#pvp
crude mortar
elder crane
Hmm, thinking about it
there's a major event every month
every other event is a rerun
so next new event, we expect November
and after that, Jan
"no more new UR for this year" <- doesn't include January
conclusion:
new UR every other new event probably?
so 3 a year probably
upper cove
YEP
ripe latch
upper cove
Tab
naive dome
what does UR mean ?
storm jewel
uncommonly rare
crude mortar
^
storm jewel
"if this ship sunk, revive your DD"
obsidian kite
golden fable
upper sparrow
ripe latch
rip queen meta
sterile bobcat
How bad is Dork assuming I'm already using Warspite to help aim her shots?
elder crane
Not great
Not the worst though
coral wren
yorks got a decent barrage
id take pirates soul over concerto of blood any day though
midnight heron
upper cove
YEP
coral wren
looks normal
midnight heron
dodging 6 outa 8 shots is normal 
coral wren
yes
midnight heron
pretty sure hit rates are above 50% on average
upper cove
Sounds like 6/8 to me
naive dome
happens to me all the time tbh
dire stream
doesnt QE have eva buff
crude mortar
^
midnight heron
ive said it in the other channel and i'll say it again: qe has eva buff but its nowhere close to amagi's buff
yet somehow dis qe managed to dodge better than other fleets with amagi
crude mortar
ripe latch
upper sparrow
Lmao
midnight heron
golden fable
somber axle
So I got a third rudder PVP, does it go on Nagato?
Hiryuu and Amagi already have one.
ripe latch
put staag and enough
somber axle
Ok, still don't have staag though.
ripe latch
when get triple 152 or twin 152 , replace for range
ripe latch
but on u comp only bel can deal dmg
somber axle
But then my CLs gotta use poverty main guns
storm jewel
How is warkai on defense compairing to Enty 
buoyant parrot
storm jewel
yeah but defense warkai get dps reduction tho
this is an attack warkai
not really sure how to compare this to defense warkai
ripe latch
golden fable
we sure will find out once they're actually in the game for anyone to play with
as right now they're subject to change
ripe latch
@golden fable 
golden fable
Nice #461381136661217283
granite flame
Run helenaKai 
mystic bane
she wouldn't get negato buff
still worth?
and who should i replace
i guess i could just run nagami fdg
coral wren
the opposite
mystic bane
lol
ripe latch
a long time ago she not bad on ijn fleet , now she usless and ez replace to juneau or other CA
charred sable
One of these is not like the other 
upper cove
is it cause sara has pink hair?
crude mortar
sour oasis
Erebus & Terror aren't oathed
upper cove
he said one
proper sorrel
uhh one of the skin is L2D
waxen dawn
One of them is actually a 100 year old vampire
elder crane
The rest are just ~80-90 yrs old
trail temple
How many of them got nuked?
storm jewel
man just kai my warspite today and its def life changing in pvp
waiting for 2nd skill to maxed to see that salvo get smaller spread
ripe latch
shy hazel
now you cant go back to non meta backline
unless u too high and use meme fleet
do you see that new ur shinano watever
cocaine kai will just 1 hit that ho so no meta will change
storm jewel
but the potential leak says she buff sakura torp
cant take her down if the torp cancer maneuvers into your warkai first
dull herald
Not so sure about warkai since shinano HP stats are S also she's basically yamato class she must be heavy armour carrier
elder crane
Amagi is much more of a problem than Warkai is
naive dome
but warkai has higher kill priority than amagi imo
elder crane
anyways I predict Shinano Amagi Hiryuu if Shinano is worth using
esp if Shinano further buffs torpmemes
elder crane
losing a set of BB secs might be a bit annoying though if Shinano has trouble nuking vanguards
tropic dagger
Should i siwtch anyone for: Odin, doy, chapayev or formidable
upper sparrow
Change kitakaze with juneau or yukikaze, and georgia with warkai
Ur meta fleet will be done then
upper cove
past egret
Why tf would Shinano buff torpedos
I could totally see it happening since devs are heavy IJN bias but I stg if someone jinxes it
spring kestrel
what's the priority order to get pvp-only core shop equipment?
bought the important stuff for pve
coral wren
Id say try and get 2 oxytorps first
For the damage buff
The meta may unironically change when the new ijn event drops
So for backline stuff id give it a bit
elder crane
Also there's almost nothing in there useful for PvP that isn't useful in PvE
It's just some niche use planes
elder crane
Gas tank is also niche use for the most part
Beacon is nice on Hiryuu (and niche use on other CV) and is also very useful in PvE
storm jewel
beacon is so nice, your cv almost kill entire wave anywat why not do it bit faster
trail temple
Hmmm, do I wait for a +12 or do I chance this guy for a +1?
karmic forum
I'm retiring from sandbagging
proper sorrel
holy congrats
trim bough
I can be happy for 3mins
trail temple
I got wrecked by the game, so I am gonna mald in the corner
wispy portal
What is sandbagging?
tough estuary
what could a good frontline fit be with richelieu /jb/filler backline if I want to use sanrui but don't wanna go full defensive with the other two
proper sorrel
juneau yukikaze
trail temple
That is basically what he doesn't want to do
trail temple
Tbh I would have yeeted sanrui, go torp meme in the front and see how that goes. Sanrui just lends herself to a more defensive comp
proper sorrel
sandbagging is basically waiting for others to move on your list to snag extra points from them. no reason to sandbag if you're not trying to go for top 10
tough estuary
how about Sanrui / yuki / bel
proper sorrel
swap bel for juneau 
tough estuary
all the other stuff I have levelled is like pve things
brem, reno, london, indy, etc
proper sorrel
but i guess since you don't have her properly leveled yet, that'll probably be fine for now, as long as you don't fight meta fleets
if you haven't, i would level juneau at 12-4 or something so you can start using her
tough estuary
My hope on beating meta fleet is just praying richi/jb kill frontline quick
dull herald
If you run a backline with french,the why not try to full french? Algerie with jeanne/juneau will be quite good
Since u use saint louis
sweet venture
full french is so cancer to fight
deep glacier
full french fleet is underwhelming
trail temple
With a meta fleet, they're pretty easy
deep glacier
^
trail temple
At least they have more "good" pvp ships than KMS
clear fox
Hello, how do I build a Fleet for casual but daily exercises?
