pvp

[zenith tundra]

that's closer to 17s then 15

[elder crane]

global timer is 0.5 s between BBs, right?

[zenith tundra]

something like that

[elder crane]

probably initial delay?

[elder crane]

20.65 s base load time for 457, right?

wtf

[zenith tundra]

i think she doesn't get reload pre 1st shoot

[elder crane]

ohhhhh right

then FdG non HPFCR should be comfortably behind DrH Nagato

1.67 s after then 0.61 s after

no clash

[zenith tundra]

idk about that difference tho. is too close to each other and u can end up hitting water

if one ship dies and both attack same

[elder crane]

yeah, that is a bit of a concern, overkill
at least no global CD clashing though

HPFCR on FdG is fine too on global CD clashing

[zenith tundra]

hpfcr 457 does seem to close

[elder crane]

HPFCR is -15% right?

then it's 1 s FdG first and 3.3 s FdG first

[zenith tundra]

look at the video above is 457 hpfcr

they literally shoot together

[elder crane]

hmm, interesting

let's check calcs
Nagato is 155 base reload, +20% is +31 for 186 reload
DrH is then 19.42*sqrt(200/(100+186))= 16.240 s

FdG is 166 base
457 with HPFCR is then 20.65*sqrt(200/(100+166))*.85= 15.550 s

[zenith tundra]

so not close enough but still pretty much very close to it

[elder crane]

yeah, just 0.69 s away
global CD is 0.5 s iirc, so very close

[buoyant parrot]

Yamato????? Soon??? By nozo. Confuse screeching

[zenith tundra]

nah

we just get an ijn event

and isss is soon too

i don't see another one maybe till towards end on year

[buoyant parrot]

Nozo giving us le bamboozling in general

[glacial shuttle]

Warkai wants SG + Washmachine or SG + AP?

[zenith tundra]

sg white shell is fine if she doesn't tank anything. overall sg rudder should be better or maybe even 2 sg

her bis setup is hpfcr rudder

[buoyant parrot]

I'd go with sg w shell

[elder crane]

In EN, yep

once the more hostile PR2 DRs environment starts appearing, then I'll probably reconsider
and 457 so WSkai damage is still sufficient without white shell

[zenith tundra]

plane suicide ehp would be just hp/(aa dr)?

[elder crane]

basically

[sterile bluff]

aww damn it!

forgot about reset again

[zenith tundra]

ur getting better at forgetting. from 20 min to 1:30

[sterile bluff]

[vague token]

[elder crane]

He took my forgetting time smh

First time in like a year I haven't missed any matches week 1

Inb4 I spoke too soon

[vague token]

i still find it funny i pushed to 0 for cay and then i got +2 on first match after charging to 10

xD

cancel out those 9s

[shell heron]

everything balances out in the end

[coral wren]

so im stuck with akaga cuz i dont have either amagi or nagato

and idw to do hms ( also waifu reasons like i got them in no time on the new server )

so is amagi akaga better or hood akaga? give advice please. im asking since amagi is getting rerun soon.

[vague token]

hood akaga isnt worth bothering with

hold your cubes for crimson rerun

amagi foxes will function much better than hood

[ionic magnet]

hood is better at sniping whats in front of her
but amagi makes foxes a bit tankier which is what you usually want

overall amakaga is better

and gets your amagi prepared for nagato rerun

[vague token]

having 80 less fp hurts

xD

only advantage of hood would be aa i guess

[coral wren]

ohhhhh

amagi akaga is better? thxxxx

im actually asking for my avrora account too, but hey it works both ways

[vague token]

and amagi does have a cl gun slot so she can help clear vanguard a tiny bit

if you have nep/seattle gun

[ionic magnet]

thought my sleeping sched would go back to normal after ditching this season
but i still wake up at 5am for nothing

[vague token]

oof

imagine adjusting sleep schedule for al pvp

[ionic magnet]

[ripe latch]

[sterile bluff]

[inner zenith]

what pr research should i prioritize to get more rainbow gun bp

there's too many gear letters

[sterile bluff]

Q-0 (gold) > Q-0 (purple), G-531 (purple) > Q-3 (blue) > Q-2 (blue)

when u have nothing better to do do G-412 for refresh

or just follow this tierlist http://bit.ly/2XUHbRx

[karmic forum]

Its important to understand how everything is tiered in that list

I don't know many people who would ever do the 10 cube research for example

But you might take the 2.5hr gold research if there aren't any better options

[sterile bluff]

he wants gear

and the tiering is simple

amount of rewards/time

it's on the left

[shell heron]

I should check the sample size on the 10 cube one.

[inner zenith]

i've tried 10 c ube ones. i mostly do cubes for ship bps

but i want rainbow gun

all the cubes i've done and im still 11/50 for rainbow so it's time for switch up

lol

[vague token]

i dont think ive ever done a 10 cube lol

[inner zenith]

imo not worth LOL

the 3 and 6 cubes are good though

[karmic forum]

I've done one 10 cube to see what I would get

Concluded that it wasn't worth the trouble

[inner zenith]

@sterile bluff thanks for list. i needed a gear one

[elder crane]

it is the worst cube project on prints per cube and per time

basically for whales only

[sterile bluff]

ma man wants gear and yall talking bout cube researches be like

ur welcome @inner zenith if u need it again type /research in #bot-spam

it's the short guide at bottom left

[ionic magnet]

all the cubes i've done and im still 11/50 for rainbow so it's time for switch up
cube comms dont drop any gear bp so

[hot creek]

not even whales touch that 🚮 project

[obsidian kite]

Cute chat

Where my meme fleets at

[sterile bluff]

OMFG forgot reset again

ok that's it

im setting alarms on everything i've got from now on

[crude mortar]

where can I read about burn damage?

