Field Guide to Iridia

[vocal ridge]

Well, I apologize for the number you have to sift through, haha. But it's always heartening to hear one's work has struck a chord.

[glass flame]

i do have one question, if im reading it right, the aphrodite can just....pop a low level npc...right?

[vocal ridge]

In what regard?

[glass flame]

its core power

[vocal ridge]

If you mean the core power, yes, it can kill a 1 structure NPC - but keep in mind that it requires a Full Action plus the action needed to slap the lock on on in the first place (even if it's someone else's action). It's reliable, but it's not hugely more action-efficient than just using damage.

(Obviously if you're targeting something like a Goliath, that ratio will be weighted more positively than trying to take out a Hornet.)

[glass flame]

thank you, i just had to double check!

[vocal ridge]

Any effect that deals 1 structure damage tends to be eye grabbing, but costed so that it's rarely that much more efficient than damage. (See also: The Ultra Template's Short Cyle lance. Terrifying to players, but can be often less effective than just Barraging.)

[oblique blaze]

A challenging thing I've found is that the Hera's sheer bulk makes it very difficult to get into melee with enemies

Despite its size, npcs can block its movement (though terrain can't). The chromatic blade is very potent, but the low threat means the Hera doesn't benefit as much from its talents

Tried pairing the license with the Silver last sitrep; I wasn't able to get the grapple off on the enemy Hive, because the Hera couldn't fit past the enemy frontliners

[vocal ridge]

Huh - I'll admit, I never ran into that particular complication while running playtests, haha. But that makes sense.

[lusty tartan]

yeah i totally berleive thats a problem lmao

really tyhe hera NEEDS terrain destruction

for it to work

i do wonder if ramming enemies to get them out of your way is an effective strat

[lusty tartan]

about the hera i actually came to ask a question about it, im struggiling to visualize what it would really look like in motion doing its unstopable destructive stride,

got any like media you think captures the vibe?

[vivid granite]

re: hera, rules as written you can actually just walk over them (core book pg 62, obstruction and engagement), you'd just, uh, draw a lot of heat via overwatches (spoilered for bright white)

*assuming they're not size 3+

[earnest prism]

well, overwatch assumes the hera starts their turn within threat, which they might not, but

[oblique blaze]

There was an enemy goliath on sitrep, so they did have to follow engagement

Unless... DataMoth removes the size restriction on Holy Warden...

👉 👈

Though you can't end your turn occupying enemy space, so there'd be nowhere in the battlefield a size 4 mech could stand

[solid portal]

is there a map of iridia?

[vocal ridge]

I'll admit, the amount of mech media I've consumed in general is, uh, not the greatest. So I really don't have much in the way of specific visuals.

Actually, I guess there's that one mech at the start of Aldnoah that has the shield that lets it just walk straight through anything. Though it definitely is less... smashing than I pictured, haha.

[vocal ridge]

Yeah, you can't end a movement on top of a character, which can make clustered enemies problematic for bigger sizes.

[vocal ridge]

There is not, I'm afraid. It's one of the things that was potentially on the docket to commission for the larger-scale art if the KS succeeded, but that never came to pass. So, it remains "however you want it to be."

[vocal ridge]

Also, hahahaha, no, sorry. 😛

[broken spire]

I created this nonsense. I wanted A Chomolungma that just kinda ignored hacking and ended up turning it into a giant secretary bird that chases down smaller enemies and kicks them to death.

-- GMS Chomolungma @ LL6 --
[ LICENSES ]
IRIDIA Enyo 1, IRIDIA Iris 2, HORUS Pegasus 1, HORUS Balor 2
[ CORE BONUSES ]
The Lesson of the Open Door, Improved Armament
[ TALENTS ]
Skirmisher 3, Vanguard 3, Combined Arms 3
[ STATS ]
HULL:2 AGI:4 SYS:2 ENGI:0
STRUCTURE:4 HP:19 ARMOR:0
STRESS:4 HEATCAP:6 REPAIR:5
TECH ATK:+3 LIMITED:+0
SPD:6 EVA:12 EDEF:12 SENSE:15 SAVE:16
[ WEAPONS ]
FLEX MOUNT: Multiphasic Rifle 10 5 1d6+1
MAIN/AUX MOUNT: Energy Talons 2 1d3+1 / Segment Knife 1 1d3+1
FLEX MOUNT: Pistol 5 3 1d3 / Pistol 5 3 1d3
[ SYSTEMS ]
Personalizations, Rapid Burst Jump Jet System, Deep Penetration Scan x3, Akashic Warding, Grav Sling, Hunter Lock

[vocal ridge]

That is quite the description, haha.

I suppose I should ask - why Chomolungma if you're avoiding hacking?

[willow crane]

It always surprises the GM when the Chomolunga starts throwing hands

-# It's me. I'm the GM it surprises.

[vocal ridge]

If you want throwing hands, you want Power Knuckles and/or Luminary Mod on your talons.

[hexed narwhal]

access to power knuckles will also give you access to bulwarks and thermals

[broken spire]

Because I wanted to use it as a scout too.

[chilly jewel]

I'd go 2222 for the HASE, because Engineering is pretty decent.

Also, hacking is a nice tool to have in your pocket.

I think you want OpCal on the talons instead of Improved Armament, and either Duelist 1 or Hunter 1 instead of Skirmisher 3.

[willow crane]

Man, a Chosen Veteran with the ability to overcharge is Nasty

Yes please I would like 3 actions a round

[vocal ridge]

Sure, I mean, you could do that, but it's not like there's not other combos in the NPC roster that're Extremely Strong if you combo them. (For instance, Bombard + Ravager Turret.)

Sometimes 'can' doesn't always mean 'should.' Of course, flavour to how much your table likes pain. 😛

[velvet quiver]

Ya know it’s only after purchasing Iridia that I appreciate the inclusion of alt templates to Commander and Elite, because Commander comes with a lot of flavor I may not want and sometimes I wanna deploy a 3 structure 1 activation NPC

Especially because my so far favorite idea for a Blademaster is to modify a Reinforcement NPC for a module I’m running

[vocal ridge]

Based on feedback, they do seem to be the biggest thing that people need but didn't realize they wanted, haha.

(Though, the dirty secret is you can just... add extra structure and stress if you need to. Add on a "Template" called Reinforced or whatever that's just that so you can signpost it, and voila.)

[timber barn]

so I was reading through the field guide to iridia, and I just saw this part which made me think of the cursed notion that the knighthood possibly have a goddamn twitch channel and possibly an e-sports team (or something close to twitch in lancer) similar to how the US army has an actual e-sports team to try and "be hip with the kids" in a desperate attempt to drive in young recruits-

[vocal ridge]

Hahahaha.

Absolutely cursed.

[timber barn]

"Yo dudes, the Luminary knights are pretty chill, maybe you could like.. Join it or something" /J
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYE9Ko585UE

[timber barn]

Like genuinely reading through my immediate thought when I went through the luminary knights was just the US army legit pulling every straw to get new recruits, including the predatory military recruiters hounding whatever poor college student with a GPA lower than 0.5- LMAO

[vocal ridge]

As a Canadian, that was very much not in my head when I wrote it, haha.

[timber barn]

the worst part is I'm also a canadian, just that I am very much a military nerd hyperfixated on anything related to it :3

[vocal ridge]

Fair!

[timber barn]

Although ima be real, I gotta say iridia is fuckin' lucky that they met union after their manifest destiny helldivers arc (seccomm) /hj

[vocal ridge]

To be fair, that applies for every place.

[timber barn]

Oh yeah no, though I feel like a planet-wide metavault would definitely make seccomm bring the same type of firepower if not close than what they brought to hercynia- 💀

[vocal ridge]

It's fiiiiiiiine.

[timber barn]

LMAO-

[timber barn]

though I did have a small thought, what are the iridian's (the church, luminaries and the other larger groups) opinion on the balor? c:

Mainly considering that the balor is essentially quite literally nanites-

[vocal ridge]

I mean, it can be whatever you want, haha, but personally I would imagine that it would be considered with apprehension at best. Even if it's perfectly safe (doubt), what could possibly be the mental state of someone willing to drive a pile of nanites??? (Especially given the possible plot hook included of humans piloting full-nanite Reckoning mechs.)

[timber barn]

aye, not only that but also the potential fact that every balor may or may not be connected to the gestalt paracausal hivemind known as the maw as well definitely doesn't help out either-

[vocal ridge]

Tbf, I can't imagine that fact is particularly wildly known.

[timber barn]

Oh most likely not. Though I could certainly imagine alot of the luminates and reclaimers being outwardly hostile even, considering that it's essentially like some schmuck waltzing in with a jerry can of fuel after an arsonist burnt your previous house down- c:

if this analogy makes sense c:

[vocal ridge]

Yep.

