#h1-builds-and-combat | Supergiant Games | Page 184

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 5:35 AM

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Well, they're going to be fast. They aren't slowed down having to carry all that blood.

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 5:36 AM

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my problem isn't so much that they're fast, it's that they have no delay on their attack if you have to dash near one

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 5:36 AM

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Yeah, I treat them as mobile traps.

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 5:36 AM

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so while you're recovering from the dash they get a free hit

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or 3

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 5:36 AM

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Zag's pithy one-liners from picking up boons could use some improvement. "It's thunder time"?

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 5:38 AM

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Please let me give more gifts to Dusa she's cute and she deserves it

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 5:39 AM

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I'm also sad I can't feed my dog booze anymore.

forest marsh Dec 31, 2018, 5:39 AM

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Gifts for bouldy or riot

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 5:40 AM

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I wonder if hydra will be at the bar if you die in floors after 2. Maybe Zag had a relationship with hydra.

forest marsh Dec 31, 2018, 5:41 AM

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I made feedback for this and you should upvote it kthxbai

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 5:43 AM

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Done.

arctic whale Dec 31, 2018, 5:47 AM

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@tulip timber I liked that particular one-liner. Sure it's kinda dumb but it feels pretty in character to me

nocturne cedar Dec 31, 2018, 9:10 AM

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anyboddy els thinks this game is hard

final goblet Dec 31, 2018, 10:42 AM

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I personally think the difficulty makes it more fun

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 12:32 PM

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For mirrorless, how do you deal with challenge rooms (spawner timed rooms) in Asphodel?

rigid quest Dec 31, 2018, 12:45 PM

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The game is hard , but it doesnt feel unfair so far. I found myself getting reliably far with less then stellar boons and upgrades.

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 12:48 PM

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I made it to Hydra with... only one boon, I think. I had the artemis cast with a few poms on it

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But when Zag says "I really hate that Hydra" as he's coming, yet again, out of the blood pool... I can relate :/

rigid quest Dec 31, 2018, 12:50 PM

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Yeah , i hope when we get more areas the hydra gets some nerfs. But i can kinda understand why it is so hard atm , it is a stand in for the final boss.

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 12:54 PM

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I'm getting to it pretty much every run

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But that spam homing attack gets me every time 😦

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:03 PM

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i think its hard if you are new to roguelites, easy otherwise

rigid quest Dec 31, 2018, 1:11 PM

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The game or the hydra ?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:15 PM

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oh whoops, discord didnt load completely when i opened it. The game as a whole! I agree some areas have a difficulty that seem "out of place", though (fire boat and hydra seem a bit inflated, probably due to 2 floors as you mentioned)

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=]

stray radish Dec 31, 2018, 1:26 PM

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im really hoping for some kind of easy mode when the game is completed

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im used to playing their games on easier so i can just enjoy myself

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it'll be kinda sad if y'all gonna be on like 2nd update and im sitting there like 'yay finally got the hydra to half hp' xD

rigid quest Dec 31, 2018, 1:40 PM

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I like hard games myself 😃 Last game i played , iroicly , was a build engine shooter named blood , from 1997. It was incredibly hard , but oh so delicios.

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:41 PM

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Just speculating here, but since supergiant is facing audiences from their other less punishing genres as well as reaching out to roguelite audiences - I can see a world where the base game stays fairly easy and then extra challenge features are added for the genre fans

stray radish Dec 31, 2018, 1:41 PM

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what i like about supergiant so far is that they let you make their games both harder and easier as you wish

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:41 PM

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I think with hardgames you just need to have a good mentality to losing, my favourite game I played hollow knight I must've died so much on the first run through but its still my favourite game you've just gotta keep at it!

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:41 PM

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mhmm

stray radish Dec 31, 2018, 1:42 PM

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hollow knight made me ragequit few times

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hades is way less frustrating cause it rewards you with lore xD

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:42 PM

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the trick is in making losing worth it - which i think they do a pretty good job of here

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at least so far

rigid quest Dec 31, 2018, 1:42 PM

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Like some sort of side areas ? like you have a choice where you either go to an easier area and get to the end , or some harder area where you can get maybe extra bosses or boons , but which also is designed with more challenge in mind ? i d love that

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:43 PM

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In every SGG game so far they've had something to alter gameplay making it harder but providing an added bonus

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They'll defo do it with hades

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:43 PM

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well, id presume if they follow genre trends we could see things like level skips that put you ahead in floors but at a cost of lower entry-power

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:43 PM

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I think haha

stray radish Dec 31, 2018, 1:43 PM

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it's safe to assume they will

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:44 PM

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im a long-time roguelite / challenge player (going on 30 years in gaming now sheesh), so any extra challenges im down for

stray radish Dec 31, 2018, 1:44 PM

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it's kinda supergiant bread and butter at this point

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:45 PM

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@ivory dragon there are currently 2 challenge routes Ik of to make the game harder

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Mirrorless

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And fresh run

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:45 PM

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i dont view those as challenge routes really, but ive done both haha

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:45 PM

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Ooft

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:45 PM

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the psychology feels more like just self-gimping than adding challenge

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:45 PM

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For me its the getting used to 1 dash

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Im really enjoying the more precise feeling movements

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:46 PM

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3 dashes is pretty redic yeah hahaha

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:46 PM

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Yeah, it kinda feels

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Danger o heck just spam dash

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Rather than thinking about it

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:46 PM

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double dash alone took me through hades with just dash spam on run 9 or 10 i believe

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hydra's projectiles just get completely outmatched from back and forth dash

rigid quest Dec 31, 2018, 1:47 PM

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i do wonder if there will be any additional dialog for beating the game first try on the fresh save XD

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:47 PM

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Do you have any tips for mirrorless for me? I've got to the hydra on my 3rd run but not beaten it yet

rigid quest Dec 31, 2018, 1:47 PM

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Hades being like " you ll never .... wait what ? he is no longer here ?"

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:48 PM

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mirrorless hydra for me was mostly just being patient on hydra. i stayed behind a wall until his last 2 projectiles were in-air and dashed over the wall to do damage

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then dashed back over

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that way you can safely damage him and see if he comes at you for a ground stomp

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:49 PM

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Ahh I see, the long game

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Thanks!

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:49 PM

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probably a faster way to do it, but im only like 40 runs into the game or so

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so minmaxing speed hasn't been a priority yet haha

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:49 PM

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If you're interested you should check out Dino's stream

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He has a sub 10m run

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:50 PM

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probably went with a strong boon setup

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they can get pretty crazy doing 600+ damage a swing on hydra

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:51 PM

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Bow atm with Daedalus and artemis dash is insane

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:51 PM

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yeah

grand cave Dec 31, 2018, 1:51 PM

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ive found that if you get behind the hydras head while it's shooting the large array of pink projectiles it's free damage; they dont hit you right away and it gives you enough time to dodge safely with one dash when they eventually reach you

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:52 PM

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@grand cave yeah thats what i do when im not on a new-save

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the entire wave of projectiles just end up facing the other way

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hilarious

grand cave Dec 31, 2018, 1:52 PM

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thats how i won my new save run lmao

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:52 PM

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i havent had the brass to try it on new-save yet, usually conserve myself to handle the smaller heads

grand cave Dec 31, 2018, 1:53 PM

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ive won it once and i did that to smack his head before it could spam it and that inherently left enough health for the small heads

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:53 PM

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but at the same time i rarely go for optimal boon builds, just pick whatever seems fun at the time

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the only exception is if i go bow it pretty much has to be artemis

grand cave Dec 31, 2018, 1:54 PM

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lul same, arty bow is the most fun

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 1:54 PM

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I like bow with the poseidon boon for the special

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and hammer maybe, for more projectiles

grand cave Dec 31, 2018, 1:54 PM

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ive been trying to find a way to make special bow viable without ares + a million poms

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 1:54 PM

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stuff just can't get close

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:54 PM

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im generally not a fan of poseidon, but he can lead to fun times in floor 2

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 1:55 PM

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things end up in the lava a lot

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:55 PM

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yeah

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you can still technically dash in and attack lava squatters and dash back before taking damage - provided more than one dash

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unless they are all the way in uganda

grand cave Dec 31, 2018, 1:55 PM

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i've had the most success so far with zeus special + double special hammer because a ton of small lightnings spawn and clear the room

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:55 PM

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my friend swears by zeus haha

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:56 PM

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I have the most fun with Poseidon but knockback not affecting bosses is really holding it back

grand cave Dec 31, 2018, 1:56 PM

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the only zeus boon i take regularly is the cast, and only if it's epic because otherwise its too underwhelming for me

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:56 PM

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i feel like poseidon will get a lot more value when more floors are added, to where the pushback becomes more than just a fun thing to do

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 1:56 PM

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I genuinely hate the bloodless zombie skeleton things

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drive me mad

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:56 PM

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I really like the zeus dash with some upgrades

grand cave Dec 31, 2018, 1:56 PM

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for the purpose of bow special zeus is surprisingly good though\