I wanna see how it calculate

nvm found it

[sour oasis]

I stayed up to test the 'if I don't shut the game off as the new day comes I can keep commissions from refreshing'... And slept through at least 5 tickets

[shell heron]

actually yes, I learned that if you can keep your current commissions if you keep the game up after reset.

I only seen it a few times because my last few are trash most of the time

[crude mortar]

@elder crane what do I put in the formula of weapon base damage of this?

do I put 15 or 90?

at weapon base damage

[sterile bluff]

when calculating burns and floods wiki keeps mention "WeaponBaseDamage" and "WeaponCoefficient". For burns I assume is the main gun of the BB who fired the fire causing shot, but what about CVs? For example sara and essex's barrage, what is this "weaponbasedmg" referring to?

if it comes from a gun it's 90

the tot dmg im pretty sure

almost all formulas use tot dmg if it's from one bullet it doesn't make sense cuz some guns have more some have less

[zenith tundra]

15

[crude mortar]

what number 156 comes from?

[cunning reef]

for CVs, you use the base damage from the barrage for the WeaponBaseDamage

[sterile bluff]

oh ok

15
@zenith tundra wait why?

[zenith tundra]

because that is base damage....

[sterile bluff]

but there r 9 shots

total base dmg

[zenith tundra]

it can shoot 25 times it's base dmg is 15

[sterile bluff]

so u r saying a gun that does the exact same dps but just with a higher alpha dmg will do more burns?

that makes no sense

for example a 30 * 1 gun does more burn dmg than a 15 * 2 gun even tho their dps is the exact same

[zenith tundra]

yes

[cunning reef]

@crude mortar

[sterile bluff]

that makes no sense tho

if that's the case

which "basedmg" do i use for the CV barrages?

do i use total base dmg

or individual base dmg

[crude mortar]

oh ok

[zenith tundra]

what dmg are u trying to calculate for cv that has base dmg?

[cunning reef]

each shot has an independent chance for proccing fire though, which is why you should only account for a single shot as a base damage

at least that's how I understood the way it works

[sterile bluff]

sara and essex

for example sara's burn

it asks for "weapon base dmg"

what do i put for that?

[zenith tundra]

check the barrage chart

it has base dmg in it

[sterile bluff]

im looking at it rn lol

but idk which one to use

the total base dmg

or the individual base dmg

i assume individual based on the seattlegun

[cunning reef]

@sterile bluff that CV calc that I made and you used last time has a table with the numbers you need for flood/fire calcs

[sterile bluff]

ye ik

which one do i use

[zenith tundra]

doesn't it say flood and fire at the end?

[sterile bluff]

336 121 202 or 672 484 808

which one tho

there r 2 base dmgs

1 is individual one is total

[cunning reef]

use individual numbers

[zenith tundra]

individual always

same with weapon

[sterile bluff]

hold on

[zenith tundra]

individual not total dmg

[sterile bluff]

her 2000 bomb does a lot more dmg than 100 bomb and sets fires

but her 100 can also cause burns

so like...

if the 100 set stuff on fire

it'll be stuck with the lower dmg?

or the 2000 will take over

cuz ik burns don't stack

[zenith tundra]

higher burns dmg always overwrite low ones. unless the big one misses it's always gonna be big one

[sterile bluff]

ok

so to sum it up

higher alpha dmg (doesn't matter dps or total dmg after considering number of rounds) will always be better for burns and floods?

[zenith tundra]

yes higher base dmg has better dots

bb guns always have best fire damage

[sterile bluff]

Cuz high alpha dmg per bullet?

[zenith tundra]

because bb guns have best base damage

[sterile bluff]

ye that's what i meant by alpha dmg, as in dmg per shell, not counting the number of shells it fires

for example 100 * 1 has higher alpha dmg even tho 2 * 999999 does more total dmg

[zenith tundra]

when calculating fire dmg the amount of hits are only relevant for chances to burn

[sterile bluff]

ye ik

but if it works like this the game highly favors ships with lower number of rounds

even tho another ship does the exact same dmg just with more rounds and less dmg/round

[cunning reef]

sounds like you're just calling alpha damage as another name for base damage to me

[zenith tundra]

it's only he and anything not bb has way too low burn chances

[sterile bluff]

yea

[zenith tundra]

bb guns and barrages have decent burn chances

[sterile bluff]

ok technically alpha dmg has a different definition ill just say dmg per shot

or dmg per round

[cunning reef]

damage per shot/round without any modifiers is just base damage though

[sterile bluff]

ye

it's just whenever i think of base dmg i always think "total" base dmg after considering number of rounds

cuz when i calc BB barrages i never use dmg/round

i always use total base dmg

much faster that way

ok now that we got the "weaponbasedmg" out of the way

what on earth do i put for "efficiency"

for CV barrages

[zenith tundra]

total dmg in barrage chart is nothing more then base dmg x coef x number of rounds. it's not really a big math change

[sterile bluff]

yea

and i always use "total dmg" in barrage chart

and i just considered that "base dmg"

anyways

what do i put for efficiency?

CV burns don't come from a particular plane slot

[zenith tundra]

it should be always 100%(1) for barrages but not 100% sure about that

[sterile bluff]

ill go with 1 for now

[cunning reef]

fire damage for CVs should essentially be (BaseBarrageDMG x Scaling x FireCoeff) + 5 and ignore the rest iirc

[sterile bluff]

ye as i thought

[zenith tundra]

in that case it's 1

since it doesn't change anything

[sterile bluff]

i think AL logic is basically "if you don't have it it's 1"

[zenith tundra]

all he bombs and torp have 100% coefficient so it makes sense to just ignore both slot efficiency and coefficient

[sterile bluff]

ok wtf

i did (336) * ((442+295)+100)/100 * (0.1) + 5 and got 286...

that extra 295avi is from gear

how is it so low???

