Yeah 😦
#off-topic-discussion
toxic steppe
That was a swing and a miss for Cloud.
Also ||why bother making me love Jessie so much if you're going to still kill her but spare Wedge AND AS IT TURNS OUT, BIGGS AS WELL??||
So salty
odd grove
Hey look at the bright side
signal musk
pretends to understand whats being discussed
odd grove
At least it ain't XC2
sudden torrent
||Cloud is so socially awkward even the death of one of the dots of the love square still makes him slip up such lines. ||
||I guess since they are written as these sort of anime sidekicks that exist they were given ability to stay. ||
faint panther
||Jessie's glove is on the dresser next to Biggs when he wakes up, there's a chance.||
toxic steppe
||The gold rain in Zach's scene is also present in Biggs' so it may be an alternate Biggs altogether||
indigo walrus
It's so nice, that The Kid is in the centre 🙂 That is still the best soundtrack from game I've ever heard, among Rayman 2 and Hollow Knight
I'm thinking about getting Necro Dancer now, since it's on such a big sale. Any thoughts about that game, guys?
hexed hollow
necrodancer is a great game, but it can be incredibly punishing
hearty wedge
@indigo walrus NecroDancer is quite hard imo but its fun once you get the hang of it
Cadence of Hyrule is a really really big improvement visually tho
I have the original for the switch and handheld is murder cause its so tiny
indigo walrus
From the looks of it, Necro Dancer reminds of Pixel Dungeon, which I liked a lot back in a day
I wonder how rhythm works for a rogue lite... I guess I'll try just for the sake of trying a new experience
hexed hollow
keep to the beat and learn the enemy attack patterns :3
you have a beat indicator thingy to help you with that
indigo walrus
alright, I'll try it, thanks guys 🙂
hexed hollow
no worries, hope you enjoy ^_^
hearty wedge
There is also a character that disables the need to be on beat so you can learn the enemy patterns if its too hard
Enjoy ^^
hexed hollow
oh yeah, I forgot that character existed 
hasty kernel
Oh I missed FF7R talk
Yeah ||Aerith knows too much from the very start. Its why I thought she was responsible for the whispers||
||Anyway, my big issue is that the whispers dont act according to what they were described as||
||Supposedly they prevent people from altering the timeline too much||
||But in actuality, they keep altering the timeline themselves. Jessie being injured and not going on the raid to mako reactor 5. Wedge and Biggs surviving. Aeriths and Clouds first interaction changing entirely||
||While they do nothing to stop the 2 people who know the timeline and keep trying to mess with it||
faint panther
||To the best of my knowledge they are attempting to "course correct." Injuring Jessie was to get Cloud back on the reactor 5 bombing (like he was in OG), blowing up Jessie's grenade prematurely, trying to separate Cloud and Aerith before they meet for the first time at her church, etc.||
hasty kernel
||Right but then, why dont they stop Sephiroth from pulling Cloud down the wrong path? That in itself causes the other things they "course correct", but they didnt do anything about it. They also caused Wedge and Biggs to survive, they made the way Cloud and Aerith interact very different, Jessie dies to a grenade and not to the plate falling and so on||
desert minnow
||becaue Square Enix’ storywriting has been less than stellar for a while, XV was one of their few good ones||
faint panther
||I don't think their influence is total. Sephiroth and Aerith definitely seem to be able to mess with the timeline and I can see Sephiroth especially being outside of their ability to block considering he is currently in the Lifestream.||
hasty kernel
||Right but they dont have to block Sephiroth because Sephiroth himself doesnt actually physically appear||
||All they wouldve had to do is block Cloud from the detour||
||Theyve shown to be able to block and railroad paths, after all||
||Hence why my theory was that someone is using them to mess up the timeline, and towards the end I was sure it was Aerith doing it||
faint panther
||That would be very in-character. Do you think she was clowning the entire game or is she figuring out how to manipulate the Arbiters on the fly?||
hasty kernel
||Part of the latter, part trying to hide it?||
faint panther
||Considering the "true" timeline ends in her death, whatever the ultimate benefit/outcome, I get trying to avoid that while still getting the W.||
hasty kernel
||Because if it is true, then she is still, as far as cloud and the others know, responsible for the fall of plate 7, and the death of biggs||
faint panther
||Biggs survives, he wakes up at the end of the game. It's Jessie that's probably dead.||
hasty kernel
||Right, but they dont know that||
faint panther
||Can you go over the plate falling and how Aerith ties into that?||
hasty kernel
||I also imagine its not just Aerith trying to survive, but also trying to create a timeline where the meteor is stopped much earlier||
||My guess is that it happening is a neccessary event. It means that the crew have no attachments left to Midgar, and their ire towards Shinra is amplified||
||If the plate doesnt fall, there is no guarantee they even find out about Sephiroth||
||Plus it creates a convenient context for her being captured||
faint panther
||If Aerith is aware the original timeline, she doesn't have any reason to let the plate fall. She can point them in Sephiroth's direction.||
hasty kernel
||Not without it being suspicious||
indigo walrus
umm, guys, don't you want to have this conversation in pm maybe? you're putting spoilers anyway, so it's basically a wall of black stripes now in this chat 😉
hasty kernel
||Aerith already lets it slip that she knows more than she should a couple times. Imagine if she outright told them about Sephiroth, they would question how she knows||
faint panther
Ideally anyone who has played/watched 7R would also be chiming in.
hasty kernel
Yup, thats the idea
hasty kernel
||The part that feels off is that, while the undercity was mostly evacuated, the topside people werent, and they all died as far as we can tell. By Aeriths standards thats unusually cruel, even if neccessary||
indigo walrus
@hexed hollow @hearty wedge ok, so my first impression about NecroDancer are: Ok, it's interesting, bit annoying with Cadence sometimes, I like it with Bard more, would like to finish the story mode and discover what game's got to offer.
Also, I thought I'd just try a little bit of it and I ended up playing for 90 minutes, which is a good sign 😉
hasty kernel
||Oh yeah, the other reason why I think its Aerith is because Sephiroth manipulating them doesnt make a whole lot of sense||
||If he has that much control, he could have stopped them from going down a path that leads to him||
fervent zenith
I have the hunch they made The NecroDancer game JUST to make that pun
fervent zenith
Also about FF7R it was implied in the OG game that Humanity is doomed anyways, with or without Sephiroth
||The heroes see Meteor falling and they presuppose that's the end of humanity, taking it out of context, but the true ending of humanity is that the Earth has almost reclaimed the planet and That's what now they have the chance to stop||
hasty kernel
||Im not sure I agree with that interpretation?||
||What we see is that Midgar gets reclaimed||
fervent zenith
That's the fun thing about incomplete games each one has its interpretation
hasty kernel
||But Midgar was basically totally destroyed||
||There isnt really any indication that the planet as a whole is getting reclaimed||
fervent zenith
||maybe reclaimed isn't the right word||
But
|| the later games puts a twist on the plot by saying the WEAPONS are a twisted effort to save humanity from itself. If the Life Stream decides the planet is polluted beyond hope, it ejects itself into space to find another healthy. The WEAPONS are sent to kill humans so their souls are re-absorbed rather than be left behind on a barren planet||
hasty kernel
||Actually thats only in Dirge of Cerberus||
||Which is now non-canon||
||In the original game, they just protect the planet, from Jenova or from the mako reactors||
raven harbor
||Judging by the amount of things the remake brings into making canon, I would be suspect if they didn't pull anything from Dirge||
hasty kernel
||I mean the official line is that everything other than FF7 is non-canon now||
raven harbor
||But you've got characters from deep cuts like the Turk side story showing up, so I'm going to assume that means "they haven't happen in the Remake timeline", rather than "we plan to ignore these and so should you"||
Then again, I'm coming at this from the angle of someone who A, has never consumed a FF7 related content in my life, and B, is a sucker for this exact specific sort of thing
hasty kernel
||Thats true I suppose, but that one came out much later than any of the other games, no?||
raven harbor
||The Kids Are Alright released in 2011 in Japan, while Crisis Core was the closest at 2007. So a bit of a time gap, but not what I would call a super significant one||
fervent zenith
Oh no, FFVII got Star Wars'ed
But yeah even if not canon, almost all spin-offs got its own callback
raven harbor
I guess my big point is like
fervent zenith
Yeah I want to see the Overworld
toxic steppe
I'm excited about the five additional playable characters.
