hard to really interpret otherwise 
#game-feedback
covert raft
neon kite
well now you know what I meant 
covert raft
remote parrot
Also a ships type is actually determined by their gun caliber. As a FYI, not their hull type. It's why a CL is a Light Cruiser and a CA is a Heavy Cruiser. It's based on gun caliber.
@minor robin Since i think you were the one saying otherwise.
covert raft
anyways i sort of see your perspective
neon kite
Pretty sure CL/CA etc are based on their hull type but I digress
covert raft
as a new player starting off you decided to invest much of your hard earned time into a ship that turns out to be useless
and now you're upset
remote parrot
And I can't really use. Yes.
covert raft
makes sense, anyone would be a little frustrated
remote parrot
Use in modes that the game is built around.
covert raft
yeah i understand
it sucks
it's just from a more veteran player's perspective, making a massive change (assuming u want the toggle thing to apply to all refits) is a massively impacting solution to (what we perceive as) a small problem
remote parrot
End of the day here's my feedback as clear as I can make it.
Allow certain ships (BB to BBV's) to be toggled by the player back and forth. A cool down time is of course a option to prevent frequent changing. Or allow BBVs to be in a BB only slot. This may mean a buff would be unnecessary and the player will have to think more about if they want a weaker BBV to be in a slot that could mean a battle could be lost or won.
That's my feedback as best I can make it.
covert raft
hopefully you can replenish your BB blueprints and move on with better ships i guess
remote parrot
@covert raft I do want to ask, how does allowing a toggle option hurt you. As the player? If anything you'd benefit from it. You get to keep the skin, you don't have to RNG to get another of the same ship. You don't have to spend more RL money to expand your dock. You can choice if you'd rather that ship be a BB or BBV (in this example). You as the player would benefit. Veteran or not.
This isn't a PVP game. And even if it were you'd still be fine. As the stats don't changed between a player using a BB with everything but the Modernization. Or two players both using a BBV variant.
Major stats I mean. Based on a Retrofit at the same level between two players.
You'd benefit from this choice, not the opposite.
naive cobalt
My problem with toggle is that player would have no reason to use them as BBVs
minor robin
I'd argue it to be more of a case of game balance than being beneficial. Especially when ships like Tirpitz exist who will not activate her skill with BB/C. I could just swap to BBV to team with her. And if i want to pair with Mikasa? Oh I'll just change them back.
naive cobalt
It's not a solution
remote parrot
@naive cobalt I'd have to disagree. Can you say that with 100% certainty?
(Part of making a point is catering to other side. lol)
minor robin
Literally the only reason they would is to pair with Tirpitz.
remote parrot
@minor robin Game Balance is important in both PvE and PvP games but I feel like you may be looking at this game in a PvP sense when it's not.
I could be wrong.
velvet adder
What am I missing?
remote parrot
How does changing it from a BB to BBV or back negatively impact the game balance?
@velvet adder A lot I think. xD
velvet adder
So it seems
minor robin
@velvet adder TL;DR, someone saying we should put a toggle button to convert BB to BBV for yama fuso and vice versa
remote parrot
Sorry for helping blow up this channel.
velvet adder
That's not how Kai works, though
remote parrot
Or allow BBVs to be used in a BB slot in hard mode maps
covert raft
@remote parrot for two reasons:
- resources - expending resources on a fairly small benefit (even assuming it is a good idea) is not a good use of time. I'd like to see efficient things being done in AL and there are more important things for devs to work on such as implementing new ships, fixing the PVP ladder and taking care of other ideas
- competitiveness - there is a competitive aspect of AL and yamashiro/fusou refitting is how i see it a trap - it increases the difficulty of the game which i personally like as a competitive player; having extremely easy no-risk gameplay is not fun for me personally
neon kite
What risk are you talking about @covert raft
minor robin
And by the way I'm thinking in a PVE perspective. I can't be bothered about pvp.
velvet adder
It isn't a big deal neither from the player perspective (just get another pair, w/e) nor from the balance perspective (it can't be either a BB or a BBV at the same time, so uh, whatever)
remote parrot
@minor robin Fair enough
velvet adder
I'm rather indifferent to the proposal, nor do I expect it to go anywhere, but I don't see why not
Would be much more preferable to be able to use a Kai skin on a non-Kai unit if you have Kai'd that same unit before, as you would with a 'real' costume
minor robin
Or actually buffing them
remote parrot
I just made the mistake (due to a few different things, not all entirely my fault) in Retrofitting my one Fusou and now it's stuck as a BBV. That's where this all spawned from. Because I still want to use it as a BB, but had wanted the skin.
covert raft
risk as in not reading into game mechanics
remote parrot
My last message was for you @velvet adder
clear heron
IIRC, the retrofit for hull changes warning are really off rn, still in the process of discerning how to change them
velvet adder
what
remote parrot
@velvet adder That's why I am posting feedback. -_-
velvet adder
Feel free to propose something that would make them less shit
remote parrot
I wanted the skin (which is part of the core mechanic of Retrofitting) but the game wasn't entirely clear that I'd no longer be able to use it in a BB slot. And (as @bronze estuary has pointed out) I thought it was just adding a spotter plane. Which is what almost all BBs had.
@velvet adder What?
velvet adder
What, what?
remote parrot
You missed my point if that's how you interpreted it.
bronze estuary
clear heron
It's this jumble of things. I'll probably add a tip that this will be a permanent change, at least.
velvet adder
The BB slot says it requires BBs
neon kite
@covert raft it isn't a risk. Nor does it increase game difficulty, and even if it does, it's just a really bad way to do it. Imagine if all retrofitted ships became worse than their non-upgraded version, everyone would freak out. Luckily this problem is only on two ships but that doesn't mean the problem is okay
velvet adder
It doesn't imply you're able to use BMs or BBVs, it says BBs and that's all it accepts
naive cobalt
same way you can't use monitors or BCs
velvet adder
If that's your issue, I'm sorry but you have only yourself to blame
remote parrot
BCs aren't obtained by Retro fitting.
covert raft
you're strawmanning my argument - i'm not saying let's make all refits shit and increase the difficulty of the game i'm saying each game has unique difficulties and traps that as a player who takes time to research gets rewarded by not falling into these traps
remote parrot
Ya...
sighs I give up.
People are missing the point.
velvet adder
What do have BC to do with this?
patent narwhal
endless argument, it's not a feedback anymore.
remote parrot
points to what Restart said
velvet adder
You kind of had a point, but not the one you're actually making
remote parrot
@patent narwhal Ya.
clear heron
I do feel that they should distinguish monitors, battlecruiser, light carriers and such better early on.
remote parrot
My feedback has been stated. So just going to stop and move on with my day.
naive cobalt
velvet adder
Isn't a class tag enough?
covert raft
just take my advice and let BMs and BCs and BBVs participate in hard mode fights
otherwise they will literally never get to fight in hard mode maps
velvet adder
I mean, the game flat out tells you what your unit is
covert raft
(virtually)
velvet adder
It's not hiding that Erebus is a BM or Vestal is an AR
clear heron
Beginners usually just pay attention to the icon, and sometimes not even, so they think al the battleship icons mean they count and battleships
covert raft
i think from a balance perspective it's not fair to have such an overwhelming majority of hard mode requirements for backlines to be BB and literally none to be BM/BC/BBV
naive cobalt
ok, unless someone has actual new feedback - stop 
velvet adder
Some more icons to distinguish them would be nice, but again, that's not entirely the game's fault
covert raft
while at the same time it's not fair to create a BBV/BM only slot as those ships are fairly rare
so why not just let BB/BM/BBV work for all current in-game BB hard mode slots
velvet adder
@naive cobalt Note this down, then - a few more icons to better distinguish BC from BB, CV from CVL, and BM from dustbins with guns
remote parrot
"Some more icons to distinguish them would be nice, but again, that's not entirely the game's fault"
Implying the game can make choices on it's own. xD
covert raft
Reducing the chest size of Taihou when?
sly canyon
blasphemy
simple river
On hard mode you can hold and access unit equipment, having that option on normal fleet comp would be nice too.
naive cobalt
minor robin
if you hold down on a ship in hard mode menu, you can open up the ship info
same cannot be done for normal mode
naive cobalt
Because normal uses your fleets
minor robin
like the before entering the map menu
naive cobalt
I'll add it tho
simple river
yeah I know it uses the fleet, but it'd be nice if you had the option to do some minor adjustment on the move.
hazy delta
Chooks22Today at 17:09
well if this is going to be suggested, might as well make it 4 purp bulins if you're going to give medals + 1 purp bulin when retiring a gold one.
retiring 3 purp bulins = 12 medals; retiring 1 gold bulin + 1 purp bulin = 14 medals
RestartToday at 17:11
you supposed to lose something in the process, it can't be 1 to 1 exchange
this is literally what I said
@fervent musk
naive cobalt
@remote parrot @neon kite @wooden kelp @covert raft Just in case you want to add or suggest anything - I compiled what you were talking about BBVs and their buffs here https://pastebin.com/zMZ7BRD4
remote parrot
Wow. Thank you. I appreciate you going the extra mile and doing that.
