@copper aspen If there was a queue, especially for official servers, you'd never get into them.
#general-feedback-discussion
steady cosmos
verbal acorn
Ever...
barren zephyr
^
blazing charm
@novel acorn Not sure if Trike is getting a charge attack, I think it might be getting some kind of Gore attack. But that could have changed. I know Pachyrhino was supposed to have a charge of some kind.
Raptors are planned to pounce again, I can go dig up a recent stream clip if you'd like. And as for scent while crouching, I think it might be a bit troublesome both balance wise and technically to have a dinosaur use scent while crouching.
toxic vortex
is is cerato faster than a dilo now?
blazing charm
No clue, you'd be better off testing it on a death match server.
warped harbor
@toxic vortex it's definitely slower than a dilo
Also slower than an allo right now
The plan is to have it be faster than an allosaurus but slower than a pachycephalosaurus
novel acorn
Thanks for the answers @blazing charm
If the "cousin" of the trike os getting a charge maybe the other gain to, Just maybe change the kind of wound, some do bleeding, others break legs, depending on the type of the chrest they have.
Cool, so they will pounce again. I Just liked the abilitie when I Saw, but I know that gonna be a problem for who play most of the time like a herbivore hahahahaha please, tell me already How It thake them of after they attached to me 🤣
And about the crouching, I think I don't understand when you say "balance wise" you até meaning about the animation? Because It would be a New one to be made and would really be troblesome. But it's not something só much needed really.
blazing charm
If you can sniff while crouching, you would just have Carnivores constantly crouching around with an ambush boost at the ready.
@hoary ocean Unless I'm mistaken. I believe Herbs not being able to scent while moving is to prevent them from actively tracking down other creatures.
hoary ocean
@blazing charm Ahh, makes sense. Thanks for the information.
blazing charm
np
idle pulsar
It would be cool if herbs could spawn like 2 ai babies that would follow them until they grow and if they are in a group it be this huge herd. The AI would grow at a slower rate then a normal players so helping them grow would be hard. Just an idea for late game herbs that don’t have anything to do.
true haven
idle pulsar
No not necessarily obviously it be something they’d have to build around if they wanted to. Ai would be reduced and one way to easily do that is to stop having ai spawn around adult carnivores of a specific weight class.
barren zephyr
@still fossil its not so much trike starving as it is keeping 4 juvies fed, raising kids isnt easy
This ones more on you and not the game
still fossil
@barren zephyr my adult trike shouldnt lose 8% food every minute.
barren zephyr
It should because its meant to be a lawnmower
Your an "apex" herbivore
A massive body
Constantly on the move for food
Actually
still fossil
that doesnt make sense. i could see 4% but a trike will starve in 30 minutes.
still fossil
a massive food drop i get. but 8% is abit much to me.
juvies are about the same rate so moving around to get food yes. Starving cause your herd moves slow no.
barren zephyr
6/5 sounds better
still fossil
that i can get behind too. a large bush only fills 30% of a trikes food bar.
barren zephyr
Mmhmm
@quasi stream people were literally exploiting a computer screen option to the point where nv wasnt needed at all and it was like seeing in day
So now it has to be like this until they can find a better solution
@sweet oasis had a great suggestion
wraith trout
barren zephyr
Ty jewwy
wraith trout
Did that send properly for you?
barren zephyr
Ya why
wraith trout
Didnt load on my end, oh well
barren zephyr
Nawh u good
wraith trout
epic
quasi stream
And I said to find a better option for night vision or change the nv back how it was
I didn't mind people using gamma
barren zephyr
So youd rather people use an exploit
yes but just because you dont mind doesn't mean it isnt a problem
you just said you dont mind people cheating
Do you mind athletes using steroids to break records ?
quasi stream
It is a problem but rather than changing the game to black change the night vision into something else
barren zephyr
There is nothing else yet
quasi stream
What's athletes have to do with this?
quasi stream
As long as you didn't beat the record, why do you care? 
barren zephyr
they are both gaining an unfair advantage using third party programs/settings
because its unjust to the record setter
and unfair
quasi stream
So I am an adult allo, I run straight and because my nv is so small I run straight into a trike that just kills me
barren zephyr
Why r u running
wraith trout
Man that's your personal problem
quasi stream
Why should I walk when I am starving?
barren zephyr
besides unless the trike is standing still
you should hear it
Why r u starving? Is it cus u cant raise ur gamma and cheat?
also you can veer to the
left or right
I rest my case your honour
quasi stream
You know I was not a gamma cheater right?
quasi stream
I don't care about gamma cheats.
