

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:31 AM

#

@cunning urchin So its just worded weirdly then? I didnt realize it stacked in miniboss boons due to them also always being rare afaik. But I assume in that case theyre both always rare with a +chance at better right? In that case only the +chance stacks?

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:31 AM

#

@frigid bear no its luck

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:31 AM

#

Yeah, exactly.

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:31 AM

#

Though you can massage the RNG a bit via some mechanisms

frigid bear Oct 12, 2020, 7:32 AM

#

thx

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 7:32 AM

#

God keepsakes and the door rerolls

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:32 AM

#

yeah yarn/etc have really unintuitive behaviour

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:32 AM

#

Pray to rngesus

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:32 AM

#

Ah ok if thats how it works I was just confused on the wording, cause that seems like a fine solution, thanks

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:32 AM

#

a bit of a shame

#

since i think "just increase the rarity by 1" would be more understandable and make them more worthwhile

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:32 AM

#

Best use case for Yarn of Ariadne etc. is if you have the requirements for a Duo Boon you want.

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:32 AM

#

although yeah thats a good point

#

it means yarn is for legendary/duo fishing mainly

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:33 AM

#

You talking about curse strike hammer mema?

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:33 AM

#

Especially if you also have Persuasion, because all your rerolls for that boon will have the increased odds.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:33 AM

#

Now that's interesting

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:33 AM

#

Cursed Strike is great. Not exactly a meme.

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:33 AM

#

One more noob q before playing again. +legendary/duo% from the mirror or +epic%

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:33 AM

#

Max HP goes down, but your effective HP goes up a lot.

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:34 AM

#

Ive been going with the former

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:34 AM

#

@brisk trench I take epic+ always.

#

Also Dark Foresight always.

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:34 AM

#

epic% as a "default", if youre going for a very specific build than +duo% can make sense

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:34 AM

#

Depends on if your build needs a duo boon merciful end

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:34 AM

#

Dark foresight is the one I love so that makes sense

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:34 AM

#

Cursed slash is really good if you are very good at the hades fight and don't walk into or onto traps

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:34 AM

#

Sorry phone typing is bad

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:34 AM

#

but epic% is never bad

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:35 AM

#

I can get Merciful End pretty much 100% of my runs without any points in legendary/duo+.

mellow quest Oct 12, 2020, 7:35 AM

#

Otherwise it will just kill you for not having enough max hp

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:35 AM

#

yeah its more that

#

if you want to get multiple duos

#

for some super specific build

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:35 AM

#

Just dont get hit vs hades 4head

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:35 AM

#

+duo% is very very nice

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:35 AM

#

Honestly I find it the opposite way, I've only needed curse strike when I was bad at hades

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:36 AM

#

but these are far more niche builds for sure

#

+epic% should be the "default" and you cant really go wrong with it

#

unless youre planning on like, speedrunning

#

in which case getting merciful end or w/e ASAP is the priority

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:36 AM

#

Got it thanks guys I appreciate the advice

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:36 AM

#

Definetly better for casual I think

frigid bear Oct 12, 2020, 7:36 AM

#

what weapon should i use if i am a noob

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:37 AM

#

Whichever feels the best?

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:37 AM

#

Cursed slash is really good if you are very good at the hades fight and don't walk into or onto traps
Not really, you can just keep wacking and heal up. Lots of players who did their first clear "easily" with Cursed Slash thanks to the auto-healing.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:37 AM

#

what weapon should i use if i am a noob
@frigid bear whichever one you win with

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:37 AM

#

ice wine is broken right?

#

like it's bugged out?

frigid bear Oct 12, 2020, 7:37 AM

#

yeah that makes sense

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:37 AM

#

Bugged?

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:37 AM

#

you mean the delay? thats been around forever

#

seems intentional

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:37 AM

#

Can confirm, cheesed the whole first 3/4 of the game thanks to cursed slash the instant I unlocked hammered

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:37 AM

#

chaos shield is a very safe weapon tho

#

but it’s not great until it’s maxed out

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:37 AM

#

it has no windup or lob for me

#

whereever I press cast

#

it just instantly explodes

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:38 AM

#

yeah that’s on purpose

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:38 AM

#

@frigid bear ignore those fools. The real answer is Malphon. squirtdevious

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:38 AM

#

Also, stubborn defiance is just bad right?

frigid bear Oct 12, 2020, 7:38 AM

#

malphon is the fist or the spear

@frigid bear ignore those fools. The real answer is Malphon.
@cunning urchin

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:38 AM

#

Twin Fists.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:38 AM

#

i played malphon exclusively for a good period of time

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:38 AM

#

Stubborn Defiance is amazing.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:39 AM

#

then i started doing heat, and realised i was too bad for real weapons

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:39 AM

#

I do like malphon and exagrph

frigid bear Oct 12, 2020, 7:39 AM

#

I didnt really like the fists but I will give it another try today maybe the problem is the boons I chose idk

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:40 AM

#

What'd you go for?