[zenith tundra]

*0.1

[sterile bluff]

i did

[cunning reef]

Saratoga's burn damage is pretty low

[sterile bluff]

ok i need to verify that 286 later

also

[zenith tundra]

x 0.1 reduces damage to a 10th

[sterile bluff]

it scales with avi right...?

on wiki it says firepower

but im pretty sure sara and essex don't have firepower...

[zenith tundra]

it says scales with 120% aviation stat

in the chart

[cunning reef]

Sara's Witch's Prank burn and flood scale off AVI, Artillery Cover scales with FP

[sterile bluff]

but that's not for burns tho

that 120% scaling

[zenith tundra]

anyway it is low because the burn coeff is very low

without the x0.1 it would be 2.3k dmg

[sterile bluff]

ye prolly

alright onto flood

[cunning reef]

2.3k fire damage per tick for 5 ticks, what a dream

[sterile bluff]

idk why im suddenly doing CV calcs i feel like im betraying my BBs

wow at max stacks essex can get 968 dmg per tick

that still seems so pathetic tho...

[zenith tundra]

try and to the math for sara burn with 442+195 avi

[keen sparrow]

saruga can do more dmg than warkai n im surprise useless queen can do more than 10k dmg

[cunning reef]

that should still be ~20% damage increase to the airstrike for Essex though

[zenith tundra]

did ur ws shoot an invincible hiryuu for 15s?

[keen sparrow]

all my warkai barrage miss to hiryu

[zenith tundra]

she is mortal when her broken barrage misses

[keen sparrow]

lucky nagato barrage no proc at all n all my vg can tank she plane

that hiryuu so lucky

[sterile bluff]

so uhhh...

how do i calculate AA dmg reduction?

Cuz theoretical CV dmgs r inflated AF

[zenith tundra]

https://azurlane.koumakan.jp/Combat#Damage_Reduction

[cunning reef]

Taihou has 79.45% air resistance for reference

CV damage would be pretty busted without AA

[zenith tundra]

that's because they put avi stat on all slots

[sterile bluff]

79.45% air resistance

lmao GG CVs

my triple BB 13-4 dream is still alive

[cunning reef]

if Taihou had 0 AA instead, Enty without Lucky E proc would deal ~100k damage in a single airstrike

[sterile bluff]

pfff rookie numbers

[zenith tundra]

when cv literally gain 75% of they base stat just from equipment seems sensible to reduce it

[sterile bluff]

give her to me right now

[cunning reef]

she got perma'd on JP, right?

hopefully doesn't take too long for EN

[zenith tundra]

good luck getting her without rate up

[sterile bluff]

^^^^^^^^^

we better either get essex raids with rateup

or wishing well

[zenith tundra]

we might never get a wishing well again who knows

[cunning reef]

not like I'd get her even with rate up, at least one can hope if perma

[sterile bluff]

wdym never get another wishing well?

i asked they didn't discontinue it

i think it's cuz en is trying so hard to catch up with events there's no time for wishing well

[zenith tundra]

u still have to wait for her to be added and wait another 3-4 months after till u can select her

[sterile bluff]

ik

but at least there will be one eventually

but like

im 99% sure it'll be essex raids before she gets perm'd

[zenith tundra]

now i doubt what they'll even do with that since essex is perma now

[sterile bluff]

not in en

en has to get essex raids one way or another

there's never been a single run

[zenith tundra]

having event ship with rate up in limited when ship is perma?

[sterile bluff]

for different servers

i need essex

[keen sparrow]

we can do essex senpai meme if she become permanent

[sterile bluff]

NO!

she's not going to be perm

before essex raids

or some kind of rateup

stop it!

i need hope!

[zenith tundra]

[sterile bluff]

hmph, i wish gems could buy her

[zenith tundra]

u can once she is perma with no rate up

[sterile bluff]

NOOOO!!!

don't say it!

don't say the p word

[zenith tundra]

i spent 5k gems on aurora

[keen sparrow]

pray to rng god n hope she come with 1 roll

[sterile bluff]

ok look

she's gonna get her rateup in her raids and that's all that matters

even if she's perm'd

we're gonna get wishing well eventually

so there's always hope

...

right...

right...?

[zenith tundra]

akashi is always the best hope

[keen sparrow]

[sterile bluff]

akashi is always the last resort

omfg i swear u guys r just trolling me

i wanna cry rn

[zenith tundra]

as i said essex air raid is in a weird spot now that essex is in perma for jp/cn

who even knows why she was added before event rerun

[sterile bluff]

because jp and cn has nothing to do with en schedule

jp and cn is ahead

af

[zenith tundra]

i still don't think they will just prepare new (old) events exclusively for en tho

[sterile bluff]

it's not a new event tho

[keen sparrow]

en now follow jp event

[sterile bluff]

shut up

en is catching up

which includes giving us essex raids

they can't just omit an entire event for en that's biased af

[zenith tundra]

the only difference in events setups between en and jp from like iris that wasn't rerun was dc rerun and polaris moved to a later date because en didn't have pr gascogne yet

[keen sparrow]

en still dnt have sakura rerun too

[sterile bluff]

ok look

if it's a rerun

i get that it might get archived if en doesn't have time to run it

but essex raids is smth that never happened b4

and hq isn't stupid

they know essex is one of the most important CVs that everyone wants

so they won't just omit such an important event like that

[keen sparrow]

[sterile bluff]

wut

did i say smth wrong?

[zenith tundra]

everyone wants an amagi skin and there isn't one yet

[sterile bluff]

ahhhhhhh just

staaaap!

my logic is flawless

we will get essex raids

[keen sparrow]

amagi oath when

[sterile bluff]

end of story

it's late af

i need sleep

[keen sparrow]

[sterile bluff]

this is too much

gn ya weebs

[ionic magnet]

when did essex became important

[shell heron]

It's already getting difficult to get more than a single bonus per reset now

Important in PvE sure. PvP is just free food

[vague token]

i got 1 bonus

[zenith tundra]

even 3 behind i had to wait for someone to finish pushing 8min before reset for a 2nd +1

[shell heron]

I see familiar names of rushers, but I guess they don't rush til mid week 2

[zenith tundra]

maybe they all learned to sandbag

[shell heron]

The day everyone sandbags. It will be a chicken race on who holds out

This name looks familiar. Wasn't someone here named this?