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:57 PM

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oh the skeletons were a pain at first - end a dash anywhere in their vicinity and you will be taking damage

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 1:57 PM

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Managed to get to the hydra with shield that time at least

grand cave Dec 31, 2018, 1:57 PM

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i used to take dash but hunter dash is just so op

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:57 PM

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now i just slow walk around them until they are done being jerks and then engage whatever

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 1:57 PM

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they just have such weird timing on their attacks

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 1:57 PM

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True artemis dash is probably gonna be nerfed at some point

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 1:57 PM

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and the wind up seems a bit inconsistent, and like you said, if your dash ends near one they're probs hitting you

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like they've started their attack wind up facing one way, and then correct to your new dash position to follow through

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:58 PM

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my only real issues with hydra are more minor gripes - like the hitboxes on floating enemies leading to needing to aim at shadows instead of the heads, or the very obscure tell on their pound attacks

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 1:58 PM

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I'm still struggling to fully catch when the mini-hydra's are attacking

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I just dash a lot and hope for the best 😂

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 1:59 PM

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yeah its a lot smaller of a window than most things

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i can probably overcome it if i really try, but its pretty obscure compared to everything else

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 2:20 PM

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I just beat hydra! Is fresh much harder than mirrorless?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:20 PM

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if you crutch dash a lot yeah

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 2:21 PM

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depends how much you like the weapons. If you are cool with the sword in general fresh isn't too much worse than mirrorless

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no keepsake is a notable extra handicap, and healing is a lot more limited because there are no wells of charon. also it's tough to get daedalus hammers since the only way is buying them from charon

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:22 PM

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wew finally a damageless deathboat

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usually take a few hits in there

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 2:24 PM

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oooh, I do quite like the sword It was my first hydra kill and I rarely use wells for healing the death defiance is quite nice tho

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:24 PM

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Managed to double my total hydra completion this morning 😄

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 2:24 PM

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Only 1 way to find out how hard it is haha

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:24 PM

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now up to 4

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2 spear, 2 bow

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 2:24 PM

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yeah do it dude

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:24 PM

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awesome! consistency seems to be kicking in brax!

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 2:24 PM

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fresh file was my favorite of the challenges I've done so far

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 2:25 PM

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Is it a hassle to go through the opening each time?

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 2:25 PM

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yeah, it's a little tedious

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:25 PM

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I enjoyed it but not having the extra dashes makes it feel dramatically slower haha

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 2:25 PM

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not too bad though

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:25 PM

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With the bow, nothing beats artemis and Ares boons

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 2:25 PM

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Would it be useful to recommend a skip button in feedback do you think?

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:25 PM

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Dash crit + extra crit damage + damage after attack = 200

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the hammer giving me +200% damage from distance

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 2:26 PM

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hm, kind of an edge case here, not terribly important

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 2:26 PM

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Ok, thanks!

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:29 PM

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I avoid the hard room in the second area as if they have the plague

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last time I ended up losing 60-70 hp....

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 2:29 PM

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Plague?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:29 PM

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im uploading my damageless of it i just did to remember "that one time i didn't suck"

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:29 PM

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And I wouldn't have done it if there was any other choice

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:30 PM

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Avoid the hard room?

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:30 PM

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Yes, plague. 😄

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If the reward on the door has a little skull on it, the room is hard

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that's what I call it atleast

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:31 PM

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ohhhh

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:31 PM

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don't know if there is an official name for it

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:31 PM

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is there any point in ever choosing them?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:31 PM

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIZNGqz4Ibo&feature=youtu.be

I noticed i still aim at models instead of shadows sometimes

YouTube

Frosthaven

Imagine "You can't touch this" playing in the background

Deathboat? It's k.

▶ Play video

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:31 PM

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I always avoid too 😂

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:31 PM

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more rewards

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 2:31 PM

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you can deliberatly go to the hard rooms because your fighting spirit compels you

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dusa

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:32 PM

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hahaha

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:32 PM

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Interesting

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I play with controller

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Is M+KB better? or just preference?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:32 PM

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im just too hardwired for mkb personally

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but its just pref

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:32 PM

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Main issue with controller is the occasional dodgy choice of target

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:32 PM

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you have artemis dash and ares attack

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what else?

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 2:32 PM

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I've heard most people prefer controller, I like mouse + keyboard

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:32 PM

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which hammer upgrade

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:33 PM

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extra damage on power

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 2:33 PM

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or maybe the controller people are more vocal

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:33 PM

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hence the 255 hits

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:33 PM

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yeah

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:33 PM

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that's crazy

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:33 PM

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@ivory dragon my last run was literally that (with a slightly different hammer choice)

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😂

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:33 PM

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hahaha nice!

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:33 PM

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if I play spear, I usually get 500% dmg to armor

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:33 PM

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https://i.imgur.com/N9bgFLD.png

Imgur

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:34 PM

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lv4 curse man

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:34 PM

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It's OP

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:34 PM

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talk about set it and forget it infomercials

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:34 PM

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hahaha

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:35 PM

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also, the bow being essentially a rail gun now is nice

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:36 PM

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i ignore the special cast on it, but i have done a lulzy run with it basically one shotting things at point blank

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:36 PM

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having it on special can be nice for crowd control

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:36 PM

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it's quite slow though

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:36 PM

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yeah, my crowd control concept atm is "if they are dead they are under control"

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:36 PM

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I quite like Ares' dash

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especially if you buff its size

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But with bow Artemis dash is too good

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:38 PM

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if you can get the timing right 😄

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some people expressed preferences for the triple shot and artemis dash

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:40 PM

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I've still not had a decent run using the sword

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just so hard with it being all close quarters

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:40 PM

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get a good attack boon

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:40 PM

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and this games difficulty largely being based on throwing crap loads of things at you at once

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 2:41 PM

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and the quick attack hammer upgrade

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I think that works

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artemis dash would be nice, too

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you can get a few crits after a dash

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I rarely play sword, but it seems to be not such a bad weapon after all

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:47 PM

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if you ever get the chop animation upgrade on sword its pretty hilarious

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just massive damage

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:48 PM

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What keepsakes do ya'll typically run with?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:49 PM

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if im on bow i start with artemis, but otherwise i typically run with either %20 less damage from the front or extended well of charon if there is a damage boost at the halfway marker

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besides that just sorta whatever

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i used to use the health boost or extra death defy, but haven't needed them in awhile

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:50 PM

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I sometimes switch to the death defy in the mid-point depending on how confident I am on the run 😂

true dock Dec 31, 2018, 2:51 PM

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Usually depends on what dumb build I'm trying to make since I try to make them based on specific boons. Lately I've been using Conch Shell to fish for that boon that gives extra rewards really early.

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:51 PM

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ah thats not a bad idea

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:51 PM

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Side question: is the hammer showing up random?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:51 PM

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it feels like it is, but I don't know the backend mechanics :3

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just going on anecdotes

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:53 PM

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It must have heard me, it's just showed up 😂

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 2:53 PM

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I've had a run where I didn't see one til late asphodel, usually get it in tartarus though

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:53 PM

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you are playing the hammer time music track right? i mean you have to

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:54 PM

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ooooh... point blank shot, or steady shot? which would you go for 🤔

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thinking point

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slow charge on steady is probably gonna get me killed

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:54 PM

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im not good with names, is steady shot the longer charge time?

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ah yeah

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i avoid that like the plague

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good for making coffee and taking a nap mid-run though >.>

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:56 PM

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The shop prices feel real weird to me

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at least for the Ambrosia

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300 gold for something that can often be found behind one of the doors vs the god boons which are 10x more useful for 200

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:57 PM

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yeah, in my own preference i think ambrosia would be better suited to rare spawns in rooms rather than reward or shop pooling

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sort of like how gold vases can appear, but rarer

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just something "extra" without being in the progression line

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 2:58 PM

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I would actually like ambrosia to not turn up in shops as it takes up a slot where something useful could be

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 2:59 PM

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I find that stance agreeable

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 2:59 PM

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#hades-feedback got that listed yet?

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might be worth adding 😄

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 2:59 PM

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I'll look and add if it isn't

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:01 PM

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but if there's no ambrosia in the shop I can't spend 300 gold in tartarus on a fresh file run to buy it, immediately give it back to charon and then get +3 duration on something from the only well in the run bouldy

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:01 PM

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Ooft that is rough

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:02 PM

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just get him a gift card next time

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:02 PM

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I can't wait for him to get an actual sprite and not placeholder

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:04 PM

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charon will end up having the largest transformation if they use his original depictions

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https://i.imgur.com/vdb0Tcf.png

Imgur

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:05 PM

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he wants those coins

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:05 PM

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LOL no kidding

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:05 PM

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he does remind me of santa though

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:05 PM

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Zeus doppelganger

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:06 PM

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he's reverse santa

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:07 PM

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the olympian gods must hate him in this game

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they blessed him with boons and he's just like "good moneys"

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:07 PM

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Whenever you pick up a boon from him they always say something about it

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:07 PM

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"hey give this to zag when you see him" -> 200g

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:07 PM

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I swear there's a timing issue with enemies knowing your position on a dash

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:07 PM

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Whether positive or negative lol

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:08 PM

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like they see your new position before it's even half finished

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:08 PM

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the dialogue engagement is pretty good

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:08 PM

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I think dashes are basically instant

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:08 PM

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@tawdry sleet im guessing you are just talking about skeletons?

