h1-builds-and-combat

[livid comet]

calls are too unreliable for me

[turbid needle]

Oh btw

[main citrus]

Especifically for Theseus, yeah

[dense star]

You get like 2-3 calls v. Final boss or something

[lament coral]

@ionic blade absolutely doable with enough rerolls

[naive talon]

There waas a not uin patch notes Aredite

[turbid needle]

If you activate a god call on your dying hit you wont die.

[main citrus]

You can get boons from the god Theseus used in Styx tho

[naive talon]

Jesus

[turbid needle]

I am not sure if that's intentional

[lament coral]

but why would you want a boon from every god?

[main citrus]

That sounds awfully close to a Touhou death bomb :p

[dense star]

^

[ionic blade]

It's be kinda fun

[naive talon]

There was something in the patch notes. Where they limited tjhe amount of boons from different gods u can have

[icy edge]

You're playing Ares/Zeus and get Vengeful Mood

That'd be a reason

[turbid needle]

Heehe no profanity allowed

[ionic blade]

I absoloutely love how much of a jerk theseus is

[fallow niche]

Theseus is graet

[icy edge]

Though it's only like... 4 that have revenge boons

Ares, Zeus, Athena and Aphro, right?

[ionic blade]

I've always had a strong distaste for on-damage effects

[naive talon]

@ionic blade It's the first point in the Bug Fixes of last patch

[ionic blade]

It's a hangover from My Binding of isaac days

[main citrus]

Yeah, Theseus is the only narcisistic enough hero that Hades could hire lmao

[fallow niche]

Yeah the revenge boon duo aint very good

[shell solar]

@ionic blade Until I found the boon that makes them randomly trigger without damage I didn't like them either lol

[main citrus]

That one is fantastic.

[icy edge]

It's not at all random tho

[main citrus]

"Hey, doom stacks outta nowhere"

[icy edge]

It's timed

[ionic blade]

And every time you see him, he's like "haHA! Ready to be sent back once again, foul demon?" even though you've killed him 10 times in a row

[naive talon]

Zeus/Ares duo ! 😄

[fallow niche]

While I think all the gods boons are relatively well balanced, duos definitely are not. At least they're not anywhere near as wonkily balanced as hammer upgrades.

[dense star]

Revenge effects generally are either terrible or busted. Rewarding getting hit usually isn't good mechanically speaking

[ionic blade]

Yeah

[icy edge]

It's all fun and games until Theseus gets health from the Pact

[main citrus]

Duos are a mixed bag.

[ionic blade]

gets WHAT?

[main citrus]

Some are just eh. Some are outstandingly powerful.

[icy edge]

Then we go back to the days of Beefy update

[dense star]

Cause either they're not worth having or you literally use your health as burst damage

[shell solar]

Explosive chain or perfect shot for Charon aspect 🤔

[main citrus]

Does Theseus get upgraded from the pact that changes bosses?

[icy edge]

Rank 3

[livid comet]

Ah yes

Good old Beefeus

[fallow niche]

Theseus gets a hot ride from Extreme Measures

[dense star]

At least Vengeful Mood design-wise reduces that dynamic

[patent tiger]

Exterme Theseus is... quite entertaining. And to me slightly easier over normal

[main citrus]

btw loved the graphical upgrades on Lernie's arena.

[fallow niche]

God I laughed so hard first time I did Extreme Measures 3

10/10 thank you SG

[main citrus]

LMAO

[icy edge]

Beefy Update was a great meme tho

[ionic blade]

Extreme measures sounds fun actually

[icy edge]

You really felt the slog

[ionic blade]

As does Tight deadline

[main citrus]

I need to try it. I only have seen the Furies and Lernie

[fallow niche]

EM 1 is cool, EM 2 sucks unless you speedrun, EM 3 is amazing

[main citrus]

In fact, I only bought the game because I watched a Youtuber play it before. Good stuff.

[livid comet]

uhhh so how does one skip snek

[dense star]

Yeah, EM 2 makes me sad

[ionic blade]

hold up, what was the dash like before the beefy update?

[icy edge]

Makes everyone sad

[fallow niche]

Instantly activate Meg companion on the battle start and also deal a TON of damage at the same time, usually with privileged position @livid comet

[dense star]

Not fond of 'the floor is lava' the boss fight

[main citrus]

Poor Lernie 😔

[icy edge]

Zippier

[livid comet]

LOL

bahahah

[fallow niche]

I've killed Lernie in under a second before

[main citrus]

Jesus

[fallow niche]

All of the bosses have this tiny window on the start of the battle where their shields won't activate

Including Meg

[livid comet]

I find lernie fights amusing when doing GY deflect spin

[fallow niche]

I've accidentally caused Meg to use her shield several times in a row because I chunked her to half HP before

[icy edge]

Meg's fight is too fun to skip though

It's just really well designed

[livid comet]

Alecto sucks

[fallow niche]

I really, really like this and hope SG never stops it because its great for speedrunning and its not necessarily easy to pull off.

[main citrus]

btw what's the easiest Fury sister in your opinion?

[livid comet]

Tisiphone is easy

Tisiphone or meg

[fallow niche]

I like Alecto as a character, but she hurts lmao

[main citrus]

Alecto is hardest

[fallow niche]

Yeah

[icy edge]

Unless you bring in Tisiphone who just fills the entire arena with damage and festive clog

[naive talon]

Alecto > Meg > Tis

[livid comet]

Gods forbid you get all three soul sisters in a fight

oof

[fallow niche]

I can't see anything on EM1 thanks to Tisi

[icy edge]

Yeah, I get that it's supposed to make it harder

[fallow niche]

Mildly

[livid comet]

I had that once. Knocked off a death defiance

[patent tiger]

Alecto is hardest. For me hardest to easy is Alecto > Tis > Meg.

[icy edge]

But it'd be better if it was fake-outs than just blindness

[livid comet]

Yeah obscuring the screen isn't a fun way to make the fight challenging imo

[fallow niche]

Tisi's fog doesn't bother me much on Meg

[shell solar]

@livid comet holy effing es man you jynxed me!

[main citrus]

Three Sisters fight is just Touhou

[fallow niche]

But with Alecto it makes seeing her blade rifts harder

and that's scary

[naive talon]

In general, I find that it's pretty easy to get lost in what is happening on screen and get hit by a projectile you didn't see

[shell solar]

Dude it just happened to me as you said that lmao

[ionic blade]

Come to think of it, what does Boiling blood from hades do? Make you take more damage?

[last nacelle]

Yes

[fallow niche]

Its the same as yours

So yes

[ionic blade]

Ok, thought so

[livid comet]

Also I wonder how many people read the pins in #hades-feedback

because it explicitly says not to give suggestions on how to fix things

But rather to say what the issue is and the experience with it

[shell solar]

That wasn't so bad, I just beat the 3 sisters on 3 hear with charon bow.

