which isn't the highest, but it is passive damage
#h1-builds-and-combat
analog lodge
kind cloud
The mini-contest with thanatos is not timed? is that a change in the new update?
analog lodge
That effect was there in the previous update
naive tusk
Was it timed before?
analog lodge
no
kind cloud
Ok. So I guess I never noticed before. I tried to avoid battles with Thanatos for that reason alone. (I'm terrible at timed things.) I was just watching a Haelian stream and notice it wasn't timed. When I beat 32 heat, I did it without the timer option activated in the pact.
naive tusk
OMG I can unleash 9 Blade Rifts every 3 seconds with Hunting Blades and Vicious Cycle and I'm seeing red all over the place 😄
naive tusk
I have 2 casts with Stygian Soul + Dual Shot + Blade Dash + 4 dashes
naive tusk
It's the Mirror talent that lets you regen your bloodstone every 3 seconds
kind cloud
So 1
naive tusk
The alternative to the 3 bloodstones
kind cloud
Got it.
turbid needle
I love Stygian Soul so much.
kind cloud
But that still doesn't explain to me how you're getting to 9
I get dual shot doubles it.
But how 9?
naive tusk
1 cast is default. I got +1 from Chaos. Dual Shot makes them 4. My blade dash can make 5 when I dash 5 times in a row, and I can dash +3 times thanks to Hermes
I am streaming it now if you wanna see 😄
And for overkill, I got Ares' Aid
kind cloud
Oh, ok. Got it. You were combining dash and cast. Yeah, makes sense. Got a link?
naive tusk
I will DM it to you
kind cloud
Thanks.
rare salmon
It turns out that Athena's Attack on the Fists is super fun. A surprising number of final boss' attacks can be Deflected. I ended up with Athena on both Attack and Special, plus the Artemis Duo.
turbid needle
Hey, that reminds me, I've got queso fresco in the fridge, I should make tacos tomorrow morning.
naive tusk
You totally should
tidal thorn
First thing I tried when I got to Aspho. lol
vague hearth
So uhh
I'm a speedy zag rn
Max zag sword
Drift dash
And greater haste
It is
very hard to control
tidal thorn
I blame Drift Dash.
turbid needle
now get Second Wind and play Yakkety Sax
analog lodge
Infernal soul creates more blade rifts per 3 seconds than stygian soul. As blade rift has 4 second duration.
mighty ermine
then stack some ignited ichor from a well or two
turbid needle
Okay, but have you tried Aspect of Demeter with Hunter Dash and Explosive Upper?
vague hearth
That nerd just got sonic'd
analog lodge
That works now?
vague hearth
It shouldn't have
turbid needle
It's always worked, at least since I discovered it on like, Wednesday of last week.
analog lodge
Then I guess I should try "One Punch Zag" one more time with an extra boon now
mighty ermine
gotta gun for some chaos lunge boons while you're at it
analog lodge
Can't wait to 6k crit hades
turbid needle
What's everyone's go-to Malphon build for 32 Heat?
vague hearth
Heroic greater haste with max zag sword
It's even worse than before
Also 5 dashes
turbid needle
Hey, at least this isn't like HLD where if you dash into walls moving to quickly you stun yourself.
vague hearth
True
gloomy vine
Well, this room was impossible... rip run... https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/779625968718224670/D8EE572556DF41EF35A513A8C975C5B348F69085/
Fast numbskulls which were giving each other shields. Using aspect of arthur and I couldn't do anything.
uneven quest
I feel your pain @gloomy vine https://youtu.be/39c2pJ5gChQ
median flume
oh hey I ran into this too. This perk needs to be fixed. https://i.imgur.com/cfggKv6.png
gloomy vine
It is frankly just not fun
I been trying to do the 32 heat challenge but I'm starting to think it just isn't worth it. Too stressful and stuff like this makes it luck based
median flume
I only beat that room just now by tanking and doing my special to whittle them down. I was lucky there was a trove with darkness in it
gloomy vine
Can't whittle them down though, theres too many of them refreshing their shields
and the fact they had speed boost as well meant I couldn't just facetank and hit them. It was just not possible
median flume
Yeah as I said I got lucky. What weapon were you using?
speedboost would make that even worse for sure
gloomy vine
Already said, aspect of arthur. Slowest weapon of them all 
median flume
oh yeah rip
vague hearth
Super sonic'd him this time
tall dove
Look at all those Bloodstones....
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/520451817323364352/689697305565462559/20200318004412_1.jpg
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/520451817323364352/689697331230408705/20200318004557_1.jpg
vague hearth
oof
tall dove
I think I once got even more stuck in him, but I couldn't screenshot it in time
All that after having to fight Extreme-Measured Theseus & Asterius whilst Slothful
Worth it
And that pair of duos is just for getting the Prophecy, they weren't part of the build at all lmao
So, do we reckon in general that max level Stygian Soul is just kinda busted?
tall dove
Better get Skelly's last statue before it gets nerfed!
tall dove
The ammo for your cast, yeah
spring mauve
cool
vague hearth
the first speedy run https://imgur.com/a/IYcpRdI
spring mauve
Lord Had
tall dove
LORD HAD♦️♦️♦️♦️♦️♦️♦️♦️♦️♦️♦️♦️♦️♦️
gloomy vine
That should really be in spoilers
spring mauve
fastest I ever got was 15 minutes and I was cheating 😳
unkempt pagoda
no truce with the furies
spring mauve
I ALWAYS read that as furries
vague hearth
wait.
vague hearth
What does this look like with a fully stacked plume
spring mauve
that sounds vaguely sexual
vague hearth
ZagreusBreaksALandSpeedRecord.png
spring mauve
how fast does he actually move when dashing
vague hearth
Fast Enough that I was able to survive without any death defiances left
privileged status put in some work in this run
spring mauve
I feel like if I had that speed in asphodel I'd just die
because i'd always be on fire
vague hearth
oh
I was on fire a lot
the hydra fight was just internally screaming the entire time
I think in that run I defied death at least six or seven times
dapper pilot
[Deja Vu, but played on a Lyre]
vague hearth
also with distant zagreus screaming
I will say though
zagreus when he's that fast and with that many dashes
must have been a nightmare to deal with
you know the speedrunning mario from terminalmontage?
