elysium takes too long ;-;
#h1-builds-and-combat
strong flame
turbid needle
Oh man..
Yeah, Elysium can be tiresome.
I like the place and the map and all.
But its enemies are annoying.
strong flame
tartarus and asphodel i can clear really easy with like 2minutes left
but elysium is always a struggle
mild crag
Been a few feedbacks put in that tight deadline is too unforgiving for elysium
turbid needle
Well, for now it is supposedly to be the pre-last area, so , they wanted to make it challenging.
mild crag
6/7/8/9 is better deadline than 7 flat
turbid needle
Kossetsu, like, starting in 6 mins?
mild crag
6 minutes for Tartarus then increasing by 1 for each zone
mild crag
It used to be something similar
strong flame
9 is a bit too high for satyr
mild crag
But it increased by 2 for each zone
turbid needle
Was hoping we could have like save add on our timer on the new timer or something.
mild crag
Which made the timer an non issue
Which is why it got balanced to this
But now it's too difficult
turbid needle
Yeah...
mild crag
But as it stands
stray frigate
Hades when killed: See... You... At...Home
Hades meets Zag at home: Your presenet is not welcomed here
turbid needle
I don't wanna run without darkness or with such low healing items or whatever, and sacrificing the deadline is kind of rough, even at 9.
stray frigate
mild crag
I have 2 min left in Tartarus, 1 min left in Asphodel and I run out at the boss in elysium so I think it's pretty close but not quite balanced
stray frigate
shield is totally op
honest raven
Do you keep the speed/dodge bonus from Hermes' trinket if you swap it out at the change of a floor, or lose it?
mild crag
Lose it
honest raven
Thought so
mild crag
@strong flame 9 is fine for Styx if you get screwed by the sack
Hard to have deadline there since its so rng
Maybe it should just give you like 2 minutes each wing
honest raven
If you have the upgrades to both Nectar and Poms... Does the Pom from getting Nectar get the upgraded Pom effect?
mild crag
Nectar always gives +1 level to something random with the upgrade
What's the Pom upgrade I've forgotten
honest raven
The upgrade to Poms make Poms give a rarity upgrade in addition to their normal effect
mild crag
Such an upgrade exists?
stray frigate
6 bounces
and zeus doesnt bounce
eh
i still need 2 zeus boons
2 duo boons
this shield upgrade
and other stuff
uh
@mild crag did u do chaos fated list?
mild crag
I'm not sure sorri
turbid needle
AHHHH
I got the boon that drops a random assortment of stuff from Poseidon
And then I went into the exit because the stuff was all over the exit
So I didn't get my healing
gray lintel
rip
turbid needle
Cool, died because of it
gray lintel
limpid tapir
Aha, nicely done š
serene nexus
Okay. How the heck do you deal with Theseus? His shield makes things way too difficult.
mild crag
Wait for him to throw his spear at you
After he recalls it
He always walks away from you
So hit him in the back then
grim adder
most of the minions in Elysium train you for the bosses
he's a lot like a shield-bearer
spare elk
I had the railgun and got seeking arrows with crit and it was insane until hades removed my head
serene nexus
My strategy of pelting to death with Dioās cast didnāt work that well.
Trying again with Nemesis Blade and Iāve got to say, I really like the special and normal weaving. Got weak on the special and doom on the normal
Need a decent cast though. Iāve got Athenaās dash which is really useful
mild crag
Would be better swapped imo but sounds neat
Special doom deals more damage and you want the higher attack bonus to benefit from the crit bonus
Athena dash best dash
serene nexus
The attempt where I failed was a hades spear dash build with triple dash, chaos boon, and Athena dash
oak owl
I just spam dash around him
serene nexus
Unfortunately it fell flat with Theseus blocking half of my attacks
mild crag
In my experience the best spear builds involve abusing special
serene nexus
And each spear throw chunking me for 20 hp
mild crag
Protip recalling your spear special hits Thesus in the back
So he can't really block it
spare cobalt
The spear throw counters shield bearing enemies, but it'll be slow going unless you've found a decent upgrade or two to boost it.
mild crag
Take Artemis and the one that gives crit chance on recall
spare cobalt
Hades spear vs. Theseus is mostly about knowing his openings and dodging a lot.
turbid needle
I wish any of the spear Aspects played better with Flurry Jab.
mild crag
Nice try flurry jabber
Maybe if there were an aspect for each attack in a short period had increasing damage
Like each attack you do in half a second of the previous one has its damage increased
Then you can flurry jab em like crazy
spare cobalt
Yeah, flurry kinda just makes your spear worse unless you're on Zag aspect, and even then it's a so-so trade.
turbid needle
I'd say Hades Aspect, but that requires you to spin attack to set it.
And okay, technically Achilles buffs it.
strong flame
theseus spear misses you everytime if you just continue walking from a distance
mild crag
Spear basic attacks have a nice animation would like to see them more utilised
Spamming special is the best but
It's just sorta wacky
Not cool enough
last nacelle
I wish the spear had a basic swipe somehow, because it's not always easy to charge a spin attack.
grim adder
Iām curious if you can get vengeful mood just taking Zeus and Ares revenge boons
turbid needle
Yes.
grim adder
That technically frees up the 5 action slots to take all 7 gods at once
So with... 11 boons you could have Duos with all the gods
gray lintel
friendship is magical
stuck bough
Haven't really tried zeus's attack boon, what does it do exactly?
mild crag
I think the way the game influences the pool of gods its not possible to get them all
grim adder
I think itās possible with the right application of keepsakes and rerolls
mild crag
Rerolls usually roll to gods you already have
grim adder
You need to force as many early on and the later keepsakes let you fill the gaps
mild crag
There's a pool of about 4 gods it'll keep giving you
strong flame
also don't you need to have specific boons to get certain duos?
