so any other things i should keep an eye out when using the arthur aspect/
#h1-builds-and-combat
rocky sage
kind cloud
Hence, when i play on 30+ heat, I have to do it without the timer
rocky sage
?
hybrid galleon
also nyx trinket is great if you rank 3 it
turbid needle
Elysium is why I go for 9 minutes instead of 7 LOL
kind cloud
If I could do the timer, I could play at 40+ heat
hybrid galleon
since you deal more initial damage
lament coral
I want god trinkets early, then maybe Money Bag, and then a safety trinket, either Acorn or Tooth
hybrid galleon
with dark pressence, you could already slap hades silly
I decreased 10% of his health with this
in first hit
hybrid galleon
though, there is a bug with it
damage control will count as first hit
for some reason
hybrid galleon
i hope the slap only procs as soon as red bar show sup
or else this trinket is really useless LMFAO
hybrid galleon
Yep
turbid needle
... Welp, one more reason to ditch that on non-shield/fists run LOL
hybrid galleon
i think these two are the reason why the thing isnt as op as it looks
rocky sage
do u prefer stygian or infernal soul?
hybrid galleon
hope they fix it anytime
infernal soul everyday]
stygian is good unless you dont cast build
kind cloud
chaos shield is super useful for handling the 2 blue heart pact
turbid needle
Stygian if not going for Cast specific stuff, Infernal Soul otherwise
hybrid galleon
so you can keep throwing your kidney stone into the lava
turbid needle
^
hybrid galleon
and 3 seconds later have it back
rocky sage
fav gun aspect?/
kind cloud
the third one
hybrid galleon
Base
kind cloud
yeah, that one
lament coral
2nd one
hybrid galleon
I like the base for more ammo
kind cloud
hestia with artemis on attack, COME AT hades and get wrecked!
hestia with also artemis special plus triple bomb is so good
kind cloud
i don't like artemis call
hybrid galleon
its not called press F to skip phases without a reason
lament coral
I don't like Hestia's reload spam, and Zag's extra ammo is negated by Delta Chamber and 2nd aspect's bonus
turbid needle
^ Which I find odd
full swift
does anyone here run benefits package for pact?
hybrid galleon
is rail really that weak
kind cloud
hestia's reload spam took a lot of time to get used to
hybrid galleon
me, and god i hate it
turbid needle
Honestly Zag gun to me feels more like a QoL thing than anything
lament coral
BP can kill you
full swift
yea
lament coral
especially in Elysium
kind cloud
but once you do (and you've gotten damn good at aiming), it's fun
lament coral
it's already bad, but BP turns it into hell
full swift
I just found out they can get hotwheels the teleport and bonus speed
kind cloud
QoL?
turbid needle
Quality of Life
turbid needle
Extra ammo means less reloading
kind cloud
i don't follow @turbid needle
hybrid galleon
tbh there is a quirk i find rail annoying
chilly abyss
Am I the only one who feels extremely cheesy standing in the middle of a laser light show of death without taking damage? 
kind cloud
ah, i see
hybrid galleon
it does not auto reload when you are out of ammo
and you waste time just dry shootin
turbid needle
^
civic barn
i mean, they include that for a reason
civic barn
whether that's a good reason for us is another issue
kind cloud
@chilly abyss is that how to negate the hades laser attack without spearpoint and athena'a deflect (dash/call)?
chilly abyss
Yeah you take no damage if you dash into him and you can even attack him safely there
kind cloud
i find that the game randomly gives me like 40 damage sometimes just for getting too close before he does it
full swift
or you stand behind any terrain
turbid needle
You usually stand behind the central obstacles to block the lasers, but flexing directly on Hades is another way to do it
kind cloud
yeah, i usually hide behind terrain
full swift
some weapons push you back into the lasers though
like I tried it with the sword and just got yeeted into the lasers
chilly abyss
Lol yeah
chilly abyss
But each weapon had at least one attack that doesn't move you
hybrid galleon
what weapon do you find one of its skillset is basically cheese
i think either chaos shield throw, or just spear throw
hybrid galleon
spin 2 win baybee
turbid needle
Special or Spin, pick your poison
kind cloud
chaos shield or the spear throw in guan yu
chilly abyss
It just feels extremely exploitative being able to do that :(
kind cloud
but guan yu was much stronger when it used to be able to to go through solid objects, now it bounces off pillars back into your direction
hybrid galleon
sword + hermes special
turbid needle
Now you gotta do math
rocky sage
i dislike the guan yu special
hybrid galleon
Rocket Lawnchair
rocky sage
feels lazy
kind cloud
lulz
turbid needle
Lazy, but effective
kind cloud
that's why it so good!
hybrid galleon
also instead of young adult grunting
kind cloud
you'll be loving that special on 30+ heat
hybrid galleon
you get soup
rocky sage
its just damage
turbid needle
You get the Explosive Launcher hamme upgrade for free basically
rocky sage
am i missing something ?
kind cloud
@turbid needle Yes!
hybrid galleon
@turbid needle Killer Queen has already touched that spear
turbid needle
Extra damage, Bigger Area of Effect, no need to return it
kind cloud
yep
rocky sage
@hybrid galleon NANI
kind cloud
so good
turbid needle
LOL
chilly abyss
Didn't it heal too?
hybrid galleon
D E A D L Y Q U E E N
turbid needle
Nope, spin does that
turbid needle
Billowing Strenght art intensifies
chilly abyss
Ah special yes nvm
hybrid galleon
Face my stand, Scary Grandma ™️
rocky sage
GIMME THAT KRONOS INTERACION
obtuse cipher
I'd love "other SgG"-aspects
chilly abyss
I just dislike guan. Healing on a regular attack with no condition feels cheesy. Means you can win any encounter if you just play it slow/boring
rocky sage
also i noticed like three runs ago that aphrodite is naked
turbid needle
Alternatively, spamming special with Guan-Yu is legit good, fun and not slow
rocky sage
my perception is 0
turbid needle
Because base damage
rocky sage
its only like 50
chilly abyss
You chose to put naked mom on your wall?