As long as people can see with the gamma raised a little bit
barren zephyr
R u a steroid user?
quasi stream
sigh
barren zephyr
Is that why u dont care that someone will make a record you will never reach
wraith trout
Honestly though, if you ran straight into a trike and died that's just unlucky
Like
The chances
quasi stream
I am not even gonna try break records because I don't want to waste time on that lol
barren zephyr
I guess wanting to live to adult is a waste of time too
quasi stream
Does that make sense?
barren zephyr
Instead of getting killed by a cheaterrr
wraith trout
^
barren zephyr
Who found ur juvie hiiding
barren zephyr
Idc about dilo but fact^
wraith trout
With all the gamma cheaters around there was no reason to be a dilo
quasi stream
One of the enjoyments of being a dino for me was to stalk the prey and kill it at night. Well not anymore
barren zephyr
Well wait until they fix night so u can see with out being a cheater
wraith trout
lmao
barren zephyr
quasi stream
RIP you have something with the word cheaters
It was just a matter of how good your monitor was
quasi stream
Oh, sorry people who play on an old TV screen from 80s should see like the people that play on 1920x1080 gaming monitor 144Hz
Ma bad
barren zephyr
Yes
wraith trout
yeah
still fossil
i agree and disagree.
Agree: night is super dark. and its really bad when it comes to NV. the moon and stars give some light so there should be some small light
Disagree: it does make it to where some dinos like dilo are more useless at night if their prey can see them.
quasi stream
Devs want players to enjoy the game and have actually working mechanics into the game. Probably they don't like this nv as well but they have to stick with it since "Daaad an exploiter killed me change the night to hell difficulty please"
barren zephyr
the problem was
you could see without nv anyway
Il give u credit dawg u are wrong with a straight face and madd confidence
wraith trout
In a perfect world, there would be light at night and you would be able to see past your NV, but not very well
HOWEVER
Exploiters waltz in and ruin everything
So here we are
barren zephyr
^
brisk mesa
Guys, you do realize you can make night hard to see without cucking our ability to travel or explore, right?
quasi stream
I'm a straight The Isle fan, I like to read everything and know everything about the game and if The Isle will ever die I will die as well (part of me anyways)
Buuuut Daad please change the night vision back mommy is angry that she can't find the mayo
brisk mesa
Ok, so I decided I wanted to test something, bc I havent played on V3 since night fix.
barren zephyr
Wyatt thats not the point the point is homie is fine with exploiting
Idc how they fix it
As long as it works for everyone wit out gamma
quasi stream
In a game there will always be exploiters
wraith trout
NO
quasi stream
Because it's multiplayer
brisk mesa
If you made night have a fog effect, trust me, it is 10x scarier than the short range.
I was testing to see some things, and the scariest shit ever as a juvi Trex
was seeing an adult Giga
wraith trout
Exploiters can be squished, it just takes time and patience from the developers and the community
brisk mesa
emerge from the fog, rearing his head
as he ate a carcass
Nearly shat myself, as his head lowered back down into the fog.
quasi stream
And putting people from around the world raised different ways by different people and learn different into a small map , yeah, of course you are going to see some people exploit or KoS or other stuff that make you go "DAD IS HAPPENING AGAIN"
brisk mesa
It could let you see trees and such, but ground level has a dense fog.
So you could still navigate
And have Dilo with 'less fog'
:
brisk mesa
Yeah, because its dense, opaque to an extent
So doesnt matter about your settings, infact
cranking Gamma would blind your ass
barren zephyr
@brisk mesa dickhead go suggest it 😉
quasi stream
"Kos isnt a thing" - This post was made by Chinese Society
wraith trout
It truly isnt, but please, let's stay on topic
barren zephyr
^
languid ember
@fading shadow sub rex with bb is a huge nono after it got a damage buff
barren zephyr
^
quasi stream
Oh sorry talking about athletes is on topic but Chinese that KoS is off topic
Ma bad
barren zephyr
It is when its related to the topic
wraith trout
^
barren zephyr
Nobel award for this man
wraith trout
or 'Being a jerk'
barren zephyr
KOS
wraith trout
Depending on what you are meant to be eating
quasi stream
Ok let's all agree that NV is bad right now but better since there are no more exploiters
We good?
barren zephyr
Where ever u were raised
wraith trout
I think we good
quasi stream
What did you say?
wraith trout
Oh god no lmao
barren zephyr
no im write 110% of the time forever
wraith trout
lol
brisk mesa
Wut
barren zephyr
ok but only if dilo gets 1000 more damage in the fog xd
wraith trout
My only real concerns about your suggestion, Watt, are;
A) the impact on lower end PC's from rendering such fog, and
B) How would human light sources fare with thick fog all over the map?
barren zephyr
Agreed @barren zephyr
brisk mesa
Well, I'm sure you've seen your share of horror movies and how they love flashlights... as for torches, they'd probably disperse the fog
but something far off would still see a light in the fog
yikes tribals would be creepy
barren zephyr
now that i think about it
brisk mesa
Just imagine your an inoccent juvi Trike and you see fucking glowing orbs
barren zephyr
the "cannibals" or whatever they are called
dont have eyes
so are they based on echolocation
wraith trout
yeah, as far as we know
barren zephyr
or do they have scent vision sorta like the shirshu
brisk mesa
We know the normal ones have eyes lol. Not the stannibals
brisk mesa
Ok, hm, goddamn if so, they'd probably outclass Dilo at night.
