I think part of it is the isometric perspective
#h1-builds-and-combat
grim loom
right
but shouldnt that make it feel like you have less range vertically than horizontally?
forest marsh
¯_(ツ)_/¯
grim loom
oh well. it might be different in two days anyway
broken kite
Is it just me that dislikes the skull-crushers?
forest marsh
It's not just you, they're my least preferred enemy to face
lost rose
i dumped a lot of my heat for the 60 heat run into enemy damage boosts but i may have to switch that over to enemies having more health because, while i can dodge almost everything, armored numbskulls just. destroy me, man
they go so fast
(deadly nyooming intensifies)
side note though, ares boons have become a true blessing for wiping out those enemy death defies
still pewter
Zeus too
lost rose
i love zeus for, like, raw power, but the delay on the ares boons is useful for just taking down that extra armor really fast
i was doing pretty well this last run with triple shot bow and ares on attack, i was trying to go for the artemis dash attack boon too but i got a survive room and then a no hit room and i gave up because i could tell the run was dead, lol
broken kite
ouch man
I don't dislike the no hit rooms, but sometimes when i get a horde of witches and I don't have deflect, it hurts
lost rose
yeah :/
i've gotten better at them now that every enemy hit does like 3x damage haha
but sometimes....sometimes,
broken kite
this is why I pray to RNG-zus every night before going to bed
lost rose
chaos, the patron deity of RNG
broken kite
oh god, i took the boon for every dahs hurts you, and the next room i got skelebosses with a sword
broken kite
still so far, completely loving hades.. it hurts edit: sometimes tho
Was it just me that thought, on start-up, that you'd have some sort of relationship war with all the characters and gods and have it be like some animated novel type stuff?
turbid needle
I never take the dash penalty, because I can never perform well without dashing hehe
pastel jolt
ughhhhhh i haaaate when the best boon chaos has to offer is one that takes away the reward previews
pastel jolt
on the bright side i did just take down the hydra without getting any health upgrades besides the mirror ones and i never used a death defy
and now i have 61 heat in total so i can start trying for the second reward
lost rose
suffer with me sparrow
pastel jolt
although i haven't unlocked the final condition on the pact yet so no increased enemy spawns for me
still pewter
yeah, I mean it really messes with some builds, but you can def build around it
pastel jolt
yeah, i think for my 15 run i went with 1 point in tenebrous veil and two in death insurance
still pewter
I'm telling you, lowering darkness isn't as intimidating as it looks
pastel jolt
alright, got me a zeus attack as my first boon on a 60 heat run
let's see how badly i die
still pewter
spear?
still pewter
I believe in you
pastel jolt
i didn't max out enemy damage, i think it's at like 400%
still pewter
I did my 60 heat with no more than +70%dmg
lost rose
i've been playing on like 190% and it SUCKS
still pewter
that thing
lost rose
how are you dealing with 400%
still pewter
it scares me
lost rose
i'm about to try more runs swapping the damage boost for enemy health boost because honestly i can chew through that faster and more safely
still pewter
I'm the other way around. gotta learn to make less mistakes, so I gotta pump that dmg up
lost rose
i've been doing that and i am not enjoying it,
it's the numbskulls tbh, it's 100% the numbskulls
everything else i can handle but if i have four numbskull spawners in a room, they all have 2 death insurance, that's, like
that's rough
at a certain point you cannot reasonably dodge everything
still pewter
ugh idk. I feel like affording to make mistakes lets you play in a more fun playstyle. you gotta really stick to a certain playstyle to never get hit
lost rose
again if you build for power you can def chew through the extra enemy health, ares and zeus boons ftw
still pewter
yeah, but only them, and mostly zeus
like, I wanna play some sword at times and it's really really hard to never get hit with sword
lost rose
yeah, bow and spear are probably the easiest to never get hit
well...shield i guess too obvs
but also shield has some weird vulnerabilities
still pewter
shield is still a bit finicky
way less dmg potential and the block isn't consistent enough
pastel jolt
aaaaand dead before i reached meg :c
still pewter
rip 
pastel jolt
it's fun when you forget that louts do 40 damage a pop now
and by fun i mean ow ow ow ow ow
still pewter
louts are the worst
pastel jolt
i'm turning heat off when i get to run 100 because if i don't win my 100th run then what am i even doing with my life
pastel jolt
this is how my pact's looking right now but i think i might change it a bit
still pewter
I'm telling ya sparrow. time to let go of the mirror. join us
pastel jolt
listen it's taken me this long to max out olympian favor/god's pride you can have them from my cold dead hands
pastel jolt
tbh the part i'm enjoying the least is removing a boon choice
what if i just run +500% damage and two death insures
..........on the other hand that sounds super unpleasant to get hit with
still pewter
Yeah, people don't usually go tenebrous veil even for 120
If you're taking this much dmg, healing isn't helping you much
So you could cut from that
pastel jolt
i could do 1 death insure, +500% damage, -60% healing.... that'd leave me with all my darkness and all my boon choices so i can go for a good build
🤔
i like how flexible you can be with the pact tbh
still pewter
I mean, if you're doing 1 death insure, might as well do 2
pastel jolt
LOUD CACKLE
yeah i went two death insures and 500% damage
and this is why i refuse to give up the mirror
oh god, oh god, ow, a thug just smacked me for 60 damage
still pewter
pastel jolt
do i risk the bomber room for an artemis boon or go for the shop? i have 173 gold so if a boon or a pom comes up in there i could buy one
pastel jolt
yeah but ow
i think i wanna go shop.... artemis is probably going to offer cast/special/dash boons and i'm not interested in those
from her, at least
WHAT COULD POSSIBLY GO WRONG (lots of things)
wish me luck
still pewter
Oof. Good luck birb
pastel jolt
OKAY OW HER ORBS DO 24 DAMAGE EACH
okay i don't care if i die horribly in asphodel bc i'm missing all my death defies
okay so would anyone like to know how much damage inferno-bombers do when you have 500% damage on
analog crystal
Isnt it like 72 i remember?
