#dark tidings (Darktide for people in the searchbar)

1 messages · Page 27 of 1

regal pendant
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What are y'all's headcanons for your characters

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Like, personality, backstory, goals, shit like that

sonic elbow
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my ogryn has the fuckin

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academic background somehow

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so my headcanon is that he was sent there by bureaucratic mistake and kept graduating classes by bullying others to write for him

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his name is Bendik (big thinker name) and he has a forehead prayer tattoo (useful reminder)

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he ended up on the prison barge after the nerds he bullied lured him into an off-world shipping container

regal pendant
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Lmao that's the most 40k way to get thrown in jail I think I've ever heard

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"...is he... supposed to be here, sir...? He's not showing up in the prisoner manifest."

"You DARE question the will of the noble Judge??? If he is on the ship HE IS MEANT TO BE HERE!"

"Alright, alright! Fuck! Fine, I'll just fucking add him in I guess..."

heavy geyser
regal pendant
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oh my god damn

regal pendant
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What's the safest dump stat on the slab shield?

quiet escarp
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Ironically, defense

regal pendant
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What the fuck

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marsh gyro
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2 daemonhost 2 furious

fierce marten
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The illusion of choice, all paths lead to daemonhost

regal pendant
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On Psyker, should I run 2 toughness 1 health, 2 health 1 toughness, or all toughness for curios?

ionic tusk
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it depends on how you play and what you're most worried about

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but the cookie cutter loadout would probably be 2 toughness 1 stamina

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you don't need stamina as much on psyker but blocking is good (especially with kinetic deflection, having more max stamina will make it take less peril per damage)

ionic tusk
marsh gyro
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I like 1 stamina 1 toughness 1 wound with health/toughness/sprint efficiency as the perks

ionic tusk
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what build are you running it on? if you have a ton of instant on-demand toughness regen that warps how valuable each thing is imo

opaque crown
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i like running big toughness cause you can gain tough on heat gain, heat loss, and melee kill, plus whatever your allies are doing and if you have shield, static regen there too

waxen patio
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I use either 2 toughness 1 stamina or 3 toughness

split mantleBOT
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Keep in mind that Psykers have a I think keystone that means they can quell for toughness. Personally I run it, which makes me think toughness is.. Less good? Or is it more good?

dragon (she/her) ↩️

[Reply to:](#1159883850562932826 message) what build are you running it on? if you have a ton of instant on-demand toughness regen that warps …

ionic tusk
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it should make it more good since all toughness restore is % based
that one is a normal node though

they have a lot of toughness regen, it's the primary way they get tanky

sonic elbow
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the trade on that perk is rather poor outside of very specific builds

ionic tusk
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so more max toughness = more damage resisted per % of restore

ionic tusk
sonic elbow
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oh I read "quell for toughness" as in like

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wood for sheep

ionic tusk
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they're probably talking about this one

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sonic elbow
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I was thinking empyric resolve

ionic tusk
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psyker has so many decent toughness restores though

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(this isn't even all of them)

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anyway uh, the way I think about it
more max toughness = each attack takes away less % of your toughness
and since you still restore the same % of toughness even with a higher max, you shrug off attacks quicker

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it's not just the amount of damage you can take in one go, it helps with sustain

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(the only real exception to this is vet shout's modifier node which adds +50 flat ignoring cap- chorus heals % before adding gold toughness so it works as normal)

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so, having more max toughness actually makes vet shout less likely to bring you back to total protection range (I do not think this is significant enough to be a real downside though)

regal pendant
regal pendant
drowsy tusk
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(my game takes an abusrd amout of time to launch but im starting)

marsh gyro
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I'll be there in 30 minutes, it's tide noon
Edit: whoops, IRL came up, the enemy of the grimperor

drowsy tusk
regal pendant
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Lmaoooooooooooo

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I need to make a joke character sometime

fierce marten
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My Ogryn is named Jean-Steel-Ur

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He's just a funny guy

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My zealot is named KinswomanOfFight, legally distinct from sisters of battle

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17 character limit and no spaces hurt me

waxen patio
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Psyker's durability lies strongly in their ability to regenerate toughness and play footsies with good positioning, therefore toughness-maxxing and good stamina is key. Without toughness they're fragile babies, but when you have 160 toughness that you actively regenerate by fighting and killing and quelling and venting and so on you can be very hard to put down.

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unlike the other classes who can stack more toughness resistance, psyker just active-tanks by having "more toughness" through regenerating it

fierce marten
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I don't play psyker often but it looks loke a lot of it is don't make mistakes that'd that'd get burst your toughness down, generally true for most places but especially psyker they seem to get punished more for it

waxen patio
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accurate

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they're the closest thing to a glass cannon even in the most durable builds. you cannot face-tank crowds and stuff like the others, so you must be elusive in positioning and constantly either killing to generate toughness or quelling to generate toughness or critting to generate toughness or- you get the idea

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but when you're not neck deep in moebian ragers you can cause much havoc and valuable support and control effects

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everyone loves a good bubble shield after all

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or a smite that puts the entire room on pause

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for the love of god if you find yourself with a smite psyker please kill the enemies while they're stunned instead of picking your nose

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it's like when a zealot uses their flashy pulse thing over a downed ally and nobody takes two seconds to pick up the ally during this entirely unpunishable opportunity

spiral badger
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psyker is extreme feast or famine

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you're fucking invincible until you fuck up one time and then you're dead

regal pendant
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So I'm better off running 2 toughness 1 health then? As insurance for if I do fuck up/run into fifty billion ragers

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...god I fucking hate fighting ragers

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Like bro, stop FUCKING swinging

ionic tusk
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😔 I usually end up canceling and reviving myself
you can kinda do that with smite too if you use it in short bursts

waxen patio
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cool trick though, most psyker melee weapons can either push-stagger ragers (all the force weaponry) or just outright kill them with a weakspot hit (e.g. duelling sword, devil claw sword)

fierce marten
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Zealot pulse has the benefit of if your teammates decide to take a vacation the moment you pulse at least afterwards you got a buff and gold shields

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Smite if your team is slapping poxwalkers youre only in a slightly better situation

waxen patio
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on the other hand a proper smite-build (there's only like, one) enables the team to handle some ridiculously dangerous missions due to perma-stunning everything short of monstrosities with ridiculous uptime

fierce marten
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What's the keystone on the one you think is the one build

waxen patio
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iirc it's smite + venting shriek + empowered psionics

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you can venting shriek while actively channeling smite to draw it out longer and also stack soulblaze as well

fierce marten
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Ah yes that one, im a decent fan of enpowered psionics smite as makes it be able to kill a walker during a smite, not the most amazing ad clear when flame staff exists, but you can spam it and kill reliably att least.

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And of course the big cc

waxen patio
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yeah it's not ever especially good for damage but the crowd control is undeniable

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if you practice not relying on the charge-up channel it's actually pretty flexible, just LMB an enemy to stun them and swap back to melee/ranged weapon

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also LMB smite can one-tap explode poxbursters from long range, very safe

fierce marten
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Poxburster is the big thing for imo for that build

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Being able to stun and kill a trapper or other specialists you cant see in a horde is nice

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Like the infamous trapper behind bulwark group wall

regal pendant
regal pendant
drowsy vine
regal pendant
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I see

vapid anvil
sonic elbow
twin wasp
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indeed

regal pendant
waxen patio
regal pendant
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Nice to finally have my crusher armor back

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Got a nice fur collar to go along with it too

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I need to try and figure out if I can change the color of it... white might go well with this armor

regal pendant
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Double barrel on tha ogryn

opaque crown
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??

regal pendant
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Weapon customization mod

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Lets you transform the Thumper into the most Super of Shotguns

regal pendant
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YEEEEEEEEEEEEEAH THE MF SQUAD

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finite nymph
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Kront infiltrating the Death Star, they'll never see him coming

opaque crown
regal pendant
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THE BOYS EMERGE VICTORIOUS

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YA CAN'T STOP AN OGRYN SQUAD

regal pendant
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Holy shit it's Mario

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split mantleBOT
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And a heretic!

regal pendant
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What?? Nooooooooooo, spark 'ead could NEVER be hairy tick!

regal pendant
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WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS 😭

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ionic tusk
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smaller model using ogyrn size anims, it looks like

regal pendant
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That or the Ogryn's had to skimp on rations

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Speaking of Ogryns, anything y'all would advise for this fit?

Ogryn.png
opaque crown
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Anything how?

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Like weapons?

regal pendant
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Any accessories, armor bits, colors, anything that'd make it look even better

opaque crown
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I think a different helmet or no helmet would look neat. More Gothic knight than Nurgle champ

regal pendant
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Hm, true

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Maybe that other crusher helmet...

regal pendant
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That DOES look a bit better, honestly, you had the right idea

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regal pendant
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Y'know what'd be a nice feature

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If you could like

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Shoot bulwarks through the little slot in their shields

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That way if you don't have grenades or a flamethrower or something that can bypass them you aren't stuck waiting for them to give you an opening to do literally any damage

marsh gyro
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Shooting/punching the shield with enough impact rating will open them up for a hit by knocking them back, easiest done with a bolter, though ammo expensive

opaque crown
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i think you can slap/uppercut them out of the way?

marsh gyro
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Yeah on Ogryn you can angle your slaps towards their right / your left

regal pendant
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I use a pickaxe

marsh gyro
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Borovian or Karsolas can do the yank over the top easy then, Branx can just angle a heavy over the top

regal pendant
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...can it now...?

