||it's really not, I die to Hades at the end||
#h1-builds-and-combat
turbid needle
turbid needle
Gonna keep fishing for Chaos Lunge and Hunter Dash together.
heady zephyr
oh man, benefits package gets pretty serious in styx
sullen valley
Aspect of Chaos is always fun, ya?
quaint stream
Definitely
spare quarry
- chaos on special
sullen valley
Hm, Chaos Special with Artemis would sound pretty effective...
...but Chaos Special with Poseidon sounds funnn
quaint stream
Tried them both
Artemis is big burst damage
Poseidon just really fun
But in small areas and asphodel it can be really good
unique plinth
how many ranks does stubborn defiance have, and do they translate to more life or more charges?
unique plinth
oof
so by taking it I commit to going into the final boss with only one death defy
tidal thorn
https://i.imgur.com/iiLc1dI.jpg
Who needs dodging when you can have BEEF
scarlet kindle
its in theory really nice for regular rooms but i almost never lose death defiances to anything other than Hades
although i havent even gotten to 16 heat yet so take what i say with a grain of salt
unique plinth
I just came back to the game yesterday and started a fresh save
turbid needle
I've been having trouble with Hades since switching to Stubborn Defiance.
I agree it's nice for regular rooms but I'm not sure how you're supposed to deal with Hades.
spare quarry
play ranged to kite basically
unique plinth
yeah I think being limited to one defy per boss is enough of a handicap that it doesn't need to be only 30 life restored max
opal bay
Mean it's possible to beat Hades without losing one DD, but really the stubborn defiance need a change a bit.
unique plinth
I got to him for the first time tonight and got my ass beat
unique plinth
that spear spin hurts
opal bay
I think if it had second rank that would have been enough BUT if we think about it then it makes the other mirror upgrade useless, considering if you get skelly you pretty much have all the DD needed to beat him
Spin attack is very dangerous. Honestly Hydra head bash, Asterius spin and Hades spin are pretty much can be run enders.
dense locust
you've been having trouble because stubborn defiance is bad
I did see someone post a boon from chaos that gave a charge of stubborn defiance even though they had the regular death defiance
now thats op
although i guess it would be added to the end
wait no
spare quarry
but does death take the stubborn or regular charge first is the question
dense locust
they are added to the front
pretty sure the extra dd is added to the front of the stack
so i'd assume the same for stubborn
dense locust
Having a rechargeable life on top of 3 lives
tidal thorn
Does Chaos count to the damage buff per Gods?
dense locust
can you be more specific
sullen valley
The game calls it a boon, so I would say yes.
tidal thorn
k
sullen valley
He's talking about that Mirror skill that gives you more damage per the amount of boons you have
tidal thorn
That's what I was thinking, might as well ask.
dense locust
oh
heady zephyr
just lost all 3 DDS to an aphro trial in asphodel with nothing but extra enemies on, geez
that homing arrow is rough
dense locust
Well this question was asked last night and they decided it did not count towards it because he's not an olympian
sullen valley
You know what would be rough?
tidal thorn
Aw.
sullen valley
Aphrodite Trial + Jury Summons + Chaos's +more enemies curse
tidal thorn
I never thought Hermes didnt.
heady zephyr
jury summons, that's the one i'm thinking of
tidal thorn
Because, now that you saw that, he is an Olympian.
heady zephyr
plus i was using fiery dash and fists, so verrry difficult to dodge all that
dense locust
yeah that was the consensus, but it was all just based on intuition
sullen valley
The Rainbow
That would HAVE to be some rare achieve in the future.
although nigh impossible, still worth trying
tidal thorn
I dont think its actually possible.
tidal thorn
Youre locked into certain gods after a point in the run.
dense locust
and then restart and force the boons that don't show up at each junction
but i think you'd get maybe 6-7 max
dense locust
is it 4 without keepsakes?
tidal thorn
Yeah, 4 is the usual number. 5 sometimes.
spare quarry
i always use keepsakes so idk about a non-keepsake run
sullen valley
I honestly wish there was some kind of keepsake or something that prevented that lock-in. For the sake of more randomness and variety
frosty pier
Family favourite?
dense locust
yeah that one
sullen valley
boo
lean sluice
finally got Defiance boon from Chaos after 70 ish hours
aaaaaaaaaand my game hard crashed near the end of the run
so thats gone now
sullen valley
Nice.
lean sluice
absolutely incredible
halcyon cedar
waht boon good pairing with telos fist
lean sluice
same stuff thats good with the rail
super fast attack for on-hit effects
chain lightning/hangover
halcyon cedar
talos fist, the one with improve cast damage
lean sluice
oh
forgot what the name was
isn't that the one that yanks them in
same thing really, it just helps isolate enemies in melee
the increased damage is nice but its not THAT important
halcyon cedar
because sword version of improve casting bonus is posidon sword, basically u focus on cast boon (artermis) can kill most foe instantly if goes well
3 cast can kill 1 hydra head, but the fist have lesser bonus and no skill to make cast bullet drop besides kill them
sword's special can make foe drop without killing them (especially boss)
tidal thorn
If youre current bounties are for Heat 6 and you run Heat 7, will you get Heat 6 or 7 bounties?
dense locust
no
tidal thorn
your*
dense locust
i don't think you get either, unless they changed it
rancid shore
you get the lowest level bounties available
dense locust
oh okay
rancid shore
if you ran 32 heat but only had 2 heat unlocked, you would only get the bounties for 2 heat.
tidal thorn
And it just goes up one at a time from there. k
rancid shore
yup yup
tidal thorn
ty
dense locust
up to a point
tidal thorn
Yeah
halcyon cedar
i play 5 heats, i can play 5 heats , 5 time to collect all bounty
after collect, i still can play 5 heats but no rewards given (replace with darkness)
rancid shore
yee that's right
high crow
does hazard bomb actually deal self-damage?