turbid needle
Which is a lot for something that spammable, also Special spear boons scale very nicely
full swift
getting a special build with the spear makes me feel like kalista from LoL
turbid needle
^
hybrid galleon
I actually play Il vento d'oro on background when im playing fist
i feel like a gay gangster
xd
turbid needle
I just finished my fists bounty and I'm winding down basically
rocky sage
anyone up to vc?
turbid needle
Not for me, family's still asleep I think
rocky sage
i want some coaching mb
chilly abyss
Can is say lil snek is the cutest thing?
full swift
suppose I can vc
hybrid galleon
Can I say the cutest thing is called
BOULDY
look at that
round
thicc
body
hybrid galleon
its a BIG OL UNIT
full swift
the cutest thing is called DUSA COSTING 11 AMBROSIA TO ROMANCE WTF
sly sonnet
Bouldy best girl
rocky sage
Wait are there no voice channels here?
chilly abyss
It's called the price of love
full swift
good thing I had 30 in stash :)
hybrid galleon
Ive dated Thanatos
or what i like to call
Leon from RE2 but deficiency in vitamin D
chilly abyss
How is his scythe?
hybrid galleon
Did I hear Door
rocky sage
wait so how can ppl in this server vc?
sly sonnet
Not sure
hybrid galleon
Someone's knocking on the DOOR
rocky sage
TOO BAD
sly sonnet
Door kun
turbid needle
... There aren't any channels for VC here LOL
hybrid galleon
YES
rocky sage
KILLER QUEEN ALREADY TOUCHED THAT DOOR KNOB
turbid needle
Just noticed
rocky sage
SHINE
hybrid galleon
the unoriginal second playthru name
full swift
ayy finished my first 10 pact run
hybrid galleon
Door Kun Kun
chilly abyss
Door senpai noticed you
hybrid galleon
cause yes me
sly sonnet
No Yu
hybrid galleon
but seriously his hair looks like egg
full swift
Also are there things you can do to trigger story events
full swift
because I've just hit a 100 runs and I still haven't gotten the event that lets you give ambrosia to sisyphus
turbid needle
It's RNG yo
hybrid galleon
have you bought the 10 diamond letter?
sly sonnet
Yeah there is a quest
full swift
no that is what I am waiting for
rocky sage
who do i ask to make some voice channels?
chilly abyss
Thing is that you need to get through some conversations
full swift
or it isn't in the shop rather
frosty pier
Oh crap I came back to dissing p4 protag
chilly abyss
So if you got unlucky and those didn't come up yet, try again
It'll happen eventually
full swift
I'm really curious what needs to happen to unlock the special conversation with Artemis
hybrid galleon
summarize p4 protag roast in 4 sentence
full swift
Also no spoilers on that please
chilly abyss
Special conversation???
frosty pier
Let's leave him alone?
chilly abyss
Let me pour that sweet nectar over her now I guess
full swift
Artemis best Olympian change my mind
chilly abyss
Impossible
frosty pier
"Agressively empties bottle of nectar" GIVE ME YOUR SECRETS! WHERE DID YOU HIDE THE GUN ASPECT?!
hybrid galleon
Dionysus at max nectar, "EYYY ZAG LETS GO TO THE GYM FOR SOME LEG DAY"
I will shave Ares
full swift
AAAA waiting for 6 storyline events
hybrid galleon
to bald
errant narwhal
leave his hair olone
hybrid galleon
everytime i see him i roast his hair
errant narwhal
i just think hes neat
hybrid galleon
with slicing shot
frosty pier
It seems like something made her upset
turbid needle
Nice
frosty pier
I'm still mad that you cant buff the cleave on it.
frosty pier
I'm more about that you can use cleaving attack as dash-attack if you attack the air before dashing. And that dash-attack is not affected by hammer and artemis dash.
rocky sage
also thoughts about shadow lash?
turbid needle
I don't have a strong opinion on it, altho that might change for others
... wait, that's the bonus backstab damage one, right ?
turbid needle
Yeah that's what I thought
also Arthur doesn't have much for hammer upgrades on attacks, sadly
turbid needle
Anti-armor CAN be great, or meh
Depends on the weapon/aspect/build really
But they are never bad per say
They are good fillers for bad rolls basically
Except, IMO, for the anti-armor fist hammer upgrade
That one's nutty straight up
obtuse cipher
My thought process is usually "bosses don't have armor", so I pick other upgrades...I don't mind killing mobs slowly
turbid needle
Hydra small heads have armor, and final boss adds have a good deal of armor as well
It's mostly Theseus/Asterius and the Fury sisters that don't have any
obtuse cipher
Oh yeah, the Hydra heads
turbid needle
And those on EM 2 are a pain to deal with
lament coral
sure, but other hammers help you all the time, and in a non-gimmicky fashion, too
restive widget
you guys don't like the armor piercing 1000% percent on fists?
obtuse cipher
final boss, though, I usually deal so much damage already that armor shred isn't that necessary anymore
turbid needle
@restive widget That's the one I am mentionning
restive widget
I'm really new at this, but seems amazing
lament coral
that's 1000% on dash attack
turbid needle
^
obtuse cipher
that one's cool
turbid needle
You deal like 250 at 'least PER dash attack on armor
It's nuts
Shreds basically any armor away
restive widget
yeah
turbid needle
Which helps Fists A LOT
turbid needle
Since they need to get close to deal damage through non-cast methods
lament coral
you know what else shreds hydra heads? The kick
obtuse cipher
tbh I'm not set on not picking armor shred, it just depends on the build I'm planning to go for or if I expect it to be necessary to progress more smoothly
restive widget
not sure if I've tried that one
turbid needle
The kick is like amazing no contest
lament coral
not only does it shred armor, but it shreds HP, too
turbid needle
Yup
lament coral
yeah
obtuse cipher
still waiting for that upgrade to show up
restive widget
you need the hammer for that?