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I've tried it before and it never works

marsh gyro
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Testing in the psykhanium right now, on Branx looks like what the score is is you gotta tag to the left or right of the shield with the heavy and hit an shoulder/arm poking out, the center of the shield is super tall for blocking the hit

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Three bonks with the Branx special on a left side melee ogryn will pop the front shield open though

regal pendant
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I see

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Thanks Clem, that's quite handy

regal pendant
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Jesus CHRIST that's a big grutting axe

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regal pendant
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...am I playing it wrong or is it just unreasonably hard to get Toughness back as Ogryn

marsh gyro
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Did you take the toughness regen on melee hit nodes or the toughness regen on braced aim nodes? If not, check out inspiring barrage, confident hit, or slow and steady blessings

regal pendant
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I do have toughness on braced aim

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And on melee

marsh gyro
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All the active abilities have ways to get toughness too - which one are you using?

regal pendant
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But like, it feels like when it gets broken, it STAYS broken unless there isn't a single ranged unit out and about

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Because for some fucking reason I get hit with one salvo from some random grunt and it shreds like 1/10 of my toughness

marsh gyro
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How much total do you have? This affects regen scaling

regal pendant
regal pendant
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...goddamn look at this shovel I got from an end of mission drop

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drowsy tusk
ionic tusk
# regal pendant And on melee

I think you only have the 'hit multiple with same swing' melee so be careful to do that (I checked earlier today with inspect from social)

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but note that, aside from ability use, psyker is the only class really able to generate all their toughness back on demand

marsh gyro
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Oh yeah if you have to only pick 1 of the ogryn melee toughness nodes get the single target one because it's a more common situation; I like to have both

regal pendant
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Right, right

ionic tusk
regal pendant
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Finally have a robo-hand for my vet

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fierce marten
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If they die go to the nearest prison barge

ionic tusk
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true

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but I mean either from the respawn points or new players after repeated ragequits

fierce marten
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I know it's an entirely gameplay conceit but my head canon is the respawn totems are other rejects that were captured and about to become part of a ritual to be like daemonhost or whatever and we rescue them

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Why those random rejects just happen to be having the same equipment and skillset as the last reject who died? Emperor protects

ionic tusk
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although they probably couldn't become demonhosts if they weren't psykers right? but lots of other horrible uses I bet

fierce marten
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Probably, there's maybe some latent psykers but probably many sacrificial uses, daemons are easier to handle if they've got captive playthings

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I am not entirely unconvinced the veteran or zealot isn't a latent psyker

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Veteran is like a mini yarrick and zealot whatever the saints got being high on faith.

ionic tusk
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maybe an emperor shard is just very active on atoma or something

fierce marten
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They also got a holy relic

ionic tusk
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well. given the psykers rambling about their beloved, it probably is

fierce marten
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Considering in the intro we were prisoners with nothing, zealot found a holy relic randomly on atoma or the ship

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So maybe it was the emperors will

ionic tusk
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I think each time a zealot with a holy relic dies it just gets picked up by the next zealot that goes there (and then dies); eventually one is good enough to survive

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the way I see it, every death is canonical

fierce marten
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That's a good one

ionic tusk
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you just don't have to roguelike back up from level 0

fierce marten
ionic tusk
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but thematically every body you throw at a mission is someone who did everything you did to level them up to that point before dying and getting replaced by someone nearby (who just has your talents and gear for gameplay reasons)

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kinda like helldivers
but with more training and successful missions involved

fierce marten
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It's probably more effort than it's worth but having a helldivers randomization option but your cosmetic loadout but be neat

ionic tusk
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I think there's a mod for that in darktide, only between missions tho

fierce marten
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I have many fits but too lazy to swap between them but want to show them off

ionic tusk
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make each one a different loadout

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then play the loadouts sequentially

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I don't fashion much but I have subtle differences so I can tell which loadout I'm playing lmao

fierce marten
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I already have a lot of loadouts I have too many ideas

ionic tusk
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just link them to fashion! whatever has the closest vibes

fierce marten
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I have more loadouts than fashion I like unfortunately

ionic tusk
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for example my benediction havoc zealot has armor plates but my beacon havoc zealot has handwraps because less armor more support

fierce marten
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Zealot only having like a 3 pair of pants that isn't just entirely cloth gets me

ionic tusk
ionic tusk
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I've been wearing the havoc pants since I got them

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and just finally unlocked another pair of armored pants

fierce marten
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There's only one I have the one that has the chain mail square on the upper left leg

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The rest are like just armored knee pads

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I also don't really hunt for achievements

ionic tusk
ionic tusk
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mortis is very silly

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if the enemies rolled aren't scary on their own or combo it's pathetically easy up until like wave 10

if they combo though it's really intense
or if it's something that's dangerous solo like sniper or trapper

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sometimes it will just do like. here have both flamers and 30 poxwalkers

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othertimes it's. here have 20 scab ragers, scab gunners, and scab maulers each; hope you're ready for the fight of your life

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but then you'll get "here have some bombers but nothing to actually combo with the zoning"

fierce marten
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I haven't played much since Mortis came out

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It's been a while

marsh gyro
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It's good blasting in all the modes these days, party finder provides

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I am spoiled by the ogryn buffs of course because running full speed while charging heavy melee kind of rules and other classes have to actually bob and weave

fierce marten
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I do like bobbing and weaving

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And dislike spamming heavy attack, unfortunately besides like gungryn it's the opposite of my ideal class

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But I'm glad Ogyrn got buffed, every class should feel as strong as zealot

regal pendant
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I am far too fancy for a reject

Psyker_3.png
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Type of shit a Rogue Trader wears

fierce marten
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Modded fit not canon

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Canon is we're only allowed pants

regal pendant
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But John Warhammer himself says that everything is canon

opaque crown
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I do like how the ogryn rework gives love to light attacks, I have buddies who just refuses to heavy as ogryn and it was painful

regal pendant
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The present fits for me crew. Quite proud of em tbh.

Veteran.png Zealot.png Psyker_3.png Ogryn_2.png
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...do think I should figure out a different color for my Vet's pants though, black shirt and black jeans is too uniform for my taste

ionic tusk
ionic tusk
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tbh I haven't really used heavy attacks out of those weapons because I could never get them to hit anything when it mattered, only in the lab

fierce marten
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Sort of opposite, you go faster while holding up heavy on combat blade and dueling sword

ionic tusk
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I do charge heavies on the dueling sword a lot but for fun, I should test how faster it makes you

fierce marten
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So DS was unnoticed for a while

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Combat blade you get the fov change and effects to see you're faster

ionic tusk
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what happens when you slide while charging (because that's what I do)

fierce marten
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DS doesn't but if someone watches you they can notice you're faster

ionic tusk
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sliding lowers overall speed but massively increases stamina efficiency

fierce marten
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So there's no signs for you that you're going faster, but a player watching you will see you are going slightly but noticeably faster

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I also do slide and charge

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I get anxious about stamina but also I mostly play zealot so it's a habit to ignore bullets

ionic tusk
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I run out of stamina a lot because I'm an agile addict and dodgespam everywhere which cancels the regen

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and since I basically never have to stop to get dodges back, my stamina doesn't come back

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I run 3 stamina regen minor curio perks to help but well. if you're not regenning in the first place they do nothing lol

fierce marten
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Wow I didn't realize, that explains why I need to conserve stamina a lot even with stamina curio.

I dodge a lot though since zealot kit really leans hard on dodging

ionic tusk
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if you don't have agile it shouldn't be that bad since you still need to stop to regen the dodges

fierce marten
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I don't usually take Agile, although thrust and Agile is fun, zealot has many just like ways to buy a second to get dodges back

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Veteran I do thrust and Agile

ionic tusk
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as soon as your dodges come back it should be when the stamina regen starts afaik?
I thinkkkk that's consistent across talents and classes but honestly idk

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since that would mean psyker and two talent vet do it a lot quicker

fierce marten
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Probably, a big difference is dodge resets completely while stamina regens

ionic tusk
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yeah

fierce marten
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So I'm basically always dodging the second I get it back and barely ever regen stamina

ionic tusk
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yeah

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the main important thing is to know dodging halts stamina regen

fierce marten
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That would explain why I struggle with stamina more on Ogyrn and veteran, probably dodging more than I should

ionic tusk
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veteran has an outrageously long stamina delay

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iirc it's one full second

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and zealot has .75

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psyker (and two talent vet) have .5 which is fast enough to regain stamina back when sliding (net gain if done perfectly or with some curio perks to help)

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looks like ogyrn has the same delay as vet

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if my theory is incorrect and dodges have their own fixed recharge time, then it'd be even worse for stamina

ionic tusk
ionic tusk
regal pendant
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"Aw geez how am I ever gonna be able to tell how good my Internet connection is?"

The ever reliable WiFi bar:

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marsh gyro
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Ogryn Cleavers are super neat with either heavy or light attacks, I'm finding the bull butcher mk3 to be the heaviest heavies

opaque crown
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oh is bull butcher back?

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ive still been using hte krourk

marsh gyro
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Krourk Mk4 is great for the lights and has the vertical choppy heavies, and the Mk6 is a good balance between AoE and single target

frigid saffron
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I really like the Mk 6 because of its nutty single target you can get with tenderizer

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and yeah- the very easy push -> heavy -> light -> [repeat last two] aoe combo

rocky dagger
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<@&1042950387478560878> tideing?

drowsy tusk
split mantleBOT
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we can be on in like,,,, 10-15?

