Share your thoughts on the changes Rena received in the 3/27/2024 balance update! Did she get better? Need more improvements? Let us know!
#Rena Balance Changes 3/27/2024
hollow turtle
uneven solar
Buffs unclear. Needs more buffs.
ivory sinew
I like Mod Karma. ouo Totally new stacking skill.
zinc hornet
Nerf DyB more
deep hearth
Aka rena’s satisfaction has met
Case closed 
ivory sinew
this is how your justice ends
gleaming gate
you traitor
brave fern
The only char that needs a buff here is TW
gleaming gate
i want more traps that are actually traps sadge
brave fern
The rest are fine
deep hearth
Why u guys here. Rena is satisfied already
brave fern
Bcs TW got a really weird change that didn't help her that much
brave fern
Just Karma
gleaming gate
and base rena nf change
brave fern
Yeah
gleaming gate
lol
wait how was karma changed?
i just know it was changed
wiki hasnt been updated yet to show new skill lel
summer citrus
wait how was karma changed?
mod Karma now has two tornadoes instead of one, which increased the dmg by like 6k% iirc?
...that's it
gleaming gate
ah ic
oh it was mod thats why i didnt see it
does anyone even use the mod? i thought even if it didnt hit much cuz it passed through base karma did more dmg
ivory sinew
I didn't at first. But the mod upgrade PLUS the negative frame reduction really helped her
I just gotta adjust my rotation for it, change my stacking and grind ERP lol
opal cargo
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Nerf Call of Ruin from 24k% to 20k% and move that lost % to mod Karma instead (18k% -> 22k%). Call of Ruin's purpose is supposed to be a cooldown reduction skill attached to an internal cooldown on a passive (Calculated Strike). It should not be the main skill. Karma was historically Twilight's main skill until her last significant patch during the Berthe era which made choosing between Karma and Call of Ruin confusing.
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Karma still does not use Nature Force, which makes its actual damage lower than it should be.
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Twilight's MP problems come from spending too much time every 6 seconds having to upkeep her debuffs that cost 310mp in total. Either bring both of the durations to 10-12s or add a passive feature where TW gets ~30% Mana Cost Reduction buff on Trapping Arrow and Evoke for a set duration whenever she presses those skills.
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Remove the knockdown on Call of Ruin's last hit and the insane launch from mod Karma's last hit. Remove knockdown from Gliding Strike too.
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Please give her trap skills a purpose again in PvE for the sake of improving class individuality. Possibly like allowing Delayed Fire to stack up 10 times in PvE and having her class-specific skills contribute to its stacks. Another possibility may be like allies who hit an enemy with Briar applied will gain a short cooldown acceleration buff.
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Please return Fragmentation Seed to Twilight and Humming Wind to Daybreaker -_-
ivory sinew
pliant parcel
TW is behind her sisters and lacks many things. She needs some skill rework and improved passives. What Sage said earlier covers a lot of good things.
Sharpen Arrow, VPP - improve/rework these two passives as they are almost useless.
Fatality - increase damage slightly and remove low chance to critical hit. Make mod version faster.
Evoke - this was nerfed but the cooldown remains high. Either reduce the cooldown or increase the duration slightly.
Trapping Arrow - increase duration slightly.
Rage Fungus - this is lackluster and needs a damage boost. Make binding not interfere with freezing.
Eradication - either increase damage slightly or reduce mp cost.
Less important:
Aero Tornado - make it air usable. Don't bury half of the skill underground.
Seed of Wrath Icicle - dreaming about using this skill to freeze.
Ancient Soul - increase speed. Allow moving away after casting.
Silent Wind - if the boss can even be silenced, increase silence duration slightly.
gleaming gate
she's a trapper but she feels more like a budget AN rn imo
manic zodiac
Thank you for Pr Pour down buff, the suffering of you must waste 1 second to jump is unbearable
gleaming gate
They should give her a thing where she like stacks debuffs as the fight goes on and the more debuffs she can get on the enemy the stronger some of her big skills becomes (treat the debuffs like valasia so we don't need to worry about hyperarmour)
Think delayed fire but like actually decent lel
steady jasper
I feel like all the nerfs over the years were unnecessary
what should have been nerfed this ENTIRE time is the strength of enhanced equipment from 40% dmg boost per level on top of the previous ones to the value of +8 or 9’s boost level (the one below it).
That I feel would be a much BETTER nerf.
or even cap per level enh level dmg boost from 40% -> 25% on each lv that builds upon itself.
basically:
- +1 = 3%
- +2 = 3%
- +3 = 3%
- +4 = 7%
- +5 = 7%
- +6 = 7%
- +7 = 15%
- +8 = 15%
- +9 = 15%
- +10~+13 (and beyond) = 40% -> 25% <— this would be a much better invested nerf. Yes the whales would complain but it is better than completely gutting everyone’s useful kits into useless ones and killing the game with unbalance that people assume is balanced.