turbid needle
Yup
errant narwhal
i love the armor piercing hammer on fists
errant narwhal
i pick it like every time
lament coral
because I like having attack range
surreal jolt
I usually only get a hammer as my starting boon, then my 2nd in Elysium. It'd be nice to have anti armour for the Hydra heads.
errant narwhal
i dont like the attack range much ngl
turbid needle
... with Charging special ? eh
lament coral
kick doesn't charge
turbid needle
Oh yeah the attack one
lament coral
you're confused
restive widget
I hate all delays, like the charge one - at least so far
lament coral
no, special charge is bad
turbid needle
^ finnicky from my usage yeah
restive widget
too slow for my taste, but then again I can't get the bow working either
just tried a little though
lament coral
it has the same problem as shield and bow
the only special charge I like is spear's
turbid needle
And that's because it as actual base range to it LOL
The rest require some charge to get anywhere
And uh charging special shield is uh kinda eh
restive widget
for now I can't remember all the boons etc. and from which gods - do you guys remember them and pick carefully on each chamber entry?
It's a bit random atm, though less so than when I started out
didn¨¨
didn't understand it at first
surreal jolt
Did two ares fists runs and both wouldn't give me the doom stack boon, somehow finished them cause Athena and Poseidon came in clutch.
turbid needle
@restive widget At some point, you'll get a general idea of what you can receive from certain gods, yeah. Takes some time to get used to
restive widget
Alright, that's my approach so far 🙂
But I would really like it if Supergiant included a kind of boon guide
the general layout with main boons, how they interact etc etc.
turbid needle
I know some of the pages on the fan gamepedia have graphs that show what you can get, but yeah an in-game way to read said info would be neat
restive widget
I think that community wiki is great, but it really shouldn't be necessary
turbid needle
^
restive widget
e.g. when you get a chance to pick a boon, you could have a pop-up showing the graph of possible ones
turbid needle
As with most roguelites nowadays, sadly
It's somewhat been of an issue
I know games like Wizard of Legend started recently to show that
restive widget
atm, this game is like "hit play, gl hf"
I really like the game, but I think this would make it easier for new players to keep playing. Nobody likes to be confused 🙂
The challenge should be the execution, not how it works
lime relic
I think it's pretty straightforward
surreal jolt
That's all I've been doing. I'm making a feedback post soon on the unlocks because I think their system is awful. I haven't used a wiki yet cause the games simple enough.
turbid needle
Meta-progression in this game is, honestly, something that I hope is revamped at some point
Too much of it is required to get anywhere as far as the Pach of Punishment goes
Between the mirror, the keepsakes, the billion of contractor upgrades, the weapon aspects, the fact that base sword, arguably the worst weapon, is the one offered to begin with ...
Oh, and the room rewards too
for Meta-currency
surreal jolt
I didn't know there was a rail gun cause it didn't show up till after I beat the game. I thought that was it's reward
turbid needle
^ that as well
surreal jolt
While my friend got his first clear with it...
surreal jolt
I never saw her till I beat the game as well. I reached the end but failed at least 6 times.
I unlocked the record room at 30 hours and my first clear was at 11 hours.
clear dome
the first boon after reach surface is always demeter
surreal jolt
It's all completely random or the timer they have set is way, way too long.
turbid needle
Oh, that's the best part, basic features being locked behind Meta-Progressions. That one doesn't sit right with me
surreal jolt
I assure you I never met Demeter till my clear. Cause I was like "wow a gun, skulls and a new God too?" Was my reaction
turbid needle
Yeah, they are technically unlocks
obtuse cipher
Damn, just as I said I'm still waiting for the kick to show up, it just did and it seems to be really strong
good thing I could immediately pair it with Artemis
mint vortex
Is Benefits Package supposed to change all enemies to elites or is that some sort of unlisted effect of using high heat? I started a 32 heat run last night and every single chamber except the first one you land in upon leaving the House had elite enemies. Not really sure how you're supposed to deal with uber elites right as the run starts before you even get any boons.
turbid needle
I don't think so ? Maybe someone with more experience could chime in, but I'm pretty sure from watching others use it that it did not affect how often Elite enemies appeared
Bad luck happens
mild crag
as i undstand it no, it should just change the elites
twilit stag
The description says that it only gives additional effects to elites but it definitely makes more of them appear than normal.
mint vortex
That's what it seems like to me. That was the third or fourth time I've used Benefits Package, and it seemed liked there were a lot more elites the other times too. This time was just worse because they started showing up right at the beginning of the run.
rocky sage
do u prefer fated authority or persuasion ?
versed ibex
At first I was super into persuasion but the rerolls haven't been lucky for me and I kept having runs with very few boons :/ I feel I didn't need to reroll doors this much before...
fallow niche
Authority is just far more powerful atm
Especially since you only get so many persuasion
versed ibex
and I wish it didn't max out at 4, yeah
fallow niche
The new mirror stuff needs tweaking, though I love the ideas behind most of it, its just mostly not powerful enough
There are a few exceptions though
50% damage on first hit is very real
the more damage when 80% or more HP also
The 6% damage per god is also decent, though Privileged is just better for non-Artemis builds atm, I think it should be 7%
Maybe even 8%, hard to say
versed ibex
I love Stygian soul a lot and doing an abyssal soul run after that was painful. bleh having to pick up blood stones that are hidden behind a pillar on lava
frosty pier
Yeah, it's kinda like that for me: WHAT? You saying I need to PICK UP MY CASTS, like some commoner?
versed ibex
I haven't tried the Hera bow with Stygian--waste of titan blood aside, can you still multi-load if you get lucky with Artemis/Chaos?
prime knoll
Hera bow with Stygian Soul is one of my top three weapons
even without any extra casts, the 3 second recharge allows for consistent Attack + Cast combos. Not as much burst of course, but less downtime.
and you never ever lose your cast which is helpful on a bow that relies on it
twilit stag
The mechanic of picking up casts that get stranded is so bad that I still pretty much always pick stygian soul even though it makes that one demeter boon pretty crap
spring mauve
kind cloud
So i just had a successful run with the demeter aspect (fists) hammer kick on 12 heat. Uh, this thing is broken. I had athena attack, aphrodite special (after I sold poseidon special), poseidon dash with epic razor shoals and epic typhoon's fury and nothing else.