๐ Props to you
naive cobalt
(now I just need to backread like 24hrs of this chat in case I missed (I did) suggestions 
)
velvet adder
I disagree with most of point 3's solutions and I see this being rejected entirely
naive cobalt
@tardy arch About your hitbox on a furniture - I'd say you better to report it with the form. (Not saying you're the only one, but it's better to report this one as issue, than as feedback)
velvet adder
Tobi's suggestion is especially ludicrous, as it would turn these BBV into proper BB, with all the advantages that entails and none of the drawbacks
tardy arch
ok. i didn't consider it a bug which iis why i posted it here since it still works, it was just a bit weird. i'll report it.
velvet adder
Three salvo, a defence barrage AND a free screenclear? Why not also have it buff everyone's damage or become invincible ร lร Enterprise while they're at it?
That's not the point of BBV, folks. More than any other class in the game they are meant to be sidegrades rather than upgrades - it reflects their historical capabilities and the compromises that had to be made to account for them, letting them keep all their BB goodies without paying the price misses the point of the class itself.
naive cobalt
I agree with that, but aren't they too weak, especially compared to Hyuukai?
velvet adder
You also seem to forget that BBV do lose a salvo, yes, but Main Gun Efficiency skyrockets to the point where it's not even a loss anymore. Ask Ise and Hyuuga how are they going with their 180%, or even just the cats' 165% (iirc)
They are, yes
But I also suspect that's intended.
naive cobalt
And I pointed this out iirc
velvet adder
The cats didn't go as planned for the devs, of this I am quite certain
They wanted to get it right with Hyukai and Isekai, and they did - but they also wanted to make it clear we wouldn't be able to pull the pre-Kai trick again, and they managed that too
naive cobalt
Why not make it so people wouldn't want to pull pre-Kai trick in the first place?
velvet adder
I do believe the devs are fully aware of the cats' pre-Kai situation and decided to cut their losses, while leaving Ise and Hyuuga as the real BBVs
naive cobalt
What started this is that people want to use them, but they lose too much in the process.
velvet adder
They gain a lot by not being BBVs, though
That is very valuable, and something Hyuuga and Ise can't do
naive cobalt
Anyway, the point here is to take feedback and suggestions and I don't see any harm in compiling this list. Devs are free to disregard it if they feel like everything is as planned
~~as they would like 90% of the feedback sheet tbf ~~
velvet adder
It is rather counterintuitive, but I'm certain it's also intentional.
If you really want to have their BBV form not to be a flat downgrade, though... you'll have to look into something better, like a proper skill instead of something ludicrous like what I'd seen.
naive cobalt
That's also a possibility
velvet adder
The only realistic one
More MG Eff wouldn't go amiss either, since they are quite a bit inferior to their counterparts in that regard
outer surge
Please allow us to set 4x the time speed for Exercises...
I swear I fell asleep countless times waiting for each Exercises to finish..
Pretty sure its possible since its auto anyways..
Maybe 4x is too much, but at least give 2x speed
velvet adder
See if the cats' historical records offer anything of note. That's usually what originates skillsets.
naive cobalt
@outer surge It was suggested, pretty sure.
outer surge
@naive cobalt
Thanks
remote parrot
I want to say this is use of a slippery slope and may be being over exaggerated.
I did briefly read what Tobi said and I don't think the extreme you went was accurate. I could be off though, as that was this morning at this point.
naive cobalt
tbf Tobi's suggestion is basically "lose almost nothing, while gaining all the benefits"
remote parrot
If that's true (not sure how far back it was at this point) then ya that's a bit overkill. It's why I didn't suggest that (even though I also didn't think of it xD) and I disagree with that idea.
Still think how Waifu turned around and explained it was extreme and could have been left out.
So here's my thoughts:
5. I don't know how many BBVs they are going to add and how many were in WW2 (regardless of them seeing active service or simply sitting in a dock) but if they are going to be a very few BB - BBV ships then this point is fair.
6. I think this could be omitted as it doesn't really add anything to the report. Sounds more like your opinion. I'd suggest leaving that conclusion to the devs.
7. I don't understand why this is a bad thing (if the use of the minus sign means bad and the plus means good). If players choose to go back to BB and never use the BBV variant what's bad about that? I mean that is their choice but it doesn't harm the game as a whole.
8. The latter part of this sort of goes into what was being said about #7. If the player want to spend those resources, that's their will. They knowingly are using them and that's not a bad thing. Giving them the option to go back doesn't mean those resources are given back to them but they can still switch to the BBV mode. That would be a problem for sure.
Here's what I'd suggest you use as a negative.
5. Would need some sort of system to change Retrofitted Ship stats back to Pre-Modernization Ship. However should be easy as those stats are pre-determined and can be referenced easily.
I doubt they are paying you so I can imagine you aren't really putting as much thought into this as I am. Which is fine but that's probably why it reads as more of a opinionated feedback report then one that's clear.
Also it's doubtful that the ability to enhance a ship as they level up with other ships would make this system harder. As you'd just need to remove those added stat number from the ship when toggling the Modernization option.
It's like adding or removing stat numbers on a DnD character if you will.
Is the best example I can think of.
tardy arch
lol
they really shouldn't though. the whole point of retrofitting any ship should be to make it better. i do agree that you should lose something when retrofitting from BB to BBV but that lose shouldn't make the ship even worse then it's normal variant.
naive cobalt
I can see WiS's point though, at least I think I can.
tardy arch
retrofitting a ship should always be a positive otherwise why is it even there?
naive cobalt
About They gain a lot by not being BBVs, though That is very valuable, and something Hyuuga and Ise can't do
But I'm not knowledgeable enough about the game, so I'm not going to give my own opinion, I'm just recording what others think
tardy arch
also having a toggle system to switch between the normal version and the variant might cause some problems. for instance skills that are tied to the retrofitted versions. would they be relocked? or would that stay unlocked? and would their level reset if they're relocked?
neon kite
What I suggested was how they could be buffed. Even without significant tradeoffs, it won't make them overpowered because the seaplanes themselves are weak af in the first place. What you do is retain their initial strength but focus on making the seaplanes the buff instead
The reason why people use Hyuuga as BBV is because she does exactly that. She remains a strong BB ship, also got a skill to balance out the loss of her secondary gun
naive cobalt
they get shitton of buffs from retrofit tree
neon kite
I'm not saying that they shouldn't lose anything at all, but it is not as big of a buff as you might think
So does yama / fusou
tardy arch
don't you lose the aux gun when you go from BB to BBV? if that's the case then ya i'd say buff the planes and don't nerf the BB damage. you still lose a gun slot.
naive cobalt
And that is WiS's point - BBVs are supposed to be side grades, not up
neon kite
There are many ways to buff this, you don't have to do everything. But the important thing is to make the retrofit an actual upgrade. Easiest way to do it imo is just look at what they lose and how to migitate that up to a point where players no longer feels that it is a downgrade. This is completely adjustable
naive cobalt
And if you don't fully upgrade them - it's strict upgrade
That is very valuable, and something Hyuuga and Ise can't do```
remote parrot
Their retrofit is not tired to their level (other then meeting a level requirement). You can go a whole ship without retrofitting it. Toggling a Modernization would not have any tie into to level.
tardy arch
if it's supposed to be a sidegrade then why are they worse? if it's a sidegrade they should be the same just with a new toy added.
neon kite
@naive cobalt I think we've gone through that. The point is that people want to do a full upgrade but are deterred by actual game mechanics
tardy arch
cause rn yama/fuso's retrofits are downgrades. which isn't good at all.
remote parrot
Let me tell you what Modernization does when for the aforementioned ships. Changes two Gear Slots. Adds some numbers for different stats.