trail temple
Define "casual"
clear fox
Does the difference in lvls work the same as PvE
trail temple
Not trying to be an ass
Levels are a bit more important because of health scaling
So, in PvP, you have more health with 120 ships having roughly 2.34x more HP than what they'd normally have
clear fox
I mean, I don't want to get to top so I'm not looking for the best sinergy and all but I'd like to know what to look for in a pvp fleet
Alright so lemme do a quick fleet and I'll brb
trail temple
Np
clear fox
Wait why can't I confirm the changes in def fleet?
trail temple
Try restarting the game
But I can see you have a few hms backlines from thay screen shot
clear fox
It did the work haha thank you
Now I've got smth like this but idk much about vanguards so I'd need some help please
I have a lot of 100 ish ships but might be not worth mentioning since lv is important you said
trail temple
Oh good, well that's not a bad start
You could do something like this:
Monarch (flag), amagi, warspite
Noshiro, Azuma and ykkz
trail temple
Sanrui is good, but is better with riche, so you can use her instead of azuma
Laffey isn't that good.tbh
Tbh*
clear fox
Oh really huh I didn't know.
Welp I'm going to go for Nanoda then
Okay so here goes. Thank you very much! 
upper sparrow
Thats already meta enough
ripe latch
without juneau this fleet 🚮
coarse hearth
Guys
How to use sandbagging chart?
I just wanna reach Admiral Of Navy as fast as i can and grab that sweet 2500 merit
After that, I gonna let everyone surpass my rank & start focus on lowest opponent for lvl up my weak ship
Is that possible, or it would be hard to reduce ranking from top 10 toward 1000?
coral wren
The idea is to have enemies be a certain amount of points ahead of you
35 or more
To get the most points out of every attack
coarse hearth
Thanks a lot @coral wren 
idk that 35 point is already than enough
sour oasis
@coarse hearth
If your goal is to hit AotN the fastest... That will be on day 12 of season 2nd refresh (maybe 3rd). The chart is just a guideline of how many points you should have on that ticket on that day en route to fastest AotN.
If you want AotN, the best advice is to not lose. Play every ticket and win.
The 2nd best advice is to always fight the person on the left. They are almost always going to be above you (and will give bonus points if they are significantly above you - now significantly depends on where during the season you are).
3rd best advice is to not lose. Play every ticket and win. Even if you have to fight someone not on the left. (see slightly different)
elder crane
yeah, it's not really necessary to sandbag much
just only play down to 5/10 when you have time, as much as possible
and line up a good rush timing where you dump all your matches ASAP after a reset
sour oasis
Sandbag is to wait, collaborate, or refresh often to get the biggest bonus possible as frequently as possible and is very troublesome.
elder crane
usually the 4-5 resets before the very last reset are good for that
when doing the rush, keep an eye on the highest scores
it's very much worth it to eat a few +9 from fighting lower ranked opponents if their fleet is so weak that it folds over and dies quickly, as long as you still have enough score to hit top 10
if you get lucky, you can ram out all 5 matches within 3 minutes
sweet venture
if you sandbag wrong you can easily screw yourself over and get stuck low 900 last few days
sour oasis
This last season I got +0 bonuses on every fight and was sometimes almost able to get AotN. Getting +0 bonuses on every fight is pretty hard; you will likely get 20 or 40 or even 60 extra points throughout the 14 day season. If you really want to keep track, when you get 45 extra points, AotN is almost guaranteed.
elder crane
I'd rec only doing this on your last rush attempt though
cause it means your score is now a lot worse for future attempts
yeah, with some sandbag, I've been able to hit AotN with even 9 matches accidentally dropped (+0), which pretty much makes up for all the score I gained from sandbag
so, yeah
sour oasis
Just win all your tickets. That's the hardest part. (Because you can sleep through some or an opponent can RNG a win no matter how good your attack squad is)
coarse hearth
if you sandbag wrong you can easily screw yourself over and get stuck low 900 last few days
I guess this is one of few reason i stuck alot,
Thanks guys for clarify what sandbagging really mean
I never thought sandbagging actually more than waiting & refresh
But my biggest problem,
I got screw up alot when i messed my pvp schedule from overwork
When i do, i might fall asleep, and RNG start pulling thier sneaky prank on my fleet then
sour oasis
Hence just rush until you're 0/10 
thorny bramble
sweet venture
dev 15 with high level and good equipment isnt bad
otherwise run monarch or warkai
elder crane
Dev30 needed to be actually worth it
Otherwise no second MGM+1
Between that and effs and FP, she'll do only half the dev30 gun dmg at dev25
Basically a Suruga before dev30
sweet venture
shes passable at dev 15 but dev30 if your actually trying
deep glacier
I started using my FdG only after reaching dev 30
that's why I can't speak from personal experience
but according to this chart from the cn wiki;
it would be acceptable to use her at dev 25
but definitely not at dev 15
sour oasis
Nagato and Hood have the same damage...?
elder crane
wow yes Nagato dmg output when Nagato without her fleet buffs is not worth using
or like
it's questionable for offense if Nagato is good enough, even with those fleet buffs lol
coral wren
Its her skill that makes her 
sour oasis
I'm still not seeing FdG as amazing in PvP without 457 when compared to comps with skill synergy. And it's hard for me to picture non-synergy team on offense outperforming say an all-IJN team.
coral wren
If you have fdg well in enough to do pvp id imagine your fairly close to a 457
sour oasis
No. 
sour oasis
Right. But Warspite has better aim to snipe specific backliner.
sour oasis
I have 5 more prints until my first 457, but about 50 more FdG prints to go. I'm expecting dev30 before 457.