The kick aspects works but it works too well. It basically turns the game into button-mashing. The action is happening so fast that there's this crazy visual lag between how much damage i'm dealing versus where zag flies off to in the map.
lulz
I feel like it takes the skill out of the game.
It's kinda like the shield of chaos bullrush but with auto-aim.
twilit stag
12 heat doesn't require a lot of skill to complete
kind cloud
i'm still struggling to complete 11 heat with bow and arrow so thanks, #FeelsBadMan.
rocky sage
what trinket should i use with guan yu
kind cloud
to start? i use athena to get her special (or her dash at minimum). guan yu spear with athena's special (which has deflect) is so damn good.
especially after getting charged skewer (from hammer)
twilit stag
both #2 and #3 bow aspects are way stronger than any fist aspects
well #1 too I guess if you can shoot consistently
kind cloud
i hate the bow. chiron aspect is the only one i like and even then i'm terrible at it.
twilit stag
But anyway, if you think that fists are too strong, turn on +100% damage, extra trap damage, +40% bonus speed and second level of middle management and see if you manage to leave Asphodel
kind cloud
That adds up to around 15 heat so uh...wut? I've already completed up to 20 heat with fists using talos.
kind cloud
i'm not snappy with the lingo, what is em bull?
rancid shore
extreme measures
kind cloud
oh yeah
twilit stag
facetanking the bull isn't that hard, but the em version of the hydra fight is incredibly hard with the fists
rancid shore
is it?
twilit stag
I've lost more death defiances to it than anything else at 32 heat
rancid shore
That one's at least forgiving in ways the bull isn't
The bull lacks a tell for one of his attacks and his AOEs are huge with no fall off
which are terrible for the very up close fists
twilit stag
I don't think I even lost a single DD to them during that run, but hydra was extremely tough with only one dash and there being barely any floor not covered by lava
stiff stone
@versed ibex you need to get Ocean's Bounty / Sunken Treasure. Those are the Huge Catch prereqs.
And even then, it's a legendary which has a reduced chance of popping up. I would recommend using the mirror options which increases the chance of duos/legendaries.
versed ibex
lol by the time you get those you're probably in Elysium and there's no reason to bother with the fish anymore
stiff stone
One or the other, not both
Not really, you can get them rather early
I got Huge Catch in Tartarus pre-nerf, idk about now, I haven't tried
versed ibex
oh, needing only one is better but it's still... meh, considering it doesn't help for actually beating the game
stiff stone
well damn
turbid needle
I got Huge Catch at the very start of a run lol
brisk island
l'm always was pissed off by Nemean Chariot Champion (gray) in Erebus cuz this is guaranteed challenge fail.... but with Speeder perk from Benefit Package this is next level of f***ery & disappointment.
kind cloud
the grey skulls in erebus are pretty absurd too, they seem way more powerful than the armored skulls with 2 blue hearts (non-benefits package)
also, does eurydice + orpheus give some kind of companion for reuniting them?
i know sisyphus gives one. i've yet to collect it.
stiff stone
@turbid needle that was because of an pre-set event to show off the new boon lol
turbid needle
oh 
stiff stone
hahaha yea, all good tho 😉
surreal jolt
@kind cloud I tried your kick build that you mentioned and I got my ass kicked, but I finished the run. I just dont get the appeal around the kick.
boon selection wasnt the best
fallow niche
didn't it get nerfed when it wasn't even that impressive?
errant narwhal
always go for chaos, all the time
simple ether
always be chaos
errant narwhal
i won this one too :DD first guan yu win, spear win in general apparently ever since the bounties system was in place?
simple ether
awesome ☺️
kind cloud
LMAO at this guy getting a flawless victory on his first ever 32 heat run. Super cool. And once again, hades' spin attack somehow doesn't apply damage in some wtf instances.
twilit stag
it's not flawless victory, he's using the acorn keepsake
turbid needle
@mint vortex Not 100% with you on rebinding the Codex behind the Boon screen, but 300% with you on more manual aiming.
I play on MKB, so not being able to hold down Cast and actually line a shot up with the reticle is confusing and frustrating.
kind cloud
@twilit stag it shows up as "perfect clear" so /shrug. does the game make a distinction between perfect clear and flawless victory?
mighty ermine
the perfect clear title isn't too discerning. you can get it even after taking resisted hits with the acorn, or if you heal off damage (i.e. shady food, etc.) you've taken during the final boss to be back at full health
kind cloud
Cool, cool. I didn't know that.
rancid shore
Isn't it full health, regardless?
turbid needle
I've earned Perfect Clear when I had zero DDs and I lost all of them to the boss, it's just checking whether or not your HP is full.
rancid shore
how'd you heal to full? GY?
mighty ermine
hence, not too discerning
rancid shore
at where you were or higher
implies it's fine if it's not full health
p sure it's just at full
empty mason
do you earn more titan blood if you do more heat than the bounty? i mean i didnt do any heat on spear.. if i get pass 10 heat what happens? do i have to pass heat2 after all to get titan bloods again?
turbid needle
No, earns meta items per clear per level.
rancid shore
you don't earn more than the bounty. You get the bounties for the lowest unlocked heat
turbid needle
If you jump to 20 from 5, you'll have to clear 20 15 times to get all the Heat between 5 and 20.
