also, a question
#h1-builds-and-combat
rotund ember
torpid abyss
Then what am i supposed to do with starting keepsakes?
rotund ember
i like butterfly
torpid abyss
I rarely ever get any relevant amount of boons till elysium
rotund ember
or broken spearpoint
i usually get the important ones early on
they usually give you boons from gods youve met to give you a build
so i find that the simple boons at the start dictate my playstyle
torpid abyss
But it's like the only time i ever find that god for the whole floor
rotund ember
and sometimes i just NEED that one athena build but never get it
dense locust
It depends on what heat. For 32 runs I'll run through the first parts of the seed quite a few times to feel out what its giving me. I like to start with chaos egg if there are 1 or 2 chaos portals, or a god's keepsake to get a crucial boon for my weapon/aspect (like zeus or demeter attack on the rail). Otherwise you can always snag the free gold keepsake
I wouldn't start with broken spear because its far more valuable in elysium/styx
rocky sage
What do u think about the concentration fists hammer upgrade ?
tame zinc
How does the special work for Zeus with the Demeter twin fist?
I see the lightning striking 4 times
But I see the damage still being 38
Is it any worth or not then?
dense locust
My guess is that zeus lightning has a certain cooldown between strikes so that it doesn't proc every hit of the special. Similar to how chrion aspect on the bow doesn't proc lightning for every arrow. But also zeus on special for demeter aspect is not ideal. The base damage of the special is pretty decent so you'd be better off getting artemis. aphrodite, or demeter on special for more damage
final frigate
just an interesting thing i noticed, with guan yu and skelly companion
if skelly companion stays alive after an encounter you can heal off of him fully
turbid needle
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/181645099485233152/690894031345156166/20200321200229_1.jpg i did the thing
shadow copper
IM LATE BUT BANANATOS
prime knoll
Bananatoast?
dense locust
I got my shield 32 today as well!
turbid needle
nice!
kind fulcrum
If you buy two yarn of ariadnes, do you get two boons with upgraded rarity?
Or one boon with double upgraded rarity?
Or just a single boon?
mild crag
i believe they are consumed one at a time
kind fulcrum
Cool, thanks
placid path
Hey ive been looking at the pins but found nothing
Is there a spreadsheet for the best things to roll for the heat challenges
16 and 32 respectfully
dense locust
Hey im just a 7 heat in hell mode on the mittens, but athena attack and athena dash makes you nearly untouchable
oblique zealot
What happens when you kill both Theseus and Asterius at the same time.
https://streamable.com/5kd5f
prime knoll
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/794262987165057369/B823E3126CD6C90EA92762180DF961B98D13F8C6/
I almost had all four revenges
(I didn't show Ares' revenge because it wasn't as potent in the last fight. It did work elsewhere, though- especially in the small rooms of Styx.
It gave me Aphrodite third boon, but never gave me another from her ๐ฆ
@oblique zealot Huh. I'd love to see some specific interactions for killing them simultaneously and/or nearly simultaneously and/or cutting off their dialogue with grunts or screams of frustration as their (Theseus') hubris is shoved in their mouth.
I like how they both reacted to the other one dying there- both comically and actually. Like they're more concerned for each other than for themselves.
wild fiber
how does everyone feel about the Arthur aspect rn?
prime knoll
I've been enjoying it quite a bit
exotic turtle
my first run i went all artemis and killed both the heroes in like 10 seconds
prime knoll
I disliked sword until this aspect came out. I've successfully cleared heats equal to my skill with other weapons now.
wild fiber
I could go artemis hmm
also been playing around with Guan Yu finally, you guys have any tips there?
I need to upgrade it more for it to be viable I think lol
but I've been trying Artemis on the attack so the spin crits a bunch
prime knoll
Lots of options for attack honestly. I had a great time with double nova Demeter special on Arthur
wild fiber
Arthur seems like it is way more usable before upgrading it a bunch
also how do you guys feel about Blizzard Shot? I thought it seems kinda weak but was just watching a Jawless Paul video where he made good use of it
prime knoll
I managed to jump from 7 heat to 19 on my first try with a level 2 Guan Yu (also first time using Guan Yu aspect). That was before the update though, and the spin went through walls, which was a very safe option. I didn't find the health difference to be that big a deal since it was mainly just "don't get hit ever."
wild fiber
want to try out some fun cast builds that aren't just Hunting Blades or basic Artemis cast lol
prime knoll
I have not done a run like that since (I'm up to about 15 now), but Guan Yu is pretty solid right out of the box imo
I like the uniqueness of Blizzard Shot. It's one of the few casts that I prefer when I don't have Hera bow
wild fiber
I'm still working with like heat level 3 lol
only about 30ish hours into the game
interested in trying the alternate cast on the mirror
prime knoll
It definitely offers a different style
wild fiber
also is it worth trading ambrosia for blood?
I haven't found a use for ambrosia yet but I know it's for some support stuff later down the line
prime knoll
for instance, Festive Fog normally has a long recast time because the bloodstone doesn't drop until the effect is completely done, but Stygian Soul just has its flat cooldown, allowing you to recast Festive Fog much more frequently (though of course you don't generally have as many casts to throw out at once).
At least right now, the "great deals" at the broker are pretty inefficient. I wouldn't personally take most of them except trading out keys for blood
Which weapons do you like most so far?
wild fiber
hmmm probably the Bow and the Shield for me
I'm def in the camp that things the bow is really strong
dense locust
Okay athena attack and dash on mittens is incredibly strong
proud storm
we are out there https://i.imgur.com/ws7Jd5M.jpg
opal bay
man, you making my 444 hp run looking weak.
kind cloud
oh my
i t hink the most health i ever had was like 550 but i had like 7 death defiances (before that got taken out of the game).
opal bay
were you blessed by both Aphrodite and Dionysus?
proud storm
mind you i'm using the arthur aspect and cerberus' keepsake
no aphro/dio boons
or chaos
it's all just centaur hearts
restive tinsel
how do you unlock the 4th tier upgrades on the weapons? I havent used the spear in a hot minute, but I have unlocked the 4th upgrade. The rest say ????
opal bay
at most Arthur aspect gives 50 hp right?
only Sword and Spear have the 4th aspect
Sword is unlocked by putting about 5 bloods across its aspects
and then talking to Nyx to unlock it
restive tinsel
Ah bet
Thanks
Eh, its going to have to wait
Just maxxed out the gloves
not a fan of the base sword
kind cloud
i tend to overrate centaur hearts. i've noticed from watching a lot of other youtubers that they prize boons (especially duo boons) and hammers over anything else. they're trying to build as much dps as possible. but i'm usually more focused on getting my health to around 375+ and having good (but not great) dps.
proud storm
i mean if you're good at dodging you probably wont need much health
maybe a heart or two as a failsafe
kind cloud
Given how absurd, inconsistent, infuriating hades spin attack can be (especially when he starts spamming it like a maniac)....i side on caution since i enjoy melee style combat and don't do the distance sniping builds.
prime knoll
@wild fiber sorry for the late response, but I am with you in the bow camp. Bow and Rail are my favorites. Lots of cool play styles among their aspects.
proud storm
worth pointing out there's a special run clear title for if you complete a run with more than 400 max hp
kind cloud
What is it?
clear dome
how to get that much hp
kind cloud
I only recently started noticing the status changes after completing a run.