[zenith tundra]

@crude mortar

[inner zenith]

ez find

xddd

[crude mortar]

point donator

see im a very good guy I dont waste people time in their life

be like me

[zenith tundra]

i'd rather not donate free points to other sandbaggers

[midnight heron]

only meant to stall newbs

[ripe latch]

crane's with ihr

[crude mortar]

crane

[zenith tundra]

what the actual fuck...

does the game not work the same for jp and en?

[frail orbit]

FR wise?

[zenith tundra]

yes

why is faster in jp

or the ui bugged

[frail orbit]

Same Amagi reload in ur JP ones?

Check it

[zenith tundra]

both max 200 oath

and it's supposed to be en according to formula

[frail orbit]

Same fleet tech?

Same extra reload?

[zenith tundra]

is that accounted tho?

ok it is

i have 4 reload extra in jp

from fleet tech

[frail orbit]

[zenith tundra]

stella has 0 extra so it's formula number

well thanks for that

[crude mortar]

[elder crane]

Yeah, fleet tech is displayed, but doesn't actually apply once in battle in PvP

At least, that's how it's supposed to work

[crude mortar]

pr3 when?

[zenith tundra]

@elder crane dunno if u have time but could u check this a bit to see if things are ok? i'm trying to add edps in the table too for now only amagi is done as dmg calculation. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1bIMMUpiKm3SSPhMU9pMh9tyN8FyKWK9JvqPREdFBbSI/edit#gid=0

number of reloads is manually calculated because dunno how to properly crate a formula for hpfcr and amagi cdr to calculate the average cd u get in 1min

also 1 thing i don't understand about the barrage sheet is this. how is it possible that 124x4x1.1 is only 240

[crude mortar]

good

BB have 18k hp?!!

[zenith tundra]

welcome to pvp

[crude mortar]

I thight it was around 16

*thought

[zenith tundra]

base hp x 2.34 at level 120

look fdg

24k

[crude mortar]

why warspite non kai image

[zenith tundra]

if u have her kai icon i'm more then happy to change it

[ripe latch]

https://azurlane.koumakan.jp/w/images/d/dd/WarspiteKaiIcon.png

[zenith tundra]

ty

[elder crane]

looks like formula mistake on the Barrage chart

[zenith tundra]

how do u find the kai ones?

?

[elder crane]

the damage assigned to the AP rounds above it is wrong too

it's actually the torpedo damage, pretty sure

not sure where the 240 in torp damage comes from though

[zenith tundra]

the actual numbers are good tho?

i used those

[elder crane]

actual base numbers afaik are good

and it's literally just those two that are off on total damage as far as I can tell

I don't see crits being included

[zenith tundra]

yep

u mean for shells?

[elder crane]

I mean in general

[zenith tundra]

i can calculate it as a multiplier for final damages right?

[elder crane]

yep
multiplier of
(1+crit chance*crit boost)

[zenith tundra]

i have to calculate for each enemy separately

[elder crane]

technically there's an effect by enemy eva/luck, but if you actually eval it, the effect is pretty minimal
you do have to do hitrate adjustments anyways tbf, so I suppose might as well bundle with that?

[zenith tundra]

changed the 1st 2 edps columns. is it fine now?

[elder crane]

+crit chance shell is +8%

not +5%

looks good otherwise

oh, also an issue
there's units that buff stats, how are those going to be accounted for?

like, say, Amagi with Nagato and Amagi without are going to have different dist on eDpS

[zenith tundra]

i know i have no clue about that for now. all i was thinking is making a specific comp section

[elder crane]

and anything with Amagi will have a diff dist on eHP than without

ah, starting independent point, sure, makes sense

Maybe have something up top that can input fleet buffs?

[zenith tundra]

i think i would have to find out how to do that

[elder crane]

shouldn't SG/HPFCR+Shell be an option for BB/C aux?

[zenith tundra]

i have sg+hpfcr

[elder crane]

double shell basically never makes sense on anyone anyways

[zenith tundra]

double shells is for noobs asking about shells in pvp

i want to see the difference

dunno about sg+white tho...

[elder crane]

I ran calcs before, and SG+white is basically to 2 SG what 2 SG is to SG+Rudder

[shell heron]

I'm disappointed. r6 is only 69 up from me

[crude mortar]

how many tix u have

[shell heron]

all 10. I saw you moved to r8 as well

[zenith tundra]

dunno it's 3% more hit for a 20% drop in ehp

over sg rudder

ofc more dmg

but dunno

at least hpfcr+sg is like 6% more hit

[elder crane]

yes, but the FP+crit means you hit a good deal harder

[zenith tundra]

that mostly applies to shelling bb tho

[elder crane]

FP still affects barrages

and +55 FP is still like +8-8.5% damage iirc

[zenith tundra]

i'll do the math for amagi since her dmg is already done

53.92% 39533 36.08% 55247 SG Rudder
60.47% 48945 23.90% 44731 SG HPFCR
58.68% 47721 23.90% 44731 SG White

20.7% more dmg for 23% ehp

[elder crane]

wait, something seems wrong, gimme a sec

[zenith tundra]

that's amagi mirror

with sg hpfcr it's a 23.8% dmg increase (48k/39k) and same ehp loss 0.809% (23.6%)

[elder crane]

oh, I see, # of shots in 60 s is what's throwing me off

[zenith tundra]

i think that's average length of a fight. the time limit is just for hpfcr

and amagi cdr to have a meaning

i can change that dunno if it's needed anyway

[elder crane]

I don't feel like HPFCR load timing adjust is that simple to eval, but given the idea behind the sheet, probably fine
sometimes the load time diff is super impactful
sometimes I feel like it's just whatever (or actively bad occasionally)

[zenith tundra]

should i just do dps for 1 reload then?

idk how i would compare ships dps without a time limit tbh

actually it would be just per second then....