empty mason
thx
and one last thing.. on the last charons shop i remember getting titan blood for 1500golds.. now for a long time i only see diamonds... is it rng or is there anything that triggers its spawn?
rancid shore
it's RNG afaik
mighty ermine
@formal basin might want to specify that you mean the Aspect of Talos special instead of just fist special in general with that feedback. i know you imply it with the whole "dragging an opponent across the room" bit, but just saying fist special overall needs more hit stun is a little weird when it's fine on other aspects
surreal jolt
i love talos until i get to elysium where dragging them forward and wailing on them means nothing cause theyll combo me even if they arent armoured or elite
forget about it in styx
solid cairn
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/392070250511728653/690243441182900313/unknown.png was on super good pace but actually lost 9 minute tight deadline in styx because it was the last room I checked that had the bag. I wasn't worried about dying because I got chaos defiance, but it was still a little tense. leaned super hard into hermes and didn't get hermes attack. Lot of work to do with this weapon
simple ether
had some success with talos in elysium by slamming enemies into walls from the other side repeatedly 😄 would be good with poseidon or sped-up specials
kind cloud
yeah, posiedon is great with talos especially with typhon's fury.
i think my preferred build with talos is athena attack, poseidon special (to get typhon's fury and breaking wave) and dash (to get razo shoals), zeus cast, i try to get sea storm (poseidon/zeus duo boon) when possible.
it's fun to jerk the enemies around. the yoyo ability reminds me of daud's void abilities from the dishonored franchise.
mint vortex
@turbid needle Pressing select and then L1 would actually be faster than the current method of holding L1 to open the Codex, so I'm not sure what the issue would be with rebinding it. That's also the only available controller button that's not used for pause/interact/combat.
turbid needle
L3 and R3 both used already?
mint vortex
You can't hold R3 and attack at the same time, unless you have two right thumbs. And the left stick is used for aiming/moving, so it would be kind of hard to hold the stick down and tilt it to aim at the same time. I don't think most controllers are even built to be used that way. It's either click or tilt, but not both at once.
restive widget
Do you guys always get legendary/heroic boons? Is there a good strategy how?
rocky sage
luck and mirror
restive widget
you mean the Olympic Aid one? Or whatever the name is. Increasing the chance of it?
rocky sage
yes
restive widget
Alright, cheers
mint vortex
I tried using that for a few runs. Never saw one Duo/Legendary the whole time.
covert tide
Even with the prereqs?
ripe parrot
The one that increases Rare chance is honestly better.
covert tide
With boon rerolls and the increased chance and aggressively choosing prerequisite boons I usually have good luck getting one or two legendaries by the end of the run
I prefer legendary/duo chance over boon rarities because there are already ways to increase boon rarity during a run
Euridyce, rare crop, yarn of ariadne, that duo that sets the minimum to epic...
ripe parrot
I just see way too many Commons when I have it switched over to the Legendary/Duo one.
hazy plume
Hi. I have a problem. What is dusa'' s request?hah. Yes I missed the moment, help
covert tide
I keep the epic chance one
@hazy plume I think that one you have to buy a lounge upgrade with the contractor
But I could be misremembering
dapper pilot
Yep. I believe it’s the options to clean up Cerb’s fur and scratch marks
hazy plume
In other words, the best option is to buy everything from the contractor related to the living room?
covert tide
I don’t think she tells you explicitly to begin with
Just that she could use some help
ripe parrot
Is the task in your Fated Prophecies list yet?
dapper pilot
That’s what I did. Keep making the lounge pretty and wait for Dusa to say something 
ripe parrot
Have any of you completely finished renovations? I did a while ago and now I forgot what it looked like before x]
hazy plume
@covert tide thank you very much , at least somewhere answered xD
ripe parrot
What sort of ||flowers did you place in the East hall? I love roses but had to go with the purple flowers to match Nyx||.
ripe parrot
I don't know, better safe than sorry lol
I just assume so because a lot of the things you buy ||don't unlock/aren't visible until tiers below them are bought, so||
mighty ermine
@ripe parrot same here! it's just such a perfect fit with her and the violet tiling decoration too
ripe parrot
Yeah! I recently got the dialogue where she comments on them too and I was like :3
restive widget
I have hunter dash now (+100% dash-strike), but getting offered to exchange with a heroic one from Artemis (blade rift)
It only has 8 damage per hit - doesn't sound very tempting..?
covert tide
Blade rift is ares
restive widget
ares, yeah, sry
ripe parrot
And you're right
covert tide
It’s not that great without other boons boosting your blade rifts
restive widget
right
ripe parrot
Facts.
covert tide
But if you’re new to the game it might be worth taking just so you can get familiar with all the mechanics
restive widget
I've used it before, but not a lot - I know how it works
works bets for large crowds imho
covert tide
Ahh
restive widget
best*
covert tide
Yeah
restive widget
dash-strike will be much more reliable
covert tide
Personally I don’t love Hunter Dash because it doesn’t break pots for me
restive widget
I don't get why it's heroic though, I have gotten blade rift before. Perhaps the base dmg is higher?
also, what are pots, @covert tide?
covert tide
Blade rifts formed from dashing happen a lot more often than casts or call ones
Oh I mean the little pots around the rooms that sometimes have money
restive widget
ah, ok I guess I don't usually check them
covert tide
I don’t like getting stuck on them and if you have a dash that does damage around itself then they break
restive widget
right, thanks for your input, fellas
covert tide
It’s kind of a stupid reason but it’s just a pet peeve of mine haha
gloomy vine
I personally really like blade rift, but like others have already pointed out in order to get the most from it you have to commit to building around it.
turbid needle
Talos kinda makes them terrifying even without Hunting Blades, you can keep dragging stuff into them.
lament coral
except for bosses
fallow niche
Schpoon you told me dio was good on the fists and he was just as bad there as anywhere else eugh
Awful run
Took so long
turbid needle
Did you get Long Knuckle?
turbid needle
Oh, yeah.
turbid needle
With Dionysus you want Long Knuckle and Zagreus Aspect.
lament coral
you get Dio attack/Aphro special/Athena dash
turbid needle
I feel it's better with Aphro Dash.