@clear dome don't pass up centaur hearts, go to erebus for centaur hearts (double so +50), buy centaur hearts, go to styx for centaur heart (double so +50), take arthur aspect (+50), have cerebus keepsake (another +50). and (usually) get aphrodite's boon that gives 30-42% more healthy per centaur heart
sorry about the random spaces in my post, my space bar is kinda broken and it's about time for me to get a new (endgame?) keyboard.
proud storm
@kind cloud Minotaur's Toughness
kind cloud
got it. thanks.
getting aphrodite's life affirmation early in the game is super helpful because it applies to centaur hearts in erebus and styx. so for instance, i usually go to erebus for at least one centaur heart (+50) and getting her epic version (+42%) adds 21 more health points (50*1.42 = 71). taking the centaur heart in 1 of 2 styx mini boss room does the same. so getting +42 overall (21 + 21) is almost like getting a 3rd double centaur heart (with aphro's life affirmation).
prime knoll
And the contractor upgrade that gives max HP when you get darkness (aphrodite's boon also increases that)
kind cloud
yes, that too. thank you. forgot to mention that.
proud storm
yeah i also picked up all the darkness i could find
prime knoll
I wish those boons and upgrades would work with troves...
clear dome
glass cannon better than tank
prime knoll
It could be cool if you could use HP as a resource
or just have some abilities scale with HP
kind cloud
that's not a bad idea
prime knoll
kind cloud
@prime knoll add that suggestion to #hades-feedback.
i'm wondering what SgG will do for the 4th shield. It would be cool if it the new new shield had a life-steal component (like guan yu). But that's already been used so maybe if the 4th shield had attack/special scale with HP. But that probably be the most powerful aspect in the game since you're getting both damage plus health intertwined as they go up.
prime knoll
I just hope the 4th aspects aren't all big, slow heavyhitters
kind cloud
yeah
prime knoll
I like the two we have, but I don't want more of that.
kind cloud
exactly, feel the same way
prime knoll
Maybe a laser rail ๐
kind cloud
i was just thinking that
clear dome
machine guuunnnn
prime knoll
or a flamethrower type dealy
kind cloud
given the the gun is the most versatile weapon in mankind's history, SgG has many options to choose for the 4th weapon aspect of the gun.
proud storm
sometimes i forget why heat runs stress me out https://streamable.com/anbho
prime knoll
The bow could be a shortbow or something- weaker but faster overall with a nifty unique dash attack
clear dome
or a mechanical crossbow
kind cloud
benefits package is an evil pact.
prime knoll
Dude, those witches on meth are just the worrrrst
clear dome
they are not tthat bad, its just homing
proud storm
speed + cloning
clear dome
= meme
prime knoll
You can avoid them easily enough, it just takes forever to finish the chamber because you never have time to attack
That super speed buff is rough with most foes. The wavemakers are also annoying with it- the shielded ones at least
I guess they're guaranteed to be shielded...
numbskulls with the slow aura are also awful.
particularly the gray ones in Erebus... 
prime knoll
Anything beaming lasers to nearby rats in Styx...
main citrus
Ok, the speed upf rom the Pact doesn't feel like 40% at all lmao
More like 75%
Still managed to win! And finally cleared 8 Heat as well. God bless Adamant Rail with Zeus attack.
Zeus/Poseidon/Demeter/Dio is a surprisingly good sync team to use. Got 3 Dio duos as well lol
sly sonnet
What is better , clearing lower heats with each weapon or higher with one weapon ?
I mean i usually just switch weapons every run
lament coral
it's easier to rotate weapons and start with lower heat first
if you wanna farm bounties
sly sonnet
I see good to know thanks
lament coral
you don't get bounties from lower levels if you skip a bunch and do higher heat
rocky sage
got my chaos shield to top level
hoenstly
had know idea the shield could stop ANYTHING
solid cairn
don't know why they thought the block mechanic was a good idea
full swift
laughs in hydra counter
wild fiber
trying my first Excalibur run
you guys have any build tips?
went with Aphrodite on the attack, not sure if I should go for any casts or specials
gloomy bone
Does the Legendary Chaos boon still spawn if I have Stubborn Defiance?
slate dove
my GPU driver crashed during a really good run, in the middle of the lernie fight
chrome root
your autosave should save you?
slate dove
It wasn't crazy good, just pretty good
No, I'm kicked to the beginning as if the entire run never happened
chrome root
ouch
rocky sage
i did i rush kick upgrade and i feel like it wasnt helpful at all what am i doing wrong
kind cloud
40 heat run by horheristo, guy was a boss against theseus and asterius, lost no hp against them, picked up some tips from him after watching.
the tank build with excalibur is so damn good.
fallow niche
40 heat ain't torture%
57 is the max atm ain't it? haven't seen anyone get past meg with it yet
or rather, only just beaten meg
kind cloud
i'm at 37 heat with chaos shield. dps is a problem. i've gotten used to excalibur but not enough to go into the mid 30s in heat so i admire this run.
but horheristo got lucky. he went through 6 death defiances to get this run. most people won't be that fortunate.
fallow niche
You gotta get lucky with any run above 32 heat tbh
versed tide
40+ heat isn't a test of skill, it's like running a marathon with an anchor around your neck
fallow niche
Skill and luck are both necessary
I can consistently complete my 32 heat runs but when you add No Choice (or w/e its called now) it gets much harder and relies a lot on RNG
kind cloud
yep agree with that. you needs lots of luck and plenty of skill to adapt on the fly and work with janky builds.
versed tide
it becomes random
fallow niche
I enjoy 32 heat the most since its just pure skill
I don't like luck determining whether I win or lose
versed tide
some rooms make you lose via timers, having a bad boon selection makes you lose through lack of DPS
fallow niche
Eh the timer thing ain't so bad
kind cloud
to be fair, i don't play with the timer beyond 9 minutes. the 7 minute limit is too stressful for me.