Yes. Yes she does.
sour oasis
Warspite has 100% critical on her divine+, FdG has faster reload. FdG has the Sonata counter, but it's not terribly accurate.
elder crane
457 prints and FdG prints are somewhat mutually exclusive
the best ship print projects are shitty for equips and vice versa
still, it's very possible to have both by now
well, before PR3
elder crane
right now probably possible for dev30 FdG and 2 457 lol
if you skipped PR3 for now that is
sour oasis
Yeah, no. Once I get 457, I'm going straight to sex bofors.
elder crane
I'm skipping FdG for now
too many good equips in PR3
coral wren
Champagne
ripe latch
1089 dmg fdg dev25
its what , degen twin?
sour oasis
STAAG (remember those?)
elder crane
that's some sort of relative dmg thingy I assume
elder crane
the important part is their conclusion that her guns are about as good as Nagato's
which is
nowhere near good enough to run for that lol
sour oasis
Ffff. Forgot I still have 300+ Azuma prints to grind.
elder crane
Shinano is coming anyways
sour oasis
She's a CV, so that's just an Enterprise/Hiryu alternate.
Azuma and a strong BB (FdG /Warspite) are still needed. And because IJN, Nagato/Amagi.
Wait. Shinano. Warspite. FdG. Azuma. Sandy. When will UR DD be here?
ripe latch
now azuma its only food for trp team without bulge
or u equip on she bulge + gyro or she die after first trp salvo
sour oasis
Azuma without bulge
coral wren
UR bc
ripe latch
past egret
coral wren
I was too impatient and ran out of refreshes
sour oasis
Looks like a +2. It's going to give a bonus. Just a small one.
storm jewel
how could you calculate if it a +2 or + etc ?
sour oasis
I'm making an educated guess based on positioning and time remaining until next refresh. @storm jewel
At this point, winning a fight with +0 moves me about 500 ranks (for +22). Someone at rank 6000 when I'm at 8000 definitely has a score 25 points above me (+1 bonus), maybe 50 (+2 bonus). Player at 100 is about 200 points above me.
I'm going on the assumption there's a bigger cluster of players at 101-1000 (so they have the same score) vs the 1000+ ranks, which have a more even distribution.
So on that assumption, there's a 200-ish point difference from rank 1000 to 8000, evenly distributed, means every 100 ranks someone has 3 more points. At this point in PvP (Ensign) a bonus happens at every 20-ish point difference. So taking on someone 700 ranks above me should give a +1. It also falls close to my rank jump of 500 spots when I got 22 points (if my assumptions were exact, I should have jumped 700 spots).
Again, assuming players 100 to 1000 have the same score, and assuming that 1000 to 8000 (where Haru is) scores are evenly distributed.
upper cove
same reason enemy nagatos have 100% proc chance
storm jewel
hm
so i saw some people move with the first 10 pvp ticket
way before the next reset
is it to maximize the bonus point as many people rush their first 10 pvp tickets today ?
i did try 2 tickets and got 78 points, 8/10 left and stuck among the Seaman
sour oasis
I still wanna present my 10k/10k offense fleet being manhandled by just Eldredge and Enterprise. ||Hiryu freaking lost to Enterprise just like IRL.||
upper sparrow
Always has been
sweet venture
My nagato performs like shes a level 3 and cant proc for shit
but their nagato one shots my backline ????
shy hazel
elder crane
this is why Nagato is so good on defense and is shit on offense
RNG for being amazing or complete garbage
coral wren
It is definitely 
fault
sterile bobcat
if I'm running juneau+yuki+bel, who should be the pearl carrier?
sour oasis
It's 2020, I'm still blaming Enterprise.
I'm a casual and I've got 150 bp to go before FdG dev 30. I've also got 5 bp before my first 457. Which will I manage to get first. ||Never is still on the table.||
midnight heron
at least u close to 457 ive been stuck on 37/50 for like forever yet my alt who already has a 457 keeps getting bp
upper sparrow
ripe latch
next oxide
Noob here, was the black torp aux useful to you, seniors?
dull herald
How much black torp u have? @next oxide
At least need two to work nice
next oxide
I just have 1 xD
dull herald
Then forget it mate,build another strong frontliner
next oxide
I see, thxs for the input
elder crane
@ionic magnet
~20% for Nagato to fail barrage 3x
~20% to lose in mirror
Coincidence? i think not
ionic magnet
yep coincidence
nagato or not, you're p much capped at 85-90% winrate anyways cos of all the rng in your matches
so no bulli
elder crane
Hmm, so that's why HMS warkai mirror is 95+% winrate, or 90+% for Amagi Waryuu
And torpmemes mirror is like 70%
And ofc FC being FC, mirror is pretty much 100%, but that's partially to FC having... quirks on defense tbf
Meanwhile Nagato or FdG is as you say
And Nagato+FdG mirror is apparently ~80% no matter how you build it
ionic magnet
lets be real here, mirror is whatever
only def that matters is namaryuu or namaspite or namagi fdg
if nagato comps can win 85-90% vs the best def, i dont see any problem
and its not like any non nagato comp can reach 95 or 100% winrate so 
elder crane
No one is saying Nagato isn't strong overall
It's about her inconsistency
The fact that objectively-on-avg-weaker teams perform just as well if not slightly better on offense than Nagato setups shows that
Same with FdG
ionic magnet
her barrage is whats inconsistent like any other barrage
but her buffs are more than enough to make up for it
ripe latch
ionic magnet
idk i feel like ppl just want to find a reason on why they are losing and barrage counting seems the easiest one to do
elder crane
it also is incredibly good at predicting win/loss
that's why I did barrage counting for testing
"did the team win/lose at X barrages down over the enemy team"
gives a clearer picture than just logging a bunch of win/loss
For Namagi (pre-warkai) mirror, for example, my question was what happened when you were 2/3 Namagi barrages down (or actual value v expected value when third ship is also a barrager), mostly
1 down or less should never be a loss, basically, unless your setup is real shite
if it's not vs a torpmemes that got miracle torps off or something like that, losing here = your fleet setup is pretty much 100% confirmed not great
None of the at-least-good setups I've tested in this kind of matchup ever lost this during testing
4 down is pretty much 100% a loss, nothing I tested was ever good enough to win during testing, though ofc miracles can happen maybe?
