pvp

[shy hazel]

so much to do

[zenith tundra]

2012 rn highest on my jp server and 3d 15hr left vs 1895 on avrora with 4d 7hr left

[shy hazel]

after w12 gotta 120 pvp ships

👀

did u go to a populated server

[ionic magnet]

my foxes are ready for 120

[shy hazel]

my jp diesnt have bggers

[ionic magnet]

but then again its foxes lul

[shy hazel]

fixes in 2019

[vague token]

xD

[zenith tundra]

i asked in ec discord for a good jp server

[ionic magnet]

they got so much exp when i farmed affection

[shy hazel]

anyways its on u👀

u start from scratch

[vague token]

im too many in to swap off of en xD

[shy hazel]

[zenith tundra]

this is my scratch so far

[vague token]

centaur, give

[zenith tundra]

nope

[vague token]

[shy hazel]

just gib us pvp updates once u good

if u choose to move

[zenith tundra]

which is never since i cant farm pr2 ships or have ws kai

[shy hazel]

[ionic magnet]

[shy hazel]

dunno

[ionic magnet]

the deletes in this chat is strong

[shy hazel]

its gray market

[sharp wing]

I got SS

[shy hazel]

[vague token]

busted

[shy hazel]

oh unigun here now

[ionic magnet]

[vague token]

nitro boooost power

[sharp wing]

🐳 power

[coral wren]

I swear once centaur or jeane bart is here i’m benching hood. She is nowhere near 70% to barrage in pvp

[sharp wing]

[hot creek]

still can't believe there are no centaur doujins

[sharp wing]

ohboi

[vague token]

you sure about that

xD

that would surprise me

[sharp wing]

I'm nt sure tho

[zenith tundra]

i havent seen one yet

[vague token]

weird

eep 3k gold left

[zenith tundra]

i had gold for a bit till monarch happened

[vague token]

xD

[cerulean estuary]

since research came along . i havent had the resources to buy discounted gold boxes

research drains my gold

[vague token]

ive had 2 of the 30 minute research in the last 3 days

murders gold real fast

[zenith tundra]

i would prefer those over having to do ship bps ones

[vague token]

xD

[cerulean estuary]

tried the 5 hrs 5k gold research ( elite )
with supposedlyy 2 gold bp's reward

ended up getting 2 purple / elite bp's

smh

[vague token]

[cerulean estuary]

and always giving me MEME GUN bp's

[lament lichen]

at least you're not about to make your second confetti gun with bps

[zenith tundra]

i made a 410 ap gun and now have 14/25 lol

[cerulean estuary]

already had 1 availabe/ ready to craft MEME GUN as a result of a "lucky" BP's reward

[shy hazel]

lucky indeed

[wicked rivet]

I lost a battle yesterday so now I'm actually 1 down from top

[shy hazel]

at least better thn me

[zenith tundra]

i am rank 4.9k u lost nothing

[shy hazel]

i only made sandy aa radar

lol

[vague token]

i mean it gives 10 ambush evade

so that's nice

[shy hazel]

i call it

[elder crane]

lol I'm at 31/25 on the meme gun

[shy hazel]

the plate

[elder crane]

I think higher now actually after today

[shy hazel]

cos it looks like a plate

[zenith tundra]

its still worse then sg radar tho

[shy hazel]

[vague token]

sg radar doesnt help with aa in ch12 xD

[elder crane]

gotta get that fat plane damage reduction

[zenith tundra]

all u need is sandy. even without retro

[elder crane]

that's a weird way to spell, "repair ship"

[wicked rivet]

so far i've gotten one of everything except the triple 410, AA radar, and both actual AA guns

[zenith tundra]

i tried sandy for a bit for saint louis farm and she far from unusable

[elder crane]

or tbh just any of the ships that are usually good with high AA

yep, she's just mediocre

[zenith tundra]

i might even say better then juneau as damage

[shy hazel]

i built 5 prs so i dont have money for research

fight me

[elder crane]

well ofc jun is just a worse sandy for PvE usually

lower rarity of the same class so lower stats

[shy hazel]

im planning to do long oil comm after all prs end

then w12 comes

[elder crane]

and a skill that isn't usually relevant for PvE

[vague token]

eh just sink juneau on the 6th fight

toss her in 2nd floor

[shy hazel]

forever poverty

[vague token]

sustain fixed

[elder crane]

well, that's actually what I did for a while

[vague token]

xD

[shy hazel]

i imagine after dev30

pr2 comes

[vague token]

ugh plz no

i need a bit of recovery time xD

[cerulean estuary]

slow down a bit will ya?

[zenith tundra]

i wish i could ask the devs about pr2 release for en

[shy hazel]

im almist done grind pr1

so i want 2

oh my new fav emote

[zenith tundra]

u get bps for all ships with pr2. it's just more random

[shy hazel]

and more expensive

[elder crane]

well, you can lock 2/5 to just one season

the projects, that is

[shy hazel]

dev 23 monarch

doesnt feel useful at all for niw

[vague token]

dev 24 saint louis is working ok for me, she's a fancy portland xD

[zenith tundra]

randomness at its finest so far. only do kita ones pretty much as char

[vague token]

oh god that distribution

[elder crane]

Monarch with slv 10 at lower devlv is basically a barrage boat
and with AP barrage, damage-wise she's niche but still great in that niche

Great in the event with all the med/heavy around

[vague token]

a zombie barrage boat ;)

[elder crane]

and that heal ofc is nice too

[zenith tundra]

i use ap in d3 on bismark and have to say the dmg is pretty insane considering im using 380

[elder crane]

though the amount is low so applicability is limited

380 is basically the AP version of the twin 410 base-damage-wise, no?

rather than being more like the 381

[vague token]

uh no, the 380 has same base damage as 381 give or take

[elder crane]

whoops, my bad

[vague token]

there isnt a twin ap gun with 150ish base damage

for some reason

[zenith tundra]

410 ap hits like a truck on anything non light. i love that gun

[vague token]

only the triple 410

but hey there's one with 200 base damage XD

[elder crane]