brisk mesa
As for low end PCs Jewbacca
barren zephyr
they would still make noise
brisk mesa
It would probably be demanding at first, but I'm sure they'd be able to optimise the performance.
wraith trout
Yeah
barren zephyr
instead of fog they just make a grey scale
brisk mesa
Like how Thenyaw was initially
wraith trout
That is my biggest concern
barren zephyr
after a certain
brisk mesa
my lord...
barren zephyr
distance
brisk mesa
20fps flashbacks
wraith trout
mhmm
barren zephyr
if their was an option for me to make the game greyscale in order to improve performance i would be on that
brisk mesa
Yes, but that would essentially be Reshade for everyone
barren zephyr
would that improve
brisk mesa
XD
brisk mesa
A grayscale with distance, basically reshade exploit
brisk mesa
Yeah night isnt bright with reshade, if you dont turn on NV.
Trust me, you'd just make reshade but for everyone.
brisk mesa
I dont think we want that, also it seems to lazy honestly.
We know Dondi's a perfectionist.
Maybe if the fog's quality scales with the effects setting, it could help players with weaker hardware
brisk mesa
They simply could tone it down.
brisk mesa
:/
barren zephyr
cant use the color anyway
brisk mesa
XD
novel acorn
@blazing charm sorry replying so late, but now I think I get it what you are saying. But I put it wrong, I forgot that crouching is the one using Ctrl, what I was trying to ask was when the dino are sit, not crouching. When the sit and don't move they could smell de scent in the surroundin, not just when they are standying. Sorry for the wrong word, I really forget that here the translation of this particular word could mean two in english.
blazing charm
I mean, sitting could work.
barren zephyr
steam
fluid schooner
This?
barren zephyr
edgy spire
a patch?
jovial arch
probably just steam
brisk mesa
Zann, curious to your reaction to the NV proposal.
dreamy wharf
Dek, you can abuse that quite easily since you’re so fast as a cerato. And besides, it’s not that fun of a gimmick. Ask yourself: “Man, I’m a cerato, what can I do? Oh, I smell bad and I drive down affinity” and see how it sounds. I don’t mean to be malicious or anybody but that’s what I think.
brisk mesa
^^Agreed.
Abilities that can serve to grief are a uh, problem.
Especially since Affinity follows you after death.
So imagine a Stanky Cerato staying near a Juvi
that just cannot run away, or drive it off.
And he tanks his affinity to starve him to death.
It's one thing for a Trike to one shot you with a charge...
dreamy wharf
Watt, yours? It’s just kindof cosmetic if anything, and besides, just kindof turns everything into a dilo if it’s how I’m thinking it is. Relatively see-able but there’s a slight mist on the ground I guess. Would be cool if dilos were able to use it and only them, but, instead you’d probably see people with their gamma up or something running around biting people at night since it’d be much easier to see.
visual urchin
i find it no more griefy than dilos bleed. its just for the playstyle of the animal. if you're a scavenger, and a large one at that, you need the ability to bully people.
its not like you cant just kill the bugger anyways
dreamy wharf
I’d like to think dilo’s bleed is much less harmless than a permanent affinity debuff to any and all things. That’s why the early “stress” system was being revamped was because of the same issue.
brisk mesa
I'm talking pretty dense, at least in forests or in lakes, and turning up gamma with that hm, lemme, have you tested the Reshade issue before, to see what advantage it offers?
If not, I'll skip right to where my idea idea 'spawned' from... I wanted to see what happens if you turn up Gamma while using it. My 👀 hated me. A lot.
So imagine if you put in a fog, already, but designed it in such a way where it was less abusable than reshade, an actual, proper volumetric fog.. If you applied Reshade you would'nt see ANYTHING in the thick white soup it would create. If you turned up Gamma, you'd be blinded by an unholy hell of white.
I'm not advocating for some amazing nocturnal visibility. Not at all. But you'd be able to see trees stand out from it, mountainsides and the like, so you could still travel and navigate. It would create a nice horror atmosphere, and also still inhibit your ability to spot threats or prey from afar. And, because of the nature of it, nobody would be able to use other exploits to see better as they'd handicap themselves.
dreamy wharf
LOL
brisk mesa
I do a lot of things for science.
My eyes are casualties
I found inspiration in self-inflicted pain.
dreamy wharf
Yeah, that sounds pretty neat tbf. But, I kinda feel like it should be sheer silhouettes instead of being able to see things indefinitely. Which isn’t something I think you’re trying to shoot for.
But
You know how most people roll.
dreamy wharf
Alrighty.
brisk mesa
I'm talking more or less, 'horror movie fog in some pine woods' type shit.
Not 'light mist after sunrise'
dreamy wharf
Got a reference picture or anything?
Ahem, oh. I see.
Sounds really cool, not sure how easy you’d be able to balance it between it being dark and having some creep factor in there, but, is a really nice idea.
verbal acorn
How would the fog impact frame rates/performance?