Being able to win at all when 3 down is one of the major litmus tests, the best setups should be able to very occasionally win - even many of the good setups I've tested hadn't managed to pull a win out of this situation during testing.
2 down should still strongly favor a good offense team setup, how strongly + ability to win when 3 down being my major evaluating points for setup comparisons
storm jewel
how reliable torp meme noshi/naganami/jintsuu on defense? 
elder crane
it seems to be a bit scarier than standard torpmemes
it'll actually be slightly problematic if you don't have defense against torps
gritty cove
It'd be nice to test all these things but nobody has decent defense
elder crane
for example
azuma(rudder+bulge) jun(pearl+boiler) ykkz(FE+boiler)
with, I think WS Amagi FdG?
looks to be likely sub-80% offense winrate
despite already hedging the use of VH armor by running torpbulge
but something like
azuma(rud+bulge) ykkz(FE+boiler) jun(pearl+boiler)
gets the 85% ish winrate you'd expect vs the best defense teams
the surprising part being that a Noshiro+torpbulge setup doesn't appear to be any better than just torpbulge and mid ykkz
no particularly significant difference at least
anyways, the fact that it's even able to force changes on setup and even afterwards, performs no worse than top defense teams before, cements it as one of the best defense teams
storm jewel
i never see such defense like said
but i was thinking if someone have that, they could potentially nuke my offensive backline with that 610mm+black aux due to the close range between defense vanguard => offensive backline
i faced azuma/ykkz/juneau + namagi FdG before and at dev30 its quite scary even I tried to torp them
but i just kai my warpsite so i want to face that team again but barely see anyone with azuma/fdgDev30
ionic magnet
@elder crane yea i get you but i still see nagato 🅱️ as just one of 10 million factors in a match so it shouldn't tilt your winrate that much
you said being 1 or 2 barrage down should still be a win so i thinm it kinda backs my point
and well, 3 barrage down is rare enough that idk if its even worth looking at
and even then, what about the hiryuu ryuuseis, warkai barrage or bb shells and torps etc, not to mention if nagato barrage even hits anything at all
anyways enough for me in this ig
why am i even defending
hms masterrace 
sour oasis
@midnight heron doesn't your main have a 457 already? (I've been working on this stupid gun since... When did FdG come out?)
elder crane
1 barrage down (or better) is almost always a win (~78% of the time)
2 is split on other RNG and how good your team is overall (~12% of the time)
3 is almost always a loss (~6% of the time)
4 (or worse) is always a loss (~3% of the time)
Which means your overall winrate should be from 80-90%
sound familiar?
The Namagi barrage RNG is what is setting the winrate boundaries, extremely obviously so
at least this is better than Enty v Enty, where aside from like the 1/3 chance you kill his Enty with other ships, is 50/50 basically on who fails Lucky E first
and what do you know, that's basically the winrates on Enty v Enty when Enty is the focus of her team
trail temple
To make sure I am not malding in vain (well either way it probably is), getting people to sandbag off is essentially luck right? There's not a way to increase the frequency/liklihood of finding people who will do their exercises?
hot creek
Mostly luck, but sometimes you can recognize certain names.
elder crane
for light tryhard, get a feel of when people at what rank tend to rush
p.s. generally right around resets is when it happens, very few ppl climb in the middle
for heavy tryhard, you're going to cyberstalk names, keeping a database of when each player rushes 
trail temple
I might throw a refresh around resets then if nobody moves for the first 15 mins.
The second advice is a WIP
elder crane
my rec for that is
early season, do 1 match before ~5 mins after reset if no one moves
that puts you at 9/10, which most ppl around your score are 9/10 too, and many ppl at 9/10 right after a reset are currently rushing
then refresh if still no climbing
sour oasis
Essentially be where the crowd is. If it means burning a few tickets, so be it.