Yeah, it nearly kills the daily gunfire boss in one salvo by itself on any lv110 BB

[zenith tundra]

the only one with 200 base dmg is twin 458 iirc

1 off well

[vague token]

exactly

[cerulean estuary]

already crafted the prototype 203 HE gun for CA , but i think eugen gun is more effective on lvl level mobs ( like this current event )

[vague token]

xD

[elder crane]

yep, that thing also has enhanced AP modifiers

BBAP+

[zenith tundra]

i use skc for portkai in d3. seems better then 203 mle

[elder crane]

kinda like SHS modifiers, 5% less mod on light but 5% more mod vs med/heavy relative to that iirc

[vague token]

i mean SHS isnt even a real ammo yet =(, it's just a skill mod in the end

[elder crane]

D3 tbf has a looot of med/heavy, just like all the event maps

[vague token]

we need some SHS guns

or maybe a shell equip that converts to shs

[zenith tundra]

i hope they keep the trend and use more medium and heavy ships from now on

kind of tired of light armor spam

[vague token]

does pve have armor specific to the ship or does it generalize and do armor based on class

[elder crane]

it's also making CL guns more competitive vs DD guns

PvE is ship-specific afaik

[vague token]

oh ok

[elder crane]

I mean, most of what you face it matches up anyways, so idk tbh

[vague token]

i wasnt sure xD

like i wouldnt be surprised if they did the lazy way

[cerulean estuary]

anyone here crafted the other prototype 203 AP gun? for CA

[elder crane]

I think this event, the RN CAs have light

[vague token]

roon gun? im at like 21 or 22

=/

[zenith tundra]

i dont have bps to do comissions for that

[cerulean estuary]

in terms of pve

roon gun or st louis gun?

[elder crane]

I'm still at 16 on that
as I said, none of the really good PR equips high yet

Roon gun mostly better cause better base stats

[zenith tundra]

depends on enemies

[elder crane]

but yeah, still somewhat armor dependent

[vague token]

saint louis gun has that 130 base coefficient

[elder crane]

if I had to just pick one to place on a ship and leave it, Roon gun

[vague token]

but it's still he

[cerulean estuary]

ah ok but like dealing with sirens and 3 node main fleets = ap gun is the wise choice?

[elder crane]

the base DpS is significantly higher for the Roon vs Louis gun

[vague token]

or if you want barrages

roon gun isnt as good at fire rate

if for some reason you have extras

and are using other cas

for w/e reason

aka very specific not very common scenario

[elder crane]

even on Roon herself the Roon gun is still better imo, and not many ships have better barrage-to-gun-damage ratio that her

the total gun+barrage damage is a teeny bit better on the Louis gun iirc, but gun damage > barrage damage

well tbf she has the ammo mod skill, but still

[vague token]

i mean saint louis gun has 2 second lower fire rate with lower volley time

so if you're using like a shark

they'd rather have saint louis gun

not sure why you would

but you can

[elder crane]

yeah, the sharks it matters on
and Louis cause the skill
and Houston

[vague token]

yeah

[elder crane]

might matter on the Takaos too

everyone else, no.

[vague token]

roon gun definitely better equip and forget

french guns you think about em

german gun, slap that one everyone

but who are we kidding we dont have spares

xD

put those guns back on saint louis/roon

[zenith tundra]

for pvp i really liked mle fire rate and dmg

[vague token]

i mean it has a 1.3 base coefficient

perfection for ripping through light armor

combine that with 35% more from saint louis

big lol

[elder crane]

Yeah, mainly light armor mods and fires are huge for PvP on CA HE vs AP

[vague token]

well not so much fire

saint louis has -3% fire chance

xD

just DAMAGE

[elder crane]

well louis has her skill, I mean in general too

[vague token]

oh yeah

oh boi just barrage left to level 10 on biscuit

left it for last

cause it's lol

[zenith tundra]

waste of books

[vague token]

shh

i have plenty of purples

to waste

[zenith tundra]

im using blues on bismark skill

[vague token]

xD

[elder crane]

I've actually used so many blues on red skills, that I'm kinda low on those now

barely enough T3 blue left to max Louis skill

[cerulean estuary]

reading all the comments and discussions here , made me think

which to pick first to dev 30

roon or st louis

[elder crane]

might need to start eating yellows too eventually

Roon for PvE, Louis for PvP, between the two
In the crossover role, imo Louis more viable

Monarch is also another option, she's very viable in both

[zenith tundra]

imo whoever u like. saint louis is better for pvp

[vague token]

i did saint louis then monarch

roon will be next

but that's gonna be slooooow

i just started the 2m for monarch lol

[cerulean estuary]

i doubt my faith on roon . bcoz of bismarck skill's

well goota wait 1st for actual pvp data on KMS fleet

[elder crane]

Monarch->Louis->Nep->Roon->Ibuki->Izumo is my planned order, for getting ships

[zenith tundra]

my 2nd is ibuki after roon if i keep playing

[elder crane]

I've just started Nep

[vague token]

roon is good without biscuit

she crazy but she's good

[zenith tundra]

roon with bismark might be too good tbh

[elder crane]

She's almost broken if not actually so in PvE, Roon

[vague token]

did anyone figure out how much ammo penalty reduction that letter is xD

biscuit roon core sounds fun

[elder crane]

-15%

[vague token]

oh that's not terrible

[zenith tundra]

35 instead of 50

[elder crane]

also biscuit -35% damage apparently is additive with 0 ammo debuff

which is

[cerulean estuary]

KMS fleet cons = bad / low AA though

[vague token]

oh

[elder crane]

Roon AA iirc is decent/good

[vague token]

that's eww

only bad aa on capital ships

since we get leipzig kai soon

[zenith tundra]

aa for what... hiryuu?