mild crag
You do yes
grim adder
If you have 4 by the time you leave the first zone youāre set
strong flame
you need a way to make enemies weak, poison, knockback, doom, rift blades etc
timber tiger
So I can't tell if it's a bug or a feature that the spear special can delete the rings that Hades spawns?
grim adder
Sounds like a cool bug
gray lintel
zeus's attack boon gives like 10-14 damage chain lightning on attack
timber tiger
It's an unfortunate bug because it sort of just makes the vases pile up
mild crag
Break the vases yourself
timber tiger
well, that's definitely not annoying to do
grim adder
Has anyone experienced weird damage spikes around charmed enemies?
gray lintel
i think that's known yes
grim adder
I canāt tell if thatās a bug or a feature
mild crag
Yes it's a bug
gray lintel
charmed enemies get a damage boost to keep up with player damage, and sometimes they hit you anyway
spare cobalt
The damage from Zeus's attack boon is flat rather than percentile, so it favors rapid light attack weapons. It can bounce up to 4 times, doing less each time.
mild crag
Charmed enemies deal increased damage and it affects you too
grim adder
Ah, yeah Iāve been avoiding charmed because of it
gray lintel
so yeah something that deals 5 damage might get boosted to deal 100
mild crag
Yeah it's disastrously coded it would seem so good idea to avoid it til they fix it
grim adder
Itās a shame, I like how certain characters laugh when Aphroditeād
mild crag
I managed to use aphrodite's legendary to good effect against hades since it kept cancelling his attacks
But playing ranged I can get away with it since I was out of his attack range regardless
He just sorta chuckled to himself as he died
stuck bough
what weapon is good to have the zeus attack boon on?
turbid needle
Rail.
timber tiger
Nothing š
mild crag
@timber tiger almost true lol
timber tiger
the flat damage is so low š¦
spare cobalt
Rail uses it best and I don't know if any other weapon wants it ever.
mild crag
Zeus attack and special are both a joke
turbid needle
Flurry Jab on the spear and Flurry Slash on the sword can work.
stuck bough
mostly like zeus' dash
spare cobalt
Zeus special's good on Zeus shield, fittingly.
timber tiger
Even for rail artemis with the reload attack is the best
turbid needle
But they're pretty weak next to the rail.
timber tiger
like a million damage on a single shot
stuck bough
so zeus attack boon is good on things that attack rapidly?
turbid needle
Yes.
grim adder
āGoodā is relative
mild crag
"most effective on" then
spare cobalt
It's not a good attack boon. Except on the rail, because the rail's unmodified primary fire is like tossing a handful of dried peas at whatever you're fighting.
mild crag
But if you put hestia on it becomes pointless again
grim adder
His attack and cast both do chain lightening, itās best against large numbers clustered and applied with lots of shots
mild crag
I feel like they need to change Zeus so it arcs for a percentage of your damage or something
Which would funnily enough make it bad on the rail and good on everything else
turbid needle
It's fine as it is. Eris Rail with lots of Zeus boons is top tier DPS.
gray lintel
eh damage on the rail would have to be boosted slightly i think that might be partly why rail damage is low right now
granted rail has like the best special
turbid needle
Hestia is good.
spare cobalt
I saw someone suggest that the Zeus bolt's damage be averaged over its targets. So, if there's just one enemy, all the damage is concentrated on that enemy.
grim adder
If you take the zag rail does the special get taken out of the pool?
turbid needle
?
spare cobalt
The special does not use ammo.
grim adder
I mean the upgrade, the hammer that gives infinite ammo
turbid needle
I don't think so.
pastel jolt
no
gray lintel
it would be kind of neat if hestia with infinity clip had the hestia effect on every shot, but with a delay
mild crag
No
grim adder
Basically renders the aspect pointless
pastel jolt
then donāt take it?
gray lintel
go from a machine gun to a sniper rifle
grim adder
So why have the two overlap?
gray lintel
spare cobalt
There's a few Daedalus/aspect interactions that need to be looked at.
gray lintel
honestly I think the infinity thing needs to be taken out or altered as it doesn't work well at all with two of tthe three aspects
gray lintel
it's also not really very interesting just QOL
grim adder
I still feel the way you can stack attack, dash, and dash attack all together is broken sometimes
turbid needle
Flurry Fire.
grim adder
Maybe when you stack ammo upgrades they double up the shots?
turbid needle
I actually do wanna try Zag Aspect with Flurry Fire.
30 shots has gotta be fun with Epic Swift Strike.
pastel jolt
i miss cooling chamber
grim adder
Some of the most fun I had with the rail was the shotgun upgrade with explosive shot
turbid needle
Dash to reload rounds?
grim adder
Is there some Karma in your life unresolved?
crisp iris
well I had to do 20-30 runs before I ran inti reworked sysphus
once
So maybe
Are you able to get boons and upgrades that cancels each other out?
turbid needle
Kinda, yeah.
grim adder
At least you can sell them :p
crisp iris
Ok thank god dread flight cannot be comvined with zeus aspect
on Hades Varatha run
accidentally gets Flurry Jab
oh no
gray lintel
dash to reload rounds sounds broken with hestia lol
crisp iris
wait that exists
grim adder
Itās a shame Explosive Return doesnāt combine with Chaos aspect but thatād be broken
hot edge
dash to reload is almost the same as never reload
its pretty rare that I get to stand still and shoot 13 shots without dashing
pastel jolt
but it is more interesting
gray lintel
there are attacks in tthe game that aren't dash attacks?
hot edge
yeah for sure
crisp iris
Hestia does have dash attack issues though
Delays the next round
So the dash attack is nullified
mild crag
Nullified in what sense
grim adder
I think explosive return is bugged in an exploitable way, it seems to penetrate geometry
So you can hide behind a column and spam special to kill things
crisp iris
Dash attacks with rail makes it so you shoot quick in succession for first 2-3 rounds
Hestia has empowered first shot, but delays the subsequent shots
So it deals more dmg, but the dash attack itself is reduced in effectiveness
turbid needle
I'm really not seeing the issue if you've got Hunter Dash or a big Chaos boon.