fallow niche
Its mostly the removal of Fated Authority and the removal of choice from what you choose from the gods you get
versed tide
it's bad at 7 when the game decides to throw a room of armored skulls and you only have an upgraded cast
fallow niche
The latter being more serious
I play on 7 minute timer for my 32 heat runs, its free heat
Really teaches you how to play differently too
Your mind sort of adapts to minimize time in each room
versed tide
I'm not really sold on timer because I think the game needs to warp itself around it, it already does by freezing time in a bunch of events
fallow niche
It barely warps anything
it only stops for the story rooms
which there are only 3
Though I can see it being a problem for people who choose stuff like Jury Summons
versed tide
it does, the devs already had to freeze timer for several events
versed tide
thanny
versed tide
maybe troves I don't remember
fallow niche
Than is just obnoxious
No troves don't
Its just Than
I guess Than is a blessing in some cases when you want that health but I just want a fast time ๐ญ
At least he's hot
fallow niche
I would be 100% fine if they just turned him off when you have the timer going
Even if he pauses it
But people got really mad last time I suggested it because they need him to pause their timer to complete runs so ๐คท
versed tide
overall it's only a handful of pacts that mess with the game
fallow niche
If there was a relic to turn off than I would run it in Elysium every time
versed tide
watching the 40 heat vid, saved by patroclus
ripe parrot
I'm wondering why he has the enemy health bars turned off
I didn't even know you could
tardy chasm
Man, the fists are pretty neat
love building up for a big special with the third aspect
covert tide
I like the third aspect because it gives me a clear indicator of when to special, with the others I just kind of flail randomly
tardy chasm
If I'm going for a speedier build I'll go with the Zag aspect, but otherwise yeah
anyone use the magnetic one?
covert tide
The magnetic one can be hilarious with Poseidon on special
Like one of those.... paddles with the ball attached with an elastic string?
Boing boing boing
covert tide
So itโs funny but Iโm not sure how effective on high heat
lusty sequoia
I just had a really good run using Demeter attack and her boom that makes a burst on 10 stacks of chill
covert tide
Yeah I like Zeus, demeter, or Dionysus on fist attack
torpid abyss
I found artemis on fist is pretty good
The high attack speed makes it very likely to get crits
rocky sage
but the crit is less impactful
covert tide
Yeah but if you have Marked or something then the frequency of the crits can matter
And also itโs always fun to see lots of big numbers haha
turbid needle
I think I used crit fists with Long Knuckle to beat 20 Heat, it's very good.
turbid needle
I came so close to beating 32 Heat first ever try with Malphon last night, and I owe it mostly to spawning on Long Knuckle.
torpid abyss
I feel the attack hitbox should be a little wider
full swift
Hey I just had a run where I got the Dio\pos duo boon, after that I got the sweet nectar. The next 3 boons were all epic only and still consumed the nectar charges. Is it supposed to work like this or is it a glitch?
turbid needle
Supposed to work like that.
Wait, you mean the one Eurydice gives? "Sweet Nectar" is the name of the Poseidon/Aphro Duo.
full swift
Yea the one eurydice gives
The boon is called select premium or something
But anyway, the duo boon with a "next boon + rarity effect"
Feels like it should make it heroic
tawny ivy
you could leave a feedback, but yeah. in that case, eurydice's ambrosial delight does nothing for you :/
proud storm
every time i fail an erebus challenge i feel sad
but then i remember i make progress towards completing the onion codex entry so i feel good again
sly sonnet
Everyone here completing hard stuff and then there is me still on 3 heat
proud storm
ive been trying to beat hades with the fists on 32 heat but i cant get past theseus yet
also hydra is a russian roulette where i either nail it or lose 2 death defiances
covert tide
@proud storm it do be like that sometimes
proud storm
i lost all three just now but i'm confident in my abilities
solid cairn
what's your 32 heat setup btw @proud storm what pact stuff do you put the heat into
solid cairn
if I do 32 heat I'm doin it with guan yu
proud storm
blazing mulch
Safe and steady haha ๐
hallow sorrel
Hey @cold glacier The contract usually shows up after the next run.
cold glacier
@hallow sorrel oh! well, then zag shouldn't say that it's already there then :)
hallow sorrel
If I recall, he says "should be patched through to the house contractor" which can imply future tense
As in "it's now in the process of being patched through"
full swift
Patroclus aka the one encounter you want if you've lost some DDs
hallow sorrel
Or to make your SDs twice as effective
proud storm
theseus once again mowed me down
@solid cairn https://i.imgur.com/e9QE7Cy.jpg my pact setup
full swift
EM Theseus?
proud storm
yeah
im probably going to shift some of extreme measures' heat into tight deadline or something
just so i dont have to face EM theseus bc this is starting to be my only issue now
full swift
You die when both are still alive or to theseus specifically?
proud storm
i manage to kill asterius but theseus finishes me off
full swift
Yea the ||chariot|| makes him hard to hit as a melee
proud storm
it's also that while i'm dealing with asterius and theseus starts driving down the arena like a maniac i get hit by a stray bullet or two
and it hurts
full swift
Yea those are hard to dodge
Also why are you trying 32 heat
Isn't it a good plan to clear all lower ones up until it first
proud storm
i felt like testing myself,
full swift
Fair point
turbid needle
Hey, I almost got Malphon in my very first try.
full swift
Do you actually need to clear everything 32 heat to unlock all
tame zinc
Do Chaos & Bouldy count in Family Favorite or not?
turbid needle
Also no, @full swift, Bounties stop at 20 Heat.
Well, there is the 32 Heat Skelly statue.
full swift
The ultimate prize, a statue of skelly
turbid needle
It's a pretty nice statue.
tame zinc
So the most damage bonus you could get is 63% with less chance of a real build/duos and such, against 40% for two status that you easily have in most cases with family favorite... Could take a buff I guess
turbid arch
torpid abyss
Last update
Pretty odd he gets it before Achilles tho
Since most players will have talked to Achilles 20 times before meeting Patroclus
unborn birch
Patroclus is having a rough time, he can at least look good during it ๐
primal cape
do you think talos/demeter aspect is better for fists?
sly sonnet
I just did a run with those 2
ripe parrot
I like Demeter on Fists most
sly sonnet
The bonus cast damage really good
I clapped final boss
Like had 4 casts, greater recall and her cast on epic level 4
First phase was a bit tougher since he moves around a ton
but 2nd phase literally dropped his health to 0 in like 10 seconds
torpid turret
https://i.imgur.com/fL9Prvo.jpg Jeez didn't expect the sub 9 so soon after sub 10
hushed ledge
woah
sly sonnet
Thats fast af
hushed ledge
zeus just always feels so bad to get boons from
sly sonnet
Weird
I love zeus
Even if I have a bad run with him I am fine since his effects are eye candy
Although to be honest the whole game is eye candy
hushed ledge
they just don't do much to bosses and that's what i always find the hardest
torpid turret
My sub 10 was a zues build
sly sonnet
If you get the zeus double hit effects and dash
you would be suprised
how much you can do with just dash
My least favorite is Dionysus
but even him I use quite frequently
hushed ledge
dio is very weapon dependant
quaint gazelle
@torpid turret ok how the hell did you get sub 9
sly sonnet
DIO
hushed ledge
i really like it on rail/fists, but it's not great on other things
quaint gazelle
my quickest is 19 minutes
torpid turret
That build is insane damage
I'm uploading video rn, but you burn down bosses so quickly its nuts
sly sonnet
I feel like if I am going to be stacking status effects might aswell stack it with demeter
since currently I dont feel like 5 stacks of poison do much
(I know you can upgrade to get more)
hushed ledge
you can do the maths on how much it does
torpid turret
I have a video of sub 10 with fists if you're interested
lusty gust
I've seen people that prefer to use Dio + Aphro on Hera's aspect
I might as well try it for curiosity's sake
wild fiber
who do you guys feel is the strongest god atm?