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:40 AM

#

you prolly want divine strike/lightning strike/curse of agony on attack for fists

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:41 AM

#

Drunken strikes could work too... I like dots on fists

frigid bear Oct 12, 2020, 7:41 AM

#

the furthest I got was the two bosses with the sword and I only managed that because I had the 2 hp regeneration per hit on my sword

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:41 AM

#

Drunken Strike is trash on Malphon.

#

I don't know why people keep bringing that up lately lol.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:42 AM

#

i think the logic is fast attack = poison stack gud

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:42 AM

#

Dots on fist is awful

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:42 AM

#

doesn’t really work in practice tho

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:42 AM

#

Because dots are fun and you can stack hangover repeatedly I wasn't saying it's optimal

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:42 AM

#

Chill tho? Chill on fist is pretty cool

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:43 AM

#

Far from optimal.

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:43 AM

#

Honestly I think dio could use some love

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:43 AM

#

well "optimal" for fists is merciful end, which works but isnt super interesting

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:44 AM

#

that isn’t the only good fists build lol

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:44 AM

#

DoT builds are fun and i have won with drunken strike on fists at 32

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:44 AM

#

it’s just the one everyone talks about

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:44 AM

#

i mean theres certainly other builds that work

#

zeus attack works, aphro is good on literally everything

#

but if we're just saying what's "optimal"

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:44 AM

#

Curse of nausea feels good

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:45 AM

#

i mean, my most successful talos run featured a zeus build that didn’t come together and full wine

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:45 AM

#

I don't think Lord Dionysus needs any buffs. Trippy Shot is amazing with the right Duo Boons, he has the best DPS Call in the game, Drunken Flourish does a ton of work on some aspects, and both Drunken Strike and Drunken Flourish are amazing at dealing with DC2 at high heats.

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:45 AM

#

so i guess i’m no fists build expert lol

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:45 AM

#

yeah and dio has some decent "generics"

#

sweet nectar is nice, strong drink is a meme but its good if you pick it up early

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:45 AM

#

wait so

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:45 AM

#

nothing on the level of ravenous but

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:45 AM

#

hold on

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:45 AM

#

they're fine

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:45 AM

#

ice wine is supposed to function like that?

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:45 AM

#

Yeah optimal on fists is merciful end and I think that's it sure there's other builds but that's really the one

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:45 AM

#

just click and boom?

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:46 AM

#

Trippy shot I think is really good just on its own tbh

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:46 AM

#

just click and boom?
@runic osprey yes

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:46 AM

#

that seems like a huge oversight

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:46 AM

#

Just cause it negates literally every room with the stun effect

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:46 AM

#

it eliminates the lob

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:46 AM

#

I'd take Divine Strike over Curse of Agony on Malphon any time unless I already happened to have Divine Dash.

#

@brisk trench Frost Strike on Malphon does the same damage that Divine Strike does, but Deflect is just so much better than Chill.

#

@runic osprey it's not really an oversight. Cast Duo Boons are supposed to be very strong. That's by design.

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:48 AM

#

Oh yeah tbh when I take fists I dont think anything can compete with divine strike

#

I just put a high value on the chill effect

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:48 AM

#

it just doesn't seem very balanced to me

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:48 AM

#

...supposed to be very wrong?