rancid shore
yes
high crow
oof
high crow
horrible with butterfly
rancid shore
the wiki says 1%
tidal thorn
LOL
dense locust
just don't get hit lol
tidal thorn
Yeah prob.
dense locust
oh maybe it is 1
It's not the worst thing to get hit by it
but it does kinda nullify eris
rancid shore
can't you iframe it for eris?
dense locust
yeah
high crow
how does it work?
halcyon cedar
oh deal 1% hp
halcyon cedar
i still prefer rocket bomb tho, faster
keen carbon
can someone give me some tips? 24 runs in and still haven't beaten hades
dense locust
might iframe your own special only to dash right into the enmy
yeah rocket bomb is my top pick for rail
you use mouse and keyboard or controller?
keen carbon
controller
halcyon cedar
@keen carbon git gud? use shield? XD
keen carbon
I feel like i usually don't do nearly enough damage to have a shot at hades
dense locust
which weapons do you have unlocked
rancid shore
do you die on hades or usually somewhere else?
halcyon cedar
i use controller too
halcyon cedar
i use more on chaos aspect shield, always toss my specials for long range with maxed doom (ares) boon to infect all foes like COVID lul
keen carbon
got all the keepsakes unlocked, some upgraded
dense locust
prioritize the hammers and hades when they appear
rancid shore
Also take the patroclus keepsake (broken spearpoint) for the last area
keen carbon
normal shield with doom was probably the furthest i got
dense locust
broken spear point for elysium and styx is good
rancid shore
yee
dense locust
Top priority hermes boon is dashes
keen carbon
so get some boons i like with keepsakes in first and second, then switch to spearpoint?
dense locust
How upgraded is your mirror?
keen carbon
I need to unlock the new set of talents still
rancid shore
i usually do like purse > god > god > spearpoint
or god > purse > god > spearpoint
keen carbon
and I only have the old (purple?) talents upgraded
rancid shore
you'll want to go for 3 asap. It's really reassuring to have it
dense locust
3 is definitely a big upgrade
keen carbon
yeah i'm saving up for the third
dense locust
but you can do it on 2
try rail with zeus keepsake for the first biome
and pray for zeus attack
it'll carry you pretty far
keen carbon
I'll try :D, thanks for the tips
dense locust
then if you get the option for rocket bomb, take it
keen carbon
oh, how much should I prioritize chaos?
dense locust
depends
keen carbon
i'm always kinda scared to go for it
dense locust
its pretty high priority
unless you're really low on health or the other options are hermes or hammer and you really need a big boost
rancid shore
it's not so bad to take, but it's also fine to skip it if you're spooked with your health
dense locust
also, prioritize hearts over gold almost all of the time
unless you have something that increases gold
sacred idol
rancid shore
hammer priority is also different for different weapons/aspects
dense locust
even then, there are only so many things available to buy
rancid shore
hammer on poseidon aspect? not as good as a hammer for the rail
halcyon cedar
my favourite run set: chaos shield
first zone, equip ares keepsake, aim for doom special, toss your specials like COVID lul , max the doom (curse damage)
2nd zone, equip athena keepsake, aim for dash deflect fo survival skill, if can, get extra one for EXPOSED status curse for DUO status CURSE for extra damage.
3rd zone, equip ??? keepsake , i maybe aim for the naked goddess with love one, forget her name, get the charm CALL for stunning boss later, especially HADES laser PEW PEW PEW (or use shield block it)
4th / last zone : equip skull earings , less HP deal more damage. or others would help you in battle, no more god keepsake.
HP maybe i normally boost to 200hp then focus on money or others.
dense locust
Also make sure you've got dash attacks down
they aren't difficult but I've seen people here not quite understanding how they work
keen carbon
yeah i noticed they can be a bit weird, got the dash attack hammer on sword yesterday, and for i while i didn't seem to be able to pull it off
halcyon cedar
watch "hades speedrun" would help lul ( just to get gimps of what boon is nice what is not so nice)
dense locust
They aren't necessary but its basically free damage over the alternative of just dashing, at least with the rail
also go for athena call or dash, or poseidon call
if you can
and if its athenas call, level it up a bit
if you have the option
keen carbon
cool, gonna dive in asap when i get home haha
dense locust
Just keep at it and try and make it a point to practice one thing per run
halcyon cedar
at least all skill level 2 for more boost
dense locust
Feel free to ask about which boon to take here
keen carbon
will do ^^
halcyon cedar
read wiki more XD some boon will trigger to show up depends which one you take
keen carbon
what would be a good god to mix with zeus? on rail?
dense locust
I will say that I played quite a lot before looking at how boons worked, or the mechanics in general
And I feel like it helped in going with the flow of the boons and hammers instead of forcing a build
but if you're having trouble, it wouldn't hurt to learn a bit about what you need to get duos/legendaries
keen carbon
yeah i've abstained so far, trying to go with my gut on the boons
but i usually end up with very low damage builds
dense locust
But definitely take a look at some point
If you
are avoiding chaos, stop
try everything out
Lol 6 mitten runs and i've yet to see quake
keen carbon
will do 🙂
dense locust
Chaos can give you +75ish health, +90% special damage, an extra cast, even an extra death defiance if you already have a chaos boon
and sometimes the temporary punishment doesn't even matter
not to mention the dialogue and plot
keen carbon
true haha, next chaos i'm diving in
halcyon cedar
boon i think catergorize for 2 types, one is no raw damage increase, but after effect strong like zeus , and the grape god
another one is increase raw damage input like athenna, artemis, demeter ....
think of like this, railgun damage is only 10, how many % u increase, even u increase 50%, it is only 15 damage XD (other melee weapon have stronger effect)
back to railgun, zeus early strong because his zap damage actually exceed your railgun bullet but later 2nd stage onwards will feel slugger , only if you take his JOLTED curse which is dealt more damage and mix with others boon like doom etc.... (remember mirror of night also increase damage for duo curse)
keen carbon
yeah i got that upgrade and have always been trying to get 2 status effects going since
dense locust
Its nice to get an extra boost to damage, but it's not crucial to beating hades
frosty pier
Get zeus, get his legendary, profit.