ripe parrot
If only because it's clutch when it comes to the FB fight
wild fiber
I'm actually not sure if I've tried her legendary yet
lusty gust
Hestia + Demeter's legendary is crazy good
The especials were hitting +1k everytime
I think I took like 1,5 cm of the FB's hp bar
sly sonnet
Just had a thanatos room with 80 enemies
very fun
Room with lots of enemies + Chaos + Pact
wicked raft
Just got 980 darkness from Elysium boss battle
Stacked 3 chaos boons ๐
Atrophic + Pauper + Rolling Elipse (270 + 250 + 188)
wild fiber
To me Artemis seems like the overall strongest god that really just works with any build
stuff like Pressure Points is never bad to have
tepid ridge
Hermes and Artemis are definitely some of the most versatile gods. Aphrodite, Zeus and Dio can transform a run with the fewest boons in my experience. Demeter can create some of the more ridiculous combos depending on the weapon/enabler.
hushed ledge
ares has the upgrade that's generally just better pressure points iirc
the one that's just like 10% to all
wild fiber
Poseidon and Athena are underrated in general imo
Poseidon can make some really really strong runs
hushed ledge
Pos has real issues with boss damage
Athena isn't really underrated, she's really good
wild fiber
that's true, but he can be a room clearing god
idk I think the god balance is quite good in general
Artemis, Aphro, and Zeus are prob my 3 favs
sly sonnet
Well actually it depends
usually poseidon has weak boss damage
but the boon that makes his knocback effects do boss damage
and some op duo boons he has
can shred
like zeus+poseidon
or poseidon+demeter
unkempt pagoda
it's pretty good
it wasn't spectacular in my mind, but maybe i just need to play with it more
sly sonnet
Havent either but I have seen videos of it melting final boss
tepid ridge
Is urge to kill better than pressure points though? And yes I like Poseidon more than most people but he also needs combo and once you hit a boss he becomes less viable. He and Athena are combo pieces imo, like how exposed is an easy status curse to apply and proc privileged status. Duos I also havenโt played with much between that group.
unkempt pagoda
i prefer pressure points to urge to kill
tepid ridge
I agree. Especially with Aresโ cast ironically enough.
unkempt pagoda
urge to kill is fine with ares or demeter cast because any small increase is still a big increase, but even then
pressure points would proc more anyways due to the high hit rate
tepid ridge
Yes the overall damage increase of crits is better across a run than a flat damage bonus depending on how quickly you can hit, or at least it feels that way to me?
unkempt pagoda
one could argue that UtK is more consistent, but 10% (on only three things) is too low an increase to compete with a global crit rate
hushed ledge
Wait isn't crit just 2x damage?
hushed ledge
Ah
So even then, just straight out maths, you need epic pressure points to be equal to common urge
And pressure points gets worse if you have other sources of crit
Because it adds linearly
Pressure points is actually pretty darn weak
Notably, crits are stronger on room clears if the urge bonus wouldn't save attacks on common enemies
wild fiber
Demeter's cast still seems real bad to me
jolly fiber
Is there any mechanical difference between bronze skin and different league?
wicked raft
Just did my first run with Zeus legendary + cast and double lightning
Not impressed, was good at room clearing low hp stuff but otherwise pretty bad
On overall, I don't really like zeus outside of on rail maybe
hushed ledge
stygian soul seems crazy good for just clearing a run
wicked raft
Even the zeus + posidan duo with chaos shield couldn't kill stuff past Elysium quickly
hushed ledge
being able to just camp is incredibly strong
wicked raft
styg is awesome
hushed ledge
like it feels like it should be a trade of "infernal is stronger but harder to use", but nope, stygian just feels stronger
because health is so nice
torpid turret
https://i.imgur.com/bR73bQM.jpg Another PB lmao, they just keep coming
floral sedge
Ridiculous combo idea: Poseidon Attack+Rupture+some lightning Boon+Jolted+Zeus-Poseidon Duo Boon on fists
covert tide
If you have knockback on attack donโt things just go out of range a lot?
floral sedge
Constantly triggers the two-status Mirror upgrade with a barrage of punches
Depends
floral sedge
I was gonna say, good positioning or heavy enemies makes a big difference
Well it is and isn't
In Asphodel you can just punch them into the lava
covert tide
That doesnโt help on floating enemies
floral sedge
Plus they're Jolted so even if they're the gorgon heads they take more damage
No combo's going to be perfect
covert tide
Jolted will only last one attack without the demeter duo
It would be a lot of fun in the tiny Styx rooms though!
covert tide
Itโs always satisfying when you enter one of those rooms, chaos ensues and then everything dies in seconds
floral sedge
Still haven't found Defiance from Chaos in many, many runs to complete the List...
...is that a common issue?
clear dome
yes
torpid turret
https://i.imgur.com/ZDj1ns7.jpg Well I think I just got WR
hushed ledge
Gz
torpid turret
According to Speedrun.com
solid cairn
So this is the fastest run for any heat level
torpid turret
For this update, I think so
solid cairn
I wish records for every weapon were listed somewhere
solid cairn
Just you watch Iโm gonna cop the guan yu would record
torpid turret
Or you mean aspects?
solid cairn
Yes
torpid turret
ahhh
solid cairn
That would be interesting
torpid turret
In-game leaderboard plz
solid cairn
Yeah
torpid turret
Next update sounds like the perfect time for it
solid cairn
Sink do you have history in speedruns
torpid turret
Gonna take awhile for youtube to process this video since I recorded in 4k
This is my first time ever speedrunning a game
solid cairn
How many attempts
covert tide
Some of the aspects are so substantially different that I wish it were possible to have separate heat trackers for them on hell mode, even if you can only obtain bounties for one at each level
dense locust
Haelian did a 32 heat in 5:30ish
covert tide
I want to play with Arthur but I need to get used to the hell mode base Pact stuff because itโs different from normal mode
torpid turret
Leaderboard resets every update
covert tide
But I have stygius up to like 27 heat
solid cairn
My best heat is 16
covert tide
And itโs tough to jump in like that haha
covert tide
I donโt want to start another hell mode file for this purpose
dense locust
I saw the video of the speed run the other day but am having trouble finding it again
solid cairn
Runner chooses order
Thatโs 20 aspects
My guess is thatโs at least a 2 hour run
solid cairn
Why is it 14 heat specifically
solid cairn
Probably because some pact modifiers are faster?
dense locust
so that run might be wr this update
spawn enemies faster maybe
That's the 32 one
torpid turret
WR this update yeah
Forced overtime makes enemies spawn faster
Tight deadline because why not
Middle management I think makes partial hydra skip easier
solid cairn
Sink do all aspects 32 heat next
torpid turret
I've never done a run over 16 heat lmao
solid cairn
Youโll get WR because nobody else has done it
torpid turret
Touch2Much is currently grinding 32 heat WR
And I know he's going to post a good time
solid cairn
Whatโs a hades run like btw
torpid turret
He has a 10:38 32 heat atm
solid cairn
Like is it particularly difficult?