fervent zenith
Costa del Sol intensifies
raven harbor
Are they non-canon, or ||did they just get relegated to the other timeline||
I'm a fan of one and not a fan of the other
raven harbor
But yeah, the only real thing to do is wait at this point
fervent zenith
I think they got the Canon until told otherwise
That or the Mortal Kombat treatment
You know what I mean?
Because it's happpening EXACTLY the same as MK9
toxic steppe
From what I've seen ||people assume that it'll continue to follow OG timeline with Cloud and co, while divergent timeline with Zach and everybody else that is supposed to be dead in the OG timeline runs concurrent. I don't much understand this next part: There's also talk of Zach having to cross over into the OG timeline so they can beat Sepiroth, and also the idea that this split timeline where everybody is alive is only existing so they have to sacrifice it at the end, since sacrifice is the central theme||
fervent zenith
Let me explain there were 8 Mortal kombat games
In the eight one all gones to hell
So one protagonist send his memories back in time to make his past self avoid apocalypse
Diverging the timeline and decanonizing the games
EXCEPT mortal kombat Subzero which is a prequel
Same as here
toxic steppe
Haha I saw that one.
fervent zenith
Maybe the prequels happened exactly the same
sudden torrent
lesson learnt: time travelling sucks unless it doesn't change the existing timeline.
fervent zenith
But the future games are not canon
raven harbor
I'll be honest I don't know what I typed lol but Raiden is also just Not Great at accomplishing what he tried to
toxic steppe
It was just an f-bomb.
fervent zenith
So Crisis Core is canon and Advent Children isn't
raven harbor
I'm really interested to see where they take things
fervent zenith
Also Crisis Core HAS to be canon
toxic steppe
CC is about Zach and Cloud right?
fervent zenith
All Cloud's and Sephiroth motivations comes from there
It also explains Sephiroth madness
It's actually jarring, he was still creepy and aloof but in Crisis Core he actually was kinda nice and empathetic before going cuckoo
toxic steppe
Also is the Sepiroth you ||fight at the Edge of Creation the real Sepiroth or just another clone? I know that the one they see, at least at the Shinra HQ roof, is a clone.||
fervent zenith
Like he let Zack go protect Aerith and not report him AWOL because Zack cared about her safety
@toxic steppe ||Clone, Sephiroth is still 'dead'||
toxic steppe
||I also wish I had gotten a screenshot of that dope shot with Cloud in the very close foreground and Sephiroth and the Meteor in the background over his shoulder||
fervent zenith
Ah another Crisis Core reference in FF7R that solved a doubt people had durng a decade
Kunsel still lives
So he may or may not appear in the sequel
hasty kernel
Nah the one you fight at ||the edge of creation is real, since thats within the lifestream||
fervent zenith
Oh, yeah I forgot
hasty kernel
||I dont think we will really have split or parallel timelines||
fervent zenith
My bad
toxic steppe
||I have no idea what the Lifestream is, but based on context I'm assuming it's the life source of the Planet?||
hasty kernel
||We have a divergent one from the original, and knowledge of whats supposed to happen, but the timeline is self-contained based on what we know||
||Basically, yes. All life comes from the lifestream, and returns to it||
toxic steppe
So it's what they're referring to when they say Mako
hasty kernel
||Basically||
fervent zenith
God, we Pannenkoek to help us solve this
hasty kernel
Personally I can see 3 ways the next game plays out
||Option 1, its more or less the same as the original, juts expanded. Problem is, that doesnt make much sense with the shift in narrative and the focus on defying destiny||
||Option 2, Sephiroth is the dominant force in messing up the timeline. He changes things around to accelerate his timetable, and we might skip ahead a bit here and there||
toxic steppe
||I honestly think they're going to subvert our expectations involving Aerith, but instead of not killing her, they're going to make us think they're not going to kill her and then kill her again anyway.||
fervent zenith
Cloud: Falls in love with Jessie
Arbiter: Twitches eye
||There is NO WAY Aerith doesn't receive the Sephiroth special||
toxic steppe
||...Did Jessie's parents die in the plate crash?||
hasty kernel
||Option 3, Aerith is the dominant force, and the plot goes further away from the original, with the goal being that Sephiroths plans get messed up. I.e., visiting locations in the wrong order, changing the time and place of events, or outright preventing them||
raven harbor
||If they end up killing Tifa instead of Aerith there's going to be a riot, and that's who would I would think would be put in that spot||
hasty kernel
||Far as we know, yes||
toxic steppe
||F||
fervent zenith
||No way the father did||
hasty kernel
||Oh hell no. Dont you dare kill Tifa||
||My bet is 2, or a mix of 2 and 1. My hope is 3||
raven harbor
||There's also debate on whether Jessie is actually dead or not, so things are super up in the air for everything||
serene tulip
So in order to stay out of my own head I need to listen to an audiobook or podcast instead of music while working out. What should I listen to?
hasty kernel
The Nightwatch by Terry Pratchett
toxic steppe
I love to listen to My Brother, My Brother, And Me.
fervent zenith
my vote is on yes she is
hasty kernel
Or any of the Guards book
raven harbor
So it might not be appropriate for the current timing, but the World War Z audiobook is absolutely stellar
hasty kernel
||She is. There is a big difference in how she is presented, and Biggs is||
raven harbor
Otherwise I don't think you can go wrong with any Pratchett, yea
hasty kernel
||With Biggs they were ambiguous, with Jessie not so much||
toxic steppe
||If she is alive, she's missing an arm and it's in an alt timeline||
raven harbor
||Something something glove on table is the thing people point to||
hasty kernel
||Yeah, but I dunno, I think thats more a memento||
toxic steppe
Did any of you get the Aerith scene at the end of Chapt 14?