I feel this is what proper balance should be placed.
In enhancement benefits
Besides people above +11 do not really need anything above unless they are ultra whales, also with equipment dumbed down it makes pvp more fair, raids more fair while also solving the abusable aspects of say dom’s kit to clear abyss within 2 minutes 
.
Nerfing that would ensure that even those dom’s who could do such before would have at least 4 minute clear times.
Values obtained from here btw: https://elwiki.net/w/Upgrading_Equipment
This is why I felt like all these years that the development team do not always think far into the future when assigning values to stuff like the enhancement table.
Also it seems to not have been touched much since cbt no?
And even then if they whales complain about being “weaker” at +13 after the nerf then release up to +16 to “get them at least” back at what they had when they were +13. Also gets them to invest even more money to try to get to +16 which helps make server more alive.
Since Endgame is usually bored anyways I legit see people enhance even “bronze sword” to +13 if they wanted to.
gleaming gate
Cut out everything before +9 then bump 9-13 down to 0-4 in numbers
Cuz everything before +9 doesn't matter anymore
Already either the item comes +9 or higher ... Or it is worthless until +9 or higher ... So might as well cut the pretense and make +9 the new baseline
strange musk
This is the Rena blance patch thread.
gleaming gate
Hey I didn't start it owo
ivory sinew
So to make it more clearly relevant, adjusting damage values of classes based on incredibly high enhancement in gear is not the way. If we want better balancing for classes - including Rena - then it has to come from the nerfing of gear first. Yeah?
pastel swallow
Anemos is now op
hollow turtle
Definitely see a lot of Twilight mentions, how about the other classes? How did the changes impact them.
I do see the Anemos is now OP comment above which I can already figure from what I've seen some conversations about. How about Daybreaker and Prophetess?
ivory sinew
Ummmm, like, it's cool that Fickle Blessing roll is just 5 seconds now. ouo Much more doable, and I find myself remembering to roll it a lot more often than the previous 20 second one.
strange musk
I don't play AN, so I don't really have skin in this game.
My general understanding for her skill animation renewals, is shorter/faster animation times.
Violent Attack - visually the animation is a bit of a hot mess; looks like someone frankensteined it together. I would say it's mainly the downward gust that needs to change, specifically the wings should be removed. Rena is no longer travelling in that gust, so even if it was part of the previous version imo it's no longer appropriate.
[Mod] Dive Kick Bombing - visually feels very lazy; basically mont blanc reskined. Someone took the bombing part in the skill's name too far and completely forget that the class is centred on kicks and wind gusts/movement. Less exploding visuals and more gusts are needed here.
You can even take Minecart's tnt explosion as inspiration for what to do with dive kick bombing's visuals
You know that i'm thinking about it, violent attack's renewal is also a ripoff of [unmodded] dive kick bombing
can the design team get better deadlines or step their game up. this completing ur (home)work last minute is getting a bit too much of a trend 
opal cargo
Definitely see a lot of Twilight mentions, how about the other classes? How did ...
DaB and PR are fine
but they should somewhat revert Ace in the Hole to how it used to be (except you're not stuck in place as badly so some modifications will be needed) and return to Gungnir meta, which would make Dab more interesting to play
The only complaint that I have for PR is Mod Lyrical Flow requiring the boss to be as tall as the one in Birth of Origin phase 3 to have all 3 hitbox layers land. This height requirement is unrealistic for the amount of damage it provides on average and already makes the regular version better in every scenario.
Also the damage on Phoenix Strike needs to be buffed. It does way too little for what it's supposed to do and its requirement to use it.
uneven solar
Wait. People actually think anemos is OP?
On a serious note. Keep anemos as is. She performs as she should. Only one quality of life change: to make mod dkb stable. It forces her to slide with whatever her mobility is currently and causes a bit of frustration when raiding, which is its current main purpose.
Change dab ace in the hole to the old version for a time period to experiment how she would feel now with all the changes she's received over the years.
Give twilight a better passive for sharpened arrow to make her more effective and plz make some of the trans skills a bit more potent. Rage fungus and eradication are pretty weak for what they should be right now. (also buff mod fatality to actually be super fast.) eradication was left as it was because elrianode city was actually an important dungeon. No need for it to be as weak as it is now.
PR only has a clearing problem. It stands as her biggest drawback for those who want to main her. Maybe try making current split as it hits a target to encourage better usage and to also make the size a bit bigger. Not fun clearing 1-2 platforms.
Lastly AN is good. But she's not OP. Just like any other class requires a lot of thought to maximize potential. Being similar in damage to classes of same type doesn't mean she's OP. She was greatly underwhelming before. Now she performs as she should. Nerf her and I'll probably get myself banned the next anemos balance patch with a potty mouth.
gleaming gate
can the design team get better deadlines or step their game up. this completing ...