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:08 PM

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any apparant motion is just for visual

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:08 PM

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because I just had a bloodless zombie + bomber room, and the amount of times the zombies swiped me, and the bombs were thrown at my feet where I was going, not where I had been

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:09 PM

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and I think it's important that dashes can be punished

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:09 PM

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^^

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:09 PM

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ah yeah if you dash and they throw the bomb at the same time it can appear that way, though the bomb throw went off immediately after you hit dash

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:09 PM

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I would like a ring to show the radius of the bomb explosion though, sometimes it feels a little cheap to take damage from one

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:09 PM

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i agree @vapid mauve - atm being punished for bad dash positioning is the only thing that keeps it from feeling like an in-game cheat ability

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:09 PM

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hmm, you're probably right tbf

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:09 PM

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i would actually prefer for more enemies to punish dashes

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:10 PM

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i wonder if there would be room for structural enemies that disable dash if you are in range of them

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like totems or obelisks

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:11 PM

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or anti-crystals that hit you when you move and you can completely avoid them by standing still

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would make an interesting change of pace for some rooms

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:12 PM

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I feel like something that forces you to stand still would be a bit too challenging if there were other mobs attacking you

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:12 PM

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enemy pool for the room type would need a lot of care

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:12 PM

#

I think all damage in the game should be avoidable if you're good enough but from what I'm imagining from what you said that would make a situation where you would take damage no matter what

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:13 PM

#

or even just challenging no-enemy gauntlets could be fun

#

finish fast enough for a prize and move on

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:13 PM

#

What's the fastest you've done a chest btw?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:13 PM

#

I don't even do chests because im a bad person 😦

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:13 PM

#

Ooft, I did them a bunch when I was farming darkness cus they drop a lil bit

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:14 PM

#

yeah, i learned about the darkness only recently but

#

its sort of too late for me on this save now haha

#

always assumed it was just gold and i was like "uhhh im never low on that skippppp"

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:15 PM

#

I've gotten over 100g from an asphodel chest, 80 something in tartarus ( they start at different values)

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:15 PM

#

Yepp I think they start from 150 and 100 respectively

#

Some runs I do horde a decent amount of gold, it'd be nice if like it was converted to darkness at like 100 gold for 5 darkness rate or something

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:16 PM

#

true, that would be a weird interaction with coinpurse though

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:16 PM

#

if the game were to perpetually be stuck at 2 floors, keys and darkness could use some love - but im sure things will even out a bit as more floors are added

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:16 PM

#

I think spend it or lose it is ok

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:16 PM

#

at least thats my hope

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:16 PM

#

yeah the dynamics there will deff change

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:16 PM

#

Oh true, I forgot about coinpurse

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:17 PM

#

15 days to the next patch anyone got a time machine i broke mine

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:17 PM

#

I've not been this excited about a game's update in a long time

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:17 PM

#

^

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:17 PM

#

I would like to see the bar they set for each major update

#

I'm hoping 3 new gods and a new floor and maybe new interactions

#

A weapon at a large push

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:18 PM

#

I think a weapon is pretty likely but I'm not super confident we'll get a new floor

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:18 PM

#

I wonder how many primary floors and potential hidden floors are going to be in the final game

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:19 PM

#

You sound pretty confident on hidden floors being added haha

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:19 PM

#

6-9 feels like a good guestimate based on olympian lore and other roguelites to me?

#

and it's what, 12 months of alpha planned

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:19 PM

#

that sounds a bit ambitious imo

true dock Dec 31, 2018, 3:19 PM

#

My hope is that darkness/keys will be spent to access the hidden floors.

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:19 PM

#

Based on lore I believe there are 4 areas of the underworld, IMO I would love for us to take the fight to Olympus

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:20 PM

#

i dont know if id call it ambitious while counting possible hidden floors

true dock Dec 31, 2018, 3:20 PM

#

Erebus and Elysium are probably going to show up

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:20 PM

#

4-5 base without hidden easily

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:20 PM

#

I'm hyped for Elysium

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:20 PM

#

and if we dont have hidden floors ill just cry in a corner and still enjoy it 😛

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:21 PM

#

And ye the stockpiled resources will be an issue they're gonna fix, considering ambrosia, keys and darkness will end up with nothing to spend on

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:21 PM

#

did any of you guys get to a point where you can consistantly beat the hydra without losing too many hp/death defiances (like the fight vs meg) ?

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:21 PM

#

Do you think they'll make hidden floors? I'd love it if they did, but I'm not sure if it fits their parallel focus to narrative

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:21 PM

#

i dont ever use death defiance and basically just randomly pick boons atm @silent cliff

#

@still pewter i feel like there is going to be too much pressure to make hidden floors. Basically every roguelite has some extra pathways

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:22 PM

#

Im quite curious how hidden floors would work

#

After each boss

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:22 PM

#

they could get away without it, but i think the roguelite crews are going to be expecting it

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:22 PM

#

Or you find an alternate pass on the floor

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:22 PM

#

Hydra always gets some hits on me still, whereas I can down Meg damageless. But I can clear both consistently

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:23 PM

#

okay, then I am just bad haha

true dock Dec 31, 2018, 3:23 PM

#

@silent cliff Yeah. I've got nothing to really do now until the patch drops because all I've been doing is farming ambrosia.

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:23 PM

#

nah not bad tbh

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:23 PM

#

I think "Chaos" has some potential of being "side content". Not necessarily whole floor scale, but definitely more fleshed out than what it currently is

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:23 PM

#

its all just a practice game

#

the more you play the better you get

true dock Dec 31, 2018, 3:23 PM

#

Mirror also helps immensely

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:24 PM

#

The epic % is insanely good

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:24 PM

#

that would be interesting @still pewter

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:24 PM

#

I miss epic boons

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:24 PM

#

I kinda dislike the mirror flat out giving you stats. I'd rather it gave diversity over raw power

true dock Dec 31, 2018, 3:24 PM

#

Hoping for a Titan jailbreak as a side level. Where you unlock their boons

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:24 PM

#

I feel like the mirror was needed to keep the existing supergiant audience onboard into a notoriously punishing genre

#

just speculative ofc

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:25 PM

#

i'd love if the mirror would side you more with your dark self which would then displease the olymp gods - then it could be a trade off between permanent smaller bonusses or a higher chance for epic boons

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:25 PM

#

i like that @silent cliff

#

anytime the word tradeoff is used in game balance i have to cheer

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:26 PM

#

idk. a meta progression like keepsakes seems cooler to me. It gives you more ways to play the game. Can't say the same about the mirror. It feels more like a resource sink to be filled

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:26 PM

#

Would your darkself mean that you start off really strong rather than gradually getting better through boons then?

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:26 PM

#

The Hydra itself is the easy part

#

It's always the adds and mini-hydra's + the chaos of the lava etc that screws me

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:26 PM

#

its those annoying little heads

#

with their dumb hitboxes and low tell animations

#

😄

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:26 PM

#

I just got it down again, number 5 😄

#

but still relying a bit on extra lives

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:27 PM

#

I also feel like there's potential with your suggestion @silent cliff

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:27 PM

#

you'll get there! you are moving at a quick pace

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:27 PM

#

@analog crystal i mean it more like the more you invest in the mirror, the more boni you have but also the less likely you are to find epic boons (because the gods don't like your dark side)

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:27 PM

#

Oooh I see

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:27 PM

#

maybe if you take too many darkness buffs you end up having to fight stronger midway bosses or something?

#

or chance% of it

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:27 PM

#

It does feel like it needs balancing

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

@ivory dragon i like the idea but then the difficulty level kinda stays the same - given that the bosses scale with the amount of darkness you spend

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

so you aren't just maxed on everything

true dock Dec 31, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

Mite b cool. It does feel too easy when you're getting epic boons all the time as well as doing 200% extra damage and have three lives

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

sort of @silent cliff but depends on how "stronger" is defined i think

#

like you could make the meg fight 4x as long and it'll be the same difficulty for me

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

Are legendary boons actually a thing btw?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

yeah

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

yes

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

I'm yet to see anything besides Rare and Epic

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

there are prerequisites i believe?