That's it.
@tardy arch This is for you btw. What I am saying.
naive cobalt
That's why I'm compiling the list. I'm not removing anything from it and I would add all your suggestions.
Doesn't mean I can't say my opinion in this chat
remote parrot
The most the player would need to do would be readd the gear for the toggle. That already happens when you Acquire the Modernization. You have to equip (if you want) a plane and a the other slot that is changed.
Modernization does not affect ship level.
If a Modernization add a skill (like the Laffey for example) then have the game remove said skill but keep it's level for said skill. The game already keeps track of many other things. Ships levels and skill levels.
Removing a skill but remembering it's level isn't a concern.
Here's the thing. Retrofit should make a ship better, and it doesn't. The main point of the game is to collect things (hence the make "Gotcha"). Collecting skins is part of this game. However some skins can only be gained by unlocking a ships Modernization. So if a player wants a skin but does not want a ship to change ships types then they are essentially screwed. And I am going be a bit blunt here. Telling a player to "level up a another ship of the same type" in a game where dock space is tied to gems which cost money and ship drop is tied to RNG is not a viable reason.
If Dock space didn't cost real money then fine. If the game wasn't run by RNG okay. But both are in place and I know why. However I also can see that puts a strangle hold on the player.
A toggle would remove that strangle hold.
tardy arch
i don't really think there needs to be a varient toggle button. if the idea of retrofits is to make them better yet you also have a toggle button for it that means you've failed in making the retrofit better if the player would rather use the original version of the ship.
remote parrot
Also there are more then enough ships in this game (CN, JP and EN) that the player will have to upgrade their dock no matter what. The devs will still make money even with the toggle.
tardy arch
ya i agree having to raise 2 of the same ship just for the retrofit skin cause the actual retrofit sucks is absolute horse shit.
remote parrot
@tardy arch Part of the concern that I brought up was that BBV class ships can no longer be used in hard mode to fill the needed BB slot. There also are no known required slots for a BBV. This makes the BBV classification pretty pointless. Some CLs are turned into a CA, but both of those can fill a Hard Mode Slot.
tardy arch
is that for CN and JP as well or only EN?
remote parrot
Can you elaborate?
tardy arch
the BBV not being allowed in a BB slot.
neon kite
that applies to all
tardy arch
lol. that's just inconsistent.
remote parrot
Also players want the Retrofit skin, it's a core principle of this type of video game. If they (as it stands) want to keep the ship they've invested in and put time into, into a BB only slot they no longer can. Making the entire process of having a BB and bulking it up pointless.
@tardy arch What is?
naive cobalt
The main point of the game is to collect things (hence the make "Gotcha") nah, it has nothing to do with this word. "Gacha" comes from the sound of cranking vending machine
remote parrot
Not completely no.
tardy arch
that BBV can't go into a BB slot but a CL turning into a CA can still go into a CL slot.
remote parrot
It's part of the concept of a "collecting" game.
Ever wonder why pokemon has the slogan "Gotta Catch Em' All"?
Think of Shiny Pokemon as the concept of a skin.
It's the same idea really.
@tardy arch No a CA cannot go into a CL slot. Unless that's something i was not aware of.
CL is a Light Cruiser. CA is a Heavy Cruiser. Both have Hard Mode Slots that can be filled.
tardy arch
Some CLs are turned into a CA, but both of those can fill a Hard Mode Slot.
remote parrot
Yes.
tardy arch
yet BBV can't go into BB slots. that's inconsistent.
remote parrot
As in both can fill a slot based on that ships Classification.
That's not...no.
Hang on. Explaining it more
And I mean in sense it does make sense. A BBV isn't a BB anymore. It's a mixture of both a Carrier and a Battleship. So no, it cannot fill a BB slot anymore because it's now part Carrier.
tardy arch
oh oh i see what you mean. nvm.
remote parrot
That's what the "V" comes from
Hence why a CV is a Carrier. The V is also part of that name.
CVL means, well can you guess?
A Light Carrier. Same idea as a CL.
tardy arch
i read it as a CL into a CA can still go into a CL slot. nvm.
remote parrot
CL and CA are determined by gun caliber.
Not their hull type.
Same goes for all ships.
It's within a range of caliber size.
tardy arch
anyways.
in pokemon you're not given a different random pokemon if you catch one. the only rng in that process is which one you encounter and even then they have set location in which they appear.
naive cobalt
Don't wanna sound rude, but discussions in order to make a suggestions if fine, but that's kinda strayed off at this point.
patent narwhal
Okay, i don't see the points for explaining this much of a topic. Like it should be in general now. Not in this channel. And comparing doesnt solve problems as well.
remote parrot
Sorry.
I got a bit too nerdy. xD
@naive cobalt Don't think I can alter the document you linked.
naive cobalt
You can't
remote parrot
Are you able to instate the suggestions made? If you can.
naive cobalt
I haven't really seen suggestions tho 
tardy arch
lol if anyone could make edits to the suggestion list it'd either be complete nonsense or just all deleted by a troll.
suggestion:
make yama/fuso and all future BBV retrofits worth retrofitting. either as a sidegrade or an upgrade but not a downgrade.
there.
tardy arch
patent narwhal
Yes that's the points of the discussion.
tardy arch
i left out specifics cause it's ultimately up to the devs to make the changes. they just need to make sure people would want to retrofit the ship.
remote parrot
@naive cobalt What I was referring to.
naive cobalt
Point was to collect ideas on "how to", not just "buff the ship"
remote parrot
naive cobalt
I'm not changing the list, because it's not "Daragoth's ideas", but compilation of what others think as well, with my opinions which I got out of your discussions.
tardy arch
ok. either buff the BBV planes and don't decrease their initial BB damage or increase their BB damage and leave the planes alone. or buff both planes and damage.
patent narwhal
Well the point of what i think he meant is he wants a toggle that can switch BBV to BB without the stats of the ships modernization being turn off like it still there but i just want to change it. Cause he mentioned the hard mode slot like 2 times maybe
But that would be against the mechanism of the game
naive cobalt
hard mode was different suggestion
patent narwhal
As... what retrofit its for
neon kite
Buff suggestions for their current damage loss:
- Keep 2 main gun salvos. Buff main gun efficiency by +40-50% instead of +20% (to keep in line with the loss of 1 gun salvo).
- Keep 2 main gun salvos. +0-20% main gun efficiency. But much higher aviation stats to make the seaplanes actually worth it, I don't know the actual numbers so it's up to the devs to crunch it.
- Retain 3 salvos. No buff to main gun efficiency as added seaplanes is already a small buff to damage.
As for the loss of secondary gun:
- Easily fixed by giving fusou/yama similiar barrage skill like Hyuuga kai has. Doesn't matter if it's a weaker or stronger, as long as they still have some sort of way to handle incoming suicide ships. This option could be applied to all 3 of the above solutions or not, based on how much they want to go with the damage buff.
naive cobalt
Buff main gun efficiency by +40-50% 
tardy arch
as i said about the whole toggle idea.
i don't really think there needs to be a varient toggle button. if the idea of retrofits is to make them better yet you also have a toggle button for it that means you've failed in making the retrofit better if the player would rather use the original version of the ship.
i think it's a bad idea and it would have the devs admit they made a worse ship that the player could choose to not use. as for the BB hard mode slot just use another BB
patent narwhal
Pretty high
neon kite
It's not high at all. That's just keeping their original damage
If u lose 1 main gun salvo, that's losing 1/3 of ur total dmg. By buffing their main gun efficiency by 40-50%, you just close the gap back so you don't lose out in damage
As of now, the seaplanes damage is laughable
naive cobalt
when you pack barrage AND screen clear into a single ship, they have to lose their damage.
tardy arch
maybe 30% buff instead of negating the lose entirely? that way it's still compensated but not completely negated.