[abstract pilot]

i don't even remember the difference between the 3 sisters and i kinda just tank their hits, lol

[oblique tusk]

charon bow

[fallow niche]

Nobody reads it but SG are fairly liberal and accepting with how people have been using it

[oblique tusk]

charon aspect when

[wise yoke]

Ah, fair enough. I did not catch that

[ionic blade]

I wouldn't think suggestions would hurt though

[shell solar]

lol

[abstract pilot]

one of them doesn't cause the screen to get all blurry though with extreme measures on, i like that one the most

[ionic blade]

I do get why they dont want them tho

[shell solar]

Yeah I'm a dingus what can you do

[wise yoke]

(but like, that's just my instinct when pointing out a problem is to try and find a fix)

[ionic blade]

How do we actually? Do you PM a mod?

[wise yoke]

The pins don't say, "Never tell us how to fix our game," it just says, "Focus on your experience. You don't need to propose solutions."

[slender basin]

If I use Heat 3 whenI only need Heat 2 I'm not locking myself out of heat 2 bounties am I?

[oblique tusk]

nope

it just goes up

[fallow niche]

The problem is that if you allow suggestions then how do you sort suggestions from someone who has experience with game design and a plumber who comes up with something that sounds nice on paper but would be totally bad for the game? Leaving the actual solutions to the problems or feedback to the game designers is the best choice - but SG has taken solutions from feedback before, so their diligence in reading them all honestly astounds me. @ionic blade

[oblique tusk]

so if you use like

10 heat

when you haven't cleared any heat bounties

and you clear it

[livid comet]

OK, I''m going to chuck up what I said re:EM1 fight in feedback

[oblique tusk]

heat 1 will be ticked

[fallow niche]

What

@livid comet

[ionic blade]

Yeah, that is true

[livid comet]

"Yeah obscuring the screen isn't a fun way to make the fight challenging imo"

[oblique tusk]

and then you can just keep doing 10 heat again, and it'll get 2 heat, then 3 heat, etc.

[fallow niche]

Oh yeah sure

[lament coral]

Tisiphone's farts

[oblique tusk]

so there's no risk of locking yourself out @slender basin

[lament coral]

they gotta go

[fallow niche]

I personally think its fine but it is annoying

[livid comet]

not sure if it's been said yet

[fallow niche]

also, that is totally cursed Zepp

[ionic blade]

I think that Making the player unable to react to stuff is bad tho

[lament coral]

she eats murder

[slender basin]

ty

[fallow niche]

@livid comet You can use the search bar for the channel

[lament coral]

no wonder her farts are so deadly

[main citrus]

aaaaaaaaaaa

[ionic blade]

armchair developing I know, but generally you should make it more complex or more punishing, but not harder in and of itsself

[main citrus]

I can't unsee that

[fallow niche]

Same

[lament coral]

unsee? Unsmell!

[fallow niche]

Stahp

[ionic blade]

That's why I really hope they don't add slowing mechanics

[lament coral]

can't, they're seeping through my screen!

pshhh

[main citrus]

Difficulty for the sake of difficulty is never a good thing. Difficulty for the sake of challenge is totally fine tho.

It's a fine line

[lament coral]

I'm not a big fan of smoke clouds in Asphodel either but at least those are only present in regular mob areas

imagine if there were smoke traps on the barge

[patent tiger]

I feel somewhat bad for summoning Than to finish off a boss after thier last invulnerable shield phase drops.

[fallow niche]

I think its important to articulate the issue itself a bit better. Adding challenges for the player is fine, but when the challenges obscure player skill then there is a problem.

[lament coral]

instead of the 3 boom vases

[ionic blade]

Yeah, adding new attacks to dodge sounds good (I've not actually tried any pacts yet, I wanna escape with each weapon first), but making it less skill-based feels annoying in any game

[main citrus]

I would also feel somewhat bad. Unless it's Theseus, he deserves all the punishment

[fallow niche]

Thankfully I think Hades is a very skill based game

[livid comet]

done

[ionic blade]

Of course yeah

[lament coral]

I wish normal Theseus was reworked

he's such an ass to play against

[fallow niche]

The only RNG is for level generation

[main citrus]

He's fine as is, he's supposed to be boastful and full of himself

[fallow niche]

Nah Theseus is AMAZING

I love him

[lament coral]

no, I'm talking about the shield

[fallow niche]

Oh

[lament coral]

gameplay

[fallow niche]

You'll learn how to get past that

[main citrus]

Ahhh, that.

[fallow niche]

I kill him in like two seconds nowadays

[naive talon]

It's annoying to deal with at first, but you learn how to get around it.

[novel python]

I need to farm more Ambrosia
Theseus: starts sweating aggresively

[fallow niche]

When in doubt dash in front and behind while attacking constantly

[main citrus]

You know a way to deal well with Theseus? If you have a good close weapon, you can just dash around while he does the first call and smash him silly.

[fallow niche]

You'll hit at least 50% of the time

[oblique tusk]

theseus is just kinda boring tho

[main citrus]

Did that with double hit sword dash, his HP melted

[ionic blade]

I do love How precisely large Hades' swing is

[livid comet]

what you do is you walk in circles at a distance when he aims the spear

and when it misses

[ionic blade]

It's just Big ewnough to catch you even if you double dash, so you cant just spam spacebnar to gfet out the way

[novel python]

What's a good spear aspect to try to get flurry stab and zeus attack on?

[livid comet]

you dash in and show him who's boss

[ionic blade]

you need more dashes/ speed, or to time it well or something else

[naive talon]

Or hide behind pillars and take the opportunity he turns around to sneak a few hits in.

[main citrus]

Not Hades aspect. The rest is fine.

[ionic blade]

I usually try to hide behind Pillars and fight him ranged

[novel python]

@main citrus So Guan Yu is fine too? 👀

[graceful vault]

Thesus has so little HP compared to the Minotaur I sometimes go for him first if I have a good build to get around the shield (like Demeter cast or Hunting Blades)

[main citrus]

👀

[naive talon]

Unless I have a cast that goes through shields, I do the same @ionic blade

[hollow sorrel]

Thesus' spear throw has a predictable timing. You can just dash to the side to avoid it, or dash toward it if you have the athena dash

[main citrus]

I feel that best weapon for Theseus is sword, worst is Bow :x

[fallow niche]

@novel python All but Guan Yu

I run Zag aspect since I can't guarantee flurry and having Explosive is good too

[livid comet]

I see noone has tried Guan Yu on thesues

[novel python]

I mean I love having 5 dashes and just dashing around while holding LMB

[main citrus]

Rapid fire Exa is also fantastic.

[livid comet]

because the GY spin bypasses theseus's shield

[main citrus]

That is glorious indeed.

[naive talon]

Triple Dash Spear

[livid comet]

:)

[ionic blade]

Guan Yu is one of the Spear aspects yeah?