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:28 PM

#

And I barely ever see Epic unless I use a keepsake

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:29 PM

#

yes, try sticking to a specific god in a certain run

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:29 PM

#

@ivory dragon but then what is the incentive of farming and spending darkness? it does not really feel motivating to farm a resource which makes the game flat out harder for you

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:29 PM

#

you'd have to have higher incentives for sure

#

risk/reward

#

looking at something like gungeon for instance - they do a really good job with their cursed items

#

a lot of up front power, but chance for getting stronger enemies to balance it

#

too much and you get chased by death

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:30 PM

#

Wizard of legend do good cursed items too

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:30 PM

#

I'd love a curse system in hades

#

more like gungeon and less like dead cells though

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:30 PM

#

i can agree with that

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:30 PM

#

gungeon curse is super cool

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:31 PM

#

https://wizardoflegend.gamepedia.com/Category:Cursed_relics
I think a lot of these are applicable to Hades

Wizard of Legend Wiki

Category:Cursed relics

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:31 PM

#

i would definitely love to see a 'darker' side of zagreus

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:31 PM

#

but gungeon has metric tons of items, some of which interact/manipulate curse. it's a fleshed out system of its own

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:31 PM

#

As someone who hasn't really played roguelikes, it's kinda disappointing how little there is currently that is permanent between runs... I like me some feeling of progression

What do you guys think about getting cosmetic armour upgrades for completed runs or something similar? or more changes to the House of Hades based on successes

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:31 PM

#

cosmetic upgrades im 100% behind

#

my dream is to be able to fill some metric with the sword and get a transistor sword skin for it 🤔

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:31 PM

#

i'm quite sure that we will get cosmetics in the later development stages of the game

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:31 PM

#

@analog crystal do you recommend wizard of legend?

true dock Dec 31, 2018, 3:31 PM

#

Yeah, I'm down for cosmetics.

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:32 PM

#

permanent power progression im not a fan of, but i can reason my way around its existence

#

roguelites are always about you the player getting better, not you the player getting more boosts

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:32 PM

#

Yeah I wouldn't say power upgrades

true dock Dec 31, 2018, 3:32 PM

#

For what it's worth I would also recommend Wizard of Legend. Great little roguelite

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:33 PM

#

yeah, most meta progressions give you more ways to play the game, they add more diversity to your runs

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:33 PM

#

@still pewter It really depends on how you like games, the game is hard and offers a harder mode, but to finish the base game can be quite easy. I really enjoy the combination of magics it makes the game fun each time you play it though.

I would recommend watching a video on it first ^__^

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:33 PM

#

huh i havent played this. will definitely check it out

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:34 PM

#

I think binding of isaac does rogue like progression well with unlockable items from bosses and challenges

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:34 PM

#

thanks. I'd love to hear more roguelite suggestions but let's keep them off this channel

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:34 PM

#

good call 👍

#

unless it pertains to hades gameplay ofc

true dock Dec 31, 2018, 3:34 PM

#

Loads of unlockables is my jam.

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:34 PM

#

yeee

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:34 PM

#

I wasn't recommending BOI as such but more inspiration for Hades

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:34 PM

#

another idea for balancing out the mirror is that e.g. 'epic' boons don't define themselves over just having higher numbers but rather being more unique and playstyle-changing than rare boons
one example for zeus could be: 'after every 3rd attack, a lightning bolt strikes your target, dealing 600x of your attack damage. your normal attacks don't deal damage anymore'

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:35 PM

#

i made the joke about it before but, you know you are playing a roguelite when your second monitor is glued to the game's wiki page

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:35 PM

#

Although, BOI did get to a point where I just wasn't enjoying it and it became a drag to play. I've not played in a while tho tbf

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:35 PM

#

Anyone got a recommendation for boons on the sword?

#

determined to try a decent run with it

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:36 PM

#

that's the stuff I like felix. more wacky, crazy, creative stuff that give you a different experience

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:36 PM

#

I really like athena on sword

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 3:36 PM

#

I wanna complete the OG game with each wep at least once

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:36 PM

#

sort of like most deadalus upgrades

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:36 PM

#

Especially with blade flurry

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:36 PM

#

if you get the chance to snag the 400% chop animation and crit with it that's pretty amazing

#

if you want to easyboat it

#

https://i.imgur.com/1nxC9kk.png

Imgur

#

good times haha

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:38 PM

#

400% chop damage + crit after dash + increased crit bonus is just fruity

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:39 PM

#

what do you guys think about stacking multipliers? Like being able to use a dmgbuff on your attacks and combine it with artemis dash? I think it creates synergy and makes you think about what you pick more, but don't you think it's a bit too crazy to balance around? I feel like it creates too big of a gap between strong and weak builds

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:39 PM

#

It creates synergy but it's a little bit too strong atm

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:39 PM

#

i think we need more reason to use all of our abilities in synergy, whatever balancing that requires.

#

im noticing in my runs i typically upgrade one thing and ignore the rest

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:40 PM

#

I would love if the boons had more synergy but balance is tough to do for that

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:40 PM

#

Icathios is right - when you need to rely on synergy then builds without it become incredibly weak

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:40 PM

#

so attack but no cast/special

#

or special but no cast/attack

#

so i wouldnt mind a world where weaving different abilities gives you a good footing compared to stacking

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:40 PM

#

an immediate proposition that comes to mind is making stuff stack additively. then again we already have this sort of additive scaling (ares curse)

#

which gives ares his identity as a flat power increase

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:41 PM

#

I was hoping for a grimoire weapon (it works in flavour and would be cool) where boons would give you spells you could use which would provide synergy between boons and weapon

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:41 PM

#

I think the problem lies more in the fact that there is no need to combine all of our abilities to beat the game - it is perfectly viable to use attack/cast/special only in a run

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:42 PM

#

not just viable, but arguably the "best" way to assure victory every time

#

i could see things like giving you extra boosts against enemies that have a cast on them

#

etc

#

dash > crit synergy does a great job, so stuff like that with other abilities

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:43 PM

#

another way to create synergy is that you'd work with elements - so a poseidon cast (water) makes the enemy more vulnerable to lightning for the next (couple of) attack(s) - then you would create synergy in this case between poseidon and zeus without having to tweak the numbers

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:43 PM

#

yeah

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:43 PM

#

That'd be cool

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:44 PM

#

would also add an incentive for picking god-specific trinkets during your run to force the right type of boon

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:44 PM

#

I think poseidon should also have the ability to put out lava pools on the ground but idk if that'd be too good

#

Maybe as a tier 2 boon?

#

Idk

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:44 PM

#

walking on lava puddles? i dont think that would be breaking for the content we have atm

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:44 PM

#

weirdly enough dash crit is the power up I see most likely be removed due to it being a potential balance headache

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:44 PM

#

I think if they gave it a percentage it'd be fine?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:45 PM

#

the power curve on it is a bit high, but i feel it could be balanced

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:45 PM

#

The problem is it's guaranteed crit

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:45 PM

#

maybe dash crit but the crits only do half of their bonus damage

#

as the tradeoff

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:45 PM

#

So rather than +100% its +50%?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:45 PM

#

yeah something like that

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:46 PM

#

not only that. compared to all the other dash upgrades that do their thing, artemis dash just doubles your dmg overall most of the times

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:46 PM

#

But the problem then

#

Is what if you also had a crit chance on your weapon as a boon

#

Would that damage be +100% if you didn't dash and +50% if you did dash?

#

Cus then it'd seem like more of a drawback

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:46 PM

#

yeah, that's a bit of built in anti-synergy

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:46 PM

#

Ye

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:46 PM

#

becomes a tradeoff of standing still to do more damage

#

or being safer with dashing to do slightly less

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:47 PM

#

I don't think they'd ever want to put in anti-synergy within a gods boon pool tho

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:47 PM

#

guess it depends on how you feel about anti-synergies in general

#

im fairly used to them, so im biased

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:47 PM

#

I think it'd be a good idea with gods who hate eachother

#

but not with the same gods boons

#

It's less being used to them, more flavour-wise it sucking

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:48 PM

#

yeah its not a hill id die on by any means

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:48 PM

#

anti synergy is not inherently bad. It's just really awkward if it stems from the same system interacting with itself (artemis has antisynergy with herself)

#

it's not like you wanna avoid a god combo because it doesnt work as good as you'd like

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:49 PM

#

or you could just straight add a cooldown so that you cant repeatedly just dash crit over and over

#

just spitballing

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:49 PM

#

that'd could be a solution

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:49 PM

#

That would be alright, considering the prerequisite of having dashed I think you'd need to make it guaranteed crits if you did that

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:49 PM

#

bit of a brut-force-ish one, since we don't have other cooldowns in the game

#

I could see it working tho

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:50 PM

#

Activated abilities could be quite a cool line of boons

#

A bit like the revenge boons

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:50 PM

#

I think it's important to note that artemis dash doesnt neccesarill double your damage. If you are already getting +100% from quick temper and +100% from a boon on your attack then the crit puts you from +200% (triple damage) to +300% (quadruple damage) = 33.33...% increase

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:50 PM

#

yeah its +100% not 2x

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:50 PM

#

I think the main issue with it is not itself, but rather the things it's buffing (bow mostly)

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:51 PM

#

i think many people agree that bow is too married to artemis atm

#

thematically it makes sense, but feels weird to play it

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:51 PM

#

Imo the biggest problem with bow is the Daedalus upgrades being too good

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:51 PM

#

well other than the spend 7 years charging one 😄

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:51 PM

#

haha yep

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:51 PM

#

combination of a ton of things but especially triple shot is blatantly op

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:51 PM

#

I really hate that it throws off my power shot timing

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:52 PM

#

im still charging my power shot from 8 days ago 🤔

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:52 PM

#

Imo the numbers are just too large

#

Like

#

+350% to close enemies is insane

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:52 PM

#

doesn't crit make your attack "hit twice"? therefore isn't it x2 dmg?