Imagine being the final boss expecting zagreus to show up and then you just get this entity that proceeds to move around you at mach 2 and poke you a lot
spring mauve
sonic movie
vague hearth
again
spring mauve
you lose control the faster your character moves
vague hearth
the internal screaming never stopped
it just started during the hydra fight
it was, uhh
chaos
spring mauve
hermes = chaos?
vague hearth
which is fitting, because I had about 4 or 5 chaos boons by the end of it
so the lesson is
if you want some control over your character in hades
at all
spring mauve
equip the chaos movement debuff but mod it so it never changes to a good boon
vague hearth
don't get the rarity upgrade from eurydice after getting epic greater haste
spring mauve
legendary greater haste level 20
vague hearth
especially if you're using the zagreus aspect stygian blade at max level
I managed to run past a leaping asterius into his strike by accident
vague hearth
poseidon aspect is honestly surprisingly fun
uneven quest
@gloomy vine I'm uploading a guide right now to make a high heat Excalibur build if you want to try it
got me through 33 heat
vague hearth
nice
uneven quest
idk how to feel about the fists
I got through 32 heat with them
but I shouldn't have
I got like 5 extra death defiances
the damage was so so low
turbid needle
Malphon's got good damage.
uneven quest
mmm
maybe it was the heat stuff I had on
how do you get good damage with them @turbid needle
turbid needle
Artemis, mostly.
turbid needle
Aspect of Demeter, Deadly Flourish, either Flying Cutter with lots of Special damage, or Explosive Upper with Hunter Dash and Chaos Lunge.
uneven quest
what's the hammer boon that lets you charge the special?
turbid needle
Flying Cutter.
uneven quest
that plus demeters aspect was what got me through
that and a poseidon boon to keep enemies off me
turbid needle
I feel like Explosive Upper might be a little better for its speed and better AoE, though.
uneven quest
is explosive upper the dash-special one?
turbid needle
Yes.
hushed ledge
Tbh I can't figure out the flying cutter + Demeter aspect synergy, sometimes it feels like you get the extras when you start charging.
turbid needle
That's from Dash-Upper.
uneven quest
that ones pretty good, but idk I really like dash-upper
hushed ledge
Dash uppers don't charge
turbid needle
I'm sorry, I thought you meant you got multiple hits and then it started charging.
uneven quest
wait, I mean explosive upper lol
hushed ledge
It makes the sound at the start
And also starts charging at the same time
Also dashing out of charge is super confusing to me
It's distinctly not a dash upper, because it doesn't have the visual effects
It's really weird
(also pls fix keyboard charge upper sgg)
lusty sequoia
Damn aspect of Arthur seems pretty good
Just beat the last boss with it
Gotta time dodges well to make use of it though
twilit stag
Hmm, is it true that fiery presence doesn't work for casts?
gloomy vine
You can very easily test that against skele
hushed ledge
got my first melee clear 
(with a bull rush shield build but still technically melee!)
Final Boss didn't do the jar attack once in the last phase
hushed ledge
It was a silly power rush + faster bull rush run
So I was basically just spamming out 400% bull rushes
fallow niche
With the heavy artemis cast nerfs I wonder if Chaos Shield is just by far the best aspect again
lament coral
probably, yeah
nimble cypress
What has Artemis cast got to do with chaos shield?
fallow niche
The best speedrunning aspect for a while was Chaos Shield, then last update Artemis Cast on Poseidon Sword became the best because of people discovering it and being encouraged to look at it due to mild Merciful End nerfs @nimble cypress
fastest time was down to 5:51 using artemis cast on poseidon sword
hence the ridiculous nerfs on artemis cast builds this patch
I think they went a bit overboard, chaos shield is much less fun to watch too
rancid shore
I'm curious as to why people downvoted this feedback
The Ares boon that makes your next attack or special do more damage... with faster weapons like the rail or the gauntlets it’s wasted on an attack that hits nothing most of the time. It would be nice if it would boost the damage if the next attack or special hit, so that at least it isn’t completely wasted
I know it's not exactly what they stated but bullrush and spin attacks literally don't work with it because you have to attack the air before you can charge those up
turbid needle
Has there been a name assigned to beating the last boss on first escape attempt in hell mode?
frosty pier
probably no
turbid needle
I did my second successful attempt yesterday, considering if people would find it interesting to watch
frosty pier
you should
rancid shore
that one's a big 
untold blaze
@rancid shore There's a boon you can get in the doom chain that makes the doom deal more damage for additional dooms applied. Combine that with the one that makes it take longer but deal more damage and it's worth while on things like the rail. I've gotten 1000 damage dooms off that way.
frosty pier
Those were erebus placeholders i think?
rancid shore
That's not the boon they're referring to though
I'm not arguing about the viability of rail or fist on ares
It's that that boon simply doesn't work with attacks that make you hit before you can charge them up
blazing mulch
Actually the tortilla with fries can be a reward
untold blaze
Oh, okay yeah I see it.
opal bay
since when?
blazing mulch
Since a long time, but be free to report it if it shows too many times
rancid shore
I've literally never seen that show up
opal bay
yeah this is like first time I seen it
blazing mulch
I seen it maybe twice time, when I play like 400h
rancid shore
It's not included in the room rewards algorithm so it must be a bug
untold blaze
Sorry I thought they were talking about doom itself. Yeah I kind of wish that boon was something like, deal additional damage for x seconds after killing a creature. Maybe make it so he has a legendary boon that links into it that resets the timer, increases movement speed, and the adds more damage for subsequent kills during the effect.
It'd actually be great.
As it stands I only take that boon if I'm working on something like the bow because literally that is the only one its useful on.
Maybe zues shield aspect, since the shield retains the damage bonus the entire duration its out.
However on most it really is not worth it.
turbid needle
I got health reward as an option for three choice rooms yesterday
Ok I'll record my next attempt
think it's actually one of the more viable categories of speedruns
surreal jolt
Wait the health rewards a bug?
I used a fated authority yesterday and got that...then used 2 more and it didn't change
opal bay
unsure if it is
atomic mist
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ETZhEy1XkAEgmkO?format=jpg&name=large Finally won my first 32 heat run. It was a lucky one, carried by Artemis Hazard bomb (out of all things lmao)
placid path
stable onyx
is shady the best companion out of all
fallow niche
@turbid needle Spread Fire might compete with Chaos Shield now
Current patch WR is now sub-8
analog lodge
Given all the mirror damage buffs introduced, that doesn't surprise me
you can get like a 5.9 time multiplier just stacking mirror buffs
That said, it is harder now to speedrun at WR levels as one of the mirror buffs required only works when at very high health
atomic mist
The companions are situational and there's no clear winner out of all of them IMO. Mostly comes down to personal preference
fallow niche
I'd say that Bouldy is best for general use, Meg is best for speedrunning, and Skelly is best for securing 32 heat runs.
Dusa and Than's are not good enough imo
They are fun tho
analog lodge
Skelly is good for hades as you can mess with his Ai, but for speedruns you pick Meg for high damage and hydra skip
fallow niche
Yeah I'd say that Bouldy, Meg, and Skelly are all great
Its that Than and Dusa need some small tweaks/buffs
Not sure what can be done for than specifically though
analog lodge
I wonder, with mirror the way it is, can you get FULL hydra skip on this patch?
atomic mist
I agree, though I never use Skelly, but again that's personal preference
fallow niche
Yes but its MUCH harder now Doom
atomic mist
And never managed to successfully do the Hydra skip
fallow niche
Its easy to get a partial skip but a full skip is very difficult
Once the "best build" for speedrunning is found I'm sure it'll be pulled off a lot more though
As of right now I've done it only once this patch and only seen someone stream it once
atomic mist
Is there a video or something out there that explains it because I know what you're supposed to do but not how you do it
fallow niche
So the first 1-3 seconds of any boss fight, the bosses don't get their invulnerable bubbles to change phases, so if you deal their entire HP's worth of damage in their period you skip them
Requires an absurdly good build by that point however
Last patch Artemis Cast could do it on the regular
atomic mist
Ah. I did not know that. Thanks
fallow niche
You use Extreme Measures 2 simply because the Hydra spawns closer to the entrance as well
atomic mist
I will definitely try that again now that I know this
fallow niche
@atomic mist Its almost impossible to do without Meg's keepsake as well I'd like to mention!