No good deadline is gonna save bad time management lel
keen tapir
I wouldn't say almost every scenario. Mod Lyrical Flow is really good against alot of small bosses if you know how to position it underneath the boss for atleast 2 hitboxes.
pliant parcel
Found a relevant post from KR balance suggestion page on TW.
https://elsword.nexon.com/Community/Balance/View?n4PageNo=23&n4ArticleSN=13088
Summary:
- Make Karma consume NF.
- Add defense ignoring effect to CoR.
- Add mp recovery to Eradication.
heady wadi
Prophetess is better to play now. Her rng buffs to a minimum and faster fickle stacking. Magic parties now consider her for raid, now that she's a debuffer. I hope that buff stays: too good to be true.
PR seems like she should have been for physical parties or a healer.
Her cooldown extension gives players a mini break from her spam of spells.
Her super armor should be instant and it could also use 8secs. Her cleanse in tuning should be improved.
I feel that 3/4 Renas need better cleaning for normal dungeons. Phoenix Strike should be buffed or change/give a mod to Aero Tornado for clearing.
Aero tornado is easily displaced when pushed during battle. That's annoying.
heady wadi
Twilight remains the same compared to other physical dealing classes. Everyone getting the same passive boost + karma mod improvement. She needs a buff in passives and in bravery skills. I wasn't expecting anything for her. Not enough love shown to Twilight.
Changes/buff in eradication or rework of skill would have been great.
Maybe an extra buff in evoke.
Butterfly's super armor trait to self or party would be an idea.
Or multiple waves to normal karma.
Rage Fungus- duration increased/casting increased and avoid interference with freezing skills.
Trapping Arrow- I agree slightly improved secs or keep the same to avoid nerfed.
Fatality - In Agreement with [mod] skill spd casting improved.
Her Eldrasil passive isn't complicated to maintain but would be effortless if Karma was added to activate Eldrasil or improve duration slightly.
If Twilight's skill sizes and range were improved to be larger she would have an updated PVE dungeon experience.
Karma, normal and mod now did slightly improve her bossing ability in raid to a single skill.
lunar coral
Twilight remains the same compared to other physical dealing classes. Everyone g...
TW is already very strong by current top-tier DPS standards, and it boasts a very potent offensive support, so I think expecting further buffs would be excessive.
ivory sinew
Think so? o3o
pliant parcel
TW is already very strong by current top-tier DPS standards, and it boasts a ver...
Current top tier? lol where did u get that? Many broken classes outdamage TW easily especially in end game dungeons. A lot of players including TW themselves are ignorant and don't think TW needs rework/improvement, thus kog did almost nothing for TW in the last balance. Her issues discussed above have been neglected for too long. She is probably the weakest dps rena now, many jc to other renas.
lunar coral
Current top tier? lol where did u get that? Many broken classes outdamage TW eas...
I don't know which end game dungeon you're referring to, but in Challenge Mode, the current hardest end game raid in the game, she performs very well and can achieve the highest offensive numbers.
pliant parcel
Maybe the TW you saw had +12? TW dmg clearly isn't the top dps. Her offensive support is not potent. Many other support classes can do a better job. We should know by now doing character balance based on raid isn't a good idea.
lunar coral
Maybe the TW you saw had +12? TW dmg clearly isn't the top dps. Her offensive su...
Yes, but the other DPS players were also at the same gear level. Additionally, her offensive support is currently among the best, just compare her with others yourself.
pliant parcel
To see if a character is strong or not, you have to look at it in general, not just in raid. Just because you saw some whales perform well with said character doesn't mean that it is strong. Not to mention if they need to have high end +12 gear to do it and most people have +11. It's a fallacy. Some character needs specific composition to perform decently while some don't. That itself is a form of imbalance.
lunar coral
Well, as I initially mentioned, my point was about raids and bossing, with the challenge mode being the example. We players don't have very precise data and experience of the endgame without actually playing or at least watching videos and pondering over them. Based on the performances I've seen of her in challenge mode, I considered her to be at a very high level—considering and comparing the level and gear of others in the same situation as well—however, I don't discount the need for improvements, such as mana consumption and the RNG factor of her passive "Predator."
pliant parcel
TW damage is not weak. Thanks for acknowledging that she still needs some improvements. Don't know what this "very high level" is supposed to be. Classes like RI, LiB, CA, BQ, MO, TP... are all in high levels and definitely higher than TW. If these super strong classes get buffs, why can't TW?