Hey, could someone tell, plz, what does Hera Aspect of the Bow do? Can't get it at all.
hot edge
lets you load casts into attacks
gray lintel
press right click like you're going to cast
instantly with zero cast time and delay it's added to your next attack
hot edge
if you press cast it just uses a charge, then when you attack it also fires the cast at whatever the attack hits
can load multiple at once
its š
gray lintel
when you hit anything with your next attack it fires the cast from that location
gray lintel
i once got hunting blades with hera
crisp iris
Really?
hot edge
because his cast does CRAZY damage
gray lintel
hogod that was ez
hot edge
in a big aoe
crisp iris
Though it makes sense
hot edge
its supposed to be hard to hit or something
but when its on your attack, not that hard!
gray lintel
it's kinda basically infinite cast time decrease because you just load casts onto a regular attack it's lovely
hot edge
I for one love the amount of auto aim in this game
turbid needle
Yeah, got it, thx
hot edge
that could be an interesting pact though lol
no auto aim, gives more heat if used with rail or bow
in reality probably is just terrible
crisp iris
It'd be no problem on KBM tho
hot edge
you have to aim everything on kbm?
strong flame
It autoaims on pc too
hot edge
I assumed it still snapped onto targets
crisp iris
I want to have controller's movement but KMB targeting ngl
Makes rail a lil funky to use on controller tbh
If it's only controller
oak owl
whats the best companion?
grim adder
āBestā is subjective
crisp iris
I need to check if it's possible to use dual stick control on ranged weapons
grim adder
Than hits the hardest but has a lag landing it
mild crag
How does ranged weapon targeting work on gamepad?
mild crag
Oh that sounds like hell
crisp iris
I keep missing Hestia shots
mild crag
KBM is heaven for Hestia
crisp iris
Yeah, I want dual stick for that tbh
mild crag
So you're telling me kiting isn't possible
grim adder
I like bouldy for the income
crisp iris
Yeah very hard to kite with controller
Again, I don't know if I can dual stick this
So maybe thru that it can be fixed
Speaking of which, taking the books of DMC5, I wonder if Hades can benefit from having separate contol schemes for each weapon
mild crag
High heat on gamepad must be a meme
crisp iris
P much
Loterally dashes into the boss as my kiting is near impossible
I wonder if I can link my flight joystick and Mouse for gameplay
mild crag
Not arguing I literally didn't know how controller movement worked
If only Zag stayed in the centre of the screen it would be easy to place the mouse cursor
Twin stick is having the right stick aim relative to your character right?
turbid needle
Yes.
stuck bough
the only thing annoying with the hestia aspect for me on controller is pushing the right control stick to reload
mild crag
That does sound not ideal
turbid needle
Yeah, that'd get a quick remap.
halcyon cedar
yeah, i rebind my reload key from R3 to touch pad (DS4) (so i just need click / press touch pad once)
because i hate people set most frequent used key on L3 R3 key
feels like will spoil my joy stick faster
karmic coyote
r3 isn't too bad for me, probably because i was already familiar with other games
mild crag
L2 and R2
halcyon cedar
trigger is fine, because it is just call gods 9R2)
i forget what's L2 for
and i play it , i rarely get boon for calling gods lol
mostly fill in cast, specials and attack first, or damage resist
crisp iris
Remapping dash to my trigger was the saving grace for this game
thorny edge
L2 is for summons/companions
i remapped it for reload, i think the default is R3 but at least on my end there's no graphic for that button
mild crag
Does moving the right stick do anything?
thorny edge
nope
mild crag
How do you aim rail special or festive fog
thorny edge
it sorta auto targets an enemy
mild crag
Interesting
thorny edge
i had a run where i used both, it like, worked?
didnt win, i havent beaten hades yet but thats more down to me sucking i believe xD
during the Theseus fight my special and fog were hitting where i wanted but trying to aim Attack with asterius chasing me was slightly awkward
mild crag
Since you'd have to walk towards him to aim huh
feral laurel
vestal umbra
Alecto is the hardest for me I think
mild crag
Enjoy the searing heat of asphodel
vestal umbra
Mostly because I get tripped up by the spinning blades.
mild crag
Alecto has some annoying spike trap placements too
vestal umbra
Tisiphone is the easiest sister imo
icy garnet
I think Tisiphone is the hardest with heat boss difficulty
but maybe Meg is harder, didn't have that many runs with heated Meg
mild crag
With extreme measures I think tisiphone is hardest
Cause when she shrinks the room then alecto starts dropping spinny blades
That's heck
azure bone
Tisiphone is easy if you got a good high damage combo early
if you dont, you'll take a lotta damage
vestal umbra
I haven't tried extreme measures yet
azure bone
extreme measures is literally same fight, but the other sisters do their attacks perodically
vestal umbra
I've only been up to heat 3 so far
azure bone
the only fight that changes entirely for it is the elysium boss, hydra just has a makeover of his room and gets a new mechanic at the end
mild crag
Should consider turning off your other options and just use extreme measures
To get used to the new fights
vestal umbra
Haven't even managed a heat-free run with the bow yet because I'm bad at it.