halcyon cedar
zeus boon i feel need take a lot to get benifits because his zap does not really deal a lot damage except revenge one
dense locust
zeus attack carries you far but getting rocket bomb and artemis or aphrodite special will give you big damage
for the rail
keen carbon
for me it feels like an endurance fight so far, which i haven't been able to make work :p
halcyon cedar
if you get revenge one , his duo boon is nice, trigger revenge damage without take damage
dense locust
demeter attack is also real nice
demeter attack with explosive shot
makes everything move like molasses
keen carbon
cool, thx for all the tips
😄
i got the tripple special with demeter special o nrail once and that felt amazing tbh
dense locust
My 32 heat was triple bomb, rocket bomb, and artemis special, among a lot of other crap but that was the core damage
frosty pier
Triple special rail is really one of the best hammers
keen carbon
that sounds insane haha
dense locust
athena special does a surprising amount of damage but also has great utility
halcyon cedar
right now my specifics formula for run is err:
- sword - posidon - always cast damage and artemis boon
- shield - chaos shield for doom
- railgun - zeus for zaps or doom or demeter depends...
- bow - always crit
- spear - posidon throw
keen carbon
doom feels like a bit of a weird one to me
didn't feel good until i got the aphrodite ares duo
dense locust
i view it as a status for privileged and a secondary damage source
Chain shot with the bow and epic ares attack was amazing
you can shoot through walls and keep applying doom pretty safely
to multiple targets
halcyon cedar
doom need get more pom to feel stronger or his extra doom damage, or else not really strong, it cannot stack within 1 seconds before the curse damage apply to FOE
dense locust
yeah most flat damage abilities benefit a lot from levels like doom or casts
halcyon cedar
the chaos shield run with doom damage need up to 200 damage to feel strong and bounce everywhere lol
dash, i like posidon because wide range to damage creep ( if get rupture curse, better)
or defensive dash is athena reflect dash
rest of that i feel not worth
ares dash or doom, i'd choose doom over dash
dense locust
I've noticed that the rarity of chaos boon that grants an extra cast is completely worthless
halcyon cedar
^ not really if u focus on cast damage
dense locust
I mean the boons that chaos grant you
you get one cast if you complete the required nerf
spare quarry
i avoid building around artemis for the most mart
halcyon cedar
yeah not really, chaos punishment and reward both are randomized
dense locust
no matter the rarity
whereas things like increased max health or damage is scaled
an epic chaos boon that grants special damage will be about 90% but a common one will be 35%
keen carbon
@spare quarry why is that? she seems pretty strong?
dense locust
but a common chaos that grants cast is the same as an epic
and the punishment seems random
halcyon cedar
i sometimes go to chaos if the room reward dont have the thing i wanted lol
but if i fo for cast damage mainly, chaos cast reward is good
because no other god boon can improve cast bullet or damage that much
except artemis
artemis cast 👍
grant homing ability with crit chance
gives 2s cast with lower damage
legendary gives 3 more ammo
dislodge bullet gives damage to foe
spare quarry
artemis has low damage bonus for attack/special
halcyon cedar
yeah true that
spare quarry
so the times you don't crit, your damage will feel like wet noodles
halcyon cedar
but i like 5% gives crit for all attack sometimes XD
spare quarry
and leveling the crit boon doesn't even give you more crit chance
keen carbon
oh, makes sebse
spare quarry
its stuck at 15%
keen carbon
sense
spare quarry
its good if you can get the chaos boon for +% dmg to special/attack i guess
halcyon cedar
yeah only get crit if other weapon special power have raw power increase ability
summer linden
crit is worth it but it's def good to go for statuses and chaos boons to augment it
spare quarry
i tried artemis on chiron bow and it was pretty weak without a chaos boost
now i just go dementer
keen carbon
that might be why i failed so hard with it yesterday lol
spare quarry
for the chill blast boon
keen carbon
on special?
halcyon cedar
that homing arrow? i go for crittttssssssssssssssss
keen carbon
oh do you mean the one where it explodes on 10 stacks of frost?
spare quarry
yea
halcyon cedar
normal is the WEAK status (need find the damage amp one) , then special is CRITTTTTT
keen carbon
ooh, that would be good with her frost special on chiron, i can imagine
halcyon cedar
oh yeah CHIRON bow does not work on support fire XD
spare quarry
i always start dementer for chiron bow and then try to go for the festive fog cast
since that gets me ice wine
keen carbon
haven't seen that one yet, what does it do?
halcyon cedar
demeter duo boon mostly improve your debuff power
summer linden
ice wine is crazy good
spare quarry
it gives a 50% dmg boost to your dionysus cast and adds chill
and it makes the cast near instant
summer linden
add the zeus/dio duo boon for maximum fun
spare quarry
its easy to burst mobs/bosses with that alone
halcyon cedar
does ice wine chill have pulse-like chill effect like demeter's aid?
spare quarry
idk pulse like but it constantly stacks chill while monsters stand in the fog range
swift trail
Guys, have u some tips how to get better boons? Because I get the legendary/duo boons only 3 maybe 4 times after about 50 hours of playing
halcyon cedar
flip mirror of night to upgrade the % of getting legend boon
spare quarry
one of the new mirror talents increases chance for legendary/duo boon
and duo boon you need the right boons to unlock
not just one from each god
swift trail
to what percentage can I increase the chanse?
spare quarry
+15%
spare quarry
its better than +50% rarity anyway
swift trail
yup
keen carbon
ok guess, that's one passive i'm gonna have to unlock :p
keen carbon
will do 😄
swift trail
there is more than 2 talents to switch on each position ? 😮
spare quarry
only 2 talents to choose from per line currently
keen carbon
is the new defiance passive better than death defiance?