torpid turret
But I think he wants sub 10 before submitting
Difficult I'd say nah, I've never speedran a game before and I was able to get into it pretty easily
dense locust
Oh you can only do the hydra skip with middle management on?
covert tide
You play with FO on, right? So with extreme measures, FO, and deadline youโre at 16? You could probably add on convenience fee and middle management without giving yourself too much trouble, maybe one tick of benefits putting you to 22
solid cairn
Whatโs the spear WR done with
covert tide
Or underworld customs if you can stand to lose boons
dense locust
Pretty sure haelian explores the seed extensively before attempting the speed runs
torpid turret
14 @covert tide only 2 points into middle management
solid cairn
You mean extreme measures?
solid cairn
I wonder what the guan yu WR is
covert tide
How do you put 2 into extreme? Thatโs 3 heat with the furies and the hydra
covert tide
I mean you canโt just the put it on the hydra, right? You have to take the furies point first
dense locust
interesting, so it's purely a positioning thing so you can insta cast meg?
do you have to damage him first?
torpid turret
I believe so, not positive though
covert tide
Oh you could probably handle a point or two in hard labor
torpid turret
Basically so you can do this
covert tide
Obviously you are a better player than me
covert tide
So youโd be fine
torpid turret
Super fast hydra kill, and timer pauses while you finish off the small heads
dense locust
yeah haelian did a similar thing, i think there is a threshold of damage you have to get in
dense locust
in order for it to skip the phase
solid cairn
I feel like eris may be the new speed weapon
covert tide
@torpid turret if you want to add heat you can definitely add a tick in lasting consequences, hard labor, and convenience fee (maybe x2) without slowing yourself down, no?
dense locust
Eris has been my #1 since the beginning
torpid turret
Maybe yeah
torpid turret
Convenience fee might cuck me if I can't afford a chaos gate
solid cairn
The two are pretty close tho
covert tide
On hell mode one tick of lasting consequences and hard labor are on at a minimum
And itโs totally doable
dense locust
I've been really digging zag or demeter mittens with athena attack and athena dash
covert tide
And you donโt have the actual dangerous difference which is the lack of invulnerability frames from getting hit
torpid turret
Zag fists are poppin
solid cairn
Zag fists more like
torpid turret
9:45 with fists of thunder
solid cairn
dense locust
yeah its not a speed run build but its a safe build. Gonna be one I suggest to newer players that are struggling
torpid turret
Ah yes
dense locust
If you get 3+ athena dashes and not let anything get behind you, the only damage you take is from traps or undodgeable/deflectable attacks
torpid turret
I'll prob go for 32 heat all weapons until someone takes the WR
solid cairn
Bruh in a row?
torpid turret
Haha no just getting a completion on all
solid cairn
Oh lmao
torpid turret
My highest heat atm is 16 so ive never had a go at it yet
upbeat spindle
Hello, I had a question, how does ambrosia work? I have multiple characters that have full nectar (shows the lock) and have no more conversations with them (says learn more by deepening relationship) but still can't give it
torpid turret
Something new
solid cairn
But it shows all of them as being completed at 32
dense locust
Yeah wait what
This is a twist
OH that was Travis
That wasn't his vid with the 32 on all
torpid turret
It is, just using Haelians seed
He posts them in his discord for others to run
@upbeat spindle I think you just have to keep doing runs until they have new dialogue, can't quite remember
dense locust
Is there a way to upload seeds?
torpid turret
You just copy an entire profile basically
dense locust
ah
torpid turret
Thats why it has their records, settings, etc
dense locust
My current goal is also 32 on all, i've got 3 to go
torpid turret
Nice!
dense locust
I've made it to Hades with 1/3 health on his second phase twice with the bow...
And I think this athena build with the fists might be my ticket for 32 on those
with the right rng and not too many errors
torpid turret
I'm scared of 32 heat at this point
I'm so used to just face tanking hades to maximize DPS
Face tanking everything actually
dense locust
the 2nd face is a lot easier in my opinion
if you have 5 athena dashes
you basically just dash charge through him whenever he is about to attack
and it either deflects the skull, deflects the spear jab, or he spin attacks fowards, which will be behind you at that point
but obviously 5 athena dashes rarely happens
torpid turret
Yeah
dense locust
The real challenge imo is getting to hades without losing too much
theseus upgraded is scary with most builds
and styx is no joke
both my losses with the bow against hades, I went in with 2 dd, and if I had 3, I would have clinched it
If you get the hammer that gives 1000% damage to armor with dash attacks on the fists, the athena attack and athena dash build is nearly untouchable, even on 32 heat if you play smart
torpid turret
Love that hammer
Especially with long knuckle
My last run with the rail I got pierce, which was essential in taking out shield boys
dense locust
I haven't been able to get long knuckle with the athena build, but i'd imagine it just makes it even more untouchable
It's the most relaxing build i've played at high heat because as long as i never let go of punch, almost nothing can hit me
hushed ledge
long knuckle just feels absurd
torpid turret
Can't play without it tbh
Everytime I start a run I'm playing as if I have it and missing a lot of attacks lol
hushed ledge
tbh it should be removed imo
it changes the weapon so much
it basically makes you play spear
in terms of spacing
dense locust
I really recommend trying athena attack on knuckle and try and get athena dash asap. Hold down the attack button and then dash before the attack stops while holding attack. That's the majority of it
You don't really need hammers for it
Just be mindful of undeflectable attacks like spin attacks from the furies, shield dudes in elysium, or hades, or the smash attack from the hydra or the flying obelisk things
and traps
dense locust
And you aim for artemis and aphrodite whatever you want on top of that, you can get deadly reversal and heart rend for a lot of damage
torpid turret
Ok it's finally processed 1080p https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nh0mmMMQIjw
dense locust
Only 8 heat on hell mode but hades couldn't touch me first phase
Crap i should have saved this seed for 32
besides the quick hydra kill, any other tricks used?
torpid turret
Not that I can think of
dense locust
How about the boons used
The hammer at the beginning seems mandatory for the speedrun, then artemis attack and athena dash is great because it would open up deadly reversal. Everything else seems to be up in the air. What was the second hammer?
torpid turret
Everything else was just to get damage off Olympian favorite or whatever its called
2nd hammer was pierce iirc
lament coral
I'm surprised you don't use your cast, at all, considering it gives +50% attack damage
torpid turret
Yeah I usually forget tbh
dense locust
yaaaaas 32 mittens
Made a lot of mistakes but got lucky with recovering 2 dds in elysium from whats his face and also buying 2
if I had more than 2 dashes it would have gone so much better
I stand by the athena fists build, its just a little awkward because it requires athena attack, athena dash, and getting more than 2 dashes really makes it shine (I only had 2 which is why I got so beat down by hades): https://imgur.com/36qhOLJ
torpid turret
"Death Defier" haha
covert tide
Do you need to use up 6 to get that?
opal bay
5 or so yeah
dense locust
I used 2 bought 2, then used 3 more so 5
wait that was wrong. I used 2 bought 2, used 2, refilled 2 thanks to my man, and then lost 3
so 7
athena dash was blocked every time until elysium, and I got denied +3 dashes at one point. I cannot take that heat again
formal basin
I just managed to actually tie with Hades, which I didn't know you could do.