Its a nice reward for speedrunners I'd say
Not easy to pull off
atomic mist
Than is too slow I'm guessing?
fallow niche
Yes the delay is longer than the period they can be killed iirc
That is the sole reason he's not used for this
analog lodge
The real question for speedruns is if the 25% damage from confidence is worth the 50 less health
fallow niche
Yes
Losing 50 health is something you can just take into account in the run
And speedruns are often seeded at the start, so you get a massive headstart
Just be careful of those tiny chariots 
analog lodge
Though it IS non-optional on no-hit speedruns
fallow niche
I don't know if no-hit runs exist yet
atomic mist
I would like to see that
fallow niche
Haelian tried earlier but failed in Elysium
analog lodge
You probably need to do a no hit or close to no hit to constantly get the 25%
fallow niche
We have Any%, 32 heat (any%), and empty file% (any%)
atm
@analog lodge We always generally get close
I almost never get hit until Meg
And even in Asphodel I rarely get hit
Elysium is another story
We also try and get fountain rooms, which heal
analog lodge
And here I am, at only 16 heat at the highest
fallow niche
Don't worry, you'll get higher
atomic mist
If you get those hastened elite chariots or flamewheels, it's over. Teleporting enemies too. Elysium is just something else...
atomic mist
Yep
I just cleared heat 32 today, if I can do it, anyone can lol
With enough time and luck
fallow niche
Yup
There is a real strategy to doing it as well that makes it sooo much easier
32 heat speedruns are pure skill though, truly nuts, the only problem is that you often rely on patty
sacred folio
There's a website for that https://www.speedrun.com/hades
astral magnet
there's no 32 heat runs on there
oh nm, it just defaults to an update with few runs
gloomy vine
patty?
ripe parrot
Patroclus.
finite tulip
just encountered an infernal trove+chaos in the same chamber. They overlapped for whatever reason. Looked like Chaos was going to eat the trove
stoic crest
so
what are your thoughts on olympian legacy over olympian favour?
I've already maxed out legacy but idk...
sure I had a run yesterday with 3 duos now that I think about it
but frankly it seems to me that if you've met the requirements for a legendary or duo boon
then the 15% chance doesn't play a huge role
while 40% for rare boons just off the gate seems much more reliable
thoughts?
turbid needle
a lot of my builds involve duos or legends so i cant live without it
personally i feel that some duos are just essential to builds (see: merciful end) and not getting them is way, WAY worse than getting another lower rarity boon
tried without and the (bad) luck just screws you over
fallow niche
@atomic mist None this patch, but last patch was 11:02
could have gone even lower too
@stoic crest completely agreed
Most of the new mirror stuff ultimately isn't good enough
A handful of them are spicy as hell / very good though
stoic crest
I like stygian soul a lot
dark regeneration too cause I'm farming darkness again for fated authority/persuasion so I might as well got good heals off of it
main citrus
Stygian Soul is great if you get Fully Loaded as well.
And yeah, Dark Regeneration is superior to the measly 3hp per room, since many times you'll waste it.
stoic crest
ok I wanted to make a similar argument for god's pride over god's 10% chance of boons, hammers or poms
I was like "well boons are common as it is"
stoic crest
I'm close to fighting the furies and I have ONE BOON
fallow niche
I don't prioritize darkness much now that I have everything in the mirror
stoic crest
I have used 4 fated authorities
fallow niche
Ouch
stoic crest
and I only get darkness, keys (which land me authority) and the crystals for the contractor
wtf.
ripe parrot
Did you run into any Chambers with the Coin/Hammer/Pom/Nectar reward? Those can be rerolled into Boons, the currencies like Darkness, Keys, and Gems cannot.
hearty pilot
i think i haven't given poseidon enough credit. knockback on hera attack with distant memory synergizes verrrry nicely
trail meteor
for people that say Artur sword is slow. I made game on lowe heat (5) i dont have strong boms (most dmg from normal attack, aphrodite on eepic lvl2 plus gift from chaos, no others bost)-made game in less than 19min witchout rusching
stoic crest
Did you run into any Chambers with the Coin/Hammer/Pom/Nectar reward? Those can be rerolled into Boons, the currencies like Darkness, Keys, and Gems cannot.
@ripe parrot oh, word?!
well that explains it!
so basically rewards are compartmentalized into run-only and development
now I know
ripe parrot
Yeah. Usually the pool will net you a Boon in at least 3 rolls from any of those in the above list, but I've had RNG curse me and it's sometimes taken 5 - 6 rolls.
I usually try to save at least a couple so I can change all doors in Styx to Boon doors.
errant narwhal
Check out sparrow’s guide to room rewards pinned in this channel
It’ll show you what can reroll into what
based on the color of the laurel
ripe parrot
I'm colorblind so the laurels aided me none at all.
I wish I had that guide when I started, though, I kept avoiding the NPC doors because I didn't know what they were lol
fallow niche
Oh my god I didn't even realize the game didn't have a colorblind mode
errant narwhal
ah, I do hope it’ll have a colorblind mode in the future
they are divided into permanent resources and run upgrades so now u know tho it’s a super helpful guide, thanks sparrow
ripe parrot
Hahah it's okay it's not like it's that debilitating to me, I don't really know if a colorblind mode is even really needed too much.
hearty pilot
i have never known fear until i saw tisiphone using her feet to run at me then away then back again without dashing
spice turret
So, it turns out that legendary Aphrodite+fists is pretty slick on the final boss.
I didn't win, but I certainly stopped a lot of those spin attacks.
calm ember
Dude Aphrodite's cure/passive whenver you piss her off in Trial of the Gods is OP/Broken AF! I just got my ass kicked because I could never see the stupid charm coming and it never stops following you.
That was so frustrating. Ruined my whole run. That was the first time I had ever seen her "Scorn".
tidal thorn
Yeah, I though they came from enemies but they come from nowhere and just track you down.
sly sonnet
Yeah but from what I understood there can only be one charm on screen at once
so you run in a circle
and while its turning around you hit enemies
I actually find it to be one of the easier trail of the gods
calm ember
It may be once I've done it some more. I had just never in all this time, apparently, ever seen aphro's "Scorn" as I'm calling it.
It pissed me off for a second. You know how it is when you're having a decent run and then something you've never seen just messes your groove all up.
Out of all of the Scorns I have Demeter's for sure.
elfin zephyr
Demeter's is brutal. Huge circles so you can't hit the enemies within with melee.