What about little hills...will the fog be tied to the player or terrain? Will a dino on a little hill, be out of the fog? Will the little hill dino be in his own fog unable to see the dino at the base of the little hill, while the dino at the base of the little hill can look up above his fog and see the dino on the little hill?
brisk mesa
Terrain obviously, I mentioned it being more present at forests and near bodies of water, that's a clear indication the fog isn't in your head. However, if you will, 'NV' would simply be how far you can see through the mist, it's opacity, etc.
Performance, well, depends how detailed it is.
If it's extremely basic crap, well, even a potato PC would see 0 difference
If it's detailed, swirling fog, there'd probably be a substantial impact, so finding a middle ground would be key
@barren zephyr Ok hold on, you've repeatedly had issues with exploiting, or griefing in general, why would you support an ability that screws over others over several lifetimes after an encounter, on a dino about to be made faster than Allo?
barren zephyr
huhhhhhhhhhhh
brisk mesa
Cerato debuffing affinity, just imagine one running up to a Juvi of some sort.
barren zephyr
ohhhh i liked the idea
brisk mesa
And just staying near it.
barren zephyr
didnt think into the logistics
brisk mesa
Until it starves to death due to affinity debuff
and next time he spawns, poor bastard is helpless
with cucked affinity
when he did nothing wrong
barren zephyr
id assume after being around long enough but ya
he would be fucked
for breathing
brisk mesa
XD
Griefer in chief, Cerato...
If a juvi is too slow to get away from the cerato
he could just ruin his life on that server
and what's a juvi gonna do, fight back, run away?
barren zephyr
@wanton root press f12
brisk mesa
Nah only option is suiciding before the Cerato perma rapes your affinity
barren zephyr
then scroll down on teh steam page
and click screenshots
maybe the smell just
makes you like
more thristy
so yo go to get water
xd
or teh scent blocks out your own
cerato could smell like death attracting juvies xd
brisk mesa
Oh lord, smelling like gore piles...
suicide ability.
Yes, let me attract literally everything by glowing red.
*except herbivores, of course
barren zephyr
no smell like a tiny gore pile
brisk mesa
...
barren zephyr
hehe
xd
or his scent makes fresh gore look rotten
so bigger things stay away
cause no point in go'in twords unedible food
junior jacinth
@leaden night I'm aware that max sized sub-rexes deal 400 damage, but their growth damage does not align with it. They still float around the 200 damage mark before reaching 1.0.
-was a 0.9 sub rex the otherday and had less than 200 damage.
round void
Sub adults shouldn’t be that strong, cuz if they were you’d have more apex’s around and that’s makes it unbalanced, subs are mid tier food
leaden night
Sub rex is way too danger near max for most mid tiers
Sub rex is the wrong sub for that
Sub Giga and Triceratops are the actually shitty ones
junior jacinth
How i see it, you're a crusher. You should have some form of bb at the later stages of sub-adult.
leaden night
It's a problem with how BB works rn
Giving sub rex BB makes it almost as much as a problem as when Allo had it
junior jacinth
I've play allo many times
and easily destroyed sub-adult rexes and gigas at their larger end size
its too easy
These are just my thoughts from what i've seen
clever leaf
subadult rex doesnt need bonebreak
junior jacinth
as a player
clever leaf
its jaws arent fully developed yet
junior jacinth
^
Aren't fully developed, but are still developing
pure copper
So essentially we’re trying to make sub rex stronger than it already is
junior jacinth
My suggestion is to allow Sub-adult to not be a pushover. It still should be at a disadvantage towards dilos and allos.
clever leaf
locational damage gonna be a fucking life saver
leaden night
It's not a pushover
clever leaf
in making bb less gay
leaden night
It shits on Allo at max while bleeding out
Sub rex's main problem is how the damage scales with growth
And as I said before
Sub Triceratops and Giga are the ones who really need changes
junior jacinth
I also agree with trikes and gigas at sub-adult needing buffs
gloomy island
@junior jacinth It takes allo 4 bites to be an instant kill on a 1.0 sub rex
it cannot heal the bleed
junior jacinth
Im aware about 1.0 sub rexes.
gloomy island
3 bites leaves it critical with the sub having to rest instantly
junior jacinth
but the growth damage does not align
jovial arch
Imo sub Rex could lose 100 damage and go to like 10 bleed heal
junior jacinth
at 0.95 size. It had just under 200 damage sub-adult
leaden night
100 for 3 more bleed heal isn't really worth
jovial arch
Nah
gloomy island
7 bites from the sub at 1.0 to kill, the entire engagement is really about who can get the jump on the other, with those 4 bites and given the two are nearly completely the same speed wise with the sub being just barely quicker, if the allo gets those 3 or 4 bites in and runs the sub will bleed out far too quickly
Plus the fact that Allo grows way faster, the chances of you coming across a 1.0 sub are very minimal.
leaden night
Ye
brisk mesa
cough dont mind Ditto, Kev & I
leaden night
Sac 100 raw for bleed res and 12 bleed heal
brisk mesa
Bleed rez on Subrex isnt actually... bad.