naive cobalt
40-50% is absurd
neon kite
So tell me why people are not using them as BBV
it is because the 20% main gun efficiency is not enough
the loss of a main gun salvo for the measly damage from the so called "screen clear" is not enough
tardy arch
cause their damage sucks and the planes are shit.
neon kite
exactly
remote parrot
@patent narwhal Toggle would change stats. I did say that.
tardy arch
so 30% increase and a buff to the planes.
neon kite
That would also work. As long as the numbers add up enough so that it becomes a slight buff to their overall damage instead of an actual loss which is the current case
naive cobalt
Yea, so exactly what Light already suggested
tardy arch
kek
neon kite
You have to remember that BBV launches very few planes in comparison to an actual CV. They don't get the extra planes from limit breaking. The aviation stats are so low it's not worth mentioning. And to make the matter even worse, seaplanes themselves are extremely bad version of dive bombers.
naive cobalt
as I already asked to - keep it to actual suggestions, we already flooded this channel enough
tardy arch
plus you're kinda just repeating yourself at this point.
neon kite
Which I did, but you guys have been saying it's absurd because the seaplanes are a "screen clear". I'm showing you why it's not
tardy arch
who said the seaplanes were a "screen clear"?
naive cobalt
I don't think you understand what it means
Airstrike clears screen from enemy's bullets and tops
tardy arch
then "bullet clear" would have been a better word choice. 
neon kite
^
tardy arch
cause "screen clear" implies all enemies are dead.
neon kite
Also I don't see how a barrage with the added effect of a bullet clear warrants the damage loss. It's not so stop pretending it is
tardy arch
well i mean the ability to bullet clear without needing a CV/CVL is an upgrade. it doesn't negate the damage loss but it is an upgrade nonetheless.
still though point stands. planes need to be buffed cause that damage was pitiable.
turbid gazelleBOT
๐ Before reporting feedback, please check #known-bugs and this google doc https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/162vbURn4lnqdK2sb0fhU1qutRawwYhePpApcCY0vFjk/edit#gid=784604138 to see if your feedback is already listed. If you want to report a bug or translation error that is not already listed there, please check pinned messages in #bug-reports . Thank you for your cooperation Commander!
minor robin
Or why not just give Yamashiro and Fusou specifically better recon planes than the other 2
Could be like Akashi's paw where only they can use it
Since Hyuuga Kai has the 10 second barrage, Isekai has aviation buff with CV/Ls and a few comet planes, why not give the others the very thing they lack? Good planes
naive cobalt
just so we clear - I hope everyone realize that all of this more than likely just gonna be ignored
tardy arch
even if it is it should give them a good idea on what the players would like.
minor robin
I'm aware
I mean Yamashiro Kai has been around since September last year, Fusou since May this year, and if nothing has been done it says a lot
Especially when the other 2 kais came out after them anyways
ornate basin
give previous summer skins a summer background?
ornate basin
ya
velvet adder
Hey. I have request. if USS Seawolf ever gets into the game, i hope she will be a cute wolf girl
ornate basin
probably would be
would fire the person who drew them without being a wolf
foxhound isnโt exactly a fox though
turbid gazelleBOT
dont say mean things about my imouto
timid trench
suggestion: a silhouette of your ship if they're behind a large decor
my prince of wales was hiding next to the large house. and i had to randomly click on the building til the game could register that she is there so i could pick her up
tardy arch
lol nice hide and seek there.
timid trench
yea 
velvet adder
humble hare
Why not make BBV's count as BB's for events? I honestly doubt it would be THAT broken. Because after you refit let's say Yamashiro, she wont be useable as a BB anymore, only making her more limited than she already is. I'm not saying a whole BBV pick, but it'd be nice to be able to use them as a BB pick.
velvet adder
Much better suggestion than whatever folks came up with before
(to be fair, points 1 and 2 were okay, but the proposed rebalancing was pure madness and/or ignorance)
If you want a real suggestion on how to fix them, raise the MGM Eff by +15% to have them be in line with IseHyu and heavily improve the Zuiun barrage (eg. higher base damage and more than just one use), or give them a third skill (perhaps a fleet acc buff on account of their super-high pagoda towers, or a sibling buff)
neon kite
You are suggesting exactly what I suggested except ur suggesting a 35% MGM increase instead of the proposed 40-50%. Madness much wow
velvet adder
No, you asked for 3 salvo, secondary guns and full MGM buffs
neon kite
Reread point 1. It's 2 salvos
tardy arch
i suggested a 30% increase instead of the 40-50%. thought i'd try to make a compromise.
velvet adder
I read point 3 yesterday, that's where that piece of fancy came from
neon kite
That was where I just listed the problems and how you could buff them, not all at once. And even then I didn't ask for the MGM buffs, only for 3 salvos and a solution to the 2nd gun
velvet adder
Doc must've changed, don't see that part anymore. All the better, at any rate.
minor robin
No? What makes your say that?
velvet adder
No, if anything they buffed it some time ago
The bomber she summoned before did basically 0 damage, and was one-time only
neon kite
Sure, they must've changed it because you refuse to acknowledge u made a mistake.
neon kite
Once you get down your high horse and your "real suggestions" sure
velvet adder
Just pointing out what was proposed earlier had a snowball's chance in hell to pass and woefully disregarded how BBVs work and are intended to work.
daring breach
can u tell me how does saratogas effect work? how much damage increased by skilling her and by bringing heavy cruisers
velvet adder
As I said yesterday, BBV are meant to be sidegrades, not upgrades.
There's gotta be give and take, they shouldn't be battlestars with access to fuckhuge guns and a screenclear (that's the term we've used since forever) and self-defence mechanisms.
@daring breach CA don't matter
daring breach
mistranslation again?
minor robin
That's a question for #gameplay-help anyways
velvet adder
The gunfire damage depends on Airpower
daring breach
hm so ur saying that the retrofit isnt meant to be an upgrade, after investing tons of resources?
velvet adder
Not for Fusou, Yamashiro, Ise and Hyuuga, no
minor robin
I mean, all the BBVs are side grades
velvet adder
BBV are neither battleships nor carriers
daring breach
for yamashiro is intended, by design, to be a sidegrade?
velvet adder
They are something different
No, it is my belief they missed the mark A LOT
They had expected the cats to be much better than they actually were, and certainly didn't take into account we'd grab all the upgrades EXCEPT the BB->BBV conversion
neon kite
Just because something is historically accurate doesn't mean it is good game design. I don't know whats so hard to understand about it. ESPECIALLY when the whole community agrees on that a fully retro yama/fusou is worse than non-modernized one
velvet adder
Hence why they forced the conversion down your throat almost immediately in the other two's case.
minor robin
Regardless, the way to go around fixing them wouldn't be by fixing the downgrades that come as a part of being a BBV but by fixing the unique points of said BBV, the so called benefits
daring breach
sorry dont mean to criticize any of you i just saw some contradictory things and wanted to get it sorted out
i just walked into this discussion
velvet adder
Asking is free, no worries.
As Ender says, you gotta fix the pros and roll with the cons - doing otherwise goes against the game design.
neon kite
They could buff the seaplanes, either by releasing actually good planes for players to use (which might get some balance issue since Hyuuga / Ise can also use them) or buff Yama/fusous aviation stats or give them some skill related to their new airstrike
minor robin
And even then, as Restart said, all our feedback is likely to be ignored. Especially when you consider Yamashiro Kai is over a year old in other servers and was never fixed anyways, unlike stuff like Yorktown and Hornet.
Oh and I already mentioned the seaplanes part
daring breach
the BBV upgrade should, in general, be "better" than the non-retro version, agree?
to justify the use of resources
@velvet adder
velvet adder
Chances are things will stay as they are - cats always meant to be pre-Kai BB, dynamic duo being the real BBVs
minor robin
Like straight up way better exclusive seaplanes for them, that Ise Hyuuga can't use
velvet adder
@daring breach
daring breach
uh i dont get that face lol
velvet adder
You want screenclears on something that isn't a carrier?