Screen freaked out, Hades said his victory lines while Zag slipped on a banana peel, and when I got back to the house, I was declared victorious.
lament coral
I believe you lose the bounty if that happens
formal basin
Yeah, I did lose the bounty, but oddly enough I completed a prophecy.
vagrant marten
Wdym Zag slipped on a banana peel? You got the message as if you went through the "door" at the top of the screen, despite dying and not going there?
Or "slipped on a banana peel" = death animation lol
vagrant marten
rofl
Would be funny to respawn in the house next to Hades
formal basin
If only, lol
vagrant marten
Coming out the pool with him like... "yup that just happened"
summer lotus
does pitch-black darkness not affect darkness you get from infernal troves?
clear dome
it doth not
summer lotus
rip
covert tide
@vagrant marten https://damaless.tumblr.com/post/613228402783191040/bananatos
covert tide
Thatโs just his resting face
marble ridge
K-ortis
wet dagger
ok wow..... This is like, the slowest of slowpoke moments, but this is the FIRST TIME EVAH this next chamber reward showed up for me
https://imgur.com/Cflk2k9
wet dagger
It was around before?!?!? Like... Demeter's update before?
Because this has literally never showed up 
unkempt pagoda
thought there were enough blue currencies to phase it out by now
back before, when there werenโt as many currencies, food was an option if there were a lot of chamber options
happened most often at erebus since thereโs three chamber choices there
before gemstones, i think
wet dagger
Was it more likely to show at like... earlier runs?
None of my 100+ run saves ever had it, but a brand fresh new file just yesterday and BAM!
unkempt pagoda
nah, it just kinda happened
hushed ledge
I was rerolling rewards from a chaos room and got food on two of them earlier
unkempt pagoda
granted, i havenโt played early game since before the final boss was added
i donโt know anything about early game
mild crag
Food seems to have started appearing after nighty night, I've never seen it myself either
wet dagger
Also that feel when was hoarding coins for couple runs specifically to buy Diamonds in Styx ..... and the game instead threw Titan Blood in that shop ;_;
what even is my luck
unkempt pagoda
at least your room reward wasnโt literally nothing lmao
wet dagger
Oh, the game trolls me on those! Like Zag at full health runs into fountain room
sly sonnet
I got that room first time yesterday too while rerolling
unkempt pagoda
opened a backup save i hadnโt touched in a few updates and the room preview was empty. thought it was a visual bug and i did it
there was no reward
wet dagger
Ok, I'm just onna roll with this new run!
Met Zeus, then Ares, then couple goddesses, died.... Started next run, ran into Poseidon and Zag goes "oh, this must be uncle number two"
my dude.... that's already your 3rd uncle you're meeting. All those Hydra blows to the head clearly havin an effect
errant narwhal
Food room reward is definitely from before nighty night
I thought it was only in erebus tho
sacred idol
stable onyx
arthur sword is so much fun
torpid turret
Havent tried that one too much yet, what build you been going for?
stable onyx
i have done crit on my attack with as much as hp as possible
also damage reduction
weak on my special
you can just stand still most of the time in the special zone
prime knoll
Athena attack is also fun with Arthur
Smacking all of the slow projectiles. Any core Athena boon would do
stable onyx
yeah
basically artemis aphrodite and athena boons are the best
damage reduction from both aphro and athena
crit on your attack
weak on your special
if you have these you are set
and ofc duos and more crit chance , crit dmg with the dash attack dmg from artemis
icing on the cake
I didnt like playing with sword before but this might be my favourite aspect to play with rn
deflect on your dash would be nice too with the artemis/athena duo
well deflect on dash is always good anyway lol
prime knoll
I'm with you on finally enjoying sword with this aspect. I don't have much fun with it otherwise.
@dusky hull I was thinking a while back that the increased rate of fire would be good to give the Zag aspect a little pizazz.
dusky hull
Nah, I think that +12 ammo is good enough for an aspect, fire rate should be a hammer upgrade.
strong flame
is there no autosave on runs?
errant narwhal
It saves every room, iirc?
at the start
you can quit safely if you didnโt take damage yet (โgive upโ will return you to the house as if the run hasnโt happened)
hushed ledge
The fists not pulling properly is annoying but I've never felt like it's that awful tbh
strong flame
the game just crashed after i killed theseus
hushed ledge
The spacing is a range where often I'm actually kinda happy they don't pull
strong flame
and when i opened it i was just sent back to the house
errant narwhal
ah, crashes do that
strong flame
sad, it was a good run
errant narwhal
hopefully youโll get another good run ๐ช
strong flame
thank you
prime knoll
Does anyone else feel like EM Asterius is just astronomically more difficult for melee weapons but basically only a bit different for ranged ones? When I run through with Rail or Bow, I kind of don't care that he's gold-plated, but if I'm running fists or something, I either take tons of damage from his shockwave or the fight takes forever because I have to keep dashing in after every shockwave then dashing back out to avoid the next one, then back in, etc.
@hushed ledge I'm not sure what you mean about being happy they don't pull? And at least for myself, the range doesn't feel like a hard cutoff. I have noticed that if a foe is walking perpendicular to me when I Special, it will damage them, then (perhaps an instant later) try to pull and fail because they're no longer lined up.
turbid needle
Kinda makes sense since EM Theseus is easier with melee (unless Asterius really goes in with spin attacks).
Talos's pull happens before the uppercut.
hushed ledge
Often the spacing is a range that I'm just out of the enemies range
prime knoll
Aye, the damage from the pull seems to happen separately from the pull itself. I can damage someone an arms length away but not pull them
hushed ledge
So you get this perfect free damage at no risk
prime knoll
then hit someone halfway across the room and pull them
hushed ledge
I've always found it very consistent
Usually I can go "oh that isn't going to pull" when I start the uppercut
prime knoll
Hmm. When practicing against Skelly I can't seem to get a spot that will hit and won't pull
hushed ledge
I'm fairly certain it's based on momentum
So try drifting away while uppercutting
If you're on kbm it's probably a lot easier
prime knoll
I am not
hushed ledge
Hmm
Kbm can do retreating uppercuts easily it's so good
Makes the move super non-committal early on
prime knoll
Yeah, I'm not getting any behavior like that. I'm guessing it has to do with enemy movement as well. It's just odd. I was in a small room in Elyisum, and I couldn't pull a little droplet shade (whatever they're called). I was at about half, maybe 2/3 range for the pull. It just wouldn't do it. I had to run up and punch it before it transformed because the damage from the pull wasn't interrupting it.