[fallow niche]

Its the new one

[novel python]

Yeah

[fallow niche]

4th aspect

[naive talon]

It also goes through the pillar @livid comet

😄

[novel python]

@fallow niche how does zag aspect spear special feel

[naive talon]

First run I did with it I got the Artemis attack buff and Massive Spin

[novel python]

I mean I can max it, I've already gathered like 10 blood

[fallow niche]

For explosive? Good

[ionic blade]

nice

[main citrus]

Imagine getting Rare Crop and the Hermes dash being one of the affected boons

[novel python]

You need to learn to walk before you start running, boyo

[main citrus]

+4 dashes 👀

[livid comet]

GY spin hits through walls so you turtle behind a pillar in the arena and spam spin attacks

[main citrus]

Imagine getting Rare Crop and the Hermes dash being one of the affected boons

[novel python]

5 are more than enough

[ionic blade]

that sounds awesome

[naive talon]

Did that with Hades too 😂

[novel python]

Double post

[ionic blade]

I never get rare crop until really late though :/

[novel python]

Kek

[ionic blade]

so annoying

[novel python]

Am I the only one that notices discord lags?

[naive talon]

I get it when I dont need it

[fallow niche]

Discord is dying dude

Aaaa

[oblique tusk]

mood

[ionic blade]

A bit of lag yeah

[naive talon]

Like, oh 2 heroic and 3 epic. Lemme give you rare crop

[oblique tusk]

same for me, and also with exclusive access

i get exclusive access super often...in styx

[fallow niche]

lmao same

that duo boon is sadly not good

duo boons are hard to get early

[ionic blade]

Is that the higher-level boons one?

[hollow sorrel]

rare crop is much less exciting, since the hell mode nerf. Before the nerf, like 95% of my boons were common

[fallow niche]

they should be biome agnostic

[oblique tusk]

@ionic blade it's the pos/dio duo, which forces epic rarity

[fallow niche]

I need to tier list the duo boons

[ionic blade]

Thought so yeah

Actually, now you say it, I've gotten that twice, and both were in styx

[naive talon]

That would be interesting Forge

[ionic blade]

angery

[novel python]

Ive updated discord on pc and now it keeps loading

Way to start my thursday night

[main citrus]

My Discord is derping as well

[novel python]

Oh nevermind it's working right now

[main citrus]

It's back lmao

[ionic blade]

Mine is pretty much fine

[novel python]

Welp, gotta start zag spear run

brb

[ionic blade]

glhf

[novel python]

thank

[fallow niche]

https://i.imgur.com/yTm2ZwC.png

basically

[novel python]

chain / vicious skewer or Serrated Edge

[shell solar]

My god if lightning rod did damage for EACH stone

[novel python]

How bad is Serrated Edge

Ive only used it once and it nearly costed me my run

[fallow niche]

wow you got bad hammers

[novel python]

ikr

😦

[shell solar]

I had 8 casts the other day and it was amazing but I realized that the damage only proced once whether it was all 8 or just 1

[fallow niche]

vicious is the 50% damage one right

prob that one

[nocturne dirge]

serrated edge is good what

[naive talon]

@shell solar It does ?

[nocturne dirge]

Take it with artemis dash and it's gg

[main citrus]

I like how Athena/Artemis/Ares compose the three best duos lol

[novel python]

50% dmg and 50% crit on return

@fallow niche

[wise yoke]

I'm so sad. I couldn't get Scintillating Feast for the prophecy before the Demeter update

[fallow niche]

yeah thats good @novel python

[shell solar]

@naive talon My disappointment was immeasurable

[naive talon]

Or at least it augments the frequency of ghits

[fallow niche]

its not great

[wise yoke]

Now i've got like 5 more duos to find

[fallow niche]

but its not bad at all

[naive talon]

right ?

[novel python]

Chain could help with spreading status effects

[shell solar]

I've also had similar issues with exit wounds

[novel python]

At least that's what comes in my mind

When I think about it

[shell solar]

It dumps them all out of Hades and only hits him for 2x the damage

[fallow niche]

artemis/zeus duo boon needs to removed and replaced with an entirely different one

[nocturne dirge]

I think cold fusion goes in S Ice wine in A and The other Demeter boon in C who agrees

[fallow niche]

its not only bad and doesn't work right, its also EXTREMELY awkward to set up

[shell solar]

It's a goof concept it just doesn't work

[fallow niche]

yeah

just give us some kind of lightning crit thing

seriously

[main citrus]

The Demeter/Artemis duo is fine if you like the cast :x

[shell solar]

Good* if you get the boons that make enemies drop them it's good stuff until you fight a boss

[fallow niche]

or an augment for zeus's awful cast

[main citrus]

Not top tier but it's cool.

[fallow niche]

nah its real bad

easily the worst duo boon

[shell solar]

Ah we in the "saying opinions like they are facts" camp. My fave lol

[fallow niche]

esp when some of them straight up significantly increase your damage

@shell solar Some opinions hold more weight than others even if none of them are facts

[livid comet]

like trump's

[fallow niche]

https://i.imgur.com/9dZrn3w.png

[shell solar]

Either way you are just disagreeing like it's a law lol

[fallow niche]

I've played enough with that duo

Its trash

On all heats

[shell solar]

It's good with poison if you're not in a hurry

[fallow niche]

So you're saying its good except it doesn't increase the speed of clearing anything?

[livid comet]

[fallow niche]

Doesn't that just mean it doesn't help?

Lmao

[shell solar]

...no

I don't speedrun

[nocturne dirge]

speed is the most important factor

[fallow niche]

^

[nocturne dirge]

The faster it kills the less chance you have to mess up

[fallow niche]

^^^

[shell solar]

Lol

[fallow niche]

Especially when one of the better heat modifiers is a timer

[livid comet]

dps is a very universally effective weapon, ngl

[shell solar]

I'll stop enjoying playing the game the way I like to when you can find a way to make me do so I guess

[fallow niche]

everything is viable on 0 heat, that's not really what matters

I'm not telling you to stop enjoying anything

I'm saying its a strictly inferior boon to other duos

That has no bearing on what you enjoy

[shell solar]

I like taking my time

[fallow niche]

Your enjoyment has no attachment to 'whats good' more than what you make of it

[shell solar]

Dashing around and focusing on not getting hit while DPS auto-procs is just fine

[livid comet]

So maybe saying "this duo boon is fun" is a better statement

[shell solar]

I said it was fine

I didn't say it was good

[fallow niche]

That's fine for you but we're not talking about what you personally enjoy - at least I wasn't and its not really fair to assert that I was

[nocturne dirge]

fine implies good

[fallow niche]

There's no reason to argue here seriously

[livid comet]

it's all subjective anyway

[shell solar]

I'm aware of that one my dude lmao

[mild crag]

Saying its the worst is wrong when refreshing nectar exists anyway

[livid comet]

you mean for level ups?