Aphrodite's is manageable, but the projective does travel pretty fast. Feel like it could be a little slower.
covert tide
@calm ember they changed it to this recently. It used to be smaller circles forming in a ring around each enemy
My only beef with the Aphrodite scorn now is that it’s really hard to see when you’ve already got pink effects all over the place from the weak you’re presumably applying to enemies
I avoid pissing off demeter as much as possible... really the only scenario I can imagine where I’d do so is if I’m short on time in Elysium and my other option is angering Athena, because those encounters can take forever
dusky hull
That moment when you're at the ground floor with 3k obols:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2r_8Wf8nRr8
covert tide
Haha did you use the new mirror money option?
dusky hull
I did, plus 2 money boons from Chaos.
surreal jolt
wtf 3k? did you have like 100 fated authroity so you could get only money rooms and no boons?
i cant even imagine that much money
dusky hull
No, I had like 2 coin rooms and 1 coin trove.
covert tide
Shady as your companion?
mighty ermine
chaos money boons affect enemy or urn gold drops too, so i can def see it
dusky hull
@covert tide , yes.
untold blaze
Love trial is definitely one that catches you off guard, I imagine they're probably going to slow it down eventually but it doesn't really do a lot of damage to it's whatever. Personally I can't even consistently dodge redacted's skulls so that's one I'm probably going to avoid depending on who it's paired with. Unfortunately, it's usually paired with demeter on the second floor or athena on the 3rd for me. Both of which present some interesting problems that I would rather just take a few hits to avoid.
Nothing says annoying like a great shield taking a moment to die and then getting invulnerability while it's rearming.
sly sonnet
I think when the little souls drop they have to walk back to where they died or something like that
and while they have invulenerabilty shield up
you can still stunlock them with attacks
It only might be a problem if you doing a ranged build
gentle palm
https://prnt.sc/rin0i5 10 in a row babey!!!!!!!
sly sonnet
Woah nice
untold blaze
Oh no can't stun lock them while they're invulnerable. It's not a problem persay, there's a good chance you can kill a soul before it can get that protection usually. It's just annoying when you killed 3 great shields and they're all reviving under a goddess's protection... Honestly though, I'm wondering if they'll ever add lore specific bosses for each the trails around the 3rd floor.
sly sonnet
I got my new record today with 4 in a row
untold blaze
Like you displease one and they summon a champion from the past to come kill you.
sly sonnet
Hm weird I was pretty sure I had to fight the invlunerable ones once and I just spammed sword and it worked
But yeah its a bit annoying to deal with it
but thats the magic of trail of the gods
you chose what kind of challange you want between the 2
Honestly anything that isnt aoe damage I always pick
I just cant deal with sawblades or dionysus poison puddles
untold blaze
I will say though, I haven't gotten artemis's scorn since the update and I'm scared to try it.
With how much more dangerous all the others got, worried she doesn't have 'random' attacks anymore.
turbid needle
I gotta say, hate how Discord skips from where I left it when I closed (little after 1 this morning) to not when I log back in, but some indeterminable time between closing and opening it.
Anyway, this is all to say that I think Nemesis needs a little more using, too, @fallow niche
turbid arch
Nemesis Aspect is so robust. You get a good Attack Boon, you basicly have a run, even if you don't get anything else.
turbid needle
Got me my first 32 Heat Stygius clear in one try, and nearly set a PB.
turbid arch
Good man.
dapper pilot
heck yeah!
fallow niche
@turbid needle I mean, we know its good, but its sadly just out of contention of Chaos Shield/Rail/Poseidon Sword because of the massive top-end those builds get
Also congrats!!
I knew you'd cruush 32 heat on styg soon enough
turbid needle
...Nemesis had the WR on 32 Heat last patch.
turbid needle
Not untrue.
fallow niche
Artemis cast was only so fast because you never had to pull the casts out of enemies, they just died outright most of the time
ripe parrot
I love Nemesis aspect
turbid needle
Correct.
And in 32 Heat, enemies are more likely to live hits, meaning you need to regrab them, not to even mention the True/Dual Shot/Fully Loaded nerf this patch.
fallow niche
The nerf was huge
Probably way too much
And I hate nerfs like that
Like why make some boons exceptions out of the lot instead of just nerfing the actual stats of what is given
Or nerfing Poseidon Sword's statline itself
Because that's really what they were after
Reminded me of the weird band-aid to Merciful End last update
turbid needle
They still haven't technically fixed Merciful End, what makes it OP is the instant Doom detonation, not the bonus damage.
Should probably nerf Poseidon, though, you're right.
fallow niche
Ehh the bonus damage had a real impact as well, but the actual lynchpin of the build was Explosive Return and that never got touched until just now
turbid needle
Every other Aspect boost in the game requires additional player work to make it activate.
turbid needle
Eris makes you step in the bomb, Talos has you use Special and grab something.
turbid needle
Heart Rend requires you apply Weak.
fallow niche
Oh wait you're talking about Poseidon's thing
turbid needle
I amended my original line to be specifically about Aspects.
fallow niche
And applying weak is just attacking... like with doom
Like thats it
Most boons are passive
turbid needle
It's still a multi-step process, even if it's two steps.
But we're getting beside the point.
turbid needle
Poseidon should be weaker because it's an innate boost that requires nothing more than pressing Cast.
fallow niche
Well, that's not the right way to think about it
"it must be bad because it requires less effort" should be "it must require more effort to be good"
But that requires a mechanical change rather than a strict numbers one
fallow niche
Why though?
And its already not good enough anymore
Like the bizarre arty nerf killed it
fallow niche
I mean so is every other weapon in the game
Except zag aspect sword
That one is just straight garbo
covert tide
I haven’t done 32 heat (just 26) but my fastest time is still just over 21 minutes with Poseidon sword
turbid needle
It's Stygius with a movement upgrade, it's not like naked Varatha.
versed ibex
exploding chariots in Erebus with fists feels bad :(
fallow niche
Movement speed doesn't do much really
covert tide
Though as I get used to the fists I’ll almost certainly beat that
turbid needle
Dash distance does.
fallow niche
Not really
Its a mild survivability boost at best
Nothing scales off of dash distance for damage
turbid needle
No, but eating that many fewer of Hades's spin attacks can be the difference between victory and defeat.
turbid needle
No.
turbid needle
No, I don't wanna play 32 Heat anymore.
turbid needle
Maybe if Malphon gets some sick upgrades in the future.
fallow niche
Was the worst aspect by far
turbid needle
You're better than me.
opal bay
me even thinking anything above 12 heat
fallow niche
Even if its supposedly more survivable than Nemesis, it just does not offer nearly enough to make up for the DPS decrease. Killing bosses faster makes them deal less damage too.
Less time to deal damage to you
turbid needle
Yes.
opal bay
But really. Who uses Zag aspects outside of just mending with them.
fallow niche
Anyway, people like the dash distance, just give it something else to be good
Maybe dash attack damage
Or a boost of damage after the dash for the next attack
Something
earnest ravine
I like the Zag sword and fists, and the bow is SPICY if you go for an artemis build
fallow niche
Zag fists are very good
15% attack speed is just straight DPS and the dodge is EHP, very very solid
turbid needle
I love Zag Fists and Bow.