I got Tifa's but I watched Barret's and Aerith's.
hasty kernel
||Uh, what are you referring to?||
fervent zenith
||Jessie: Gets arm destroyed by a grenade||
||Jessie: Tis' but a flesh wound||
toxic steppe
||Before they go storm Shinra HQ to save Aerith they stay at her house. During the night you go up to the flowers and a scene occurs with one of the three depending on your choices||
hasty kernel
||Oh, I think that was Aerith for me?||
||At least there was a scene where she talked about being back at her old house||
toxic steppe
||Barret's is the best imo since it really characterizes him and his Avalanche team more, but Aerith's is a dream Cloud has and it feels like a different Aerith altogether is speaking to him, she's blatantly talking like she knows she's going to die||
hasty kernel
||My guess there is, whatever connection allowed them to talk, prevents them from hiding the truth||
toxic steppe
||But the thing is, during this dream Cloud tells Aerith very firmly that's he's coming to rescue her. But when they get to Shinra HQ, Aerith is surprised and says "You came for me!" So the Aerith in the dream was either just a straight up dream for Cloud, or maybe even an Aerith from a future point.||
hasty kernel
||I think its neither. I think it was a subconcious connection that she didnt control||
opaque quail
Joyful you fully got me with that link. 
I'm not quite done with FFVIIR so I've been very carefully poking through this conversation. 👀
toxic steppe
How far along are you?
fervent zenith
FF7 was my first Playstation Game, so i got the game full in my heart
I doubt I could play it now, tho I just don't want my nostalgia smashed
opaque quail
I think I'm on the last chapter, I'm ||trying to get out of Shinra HQ now with the whole gang. I left off in Aerith's old room I believe (it's been a couple days).||
toxic steppe
Well if this first one was anything to go off of I expect the rest to be pretty good.
fervent zenith
My brother meanwhile has 0 idea of the original he only played Crisis core and Advent Children. He actually has 0 clue about Tifa personality xd
odd grove
This chat be like ⬛:black_large_square:⬛:black_large_square:⬛:black_large_square:⬛:black_large_square:⬛:black_large_square:⬛:black_large_square:⬛:black_large_square:⬛
toxic steppe
xD
opaque quail
I figured!! I've been able to totally avoid spoilers on the length/aspects of this game so at chapter 14 I thought I was at the end. Then at 15. Then at 16.....
fervent zenith
Something that killed me is that they swapped Aerith and Tifa personalities in the spin-offs
toxic steppe
Yeah haha I was like that at that point, too.
fervent zenith
Tifa is the shy one and Aerith the bold and foul mouthed one
toxic steppe
I was like "Is this the end? No, how about this? No... this one?"
fervent zenith
Well, reserved
toxic steppe
Speaking of foul mouthed
hasty kernel
Yeah, or unsure about avalanche
toxic steppe
I loved how often they all curse.
opaque quail
I've really loved playing it and the combat is great, but I do feel like chapters 13 - the end start to have a bit of drag to them
hasty kernel
Aerith however is a girl who grew up in the slums
She is not this delicate innocent flower
opaque quail
It's hard to know if that's because I'm familiar with the beats of the game though. 🤔
fervent zenith
When Aerith dropped that Random s-bomb I laughed my ass off
hasty kernel
Oh
toxic steppe
I don't know the beats of the OG at all and I really liked the pacing.
toxic steppe
But since it's all new to me I was just open and ready to absorb everything.
I just want to be on the bandwagon
opaque quail
I liked most of the event pacing, I just wished most of the traversal sections were like. 10% shorter maybe
hasty kernel
But yeah even in the original its Aerith that ||threatens to castrate Don Corneo||
fervent zenith
Yeah feels weird I think Midgar lasted 10 hours for me in the OG
hasty kernel
Also that scene where Aerith hits one of the goons with a steel chair
fervent zenith
While smiling
toxic steppe
Well Midgar does make up only like 10% of the plot of the original.
fervent zenith
Alo you only get like 3 weapons per character there
hasty kernel
At this point I just wanna see Aerith getting a weapon in a future game thats just a pair of knuckles
toxic steppe
I was watching a video where people were playing the OG and the R side by side and the person playing the OG had already blown up Reactor 1 by the time the R had finished like, the first Aerith cutscene
hasty kernel
And her moveset becomes wrestling-themed
opaque quail
10%....................... don't really want to check how many hours I have on the remake now. 👀
It was also, incidentally, 100GB.
hasty kernel
I do think parts of the remake however is just padding
toxic steppe
The goal is to Platinum it
hasty kernel
Made to make it longer
opaque quail
So. I'll get an external storage device just for the full remake probably. 🤔
fervent zenith
My Aussie friend finished in 70
Personally now I'm playing it spoilered (Got a ps4 yoohoo) im 20 in
toxic steppe
Anybody ||fight the Pride and Joy prototype yet?||
fervent zenith
Not yet but I plan to
hasty kernel
||The what?||
fervent zenith
||Bonus boss of the VR challenges||
toxic steppe
It's ridiculous because || to get to them in Round 5, you literally have to fight through all the summons including a Bahamut that summons Ifrit||
fervent zenith
It's actually foreshadowing
But thats for the last ff7 game so I wont spoil it here
toxic steppe
||Shiva, Fat Chocobo, Levivathan, then Bahamut w/ Ifrit||
||The latter being the hardest fight in the whole game||
hasty kernel
I havent even fought ||Bahamut|| yet
toxic steppe
I haven't either, I have a single Battle Report to finish in order to do so.
||Did fight the Whisper version, tho||
hasty kernel
||What is it foreshadowing again?||
fervent zenith
OK, WARNING SPOILERS FOR A FUTURE GAME ||Pride and Joy is the prototype for the Proudclod, Shinra's best weapon that Scarlet and Heidegger try to use to kill you at the end of the game||
hasty kernel
||Ah, right||
fervent zenith
I was told when FFVII came out there were ton of controversy
A lot of people felt mislead thinking it was Action-RPG
Because the trailers emphasized the Cutscenes bit too much
fervent zenith
The remake is a Genuine Action-RPG
Where you control a party member and the party is controlled by an AI
And you can change the one who you want to use anytime
toxic steppe
They did a real good job at making them each feel distinct, too.
I genuinely love the combat system so I'm looking forward to the Hard playthrough.
hasty kernel
The remake is kinda a middle-thing?
To use spells and actions you gotta go in a submenu
You can link some of them to quick button combinations
Buuuuut you dont have enough space
toxic steppe
You can link 4 which is more than enough, though.
hasty kernel
Here is one thing I didnt like too much about the remake: It didnt really feel challenging
Nah
Just on cloud Im using Assess, Steal, Cura/Curaga, Braver, Infinities End, Focused Thrust (OwO) and sometimes counterstrike
toxic steppe
I have a dedicated healer so I don't have to worry about that much clutter.
hasty kernel
Cloud is my dedicated healer
toxic steppe
What
hasty kernel
Though I also have pray for AoE healing
hasty kernel
Look my logic was simple
Barret is on Pray and Stagger duty
Tifa does the damage
So cloud is the healer
hasty kernel
Same
toxic steppe
Tifa is my Stagger.
hasty kernel
My issue is that Cloud, generally speaking, doesnt do that much damage
He can crush staggered enemies with uh
Infinities End
But for regular room clear, his regular attacks are better than commands
Might a well use the ATB bars for healing
Tifa is the damage dealer because Metal Knuckles are absurd
toxic steppe
Yeah Tifa is pretty crazy.
I have the Parry on her with an HP Absorption attached haha.
hasty kernel
Surprisingly Aerith is the other good damage dealer
hasty kernel
Her Tempest shreds stationary enemies
toxic steppe
Refocus*
hasty kernel
Tier 3s?
hasty kernel
Ah
Nah I just gave her some spell materia in case I need to exploit weaknesses, Pray and I think magic up
odd grove
@hasty kernel That's literally a Raidou game
toxic steppe
But with the Refocus limit and the accessory that fills your ATB gauge when using Refocus.