Long Knuckle provides the defense you need while keeping better Hangover uptime.
lament coral
what's on the special then?
turbid needle
I don't even press Special when I get a full build like that.
You're free to skip it.
Guess you could take Thunder Flourish for Scintillating Feast with Trippy Shot, which you also want for Black Out.
lament coral
also, Merciful End shrekts
turbid needle
Of course it does.
lament coral
surprisingly, it's garbage if you get it off attack/special
but attack/dash, that's a won run
lament coral
talking bout fists
summer linden
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/531858019730849802/690279182412021882/unknown.png?width=722&height=407 i love it when a build really comes together
turbid needle
I've never tried that, but I feel like Long Knuckle/Explosive Upper has some real room clearing potential.
lament coral
really? I'm having trouble getting special dash off consistently
turbid needle
Oh, wow.
lament coral
it just doesn't come out sometimes, not an issue with dash attack
lament coral
yeah, but I don't need to do that for dash attack
turbid needle
🤷
lament coral
why do I need to follow a different timing for the special?
turbid needle
It's a new mechanic, I'm okay with it having new timing.
It's the first time a weapon Special has been modified by a dash.
lament coral
it's slower, that's the issue
fist special is already slow enough to leave you open for an attack
you have to dash cancel it, meaning you don't get the landing animation, so Quake hammer doesn't work
not that it was good to begin with
turbid needle
I heard Quake Cutter's rework actually made it not-half-bad.
lament coral
what rework? It just scales off special
you still have to wait for the special animation to finish in order for the landing animation and Quake to proc
meaning you just stand still, like a dummy, while everyone gets to sock you
turbid needle
Not scaling past Tartarus was kind of a big point against it.
naive tusk
It’d be nicer if its wave appeared sooner
turbid needle
A little.
lament coral
it should just happen after the special hits, without requiring you to land
basically, it'd be special + scaling AOE
instead of the way it is now, which is special + dash cancel and no Quake
naive tusk
Which is why I prefer Explosive Cutter. No wait time at all to activate it
lament coral
I'm a kick man myself
covert tide
I play on keyboard and mouse and find it a bit awkward to consistently activate dash-upper
But rebinding keys at this point would be insane lol
mighty ermine
same, peach. i'm a fan of explosive upper
vague hearth
I like them all, but I think I prefer the initial utility of the kick
covert tide
I like the kick too because it misses less lol
covert tide
I’ve thought about trying on controller but I don’t think I could get used to not having the mouse to direct attacks@
mighty ermine
i do, yeah
naive tusk
Yeah, I use gamepad
lament coral
perhaps it's a mouse specific issue
naive tusk
The Dash-Upper window?
lament coral
yeah
naive tusk
Probably. You'd have to ask others who play on KBM
lament coral
damaless is having the same issue
naive tusk
Using a gamepad, the Dash-Upper triggers easily
mighty ermine
odd, yeah, i never have issues pulling off dash-upper, either on its own or immediately following a dash-strike attack
lament coral
try using a mouse if you get a chance
covert tide
It’s because my hands are centered over WASD and thumb is on space
So going space->Q fast enough is a little awkward
covert tide
I can do it, just not as consistently
vague hearth
Mine is bound to middle mouse
lament coral
and I'm unable to do it reliably
naive tusk
Well... I'd certainly switch the Special on Q to Special on RMB because it's tooo awkward on the Q XD
lament coral
unlike the dash attack
covert tide
If I swapped them I would screw myself over for hours until I got used to it haha
Maybe I’ll try it
vague hearth
Yeah, I found that out when I took an attack curse from chaos while using the hera bow
Word for the wise
covert tide
My husband and I play on the same file though so I’d have to get him to agree lol
vague hearth
don't do that
naive tusk
Well, I can trigger it easily as well
lament coral
it's awkward the first couple of runs but amazing after
naive tusk
It's a matter of timing it
lament coral
feels natural, proper
covert tide
I’ll try it out
lament coral
you spam your special often, you don't do that with your cast outside of very specific setups
vague hearth
Yeah
covert tide
That’s true
naive tusk
My recommendation is to press the Special button as soon as the dash is at its end
lament coral
see, I can do that
covert tide
It’s not the timing I have trouble with, it’s having my fingers on WASD while dashing (to direct it) and then having to quickly hit Q
But switching to rmb might be a good solution
lament coral
it just feels weird and clunky to have to time it so precisely when I can spam dash attack
you actually feel like fist of the north start with the dash attack
naive tusk
@covert tide I highly recommend you remap the special to RMB
It will make your plays smoother imo
restive widget
are people using the standard bindings on the controller? I've never tried Hades with keys and mouse.
naive tusk
Special on Q with Malphon is just too much trouble to get it to trigger
lament coral
it's perfectly playable with kbm
just have to swap cast and special buttons for maximum comfort
earnest ravine
Everything for me is standaard on controller aside from reload, which I THINK I rebound to left stick click.
restive widget
For me, A then Y (dash to upper) isn't perfect
lament coral
I was apprehensive of the idea at first, a couple of months ago, but decided to give it a try
earnest ravine
i rarely play rail so >.>
lament coral
and then never went back
restive widget
haven't tried anything else tho
naive tusk
Aiming with KBM is so much better compared to gamepad
That's why I don't use Special as much with Exagryph. Too much of a hassle to aim it in a packed room
rocky sage
i did an aspect of chaos shield run and i gotta say i didnt get
it
bull rush always feels too slow
i took the hammer upgrade that makes it a shot but i just felt the special kept on missing
is ti only good once upgraded to max?
covert tide
I don’t really like any of the shield aspects except zag’s
earnest ravine
It starts to shine after three upgrades but best at maxed.