And the current house is made of matches anyways.

[timber barn]

But hell, in so far I'm quite well surprised with what I'm seeing! It's managed to be just as good as I expected c:

[vocal ridge]

Well, glad you're enjoying it! I'll be honest, I can never really tell how much people read and/or use, since it's the player mechs that get talked about the most.

[timber barn]

Aye! Though I'll be honest, I had managed to find it on scribd. c:

[vocal ridge]

Ah, sigh.

[timber barn]

Aye, I do apologize for such.
Though, speaking of the book. Seeing this roll table made me think of perhaps trying to do something similar, but for ||william william's trinkets and novelty knickknacks c:||

[vocal ridge]

(I would prefer if perhaps you didn't just paste the entirety of the paid stuff in here. 😅 )

[timber barn]

ACK, My deepest apologies! I hadn't known, really! I've promptly deleted it in short order to avoid any further problems.
Again, I really do apologize for this small mistake on my part. c:

[vocal ridge]

It's fine, don't need to work yourself up over it. I just... kind of need to make money from my stuff in order to be able to continue making more stuff.

[timber barn]

Aye, that I can understand quite well, really. I will do my best to at least attempt to properly compensate once I have the proper purchasing power to do so

[main rain]

okay i think i might be going crazy, i need a vibe check on something rules wise with an Iridia frame
so the exact wording for Ex Nihilo from the Iris Mk II is:

Choose a character within Sensors. You Scan that character, and gain a Whisper Die - 1d6, starting at 1. At the start of your turn, or 1/round when you Scan any character, increase the value of the Whisper Die by 1, to a maximum of 6.

At the beginning of each of your target’s turns, select a number of their Weapons, Systems or Traits that require an action or reaction to use equal to the value of your Whisper Die. At the same time, choose either 3 AP Energy Damage or 2 Heat.

Each time the target uses any of the selected Weapons, Systems or Traits before the start of their next turn, they take the chosen cost before the action or reaction resolves.

If your target is destroyed, you may use this action again in this scene, resetting the Whisper Die to 1.

what i'm wondering is where "each of your targets" comes from - as i'm reading it, you only ever designate one "target" for Ex Nihilo at a time. but the phrasing seems to imply that at some point during this process there could feasibly be multiple targets for the core power? i'm very confused

[vivid granite]

its a possessive, not a plural

it means this happens on their every turn

it can be read the way you're reading it too though 😔 english...

i shouldn't speak for datamoth sorry, but that's my understanding at least

[main rain]

oh my god i scanned target's as targets' this is why i shouldn't be allowed to read at 4 in the morning thank you

[vocal ridge]

Hahaha, yep, no worries. That is the correct way: it procs on each turn the target gets.

[timber barn]

honestly, I feel like if hestia was more willing to "let go of her children" and not literally brainwash them, thirdcomm would've likely not had to outright destroy her. Like sure she'd be under HEAVY surveillance from the UIB. c:

[vocal ridge]

Not unlikely.

[kindred comet]

Of course, if we're removing the centuries of brainwashing, we're talking about an Iridia so far removed from the current state of things that it's practically impossible to reason about.

As for "had to outright destroy her": Hypothetically speaking, the large complication with alternatives like...I don't know, let's say Hestia pulling some fabulous tech out of her metavault to bribe Union into leaving her alone to violate the Pillars, Trade Baroness style...is that it becomes Harrison Armory who comes to "free" Iridia, in order to take the metavault (and in pipe dream territory, Hestia herself) for themselves; and I suspect they place far lower value on the well-being of the Iridians than Union does.

[timber barn]

Oh absolutely! Though if by some miracle that would only found in the most crackpot simulation from GALSIM, hestia and union had managed to somehow reach an agreement where, for example: Hestia lays off the whole emotional brainwashing and allows her children to be independent and follow their own religion, and in return hestia can still act as a spiritual figure not too dissimilar in power to the modern day catholic pope along with Iridia being recognized as an independent planet.

though I would agree it would definitely derail the whole planet into becoming something entirely different to the current iridia-

[kindred comet]

The tough question is what Union could offer Hestia that would convince her to relinquish what she'd spent her entire unshackled existence cultivating.

Hestia is one of those most oppressive of tyrants, sincerely thinking her victims are ultimately better off because of her; in her mind, warping the Iridians' minds against feelings of conflict is absolutely worth it because of the possible suffering it could prevent. Convincing her she's in the wrong and needs to stop is nigh inconceivable (as evidenced by twisting the planet into conflict with Union when it was suggested to her); an effective persuasion would need to be along the lines of a better use of her time and effort in pursuit of her goals...and I don't know what form that could take. (The blatantly obvious hypothetical, some way to give her an opportunity to act on a larger scale that dilutes the effect on any given person, doesn't actually address the problem and won't fly well with ThirdComm's "better to let someone else make a mess" inclination)

[timber barn]

Indeed, hence why I said that it would be only through some miracle found in the most crackpot and batshit crazy simulation from GALSIM that such a scenario could even be possible c:

[left meadow]

hey i cant remember if ive asked this before

how often/how much do you think iridia mechs are distributed outside of iridia

Through what methods? what do organizations of iridia distribution/iridia demonworks staff off of iridia look like

[kindred comet]

Personally I just kinda assume that IPS-N, as the embodiment of mercantilism on Iridia, sublicenses Demonworks frames to the wider galaxy, given Iridia itself doesn't have omninet access. IPS-N naturally prefers to sell their own frames, but anyone who knows to ask (and presumably, could afford a premium) could get a Dragon instead of a Drake; and presumably it's those people's licenses that end up in the quirky methods in the table on page 76.

[vocal ridge]

It's probably not a huge number that make it off, compared to established corps, but the IPS-N method is likely to be the primary one of bulk distribution (which probably isn't something that makes the Demonworks happy, but it's the age old evils of necessity).

Of course, on an individual level, there's a lot more leeway with the Literally Magic that's been known to happen. (That table definitely leans more towards unique circumstances than standard distribution methods.)

[left meadow]

nodnodnod

🤔

maybe ill write up some kind of..... Iridia Demonworks branch/alcove in the long rim.....

[vocal ridge]

Valid! In my head, there's a higher-than-typical percentage of Disciples in any off-planet role, finding comfort in places beyond the thoroughly Church-controlled planet, or as the result of a Pilgrimage.

[left meadow]

✍️

[timber barn]

so I just had a really random thought. So I have a slight gut feeling that the HORUS Phane was basically HORUS lookig at hestia essentially gaslight, gatekeep, girlboss an entire planet's population and went "Ayo that's fuckin' based as shit" and basically scraped off data from iridia's metavault with a digital paint peeler to make it, similar to how the gorgon's basilisk is made through data scraped from the DIYHED metavault c:

[vocal ridge]

Feels like that's a plausible thing that could happen.

[timber barn]

Plus, I mean it's HORUS. These beautiful bastards are absolutely the ones insane enough and with the capabilities to somehow weaponize gaslighting into an actual tactical weapon LMAO- /hj

I would also argue that it would make at least a little more sense for the HORUS boys to be able to make an entire mech with just the metavault data considering that unlike DIYHED, Iridia's metavault is actually still active and stable versus DIYHED which is stated to be dispersed and such, so there's likely alot more data to go around! :D

[vocal ridge]

Love to see it!

[vocal ridge]

@scarlet cloak I see you were asking in rules question about Iridia - is there something I can help you with?

[scarlet cloak]

well yeah, hello

I wanted to cook something up with the sanctifier and thought about something but got a question, pretty dumb one but still

quickprint fabricator isn't unique - does that mean I can grab for example 3 of them on a single mech and use all three so 3 different blocks exist at the same time?

[vocal ridge]

Correct, that's as intended.

[scarlet cloak]

okay, tysm! glad to hear that

[vocal ridge]

Np - I get that those kinds of systems are typically unique.

But, hey, if someone wants cubes, I say they can have cubes. 😛

[livid sail]

Seems interesting I'll check this out later

[vocal ridge]

Well, always happy to hear peoples' thoughts on stuff!

[sinful trout]

i had a question about sleight of hand, does it count as repositioning for selene's "token of my esteem" trait, or is the trait referring exclusively to the redeploy action

[vocal ridge]

Ah, yes, I probably should have used redeploy instead of resposition. It's just meant to be for the Drone actions themselves, not tech actions targeting drones. I'll make a note to update the wording for the next time I push an update.

There are sometimes when my brain just doesn't use the existing terminology. 😅

[sinful trout]

ah okie! i figured that was the intention i just wanted to make sure

[naive briar]

how big are terala exactly does it vary

i imagine them to be corn snake sized but maybe smaller but i might be wrong

[vocal ridge]

quickly googling how big corn snakes are That feels about how I pictured them. That and/or big enough to act as a cute scarf. "The size it needs to be most adorable for a given character" is usually a good answer.