You gotta pay the price for it
minor robin
Like what he said earlier, they missed the mark
minor robin
They didn't intend to make them that bad, but well, some poor design decisions resulted in that
daring breach
im agreeing with the tradeoff thing
neon kite
@velvet adder "always meant to be pre-Kai BB" ? That's only because they messed up with balancing and for some reason haven't fixed it. Might as well not give them a retrofit if that's the case
daring breach
the BB designation sticks
minor robin
He's trying to say let it be lol
daring breach
but universally, the retrofit should better than the BB right? just to justify the resource increase
velvet adder
I already spoke my piece - BBV are unique in that they are an entirely different class rather than a simple upgrade, and given their history I'd say it's fine they are like this
Literally every other Kai in the game is an upgrade
minor robin
I mean, you don't see me arguing how to fix Long Island and she's still shit regardless of the Kai or not, Shouhou and Ranger Kai do what she does but better
Yes they should be better but there's no urgent reason to fix what isn't completely useless
daring breach
ender thats not a reason to shut down discussion, people are free to suggest things
velvet adder
Pre-Kai Cats are pretty beastly
daring breach
and yorktown and hornet got changed for this reason
prekai cats are good, but i think what most people are getting at, is that the retro should be better than non-retro, because of the resource cost
neon kite
I guess we'll just have to disagree. I do not believe for one moment that historical accuracy should be prioritized over a better game experience.
velvet adder
That's your cue on how to use them. It wasn't intended, but that's how it is for the time being - as for how to solve the issues, well, I'd suggested a few things already and others have too.
The important part here is not covering their weaknesses, but emphasising the strenghts - and I do feel some have missed that the cats have higher seaplane Eff, which means they could do more with said planes than they are.
minor robin
And yes they don't
daring breach
the design is good, the numbers are awful is what i think
minor robin
Especially when you have Jean Bart getting this as a nerf to a preloaded shot
daring breach
covering weaknesses is just lazy
velvet adder
I would kind of agree, weren't for the fact that the game does take historical accuracy into account (to a degree) - that's simply not how the devs deal with it, and they re unlikely to change course after one year and a half.
neon kite
problem is that the seaplanes are just too weak as I see it. Tbf, I don't really care how they buff the retro, as long as they do something about it so that they actually become better, even if only slightly.
daring breach
in my opinion, just make the seaplanes worth using so u can keep the advanrtages while keeping the weaknsses
giving main gun damage is lazy and doesnt make seaplanes better imo, which is the niche
minor robin
Which has kinda been thrown around a few times in this discussion already
velvet adder
Seaplanes will always be weaker and slower than proper planes, because again, not real carriers
daring breach
they should be weaker
velvet adder
Not this weak though, yes
minor robin
Nonetheless, we are not bringing anything new to the table, we should just cut the discussion here
daring breach
everyone is free to input their opinion, they should be free to chime in
ornate basin
but theres a difference between contributing and restating the same things over and over
velvet adder
They should know their shit before speaking up, is what I think. (Not pointing fingers, it's a general remark)
daring breach
maybe but thats for the mods to decide tbh
minor robin
They should, assuming they have constructive feedback and not just repeating stuff over and over again
daring breach
also since its feedback, "i think yama cat is bad and needs mgm" is feedback whether u like it or not
velvet adder
Anyway, let's make it easy for Restart...
If you want a suggestion on how to fix them, here are a few (not all are necessary):
- raise the MGM Eff by +15% to have them be in line with IseHyu
- heavily improve the Zuiun barrage (eg. higher base damage and more than just one use),
- give them a third skill (perhaps a fleet acc buff on account of their super-high pagoda towers, or a sibling buff)
- bank heavier on the seaplanes, as their Efficiency with them is already higher it would make sense to make the cats more "carrier-like" and IseHyu more "BB-like"
daring breach
who is restart because i dont see him anywhere
minor robin
He is the person who manages this channel
velvet adder
@naive cobalt
minor robin
And was also involved in the discussion when it begun over some 12 hours ago
daring breach
i see
tardy arch
he's probably asleep rn and is gonna kill you when he wakes up.
minor robin
He's European anyways or East coast
ornate basin
around this time he always goes something like being excited to sleep to escape all the repeat bugs
daring breach
im actually not sure how feedback gets implemented. prinz clothing issue has been bugged the entire time shes out lol
it seems... sporadic
minor robin
That one is a bug and it has been reported more than a few times
minor robin
All bugs are on the Trello page anyways
ornate basin
why they dont fix even the most common bugs is enigmatic but I think theyre fixing every single bug and then are going to upload the patch to fix them sll
when the game is out of open beta
if that will ever happen
at this rate
daring breach
the main issue i have really is that
they have no QA
like the chinese skill issue
with yorktown
minor robin
I mean it went from blank to one language to another and to another and then to another language
velvet adder
betas with cash shop are called "release"
daring breach
and the zuikaku shoukaku thing
they cant even QA that which makes me ๐ค
it was dollar sign, they fixed to "wrong descreiption" and now finally fixed after multiple weeks
minor robin
They are trying to fix it yes, but my suspicion is the number of players barraging them is making less of the devs and more of the translator's who are getting confused
daring breach
i legit think they dont have QA tbh
thats how the event got through as-is
because u only need to read the event once to notice the errors and skill description
and korean text
minor robin
Considering they had to nerf the event by 10 or so levels for EN only, it clearly isn't that straightforward.
daring breach
no, shoukaku skill is legit a QA issue, you only have to see her page to realize this
like the first thing u do, play the event once
but they do not have testers is my opinion, so it goes out straight from input > release
basically there was a translation done, but no one bothered to proofread it or actually use shoukaku
ornate basin
translators im coming for you
daring breach
and the same thing is happening
with these fixes
someone fixed yorktown text but forget to check the coding
ornate basin
theres 2 translation teams
daring breach
like u need to actually use yorktown after u "fix" the skill
to see if it was actually fixed
ornate basin
one for events and one for the rest of the game
daring breach
but they are half-assing it so bad
no one is testing these fixes so it ends up being a vicious circle
that and questionable things, like fixing some spelling errors but not others which are earlier
๐ค
neon kite
Just gonna throw this in, both as a question and suggestion for seaplanes. Is there a specific reason why BBV can only use seaplanes? I feel like letting the option yama / fusou equip normal dive bombers on their 2nd slot would make them actually viable as BBV (similiar to how some BB can equip both DD & CL gun as aux gun). They still don't launch as many planes as CV and have lower aviation stats so they will still be a lot weaker compared to actual carriers.
olive wadi
The only BBV's to actually be completed, the Ise-class, could only use seaplanes. If the Fusou-class were refitted as originally planned, they would have only been able to use seaplanes.
Even in real life BBV's were a terrible idea.
neon kite
I don't really know the difference between seaplanes and the normal planes so I'm kinda confused why they can't be used on BBV (even irl). Both are planes and should be able to take off no problem?
olive wadi
Take off, yes. Land, no. Seaplanes take off using catapults, but land in the sea. Then, a crane on the ship lifts them back up onto the deck.
The deck of a BBV simply wasn't long enough for aircraft to land on.
normal vine
Fun fact: British ships carried a small fighter on a catapult at some point, too
It was basically a single-use item, because they needed an airfield to land and a harbour crane to get loaded
velvet adder
Single spotting planes for BBs were somewhat common, to an extent
Early warning and recon is of critical importance, after all, and back then the best way to do so were spotting planes
And yes, as Farveil points out, BBVs managed to be the worst kind of hybrid - taking both sides' weaknesses and none of the strengths
Then again they also were conversions out of desperation more than the fruit of a cogent plan, if I recall correctly.
olive wadi
Yeah, after Japan lost 4 of their 6 fleet carriers in Midway they were desperate for a way to launch planes at sea. Originally, they were going to convert the Fusou-class, but decided the Fusou twins were too old. So, they went with the Ise-class instead.
There was also Shinano. A ship no one ever remembers, but this isn't the channel for this subject.
naive cobalt
one for events and one for the rest of the game actually, from what I can see, not quite true. it's just that the second separate team(had something to do with wiki I think) was asked to look through ships' dialogues and fix them or something
daring breach
There are multiple translation errors, but I do notice that the later wave of translations is worse than launch.