analog crystal
500% makes every room a no touch hades room lel
I think armoured louts are worse than the bombers though
Like theyre easy to deal with on their own but with others its so hard
lost rose
i got up to the second stage of the hydra 😭
i burned through both my death defies before that in a room that had three skullcrushers that kept slamming into me as soon as the one i was attacking flew back up into the air
still pewter
louts are the worst
lost rose
the worst thing about the freaking louts is how they immediately attack after they spawn in
if ur unfortunate enough to be standing on top of their spawn point
still pewter
hydra heads also do this
well, pretty sure every enemy does this
it feels pretty bad in some cases
icy edge
Wait there's a limit on olympian favor/god's pride?
lost rose
there is, yep!
proud storm
50 for olympian favor 25 for god's pride
atomic panther
The way I get through bonus enemy damage (I only crank it to 400%) is to master Athena dash
Sure louts do 40 damage to you but they deal 200 to themself
pastel jolt
athena dash 🤢
proud storm
wow the hate is palpable here
atomic panther
Athena dash is good! It's the only reliable way to deflect louts and thugs
atomic panther
It felt bad for me until I realized that wretches deal 250% bonus damage to themself
grand patrol
i like...athena dash actually sorry sparrow hjfhjfj
atomic panther
It's the best dash and I will fight you on this (ง'̀-'́)ง
pastel jolt
(ง •̀_•́)ง then fight me
lost rose
60 pain pvp mode
proud storm
trouble in the athena fandom
atomic panther
(ง •̀_•́)ง
grand patrol
you dont have to actually fight witches you just run around
one time i beat an entire timed room by just athena dashing at a wall for 55 seconds
atomic panther
It works really well against elite witches bc they shoot 3 so the first one breaks their armor and the second kills them
It does take some time to do properly, but I think it's worth it and it fits with the playstyle of "just straight-up get better" that the pact of darkness supports
You need to learn timing, both of your attacks and the enemies'
grand patrol
same w sword special i think... i dont mind the dead time after it so much bc its like, a matter of timing
atomic panther
Yeah they nerfed that in one of the minor patches last month but it's still good
Although the thing w sword special is that, since it pushes away and staggers enemies, it's hard to properly counter physical attacks with it
grand patrol
yeah, and then you have to go find em hjfjfjfhj
ok i just imagined a universe where they put in a mechanic like "you cant use the same weapon two runs in a row" and like. aaaaaaaaa
atomic panther
I mean I don't. I always go for the dark thirst bc it gives me 52 from Meg's room
icy edge
Tbh i wouldnt mind being locked into weapon choices as a heat sink - its easier to adapt to spear or sword than to wail on 300% health skullomats tbh
atomic panther
Extra health only goes up to 100% but I definitely agree. The problem with heat determining weapon choice is that you could always remove the heat, change weapons, then put the heat back
hollow notch
So how do I tell which urns/pillars will give me moneys in Ashphodel?
Can't seem to tell the difference right now...
atomic panther
Pillars? No way to tell. As for urns they should still be gold they're usually just very small
hollow notch
Same design as in Tartarus?
proud storm
yes
they can either incredibly big or ridiculously small
it loves danger https://i.imgur.com/pPxSKwl.png
atomic panther
Just asphodel
errant narwhal
I’m pretty sure just asphodel
proud storm
yeah just asphodel
hollow notch
Maybe also in the third area?
icy edge
I wonder how things are going to scale once we get more chambers
Right now, its possible that you get kitted out completely (modifiers to cast, attack, special and the hammer)... which means future updates will either space those style of play updates more, or we'll eventually get stacking/modifiable boons
errant narwhal
in the elysium update this discord will explode
grand patrol
everyone dies and goes to elysium in real life
atomic panther
When Elysiym drops my body will disintegrate and my mind will ascend to a higher plane (Elysium)
Shdkgoglrbakdf Same Hat
grand patrol
patroclus and euridice's spirits descended upon by 10000 gamers yelling YOUR BOYFRIENDS ARE IN THE HOUSE OF HADES THEY MISS YOU VERY MUCH
atomic panther
Elysium: Happens
Me: So Patroclus, I heard you're single 👀
atomic panther
He do be like that and I love him for it
grand patrol
achilles: this is my boyfriend patroclus and his boyfriend smoocher
hard holly
Lets be real here, almost everyone on this server would go to Asphodel
atomic panther
I'm happy to accept the nickname Smoocher 💋
pastel jolt
actually i would be that one shade that does nothing but sit beside hades's desk and write stuff down
atomic panther
I'm one of those pests in the jar
proud storm
i'm a skinny lout
grand patrol
sparrow you poor thing sitting next to hades all daedes
i hope you throw paper airplanes at him
proud storm
there will be content tomorrow
pastel jolt
yes absolutely
throw all the paper airplanes at hades
and look if some of the paper airplanes have hearts drawn on them and are thrown towards achilles instead then that's my choice
proud storm
a lone paper boat drifting in the river styx
hard holly
I imagine all paper airplanes would just be incinerated by Hades's aura of pure bitterness
grand patrol
achilles: unfolds airplane
secratary shade: 😉
pastel jolt
let me have my dream, unovven.
proud storm
paper: "YOU STINK" written on it
grand patrol
sparrow throws a heart drawn paper airplane at achilles and hades catches it and they die again
pastel jolt
💀
hollow totem
Im not sure if this is asked but will the game support mods
Like many other rogue lite-likes
grand patrol
not, like officially, but like so long as you arent passing anything off as "yes this is a totally real patch" i think it is allright
hollow totem
Ahh cool beans
I just wanna have a really dumb looking zag model thats very out of place
Or being able to play as red or the kid
grand patrol
follow your dreams
altho replacing an whole entire character 3d model sounds. difficult
atomic panther
Play as Skelly
worn owl
I was stupidly expecting to be able to play as Meg after beating her
atomic panther
God I wish but that would be so much more complicated to code
grand patrol
hdjfjfkgkgk u become meg and you wait for zag to show up and use whatever moves you used last time
atomic panther
No u also try to escape
hard holly
Ah yes, the subgame
"Meg enjoys a glass of wine while waiting for Zag to show up already"
atomic panther
She drinks vodka out of a wine glass
hollow totem
Drinking on the job is drinking on the job
open kernel
Just adding a little of the hard stuff to her Ambrosia
atomic panther
Ambrosia is the hard stuff
placid violet
Ambrosia is the good stuff and if that makes it the hard stuff so be it
shell finch
Guys, what the hell is "perfect landing" in the beginning?