Yeah maybe
gray lintel
i feel meg's the easiest one. the ragey person is kind of annoying with annoying patterns, and MURDEEEEER is the hardest(she ironically is easier on extreme measures for me)
split arch
I feel like such a dumb dumb for pouring in a lot of blood into the rail
I wish I put some in the shield and spear, only have one tic on the spear and one on the shield
only beat up to heat 2, haven't beaten the game on bow either
vestal umbra
Spear is what I'm the best with
split arch
spear is definitely good but rail with triple special can be amazing
azure bone
shield is extremely strong without any blood input in it
split arch
it can be with the right boons obv
azure bone
Rail is fun, the triple special isn't even needed. It's really flexible
DOesn't even need right boons
spark shuttle
the furthest i have gotten is with rail just because of how godd the hammer upgrades are
split arch
yeah you really need the hammer upgrades for rail
azure bone
the fact you're invulnerable from the front while holding up shield means so long you're not rushing you can very easily complete everything with minimal damage
spark shuttle
the one that turns it into a shotgun is super fun
split arch
explosive shotgun
azure bone
poseidan shotgun rail is hilariously fun
spark shuttle
i also has the one where it dealt aoe and stutters them
split arch
with hades push back
spark shuttle
both just make it a breeze
vestal umbra
I like the triple bomb
split arch
i mena not hades push back
spark shuttle
i had that as well
split arch
the posedian like dissenith was saying
mild crag
Hestia rail yis yis best weapon
Take piercing fire and never have trouble with shields again
azure bone
piercing fire crit shots hestia rail
spark shuttle
i feel like the spear doesnt feel unique enough to me
azure bone
second spear aspect is incredibly unique to play, as are spin builds
vestal umbra
Spear with Achilles aspect feels pretty unique
spark shuttle
but i dont think a weapon should have to have a certain build for it to feel like its worth playing with compared to the other weapons
clever adder
this was my first game getting a bunch of blade rift synergies. hunting blades + vicious cycle + engulfing vortex made the final fight trivial
mild crag
Hunting blades is possibly the best boon in the game this is true
azure bone
Not gonna lie aphrodite, ares, and cast builds in general are really overtuned
especially aphrodite
azure bone
why does she has the highest damage of all, while also having the best debuff of all
mild crag
Cause reasons
vestal umbra
I dunno, the bow is still what I mainly struggle with.
azure bone
its less that deflect is OP and more having at least one athena buff is really decent
clever adder
don't forget it's also easy to hit with
azure bone
I feel like athena should be 'hermes' like
spark shuttle
i feel like once you get defelect on attack and dash on either spear shield or sword you dont have to think about running into groups of enemies
clever adder
i hear athena is good but i don't really get it
azure bone
Deflect on dash + slowed enemy projectiles is extremely good combo
vestal umbra
I like Athena's dash the most
spark shuttle
imagine for example you have deflect on dash
azure bone
but having one kind of deflect means you can easily counter so many things
gray lintel
weak is good defensively but doesn't really offensively do much I guess
spark shuttle
you dont need to thnk about where you need to go to dodge it only that you just have to dash and it defelcts it
azure bone
unlike other gods that need a secondary boon to add a status (jolted, exposed, etc)
err not exposed
the 50% damage with 2 status thing
vestal umbra
Weak + poison is nuts
spark shuttle
i never get dionysus
azure bone
Aphrodite combines with literally anything
gray lintel
the main combo I know of to get two statuses on one thing is posidon + zeus
spark shuttle
y because every single enemy is affected by weaken
azure bone
she has the highest base damage on all her moves, despite also having weakness on everything
gray lintel
but yes weak is strong
vestal umbra
Well poison and weak both last awhile mostly.
gray lintel
athena also IMO combines with everything and athena dash is IMO the best dash
azure bone
athena works well with anything, but she's kinda like hermes
building around athena doesn't really work. but having at least one buff from her is super useful
gray lintel
because it can apply exposed easily, is good defensively because of deflect
azure bone
Yep
spark shuttle
thats why i take the athena artefact on the first floor then switch after
azure bone
I don't grab athena artifact until second floor, since oftentimes I don't need it early
gray lintel
her cast is nice too, I like athena + zeus duo
azure bone
and there's a chance it'll just show up
gray lintel
i'm still kinda trying to get a run with the rifts that suck in people
i wanna see if the sucky rifts proc Sea Storm too kinda
serene nexus
Made it to Hades Phase two... wtf. Any ideas how to avoid the laser beams? Iām pretty proud I got it to that far though.
gray lintel
there are objects in the area that block pathing and attacks
vestal umbra
Dash behind cover
azure bone
dash behind cover, if using shield just hold up shield
vestal umbra
Or pop a call if it's charged and one of the ones that makes you impervious
azure bone
You mean pop ares call because idk why you'd use anything else
vestal umbra
I mean, fair
gray lintel
athena call is a pretty decent second for me, makes you invuln while still being able to shoot
azure bone
Ares call is athena's invul + zues's damage with double the duration
Yea but if going an ares build you wont out damage the blade rift from ares call
in the same time-frame as athena's invul
give the fact its like double the duration of athena's
gray lintel
if going an ares build sure
azure bone
even if not going ares build
gray lintel
i still think athena's a close second
vestal umbra
I've gotten decent damage out of Poseidon's
azure bone
Its really just ares but worse. I'd put aphrodite as being the only call on the same level as ares
the fact you can charm bosses and it inturrupts whatever they are doing is so good
native cipher
poseidon and ares call are only better than athena's if you can get more damage out of their effects than you would with your weapons during the duration
clever adder
@serene nexus mostly i hide behind cover, but also he only spins so fast. so you can dash to get ahead of the beams, and then just walk in an arc around him
native cipher
which often you cannot
azure bone
yea, and often you cant unless running a really bursty build and you're not using it to block an invul-phase boss attack
native cipher
dude if youre not trying to go for a high burst build then you arent surviving high heat runs regardless of call
azure bone
athena's buff is half the duration of ares, so you gotta take that into consideration. do 6 seconds of damage vs 12 seconds of ares
Well ofc, the issue is a lot of high burst builds are ares builds anyways
so like, might as well get ares call
native cipher
tqbh i get more damage out of artemis than ares
doom damage tends to fall off like a brick where crit scales incredibly hard
azure bone
if referring to artemis cast I wouldn't be surprised if that gets nerfed
native cipher
cast and attack on artemis are both immaculate
vestal umbra
I've not really had success with Athena's call. I think Poseidon and Ares have the best ones.