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do one without us

regal pendant
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How does one deal with crushers/maulers as a vet sans Krak nades

drowsy tusk
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Shovel, frags, revolver,plasma

marsh gyro
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What melee and what ranged are you using because both have ways to bust them good depending on rending

drowsy tusk
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Chain axe

marsh gyro
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Maulers in particular have a weakness to bleed stacks from shredders

drowsy tusk
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Boltgun/pistol

marsh gyro
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Crushers have to get a little more creative, like a Helbore with Armourbane blessing can do two charged shots and that's enough brittleness to bayonet the crusher down

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Combat axe with brutal momentum / thunderous is a good versatile backup too

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Autoguns / recon lasguns can actually burn down crushers if you have the brittleness stacks on continuous hit node

drowsy tusk
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Light inf autogun can generally spray down anything you point it at

marsh gyro
ionic tusk
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obligatory dueling sword mention vs armor

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not entirely vet but I have discovered some whacky implications of carapace head and flak body
the zealot's knife does way more damage to the body than the head (still awful though)
so I'd suggest going into training mode and testing if any weapons you use are the same

ionic tusk
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and also shredders are still great vs crushers even without rending in that the stagger from the explosion can knock them down

regal pendant
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Did end up swapping to bolt pistol from revolver

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Feels much nicer, and Extended Weapon Customization let me turn it into basically that one super long pistol from Hellsing

ionic tusk
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both should be good vs armor, although the revolver will probably be way better due to having access to hand cannon and surgical (or alternatively the other mark which requires a different blessing set)

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the bolt pistol has more general use and should be more adaptable

regal pendant
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Nah, bolt pistol has innate AP

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Punches through carapace like flak and flak like cardboard

ionic tusk
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they both do, hand cannon is just insane

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even post nerf

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(+60% rending on critical hits, plus blessing to always ensure a critical hit given some time spent aiming)

regal pendant
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I unfortunately prefer the other mark

ionic tusk
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that one has a different blessing for critical hits

regal pendant
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Even though it sucks shit through a straw and is possibly one of the worst guns in the game

ionic tusk
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that rewards fanning the hammer

regal pendant
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Crucian Roulette, yeah

regal pendant
ionic tusk
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zarona revolver is definitely clunky as hell though, weapon specialist makes it bearable

regal pendant
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It needs something, idk what but it just needs a buff to something

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Maybe just less spread

ionic tusk
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I think it's role is massively downplayed by the meta right now and is kinda questionable in the first place

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it's a close range armor deleter

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but ranged horde deletion is super strong right now

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and you'd probably want to use a melee at close range anyways if it's not instant win, because it does cost ammo

regal pendant
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Even then it's only really good for flak armor, and there's only really two flak enemies that warrant having anti-armor for

marsh gyro
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Braced revolver rules at burst damage on single target and deleting individual scab/dreg shooters

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It having double the ammo pretty much of the zarona revolver helps in extended missions

regal pendant
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It IS good for burst damage but the aimed one is far better for getting picks

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That's its entire identity is being able to whip it out and pop someone's head in a moment's notice

ionic tusk
regal pendant
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Yeah, the spread on the braced one is atrocious

ionic tusk
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you can also whip the zarona out and it'll usually kill something in one shot anyways
if you get unlucky you'll have to shoot again

ionic tusk
marsh gyro
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My three builds that use the braced revolver are

  1. Eviscerator Zealot
  2. Disrupt Destiny Force Sword Psyker with 100% more cleave
  3. Power Sword melee specialist Vet

and the general loop is to melee most things and to just pop off 1-2 rounds into gunners that look mean

ionic tusk
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also if you're on wamly, I'm also on but a bit discombobulated

regal pendant
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Holy shit dude go back to boot camp 😭

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regal pendant
tough compass
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I am totally ok with the gunners not being sent back to boot camp. Just skip drilling for them as well; that would be great

regal pendant
ionic tusk
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sorry about stealing all your revives clem lmao

marsh gyro
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Because it had been a moment since I'd played non-Ogryn, I forgot the secret sauce on Braced Revolver was Run 'n' Gun blessing to tighten the spread

marsh gyro
ionic tusk
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I figure I either get the rez or I don't and figure out what's interrupting it while pausing the bleedout timer

ionic tusk
marsh gyro
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Thrust / Sunder on the Power Sword Scandar is one of my favorite combos these days

ionic tusk
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and build up

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so you'll turn a corner and see 12 scab gunners shooting at a wall, constantly generating particles

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honestly
just as deadly as them actually shooting at you

ionic tusk
ionic tusk
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agile tac ace notable for doing that better but at the cost of your ears since you'll be clanging carapace armor with lights

marsh gyro
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Agile Precognition is the juice

ionic tusk
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I think uncanny is better for vet due to generating rending for shredders but I'm not sure

opaque crown
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late to the discussion, but i found the chainaxe to be just great for maulers and crushers

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the one that has rev on light

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you can just spam it

#

not as good for massive crowds of em

#

thats where you spam shredders

fierce marten
#

I like combat knife but dueling sword has nicer blessings as I never really spec into bleeding

#

Dueling sword has like mostly all the good generalist blessings

ionic tusk
#

does it have thrust?
uncanny/agile/precog is already a power triple though

#

the baseline for it is also broken
it can't do hordeclear and the stamina boost is bad

but everything else is like. S tier to A tier at worst

#

(and it's held up on the hordeclear front by all the overperforming ranged hordeclear options, otherwise that would be a significant downside)

fierce marten
#

Yea DS has thrust

#

That the 4 you mentioned basically are amazing and fit on any build

ionic tusk
#

and then uncanny brings shredder builds to the next level and precog brings fury cooldown bypassing builds to the next level

#

agile wins defense (as long as you have access to heads and they aren't blocked by the massive horde you can't clear with melee) and thurst grants reliable more damage

#

I love it though
it's cheese
but I hate the attack patterns every other weapon has and I dislike fighting hordes directly anyways 💀
so I hope they don't nerf it into the ground too hard

marsh gyro
#

I think if they were gonna nerf it I think they would've at this point

ionic tusk
#

I've heard they're discussing nerfs internally

#

but the darktide community seems to be torn between sending death threats to get it nerfed and death threats to prevent it from being nerfed if how they treat content creators is any indication of how they treat devs

fierce marten
#

The heavy poke attack pattern is great considering it's just poke poke

ionic tusk
#

yeah I love that

#

more weapons should have thrusting attacks and very simple, consistent attack patterns

#

and small profiles so they block less of the screen

fierce marten
#

At least for ranged weapons I know theres a mod that makes them take less space on a screen hip firing

ionic tusk
#

there's just so much coincidental qol in the weapon that doesn't really directly elevate it's power level but makes it usable without mod assistance (for transparency, attack pattern reminders, etc etc) or a morbillion hours of training

fierce marten
#

Bolter is quite literally one of the biggest offenders of that

ionic tusk
#

I personally think melees are a bigger problem because you hold them when running a lot more and some of the animations have the flat side of the weapon (looking at you force greatsword) face the camera

#

it blocks out the entire top left of your screen or something funky like that

fierce marten
#

That's fair, Melee weapons would be a bit harder to adjust as a mod since while swinging the size matters for swing patterns and being accurate with hitboxes. I don't imagine darktide was meant to be modded it was just a modders miracle they did and fatshark didn't care to police it that much

ionic tusk
#

I think I've seen some videos of all weapons having transparency

ionic tusk
#

I think the entire game is also lua
so in practice the entire thing is a mod 😆

#

they do intentionally try to not mess up modders afaik 🤔

fierce marten
#

Thats moreso on Roblox pushing Lua moddability beyond many other scripting languages and every square inch of Lua has been looked at for roblox games and it extends to anything made with it, like Bethesdas engines got so much eyes on it scouring code to mod it the heavy lifting was already done for you

sonic elbow
#

the furtive gmod, so easily forgotten

fierce marten
#

Oh right and source engine

ionic tusk
#

"everything is tables" is all lua has ever been pitched to me as

fierce marten
#

If you make a game that uses source engine, lua, or somehow besthedta engine it's basically inherently moddable you'd have to try to make it unmoddable otherwise its probably moddable

ionic tusk
#

anyway
on a "qol mod that changes everything" tangent
this is one of my favorite mods
https://www.nexusmods.com/warhammer40kdarktide/mods/376

Nexus Mods :: Warhammer 40,000: Darktide
Barrel Warning

Tired of getting killed by barrels because you couldn't hear them?This changes barrels to play Poxburster sounds to reflect how dangerous they truly are.

#

new problem: you can't tell if it's a poxburster or a barrel
is this problem worse than not knowing when barrels are exploding? no

#

they do make a noise base game but it's not very noticeable

fierce marten
#

I got that mod too lol

#

Saves my life on the infamous bridges

#

They will yeet you into death

ionic tusk
#

but it feels kinda cheaty, especially with the demonhost and poxbursters on

fierce marten
#

Oh whoa what I've never seen that one

ionic tusk
#

it's not perfect but it is very good

#

rn I just have the active fire aoes, barrels, and already-shot flamers on

#

but even if I decide it's too cheaty for me later I think it'll probably keep the indicators for fire barrel fire on so I can actually tell if it's bypass-toughness-fire or scab bomber fire @.@

#

the former also includes scab flamer explosions most likely due to code reuse, I'm p sure the dreg flamers don't do that

#

it always feels like a fine line to walk for me
because each qol thing I add that is reasonable does significantly increase how well I play, but I don't feel guilty for "the hud is more readable" "the sound you're supposed to be able to hear you can hear"
but some feel like they solve gameplay itself rather than bad ui/sound choices

fierce marten
#

It's a strong argument for a very controversial mod, spidey senses

#

That many dangerous audio cues just don't play or are too quiet to hear reasonably depending on what else is making sounds

#

As there's sort of a soft limit on the number of sounds that can play at once so you don't hear 50 pox walkers

#

My favorite is delayed audio hound, the pounce noise playing after it's on someone, if I didn't have a chronic side dodging habit especially when I hear the hound howl, I would have been pounced.