It happens against (seemingly) unmoving skeletons as well.
earnest ravine
It keeps happening to me with Brimstones, armoured or no.
prime knoll
I really like the idea of the Talos aspect, but the pull not interrupting foes just makes it suicide against FO or Benefits Package
Interesting. I'm not sure I've encountered it with brimstones myself
earnest ravine
So it is like, weirdly inconsistent, but only on certain enemy types? It's weird and that makes me think it's uninentional.
If I could tell whether or not the darn things would be pulled, I'd be less upset when it doesn't happen.
Because one run it was those and, uh... The blademasters, they weren't being affected at all.
prime knoll
yeah like if there were a visual of the pull effect to show why it isn't pulling or why it pulled them against something between the two of you
earnest ravine
When it works though it feels like a dream, especially in Asphodel, so it's unfortunate.
prime knoll
One hypothesis I'm generating is that at least some of the affected (or rather, unaffected) enemies jump/move frequently, which may be overriding the pull effect as it happens even though it looks like they aren't/weren't moving when the pull took place.
Yeah, the pull is quite fun when it triggers. I didn't even look at the other aspects as soon as I saw the Talos pull, I dumped all the titan blood I had into it.
earnest ravine
SAME
prime knoll
I tend to like magnet push/pull effects in games. Control and maneuvering
earnest ravine
It's either movement, or rapid attacks interrupting it?
Which might as well be the same thing most times, but it would make sense why the brimstones also were being weird. And I know that the little droplet shades have their respawn coded as some sort of attack (because FO 40% can cause them to skip the animation if I kill them on top of a weapon sometimes and I hate it)
idk I don't code dive so I can't figure out the specifics of how it works
prime knoll
Yes! It is so obnoxious when the droplets just transform anyway after dying to my attacks.
earnest ravine
Probably because enemies on FO can just like. attack as SOON as they spawn, which causes that weirdness. Not exactly my favourite aspect of it.
fallow niche
I have come up with the perfect idea to make Shackles useful
I am a genius
Have them lock up Thanatos
Like in Sisyphus's lore!
Holy smokes
its perfect
prime knoll
@dusky hull a small followup to earlier- I'd argue that simply doubling the clip doesn't make it useful in any way (at higher heats/against more challenging foes) because without attack speed, you'd never want to stand in place to unload a clip (much less one twice the size). I use Zag rail a decent amount, but it is always contingent upon getting Flurry Fire and (hopefully) Swift Strike.
dusky hull
Lol no it does make it useful IMO.
prime knoll
What would you say it offers over the other two?
dusky hull
Bruh
It offers stability as you have to reload twice less often.
Basic attack speed buff is something fists already have, and wind up is to complicated for a starter aspect.
ember hearth
I've played Hades for quite sometimes and charge weapon such as bow and spear are quite meaningless when you dont get a particular upgrade from the hammer. the game is fast pace and having charge power is pretty meaningless and tedious. I also have tried the Guan Yu spear and it was very hard for me to use, I dont see myself taking the Pact of Punishment using Guan Yu
dusky hull
Guan Yu's aspect is broken, it's really powerful. @ember hearth
hearty pilot
charge weapons are quite easy to manage if you master dash striking
i cant speak for guan yu as much but from what i've done, it's very strong. i don't have a problem at all with the bow, and i never take flurry shot
prime knoll
The fist aspect is different being an immediate and static increase.
Most of the weapons have attack rate improvements in one form or another (usually hammers), whether they be multi-attacks or actual rate increases.
Reloading is easily done while dashing- more or less a standard gameplay pattern for any rail aspect. So it then comes down to how many shots you can sustain before dashing to a new location, which is rarely (in my experience) anywhere close to the normal 12.
Additionally, a ramping attack speed mechanic would largely only benefit the larger clip anyway. Hestia would still be more efficient to fire ES only.
The ramping speed would only be present on upgraded levels of the aspect as well, so the base rail would function the same.
prime knoll
The default charges are pretty manageable- some of the hammers that slow charging really drop the viability, though. Looking at you Explosive Shot.
hearty pilot
explosive shot is fine but you have to go shotgun mode
i try my best to avoid hammers as much as possible but if im forced into one, i really only go for the power shot upgrade or sniper shot
last resort, chain shot is decent but you lose the piercing. flurry shot is unnecessary, but ill take it over a special upgrade.
prime knoll
Shotgun mode on bow?
hearty pilot
its strange fated persuasion doesn't work on hammers, tho if they turn daedelus hammers into hephaestus then ig it will work
shotgun mode as in cqc
close quarters combat
prime knoll
Ah. Yeah it's not bad. It just sort of lowkey forces that. Like you technically can shoot much farther but you'll never be able to make that work.
hearty pilot
mhm
other niche scenario is when an enemy is spawning in and you don't have the damage negation pact thingie
prime knoll
Explosive fire for rail is much more universally applicable
turbid needle
Fastest gun West of Athens
teal wren
oof did some 6 runs trying to get quake cutter only to now learn it's incompatible with the aspect of demeter
hearty pilot
is it?
that's the one where you slam on the ground right
why would they make it incompatible...
teal wren
not sure but the wiki says it is at least
prime knoll
I believe that is correct. I wonder if it makes the special take too long or something
covert tide
@teal wren explosive cutter works pretty well with dem though
teal wren
oh definitely, I really like the flow aspect of demeter gives(combo combo combo->special) feels a bit like a fighting game
prime knoll
Dash-upper is really awkward on controller
covert tide
@prime knoll it was on kbm too until I followed some advice and swapped the bindings for cast and special
Maybe thereโs some remapping you could do on controller?
stuck bough
any builds for the fist y'all would recommend to try?
covert tide
Corgi: Iโve been having a lot of fun/success with demeter, aiming for long knuckle and explosive cutter
@prime knoll I got used to it pretty fast, it wasnโt so bad
stuck bough
how is doom on the fist?
covert tide
@stuck bough I try to get chain lightning, chill, or poison on attack
teal wren
depends a lot on your hammer upgrades, but it feels like mostly anything works with fists
covert tide
Doom is fine on special, but I think itโd only be good on attack if you get that boon that increases doom damage with more applications
teal wren
high enough attack speed for procs, high enough damage for dmg boons
prime knoll
Aphro + Artemis is always good between attack and special
covert tide
If itโs the second status effect and youโre playing with that mirror option then itโs worth it regardless
I had doom on fist attack the other day and it was alright, changed how I played though, since I just wanted to dash around like crazy applying it to everything
Rather than concentrating on killing whichever enemies I was currently dealing with
stuck bough
AIght
obtuse cipher
I think I just got 4 Athena rooms in a row. Everything's deflecting now, woop woop.
lament coral
was that in Tartarus?
prime knoll
Yeah, doom seems most appropriate for AoE effects, but the fists have rapid (attack) and high damage (special) single target strikes, which is why Demeter is generally strong with them.
obtuse cipher
so I have 6 of her boons now
prime knoll
Sounds like you have a lot to reflect on
hearty pilot
hallow sorrel
Artemis' Hunter's Mark could lead to some devastating critical uppercuts
lament coral
Athena/Ares attack, Artemis special, Athena/Artemis dash
I like Ares attack with Athena dash for Merciful end
and Artemis special is a no brainer for mega fat crits
Arty dash is a nice option if you get the dash attack finisher hammer or just wanna dash fist around, alternatively, just get a long duration status, like Demeter
unkempt pagoda
rush kick is awesome on demeter
prime knoll
rush kick is awesome in general
hallow sorrel
rush kick is awesome in real life
hearty pilot
wait no
obtuse cipher
Huh, the lambent plume also activates after the final boss fight.
covert tide
Oh that reminds me of feedback I meant to give
obtuse cipher
I'm pondering if the activation after the final boss belongs there, as well.