azure bone
I love how athena's call is just her dash attack without the dash part if you don't use a full ch arged version
I haven't ever used poseidon or dion's call D:
native cipher
poseidon's call theoretically does a lot of damage
dion's call is supposed to but doesnt
native cipher
and implying you can land all your shots
vestal umbra
Poseidon's can be a lil hard to control.
azure bone
I just wish poseidon works vs bosses
cause its so bloody fun, but then you hit the last boss and you hit like a wet noodle
(comparatively)
vestal umbra
It works on the fury sisters and the elysium bosses.
native cipher
poseidon is like, bottom billing when it comes to gods. i'll take him if i have no other choice, but all of his boons are objectively worst in slot.
azure bone
For bosses yea, but there are some crazy buffs to his
turbid needle
Poseidon's boons are amazing wtf
azure bone
his attack on rail is super good purely because it adds stagger to it
vestal umbra
He's got an insane duo too
native cipher
yeah if you can get +50% reward quantity early on it's pretty good
vestal umbra
Exclusive access
azure bone
and poseidons knockbacks work on shielded enemies
native cipher
his cast is C tier
turbid needle
Am I the only one who thinks that Dionysis has really weak boons and that Poison is total crap?
azure bone
Oh yea his cast is meh
turbid needle
Poseidon's cast does mad damage though, esp with the right build
azure bone
I literally don't grab anything Dionysis anymore. if I see I'm gonna get his boon I'll reroll it
vestal umbra
I think poison is pretty good
native cipher
dio has weak boons. poison really does not do enough damage
turbid needle
Poison would have fine damage if it didn't drop off so quickly
Or if it could permanently stack
azure bone
https://streamable.com/meoss @native cipher thats a poseidon spin build. Worked well until hades
ignore the loss of DD, I had to fight extreme measures meg with a -60% speed buff and no dash buffs cause I was dumb
vestal umbra
I guess I haven't made it that far into the hardcore stuff though.
native cipher
thats only 3 heat
azure bone
Ok, it still literally instagibs entire rooms with damage to spare
I was just doing it for funyou can crank up the heat and it wouldn't change
native cipher
poseidon is really good in the temple of styx because the cramped rooms guarentee wall slams
native cipher
but thats one fourth of the game
azure bone
elysium as well since the knockback works on knockback immune enemies
like shielded guys
can easily knock them into traps
turbid needle
Blows how much you can't knock back bosses
azure bone
and the knockback works on minotaur surprisingly so that was nice
vestal umbra
It works on Theseus too
azure bone
yea but theseus is a non threat once you get good at dodging his spear throw
vestal umbra
True
azure bone
and hes easier on extreme measures
native cipher
yeah tbqh the hardest boss fight on extreme measures is hydra
mild crag
Agree
azure bone
Yea I'll agree there, alternatively meg can be hardest if you go into her fight without the right stuff cause unlucky
or go into her fight with a -60% speed chaos debuff D:
mild crag
Alecto with speed down is death
native cipher
i generally dont take choas gates if im close to an act boss
and alecto just has soft one-shots with her spinning blades
azure bone
I take every chaos gate just cause I love the aesthetic
idc if it takes me to 1hp imma do it
turbid needle
Me: "This aspect is for a special build!"
Game: "Attack build run š "
vestal umbra
Chaos sounds so cool
native cipher
i like his goblin sash
vestal umbra
Thought Chaos was a they
turbid needle
Is Chaos' pronoun really that important?
native cipher
they are a they
although i think the lack of tiddies was a sign of cowardace on the visual team's part
i want full baphomet when it comes to my eldrich horrors
turbid needle
which is especially weird since we've already got nude aphrodite
Hey, she's not nude
She's just a Bayonetta fan
azure bone
I mean why does chaos need bewbs
turbid needle
Of all the characters I don't think a primordial titan like Chaos would care much about pronouns. Or secondary attraction characteristics such as a chest.
vestal umbra
True
turbid needle
then why is chaos so hot
azure bone
the fact chaos is chaos means its subverting your expectation by not having breasts.
truely chaotic
chaos is a better diva than aphrodite tho
turbid needle
Maybe you're an ancap?
azure bone
Just look at that pose
native cipher
jawline and facial structure are mostly mascule. the point is for them to be an androgenous and i feel like they have too many masculine traits and not enough feminine ones.
azure bone
But its chaos, it doesn't have to be androgenous
it coulda taken a masculine appearance cause its talking to zag
turbid needle
I'm less worried about how masculine Chaos' face is and more so the fact he's got EARTH in between his fingers.
azure bone
I like how in the art the hand not holding earth is ripping reality apart
if you look at the textures around the fingers
native cipher
i like how the goblin sash has flowers growing from it
azure bone
Its hard to see since the dialogue box hides it
Hey the image is png I wonder how it'd look on discord
Yo the reality tearing part works on discord thats cool
turbid needle
Super low res
turbid needle
I don't see what you mean about the reality tearing thing
azure bone
his fingers are dragging and pulling the outside to the inside
it looks better in game with the background changes
azure bone
I just noticed his 'hair' is stretched skin
native cipher
i see that he has head wings and i guess that's where hypnos' went.