ionic tusk
#

I seem to have some ultra instinct for hounds and block them after they jump, and I have no idea how I get away with it

ionic tusk
sonic elbow
#

I was a bit of a roamer in vermintide so my gutter runner insticts are overkill for hounds

ionic tusk
#

my ears are currently dying and I might end up using it (I currently don't but had to turn off music)

sonic elbow
#

not that it helps when hounds get up to some bullshit with phasing through hordes in ways that hookrats could only dream of, but

ionic tusk
#

my advice for hounds and trappers is to dodge and spam push at the same time

#

trappers do get staggered by pushing if you end up in their face (which makes it really hard to dodge)

#

hounds in general are really forgiving though
both in terms of them hitting you when you're not dodging, and them not hitting you when you're dodging

#

like. the hound's hitbox physically pushing you post-miss is very common

regal pendant
#

Does a +3 stamina curio do anything meaningful for a psyker that uses Kinetic Deflection?

ionic tusk
#

yes

#

it decreases the amount of peril gained by kinetic deflection (lemmie get the post about this), lets them shove more (which kinetic deflection doesn't help with and I think is kinda agony to have very low), and also mobility management (although if you just slide everywhere psyker doesn't have to really care about max stamina for that)

#

(stamina damage * 0.25 / Max Stamina)%
peril gain is 25% of the % of stamina you took- so having more stamina makes the stamina damage you took a lower percent relative to the larger stamina pool

so if you had 1 max stamina and took 1 stamina worth of damage, you would get 25% peril. but if you had 4 stamina, it would be ~6% peril damage
this obviously varies greatly based on how much stamina your weapon has (although I think that doesn't apply when you are reviving, which is the case kinetic deflection is most needed)

https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkTide/comments/10f6m71/comment/j4x4upn/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkTide/comments/10dzfgk/comment/j4qtumq/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

regal pendant
#

Fascinating

ionic tusk
#

I have played dueling sword psyker with no stamina curios and you only get like 4 pushes which kinda sucks for dogs
but most weapons have more than that so it's not as much of an issue

still, optimized kinetic deflection lets you revive in melee enemies' faces to an absurd degree

regal pendant
#

Oh yeah, it's fun just ignoring the shit out of a big horde while you pick someone up

ionic tusk
#

like, "ignore a crusher or mauler" degree
(although that can be problematic if you finish reviving when the crusher is crushing you and the person you're reviving instadies)

#

but uh, there's actually a huge tech you can do that greatly helps with reviving on all classes!

#

if you're near a wall or other obstacle, get close to it
the game works on a slot system so putting your 'back to a wall' (figuratively, the direction doesn't matter) actually does meaningfully reduce the number of enemies that can attack you

#

sorry I'm on a bit of a tangent but revive optimization is so cool to me

#

+stamina regen (minor curio perk) also seems to help with reviving outside of kinetic deflection since you're regaining stamina while reviving- combined with the wall tech, you can reviving in insane locations as long as there's not a rager, mauler, crusher, or gunner attacking you (gunner can be mitigated somewhat with gold toughness beforehand) [specials make it straight up impossible usually though]
+block efficiency (minor curio perk) does help kinetic deflection also (I can't remember if it double dips or not, though)

#

oh apparently psyker actually does have 1 base stamina lmao
was just trying to do a simple example

regal pendant
#

...why does he only have like four guns for sale

image.png
regal pendant
#

Is it better to run block efficiency or +stamina on my sword, actually?

marsh gyro
ionic tusk
#

my personal preference is just to get enough stamina to be able to run around and spam push without micromanaging it and then get +damage

#

how much stamina does the sword have base, and are you running a curio to boost your stamina?

#

oh I'm looking at the dueling sword's stats and I confused precognition for another blessing lmao

#

I was thinking of riposte

#

gameslantern page doesn't include the base stamina the weapon has tho 😔

#

weapons do have stamina though, pretty sure (although I think that doesn't apply when reviving, and instead there's like some. unequipped stamina bonus??? it's cursed, like how auspexes have a large stamina bonus)
otherwise a single +3 stamina curio would be a 4x to how much a psyker can block both normally and with kinetic deflection

marsh gyro
regal pendant
#

Are smoke grenades any good on their own or do you need to build around them?

marsh gyro
#

They rule and you can sustain them good just with the 5% grenade on elite kill node

#

You see a big pack of shooters in the background and you can tell them "nope"

regal pendant
#

Yeah I heard they prevent shooters from targeting whoever's in the smoke

#

They feel kind of a bit small though

#

The radius I mean

ionic tusk
#

also you can grief with them by obscuring melee enemies

spiral badger
#

so smoke grenades are a little confusion

#

confusing

#

what they do is create a zone where enemy line of sight is broken

#

enemies on the opposite side of any part of the smoke cannot draw a line of fire to you

ionic tusk
#

they're kinda just super discount psyker bubble shield ime

spiral badger
#

so you can place them between you and the shooters, on the shooters, or on yourself

#

well no the thing that they do that psyker bubbles don't is 1. they can't be broken, obviously and 2. they force enemies to approach

#

the regular shooty enemies will actively advance toward you in smoke, because they're trying to redraw line of sight

#

this also explains some of the odd behavior you might see with gunners/reapers

#

who will continuously fire on the last known LOS to someone who enters/gets behind smoke

#

so if you're already being shot by a reaper and drop smoke on yourself, the spray from teh reaper will continue hitting you

#

if you don't move

regal pendant
#

Ah, I see

spiral badger
#

this means in terms of application the best use of smoke is advancing

#

drop it between you and the shooters and move toward them and into it

ionic tusk
#

(you can do this with bubble also)

regal pendant
#

So just yuck some smoke at em and bumrush em with a sword?

spiral badger
#

yep

regal pendant
#

Any use for them beyond breaking gunner LoS?

fierce marten
#

I don't imagine it does, but do smoke grenades affect daemonhost at all

#

I've never seen anyone really use them let alone try it near a daemonhost

#

It'd be funny if you could smoke them and just run past without worry of triggering it from being close

regal pendant
#

Plot twist, they're laced with a strain of zaza that exclusively affects warp daemons

fierce marten
#

Daemonhost, despite having horrific rituals done to their entire bodies to invite a warp entity, has very sensitive eyes and dries easily leading to anger that would make khorne shudder

#

Smoke feels bad in eyes

spiral badger
#

managed to do havoc 40 on the new style
14 deaths but a strong team that didn't panic when someone got got and just kept moving

heavy geyser
#

Bolt Pistol is like the best of both worlds between both kinds of revolver.

#

I big recommend throwing Run & Gun on there with your choice of second blessing.

#

If you use any kind of explosive grenade, Lethal Proximity makes its effect 25% larger

ionic tusk
#

I am lucky to have people who no-life the game harder than I do to run with tho lmao

#

I feel like the most significant factor to any darktide mission is gonna be how the team rallies around each other to either protect or take advantage of circumstance

fierce marten
#

Not unsurprising that harder content has better players past like damnation

#

If they weren't good they would not likely climb to havoc 40 relying on the chances of being carried

ionic tusk
#

ehhhh
people play this game like it's a slot machine

#

and I really don't think 4 of me could beat a havoc 40 tbh

ionic tusk
opaque crown
#

I haven't played at that level but I get the impression it's less about which class you play and more about knowing how to play your class and your teamwork

regal pendant
#

...wish the smoke nades were more responsive

#

Rather than pulling them out and having to wait to actually throw it

opaque crown
#

Imagine throwing nades like the zealot throws knives

heavy geyser
#

the one that should have an option to throw like that is Ogryn rocks

fierce marten
#

Zealot knives being super convenient ruins the other blitz for me

#

Cause as a blitz, fitting for the name, it's extremely fast and rarely interrupts your flow.

#

If I get net by a trapper and it was in front of me I feel like if I could as faster I could have knifed it

opaque crown
#

For me it's just hard to give up the zone control of the flame nade

fierce marten
#

In a way, similar, I usually almost always take flamer

#

You just get more and more value out of it on havoc as you go up

sonic elbow
#

did they make flame nade scale better in recent times

ionic tusk
# opaque crown I haven't played at that level but I get the impression it's less about which cl...

I would say it heavily depends on subclass rather than actual class
there's overlap on how classes can do important things, but not every build really... contributes meaningfully to havoc

a shredder/shout vet fights mixed hordes and increases team survivability, a flame staff/bubble psyker fights hordes and increases team survivability, a flamer/chorus zealot fights mixed hordes and increases team survivability, a rumbler/taunt ogyrn... you get the point
but exe stance/scier's gaze don't really contribute anything besides 'kill better' and I simply do not think they offer kill better enough to offset the team benefits of the other abilities (who still run very respectable dps)
similar deal with stealth because going down in the first place is bad

I've seen venting shriek and zealot's charge more, but personally don't feel like they do the massive number change needed to offset a team benefit

and ammo still sucks. either you have a survivalist vet or have 2-3 people not really care about finding ammo and leave it for the last peeps

#

oh and ogyrn charge does enough cc to be a different category of "good" than the example one I provided
(similar to shriek, shout, and chorus if spammed)

#

🤔 although I supposed taunt is also that

ionic tusk
ionic tusk
fierce marten
#

Oh right, I have that but never used it

#

I haven't played vet since

#

I have the autoinject stim one too

#

I set it up so Quick press will self inject, hold button to take it out normally for others. Really up'd my usage of stims

#

Since it seems no one really uses them ever besides the health ones

ionic tusk
#

I really like concentration stims and will usually try to pawn off health stims on other players lol

fierce marten
#

Same for me unless I'm real bad

#

I'm rarely ever real bad, it's either perfectly healthy or dead

#

The red and blue I like

ionic tusk
#

sometimes I'm safer at 1hp being super paranoid than I am at max running around and getting stuck in crushers 😆

ionic tusk
#

just because I often die in really dumb spots

fierce marten
#

For me it's the specialists, I've never really had issues with crushers cause either stealth zealot is the dummy one tap back spams, or chorus in range to stagger them and someone usually bursts down crusher packs before its over

ionic tusk
#

I confess I am a specialist stabbing addict

fierce marten
#

I usually don't go down, and that's not really a skill thing but moreso the builds I play are fairly defensive and if things are bad enough I go down as a chorus or stealth zealot which are 2 of the most avoid BS deaths build in the game it's almost always a wipe.