Zag lightning and poison fists are devastating, Artemis with Long and Concentrated Knuckle gets pretty kooky, too.
untold blaze
Honestly one of my favorite bow upgrades.
Though I usually pair it with the drunk special or chill special.
Chill of course because of the chillsplosion you can create.
mint vortex
Is Benefits Package supposed to change all enemies to elites or is that some sort of unlisted effect of using high heat? I just started a 32 heat run and every single chamber except the first one you land in upon leaving the House had elite enemies. Not really sure how you're supposed to deal with uber elites right as the run starts before you even get any boons.
crystal bobcat
Quick question for just starting. Anyone know what would be considered good starter boons for each weapon?
covert tide
Weak and deflect will help a lot while you’re figuring things out
versed ibex
Athena dash is great
covert tide
So Athena and Aphrodite
crystal bobcat
I'm on Heat 2 with fists and Exagryph. I just feel that the Zeus start I go with Exagryph might not be the best?
versed ibex
I'm really feeling the tweaked rng :/ got all the way to Elysium without an attack boon, and building synergies is a lot harder
crystal bobcat
Spear I'm also looking for what would be its best boon since I mostly just hope I start with a Daedalus Hammer for the run.
covert tide
Exagryph with chain lightning on attack is fine because it’s fast, same with fists
Especially if you get more lightning synergy boons
Honestly I can’t tell you anything about the spear, it’s my weakest weapon by far. A range boost is a good Daedalus to get I guess
dapper pilot
Doom can be pretty good on spear. Weak is always a good boon in general.
Artemis crit on heavy hitting, single hit attacks is always good
crystal bobcat
Bow's probably my weakest since I haven't even cleared Elysium with it. :V
Then after that would be a mix between Aegis and Sword.
covert tide
Bow is hard before you get the aspects unlocked imo
The sword is my fave, but might get ousted by the fists
dapper pilot
Rip @-@
With the bow, I like to combine it with Lingering Memory (Orpheus’s trinket). Stay as far back as possible and snipe from a distance. There are a lot of hammer upgrades that have synergy with staying tf back
If you like bow aspects, Aspect of Chiron is paired well with a stacking debuff like Hangover or Demeter’s Chill on your Special. Just had a good run with that, alongside the hammer upgrade that adds four arrows to the special
Get someone with your regular attack, then spam the homing arrows like no tomorrow
Otherwise when it comes to the bow I think it comes down to mastering the power shot timing, plus positioning so that the arrow pierces through several enemies
sacred idol
RIP easy Winter's Harvest
dapper pilot
Yeah it’s not the best. I do like knockback on the arrows so I can keep a wide swath of enemies from getting in my face tho
sacred idol
👀 that Quake Cutter buff though
versed ibex
does anybody know: if you somehow ended up not getting the gods boon from the trinket, will they show up in the next biome?
idk if I missed the door or what but I never saw Aphrodite despite carrying the rose :(
rancid shore
it should still try to make the god spawn if you never picked one of their boons up (but someone correct me if i'm wrong)
covert tide
I think it will show up again in the next biome
versed ibex
ty
mild crag
It doesn't show them to you more during the same biome at least
But next biome sounds about right
dapper pilot
If there’s a little one underneath the trinket, it means it hasn’t proc’d yet. I don’t know if the number goes away even if you didn’t take the path it summoned, though.
stable fossil
I'm streaming Hades right now
analog lodge
This was a rather fun build to play, turns out rail can stack doom really fast, and 5 rockets point blank with Aphrodite is a lot of damage
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2026891447
meager verge
Can I ask a quick question ? At what point do we unlock weapon aspects ?
harsh flower
Is Forced Overtime broken for getting more bounties with Heat?
turbid needle
How do you mean?
harsh flower
Whenever I meet the heat requirement with forced overtime, Zagreus mentions that he won't get any bounties from the extra heat
tidal thorn
You sure you're not over the heat? It won't give you extra bounties but you'll still get them for the lowest unbeaten heat.
harsh flower
I think I'm meeting it exactly
worn bobcat
I rly don't like bow, i reach elysium with it, but idk if it's my rng or the fact that i don't have aspect i got like only 4 titan blood), but feel very strange. The only moded weapon i got is my gun (witch i like a lot)
still trying yo beat last boss
turbid needle
Try Zagreus Aspect Coronacht with Artemis's Attack and Dash boons.
harsh flower
Bow definitely feels the clunkiest to use (used to be spear but recently it's been better)
turbid needle
Spam the bejeebus out of your Dash attack.
I think the bow comes to me more naturally than any other weapon.
Power Shots are the easiest thing in the world to me, it makes Coronacht fun.
worn bobcat
Don't understand what u mean about Coronacht (english pretty bad)
it's one of the aspect right?
i usually play the gun, with the dmg boost when taking mortar explosion
covert tide
Coronacht is the name of the bow
covert tide
No worries!
worn bobcat
the fists are pretty strange, but i guess playing only the gun for a while make me bad with melee weapon aha
covert tide
I’m used to the sword and really enjoying the fists haha
worn bobcat
the fishroad mech is pretty fun lol
formal basin
I've kinda got a problem with fist special. There's no hitstun. With the sword, if I hit something with special and it's still in range, I get a follow up as long as they don't have armor. I don't think that's the case with the fists. Either that or the first attack is missing because range on fists is pretty awful.
tidal thorn
Yeah there is no stun on fist special.
pine spindle
What are the new requirements for Demeter and Artemis' ults? Does anyone know yet?
turbid needle
Pause menu, Controls.
fiery silo
I couldn't find that. Are the input locked on controllers?
turbid needle
No.
fiery silo
So I should be able to change my Special from Y to B (Xbox One controller)
turbid needle
Yes.
fiery silo
Strange, I couldn't do. When I was in that menu.
Last thing.
If a combination of input, most added effect from the hammer of Daedalus, are dash + attack or dash + special. Am I correct?
Is there any dash + cast or cast + special / attack or attack +special combinations?
turbid needle
I'm afraid I don't understand the question.
fiery silo
My bad. Some actions require a combination of inputs such dash + attack or dash + special.
unkempt pagoda
all weapons have an dash + attack (Dash-Strike), fists are unique in that they also have a dash + special (Dash-Upper)
there's no other combos to my knowledge
fiery silo
I wanted to know if there are other combinations such as dash + special / dash + attack / dash + cast
Oh ok
Thank very much @turbid needle and @unkempt pagoda for your clarifications
unkempt pagoda
you can dash then cast in quick succession, but there's no special thing that happens
👍
fiery silo
And I just realise I can't trick the input with Malphon Grand Upper
Usually I press simultaneously attack / dash and the result is good
But for Malphon Grand Upper, it seems it is really Dash > Special...
turbid needle
Rare Crop'd Heartbreak Strike in Tartarus! 
fiery silo
@turbid needle Oh yeah I got that last night myself. It is crazy to see your boon becoming legendary when you reach Styx
turbid needle
Legendaries are unique, I think you mean Heroic.
fiery silo
Must be Heroic then
But even my Poseidon cast was boosted max
I got the rare crop in Epic, If I am not mistaken, 4 boons were affected
vague hearth
So I had a fun time galavanting through the underworld with an RPG
Eris aspect works wonderfully with the rocket special
turbid needle
It does.
tidal thorn
Yeah, I got that and Triple Bomb a few runs ago. So much fun.
vague hearth
Can you get the rocket and the triple chamber or are they mutually exclusive?