peak cloak
Chaos 
spark shuttle
if you give choas a nectar you get a really great artefact
native cipher
imho chaos egg really aint that spectacular
spark shuttle
i mean for the first floor the ability to take a load of choas gates with little to no worry is quite good
azure bone
I only grab chaos egg if the fountain after first boss has a chaos spawn gurantee thing
native cipher
doesn't force a spawn like olympain trinkets do and health is a resource that can be restored later on
turbid needle
chaos egg is aight if you find a ton of gates but that never happens
azure bone
like I check the fountain and, if it has a chaos purchase item i'll buy it then swap to cosmic egg for the huge % rarity buff
bonus if I can get a +rarity at the shop at same time
native cipher
yeah always purchase the stuff to force a choas spawn
turbid needle
love using egg and not finding chaos once and then having them spawn in the first room of the next biome
azure bone
getting an epic chaos buff after first boss is really really nice since tartarus is super easy
peak cloak
Is Bow as op as I find it?
azure bone
No
native cipher
falls off like a brick once you hit elysium
falls even further when you start playing with heat
vestal umbra
I suck ass with the bow
native cipher
really fun with hera aspect
peak cloak
If you use explosive shot and get lucky with attack boons it seems to melt enemies
azure bone
Yea but 'if you get lucky' on anything else means you delete rooms in <1 second
vestal umbra
Bow is the only weapon I haven't finished with yet.
azure bone
Its my lowest on the heat gauge. Hera builds are the only way I can win with the bow
unless I get lucky and get 300% damage on distant enemies
native cipher
bow's actually my highest heat guage
novel tapir
Same
azure bone
Shield/rail/sword/spear are all tied for me
vestal umbra
Yeah I just unlocked that, I just haven't gotten around to using it yet.
azure bone
I do them one after another
native cipher
i do them as they have darkness buffs
novel tapir
I love chiron too much to play other weapons
vestal umbra
Spear>rail>shield>sword>bow for me
native cipher
nyx cowl
azure bone
If it was a gems buff it'd be another story
vestal umbra
My fastest run so far was with spear and it was the first weapon I cleared with
split arch
azure bone
Mine was literally a poseidan aspect sword run I decided to speed run with to prove a point
native cipher
||real talk, nyx cowl is so op in the first half of the game. makes darkness basically heal you to full||
azure bone
Yea, problem is unless at really high heat you wont take much damage early game <_<
split arch
that's kinda cool
native cipher
100% at rank 3
azure bone
idk how high it scales cause I never use it
clever adder
i only got the game when it released on steam, so my highest heat is only like 4 or something. how high do the good players play at?
split arch
the sword keepsake thingie that makes you invun for burst damage is the best imo
vestal umbra
I'm still working on just leveling keepsakes right now
split arch
I mean you can change things around in the first part and not do sword
azure bone
@clever adder 5 heat honestly is the minimum. Play with extreme measures and don't turn it off
Idk why you wouldn't leave it on
split arch
like coin or boon. I've done a few peirced butterfly runs which were nice
native cipher
only keepsakes i have to level are the poseidon keepsake, chaos keepsake, hermes, and euridycie
azure bone
I always use a god boon first
native cipher
generally if you go owl > rose for the first 2 biomes its basically a free win
azure bone
then, at the end of first part I'll check if there's a chaos trove. If yes I'll use cosmic egg. If no i'll use athena boon if I don't have an athena buff yet.
vestal umbra
I'm working on Athena's atm, Poseidon's I just finished leveling
native cipher
currently im trying to figure out how to unlock battie so i can get meg summon
azure bone
afaik its linked to thanatos
native cipher
but she stopped accepting nectar and won't accept ambrosia
azure bone
I had an event where thanatos showed up and theyt alked
after that, it continued by her showing up in zag's room after each run
and then I could give ambrosia
native cipher
well i just got than to max rank
azure bone
Hrm idk then
native cipher
so here's hoping meg triggers soon
azure bone
All I know is after fighting her and winning she appeared in zag's room
but yea, it took like... 10 runs
native cipher
she's appeared in my room once
azure bone
after maxing her out before it happened
she'll appear a second time
then you can give her ambrosia
native cipher
guess i'll have to farm that then
azure bone
so this is really bad but I know I'd do better if I used summons
I've had summons forever now, first skelly and now megs
and I still have never used them once
I jsut constantly forget they exist
vestal umbra
I have Than's summon but haven't used it yet
azure bone
I need to use them more on warden rooms
native cipher
than's summon is a "win this boss" button
takes off half the health bar of either theseus or the minotaur
azure bone
I imagine meg's is really good for the battle barge
vestal umbra
I don't think you can use summons on Hades
azure bone
I can't seem to use summons on hades fight
split arch
I'm so bad at hades final the first time I won against him I had to turn on god boon
azure bone
I tried with meg when I remembered it existed
native cipher
okay hear me out
aphrodite on attack
it will win you the hades fight i promise you.
azure bone
Yea aphrodite is so absurdly good
native cipher
double your effective hp
clever adder
also aphrodite on cast
native cipher
yes
azure bone
aphrodite on cast inturrupts all his most dangerous abilities
native cipher
aphrodite is best in slot for everything sans dash and call
azure bone
and even on call she's super good vs bosses
native cipher
oh yeah, 2500 free damage
azure bone
charming minotaur is really useful
oh, I moreso meant the fact the charm works on bosses
native cipher
it only works on bosses other than hades
azure bone
so like vs hades you can use the non-full charge version every time hades goes to use laser
it works on hades
Just not like
full duration
it still inturrupts him
native cipher
worst is a toss up between either zeus or dio
azure bone
but you have to stand so close to get use out of it and chances are you'd take tons of damage
same with dio yea
split arch
yeah aphrodite is definitely strong
clever adder
zeus call is especially bad if you care about seeing what's happening on the screen at all
native cipher
aphro and artemis are my 2 favorites
split arch
I try to do double curses on runs to get that extra damage
but on this bow run I just wanted to do critical and poisden dash
native cipher
then the invuln calls are all pretty decent
split arch
I did have heroic zeus cast but I sold it to see if I can get an extra life and hades
I mean hermes**
vestal umbra
I like Poseidon's call the most because you skate around and knock peeps around like bowling pins.