#

Or I'm not able to be rez'd

ionic tusk
#

the most bs deaths are knockup into no ledgegrab imo

#

a lot of barrels really blend in + silent poxbursters hitting you at the most cursed angles

fierce marten
#

Yea that is merciless I use that pox walker barrel sound mod for that reason

ionic tusk
#

that doesn't help when an ally double whacks it with a knife :p

#

or when you double whack it with a knife
the hitboxes feel so generous when they're used against us....

fierce marten
#

I use bolter when I get tilted by barrels so I have a gun to shoot them before the team gets there

#

I'm using my powers as a zealot to run ahead to explode barrels

ionic tusk
#

🫡

#

my havoc group occasionally just does that before events lol
run around and pre-explode all the barrels

#

we usually miss some
and on some maps there's just so many (gloriana) that it's kinda not worth it out of the main path

fierce marten
#

The only ones I mostly fear are near ledges

#

I remember many of the spawn points that have killed me, and before havoc I skipped auric with barrel mods

ionic tusk
#

I've also managed to dodge off of stairs into instant death a few times
somehow

fierce marten
#

Oh I get that too it's not just me apparently

#

Is it for you as well the stairs without railing

#

Cause normally you need a stupid amount of knockback and you'll just teleport 10 feet to the ledge, but those stairs going up/down that go off the edge it seems to not see the stairs as an edge

#

So I can really just walk off it and the game is like, die

ionic tusk
#

I did it in the cogitator array once or twice which was really funny because everyone was there as I just tried to dodge a melee enemy but yeet'd myself
and then like 3 seconds later "wait how'd you die?"

#

"you were just right next to me"

fierce marten
#

I'll admit I'm super spoiled by the edge save

#

My ledge awareness is poor

#

And I naturally lean towards dodging to the left and that's often the ledge side

ionic tusk
#

I've gotten better after finding the 1 meters of railing gaps enough times

#

but it still happens esp. when I'm tired lol

fierce marten
#

Oh the railing gaps

#

That bridge after the tree

#

I falk into it more often than I like

#

There's just so few bridges that make an actual small gap in the middle, it's often like the whole bridge section is out so you won't even think to cross it

#

Or it's a gap you can safely fall into the under sections

marsh gyro
regal pendant
#

How much of a difference does +5% toughness DR make on psyker?

waxen patio
#

about +5% or so :v
more is gonna be better cuz psyker active-tanks with toughness regeneration methods, so you need to look at what the opportunity cost is for taking that +5% DR

marsh gyro
#

The more toughness DR you have the better it gets - you can get 33% from peril, 20% from scrier's gaze, about 25% from the tree for about 78% reduction if you spec hard for it

regal pendant
#

Hm

#

Makes sense

#

I'm mostly trying to figure out if a whole 5% extra toughness DR is worth taking Assail over Brainburst for

marsh gyro
#

Assail vs Brain Burst I think would be more a question if you want the 100% cleave node on the right and also what ranged you're taking

regal pendant
#

Inferno stave

marsh gyro
#

You'll probably want brain burst more for the range then

regal pendant
#

...ugh

#

Wish it wasn't set up so that one specific blitz makes you lose out on more toughness DR

waxen patio
#

yeah when it comes to the blitz choice it's mostly a matter of what each one does for your given kit

#

inferno staff is going to be abysmal at range and vs heavy single targets so brainburst fills that hole nicely, although assail can be serviceable if it's not like crushers or something

regal pendant
#

I do have my force greatsword

marsh gyro
#

Whether you're running Warp Charges or Enhanced Psionics you'll have toughness for days with fire staff

regal pendant
#

And my Inferno stave has the one blessing that inflicts Brittleness

#

So crushers don't tend to be hugely threatening

ionic tusk
#

but also them not stacking additively doesn't mean they're not great
a 33% reduction is still a 33% reduction on the damage you take even if you're taking less

ionic tusk
# regal pendant Wish it wasn't set up so that one specific blitz makes you lose out on more toug...

I still think psyker's tree is just poorly designed there, because conversely assail locks you off from psykinetic's aura
they buffed assail, buffed maleific momentum (one of the mutually exclusive things from psykinetic's aura) and nerfed psykinetic's aura

and it's still probably one of the best nodes in the entire game right now (although it's power level is heavily dictated by the ability meta also)

waxen patio
#

never not running %cooldown curios on top of psy.aura

#

the screamiest sparkhead

ionic tusk
#

with 5% it's not super noticeable tbh

#

but here's the math of close order drill (if it's linear) which gives up to +33% to highlight the effect

image.png
#

the reason it works like this is because each additive amount has less total value to decrease from
so it decreases a higher % of the percent remaining
and I am just realizing I did a really poor job of explaining this because percent is used too many times

ionic tusk
#

one with the warp, for example, is minimum 10% even at 0% peril
which is still better even if it didn't scale with peril

#

you might want to look at how +flat toughness goes on your build though
pskyer has 5 +15 toughnesses and 75 base toughness

image.png
#

which, revisiting the last chart

image.png
#

(if anyone would be so kind as to sanity check my math that would be appreciated lmao)

#

this does mean a +flat toughness should always be more valuable than a +5% toughness reduction, on psyker, even though the % reduction gets better the more you get and the flat gets worse the more you get
since every other interaction is multiplicative

#

well. aside from havoc's flat toughness
but that means each flat toughness is even better (because each provides a higher +% increase on a lower base) so the assertion should be strengthened, not weakened

#

(mandatory "vet shout is a flat +50 but that probably doesn't matter enough to bother caring" mention)

#

also, 3 of the +15 toughnesses are just before the keystones so they're kinda annoying to get
both ones up top should be must-haves though if you care about total durability this much

#

thinking about this does let me do something really funny though
behold, the most optimal psyker build for literally afk-ing next to your teammates

thank you for coming to my ted talk

image.png
fierce marten
#

I think it's multiplicative, so that 10% extra on say 30% isn't 40% but moreso like 37% with diminishing returns and soft caps near 80% since there's only so many TDR or DR sources (not sure about ogyrn post patch)

#

But it's still worth if you have high DR or TDR cause of how EHP (or toughness variant) is

#

I don't know math, I think there's a mod that shows current TDR and it's fairly accurate

ionic tusk
#

I believe the +5%'s are additive with each other but that amount is multiplicative with everything else

fierce marten
#

Source code is mess

ionic tusk
#

I've never heard of soft caps?

fierce marten
#

Yea iirc there's 4 types of DR, each group is added additive ly then each group is applied multiplicative ly

ionic tusk
#

cursed

fierce marten
#

It's moreso cause there's a finite number of DR sources, it could be higher if it's added

#

I think it was zealot that gets a little over 80% with every TDR talent and buff, or maybe that was Ogryn and DR

fierce marten
# ionic tusk cursed

Yea the additive bonuses on a group who's percentage is low is a big boon. I think I remember the post

ionic tusk
#

clem will probably go into the source code and bestow wisdom upon us
but I am a hack fraud and am just gonna refer to the kuli guides 💀

fierce marten
#

Not the post but a summary

#

Yea you basically have to scour source code cause descriptions are sometimes plain wrong

#

Or have hidden effects in code that isn't shown

ionic tusk
ionic tusk
#

and curios are the only source of that and iirc all stack additively with each other

fierce marten
#

There's a tool tip mod that tells you either each talent is multiplicative or additive and another more stats inventory mod that displays TDR and DR post everything

ionic tusk
#

I'm so confused about what we're talking about at this point

fierce marten
#

It's wonky is what I'm saying

ionic tusk
#

is anything of what I said wrong

fierce marten
#

I don't think so, but whether the talent that gives TDR depends on other sources of TDR in the same build cause it can reduce the bonus given with how the math is and it might not be worth the talent cost.

ionic tusk
fierce marten
#

It's probably easier to try it or test enemies in psykarium and see if it hits any breakpoints

#

That's interesting, I didn't know psyker was like that

ionic tusk
#

for zealot the only exception apparently to be that one martrydom keystone

#

checking veteran and ogyrn they appear to also not have any exceptions, leaving zealot as the only one with one exception

#

which makes it more a weird quirk of how this single keystone node works

image.png
#

and other stuff might stack additively with itself, but that doesn't matter when considering small TDR nodes, because it ends up multiplying the effective toughness- it doesn't matter how you get to the effective toughness

#

something like
(base toughness + flat toughness nodes - havoc penalty) * (major curios + minor curios) = actual toughness
(small toughness reduction nodes + ISNF) * other sources of tdr * other sources of all dr = damage multiplier
actual toughness * damage multiplier = effective toughness

ionic tusk
#

because it says +25% Toughness Damage Reduction & +20% Health Damage Reduction. but is actually 25% toughness reduction and 20% global reduction