It's better than Allo.
By a substantial amount.
gloomy island
Its kind of a tough position because lowering the subs strength wont change the fact that for the most part this fight almost always ends with a trade
brisk mesa
A trade isn't the way to go then...
gloomy island
I'd agree with lowering attacks stats more if bleed itself wasn't such a monster
brisk mesa
Ah, how it would be lovely if everything had 0.1 ratio when resting.
gloomy island
Personally I'd change bleed to be a lot quicker on the healing side, forcing bleeder animals to engage more often and making trading less likely
brisk mesa
True.
languid ember
dying to bleed after a fight is probably what annoys me the most with this game sometimes, like killing an allo and only going to second screen but bleed gets me as a sub rex
brisk mesa
Threetails posted a Pachy idea
that worked along those lines.
And Kev has a point.
It's frustrating.
I understand bleed being deadly.
Really do.
But it shouldnt just guarantee you sit there and die.
Granted, how to balance that with Dilo might be a challenge
given their super low bite damage.
gloomy island
Well honestly Dilo is the only bleeder I enjoy playing/fighting against
due to its pitiful base damage
brisk mesa
Fair enough
gloomy island
But I'd rather bleed heal rates be way quicker
barren zephyr
Dilo bleed should last longer than other bleeders
It has venom that thins blood
But faster bleed heal would be nice
pure copper
Isn’t dilos bleed essentially a stand in for when it does get venom ?
leaden night
Yes
brisk mesa
#519931024956850187 says it isnt....lol
manic ibex
blood thinner cancel coagulation, and so healing. that's how dilo's bleed should be handled
maybe a bleed heal debuff
languid ember
i am very much alive @leaden night 
manic ibex
Thanks Chimi, if you could show this to Don it would be 👍
barren zephyr
imo dilo bleed should do damage faster for its venom
er
speed up all bleed
on the dino
thinner blood
ur bleeding out faster
xd
manic ibex
that's also an option, like, make it ticks every 1.5 sec instead of every 3sec and lower it to 35 or 40
barren zephyr
yea
it would also help with utah matchup
cause like
the problem with utah
is that you get it to max bleed butt
iit still has like
30 seconds to kill you
manic ibex
the utah kills dilo out of spite tho
barren zephyr
yea
manic ibex
because he's mad
manic ibex
if he died faster, that would not be an issue
junior jacinth
Not always, but usually
barren zephyr
yea
like with utah
900-950 weight
1200 health
@visual mural not even dilo can eat small gore
but allo can
manic ibex
FeelsBadMan
jovial arch
ok wait
r people meaning to drop the middle finger
or are people fucking up the up sign
god
if you don't like a suggestion
just
👎
it's obvious what that means and there's very little confusion
wintry cipher
tbh should just limit the reactions here to 👎 and 👍
leaden night
📌
sweet oasis
yeah that's... definitely not a thumbs up on that suggestion
barren zephyr
🤦
its making me laugh
cause i know some of these people are trying to like
thumbs up it
paper willow
I thought it was a finger pointing up
Upon closer inspection, shit
sweet oasis
yeah uh... anyone that reacted with a 🖕, might wanna rectify that to a 👍
paper willow
Will do
jovial arch
i literally can't tell whether these people are upvoting or giving the guy the middle finger
sweet oasis
i'll fix any that remain when i get to my pc but that's a pretty funny mistake
jovial arch
does 125 server slots actually have 4 people that don't like it?
barren zephyr
i dont think so lul
leaden night
@barren zephyr A flat number for damage, growth and speed is better
sweet oasis
@barren zephyr I like this.
jovial arch
ditto
sweet oasis
It would definitely help new players with selecting a dinosaur a lot.
jovial arch
that's not what he means
barren zephyr
cause alot of new players dont know
whats fast
and whatisnt
based on numerical value
so having a slider helps
not tomention the influx of players due to shroud
and it being on front of top sellers page in steam
barren zephyr
@crystal turret i think bleed is pretty ok how it is, some dinos just need number changes on resistances
crystal turret
Bleeds damage is ok, the duration is completely out of whack. Its reapplication also
pine shore
Alpha and Wiru are having some middle finger fun
crystal turret
It's unrealistic to simply remove bleeds if you kill your opponent, but bleeding for god knows how long after they die and eventually dying too is silly
pine shore
guess they're frustrated about something
crystal turret
But I didn't 'remove' bleed perse
barren zephyr
well the dilo suggestion makes him really bad tho
unless his strike did
massive damage
crystal turret
I just shifted it so we can have an excuse to remove it from damn nearly every dino
barren zephyr
its on every carni and a handfull of herbies
3 to be exact
trike stego and dibble
crystal turret
yea, like I said... damn near every dino
brisk mesa
Your idea is making the game into like, an MMORPG.
crystal turret
Buffing bleed heal doesn't solve the problem of needing to sit for 30seconds or a minute after a fight to stop bleeding
brisk mesa
lmao.