[elder crane]

as a starting point, it's good I think
worry about it later imo

[zenith tundra]

the problem is that removing stuff from 1 ships is a thing. removing from 20+ is another

[elder crane]

issue is, I can't think of anything that wouldn't be super opinionated and/or add a lot of additional complexity for not all that much more benefit

a lot of the interaction issues I'm thinking of are pretty team-specific anyways

in any case, I think the numbers do work out to HPFCR+SG and W Shell+SG being fairly interchangable on overall effect, with the difference being a qualitative eval on whether the 15% preload is actually impactful or not

[zenith tundra]

it would be fine as pure damge per second anyway

[elder crane]

yeah, the other option is to just yeet the 15% preload
I think that's an easy mod in post though, especially if you write it in as a formula, "=base+0.15" which you can then mod with search+replace

alternatively put the modifier from it up top as an input box, so you can change it globally from there

[ripe latch]

@zenith tundra why not add triple 406 to fdg?

[elder crane]

if you have FdG dev30, you probably should have 457/are close to having 457

[zenith tundra]

457 is better on her by miles

[ripe latch]

but before...

[elder crane]

and that

if you don't have FdG dev30, she's not worth using

[ripe latch]

[zenith tundra]

well if u don't have anything better which i doubt u could use her at 25

[elder crane]

MGM+1 and main gun eff on a ship semi-focused on main guns

kiiiinda important

without dev30, she loses something like 30-35% of her damage output in PvP, which is

[zenith tundra]

i know but she can tank well but most likely hiryuu would do a better job overall

68.81% 797.64 36.81% 101570
67.02% 808.23 36.81% 101570

yeah like this is ok still too offensive for my taste

[ripe latch]

this actually

[zenith tundra]

this isn't meme channel pls

[ripe latch]

local memes

[zenith tundra]

should all cv have a vh option? for equip

[crude mortar]

what vh

[zenith tundra]

https://azurlane.koumakan.jp/VH_Armor_Plating

[crude mortar]

oh

[ripe latch]

only hiryuu

ihr better

[crude mortar]

put it on azuma vs torp

[elder crane]

VH is better if vanguard can live, nontorpmemes, and threat is enemy Amagi barrage (or Nagato barrage)

Medium armor just melts to those barrages

[ripe latch]

vh can save vs war kai

[elder crane]

also that, if it's a breakpoint vs warkai
on average perf vs BB shelling though, Rudder is just as good more or less

the extra eHP from the evasion is pretty much exactly the extra HP and armor mod difference

[ripe latch]

hm , maybe on suruga put and test

[elder crane]

Useless on Heavy

[zenith tundra]

rudder offensive item is better i think then vh offensive but should cv maybe have a vh defensive option?

[elder crane]

yeah, I think a lot of CVs have a damage breakpoint for VH armor vs warkai

it's less RNG
which idk if that's a good thing for a defense fleet tbh

[zenith tundra]

what about offense tho

if u are running something that doesn't have a tank...

[elder crane]

depends on team matchups, yeah

if you're having issues with torpmemes and/or vanguard is squishy, ehhhh
probably bad idea

[zenith tundra]

well 1 thing would be that something like nakaga wouldn't stand a chance even with vh rudder against ws

[elder crane]

does something vs suicide, which rudder can't claim
also makes Amagi/Nagato barrages an ez no-sell
is about same perf as rudder vs other shelling, but is less RNG

risk is getting chunked by torps, and smacked by bombs/TBs after vanguard sinks

[coral wren]

Is this a good defense fleet?

[crude mortar]

[coral wren]

Im still learning how to make a defense fleet

[zenith tundra]

should i include both vh offensive and vh defensive options for cv? are they worth consider running ever or it just makes my life more complicated

[crude mortar]

dat defense fleet

use

or just use anything

[zenith tundra]

suruga mid doesn't seem to do much tbh. it tanks nagato but ur ws and hood are easy prays for ws

[crude mortar]

there are 2 type of defense fleet

2.another

[elder crane]

Also Jav in PvP

Kinu isn't terrible but isn't optimal either

[coral wren]

I dont have ibuki, amagi, and nagato

[elder crane]

Juneau+yukikaze 99%
that's the base setup for PvP fleets, basically

[zenith tundra]

defensive fleet doesn't really matter most of the time. if u cannot set something that has a chance to stall or force resets i wouldn't really bother setting an actual defense fleet

[coral wren]

Ok, thx for the help

[zenith tundra]

should i include both vh offensive and vh defensive options for cv? are they worth consider running ever or it just makes my life more complicated

[zenith tundra]

i have to set up different modifiers for dmg based on armor. it's a lot of work and dunno if even worth for the most part...

[past egret]

What would we do without zack sometimes I wonder

[zenith tundra]

people would just play normally

=AO13*(($W13if(AR$4="Medium",1.1,0.9)(1+$O13*(0.05+$N13+($AI13/($AI13+AP$4+2000))+(($AD13-AQ$4+0)/5000)))/$U13+0.7*($X13if(AR4="Medium",1,1.3)+$Y13if(AR$4="Medium",1.2,0.7)+$Z13if(AR$4="Medium",1.2,0.7))(1+1.5*(0.05+($AI13/($AI13+AP$4+2000))+(($AD13-+AQ$4+0)/5000)))/$U13))

dmg formula....

[frail orbit]

Is that even a 🍝

[zenith tundra]

i wish

it has crit included as well as amror mods

since they are calculated for each opponent separately

[sterile bluff]

why is crit chance so hard to calc

i think im doing smth wrong

i always get like 10% or some shit

[zenith tundra]

do u expect more?