This is why it'd be great if we could collaborate with each other reliably. I've just ate all of my tickets. If you see me, I'm not moving for awhile.
trail temple
That's a good point Blue, I will give that a shot
midnight heron
no lul if i had 457 i wont be saying wat i said
naive dome
my 457 bp count has been stuck at 40/50 for a month already
midnight heron
wait 457 bp is a lie? always has been
hot creek
ripe latch
frail orbit
crude mortar
fresh sandal
azuma useable for pvp at what dev lvl? 20, 25 or do you have to max dev her?
sterile bobcat
If I'm using Jun+yuki+Belfast, at what dev level can Neptune replace Bel?
actually, is Neptune useful in pvp to begin with
trail temple
More so than Belfast
midnight heron
u can take a nep when pvping then lose cuz rng
sterile bobcat
I only have enough prints to get her to dev 25 rn, I'll probably just stick to Belfast
Another thing, is hoodgun good on Monarch for spamming her barrage?
upper sparrow
Fdg gun is better for her
ripe latch
trail temple
That question is like asking if you should bang the hottest girl in class or you should wait for anime girls to become real.
tl;dr - yes, attack the rank 245 dude
storm jewel
im, learning
so after that i got 2 guys lv100+ up, same rank as me and i have to wait for them to move? or what if they dont movee ?
trail temple
There's a good guide that helps with sandbagging, lemme post it rq
and I'll curse myself by helping more people sandbag
storm jewel
storm jewel
oh i watched it already
i just dont know what is the moment to fight before the prime time "15 minutes before reset"
cuz i see some people do it way early
upper sparrow
If they dont move?u arent lucky there
storm jewel
oh so i have to reset to find someone who move ?
upper sparrow
Sandbagger here Usually wait until 15 minutes before reset
storm jewel
its kinda luck based there cuz it takes them long to move
upper sparrow
Also 2 bonus in a reset is already pretty nice
storm jewel
hmm fair
upper sparrow
Getting 3 bonus on a reset in this mid season need some great luck
storm jewel
but if i see someone way too high in my pic, i should totally attack for more point right ?
upper sparrow
Yes
storm jewel
i see ✅
storm jewel
trail temple
Practice makes perfect, even I'm still learning to do it better
upper sparrow
But still better to not miss attempt rather missing attack attempt bcs u sandbag and forget to do pvp
Follow The rusher way
Become the food
ripe latch
naive dome
protip: aotn is easier to reach on saturday/early sunday than on friday
take it from someone who frequently has to get aotn after missing 5-10 fights
naive dome
aotn rush is doable at any point of match +5
doesn't have to be server reset
you basically rush those +5 matches to temporarily get ahead of the packs and hopefully get top 10. On saturday and early sunday, the more competitive crowd has either already done their rush on friday or hold on to them until the last minute
before you decided to rush, check leaderboard to see if the 10th guys is less than 50 points ahead of you (though you might want 45, in case of +9 matchup)
if you want to account for their own movement, you could do 30
elder crane
Yeah,the 4-5 resets before the very last one are easiest to AotN rush for, by far
not really any diff between them tbh, so pick by your schedule
sour oasis
It is possible to make AotN while slipping up to 10 exercises on day 1-2 if you forgo sleep.
You can lose 5 exercises in week 1 and make AotN with a little sleep loss.
If you purely rush and rely on maybe getting a bonus on your first exercise every 5, you can lose maybe 2 fights and still AotN easily.
Also, being food is a lie.
Only players who drag their anchor can be food because they can move farther ahead. People who forget enough exercises just.. Disappear.
shy hazel
it was easily possible to top 10 eos without losing sleep
until covid happened
ppl became neet and now that status quo
edgy sparrow
Which french ship are most useful?
keen obsidian
What to do against Belfast Eldridge Juneau front?
storm jewel
just notice that people on the right if they move up they appear on the left-ish
coral wren
Champy
proper sorrel
now i want to do that
upper cove
speed meme so fast you skip the vg and shotgun the backline
sour oasis
too fast torp meme cant catch up
Unless torp meme misses vg and 10k cripples your backline at start.
coral wren
then warspite is like HelLo thEre
storm jewel
finally found the use for that second skill dd part
trail temple
What to do against Belfast Eldridge Juneau front?
Aurora works, or torp meme them so eldridge can't get her evade out quick enough
elder crane
Alternatively just ignore the vanguard since it doesn't do much
Warkai for extra "oh how cute, extra tanky Juneau, thanks for making sniping main fleet easier"
And ofc torpmemes does well
ripe latch
+2 
sour oasis
@coral wren Warspite aux gun range doesn't reach past your non-dead vanguard. Defense fleet torpedoes can squirm into backline.
coral wren
i meant warspite says hello there with her divine marksman
sour oasis
It's dumb luck a torpedo (or eight) does that, but I've had my Warspite almost instantly deleted in 30s from torp meme defense fleet.
coral wren
sounds like some painfully bad luck
sour oasis
Three times in a row. Luckily these were all done 30s into the fight, but 🎲 gonna 🎲
coral wren
yea
elder crane
30 s?
I've seen 5 s deletion once
vanguard moved in a way to collect like every torp launched and aim them at warspite lol
sweet venture
my enty just got one shot by their enty from not procing owari da
lol
it just never ends
elder crane
ah, the good ole 2k18 meta
where if it came down to enty vs enty
which half the time it did
basically, who fails lucky E first lol
sour oasis
Me.
Always me.
midnight heron
reported formi for hax
upper sparrow
Crash damage go brrrr
hot creek
upper sparrow
Look like suruga barrage
dull herald
So it won't work good if we dont put her in the middle?
ripe latch
midnight heron
imagine nagato + suruga + kii bullet hell
storm jewel
forest lake
Amagi Suruga Shinano ultimate stall fleet les go
rocky shadow
Why suruga?
hot creek
FDG/WS/Shinano
forest lake
Why hiryuu when shinano herself can already stall for so long
hot creek
Cause Hiryuu op
hot creek
cause damage reduction meme
forest lake
^
storm jewel
alright cuz i oathed her, gotta use her
coral wren
rocky shadow
Or maybe Shinano will replace hiryuu?