[fallow niche]

Not really, its a much better boon if you get it early

The variance on it is massive though

[nocturne dirge]

Refreshing nectar is good proportional to how early it is in the run

[fallow niche]

^

[mild crag]

I think that's the case with exclusive access

But nectar is so useless

[fallow niche]

The Artemis / Zeus duo is just bad at all times

[mild crag]

Since it requires you to take poms

[livid comet]

oh yeah, having a 5/6th level is super handy

[shell solar]

I really enjoyed the revelation of level ups with nectar

[fallow niche]

Poms are very good on some builds

Especially on Dio ones

[nocturne dirge]

Namely fog builds

[fallow niche]

Yeah

[livid comet]

I love pumping poms on most of my builds tbh

[fallow niche]

And poison

[livid comet]

anything that inflicts a status ailment

[main citrus]

Poison stacks with fast weapons are delightful

[livid comet]

demeter special + poms = win

[nocturne dirge]

yeah remember every damage per poison tick is actually +8 damage total

[shell solar]

side note, very important question; why do the chariots purr

[livid comet]

GY attack stack poms = win

[mild crag]

Yeah but if you're playing fog you're going for scintillating feast and if you're playing posion you're going for low tolerance

[fallow niche]

@shell solar What, you don't like cats?

[shell solar]

Not the explody kind

[fallow niche]

Heh

[shell solar]

Call me heartless

[mild crag]

They rawr like lions the big ones

[main citrus]

tfw Theseus is less dangerous than the Exalted Shields in Elysium

[fallow niche]

Accurate

[nocturne dirge]

factual

[livid comet]

ikr

[nocturne dirge]

especially in extreme measures theseus is a joke

[fallow niche]

He's just having a joy ride man

Let him have his fun

[nocturne dirge]

Unless you're an idiot and walk in front of him I never do that ever

[main citrus]

It's Theseus, he's allowed no fun.

Because he's a dumdum

[livid comet]

zeus sheild probably wrecks him

[nocturne dirge]

Everything wrecks him he's a joke

[fallow niche]

^

[main citrus]

I lowkey love Zeus Shield

[nocturne dirge]

Austerius on the other hand

[fallow niche]

yeah asterius will mess you up if you're not paying attention

especially with EM3

[nocturne dirge]

his charge does like 40-70 damage based on your heat level

and his spin hits twice a second

[main citrus]

Jesus

[nocturne dirge]

yeah EM3 Austerius is rough

if you get hit

[naive talon]

Still havent tried EM

[nocturne dirge]

He's still slow

[fallow niche]

his spin is total nonsense

will literally instantly kill you because the stagger will prevent you from escaping for a bit

[livid comet]

I always try to burst asterius down

asap

[fallow niche]

newer players should kill asterius first

[livid comet]

and take my time with theseus

[fallow niche]

only when you feel really comfortable you kill theseus first

because its really easy to kill both that way

at the same time

[nocturne dirge]

Before Extreme measures I think that's the right choice but after extreme measures I like taking theseus down first because he's only dangerous if you drop your focus

[fallow niche]

well

if you drop your focus you get instagibbed

those bombs HURT

[nocturne dirge]

exactly

[fallow niche]

esp with 400% trap damage

[main citrus]

Whoops, I forgot to set my roles lmao

[turbid needle]

The bombs should be enemy damage.

[fallow niche]

Same with the bombs from other enemies

[shell solar]

Speaking of things that are objectively trash, the butterfly room is either trivial or enough to make me want to dumpster my run and there doesn't seem to be any in between

[nocturne dirge]

the soul catcher miniboss room you mean

[shell solar]

I said what I said

But yes that one. It's a fun challenge most of the time but I find that if your build is even a little bit lacking it goes to hell very fast

[pastel jolt]

it's easier if you keep an eye on the shield spawn

[livid comet]

yeah

[shell solar]

YEah definitely

[pastel jolt]

if the shades turn into spears/bows i can handle that

[nocturne dirge]

Soul catchers are just an odd enemy. they have like 2500 hp

[pastel jolt]

but if i let more than one or maybe two turn into a shield? nah

[nocturne dirge]

Even on a good build they take literal ages to kill

[livid comet]

do shades spawn infinitely while the soul catcher is alive??

[nocturne dirge]

ye

[shell solar]

Yep

[livid comet]

yeah so best option is to shut it down asap

[pastel jolt]

yup

focus down the boss and break off to snipe any shades aiming for the shield

[shell solar]

Which is kind of silly IMO since if you have more single target DPS you can really be in a position where you have to choose to kill the soul catcher and let 100 enemies spawn or keep killing them and chipping away at it forever

[primal orbit]

is there a way to get thanatos to start spawning? I've done 30ish runs and haven't seen him a single time

[fallow niche]

soul catcher is super easy if you get the hang of it

same with asterius if ima be honest for the miniboss

[livid comet]

I mean, any decent build will be able to get past that room.

[shell solar]

It's not the mechanic that's necessarily hard it's just a LIIIITLE bit of the balance

It's so close to not even being a complaint for me

[fallow niche]

how so?

[livid comet]

if you can't handle that, then you're probably not going to be able to finish the run either way

[fallow niche]

like the elysium minibosses are the easiest part about that place

[dense star]

I just focus the catcher, yeah. Occasionally I have a build that goes hard enough on aoe that incidentally gets to prevent any summons equipping thenselves

[nocturne dirge]

I'll be honest every time I see austerius I sigh a bit of relief

[fallow niche]

the regular rooms are ultra annoying

[livid comet]

you know what I hate more than the soul catcher room???

[fallow niche]

poison.

[livid comet]

the BABY CHARIOTS

[shell solar]

Yeah Asterius isn't so bad. His charge annoys me when he refuses to hit the obstacles

[fallow niche]

oh god the baby chariots on forced overtime

🏃‍♂️

[shell solar]

They suck so bad lmao

[livid comet]

Baby chariots can die in a fire for all I care

[nocturne dirge]

any room with more than 5 exalted shields makes me want to end my own life

[abstract pilot]

there are some builds that kill the big soul catcher in like 5 seconds

[fallow niche]

less than

i've killed it in like under a second upon it spawning before

[livid comet]

yeah, I manage pretty fine with my subpar GY builds

[shell solar]

That much I can appreciate, a high enough DPS build that can kill the Soul Catcher is usually good in general. Some games a high single target DPS is always a much bigger trade off

[fallow niche]

most builds take it down in like 10-30 secs

for me

[livid comet]

I think I average... 10 seconds with the GY?

[ocean arch]

There is something extremely satisfying about dropping the instagib on the soulcatcher miniboss

[livid comet]

and I get my health back for it

Soul catchers make a great snack

[main citrus]

Y'all are too fast

And I am here, happy with my sub 30

[livid comet]

sub 30?