Rank 1 is practically indistinguishable from base shield.
rocky sage
also is it really worth putting points into the arthur aspect
i mean it does its work
earnest ravine
(though I;m a hardcore zeus aspect one-trick so I'm not the best judge)
vague hearth
Not at high heat, apparently
rocky sage
dont get how to use that aspect at all
vague hearth
Heavy attacks with greater risk for greater reward
Trap them in the aura
Move to a safe range
Set up for the third attack and dash in just before you swing
rocky sage
ye but like the upgrade is only for when u are standing in the aura
vague hearth
Yeah
earnest ravine
It's actually pretty nifty on FO 40% to make projectile barrages less overwhelming, especially in like, Asphodel. But base aura works MORE than fine for that.
only really worry about it if you're going full Hard Labour and FO and still need help dodging anyway
rocky sage
any good bow aspects?
earnest ravine
All of them
rocky sage
i dislike the bow
vague hearth
All of them
earnest ravine
Hera is a fan favourite, I like Chiron, Zag can do BIG crits and is fun
vague hearth
Hera has insane burst potential
vague hearth
You can stack multiple casts into a single shot
Which means even a normal dio cast can mean 300 damage in one shot in an area
It only gets more insane from there
slow copper
aight getting hera next run lmao
full swift
Chiron aspect just feels very good
vague hearth
Chiron is honestly really fun but needs to be upgraded to truly shine
earnest ravine
^
vague hearth
Get it with zeus special and you have a terrifying amount of damage
full swift
The hammer that gets more special shots
earnest ravine
The arrow reduction sucks at base level but after a few blood it adds up fast.
full swift
It might not be the best thing but chiron aspect and then poseidon on the special
vague hearth
I did that once
full swift
All enemies get yeeted
vague hearth
Surprisingly fun to watch
full swift
Razor shoals with that
vague hearth
Zagreus aspect is reliable
rocky sage
wait but if i run infernal soul
vague hearth
You can't go wrong with having solid options
earnest ravine
I like Demeter on Chiron and Zeus, but one time I ended up getting the uh, "does more damage per application" doom thing and then got aan Epric Doom Special
vague hearth
Infernal?
full swift
Infernal soul hera is a big rip
earnest ravine
and that was funny
rocky sage
@full swift the good or bad kind
full swift
Wait infernal is the stacking one right
rocky sage
its the regenerating
full swift
You want the one that stacks
rocky sage
i see
full swift
Regen doesn't get you the umph
vague hearth
You want burst damage above all else
Still trying to get the ultimate hera bow run
With fully loaded and instant recall
lament coral
it's harder now
earnest ravine
Yeah, right now, the recharge time and lack of burst makes it really not worth it on Hera. Unless you lean into Chaos boons and Prometheus stones.
lament coral
Arty leg comes so much later
vague hearth
I knowww
rocky sage
whats arty leg
earnest ravine
which is fun in its own right! but takes ages to get going by comparison
vague hearth
+3 cast
full swift
Artemis legendary
versed ibex
artemis legendary. it's so good 😭
vague hearth
I've only got it once, and that was back when the hydra was the last boss
versed ibex
+3 bloodstones. If you get that and Hermes's faster regen on stygian soul, you can sort of spam casts
vague hearth
It's beyond busted with the right setup and I adore it
versed ibex
I love it and hope it does not get nerfed :X
full swift
The burst one from Hermes
vague hearth
To be fair
full swift
Gun anything down with 6 casts
vague hearth
It's one of the rarer boons to get
So it makes perfect sense that it stays like that
versed ibex
oh, "extra damage on anything without bloodstones in them" is great if your casts is dio or ares
vague hearth
So you can every now and then get that run of sheer insanity
full swift
Legendaries are supposed to be really impactful
full swift
@versed ibex Hermes legy
versed ibex
I got one run where I Ares cast + Artemis double cast + Ares/Artemis duo + Artemis legendary + Hermes legendary
the final boss stood no chance XD
full swift
Yea that with the pulling in vortex
vague hearth
Oooof
full swift
Rightclick equals kill
versed ibex
well, this was before the most recent patch where they changed the numbers and now I'm getting like, no good boons 😦
vague hearth
Like eris aspect RPG run
full swift
They nerfed the arty double cast right
covert tide
@versed ibex yeah with a build like that your weapon doesn’t even matter
covert tide
You could win the fight without even attacking
versed ibex
cast build got me through the final boss the first time too
because you can attack from afar and just dodge dodge dodge
vague hearth
I think my first victory was double nova crit sword?
vague hearth
Which is ironic considering it's one of my least used
vague hearth
The only reason I used it recently is because you can reach utterly insane speeds with zag aspect and greater haste
versed ibex
I'm having a hard time with the attack on Arthur because it's a thrust instead of a sweep
so I keep whiffing 😔
vague hearth
You can dash with the sweeps
vague hearth
So you can thrust to prepare and then dash in with the sweep
At high heat, it's really not great, I've heard
One thing to say is
slow copper
just beat 16 heat with arthur like an hour ago
vague hearth
Never pick forced overtime with arthur aspect
earnest ravine
it's not that bad! My first clear was 40% overtime because of Heat bounties on the sword.
vague hearth
A lot of people pick forced overtime as a general heat choice apparently
versed ibex
I could probably shave a good 5 minutes off my run if I didn't stare at doors with indecision, lol.
earnest ravine
Just a bit sketchy sometimes.