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:48 AM

#

With fists specifically

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:48 AM

#

Lol

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:48 AM

#

trippy shot already has AOE with one of the largest single damage hits in the game

mighty ermine Oct 12, 2020, 7:48 AM

#

ice wine is supposed to be strong and immediate, it's intentional

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:49 AM

#

having all downsides of it negated just seems

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:49 AM

#

@half crater I definitely wrote strong. I don't know what you're talking about. dusa

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:49 AM

#

and i know this is a game where there's a bunch of broken combinations

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:49 AM

#

There's defs stronger things out there

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:49 AM

#

hmm true

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:49 AM

#

but this seems too broken

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:49 AM

#

i am clearly mad

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:49 AM

#

wonder what your thoughts on curse of drowning would be haha

#

especially pre-nerf curse of drowning

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:49 AM

#

https://streamable.com/ygm5mz

Streamable

ice_wine

▶ Play video

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:50 AM

#

Yeah working as intended

untold vortex Oct 12, 2020, 7:50 AM

#

Duo boons are meant to be strong, you have to work for them so it might as well do something strong

mighty ermine Oct 12, 2020, 7:50 AM

#

like, you have a heroic lv. 8 trippy with the +50% from ice wine

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:50 AM

#

@runic osprey that’s not broken lol, you don’t even have scintillating feast 😛

mighty ermine Oct 12, 2020, 7:50 AM

#

this does not surprise me

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:50 AM

#

especially cast duos

#

since you kind of have to build around them specifically

#

or get real lucky

#

well maybe "build around" is the wrong term but

#

theyre meant to be transformative

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:51 AM

#

Level 8 heroic cast with duo boon is going to do that

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:51 AM

#

if that makes sense

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:51 AM

#

pretty sure ice wine is only +30%, but yeah

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:51 AM

#

although in this case you certainly built around it 😛

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:51 AM

#

You also have a Heroic Lv.8 Trippy Shot and +1 ammo. It's a lot less impressive without that lol.

mighty ermine Oct 12, 2020, 7:51 AM

#

it's 50%

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:51 AM

#

even without the great run I had

#

having an instant area of affect burst

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:51 AM

#

really?

#

was it buffed, or am i just blind?

#

who can say

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:51 AM

#

just seems wayy too good

untold vortex Oct 12, 2020, 7:51 AM

#

Is that in live or test build Tail?

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:51 AM

#

It's not as crazy as you think

mighty ermine Oct 12, 2020, 7:52 AM

#

live pretty certain

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:52 AM

#

It's pretty standard as far as cast Duo Boons go.

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:52 AM

#

if this is your standard for "too good" youre gonna love the other cast duos

#

or smoldering

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:52 AM

#

It'd be way weaker if you had common and not level 8

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:52 AM

#

cough hunting blades cough

untold vortex Oct 12, 2020, 7:52 AM

#

Yep definitely not the lvl 8 heroic trippy shot putting in most the work. Nope not at all klinkSmile

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:53 AM

#

yeah I agree it'd be way weaker if I didn't have it at level 8

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:53 AM

#

You should get Scintillating Feast + Ice Wine.

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:53 AM

#

but say it was doing 300, 400

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:53 AM

#

Does Premium Vintage + Life Affirmation work together, I need to know.

mighty ermine Oct 12, 2020, 7:53 AM

#

yeah i don't think we can stress enough how big a difference it makes that trippy is heroic and level 8 lol

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:53 AM

#

thats still a decent chunk of area damage

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:53 AM

#

That's not even its final form yet. dusa

#

Oh, and Splitting Bolt.

#

Because why not.

mighty ermine Oct 12, 2020, 7:54 AM

#

double strike dusa

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:54 AM

#

Jolted

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:54 AM

#

That too.

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:54 AM

#

look it's not that I haven't seen or used anything else, I've experienced pretty much every single interaction of boons in this game

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:54 AM

#

Black Out as well.

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:54 AM

#

the point I'm trying to make is that it seems overtuned for how simple it is

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:54 AM

#

i mean your sample size is 1

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:54 AM

#

its the interaction, not the damage numbers

brisk trench Oct 12, 2020, 7:54 AM

#

Would you rather have the explosion chill boon or the DoT chill boon with that cast?

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:55 AM

#

If anything lives long enough in your Festive Fog enough to actually apply Hangover to it.

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:55 AM

#

Yeah like there's nothing crazy happening here you need to get some other duo boons before freaking out about this

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:55 AM

#

like this really isnt unique to this duo

#

if you had idk

#

level 8 heroic athena cast with athena/aphro duo

runic osprey Oct 12, 2020, 7:55 AM

#

the simple interaction of taking away something's one downside in this case seems out of place

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:55 AM

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and quick reload

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youd probably have similar DPS

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:55 AM

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Have you had Merciful End on Malphon yet?

untold vortex Oct 12, 2020, 7:56 AM

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Hera does that for free by exisiting Namington

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:56 AM

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That's what duos do they're powerful boons

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:56 AM

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heh, hestia is fun indeed

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:56 AM

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@mighty ermine was it buffed recently?