I'm sitting pretty at around 39 mins

;-;

[main citrus]

It was a lucky run

[shell solar]

I don't even know how long it takes me, I just got to the point where I can reliably leave the tooth at home lmao

[fallow niche]

@ocean arch its literally a big balloon to pop

[main citrus]

Sea Storm + Sword with double strike dash attack

[fallow niche]

so good

its like popping a big pimple

[ocean arch]

I've only recently started breaking into the sub-20, most of my runs go about 22-24 mins

[main citrus]

I was just zooming around and blasting dead people around.

If you get double knock from Poseidon it's even more hilarious.

[livid comet]

hm

[nocturne dirge]

My favorite personally are big crit hestia builds

[fallow niche]

nearly all runs are 12-18mins for me now, except bow, they always take a bit longer in general

[livid comet]

how did it do against bosses tho?

[ocean arch]

Sea storm on Chiron bow with Poseidon Special

[fallow niche]

on low heat that is

[ocean arch]

Is damn hilarious

[main citrus]

Imagine hitting 2 attacks, 3 wall slams and 3 bolts :'D

[livid comet]

I very much dislike poseidon's effects because they suck in boss fights

[shell solar]

The posiedon boons where you do an extra knockback, then the wall causing an explosion, and the zuess duo where knockback = lightning is hilarious in the tunnels

they just bounce around like ping pong balls

and explode. Much satisfaction

[main citrus]

Cluster Bomb int he tunnels is oddly satisfying.

[ocean arch]

I only really go for Poseidon if I intend to get Sea Storm tbh

[livid comet]

Trippy shot

[shell solar]

That was my first one with those knockback combos lmao

it was an insta-clear in every room

[turbid needle]

Blood and Darkness, 12-18?

[main citrus]

Poseidon is a nice side god. Not my main tho.

[livid comet]

what does sea storm do again?

[turbid needle]

I don't think I have every weapon cleared under 18 yet.

[fallow niche]

lightning bolt on knockback effects

[shell solar]

knockback causes lightning to strike

[main citrus]

Thunder on knockback

[fallow niche]

works on bosses

even if they dont move

[livid comet]

wait really

[fallow niche]

yes

[main citrus]

Yes.

It shows the power of knockback

[fallow niche]

it sometimes works on chiron bow special

[livid comet]

...

[ocean arch]

And on the bow special it counts every hit for a bolt

[fallow niche]

yeah

[livid comet]

and here I just assumed

[shell solar]

some of the duos are mad good

[fallow niche]

not always though

[ocean arch]

It's just much MUCH stronger than a zeus special on bow

[main citrus]

Sea Storm is top tier stuff.

[nocturne dirge]

bosses still take knockback it's just drastically reduced

[fallow niche]

sea storm single handedly makes poseidon not entirely bad

that and his dash

his dash is actually really good

[main citrus]

You basically chain everything and some more.

[nocturne dirge]

the posideon demeter cast is really good

[turbid needle]

Sea Storm used to work with Chiron, but it's back to working like Thunder Flourish now.

[main citrus]

I find Zeus also a good secondary god.

[ocean arch]

I mean, a dash that opens up some breathing room is brilliant

[fallow niche]

dang that sucks @turbid needle

[ocean arch]

Ohno

[livid comet]

naw, demeter cast with something else would be better imo

[fallow niche]

its not like bow AND poseidon needed nerfs

lmao

[livid comet]

because status effects

[novel python]

@fallow niche I got flurry on Elysium ❤️

[turbid needle]

I know, right?

[lament coral]

I wish Zeus special was good

[main citrus]

I always go Athena, Dio, Ares or Demeter as main gods. The others are support.

[livid comet]

yup.

wait

[turbid needle]

Zeus Special is good on Zeus Aspect and non-Chiron bow if you like to shotgun it.

[livid comet]

no crit builds?

[main citrus]

Artemis is whatever she wants to be because she's best gal and I want an option to romance her

[livid comet]

[main citrus]

She has the massive crush on Zag

[fallow niche]

Any god besides Poseidon is good as your main god

[livid comet]

ikr

[fallow niche]

Zeus is only good in very few circumstances tho for main DPS

[ocean arch]

Artemis as main on poseidon sword is quite fun

[fallow niche]

Its the current WR holder for speedruns @ocean arch

[livid comet]

for me fun = effective

[main citrus]

Artemis as main on everything is nice. Crits are insane in this game.

[ocean arch]

Though any cast build on poseidon sword is damn fun

[turbid needle]

I've been trying to beat 32 Heat with Eris Zeus.

Gotten to Hades twice.

[fallow niche]

Aphrodite Cast with Demeter chill on cast boon with poseidon sword is real fun, try it sometime @ocean arch

[ocean arch]

@fallow niche take it crits and exit wounds just blasting big damage numbers?

[fallow niche]

exit wounds unnecessary

take the cast and pom it up

[novel python]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/457639241615409173/672568091238072352/unknown.png I'm wondering if Support fire would be better here 🤔

[ocean arch]

Ah fair

[fallow niche]

and the game ends

dual shot is the best next boon you can get

[ocean arch]

Yeah I love Dem's chill aoe on cast

[turbid needle]

That or Pressure Points.

[fallow niche]

support fire is fine, pressure points is probably better though? @novel python

[main citrus]

Support Fire with infinite ammo Exagryph is so silly lmao

[fallow niche]

after support fire nerf

[turbid needle]

RIP Infinity Chamber.

[lament coral]

I don't hold Zeus shield in high regard

[novel python]

Not sure tbh

[ocean arch]

Delta Chamber is weird

[main citrus]

Hey, at least the birst fire Exa now has the infinite ammo.

[novel python]

But idk, Support Fire is Guaranteed damage

[ocean arch]

Not entirely sure I like the 3burst

[turbid needle]

I've beat 15 or 20 Heat with Zeus.

[fallow niche]

Zeus is the second worst god so yeah @lament coral

ironically

[lament coral]

I guess

[main citrus]

@ocean arch Try with DoT gods like Dio

[novel python]

Pressure Points is probably you'll do more damage if you crit

[fallow niche]

@turbid needle He's very good on a handful of select builds

Like flurry spear

[lament coral]

I love Zeus attack on the rail though

[turbid needle]

Zeus Aspect.

[fallow niche]

Or rail

[lament coral]

it's SO GOOD

[main citrus]

If possible, try to get the attack speed boon from Hermes for a machine gun of pain

[ocean arch]

Pew pew

[turbid needle]

Epic Swift Strike and Infinity Chamber.

[main citrus]

MOAR DAKKA

[ocean arch]

Zeus aspect shield is better with the new tick rate but I'm still not too fond of it

[turbid needle]

Put Splitting Bolt and Support Fire on top of that? 👌

[lament coral]

@turbid needle are you gonna change your name to Schpoon Delta Man now?

[turbid needle]

Oh hell no.

I hate Delta Chamber.

