No, I already did upgrade. 😆
#pc-build-help-and-tech-talk
fleet canopy
What CPU though, are you upgrading to?
eternal cairn
I'm not upgrading to anything currently. I upgraded to a Ryzen 9 3900x about a month ago.
I found the difference between G-Sync and G-Sync Compatible: https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/baih3q/advantagesdisadvantages_of_the_gsync_chip_vs/
fleet canopy
What about a normal freesync/freesync 2?
And how well does NVIDIA work with Freesync/2 monitors that're not "Gsync compact approved"
eternal cairn
Based on how it works, G-Sync monitors have the chip that does all of the stuff that is done via software on G-Sync Compatible displays. I imagine G-Sync Compatible would still have be affected by PC performance since the display doesn't have the G-Sync chip in it.
Freesync, I believe, uses an open-source chip (but I might be thinking of adaptive sync).
Freesync 2 is essentially the same, except that it has higher dynamic refresh rate.
lament fiber
If you want a $300ish card that you can play games on and tinker with gat a 5700. If you want a GPU that works out of the box and has a solid rep get a Nvidia super of some kind.
Monitors are now coming out that support both AMD and Nvidia GPUs.
eternal cairn
Could you link some?
eternal cairn
Oh, those are just G-Sync compatible.
lament fiber
That does mean it works. It is better than plugging in your monitor that you spent good money on and getting a black screen followed by a "Video not supported" message.
Also IPS monitors are now able to do gaming level refresh rates and response times. Though for a price well above TN monitors.
sick reef
I think most people want a GPU that works out of the box, as that is kind of the point.
And I'm unsure where to get your info for Monitors on a basic level, but I'm pretty certain Tom's Hardware is not the right place.
I use tftcentral, but it requires a certain investement into panel metric to understand.
But you can't really trust methodology or intention regarding Tom's Hardware.
brisk badger
abstract kite
Now to be fair and give proper credit to AMD I have not been black screening at all since recent updates.
I have not been BlueScreening either. My next move though is to buy some Noctua 120mm Case Fans because you gotta keep this GPU cool or it will sound like a Jet getting ready to take off.
But that is really a super minor gripe lol
brisk badger
take off the cooler, remove paste (and pads if you have your own). replace them and put it back it. saves some degrees
or do it like I do; undervolt 🙂
lose 5-10% performance for 20-30% less power consumption (and therefor also heat production)
brisk badger
Idon't think you have to unless you want to change thermal pads
as reference;
the 5700xt uses 1'200mV by default. My gpu does 1950MHz @ 1200mV and I changed it to 1850 @ 1080mV. Doesn't look like much undervolt but it actually really does help. In demanding 3d applicaiton I have a power usage of ~155watt. It used to be 180-190w
abstract kite
Btw for us in the USA we're looking at a great possibility of a recession. Prices are gonna start shooting up for electronics.
jolly idol
merry bay
If you weren't planning on upgrading right about now anyway, don't go on a shopping spree. Panic purchases are a huge part of the price increases.
vapid crypt
For the reference 5700XT there is a modification you can do to improve temps and therefore acoustics. You just need some plastic washers, apparently just improving the mounting pressure is enough.
abstract kite
Do I need a Thermal Paste Applicator too? 
vapid crypt
People like to change out the thermal pad for paste too, I'm sure that helps as well
abstract kite
I mean its good I guess.
vapid crypt
abstract kite
I was playing BDO on Ultra Settings and my PC was having problems with thermals so I switched it to high.
fleet lark
Honestly yhe stupid bitcoin boom has been worse for technology prices than a recession will be lol
fleet canopy
Yes
fleet lark
I remember i bought my 1080 for like 500~ bucks and within a week or two it was online for like 1100 bucks
fleet canopy
Damn
fleet lark
And i was like got dayum boi people be burning electricity to make cents lol
fleet lark
Honestly it probably will with some other crypto
fleet canopy
Because I don't want like the 3000/3000S series to go boom boom in price
fleet lark
At this point at least in america its expensive to mine bitcoin unless u got solar power and shit
fleet canopy
There's been other currency sort of rising
fleet lark
Yeh always but you gotta see if another one rises like btc did
fleet canopy
Kind of like really low in price, but steadily increasing
Fuck internet currency though cause it proves no literal help
You spend too much to make the amount you spent on
fleet lark
Unless you live in china and have your electricity provided for free B^)
fleet canopy
Unless you can fish out hundreds of GPUs for an even bigger discount than a shitty price
vapid crypt
I doubt a boom of the same level would happen, that was a time where everyone and their momma learned about Bitcoin and how it skyrocketed in price. That also uplifted the cost of other alternate coins, so 
severe aspen
am i allowed to post links to tech stuff im looking to buy? amazon links.
severe aspen
because ive been looking to get an upgrade to my current laptop and think ive narrowed it down quite well. The main one im looking at is:
vapid crypt
Hmm
So the new Ryzen chips for laptops are gonna be rolling out soon in this quarter, some might already be out. Might be worth looking out for those, cause you could likely get a 6c/12t laptop for the same price. Not something I know entirely about though, I only recall Asus having the new 8c/16t with 1660tis and 2060s starting at $1400, I suppose the GPU and other such things would add to the price though.
severe aspen
Im not looking for anything over $900 for one. and im not looking to be playing AAA titles like CoD or anything super graphically taxing. I just want a laptop that can stream some PC games, like GTFO for example. And to do that, i need a better graphics card. because the one i have now, GTX 960m, doesnt have the power to render the graphics properly without having to use the help of my CPUs. 4c i7. that there means my CPU cant dedicate itself to the upload of the stream for high graphic games, even on low settings. making the stream choppy
so a GTX 1050 is a HUGE step in the direction i need, plus 16GB of RAM and an SSD will help wonders
vapid crypt
Eh I mean I doubt a mobile 1050 is that much better than a mobile 960, but then again I don't really know. Any reason why it needs to be a laptop?
severe aspen
where i live, the space i have doesnt allow me to have a desktop
or space for a tower
and yeah, a 970 is significantly better than a 960 as is. so a 1050 is massively better
vapid crypt
So you might have space for a monitor, and peripherals, but none for a computer. Are you aware of the various form factors computers come in?
severe aspen
i could use my TV as a monitor. I know people who do that. I just dont have any space, literally for a tower. I am not aware of other form factors that they come in.