when spawning in the first room
atomic panther
It does nothing
plush blaze
It alters RNG but nothing else
shell finch
It is too bad hammer only drops once. It often doesn't give me the option I want for my current playthrough and I'm forced to take something I'm not interested in and lose any potential of getting great results due to more hammers this run
tulip timber
Every run can't be great. 😦
shell finch
yeah, but it sucks when everything was perfect in terms of other boons and then hammer fails
errant narwhal
if every run was your optimal loadout, would the game be any fun? 
the variance and experimenting is what makes the game in my experience
shell finch
I still can't beat hydra except with shield (and even so only in small % of runs)
errant narwhal
how many runs have you done?
tulip timber
I mean, the same argument can be made for getting nothing but collectibles. 😃 I have a streak going currently where I start with a heart and don't see a boon or hammer for 3-4 rooms.
shell finch
where can I check it?
tulip timber
The water bucket near the door out of your room.
shell finch
I've been playing for a few days. I'll check next time I die
errant narwhal
sometimes in charon’s wells you can buy a scrying pool, if you don’t already have it
tulip timber
You may not have the room stuff yet then. You buy then from the Charon wells.
proud storm
you can buy the scrying pool from charon????
tulip timber
Only one with a function is the scrying pool.
errant narwhal
it tells you when you interact with it how many runs you’ve done and how many enemies you’ve killed
lol no from charon’s wells
uhhh that’s what they’re called right?
hard holly
Yes
shell finch
Oh, I ddin't buy the chalice yet
proud storm
yeah thats what i meant
hard holly
So once you get the pool, things will go well
tulip timber
The Shop Pot.
proud storm
pot of greed
hard holly
I dont get how that dead meme keeps staying undead
tulip timber
I have noticed that the Wells don't seem to give you a blank spot anymore where a room decoration would go.
I think I've always gotten 3 options since the last few patches.
Which is much appreciated.
errant narwhal
yeah, I’m pretty sure it was patched
hollow notch
It was in the patch notes
tulip timber
I appreciate low-priority quality of life fixes getting into the patches.
hollow notch
store will give three items even if all decorations are bought
something along those lines
shell finch
well, must be a balance thing
Well, the only balance changes i'm interested in is more Dusa scenes
tulip timber
It's just the nature of the game. Some runs everything seems to line up, and it's a cakewalk. Some runs you get 8 keys and Aphrodite special and nothing else.
shell finch
Shield feels like it's the strongest weapon to me. (supergiant, if you read this, pls don't nerf, I need to kill hydra somehow)
depending on boons both throw and charge are very strong
tulip timber
Everyone has a favorite. 😃 Don't worry about yours getting nerfed.
tulip timber
I've gotten better with the melee, but bow is still my love.
Sword Special isn't great against bosses. But neither is bow special (except for clearing hydra missiles). Most skills are not optimal for every situation.
I barely ever throw the spear, personally.
shell finch
shield special works against both bosses due to minions and stuff, so I just dash with athena or rely on some sort of defense boon
tulip timber
Yeah, it's good for kiting and getting damage on the run.
And it's a lot better since they made the return better; it used to be a gamble in Asphodel.
hollow notch
@tulip timber the spear special with 500% dmg to armor hammer upgrade is awesome
tulip timber
Sometimes it would just go off on its own for a while.
hollow notch
makes asphodel real easy
tulip timber
@hollow notch That's basically the only time I find myself using it.
hollow notch
Do you use the circular attack
hollow notch
I was barely using that, until I found out that the dash triggers your circle attack. at the point you land
hard holly
The special is the worst in the game and pretty much useless
shell finch
It might be the weakest, but it certainly is the easiest for beginners
hard holly
Eh, Id say Bow and Spear are
Shield is actually quite tricky to use effectively
As you have to be good with timing your charges and dash attacks
shell finch
dash as invulnerable/deflect, shield does the thing on it's own with +7 zeus special or something
worked against hydra
hard holly
Its no more safe than bow and spear
shell finch
the only thing that worked fr me
tulip timber
Oh yeah, I do charge-dash with spear. That's the main thing I do with it.
hard holly
While taking twice or more time
Meaning you actually are less safe since you have more opportunities to mess up
shell finch
bow is hard to hit with, as is spear
hard holly
Twice as long or more
Jeez I cant english right now
Oh, youre playing Mouse and Keyboard?
shell finch
yep, no auto-aim
hollow notch
with mk you can walk one way and shoot the other
shell finch
I like to dash on mouse
hollow notch
it's like it's coming out of your butt 😄
hard holly
Without auto-aim that does change things
I play on Controller, so auto-aim is kind of required
shell finch
without autoaim I can use backstab +100 with shield
hard holly
Though judging by the bit of Crosscode I played with Mouse and Keyboard, getting precise shots with bow should still be easy
shell finch
I throw it to miss enemies and it hits them on it's way back
hard holly
Since the hitbox is about as fat as a lout
shell finch
2x damage in the beginning, at safe distance
hard holly
But its only 30 base damage
Which is less than a charged non-perfect bow shot
Without backstab
While being slower
shell finch
how much is bow?
shell finch
well, i mostly get 60 off enemies
Oh, I got chaos challenge on 55% special damage
Does it mean I'm better with boons on special which further increase% or flat damage?