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:53 PM

#

Nah, its +100% so like if you do 3 damage normally a backstab crit would do 9 instead of 12

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:53 PM

#

is that real?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:53 PM

#

could increase the bow base damage and lower the power of the upgrades a tad perhaps?

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:54 PM

#

hmm, gotta go test. I'm pretty sure the UI states it's "hit x2". the actual math could be as you guys say

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:54 PM

#

https://hades.gamepedia.com/Heart-Seeking_Bow#Upgrades

Hades Wiki

Heart-Seeking Bow

The Heart-Seeking Bow is an Infernal Arm that can be unlocked for 2 Skeleton Keys.

#

I might be wrong with the crit, but I'm pretty sure that's how it works

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:54 PM

#

the damage is pretty crazy on point blank shots, and you are guaranteed to get them with how some of the mobs work - especially the bomb guys

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:55 PM

#

The only other bonuses that give that much of a boost to damage are against armour

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:55 PM

#

since they live on your face

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:55 PM

#

But those bonuses are to all enemies

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:55 PM

#

speaking of, what do you think of armor?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 3:56 PM

#

no strong opinion atm, does turn it into a bit of a kiting game for a bit though

#

which could be good or bad

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 3:57 PM

#

"critical: damage twice the usual amount, or more"

#

is in game description

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:58 PM

#

Usual amount

#

As in

#

+100% to base damage

#

Is how i see it idk

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 3:58 PM

#

so a backstab crit with 10 base damage is then 10+10+10 = 30?

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:58 PM

#

I could be very wrong and look dumb haha

#

But

#

yes that's how i think it works

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 3:59 PM

#

crit is deff +100 ontop of other percent increases you have

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 3:59 PM

#

Rather than 10x2(backstab)x2(crit)=40

#

For instance that close up boon of +350% wouldnt end up doing 900% on crit, it'd be +450% which is how it should work imo

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:00 PM

#

so +100 on athena and crit = +200% (triple). not double damage and then double again for quadruple

#

+350% is an absurd number, they should nerf that and make triple shot set each shot to like 75%, or make it so each enemy can only get hit by one of the three at most (so it keeps AoE usefullness but isn't straight up triple damage)

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:01 PM

#

instead of 24 I did 39. 15+15(crit)+9(backstab)=39 (15=spear base dmg).

#

seems like it's as you guys are saying

surreal hemlock Dec 31, 2018, 4:01 PM

#

its not +350%, its up to 350%

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:01 PM

#

yeah my b

#

But

#

The point still stands

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:01 PM

#

but the fact I got confused probably means the ui could be a bit more clear

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:02 PM

#

I think it'd be kinda hard to word it without it being a mouthful

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 4:02 PM

#

damn died with hydra less than 50% using sword

#

almost

#

NYE time now 😂

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:02 PM

#

dusa

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:02 PM

#

what did you in?

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 4:02 PM

#

the mass of heads with lava

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:03 PM

#

ahhh the ol' game of dodgeball

tawdry sleet Dec 31, 2018, 4:03 PM

#

my Ares casts

#

kept losing myself in the clutter haha

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:03 PM

#

What do you all think the worst head is?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:03 PM

#

Sometimes, one must lose themselves in order to truly find themselves - Some person

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:03 PM

#

lava spit

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:03 PM

#

ye same

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

The spawner, definitely

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

spawner here

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

safe space to stand is such a precious commodity on that fight

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

I think the eggs aren't too bad to deal with considering how long they give you

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

naah. slam heads are the worst. especially when there are a couple nearby

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

they aren't hard to deal with, i just dislike dealing with them haha

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

But the amount of lava makes it so hard to melee those head sometimes

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

seem like the best at denying breathing space

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

ill take lava damage any day

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

same

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 4:04 PM

#

The summoned bloodless are just way too tanky for how much damage they do

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:05 PM

#

hm\

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:05 PM

#

Kill the spawners before they can be summoned

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:05 PM

#

the eggs can also get stuck in the wall where you cant break them easily

#

thats happened to me a couple times

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:05 PM

#

unarmored bloodless arent that tough

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 4:05 PM

#

Coupled with the sheer amount of spam going on it’s hard to prioritize

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:05 PM

#

what I hate about thise zombie like bloodless is how little windup their attacks have

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:05 PM

#

That does suck, and feels like a bug tbh

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:06 PM

#

i do think if they make it where you can attack the heads instead of having to carefully surgically strike the shadow under them, the fight will be almost double as easy

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 4:06 PM

#

same here Icathios, once you get close to them you can't avoid their attacks.. the only way to consistantly avoid being damaged is to stay far away from them

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:06 PM

#

at least for me

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:06 PM

#

they do have windup, but it feels kind of cheap getting hit by them

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:06 PM

#

you can walk rotate around the windup, but you will get hit if you dash at them

#

if you land your dash within breathing distance you take free damage

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 4:07 PM

#

Wall of text....

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:07 PM

#

true. but you really can't do anything if your dash lands near one

#

you just take the dmg

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:07 PM

#

thats why you have to not land near them 😄

#

like finally getting no damage on the deathboat was all about walking and then dashing away after i provoke their charge

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:08 PM

#

yeah, overdashing is a very risky play

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 4:08 PM

#

Maybe I should prioritize a Poseidon dash upgrade

#

Just a giant middle finger to them

#

Super giant, even

carmine zinc Dec 31, 2018, 4:08 PM

#

For me the two best dashes are zeus and artemis

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 4:09 PM

#

they still hit you if you dash right through them, the knockback sometimes isn't big enough

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:09 PM

#

dash is super good but if you rely on it too much instead of moving properly it can land you in a lot of trouble

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:09 PM

#

^

#

you'd be surprised at what you can avoid by just walking

#

even bomb throws

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:09 PM

#

walking is low-key op

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:09 PM

#

I think most people underestimate walking in this game just cus of truple dash

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 4:09 PM

#

walking wins you every single time trial without taking damage

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:09 PM

#

Yup haha

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:10 PM

#

its the main reason i walk instead of dash IRL

#

dont tell my secrets though

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:10 PM

#

same

dense holly Dec 31, 2018, 4:10 PM

#

everyone new does overestimate walking. obviously

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:10 PM

#

you run irl then run out of breath next to skeleton zombies and that's the end

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:10 PM

#

I get whiplash whenever I dash IRL it hurts like hell

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:10 PM

#

lmao

#

the one mechanic that still trips me up sometimes is the larger bomb throwers - when they decide to triple bomb while still being alive

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

My problem with dashing vs. walking is I use a keyboard.

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

i get so lazy sometimes

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

it's interesting how walking can be safer than dashing at times. kind of unintuitive though

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

yeah they catch me with that a lot as well

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

hey mkb life here @dapper heart !

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

Same

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

mkb kin unite!

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

So I end up with either using one or the other exclusive.

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

The way I see dash is only for an instant movement, never use it just to get around (unless you have triple then never stop the spam)

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

who cares if you cant see the cursor in floor 2, didn't need it anyways 😏

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 4:12 PM

#

The best way I've described it is "Triple dash if you don't have buffs on shield special"

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 4:12 PM

#

Don't you people have a party to go to or something?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:12 PM

#

ok but after room clear if you aren't dashing to the exit i feel bad for you

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 4:12 PM

#

Hopefully one where the Hydra is not on the guest list....

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 4:12 PM

#

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/340618610227544065/529329906220400650/unknown.png And I beat Hydra for the second time.

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:12 PM

#

in about 6 hours

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:12 PM

#

grats pund!

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 4:13 PM

#

@hollow notch I demurred from my friends' plans for new years; we're going out tomorrow to museums and the zoo.

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:13 PM

#

If I see the hydra there, I'll do a quick 180 and be on my way

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:13 PM

#

nb nb

#

I think I'll be doing a whole of nothing tonight

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:13 PM

#

It's 4pm for me atm, the party I'm going to isn't for 4h lmao

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:13 PM

#

and here i am gearing up for a 12 hour shift like a loser

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:14 PM

#

Ooft that sucks

#

Doing what

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:14 PM

#

oof

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 4:14 PM

#

Hey, you're getting paid, that ain't being a loser.

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 4:14 PM

#

@dapper heart Zoo? You live down south somewhere?

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:14 PM

#

i hold two jobs, 12 hour shift rent-a-cop and software engineering

#

so free time is hard to come by

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 4:14 PM

#

I'll take it to off-topic to explain.