The game would greatly benefit from having a native English person at least read over the script.
naive cobalt
I do notice that the later wave of translations is worse than launch. Absolutely not true, quality of translation noticeably improved over time, to the point of newer events being actually "readable" and even somewhat "enjoyable"
It was worse in terms of typos as well as in terms of translation and sentence structure.
minor robin
I'm guessing you're referring to closed beta restart?
naive cobalt
No, School event was a complete disaster in that sense, for example.
New secretary missions, Bits of Courage, VdiR and FW are actually not bad, even if somewhat stiff
Not ideal, mind you.
But way better
I'm not saying you're wrong, they DO need some proofreading and not in the form it is now, when Fly needs to look through old events pointing out all the typos, errors and wrong structures.
But saying that the translation got worse is just plain wrong.
Unless by that you mean purely "has untranslated bits and pieces here and there". But that's not how it works, it does not mean "low quality of translation", but "not having enough time or people for that". Which is a problem, yes, but of different sort.
daring breach
I wasn't comparing it to event translations, those got better over time. There were no events on launch either, so we had mostly ship quotes to work on. Comparing those to the upcoming events, the events are far worse offenders.
so i do agree with u that event translations got better over time
but the overall experience seems rather wishy-washy and they need to enforce some sort of standard rather than bumbling along if that makes sense
so the trajectory seems to be an up-down, up-down sort of thing, with the trend going up, but with a proper proofreader it could be so much smoother
i'll literally proofread their script for free if they need. because even if things are properly translatled, it reads quite stilted and that likely wont be fixed without a native tester/proofreader.
naive cobalt
we have that, you can check in trello
daring breach
whats trello
naive cobalt
daring breach
yeah i just googled that but it says nothing about proofreading or QA
its more like a bug-reporting feature
im talking about them needing some sort of QA to pass over these things, like "dearmweaver" and korean text would be immediately noticed on a first playthrough
if i were to comment on every single thing that seems slightly wrong it would likely fill pages :P
like a missing period, or wrong verb tense/agreement, etc.
naive cobalt
I meant me and Fly (mostly Fly) are doing exactly that
Yes, including "missing period, wrong verb tense/agreement"
daring breach
thanks for your work, no sarcasm
i know how tough proofreading can be
hopefully they bring more people on board, want to see this game do great
hallow inlet
Will there be a guild fleet buff or something to do in guild like Guild base in the future content of the game?
minor robin
There are currently no planned improvements for the guild system
Any suggestions prior to yours would be in the link in the pins
naive cobalt
Well, there may be. Point is - we would have no idea what and when even if
minor robin
I should ammend my statement,
There are currently no known planned improvements to the guild system
drowsy fiber
Thatโs a good one
naive cobalt
Also no, @velvet adder I haven't removed anything from the list, "EDITED" is because I was adding new stuff to it.
@restive mountain Great idea, I add it.
daring breach
option to convert purple boxes to gold pls. even if the rate is pretty bad (25:1)
restart, owari da sound procs when you have something that gives a skill.
test it with pirate soul plane, it proc because the plane has a special skill
it doesnt proc randomly, only if the plane has a skill
this is the same for the FRC, it'll proc the BBs skill sound because it has speceial effect
*gold FCR
i think its kinda neat though
naive cobalt
yea, that would make sense
and purps to golden was suggested pretty sure
but I doubt they want golds to be "craftable" this way, because you can't upgrade anything from purps to golden
boxes or bps
ornate basin
convert retrofit blueprints
tardy arch
i don't mind that you can't craft the gold boxes. makes them all the more special when you do get em.
ornate basin
I am actually surprised its not a thing but I guess they really dont want to make it that easy to access and rng its way into the game
naive cobalt
golds aren't special tho. rainbows are
ornate basin
cant retrofit any of my ships anymore on jp because of gold blueprints
t5 boxes
er
t6
daring breach
yeah i would really like purple bps to be transferable to gold hopefully if we keep spammin they will change it
:P
prob not tho
sucks that cant retro all the starters and have to pray to rngesus
ornate basin
ive been trying to retro my sandy and long island for soo long
feels like forever at least
tough kite
tardy arch
this kid has to be a special kind of stupid.
keen raptor
idk if this is a thing already or not, but if it isnt, is it possible add a feature where depending on where you start and walk to a siren, it gives a buff (ei. Walking infront the siren gives 1% buff and walking to attack the siren from behind gives 5% buff) while if you were ambushed by the sirens, you get debuffs
ornate basin
I think getting a debuff for getting ambushed is dumb
personally I let mine come to me because I use 2 fleets
and youโre probably going to attack them anyways
so you probably shouldnt get a debuff for letting the game do its mechanic
keen raptor
I see
frank quest
can we craft food into better ones, i have like 2000 colas sitting around cuz they take too long to restock with
outer surge
Please add bigger maps so we can use all 4 fleets at once...
Whats the point of having so many waifus if you cant use them all together at once anyways? Wasted
ornate basin
@frank quest just hold onto it
frank quest
๐ค
frank quest
o
bleak olive
Can u guys make stuff like trading in guilds to make them more appeling
minor robin
@bleak olive no cos that would break the game
@outer surge for your information, for as big as the maps do end up getting, we still only get to use 2 fleets
The reason why we have 4 is to have preset fleets like for dailies or low level maps etc
More fleets can make things unnecessarily complicated anyways
outer surge
About the fleet topic, I personally think that adding more fleets wont make things 'unnecessarily complicated'.
It doesn't need to jump directly to 4. Can start with 3 first.
But I guess this suggestion is a bit too early since the EN version is not even half a year's old~
Should have a poll channel in this server
minor robin
Even the other servers use only 2 fleets btw
outer surge
I know
minor robin
Well unless you count the submarine fleets
tardy arch
do none of the maps let you use all 3 fleets? (not just EN but JP and CN as well)
minor robin
the biggest map in story is 12-4's 8x11 map
and the number of enemies there is only comparable to b3/d3 maps
6 mobs clear to spawn boss
tardy arch
k so no then.
minor robin
and for what i mean by unnecessarily complicated
look at this way
if i can use more fleets, i don't need to worry about the challenge of ambushes or 0 ammo if the number of enemies doesn't change and it makes things way easier than they're supposed to
if the number of enemies do change, it'll have to reflect how many fleets there are to balance, and it will also raise the number of mobs you have to clear as a result, making farming needlessly take an excessive amount of time since a lot of good ship drops are boss only (foxes, poi, maya, nicholas, sendai, jintsuu, choukai etc)
@outer surge
no one wants to clear 9 or 10 mobs just to spawn the damn boss
tardy arch
ya i can see that. to many fleets make it to easy and trying to balance that makes it tedious.
outer surge
Then make it a 'new separate mode' then @minor robin
Im pretty sure there are fanatics out there
Like me cough cough
minor robin
And then the biggest argument
Why would anyone want to use more oil
And in later worlds where you need to be AT the level cap to even do it (w9 and on)
considering how hard it is to get to 120 for w12 that would be madness
tardy arch
people are already complaining that "the game doesn't give you enough" (it's a mobile game it's supposed to give you diminishing returns like that. )
minor robin
and when you realise they made hard mode easier by introducing immediate boss spawning after x number of clears
15 i think
and by cutting down number of hardmodes to half and doubling bp drop in return
tardy arch
i don't like that they nerfed the FW event. i cleared it without any issues. it felt easier than Dyed in Red actually.
minor robin
they can't please everyone
tardy arch
ik. the nerf was mostly for the casuals.
minor robin
it is a viable suggestion yes, but considering the past actions of devs
tardy arch
then you'll get the same response in a year.
minor robin
nonetheless i think it should be recorded, an ex mode to speak
just can't see them implementing it tho
velvet adder
Why have more fleets on the map, though?
merry kindle
can we have kindergarten skin version for some ship that look like 18 years or older like Hood, Enty, Duo foxes sister?