[vague token]

you'll have a good aa cl

oh

i dont think biscuit aa is really any worse than nagato

xD

[elder crane]

for PvE I'm pretty sure
cause PvP, KMS is still a meme

[zenith tundra]

if i wouldnt be stuck with pr ships i would level up my roon bismark and graf to try out

[cerulean estuary]

still we dont have enough pvp data on KMS fleet , so its far to know by now

againts CV's or BB's or mixed

[vague token]

my biscuit is 104 xD

gotta level graf

i think she's 90 or so

[zenith tundra]

104 roon and bismark and 98 graf

[elder crane]

I don't see it
Bisko compares unfavourably with Nagato, better base but worse buffs overall than QE
And KMS ships for PvP are all 🚮

[vague token]

well, 25% crit rate isnt that bad

[elder crane]

like you'd never use pretty much any KMS in PvP unless for forcing KMS

[vague token]

once we get shell

[cerulean estuary]

i have lvl 110 bisko and mama graf ( same affinity )

[vague token]

then it multiplies out pretty well

[zenith tundra]

i want to see 120 roon dev 30 putting holes in opponent ships

[elder crane]

and then getting smacked around by BB shells?

[zenith tundra]

if ibuki can survive in jp meta so can roon

[vague token]

roon can take he better than most

[elder crane]

Ibuki survives by being in an alpha strike team

[vague token]

especially with graf

[zenith tundra]

i mean keep herself alive with 2 oxy equipped

[cerulean estuary]

quadruple BB gun with 20 spread angle?

hmm seems legit and i wish

[elder crane]

KMS is not an alpha strike team

KMS is going to be as slow if not slower than Namayuu....

Ibuki survives by being in a team that finishes matches in under a minute

[zenith tundra]

all u have to do is put roon in front of opponent main fleet

[elder crane]

Well, glhf with that with no way of bursting VG and eating every BB shell...

[vague token]

i think kms would be doable if they buff part of biscuit barrage to 200 base damage after fixing its range issue

depending on what leipzig kai does

though

(and damage shell)

[zenith tundra]

u get 15% dmg rwduction on one of the tankiest ca in the game

[vague token]

without that kind of oomph big seven just laughs at you

[elder crane]

I'm still super skeptical on Leipkai
She's a low rarity ship with bad base stats, idk how far she can really go
Retro won't fully fix her stat issue, and so idk how much she can rely on skills
I suppose a broken skill is possible, but I at least won't be holding my breath

I place more faith in Z1kai tbh

[zenith tundra]

z1 kai wont help anyrhing in current meta

[vague token]

are her bases really that bad for a support cl?

xD

[elder crane]

though i suppose her stats aren't much better heself

[zenith tundra]

she needs othe z ships to be good and u would sacrifice either juneau or yukikaze

[vague token]

at least with like

roon/leip/ykk

err juneau

roon/leip/juneau

you're getting a lot of stat boost out of cruiser command

[shy hazel]

leip kai soon

👀

[zenith tundra]

not sure about en tho

[shy hazel]

shell just prolly get some meme skill tho

we get updated kms kais at least

[vague token]

im more scared of helena kai

xD

[elder crane]

tbh I'm overall dissapointed on Bis
It's probably the last major KMS faction event, there's not much left to add for them

and nothing super impactful imo

[vague token]

more like we expected too much

[shy hazel]

next kms event

is all about submarines now

[vague token]

we expected someone to boot out nagato

[shy hazel]

[vague token]

we fooled ourselves

[shy hazel]

bisko is bad

[vague token]

[zenith tundra]

im not really tbh. with fdg grad and roon it should be viable as long as fdg dmg is good

[shy hazel]

so yamato should be bad too

[vague token]

LOL

[ionic magnet]

if they wont fix helena skill timing then she will just still be mediocre at best

[elder crane]

I'm super skeptical on FdG damage too tbh
we'll have to see overall I suppose
Just doesn't feel like it has the right tools to be broken enough

[vague token]

fdg isnt about damage

it's about 10k base hp

with mama graf

and trolling your enemies

for years

[elder crane]

that's what she has going for her, we'll see if that's good enough

[zenith tundra]

shes already unkillable with yukikaze graf and juneau. all she needs is damage

[vague token]

the one good part

is that she synergizes extremely well with biscuit's crit buff

with a shell and that her even shot is like

[elder crane]

yeah, the problem is the team as a whole is... lacking, I feel

[vague token]

225 crit damage

and 70 crit rate

[shy hazel]

wish bisko 40% buff didnt only buy pitz

[vague token]

that's a lotta damage

[shy hazel]

but all kms ships

for max retardation

[vague token]

that isnt a buff though

[shy hazel]

[elder crane]

relying on BB main gun damage

[vague token]

it's just a fix for tirp skill

with a bit more

the main buff is carrier gets 20% with 20% crit

xD

[elder crane]

Tirp gets double stack on buff afaik with every other BB/BC sunk

to +70%

[shy hazel]

then bisko dies lonely queen procs

lul

[vague token]

yeah xD

70% damage mag torps still dont hurt

rip

[shy hazel]

if only they give tiro barrage too

[vague token]

can we get oxy on bc/bbs yet

please

so we can buff torpedo main fleet skills

like seriously

xD

[elder crane]

maybe we'll get accelerated KMS kais since there's not much ship-wise to add?

[shy hazel]

begone memer thot

[elder crane]

without equip slot eff mods that won't save her

[shy hazel]

prinz kai announcement when

[elder crane]

the skill torps just have base 100% efficiency as an equip, which is 🚮

[ionic magnet]

id imagine DC rerun will come with a new broken ship

[vague token]

wait what, that's terrible

=(

[ionic magnet]

[elder crane]

DC rerun already exists

[shy hazel]

[ionic magnet]

rerun rerun then

[elder crane]

it's the Bismarck rerun that you want

[ionic magnet]

[shy hazel]

rerun kai 2

[elder crane]

so far no rererun events expansions exist

instead events are just retried

[vague token]

oh wait but the main fleet torpedo skills use 120% of stat

[ionic magnet]

well so far everythings possible with en

[vague token]

so you'd get 20 more torp xD

[elder crane]

DC feels like JP/CN will retire after next time they run, which would be our rerun if they sync schedules again

[vague token]

tirpitz says it uses 150% torp stat

each oxy would be 150 torp

for the memes

oh huh sara actually uses 120 aviation for her skills, didnt know that

weird

wish they put ratios in skill description

[zenith tundra]

winning vg for kms shouldn't be hard with bismark using her 2md gun way more often then other bb do in pvp

[wicked rivet]

for kawawawakaze would it be better to have a blue 76 or gold 100

[elder crane]

I suppose FdG barrage, while not doing much to main, also somewhat splashes VG with guarenteed damage too

[vague token]

awawawawa

gold 100 cause she actually shoots things

[zenith tundra]

in pvp i prefer 100 for extra aa unless u dont fight cvs

[vague token]

also the aa

[wicked rivet]

I should add more wawa's

[vague token]

she has a torp barrage and uses the 30 aa so

xD

[elder crane]

does kawa have not dogshite gun stats?