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:14 PM

#

well 3 jobs, taking hydra down is something i do regularly

#

😏

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 4:15 PM

#

cantwakeup

#

Someday

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:15 PM

#

lol

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:15 PM

#

@glossy slate how does one get roles? Like hades/transistor etc?

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 4:16 PM

#

#bot-commands

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:16 PM

#

no icathios dont do it its a trap stay here with me

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:16 PM

#

shadeembarassed

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:16 PM

#

What are the roles for btw

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 4:16 PM

#

Just go there and use ?role with whatever you want

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 4:16 PM

#

early access role lets you give feedback, dunno if the others do anything other than color your name

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 4:17 PM

#

You need the early access role to post in feedback

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:17 PM

#

Ooo I didn't know it changed the colours of your name

errant narwhal Dec 31, 2018, 4:17 PM

#

#bot-commands

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:17 PM

#

In #bot-commands ^_^

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:18 PM

#

everyone's going to leave me behind in the wonderful land of color

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 4:18 PM

#

Quick someone force a role on him

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:18 PM

#

LOL

carmine zinc Dec 31, 2018, 4:19 PM

#

Yay

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:19 PM

#

mods, make it happen

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:19 PM

#

Ascension is rarely free!

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:20 PM

#

just jump out the pink window and work your way up

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:20 PM

#

i dont think my avatar guy can fit, which is probably why the lord of hades is actually stuck now that i think about it

#

if only i made bigger doors

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:21 PM

#

only reason he's stuck doing infernal paperwork is because he can't get past his desk

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:21 PM

#

bahaha

#

alright time to go do boring non-hades things. someone go kill a few skellies for me and tell poseidon im sorry for always making him mad in dual rooms

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:21 PM

#

now that's some quality hades-gameplay conversation

#

#freehades

#

not sure I won't be making him mad instead, but I'll try my best

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:22 PM

#

I would love to be able to play as Hades trying to escape just as like a cosmetic skin

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:23 PM

#

using the exclusive infernal weapon: spiral mustache

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 4:23 PM

#

it needs pringles flavor text

#

ok im really leaving now

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:23 PM

#

take it easy out there

analog crystal Dec 31, 2018, 4:24 PM

#

Time to go die again

#

jumps out window

stiff ridge Dec 31, 2018, 4:31 PM

#

where is the right place to go for help?

#

having difficulty with a certine boss

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 4:31 PM

#

press CTRL+F and type in "meg" :p

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 4:32 PM

#

#nerfhydra

#

😄

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 4:33 PM

#

you can ask here

silent cliff Dec 31, 2018, 4:34 PM

#

yes, that also.. but i'm sure that a lot of helpful hints were already given by people more competent than I

hollow notch Dec 31, 2018, 4:38 PM

#

The all encompassing git gud is a local favorite

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 4:54 PM

#

Grinding often helps.

#

Grind darkness, improve yourself in the mirror, and try out different gods and boons.

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 5:28 PM

#

alright back home and i have time for one run before heading back out. any suggestion on weapon type?

onyx badger Dec 31, 2018, 5:33 PM

#

Win with just Casts

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 5:33 PM

#

alright

onyx badger Dec 31, 2018, 5:33 PM

#

It’s 1040 EZ

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 6:08 PM

#

Pick whatever weapon gives you more darkness.

#

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/340618610227544065/529359089516412939/unknown.png And I beat Hydra again!

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 6:09 PM

#

i dont have any use for darkness at this point

#

just having fun 😄

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 6:09 PM

#

Nor do I, I just do it for variety, you know?

still pewter Dec 31, 2018, 6:09 PM

#

lv 6 thunder dash

#

oof

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 6:09 PM

#

cast run hasn't given me a great start so im spending a lot of time running waiting for cast returns atm 😄

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 6:10 PM

#

The thing with the thunder dash only is the final fight still ate a lot of my defiances.

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 6:11 PM

#

spoke too soon, seaking blade rifts. its a start

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 6:11 PM

#

https://i.gyazo.com/bd812b13df7514a6a94e351e1a1879d8.png

#

this is how I'm entering the fight with Meg

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 6:12 PM

#

Good luck!

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 6:12 PM

#

everything lined up perfectly for once

dapper heart Dec 31, 2018, 6:12 PM

#

Hit and run, hit and run.

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 6:12 PM

#

fully charging the spin attack takes about a second and I can dash to activate it and double the damage

#

it's stupid

#

Oh Artemis I love you

#

Epic Hide Breaker

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 6:23 PM

#

gottem. the spin + seeker trivialized it https://i.imgur.com/5FMSFoP.png

Imgur

#

was a slow start, but fun run - thanks for the reco

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 6:24 PM

#

my spin-dashes are dealing over 1000 damage to armored enemies if I lose this I'm gonna tilt off the face of the planet

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 6:24 PM

#

LOL

#

If you manage to die with that I'll bring you some ambrosia next trip back home

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 6:33 PM

#

alright I'm rolling up on the hydra fight, nearly full health

#

https://i.gyazo.com/5cd91b0db933cfb161ad5dfe0f7e8d4e.png

#

Let's rock

#

VICTORY AT LAST

#

Berserk

#

https://i.gyazo.com/40d16dc3c0e2850f931bbf8b5f85d27a.png

#

well a 0.02% winrate is something 🙃

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 6:43 PM

#

Heyyyyy

#

Grats on the win!

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 6:44 PM

#

being able to oneshot the extra heads made it a bit too easy

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 6:44 PM

#

In the end hades always pulls us back down :(

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 6:44 PM

#

There is no escape

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 6:45 PM

#

:]

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 7:02 PM

#

If you'd do anything to help run the place you'd know parts of it are being renovated. Zag is basically a millennial.

#

I am coming up on 50 unusable keys, and it's getting to where I want some sort of early access reward for them all. Like a Zag top hat.

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 7:05 PM

#

Or at least let you break them down into darkness

keen badger Dec 31, 2018, 7:07 PM

#

But even darkness becomes useless pretty quickly
I think you should be able to trade them for gold

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 7:08 PM

#

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hecate

She could show up in future content patches.

Hecate

Hecate or Hekate (; Ancient Greek: Ἑκάτη, Hekátē) is a goddess in ancient Greek religion and mythology, most often shown holding a pair of torches or a key and in later periods depicted in triple form. She was variously associated with crossroads, entrance-ways, light...

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 7:08 PM

#

There we go

#

Key merchant!

keen badger Dec 31, 2018, 7:09 PM

#

There'd be an element of risk in trading keys for gold since you'd lose it all if you died
but I think that's a good thing

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 7:09 PM

#

You can Google Greek god of X and get whatever you like. It's a good source for a game like this, and public domain. I'm surprised more don't use it.

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 7:10 PM

#

The whole Greek myth angle is so overdone it’s hard to pull it off well

#

Most of the time it’s just met with a horde of complaining neckbeards

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 7:12 PM

#

I'm not suggesting you go as nuts as Disney's Hercules. But the original myths offer a lot of templates and archetypes without being too descriptive.

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 7:12 PM

#

Very true

#

I think the large amount of “But what if X was a hot girl instead” that gets flung around in games kinda spoiled the pot for most

#

Looking at you, Fate

keen badger Dec 31, 2018, 7:16 PM

#

This is really more suitable for the Discussion group, rather than Gameplay
But I'm really delighted that SGG seem genuinely keen to be as accurate to the Mythology as possible

#

They've had to pick and choose some details where there is conflicting information in the mythology itself
but I haven't noticed any glaring errors or stupid changes

#

I'm looking at you Disney 😠

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 7:20 PM

#

Collective side-eying

pastel jolt Dec 31, 2018, 7:21 PM

#

you know, pointing out that your conversation would fit better in another channel does not mean you should continue in the same channel

ionic laurel Dec 31, 2018, 8:38 PM

#

https://i.imgur.com/QiHdMq0.gifv

Imgur

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 8:39 PM

#

smooth moves

pastel jolt Dec 31, 2018, 9:06 PM

#

i'm stuck hearing running in the 90s with that gif

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:13 PM

#

Have you experienced getting launched back into the stone age with spear yet? Keep getting launched halfway across boss rooms from hitting immunes lol

forest marsh Dec 31, 2018, 9:16 PM

#

@ionic laurel re: using the bow, the best advice I can give is to practice the timing on dash-attack power shot, and make sure you max quick temper, shadow presence, and dash in the mirror. Not sure what your current usage is like, though, so 🤷

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:19 PM

#

I just got my second win!