ripe latch
no
forest lake
amagi/fdg shinano hiryuu can possibly be new meta
shinano can boost hiryuu
no need for nagato unless you like 40% barrage
ripe latch
double cv without naga buff usless
forest lake
Yea I'd say that but Shinano gives 15% AVI
ripe latch
forest lake
To both herself and other IJN CV
rocky shadow
Nagato + Shinano = double Avi boost
forest lake
Ig there's that but I prefer amagi/fdg for extra chonk
coral wren
forest lake
both of them sound like they can do nice damage already
rocky shadow
Well amagi + Shinano is good for double debuff
coral wren
forest lake
2 Ryuusei with 4 Cuda or the other way around plus 1 more Ryuusei and 2x500lb fighter from skill
With helldiver
Oh wait do 'first x sortie' buffs work in pvp
Also considering that CN people will most likely mald there's a chance Shinano could get buffed
upper sparrow
Cv meta is back
safe meteor
Shinano relevant in pvp or no?
i see skills that prob are pve focused, guess thats a no? unless her dmg with Nagato and tankiness carries her?
safe meteor
guess we need to test eh
Does Sovetskaya Rossiya buff work in pvp? Shinano has a similar self buff that works for the 1st two sortie
forest lake
Should work but then research exp from "sortie" doesn't include pvp so ???
naive dome
shinano + amagi = 40% damage reduction = 60% more EHP right ?
forest lake
where you get amagi dred tho
naive dome
oh right i keep forgetting it's not straight forward
upper sparrow
Where is zack when we need him
elder crane
Shinano almost certainly makes it in, question is over what
If Shinano+Hiryuu is meta, Nagato, I'll begrudgingly admit, is probably the correct third, at least over Amagi
Reason is, Amagi's defensive boost isn't worth as much vs CV, while Nagato offensive boost is worth more for CV than BB/C
If however it's just Shinano, Amagi > Nagato probably
But you maybe run neither? Azuma and ykkz/noshiro is your 3 IJN already for Shinano.
After all, foxes iirc run Warkai rather than Nagato these days.
The 15% evasion boost for DD is a bit... wut
and 15%... FP?? wut
frail orbit
I'd rather run Namashi if I could make it to her
next oxide
Noob here, seniors, can the super floof affect the meta?
ripe latch
possible , but other comps still strong
they think if run with hiryuu and nagato - op , but any triple meme cv can destroy this degen main
next oxide
ripe latch
if shinano not get bonus to launch first plane - u can forgot about she on pvp
next oxide
O.O??
ripe latch
first airstrike too long
on any cv
if shinano as like hiryuu or taihou stats - ws kai + amagi can kill fast
🚮
shy hazel
do you people know what matters
we get ijn meta again and forever
thats the only thing that matters to devs
storm jewel
they didnt win the war 
but they won in pvp 
crude mortar
elder crane
@ripe latch she has better-than taihou stats and 20% dred vs everything but ship torpedos
elder crane
so what, she makes it to that perfectly fine
ripe latch
20.8 without
elder crane
she's Warkai resistant even, due to her dred working on AP
also 3 CV vs her+Hiryuu is LOL
enjoy dying to Hiryuu at end basically
ripe latch
enjoy see how hiryuu die last
hot creek
time for souryuu to shine?
elder crane
it's 3CV
you have no way of killing Hiryuu anytime fast
elder crane
Nagato is better than Souryuu here still
if you want to go that route
elder crane
?
Belfast does nothing though
ripe latch
smoke
elder crane
smoke doesn't last
ripe latch
always counter
ripe latch
vs azuma?
elder crane
it does nothing vs standard CV/L strike timing
elder crane
Not even centaur will strike into Belfast smoke
ripe latch
how enemy cv try hit
ripe latch
elder crane
tf is wrong with you lol
if Bel smoke covered out to 25 s she'd actually be somewhat useful
as it is, she doesn't do anything with her smoke basically, lol
and JdA does what Bel does but better anyways
blazing scroll
Just use sandy if you wanna counter cvs that badly
She actually helps your backline
elder crane
I'm prolly trying out Warkai Shinano Hiryuu first
frail orbit
@elder crane not trying FWS? For the slow crash meme
Or swap W with C/H
Also Kii torpmeme hmmm
elder crane
Hmm
is Shinano even fast enough to launch for that
2+3+2 Ryuuseis is pretty scary... if it lands
though Formi stop is a bit hmm hmm on timing
elder crane
Namagi Kii torpmemes
with Kii trying to focus down Hiryuu
frail orbit
And 831
elder crane
meh, I never liked the crash setup
too vulnerable to return fire imo
esp if you don't run Amagi with it
elder crane
Anyways, Namakii torpmemes might be worth a shot, probably with Kii trying to focus down Hiryuu early enough to not get fucked
that's easy though
Azuma+ykkz/Noshiro
there's your 3 total IJN
it's no "3 HMS restriction" annoyance
since IJN ships you're already running anyways
forest lake
Not really sure about kii focus hiryuu
20s timed barrage
Doesn't look like it have impressive damage either
frail orbit
P much
elder crane
oh right, it's timed
frail orbit
Kusa B word
elder crane
forest lake
You really wanna sacrifice a slot for 10% torp and 15% aa
elder crane
I forgot her barrage was timed
frail orbit
Ffs
forest lake
Yea
elder crane
it's not actually that bad on dmg since it has good ammo mods
forest lake
Biggest let down of kii class
frail orbit
Well
elder crane
unlike Amagi barrage, doesn't get cucked by heavy armor
still, timed kills it for PvP
frail orbit
What to be expected for something that's the equivalent of the NC/Sodak class on IJN?
elder crane
yeah, she's basically a newbie ship
amazing for a newer player
not all that special for the rest of us
spring kestrel
who's the best non-azuma tank to go with yukikaze and juneau?
storm jewel
hm wonder if i should put rudder on shinano ,
elder crane
Noshiro
Jint is, mmmm
I'd rather take Sheff or something
rocky shadow
hm wonder if i should put rudder on shinano ,
@storm jewel
Maybe you should
Like put rudder on every cv in pvp?
storm jewel
idk i see people put VH armor on hiryuu
but shinano already heavy armor
so i guess she could cheese with rudder
rocky shadow
VH armor only worth if the ship medium armor
Shinano already heavy armor so just put rudder
storm jewel
yeah hence the rudder instead of vh
i never run cv in pvp so i wonder
could pull some play on defense
rocky shadow
Idk, flb Shinano maybe take 3 month from now (if only get 1)
We get free mk3 bullin from current event
elder crane
You get 3 this month
Then 1 next month
For MLB
One from event pt milestone, one from event reward, one in shop
midnight heron
hold up all ships hav sonar now? 1st pvp match and i see those icons lmao
tfw didnt read patch notes
sour oasis
@midnight heron yes. Sonar items do RNG stuffs.