[sterile bluff]

ofc yea, according to my experiences

actually my calcs weren't even 10%

like 7 or smth

i think it's cuz im calculating with PR ships

who have no luck

[zenith tundra]

[sterile bluff]

still tho even for PRs 7% seems too low

[zenith tundra]

luck is best stat to nerf power creeps

[shy hazel]

zack as usual

[sterile bluff]

ok lemme test it again

[shy hazel]

try to get all those usual ships

[sterile bluff]

ill see how often PRs crit

[shy hazel]

even if theyre trash

i shouldve bought the token again

lazy tho

[zenith tundra]

i forgot to exchange a ship last event

[shy hazel]

wow

[zenith tundra]

been to caught on reno

[shy hazel]

[zenith tundra]

and forgot casablanca

[shy hazel]

time to sell accnt to zack

prepare the 200 dollar cash

anyways laters

[zenith tundra]

sorry about that i only saw it later in collection

[sterile bluff]

crit works the same way with barrages right?

if the barrage has no guaranteed crit bs

[zenith tundra]

yes. they only aren't affected by shells

[sterile bluff]

ok

lol ok yea 7%

seems legit

[elder crane]

for PR vs nonPR, sounds about right

[sterile bluff]

so would it be smart to position ur PRs to hit other PRs?

to maximize crit rate

[zenith tundra]

if u like mirroring for sure

[sterile bluff]

well, just in general

if they r using a PR

without compromising too much

[zenith tundra]

the only 2 pr used on backlines are monarch and fdg

for vg only azuma

azuma just targets all vg anyway

[sterile bluff]

then ill snipe tf outta fdg

[zenith tundra]

the fun of attacking fdg for 40+ sec before dies

[sterile bluff]

holy F...

why is my dmg reduced so much in pvp

oh nvm they r 120

[shell heron]

well syandra's torp meme forced me to use my noshiro again

I know my Azuma isn't dev25 yet but she got deleted

[zenith tundra]

did u reset early?

[digital prism]

Anyone try using London/avorora/Ajax?

[zenith tundra]

i don't have any of those leveled.

[digital prism]

It seems to be like a pretty strong shooty comp but idk

Maybe z23 instead of Ajax?

[zenith tundra]

idk about how good london is but avrora is too slow and ajax to fragile. ur vg is most likely to just die to bb shoots because they cannot dodge them and low survivability. airstrikes will be even worse

ajax skill against heavy cruisers is also completely pointless since most teams don't even use ca

u are free to try it to see for urself since as i said i don't have any of those leveled up. if u want to know what ships are good to use there is a tier list in pins

[digital prism]

Well I'm just looking for a new comp

[zenith tundra]

also dd generally don't belong in pvp. they way too squishy. the only exception is yukikaze that makes an amazing stalling ship due to blue skill and luck

[vague token]

london isnt super great

probably one of the best hms CAs

but one big seven eats through her hp cause light armor

[elder crane]

Yeah, Azuma pre-dev-25 is pretty much "run Noshiro lol" vs torp comps if your team isn't fine with her dying early vs them

[shell heron]

against any other vgs it works fine

even mirrors

[sterile bluff]

i don't get it... big seven on paper literally mops the floor with every other barrage but it's clearly not nearly as strong in practice... even if u take into account the wasted shells and modifiers... am i missing smth here?

[zenith tundra]

did u take into account hit%?

[sterile bluff]

i basically evaluated it according to how i evaluate other BB barrages. Other BB barrages are close to kind of far from their theoretical dmg, nagato is extremely far from theoretical

like even if less than half her shells hit the dmg on paper stills seems wayyy to high

like bro... 5.5k + 2k tot dmg????

[zenith tundra]

5k dmg?

amagi in pvp does 10k....

[sterile bluff]

wdym

im talking about the dmg numbers on the chart

nagato has 5500 + 2000

[zenith tundra]

before fp scaling...

[sterile bluff]

yea so?

[zenith tundra]

idk how u see it low tbh...

[sterile bluff]

i mean

it's extremely high

my whole point is nagato's barrage seems freakishly high on paper

but in practice it's not even close to its theoretical dmg

even if say like more than half the shells don't hit

[zenith tundra]

the whole 2k part hits less then 20-30%

[sterile bluff]

what about the 5.5k part

[zenith tundra]

it's the opposite

the 5k doesn't really hit due to dispersion

[sterile bluff]

the 2k part (the bigger central shells) seem to hit mostly...

unless im blind

the 5.5k part misses a lot but definitely more than 30% hit

[zenith tundra]

2k+5k/4=3.2k

[sterile bluff]

why /4?

[zenith tundra]

20-30%

[sterile bluff]

25% hitrate?

bruh

that seems a bit too low...

[zenith tundra]

are u tanking into consideration that ships in pvp have defensive gear and nagato hit doesn't really go beyond 70% most of the time

[sterile bluff]

if that's the case then other ships would also be pretty far from their theoretical

but they're not nearly as far as nagato

[zenith tundra]

not all barrages hit the whole screen

[sterile bluff]

monarch's barrage is wide af she still does ok

[zenith tundra]

nagato barrage is broken that 2 of them makes u reset most of the time...

unless ur nagato keeps up

[sterile bluff]

i guess i need to rewatch some more clips

or have a taste of her barrage myself which i don't wanna do

[zenith tundra]

if u are watching from offense prospective remember that she does a lot less dmg on defense due to backline damage reduction also being multiplied by offense advantage of 0.8x dmg taken

[sterile bluff]

but on offense ur backline does 0.8* dmg right?