swift trail
okay, so the 2nd one is "green" ?
swift trail
what's the total cost of darkness to max the legendary % talent ?
frosty pier
10
spare quarry
dont remember off hand
summer linden
I usually only actually lose lives on the final boss so I'd rather have a stock of them, but if you're dying more on the way then the alt death defiance might be good
frosty pier
it has 10 levels, so 1500?
spare quarry
the alt defiance is kinda bad because it heals for so little
nice for beginners learning the game i guess
frosty pier
Yeah, I cleared the 0 heat run with it and that was not good for my potato-skilled heart.
keen carbon
yeah but i barely die in normal rooms, it's usually a boss room, so i guess the standard one would be better
spare quarry
the thing is
3rd area you have a chance to get that npc that refills all defiance charges
which is worthless on alt defiance
spare quarry
i usually skip him when im high hp/full defiance
keen carbon
patroclus saved my butt yesterday :p
summer linden
one time I took his jerkey and actually still had one use of it when I got to the final boss
spare quarry
since you can sometimes buy defiance charges in charon's well anyway
summer linden
that was great
swift trail
Is there worth to clear all the chambers in Cerberus room?
surreal oracle
depends
river jacinth
Only to get all the rewards if you want them
spare quarry
i do then when im close to enough gold to buy something i want
frosty pier
Well Pat gives you item that makes you restore health like usual DD.
spare quarry
like titan's blood
summer linden
it can be if you really wanna try to complete a build with something specific
surreal oracle
Doing Guan and got low health, just went into another one and then, full health with all the vermin
spare quarry
each room you can get 100-200+ gold from pots/drops alone
river jacinth
There’s very often a lot of those small gold things you can break for 15 obol
surreal oracle
yep!
swift trail
I always clear them, when i have only one defiance to get chanse to buy another
surreal oracle
I still wish there was a overdamage armor hammer upgrade or boon
...is there one?
swift trail
but instead of it I always lose it
river jacinth
Also, if you want to buy a boon but need a legendary, you can go into more rooms to try and find a shop to buy a yarn
dense locust
I've had hopless runs saved by the death defiance refill
river jacinth
I’ve done that once and it worked
halcyon cedar
i used to be clear all room until i start to play with heats, then go for time limit thingy, then i stopped clear more room since i hunting titan blood anyways XD
dense locust
I don't use the time limit, even at 32 heat
summer linden
I dread the day I get high enough where I'm forced to turn on the time limit
heady zephyr
zeus is actually so good on the fists
glad he finally got a good weapon
for armour overpenetration, i feel like that would be a good fit for artemis
river jacinth
@shell trout doesn’t the codex say “underworld”
So it wouldn’t include the surface
Sorry if I’m misremembering
shell trout
@river jacinth you might just be right
river jacinth
I also have the house in my codex I’m pretty sure
shell trout
Does anyone know the amount of darkness that is now required to max ou the mirror?
dense locust
@heady zephyr bruh, zeus on the rail is amazing
heady zephyr
on the full auto rail, but the full auto rail, at least as of last patch, was not great
rancid shore
The house is literally the first entry for the underworld tab
heady zephyr
btw, i'm guessing you need high relationship with nyx before you can unlock excal?
halcyon cedar
i have no idea how many darkness to max out mirror but that thing can overfarmed
dense locust
I take zeus for attack and then focus on special
a rare or epic attack effectively doubles the rails attack damage and bounces
and get jolted and you're money
halcyon cedar
till now i still haven't maxed out my mirror or beat 32 heats, yeah 32 heats i have to turn off or lower down time limit due to foe too strong or too many unit to kill
dense locust
maxing out the mirror takes a long time unless you're purposely farming darkness
I hate time limit for 32 heat because I often can beat a run if I just take my time
Zeus attack on rail might be the single most effective boon for any weapon as far as how strong it makes you with just 1 boon
hardy relic
Is Flurry Slash (Hold to attack with quick sword slashes) supposed to completely replace normal attack? Because if i'm tapping the button it's still doing the flurry thing, so mash or hold, it's basically the same. Description unclear.
dense locust
without flurry, i believe he does a 3 hit combo
with some delay after the 3rd hit
with flurry, you can hold attack for nonstop attack
not my fave but its fun with the shockwave hammer
not super strong, but fun
hardy relic
my point is even if i'm not holding and just tapping with flurry, it's still just flurry, only two-hit combo
dense locust
I think they made it overly sensitive
i think you can do a single attack but you have to tap it quick
same with flurry cast
hardy relic
might be
dense locust
i double cast all the time with flurry cast when i dont mean to
turbid needle
Had a run now with Talos glove and regenerating cast, got +77% cast damage from chaos and full Artemis package. Lodged projectiles almost completely obscured boss names. Hades died with 15 bloods in him.
dense locust
haha sounds fun
so 4 regenerating casts?
double cast?
boy its really a kick in the poms when Steam kills zag
turbid needle
4 regenerating Artemis casts, double cast and epic dislodge, in last fight i had +1 cast from charon and sometimes by the time i cast 5 - others strart going off cooldown, so it was endless barrage
dense locust
Yeah thats the dream
Not a huge fan of artemis's actual cast though
But with flurry cast and double cast, its like a bloodstone machine gun
south flax
When do I get to unlock alternate weapon styles?
frosty pier
After you get all the weapons and do a run/or die in it.
daring nymph
Do you possibly know what to do for the 4th style of a weapon?