@ebon kraken you're going for EoS-100 this season?
ebon kraken
i've already missed a couple matches though will have to see if everyone slacc
crude mortar
sonar item is clearly not for haloist
sour oasis
past egret
How do we use the yama gun
And does it have stats or we have any idea if it’ll be good in pvp?
Nvm it’s just a buff for Backline BB’s
Is the 10% extra FP worth using her for a comp like FDG Amagi WSKai or other Backlines
Or is it not good enough to use in pvp
coral wren
From a pvp perspective might there be a meta change with the new ships? who do you have in mind
sour oasis
What's this I hear about a new fighter in event map?
storm jewel
shiet bomb but super AA
elder crane
I'm still convinced it's a dev error
The plane's first AA weapon listed is a weaker set of 4 cannons, and the second set of 4 cannons is an upgraded version
Pretty sure it was supposed to be IJN Sea Fury
upper cove
pretty sure it's more like an IJN hellcat
it's AA might even be close to messer
it's paper AA damages are coming out to being higher than messer apparently
hoary saddle
does azuma dev 20 outperform Noshiro?
shy hazel
no
storm jewel
should i atrack this guy
he is the same rank w me tho
idk how many bonus i can get
hot creek
attack
bleak osprey
iirc u shld be getting +11, so u got 2 bonus
hot creek
nah, base 12 right now
bleak osprey
ah, so 1 bonus
ebon kraken
that's the standard no. of points you get at this point of the season (captain 850-1050)
past that it becomes 10 base
sour oasis
You can't go past 1050 (to reach 10 base) until next refresh. Without hacks.
ebon kraken
sour oasis
That name sounds familiar
jovial sedge
So is Shinano again the super IJN bias bullshit like u even build azuma with dog and juneau , nugato and Amagu shinano and everyone can go gtfo?
forest lake
p much
jovial sedge
Fucking cancer... When u think there was enough of this favoritism bullshit... We go even further to despair and more bullshit ijn.... 2 first of a kind ships IJN... And here i thought after year of not caring somth might change : /.... Well at least in terms of stacked ships the measurements increased again
forest lake
Not even pvp system was changed
What makes you think devs care
Only thing they added was a sub almost nobody wants
Tho I still run whatever I like
been trying out howe past few days
jovial sedge
Running whatever u like works for certain rank guess
Then whit ships that cant compete to that idiocratic brokeness of ijn cant let u pass
If at least they released bikiny for that fox....
Also about those devs my guess is, it is you people who dont care cos if community would complain somth would change... But in this matter I think im the only one who complains for 2 years + now... So thats why I kinda didnt do much pvp
crude mortar
need more complaints you measn
silent ocean
more of a matter of who i.e the cn players
jovial sedge
Means people should point out certain biased approach of devs and ask for change in this matter, not that 2 years ijn is the most broken faction and gets mosts ships and nothing changes and with this approach nothing will so we can expect more rainbow ijn snd then spam whole pvp with ijn, like have fun mirroring whole another year plus
hollow maple
I love ijn and their meta 
jovial sedge
And here is the whole problem so why do I even bother... This is like a one man crusade, Dante's inferno, mine inferno
ionic magnet
KMS has fdg
HMS has warkai formi
USS has goddess juneau
French has richelieu
i dont see any problem
jovial sedge
Now build from each faction fleet that is at least equally strong to those ijn
Oh u cant cos they got no equal
jovial sedge
:|
forest lake
works on certain rank
is getting top 100 eos really that hard
get ships that are relevant in pve to 120 and you p much good to go
jovial sedge
Ye so get full ijn .. i mean we circling around same thing, I come here after huge periodical pauses , see the unchaged state point out this problem, no one gives a fuck and this repeats : /
At least cow ship is even bigger than taihou... That is somth.
forest lake
if devs don't give a shit then as players do the same
ionic magnet
yep should've figured it out by now tbh
bleak osprey
I mean ijn players contribute 60% of Al's income. Obviously there will be a ijn bias.
forest lake
there's a reason for attack bonus
tho I do understand wanting other factions to be relevant cuz I'm not entirely ijn main myself
blazing scroll
It would be great if they released a new USS event
crude mortar
coral wren
hi is shinano good for ppvp
crude mortar
obv
jovial sedge
sterile bobcat
I've been seeing some discussion in gph that Suzutsuki is mostly superior to yuki for pve, how does it look in pvp though?
I presume yuki is still the better option?
frail orbit
Test 1st pls
sterile bobcat
also @jovial sedge you really don't have to meta-slave that hard, I run a mostly HMS comp in pvp and I've made it to top 50 so it definitely works plus as fish said JP players are the biggest source of income so obviously devs will play favourites
@frail orbit I would test it myself but ofc I dont have suzu leveled/MLBed yet
forest lake
Suzu is like second best DD in every aspect p much
Besides torps
Still far from ykkz overall tankiness/contribution to team
in pvp
MGM+1 and up to 30% FP boost but you need close to full IJN cuz you not gonna shoot enough planes down
I'll give her a shot since I'll be raising her
If i get her that is
but not really expecting any good results
sterile bobcat
I have a feeling suzu won't replace yuki in pvp comps
but yeah I definitely look forward to seeing other people's results since I'm real short on purins rn
jovial sedge
bleak osprey
@crude mortar hol up, is that supposed to be me? 
glad mulch
which one is stronger?