[wicked rivet]

85% 66 FP

[elder crane]

ok, dogshite then as usual

[vague token]

i mean the only gunner ijn dd is pr2

[ionic magnet]

[vague token]

lol

[elder crane]

still probs 100mm most of the time for AA, without anything other than barrage to proc

[zenith tundra]

that torp wall she has for barrage tho

[elder crane]

not as good as ykkz's though
and worse than Poi's too

[zenith tundra]

i mean kitakaze

[wicked rivet]

kitakaze isnt even in EN yet

[elder crane]

oh, kita

[wicked rivet]

Im talking kawa

Ive been using the 100mm and it seems to be working fine

but with barrage every 10 times

[elder crane]

she doesn't get that much use out of the faster 76 really

[wicked rivet]

min 5.6s vs min 7.8s

[elder crane]

just a few more procs of a not-amazing barrage

[wicked rivet]

for +9 100mm at least

yeah it does kinda suck

[vague token]

xD

[wicked rivet]

lights everything on fire which is nice

but otherwise

[elder crane]

her barrage torps only use 80% torpstats, like poi, for whatever goshdarned reason

[wicked rivet]

wait rlly

wtf

gold 100 it is

[vague token]

what torp auto barrages dont use 80%

[elder crane]

ykkz apparently

[vague token]

o.O

power creeeep

[elder crane]

on top of having more base damage on ykkz too

[vague token]

____>

[elder crane]

isn't kawawawa later than nanoda though?

[vague token]

dunno

[wicked rivet]

kawa is same event I think

[vague token]

nanoda is rerun visitors

so no

[elder crane]

Kawa iirc is Nagato

[vague token]

kawa is ink stained

[wicked rivet]

oh yea nvm

[zenith tundra]

nagato was before rerun vdir

[elder crane]

....pretty sure not so....

[zenith tundra]

nanoda was released when en started pretty much

[vague token]

[wicked rivet]

what

no she wasnt

[elder crane]

VDiR rerun
JP Server: March 27th - April 10th 2018
CN Server: March 29th - April 12th 2018
EN Server: March 21st - April 3rd 2019
ISSS:
JP Server: May 31st - June 14th 2018
CN Server: June 7th - June 21st 2018
EN Server: April 11th - April 25th 2019

[wicked rivet]

the first vdir didnt have nanoda or nagato

[elder crane]

so, very much no

[zenith tundra]

wasnt kawa in og isss event tho

[elder crane]

yes she is

that's ISSS first run timing

and VDiR rerun timing

[zenith tundra]

so kawa is before nanoda

[elder crane]

What?

can you read

[vague token]

xD

[elder crane]

kawa is ISSS
nanoda is VDiR rerun

[wicked rivet]

we got nanoda

then a week later we got kawa

[zenith tundra]

ok confusing vdir rerun time mb

[wicked rivet]

I got em confused cause they were so close to eachother

[vague token]

i mean he put them up with comparison unfriendly format

xD

[elder crane]

kwkz is pretty forgettable so understandable really

[vague token]

i mean most destroyers are forgettable to the superior power that is ykk-sama

[elder crane]

I mean Zack didn't specify which server so I had to include all 3 to make point fully

[vague token]

how can any compare

xD

[elder crane]

well, ayayayaya and nanoda

[vague token]

ayayaya and nanananoda

[zenith tundra]

idk why i tought they got vdir rerun with our og run... must be reterded

[wicked rivet]

yea we only got the first version in vdir in october

[elder crane]

nothing out-torps ayayayaya
and nothing out-tanks nanoda
and overall gunboat DDs aren't top of their type since other classes do it better
(for DDs)

[vague token]

i mean the thing with nanoda

[wicked rivet]

and so far vdir is the only event we've actually had a rerun of in EN afaik

[vague token]

is she still does good damage

relative to her durability

[wicked rivet]

yeah she does

[vague token]

unlike the majority

of destroyers

[wicked rivet]

and she survives forever

[vague token]

which can only do 1 thing

or the other

aya is kinda durable (in pve at least) thanks to evade though

[elder crane]

she's by far the tankiest DD though

[zenith tundra]

i have nanoda solo tanking sp0 boss

[vague token]

no i mean

her ratio of tank to damage

[elder crane]

I'd venture to even say tankiest of DD/CLs

[vague token]

is waaay better than any other dd in the game

she is the most superior light ship

she helps your main fleet

[elder crane]

yep, her damage output is also better than most too

[vague token]

she tanks

and she dps

she is flawless

[elder crane]

only weakness is not-a-gunboat for automoding PvE

poor at cleaning up and reliable single-target DpS

[vague token]

i mean that's w/e

not like we'll be solo gunboating ch12

anyways

[elder crane]

well, you say that...

[zenith tundra]

im curious about kita dev 30 performance

[vague token]

kita is weird cause no preload right?

oh wait she gets preload

nvm

hmm

[elder crane]

she gets a TRB-skill

[round dome]

some ppl in CN already maxed her and had a review of her.

[zenith tundra]

do u have any links?

[round dome]

sure 1 sec

https://www.bilibili.com/video/av53890336

[elder crane]

http://wiki.joyme.com/blhx/12-3/4低耗阵容推荐
Phoenix solo-VG autofarm ch12 at safe/lv120

grrr wtf is it a vid

[round dome]

it's a video in Chinese tho...