[lament coral]

D:

[novel python]

39/175 HP and 2 DDs, I have to choose between Patroclus and Hermes. I'm just not sure if I should take the HP from patro or go for hermes since he might not appear anymore

[turbid needle]

Flurry Fire is the best for Zeus Rail now.

[lament coral]

how?

[ocean arch]

Like part of me would like having the return speed a bit slower so you can just run around with a sawblade chasing you

[lament coral]

you do memba that you get a Zeus proc off each Delta shot?

[turbid needle]

Yes.

But I play on PC so I don't land every single shot.

[lament coral]

that's 3 very fast Zeus procs

[fallow niche]

delta chamber needs to be faster

[main citrus]

Triple Shot on rail is nice, you can dash like mad to get quadra shots going

Add Low Tolerance and enemies melt

[turbid needle]

And missing those bursts hurts really badly.

[lament coral]

what do you mean you don't land every shot?

aren't you aiming?

[turbid needle]

Sorry, mouse and keyboard.

[main citrus]

oof

[lament coral]

me too, so?

[ocean arch]

Playing M+K should help you aim better if anything

[ionic blade]

Delta chamber is the infinite burst fire one?

[lament coral]

turn aim assist on

yeah, Delta is Infinity's replacement

[fallow niche]

I wish I could just list a handful of good hammer upgrades and tell SG to buff the rest because they're ALL SO BAD

[normal pecan]

Imagine using aim assist on mouse

[ionic blade]

IDK, i think thwrye mixed

[main citrus]

Some upgrades are clearly superior to others.

[fallow niche]

God so many are cool but suck

[ocean arch]

World smasher feels awful imo

[turbid needle]

I still like World Smasher.

[lament coral]

imaging missing Hydra heads with the spear at point blank

[ocean arch]

The bull rush override for shield

[turbid needle]

It's super good on Zeus Aspect.

[fallow niche]

And they nerfed the new Shield world breaker or w/e that was really cool and good!

Why!

[ocean arch]

Idk man

[main citrus]

Double hit on sword dash is really great compared to other sword buffs :x

[lament coral]

that's what it's like to play without aim assist

[fallow niche]

World Smasher got nerfed to being awkward to use

and not really anywhere near as fun

[turbid needle]

I don't think fully automatic made it that much less fun.

[fallow niche]

It eats up so many inputs now

[turbid needle]

I've used it since the update and it's still fine.

[fallow niche]

I have and its not

the duality of man

[turbid needle]

I'm M1ing a little more. That's all.

[lament coral]

what's Smasher like now?

[fallow niche]

Its now like your shield charge

[main citrus]

Slower?

[fallow niche]

Yes

[turbid needle]

70 damage and you have to reclick after every smash.

[fallow niche]

You can't just hold it a bit and get it to happen

[lament coral]

so you just hold then release?

[fallow niche]

Again and again

[lament coral]

so it's full auto but slower?

[turbid needle]

Don't have to release, it will still fire, but you have to click to attack again.

[fallow niche]

You can't just keep slammin and jammin

[lament coral]

ah, I see

[fallow niche]

It does less damage and much slower, and its semi-auto @lament coral

[main citrus]

I like the shield shot replacing the bull charge.

[lament coral]

sounds pretty bad

[fallow niche]

Like why nerf it

[turbid needle]

Charged Shot is so awesome.

I love it.

[fallow niche]

it wasn't even close to being the best shield hammer

[lament coral]

also, I tried the new bull rush speed hammer

[main citrus]

My favorite shield upgrade

[lament coral]

it charges really fast, I love it

[ocean arch]

My fav thing about charged shot is that it doesn't lose the ability to bypass shields

[fallow niche]

Its so frustrating to get that nerf when it was so delicious

[main citrus]

That with the upgrade that makes Bull Rush timed attack does 400% damage is SOOOOOO GOOD

[fallow niche]

There was a glimmer of hope for more good hammer upgrades

[main citrus]

A shield shouldn't so that much damage lmao

[fallow niche]

But at this rate I think there will still only be 1 good one for shield upon release

[turbid needle]

That's not an exaggeration at all. /s

[main citrus]

I use it with Zeus shield and keep pushing the enemy back to the vortex lol

[turbid needle]

World Smasher is still good.

[fallow niche]

I'm not really talking about playing the game on a casual level

Seriously

You can play anything and beat the game with ease

[turbid needle]

I've used World Smasher to clear 15 Heat.

That's not a common playing level at all.

[fallow niche]

Hades isn't that hard of a game and when it releases you'll see tons of people far better than me just choose the most optimal builds and nothing else

[turbid needle]

Post-nerf.

[fallow niche]

I don't see whats the point of the nerf tho

It hardly broke the game

[ocean arch]

That's the nature of rogue-like games at the end of the day tbh

[fallow niche]

I'm being told that things that aren't the best are fine getting nerfed

[ocean arch]

I'd rather they buff the things falling behind

[fallow niche]

SAME

but they nerf things that were perfectly fine

[ocean arch]

At the same time they need to balance around the game itself

[main citrus]

Competitive gameplay is not my forte. I am a casual dude. But yeah, things need to be balanced otherwise people will just pick the best stuff to clear achievs

[ocean arch]

Like I'm happy damage increases don't multiply because that would instantly make chaos boons overpowered

[fallow niche]

I don't think the game's balance should revolve around more competitive people

But randomly nerfing things like that is concerning

[ocean arch]

It shouldn't

[main citrus]

Once I got like 4 Chaos boons that gave me extra Darkness, paired with the Nyx Cloak to have instant heals all the time

[fallow niche]

That was really fun when I started playing too

[ocean arch]

I've played a couple of games that balance around the top players and it just ruins the experience

[fallow niche]

^ The game should be balanced around whats fun first

[main citrus]

Some games are built for competitive, that's a fact.

[ocean arch]

Like it takes the fun out of the game and I don't want that

There should definitely be challenge, which is what high heat runs are for

[fallow niche]

But I don't think it ruins the game to achieve some sort of competitive balance around the particular stats on stuff like hammer upgrades

[main citrus]

BUt knowing Supergiant, I feel their games are always built towards the game experience as a whole, especially the narrative

[fallow niche]

Well yeah

This is the first time they've ever done a game like this

And they've done an amazing job

[main citrus]

I trust 'em that the final product will be nice.

[fallow niche]

Every patch has been 95% perfection

[mild crag]

I was pretty surprised when they nerfed spent spirit

[main citrus]

Hecc, I never thought I would enjoy a roguelite as much as Hades.

[fallow niche]

Its that last 5% I'm left to complain about though

[main citrus]

It tickles all my spots.

[ocean arch]

Oh yeah you defo don't want a situation where you're just wanting to start a new run because the choices on offer are all relatively bad

[fallow niche]

Realistically my complaints are small

But its all I got left to complain about hahaha

[main citrus]

Fair enough lol

[fallow niche]

Minor stat changes on some small part of the game

[ocean arch]

Like in Binding of Isaac it hit a point for me where if the first item room didn't give me a decent item I just restarted

[empty locust]

just gonna say that shield is a beast with it's ricochet ability when you throw it

[ocean arch]

And I don't want Hades to have that same issue

[main citrus]

Shield is the best weapon for casual players, hands down.