Plus the Arcane Ward.
odd grove
FF7R is just a Raidou game then?
hasty kernel
I do not know what a Raidou game is
odd grove
Devil Summoner: Raidou Kuzonoha vs is a series of games made by Atlus
It stands out as it's possibly the first game to be a "balanced" middle ground between action rpg and jrpg
And it features literally everything you said about it so far
toxic steppe
It's cool that the Materia system is so strong that you can really dedicate any party member you want to whatever task.
I have Barret as my main tank/healer because his HP pool is crazy and he has that Lifesaver ability.
Which is, well, a Lifesaver.
odd grove
Tank healers are neat, yes
toxic steppe
Then I have Magnify + Barrier on him so I can get the team wide Manawall.
His ATB fill rate is also like, super quick, especially after you get Hastes off.
odd grove
Not bad
toxic steppe
Though you can fill Aerith's super fast too by getting aggro with somebody else then switching to her and just popping off a single fully charged Tempest
odd grove
I got Turdak with Dia and Heal Boost
hasty kernel
Here is the funny thing
I completely ignored Materia for the most part
I rarely used damage up materia, and never defensive materia
odd grove
With his above average str he's pretty good dealing damage and heals more than enough
hasty kernel
Or debuff materia
odd grove
Why would you ignore debuffs
toxic steppe
I didn't really start strategizing with the Materia until after Cha 14.
hasty kernel
They didnt really seem useful
hasty kernel
Death is the best debuff
toxic steppe
Also the debuffs are super useful.
odd grove
Yah
toxic steppe
I just wish there was more than one Magnify.
odd grove
Pull some Rakukaja on em'
toxic steppe
But that would be OP
hasty kernel
FF7R doesnt really have attack/defense debuffs IIRC
odd grove
Then the rest of the game will be a cakewalk once i get Harlot
toxic steppe
The Binding Materia affects attack/defense at max level.
By applying the Berserk debuff.
The Subversion Materia is super useful for removing enemy barriers and stuff too, especially those annoying ball drones.
hasty kernel
But yeah my general feeling is that there was a lack of challenge in FF7R
Or rather, good challenge
The last 2 bosses were an absolute pain
toxic steppe
Have you attempted Hard mode yet?
toxic steppe
Well, that'll probably help, it definitely is harder.
hasty kernel
Main difference is that you cant use items/regen MP at rests, no?
I dont like that kinda difficulty
toxic steppe
It's not so bad since you only replay a chapter at a time.
But I thought the last bosses were pretty easy, but our parties are set up completely differently.
||You can counter pretty much every single attack Sepiroth throws at you, I was just chaining the Punisher mode counter directly into the ability counter you get from Cloud's last sword.||
hasty kernel
For me the trouble was that ||Whisper Bahamuth kept doing the two ball attack||
||While Sephiroth interrupted every attempt at healing like the prick he is||
toxic steppe
||Yeah Bahamut was a pain. A big help in that fight for me was Tifa's Parry, which just lets her slide dash around at a crazy pace.||
Did you do much of the Shinra Simulations?
They get pretty challenging too.
hasty kernel
||I did do those. Those were surprisingly easy||
toxic steppe
It's wild that we're having like, complete opposite experiences in some areas. xD
hasty kernel
||Probably differences in build/playstyle||
toxic steppe
For sure.
hasty kernel
||My experience with the simulations was that throwing a lot of damage at them was enough to make them easy||
||I just maxed out on damage in general||
toxic steppe
So for Weapon Upgrades.
Did you like, hand pick them?
Or did you have it auto-level?
hasty kernel
There was an auto-level option?
toxic steppe
Oof.
Yeah, go into the Weapon Upgrade menu and when you hover over a weapon you can push Triangle.
sudden torrent
Wait really
toxic steppe
Then it'll open a menu and you can choose to have it auto-level the web based on balanced, attack, or defense.
toxic steppe
I never once manually selected a skill lol
hasty kernel
Then all +% for damage
sudden torrent
watched a lot of playthroughs first time hearing about this.
hasty kernel
Then whatever else helps me do more damage
Then health regain when doing damage
And then materia slots
toxic steppe
I didn't want to be bothered doing it for every single weapon every time so I leaned heavily into the auto-level.
That's wild you didn't know about it it gives you a tutorial prompt about the feature.
hasty kernel
I guess I skipped that one
toxic steppe
I put priority on Attack for the most part, but with Barret I prioritized Defense.
Dang I'll have to like, look at all the things it auto-selected for me for more insight into why things are working for me rn.
raven harbor
I usually find that auto-level systems invariably make awful choices
hasty kernel
Ive had some that worked well before
toxic steppe
Well they did me right this time around.
Also hype
Finally have a release date.
Even more off topic, but if you're a Funhaus fan AND a Star Wars fan then this video is quite a treasure - https://youtu.be/Jq2XuNqQEVU
odd grove
@toxic steppe ICH WILL this thing to come out already
faint panther
@hasty kernel Watching a stream of a Hard Mode playthrough and he's ||at the plate drop. As for why Aerith doesn't try to evacuate the topside of the plate, they never even make it topside before it drops, and I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be able to convince topsiders that Shinra was planning on murdering an 8th of largest(?) city in the world.||
hasty kernel
||Yeah thats why she couldnt save them||
||But even in my theory, even with it being "neccessary" in her eyes, Aerith still causes the deaths of thousands of people. Thats cruel by her standard||
toxic steppe
Yo my PSN is Heart_of_Eld by the way.
If any of you want to add me, presumably we all own PS4's since we've been talking about FFVIIR for the past few days.
faint panther
||Just to double-check, you think she could have stopped the drop but didn't because doing so would hurt the plot to stop Sephiroth?||
toxic steppe
Honestly I'd be fine if they just remade the next two in a similar style.
hasty kernel
||Well, the Whispers were the reason Rude could initiate the sequence, so yeah, if the whispers didnt interfere, she could have stopped it. The idea being that she didnt precisely because otherwise they wouldnt go after Sephiroth, and the planet as a whole would be doomed||
toxic steppe
Yeah PotF can be included.
Screw it, remake them all. I just want to replay them but have them look pretty.
odd grove
And new content ofc
My favorite trope of remakes is "here's the cut content you datamined"
Also i might buy the FUN edition for Battle for Bikini Bottom
toxic steppe
Yeah.
They're doing that already for the first one by giving us the cut Area 52 mission.
odd grove
I just hope i can actually afford it tho
serene tulip
fervent zenith
I don't get it
velvet fjord
I could...
- complete schoolwork that is due very soon
But also...
- xcom chimera squad is right there on my desktop
north hamlet
do your homework and all the play after is 100% guilt and stress free
if you play first you will be playing with dread knowing that you have urgent work to do
velvet fjord
lol yeah I've finished it already, it's just my new Impossible run
also yeah
raven harbor
The characters all feel really unique, if a bit unbalanced in some senses, and between the turn-order change and the breach/encounter system, it feels a lot better to play
You do lose some of the more complex strategy elements in exchange, but I think that's Fine
Especially at a price point of uh
20 USD
velvet fjord
lmao yeah I love that one
my only problem is Terminal's existence and some of the dialogue/voices are iffy, but I can get over that
tranquil oracle
can someone explain to me about ranks; this is my first discord server? Or point me to where to look for explanations?
hushed zenith
The bot commands channel gives you ranks relevant to the games you're interested in! The only one that REALLY does anything is he Early Access one, which'll let you post in the feedback channel. There's also roles for pronouns so people can know how to refer to you in conversation.