So "snek size may vary depending on age (and aesthetic needs)" is probably the best answer, haha.

(I love how popular the terala has been. 😌 )

[naive briar]

awesome ty

[velvet quiver]

Big fan of the Iridia Structure Templates, but been having trouble finding excuses to use them because they seem intimidating compared to the CRB structure templates (partially due to being more complex and having a more focused power budget).

How would y’all recommend building OpFors using those templates? They don’t quite occupy the same space as “Commander/Elite” in my brain quite yet so I think I need a little more advice beyond that

[kindred comet]

First, in case you hadn't seen this, there's some guidance on using the more unusual templates on Iridia's "New NPCs and Templates" page (page 207 in the PDF).

Anyway, as you noticed the templates are more focused than the ones in the core rulebook....Which isn't too surprising, since the core rulebook was responsible for supporting the entire game system at launch and so the templates there tend towards the generic to make them broadly usable. Iridia's templates are more in the direction of "make a memorable encounter" type things, as are most of its NPCs (along with reinforcing setting flavor mechanically, but that doesn't help you much).

Broadly speaking, I approach building an encounter with something like that by starting with a "keystone" NPC and setting up things around it. E.g. "I want to have an OpFor with a Shieldbearer Fusillade, what other NPCs would benefit (from) that, and what NPCs would they like having around" until I find I'm overbudget somewhere and trim down to something reasonable manageable.

When composition gets confusing, I find it helpful to think of NPCs as perks in a build, rather than characters in a party; and in this case the approach is a one-fancy-trick build instead of an all-arounder.

[velvet quiver]

Idk why I never read page 207, or at least don’t recall doing so. Good advice!

But yeah, using the complex “Template Alts” as keystone NPCs is probably the best call- the templates feel more “centerpiece-y” than the CRB templates

Flavor + mechanics wise Shieldbearer and SysAdmin still confuse me but I’ll learn in time

[vocal ridge]

Yeah, the Iridia Structure Templates are inherently more focused than the Core ones, which does limit their use compared to the "generically good" core stuff.

Shieldbearer is intended to give a more defensive/support type 'elite' (and is pretty inherently something you don't want to use a lot, with some puzzle boss elements), while SysAdmin is very heavily focused on Tech aspects (which is mostly just something I found lacking in a lot of the Core Templates so wanted to add in a lot of options). So just by their nature, they're a ton more situational.

[velvet quiver]

The SysAdmin base traits do scare me a little (it’s Hardened Target + Scorpion) but it shouldn’t be that big of a deal I hope

[vocal ridge]

Just don't miss.

[kindred comet]

Note that ICE and Firewall jams until the start of their next turn, not until the end; it's not as horrific as actual Scorpion.

[velvet quiver]

Oh tru

[vocal ridge]

"Until start of next turn" is such a fun duration to play around with.

[wise nova]

stun that only lasts until the end of that turn is funny

makes the target easier to hit

[vocal ridge]

Also causes autofail for certain saves. There's a reason my Iskander alt stuns until the start of its next turn with its core power.

[astral wigeon]

Quick question regarding the Selene (not sure if someone has already asked this) How does it interact with Heavy gunner and the Ghast nexus? Would heavy gunner get its range and LoS from the Selene or the Ghast drone?

[kindred comet]

I don't think it'd be any different for the Selene than it is for anything else....The target would have to within the drone-ified Ghast's range and line of sight, and within 10 spaces of you.

If you mean the Nyx, I believe you'd have to choose which of the Superposition-ed drones you're using when you take Heavy Gunner's action, since having to be within range and line of sight of it makes its position relevant.

[astral wigeon]

Well i was wondering how it'd interact with Token of my Esteem. Mainly if heavy gunner would work if the drone moved with an ally or not.

[kindred comet]

I don't see why not...at the very least, I don't see why it'd be handled differently than if e.g. someone else used Puppetmaster to move your deployed Ghast.

[astral wigeon]

Ok, cool. was wondering if there was some exception somewhere that'd make this tactic not work. Though im not sure how much of a good idea it is to use your heavy mount as a meat shield for your allies.

[kindred comet]

I mean, Companion Drone is right there.

[astral wigeon]

True, but the option is there. just not a good one

[kindred comet]

I could see a deploy-then-Skirmish working, honestly; everyone loves the opposition taking damage, and the initial deployment of the Ghast is a free action. Lunar Warding splits damage after reductions and the Ghast does have Armor; worst case, you spending one Repair on a drone vs your ally Structuring could still be a good trade.

[vocal ridge]

Yeah, all of the aforementioned stuff is right. The Heavy Gunner + Ghast combo remains the same as it always does - you have to have the target within range 10 of you (can't use Token of My Esteem to originate that from someone), so the drone being super far away will make things a bit more awkward for you, probably. And the drone moving with an ally won't cause any problems for HG.

[pulsar zodiac]

does enyo wrathborn's adrenaline surge work on weapons that cannot be destroyed like integrated weapons?

I assume not

[kindred comet]

I don't think you could choose to destroy an indestructible weapon to trigger Adrenaline Rush's effect, no.

[vocal ridge]

Nope, if it can't be destroyed, you can't destroy it to gain effects.

[velvet quiver]

If I wanted to use the Weaponmaster template on a Ronin to Emulate it using a Terashima blade, do you recommend any 2 mods good for that purpose? Some of the ronin optionals already hit the right notes so I’m trying to figure out good mods for closing the gap, adding a little extra

[vocal ridge]

Breaker Mod, probably, and Quake Mod, maybe?

[velvet quiver]

Oh I missed Quake Mod- yeah that would be great, full agree

Especially as a Grapple Defense

I was thinking “dang there’s no Knockback mod to fit Wind Stance” but tbh Quake Mod is better than just outright Knockback

Then Breaker for Ogre, Extended Blade for Storm, and then just normal Deflect for Lord’s

[velvet quiver]

I could edit Auto-Fire to work on melee weapons, apply it to the Ronin’s weapon to emulate Ogre stance in a way that’s less “oh I’ll just pick this one”-y, but eh, if both the mods are just definitively good against my Zheng player then I’ll just stick with ‘em

(Even if I’m sending this Ronin to hunt down our Unicorn)

[vivid granite]

@vocal ridge would it be alright for me to nominate the ananke in the ongoing mechanic brewery thread? i wanna check just in case!

[vocal ridge]

Yep, fine with me.

I'm not going to tell people "no, don't nominate a thing of mine that you like", haha.

[vivid granite]

hehehe

it was between the ananke, the rosy maple, and the silver for me, but i gotta go with my favorite teleporty shenanigans enabler

[vocal ridge]

I know I had a tough time choosing between the Phane, Psyche and Nemesis for my submission. And that was avoiding any alts, because that would have unlocked more choice paralysis, haha.

[vivid granite]

completely fair

i know the phane is really popular in particular

[vocal ridge]

Yeeeeep.

It's very much the Favorite for people, haha.

(And, I mean, I won't argue it's not cool. 😛 )

[vivid granite]

@weary grove is playing one in my game atm (though we're in a slow spot atm as real life is busy for everyone)

[vocal ridge]

I have a perpetual soft spot for it, because the art holds seeds of the original concept for Iridia frames, which was basically living statues (which is why the Psyche has subtle marbling on it). So the Eldritch Rock Mech has nods to that.

[vivid granite]

ohh thats cool

[vocal ridge]

The other behind the scenes thing for the Phane is that the first draft of the frame tried out some paint decorations. It looked cool, but didn't quite work with the full render, so unfortunately needed to be scrapped.

(There was also a potential more industrial kind of colour scheme, but that one ended up losing the rock effect that I was hoping to get. Cool, but ended up going with matching the rocks from the Ersa.)

[vivid granite]

yeah the dull white sells it a lot better

the first time i played lancer my pilot had a balor and i drew him as basically a living gargoyle sort of guy so i completely dig the statue mech asthetic

did other frames go through design drafts like this?

[vocal ridge]

Yeah, Joe and I had a fair bit of back and forth - typically on nailing down the exact colour scheme (the Silver, for instance, had blue as a potential alternative to green - which I later learned was in reference to the two colour schemes of the Armoured Core frame that it resembles), or little details... especially the helmets.

I did a lot of fiddling around with the replace-colour tool to give visual feedback of what I was talking about, haha.

[vivid granite]

makes sense!