vapid crypt
So like Mini-ITX is a popular formfactor cause its quite small, like this is the complete opposite of those massive full tower computers you've may have seen before
fleet lark
Yeah what i think its atx tower, atx and mini? I think?
vapid crypt
There's E-ATX, ATX, Micro ATX, and Mini-ITX. There's some other niche ones like DTX or something, at one point there was a BTX but I think that died like over a decade ago
But anyway yeah I would say Mini-ITX computers take up no more space than most game consoles. Granted depending on the enclosure in question
severe aspen
do they pack the same power as a normal sized computer can?
vapid crypt
Absolutely, its all the same hardware
The only differences are the power supply, and motherboard. It limits some options naturally when it comes to space
So you might not have access to every single kind of massive graphics card for example
But generally they make ITX models in such cases
severe aspen
currently the only space i have for a desktop would be directly next to my router. (which on its own is not a bad thing.) but I have a cat that doesnt leave me alone, and he gets adventurous from time to time.
if he knocked over a $700 desktop (or more expensive even who knows) and smashed it... I would no longer have that cat
he would be out the door, 100%
vapid crypt
Now an ITX computer wouldn't be as heavy as some pcs, but I don't think it would be light enough and lack the friction to be pushed over by a cat 
stark plover
Just put a big o paper weight on the PC and now it's to heavy to knock over
Smart 100
severe aspen
he has somehow managed to rip a weighted cage lid off. im pretty sure he can still knock over a small pc
stark plover
:(
brisk badger
Your cat would surely have fun with such a build: https://discordapp.com/channels/408196129470152705/584808651164745809/685159479289053189
severe aspen
yeah, he sure would 😆
at least with my laptop, the worst he can do is sit on it
which he has done before.
vapid crypt
Yeah that's an ITX chassis
abstract kite
Only a 650W PSU?
vapid crypt
Its a 1060
abstract kite
Fair.
vapid crypt
So 700W is what they recommend for a Radeon VII
Still though, considering efficiency curves
Its not a bad idea to go well over what's needed
vapid crypt
Power Supplies are usually most efficient at 50% load
abstract kite
So I should be looking to get a 1200W PSU?
vapid crypt
No
Your GPU isn't drawing 650w
That's what they recommend considering the system as a whole
At max load it might be drawing 550w or something, that's at max load mind you
And I'm referring to your entire system
So let
Eh
abstract kite
Well I'm not running at 50% load.
vapid crypt
Let's say its drawing 350w while gaming, then a 700w power supply would be most efficient. Course that's only an estimation
fleet canopy
I prefer like 300W more than what PCPP says it'll be
Cause then you have a lot of room for overclocking, upgrades later on that likes power, etc.
abstract kite
I bet the 3000s series of GPU is gonna be a energy hog.
fleet canopy
Oh yeah it'll be
Honestly I never really will get a PSU if it means I'm below 200W minimum
vapid crypt
Nah they're going to 7nm, and as long as they're limiting their flagship to 250w they will do it
They might decide to up it to 300w, they might have to
merry bay
3000 series will be on 7nm, I don't expect them to go ham on power to start with. And the smaller process should allow for pretty good efficiency
Beat me to it ^^
fleet canopy
It'll be pretty nice having that
Hopefully they're not wrong about a near 50% increase in performance tbh
Cause then that'll be a big upgrade from 2070 Super to a 3070 Super
brisk badger
Welcome to the world of marketing and advertising
fleet canopy
Oh? Generally just said "The 3000 series GPUs"
vapid crypt
It won't scale up like that I don't think
fleet canopy
Probably not, but it'd be nice
More likely a 20-30%
Which is still quite a big amount
vapid crypt
The 3070 will likely be ~5% better than a 2080 Super or something
fleet canopy
Like 1070 to 2070, there's a 25%~ difference
vapid crypt
Its kinda easy to figure out how the stack performs, though if we go by performance/watt, its likely across the stack they will easily increase it by close to 50%
fleet canopy
And with 7nm, plus the fact that'd probably allow even more performance
vapid crypt
Which is to say a lower watt card will perform similar to a higher watt one from this current generation
fleet canopy
https://pcpartpicker.com/product/hbYWGX/phanteks-enthoo-elite-black-atx-full-tower-case-ph-es916e_bk what the fuck is that price
Randomly saw a build with 1K USD, thought I'd put my suggest in for better build https://pcpartpicker.com/list/VYwxTC
This was their list as well: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/Ns3Lp8
He wants to just game lmao
vapid crypt
Nice improvement, but that m.2 you keep using is Sata not PCIE
fleet canopy
Wait it is?
vapid crypt
First of all it says Sata on the label, but other than that there's another way
Spot the difference?
vapid crypt
The connectors are different
fleet canopy
Oh I see
fleet canopy
I mean like the difference
vapid crypt
Well if you look it has just the one notch
fleet canopy
So just the 1-2 notches then
vapid crypt
Sure
But yeah the Sabrent Rocket at the same capacity as that
WD one is pretty much the same price
cerulean pilot
idk ive always found that samsung have the best 3D NAND for NVMe
vapid crypt
They do, and if you value the fastest speeds then you'll likely pay for the premium
vapid crypt
But tbh there's a number in the market that's close enough
fleet canopy
50$ for a 500GB SSD, 100$ for their 500GB SSD
Wait uhh
It's slightly lower
But you get the idea
vapid crypt
I think its like 80
fleet canopy
It's just got the overpriced cost
vapid crypt
The 960 pro or whatever
vapid crypt
Yeah there's a 960, I think there's a different lower spec model
Oh the Evo plus line
Or just Evo
These product lines can get confusing
fleet canopy
Samsung is overpriced for something you can get for same specs at lower price
vapid crypt
There's 970 pro, 970 Evo, and 970 Evo Plus
fleet canopy
I believe Pro is top tier over all Evo
fleet canopy
"The key difference between the Pro and the Evo is the type of NAND used: the Pro uses MLC V-NAND, while the Evo uses the cheaper and more tightly packed TLC V-NAND. Random read performance (4KB QD32) on the 512GB 960 Pro is up to 330K IOPS (Input/Output Operations Per Second), with write speeds of up to 330K IOPS."