#

for a total of 40% toughness reduction and 20% health reduction

fierce marten
ionic tusk
#

I think making it more complicated would be more annoying to code

fierce marten
ionic tusk
#

but I have not looked at the code, that's just me knowing they'd have to keep track of everything

ionic tusk
fierce marten
#

The dodge mod one I did a minor change so that it changes colors more granually. By default it has 3 color states, has dodges, no dodges, and "negative" dodges I add extra colors for 1 dodge left and 2 dodges left

ionic tusk
#

oh right
I was thinking about doing that myself lmao

#

I think I'd probably lerp the colors

#

...although that might be impractical depending on how darktide does colors

#

lookin' at the mod now

fierce marten
#

If you know scripting it's not difficult to make the codes, could do it in notepad++. Finding what you need to change is more difficult

#

I piggyback'd on the custom UI colors class to pick colors and use them, and a mod that let's you look at menu Sub-item names as it'd appear in a console line to find the name of the functions the class of that button uses.

ionic tusk
#

I'm just looking at the lua in notepad++
it's not that big of a mod

fierce marten
#

Most mod files are self contained within that mods folder anyways, or draws from Custom UI and mod loader rarely

ionic tusk
#

my logic is that it has to actually set the colors at some point, and I can just hijack that

#

I don't know how to code in lua but that's never stopped me

fierce marten
#

Worst case mod loader crashes and you reinstall that mod

#

I have a mod to backup my mod on launch, it's an issue

ionic tusk
#

it doesn't need to compile right
I already made a backup :3

fierce marten
#

Darktide is my most heavily modded game besides minecraft

ionic tusk
#

I feel that

fierce marten
ionic tusk
#

even when I make mods I don't involve this many mods
and when modding a bethesda game I don't understand most of the mods or I don't install that many

fierce marten
#

Probably cause it's based on Lua and xml, but darktide has an unusual number of mods

ionic tusk
#

it has a skyrim number of mods

#

and similarly a ton of them fix one small issue that may or may not eventually get patched

fierce marten
#

Fatshark not fixing common complaints and people playing the game so much they create mods to fix gripes is an indicator of how much hardcore players invest into the game

ionic tusk
#

some of them aren't really complaints, they're straight up bugs and do eventually get fixed

#

the bugs that modders can't fix (because they're server side) tend to last way longer if they don't crash the game

fierce marten
ionic tusk
#

idk having made qol mods for other games
sometimes it's just done because it's easy (which points to the lua aspect)

fierce marten
#

Skyrim also had it's share of easy QoL mods, most are textures or fancy number adjustments

ionic tusk
#

I feel like opening text files in notepad is easier than using creation kit
don't even need to install anything

#

skyrim is probably much easier for content mods though

fierce marten
#

I use vscode cause I have it already for work when I need to edit something quickly and don't want to wait for an ide to load.
Skyrim with their mod toolkit yes, it's very refined and put through the ringer with the many overhaul mods pushing limits and causing improvements, without not really, it's mostly had a lot of eyes and work previously done so you don't have to

#

Also Skyrim is offline is a huge difference

#

Another reason darktide mod community is super impressive

ionic tusk
#

I do think the server client authority is pretty impressive on darktide, yeah
or maybe modders are just very mindful lmao

fierce marten
#

Fatshark is lenient on client side

#

Server side not really but that's understandabl

drowsy vine
#

really hope that next patch trashes the duelling sword

ionic tusk
#

I am a dirty ds4 main so I hope it gets nerfed but not trashed 😔

#

I'll probably end up using it even if it sucks tbh
that or go back to tac axe

#

I have only met one person ever who shared my opinion on this though
it's either

  1. I hope it gets nerfed into the ground
  2. it's can't actually be that good right?
  3. it sucks
#

the problem is they probably won't nerf knife at the same time
so instead of 70% of people using dueling sword, 15% knife, 15% other (for non-ogyrn), it'll probably be 80% of people using knife 20% people using other after a month or two

drowsy vine
#

Knife is very good but it actually takes a reasonable amount of skill to use, and you're very capable of flubbing with it

#

It won't corner the market in the same way imho

ionic tusk
#

true, I was thinking about that, but it's arguably better
I can also see a world where people pivot more heavily to ranged weapons and just zoomies with it more than kill

#

I think a ~.1 to ~.2 sprint speed decrease on both weapons combined with a cleave decrease on dueling sword would help a lot

marsh gyro
#

Dueling Sword doesn't bother me so much because other weapons cleave way better. I think the issue is more they're better at their role than other melees - I think if they brought tac axes up to dueling sword single target throughput there'd be a bit more variety in melee output

ionic tusk
#

other weapons cleave way better but ranged weapons (mostly staves and flamer) have cleave: yes which blows that out of the water

#

so that makes the dueling sword's niche the one that ranged weapons push melee weapons into

ionic tusk
#

although I am in a position to just fix it with mods in practice

opaque crown
#

I happily use the Catachan sword, chain axe, power sword, shovel

#

In fact, the only place I use the dueling sword is on one psyker build

#

The greatsword is real fun too

drowsy vine
opaque crown
#

The game simply does not require anywhere close to that level of single mode optimization until maybe the highest tiers of havoc

#

Auric maelstroms? You can make use and succeed with pretty much all of the melee options

#

and cleave gets pretty relevant if you're playing with randos and they DONT have crowd clear

drowsy vine
#

What exactly are you arguing against?

opaque crown
#

The assertion that cleave is only good up to a certain point implies that there is a point where the dueling sword is the only choice; I disagree with that

#

That point never appears in regular play or auric play

drowsy vine
#

It doesn't matter if it's not the only choice when it's the objective best choice - I fully assert that even if other weapons are viable, and they absolutely are, the way the Duelling Sword is now is game warping and sets a bad precedent going forward

#

Something that blatantly superior to its competition shouldn't exist, full stop

ionic tusk
marsh gyro
#

I think maybe a big part of it is the difference in rolling with a premade vs solo queue, Dueling Swords have pretty tangible weaknesses in hordes that are compensated with a team running horde clear which isn't a guarantee when hitting quick play. I mostly quick play so I run more debuff/horde oriented builds since I figure the folks already have single target covered so maybe I'm out meta-ing the meta

ionic tusk
#

you can run better horde clear than melee and still run dueling sword, though

#

I typically don't because I don't like to
but shredders, flamer, flame staff basically invalidate melee horde clear competition wise

#

and you don't actually need horde clear to win
I have had games where noone killed anything and I just agile dodge spammed to the finish line

opaque crown
#

I'm mostly saying that Havoc is not the bar by which everything is measured, a minority of the players play that; from what I can gather most people are playing quick play in either auric or standard play. In both of those arena's, the superiority of the dueling sword isn't something I see nearly as commonly, and I see people with the dueling sword die just the same. I actually agree its better than it should be; but I think what I'm disagreeing with is the idea that its the only valid use choice because its good.

ionic tusk
#

I see 2 or more dueling swords that aren't me like 30% of games

#

and I mostly play solo queue auric

#

it's much lower now that ogyrn counts have gone from 'once every 10 games' to 'mostly even'

opaque crown
#

its a bit funny because as an ogryn main, i was effectively guaranteeing an ogryn in every solo queue i was in

ionic tusk
ionic tusk
ionic tusk
#

well. enough

#

dueling sword also isn't as bad at hordeclear as people think

spiral badger
#

yeah it's quite adequate at it

#

that's part of the problem

ionic tusk
#

if you build for it you absolutely can top lesser kill score

spiral badger
#

it doesn't really have a weak spot

opaque crown
#

My point with saying I see dueling sword users dying is that thus far the implication made by the discussion is that its so good that no other weapon even comes close, that its so good no other weapon is worth using, and that it performs that much better than every other weapon. I think that while it's better than many of the other weapons, its not so much rediculously better that its gonna play the game for you or auto win by virtue of bringing it at all.

ionic tusk
#

I've done it with martyr builds even not using a ranged weapon

spiral badger
#

it is significantly above basically every other weapon

#

not game breakingly so but like

#

noticiably so

ionic tusk
#

well. combat blade comes close

#

but I think the group of like 5 weapons that are around dueling sword power levels just means they're all OP and should either be tuned down or everything else tuned up a lot

spiral badger
#

honestly my argument is that enemy armor should be retuned

#

because the core problem is that you need a weapon that can break it for the hardest difficulty

opaque crown
#

tbh, at a base level i agree that tuning is necessary; I think the detail that I'm stuck on is that theres some sort of obligation to use it; and the most common play state for the game does not ever demand that degree of optimization; there is no obligation to use it just because its currently the best

ionic tusk
#

I don't think any of us have been pushing it as an obligation?

spiral badger
#

specifically on havoc 30+ if you don't have an armor breaking main melee you might as well just go home

#

and to a lesser degree on aurics

#

this is more of a weapon pool limiter than any specific weapon being too powerful

#

the other option is to reduce the ammo restrictions

ionic tusk
#

the havoc ammo restrictions are just awfully designed
same with the toughness ones

ionic tusk
spiral badger
#

effectively you have to at least have a solution for it on hand

#

because there's basically no way to avoid getting pursued by it at least once in a havoc

split mantleBOT
#

Personally, at least on my Zealot, I run a single-target weapon and a horde weapon, or two multipurposes.