[elder crane]

I don't understand the chinese gamerlingo, I'll try I suppose

[vague token]

hmm

i dunno if i can do that clear fleet on 11-4 lol

maybe if i reset for 0 level 3 mobs

would be doable

although i guess 120 boosts durability more

so maybe it's different

compared to 110 on 11-4

[round dome]

well the conclusion is that her sweet spot is around ch 11 and event D3, where enemies are about lv105

[elder crane]

Also I can't find the doc anymore, with the ch12 guide, which has more teams of that type

[zenith tundra]

comparing kita to laffey and z23 that are pretty much gun based dds

very useful tbh

[vague token]

well she has MGM+1

so that's nice

100% better already

xD

also armor ignore

means you can run any gun you want

and do 115 to pesky Heavies

why isnt there an ap dd gun with good stats

=(

that could be fixed by that skill

xD

[round dome]

iirc the twin 100 is better since the extra 15% eff and fast barrage proc

[zenith tundra]

is mle better then 100 for kita?

[elder crane]

huh, another point is her damage timings initially

I see it, fills in the gap to the first round of main fleet nicely

[vague token]

the other advantage of kita is that huge hp

only rivaled by z46 lol

[zenith tundra]

i skipped a bit the video since im at work does it shows with 100 as well?

[elder crane]

as with all high-evasion ships, gets super tanky when a fair bit above map level
and falls off hard as you near/reach/pass level parity

the guy did some stattesting comparsion, yep

[round dome]

altho having MGM+1, kita's torp damage is still higher than gun damage. and twin 100 has higher raw dps with that extra 15% gun eff

[coral wren]

fk u mean max limited already

[elder crane]

So basically she's a nice ship to have, and really good at clearing maps around lv100-110 especially, compared to other ships

[coral wren]

wtf is this

can u p2w research in CN?

[round dome]

her main problem is survivability, she has only a little more eHP than wichita...

[elder crane]

but falls of hard vs the hardest content

[vague token]

oh i just realized all the MGM+1 ijn destroyers have over 2k hp

weird

[elder crane]

oh, raw eHP is a bit misleading since it usually doesn't consider lv advantage evasion rate buff

[round dome]

if you think dumping cubes into research as p2w, then yes, you can

[elder crane]

which is super impactful for moderate lv advantage on high-eva ships

[zenith tundra]

not like u cannot use her in a team

[elder crane]

which means DDs at moderate level advantage are a lot more tanky than they are at other points, relative to other ships

[vague token]

[elder crane]

but yeah, that tells you why she seems to be super squishy nearing level parity, if your calcs are correct

[round dome]

well, no level advantage in ch 13... only level disadvantage, enemies are lv 121-122 in 13-4

[elder crane]

it also means that high-eva ships suffer the most when placed at a level disadvantage, eHP-wise

[vague token]

i mean flat % mods are one hell of a drug

amagi? flat 10 evade xD

level difference? flat evade boost

(and hit)

[elder crane]

wait, is that a maxed Seattle in the final clip

[round dome]

yeah, that guy has all 4 gold pr2 ships maxed

[elder crane]

oh it's a full-PR team

[vague token]

dear god

my money

just thinking about that

-billion gold

xD

[elder crane]

Roon Kita Seattle, Monarch Georgia Gascogne

[zenith tundra]

using only cubes and gold seems broken but why even bother spending money on that

[coral wren]

cus they can

[elder crane]

ehh, for those who have the cash to blow...

[round dome]

btw Gascogne review, just came out today https://www.bilibili.com/video/av54667561

[elder crane]

ty for supporting us cheaper ppl I suppose

Prediction: Gascan is meh

[vague token]

i dont even remember what she does

[zenith tundra]

manual god

[vague token]

too distracted by the fdg, azuma, and georgia lol

[elder crane]

2X8% heal at 50%

[vague token]

seattle is cute though with the fangs

[elder crane]

2 MGM shots, but both can be manually aimed

[vague token]

ah

[elder crane]

70% (?iirc) barrage, which is decently powerful

[vague token]

uh is that

1.8 efficiency

on mg?

o.O

[round dome]

she's really good for mob, but can't compete with top boss killers

[lament lichen]

[round dome]

her barrage is 100%.... max consistency

[elder crane]

iirc the actual barrage itself is... okay

[vague token]

ah yes my favorite

just okay

xD

[round dome]

yeah that's the problem... barrage total damage is ... ok level

[vague token]

maybe we're just too used to amagi having aimed shells that hit harder than 457mm gun

[elder crane]

but that 2X8% heal and 30% eva buff at 50% HP seems nice

[vague token]

[elder crane]

more heal than Monarch and at not a super unsafe HP level

great for a mob fleet flagship to have

[round dome]

yeah, kind of a more consistent wash with heal, probably the best pick for mob fleet

[elder crane]

hmm, interesting view of her as a super-Washington

I see it tbh

[vague token]

super wash? isnt georgia the super wash

xD

[round dome]

idk but up there in help channel, people seems dislike wash for some reason...

[vague token]

or you mean in role

[elder crane]

I mean role-wise, as a stable damage-dealer, for mobbing

[vague token]

ah ok

[elder crane]

Wash is imo the current 2nd best BB for mobs overall, after Amagi
Maybe with KGV challenging that spot

[vague token]

the more you skimp the worse kgv is though

so it's a bit different

[elder crane]

Yeah, and I'm kinda falling out of love with her damage timings

[vague token]

but hey she's still 1000x better than pow

so

that's an improvement

[elder crane]

if you miss a barrage, which is "only" 70% proc, it's a super long wait for her next set of damage

even though her 75% preload means she doesn't have the inital downtime pretty much even main fleet ship has

[vague token]

if pow had the gun skill i think she'd be good, because you could do pow/vestal/phoenix/X

and that'd be pretty decent

[coral wren]

yeah dont trust 70% just use zeppy she has 100% proc on barrage

[vague token]

and have close enough stat boosts

xD

without having to rig a weird minimal hms comp

[coral wren]

ikr. litterally the same thing except better barrage

200 IQ

[elder crane]

....he's talking about a hypothetical PoW

Zeppy is imo the best solo-CV

idk about her overall though
for mobbing

[zenith tundra]

my feeling about kgv is that she doesnt shoot down stuff with the mg shoots landing on it she feels really bad

like if she has to target same target twice better not bother

[elder crane]

yeah, her total damage output is lower than the other barragers, which is

both on gun and on barrage, with the 356s

[zenith tundra]

without 356 u should use anythong else tbh

unless u run 3 hms for fp buff

[elder crane]

then pretty much no point in using her tbh

[vague token]

buff pow!

xD

[elder crane]

what does she offer over other ships without that skill?

lol Azuma being run with double +speed

makes sense

[zenith tundra]

is she that slow?