vague hearth
It's not good on arthur
slow copper
i can do the first rank of forced overtime but not the second
vague hearth
I don't touch overtime
earnest ravine
Nah, I meant, with Arthur. It was kinda funny watching the saytryr in Styx just keep wiffing
versed ibex
I did forced overtime once with the Zag sword, I think. Just to get the prophecy. and then never again
earnest ravine
Because their projectiles were VISIIBLE lmao
vague hearth
Yeah
tidal thorn
I don't use OT but I use max Benefits.
vague hearth
Also
You should try out max zag aspect and heroic greater haste
Perhaps even taking the plume as well
It is
Nigh uncontrollable
slow copper
sounds like it lmao
versed ibex
I wish I could choose which of the bosses get benefits. I don't mind upgraded Theseus but the hydra is just not fun when the battle isn't actually against the heads, but trying to find a safe space to stand
slow copper
hydra is pretty easy imo but theseus is crazy
versed ibex
and if your build relies on dash attacks... well, good luck
slow copper
that spinning attack shreds
versed ibex
it's not that the hydra is necessarily hard, I just don't find it fun
slow copper
wait i was thinking asterius
vague hearth
Hydra with extreme measures is a massive pain if you don't have a way to quickly dispatch the heads
tepid ridge
The hydra does kinda feel like a pace killer no matter what form you face it in.
versed ibex
at least in the standard version I don't have to worry as much about accidentally having a foot in lava
vague hearth
Theseus and asterius is just a matter of remembering not to be near asterius when he lands
Because he's hit you four times already with the shockwave and you should be expecting it by now
earnest ravine
I don't even mind the lava, the little like... neck-bone bits keep getting me when I try and dash and ruins my dodges.
vague hearth
The worst part is easily when the heads end up over lava
full swift
Easy ups for pact are EM and heightened security
tidal thorn
Hydra has gotten constantly stuck on things and in walls for me since update.
full swift
Then either BP or jury summons
vague hearth
Heightened security is traps right?
lament coral
it's always been getting stuck
full swift
Yes
versed ibex
traps are fine until you're standing in lava 😛
vague hearth
I'd say that's less of a good idea with hydra
versed ibex
and iirc isn't one of the final boss's attacks counted as a trap?
tidal thorn
Runs High Sec with Arthur. Free heat.
vague hearth
Especially when four purple heads spawn and the amount of safe ground is cut to a third of what it was
full swift
Traps has been treating me good until one time there was lava lobbed on me while picking up the diamond
versed ibex
oof
oh, I do remember the first time I beat the hydra with like, 5HP left, and then as I was leaving I accidentally missed the boat and stepped in lava, resulting in death
vague hearth
I am awful at dodging traps
full swift
After losing about 10 death defiances to the axes in styx you'll be way more alert to them
vague hearth
You'd think so, huh?
tidal thorn
I hate the Elysium traps. The arrows and the soldier traps, ugh.
tidal thorn
^^
slow copper
i hate elysium in general
vague hearth
The soldier traps have helped me more than hurt me
full swift
I find the traps easier to get over then the other pact options
vague hearth
I dash into the arrows a lot though...
full swift
On god never do BP 2
vague hearth
I'm planning on getting used to the time limit with some of my weapons
versed ibex
I'm not super great at dodging so the arrow spearhead is pretty much a must for me as of Elysium :/
full swift
Time limit is 9 minutes a world right?
tidal thorn
9 and 7.
versed ibex
yeah, whoops. that's what I meant
vague hearth
I wanna try and do a run of that with full extreme measures using eris aspect
full swift
That does sound ok
vague hearth
Shotgun blitz is a beautiful thing
blazing mulch
9 and 7 min but its have stops in some situations like fishing
vague hearth
Yeah
full swift
The fishing is nice
vague hearth
It helps that you can select rewards and boons as they appear
Which also just feels cool
versed ibex
Also, is that, uh, extra challenge room (do it without taking damage for the reward) thing ever super worth it? I find lately the rewards are middling at best and not taking damage is not my strong suit so even when I'm playing at high enough heats I end up skipping them a lot
vague hearth
Sometimes yes
tidal thorn
Every so often.
full swift
Shotgun blitz?
versed ibex
oh, I guess so. I didn't know that
vague hearth
As many dash strike chaos boons as possible
More dashes from hermes
And the attack boon of your choice
And if possible
Piercing fire
So that you can flex that little bit more on great shields
full swift
If you have the %extra shekels the erebus trial for money is worth it
vague hearth
You get lotsa money
slow copper
probably better rarity
versed ibex
ohhh okay, that's good to know
vague hearth
Why don't I get two red onions then
full swift
The red onion is double a half hp
slow copper
red onion is the best item in the game
vague hearth
You just die in erebus
Waiting for you in front of the pool of styx is two red onions
full swift
Playing butterfly on all runs makes erebus a routine job
vague hearth
I like the plume more actually
Fast > safe in my eyes
Also completing a room quickly feels great
rocky sage
i like to play some chambers like a true coward
full swift
Somehow when you play plume you get the 4 wave rooms
vague hearth
I like to play a lot of rooms like an idiot
But a brave idiot nonetheless
Until the flamewheels appear
Then yakety sax starts playing
full swift
You have not seen fear until you've met haste teleport flamewheels
vague hearth
JESUS
full swift
omae wa mou
full swift
Fun fact had that happen
vague hearth
Ngl
full swift
2 death defiances lost
full swift
Well had the Athena dash so you can panic dash through half of them
vague hearth
I was kinda hoping for the final boss to have extreme measures where he uses a few of the other weapons
Ah
Gotta love athena boons
full swift
Imagine EM final boss
Gets a random weapon you're not using
That would be terrifying
lament coral
Heals to full from 1 hit
slow copper
imagine getting kited with coronacht
lament coral
"what now, boi?"
tepid ridge
“the air on the surface is too fluid for my tastes”
drops a tactical nuclear strike on Zagreus
full swift
They should make a fishing point after the final boss
The little spot next to the river is perfect for it
full swift
You get space fish
lament coral
I think there are 3 fish types