It is similar to Belchan but I want it as a skin instead of a different ship.
naive cobalt
also if they would make something similar to Bel-chan, I would prefer them actually trying something interesting and making adult version of lolies (for example Unicorn)
merry kindle
why not both ?
would be interesting if some Akashi experimental gone wrong and end up reverse all ship age 
ornate basin
I mean GFL did that for CHILDRENS day (for like 5 guns only) and personally I think it would cost way too much to make child versions/adult versions of every ship
just leave them the way they are
destroyers are small ships, so they get small characters
carriers are massive and if you havent noticed, their cg is also massive
velvet adder
The correct answer here would be "Belchan was an exception, as she was the winner of a popularity contest back in JP"
Do not expect a repeat
also the less loli, the better, paedo begone
merry kindle
well, if they run out of skin idea to make, just know that I am up for those kindergarten skin of adult ship or grow up version of loli ship.
having adult ship stumble around because they can't get used to being children is fun to watch.
and having kiddie trying to act as adult is fun too.
minor robin
either way, we are not accepting them
fervent musk
loli ark royal?
minor robin
merry kindle
the decision is not your to make though? @minor robin
I am not telling them to make immediately
minor robin
the pins already said
we are not gonna be taking them regardless
i may not be incharge of this channel
but the people who pinned and said that message are
ornate basin
^
normal vine
don't see it in the doc yet, so: it would be nice if we could craft T3 retrofit blueprints out of T2 retrofit blueprints - I'm having absolutely shit luck trying to get those, and would like to finally unlock Z23's new skill ...
not to mention Laffey's entire last third of retrofit
minor robin
Weird, I swear that has been recommended a few times here
Restaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaart
merry kindle
well, that was the whole point of farming hard mode and having progression in late game so I doubt if they will do it
normal vine
then the drop chance needs to be higher
normal vine
I've done nothing but 5-1 hard lately
ruby pewter
later hard modes ^^
minor robin
well
8-x hard has almost guaranteed t3 drops
merry kindle
POI normal stage do drop it I think
minor robin
err what
normal vine
@minor robin that's nice and all, but we don't even have 6 hard yet
minor robin
no it doesn't
retrofit bp does not drop in normal stage
merry kindle
nvm it doesn't
you are right
however, retrofit is a late game thing
so my point still stand
and to be honest, the shop medal exchange have it too
so it is not that hard to get retrofit
naive cobalt
Restaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaart``` Well, if it's not in the list - it would mean it was denied what is Game Guru mean?
naive cobalt
am smart
merry kindle
naive cobalt
(not really)
minor robin
But really in his case it's more of he's a bug reporting/feedback organising assistant
naive cobalt
Just a role for people who help in... #gameplay-help
merry kindle
ok
naive cobalt
(and for me even tho I don't )
normal vine
@naive cobalt would be good to keep those in the doc, but maybe in a different table with "denied"
normal vine
also, @merry kindle, medal exchange has like one per month, and then it's always the other types, not destroyer ... :/
naive cobalt
I'm sure you agree when it's me who would have to keep track of all that
normal vine
at least has been for me so far
merry kindle
I farm for one month and have like 5 ship retrofit
naive cobalt
but not the worst idea, I'll think about it
merry kindle
so yea, keep farming cuz it is that easy to get right now.
normal vine
me too, but those didn't need gold destroyer bp ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
naive cobalt
could you probably move your discussion somewhere?
merry kindle
merry kindle
that's destroyer job
and radar
later world suppose to be hard
we are getting submarine later so who know?
velvet adder
Repair Ships should live up to their designation
Even if you tack on more support abilities they'll still be shit healers, and that's their one job
merry kindle
olive wadi
You don't have to tell Restart that. Restart is a serious advocate for making Vestal live up to her name.
minor robin
normal vine
@velvet adder one thing I don't get: why they have two AA slots instead of one AA and one DD/CL so they can kill fireships
if Houshou didn't have less health than a destroyer, I'd pair her with BBVs
velvet adder
Probably because they didn't have guns, historically
olive wadi
Vestal did 127mm guns, but they were for AA purposes not anti-ship.
normal vine
hm, Akashi only had AA guns, too
I mean, on the one hand a repair ship would always be surrounded by destroyers and such, on the other hand even the cooks are armed ...
merry kindle
I think they should give a special slot to equip repair ship
so you can go into PvE battle with 7 ship in total
olive wadi
This isn't the place to discuss history, but no.
minor robin
There are better ways to buff them, and this is not one of them
merry kindle
so yea, why not put that repair ship BEHIND the back line and deal with any air craft that make through the back line?
like behind the behind of back line
olive wadi
That's a lot of gameplay change for just two ships.
minor robin
And that's ignoring how that would totally mess up AA mechanics
merry kindle
yea, a lot of gameplay change but if they want it to be accurate
that is what I can think of
olive wadi
Azur Lane
merry kindle
or just totally make it into another meow officer
olive wadi
Accuracy.
minor robin
Choose 1
AL has some historical basis, but it's not enough to justify this
merry kindle
so there you go
minor robin
Yamashiro and Fusou weren't even BBV irl for instance
The way to go around fixing ARs would be to fix their namesake
You know, actually be good at healing
If they can be better than the non ARs at healing, that's probably a huge start already
minor robin
And to add on to historical relevance
Bismarck sank 6.5 months before pearl harbour
And in the story bismarck is still alive during the battle of midway which is a year and 2 months after
comparing with HG is irrelevant
olive wadi
Alright. This isn't history class. We can all agree Repair Ships need a change. Let's drop this.
hazy delta
What issue?
daring breach
if you equip pirate soul plane or the gold FCR on any ship, it will play their skill activation line when they fire their bb gun or air strike.
minor robin
why isn't this in #bug-reports
daring breach
because i dont feel that this is a bug and its relatively consistent behaviour
minor robin
it was reported as a bug regardless
daring breach
im using bug reports to report actual bugs. im going to put this under feedback because its how i feel on the issue
naive cobalt
Point of #known-bugs channel is to tell people that something is known so they won't report it
Lucky E line was reported quite a lot, so it's there
And if that's intended behavior - devs won't remove it just because I reported it as a bug.
And imo - it shouldn't be intended, because sound cues are important and shouldn't confuse people. When they hear "Owari da!" they expect theirs Enterprise to become invincible and destroy everything that made a mistake to exist on the same map as her.
And also it was reported that this is the case only with exercise, so I'll call this inconsistency.
naive cobalt
also please don't call me "Reset" ever
naive cobalt
what
naive cobalt
always been the case
there's soft cap after which you can't get anymore from canteen
and hard cap after which you can't get oil at all
ruby pewter
which is the hard cap ^^
minor robin
Yep
Hard cap for oil is 25k, for gold 600k
It's always been there
velvet adder
Why in the balls are you stockpiling all that shit
minor robin
There are many many ways to get rid of that much oil
velvet adder
Is this a Kancolle thing?
Because I've heard people went to insane lenghts to save resources there
shrewd wing
in the future whether Azur Lane will have guild missions or not ?
shrewd wing
tks
daring breach
its not limited to enterprise, like i said its not an enterprise glitch...
and its not exercise only, it also applies in normal map as well
like i said, take any cv with the plane, it will proc their skill activation sound
if u load up the game you'll see what i mean
for referece, use akagi with the VF pirate soul, she will spam her sound clip
can u please read what im actually saying,
because this isnt an enterprise bug, u can replicate it on EVERY CV with a voice line
daring breach
Can you at least clarify it as not an Enterprise specific bug?
before people get the misconception her skill is bugged when its not
You need to put in that the actual problem, which is the unique planes (VF Pirate Soul) that are causing ships to replay voice lines
naive cobalt
you mean the part where I specifically specify that skill itself is not bugged and this is just sound clip?
daring breach
Enterprise's "Owari da! " line procs even when skill isn't activated, resulting in massive audio spam
๐ธ
Also may create a feeling that her skill doesn't work properly. Most likely it just wasn't activated.