hard holly
I mean with shield your damage is basically non-existent either way
Buuuut flat damage is higher
atomic panther
Chaos's boon stacks with both flat damage increase and % damage increase
hollow notch
I just noticed something
You know the lion traps, the ones that shoot stuff at you
It aims at the center of the tile, not at Zagraeus
Which means that you can step somewhere near the edge of the tile, trigger the trap and not get hit
shell finch
"I mean with shield your damage is basically non-existent either way" that non-existent damage is the only damage which I've managed to kill hydra with, lol
again, shield maybe is just newbie-friendlier
hard holly
I wouldnt quite say so
Id say its more that it teaches, uh, what do you call it
Behaviour? Feels off to say that
Play patterns
It teaches play patterns that dont apply to any weapon or any of the shields good things
hollow notch
pick shield. pick conch. pick attack boon. catapult
atomic panther
The knockback is (as far I can guess) based on the attack range of the weapon so with a fully charged bash they go into orbit
hollow notch
then you get the poseidon for more dmg from wall smash
usefull even in asphodel
though things end up in the lava a lot 😄
atomic panther
I like the buff that stuns enemies knocked into walls
hollow notch
I've seen that bug out some times
the enemies would have the blue aura around them and still more
move*
darn... I'm in asphodel. have to pick between a hammer and a pom 😦
atomic panther
Hammer
hollow notch
yes, will def get the hammer
One run I got the hammer at the last room before the hydra 😄
atomic panther
Is it just my memory or does the shield not have a bonus vs armor
Bow has 2x damage to armor on attack, Sword has 3x to armor on attack, and Spear has 5x on special, but I don't think the shield gets an upgrade against armor
hollow notch
I don't think it does
atomic panther
Wack
hollow notch
I have to chose between tripple shot and barrage... I have artemis dash, aphrodite attack and zeus special
atomic panther
Barrage is the 2x special right?
hollow notch
zeus special with a lot of arrows will be something to see
atomic panther
That doesn't actually work better with zeus special
hollow notch
but the triple shot with dash hits like a train
atomic panther
Triple shot
shell finch
my pal is obsessed with picking hourglass after first boss
I would like to link his result but can't, lol
hard holly
What does Hourglass do again?
shell finch
longer well stuff duration
atomic panther
It starts at +2 rooms and I think it goes to +3 and +4
shell finch
and charon's well stuff stacks so basically you can get heals dropped of every enemy (such as second bosse's heads) and the likes
bold grotto
That could be good for harder runs but if you know you're going to clear anyway I doubt it's more damage than the low life one
bold grotto
Yea that seems good. But if it's a run you're already gonna beat more healing doesnt help. So maybe for heat runs?
atomic panther
Eyes help to clear the room
shell finch
don't forget movement speed, +30% cast damage
atomic panther
The heal isn't only after the room's done
atomic panther
Bonus cast/attack damage buffs are very good when they last 7 rooms
shell finch
almost guaranteed for whole second floor
oh snap, the Meg's comment about Sisyphus's lazy ass
what are fun boons on spear?
atomic panther
On attack? Zeus + Aphrodite. On special? Ares
shell finch
zeus + aphrodite, meaning to put weaken enemies somehow?
atomic panther
I meant they're both fun
shell finch
well, got hammer on special in the first room, so zeus it is.
hollow notch
easy bow kill. long, but easy
ares cast does stupid dmg
4 casts and I kill two heads
it was epic with one pom - 24 dmg per hit
and I had the area upgrade
atomic panther
Ares cast is great but it makes boiling blood useless so I don't take it often
I got the tracking boon with it once and cleared the hydra without taking damage
hollow notch
ah, yes, did not consider that
hard holly
Why would you ever go Ares on Spear special?
hollow notch
the boiling blood I mean
hard holly
Anyway, if you spam the regular attack, Zeus
shell finch
did anyone noticed if the background color of item indicator on next room means anything?
hard holly
If you want to use the spin or the special, athena
atomic panther
Bc it procs once when you throw and once when you pull back
hard holly
Poseidon is also fine for the spin
hollow notch
only if there is a skull
hard holly
Not for the special, his knockback is antisynergistic
First of all, it doesnt, its too fast for it
Second of all, regular upgrades just give you way more damage
atomic panther
Then don't auto retrieve it
hard holly
Granted, with the change to the crit upgrade
Its not longer as good as it was
But once upon a time, spear special tied for bow for highest possible damage
Ares is just throwing all that potential away
high pulsar
I just had a run with spear, Zeus attack and legendary boons. Apparently that just shreds everything, including the hydra. I still lost because I wasn't dodging properly, but Zeus does work extremely well with the spear attack.
hard holly
Yup, it does
Since its fast attacks with low damage, Zeus actually outclasses it
Same as Flurry Blade
atomic panther
Ares is good with every special imo. The damage is crazy good (62 at epic tier no poms) and all specials can hit two or more enemies, so it's good for clearing waves
hard holly
And I would say its bad with all of them (except maybe shield special, but I think shield special itself is bad)
The problem with it is that on the damage oriented specials
Sword and spear
Its less damage than Athena without any utility
Much less damage if you get the right hammer upgrade
With the utility-centric one, bow
Well, you want utility moreso than damage
atomic panther
It's more damage than Athena on spear unless you get over 300% from her boon
atomic panther
And the Ares buff is 60
hard holly
Just a 60% special boost, which is the lowest you can get with Athena
hard holly
Thats 96 damage per cast
atomic panther
It's not 60% bonus damage, it's 60. 80 on first throw and 100 when backstabbing
atomic panther
80 and 100, not 70
hard holly
With the common one of course
No, Ares special at its lowest is 30
You only get one proc per throw and return
Unless you wait, but then you are not doing damage in the time you wait
atomic panther
You get two if you wait
hard holly
Which causes it to be just as low
And keep in mind, its 26 damage ahead at its worst
Since apparently hammer upgrades are multiplicative
Getting crit or long range one makes this difference considerably worse
Huh, epic Divine Flourish can be 2.5 as strong as the base one?