#

50 straight runs of dying to the hydra and now I get two in a row!

covert glacier Dec 31, 2018, 9:21 PM

#

The game has in my opinion 3 really powerful builds

#

1 based on right click with Artemis

#

1 with the spear and the ares benediction based on normal hits

#

1 with Artemis and sword with the 400% attack dmg

#

Where you use the dash to get critical strikes

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:22 PM

#

yeah both of my wins were with Divine Strike/Hunter's Dash

covert glacier Dec 31, 2018, 9:22 PM

#

And another divinity to get more atk dmg

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:22 PM

#

one with the World Breaker sword and one with the spear

covert glacier Dec 31, 2018, 9:22 PM

#

I thought it was split the earth

#

World braker my bad

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:23 PM

#

my spear run ended up with more damage than my Sword, funnily enough

covert glacier Dec 31, 2018, 9:23 PM

#

These are the most powerful I've done and I tried it all x)

#

I don't think you can

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:23 PM

#

if only because I got to dump 5 poms into Divine Strike

covert glacier Dec 31, 2018, 9:24 PM

#

I've been up to 580dmg per attack with the sword

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:24 PM

#

I broke 1K with the spear

covert glacier Dec 31, 2018, 9:24 PM

#

1k ? X)

#

Demn

#

With Artemis aswell I guess

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:24 PM

#

140% damage on normal attacks, guaranteed crit on dash, plus a backstab and fully charged spin attack

#

and another 280% damage on crit against armor

covert glacier Dec 31, 2018, 9:25 PM

#

Oh i was talking on 580 dmg no matter what without backstab!

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:25 PM

#

ah I see

covert glacier Dec 31, 2018, 9:25 PM

#

Just pure critical dmg

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:25 PM

#

yeah my sword was only about 450-ish per hit

#

didn't get many poms

#

the spear let's you sorta guarantee backstabs if you dash while charging the spin attack

covert glacier Dec 31, 2018, 9:26 PM

#

Yeah a shame the game is too short for now

#

But it is sooo long to charge

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:27 PM

#

go for the extra range upgrade or the reduced charge time

covert glacier Dec 31, 2018, 9:27 PM

#

Anyway gotta go

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:27 PM

#

quick charge drops it down to a second for max

covert glacier Dec 31, 2018, 9:27 PM

#

Vs bosses it sucks imo

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:28 PM

#

it beat the hell out of Meg and the Hydra at least

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:28 PM

#

Yeah the spin spear build is pretty fun, I think i've gotten like 20 runs using it. Only thing that hits harder I think is the tri-shot bow

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:28 PM

#

the trick is to start the charge out of range and then dash to dodge

#

the spin activates where you land instead of where you started so you can clip through enemies for guaranteed backstab damage

forest marsh Dec 31, 2018, 9:29 PM

#

So did the spin-dash work for you, @glossy slate

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:29 PM

#

worked beautifully

#

it doesn't activate Quick Temper though, which is sad

forest marsh Dec 31, 2018, 9:29 PM

#

Doesn't it? I've never paid attention, honestly

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:29 PM

#

Hunter's Dash works fine with it though

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:29 PM

#

That and the followup crit from dash attack, think I hit 1200 on a hydra head total before.

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:30 PM

#

but it's really good for cheesing the hydra

forest marsh Dec 31, 2018, 9:30 PM

#

One hit kills on the heads is real nice

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:30 PM

#

dashing through the wall and then right back when he goes for a headbutt

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:35 PM

#

I personally like to play close to him and dash left or right to avoid so you can keep attacking, can be risky on the later phases cause if you get hit once by a projectile you can end up being stun-locked and eat them all, lol.

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:36 PM

#

I've lost at least 4 runs that I shouldn't have because of that

#

get him down to a sliver of health and then die because taking one homing shot forces you to eat 50 damage

#

now that I've learned the patterns it doesn't happen nearly as often but still

#

TILT

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:37 PM

#

Yeaaah, I haven't lost a run because of it but it sure did tilt me into making a few mistakes afterwards

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:38 PM

#

my usual tactic is to hide behind the wall and wait for the center of the cluster to fire and then dash through

#

risky but it feels great

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:40 PM

#

My first like 20 runs were like that but I got a bit into speed running it instead and can't go back

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:40 PM

#

fair

#

I'm no good with twitch gaming so I can't really do speedruns like that

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:43 PM

#

After doing every build/setup I could think of only thing left is for me to speedrun my fav build until I got it clean and ready for the update. ^^, I tried a spear special only a few times and they took like 28 mins compared to my usual 15~. The special makes me so sad

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:45 PM

#

man the first time I tried a spear-special run was also the first time I ran into Poseidon

#

I very quickly ended up killing myself with it

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:47 PM

#

I couldn't make it feel good or work well whatsoever, it locks you a little too much from actions and doesn't do enough damage for the time it takes. At least from what i've encountered

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:48 PM

#

Artemis' Hunter's Dash, the explosive spear, and Poseidon's knockback is a pretty potent combo

#

the explosion makes the spear stop where it impacts so you can't suck enemies back in

#

it's slow as hell but nothing will ever get near you

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:50 PM

#

I did that minus the knockback in exchange for Ares curse, hits everything the explosion hits so it was okay for aoe

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:50 PM

#

that's real good too

#

I made it all the way to Hydra with that plus Zeus' cast upgrade

#

and then died horribly because Hydra does not give a damn about knockback

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:53 PM

#

Haha yeah, it made it very difficult killing hydra with that build. Poseidon boons need a little love in my opinion

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:55 PM

#

they're very good for clearing rooms but you can't go too ham on them or else you'll end up dying to the bosses

#

which is kinda sad because his legendary boon is hilarious

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:57 PM

#

Yeah I can see them helping with survivability vs armor targets, pushing em back.

glossy slate Dec 31, 2018, 9:57 PM

#

especially with the shield

#

just slap them across the room whenever they think they can walk up

dim linden Dec 31, 2018, 9:58 PM

#

I could not get into the shield, dash build was fun to play but the ttk made me sad

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It's a good trade off for not taking like any damage though

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 11:24 PM

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Had a Zeus dash up to like 120 per dash.

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Just now. Was silly. Didn't even matter what weapon I had.

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Poseidon attack damage buff on top of some of the hammer attack buffs can be more than enough DPS for bosses.

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Is it one hammer per run?

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 11:29 PM

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yes

kindred sage Dec 31, 2018, 11:32 PM

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Just cleared Hydra for the first time (sword build, maining the special). Was going to quit but only needed a few jewels for an upgrade so I jumped in just for the lols). Ended up beating Hydra again with the bow fairly effortlessly. Just wanted to share since it took me a bit more than 50 tries shadesmile

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 11:45 PM

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Few things are more annoying than starting off with Heart - Key - Darkness - Key - Darkness with no other choices.

vapid mauve Dec 31, 2018, 11:45 PM

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dusa

tulip timber Dec 31, 2018, 11:45 PM

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No chests, no blood portals.

ivory dragon Dec 31, 2018, 11:49 PM

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grats on the clear @kindred sage !

stray radish Jan 1, 2019, 12:27 AM

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i call bs that i managed to beat Meg while drunk with basically no build at all XDDD

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got the Aphro scroll tho

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 1:03 AM

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@rose pawn my only wins were with the spear and the World Breaker sword

rose pawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:04 AM

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mine was with the throwing shield build haha

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throwing shield + ares special buff is op

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 1:04 AM

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both using Divine Strike from Athena and Hunter's Dash from Artemis

rose pawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:05 AM

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Oh I don't actually know how to use the spear lol

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 1:05 AM

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the range is a hell of a lot longer than you expect

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and the charge attack counts as a normal attack, so it gets stupid damage when modified

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:06 AM

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The bonus range pickup makes it basically the bow.

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With no wind up.

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It is super long.

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 1:08 AM

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plus you can increase the range furthur by dashing while you're holding the charge

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if they're on the screen, you can hit them

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and whatever was hiding behind them

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....and whatever was in the next room

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:08 AM

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I meant the regular attack extension, not spin.

onyx badger Jan 1, 2019, 1:09 AM

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How

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:09 AM

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Hammer buff. 🔨

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I think it more than double spear normal attack range. It's pretty funny though not sure how good it is. That was a weird 120 damage Zeus dash run, haven't played spear enough to try it again.

rose pawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:12 AM

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I have been spamming throwing shield build lol

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it's so easy

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:12 AM

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Think I'm gonna try an Aphrodite bow special run.

rose pawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:12 AM

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I'll have to try to beat the hydra with the other weapons tho

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:13 AM

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I still have yet to win with bow

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Someday

rose pawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:13 AM

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Also Dusa is so cute!!!

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:14 AM

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I never actually liked world breaker sword

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Tried it a few times, but button spam is my life

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:16 AM

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Bow is basically a lock for me now if I don't mess around. Even with bad draws on boon choices.

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:16 AM

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How do you win with bow tho ;_;

rose pawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:16 AM

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I like the rapid fire bow buff

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 1:16 AM

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timing and pattern memorization

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:16 AM

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Oh wait actual skill, I’m doomed

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:17 AM

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Yeah, I know how to kite everything now.

rose pawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:17 AM

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hope for cael's hammer and you'll be fine

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:17 AM

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And bosses are just positioning, patience, and pattern recognition.