spiral badger
#

there are other options like stunning it or having someone taunt it off you or whatever but you have to have a solution

ionic tusk
#

I think a inferno psyker with a zealot/ogyrn bodyguard would probably manage fine together
like, without it being 'turbo challenge', they could each not use their melee/ranged weapon respectively

spiral badger
#

if you have a fully coordinated team of course you can deal differently but I play a lot of pick up havocs and you have to gear to protect yourself

ionic tusk
#

ah yeah
I cannot handle bullying in videogames so I need at least one friend usually if it's something semi premade like a havoc

marsh gyro
#

I think if they juiced up tac axe base damage it'd be a good Dark Souls alternative (I stand by my autocorrect typo) since knives specialize in bleed and Dueling Swords are faster

ionic tusk
marsh gyro
#

Tac Axes do good when you have like +70% strength on them and that really should just be baseline

ionic tusk
marsh gyro
ionic tusk
#

by like, +.4 sprint speed or something

#

maybe +.2
somewhere in that range

#

I think an underlooked fact of the dueling sword is that it's thrusting and has good range

marsh gyro
ionic tusk
#

those should be .1 slower at minimum

split mantleBOT
#

I personally don't ever use duelling swords, since I went Vet -> Psyker -> Zealot, and anyway I'm not much a fan of sabres (much prefer backswords), what's the other good options I wonder?

ionic tusk
#

there's tons of viable options

marsh gyro
#

Psyker and Zealot greatswords are huge damage and cleave, just slower handling and running

#

For the sheer speed and single target of zoomies it'll be the combat blade knives

ionic tusk
#

as for what weapons I think can even compete with them outside of 'sacrificing power for fun', to me that's combat blade, blaze force greatsword
and maybe a couple others like relic blade

#

combat blade has the advantage of being even faster when heavy attacking and better cleave

split mantleBOT
#

I hope the 1h power sword gets the 2h one's mode.

marsh gyro
split mantleBOT
#

But yeah, I love the greatswords.

ionic tusk
#

blaze force greatsword is actually a ranged hordeclear in disguise

ionic tusk
#

this is definitely a result of binding issues and agile blessing abuse, though

split mantleBOT
#

I take it it's basically a lunge?

Cpt. Clem Cuddlecakes ↩️

[Reply to:](#1159883850562932826 message) The special poke stagger having huge reach has saved my bacon many times

ionic tusk
ionic tusk
#

you can heavy attack with the dueling sword while sprinting though so you can lunge whenever you want

marsh gyro
ionic tusk
#

yeah I know what it does but generally if I'm hitting the weak spot it's better to just attack 0-2 more times and kill it

spiral badger
#

Optimal damage rotation is technically heavy-special

#

the special doesn't actually interrupt heavy charge

#

so you can heavy, special, heavy

#

on repeat

#

and the poke is actually fairly damaging as well as staggering

ionic tusk
#

oh I could use the new attack queue mod lmao
to get around not having enough comfortable inputs left

marsh gyro
#

I mostly use the poke to interrupt crusher/mauler overheads and rager combos

spiral badger
#

yeah just give it a shot hitting it immediately after you land a heavy

#

it's basically instant

#

free damage real estate

regal pendant
#

Is the Voidblast staff any good for building up Soublaze on enemies?

#

I'm trying to branch out from the Purgatus but I still like using Souldrinker

#

Or the Voidstrike staff, that one looks decently fun

sonic elbow
#

yesn't

#

voidblast will tend to just straight up kill them

regal pendant
#

True

#

It IS really fucking high damage

#

Unless you spam the primary fire but even then

#

What about Voidstrike, does a not-fully-charged secondary work well for that?

sonic elbow
#

I have no experience with voidstrike but I imagine it'd be too much damage for too little AoE for that purpose

regal pendant
#

Oh yeah, absolutely does, though it's a bit of a crapshoot since it's reliant on getting a crit

#

What are the base crit rates for weapons anyway?

ionic tusk
#

iirc electrostaff is the one with a higher base crit rate

regal pendant
#

Which makes sense

fierce marten
#

Electrostaff has a silly thing with crit and the blessing to double LMB on crits

#

It's base crit is pretty significant on it

#

The biggest downside, there's 4 extra master points on it so you get a message saying to allocate mastery points after you've fully upgraded every blessing

regal pendant
#

...fucking dammit, I'm too used to the Inferno staff not blowing you up as much

#

I wish they all operated on that "If you hit 100% peril while charging and then fire, it doesn't count as peril overload" mechanic

#

Voidstrike IS a lot more fun than Inferno though

#

Those stagger values on the charged shot are fucking nutty

#

And it just generally feels better to use

marsh gyro
marsh gyro
regal pendant
#

Well my thing is, I like using Souldrinker, so I need semi-reliable means to build Soulblaze

#

If it wasn't for that I'd be down to clown with the funny lightning staff

marsh gyro
#

Oh yeah Blazing Spirit works good with Souldrinker

opaque crown
#

What's the sauce for the lightning staff and the explosion staff? I can't seem to get them to do what I see others doing in quick play

drowsy tusk
#

Lightning has best m1 for crit build

#

Cause it has crit damage as a modifier that others don’t have

fierce marten
#

Also has a hidden high crit chance modifier iirc, similar to combat knife

#

It's really just staff and surge as the build for m1 spam and constant crit combined with the node for dodge on crit makes you invincible to ranged enemies assuming you don't miss something

#

Which isn't a big ask especially on higher havoc, you'd have to try not to hit something to miss

#

And mini smite cc stuns rager packs very well and deals a good amount of damage

regal pendant
opaque crown
#

how are peoples like deleting whole crusher packs with the explosion staff?

#

i see it doing WORK during some of the more mobbed up moments

drowsy tusk
#

Double shot blessing is important

regal pendant
#

Aye, two explosions going off at the same time is pretty schnasty

#

I personally don't use it but that's because I also use it to spread Soulblaze and I don't wanna outright kill the trash mobs

regal pendant
#

Don't think that's supposed to happen

#

That whole segment got so weirdly fucked, the elevator didn't work until we killed the ACTUAL designated Big Boss for that scene and even then, two Beasts of Nurgle spawned at once and the first one we killed wasn't the one we needed to kill

#

What a weird segment

regal pendant
#

Well that's that done, at long last

image.png
ionic tusk
#

wait are you talking about trauma or the other one?

regal pendant
#

Believe they're referring to the Voidblast staff

#

The ground explosion one

waxen patio
#

Don't forget the brittleness blessing :D. Or the burn one, I forget what the super support and super nuke builds are for trauma staff

opaque crown
#

Where you paint the big circle and explode it

#

I've seen some pyskers just tearing through like armored mobs with it

marsh gyro
#

It'll do about 1000 damage in the center to carapace and so you can pop through maulers and crushers pretty good with it, Rending Shockwave and Warp Charges helps

regal pendant
#

Aye

#

The Rending is super nice

opaque crown
#

ahh ok

#

gotta get the mastery so i can get the talents

ionic tusk
#

new event, have to find and do a new hacking minigame on pickups in-mission (indicated with the event modifier icon and a diamond for a secondary objective)
they take up the stim spot so if you're not in a good spot to do them, you can carry them around for a bit

hacking minigame strat: ||I find it's easiest to match the wave horizontally before trying to match it vertically, it seems to be very finnicky||

regal pendant
#

Feel like flamers could use a timer on when they can shoot ngl

ionic tusk
#

like an indicator on the primary fire?

regal pendant
#

Or even like, changing it to where instead of doing a short spurt, moving, then another short spurt, they do a longer and more continuous stream

#

That way you don't end up playing The Floor Is Lava

ionic tusk
#

you can still dodge when using the secondary fire (you probably already know this but just making sure)

#

I think they're balanced around being so clunky though
even as-is dancing around a bit to start firing in a horde can let you wipe the floor with it

regal pendant
#

True

#

...wait I think we're considering different flamers lmao

#

I'm talking about SCAB flamers

#

Not the zealot flamer

ionic tusk
#

they're one of the 'hordeclear: yes' weapons I talk about
put brittleness on it + steady stream and then just melt a bunch of crushers and maulers and everything inbetween them

#

oh lmao

#

that is a hilarious difference

#

the enemy type is weird

#

it's one of the tankier specials
and the main threat it poses is that if you shoot a scab flamer it can explode and create barrel fire (this is a joke but also a dead serious one)

the stream having knockback is annoying sure but they're not overtly dangerous, being more a payoff to a disrupter than an actual threat

marsh gyro
#

Scab and tox flamers and bombers take triple melee damage so it can be worth a stab over a shoot

ionic tusk
#

what basically always happens is I run at them, get pushed back by a steady stream of fire, then give up and kill them with one of my ranged options

#

I think they're supposed to do a continuous stream?

marsh gyro
#

Yeah they'll stop if staggered

ionic tusk
#

idk
they're kinda the least impactul special to the point where it took me 200h to realize they weren't elites

#

the only use case they really shine in is if someone gets trappered
and at that point a rager would probably do just as much

#

I don't think enemies can attack players that are dogged or grabbed

#

the knockback does make meleeing them super annoying though if they're already targeging you

#

and they can melt you fast

spiral badger
#

they can

ionic tusk
#

but in practice a gunner wave is much much more dangerous and less range locked

spiral badger
#

they won't attack you once you're fully Got but tehre's a window as you're getting hit where you aren't blocking

#

and attacks can still hit you

#

so if the flamer is already about to fire and you get dogged or mutanted or chaos spawned you can get stuck in the fire

ionic tusk
#

interesting

spiral badger
#

mutants can also drag you into existing flame streams

ionic tusk
#

I gotta be honest, I probably mistake flamer fire as scab bomber fire a lot then

#

I didn't know it lasted for any meaningful amount of time

spiral badger
#

it's not a huge amount of time but it does linger yeah

marsh gyro
#

Flamer fire can actually knock off pox hounds which sounds good though the fire usually downs you anyways

regal pendant
#

Aye

#

Cause you spend like five minutes getting back to your feet and get animation locked

opaque crown
#

i thin think the whole point of the flamer IS to make you play the floor is lava

#

they even boosted the damage because players were kind of ignoring them sometimes