I had no idea
hollow notch
ares on shield is actually pretty cool. you get the hammer quick bull rush charge upgrade
You can hit multiple enemies in one attack
hard holly
If you get the Eurobeat upgrade
hollow notch
it's pretty wide
hard holly
You especially dont want to get Ares
Athena once again just does more damage
Though I suppose you dont really get a deflect on the charge attack
I ... think?
atomic panther
No you do
high pulsar
Yeah, I know you deflect Meg's attacks when charging.
atomic panther
It's clear to me at this point that neither of us are going to change the others' mind, so it would be for the best if we stopped arguing
high pulsar
Wait, why is Athena doing more damage than Ares on shield attack? Disregarding deflect damage, Athena does a base 40%, Ares does a flat 40.
hard holly
Anyway, I guess I mustve not paid attention when going full Initial D
atomic panther
I'd appreciate it if you dropped the patronizing tone
hard holly
Because you can get the double tap during the charge
So you essentially do 50+20+20
And then you can immideatly go for another charge
Ares's delay is a bit too long to keep up with that
high pulsar
Even with a charge and 2 attacks, that's 90 damage. 40% of 90 is still less than 40. Or is there a different way to attack?
hard holly
Actually, whats the upgrade on pom on Ares attack
Yeah the point is that you can do 90 damage twice in the time Ares's boon only has time to proc once
I will concede though that its pretty finnicky
high pulsar
Huh, maybe I'm not attacking fast enough with the shield. I may try that.
My experience has been that I get the Ares hit on pretty much every Bull Rush, but I might be attacking slow.
hard holly
Its more that you can cancel a lot of things by doing other things
But yeah, I wonder what the pom upgrade is on Ares
I know Athena is 20%, Poseidon is 20% and Aphrodite is 10%
I think Zeus was 8?
atomic panther
Ares has an upgrade rate of 16 on his attack, I think
16 on attack and 12 on special
hard holly
Interesting
hard holly
So after 1 Pom, Athena does 90*1.6=144 damage, while Ares would do 90+56
And after 2 it should be in Athenas favour
No wait, its dead even at 2
So I guess if you get 3 poms
Its better even without the finnicky aspect
atomic panther
The block is not part of the attack
hard holly
Oh that is intended, yes
It used to always deflect and back then, having deflect also made the chargeup deflect
It was utterly broken
I imagine it was nerfed for that reason
hard holly
Also nice choice for a profile pic
shell finch
Thanks, same to you
atomic panther
Just went bow + ares on 60 heat and got to the hydra
I used Dino's 500 darkness suggestion and lemme just say I'm not used to enemies dealing only 5 damage per hit
icy edge
I like ares on attacks as it lends itself to a more skirmish-y playstyle
Considering i sit down with the plan to play for hours, the slow pace doesnt bother me
hard holly
Well, if you want the skirmish-y playstyle, on bow Athena remains better
Also Poseidon but sometimes you do not want to yeet the enemies
shell finch
wait, if you don't pick hammer, can it spawn later?
grim loom
im pretty sure ive gotten multiple hammers in the same run so I don't see why it wouldn't
shell finch
wiki says you only can get one though
"You can only use the Hammer once and the effect lasts until your next death. "
or maybe it means it's a consumable?
grim loom
hmm I might be remembering wrong. the wiki is occasionally out of date too though so
atomic panther
I've failed a hammer reward challenge room then bought a hammer later in the run, so it's possible
shell finch
thx
pastel stone
hey what's the purpose of stygian blade? Except for full zeus builds other weapons are way better
lost rose
Well, it's the starting weapon, for one
I actually like it
Half my hydra clears are with sword
lost rose
let's see if i have screenshots...
pastel stone
dont really need screenshots just tell me what you usually go for
lost rose
pastel stone
your 1 or 2 basic boons/upgrades
lost rose
I always like Zeus and Artemis
It's been a while since I did a sword run, sorry, that's why I was looking for my screenshots haha
pastel stone
oh aight np
pastel stone
my only clear with sword is when i got legendary zeus
going between 3 hydra heads and watching them melt under 5 secs
lost rose
Heheheh I've not managed to get legendary Zeus yet...
lost rose
yeah, i think we found a bug with splitting bolt but I can't remember if that was patched or not 🤔
lost rose
Making the little chain lightning bolts more often than it should, yeah
pastel stone
it also spawned bolts when dashin and hitting nothing idk why
tawdry aurora
´Cuz of programing - if: dash -> than: litning.
And untill it starts messing up with game, there is no reason to writte another line of code (If: thete is no ememy -> than: no-lightning)
pastel jolt
the thing with splitting bolt is that the description says your chain-lightning effects create an additional burst, but the "additional burst" also comes from things like the zeus dash, which is a lightning strike and not chain-lightning
it looks like it's intentional that it affects more than the description says it should, because it's not like it could have been done accidentally
vestal surge
The block with the shield is kinda buggy, right? Against (wanna be) dusa's: It can block the dmg from her attack but Zag will turn into stone after that (is that intentional or just a mistake?)
shell finch
Yes, shield is finicky
turbid needle
if the enemy goes through you it probably registers as back hit
turbid needle
@vestal surge I think that was actually kinda intended, u can't destroy enemy Medusa projectiles only deflect them
solemn stream
Huuu just got an epic boon " hunter dash" who gave +200% on dash attacks i passed a room and it turned into +100% like the epicness went away ... is it normal or did i just get pranked by the game
pastel jolt
it's a bug
grand patrol
hunter dash is bugged i believe! give it a few hours
pastel jolt
it's been mentioned many, many times on the server
solemn stream
Mb i dont come here often , damn so frustrating
plush blaze
If hunter dash is fixed and also not nerfed this patch
hooooooo boy
🙏
good
Hunter Dash + Athena Attack
on bow
throw in triple shot and you have my dream
ember lotus
Rapid shot is pretty hilarious too, where you can just spam dash attacks while circling an enemy
high pulsar
I know the bow's dash attack normally makes it charge faster, but how does it interact with rapid shot?
plush blaze
idk I never use rapid shot
ember lotus
You just get the dash attack DMG bonus is all
Still, tacking on 150% free damage on all your attacks and having that stack with a God boon and maybe getting some back attacks, is very clean and very safe DPS. Especially with Athena.
worn owl
I always want zeus with rapid shot
even though it is way more dangerous
maybe with athena dash though.....
pastel stone
there has to be a way to change how bow dash attack works
after watching a crit pop for 600+ dmg or deal consistent 400 dmg shots (different build) i was thinking they capped Artemis dash on purpose to not break the game
solemn stream
Gosh just tried out a Bow run , the hitbox of the hydra's head is disgusting , i must have played to much the Shield
tight socket
Does it ever happen to you that when you want to use the charge with the shield, it sometimes doesn't seem to be working? I often find myself having to double-click to use it especially when the shield returns back from the special.