Yeah
More price for a better performing SSD
vapid crypt
I believe Sabrent uses similar TLC Nand for their Rocket ssds
So yeah... kinda not worth bothering with the Evo stuff at least
fleet canopy
Or with samsung at all unless you actually will use the speed to it's full potential in something I guess
But then again, there's more likely other SSDs that already overcomes Samsung
vapid crypt
If someone's really concerned with SSD speeds they'll get a gen 4 one
fleet canopy
Haha
vapid crypt
Which I don't think Samsung makes yet
vapid crypt
Nah its Gen 3
fleet canopy
Dang
vapid crypt
The Evo plus is actually newer, seems like it might be a slightly lower binned Pro. The performance is almost the same
While being a bit less
I dunno maybe not 
Seems negligible looking at numbers, but I guess there's more to it than just performance
fleet canopy
merry bay
The pro also has an actual dram(sometimes SLC) buffer, not just a portion of the drive, but a separate thing.
vapid crypt
Hmm looking good. looks like a really nice budget laptop chip I reckon
fleet canopy
Funny how they're trying to go for the lowest possible watt
abstract kite
I should really get that Apple PC Stand that has costs $10k
fleet canopy
Oh hell yeah Galerus
Go for it
I don't know much about it, but it's like so expensive as fuck so it's gotta be like the best ever stand
abstract kite
Ikr! I heard it was made out of this super rare material. The Material is called... Aluminum. I don't know how you get the stuff, but it is super lightweight.
fleet canopy
Rich? Nah
abstract kite
Its not about being rich. This is about buying Top Quality product.
fallow lynx
pls
abstract kite
<@&408548765599793173>
fleet canopy
Nah
finite violet
fleet canopy
That's more like a scam lol
fleet canopy
Bruh those shits lie to you
fleet canopy
Well
fallow lynx
ty
abstract kite
You are not suppose to be soliciting for money regardless in the server.
finite violet
yes
old patrol
In your closet
abstract kite
Evidently because the are not doing anything
abstract kite
I contacted D0c directly.
abstract kite
Mod contact is down.
late sorrel
the ping worked
abstract kite
It isn't sending messages to the moderation team as it should be.
abstract kite
I had to contact D0c himself for it to be done.
late sorrel
when did you message d0c
old patrol
Thank you
abstract kite
I'm sticking to my words
old patrol
Thank you he said
abstract kite
I'm glad you think so
late sorrel
So it doesn’t really matter
abstract kite
You are sitting there acting like I'm a bad guy.
Being aggressive for fuck all reason
late sorrel
the point was that they dealt with it when you pinned them
and uh, not sure where you got that from
abstract kite
No. No it wasn't.
Tinted look at how you are talking to me.
Actually you won't see it.
late sorrel
lol ok
void perch
Alright let me set a few things in order here
- this is pc build help and tech talk, which is off topic for mod stuff
fleet canopy
o:
void perch
- I've been doing a lot of network maintenance today, so my bots are going up and down
fleet canopy
:o
void perch
which leads to some moments where mod contact isn't working
that's why we have @ mod pings
for the most part the bots have been up, just brief outages while I reconfigure stuff
which will eventually lead to a more stable system.
old patrol
Hm
abstract kite
Well technically it was about the bot being down so it was about PC stuff.
fleet canopy
"pc build and tech talk" where the bots go down
late sorrel
me and the boys making windows iot devices
lament fiber
Heyo! Anyone know a company that sells a water cooling system for the ryzen 5700 that does not cost a testicle or looks like a $30 product being sold for $300? I've been over clocking mine and it be getting toasty.
The usual sources I.E. Google and Amazon/Newegg are all selling things that are WAAAAAY overpriced. That or things that seem sketchy as all get out.
eternal cairn
If your budget is anything less than $100, you're better off with a heatsink.
I have a 240mm AIO from Cooler Master that cost $130 and only keeps my CPU 10 degrees cooler.
The next cheapest is a 120mm AIO, but there's less improvement with those and they still cost roughly $60-$80.
lament fiber
I do not mind spending money if need be but when I can buy an all aluminum cylinder head for an engine at $350 from the DEALER I don't see why a cooling block for a GPU needs to cost the same amount.
eternal cairn
The excuse I've heard of is that the materials are expensive.
lament fiber
ABS Plastic, copper, brass, aluminum? HA nope.
eternal cairn
That's what I've heard, anyway.
lament fiber
They also do not inhouse make the items they have a dedicated shop do it
eternal cairn
Are you looking for AIO or custom loop?
lament fiber
Right now which ever one is working and does not cost more then it lookes
eternal cairn
Custom loop is going to cost up to thousands depending on what you want done and requires maintenance.
lament fiber
I'm about to make my own. I have a machine shop I can call I just need to give them the measurements.
eternal cairn
The only AIO setups are for CPUs, so if you're only concerned about GPU cooling, you'll have to go for a custom loop.
Oh, nice.
lament fiber
Thousands?!?!? What for?
eternal cairn
Pumps, water blocks (which are hundreds of dollars), tubing, etc..
If you're only doing your GPU, it won't cost that much.
lament fiber
I just need the heat transfer plate.... Uh most of the ones I see are made of acrylic and a brass plate....
lament fiber
Brass and copper work. Better than aluminum anyways.
eternal cairn
Oh, you'll also need a filter.
lament fiber
All the after market air coolers I see are aluminum.
eternal cairn
Those are pretty cheap though, aren't they?
fleet canopy
Hm
eternal cairn
I think almost all air coolers use aluminum fins.
What GPU do you have, @lament fiber? Do you think you'll upgrade in the near future?
lament fiber
I have a Ryzen 5700 and no I will not be upgrading any time soon unless the thing melts.... which it might do sooner rather than later
eternal cairn
Every time you upgrade a part, you'll have to get a new water block for it.
brisk badger
why heatsink fins are alumium (taken from the web):
Aluminum dissipates heat faster (than cooper) AFTER the energy source has stopped. Has to do with density and weight per given joules, among other things. Think of a piece of aluminum foil when you take it out of the oven.
also a heatsink block made out of pure copper is pretty heavy 🙂
brisk badger
xD
lament fiber
Meh I got my cpu and gpu mixed up. I have a 5700 and a 3600. I don't really keep the names straight as they are both AMD
eternal cairn
Is the 3600 the CPU...?
lament fiber
@brisk badger Dissipates and transfers are two different things.
eternal cairn
Oh, never mind.