[zenith tundra]

look at that dispersion

even part of the arrow don't hit

[ripe latch]

nagato barrage only scary newbies

[sterile bluff]

ima newbie

but im scared by another ship

not nagatoot

[karmic forum]

That moment when nagato barrage procs and your Vanguard is right next to enemy backline

Insta wipe

[sterile bluff]

restart: "allow me to introduce myself"

[ripe latch]

that moment when enemy proc and u nagato proc barrage

[shell heron]

that moment when enemy proc and u don't nagato proc barrage

fixed

[ripe latch]

this face when enemy nagato proc 3 times

but yuki can tank

[shell heron]

I seen yuki tank forever, and I seen her get deleted

Nanoda does as she pleases

[sterile bluff]

my yuki doesn't tank jack

[vague token]

somehow 4 bonuses this morning

[ripe latch]

my yuki doesn't tank jack
@sterile bluff show eqiup

[karmic forum]

His yuki is low level

[ripe latch]

but she strong after 107lvl+

its very low

but she can

[shell heron]

I'm hoping it's not yuki lead

that's suicide

Kiro, I'm waiting on my 4th. tell my list to move please

[zenith tundra]

yuki lead is not even that bad with azuma

[sterile bluff]

@sterile bluff show eqiup
@ripe latch 76mm, quad homing, random AA (don't ask), boiler, fire extinguisher

like i said after 1 particular skill activation dialogue my entire vanguard is fucked

[zenith tundra]

u aren't using 3 boilers for sure

[ripe latch]

on low lvl u can put pearl before 112-115lvl

fire left , replace boiler

[zenith tundra]

i'd throw away fe for boiler if ur problem is enty

enty cannot kill anything she cannot hit

[sterile bluff]

[ripe latch]

but anyway she can die on random airstrike if he not up her passive

[sterile bluff]

all her skills r maxed

and I never see "1" dmg marker appearing smfh

and how do i use 3 boilers...

or do u mean for my entire vg?

[zenith tundra]

yes

[sterile bluff]

but...

[zenith tundra]

if u are using slow ships u can go even 4

[sterile bluff]

according to tierlist

boilers aren't BiS for them...

and my ships aren't that slow

no CAs

[zenith tundra]

what are u using that doesn't want boilers?

[sterile bluff]

lemme check tierlist hold on

[zenith tundra]

i'll go trough all those aux once we change tier listing and all ships will have 1 speed aux unless torp memes mandatory

[sterile bluff]

hold on, tierlist puts boilers at yellow

there's 1 green aux for them

and a 1 or 2 yellows

[zenith tundra]

so u use 1 green and one of the yellow

[sterile bluff]

like for aya it's toolbox green, boiler and oxy yellow

but i want oxy

i need twerpmeme!

ok screw that

i need to actually live

ill use boiler

[zenith tundra]

if are not using jintsuu oxy won't really do much for aya

[sterile bluff]

ok ill use jintsuu then

time to change my vg

drops in 10-4 right?

[zenith tundra]

torp memes might not use speed since they die anyway

[sterile bluff]

jintsuu's pretty tanky tho right?

[zenith tundra]

not really

[sterile bluff]

shiet...

[zenith tundra]

at least not for current meta

[sterile bluff]

but at least she can dump a lotta dmg before she die

if the twerps hit

[zenith tundra]

the only ships that do consistent dmg are those that keeps themselves alive. everything else is just rng

[sterile bluff]

nope

still dying

just wanna pull amagi so i can use my gold to awaken

at 130k rn

[zenith tundra]

are u fighting overleveled ships?

[stable dawn]

woke up too late

[zenith tundra]

i just lost another 4 in en lol

completely forgot to do pvp

[sterile bluff]

are u fighting overleveled ships?
@zenith tundra perhaps

but ya know

in life u need to challenge urself and ur ships

taking on opponents 5 lvs higher than me is the way to go

[zenith tundra]

doesn't matter what u do level is too important in pvp

[sterile bluff]

ik

just wanna pull amagi soon

so i can relieve my pressure and spend my gold on awakening

[ripe latch]

imagine pull 120 lvl amagi

wow ppl amagi play indi as tank on pvp

[sterile bluff]

400 cubes is enough for amagi right?

...

...

[ripe latch]

[sterile bluff]

[ripe latch]

2 cubes enough

[sterile bluff]

fk off

[ripe latch]

[sterile bluff]

i need some encouragement

[zenith tundra]

took me 500 for reno who knows

[sterile bluff]

zack is so pessimistic 😦

[zenith tundra]

just saying it can happen

[sterile bluff]

ya know what else could happen?

[ripe latch]

maybe they add her on perma who knows

[zenith tundra]

just say u quit if u don't get her. it worked for me to get nagato 2nd build

[sterile bluff]

what
the
feeeck?

2nd build...

im done

u luck sacs have it so easy

and here's me fkin 300+ cubes no centaur

[zenith tundra]

i would've quit and for good reasons. who wants to struggle with random comps when u can namagi x and win easily

[sterile bluff]

just answer this

how many cubes did it take for centaur?

[zenith tundra]

i wasn't in en during her event and i already had her in jp when i switched

so 0?

[sterile bluff]

................

i feel emotionally unstable rn

[ripe latch]

centaur
cranes

[sterile bluff]

CVs except essex
BB/Cs

[zenith tundra]

if it makes u feel better i pulled centaur on a new jp account i created before trading account

[sterile bluff]

nah dude it's fine

i just feel so pissed when i forget to turn chat to world and see "X constructs centaur"

[zenith tundra]

i still wasted 5k gems on aurora because reasons

[ripe latch]

ppl on amagi get cent and what? no planes no catapults

[sterile bluff]

omfg don't even mention it

[zenith tundra]

centaur is actually broken on a new account

[sterile bluff]

so salty

[zenith tundra]

her barrage does dmg anyway

no need for planes

[sterile bluff]

no gun hood

that's what i did

till i got twin 410 from free login

[ripe latch]

if u spam only spec constr - 1 month+ to get her

or buy coubs

[zenith tundra]

like my 8 months no spee yet

[ripe latch]

but 2 events for clear and get her

[sterile bluff]

dude r u fkin serious?

wait hold on

wdym "spam only spec constr"

i do daily special

did it for many months now

nothing

i can't spam cuz i need to save cubes for events

[zenith tundra]

i lucksac before starting heavy builds by getting u-81 for daily

8 months of daily builds heavy no spee

[sterile bluff]

u got u-81 on amagi... ?

what

[zenith tundra]

no jp

[sterile bluff]

oh phew

ye i recently got u-81 from daily special too

but still no centaur

we better get wishing well soon

[shell heron]

I forgot how many cubes. I went for her on the first banner

[sterile bluff]

did centaur ever get a rateup?