old rivet
When is the new update coming?
shell finch
in a few hours most likely
heady palm
cannot wait for it
shell finch
I can, I've just downloaded Pyre for that
atomic panther
The only weapon I can do a 60 heat run with is the spear, apparently
The farthest I've gotten with other weapons is the megagorgon but I got to the hydra 5 of my past 10 runs with the spear
Haven't beaten it yet but I'm getting there. It seems Zeus attack is the key
heady palm
i finished the game only with the spear too , but i got far with the shield
the bow and the sword isnt the best for me
atomic panther
I can never master the dash attack or I'd be using the bow
heady palm
are you guys playing with a controller or keyboard ?
frigid rain
controller, personally
raven spoke
Is Weak a worthwhile status effect? It's never been useful for me, what do you do with Aphrodite's powers?
frigid rain
Aphrodite really picks up once you're able to get her legendary, where weakened enemies take more damage
Weak can be helpful if you find yourself getting hit by a specific kind of enemy a lot, say a bloodless or something
plus it is a p big damage reduction, and very helpful on low health no-heal runs
hasty parrot
@raven spoke personally I dump them in whichever ability I'm not using on that run kek
pastel jolt
that's not aphrodite's legendary, tea
frigid rain
ah frick
errant narwhal
I think Weak is very good in heat runs if you get hit a lot
wooden panther
The Aphrodite Legendary is the 10% mindcontrol on Weakness
errant narwhal
but I don’t play with any heat usually. It just seems that the damage reduction is much more significant then
frigid rain
I only ever remember getting it once lol, I just thought it was legendary
pastel jolt
weak, for me, is only really useful if i can aim for sweet surrender (the "more damage on weakened enemies" boon)
wooden panther
Her cast is good if you've got a decent long range option like the Bow, great for munching Skullcrushers if you have enough +Casts
hard holly
Aphrodites weak is only useful if youre getting hit a lot
But I would even avoid it then because it does kinda teach you to be careless
Honestly she needs higher damage numbers given that her effet is the least useful
pastel jolt
she had higher damage numbers and then they nerfed her into the ground lmao
hard holly
Oh yeah they used to be too high
Like, better than the ones we have now
Theyre too low now though
faint basin
proud storm
supergiant bros ultimate
icy edge
A bastion II would be the most lit thing in 2022
atomic panther
Weak is good against bosses bc sometimes you just can't avoid getting hit
chrome viper
How about being able to use a weapon from previous games
atomic panther
It's especially good in high heat +damage runs where enemies are dealing 50 per hit, taking it down to a manageable 25
atomic panther
I'd be so happy to play as Red! But only if we get the sword NPC too (I forget their name orz)
raven spoke
I've always found Ares boons to be really strong (on weapons like the bow or shield that can tag lots of enemies at once)
atomic panther
Ares can make shield special do a non-negligible amount of damage, and it's really great with all of bow
green musk
Bow is like
damage stacking territory
having the highest base damage, especially with the upgrades.
hasty mauve
I dislike the bow so much though
atomic panther
Highest on attack, sword special has the highest base damage
hasty mauve
Sword and shield master race
green musk
Shield is a bit too slow in asphodel to matter when the spear outclasses it with ares so hard.
hasty mauve
Shield is the dashmaster weapon 😄
green musk
spear = free hits, faster than the boon can hit.
raven spoke
I like getting in real close with the bow and doing the special to make a shotgun thing
which is the opposite of what a bow should do but it's really fun
atomic panther
It's mostly a matter of opinion and playstyle. I tend to play very cautiously, so the bow is perfect for me
grim nexus
Ares Blade runs grind whole rooms to dust
green musk
I like pointblank, it's easy to land with dash abuse... but it's just so slow to set up hits
I feel like charge shot and perfect shot are more usable, because they're reliable.
ares blade? I feel like world splitter with crits, or flurry blade with zeus is much more effective.
grim nexus
I like the shotgun too, especially if I have Double Special Daedalus or some strong buffs, though I mostly just stay away
atomic panther
Flurry Blade + Athena attack: No you don't get to hit me
grim nexus
Oh, flurry+Zeus is not even funny
green musk
that's the thing about ares. he is OK.
grim nexus
It's just "hello, you're dead"
green musk
even if you get the hits in as fast as possible, your dps will still be a good chunk lower than other weapons with high base damage.
hence I feel like it's mostly for the spear
the 15 base damage isn't boosted significantly by anything after all.
pastel jolt
wait, wait, ares on spear?
hasty mauve
I prefer Artemis over everyone. Just makes for the most fun runs imo
green musk
ares or zeus on spear.
pastel jolt
also spear damage is best boosted by zeus
hasty mauve
Zeus and Athena are just too op. So all the runs are just insta wins
pastel jolt
attack-wise
grim nexus
Oh yes, absolutely, but Rifts + Rare/Epic Black Metal + maybe Vortex is just silly
green musk
Indeed, hard to get tho
hasty mauve
Black Metal Blade dash 😄
atomic panther
Spear special is good with Ares
raven spoke
What's Black Metal? (aside from a style of music)
atomic panther
Artemis World Splitter OTP
grim nexus
Makes Blade Rifts bigger
raven spoke
thx!
atomic panther
NICE!
green musk
yeh
atomic panther
||That's what the Ares legendary does?||
green musk
spear throw might be best for ares
atomic panther
||That's so cool||
green musk
especially since
grim nexus
Like, cover-the-screen-big. And Artemis can give more casts :3
atomic panther
👀
hasty mauve
I just lost my 10 streak by trying to meme the Hydra 😄
grim nexus
How do I spoilertag?
grim nexus
Thanks!
atomic panther
Tbh that'd just be too similar to World Splitter
graceful lark
Dang the update aint out yet?