But since the aluminum fins are on the outside of the cooler, the fan blows the heat away.
lament fiber
I know cars. I know less of computers but I know how to cool things down.
eternal cairn
Regardless, copper has the highest thermal transfer, if I remember my chemistry correctly.
brisk badger
yea but you do have usually copper pipes transfer the heat to the aluminum fins
lament fiber
I also am about to build a Freon based cooling system for cheaper than the cost of buying an AIO or "custom" loop system.
eternal cairn
Yeah, because they transfer heat faster than aluminum, but aluminum dissipates it faster, making it better for air cooling.
What's Freon?
eternal cairn
So, it's basically an environmentally friendly cooler?
lament fiber
Nothing is environmentally friendly not even the environment...
eternal cairn
*sigh* I mean it's more environmentally safe than other types of coolers.
eternal cairn
Whatever. How is it any cheaper though?
lament fiber
Do you want the from purchasing everything new reason or it is based off what I have laying around reason?
eternal cairn
Both.
lament fiber
ok
I have an old mini fridge that is working but had been left unplugged so all the food in it rotted. It smells bad and is unsafe for food, but my PC has no nose or need to eat. I can gut it and stuff my parts in it.
The other option is I I buy one from Walmart for $80 USD and do the same.
abstract kite
Well some if the food may be good...
lament fiber
I then no longer need case fans and the factory GPU cooling device will have more room to work with
fleet canopy
A refrigerator PC, hm
eternal cairn
So you're using a fridge to cool your computer?
lament fiber
I have done it before.
eternal cairn
Why were you asking about liquid cooling though?
vapid crypt
Hmm
lament fiber
I used a deep freezer from the 1980's as the cooler and monitor stand
abstract kite
You know why can't you make a mini-fridge a PC Case? 
vapid crypt
I'm no expert on refrigerators, but wouldn't condensation occur within it?
eternal cairn
Not much airflow.
abstract kite
Ah El is right
eternal cairn
Condensation will occur with anything at cold enough temperatures.
lament fiber
I asked about if anyone knew of any companies that sold items for GPU cooling. Also for not that much money. because I have a reasonable cheaper method than what they wanted to sell to me.
fleet canopy
Well that's your only option unless there are custom watercooling for GPUs that can be attached onto the GPU
lament fiber
As for how I deal with condensation I seal the door shut with silicone and flush out all the air with nitrogen.
vapid crypt
Really only worth going for that if you're looking at pushing the card to the absolute limit
eternal cairn
Sounds like a potentially hazardous science experiment.
lament fiber
Nah nitrogen is safe.
eternal cairn
I meant for the computer.
lament fiber
I have access to CO2. Now that can kill you quick
abstract kite
Eh I want to play BDO on Ultra Settings. Only way to do that is with either better fans or a Water Cooler.
vapid crypt
By cooks, are we talking 90c or something?
abstract kite
85c~
lament fiber
I have my GPU OC'd to 2080MHz My factory settings had me locked to 1750MHz
abstract kite
But our GPU is "expected" to hit 110c and be fine 
fleet canopy
Hah
eternal cairn
What are the temps you usually get, @lament fiber?
vapid crypt
Like I linked before
fleet canopy
It'll just automictically shut down
abstract kite
I know heh
fleet canopy
Shitty gaming experience
vapid crypt
The washer mod + replacing the thermal pad will I believe drop temps by like 10c
fleet canopy
Link?
vapid crypt
Actually I take that back, it might be more like 5c; but it will run the fan at lower rpm
abstract kite
Isn't the 5700XT considered a high-end GPU?
lament fiber
Anything over 90C and the card slows WAY down. @eternal cairn Gaming I hit 74-85C regularly.
fleet canopy
Ehh
vapid crypt
I wouldn't call it that no
lament fiber
5700XT is High mid class
fleet canopy
But the price makes it between mid-high
lament fiber
5700 is mid-mid class
abstract kite
Mid-High, got it.
vapid crypt
In fact I reckon it was supposed to be a tier lower, they just put more power into it and clocks to get it up there
lament fiber
2080Ti is +ultra
fleet canopy
The 2080 and anything past is high
abstract kite
I want a Titan.
fleet canopy
2080 Ti is a joke to get
Unless you can spend that money or find it for 900$
Speaking of, could be found at ebay or the other online store for 900$ usually
eternal cairn
I honestly don't see much point in getting those unless they won't get outdated for roughly 7 years.
abstract kite
So
abstract kite
There is a difference. Saying Nvidia for a TI and a Super.
vapid crypt
That seems like its too high for a pre-owned card
lament fiber
The most exotic cooling system I have seen for a computer first hand was a buddy who sank his entire PC in mineral oil. It worked great.
brisk badger
i would pay extra 160usd shipping cost for that card 😮
eternal cairn
It doesn't matter if it's preowned, @vapid crypt.
vapid crypt
I find it funny that the MSRP is supposed to be 999, but they literally never sell for that much
eternal cairn
They all go for the same price unless they're broken.
fleet canopy
Refurbished is usually 900$ too
eternal cairn
Okay, that's ridiculous.
fleet canopy
And getting it lower than 900$ is a no-no as it's closer to a 2080 Super price
lament fiber
They are inflating the market because people will pay it.
lament fiber
And they do
vapid crypt
People with more money than sense
lament fiber
constantly
abstract kite
Psh you call it "Inflation" I call is "Surprise Mechanics"
fleet canopy
eternal cairn
Makes me glad the coronavirus is killing people.
fleet canopy
It's only killing older ones
vapid crypt
When a 75% price increase in 1.5 years is considered inflation
eternal cairn
And people with weaker immune systems.
vapid crypt
I lived through Swine Flu 
fleet canopy
What a pig
vapid crypt
Fawk Yeah 🤪
lament fiber
It is the same as the flu. Weak, old, young, immune compromised blah blah. It will go away in 6 months. Back to PC coolers and GPUs.
fleet canopy
Yeah I hope
eternal cairn
Eh, I kinda hope not.
fleet canopy
But United States is pretty dumb so my attempt at getting anything that is related to tech might be a fucking slap on the face for me for a longer bit
People might be smart enough to acknowledge it though I guess
lament fiber
So when I do end up burning out my 5700(nonXT) would the 2070 be good to replace it with?
fleet canopy
2070 Super would be a better upgrade
vapid crypt
Why would you burn it out?
eternal cairn
I'd get something you won't have to upgrade from for a long time.
fleet canopy
I'm literally seeing same prices with 2070 and 2070 Super
vapid crypt
And I mean hardly, I'm sure by the time you burn it out better hardware will be out
eternal cairn
Same, @fleet canopy. LOL
lament fiber
is there enough of a difference to warrant getting the SUPER version over the nonSUPER version? it seems like marketing to me.