Normal ijn fleet or ijn torpedo cancer
forest lake
rngesus
blissful oyster
Hey, can anyone explain to me what this team is doing in seaman tier? 😄
And this fleet power, shouldn't it be higher?
It's first time I'm seeing dev30 in exercises...
ionic magnet
Hey, can anyone explain to me what this team is doing in seaman tier? 😄
he stopped doing his exercises so hes stuck there
as for fleet power, his botes has no gears
blissful oyster
But he's definitely playing, else he wouldn't have nimi oath skin
ionic magnet
playing doesnt mean doing exercises
blissful oyster
Yeah, I know, have almost 40k merit, no idea what to do with it
forest lake
I just buy the SRs for medals when I run out
ionic magnet
forest lake
Gotta buy those full courses and gourmets somehow
ionic magnet
i just buy bulins when i run out and the occasional cubes
nothing else to buy really
got 400k now
some ppl even have 1 mil+ already lol
forest lake
Wish they would at least add t3 skill books in
bleak osprey
It's first time I'm seeing dev30 in exercises...
@blissful oyster i used to do that too. this is my first season back in pvp after a 2 year haitus, i always use defence fleets to flex oathed 120 ships
next oxide
Ahem, anyways, noob here, anyone here encountered a shinano in pvp yet? If so how was she?
next oxide
ripe latch
still not get shinano , rip on meta 
hollow maple
Shinano still needs time for skill levels before testing her in pvp 
storm jewel
and finding someone who has her maxed out in pvp defense is gonna be hard, for now
sterile bobcat
Is Eldridge at least somewhat usable or is she a complete meme?
bleak osprey
even if someone got enough dupes and lvl120-ed her
she still has 3 skills that time gated to be maxed
lofty yacht
Hi guys, is the vang trio Hermione, takao , london -kai good?
i have also nagato for back
with howe and warkai
storm jewel
dont u have anything else for frontline ?
lofty yacht
hi, yes: z23 kai, aya kai, minnea, portkai, isuzukai, juneau, belf, leip, laff kai, saint louis
also montp
javelin
storm jewel
juneau is pretty common in pvp, also occasionally belfast/saint louis on defense
lofty yacht
ok thanks
crude jetty
I can see her run with Nagato and Amagi/ Hiryuu
storm jewel
who would you replace her in defense fleet
crude jetty
she buffs Hiryuu more than Amagi..
storm jewel
you mean nagato ?
crude jetty
then id run her Nagato Hiryuu Shinano
and full torpmeme
should be some pretty sick dmg for defence
also: How good is Kii?
storm jewel
i dont see myself throwing amagi out for any of them, its always amagi and +2 but i just dont know who for now
elder crane
Kii doesn't really make sense for PvP, nothing special enough
Tossing amagi might be correct btw
her defensive buffs are worth less vs CV, and Nagato offensive buffs are worth a lot more for CV
hence why AKaga, for example, works better with Nagato rather than Amagi
glad trail
Hey so my team currently is: nagato hiryuu warkai juneau ykk belfast. would shinano be any good?
coral wren
What are expectations of ur cv?
storm jewel
@elder crane but thats the case everyone use more CV in their offensive team no? I feel like Warkai/Nagato/FdG will still be around
glad trail
idk, just being good, i was mostly wondering if shinano is worth anything in pvp :) rn im running a stall comp like everyone else so thats that. im tanking with warkai and hiryuu does decent dmg and survives well
storm jewel
just lost a match somehow enemy amagi snipe both my amagi and warkai
too laggy to even retreat
storm jewel
lost again
and a match during reset so it consume 1 attack too
wow 3 losses rip dream
elder crane
Yeah, the question is if Shinano+Hiryuu even becomes standard period
and if so, maybe warkai is still the better third unit, at least on offense - iirc AKaga works better w warkai than either Nagato or Amagi, lol
Also I remember that vs 3BB, Amagi was pretty comparable to Nagato for AKaga
it was mostly vs teams with any CV at all that Nagato performed significantly better, iirc
crude jetty
but backline be madass hahaha
elder crane
EoS no
but temp rank during rush, sure, no problem
it's still week 1 after all
I've done it before with 5 matches missed week 1 and 4 matches missed week 2
sour oasis
@jovial sedge
#game-feedback message
@elder crane did you get any sleep that season?!
elder crane
with just minor sandbagging when awake
it's not really that bad
the rush was super tight though
just barely got into top 10
for like 10 s lol
sour oasis
past egret
lofty yacht
@elder crane did you get any sleep that season?!
@sour oasis the more you rush the more you get frustrated. It's a good gacha game , take it easy
crude mortar
naive dome
i just realise after meeting a proper torpmeme team that it works not because it can kill vg fast, but because its damage to backline is insane even when it misses VG
jovial sedge
Someone gets it too so they quit AL, well one pr 3 slot still open that is another rainbow ijn powerhouse bullshit then just3 more and full rainobow ijn inc or some other gold one so basicly they will eat each other these ijn shit...
naive dome
i mean i haven't really run into a good torpmeme team until just now
storm jewel
just saw Risbi, should have waited for him to move up
naive dome
not to the point of making an excel of rusher/sandbagger
well good thing I have 2 black dildo
bad thing is I dont have Noshiro 😦
shy hazel