native cipher
best girl call can just be spammed on cooldown
azure bone
oh god
starting a rail run
rare heartbreak strike, rare heartbreak flourish, epic aphrodite's aid in first room
its the aspect with the manual reload shot
native cipher
take heartbreak strike imho
azure bone
Yea
although I 'really' want to wait for poseidan for the strike
being able to inturrupt on every shot of the rail is way more useful than any other god buff
unless I get lucky and get the stagger on hammer upgrade
native cipher
yeah i keep forgetting that the rail doesnt have stagger
split arch
yeah I have 1 death defy and 147 life I'm not going to win this without god boon
:((
time to cheat
here goes nothing
turbid needle
what's that thing just above pressure points?
split arch
I died I got him on his 2nd life 1/4 life left
god boon me cheating for hades
to try not to waste this run
split arch
I feel like a dumb dumb I didn't know youc ouldn't summon on hades
I just got the than summon
and I saved both charges for hades
azure bone
man tisiphone's fight is 100% 'does the other fury use a bouncing blade? If yes god help you, if not free win.
azure bone
Yea, if you have extreme measures on the other furies help them
split arch
oohhh
azure bone
tisiphone shrinks the room
azure bone
so if you fight in the tiny room with bouncing blades
split arch
hahhaha I just realized with the weapons and blood unlocks
they don't stack
you have to choose which version you want to use
oh my god hahah
chaos boons are so good
I almost always go for them
native cipher
exit wounds + fast reload = pog
azure bone
exit woudns + artimes cast + fast casting + extra casts + poseidan aspect = instagib hades
mild crag
dw we can clarify names just ask 
split arch
you know the mirror upgrades for boon rarity has anyone tested to see if it's better to have 25% epic and 25% rare. Like does the rare mirror percent ever downgrade chaos boon potential
like lets say I have max rare mirror and epic mirror
It says 38% or whatever for rare
mild crag
I wondered about that too
split arch
do you think it ever conflicts with chaos boon stuff
like when I first upgraded that I just did epic first and saved keys
there were a few runs where I had like tons and tons of full 3 epics and then once I started doing the rare from mirror I stopped seeing 3 epics
so idk I guess I'll test it
native cipher
why doesn't rank with olympians effect boon rarity?
azure bone
damn... +62 hp but hides rewards for 4 chambers
mild crag
Greatness at any cost
split arch
I always take boon rarity
mild crag
Easy just don't step in traps
split arch
or damage
azure bone
Yea but this late in the game
azure bone
by the time the boon switches over I only have tower of styx boons
split arch
didn't know that about ur run
native cipher
tbqh i'd take the max health until you have 300
azure bone
Yea I"m at 115 hp
native cipher
how
mild crag
Sounds like a hp pick
azure bone
I just haaaate the hidden chambers
native cipher
like how do you get to elysium with only 115 hp
azure bone
becuase I end up grabbing gem/darkness rooms all the time
Just bad luck
literally no HP increase rooms
split arch
have you guys ever altered a darkness chamber and have it turn into a boon
mild crag
No
split arch
yeah I thought so
mild crag
Tis not possible
prisma zephyr
only blue rooms can reroll into other blue rooms (keys, darkness, gems)
mild crag
Darkness will only change to nectar, gems or keys
prisma zephyr
and nectar, yeah
mild crag
Rerolling them is worthless
prisma zephyr
pre' much
mild crag
Because the best result is a key for a fated authority which you just wasted rerolling it
prisma zephyr
or nectar for the random upgrade but it's not really worth it
mild crag
Do your best!
azure bone
no call
mild crag
prisma zephyr
gl !
native cipher
i kind of do that all the time lol
azure bone
I just noticed there's no voice channels here, was gonna stream me getting my rear kicked \o/
native cipher
i dont take attack or special upgrades unless they're best in slot
azure bone
Yep
Woo
I only lose one DD
lost*
Which is cause he hit me one time for like 40 damage and I started the fight with 20hp so honestly not as bad as it coulda gone
native cipher
someone didnt have an aphrodite boon
azure bone
I have it on special, but it was his charge attack
I lack any dash increases or move speed increases so dodging it was hard :(
random question, does the rocket bomb have higher base damage than the regular arced shot?
native cipher
rocket bomb does 80 damage
native cipher
test on skelly how much the vanilla shot does
azure bone
I'm mid-run and got a hammer, jus trying to pick
native cipher
tbh i prefer the arch shot over the rocket
azure bone
spread fire, infinity chamber, or rocket bomb
yea
I wish I had the 75% slow one, its so good
mild crag
Gonna be a hard rocket bomb from me there
native cipher
do you already have the 3 at a time one?
azure bone
I'm running hestia, and yea I do
mild crag
Easiest rocket bomb of my life
native cipher
are you before or after elysium?
azure bone
after
native cipher
rocket bomb
its easier to deal with shield nerds with the arch shot
but since shield nerds are no longer a problem
mild crag
I know they removed back stab from normal special
Tbh rocket should still back stab
Direct hits anyway
azure bone
Well Iw asn't intending this to be a special run but guess thats how it works
epic aphro buff on special, chaos boon on special, triple and rocket shot
literally dont have an attack boon yet
ember raven
Is it just me or last 5 messages in #hades-feedback are missing vote buttons?
native cipher
a crap the bot's asleep
someone wake them up
hold on lemme test something
ahem
okay so he's still on top of that.