It's so good.

[fallow niche]

Hades doesn't have the same issue @ocean arch

I can say that with confidence right now

[empty locust]

the spear is really good too.

[fallow niche]

As a player on 32 heat and that speedruns

[ocean arch]

Im not saying it does, I'm saying I don't want it to hit that

[main citrus]

Yeah, all the gods are really balanced. Even the lower tier ones can be useful with the right choices.

[fallow niche]

I don't think it ever will

With how amazingly responsive SG has been

[patent tiger]

I am not good with the shield. Have yet to get a first clear

[ocean arch]

I highly doubt it, because they've been very good with the patches and community feedback

[fallow niche]

@main citrus I would say with the exception of Poseidon

[ocean arch]

As in, doubt it will hit that point

[main citrus]

Supergiant is an amazing company, one of my faves tied with Re-Logic

[fallow niche]

I can't think of a single weapon where I just want his knockback as the primary damage dealer

Ever

Any aspect

[abstract pilot]

chiron bow pew pew pew pew

[ocean arch]

The keepsakes are such a brilliant system for tailoring a run in some way

[main citrus]

I use Poseidon mostly as an add-on. Depending on Knockback is not that useful :p

[fallow niche]

What I really want is Pos/Zeus duo if I get Poseidon on main attack

That's it

I think that's an issue

[ocean arch]

Even on the chiron bow the pos special is a means to an end for me

[main citrus]

Sea Storm on Exagryph 👀

[fallow niche]

Yeah Sea Storm is it or bust and Poseidon is the only god like that

[lament coral]

is crap?

[fallow niche]

All the other gods offer some serious main DPS choices with their mechanics

Poseidon being the only support god doesn't really make any sense

[empty locust]

cant remember what it's called but there's a hammer ability for the spear that makes it so when you throw it it explodes when it comes back to you and OH is it satisfying

[abstract pilot]

back with old zag spear i had a successful run that was just explosive launcher and poseidon on special

[fallow niche]

I don't think SG is for that either

[lament coral]

Demeters lets you chunk fools for 10% of their HP

[ocean arch]

Poseidon is good fun for room clearing imo but when you are nearly unable to kill a boss because you rely on smashing stuff into walls you're just boned

[abstract pilot]

you can just stand in one spot and fend off waves forever, lol

[lament coral]

Poseidon? Lol, they bounce twice, kek

[fallow niche]

Explosive Launcher is just very very good is all

[oblique tusk]

explosive launcher is nuts

[fallow niche]

Its one of the two best spear hammers

[oblique tusk]

esp with art

[fallow niche]

Outside of Guan Yu

[lament coral]

I'm pretty sure you can't just stand and shoot with Poseidon, solely because ranged enemies exist

[ocean arch]

GY has a different ruleset in terms of good/bad upgrades due to how different it is though

[lament coral]

in fact, you'll have to dash after enemies bouncing across the room

[ocean arch]

Which, yeah, is obvious but worth mentioning nonetheless

[lament coral]

unless you have Wave Pounding

[fallow niche]

GY has the problem of only caring about two hammer upgrades

It only has one build

Spin

[ocean arch]

Spin spin spin

[lament coral]

that's not entirely true

[fallow niche]

Make the special lifesteal and we'll get many more honestly

Yes it is

[lament coral]

you can take Special charge

and be absolutely fine

[fallow niche]

The special is inferior to Zag special and not optimal when your life total is so low

[ocean arch]

Though tbh I did have some good fun using the charged special on GY

[fallow niche]

You'll just get chunked by bosses

[lament coral]

I know, I did it. It may not be 32 heat compatible but it works on 20

[fallow niche]

I mean aren't you getting your heat artificially raised by Hell Mode?

[lament coral]

yesh?

[fallow niche]

Tho its not by a whole ton

[lament coral]

by 1

[ocean arch]

So, now with the change to hell mode not having the darkness cap, any point to it?

[fallow niche]

Not really

It had no point before

[ocean arch]

Or is it just for the hell of it, still

[lament coral]

you get 1 extra heat

[fallow niche]

Because you could darkness cap yourself normally

[slow siren]

heh, "hell of it"

[lament coral]

and you can die in a single attack sequence without Speartip

[fallow niche]

And the 1 heat you get from it is at the cost of your shotgun protection

Asterius spin will end your run

[lament coral]

well, no

[ocean arch]

Ah

[lament coral]

you can dash out

[fallow niche]

Yeah but you take FAR more damage

[ocean arch]

Wonder if they'll add incentive to do hell mode over normal

True ending or something might be locked behind it at most I reckon

[fallow niche]

I hope not

[lament coral]

no thanks

[fallow niche]

That would be bull for all the time I put on my non-hell mode save

I would literally riot

[lament coral]

I'd rather not have anything normal/hell exclusive

[fallow niche]

Definitely

[lament coral]

Dead Cells was bad enough in that regard

[tulip parcel]

oh yeah...

[ocean arch]

I somewhat doubt it, seems more like "here's a challenge mode"

[fallow niche]

Hell mode should be something you can check on and off like God Mode in any run

For added challenge

[ocean arch]

With SG being more narrative driven in their games it just seems out of character if they locked it

[fallow niche]

At your own discretion

[lament coral]

honestly, I wish Hell didn't exist

[novel python]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/457639241615409173/672574124106711050/unknown.png I should stop facetanking everything papa throws at me, don't you think

[lament coral]

just add Personal Liability to the Pact

for everyone

[fallow niche]

^^^

The fact that its tied to saves is honestly really dumb and alludes to that whole "hardcore community" thats so full of itself

in so many games

[jagged canopy]

what is a good build for Guan spear?

[fallow niche]

I play hardcore in most ARPGS I play but gosh most people who talk about they do are insufferable

@jagged canopy Spin

[ocean arch]

Yeah that sounds much better than having it tied to a separate mode

[lament coral]

Artemis/Aphrodite/Athena attack

with both spin hammers

[fallow niche]

Demeter attack is also very good

That ultra slow is nuts

Athena > Demeter > Aphrodite > else > Poseidon please god dont choose poseidon for Guan Yu

[ocean arch]

Ah

[fallow niche]

[ocean arch]

Dropped an f bomb out of habit

Whoops

[lament coral]

I like Demeter on special

[novel python]

@lament coral Zag started playing the lyre like a madman but Orpheus still won't talk to me about it

[lament coral]

easy Priv Stat proc

@novel python did you play the entire song?

until it started repeating?