I was hoping it'd be out by the time I got off of work
hasty mauve
I've been waiting the whole day
Got out of work too, not out
It's been like 7 hours and it's still not out 😄
graceful lark
I wish I could pay for this game harder
I've maxed out all of the upgrades in the mirror
I've only won the game about six or so times
copper berry
I would expect the update around noon PST, so probably 30 more minutes and some change.
hasty mauve
I've won the game roughly 30 to 40 times 😄
graceful lark
The skull contracts.... I haven't really been big on those
hasty mauve
And gotten everything else done but the 2 bigger heat trophies.
grim nexus
Out of how many runs? I am still getting Darkness and I have like 20 wins
hollow totem
@graceful lark the game becomes extreamly easy once you learn how to build
hasty mauve
Got the 15 heat trophy since you only need to go full tenebrous veil.
hasty mauve
I refuse to do a fresh save since I used so much time to grind the keepsakes 
hasty mauve
WHAT
grim nexus
Top Ten Anime Betrayals
hasty mauve
green musk
Poiseidon is probably the strongest against regular mobs. but the weakest against bosses, which is a shame.
hasty mauve
^
grim nexus
at least he has really nice +damage%
grim nexus
but I wish the whole knockback/wall slam worked on the bosses at least a bit
hard holly
Eh
grim nexus
Oceans Bounty is 15/10 when grinding darkness
hard holly
Poseidon is still one of the strongest against bosses
graceful lark
I kinda miss the shield bounce doubling damage being strong
hard holly
His damage % is tied with Athena
grim nexus
^
gilded knot
I hope they tone down the enemy spawn rate in the meg fight
hard holly
The weakest are Ares, Zeus on weapons outside of spear and flurry blade sword, and maybe aphrodite
gilded knot
its really annoying more then anything
green musk
they did buff his damage ye
hasty mauve
If they tone down the spawn rate the fight will be too easy though
frigid rain
I dont usually have a problem w/ meg's spawn rate
gilded knot
buff her@hasty mauve
frigid rain
The casters usually stick to sides and the big bois are easy enough to kite
if they added louts I'd start getting much more scared
hasty mauve
Big bois 😄
grim nexus
Zeus Cast is always fun however
frigid rain
Zeus Cast can be SO stronk
hasty mauve
Artemis full cast build all the way
grim nexus
Especially with extra bounce lightning
shell finch
does massive spin affects dash spin?
grim nexus
there's Quick Spin too
hasty mauve
Spin to Win
hard holly
Zeus cast is nice, but also kind of wonky
Because it doesnt even always lodge in an enemy
Making Boiling Blood a fair bit worse
graceful lark
aye the daedlus hammer boon for the shield that makes it only bounce to 1 enemy and back really fast... Is that suppose to be good somehow?
hasty mauve
That one is uh
shell finch
nope
hasty mauve
Good if you have like a really good poseidon run going on
With the special and all
I dislike the shield special though, dash attacking madly all the way
grim nexus
Shield special saved my butt a few times, especially with Chaos Boons limiting Casts
graceful lark
sweet its live
plucky oxide
Been experimenting with Poseidon cast a lot. Trying to have it hit the environment around the enemies, instead of lodging them in the enemy. This is especially the case with the hydra stage. Those pillars are great ways to keep dishing out good AOE damage.
supple willow
apparently artemis is going to continue being nerfed into the ground
icy edge
Ok most def need to fix the new borders around interactions such as '(E) Proceed'
The big opaque rectangle wrecks the visual consistency
trail orbit
hard holly
Lets find out what Dionysus gives to the enemies in trial rooms
green musk
you can do similar stuff with a lot of weapons
dash with bow = release at cursor after dash
dash with spear = release after dash
green musk
He has SWIFT HANDS
tulip timber
The added a GUN?!
grim loom
they added a Gun
tulip timber
Best patch note for me:
Centaur Hearts no longer a reward option in the first chamber
frigid rain
yeeeee
there were a LOT of community feedback changes this patch
feels really nice
tulip timber
Yeah. They took a lot of notes on Skull Crushers especially.
frigid rain
yeee
tulip timber
Lots of tasty content. Can't wait to get home.
forest marsh
It really is, Ketrai
errant narwhal
no flurry blade, but oh boy these BOONS
the first zeus i got i took heavens vengeance because the strike was a normal, and then the next one was an epic so i felt like >:D
frigid rain
festive fog??
glossy slate
slow field
frigid rain
noice
errant narwhal
HYPERVENTILATES
i got a dio+zeus trial
im not even at meg yet and im decked OUT
tough tulip
triple gun special
is neat
big aoe destruction
and dionysus' cast is a good extra for even more big aoe destruction
errant narwhal
im still getting only epics
this trial was so worth it
ZEUS LEGENDARY AT LAST
all before meg, jeez
no flurry blade, but armor slayer is still pretty good
errant narwhal
okay i have another dio+zeus trial but i think i just cleared out zeus' selection this time
should i go for it or a pom
hell, im gonna go for it, just to see what dionysus has to offer
errant narwhal
i cleared out zeus until he only had money to give me and hes STILL showing up
hellou
those boons.... YO......
sturdy raft
Completely demolished everything with a BlightWine Bow Special build. Leveled the blight to level 4 and got the double arrow Special Deadalus upgrade. Applying huge stacks of poison to everything made the game quite a breeze.