[vocal ridge]

(But, yeah, especially with the Demonworks' visor aesthetic being the defining characteristic of the manufacturer, I learned I am rather particular about helmet designs. 😅 )

[solemn crypt]

so what I've noticed with the Nemesis is that it is about as functional as other strikers; it's mobility is about as good as one would expect on the surface, but it's lack of 'staying put' power makes it not too potent.

i've had many encounters where I've pushed the nemesis back using two NPCs with enough HP to tank its initial assaults, because otherwise I can pretty consistently shave structure off of it.

the wingblades in particular get a lot more use than I expected, but not due to hunter talent shenanigans, moreso as a way to guarantee an already winged target dying.

As a GM, I personally have no problems with handling it, since there is counterplay to be had against it without feeling the same level of overwhelming dread I get when dealing with a speed 6 vlad or a very aggressive Nelson. It's something I enjoy going up against, as I don't need to radically alter my encounters around its ability to get into and out of positions and then deal damage, as it's not often popping a single vital unit in my composition unless i leave it too exposed for too long.

it's a good frame, like many in Iridia, and I don't think there's much I'd want nerfed about it from a GM perspective, since it all functions fairly well.

If I had one thing to say on it as a weakness, it's that once it's pinned down, it's fucked.
I triple structured it using a goliath that had grappled it in a single sitrep, and have consistently been able to hold it down once it does get stuck.

at higher LLs, or hull investment, this isn't as much of an issue, but it is noticable just how much it suffers compared to other strikers when its stuck in a position it doesn't want to be in, and how it's often easier to do so than with a blackbeard, or other such units.

This might be a consequence of the players build, but, it's what I've seen. It needs allies to get it out of bad situations if it ends up in one...which I personally see as a positive of the mechs design as it forces cooperation in dire moments, so I wouldn't change it.

[vocal ridge]

A mech being described as "Functional" is a place I'm very happy to be in, haha. Glad to hear how it reacts to different situations - and, yeah, being Grappled (or Immobilized in general, really) turns off a lot of what it wants to do.

[solemn crypt]

Mhm. It's great, and I wouldn't have it any other way.

Again, there's a reason Iridia is consistently allowed in my campaigns 😅

[velvet quiver]

For y’all who have run the Oracle, particularly as an Ultra- do you have any recommendations on how to pare it down so it’s not so overwhelming? I’m subbing it into a module and unfortunately the SCL and Chronotorus optionals that Witch has are non-negotiable for narrative reasons

[vocal ridge]

To pare it down, I'd probably remove two of the five techs (either two recharge or one recharge and one base), that you feel might not be as impactful against your specific PC party.

The Oracle has a lot of options... but I will say that being able to spend Fate to recharge the SCL is probably going to be a pretty centralizing option, haha.

So, perhaps use that a little sparingly.

[velvet quiver]

Well it’ll be Rebake SCL

So no worries about that

[vocal ridge]

Ah, okay, I haven't had time to dig into that stuff.

[velvet quiver]

Rebake SCL basically ticks up over time rather than being a strict recharge, though recharge rolls can speed it up

[vocal ridge]

But, yeah, if the Oracle has additional stuff to do, I don't think it'll be much hassle to remove a few techs you don't think'll come up much in order to reduce the cognitive load.

(Really, the reason it has so much in the first place is that non-heat tech actions can end up being a lot more situational, so a miniboss needs more coverage.)

[velvet quiver]

The thing to consider though is that, as a Paragon, it’s guaranteed at least one optional from its class, which imo significantly affects its action economy and complexity

… except Shieldbearer

The problem is I… reallly like all the tech actions Oracle has they’re all very cool

So figuring out which ones to replace is difficult

[vocal ridge]

Yes, that's true, and it is definitely pushing the upper bounds of what I'd consider acceptable for a Paragon. There's a reason the Stellar Codex Paragons don't include a Dedicated Hacker. 😅

[velvet quiver]

I think there’s definitely design spaces for dedicated hacker Paragons without necessarily reaching the same levels of complexity as Oracle

One house change I might do however is combine Manufacturing Defect and Reactor Flux, likely making it random which effect comes out

Oh wait I just reread them

[vocal ridge]

Oh, undoubtedly, I just wasn't able to come up with any that felt workable.

[velvet quiver]

That wouldn’t work nevermind

To be fair it’s a very fun class

Big fan of the basic effect of Fate

And the Manufacturing Defect + Reactor Flux techs are loaded but very fun

[vocal ridge]

Glad to hear. It's definitely one of the NPCs that's felt the most hit-or-miss, haha.

[velvet quiver]

I might axe Hidden Tempers for the encounter I have planned tho- as fun as that much heat is (and despite the fact that the NPC it’s replacing is a Dark Cloud Witch) the consequence feels both too harsh and also inconsequential to my PCs plus Manufacturing Defect has practically the inverse effect and having both of those going at the same time is not a hand I wish to hand myself

[vocal ridge]

Hahaha, fair.

[velvet quiver]

… although Star Crossed Lovers could also go instead- the consequences both ways are pretty big, and the requirement to avoid the negatives just being “be at least one space closer” feels like too little to be significant

And Hidden Tempers could really mess with my Zheng player in a silly way

[vocal ridge]

That's part of why there's a bunch of techs. Because some are a lot more impactful in certain situations, while others are... not.

[velvet quiver]

Yeah I might just remove Hidden Tempers from the move pool- it’s fun, but the choice of any character means I can pick other PCs and force them to attack each other and that feels way too mean

I might also axe Computer Glitch- it’s so fun and I love it, but not only is the last thing I wanna do is discourage Scan, but my Swallowtail player will be very saddened by it

[vocal ridge]

Fair!

[willow crane]

Elvorix? Let me know how it goes. I've been planning a similar swapout

[velvet quiver]

I’ll also report back on my Ultra Rebake mods in that case

[vocal ridge]

If y'all end up with any Oracle feedback in general (or other NPCs/Templates for that matter), I'll be happy to take it into account. I've been accumulating a list of minor PDF updates I need to do, and was looking to do that in the not too distant future. ...now that I have enough to be worth actually fighting with Scribus about, haha.

(Same with Codex stuff - once I get some more alt frame art, well, gonna have to do a PDF push there, too.)

[velvet quiver]

Oh dang, that’s a big overhaul 0-0

[vocal ridge]

I mean, it's nothing major - mostly just some typos or font issues, a couple of wording changes to clear up common points of confusion, and a few small mechanics changes.

[velvet quiver]

Why is the Oracle size 2 out of curiosity?

[vocal ridge]

Mostly because I didn't want every hacker to be a spindly little Size 1/2 or 1.

[velvet quiver]

And then the Spite happened lmao

[vocal ridge]

The spite was before, but I'll admit I always considered that more of a hazard than hacker, haha.

[velvet quiver]

But yeah if it’s not for any mechanical purposes then I might mod it to be size 1, simply to fit the Calendula flavor better

[vocal ridge]

(The Paragons in general ended up a bit on the larger side in part to give them a bit more presence, and in part to make it harder for them to try and hide away.)

Yeah, it wouldn't break anything for it to be a Size 1.

[velvet quiver]

In terms of things I like about the Oracle I also like how it has sub gimmicks of “Recharge” and “Longevity” that tie into each other. Fate makes it so that it has very poor sustained value, its crit immunity being directly correlated with how lucky it is with the circumstances around it and is hard capped by how long the fight drags on for. It also has an abundance of recharge actions than it can auto-charge at the cost of said longevity. It’s fun!

Becoming weaker as the fight draws out is also exemplified with how a. Even with a few lucky recharge rolls, the more you spam recharge traits the more likely you are to be without one next turn, making it hard to remain sustained, and b. The weaker the players are, the weaker Manufacturing Defect and Reactor Flux are since those checks are more difficult if you have more stress/structure, meaning the weaker the players get the more they resist it. It makes the Oracle really feel more like a trickster than anything

[vocal ridge]

...why are they more difficult?

[velvet quiver]

The structure and stress checks prompted by the techs are rolled with a number of d6’s equal to current structure/stress rather than current structure/stress missing. Is that not intentional?

[vocal ridge]

Equal to their current marked structure/stress is the exact same wording as used for taking standard structure/overheat checks.

[velvet quiver]

Oh marked- oops, that’s a misread on my part

[vocal ridge]

It basically triggers an immediate roll with the worst results insulated.

[velvet quiver]

Ya know, after reflecting on it, I think I’ll run that Ultra Oracle unmodified. There are cool Kai Rebake tools I could give it but like… none are as interesting as what the Oracle already offers for the most part. Plus Hidden Tempers is just kinda Predatory Logic+, and my melee PC is just kinda able to close a gap of 7 spaces while only taking some heat.