The others are essentially just tags so people know what games you can talk about.
tranquil oracle
okay, so can you have more than one?
or do you have to prioritise?
Also thank you so much
tropic garden
You can have more than one! If you click the little profile icon next to people's messages, you should be able to see all of their ranks listed, too.
tranquil oracle
Thank you bothhhhhh
serene tulip
can't wait for my new headphones to get here
my current ones are just slowly disintigrating
but amazon decided they weren't essential
hexed hollow
Ooh, what headphones are you getting?
serene tulip
Sennheiser MB 660 MS
fervent zenith
https://twitter.com/MoviesMatrix/status/1255653668042477569
Look, The Hades Prequel :D
tardy anchor
zag watches this
serene tulip
hoplite is the true hades prequel
toxic steppe
Hercules has been my favorite Disney film since I was a child and this does not make me happy AT ALL.
BUT if they have Jon Favreau direct then I'm a little more comfortable with the idea.
Also if James Woods doesn't reprise as Hades then is there even a point
velvet fjord
I have faith in jon favreau but I'm still gonna pretend this doesn't exist
toxic steppe
Yeah.
The only thing that might make it awesome.
Is seeing the live-action Titans.
velvet fjord
oh yeah
then they turn out to be wonky cgi garbage
he's done a few live action remakes now, hasn't he?
toxic steppe
Yeah but they were like, the exact opposite of wonky cgi garbage.
And he did The Mandalorian.
velvet fjord
that's very true
my only apprehension now is that I wish he'd just do something new, but I guess these remakes pay the bills
toxic steppe
Yeah.
I dunno. I guess if it DOES happen I just REALLY REALLY want it to not be bad.
But I did like The Jungle Book, which he did.
And even The Lion King.
But he's only being eyed to direct, so.
I didn't even think anybody could do the song I Won't Say I'm In Love justice until I saw the Ariana Grande cover the other week.
hasty kernel
I only have one condition, Danny Devito as phil
No CGI
Not even a costume
Its just Danny Devito
toxic steppe
lol
There has be a costume at least I want to see Danny Devito as a little goat man.
tardy anchor
[spiderman point meme] live action hercules fans, pjo fans, ntflix kaos fans, hadesgame fans, hadestown fans, chorus game fans
toxic steppe
The only Netflix show in development I'm really keeping a close eye on is the Avatar: The Last Airbender one.
And I kind of get more hyped with each bit of information.
But mainly I'm excited because they're essentially expanding the story, the OG show had like 18 min episodes but they're extending them to around 45 - 60 for the live action ones.
toxic steppe
Yeah, but they're working p. closely with the OG writers too.
autumn pasture
ooh, an avatar adaptation
i hope they cast actual actors of color
not that this has been a problem before, because there's never been a film
toxic steppe
All I know is that Dante Basco is cast, though not as Zuko.
high bobcat
I was confused at first, but then I realised the joke >.>
toxic steppe
What joke? There's never been a movie.
fervent zenith
Also you are invited to Lake Laogai
gaunt valley
Kinda.
The government is quite soft in action and failing to test effectively.
And ICUs are already overwhelmed.
toxic steppe
Same thing over here in the States, F
wide ember
it's worrying how its the most affected places that are trying to reopen
like the states and quebec
toxic steppe
Yarp.
Fortunately I'm in a state that actually has a competent governor and I doubt he'll reopen this early.
fervent zenith
The problem gonna be idiots that still will disobey
I'm in Spain, so yeah I'm screwed. Luckily my area was affected relatively less
fervent zenith
That's the one with Seattle or The Capital?
toxic steppe
Seattle.
fervent zenith
Ok
toxic steppe
I'm north of Seattle myself, but the state has been closed down since March.
People here are actually observing the stay in order.
It's like a ghost town right now.
wide ember
my province is the rebellious black sheep province so more than half of the cases are here
as in across the dominion
toxic steppe
Guidelines suggest a state shouldn't even consider opening unless they've shown a decrease in cases consistently over a 2 week period.
wide ember
we are only reopening because businesses keep saying that if they don't reopen they are going to go bankrupt
toxic steppe
It isn't just going to go away.
Vaccines probably won't even be available, at least over here, until this next Jan.
hasty kernel
I mean I do get that
wide ember
well we aren't getting spanish flu anymore do we
hasty kernel
Hell, I play card games
toxic steppe
I don't want the order to end.
hasty kernel
LGSs are hit particularly hard by this
toxic steppe
The Spanish flu was just a strain of influenza, which yes, we do still get.
wide ember
LGS?
toxic steppe
There's just, y'know, vaccinations.
hasty kernel
Local Game Store
hasty kernel
Its where you go to play magic or ygo or keyforge or any other game with other folks
toxic steppe
Sans restaurants
hasty kernel
Thing is, these kinds of shops are usually barely afloat, its really not a profitable profession
toxic steppe
The delivery model is really carrying culinary rn
hasty kernel
Thankfully mine appears to be doing fairly well
Theyre mostly a board game shop, and I imagine board games do sell pretty well right now
toxic steppe
But my boi Guitar Center is in $1.8 billion worth of debt rn
wide ember
small businesses have a special loan right now to stay afloat in canada
well, small to medium
so the tea houses, cafes and game bars are probably going to survive
but the restaurants with a lot of perishable goods going bad? I wonder how many will be gone after this
faint panther
Small-to-medium business are getting nothing because giant chains are getting those loans.
Those chains are then firing employees, not laying them off, while giving executive bonuses.
This is going to be really really bad and I see either a revolution or a despotic shutdown by the end of it, at least in the US.
toxic steppe
At the risk of sounding insensitive, I think in some instances, the truly non-essential businesses going under during all of this is a good thing.
wide ember
in canada the loan is limited by your income, if your corporation had more than a certain gross profit you can't get the loan
toxic steppe
I don't need 5 different Game Stops
faint panther
I'm okay with GameStop eating it because they're incredibly predatory and anti-consumer.
toxic steppe
All the companies in that similar vein getting screwed rn is pretty satisfying.
I feel bad for theaters, though. I really miss going to see films.
faint panther
I don't think the companies are by-and-large getting screwed, though.
toxic steppe
That's like the biggest thing that was really taken from me in things shutting down.
First world problems amirite
That and my work closed down but WA has a good emergency pandemic fund in place rn which is paying me more than my frigging job was.
I've been cooking for myself a lot more and I forgot how much I enjoyed to do that.