[elder crane]

she has CA speed, so basically yeah

[sharp wing]

27 speed, pretty average for ca

[zenith tundra]

i would put 2 autoloaders on her

[elder crane]

oh, seems like CN predict Namayuu back on top with Azuma relative to current
and FdG over Hiryuu being even better

[sharp wing]

Actually, she is faster, than most CAs, being 26. Which makes little sense, since she's CB

[elder crane]

larger and newer, probably why

[sharp wing]

Larger and faster, ok

[elder crane]

weeeeeeell....
larger can be faster, see Wash vs SoDak

[sharp wing]

Probably side effect of yeeting more oil

[elder crane]

depends more on form, at the speeds most interwar/earlywar cruisers are at

[zenith tundra]

wouldnt fdg have dd speed then?

[sharp wing]

lmao

[elder crane]

see my comment on form

[sharp wing]

wow, FdG actually fastest

30

[elder crane]

...

she's a fantasy ship though so w/e

for both of them

oh man apparently dev20 azuma already is a significant boost to Namayuu

[sharp wing]

Why 20 and not 15 then

[elder crane]

probably the tester had her at 20

[round dome]

according to the "mahou shoujo" guy's test, she lifted pvp tier list by 2... normal tenryuumon are T2 now...

[sharp wing]

Cause 20 only adds secondary eff +10

[elder crane]

not like you can downgrade to dev 15 from 20

[zenith tundra]

not really. the more bps u use the higher her stats are

[sharp wing]

Well, ye, but those milestones

mostly hp increase

[elder crane]

that too, but given dev20 is already significant, dev15 should already be at/past the tipping point

HP increase is pretty big though...

[zenith tundra]

she shoots 2nd for like 8 sec at least straight with her gun

[elder crane]

She's basically a BC RPing as a vanguard

[sharp wing]

And she's basically BC statwise

at least at tankiness

[round dome]

why the hell is she so squishy in WOWS

[sharp wing]

[elder crane]

overmatchable armor everywhere and a huge citadel

gets eaten alive by every BB pretty much

and ofc also zero HE spam resistance

[sharp wing]

I'd yeet her too

[elder crane]

so all the HE spammers also melt her

basically anyone looks at azuma and takes a chunk out of her

[sharp wing]

I will keep her at dock on lock

[zenith tundra]

true answer is that she isnt russian ship

[sharp wing]

[elder crane]

if she were VMF she'd magically have 40-50 mm everywhere and be immune to everyone when angled

cough stalingrad

if she were not-IJN she'd at least have some 27 /30/40/50 mm plating on some parts of the hull

~~but WG devs still salty over tsushima ~~

[sharp wing]

Are the devs russian by any chance

[elder crane]

...yes?

[sharp wing]

Oh gawd

no wonder why bias then

[elder crane]

They have the best access to the old soviet naval archives too

relative to that of other nations

[sharp wing]

Well, obviously

[elder crane]

ofc those documents have the "gulag bias" as well

the "I-better-make-this-look-good-so-no-gulag" bias

[sharp wing]

Ofc those documents belong to non existent nowadays country

[round dome]

guess we would have a PR with full russian ships

[elder crane]

and since a lot were never built, nothing to disprove those values!

[vague token]

ah yes my favorite bias

the please dont gulag me one

xD

[sharp wing]

lol

I wonder when WoWs gonna fix their CVs and give us some PR CV

[elder crane]

30s 180 degree turret traverse, on turrets heavier than Yamato's

[vague token]

mmmm seems legit

[sharp wing]

lmao

[vague token]

good work comrade

[round dome]

space ship turret confirmed

[sharp wing]

space ship turret in vacuum

[elder crane]

gun with velocities that would melt/break the barrel if actually used
and ofc the WG bias with magically less airdrag on shells

[sharp wing]

wait, wasn't Yamato turret biggest caliber ever mounted on warship

[elder crane]

and ofc they're more accurate than everyone else (paper, WoWS dispersion values aren't as stupid.... mostly)

hmm, I wonder if anyone put a stupidly large mortar gun on a ship

[round dome]

beam laser in WOWS when

[sharp wing]

Well, if we not take into account those medieval bombard ships...

[vague token]

playable siren for al And wows when

purifier laser pleaaaase

[elder crane]

nah I don't think those even got up that large
also at that point might as well add in catapult baskets

[sharp wing]

[vague token]

i want to saturate enemy vanguards with lasers

[elder crane]

"I've a 20" basket for my catapult!"

[vague token]

lol

[elder crane]

"largest naval caliber EVER!"

[sharp wing]

Well, i'm pretty sure Yamato gun was largest actual mounted gun on actual warship, not some PR project

[zenith tundra]

how big are nuclear missiles?

[elder crane]

I'm sure those get up to a few metres in diameter

[sharp wing]

that depends...