this is what u put
coral ivy
he keeps repeating it, but you're being kinda obstinate too restart, your first line does actually make it sound like it's happening to enterprise and there's like no problem at all to say it's universal and not just on her
it'd just sound less funny
naive cobalt
because only E was reported
daring breach
im repeating it because hes not listening to what im saying, im telling him literally whats cause the problem and its not on lucky E's end
naive cobalt
I'm basing this on like 10 or so bug reports
daring breach
can you load up the game and use any CV with VF pirate soul
coral ivy
well, he also mentioned akagi now, so there's more reports
minor robin
i just tested with shoukaku, she does not have this bug
minor robin
so your point with all CV is moot
coral ivy
then it's time to find out which CVs do it
minor robin
akagi may have it
daring breach
I already identified the problem, which is VF pirate soul
and Fire Control Radar (Gold)
these will cause the ships to spam their lines
minor robin
i used fcr gold on like 3 diff ship and haven't seen the issue
daring breach
if u equip fire control radar you litertally get weird things happening like Rodney's Skill Clip g oing off at the beginning of the fight
Do it on a Proc-Based skill, BIG7 on rodney
minor robin
i have sodak with it
daring breach
at the start of the fight, there is a chance she'll proc a voice bite
minor robin
nothing
daring breach
do it with rodney and you'l see what i mean
anyway, theres a bugged interaction with the new equips
coral ivy
well, there's bugs but it's not happening to every ship if what ender says is true
so restart cant change it to "every CV" anyway
daring breach
yeah probably not every, i dont have sodak
coral ivy
we have to find out which ones are affected
daring breach
but putting it as enty only isnt true
akagi will spam
and the problem is VF soul causing these weird interactions with ships
naive cobalt
for what I know those might be two separate issues.
minor robin
i will verify with akagi now hold on
daring breach
Restart, can you equip pirate soul
on enty
go in a normal camapgin
use her skill
she'll proc voice bite every time u use air s trike
minor robin
assuming everyone has enty
daring breach
like ur not believing me even though i give u the exact conditions it procs under
naive cobalt
I do, it's fine
daring breach
Also, use rodney, put the gold FRC on her
at the beginning of the fight, she'll use her big7 sound clip
naive cobalt
I'll use Hood
minor robin
i dont have rodney free either
daring breach
im not sure if hood procs it i know the big7 proc a voice clip
daring breach
i am just giving exact replication here, its the items thats causing bugged interactions on quite a few ships
VF pirate soul on enty will proc 100% on akagi and enty
only the sound bite, and only on air strike
minor robin
can confirm, akagi does have this issue
daring breach
kaga should too
ships that already have a sound bite on airstrike like lusty cant affected because she uses a voice clip anyway
hornet should also have the same issue
minor robin
kaga has the issue yes
daring breach
hornet too if u have her
minor robin
my hornet is on commission so can't test
daring breach
i dont have hornet but im fairly certain s he'll proc it
try it on other CVs too with a soundbite
tardy arch
so the prate plane is supposed to bug the voice clip and the HFCR is supposed to bug rodneys voice clip as well right?
daring breach
HFCR bugs a lot of BB's
daring breach
restart
naive cobalt
So "Skill" sound clip procs
daring breach
rodney plays her big7 sound clip, at the start of the sortie
minor robin
that should not happen
naive cobalt
Don't think I have Rodney
minor robin
akagi and kaga both have their skill lines on air strike, which also should not happen, both their skills are start of the battle
daring breach
?
minor robin
i can confirm gold fcr does not have issue on the proc based sodak
neither does it on wash who isn't proc based but whatever
tardy arch
k well i would have posted the video here but discord says the file is to big so i had to upload it. anyways neither of them bugged for me. https://youtu.be/TQqR1X5knE8
naive cobalt
So "Skill" sound clip procs```um restart
u classified it
as an enty issue
thats the part i had an issue with
minor robin
oi light fire dead link
tardy arch
rip. k here's a working one. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQqR1X5knE8&feature=youtu.be
daring breach
im not being a broken record but i already said that the skill thing was related to the event ships but u said that for some reason
minor robin
i'm beginning to see restart's pov on this one
naive cobalt
@tardy arch doesn't work for me
tardy arch
ugh really? k let me unprivate the video.
daring breach
i literally said to restart that the sound clips play on the VF plane activation, and it doesnt matter if he considers it a bug or a feature
minor robin
make it unlisted lol
daring breach
the problem was him listing it as ENTY only
minor robin
๐คฆ
naive cobalt
BECAUSE ONLY ENTY WAS REPORTED
minor robin
the reason why he listed it as enty cos the reports he got were only ABOUT enty
daring breach
he got the reports about enty because her skill is the most obvious
tardy arch
why can i not see my own unlisted video wtf?
minor robin
yes, so he posted it with what information he had
tardy arch
nvm found it. here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQqR1X5knE8
there we go
i didn't get the sound bug with rodney or enty.
tardy arch
lol k
daring breach
the vF squadron though sohuld always proc enty voice
found it
1:40
theres ur glitch
daring breach
yeah
because in the firist sortie, she was talking so she cant override her own clip
tardy arch
still no enty bug.
tardy arch
oh ok.
tardy arch
i'm so used to hearing that in pvp and not seeing the skill activation. ya it's there then.
daring breach
and restart wouldnt change his thing and then a ton of people are thinking enty is bugged
minor robin
๐คฆ
daring breach
when i have to correct people and say that enty isnt bugged, its VF squadron causing the sound bites
also this was like the 3rd time i mentioned it
minor robin
both of you couldn't explain yourselves properly so yeah
tardy arch
lol i go to record the bug again to change the equipment and when i activated entys skill it actually gave me lucky e.
minor robin
Restart never said you were wrong
He said he only put enty there cos that was the only ship that was reported
daring breach
it procs
all the time dude
yes, and i told him why people were reporting enty, because her skill is obvious but he needed to go check it out for himself
naive cobalt
ok, finally managed to NOT proc her skill
daring breach
no one reprots akagi because her skill does nothing, just a laugh
minor robin
What's wrong with him verifying it?
daring breach
?
i told him to verify it
it was only after being up for several hours that i mentioned it again
and i also told him that
FRC was causing rodney interaction as well
which is NOT
on his bug report
naive cobalt
so you probably should've used bug report form to report a bug
same way people who reported Enty did
daring breach
its feedback thread man, i dont think im goign to report bugs anymore, just too much of a headache for me
naive cobalt
The only point of #known-bugs channel is so people won't report the same thing over and over
If people only notice Enty - I'm going to put Enty there.
daring breach
see
naive cobalt
Because she's the only one who was reported
daring breach
and then i have to correct people and say its NOT ENTY
tardy arch
if you're not going to report the bug then why. bring. it. up?
daring breach
u need to fix that and say its the VF squadron causing enty to spam
no because im not going to report FUTURE bugs because its already causing me a headache trying to explain
minor robin
the problem would have been avoided if you just reported it normally tbh
daring breach
either way, now u see the issue
minor robin
a system exists in place so such issues like this will not occur
daring breach
the only difference was that u saw it here insteaed of bug reports
minor robin
he meant with the form
naive cobalt
difference is that I saw it here instead of the bug report spreadsheet
tardy arch
ok done. got it to bug with hornet as well.
coral ivy
the problem would've been avoided if you stopped being so damn aggressive about it tbh
you can literally just tell him, even right now, to add "due to vf17 plane's skill" at the end of this line Enterprise's "Owari da!" line procs even when skill isn't activated, resulting in massive audio spam and report that other ships are also doing this
avoiding unnecessary conflict is pretty simple
daring breach
the whole point why im upset is ur not giving the cause of why enty is being bugged
and i HATE misinformation being spread because i have to correct people in other servers that enty isnt bugged
coral ivy
just ask him to mention that it is caused by the vf17 or hfcr's skills, instead of keeping on repeating the reason that upset you, we already understood that
daring breach
yeah just update it and i'll be fine
coral ivy
also what you wanted to say has already been established as true, so there's not much point going on and on about our differences in this channel
should use it if we find out more ships that have issues
just chill out
daring breach
honestly he was obstinate about it and didnt seem to believe me, anyway if it gets updated then its all good
coral ivy
also, thanks for pointing out about the other ships 
meager valley
i am unsure if this is a bug but z23 kai main screen 1, main screen 2 and normal touch dialogues dont have sound when viewed in the archives or in when set as secretary
daring breach
@naive cobalt not just rodney, nelson too and possibly other BBs
minor robin
@meager valley known, also should be in #bug-reports
daring breach
i would test but i would rather u guys do it... (i have trust issues)
but i know rodney and nelson are 100%
most with a proc % skill, not sure about timed barrages
@minor robin does sodak play a sound bite on sortie
the vanguard also has to make a speech
minor robin
She does not
And I've been farming with her on D3 for nearly the whole week
daring breach
hmm
tardy arch
it varies from ship to ship. just put "some BB's" and be done with this already. sheesh.