Plus I planted some sunflowers because I always wanted to but never had the time to get around to it.
wide ember
I said something not right: the loan wasn't directly limited by the gross profit, it was limited by payroll (that should be indicative of your income) in 2019: "To qualify, these organizations will need to demonstrate they paid between $20,000 to $1.5 million in total payroll in 2019."
toxic steppe
Feels like I have a bit more energy this past week, too. Coming out of the fog of depression a little.
wide ember
which unfortunately means that ebgames (game stop for americans) will probably be eligible
toxic steppe
Boooo
Bro what tickled me was that during the beginning they were keeping stores open and arguing that they were "essential".
wide ember
we are all downloading games off the internet or getting them from amazon alongside dry food
hasty kernel
I mean I wont shed a tear for things like gamestop, but
hasty kernel
A lot of the business going under while maybe not "essential" do provide a legitimate service (for example LGSs) and are often passion projects living on the margin
If anything its some of the big companies that are non-essential but will stick around because theyre "too big to fail"
toxic steppe
Yeah, I'm aware of the difference between these two though, which is why I made the point to clarify I meant businesses like GameStop.
I definitely sympathize with those being impacted.
hasty kernel
Mmh
toxic steppe
This whole thing sucks, man.
hasty kernel
Maybe if there is one good thing to come out of this its that remote work will become more accepted/used and perhaps we can also start talking about how we dont need to work as much as we do since productivity goes down anyway
But somehow I fear thats not a lesson that will be learned
toxic steppe
I think there will definitely be some positive things that result.
hasty kernel
I hope youre right
wide ember
considering this isn't the first pandemic, it won't be learned
but the new structure from it may partially stay
hasty kernel
But I fear that that is underestimating peoples ability to not learn
toxic steppe
I feel like speculating on it right now is maybe wasted and also potentially just, y'know, stressful to do.
Just gotta take it a day at a time.
hasty kernel
This whole mess does show the big issues capitalism inherently has
toxic steppe
Facts.
hasty kernel
Yeah the one thing to learn from this is that being part of a major historic event sucks
Though
Uh
toxic steppe
Hahah.
hasty kernel
That joke didnt really work on my parents
wide ember
I feel it's less stressful and more cathartic to talk about this
hasty kernel
I didnt quite realise that those who lived through the fall of the soviet union
May already be familiar with that
toxic steppe
Oh I don't mean the whole thing overall, Sol.
More just the potential negative impact.
hasty kernel
And hey, if you ever have children, you already have your stories to tell
When they complain about school/uni work
toxic steppe
Like it's a bummer, for sure, but I'd rather think about the silver linings than about how people are dumb and will likely not change too much.
hasty kernel
Tell them "when I was your age we had a global pandemic that shut down everything and still was able to study"
Or work if youre not studying
You get the idea
wide ember
yep
hasty kernel
Its our generations version of "uphill both ways"
wide ember
and the pandemic helped reduce a lot of pollution for a while
toxic steppe
We have a good amount of those to be fair.
wide ember
I didn't have as much breathing problem for days
toxic steppe
I mean I was born in the 90's.
You could just draw from a hat any of the various tragedies/world events that have occurred since then.
wide ember
while this, sort of does
toxic steppe
Mm.
hasty kernel
Sure there have been plenty of horrible things happening in the last 20 years
wide ember
and we live in both the horror and the coziness of it
toxic steppe
I'd say the impact this has on me is largely minimal, but I am very fortunate.
hasty kernel
But most of them happened elsewhere, claiming it for your stories seems a bit uh
Insensitive
Generally speaking
I gotta agree on that though
I didnt go out much anyway
toxic steppe
As for the earlier things, it was more indirect impact than direct. I was raised by a single mom so I'm sure it impacted her which impacted me but I was little babby
hasty kernel
Ahh
toxic steppe
But I'm also never going to reproduce so I guess I don't have to worry about not having stories for my theoretical grandchildren or children.
hasty kernel
Same
faint panther
Hell yeah, Anti-natalist high five!
hasty kernel
Interesting perspective
Mine is much simpler
"Raising kids seems like a pain and I am 99% sure Im hilariously unqualified"
toxic steppe
TIL the term antinatalism and now can just blanket my beliefs under it
wide ember
I want to build a family though, a good one
toxic steppe
I want to literally build a family.
hasty kernel
But maybe Ill be a teacher of some kind in the future
toxic steppe
And have a family of robots.
wide ember
adoption is always a thing
toxic steppe
Watching Bumble Bee last night and also growing up on The Iron Giant reminded me that I want a giant robot best friend that I can hug.
wide ember
and humans should still have children, just not give birth to too many
wide ember
like, a uni lecturer?
hasty kernel
Im mostly just keeping it open as an option
wide ember
it was something like $10 an hour, and I feel like I wasn't doing a very good job
but my student did feel more confident and all, so maybe I did something right
hasty kernel
Actually no, Ive got a much more important reason to collect stories
How can you become Uncle Iroh without stories to tell?
toxic steppe
Bro you can't prep to be Uncle Iroh when you're old
You have to be Uncle Iroh every day
That's goals right there
hasty kernel
Right
faint panther
For the most part, Unovven, I agree, I'm incredibly selfish and don't want to give up the rest of my life to raise and support people who might end up hating me through no fault of my own.
hasty kernel
But you need to also have a certain repertoire
toxic steppe
Plus like, think of all the times you've like, been sad or scared or anxious.
faint panther
But the immorality of sending someone else out into this world I hate is horrifying to me.
toxic steppe
You can counter that with positive emotions, I guess.
But I didn't ask to exist and I'm sort of angry that I do, sometimes.
I don't want to be responsible for existential crisis in another whole frigging person
Then you consider stuff like climate change and it gets real scary and I don't want to have kids that would grow up on a planet dying faster than it is already.
hasty kernel
Yeah Imma dip for a bit, this is getting close to the subject that gives me panic attacks sometimes
faint panther
Sorry man, godspeed.
toxic steppe
We can also subject change fr
hasty kernel
Nah its alright
toxic steppe
It makes me uncomfortable too.
hasty kernel
Its just something I havent fixed yet
toxic steppe
But it is slightly nice to know I'm not the only one that panics about it.
hasty kernel
Its probably a different angle thats the problem for me
faint panther
Yeah, I DEFINITELY don't want to be a Boomer 2.0 and have a bunch of kids in the middle of the world going off the deep end and then have the gall to yell at them for their existential crises.
hasty kernel
I just wouldnt be good at it
toxic steppe
It's cool, man. I definitely understand since I have panic attacks all the time. It used to be a daily thing, even multiple times a day, but lately it's not so frequent.
hasty kernel
Im lucky, it doesnt happen that often for me
And I usually bounce back within an hour
toxic steppe
For me the biggest trigger anymore is if I go down the wrong feedback loop thinking about death.
hasty kernel
But that also comes with the fact that little sticks with me for long
hasty kernel
Yeah thats the same one for me
toxic steppe
Panic attacks suck though because it's like your brain actively working against itself. I hate the battle of the two minds.
hasty kernel
But panic attack or not, this is definitely depressing so lets talk about something less depressing
toxic steppe
Of course when all this COVID stuff kicked off it was like, every cough I had that would send me into anxiety.
wide ember
we were talking about being uncle iroh, so can we talk about the repertoire?
stories to tell, skills to have
hasty kernel
Sure
toxic steppe
Yeah we can just talk about Uncle Iroh for the next 4 hours
gaunt valley
uncle iroh?
hasty kernel
Yknow its funny
gaunt valley
Sorry, I missed alot of convo.
toxic steppe
An artist I listen to called tobi lou has a song called Uncle Iroh
hasty kernel
Im pretty sure the "wise old man" trope was one that most people felt was overdone and played out before Avatar came out
But then Uncle Iroh was like everyones favourite
Turns out the trope works when the man is actually wise
Or woman
Wise old person?