Twas fun! Felt unstoppable
errant narwhal
AGAIN
proud storm
he really wants to see you
south comet
hes such an insecure uncle
errant narwhal
overbearing uncle
placid violet
Fave nephew
proud storm
he's making sure dio doesnt take all the spotlight
errant narwhal
im gonna go dionysus to give him a gift
but it better be megagorgon and not boat or ill be mad at him forever
i did well so far
YES
oh my god i got his legendary
my wig
tough tulip
what does it do?
lilac bison
I am trying to unlock the new weapon, and while I have all previous 4, it says that I don't have enough keys to unlock the new one
tough tulip
then you need more keys
tough tulip
seems neat
lilac bison
Oh, it doesnt show a requirement for some reason
Reset the room and the requirement is there now
errant narwhal
positive outlook+skull earring=combine dayquil and nyquil to create Quil
ok i legit dont know what to choose theyre all good
mmmmmmmmmmmmmim gonna go with the legendary
errant narwhal
final loadout im going in
this is absolutely nuts, i will never have a run this good again
pastel jolt
first run of the update let's goooooooo
deep musk
i don't know hwo to feel about the new weapon
my thumb is currently sore from all the square button mashing xd
deep musk
oh dear god i cleared hydra without knowing that
and i feel dumb rn
thanks strider LOL
rich lantern
Your thumb will thank you!
deep musk
my thumb thanks you hahahaha
errant narwhal
nooo
deep musk
hey is it okay to post imgur link here?
errant narwhal
oh my god this run was so good that im considering resetting to save the seed
pastel jolt
duty-shirking prince hgjdfhdkf
rich lantern
@deep musk Sure
deep musk
since it has different effect now
im kinda upset
mine was rank 3 😦
https://imgur.com/XXRLAgL < here is a gun run, my first time with a gun
tough tulip
what, the gun is fine against meg
just special where she is headed, then shoot from distance
even without any boons that should take care of her easily
deep musk
for me, im not particularly fond of the special
its too slow, but its really good for like skull tower thingy
tough tulip
you can easily just keep spamming the special while dodging and reloading and stuff
deep musk
here's what i figured out tho, the daedalus upgrade for the gun, the dodge replenishes 2 ammo one, it sucks (for me)
im never taking that ever again lol
pastel jolt
i caved and bought the last keys i needed from the broker lmao
tough tulip
yeah that's the only of the upgrades I've seen so far that didn't seem amazing
tough tulip
shotgun is sick, triple special is sick, homing is really nice as well
arctic venture
oh my god, zeus attack boon + flurry fire daedalus upgrade
arctic venture
no it's the one where you shoot very fast and have double ammo
tough tulip
my first three runs were with zeus, and easily made it to and killed hydra each time
arctic venture
but I'm glad to hear there's one without reloading!!!
deep musk
but the drawback is that you fire quite slower
pastel jolt
ohhhhhhh even jsut mesing around with skelly it looks fun
arctic venture
it's SO fun
hard holly
The gun is great
It also is the first weapon where using both the regular and special attacks at the same time is viable
deep musk
ok but for real tho, from an aesthetic standpoint, the gun looks sick af
tough tulip
yeah
arctic venture
if you get the homing missiles upgrade and dionysus' attack boon it looks and moves EXACTLY like the hydra's attack
hard holly
Its a weapon where youre now shoehorned into one attacktype
tough tulip
not*
deep musk
it makes like eagle noises when reloaded i love it
tough tulip
and I agree, it's really neat how well you can intertwine special and regular attack with it
arctic venture
being able to aim the special is so fun and such a nice trade off in terms of accuracy/defense!
arctic venture
the DoT stacks fade REALLY fast
I got dionysus' boon that boosts damage when 3+ enemies have wine on them and I rarely benefitted from it for longer than like a second
I wish that boon boosted damage more or that the wine lasted longer
hard holly
Yeah, not
arctic venture
maybe it works better with other weapons though
I think dionysus' boon is probably going to work best with something like a bull rush build so you can apply a lot of wine stacks really quickly
deep musk
the take less damage when at 40% health i think synergizes well with skull pendant
but yeah its kinda underwhelming
arctic venture
the after-party boon that restores you to like 40% of your max hp each room is REALLY neat
I can imagine those three boons all working super well together
dionysus' biggest power might just be in his passive boons which is totally cool w/ me
turbid needle
this gun... i love it
arctic venture
it feels like a really really nice improvement on the fang repeater from bastion
errant narwhal
does anyone know whats the guns dash attack?
arctic venture
I think its rate of fire goes up a little bit for a second but I'm not 100% sure
tough tulip
yeah it does a small burst
hard holly
Yup
turbid needle
i managed to get my first ever sub 20 (im not... great at being fast) with gun + dionysus boon on attack
Feels Gud
arctic venture
ahaha I love that feeling when I somehow miss that I'm in a survival challenge room because I'm melting enemies so fast with this gun
viscid ice
They really gave zag a gun goddamn
gloomy scroll
did someone say gun? I haven't had a chance to play the update yet omg hype
frosty pier
Meeeeh I wanted a shotgun >_>
viscid ice
Shotgun = aphro cast
arctic venture
OOH the troves feel much better with the new countdown
viscid ice
Rip artemis once and for all, i guess
frosty pier
Get that weak peashotter outta here
tough tulip
you can make it a shotgun
with daedelus hammer upgrade
10shot spread with only 2 ammo
it's insanely good
arctic venture
I'm so excited to try that one
frosty pier
hmm i need to get some hammer then
arctic venture
all of the daedalus upgrades look amazing!!!
viscid ice
Whats the scaling on death defiance like now?
arctic venture
I really want to try the 5x special upgrade
frosty pier
But god gun feels restrictive
green musk
Gun normal attack is super bad.
tough tulip
rememebr to use special as well
green musk
without the shotgun
frosty pier
Wanna do someting? Stand in place.
green musk
the special is alright, but only with certain boons
tough tulip
just dodge and shoot
turbid needle
i haven't even tried shotgun yet and i love the gun
green musk
doesn't work that well since some enemies are extremely mobile and long range
I mean, I haven't lost a run with it yet
it's just
doesn't feel good
arctic venture
yeah I was surprised by the short range of it
tough tulip
¯_(ツ)_/¯
green musk
What's good about a weapon with all the range of the bow, but none of the DPS.
The reload feels very non-fluid
gilded knot
and half the precision
still pewter
zeus should be really good with rail normal attack ketrai have you tried it? just had a run and it felt really good
green musk
yeah, but still, it's annoying
tough tulip
use special on far away stuff
green musk
120 damage at best
tough tulip
then shoot nearby
green musk
slow firerate
tough tulip
it's the best weapon by far for multitasking
green musk
then a reload
toxic acorn
green musk
only when unarmored
turbid needle
i have to try the zeus boon on gun
green musk
and ye, zeus should be fine, as it is with most things
on the special, the drunk guy is also p good
turbid needle
i had dionysus and i loved how easily i could keep the poison stacked