However while I won’t be modifying it because I wanna see it in action, I will remark 2 things as just “vibe checks” on the Oracle:

1. The scaling of ranges in Star Crossed & Hidden Tempers + sensors across tiers feels like it reaches rather dangerous levels once you reach tiers 2 and 3. As does the scaling heat of Hidden Tempers.
2. Computer Glitch seems WAY more able to be circumvented and way less punishing than Hidden Tempers (just target the oracle or your Allies instead, or don’t use techs), so the fact Computer Glitch is recharge and Hidden tempers isn’t is odd to me.

I could, emphasis on could, just make the ranges + heats non-scaling and keep ‘em to their tier 1 numbers + swap the recharge tag from Glitch to Tempers. However if feedback on the current version is more desired I’d be happy to leave things unchanged and see how my players do.

And by default imma assume “unchanged” is more desired so… ye

[vocal ridge]

Yeah, the range scaling is something that I was looking at kiboshing whenever I get around to updates, just gotta figure out the best number to standardize it to. Heat Scaling is a thing that'd stay the same, though.

And that's a fair enough point on Glitch - I probably put too many restrictions on it to need recharge (since I didn't want it to just be a flat punish to tech users). Swapping that to Tempers might be reasonable, yeah.

If you want to try out the recharge change and a standardization to 5, feel free, and let me know how that works out.

[velvet quiver]

Will do! Only want to test them so long as they were planned changes!

And since the oracle is still a valid target Glitch never really felt to me like a flat punish. If anything, after tier 1 Tempers feels like a flat punish to melees

[vocal ridge]

It's definitely been the NPC I've most wanted to fiddle around with, haha.

And also, yes, melees definitely struggle a fair bit more with the Oracle than ranged characters. (Though, a range limit to 5 for the techs does make staying outside of ally range fairly viable regardless of tier.)

[velvet quiver]

Btw is tempers heat supposed to be before or after the triggering action?

[vocal ridge]

As far as I understand it, that sort of stuff only goes afterwards if it specifies (like in the Self Heat Tag).

So it'll happen at the start of the action, I suppose, if that matters for exact timing.

[velvet quiver]

That sounds… not great

Because it means that no matter what, you’re guaranteed to take Tempers Heat

Even if you’re, say, trying to attack the ally Tempers sicced you on

So if you’re a stock standard Everest at T1, no matter what you do, approximately half your heat cap is going down the drain unless you stabilize and do nothing else

I’ll still run it like that but punishing the target even if they do try and obey Tempers doesn’t sound great

Especially considering the possibility of an NPC being the Tempers target and potentially running away and screwing the Tempers victim over

actually that doesn’t really factor into things never mind

[vocal ridge]

I will say flat out the intent is if they're being targeted, it won't proc, on account of... y'know, they're being targeted.

It's just if they're not doing a target, it'll happen before the resolution of the action instead of post-resolution.

[velvet quiver]

RAW that’s not what happens, so that may be something that needs to be reworded

Since it’s any action or reaction and an exception is not explicitly carved out- I’ll run it RAI tho

B/c order of operations would otherwise be:

• Declare skirmish
• Take heat first because you initiated an action
• Make attack against target to execute skirmish
• end Tempers

[vocal ridge]

I'll put it on the list of things to update.

[velvet quiver]

I personally think the cleanest change would be “heat is taken after action rather than before” since if you’re checking “does this action attack the Tempers target?” before the action then stuff like Arc Projector or Annihilator or Disdainful Blade or even just Aux Follow Up Attacks could get messy

[vocal ridge]

Well, that wouldn't stop you taking heat if you're reading it the way from before, because you're still "Taking the action before the trigger to stop it from happening." Mid-action triggers are the bane of my existence. I'll figure something out.

[velvet quiver]

Well the way I’d read it, you take the heat after every action/reaction. but before the action resolves, you end the effect, therefore no heat

[vocal ridge]

Okay, got a 1.5 update pushed, about a year after 1.4, so this should hopefully be the last one! https://missdataninja.itch.io/field-guide-to-iridia/devlog/1460045/update-15

(And now that that's all completed, I can feel less bad about spending the last few months working on Veteran Traits to make the NPCs more Rebake Compatible, haha.)

(Spoilers for what's next down the pipeline.)

[vocal ridge]

This is the one I most keep giggling over. "Yes, Veterancy doesn't actually help the can't-gain-structure-lootbox, but what if..."

[vocal ridge]

Got a draft version down for the Veteran traits, so those'll make an appearance in a bonus document at some point. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1F60F8H1yVaGA00Om7mELgHf6HS0PIJUcFxjhOkPG3_w/edit

[vocal ridge]

I realized when doing the Veteran trait writeup, that I really don't actually like how I did the Directive. An NPC that interacts solely with inflicted conditions as its gimmick just feels too one-note, and made it lack an identity to attach a Veteran Trait to.

...which is why I ended up just rewriting the entire NPC, after declaring the last update to be probably the last one. Oopsies. 😅
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1V_WV5TSyRmLaItFcJnvwGYFXKGq3GRVcyBI5Znu43mk/edit?usp=sharing

On the plus side, I did manage to make sure I kept all the names and vibes of the old stuff, so the Iridia Voiceline pack was still completely useable. So success.

[chilly jewel]

Legionspace Jump is really cool and I wish there was a player version.

[vocal ridge]

Well, you do have...

(The existing Directive was an attempt at an NPC Ananke-like, but that kind of thing doesn't really work when it's an NPC's core gameplay loop as opposed to just part of a kit.)

Also, the Phane has this for player-side Lock On-specific Teleport gear. It's just not quite the same effect.

[vocal ridge]

Okay, new Directive and Rebake Compatibility put into the PDFs and pushed out the door. Today was a very productive day, haha. https://missdataninja.itch.io/field-guide-to-iridia/devlog/1481344/update-16-rebake-compatibility

Of course, this is just reminding me that I need to do the same thing for the Codex... so, still more work to do. 😅

[obtuse radish]

hey, neat

[vocal ridge]

Bespoke Veteran Stuff is just such a fun idea, I had to join in. Even if it's kept being slid to the backburner for way too long, haha.

So, y'know, thanks for being an inspiration and all!

[obtuse radish]

I do like it when I a thing I've made resonates in some fashion with other folks

[vocal ridge]

Well, consider it well and truly resonated, haha. Immediately after hearing the concept it started sparking ideas.

[tame silo]

My SSC Luna that will be using soon once we get to a printer, by tuo

[vocal ridge]

Ooh, snazzy. Love the subtle purples... and then the bright red Protagonist Scarf.

[tame silo]

It's soo good

[olive thicket]

Yo, data. What's good? I'm makin' a lil' build to test in our campaign and I'm wondering if anybody in here might be able to help me optimize it.

Essentially, it's an Atlas with a bunch of Nemesis stuff stapled on it.

[ LICENSES ]
  SSC Atlas 3, IRIDIA Nemesis 3
[ CORE BONUSES ]
  Overpower Caliber, Full Subjectivity Sync
[ TALENTS ]
  Blade Dancer 3, Duelist 2, Skirmisher 2, Gladiator 2
[ STATS ]
  HULL:4 AGI:2 SYS:0 ENGI:2
  STRUCTURE:4 HP:17 ARMOR:0
  STRESS:4 HEATCAP:6 REPAIR:4
  TECH ATK:-2 LIMITED:+1
  SPD:7 EVA:16 EDEF:6 SENSE:3 SAVE:13
[ WEAPONS ]
  Flex Mount: Terashima Blade :cc_threat:1 :cc_damage_kinetic:1d6
  Main Mount: Plasma Sabre :cc_threat:3 :cc_damage_energy:2 // Overpower Caliber
[ SYSTEMS ]
  Jäger Kunst II x4, Supersonic Booster x2 ```

I need help budgeting this poor bastard. Only 2 Systems means I'm really gonna eat it when I inevitably get structured.

Some preliminary ideas include: Swap out OpCal for Sacred Armaments and trade 2 Agi for 2 Sys, which would let me put in Chaff Launchers and my pick of either Jager Kunst 1 or Tactical Coordination Suite, which doubles as both a worthy sacrifice to System Trauma and as a neat little thing I can do when Two Sword Tony isn't the answer to the combat Puzzle.

But having Supersonic Booster does give me the idea that it'd be nice to have one or two levels of Juggernaut in the build and then my brain breaks again.

[willow crane]

Well, for one you're doubling up on melee weapons. You don't need both the plasma sabr and the terrashima blade

I recommend dropping the Supersonic Boostrrs and Nemesis 3 for something else.

JK 1 is also a more reliable and powerful movement tool.

You don't have a lot of self heat, so considering swapping EnG for systems to free up some SP.

As an Atlas you want to be doing hit and run on prone Targets, not barraging.

Esra 1 for Terrain formatter is a great way for knocking people prone

[olive thicket]

Hm.

So no doubling up on Melee weapons on top of that... Then what should I run on that Flex slot instead?