Unlocked the Spear one but no clue how.
south flax
Thank you, I'll use my keys to unlock the last weapon then and see what's up.
frosty pier
Pinned messages in spoilers.
daring nymph
Ohh, thank you!
pallid dagger
So my Titan Blood hoarding paid off
I got all the new weapon aspects fully upgraded right away and I feel so powerful
signal viper
so i just 4-shot meg? https://i.imgur.com/ri8zr1c.png
excited for an easy run i guess cuz holy wow cluster bomb is strong
quiet arrow
I refunded my darkness and only invested in what I felt was necessary and I still have 2k to go before I can get the thing for nyx lmfao
orz
She wasn't joking when she said it'd take a substantial amount
dim rapids
it's 8888 darkness
small gorge
https://imgur.com/a/mRbRrwM
my dad really love me
shut stream
Arthur's blade incrises max HP, right?
small gorge
yes
frosty pier
Artur doesn't give you hp
Maybe you switched thick skin for high confidence in the mirror?
river jacinth
so what does everyone think about the demeter aspect giving a bonus after 12 attacks instead of a multiple of 5
personally i wish it was 10 or 15
frosty pier
Yes, that blood spitting ability of Zags.
small gorge
no
frosty pier
Yes.
shut stream
: I checked, i still had thick skin. The math goes like this.
100 base
+50 from the Mirror
+50 arthur
+74 from chaos boon
[also had 1 heart and 1 or 2 darkness, but it's not important]
should be 274? had 264, after the heart and darkness
spare quarry
mm not sure which aspect to play with tbh
frosty pier
except arthur does not give you health.
frosty pier
only damage reduction in the special zone
shut stream
oh, 🤦♂️
sage sail
arthur definitely gives you health
frosty pier
in a sence that you lose less yes, but not the solid numbers
small gorge
https://imgur.com/3QUkk4C
its give u 50 health
sage sail
^
spring mauve
how do you get that menu
versed tide
starting at 200 hp with arthur + collar makes for a smooth run
frosty pier
how in blazing hell did I missed that >_<
small gorge
you start with 150 mate
frosty pier
It's not like Arthur makes you have godmode damage cap on it's own.
frosty pier
Did you unlocked all the weapons?
spring mauve
the railgun never appears
clear dome
you need all other weapons for railgun to appear
frosty pier
So, you have others unlocked and no rail?
upbeat charm
Go do another run
sage sail
They did say that rail is final weapon now
sage sail
Don't have to win, just can't give up
spring mauve
ok then I should already have it like 6 times over
stiff stone
@pearl plank there is one, it’s the bloodstone pickup sound, but it’s very dim
jolly fiber
Are there new duo boons?
rotund wagon
@spring mauve finish a run using the sword.
Like actually got to the surface
I defeated da boss with the sword and when I go back to the house and spoke with Nyx she gave me the word
spring mauve
I did
spring mauve
but not on the second save
so i don't have the gauntlet on the save that I beat the game with sword
rotund wagon
that might explain it
turbid needle
lmao, just played the new fist weapons and got the magnetic aspect thingy of talos
first thing that came to mind:
sly marsh
is that a jojo reference??!?
turbid needle
yes
sly marsh
noice
small gorge
Ok now i know that i can make people suffer alot from behind now
with Arthur, exposed, Shadow Slash, new Black shawl and Athena
turbid needle
also, muda muda muda muda xD
sly marsh
arthur aspect is marvelous
i two shotted theseus AND asterius with that build
just added artemis atack
small gorge
i always want a Giant Axe and Arthur work just fine for me
no need
only arthena build is enough
maybe 1 more debuff
i made 3k damage from behind hades
sly marsh
crit atack+more damage on crits+exposed and marking to activate the +20 bonus damage
it was a beautifull run
native cipher
so am i the only person who thinks that fated persuasion shouldnt be able to roll boons into the same boons?
istg using them feels like i'm just rolling to get the same boons at lower quality
dim rapids
alright i officially love the fishing legendary from poseidon
finally found my 2nd chaos fish lmao
so many fishing points it's insane
native cipher
yeah i get the feeling it's a bit too woomy for what it is
i'm expecting the nerf bat any day
dim rapids
it's not really woomy though
you need to sacrifice a potential boon for it
though the good thing is you can always just sell it for gold lmao
but still at least fishing for chaos fish isn't that crazy anymore
native cipher
i think it's like all of the treasure boons where its value is increased the earlier you get it in a run
that said, you get substantially more out of it than you do any other treasure boon
native cipher
they could be beams/teleporting
tidal thorn
Yeah that is terrible.
dim rapids
teleporting isn't that bad for chariots
they can't teleport when they're chasing after you
they often just teleport once then chase you
native cipher
i've had multiple chariots teleport directly on top of me
native cipher
and explode with zero way to react
native cipher
vortex is kinda hellish
dim rapids
the suction is hard
on chariots
also laser lightshow
lmao
actually teleporting vortex is probably worse
native cipher
tbqh i feel like the elite armored guys has only shone a light on how much the sword sucks
what are you gonna do with your sword once a room full of speedy vortex guys spawn?
cast?
with your limited supply of cast stones?
still idol
native cipher
sword's big issue is that it has basically zero ways of keeping you alive
in my experience
subtle shale
Personally when the going gets rough with sword I default to spamming dash attacks and then dashing back out to safety, sometimes special if I get an opening
native cipher
yeah that's really all you can do. it's mainly an issue of the sword's dash attack has a crap-ton of end lag and is not very accurate
native cipher
athena on dash is core on sword.
sword demands best in slot for everything. this only gets more true the higher heat you go.
if you don't get aphrodite/demeter attack, athena dash, and an invuln call, you're basically just not gonna win that run
native cipher
what heat are you on?
dim rapids
you can do things slowly and still clear (unless tight deadline 2)
i mostly did merciful end runs on sword
for 20
athena dash
ares attack
special > dash > dash
repeat till everything dies
in one run i didn't even get merciful end but i just continued to chunk them down
severe stratus
Oh yeah quick question
dim rapids
athena special is optional but recommended
subtle shale
I think sword is a bit stronger than that, but you’ve gotta really know your spacing to get full combos off if you do anything other than a dash build.
dim rapids
athena special makes a nova of 'screw everything, i have deflect iframes'
severe stratus
Does Chaos and Hermes count for the new Family Favorite mirror upgrade?