Ok you can
Good to know
turbid needle
And Cluster, Cluster Rockets are kinda braindead.
tidal thorn
Speaking of the Rail, can you not get Hera and Piercing Fire anymore?
turbid needle
Hestia and Piercing Fire? You should be able to.
vague hearth
And then the ares boost when you kill enemies
vague hearth
I think eris may have won out over zagreus aspect for my favourite rail version
Because
turbid needle
Aaand Heroic going into the Hydra fight.
vague hearth
Spread fire and dash attack boosts have resulted in my fastest final boss fight yet
Same with the 3rd bosses
turbid needle
I haven't seen the new Spread Fire yet, but I loved it with Artemis before it was changed.
unkempt pagoda
new spread fire is still great
vague hearth
No more poseidon attack turning me into a literal wave
Which used to result in the spiciest wall slam damage I've ever seen
Spread fire with artemis dash and more dashes is still insane tho
twin mural
is there any way to guarantee a daedalus hammer as your first item in a run?
unkempt pagoda
not unless you have a specific seed mapped out
which is more of a speedrunner thing
turbid needle
It's not that good.
If you can get a rhythm going just mixing in dash attacks, never using the fifth hit of the combo gets almost the same effect.
Or maybe it's an even better effect because the Dash Attack hits so much harder.
night path
idk
for some reason the knuckle hammer doesnt continue after the 5th hit of the combo
im not sure if dash attacking allows you to continue you it
dense star
I've really liked Rolling Knuckle with Demeter fist aspect since the increased hitbox size gets 12 hits faster for the special procs
unkempt pagoda
you mean concentrated knuckle? i think that's intended
dense star
Easier to hit 2+ enemies with one jab series
unkempt pagoda
like, on concentrated fire with rail it's only +1 damage but you have more shots
here you have a 5 hit combo, but it's +5 damage
night path
oh i misread that
dense star
Does rolling knuckle (the one that adds a 6th hit to your jab series) let concentrated knuckle continue past the base 5 hit combo?
night path
i think so
if you break the combo at any point the damage resets
but if it continues it, it should give an extra 5
(I thought you meant rolling as in rolling upgrades/boons on it)
dense star
Cool, though that does involve standing still
unkempt pagoda
you can still dash attack so
dense star
Admittedly I don't really know the fists hammer upgrade names atm
night path
if you're running zag fist + hermes attack you'll attack quick
naive tusk
Hm... I actually had both hammer upgrades (Rolling + Concentrated Knuckle) but my damage numbers weren’t increasing despite the continued combos
So I’d say Concentrated Knuckle stops the +5 damage increase after the final hit from a single chain-attack
dense locust
Does zag fist increase attack speed now?
I remember using it and could not see the difference
turbid needle
Always has.
dense locust
And that is true peach
naive tusk
Zagreus Aspect on Malphon? Always had that
dense locust
I cannot for the life of me tell the difference, and someone did a timing test to see if you killed skelly faster and the difference was negligible
but that was when it first came out
calm ember
I can not for the life of me figure out how to trigger the events for reuniting Orpheus and Eurydice. They are both at the Keyhole/Heart in the codex entry and I have admin chamber unlocked but I can't give either of them Ambrosia or trigger whatever quest necessary. What am I missing? I've been messing with this off and on for days. I normally can figure this stuff out.
Losing my mind on this one. Any assistance would be appreciated.
OMG as soon as I asked the question. I get a conversation with Nyx that triggered it. Wow. Nyx of all people? Sheesh!
dapper pilot
She would know where orpheus’s contract is, seeing as Zag’s hopeless with the filing system and Hades couldn’t care less
covert tide
I think you need to talk to some other NPCs
Oh you got it
I should finish reading before replying huh
Nyx is reading your chat logs
dapper pilot
Praise mother night, dark and all seeing \o/
quiet gazelle
So what’s more dependable on higher heat? Meaning 20ish heat. Bow or rail? I’ve done runs on rail but can’t for the life of me seem to pass asphodel with it.
turbid needle
Rail.
calm ember
lol
clear dome
mitts
calm ember
I am having a similar problem with Varatha. I cannot for the life of me get all the way through with that damn spear.
I pick of Stygian Blade in almost any aspect and go all the way to the end. I have never been able to finish with the spear though. Why do I have to suck so much at the games I love the most. 
clear dome
use the green dragon crescent blade form
dense locust
@calm ember There is a running joke here as far as i'm concerned that if you complain about the thing that won't trigger on this discord server, it will happen almost immediately after
Because of how often it seems to happen to people
frosty pier
@dense locust wasn't working for me then I had to search for Sisyphus for like 2 major updates
dense locust
did you try complaining about it here first?
frosty pier
yes
calm ember
well....I wouldn't call it complaining but I was asking for some guidance or helpful point in the right direction...but that is funny how the very minute I brought it up after a run the next load into the House I figured it out on my own.
naive tusk
Don’t mind Dong
gloomy vine
Complaining about stuff here makes stuff happen? Hmm 🤔
God, why is this event where free pizza gets delivered to me for breakfast never triggering? I been waiting for that for years
and now we wait...
civic barn
wait long enough...
dense locust
Complaining is the wrong word
I've just seen around 6-7 people have the same experience of asking about if they can do something to make an event happen and then it happens the next run
@gloomy vine I think you meant to post that in https://www.reddit.com/r/Random_Acts_Of_Pizza/
rocky sage
how do u feel about the balance of guan yu?
dense locust
Its strong once upgraded
I think its easily the best spear aspect, but i don't like the others except for zag
lament coral
same
rocky sage
the arthur upgrade work like u take less damage while in the sphere ? or anything thats in the sphere does less damage
didnt really catch that
lament coral
you take less damage while inside and enemies move and attack slower
projectiles are also slowed
rocky sage
with the daedelus right upper upgrade
full swift
Hey just wondering where I can talk about some specific boss attacks and such
wouldn't want to spoil for newer people
lament coral
here
kind cloud
gameplay channel is a spoiler included zone so you came to the right place.
kind cloud
lulz
full swift
Like he'll make a 180 degree turn on the spot
kind cloud
because SgG is trolling.
lament coral
welcome to the arena, champion
kind cloud
A lot of people have complained about that attack
full swift
I've mastered every attack in the fight
but I still can not consistently dodge the charge
kind cloud
I find that the best way to shake him is to use a pillar as a blockade and then rotate around pillar
lament coral
dash through the pillar while he's close, he'll turn and hit the pillar
kind cloud
yay what @lament coral said
lament coral
he can follow and catch up with you if you try to circle
full swift
Yea that is my usual strat, though sometimes that still ends up getting you hit
kind cloud
it helps to have athena deflect especially with ruthless reflex
obtuse cipher
I have more problems with his ||spin attack|| (pact of punishment)
kind cloud
oh when he's armored up?