fleet canopy
It's so pointless getting a non super if you can find a super that's good for same price
vapid crypt
Technically yes
eternal cairn
Super is probably better.
lament fiber
I see it all the time. New paint on an old item.
fleet canopy
It's got a 2080 board, if El was right from what I remember
vapid crypt
The 2070 Super uses a larger GPU die and is about on par with the 1080ti
Effectively its a cutdown 2080
fleet canopy
Pretty much yeah I guess
fleet canopy
It's not by a long shot, but an overclock might be comparable to a 2080
lament fiber
So if I buy two of them and weld them together then flash a 2080ti BIOS on it I will have a 2080? Cool
fleet canopy
eternal cairn
You'll probably have issues with drivers.
vapid crypt
Nah Nvidia locks that shit down
lament fiber
And it would be just like my AMD then?
fleet canopy
Welding 2 GPUs together, hm
vapid crypt
When they used to put two GPUs on one card
eternal cairn
I doubt NVidia has drivers for welded GPUs.
lament fiber
I have a welder. I can give it the old american try.
vapid crypt
Yeah not really saving much money at that point
eternal cairn
I'd wait to hear if "big navi" is worth it or not.
lament fiber
Who said I have to "buy" the cards?
eternal cairn
I stole some RAM from Best Buy once.
fleet canopy
No one said you didn't have to "buyuh" it
lament fiber
I can just borrow a few.
vapid crypt
Unfortunately no information about that outside of statements about RDNA2 bringing 50% more performance per watt, and they plan to compete in the 4k market again finally
fleet canopy
Only thing Linus stole was tampons
eternal cairn
That was from the Amazon Store.
fleet canopy
Yes but still
fleet canopy
Hah
lament fiber
Damn. that was shady.
fleet canopy
Well anything you can do to get past the fucking crappy price
lament fiber
Yup
eternal cairn
And it's not like it'll hurt the manufacturer if only one of their items is stolen.
They'll still have enough income to afford their 12th Mercedes.
lament fiber
S class. too
vapid crypt
But is it a Mercedes or a Benz
lament fiber
So anyone else find it interesting that a good number of cars are just now updating to 32bit software?
Anything before 2010 was ran on 18 and 24 bit programming.
fleet canopy
Haven't heard of anything for cars
lament fiber
I tune my cars and the software is well mostly command code.
They even have full blown AI programming in them to learn how you drive. And computer AI in cars has been around sense 1988.
late sorrel
damn
fleet canopy
I've just now watched the video of tampon stealing
"Diet snapple ice tea, raspberry.."
"Ugh, diet."
lament fiber
The new ones with OnStar are even more... stalkery.
brisk badger
cars use FPGA, RISC , whatever processor variants there exists. Not that I know much about but what differs the usage of 32bit and lower as end consumer? I would be baffled if a car needs to use more than 4gb allocated for a software
lament fiber
They only started to update the software due to phones and people wanting wifi in their cars. To better integrate remote apps like starting your car from your phone they had to use compatible programs.
brisk badger
I see. I am also amazed how expensive these tools are to enable (serial? lol) communication to an external device
lament fiber
Most cars use multiple system computers that have a hub link to the main CPU. The cost to have a tool to talk to your transition's computer and to talk to your engines computer are the same price for non dealerships. Also the safety restraint has its own dedicated computer. That tool cost even more than either of the two other tools. Dealerships just pull out a laptop as their tool is an all in one.
I was about to buy a dealer level computer diagnostic tool but I had to subscribe to their "Terms" to even have the privilege to pay for it. The tool was a Dell laptop with a bunch of cable to connect it to the vehicle and it cost 34000, + 1200 annual subscription for updates and, a nondisclosure agreement.
abstract kite
Huh
You ever had that feeling when you are looking for something it is just not there than when you dont need it its all there?
This was exactly my issue before xD
lament fiber
Oh?
abstract kite
More or less
When I use to boot my PC I would get no Video Signal
@brisk badger remembers it xD
@vapid crypt helped me so much too 
abstract kite
Oh yeah it was fixed a while back.... I think last week. It took like 4-5 hours to get it to work again
Well properly.
late sorrel
yikes
abstract kite
In my case what I suspect was the problem was two things, RAM was not seated properly and my MOBO Needed a BIOS Flash.
marsh sequoia
OOPS
late sorrel
chill with the caps too
but no worries
anyway
windows for IoT devices is pretty cool
copper zealot
Guys i have a problem my computer won't turn on
I'm on my cell phone
Need Halp!
I think it may be IO
eternal cairn
It's funny how everyone comes here when their PC doesn't turn on. LOL
You're probably gonna have to be a little more specific, unless you've already fixed it, @copper zealot.
copper zealot
It's ok it was IO (idiot operator) i plugged it in
vapid crypt
That's always the first thing to check
sick reef
The good old technical issue between user and keyboard.
abstract kite
Wtf?
vapid crypt
Yeah it has a waterblock on the board to cool everything
Don't have to worry about overheating VRMs and what not
Super high grade enthusiast shit
abstract kite
Stupid Expensive
Could build a Mid-High end build with $1,000
Maybe add an extra $200-$300
late sorrel
yeah I remember that one
Didn’t Linus make a video on it?
seemed decently cool, just that there is no reason for it
like, the 3950x doesn’t need a special water cooler
abstract kite
I guess because its a all build for Water cooling
vapid crypt
They recommend an AIO, but yeah it isn't necessary. Big air cooler is fine.
abstract kite
I mean it looks fantastic imo, but its not worth that price. Lol
abstract kite
Would you take a B540 Series of board over that?
late sorrel
probably?
abstract kite
I mean if you had the choice disregarding money.
late sorrel
yeah
fleet canopy
If I had a reason to use PCIe 4.0, no
fleet canopy
Plus nothing needs it except big M.2 drives
late sorrel
yeah so I wouldn’t buy that
just get a high end b450
or a tomohawk max or something
vapid crypt
I mean that's technically a high end
B450
If you're getting B450 that's the one to get
vapid crypt
Fair enough, it doesn't have every feature people look for after all. Just enough + solid power delivery
abstract kite
If I wanted a really good PC I'd go with the Apple tower that costs 10k~
vapid crypt
fleet canopy
Totally
abstract kite
Excuse me. I meant $50,000
fleet canopy
Like it’s gotta be top of the line because it’s 50KUSD
abstract kite
That's just the stand too!
fleet canopy
o:::::
merry bay
That's a lot of cash for grater that can't even do any grating
fleet canopy
Haha
That’s a lot of cash for a computer that can’t even compete against AMD’s 1600AF
abstract kite
Oh come now
$50k Grate is made out of a super rare material.