native cipher
sword's issue isn't damage, it's the fact everything in its kit is a liability and nothing it has can keep you alive
dim rapids
which is why you get athena
lol
if you have issues with sword
fists will be wayyy harder
dim rapids
fists are clunky due to short range and fixed 8 directional dodging for KB&M
subtle shale
That’s kind of true for Malphon too though and those are broke right now
dim rapids
often times when you dodge on KB&M you get out of fist range
native cipher
their attacks don't actually have that much end lag, which means that it's harder to get caught out the way you do with the sword
dim rapids
you literally can't get caught out with sword if you know what you're doing lol
native cipher
and they're also faster which means you dont get interrupted as much
subtle shale
@severe stratus that is a fantastic question
dim rapids
and on poseidon you're probably just chunking everything to death with true shot
on any other sword
special > dash strike > dash strike
and win
native cipher
and then getting chunked yourself because the special has 90 hours of end lag
dim rapids
you know you can dash into a special right
native cipher
yes
quiet arrow
genesis i had that but instead of teleporting it was casters the protection one that gives them blue health and the beam one
it wasn't fun
native cipher
that doesn't change the fact that it has 90 years of end lag
native cipher
i know how the sword works
its my second highest heat weapon and my second most hated
dim rapids
i've done 20 heat runs on all weapons already
just not 32 heat, only did it on shield because i think 32 heat is too cancerous pre-update
quiet arrow
it's my fastest weapon by far but i can't say i like the sword too much
dim rapids
post-update, it might be doable on all
native cipher
i'm around 25ish with sword, 26ish with bow
dim rapids
well that's your problem lmao
native cipher
and around 16-19ish with everything else
dim rapids
*there's your problem
anything above 20 heat feels artificial difficulty
especially on 40% overtime
good luck reacting to satyrs or vermin
native cipher
yeah, as said before, high heat only makes sword's and bow's issues worse
the higher you go, the more glaring they become
dim rapids
can't wait for new 57 heat run
i mean i guess you aren't really intended to play at such high heats anyway
native cipher
shield, spear, and rail only get better on the other hand
dim rapids
uh?
subtle shale
Yeah I haven’t actually reached 20 heat yet but a lot of the pact stuff you’re forced to take reminds me of the Bastion Idols
dim rapids
if you want me to be honest
you can probably slap athena on everything
and still do 32 heat runs decently
quiet arrow
40% overtime satyrs is a little more manageable with the arthur special 🤔
native cipher
aphrodite is best in slot on attack (although with some weapons she's tied with demeter)
dim rapids
good luck trying to hit final boss with those slow swings at 40% overtime though
subtle shale
Lol that silly effect they added this patch where enemies can become invulnerable randomly
They had to slip in that old Idol effect somewhere 😛
native cipher
yeah, remember when i said that the sword has too much end lag? arthur aspect doesn't help with that. at all.
dim rapids
personally just run what you thihnk is fun lol
you aren't forced to do 20+/32 heat runs
lusty sequoia
What’s wrong with sword? I’m only on like 1 heat but it’s my fave atm
lusty sequoia
Like being too close range?
quiet arrow
fair
subtle shale
Yeah it’s one of my fave’s too
dim rapids
at stuff like 40% overtime/modifiers/hard labour, it gets harder
native cipher
yeah, it melts everything, but everything in its kit is a liability.
lusty sequoia
Oh makes sense
dim rapids
sword is good for speedruns
lusty sequoia
Like the delay after using the special?
dim rapids
poseidon aspect sword
subtle shale
I’d like to put forth the idea that Malphon is also close range but it’s basic combo doesn’t lock you in nearly as hard
A lot of sword upgrades require getting your full three hit combo off
Which is often Suicide
dim rapids
here's your problem
native cipher
yeah, malphon is so much easier to play because it doesn't lock you in place
subtle shale
That’s why dash builds are so much easier to shoot for
lusty sequoia
Makes sense, my only sword win was with world splitter
God the thrust feels so good though
dim rapids
on sword what i find best is
lusty sequoia
Wait no
dim rapids
special > dash-strike > dash-strike
subtle shale
True, but then maybe there shouldn’t be so many powers that want you to do the full combo
lusty sequoia
With nemesis?
dim rapids
with this you chunk everything and are generally safe
nemesis/zag/arthur
ok maybe not arthur special but yeah
lusty sequoia
Yeah but why use special with zag aspect? Special feels kinda weak outside of nemesis
Though maybe I’m just bad, it’s not like nemesis increases damage
subtle shale
Personally, and this is just spitballing, I think sword’s third combo hit should be able to stagger through armor
dim rapids
25% dash distance is kinda fun if you're doing dash-only run with poseidon
but that's about it lol
native cipher
nemesis special is sword's best aspect imho. poseidon has more damage in theory, but it's much harder to set up. nemesis is way more consistent.
dim rapids
poseidon still holds WR for speedrun though
and it also helps that poseidon enables it
50% cast dmg is no joke
native cipher
yeah, more damage in theory, but you need to set up for it way more
dim rapids
you don't really need to set up for it
the new talents help quite a bit
more chance to get legendary
lusty sequoia
How do you use Poseidon sword? Do you go for Zeus cast or what
dim rapids
50% bonus on initial hit helps to chunk them pretty early
lusty sequoia
Never had a good run with it
dim rapids
usually, poseidon sword always goes for true shot
you can go other stuff as well
like hunting blades/crystal clarity
native cipher
all cast builds go for true shot
dim rapids
you can also go ice wine
native cipher
okay, thats a lie
lusty sequoia
That’s the Artemis one right? Why’s it so good
native cipher
most cast builds go for true shot
lusty sequoia
Just hit lol
dim rapids
also it helps that true shot builds into dual shot into fully loaded
while for others you need to get more boons
lusty sequoia
Oh yeah makes sense
native cipher
the dream build for any cast set up imho is:
poseidon special/attack
razor shoals
static discharge
sea storm
artemis cast
double shot
fully loaded
exit wounds
then any chaos/hermes mods to cast and any artemis mods to crit
versed ibex
I love the new mirror thing for changing bloodstones into a recharge ability
native cipher
it's great asterisk
versed ibex
I had dio cast, Artemis double cast, Artemis extra bloodstone, Hermes faster cooldown, Hermes "more cast damage against enemies without bloodstones in them"
I spammed cast on the final boss 😂
native cipher
ive played around with it a bit. in my experience it's great on weapons that don't use cast as a primary source of damage, or on weapons that dont have any innate range.