crystal turret
I also have no idea how my suggestions make it a mmo...
barren zephyr
irl after a fight
crystal turret
Because abilities do stuff?
barren zephyr
even if you win
you still have to lay down and heal
like sure
you beat the guy in a knife fight but
you still got cut
the cut may still kill you
barren zephyr
derteeh fite
crystal turret
Thanks Guyo.... but realism needs to give way to balance some times.
brisk mesa
You are trying to solve a problem that doesnt exist
crystal turret
Limiting that 'sit down and heal' to 10 seconds isn't a deal breaker
leaden night
The problem is the amount of time you spend sitting there
brisk mesa
^^^^
leaden night
^
barren zephyr
yea
crystal turret
Which is exactly what I did.... the bleed dot now only lasts 10 seconds....
crystal turret
10 seconds isn't too fast lol
barren zephyr
10 seconds is way to fast
brisk mesa
Does it? You see, literally everything is lost in your massive wall of overhaul
leaden night
Universal bleed heal buff and juv rex still ends up stuck with 2
leaden night
It just works
brisk mesa
Bleed does damage every 3 seconds.
sweet oasis
@unborn quail 2 things I think you should tack on there
brisk mesa
Your idea would make you take 3 ticks of bleed
crystal turret
Watt, the only thing lost is bleed on 75% of dinos.
Its application is then adjusted to actually use effort on all but one, the dilo
sweet oasis
-
subadult has terrible resting bleed heal and dies automatically if allo bites it 4 times (so buff a bit)
-
revert allo's damage buff because it definitely didn't need it
for nova^^
crystal turret
The devs main focus needs to be to get people playing herbs imo. The only way to do that is make it so they aren't all free meal tickets. I felt my adjustments did that. But fine, leave bleed as is. What else is wrong with what I said?
brisk mesa
You do realise herbivores have repeatedly been really good, right?
crystal turret
I don't Watt. I know they are currently not.
brisk mesa
ATM they are all weak, they don't need mechanics to make the really powerful.
But at a time, herbivores all were better than carnivores in outright stats.
Herbs that did bleed, did more than carnis.
Herbs that were raw dmg or tanks outclassed predators
their weakness was generally turn rate
and recovery rates
Head on, no predator beat a counterpart herbivore.
crystal turret
Well now they have no strengths and a herd of herbis will stand 0 chance against a pack of carnis
crystal turret
Which I felt I did without nerfing anything but bleed...
brisk mesa
Before the 'balance' one
Herds were abundant
You found large herds roaming around, on official servers.
20-30 members strong.
It was awesome.
Then?
Para gets nerfed, reaaaally hard.
Allo and Carno get buffed.
Food is reduced.
And now they aren't around.
crystal turret
The problem is Herbs need more than just the ability to run away. Because if that's all they wanted all those herb packs you mentioned would be playing Gallis
leaden night
^
leaden night
Also Watt did say no carnivore could take them on in a head on fight
brisk mesa
^^^^
Not last patch but, before then.
A long while but still.
Carnivores had lower food demands
so they could plan a hunt
and pack up to tackle these stronger herbs
But if an Allo, back then, went face to face with Diablo
Diablo shredded it.
crystal turret
It's not fun spending 2.5 hours in a dark corner of a map semi-afk growing to an adult and then running around being 1 shot by nearly every predator out there. Or if you aren't technically 1 shot, you'll certainly run into that 7 strong allo pack or the 10 strong utah pack etc
brisk mesa
The disconnect from reality seems strong here.
jovial arch
look
if you want an example
of what a fun herbi would look like
go find my pachy suggestion
it's a bold claim
jovial arch
but it's a pretty good suggestion
brisk mesa
I gave him flak when he DM'd me the initial concept
but holy hell he refined it
his pachy would be amazingly unique
amazing bleed heal, and HP heal, and high damage, but middling bleed rez
languid ember
i love the ridiculously high bleed heal, so you won't just bleed out from fucking everything even if you kill them first
brisk mesa
ngl, if the devkit was out rn, I'd probably copy-paste his idea for a Pachy.
unborn quail
Actually, an Idea was mentioned so you wouldn't go below x health while sitting with bleed
And iirc
Don liked it
leaden night
@wintry cipher Bleed amount does*
Once more
Assbitey Utah doesn't need to annoy rex solely because it did 1 bleed to it
wintry cipher
Then perhaps that needs to be changed so utah doesnt do bleed to an adult rex. There have been too many cases of people losing food just because they want to be spiteful after getting to fatal
jovial arch
yeah
i don't have the exact numbers
but utah only deals ~2.4 bleed (rounded up) to rex anyway
so that's at least 20 hits to put any sort of damage on the rex
and you need to remember the rex will be healing the whole time
but i dunno how high rex standing heal is
i dunno how high a lot of stats are
it's hard to talk about balance without actually knowing most of these numbers, which is unfortunate
fickle root
Allo destroyed dibble before the buff @brisk mesa
brisk mesa
I'm talking about quite a while back, and also, Allo and Diablo was a very close matchup
fickle root
I killed a dibble in dm and was still on first screen
brisk mesa
Trash dibble lmao
fickle root
I fought him twice on the same allo killed him both times after the second fight I was on second screen
barren zephyr
traaaash potato
mental sleet
?