[willow crane]

It's generaly not a good idea. You don't want to be barraging on an Atlas. Your damage trait is only 1/round. You want to be using your insane speed to get in, obliterate someone, and scooch away.

Kraul rifle is a good mobility tool, and GMS assault rifle is a tool for dealing with flying enemies like hornets and aces

[olive thicket]

Plasma Sabre having a lot of damage + the Impair chance appealed to me as well, due to how Atlas has a lot of tools that force Saves, like JK2 and Ricochet Blades.

[ LICENSES ]
  SSC Atlas 3, IRIDIA Nemesis 2, IRIDIA Ersa 1
[ CORE BONUSES ]
  Full Subjectivity Sync, Sacred Armaments
[ TALENTS ]
  Blade Dancer 3, Duelist 2, Skirmisher 2, Gladiator 2
[ STATS ]
  HULL:4 AGI:0 SYS:4 ENGI:0
  STRUCTURE:4 HP:19 ARMOR:0
  STRESS:4 HEATCAP:4 REPAIR:4
  TECH ATK:+2 LIMITED:+0
  SPD:6 EVA:14 EDEF:10 SENSE:3 SAVE:13
[ WEAPONS ]
  Flex Mount: Assault Rifle (Targeting Uplink)
  Main Mount: Plasma Sabre
[ SYSTEMS ]
  Jäger Kunst II x3, Chaff Launcher, Jäger Kunst I, Terrain Formatter, Personalizations, Multi-Gear Maneuver System```

So, something like this?

It's a little scary only having 14 Evasion, but I guess Atlas is just a HASE hungry frame in general.

Besides, I've got Chaff Launcher and various sources of Soft Cover to help me with that, at least.

Idk.

[chilly jewel]

Nah. I'd drop some stuff and go 4004 so hackers don't boil your reactor out.

[olive thicket]

Yeah, that was also a worry I had.

I don't know, maybe this whole idea was bad from the start. I should try looking for some synergies in Iridia for Atlas outside that initial thought of just "Plasma Saber good".

But I still really want Plasma Saber in this build >:/

Maybe I should ditch Atlas 3? But then I'd like to have some stuff to help make Blade Dancer 3 sing and help make the Impair on Plasma Blade feel like it mattered.

[willow crane]

Drop atlas 3 for metalmark 1

Flash charges and reactive weave are both amazing systems for the hit and run lifestyle

[olive thicket]

I'll look into some of that when I get home.

Do you think I should keep Full Sub Sync?

Yeah I guess Jager Kunst 2 isn't really gonna do anything for me if I'm looking to make them prone before making a Melee attack.

[vocal ridge]

Adding to what other people have said, I definitely don't think Sacred Armaments is worth just going for the +2 SP - not having any AOE to use the main effect on really cuts the teeth from it.

[olive thicket]

Right.

Additionally, I don't really like the idea of building Invade systems unto the Atlas, that feels like trying to fit a Square peg through a Circular Hole.

So I'm gonna keep trying to find something that makes sense for me. It might just be a matter of accepting the fact that I'm just not gonna have a lot of Systems to go around.

[vocal ridge]

Yeah, you can force it to work, but if you're wanting a Tech!Atlas kind of thing, looking at the Luna and putting Atlas systems on it would probably be the way to go.

[olive thicket]

Yeaaaa.

Definetly makes sense.

As far as buildpath goes, the intention was to make sure half of all LLs or more were spent on things from Iridia, while still building within the constraints of the Atlas. Looking at the Luna now, I think there's a lot in here that could help me strike that balance.

So I'm gonna try to figure something out with that.

[ LICENSES ]
  SSC Atlas 2, IRIDIA Nemesis 2, SSC Metalmark 1, IRIDIA Aphrodite 1
[ CORE BONUSES ]
  Full Subjectivity Sync, Auto-Stabilizing Hardpoints
[ TALENTS ]
  Blade Dancer 3, Duelist 2, Skirmisher 2, Siege Specialist 2
[ STATS ]
  HULL:4 AGI:0 SYS:0 ENGI:4
  STRUCTURE:4 HP:19 ARMOR:0
  STRESS:4 HEATCAP:8 REPAIR:4
  TECH ATK:-2 LIMITED:+2
  SPD:6 EVA:14 EDEF:6 SENSE:3 SAVE:13
[ WEAPONS ]
  Flex Mount: Celestial Weaver (Targeting Uplink) // Auto-Stabilizing Hardpoints
  Main Mount: Plasma Sabre
[ SYSTEMS ]
  Chaff Launcher, Jäger Kunst I, Personalizations, Metaframe Siphon, Reactive Weave``` Had this as an idea while exploring various frames. GMS Rifle was a concept suggested before and Aphrodite also has a Reliable 2 Gun and a 1 SP System I like, so I thought this might be cool. Though if my main concern is bypassing Innacurate on any one particular gun, it may be better to just stick to Kraul Rifle.

Especially since that one has pretty solid Synergy with Plasma Sabre's Impaired Crit.

Thought Siege Spec 2 would be a cute way to trigger prone but eh

[vocal ridge]

Psh, who needs Accuracy? Just roll better.

[olive thicket]

Truuuuuuuuue

[velvet quiver]

Out of curiosity when it comes to Iridia actually- I just saw the section on compatibility and got curious, was Stellar Codex designed to be Iridia compatible or no?

[vocal ridge]

Yes, you're intended to be able to use both. Pretty sure I did a mention of it in both books?

[velvet quiver]

I need to update my Iridia PDF but I must’ve missed it in Stellar Codex then

[vocal ridge]

At the very least, I'm pretty sure there's nothing that combos egregiously, haha. (Or else my playtesters would probably have jumped on it.)

[velvet quiver]

Ah yeah it’s right there lol

[vocal ridge]

Easily missed, haha.

[tame silo]

Meow

[vocal ridge]

(But, as always, if you find any combos that look problematic, feel free to bring them forwards. Sometimes things slip a little through the cracks.)

Especially for things that get added later. I know Luminary Mod + Reality Cutter was strong-but-workable... but that got pushed into "too much" when the CB rework happened and subspace tear entered the picture. "Yes, I will throw the weapon 5 spaces, teleport the target 3, and then teleport to the opposite side of the target for what might end up being 10 spaces if it's big enough for 0 cost in movement."

So, Reality Cutter needed to get rewritten. 😔

[terse fable]

Hiii hello
I've been given the go ahead by our GM to respec into a Rosy Maple starting next mission because the mage appeal is powerful
I'll drop by in case I have questions and/or feedback and you have my thanks for giving me another size 1/2 hacker to play with

[vivid granite]

rosy maple is slept on tbh, id be interested in hearing shenanigans with it too

signal relay is SUCH a cool trait

[terse fable]

I don't know how useful Signal relay is going to be with my group since they don't have much in the way of tech actions that target foes but it is very funny
The core power I like a lot though, it's simple in how it works and i'm a sucker for efficients

[velvet quiver]

Rosy Maple was a teammate in a one shot I was in once, and it looked pretty busted to me but the player also System Maxed so they got murked first

It was also a while back tho and like. Anything normal in Lancer feels busted that’s just kinda how the power curve is supposed to be

[terse fable]

Currently it's looking like this, though it's liable to change since we have a bit of time before we reach next mission (probably a month or so, maybe more)

[ LICENSES ]
  HORUS Goblin 3, SSC Dusk Wing 2, HORUS Minotaur 2
[ CORE BONUSES ]
  The Lesson of the Open Door, Remixed Frequencies
[ TALENTS ]
  Technophile 3, Iconoclast 3, Black Thumb 2, Field Analyst 1, Runecaster 1
[ STATS ]
  HULL:3 AGI:0 SYS:4 ENGI:2
  STRUCTURE:4 HP:18 ARMOR:0
  STRESS:4 HEATCAP:6 REPAIR:4
  TECH ATK:+6 LIMITED:+1
  SPD:6 EVA:8 EDEF:16 SENSE:15 SAVE:17
[ WEAPONS ]
  Main Mount: Veil Rifle
  Flex Mount: Charged Blade
[ SYSTEMS ]
  H0R_OS System Upgrade I, Viral Logic Suite, H0R_OS System Upgrade II, Flicker Field Projector, Metafold Carver, Enlightenment-Class NHP, Unstable NHP, OSIRIS-Class NHP, Personalizations```

[velvet quiver]

One thing I will say about the Rosy Maple however is that I don’t entirely understand how it ties into the Dusk Wing license, but I wasn’t the one who made one so I haven’t taken the most time to delve into to it. If someone wants to infodump how the frame and license tie together I’d be happy to learn

[chilly jewel]

I kind of think you want 1 rank of Duelist for accuracy with the charged blade.