obtuse cipher
yeah
kind cloud
i just dash around in clockwise or counterclockwise on the outskirt of the arena
obtuse cipher
I usually get so caught up in the fight that I don't notice when it's about to start and lose half of my life
full swift
well the attack is doable if you're not melee
lament coral
keep your distance and don't get suck on terrain or walls
full swift
and if you stand by a wall you can block it entirely if you're using the shield
lament coral
that's when he gets you most of the time
lament coral
shoot casts at him
full swift
dash around and cast
kind cloud
i deleted my post since it got caught up in the surge of post and i'm reposting it here...
i just had a pretty awesome build with malphon-talos aspect:
- demeter chill attack
- zeus special with jolted and high voltage
- demeter/zeus cold fusion duo
- poseidon dash with razor shoals, typhon's fury, and breaking wave
- zeus/poseidon sea storm duo
- ruthless dash with hermes +2 dash
And I nearly lost to Hades because I kept taking huge amount of damage at around 10 heat (max FO, calisthenics max, 40+ damage)
I had the hammer 2% health recovery for every special kill but my combo of attacks were so powerful that I was wiping most things out. And before I could use special, either razor shoals or sea storm would finish the enemy.
After this fight, I realized that it's dumb to do close-quartes combat against hades because he'll spam you and/or hit you with his projectile and then spam his spin attack which does double damage. So without athena's deflect (which is the best defensive ability imo), I'll take lots of damage. I kept trying to inflict demeter's chill. Looks like that was dumb. Maybe I should have just kept relying on dash + special from a distance to attack hades and given up on chill. I made the mistake of attacking hades the way I used my weaponized build in styx and end of elysium. i used that style because i destroyed theseus and minotaur in about 30 seconds.
Anyone have any suggestions on how to use talos (non-cast style) and fists in general?
I remember someone suggeting demeter aspect with something but can't remember what.
If you do, just use the discord tag to make sure I see your post. Or DM me too.
lament coral
just use Athena attack
full swift
Any on hit thing is amazing with the fists
lament coral
I found that you don't actually want Dem Burst
you want those 10 stacks to stay on, forever
kind cloud
Yeah, i had my most success with athena on attack. It negates so much incoming damage especially on fist. But I'm trying to branch out into non-athena builds. (She's awesome. I'm a huge fan of her deflect ability.)
turbid needle
I've found Aphrodite/Dio/Demeter/Athema to be good starter gods for the fists
full swift
isn't the burst required for the dem legendary?
rocky sage
talos is actually quite fun with Poseidon special cuz u can yoyo enemies
turbid needle
Zeus ain't bad either
lament coral
you can look up the requirements in the wiki
full swift
the dem legendary is amazing for bossfights
turbid needle
If anything, Demeter in general excels at bosses
kind cloud
@rocky sage Yes! But it requires getting some things along the way like razor shoals and typhoon's fury. getting poseidon late in the run is annoying.
lament coral
Talos' pull doesn't stun enemies, they can hit you immediately after being pulled and before you uppercut em
very noticeable against exalted and big rats
rocky sage
also be careful with bomb units and tiny chariots as you will be magneting your own demise
kind cloud
@lament coral yeah, i noticed it this past run. the sword guys in elysium were able to get 10-16 point hits on me as i pulled them.
@rocky sage Hence, athena's deflect on special is so useful for those annoying things. But yeah...most times i don't have athena on special. I'm trying other things.
lament coral
I found Dem fist to be easier than Talos, even without the kick hammer
Athena attack, Arty special, Demeter dash
ez win
rocky sage
but i think the demeter is more upgrade dependent
kind cloud
Ah, that's right. Someone suggested the kick hammer for demeter aspect. I had forgotten that one.
turbid needle
It's nuts
rocky sage
what perks do u take in the start of the run ?
turbid needle
Even post-nerf
full swift
getting crit on your special with the demeter aspect
lament coral
do you mean talents?
kind cloud
Is the kick hammer for demeter aspect as effective as exploding return on shield?
full swift
butterfly is amazing for any weapon except the fists imo
lament coral
@kind cloud lol no, explo is garbo compared to the kick
rocky sage
and im starting to like the chaos one
turbid needle
Kick hammer is DEF better than explosive return lol
kind cloud
@lament coral damn, really?
lament coral
kick is in the same category as World Splitter
rocky sage
whats kick hammer?
kind cloud
which one is world splitter?
lament coral
40 base damage special and you home in on enemies
full swift
the kick upgrade you get from a daedalus hammer
lament coral
sword hammer, 90 base damage attack
turbid needle
The Asterius special
kind cloud
oh, i kinda don't like world splitter
lament coral
it takes some getting used to
lament coral
kick is definitely easier
kind cloud
but i'll have to give kick hammer a try.
civic barn
i feel like it's still a bit too slow to be worth it
lament coral
it's still busted even after the nerf
kind cloud
what was it before the nerf?
civic barn
i'd rather have a lot more tinier crits for the sword
kind cloud
did damage get reduced?
turbid needle
50 base damage for kick
lament coral
50 damage, slightly faster
turbid needle
They reduced the speed as well ?
kind cloud
what is it now?
turbid needle
Didn't notice it
rocky sage
wait what weapon is the kick hammer for
civic barn
it's still pretty fast
lament coral
it's barely perceptible
civic barn
malphon has the rush kick hammer
full swift
@rocky sage the fists
kind cloud
so it was 50 base damage? what is it now?
lament coral
40
turbid needle
40
turbid needle
Not like that was why you picked the upgrade for anyways
kind cloud
exploding shield got a similar small nerf too. dropped from 60 to 50
turbid needle
... really LOL
rocky sage
does anyone like the chaos shield ?
kind cloud
so it's main advantage is homing ability?
rocky sage
i cant get used to it
lament coral
everyone likes Chaos shield
turbid needle
Yeah, kinda like a super dash
full swift
zeus shield is the only thing I run
civic barn
the homing is super useful
lament coral
because it's the best shield aspect
kind cloud
@rocky sage everyone loves chaos shield. best weapon in the game imo
turbid needle
^ Objectively for high heat runs, really
kind cloud
yep
lament coral
easy to use at any heat
rocky sage
i seem to not like bull rushing
full swift
Wasn't the chaos aspect just more shields in your special after a bull rush
lament coral
doesn't depend on hammers
turbid needle
Yup
kind cloud
Yeah, but most useful for high heat since it blocks so much incoming damage.
turbid needle
Also those extra shields are nice for Ares/Dio special
lament coral
yeah, I don't like Zeus either
full swift
The zeus aspect feels so much smoother imo
kind cloud
@rocky sage try getting zeus special and jolted plus splitting bolt with exploding shield, one of the best builds in the game -- on chaos shield, adding higher voltage and double strike just makes it insane
turbid needle
Zeus shield is weird, but not weak per say, it's just not comparable to the other 2 aspects
full swift
Once you get used to how the shield behaves on throwing and return its really strong
rocky sage
wait so what gifts do u take in the runs ?