absolutely murders the damage potential of any cast based build tho
i think tipsy shot is a special case though
given that its fog cloud lasts longer than the cooldown period
velvet thicket
same with hunting blades
versed ibex
yeah, I wouldn't go for it with the hera bow, and I didn't like it when I ended up with Demeter cast. but for tipsy shot it was 👌
I think it could work well for Rift blades too
velvet thicket
if you get the full hunting blades build with regen casts you basically have at least 6 of them on the screen permanently
i think it probably does more damage than default cast unless you luck out and get automatic recall with default
although that's still slower actually
velvet thicket
you're gonna get it next run now that you've said something
turbid needle
Do holy excalibur not have a dash strike?
surreal jolt
im in a run right now and need a question checked. I have the life steal boon from Chaos, every hit gives me +2 health. Demeter has a boon called nourished soul that increases I THINK healing? Does it this with my other boon???
errant narwhal
it does have a dash-strike!
native cipher
there's also the new perk on the mirror that increases the chance at legendaries
versed ibex
And then still pray 😂 because Chaos is not nice
turbid needle
Then it must be a bug that my chaos dashstrike boon isn't affecting it's damage
native cipher
tbqh i've seen it multiple times and almost always skip it when it shows up
errant narwhal
also, i didnt have enough darkness for the new thingies.... tho i guess i could reroll my stuff to invest in it, i do have enough keys 🤔
native cipher
if you can't beat a room with 3 death defies, you arent beating it in 4.
dim rapids
i've done quite a lot of egg runs when trying to farm darkness
errant narwhal
true, but the prophecies.. the completion
unkempt pagoda
a run is more than a room
dim rapids
also if you are hunting for the legendary, the bonus legendary chance helps
stuff like yarn of ariadne also helps
errant narwhal
the leg hunt 🦵
native cipher
i see people skipping out on yarns all the time, and i never get that
dim rapids
yarn of ariadne + light of ixion got me my legendary from chaos
versed ibex
If you have the stubborn defiance thing, do you get a second death defy from Chaos or does it get removed from the pool?
dim rapids
i always skip on yarn
native cipher
but i also see people with like, 600-700 gold in their wallets
dim rapids
if i have money and i'm before a chaos gate or in styx
and it's a standard boon room
i might get it
velvet thicket
i buy it if i know i have the prereqs for a duo or legendary that i want
native cipher
i basically always buy yarns, always buy ixions
buy healing if i need it
boon rarity is one of those things that you don't notice until you no longer have it
dim rapids
egg runs are pretty insane
also i'm guilty of saving all my gold because of the new talent now
native cipher
the new talent kinda blows imho
dim rapids
velvet thicket
i think they're equivalent and it depends on how you use shops
dim rapids
egg runs are fun
versed ibex
it's good if you're farming for titan blood or diamonds
native cipher
any money in your wallet might as well not even exist. money doesn't do anything until you spend it.
versed ibex
Yeah, I avoid the shops until Styx, usually
dim rapids
also
native cipher
i always take a shop if it's open to me and if i have money
native cipher
wow, look at all that money
stiff stone
now that's excessive lol
lusty sequoia
I go to shops if I have the money for a boon and I’m missing some
native cipher
surely that helped you tremendously in your victory against hades
lusty sequoia
Doesn’t work very well though, only get boons maybe half the time
dim rapids
egg runs give you some of the most stupid chaos boon combos
and i also cleared out styx shop before that
versed ibex
I've been burned by shops just not having boons
lusty sequoia
Yeah
dim rapids
so imagine all the gooooooold
plain leaf
Does "Perfect Clear" mean you didn't get hit at all? 🤔
dim rapids
once i saw the 3rd one i knew i had to pick it
lusty sequoia
I think once Hermes starts appearing more boons spawn at shops
dim rapids
i mean it's pretty easy with guan yu
you can still get hit
as long as you end the run with full hehalth
health
you can be missing all DDs
and it doesn't check for it
lusty sequoia
Seems like an oversight
dim rapids
also in that run, i had quick + massive spin
plain leaf
Oh I see, still a gg
dim rapids
so i didn't really get hit
velvet thicket
new talent gives you more gold if you have even 250 gold at the end of each region. you don't have to save a whole lot. you still have to weigh that against the value of buying something at the very first shop but it's still probably better
dim rapids
just stayed back and spammed it
plain leaf
quick + massive spin is such an enjoyable combo for guan yu
dim rapids
this was one of the better darkness farm runs i had as well lmao
so yeah, do egg runs if you're bored
rancid shore
what the hell have you just never died?
plain leaf
That's crazy lol, do you buy the chaos gate item from the well of Charon whenever you can?
dim rapids
yep
lusty sequoia
Yeah what
dim rapids
depends though
lusty sequoia
Was that a save file you started after getting good
stoic crest
so how much darkness did you actually make in that run?
rancid shore
oh those aren't all like 20 heat runs i see
dim rapids
a crap ton
stoic crest
😂
dim rapids
my first win was like 11 runs in or so
then it just continued
because i watched streamers play hades before i bought it
lusty sequoia
How is everyone good at video games
dim rapids
it's my first save file
lusty sequoia
Took me like 30 tries
native cipher
skip chaos for duo boons, hammers, eurydice, or gods critical to your build
otherwise, chaos is priority
rancid shore
if you get close to ending the streak will you cheese it and restart?