faint panther
Actually wise, and actually tries to connect with the youths he's helping.
toxic steppe
Iroh is just like a shining beacon of positive masculinity
hasty kernel
Yeah, Iroh is compassionate
wide ember
wise old man was also very distant in the past, while uncle iroh is the wise old man that you want in your family, in your life
toxic steppe
I grew up without a dad so I think that he resonated with me a lot because of that
hasty kernel
I guess he was also the father figure Zuko shouldve had
toxic steppe
One hundred.
gaunt valley
Oh, he's from Avatar. Never watched :/
faint panther
He's the father figure Zuko got, and that's not nothing.
toxic steppe
o::::
faint panther
It's coming to Netflix next month (May) and it's one of the greatest TV shows ever made.
hasty kernel
I mean Ive never watched the entirety of Avatar either
toxic steppe
I've been meaning to rewatch it.
toxic steppe
There are some extensions that let people watch Netflix in sync
gaunt valley
I don't use Netflix tho.
toxic steppe
When it gets added we should do a group watch through.
hasty kernel
But I never went back and watched the whole thing
faint panther
Tell you what, when it comes out I will Venmo/Paypal a few dollary-dos do you can get a one month Netflix sub and watch it.
toxic steppe
Solution: Two streams for either hemisphere
hasty kernel
It still has a silly element to it, but its a character-driven show that does the characters really well
toxic steppe
Does time even exist rn
faint panther
Could do a mid-day for US/Europe and then another one late at night for the rest of Asia?
hasty kernel
Its like shonen if shonen was good
gaunt valley
I am confused who's talking to whom here. 😅
toxic steppe
Don't make me throw this secret technique of a thousand hands
wide ember
UNOvven just roasted the entire shounen genre
faint panther
Nah, I'm with UNOvven, Japan clings to their tropes even when they're really really bad.
toxic steppe
Isn't that why a trope is a trope?
hasty kernel
Tropes arent bad
desert minnow
Every country clings to its tropes
hasty kernel
Tropes are just common/repeated elements in a medium
Or even within a narrative genre
desert minnow
Also did someone say Avatar
which one
fervent zenith
Gotta say The Rest In Peace Mako moment in Avatar tore me up
faint panther
I didn't say all tropes were bad, I said that some of them were and Japan uses their specific stock without reservation or consideration way too often.
hasty kernel
For example "creepy monotone" is a trope
But its a really good one
Anyway, since we were talking about good shonen
Fullmetal Alchemix
faint panther
toxic steppe
Wow.
wide ember
I-
desert minnow
Yeah Fullmetal Alchemist is one of the few good ones
hasty kernel
I love this picture
fervent zenith
Is that Battle Chasers?
toxic steppe
Let's go back to Uncle Iroh
Delving into anime tropes is just a recipe for disaster
fervent zenith
Joking :)
hasty kernel
I do think there is interesting discussion to be had about anime tropes
gaunt valley
Damn bois, sometimes I just wish this server had voicechat. The community is wholesome but I'm too stupid for text messages.
desert minnow
Uncle Iroh is great
That’s all you beed to know
Anyone who says the opposite is lying or objectively wrong
hasty kernel
Hell some of them are just old and have been done a thousand times but I would lie if I said theyre not really cool
Like the "flash step cut into sheathing the sword"
hasty kernel
Its stupid
faint panther
Tropes Are Tools, no matter the medium or genre.
toxic steppe
I geddit
desert minnow
nothing personnel UNO
fervent zenith
What about the guy using the sword to somehow get stuck in a wall of the cliff to avoid falling to his death?
desert minnow
That’s cool too
hasty kernel
Im less fond of that one tbh
gaunt valley
We could make a separate server for that reason I guess, but that'd be still kinda suboptimal.
hasty kernel
But its alright
toxic steppe
As long as the trope is used well then I tend to suspend my disbelief.
desert minnow
Even if most swords would snap during it
toxic steppe
That goes for practically any trope.
faint panther
||See, they do that in the Avatar: TLA finale and it, uh, doesn't help too much. Sokka breaks his leg regardless.||
hasty kernel
They wouldnt snap, you just wouldnt even be able to get it stuck
fervent zenith
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DeadHorseTrope
List of tropes society admits are now outdated
desert minnow
Press F for the meteor sword
It was too cool to keep existing
hasty kernel
Though my favourite version of the delayed cut is Brooks from One Piece
Because he just walks past slowly
And is incredibly calm
toxic steppe
Which is parodying Office Space and having people beat the hell out of something with bats in slow motion.
hasty kernel
One Piece has good moments, sometimes
toxic steppe
And then having two people have to hold another back at the end when they go back for more
Always gets me
faint panther
First time I saw that scene, Cale, was in Family Guy.
gaunt valley
The manga was good. At least for a number of volumes.
hasty kernel
It was always flawed
wide ember
Gintama's playing with tropes is usually really fun too
faint panther
We used to have an old Epson printer but I was never allowed to do that.
hasty kernel
But some parts worked better
toxic steppe
I recently watched something that did the trope like at least two or three times in a singular episode and it just got funnier for me.
desert minnow
Speaking of good ongoing ones what do you lads think of Dungeon Meshi
toxic steppe
I forget tho
hasty kernel
Like if I had to put it in words, One Piece has good worldbuilding and good individual moments
But its also stupid, the art design got worse and some of the characterisation doesnt work
wide ember
I can't believe someone published a manga named Gintama and didn't get arrested for public indecency though
toxic steppe
When it comes to the Big Bois of shonen, I'm on the Naruto bandwagon :^)
faint panther
Eneru was also built his entire arc to be this incredibly smug super with virtually no weaknesses just so when Luffy no-sold his lightning the freak out face would be that much more incredible.
hasty kernel
Seriously Robins post-timeskip design still bothers me
faint panther
Naruto and Bleach were both waaay better at their outset, before they turned into Dragon Ball Z.
gaunt valley
I dropped the manga after the timeskip.
hasty kernel
I have already expressed my issues with Naruto
wide ember
Dungeon Meshi is the best in pacing
hasty kernel
It was good right up until the Rock Lee vs Gaara fight
toxic steppe
I've also expressed that I love time skips tho
hasty kernel
Which is from what Ive seen a popular opinion
desert minnow
Isn’t boruto mostly the naruto ip still being milked though
hasty kernel
I still read One Piece mostly because its getting close to an end and I do actually care to find out the remaining mysteries
toxic steppe
It's actually a huge departure which is why most Naruto fans hate it
hasty kernel
But its deeply flawed
desert minnow
Wait One Piece is actually ending?
gaunt valley
I mostly liked humour and worldbuilding, but the fighti g aspect just got too big.
hasty kernel
But the end is already in sight
We have learned more about Raftel, were starting to see the final boss(es)
toxic steppe
I only saw like the very start of One Piece on Adult Swim back in the day
gaunt valley
I know it was always important, but the fights just kept getting longer.
faint panther
Back right after Funi started doing a dub?
desert minnow
Did they ever clarify whether the One Piece is a real thing or not?
toxic steppe
Yeah, Schpoon.
desert minnow
Why not the superior 4kids dub?
toxic steppe
I was a poor kid you think we had access to 4kids
gaunt valley
Yeah, on the first page.
wide ember
my family stole cable from the neighbour
desert minnow
Wait 4kids is a rich kid channel?