[ocean arch]

As I was saying, the amount of people I know that play HC in ARPGs that look down people that don't like losing all their progress in one mistake just annoys the everliving daylights out of me

[lament coral]

it might be hard to tell

[novel python]

It keeps singing long af passages from some songs

Also the one that they practiced in the beginning

[ocean arch]

Have you done a run since?

[lament coral]

yes, just keep playing em until they start repeating, then check with Orpheus

if that still doesn't work, do a run and repeat the process

[novel python]

This really sounds like an electro accoustic guitar

more than a lyre

[lament coral]

oh, and try going to the courtyard instead of bedroom and back

I've had issues spawning people going back from the bedroom but never from the courtyard

[ocean arch]

Zag is just that good

[novel python]

Still nothing from the courtyard

[lament coral]

too bad, do a run

[novel python]

As soon as I gift Dusa some more of that good stuff

Got to 3 bottles

[ocean arch]

Which could also be removing all your darkness survival buffs and just dying in the first room to refresh the house

[lament coral]

also, Thanatos finally commented on Zag killing his dad, after 145 hours

keen observation there, Than

[ocean arch]

110 hours for me

[lament coral]

35 hour difference

how does that even happen?

[ocean arch]

He might've just been preoccupied with the war going on upstairs

Maybe recent updates added the line or activated a missing trigger

[lament coral]

bloody mortals, can't stop dying for even a minute!

[ocean arch]

I somewhat get the impression time in the underworld is a vague concept

[novel python]

One more heart to go, Dusa.

I need 4 Ambro asap.

[ocean arch]

But that's probably a conversation for a different channel

[open kettle]

Guys

I just got my first win

Omg

Using sword like I wanted

[novel python]

Grats!

[ocean arch]

Congrats!

Have fun with all the stuff you've just unlocked

Which I can't recall what you actually unlock beyond the Pact

[livid comet]

question for the hivemind

how does he raging rush work?

can you dash over gaps with it?

[abstract pilot]

i think so, but i think you can take damage from random attacks/projectiles (but not traps?)

[ocean arch]

You mean the shield charge?

[livid comet]

no

[ocean arch]

Oh spear dash

[abstract pilot]

if you mean the achilles aspect

[livid comet]

I mean raging rush from Achilles spear

yeah

ok.

[ocean arch]

Yeah you can dash over anything and through everything iirc

[livid comet]

I'm gonna post in feedback

It's weird that bull rush can't charge over gaps imo

[ocean arch]

I've had a couple times where I've just placed the spear at a spot then ran around to dash through a wall

Had no practical use other than being mildly amused like a child

[livid comet]

I'm always finding myself trying to bull rush over a gap and then getting stuck lol

[lament coral]

just dash at the end

you don't see Asterius dash over any gaps either

[livid comet]

yeah, but it slows me down lol

[lament coral]

and it's a bull rush, after all

[unborn furnace]

I'm new in this game. How hard hell mode is?

[livid comet]

tbf there aren't any gaps in that arena

[lament coral]

Hell mode just forces some modifiers on you

you can simulate it on normal

also, beating the game on Hell doesn't give you anything

[ocean arch]

@unborn furnace it removes protection from getting hit really hard, that's about it

[lament coral]

there's no difficulty exclusive content

[livid comet]

but it forces them from the getgo

[unborn furnace]

🤔

[ocean arch]

It also disables the ability to turn on God mode

[lament coral]

if you find the game too easy, you can increase the difficulty before you start teh run

just start on normal, you won't miss anything

[livid comet]

yeah

hell mode is just for bragging rights

it only makes the start harder iirc

[lament coral]

or banana brains, like meself

[novel python]

dio aphro trial or Chaos gate? Nemesis Sword, got aphro cast dio attack

[open kettle]

now that I won

where do i find some builds to try?

[unborn furnace]

Well, i'll do some runs on hell mode, if it goes bad, i'll change dif

ty guys

[livid comet]

Welp, I've posted the feedback

[lament coral]

yikes, Dio attack on Nemesis

[novel python]

That's just to proc priv stat

[lament coral]

is it even possible to get a replacement at this point?

[novel python]

thats all

I'm in tartarus still lol

[lament coral]

oh, definitely dual boon then

Chaos can wait

[novel python]

was hoping to get increased damage on cast from chaos

but ohwell

[lament coral]

why do you want cast stuff with Nemesis?

[novel python]

Wait I'm an idiot. I meant poseidon.

I really need some sleep.

[livid comet]

Oooh

Guys

what do you say about having an arena

where you can try out different builds with the boons you've managed to get before?

[ocean arch]

I'd kinda like a sandbox area

[livid comet]

It would be similar to the little trial rooms in Transistor

[ocean arch]

Like make it a place where you can pick and choose stuff you've unlocked through the prophecy lost or something

Or that

That would be neat

[livid comet]

yeah

I'm not sure if it's been suggested before

[naive talon]

I didnt play transistor, but would that be like a preset and you have to best a challenge ?

Or more sandboxy

[lament coral]

you mean like...the courtyard?

[ocean arch]

But with boons so you can mess about

[lament coral]

it's just not feature complete

[livid comet]

That's the trial rooms but there's a room where you just have access to all your functions and can fight enemies

Yeah

[ocean arch]

So it's like the courtyard but with a bit extra

[livid comet]

I would be fine with that

Also having enemies that can actually attack to test deflect etc

[ocean arch]

I would actually like a practice room to get a better feel for iframes

Atm I just don't have them down as well as I'd like and potentially burning a run just to practice isn't an appealing prospect

[livid comet]

Time to put it into #hades-feedback

wait it's been posted already nvm

[ocean arch]

Oh, should up vote that then

[livid comet]

only 4 days ago

[ocean arch]

Any keywords I should use to search for the post?

[livid comet]

practice

[ocean arch]

Tyvm

[livid comet]

yw :)

[ionic blade]

hmm

Is there any use for darkness once the mirror is full?

[ocean arch]

+5 HP per pickup in a run

Though filling mirror is quite the task

[ionic blade]

its mainly the keys that are the problem, rather than the darkness itsself

I've only got the final one to go now

[nimble wraith]

the last one is a little pricy on darkness

if you get enough darkness to max it before you have enough keys, thats impressive

[mild crag]

@ionic blade sometimes you can trade darkness to the infernal broker for actually useful resources

[ionic blade]

true

[mild crag]

Also next update I hear there's work going into other uses for darkness

So there's that to look forward to

[ionic blade]

that sounds nice

[ocean arch]

I think fated authority requires just over 100k darkness to max out?

[nimble wraith]

165k

[ocean arch]

Ah

More than I thought

[nimble wraith]

1k / 2k / 3k / 4k / 5k / 10k / 20k / 30k / 40k / 50k

[ocean arch]

Aight

[mild crag]

I just play with budget cuts anyway no issue here

[ocean arch]

Yeah that's one massive task

[mild crag]

[nimble wraith]

not like youre missing out on a whole lot when you only have 8 instead of 10 rerolls