oblique crown
Wait was carno buffed or nerfed?
wintry cipher
buffed
oblique crown
Ohh in what way?
fickle root
I heard speed as in takes longer to get to full speed
@thorny lynx what did nova say I can’t find it
thorny lynx
I really don't agree with utah, carno, maia, or galli getting boosts, but the rest of them look pretty damn solid. Everything looks so linear, so the next tier cannot be ambushed by a tier below when it is ambushing.
thorny lynx
Yeah, I don't quite agree with it
But the general premise is B tier will never catch A tier when both are ambushing
mental sleet
Rex's ambush is as useless as usual
thorny lynx
But B tier will catch A tier when B tier is ambushing and A tier isn't./
B being the lower speed tier.
That's how these speed tiers should have been.
unborn quail
@mental sleet I'm assuming you mean on terms with time with rex?
mental sleet
Oh no I mean the actual speed.
thorny lynx
But look how much of a boost he has in his ambush
mental sleet
1062
now scroll over to the herbivore base speeds.
with a few meters of headstart a dibble will embarass you.
apart from that, trike.
thorny lynx
Uh
unborn quail
Biggest issue was dealing with Giga, that I didn't want to make ambushes too obnoxiously fast
thorny lynx
subadults..
mental sleet
all it needs to do is run in one direction.
and after 8 seconds you are done and dusted.
thorny lynx
Well, ten seconds would be useful.
mental sleet
I personally don't think any ambush should be above the 8-10 second mark.
unborn quail
On terms with utah, It's short due to the fact that nothing but carno can actually keep up with the lad when it's in Ambush, though, I have been looking at changing quite a few things
Excluding herbivores^
mental sleet
You can change how ambush works rather than the speed.
Ambush shouldn't just be used for escape like that.
thorny lynx
I honestly like how cerato, allo, and dilo speeds are quite linear
unborn quail
Oh no, you aren't wrong, But this is more so in line with the current system we have, If we had a better idea for the future ambush system, then it'd be a lot easier
crystal turret
A successful ambush should really spell doom for the victim. It should really cause your next attack while ambushing or shortly after ambushing to do something special. A snare, additional damage, etc
thorny lynx
That would be dope.
unborn quail
Anywho, @mental sleet Feel free to dump some feedback/ ideas in dms if you'd like
thorny lynx
Like, Giga could do more bleed with an ambush attack, Rex could have a higher bone-break chance
mental sleet
I'm not 100% sure on how to tackle this.
crystal turret
honestly, a rex should only bone break from an ambush :/
mental sleet
I did it with Wattington before, but without changing ambush it gets tricky.
unborn quail
Mhm agreed
mental sleet
The only thing I can propose is that no ambush goes above 10 seconds.
unborn quail
I originally didn't want touch ambush
Let the devs do that
I was more concerned with sprint
But people brought up a good point that involving them could make the suggestion more appealing
mental sleet
If you are going for a suggestion make it as complete as possible.
unborn quail
Though, I will agree on a universally shortened Ambush
I could make the risk of making giga and rex the same base ambush speed, but Allowing Giga to last longer. In the end, especially with rex, Giga has been an issue
As I don't want to make ambush speeds too obnoxious
thorny lynx
I wish Rex could run longer.
Giga can run for a stupidly amount of time but Rex can only run for a minute and 50 seconds
Maybe less, now.
thorny lynx
I kind of don't...
thorny lynx
Dilo can barely escape an allo's ambush while it ambushes.
jovial arch
he didn't quite show me the light
mental sleet
What was the debate about ?
jovial arch
but he helped me understand why over stratification of speed isn't a great idea
it was about the big balance thing i posted
that was like 60 pages
unborn quail
Dilo is nearly a whole two mph faster then Allo's ambush, problem isn't so much speed
It's the time difference
mental sleet
Oh I remember that.
thorny lynx
Allo has a stupid fucking ambush
mental sleet
You can be given a stupid fucking ambush as long as its short.
It is what I think rex should have.
jovial arch
we went on for like another 5 pages
jovial arch
look
unborn quail
Both dilo and allo are 12 seconds
jovial arch
you see
thorny lynx
Allo really needs 10 seconds on its ambush, considering how much of a boost it receives.
jovial arch
you two want to balance the game in fundamentally different ways
there's not really alot of reconciling to be done
nova and fluff on more on the stratification page, whereas david is more on skill based general niches
thorny lynx
I honestly feel speeds should correlate to a predator vs prey niche
jovial arch
they're fundamentally vastly differing approaches to balance
cosmetically they seem pretty similar
but they're not
mental sleet
?
jovial arch
hmmm
how do i explain this
it's like nova wants to organize everything and put everything into its own box
mental sleet
Oh that.