Super exclusive from Apple themselves.
sick reef
If you're buying that MB you're doing it because you don't have to replace stock coolers. But often you can't pull enough power to justify more than passive air flow, or small fans on heatsinks.
For the very extreme OC, it'd be to not have to replace the stock MB cooler, and just buy something you can slot into a open loop easily.
median moon
Core Intel Xeon
abstract kite
Should I apply Thermal Paste inside the RAM Slots on my MOBO?
This Video is showing me I did not apply enough into my system.
lament fiber
Well you could always put dielectric grease in them instead if you wanted to actually grease them. I'm not sure about thermal paste's electrical conduciveness.
late sorrel
lol no
lament fiber
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2ybtHhCe8I <- his vid should have only been 45 seconds long... I skipped most of it.
I personally thought about doing that but, with a new PC and how much it cost I did not want to risk it.
kindred fiber
Can B360/B365 mainboard run with i7 8700 ?I mean for long-term usage (5-6 years).
abstract kite
@kindred fiber Yes a B360 board is compatible with an 8700 to my knowledge
B360 is an intel chipset
fleet canopy
I thought that was an AMD chipset, wut
fleet canopy
I hate how it’s so weird as hell mixing those two shit together with names
fleet canopy
They should have iB360 and aB350
abstract kite
lol
fleet canopy
It’s more simple at least
abstract kite
Neither company names based on what the other one does sadly
Well
its not sadly
just a given
fleet canopy
Yeah
vapid crypt
X399 was AMD shitting on Intel's X299 though
fleet canopy
Yeah
clear quartz
VR vs WMR head sets
tardy tinsel
@modern yew @red sinew I think we have a problem. This guy is posting the same thing on every chat
red sinew
I see
Thanks sluw
We talking about VR vs wmr?
They are the same thing btw
Just a different and weird brand name
median moon
WMR = VR
red sinew
Yeah
sick reef
Windows Media Reality. It's a standard, in practice. It is a basic VR functionality and any headsets that is defined as a WMR just adheres to that standard.
So yeah, it is VR, but on generic software.
steady solar
@abstract kite how is your pc
stoic tree
i wonder how many frames people get in general cuz i have parts better then what recommend but i still have like 43 to 58 frames most of the game
🤔
and i dont think i ever go over 80 lul
well i guess in the rundwon i get 120 but there it doesnt really matter
steady solar
What your specs
My shit maxed out I get around 70-90
Haven't really checked in other areas if it goes higher or lower
stoic tree
intel core i7 8750h
gtx 1050 ti
16ram
ah what else lul
yeah the windowns is 1o 64 bits
although this might be cuz i play on a laptop 
so its a feelsbad
oh yeah i put stuff on max or minium i dont really see a difference tbh
vapid crypt
That's not so bad I suppose considering its a laptop, I recall a number of people having pretty eh performance on laptops with various specs. Kind of all over the place
stoic tree
like for most of the game
it fine
i dont really notice
but in the last door in c2
and d1
the one with the red circle
vapid crypt
Depending on the map I'll get as low as 48 probably when waves start spawning
stoic tree
it recks my frams
vapid crypt
And that's using an Rx 580
stoic tree
lul
vapid crypt
I recall it getting that low on C2 at least
stoic tree
yeah idk if its laptop or its the best optimazed
yeah cuz i either play other games on high or ultra high and dont really go below 60 frams
frames*
someday i will have money to build a pc
merry bay
Check out your Advanced Video settings. Try messing around with Max Render Queue Frames.
Likely to make a difference if you have it set to "0" now.
In other words. Setting it above 0 should increase fps.
merry bay
If they'd allow it to be set that high, you'd feel serious lag no matter how high your FPS 
more likely your FPS is limited to 120
sick reef
That would mean it would prerender 120 frames preemptively before it renders one to the screen.
Imagine the input lag.
merry bay
Reminds me of lag right before Host Migration on CoD games. It feels like someone else is doing the inputs, really trippy
sick reef
The FPS?
stoic tree
yeah
sick reef
Have you removed most other background process and seen if that helps?
stoic tree
i think i usually only have discord open
sick reef
Try turning off hardware acceleration.
It might help, might not. Laptops are finnicky regardless.
stoic tree
would that make it worse tho
brisk badger
Buy a notebook holder or whatever they are called with some fans attached to cool it. I bet your notebook is toasty.
Also a 1050 in a notebook does not perform the same as a 1050 in a desktop. It never will. Imagine the power consumption and heat generation. What i mean to say is you cannot take notebook hardware as reference when it comes to system requirements. Even tho its the "same model" they are not in terms of performance
Something like this. Goes by the name "notebook cooler"
clear quartz
what ssd you guys recommend for a broke ass student?
vapid crypt
That depends, how much are you willing to spend on one?
clear quartz
around 40 and 50 USD
vapid crypt
That's fine, what capacity are you thinking of getting. Will this be for an OS boot drive or something else?
sick reef
Notebook cooler is absolutely a good investment. Even if the fans are ass, not keeping the laptop against something reduces the amount it heats itself up.
As for SSD, if you so are a broke ass student, the cheapest with most rewrites possible would probably be the best investment.
brisk badger
You could get like a 20-60gb SSD and use it as caching. Not as great but its, something
Not even sure if newer chipsets still supports, this technology
stoic tree
@brisk badger yeah i know it wont perform as well as a desktop would and i guess now i should get something to lift up my laptop (i have been using dictionaries to do that job ) but this was the first a game actually started to go pretty low on frame
i guess its starting to show its limitations
vapid crypt
SSD caching, sure. There's stuff like that, isn't that what optane kind of does?
AMD has that StoreMI thing
sick reef
SSD caching is what SSDs do.
SSD Caching is when you use an SSD as dedicated cache memory.
Or partition of it.
brisk badger
SSD caching is what SSDs do.