#

now they tear through toughness like paper

tough compass
#

Back in my day they would instantly remove toughness even if you toed into it. It was really annoying

opaque crown
#

its a bit why you can't have players tunnel visioning on fighting whatever is just closest to you, someone has to be snapping off shots or hits for those special kills

#

so often i have players ignoring distant specials to prioritize not taking damage (which is important) but it can be just as important to knock out a special before they do their thing, especially when stuff is frantic

tough compass
#

Yeah, definitely. It can be tricky though

ionic tusk
#

I think that flamers are the least impactful in that regard though
from that range someone could get trappred which is way worse
and snipers and bombers are more effective at keeping the hurt going if not dealt with

ionic tusk
regal pendant
#

...finally maxed out me knoife

#

Holy fucking shit this is unreasonably fun

#

And GOOD too, why the fuck is this little knife so damn strong

opaque crown
#

My real beef is specifically with flame and gas bombers. They're the worst. Especially when left unchecked

fierce marten
#

It's a fun image to think about seeing a random person killing a beast of nurgle which gets even astartes, with a few stabs of a knife

ionic tusk
#

snipers and bombers are both zoning and lethal payoff
mutants are tanky disruption and minor damage
hounds disrupt, disable, and apply corruption fairly quick
trappers are probably the most seriously dehabilitating

flamers are tanky dps
but. that's basically every elite

#

and elites spawn way more

#

like, I totally get why they made them explode after being shot
but imo that both wasn't enough and also the current implementation sucks for reusing barrel fire on the scabs

fierce marten
#

Trappers are the one that get me most

marsh gyro
fierce marten
#

They have the laugh and voice lines but for me sometimes it only plays during the net animation and covers up that net gun firing sound or it's just super quiet.

ionic tusk
#

I've never had issues with trapper noises but also my setup is potato'd more than normally possible
and they still catch me sometimes anyway
reallly hate how they increased the range, they often hit players significantly behind who they were aiming at

ionic tusk
fierce marten
#

Hound can be shoved or shot if one pounces and you can't see it, trappers you just have to dodge or kill fast

#

Oh yes

#

That'd be useful

ionic tusk
#

hound is kinda comical once you learn the power of spam shoving and spam dodging at the same time

marsh gyro
ionic tusk
ionic tusk
#

nearly everything about them is the most dangerous

another player needs to actually do an anim to help unlike dogs (I have gotten physically knocked away by some stuff like flamers, ironically they're just as dangerous when trappers are involved no matter what they're targeting; other stuff can also knock you away though)
enemies still target you unlike mutant or dog

it can't be blocked like dog

the player gets pulled back, so even if you're right there to start the animation it'll usually get canceled by the trapped player flying out of your range a second later

fierce marten
#

Hounds are like such a non threat unless it's a pack, the window you need to shove after it makes a pounce sound is generous and there's times I won't even try to look at it if it's behind me and I'm dealing with something else

#

Once I learned shoves were 360 it was over for them, almost like being a parent telling their kids they're busy talking when you shoved a hound like 3 times without ever turning around cause there's a rager pack that's way to close

ionic tusk
#

they're still fully capable of just disabling and killing you behind a crate if you fall victim to hubris
but so can 60% of the other enemies lol

fierce marten
#

My Hubris weakness is getting into melee rager packs, if I do stealth zealot I can solo them fine assuming there's not a bigger threat around. But if I see a crusher or trapper I lose focus and get dog piled cause I wasnt paying attention to the ragers

#

And then I look like an idiot that tried to solo melee a rager pack, which I am but regardless. I love darktide melee too much to be sensible

marsh gyro
#

Out meleeing a rager out of a combo is the grand prize

fierce marten
#

Dueling Sword makes it too easy, the alt has strong stagger for basically being instant

#

You can cc a pack from a safe distance and kill at the same time, I'm trying to use it less to curb it so I can fight them with other weapons

opaque crown
#

i do love slapping a rager

#

as an ogryn

#

i also enjoy catachan sword countering them

fierce marten
#

Catachan sword feels so good when you parry a rager and one shot them

#

And just chain parry kill a rager pack without worry

#

Or eating a crusher overhead

marsh gyro
#

It's my go to these days on Vet for the defense

fierce marten
#

I also use it as a main weapon on vet

marsh gyro
#

Parrying a chaos spawn all day rules

fierce marten
#

Does the parry work againsf the grab?

marsh gyro
#

Nah but the grab you can dodge at the right distance

heavy geyser
cloud hazel
#

aura farming

heavy geyser
#

I miraculously solo'd a HISTG

cloud hazel
#

nvm this is natural aura hunter gathering

ionic tusk
#

never underestimate the power of getting new rejects from the reject shelter

#

each time they die the director gives you a break for a bit which imo makes rescuing worth it even if they die shortly after

#

although you still have to never get trappered or dogged or dps'd so it's still v impressive

heavy geyser
#

These were the same teammates for most of the,run

ionic tusk
#

it can be in game or not in game! usually faster if they don't leave and you just repeatedly rescue them

tough compass
regal pendant
#

HOLY SHIT IT'S ALPHARIUS

image.png
split mantleBOT
#

<@&1042950387478560878>

#

i wanna kill people :3

regal pendant
#

My fucking eyes

image.png
waxen patio
#

🔥

fierce marten
#

Flamer, destroyer of heretics and frame rates.

ionic tusk
#

is that flamer or fire nades? both???

#

(also I Wanna See is partly updated if you wish to save your eyes from flamer)

regal pendant
#

Fire nades and a smoke nade

fierce marten
#

Changed it to blue so I dont mistake bright yellowish orange of zealot nade with scab flames orange flames

ionic tusk
#

oh, I thought that wasn't possible?

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I had to get a mod that changes it to goo

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because apparently the psyker fire doesn't work as ground fire

fierce marten
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It only changes the psykers shooting fire

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I got it moreso for flamer nade

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The NPC ground particles can't be changed for some reason though

ionic tusk
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they can! it's just the psyker blue fire isn't the right type to put on the ground

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the options are fairly limited though, I just picked one that isn't meaningful normally

fierce marten
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They can? Which mod is that one, that was my biggest gripe with the one I installed

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I'd rather have all enemy flames to be a very distinct color from PC

ionic tusk
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lemmie dig for it

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I use the one pictured in the preview because it's just like, flavor death explosion goo or something

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the other ground particles the game has are even worse lol
because they're the actual enemy ground fire and nurgle vomit

fierce marten
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Oh interesting maybe I should look at the mod store again, last time I looked was a few months ago

ionic tusk
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if you're in the modding server, there's a creations channel, that's how I find most of the cool new mods
I have gone out of my way looking for certain stuff lol

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this was a 2023 mod I think
browing nexus isn't very uh, reliable in terms of digging through

fierce marten
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What's the modding server name?

ionic tusk
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Darktide Modders

fierce marten
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I lost my mods recently due to a corrupted drive just before mortis

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And forgot to back it up

ionic tusk
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lets see if I can post the link without getting smote by a bot or something lol

fierce marten
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Nice thanks!

ionic tusk
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I would not advise actually chatting in the channels 'n such without being ready for Gamer

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but the "Creation Showcase" channel is very nice

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and it has a list of all the mods that break every update, as well as the DMF updates and temporary patches

fierce marten
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That's just what I do in general anyways

heavy geyser
regal pendant
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This is the full outfit

Veteran.png
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Did change the lefthand glove to be black leather recently, helps it stick out

heavy geyser
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Oh I see

regal pendant
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Here's the most recent version

Veteran.png
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Quite proud of how it turned out tbh

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Really selling that bionic soldier look

frigid saffron
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ooh for the drip

frigid saffron
regal pendant
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It's part of the chest piece

heavy geyser
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That looks like Morrow's coat.

regal pendant
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It is

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I'm surprised you can equip it at all tbh

frigid saffron
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Aah

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Never noticed that on the morrow model

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I knew it was morrows jacket cus of the pistol but neat

regal pendant
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Y'all think this axe looks any good or is it just far too big?

image.png
heavy geyser
#

Combination purity seal and heretical symbol is powerful.

regal pendant
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Shouty said to put the seal on

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Am quite fond of it, truth be told, makes me look fancy

marsh gyro
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Zealot knife running owns, Flesh Tearer keeps winning

regal pendant
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...I feel so small

image.png
drowsy tusk
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you am small

waxen patio
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protecc th' lil' 'un

fierce marten
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There's always a bigger fish Ogyrn

drowsy tusk
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fogryn

regal pendant
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...I feel Fire Team may give a smidge more than just a 5% boost to damage

image.png image.png
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That is nearly 100 damage points worth of a difference, holy shit

drowsy vine
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notice how you're hitting flak vs carapce

regal pendant
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Ah

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Whoops

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...no that's definitely still a nearly-100 point difference, I made sure I was smacking his head and the damage numbers remained the same as in those images

heavy geyser
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Mauler heads don't do flak damage.

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you might have missed the head and hit the shoulder.

regal pendant
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It might be the bleed stacks?

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I noticed that when the damage tics from them applied, it said Flak Armor instead of Carapace

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Which is

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Weird

marsh gyro
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Maulers have flak armor base and a carapace head override and bleed stacks count the base armor

regal pendant
#

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, interesting

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Does the carapace override go away if you somehow manage to peel off the carapace armor without killing it?

marsh gyro
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Nah the armor damage is cosmetic

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Depending on your kit it can be faster to burn down maulers in the chest than the weak point

regal pendant
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Shame, that would've made for an interesting mechanic

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Peeling away armor to make the most armored enemies more vulnerable

heavy geyser
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That is what brittleness and rending is, kinda