[elder crane]

and if you kamikaze, a plane is just a large guided shell anyways /s

[sharp wing]

sub ones might be not that big i guess

[vague token]

the weight to damage ratio on missiles is different anyways

[elder crane]

yeah, I don't think nukes you'd put on any warship get that large now that I think about it

[sharp wing]

lol

[round dome]

don't give WG the idea to make CVs even more broken

[vague token]

nukes go in subs anyways

and we dont use bbs anymore anyways

so xD

[elder crane]

Welll....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trident_(missile)
apparently 2 m across, if I'm reading this right

[vague token]

xD

[elder crane]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UGM-133_Trident_II
2.11 m diameter, but that's the rocket ofc

payload is much smaller

[sharp wing]

trident I 1.8

[zenith tundra]

nuclear subs in pvp 1 missile and autowin

[elder crane]

autodraw more like

with the distances in PvP

[vague token]

lol, didnt some ships survive the early test nukes

[elder crane]

although I suppose you live like a few fractions of a second longer

[vague token]

so they wouldnt auto kill

[round dome]

friendly fire: off. problem solved

[elder crane]

ships, but not their would-be crews afaik for the ones not a decent distance away

[vague token]

well yeah but ship girls would just take rad damage over time

totally rad

[zenith tundra]

pretty sure hiryuu would still be alive XD

[sharp wing]

[elder crane]

what would the irl distances be, relative to the in-game ones, anyways?

there has to be some distance compression in AL, right?

[vague token]

dunno, what is bb gun range again? 150 units?

[zenith tundra]

200 iirc

[elder crane]

main to main in PvP is somewhere around 135 or so

[sharp wing]

203 guns fire about ~30 km

[elder crane]

which actually makes sense if max range is 200

in terms of, scaling that to actual BB max range, 135 would be at realistic combat ranges, I think

CVs are wayyy too close ofc though

[merry edge]

how do you guys feel about hyuugakai instead of hiryuu in namaryuu?

[elder crane]

meeeeeeh

[merry edge]

namaga 🤔

[elder crane]

she works, I suppose, not as good imo

[vague token]

okay

just okay

easier to farm up though

good if you are cheap

[sharp wing]

NamaKagaBB beter imo

[elder crane]

the teams still good
idk about it vs BB Kaga even

[merry edge]

what does baga have over hyuuga in that slot?

[sharp wing]

Barrage

[elder crane]

Hyuugakai is the most PvE-viable option for the flex slot, probably

maybe also Enty

[vague token]

bb kaga has a 50 percent chance to make any non hiryuu comp lose xD

[sharp wing]

KagaBB hurts like a truck

[zenith tundra]

i think hiryuu is too good to pass tbh. 100% chances not to fuck up if u pay attention

[merry edge]

[elder crane]

Basically you stack moar barrage and kill stuff

[vague token]

i think she took off 60 to 70 off my sara

[elder crane]

well CVs are pretty squishy overall

[sharp wing]

Yeah, her barrage is heavy

But as RNG as Nyaga almost

[vague token]

sara is beefy compared to hiryuu xD

[sharp wing]

Sara is beefy, compared to Enty

[elder crane]

she's only a little bit better than the 70%ers though, if at all, iirc

[sharp wing]

50%

[zenith tundra]

hiryuu melts any 3 bb ijn comps tho

[elder crane]

okay, a little bit more powerful, 2k barrage shots and 700 more DD spray damage
vs the 2k total of most 70%ers

still pales to sakura big 7 ofc

[round dome]

the only BB that can out perform hiryuu is maxed FdG, which doesn't exist now XD

[sharp wing]

Big 7 is more spread tho

[elder crane]

5.5k wide spread and 2k chevrons

[sharp wing]

Kaga is focused

[vague token]

big seven is better spread because it hits all the squishies

[elder crane]

smacks the vanguard, sets everything on fire

[vague token]

if kaga has to go against a heavy she probably wont do much

because dueling heavies is silly

xD

[elder crane]

well, Monarch doesn't care

[sharp wing]

She actually fdo better, comapred to amagi

[elder crane]

BBAP barrage

[merry edge]

When firing main gun: 30% (50%) chance to launch a frontal barrage (damage is based on skill level).
this frontal barrage is short ranged?

[vague token]

monarch is one of the few ap barrages

[elder crane]

nooope

kinda like Wash's, if I had to compare

[vague token]

ca gun barrage skills on mains have 200 range

targeting though

is not

[elder crane]

Or Hood, if you're a new player

[vague token]

oh wait that is bbkaga

[elder crane]

pretty sure the "frontal" part just means it's unaimed

[merry edge]

high numbers?
are you targetting backrow or frontline with this?

[sharp wing]

yeah

[elder crane]

Main fleet

[sharp wing]

It's pretty much Hood

[elder crane]

with some DD spray added in too

[vague token]

frontal should mean like wash

[sharp wing]

frontal means unaimed

[merry edge]

if the barrage is so strong why is BB kaga not used as a barrager with hood gun for pve (when nagato does that with a lower rate)?
yea ik that isnt pvp but

[elder crane]

too low %

[sharp wing]

Well, nagato barrage just too strong

[elder crane]

for reliability, nobody uses Hood gun on harder maps in PvE for the optimal loadout

Nagato doesn't even if she's mobbing

for boss she does cause boss fleet cares less about consistency

[merry edge]

for reliability, nobody uses Hood gun on harder maps in PvE for baga/nagato right?
hood/amagi still use hood gun always?

[vague token]

hood does because of reload snowball

and her fp sucks

xD

[sharp wing]

Hood has no actual fp, so using damage gun on ehr is prety meh

[elder crane]

Even those are somewhat questionable for PvE mobbing

[zenith tundra]

i dont like twin 381 in w11 on amagi

[elder crane]

Hood is the least questionable one tbf

[sharp wing]

Amagi totally fine w/ 406

[merry edge]

I see I see

[sharp wing]

due to high fp

[zenith tundra]

i used 410 for w11 clears and most likely would ise triple 381 now

[sharp wing]

i run 381 in 11 fine

[elder crane]

410s is the better comprimise
imo 406s take too long to load for ch11, there's a BB/BC that spawns in most nodes that gets smacked by the 410 right as she pops in

[vague token]

triple 381 sounds fun

xD

[elder crane]

you'll be eating the shots from that BB/BC if you run 406/triple381

[merry edge]

is it just me or is triple 381 more or less a direct upgrade on 410, having a mix of shelling and speed?