[shell heron]

Did a 10 and forgot was it my 1st or 3rd

[zenith tundra]

yes during her event

[shell heron]

yes on the Sagittarius banner

[sterile bluff]

fkin hell

what should i do?

should i spam special?

[zenith tundra]

forget her

[sterile bluff]

or wait for wishing well

what????

why forget her?

[zenith tundra]

do daily special and that's it

[sterile bluff]

ik i don't like CV/Ls but

[zenith tundra]

wasting money for a ship is not worth

[sterile bluff]

im not gonna waste money

im just conflicted

like

i always save cubes for events

but if i only do daily chances of getting her r pretty slim

so

[zenith tundra]

as i said forget her and do special daily

if u get her good if no keep doing daily special

no reason to worry about 1 ship

[karmic forum]

Wait for wishing well maybe

[zenith tundra]

if it ever appears again

[sterile bluff]

It will

No reason nor confirmation that they stopped it

It wont make sense to stop wishing well and still cram ships into already infested af pools

[zenith tundra]

nor reasons to think they will run it again

[karmic forum]

If you get a good CE event maybe you can dump a few cubes in special

[sterile bluff]

Nah its fine

Ill just do daily special

Pretty sure wishing well will happen

[vague token]

already 6 total bonuses today, too bad i already lost a match

xD

[zenith tundra]

i'm quitting this season. i'll do 1 attempt for fun to see the bonus i get at the end of the season

[shell heron]

I'll prob casual sandbag once work starts again. And fix my sleep schedule

[vague token]

ive been holding on to my sleep schedule

aka no alarms for al xD

which is why i miss matches when i get distracted ;)

[coral wren]

Tosa stats dont look very good, think she will be good for pvp?
Shelling = A
Hp= B

[zenith tundra]

image stats don't mean much

some of the ratings are plain and simple wrong when u compare to other ships

they showed us 2 videos of tosa and she is very different in them. we'll have to wait for datamine to see how good ahe is but mostly it will be based on her barrage %

if it is like kaga bb she won't really be useful just like kaga bb because too inconsistent

also we don't know anything about 3rd skill and if she even have 1

so just wait for datamine

[vague token]

what was bb kaga's stat preview?

[zenith tundra]

i think it's the same she has in-game

but that's a really bad metric

[vague token]

i mean they should have very similar stats

since they're both tosa class

is all

skills are gonna be lul

[zenith tundra]

hp b fp a

in-game

[vague token]

yeah the same then

[zenith tundra]

stats aren't the problem

[vague token]

they'll probably be like within 10 of each other

inb4 50/50 barrage

[zenith tundra]

tbh since 2nd video showed barrage with same mods as bb kaga i'm expecting 50%

[vague token]

is she gonna have torps lol

[zenith tundra]

it was more interesting in the 1st because of bad nagato and amagi mods

[vague token]

ah

[zenith tundra]

i would be surprised if she doesn't have torp

she has torp i think in barrage it's a c stat

[vague token]

probably same as kaga's then

just a separate every 15 seconds torp barrage

err 10 then 20

[zenith tundra]

i don't think she has torp barrage due to melee one

i think it has to be barrage

like main one

unless they make her have torp melee and mg barrages lol

[vague token]

shoot far, shoot close

50/50 gamble

sounds lul

[zenith tundra]

hopefully not

[vague token]

yeah xD

the melee barrage could compress the torps in it

[zenith tundra]

melee barrage looked both cool and useless. like the range was so bad but she shoots for like 2s

[vague token]

good for ch11 hard mode

err 10

xD

jihad begone (tm)

[zenith tundra]

it actually would be useful there. my izumo cannot kill 2 bomb boats at once with nepgun

[vague token]

yeah

too bad kizuna bb doesnt have her barrage as a melee barrage

it'd be fun for that

[ripe latch]

cosmic brain

[sterile bluff]

so uhh

the torps from amagi barrage

do they do anything?

[vague token]

bit of chip

but their aim is whacky

so dont expect much

[ripe latch]

250-400dmg from 1 torp D:

[sterile bluff]

in pvp?

that's pretty noice

btw is amagi barrage chart fixed yet?

[past egret]

@ripe latch That Fleet is hurting me

[ripe latch]

but this fleet food...

[shell heron]

PvP is so slow without gear

[vague token]

i feel like this is a weird season, im at 1561 5/10 atm

but that puts me current rank 94

[elder crane]

1544 7/10

[vague token]

i lost a match though xD

[elder crane]

yeah, season has been kinda dead it feels

high ranks are so empty

[vague token]

like ill be 5 behind you with a loss lul

assuming you get 2 +s

[elder crane]

Maybe we'll get another influx of PvPers with Amagi

Nah, I don't do last-min sandbagging

going down to 5/10 right now

[vague token]

ah

[elder crane]

two more days and we'll know how 🚮 Tosa is

[vague token]

i mean she'll be better than bbkaga probably

xD

[shell heron]

oh I'm slightly ahead of you

1536 8/10

[round dome]

This guy is EN, right?

[elder crane]

?

[round dome]

Just being curious

[elder crane]

just cause name is in English doesn't mean they're in EN lol
servers are completely separate

unless you've modded EN client to be in chinese

Every subserver is completely independent of each other

hence why some people laugh at non-Avrora-PvP in EN

[round dome]

No, I mean he seems to be in the EN player community.