ripe night
Some improvements TW would need:
- Fatality: remove the Critical system from the skill since there's already the Predator passive to act as a Critical system; Non-Mod should take the Critical damage and Mod the non-Critical damage but increase significantly the "vertical width" of the skill range
- Seed of Wrath: Icicle: make non-Mod deal splash damage (it's pretty strange it already isn't like this since the "design" absolutely suggest it does)
- Humming Wind: improve in some way Mod version since it has literally 0 use
- Gliding Strike: same story of Mod Humming wind for Mod Gliding Strike
- Rage Fungus: increase range of "explosion" by a lot to at least try to make us of splash damage
- Butterfly: fix the superarmor of Powerful trait because sometimes the skill gets interrupted when being hit despite TW should have had superarmor
- Eldrasil's Fury: after the skill was nerfed to not drag superarmor enemies it has become much worse; to improve it make the skill slow down significantly when hitting an enemy (like Cour de Monde)
- Sharpen Arrow and Vital Point Piercing: add the effects of Sharpen Arrow to Vital Point Piercing and rework Sharpen Arrow in a new passive (like it was done with Sariel's passives High-Power Electronic Circuit and Photon Booster)
opal cargo
https://elsword.koggames.com/2024/07/emergency-ma-bug-fix/
Was this necessary that Karma had to get nerfed from 335 to 273 per hit?
Twilight wasn't even overperforming in raid content so what was the point in this rather than just have KR fix itself to 335 per hit? Every other server had it at 335.
mod Karma being decent was Twilight's saving grace because having to spam Call of Ruin would interfere with her Calculated Strike passive
https://elwiki.net/w/Karma/ModA
https://elwiki.net/w/Calculated_Strike
Why is her main skill at 17.9k without any defense ignore? Even if Call of Ruin hits 24k, it's a cooldown reduction skill with an internal cooldown tied to it.
ivory sinew
Oh, that's why I felt garbage today lol
hollow turtle
https://elsword.koggames.com/2024/07/emergency-ma-bug-fix/
Was this necessary th...
This is incorrect as people were reporting KR had a different value. This was also confirmed by the devs after checking and was supposed to be a part of the Balance update back on 3/27.
opal cargo
I did state that KR did have a different value and am aware, but people had a reason to play TW with 335 per hit because she was finally able to hold her ground. There’s very little KR footage of TW gameplay because of a weak Karma.
hollow turtle
It's hard to prove that a specific skill change is the reason there's little footage of a class. The people who do play her may just not be interested in recording and those who are interested in recording gameplay footage likely don't play her.
I get why people may be upset over the change since the bug fix will reduce her damage, but just because it's at it's intended value does not mean it won't be changed in the future.
opal cargo
The people who do play her may just not be interested in recording and those who are interested in recording gameplay footage likely don't play her.
nah if I literally have to pull out every video and youtube channel link with what region they're from or at least some kind of challenge raid video containing a Twilight that signifies region, you'll notice almost no KR challenge vid has a Twilight while a lot of others do have Twilight accepted as a viable character
Even the Rena channels from KR have stopped posting Twilight content when they regularly used to
hollow turtle
There's a lot of potential reasons for that. This one change is not the sole reason why people are not posting content unless there's evidence to support it.
opal cargo
Taiwan:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCU6RE3fBbIcmW-UZDJDBEXw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOVndDViqDs
https://www.youtube.com/@user-yd4dg1jd2h
Japan:
https://www.youtube.com/live/HC7G5cLhbng?feature=shared
INT:
https://www.youtube.com/@user-zu4bx2vm1u/streams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqwVuAnm2-U
KR:
https://www.youtube.com/@2voke_/videos (Rena player who mained Twilight but is now dead; used to be very active until the patch hit)
There was another Rena who had like 650-670 ERP but they deleted their channel or wiped out all their vids who basically did this not too long after the patch
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kI4xTZpWG4s (no Twilight)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bl7DqxYoIII (no Twilight)
https://www.youtube.com/@엔구 (no Twilight)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrf-QkzduRk (no Twilight)
Almost every KR speed run vid has not shown a Twilight
I already have plenty of livestreams that show where Twilight stands on my youtube channel as well with 335% per hit on mod Karma. It's not gamebreaking.
It's hard to prove that a specific skill change is the reason there's little footage of a class.
on what is supposed to be the class' main dps skill?
I think you know just as well as that making it sound as "oh it's just one change it shouldn't be a biggie" does not fly well if that one change is significant
hollow turtle
Again, it being the sole reason for lack of people making content is disingenuous. It's like saying "Fruit hasn't been selling well and it's because of oranges becoming smaller"
It being a reason can be a factor for sure, but not the only reason.
opal cargo
The results show
hollow turtle
There are multiple reasons for it as you're aware. Unless there's actual confirmation it is for that that reason, it's just speculative.
Like I said, I get why people may be upset over the change since the bug fix will reduce her damage, but just because it's at it's intended value does not mean it won't be changed in the future.