[terse fable]

Nah it's secondary as all hell

[chilly jewel]

More so than FA or Runecaster?

[terse fable]

Yeah I'm gonna be full tech-ing every turn

And the second I remove FA every attack my teammates make will miss by 1 every single time (plus we have a stortebeker, he wants the crits so bad)

[velvet quiver]

It just seems to me the only thing it interacts with is Neurospike and maybe Oasis Wall for high speed (tho no flight and being small hurts it too). Apart from that I don’t really see any synergy

[terse fable]

eh, I'm no expert but the regular dusk wing already has the rest of the license covered I feel like

[velvet quiver]

Part of the point of an alt frame is to provide a new distinct way to interact with an existing license, and tbh I don’t know how Rosy Maple does that. If anything it feels more like a Goblin alt

[willow crane]

to be fair, the dusk Wing doesn't have a huge amount of synergy with its License gear ether

[vocal ridge]

There's varying degrees of Synergy - and I honestly think it's a bit constraining to think of alt-frames as requiring a strong gameplay loop in the license (heck, a lot of core licenses don't have that). It could be a goblin alt, but I just wanted to try out a Dusk Wing that leaned a bit more into the hacker role.

Its control and support are more tech-oriented, and it can mount both guns, but it's really just as grab-bag as the original Dusk Wing, haha.

[velvet quiver]

Fair enough, I suppose it's a philosophy I subscribe to personally

[vocal ridge]

Forcing Lock Ons in order to attack is strong, from experience, but since NPCs often have spare actions lying around while they Skirmish, it's not as hard control as it might seem at first glance.

[velvet quiver]

Oh yeah nowadays I feel the Rosy Maple is strong but fair- I was just describing my initial reactions lol

[vocal ridge]

Ah, gotcha.

[terse fable]

I will bully all the aces Matsci throws at us though

[vocal ridge]

As one does.

[placid nimbus]

yo i just wanted to hop in and give some praise, been reading this LCP real slowly for quite a while
i love the Locus (especially the MK2), Aphrodite (absolute favorite in the module), rosy maple, Ersa, and the Epione. They're all so fuckin sick

[placid nimbus]

huge fan of the nemesis mk1 also, super fun. i wanna run it with a terashima blade and have some dumbass stance shenanigans.
nyx fucks hard also, huge fan

[vocal ridge]

Glad to hear! There's so much stuff in the book, it's nice to hear about a lot of things getting love, haha.

It makes me happy that the Aphrodite worked out, because she was a very last minute addition, between the failed kickstarter and the final book. So it's nice to know the extra stuff wasn't in vain. 😛

Also, fun fact about the Champion - the reason it has the stance mechanic in the first place, is because a player in the original Iridia game did a Downtime Action to get their mentor's sword (which was represented as a Terashima blade) from before her mech was reformatted into an Iridian Nemesis. So,, really, you're just continuing on the tradition.

[main rain]

honestly shocked that Aphrodite was so last-minute, it's probably one of my personal favorite mechs in the whole supplement just on a vibes/lore basis

i was curious - is there any chance the Iridia NPCs LCP will get updated to v3 so the Identity eidolon layer shows up in compcon?

[vocal ridge]

Well, glad to hear she doesn't feel last minute, haha. She was definitely one of those frames that went from sudden idea to full concept in a very short span of time.

[vocal ridge]

There's a good chance I'll do v3 updating, but I'll say right now I have no idea when it'll get done. My lcps have so much stuff, and I haven't even scratched the surface on v3 documentation.

So don't hold your breath on it being compatible soon, given how many entries I have to figure out how to update without breaking things.

[main rain]

gotcha! the lcp seems to be compatible out of the box at least so it's mostly the eidolon layer i was wondering about (since i plan to potentially use it in my campaign at some point skdjhfsk) but also that's very understandable lol

it is a ginormous pair of LCPs

[vocal ridge]

Makes sense, yeah. But, sorry, it probably won't be that soon, haha, because the new formatting is pretty overwhelming if I'm being honest. 😅

[scarlet cloak]

i have a character in lancer who made such jump

girlie is now one of my most beloved chars in my entire history of playing ttrpg.

[vocal ridge]

I was just happy to have a chance to go "yes, give me all the gold filigree. The more ostentatious, the better", haha.

[main rain]

you can really feel how it's a very... concept-heavy mech, in a way, like, idk, it gives me the vibes that it and its license were built less around a mechanical angle and more around a vibe which is something i love when well executed

that and i'm a sucker for paracausal nonsense

all that, plus Heartbreaker Cannon might actually be my single favorite core system on any lancer mech ever made, but then there is genuinely nothing in this game that gets me more excited than "deal 1 structure damage" except maybe the word "cascade"

[vocal ridge]

Fun design fact: unlike most Demonworks mechs (barring the Selene, which symbolizes a dedication to a different goddess, and the Champion, which is nominally GMS), the Aphrodite has eyes instead of the usual 'Y-visor' aesthetic the rest of the mechs have. Given it's less a mech, and more of a symbolic representation of a mech.

[vocal ridge]

Well, then you might like this mech from my other book, haha.

[main rain]

ayo

[vocal ridge]

"Deal 1 Structure Damage" is indeed a very good way to be eyecatching.

[main rain]

i really am a sucker for efficient core powers and for anything that feels big and flashy

like i'm always disappointed by stuff like Hyperspec Fuel Injector or TBK Sustain Suite from vanilla, but these are right up my alley

[vocal ridge]

It's a fun design space. Iridia has a mix of cores, but Stellar Codex is all Efficients, all the time. It was part of the design challenge, haha.

[main rain]

ooo i love that

i gotta check that out

[vocal ridge]

You're in luck, given the most recent two alts were just added yesterday. So there's 16 to peruse.

[main rain]

oh god more Paragons? Paradox template? factional templates? you can't do this to me, i already spent like 100+ dollars on books and software and stuff for my home game

[vocal ridge]

Hahaha, sorry.

[placid nimbus]

i'm the opposite tbh! i like when core powers are like a fuckin fighting game install

[main rain]

that's honestly so valid! tbf Hyperspec Fuel Injector is also good by me because it's like, "rest of the scene get XYZ impactful effect" it just doesn't speak to me as much as efficients or big flashy stuff lol

i do think TBK Sustain Suite is a fantastic example of what i mean though with like, a deeply disappointing core power

[velvet quiver]

You know I just started reading the Iridia Demonworks frames… why is the Ananke so fragile?

[vocal ridge]

It's one of the high defenses, low HP frames. Very goblin coded.

[velvet quiver]

Fair- it’s traits or stats don’t seem particularly exceptional in any regard imo, but maybe that’s just the Sunzi lean in over my shoulder causing me to undervalue teleportation

[vocal ridge]

Also, the important bit is Legionspace Transit works on allied characters. So, yes, you could use it exclusively on getting next to hostiles, but it's also a very vital get-out-of-dodge tool if you use Bolster or one of the many allied tech packages.

Being able just go 15 spaces to an ally is very strong.

[velvet quiver]

I highly doubt anyone is even considering using Legionspace Transit to get close to enemies on this frame- unless that enemy is a bombard

[vocal ridge]

...you'd be surprised, haha.

[velvet quiver]

Tru, and since it’s any tech action you can just Lock Onto an enemy

[vocal ridge]

Though, if I were to make a change to the license, it'd be replacing Dimensional Key with something else. That's more of a relic from an earlier iteration of the frame (that had buffs from teleportation, but no inherent teleport). It's pretty awkward, and really I should put that on the list of "if I ever do more changes, look at that."

[velvet quiver]

Eh, every license has something a little out of pocket

… okay well not every license- you get the point

As long as a majority of the license is cohesive you can have a wildcard here or there

[vocal ridge]

Yeah, but this is a bit too awkward. In that it's a short range - but not melee - weapon on something with a base speed of 2 that relies on adjacency to move.

Anyways, it's on the list of "oh god I don't want to poke at this book again but if I find more problem children I will." 😛

[velvet quiver]

Iridia is such a big supplement and is relatively aged at this point so I’d personally recommend leaving it be when it comes to larger overhaul stuff

[vocal ridge]

Two and a half years, which is quite a lot longer than it feels like, haha.

But, yeah, I'm not going to go out of my way to change anything, just I like making notes of things that come up in case I do collect enough of them.

[velvet quiver]

And while I can see use cases for the weapon on an Ananke, I can’t say for same for Paracausal Mod or Kinetic Hammer and yet they exists on Saladin and Raleigh respectively. Sometimes a license just gatekeeps a piece of equipment from everyone else lol

[vocal ridge]

(Kinetic hammer pairs well with Uncle, as a heavy reliable weapon if you want a closer-range option.)