That actually explains a lot
Not american mind you
hasty kernel
Anyway its funny because World Trigger is largely tournament arc in a way
toxic steppe
I wouldn't say it's rich, it was just part of a program that I never got through basic cable.
hasty kernel
But its still my favourite shonen because it does "smart fighting" actually well
toxic steppe
I think it was a Fox affiliate iirc so I'm sure it was on those better boxes.
gaunt valley
Throwing iphones at each other?
faint panther
Nah, characters actually act like they're in a fight, not a series of narrative steps to a "satisfying" conclusion.
toxic steppe
I like Naruto a lot because growing up as an angry teenager, his whole approach to ending the cycle of hatred in violence in Shippuden spoke volumes to me.
I mean obviously this is all subjective anyway.
I'm sure our favorites are our favorites because they shaped us in some way.
faint panther
And Naruto does a lot of stuff pretty well like that.
hasty kernel
Not even that, but also the fact that when the main character uses a "smart" strategy
faint panther
But its narrative arc by and large is weak.
hasty kernel
Its actually shown first and then explained
You get to see that he did something smart
faint panther
And they keep dumping on the genius of hard work analogy by literally handing power-ups to the main character.
hasty kernel
And it actually is smart
And it doesnt work twice
The enemies adapt
So he comes up with new strategies
gaunt valley
I dunno, as a teenager I didn't watch TV that much. And anime was foreign to me.
hasty kernel
He is the "weak but strategic" guy done well
faint panther
Okay, but do they explain every attack and strategem in detail and handhold the viewer the entire time?
hasty kernel
Only in brief
As I said, its a tournament arc
Kinda
So you have casters
Who do a play by play
toxic steppe
I respect your point of view but I plaintively disagree.
faint panther
Alright, just as long as it's not Bleach.
hasty kernel
Nah its not that long
toxic steppe
It's pretty clear we had entirely different experiences watching it.
gaunt valley
So everytime people talk about the anine series that influenced them in their development, I really can't contribute.
hasty kernel
Mostly because its been on hiatus for a year
toxic steppe
Development never stops, Zadok.
hasty kernel
And only comes out once a month
faint panther
Not that Naruto doesn't put in work, but anything besides the base Rasengan Naruto got because he got set up with SSS stats from the outset.
toxic steppe
Bruh he busted his butt off for Sage Mode
gaunt valley
Yeah, probably. I just can say that reading BL helped me alot to accept myself. Despite all its flaws. But that was much later, when I had already graduated from high school.
hasty kernel
My issue with Naruto is the absurdly explosive increase in power levels
It starts out with actual ninjas, including a guy who is a pure close quarters combatant
faint panther
He only had the ability to do so because his deck was stacked. His giant wealth of chakra that let him use Sage Mode at all wasn't anything he earned himself.
Lee and Gai? Those two are amazing, as is Neji.
hasty kernel
And it ends with another guy using CQC with such superpower that he is essentially a walking nuke
Thats just silly
faint panther
(Neji taught himself the Gentle Fist, he was the genius of hard work in that fight, not Naruto)
toxic steppe
Yeah but he also wouldn't have even been able to do it even with his wealth of chakra if he hadn't had problem solved with his clones.
hasty kernel
Its not quite as bad as DBZ
Because its not just "I have bigger numbers, Im stronger"
toxic steppe
Power creep has never been an issue for me in shonen.
hasty kernel
But its not good
toxic steppe
If I'm watching something where the good guy fights increasingly bigger bad.
faint panther
After the Saiyan Saga no character visually got any better, they just took turns handing each other beatings.
hasty kernel
But there should be an upper limit
toxic steppe
Vegeta has HUGE character development in Super, but that's not Z.
hasty kernel
And that upper limit shouldnt be absurdly higher
One Piece does a better job there, to a degree
toxic steppe
Should there be an upper limit.
faint panther
Characters closed gaps in Super they had no business closing.
toxic steppe
Or is it that you would prefer the shonen you watch to have one.
hasty kernel
There should be
Otherwise the internal consistency of the world starts to break apart
Because the same people we were shown as being "the strongest" early on suddenly just pale in comparision to new people
faint panther
Anyone beside the Saiyans and maybe Piccolo shouldn't have mattered in the slightest, but Krillin who is explicitly a worse martial artist and holds a fraction of the power, speed, and reflexes Goku has is still able to clown him in a fight?
hasty kernel
Except they dont because suddenly theyre also pulling walking nuke levels of nonsense out of thin air
toxic steppe
I just find it hard to make such objective statements myself for a medium I know is predominantly up to each individual's interpretation of it.
hasty kernel
Easy example: Compare Orochimaru and the first to third Hokage during that fight
With the same people later
toxic steppe
Note here how I haven't started dogging on any of the perceived bad qualities of any of the stuff y'all have mentioned liking.
Not that I feel attacked.
faint panther
||I remember reading that the First and Second in that fight were not resurrected properly/their hosts were too weak to hold the full suite/level of their power, which is why when Kabuto revives them they're much more capable.||
I'm ripping into Dragon Ball, man.
toxic steppe
Though I do feel a little less likely now to want to disclose similar information in the future. x]
Anime is so contentious.
faint panther
I grew up on that, but I also want to be realistic about its flaws.
hasty kernel
I mean I guess you could call it subjective
But Im talking from an internal consistency standpoint here
faint panther
I like the genius of hard work story that Naruto used.
hasty kernel
Its fine that things change as the story evolves
faint panther
Kishimoto was just not good about properly implementing it.
hasty kernel
The problem is when they start clashing with themselves
A hard upper limit prevents such issues
toxic steppe
My point is that it's a problem FOR YOU
hasty kernel
And if you set the limit right, you will have no reason to exceed it
toxic steppe
A self perceived problem.
hasty kernel
Granted Im personally a big proponent of fighters getting smarter, not stronger
I mean
I guess so
wide ember
ghost in the shell?
toxic steppe
All of your thoughts on it are entirely influenced by your personal experience with it, it's the literal definition of subjective.
faint panther
That's a more realistic take on personal growth (eventually you stop being able to lift more) which is why it doesn't see the same representation in shounen.
No, the failure of the genius of hard work is all on Kishimoto.
hasty kernel
I mean, anything about stories is subjective, isnt it
faint panther
Naruto gets explosive dividends from his training that no other character can replicate because of qualities he did not achieve himself.
hasty kernel
There is nothing objective that doesnt relate to grammar
Some people enjoy SAO
Somehow
I dont know how
wide ember
I want a shounen manga where over-training is realistically a bad thing
wide ember
that ruins your body and mind
faint panther
No one else (besides other Jinchuuriki and other "freaks") has the chakra capacity to do what he could do.
Same, Sol. Hard same.
toxic steppe
OK.
hasty kernel
Im just presenting my perspective
toxic steppe
I know.
hasty kernel
Which yes, it is subjective
See the funny thing is
DBZ actually had something like that in a scene
Hell DBZAs version of it was great
faint panther
Hellzone Grenade?
hasty kernel
You know when Trunks uses that "beefy" form against semi-perfect cell
faint panther
Ooh, yeah.
hasty kernel
And Goku then explains why, despite being really strong, that form is ineffective
faint panther
Technically speaking that was Perfect Cell.
hasty kernel
Was it?