Replace gilgamesh ursa's auto counter attack with something

[sinful goblet]

OK so we have saw the 3rd best PvP defender is gilgamesh ursa which is way better than 4th and the others, and we all know the reason is just a single passive : auto counter attack (auto CA).
The auto CA is such a bad mechanism because we have no way to prevent. It just happens.
We have specs/gears/skills/actions to increase/decrease the chance of every other thing (for example : parry, dodge chance, protect chance, status chance...), but auto CA just happens.
Even you are a experienced AL 100 player, you may lose to a LV 225 naked ursa gilgamesh just because he auto CA you. HE DO NOTHING and YOU LOSE.
Remove auto CA and give some tasty to ursa.

[sleek sun]

Where would you buff it as a counterbalance? Its PvP defense is good, but its performance in other content do currently balance for that

[delicate shore]

I'm Gilga Ursa main and I can confirm, the passive is strong BUT it's the only thing that gives us a chance to win because everything else fails, not even the status passive works in PvP (as far as I know). Outside of this scenario the passive is useless.

[sinful goblet]

Maybe something like the deity (ursa) ? random att buff would grant some spicy for PvE content

[carmine thistle]

Remove: Automatic Counter Attack.
New Passive: Quickstrike. Counter Attack is more effective. (Still have to use the CA skill as an action, not automatic).
New passive: Cleave. When it deals damage, any overkill damage goes to a new target. Encourages big damage 2h play. (Can chain targets? Chance to?)

[delicate shore]

If it works the same it works today please don't

[delicate shore]

And here's one thing that's fair and I agree, Cleave is definitely something that would help the class A LOT and fits perfectly with a two-handed weapon wielder. And a counterattack working as an action and not a passive is fair to everyone to be honest, the passive is extremely broken.

[thorny sundial]

I wish GUrsa's counterattack was based on his Attack stat, and not based on incoming damage taken.

Helps in pvp -- enemies can use Def gear (and Def^) buffs prior to hitting to mitigate the counter.
Helps in pve -- CA damage would actually be meaningful, even when taking 0 damage from random mobs.

Overkill splash would be really cool. Not sure it's something that needs to be GUrsa-specific given that there are many melee classes that want it/it's a cool mechanic that should be more prevalent instead of aoes like Sweep/Dance.

[sinful goblet]

Overkill splash sounds cool

[delicate shore]

Besides being cool it makes perfect sense for the class.

[thorny sundial]

It also makes perfect sense for Dorado, Gymir follower, Deity Ursa, and other "muscle dude" themes.

Ultimately it would be a pve thing, though, and the topic is about pvp.

[delicate shore]

It is important to remember that the passive does not work against Beo's pet and against the GS summons it is quite useless

[sleek sun]

We'll watch where it lands post-balance patch. As it is currently not a bad balance offender, I can't say it'll be something we cover in this patch

[flint tundra]

I've been playing a lot of gil ursa, and just saw this thread.

Counterattack is pretty useless in PvE for dmg, but very useful for mitigation, making up for reduced ward and lack of passive HP sustain.

If I could suggest a replacement, it would have to be two things,

Mitigation, such as an occasional immunity to physical attacks (like omnimancy but for pointy things) and

DPS boost in a group battle situation, such as a decent cleave chance, since normal gil performs much better in raid (1v1) situations

[delicate shore]

I would really like Strikes of Ursa to have the turns reduced from 3 to 2. 3 turns is a long time for the enemy to decimate you and defense doesn't work very well.

[flint tundra]

Also the way counterattack works now, in PvE if something dies to it, all the other mobs get another turn!

[split reef]

Diety Ursa would kindly take the auto counter

[flint tundra]

and lose u.omnimancy? deity mitigation is a lot better, even if heretics can kill you easily

[split reef]

I love taking extra damage from random skills. It's great.

[flint tundra]

Currently if I buy Gilgamesh Ursa, it's for PvP, because PvE isn't good at all, so if they remove or change the automatic counterattack, why did I buy it? it would no longer make sense. That's the only way Gilgamesh Ursa shines, the other classes shine in other ways as well. And like every class, this one also has an Achilles heel, believe me summoners and Beowulf do it very well against G Ursa.

In addition, the probability of auto CA is not even that much and we have a noticeable reduction in ward. It doesn't start with on guard active and also doesn't regenerate. That is a big problem. Without the Counterattack, buying ursa is worthless, you lose a lot since then Gilgamesh Base would still be much better. If it doesn't work for PvE, then neither does PvP, why Gilga Ursa as an option?

[narrow furnace]

Parry from raid bosses has a damage cap, what if it was just capped to a certain amount? Just an idea, my gilga is not ascended, nor have I been killed by the passive, just making a suggestion. You could always just change your approach, instead of nuking and risking death, thought of that? Haha

[olive rover]

im with fux on counterattack being based on attack stat

would be pretty cool and could be balanced so its good in pve

[narrow furnace]

If I had to fight one, I'd just use lighter hits so I didn't kill myself in 1 go, try that

The counter based on attack would actually be sweet, PvE etc. Reminds me of the thorns mechanic in Diablo

That's pretty fun in d3

Crusader ftw

[flint tundra]

I wanted this class to be a crusader or spellsword, but it seems like training wheels for swapping from Gil to RS

[olive rover]

spellsword would be really gigachad, but thats gonna be a third celesital probably

too far off from ursa

[flint tundra]

why is ursa, anyway?

[olive rover]

Im assuming you mean what

And it's a 2h class

Really high hp, counter attacks and uses 2 handers

Pretty cool tbh, I'd say it's actually the coolest celestial class

[flint tundra]

I mean why. It's only synergy is swashbuckler 😂

[olive rover]

zweifencer is literally a spec for using 2 handed weapons

but sure maybe gameplay wise its not as cool as its concept

[delicate shore]

Gilga Ursa Swash/Zweifencer is pretty solid, even Tamer works well. Overall it's a pretty solid class, apart from the counter which is broken af ​​in PvP, PvE is useless.

[delicate shore]

Well if you don't care about the meta and blablabla high damage blablabla you can do a spellblade build with Deity Ursa skills, I'm doing that.

[flint tundra]

To say Gil Ursa Zwei is solid, means nothing, because there's no alternative for horde dmg.

I do like this variant. I think my expectations were far far far from where they needed to be when I picked it up. I thought it would be another class, and really it's kind of just an aspect of Gilgamesh.. I wish they were right next to each other in the class selection list!

Maybe counterattack can be tuned by increasing the chance. At least there's a few of us playing it!

[delicate shore]

I agree with you, but I didn't put my expectations high, I kind of already knew it would be just ok, what catches my attention is because it totally makes my type of character.

I don't see myself playing with another class, I just wish there were more weapon options 2h but I know this is just a matter of time. Counterattack could change to something middle ground, stop being op in PvP and stop being useless in PvE

[polar shard]

I really like the idea of ursa's counterattack using its own att stat. Would make it good in PvP and pve