dim rapids
i sometimes skip chaos even if i bought light of ixion if i see a hammer
unless on shield (they don't really need hammers)
you can restart runs?
native cipher
shield doesn't need hammers, but hammers really help
dim rapids
i think i haven't gotten close to losing any runs so far
the only time i've really nearly lost a run was mostly in my early stages
lusty sequoia
I went to restart once but then hades laughed at me
dim rapids
i had a literal 1 hp no DD run
native cipher
i lost a run on sword and that killed my streak at 76
rancid shore
yeah you can give up after taking a boon or damage and restart with almost the same choices
lusty sequoia
So I finished it
native cipher
because sword is the worst weapon in the game
dim rapids
don't think it's worth to restart though lmao
lusty sequoia
Again how are people good at games
dim rapids
that's a lot of time wasted
i'm not good, i'm just consistent
also because i literally slap athena on everything whenever i can
lol
makes runs way easier
if you aren't doing that, do that
lusty sequoia
Ironically restarting is how they manipulate rng for speed runs
native cipher
👏 athena 👏 dash 👏 is 👏 best 👏
lusty sequoia
Athenas boring though
Like I can’t live without the dash but I just wish it wasn’t basically required
rancid shore
It's not required. It's very useful, but you can go without it just fine
dim rapids
status inflicting one or a god that enables the duo you're aiming for
lusty sequoia
Works I guess
native cipher
poseidon dash is second best imho
dim rapids
i've gone crappy dashes like zeus/demeter
just to enable duos like sea storm and ice wine
rancid shore
zeus dash is good with jolt
native cipher
demeter is third best
dim rapids
it also makes chariots way easier to deal with
lusty sequoia
Yeah for sure
dim rapids
that's how you keep runs going
lusty sequoia
Athena attack on sword is cool
stoic crest
triple A gods is a pretty legitimate comp
dim rapids
artemis/aphro attack/special alternating depending on weapon
lusty sequoia
The alliteration is off the charts rn
native cipher
athena attack isn't that great on weapons outside the sword
dim rapids
aim for heart rend/deadly reversal as high priority, weak resolve is also good but eh...
lusty sequoia
Yeah sucks on spear
native cipher
other weapons are either too slow or their hitbox is too narrow
rancid shore
just spin attack instead
native cipher
fists i havent tried out yet
dim rapids
chariots rushing at you? just punch them
guan yu spear? big ol' screw off deflect spin
native cipher
guan yu is an exception
dim rapids
sword? on special it's a big ol' circle of deflect
native cipher
with a 2 year wind-up
so you cant really use it reflexively the way you can with attack or dash
dim rapids
rail - probably not, it's actually quite garbage, i've tried athena attack/special on rail and it's pretty bad
lusty sequoia
Yeah that’s very fun to use against splitters and that
I can’t get the hang of rail
dim rapids
shield - don't really need but it makes shield an even more safe option
native cipher
hestia aspect + artemis attack
lusty sequoia
It’s weird cos my favourite weapon in bastion was the bone repeated
lusty sequoia
What it do
native cipher
600 damage
lusty sequoia
Burh moment
rancid shore
you can easily get 1k crits without really trying if you go hestia + artemis attack
velvet thicket
gotta get the dash too
dim rapids
hestia artemis crit is generally around 600 dmg
velvet thicket
spicy mode
dim rapids
with new talents you can probably easily go higher
dim rapids
also artemis/aphro/athena is the general trio of OP
and is what enables you to easily breeze through most runs
exposed + heart rend + crit + weak
- other multipliers
native cipher
demeter is up there too imho
dim rapids
i've done 4k++ crits with charged skewer guan yu
native cipher
demeter is like aphro where she's a god that ensures safe and healthy runs
dim rapids
just via multipliers
native cipher
my first win was from a lightning rod build
lusty sequoia
I’ve never used that
native cipher
threw 6 cast stones around the arena and just kited like mad
lusty sequoia
I don’t use casts a whole lot in general, always pick up Zeus cast though
dim rapids
poseidon cast + wall splash enables you to easily clear most styx rooms
native cipher
zeus is a good cast. i think casts are the only slot where there is no wrong answer.
dim rapids
zeus cast is arguably one of the worst casts if i'm not wrong
someone did a check on it
lusty sequoia
I mean it sucks on bosses
But it’s great fun everywhere else
Just wrecks all of Styx
velvet thicket
regen cast probably makes it less bad
dim rapids
i actually think i haven't used zeus cast in all my runs
lusty sequoia
Idk I like spamming it
lusty sequoia
I do feel like Zeus is a bit underwhelming in general
native cipher
like with all zeus abilities, it gets better the more zeus abilities you have
lusty sequoia
How many do you need for it to be good you reckon?
long sierra
https://i.imgur.com/rn6lWVz.jpg
Weirdest run I've ever had. 2 legendary and 2 duo, and all I had to do was just load up and shoot the boss man 4 times.
velvet thicket
zeus might be the worst god?
native cipher
yeah, i mostly use zeus for sea storm cheese
dim rapids
it's arguably worst god until his bugs are fixed
chiron bow + sea storm doesn't work fully
native cipher
or vengeful mood
dim rapids
zeus special is also probably one of the worst specials
velvet thicket
he's still great with rail or fists though
subtle shale
What bugs does Zeus have?
dim rapids
sea storm doesn't proc properly for all chiron special arrows
lusty sequoia
Lightning bugs wheeze
dim rapids
what i used to do was poseidon special
long sierra
It is unless you get some further special modifiers and keep going down the line, then some of them can be good on bow where special hit is lots of procs
dim rapids
sea storm
and with the nerf to legendary/duo chances now
zeus is arguably even worse now
zeus feels heavily reliant on his legendary to be effective
long sierra
but theres a new perk to offset that chance
dim rapids
while other gods don't really need it
lusty sequoia
Aw did they nerf duo chances