I don't understand
What I meant with SSD caching is to have a 20-60GB SSD connected normally to the pc either through SATA or NVME but it's not visible on your OS. You have your HDD (or whatever type of disk) and all data is stored there and the SSD which is invisble for the user is used by the OS to offload temporary files and frequently used files to the SSD. That speeds up things such as booting drastically but you don't have full control over what to cache and what. Maybe there is a way of controlling I never looked deeper into
abstract kite
@steady solar My PC is doing well as far as I am aware. Today is restart day after about 4 days of being on.
brisk badger
A company I had a contract with replaced all their PC's and their new ones all contained 20-60GB Intel SSD for caching. However because the company did some sensitive stuff and they were very skeptical about that technology, I ended up taking them all out and kept them. Now I have like 30pcs of them in my cellar still xD. They were not wrong tho with the decision. If either your HDD or SSD dies, you have some big issues
@stoic tree A man with style 👌 I also use dictionaries but for something similar: Lift up my keyboard. My keyboard feet or how to call them long time broke after smashing my hand on the keyboard 😙
stoic tree
lmao
sick reef
What I meant is that SSDs themselves use themselves as cache when used, not as the term SSD caching, which was the second statement.
brisk badger
also while the game runs and is great, there is surely some optimizations to be done. It's an early access title which justifies a lack of code optimization
brisk badger
probably however I am not sure if all SSDs have an internal caching system. Frankly I don't know much about the technology either
stoic tree
im guessing all the shadows, particles, fog/mist but 30 enemies loading another room
asks alot from a pc lul
sick reef
Well, they have to have a cache, but as a cache for the software running on the computer.
brisk badger
probably yes and AFAIK the game itself is not really multithreaded, meaning most stuff will run on one thread
maybe the host has some additional overhead, i don't know
would make sense
sick reef
How the computer caches those stuff, i don't fully know either.
stoic tree
mhm
but anyways as long as it doesnt got below 30 frames for me its still playable lul
brisk badger
it's a game where, no matter if you have 30 or 144 fps, you still hit shit with those guns 😛
brisk badger
I played B1 over and over to learn and train my aim as well
sick reef
RAM works as a cache, the GPU has a frame buffer which is a kind of cache, the Monitor has front buffer and/or backbuffer which is a cache, the CPU has its caches, the drives also have caches for it's purposes.
It gets confusing sometimes, as this doesn't include software caches.
brisk badger
I really wish pathfinding gets a tad better AND the ability to run away and hide so they lose contact but then you have rooms to clear that have been cleared previously. wrong chat I know :p
sick reef
If you already have aim, the revolver is hard to beat.
stoic tree
oh i think the pathfinding is actually pretty good the enemies seem to try to surround you
and the normals guys seem to wait for more to come when they are alone and there is more behinh them
brisk badger
RAM does not work as cache btw
unless you speak about SRAM which is basically L caches inside CPU's
sick reef
Not as an actual cache, of course. But as in a temporary storage of information.
brisk badger
caching basically means to save information that will be used again in the future.
RAM doesn't know that
your L1, L2, L3 cache in your CPU does know that in contrary
sick reef
Yeah. Is the SRAM the one hierarchly above the L-caches?
Hard to explain in the right words.
brisk badger
L cache is using SRAM which super fast but extremely expensive to produce. It also can save information when no power but usually only for seconds or minutes (in server environment to be used) but DRAM can't
i can't tell you why L1 is faster than L2, or what the reasons is with having different caches
if there is different quality of SRAM, if the L1 cache is located closer to the cores etc
sick reef
Isn't that the speeds of the L-caches, due to what size packages they transfer
brisk badger
that sounds logical. What is the common L1 cache size these days? In my memory I still have the number 128Kb which is sooo little, only the most frequent operations may stored in there
brisk badger
maybe caching in DRAM will be a thing one day. I found this: https://arxiv.org/pdf/1809.08828.pdf and even first implementation were made in 1990 . It probably will be more expensive to produce regardless
sick reef
A DRAM cache in the CPU, then?
It reads as an interesting concept, specifically for system memory applications.
Or like a cache to the DRAM.
feelsdunnoman
clear quartz
@vapid crypt its a back up storage
clear quartz
I'm already using a ssd for boot but today i realise my laptop can support upto 3 ssd
yeah
i was thinking about a WD one
vapid crypt
Alright, so you can get around 500gb ssds for that much
And that should be fine, WD is a fine manufacturer
clear quartz
yeah, that's what I'm thinking, but i thought maybe someone could have a better option
sick reef
Don't know if Corsair makes that cheap M.2 memory, as I assume those are the slots your laptop has free.
clear quartz
i got a single slot free at the moment
sick reef
But that is supposed to be the one with most longevity.
clear quartz
i have a 128 gb and another 500 gb already installed
i was hoping to get a 3rd out of greed
finite violet
What exactly should I look for specification wise when picking a monitor
clear quartz
if not i thinking of replacing the HDD
finite violet
other than resolutions and refresh rate
clear quartz
size
sick reef
What you need, what you want, what you can afford.
clear quartz
^^^
finite violet
yeh but like
sick reef
Specification wise is dependant on that
sick reef
Ah, well, it's frame time, and not really for most applications, unless you play games that could depend on it.
finite violet
what's the difference between the panel types, do they matter at all
sick reef
WA is wider, TN is faster, IPS has more true colours.
Generally speaking.
It matters, but only if it matters to you.
finite violet
I found a Samsung LU28E590DS/EN which is a 4k 28"
It's a lot cheaper than most of the others so I'm just looking if there's something bad
median moon
TN best
clear quartz
CTR best
sick reef
I looked into it a bit, that screen, and with 35ms total lag, if you play anything requiring fast and precise movement, it will be noticeable.
clear quartz
get a CTR monitor
sick reef
CRT*
finite violet
oh
tardy tinsel
I watched but I didn't really pay attention to it
sick reef
Cathode-Ray Tube.
clear quartz
oh yeah
clear quartz
CRT best
finite violet
yehh
sick reef
Do you really want 4K?
clear quartz
there are CRT with 1920x1440 @100hz monitors
sick reef
That would suprise me due to the limitations of DVI-D.
clear quartz
sick reef
I can't find that monitor specifically,so I know not if it's neither good nor bad.
ViewSonic VP3881 is apparently good.
Or the Dell UP2718Q
finite violet
hmm
sick reef
There are others, but those are the ones I could find easily. ASUS likely has one too.
Hate to say it Depr, but that monitor runs 1600x1200 in 75Hz, or 1280x1020 something in 85Hz.
Highest possible refresh rate is at the lowest possible resolution, and vice versa.