[zenith tundra]

i used that on bismark and it looked ok

[sharp wing]

Timing depends on comp

If u run phoe or Minne etc

[elder crane]

It's a slightly faster loading 406 with weaker DpS

and ofc being gold rarity gives a bit more FP

not really comparable to 410s, it's still a fair bits away on reload time

[sharp wing]

triple 381 is better for BMs and Barrage boats to boost barrage due to Fp

[merry edge]

so its more like triple 381 is a weaker but faster 406, 410 is a stronger but slower twin 381? for comparisons sake

[elder crane]

well, weaker barrages or fixed-time ones

sorta like that

[sharp wing]

basically, 406 for non barrage, triple 381 for barrage

[elder crane]

there's a BB/BC mob on most nodes of 11 that spawns in at 15s, iirc

[zenith tundra]

dont worry 410 is an outdated gun for everyone in help channel

[elder crane]

381/410s fires right after that one spawns, and can kill before it fires on your main fleet

406/triple381, without skills/HFCR/something, doesn't fire fast enough

it spawns in earlier if you kill the initial wave before 15s
it still spawns in if you don't kill the initial wave by 15s, at 15s
iirc

[sharp wing]

I don't see, how 410 can be outdated for EN

[zenith tundra]

last time i asked in help ot was 381 or 406

[elder crane]

it's only outdated once PR2 twingold406s come

[sharp wing]

Since It barely got outdated on CN due to PR S2 HE twin gun

[elder crane]

which is just direct powercreep

[sharp wing]

that 406

welp

381 by no means replace 410

[elder crane]

With Hood, I ran the 410s in 11, since her barrage if it procs instagibs that BB mob I mentioned, and the 410s themselves even on Hood could sometimes if lucky kill it

[sharp wing]

I run hood at 11-4 w/ twin 381 fine

she doesn't lose hp much

[elder crane]

Hood/Phoenix/Cleve was what I was running iirc, at the time

[sharp wing]

so i guess timings are fine

[elder crane]

and Hood did dip low sometimes

yeah, 381 has the right timing too

[sharp wing]

i run solo vg

[elder crane]

since it fires right after 15s

[sharp wing]

I auto so i never look on map after start tho

[elder crane]

I noticed once I started using Dork

since I had 406s on her at first, and she kept taking so much more damage

which was I was about at first, since the endcard damage and time seemed to suggest she should be doing fine (same-ish as Hood/Amagi)

then I watched a run and saw her eating a BB salvo at the start of every node

"oh, that makes sense"

[sharp wing]

amagi without autoloader actually has over 16.3 sec reload

w/ 381

[elder crane]

well if 410s were fine 381 is for sure fine, on that timing
since it doesn't go below 15s either

and with travel time probably down to 14s is fine too

[sharp wing]

probably that mob not shooting at main right away

[elder crane]

yeah, it first shoots at your vanguard

[sharp wing]

so it probably shoots like after 2-3 secs

[elder crane]

salvo on VG, salvo on main, there's a good 5-6 s window to kill it

[sharp wing]

tho even w/ tirp and 406 wan't noticeable for me

[elder crane]

before it fires on the main

[sharp wing]

and she has over 21 sec reload

[elder crane]

which node types did you choose to fight for it?

3* BB are avoids ofc, I assume

[sharp wing]

1st no

i eat 1st 3* bb

toolboxes regen is more, than fine to cover up

[elder crane]

well 1 at start is fine as usual ofc, I mean in general

[sharp wing]

well, can do 2 if spawn

basically i don't pick much

[elder crane]

huh, what're you running?

For vanguard

[sharp wing]

minne or phoe

what else

[elder crane]

and that allows 1:1 auto?
I was having trouble with 1:1 set up that way

[sharp wing]

I only lately used 3:1 due to mona farm

w/ hood flag

still lvling her

same as wkai (future)

started at 100 and 101

[elder crane]

that's weird, none of the 1:1s I set up could consistently do 11-4

[sharp wing]

even tirp?

[vague token]

i cant get any 1:1 to do 11-4

i usually gotta help with vestal

at minimum

[elder crane]

I usually need 1:2 with a 2nd VG

[sharp wing]

i actually havn't used AR outside full clear for 3*

[vague token]

i guess i havent tried 1:2

ill do that when im not farming 120 xp

xD

rip oil

[elder crane]

cause you need to handle 7 mobs with it if ambushed

[sharp wing]

I'm actually not going to use 1:1 anytime soon due to PR

[vague token]

3:3 11-4 farming oh boi

78 oil per run

my favorite

(fight)

[sharp wing]

why 3:3 tho

[vague token]

120 xp

xD

[sharp wing]

1:3 or 3:1 ?

ah

nvm

[vague token]

i mean, id have to reswap them every time

[elder crane]

for if your oil reserves outlast your time avalibility

[vague token]

one perk is that i can actually fight level 3 mains

for xp

namagi aint having any of that

[elder crane]

MVP means 1:3 though already gives as much main XP as vanguard, assuming the flag gets MVP

ah, the sweet taste of that 3X for flag+MVP

[vague token]

xD

amagi and nagato trade mvp depending on if big seven procs a lot

rip

[sharp wing]

Nagato procs 1/5 tho...

[elder crane]

just gimp the gun on one of them, that fleet can afford it

2/5, it's 40%

[sharp wing]

In actuality it's not xD

[vague token]

i mean, then id have to rotate flag all the time

xD

id rather be lazy

[elder crane]

idk, when I run her farming she has like 60% proc rate

[sharp wing]

even Amagi and Hood don't proc for me, lol

I'm just tired of Nagato sitting there w/ 0 barrages each boss fight

[elder crane]

you can just keep one flag until nearing halfway then swap

though I suppose having to reequip when you want to do PvP is annoying af

[vague token]

that sounds like a lot of effort

[elder crane]

yeah, nvm, I'm convinced

terrible idea for lazier people like us

[sharp wing]

Oof

I won't even reach 20k anytime soon, talk about lazy

Tho i play since September

[elder crane]

gotta be lazy to be most efficient

how else do you get so many battles in without completely nolifing?

[vague token]

xD