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Three Ps. :)

dim linden Jan 1, 2019, 1:18 AM

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I wanna say bow is the easiest to clear with safely, plus that tri-shot dmg can be insaane

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:18 AM

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D o o m e d

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 1:19 AM

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ya just gotta feel it man

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:19 AM

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Nah, it's not that steep a skill curve. I think all the weapons have a good learning curve.

rose pawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:20 AM

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I think the shield is the easiest to play

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:20 AM

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I feel the other weapons just fine ;_; Got a couple wins with all of them

rose pawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:20 AM

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spam special and run away

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:20 AM

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That's basically bow but you do more damage.

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And regular attack.

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 1:20 AM

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Aim with your eye. Shoot with your mind. Kill with your heart.

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:21 AM

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Remember the face of your father.

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 1:21 AM

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Eyyyy ajfingerguns

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:21 AM

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If he is actually the real father >.>

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:21 AM

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The Dark Tower: Maury Edition

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:22 AM

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Alright, gonna attempt another bow run, I’m sure I’ll be back to complain about how it goes

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:22 AM

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Try for Ares, it's most forgiving.

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:23 AM

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That does sound like a solid plan

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Starting with Dusa keepsake since it makes me happy~~

tulip timber Jan 1, 2019, 1:27 AM

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I wonder how it took the industry so long to realize gamers would pay to be a member of the game's play testing staff.

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 1:42 AM

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Not long it has been going on for 30 years at least

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Minecraft is when it really took off though

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:42 AM

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So do I want rapid shot or triple shot

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 1:43 AM

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rapid

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so much safer

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:43 AM

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Sweet

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Woot got legendary Zeus buff

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 1:54 AM

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oh that one's sick

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do you have the cast buff to go with it?

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:55 AM

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I’ve got Q buffed

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It’s pretty sweet

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 1:55 AM

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Nice

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 1:57 AM

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Whoops now I also have cast

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Guess this is a Zeus run

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On to hydra, wish me luck~~

ivory dragon Jan 1, 2019, 2:07 AM

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Happy new year before I forget, hades family

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 2:07 AM

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🎊 dusa 🎊

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:08 AM

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I'm having a hard time not taking zues on attack for every weapon

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 2:08 AM

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try it with Athena and you'll never go back

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:08 AM

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deflection is not that good

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 2:09 AM

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Daaaarn it

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:09 AM

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it got nerfed a lot

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 2:09 AM

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deflection is fantastic, but that's not why

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 2:09 AM

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Defeated all the phases, died like one hit away from victory

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:09 AM

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lol you'll get there no worries

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 2:09 AM

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;_;

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 2:10 AM

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athena's has the highest damage modifier, if you're using bow or spear that's how you're going to start oneshotting enemies in Asphodel

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it's not that hard to get it past 120% attack bonus before critting

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:10 AM

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honestly zeus's damage is why higher than what it seems modifiers don't matter that much

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way higher

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 2:11 AM

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I usually use Zeus for casts because his area control is phenominal

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but I break 900 damage regularly with Athena

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:13 AM

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ok look at it like this athena on attack giving 98% increase on base damage while zeus is doing 15 (rare) - 25 (epic). Now with sword spear or shield that is the same as the 98% increase BUT zeus attack will hit multiple targets it goes up for each bounce with a base bounce of 4. That means Zeus attack has the highest damage.

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It also gets crazy when you can do multiple hits when enemies are grouped because it will bounce everywhere

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:14 AM

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Its really not the same with sword spear or shield

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On spear its way lower compared to the spin

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On sword and shield depending on the hammer upgrade its still a lot lower

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Also doesnt synergize with crit, and I believe doesnt work with the dash attack upgrade or the backstab

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:15 AM

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spear depends if you have the hammer buff for fast spin charge then you want modifiers if not zeus will beat them all

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:15 AM

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Id straight up say that Zeus is bad on all weapons except Flurry Blade Sword

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:15 AM

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no way safest buff in the game

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:16 AM

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Hardly, you cant really go for the hit and run playstyle that makes the weapons safe in the first place

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:16 AM

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yes you can because each bounce on the bolt gives you that slight hit stun

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 2:16 AM

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unless they're armored

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:16 AM

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you can easily cc a crowd

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:17 AM

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Unless theyre armoured, exactly

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Also doesnt work on bosses

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:17 AM

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which is the same for every weapon

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:17 AM

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And bosses and armoured foes are the only difficult parts to begin with

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 2:17 AM

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and once you're one or two rooms into asphodel, that's every enemy

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:17 AM

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does work on bosses btw

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takes down hydra in no time becaue the heads are close enough

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:17 AM

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Nah, you can just dash attack with the weapons

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:17 AM

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um? what? that is exactly what you do

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:17 AM

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Or spin with the spear

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:18 AM

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you cannot always charge spear though

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:18 AM

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To max, no, but half-charge is quick

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:18 AM

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even with fast charge you are going to need to be presice with it

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:18 AM

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And half-charge is often good enough

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:18 AM

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yeah on fast charge attack > charge is easy enough to pull off

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:18 AM

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The problem with Zeus is that it falls off the second you have maxed out mirror upgrades and/or the crit dash

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Which is pretty soon

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:19 AM

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crit dash is overrated so much

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:19 AM

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And not only does it end up doing less damage than Athenas boon

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It also has no utility like Athenas boon

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 2:19 AM

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hold the charge at even a moderately safe distance and by the time the enemy starts an attack animation you can just dash towards them, hit everything in an AoE, and be completely immune to damage for the duration

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:19 AM

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I know how to use the spear I have 30 clears with it

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hope they fix the special on it though

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 2:20 AM

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yeah the special needs a bit of work to keep up

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real good with Ares tho

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:20 AM

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if it didn't root you when you used it

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do you get that double hex with ares?

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:20 AM

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Uh

glossy slate Jan 1, 2019, 2:20 AM

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if you wait a moment before recalling, yes

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:20 AM

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The special was insane pre-buff

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:21 AM

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urge to kill is the only buff I like taking from him atm

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:21 AM

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Its really, really good right now

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Probably the easiest way to beat runs

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Right

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Because with bow you actually have to time your shots

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:21 AM

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I'd say the easiest way to beat runs is Zeus legendary

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 2:22 AM

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;_;

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:22 AM

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Nah

worn dawn Jan 1, 2019, 2:22 AM

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I’m so bad

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:22 AM

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you can clear entire rooms in less than 10 seconds

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:22 AM

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Just Spear special with guaranteed crit, and Artemis crit damage upgrades

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:22 AM

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hydra just gets melted

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:22 AM

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Or Bow with crit dash, athena attack and good timing

ivory dragon Jan 1, 2019, 2:22 AM

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Crit dash is great, sorry just saw someone say it was overrated

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:22 AM

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because it is

dim linden Jan 1, 2019, 2:22 AM

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Bow is definitely the easiest, done a few no boon runs with it lol. I'm more a spear spin person myself though

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:23 AM

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Or Sword with worldsplitter, crit dash and athena attack

ivory dragon Jan 1, 2019, 2:23 AM

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Crit dash kills enemies the moment they spawn

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Hard to top that

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:23 AM

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Crit dash is busted, yeah

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:23 AM

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world splitter is the highest single hit damage I have done

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:23 AM

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Probably too busted

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:23 AM

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I got it up to 600 damage before crits

ivory dragon Jan 1, 2019, 2:24 AM

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Splitter is good fun yeah, kind of lulzy

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:24 AM

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once you figure out the timing you're untouchable

dim linden Jan 1, 2019, 2:24 AM

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1000~ with spin for me

ivory dragon Jan 1, 2019, 2:24 AM

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That's true with most things I find

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The untouchable part

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:24 AM

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I'll lay down some numbers for ya

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:24 AM

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My best was something around 1300 crits with spear special I believe

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:25 AM

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crit dash with spear is 30, sword 40, shield 60 bow is generally 50-80

ivory dragon Jan 1, 2019, 2:25 AM

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Once you know enemy attack animations and timings, boons just speed up the ttk but not much else

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:25 AM

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zeus dash at lvl 1 does 120 damage on 3 dashes and I don't have to attack

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yeah crit dash is overrated because I can do more damage and be safer

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:25 AM

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On the other hand

ivory dragon Jan 1, 2019, 2:26 AM

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Crit dash is safe

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:26 AM

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Crit dash with attack upgrade boon, crit upgrade boon, and hammer upgrade

ivory dragon Jan 1, 2019, 2:26 AM

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Unless you are being dumb with it

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:26 AM

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Is like 400+ damage on every dash

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Which is faster than 3 dashes

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Even with just attack upgrades (And backstab) its higher

ivory dragon Jan 1, 2019, 2:26 AM

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I don't think there really is an "unsafe" attack in the game atm

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:26 AM

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In fact, its even already higher with just the dash attack upgrade

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:26 AM

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you cannot always count on backstab so I leave it out

hard holly Jan 1, 2019, 2:27 AM

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You can if you play well

ivory dragon Jan 1, 2019, 2:27 AM

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You can manipulate backstabs pretty reliably

rain axle Jan 1, 2019, 2:27 AM

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you can until there is a group

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which is most rooms