It's kinda nice to know you were fast enough.
lament coral
considering the horrors Zag has to endure after Hades, it's only fair those should proc
obtuse cipher
I think they removed them in the latest patch
covert tide
Awww boo!
obtuse cipher
I want more fishies instead
covert tide
I would love to fish after the final boss
And get, like... a salmon
Some mundane normal fish
obtuse cipher
Same
stable onyx
have you guys seen fish on chaos realm so far
obtuse cipher
Only once
and I'm pretty sure that was the run I got the fishing legendary from Poseidon at the start of the run
dunno if that's mandatory
turbid needle
@fallow niche Okay, when and how?
turbid needle
Okay, Spread Fire makes sense.
fallow niche
yeah artemis dash + attack
It will never beat Artemis Cast times though because of the 100% hydra skip
Its not possible with this build I don't think
turbid needle
I don't look so stupid with Infinity Chamber in my name now, huh?
Yeah, anything that got the Hydra skip will have too much of an advantage.
fallow niche
You can get a partial so its not all bad
But its still like 10-15 seconds lost
He's currently doing torture% at 57 heat
turbid needle
Godspeed to him.
turbid needle
Is that everything minus time?
covert tide
Torture%?
turbid needle
fallow niche
@covert tide all pact options
stable onyx
is it also on hell mode
covert tide
Oh I didnโt realize it had a special name
fallow niche
No, Hell Mode would 58 heat
covert tide
It would have to be on hell mode to have ALL heat
fallow niche
@covert tide "torture%" is a joke
you might hear it from other speedrunners to as jokes
this is mostly a fun thing
for viewers, not the streamer LMAO
covert tide
Where does that originate?
fallow niche
haelian just got clapped by a hammer guy lmao
covert tide
Iโm just curious
fallow niche
I have no clue really, but its been a joke I've heard for years
stable onyx
honestly that would be possible either with chaos shield or arthur blade
fallow niche
It might be possible but I don't think it will ever be done, not at least until release
No Choice makes it impossible to guarantee anything
Its extremely hard to even just get to asphodel
covert tide
Are the options canceled by no choice also dependent on the seed that defines the room layout?
fallow niche
The seed slightly changes based on random things as the run progresses
If you break a random pot it will change what the next room is or has
And every room after that
So yeah while the "seed" does determine what No Choice cancels out, you can't realistically predict what what the next room or boon will entail @covert tide
fallow niche
Anything outside of combat, and technically enemy patrols at the start of combat can change it
covert tide
Are there really truly insane players who test out how breaking each pot impacts it?
fallow niche
And it is deterministic, but good luck trying to make it perfect, its extremely hard to do even for any% runs
covert tide
Do different combinations of pots do different things???
fallow niche
And nobody breaks pots, they are far too unpredictable, we use other things like casting
Casting after a room is cleared will change the rng
But its also pretty finicky and sensitive
The farthest anyone has routed an any% run was to the start of asphodel and that's it
turbid needle
(which is ridiculous in and of itself)
fallow niche
Yeah the amount of work to get that far is absurd
It took the entire speedrunning Discord the entirety of last update to do it
rip haelian just died to meg
turbid needle
๐ซ
covert tide
๐ซ
rancid shore
do they just have a copy of a pre-run save that they use? or do they each try to route on their own??
turbid needle
For speedrunning, specific starts, usually to get a specific Duo or Legendary early in Tartarus.
covert tide
Ohhh I should have looked up how to save that run from a couple days ago
I got the Zeus legendary still in Tartarus
And then the Zeus demeter duo early in asphodel
rocky sage
I finished a run with the world crusher shield upgrade (small bull charge) and idk what to think about it
turbid needle
I think it's a very neat idea that needs a lot of tuning still.
Been playing a lot of Dead Cells and I think making the block holdable and releasing in time with an enemy attack for a parry would be unique and flavorful.
unborn birch
Just died ||in my 32 heat run to Hades|| when he had a sliver of health 
gloomy bone
Two Defiance Chaos boons in a row. I'm so lucky this run
covert tide
@unborn birch on the bright side, if you got that close, you know for sure itโs within the realm of possibility!
unborn birch
Oh, he's absolutely gonna get it next time 
floral sedge
using the Benefits Package Pact
enter a room in Elysium
teleporting Puller exploding Chariots
That may be the second-worst combination, it'd only be worse if you replaced Puller with the speed boost
gloomy vine
@unborn birch that's still considered a spoiler
untold blaze
@floral sedge Okay but that actually does sound like an actually great challenge room. Exploding chariots spawn outside of a large cage and will teleport in and out of the cage trying to run you down for 45 seconds. Would be great because you could either win by dodging really well or having quick reflexes on the attack.
hushed ledge
I struggle with Theseus a lot normally and I'm not sure why tbh, in theory the fight is super easy: just dodge the spear and the spin. But I tend to take a chunk of damage on the fight :(
untold blaze
It's probably because of thesus's second phase.
It seems easy until you remember you start having to dodge the floor too.
hushed ledge
Nah that's not too bad
proud storm
theseus' second phase was the easiest i just had to call meg to kick him in the shins while i punched him to death
hushed ledge
A lot of it I think is that I take dumb risks to get damage in
hushed ledge
Also that ye
But I'm just generally overconfident and that's something I need to unlearn
I had the same problem on final boss
Now I'm consistently clearing final which feels so good
Dashing through spin is my favourite trick, it feels so silly but when you think about it it's optimal
untold blaze
Play with maxed out heat damage and high confidence. That should train out of it.
hushed ledge
I'm not at enough heat for that yet :p
untold blaze
Oh, yeah and 75% reduced healing.
proud storm
made it to h*des with 2 DDs left
hushed ledge
I got all the non-arthur aspects unlocked yesterday so now I can start levelling them which is exciting for some of them
errant narwhal
The 32 heat clear..... can it be
lament coral
with Chaos Shield, all things are possible
proud storm
DAD STOP SPAMMING YOUR SPIN ATTACK CHALLENGE