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/725021639506526249/762582571728633886/Hades_5_10_2020_6_50_03_PM.png

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:56 AM

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Merciful end gets rid of doom delay

untold vortex Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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Names are hard (what is bow aspect that does cast shenanigans)

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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hera

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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Hera

untold vortex Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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My brain did a dumb

mighty ermine Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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maybe it had been nerfed from where i thought it was even before that lol @half crater

untold vortex Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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Ty

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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At the right heat with a cast build, you'll feel like your run is doomed if you don't get Ice Wine rather than that it makes everything too easy.

mighty ermine Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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i don't even know anymore

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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ice wine with hera is a bit weird since

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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fair enough

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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it changes some properties (like the size) and adds a slight delay

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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thought i was just going crazy for a second lol

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:57 AM

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its still good because of the DPS increase and chill

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but its not as "straight upgrade"-ey anymore

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same with ||beowulf|| aspect

cunning urchin Oct 12, 2020, 7:58 AM

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Well, Hera already takes care of the instant delivery lol.

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 7:58 AM

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yeah the delay matters a bit more with ||beo|| because you'll often run straight past enemies

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 7:58 AM

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Beo is so good

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 7:58 AM

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love me some beo

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:00 AM

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Lucy is fun but I feel like it needs some love

mighty ermine Oct 12, 2020, 8:00 AM

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beo/hera with snow burst shadesmile

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 8:00 AM

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it's pretty generally agreed to be underpowered, but it might see some buffs with test branch

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i remember right after it was first released though

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and zeus on ||luci|| was

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mmmmmmm

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:01 AM

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Yeah honestly I just wish the attack would interact like Athena on it is useless

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Athena on special though
Mmm

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 8:02 AM

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deflecting beams would be hilarious

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witches miniboss fight:

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stand in centre of room

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hold attack

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spin control stick

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collect boon

untold vortex Oct 12, 2020, 8:03 AM

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That sounds like a great reason as to why it shouldn't be a thing

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:04 AM

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I mean you can already do it with special

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 8:04 AM

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I wonder if they just made it pierce at the start, or gave it a small arc instead of line?

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:05 AM

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It works with regular rail attack it's basically no different

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Athena dash also doesn't work with rail 4 dash attacks

jade rover Oct 12, 2020, 8:06 AM

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wack

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 8:06 AM

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yeah thats one of the weirder interactions

golden elm Oct 12, 2020, 8:08 AM

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Is the shield that good? I always die with it

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:09 AM

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@untold vortex are you saying divine flourish shouldn't be a thing on sword because you can do the exact same thing as described by slamming special

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I mean all weapons are good, shield can be weird to get used to

untold vortex Oct 12, 2020, 8:10 AM

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Standing in the centre of a room holding a button and clearing the room shouldn't be a thing without putting effort into it

golden elm Oct 12, 2020, 8:11 AM

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Yeah the speed and the machine gun where pretty fantastic and i got used to it pretty fast but the shield is like course and rough and it doesn't get anywhere

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 8:11 AM

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mehhh

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:11 AM

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i cannot find a good build for the rail or the twin fists and they are the only one i need to escape with and then ihave escaped with all of them any tips?

languid flume Oct 12, 2020, 8:11 AM

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i think "invalidates one very specific fight that isnt really challenging in the first place"

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isnt a big deal

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in the grand scheme of things

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if it makes the weapon play better in every other room

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as mentioned, athena sword special already kinda does this

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although you have to abuse your thumb a bit

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i just brought it up because it was kinda funny

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(and the idea of winning by literally spinning around with a laser is an entertaining image)

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:13 AM

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My idea for improving Lucifer: your special turns into throwing disco balls

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Which you can shoot lasers at to start a party

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:13 AM

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Tobi like what kind of build you looking for

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:14 AM

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i dont know any you recommend

golden elm Oct 12, 2020, 8:14 AM

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The only build that worked for the me was getting fast as hell and spamming that regular attack

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:14 AM

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If you synergize git boons and gud talents that tends to work

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(I jest.)