full swift
max rank 30 damage a tick base is already good
rocky sage
chaos ? butterfly? hermes?
lament coral
I'd rather spam Bull Rush and special than mucking about with Zeus' send and return
kind cloud
@rocky sage give me a sec.
full swift
butterfly mostly
kind cloud
i just did a 36 heat run on chaos shield
turbid needle
The Keepsake ? depends on weapon/aspects
rocky sage
on arthur ? then @turbid needle
full swift
you can stay in the bullrush stance and have the shield go out and return
its really strong
turbid needle
On arthur ? oh that one's interesting, my usual go is Athena because either on special or attack it's worth
full swift
so you just block all incoming attacks and have the shield wobble in front of you
rocky sage
@turbid needle but isnt it worth to have free chaos stuff?
idk maybe im wrong
no idea
kind cloud
i took zeus to start in tartarus
athena before asphodel (to get her dash)
cerberus pre-elysium (For that extra health)
and spearpoint before styx
turbid needle
It can be, but Chaos keepsake is unreliable because it doesn't guarantee a chaos gate to appear
rocky sage
you can make it appear however
turbid needle
also Arthur aspect gives you max hp anyways, no need for that health cost. You'd only want it for the extra rarity up
rocky sage
i mean would be nice if it woudlve helped though
imma give the athena perk arhur a shot
turbid needle
Which isn't bad, but not reliable
rocky sage
although arent the attacks a bit slow to deflect stuff?
turbid needle
Yeah Athena start for me on Arthur feels like the most consistent start
They are just fast enough and quite big to make it work
lament coral
@rocky sage you can't force a Chaos gate without FP
lament coral
you're not guaranteed to get a gate from the well
rocky sage
what do u take on chaos shield ?
lament coral
Athena/Ares, Aphro/Dio
turbid needle
^ those are good
Ares and Dio keepsake start BTW
Want to get that special rolling ASAP
lament coral
you can manage without an attack, just get the special
kind cloud
i used to take ares on special, athena on dash/attack, aphrodite on attack/dash
rocky sage
imma go some athena i feel weak cuz im afraid to do runs with more than like 3 heat
lol
turbid needle
No need to rush it, it's fine really
kind cloud
Oh, you're just learning. For some reason i assumed you were a seasoned veteran so your opinion on chaos shield struck me as odd. No worries. You'll learn.
kind cloud
yeah, still relatively new.
turbid needle
Depends on what you go for, altho from experience the God Favorite was the better pick
full swift
Is switching boons between regions worth it?
rocky sage
although i own the game from like WAY BACK
kind cloud
Some of us here have 1,000+ successful runs
full swift
I usually stay with butterfly or plume
rocky sage
thats still not much lol
kind cloud
i prefer privileged status (it used to be 50% iirc, now 40%).
rocky sage
i still dont get why athena is good on arhur
hybrid galleon
yeah its kinda just there but if you have than keepsake it might be stronk
kind cloud
besides, the status curses are super useful anyway
rocky sage
its slow
kind cloud
like aphrodite weak and dionysus poison
turbid needle
The Arthur attacks are very big
hybrid galleon
^
turbid needle
like, bigger than they show
kind cloud
adding a third like jolted from zeus is super
hybrid galleon
jolted is so meh
turbid needle
And just fast enough that you can react with the deflects
hybrid galleon
jolted is more like a filler status like athena's exposed
turbid needle
^
hybrid galleon
too niche to be actually useful
kind cloud
strongly disagree
rocky sage
depends on run imma go do an arhur athena but should i keep her all the way ??
kind cloud
because i play melee style, jolted is super useful for me
hybrid galleon
remind me what jolted do again
i remembered jolted only deals damage as soon as enemy attacks
lament coral
I've been backstabbing with fists a lot
hybrid galleon
which is VERY NOT FREQUENT
lament coral
especially with Talos
kind cloud
hit opponent with zeus attack, will apply jolted (if taken) and next attack from opponent will damage said opponent
turbid needle
When an enemy attacks, lightning strikes it and the status is expired, yeah
lament coral
hook em, punch, they retaliate, dash through, backstab, kill
kind cloud
combined with demeter's cold fusion, it's super good
hybrid galleon
yeah uh no
rocky sage
@lament coral do u like the quake cutter upgrade?
turbid needle
It's hilarious to get the Demeter/Zeus duo and affect EM 3 Theseus tho, he just kinda dies to that LOL
hybrid galleon
the moment they attacked again they probably already dead
kind cloud
yep
lament coral
@rocky sage that's the 40 damage after special?
rocky sage
yee
turbid needle
It used to be meh, but now it also scales with your boons
lament coral
no, I usually dash cancel after hooking and the explosion doesn't happen if you don't land
hybrid galleon
i do my attacks faster than the jolt does the job imo
turbid needle
Dunno about it, it's usually too slow
hybrid galleon
zeus is just uuuuuugh
turbid needle
Zeus is def a weird one
kind cloud
i will say that i'm not a good quick player so i rely a lot on jolted and second strike with higher voltage.
i've had insane build and the quickest i've been able to finish a run is 23 minutes
i'm just slow
hybrid galleon
Im in 20 minutes
lament coral
it might be an ok hammer at lower heat and without Forced Overtime, but it's unfeasible to wait until you land the higher you go
hybrid galleon
YUHHH
turbid needle
23 is actually alright as far as speed goes
kind cloud
doesn't matter if i'm playing in 0 heat or 30+ heat, i can't go faster than 23 minutes
lament coral
since you don't get any i-frames
rocky sage
imma go do an arhur athena but should i keep her all the way ?? answer plz?
hybrid galleon
yeah 23 is fast
kind cloud
wut
lament coral
keep what?
rocky sage
the athena trinket
hybrid galleon
No
turbid needle
My fastest is like sub 17 minutes on the fists and that was to clear the Heat 0 bounty LOL
lament coral
why would you?
kind cloud
most people here are doing 15-18 minutes
rocky sage
idk u tell me im not good at this game
lament coral
you take the god trinket to guarantee that god's boon, that's it
turbid needle
^ no refresh
hybrid galleon
^
turbid needle
between regions
kind cloud
i've tried to get to 18 - eighteen! - on 0 heat and ended up doing it in 25 minutes.
took like no damage until hades but still...
hybrid galleon
Try to turn on the speed timer heat
kind cloud
i did
hybrid galleon
did you use 9 mins or 7 mins
kind cloud
7 minutes
hybrid galleon
nice
rocky sage
hows the backstab trinket?/
kind cloud
but on higher heat, timer kills me elysium
hybrid galleon
@kind cloud elysium is always the one that took a lot of time
lament coral
I personally didn't like it
hybrid galleon
because greatshield and theseus exist
kind cloud
Yeah, that's my bottleneck in the game
hybrid galleon
both of them slows down the game