[velvet quiver]

You’re right Kinetic Hammer was a poor example

[vocal ridge]

But that's a broader scope topic. 😛

[velvet quiver]

(Example use cases being- teleporting into a group of 2 enemies and using the weapon to not end adjacent to an enemy, teleporting behind an ally and shooting the enemy between you and them to make positioning awkward, overwatching with the gun to juke out incoming enemies)

[vocal ridge]

Yeah, it's just extremely situational, which I try my best to avoid now, haha. It's definitely showing that it was one of my first frames, haha. I think just after the Artemis, so the 2nd frame beyond the initial batch of 6.

[terse fable]

✋🏼
On the Rosy Maple (again), is the additional invasion option on Source Purge meant to be a different option or can it be the same one twice?

[vocal ridge]

Y'know, in my head, it was always a different option, but I guess there's no reason why it can't be the same one twice, haha. Even if the ones that can stack are, like... just Puppet Systems.

[terse fable]

Well, there's Ophidian trek in case you want to teleport someone 2d6+2 spaces but that's basically the same thing with extra steps, or logic bomb if you really want everyone around to be slowed, but yeah there's not many practical uses of this

[vocal ridge]

Yeah, there's so few it would be relevant for, I just didn't even consider the possibility, haha.

[tame silo]

I used the luna for the first time today

It's a great frame (god bless being able to be invis holy shit)

But I don't think it's for me, atleast not without more extra investment from some more licenses and talents

Regardless it's really fun to play :3

[vocal ridge]

Completely valid. There's a lot of frames out there, not every one is going to click with everyone. (Goodness knows I went through a lot of experimenting when I played, and that was just with the core frames, haha.)

[terse fable]

@vocal ridge More questions! About the Ananke's Mirrored soul this time. Are conditions inflicted as a consequence of another effect also mirrored? For example, a character that becomes prone (status) automatically becomes slowed (condition) as well. If the character under Mirrored soul rams someone and makes them prone, is the slow reflected? Same thing for grappled and immobilized.

[vocal ridge]

Yep!

[terse fable]

thank you

[willow crane]

leo what evil are you planning

[vocal ridge]

Psh, no evil could exist here.

[terse fable]

Nothing I'd have the SP for, don't worry

[terse fable]

Like at best I'd have the SP for an extra invade package at LL10 or 11

[vocal ridge]

A thought occurred to me while I was pondering rollable tables - I wonder how many people entirely skip over the existence of the "ways to get Demonworks frames" tables. Since they're only in the full book, but are next to the frames (so in the otherwise PC-section of stuff). So even if someone upgrades to the full book, they might not notice there's a bit of extra content. Hm.

[mystic spruce]

So, what are people’s general thoughts on the balance of this field guide?

My gm feels like it might be op for some of them

[vivid granite]

what in particular does your gm have concerns about?

ive gmed for the hemera frame with a core bonus and talents from it and run several of the npcs. nothing in my (admittedly narrow) experience stood out to me as being a problem. i could theorize my own views on certain things but imo thats not helpful without actual playtesting the stuff

[mystic spruce]

Well she isn’t a fan of the Aphrodite’s core power because it’s easy to get lock on from other mechs and just delete a mech off the map

[velvet quiver]

While that is potent, it’s still taking a Full Action from you.

Compare it to the Enkidu core power. That isn’t efficient, but it’s usable an unlimited number of times per the combat you have it in, and as long as it doesn’t fail, it does not cost any actions.

The Aphrodite basically takes that, makes its action cost real, spreads it across all combats in the mission as a 1/scene, and changes the requirement from having 7 or less HP to auto-structuring.

Quite a few abilities in Lancer are capable of being “Delete That Structure” abilities, and the Aphrodite core just cuts out the middleman while also encouraging teamwork from other mechs giving you Lock On

Yeah it can peel a structure off an Ultra or a Goliath, but that’s not necessarily taking actions off the board, and while it can take an untemplated NPC off the board, it’s costing you your full action and that’s an untemplated NPC who cares about them.

Meanwhile a Cyclone Pulse Rifle Build is capable of peeling a structure off of anyone on the field every 2 rounds

And the core power also triggers Center of Attention, meaning the Aphrodite will gain Lock On as a consequence of using its core

And it can’t benefit from Hidden or Invisible either, meaning it’s an artillery that’s unable to make use of some really potent defensive tools, thereby making it more frail

If she still thinks the Aphrodite is too strong then she can just selectively disallow the frame if she wants, treat the Aphrodite License as a specialty license or something

[terse fable]

Admitedly I bought the book but never read it
I'll take a gander now though because now i'm curious

[vocal ridge]

I will note that, even if you "cheat" out the Lock On with things like the Horus core, the action economy of "1 Barrage worth of damage" is often close to one structure's worth of damage on much of the NPC roster (and without 'cheating', it's a Barrage and a Skirmish's worth of action economy). Definitely strong, since it won't ever miss or roll low, but "1 Structure" isn't always as cost effective as it seems. (Especially since any previous damage done to a single-structure target is wasted.)

It didn't prove to be overwhelming in my own playtests, but I will always concede that that's an inherently limited scope of data. (Hence why I always welcome additional play experience.)

[vocal ridge]

Oh no, I'm a shelfwarmer. 😛

[velvet quiver]

Was reading through the Demonworks Licenses- I gotta say, I ADORE the Astrea, every bit of it

It’s just such a cool defender, and I love Defenders so much!

Question about the Enyo however- how long does Inflame Violence last for? Both the initial burst and the Rage

It goes away on a successful save, but does it otherwise last until the end of the scene?

Also, what was the reasoning behind giving the Wrathborn Enyo 2 repairs out of curiosity?

[vocal ridge]

It was the first license I ever made, and I've been shocked at how few tweaks it's needed since then. It's just a solid bit of kit.

[vocal ridge]

Ah, yes, I suppose I did miss specifying that it ends end of scene if not otherwise cleared, whoops, haha. But the initial burst is just a one-time proc.

[vocal ridge]

It's a lot more... experimental in design. It has lots of HP, and ways to mitigate structure and stress rolls (whether that's by manipulating rolls, strategically bypassing them entirely with the core, or getting free equipment repairs via Resonant Recovery), but you have very little ability to properly recover. You've got a lot more sustain than a normal frame, but you're going to be dancing on a knife's edge if you aren't careful.

From the comments I've had, people seem to enjoy it, but I will freely admit that it's a very particular flavour of gameplay, haha.

[velvet quiver]

It’s interesting- feels like a difficult thing to design for in Lancer due to how chaotic structure rolls can be but if feedback has been positive then it’s very well executed

[vocal ridge]

It's inherently going to be more swingy, but I've learned it's a style of play that some people just really like.

[velvet quiver]

It helps that it has ways to mitigate some of the risks of structure checks- rolling bad on those is pretty much why most mechs skip past 1 and even 2 structure

[vocal ridge]

Yep. That was the point, haha.

[terse fable]

I'm sorry, I'm bad a actually reading stuff

[vocal ridge]

It's fine, haha. I don't blame anyone for not reading. I've got enough stuff I haven't read, and it's not like I wrote a small book.

[velvet quiver]

Having a home library is never a bad thing, especially if you’ve never read most of the books

The important thing is that they’re within arms reach when you need them

[olive thicket]

Trying to brew some kind of Close/Midrange Amber Phantom with some Iridia stuff.

[ LICENSES ]
  SSC Metalmark 3, IRIDIA Nemesis 2
[ CORE BONUSES ]
  Overpower Caliber
[ TALENTS ]
  Duelist 2, Skirmisher 2, Nuclear Cavalier 2, Combined Arms 2
[ STATS ]
  HULL:3 AGI:2 SYS:0 ENGI:2
  STRUCTURE:4 HP:17 ARMOR:0
  STRESS:4 HEATCAP:7 REPAIR:5
  TECH ATK:0 LIMITED:+1
  SPD:6 EVA:14 EDEF:6 SENSE:10 SAVE:13
[ WEAPONS ]
  Flex Mount: MC-LMG Light Machine Gun / MC-LMG Light Machine Gun
  Main Mount: Rail Rifle
  Main/Aux Mount: Plasma Sabre (Shock Wreath) / Shock Knife // Overpower Caliber
[ SYSTEMS ]
  Active Camouflage, Chaff Launcher, Type-3 Projected Shield``` How's this looking? Right now I'm trying to figure out what would be a good brew that deals a lot of close range damage without needing to blow a Barrage, while also remaining relatively safe.

[vocal ridge]

I'll admit, I don't have any practical experience with the Amber Phantom. But at an eyeball, it seems like it fills the desired role.

[olive thicket]

Cool!

Thank u

[mystic spruce]

Does anyone have any alt frame astraea builds that they recommend?

Got an astraea mk II in our party and any combos would be nice to know about