split arch
dude shield is f'ing NUTS
native cipher
shield is ez baby mode
split arch
haha
I thought spear and sometimes rail was best
but shield with some dmg resist and the right boons
native cipher
i'd rank it:
Shield
Rail
Spear
Sword
Bow
azure bone
Hestia aspect on rail only tho
split arch
I have 25% dodge and tons of dmg resist
azure bone
any shield is top tier imo
royal pilot
@native cipher Ever tried Bow with the cast aspect? Add 3 more ammo from Artemis for super funtimes
native cipher
i think bow's most fun, but its lacking in speed, damage, mobility, and defense for it to be considered "good"
and yeah, i'm taking hera aspect into account
all it really has going for it is range
people say spear is slow/immobile, ignoring that it probably has the best dash attack of any weapon
royal pilot
hm well in that case, could you give tips for shield? I'm currently finding it underwhelming
native cipher
charging basic attack makes you immune to damage
azure bone
Dash attacks are crazy, dont be afraid to sit there and hold block to take 0 damage when it gets dicey so enemeis gather around you and you dash foward out
native cipher
is a boss entering an attack phase? just hold m1 and laugh
tropic path
the bazooka bow is so cool though
royal pilot
Doesn't seem to work well for bosses though, eg. Alecto damage circles
native cipher
doesnt work for alecto, but it works for all of hades, hydra, and minotaur attacks
azure bone
Oh yay
hey remember the elysium comment on rocket shot?
Yea so hades is ONLY summoning shield guys
this sucks so much
royal pilot
hm, I think I might just need a few more runs to find good boons then
azure bone
lol that was such an easy fight after they were gone
burned through phase two in 20 seconds
I had 20% crit chance on deflect, so the rocket shots were hitting for 1100 consistently
tropic path
nice lol
native cipher
so euridyce's acorn might be actually pretty good and i was underestimating it
it lets you tank 5 hits from bosses. thats essentially 200 effective health on the theseus fight
azure bone
Yea its really nice in a lot of fights
Not great for hades since phase two half a second of laser hits wipes it out
mild crag
broken spearpoint wins out mostly i think
azure bone
broken spearpoint doesn't do much on earlier boss fights
split arch
I was thinking the same thing
azure bone
like maybe hydra?
native cipher
it does unarguably, but its pretty good on hydra and theseus.
mild crag
broken spearpoint saves your butt from lava
azure bone
Thats fair
native cipher
broken spearpoint doesnt proc on lava
mild crag
does the impervious protect against it
split arch
when I first started playing I tried a lot of peirced butteryfly runs and that one was the first one I ranked up to max
native cipher
it does, but it doesnt proc on it
split arch
and beat some runs with it
native cipher
same with poison
azure bone
Imo peiced butterfly is just... bad
mild crag
it does trigger off getting poisoned though
azure bone
like, lets pretend you did perfect and got idk, a 40% buff
split arch
I mean it's not super bad
mild crag
so you can avoid a bit
azure bone
one rare chaos boon will be better than that
split arch
the highest I've gotten was 22
native cipher
pierced butterfly is good if you're good. its an issue of it locks you out from other trinkets
azure bone
its not multiplicative, its an additive buff
split arch
%22
novel tapir
pierced butterfly is a great idea honestly
novel tapir
I like both plume and butterfly to change up my runs
azure bone
It needs to be multiplicative to be worthwhile
mild crag
now it's just like why
azure bone
plume is good, because it adds up in the long run
split arch
I use a combination of keepsakes now rarely butterfly or plume
but both can make the regular non heated runs more fun
and makes you try really hard
native cipher
generally my strat is to manipulate god spawns for asphodel and tartarus, then take gameplay effecting things for elysium and styx
split arch
no keepsake?! WHATT?! how am I supposed to remember my favorite gods?
azure bone
Yep, my strat too
prisma zephyr
acorn's good on hades for learning
since basically you just want to see more stuff
split arch
yeah
azure bone
I'm seriously debating using acorn on theseus from now on
I didn't even think about how much damage that'd prevent
novel tapir
The only consistent "strat" I have is to take spearpoint for styx
azure bone
90% of damage I take in elysium is like, one hit from the minotaur
novel tapir
everything else I just take for enjoyment
native cipher
again, it helps when you look at defensive items in terms of effective health
novel tapir
Yeah and spearpoint is significantly more health saved than any other keepsake for styx
native cipher
tank 5 boss hits
minotaur does 40 damage minimum wth his hits
200 effective health
native cipher
hades is also 40 damage minimum
azure bone
and if you know how to dodge his laser I doubt the spearpoint will save you from more damage than the acorn
prisma zephyr
ah yes, i love taking 40 damage from urns spawning
novel tapir
Well hades is generally the easy part of that "act"
azure bone
No no, you take 150 damage
because urns count as traps
and turning on 400% trap damage means they one hit kill
novel tapir
you will take a lot of damage in styx tunnels if you don't have the spearpoint
prisma zephyr
only when they explode
azure bone
Styx tunnels are like the easiest part in the game imo
LIke once you understand how to use terrain you don't ever take damage
native cipher
styx tunnels are 100% the most build dependant part of the game
azure bone
esp if you have ANY form of knockback
prisma zephyr
depends, if you get snakestone + satyr for the elite you're like pretty much screwed out of doing it flawlessly unless you have some gouda cheese
azure bone
(Bow users need disregard that, I pity a bow user there)
novel tapir
That might be why you have more issues with hades than styx
native cipher
yeah bow in styx is hellish
mild crag
Yes why do they spawn ine you
azure bone
I don't have issues with either, my runs end at the hydra or the butterfly miniboss
mild crag
The urns
novel tapir
lol
prisma zephyr
why do they do damage when they spawn is the question
azure bone
middle management butterfly boss is awful
mild crag
They should just like
azure bone
Rush skelly's, its super easy to get
mild crag
Which is the best and what do u do to get it
novel tapir
Bouldy
prisma zephyr
sisyphus loses value once you turn on convenience fee/lasting consequences