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:14 AM

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For rail sea storm builds are really good but I don't know where you're at with the mirror

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:15 AM

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i have unlocked everything but there are some on the green that i havent maxed out

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:15 AM

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The only build that worked for the me was getting fast as hell and spamming that regular attack
@golden elm ah yes, Aspect of Knuckles the Echidna

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:16 AM

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the only hidde nartifacts i have are for the sword bow and spear

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:16 AM

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And merciful end is pretty good on fists... I'd recommend getting the duo/leg green maxed

untold vortex Oct 12, 2020, 8:16 AM

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Pretty good is an understatement for ME on fists

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:16 AM

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Eris rail is stupidly op, and demeter fists do good with specials

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:16 AM

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A duck! *

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:17 AM

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I have no idea what I said

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:17 AM

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I can't help but avoid Poseidon despite knowing he has good boons because he is a waterfowl-typo

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Except his call I basically always take that because really why not

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:17 AM

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poseidon has huge catch tho

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:18 AM

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i think on the rail i got to theseus and died

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:18 AM

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op pls nerf

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:18 AM

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and the fistst i got to hades

void fjord Oct 12, 2020, 8:18 AM

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plox no nerf

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:18 AM

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last face

void fjord Oct 12, 2020, 8:18 AM

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not to be that person but

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phase*

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:19 AM

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yea h i know im tierd

void fjord Oct 12, 2020, 8:19 AM

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lol its cool

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im in class rn

golden elm Oct 12, 2020, 8:19 AM

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The rail aspect where you shoot yourself with your special to power you up made the fight of theseus like a breeze

void fjord Oct 12, 2020, 8:19 AM

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and i want to sleep

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:19 AM

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I want to sleep but insomnia said hi

void fjord Oct 12, 2020, 8:19 AM

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mood

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:19 AM

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The rail aspect where you shoot yourself with your special to power you up made the fight of theseus like a breeze
@golden elm eris is bonkers rn

void fjord Oct 12, 2020, 8:20 AM

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get hazard bomb on eris

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:20 AM

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oh ye

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op strats

void fjord Oct 12, 2020, 8:20 AM

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meme build

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:20 AM

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do all the damage

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damage to enemies

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damage to yourself

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ALL the damage

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:20 AM

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Why isn't the fishing rod its own weapon yet? smh

void fjord Oct 12, 2020, 8:20 AM

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well its only like 3 or 4 dmg

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:20 AM

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Yeah that's eris... Games top players actually thought it was going to get nerfed for 1.0 but it got buffed

void fjord Oct 12, 2020, 8:20 AM

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lol

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:20 AM

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Aspect of Captain Ahab

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:21 AM

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what boons are great for eris?

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:21 AM

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Zues attack

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:21 AM

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lightning strike

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or you can go poseidon attack -> sea storm

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:21 AM

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Posi dash

void fjord Oct 12, 2020, 8:21 AM

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a build i enjoy is zeus attack and demeter special and get their duo

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or that too

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:22 AM

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Generally speaking in any game anything that involves a large damage boost goes well with anything that causes chain attacks or extra hits

#

Pretty consistent rule of thumb

golden elm Oct 12, 2020, 8:22 AM

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Eris with the triple upgrade is so bonkers

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:22 AM

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or you can do merciful end

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:22 AM

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Big number X big number = bigger number

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And bigger number is good

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:22 AM

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what is merciful end

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:22 AM

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It gives big numbers

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:22 AM

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i just completed 10 runs yesterday

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:22 AM

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athena/ares duo

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you’d got ares attack -> athena special -> athena dash -> merciful end

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:23 AM

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Yeah honestly my ideal build would be demeter flourish, Zeus attack, posi cast and Zeus aid... Rocket cluster hammers

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And both Zeus duo boons

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:23 AM

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with dem flourish, make sure to grab jolted and cold fusion

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:23 AM

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Demeter flourish on the pewpew is nice

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:24 AM

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because why not

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:24 AM

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Last run I had delta chamber (with a hermes boost) and Demeter flourish and that was pretty fun

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:24 AM

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Sorry phone hates me

tranquil violet Oct 12, 2020, 8:24 AM

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I died early though so it's probably not ideal

#

And I'm also a filthy casual and a newb

golden elm Oct 12, 2020, 8:24 AM

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Crystal beam is so op but sooooo rare at least for me

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:24 AM

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also if you happen into rocket bomb plus cluster bomb you just win

#

you don’t even need a build

tawny meadow Oct 12, 2020, 8:25 AM

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Beam is ok

brave nymph Oct 12, 2020, 8:25 AM

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okok

half crater Oct 12, 2020, 8:25 AM

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i still have no idea what’s going on with the damage there