Because CRT.
late sorrel
crt noises
median moon
i would buy a CRT if it was 1440p and above 60hz
abstract kite
This is so much pink my eyes are gonna bleed
Yeston makes cool GPUs
but uh
that's a lot of pink
late sorrel
I like the case
abstract kite
I hate the tempered glass looks like a TintedMirror
late sorrel
comedy
fleet canopy
<@&408548765599793173> Gyuh uh
abstract kite
Did you try reporting me for my bad joke? lmao
fleet canopy
was a non tech related link
abstract kite
I don't see one
fleet canopy
Well we don’t have time traveling devices
tardy tinsel
That pink is actually kind of hard on the eyes
fleet canopy
Some wack meme
late sorrel
not a suprise that you couldn’t see it lol
abstract kite
So
The real question is if that Liquid Cooled System is being cooled from Gamer Girl Bath Water.
late sorrel
oh no
abstract kite
Oh yes
late sorrel
fbi open up
abstract kite
Nah
abstract kite
The Meme is still funny though
stark plover
@abstract kite is this real I need this pls gimmie sauce
fleet canopy
It’s “Belle Delphine Bathcool™️ CPU cooling system”
abstract kite
$100 is a great deal!
stark plover
Thanks
Can anyone teach me how to open up an aio to drink the inside liquids
Totally not related to the belle Delphine aio
👁️ 👁️
abstract kite
sick reef
100$ is a great deal apart from probably not as effective as anything of equal cost, and you would have to switch out the water.
Not because it's her bathwater because some incel already disproved that, but because it's likely just regular water, and it'll clog swifter than it should.
There are better purchases that can be made for those kinds of money.
steady solar
She's hot af
clear quartz
with too many filters and make up anyone is hot af
tardy tinsel
Kinda same
I think she wants attention but in the end she made herself look almost like a thot
abstract kite
True.
Also look at what Twitch has done for the past 3 years
Any semi-Attractive girl with a decent PC and recording Rig can become very successful on Twitch.
tardy tinsel
I've seen a couple of twitch streams complain about that
brisk badger
why are they successful 🤔 feels like they fill a demand
void perch
I'm a semi attractive grill that's steaming. Please donate to me and make me successful.
merry bay
clearly that's all it takes
void perch
Now I'm curious if I could make a twitch stream watching me grilling and become successful. It'd probably work just due to the meme factor.
abstract kite
D0c's like "UwU Flip this Burger for Biddies" Waits for biddies drop. Someone Donates. Turn Around, Bend Over and write name on whiteboard. Thank person who donated. Make sure to not wear a Bra. I am gonna get banned for this.
sick reef
Simp and incels. Also horndogs.
That is how they gain an audience. Horndog being a generic term, instead of a self-identification.
median moon
big simpin'
late sorrel
simp simp
vapid crypt
I don't know how long the term Simp has been around, but it gives a new perspective to The Simpsons
So out of curiosity originally Simp was short for Simpleton, and the current Simp definition was likely derived in the last decade but didn't become popular until late 2019. Sorry for derailing Tech talk further, let's carry on
void perch
D0c's like "UwU Flip this Burger for Biddies" Waits for biddies drop. Someone Donates. Turn Around, Bend Over and write name on whiteboard. Thank person who donated. Make sure to not wear a Bra. I am gonna get banned for this.
@abstract kite lol 😆
merry bay
@vapid crypt Not 100% if I recall right. Did you mention you're rocking a 75Hz display. If so, would you say you notice a difference above 60Hz? I'm kinda biased so can't give good advice around the topic
I imagine it to be smoother, but hardly essential. A guy is really curious if it's worth bothering above 60 without going into 120Hz+
vapid crypt
I do notice a difference, its just not a massive jump of course. Since its more common and doesn't add to cost it makes sense to just get since you'll see that in lower end IPS displays. I haven't really browsed around too much, but I don't think I've seen most other panels at that refresh rate, its either 60 or 100+
I have seen a 1440p monitor at 95hz, was thinking of getting that after a GPU upgrade
merry bay
That's roughly the point of really diminishing returns if you're not too competitive I'd say above 90
median moon
155hz 1440p though
late sorrel
yeah it’s much nicer
merry bay
When playing heavier games, if it's under 90 it feels choppy. But I'm spoiled
it's interesting that 75Hz is enough to feel more smoothness though
sick reef
Going from 144 back to 60 it felt really sluggish.
brisk badger
you could try overclocking your monitor. There is a neat tool called CRU
usually you 'can' squeeze extra 10hz on a 60hz monitor
abstract kite
You know I've only ever experienced 1080p is it honestly worth going to say 1440p?
With a 5700XT
brisk badger
yes and no. I don't really feel a massive difference, also using the 5700xt
I would say it's more an issue if you have a big inch monitor but 1080p
fleet canopy
It can be a big difference if you want a bigger monitor or have one 1080p that’s bigger than 24”
abstract kite
Makes sense
clear quartz
4k below 32 inches seems pretty useless
vapid crypt
Does it? I wouldn't know. I figured you just get better pixel density
abstract kite
Yes
vapid crypt
I dunno, the only 4k screens that are that size are in Laptops
abstract kite
Are you assuming what I'd like, @clear quartz?
clear quartz
no
abstract kite
can you really enjoy that?
Right.
clear quartz
im just reflected 4k on a 14/17 inch screen is overkill
vapid crypt
As far as monitors are concerned, the smallest 4k ones I've seen are 27". So technically that's substantial, but at the same time; its no laptop screen.
abstract kite
B-Baka! Don't say things like that in public!
finite violet
If you're sitting right in front of it and destroying your eyes anyway
abstract kite
That's the best place for it.
So if I bought a new MOBO would I also need to buy a new OS or is that stored on my HDD?
vapid crypt
Yeah just plug in the drive and it should boot fine
Well I should say Windows will figure it out, cause the chipset drivers and stuff could be different
But after that it'll boot
finite violet
i mean, if you don't have the "activate windows" popup in the bottom right, can you really call yourself a gamer
late sorrel
^ real talk
vapid crypt
abstract kite
Corona-Chan is already doing that.
vapid crypt
My Windows has Coronavirus 
finite violet
install some bloatware like avast to get rid of it 👏
median moon
8K laptop
fleet canopy
32” laptop >:)
median moon
60" laptop
abstract kite
80" Laptop
fleet canopy
100” laptop