jovial arch
and you want to make sure more things can hunt eachother
the more predator/prey connections for david, the better
unborn quail
Main focus was more so being able to escape things reliably, but that works too
jovial arch
for nova, it should be predefined
or
limited
rather
i'd say the current balance system is somewhere in between the two
crystal turret
more things could escape if they found a 'reverse ambush' approach for herbs to use.
mental sleet
I am not as specific on predator/prey connections.
crystal turret
then you wouldn't necessarily need all herbs to be faster than carnis. Just for herbs to be able to capitalize on a non-ambushing carni. As opposed to now where a trex trotting across a field can outrun a para for example
jovial arch
exactly
you aren't
nova is
honestly, either balance approach can work
tbh it's really hard to know
because games like this don't really exist
the success of the game is also tied to having the system work
so...
anyway
i've given up on that
rn I'm only gonna try to balance the current system
oblique crown
@shrewd python Just use test server to see adult skins
jovial arch
respeeding/restating dinos is beyond me, and so is making a new system of movement
ima just stick to regular balance
unborn quail
@mental sleet Gonna go ahead and throw in the idea of Shorter ambushes in trade for faster speeds, What would you recommend for a duration cap? (Keeping the current system in mind)
mental sleet
8-10 seconds at most.
unborn quail
👌
brisk mesa
I mean, here's an example - looking at current speeds here - that I mentioned to Ninja
Trex could receive a 6 second ambush, but have a multiplier of 1.26, or higher, up from it's current 1.17 multiplier.
What does that let it do?
A Trex would catch an Allosaurus, during ambush.
It would require you, fundamentally, to be close, or catch it offguard.
But it would substantially expand Trex's potential prey items
Now as for the conversation with Threetails, yes that's really the conclusion he came to, because there are two fundamentally different approaches to what can be considered balance.
Balance can either be very strict, inflexible and predictable, or it can be highly based on player skill, circumstances and strategies employed.
Nova's speed suggestion falls under the former, David & I's ideas fall under the latter.
Example, under our overhaul to ambush and acceleration, a Tyrannosaurus can most definitely catch a Maiasaura, IF it gets really, really close and the Maia hasn't had time to notice the Trex before it begins ambushing
No dinosaur can be considered 'untouchable'
However, a Maia that is vigilant would never be caught by a Trex.
unborn quail
Basically, Ambush is a bitch and a half to deal with, and needs a complete overhaul
Anywho, continue
brisk mesa
Yeah it definitely needs an overhaul to be done right.
Whether it's your way, or ours.
unborn quail
Personally, i never wanted to touch Ambush speeds, someone else can do that, I'm more focused on sprint speeds to avoid death stacking dinosaurs on top of one another
brisk mesa
How the Trex could catch the Maia, despite the massive sprint speed disparity, is simply that Trex's ambush bypasses Acceleration, but only receives a very mild multiplier boost. Meanwhile, Maia who achieves high speed, has a long acceleration time, so it actually wants to start running before a predator would. Normally, the Maia doesn't need to worry, bc it's predators also need to accelerate, even ambushing.
However Trex hits his 'mediocre' speed, when ambushing, immediately... letting it catch a Maia from close range.
unborn quail
My biggest issue with the secondary option i'm doing is the lack of an ambush cool down, But, that may longer be an issue in the future
Because y'know, No one wants to see A giga ambushing at almost 30 mph back to back 😂
thorny lynx
Giga really shouldn't be that fast
24 miles an hour sprint at best
10 seconds
It shouldn't really be hunting things other than maia, trike, and para.
And the occasional succ because of its shit bleed resist.
unborn quail
That's what the ambush multiplier is for, It's insanely short compared to before, but provides more speed.
In Option two that is
Not my personal favorite of the two, but Leaving the option there if the devs decide to look at it for use or ideas
brisk mesa
How we handled ambushing was by making a penalty if you ambushed before you'd built your base duration.
So example, Giga ambush lasts 15s. If you'd crouch and sit there for 3 seconds and launch pad, you'd take a stamina penalty.
Wait the full 15, and no problemo
unborn quail
Mhm, Personally, I'd rather keep the Ambush ideas up to those who have an idea for a full overhaul, But, gotta flesh it out as much as possible
Though, i think I might hold off on the extreme ambushes for the time being.
Might go back to it later
But, for right now, I'd rather stay off of it
brisk mesa
We also cranked up stamina costs to 5x sprint.
unborn quail
mhm, Yeah, feel free to handle the ambush stuff, Not my cup of tea
brisk mesa
typos be like
damn Trex hustles
Para, Cera, Diablo, Sucho, Allo, Giga, all on the menu for 6 seconds
unborn quail
He's the ambush king
If it sneaks up on you
That's your fault
He's big, Lumbering and loud
brisk mesa
Not complaining.
unborn quail
That, and it's a hit and miss situation for him, all depends on that bone break
So seems fair enough
Anywho, that's enough of that
fickle root
For the most part I agree with those speeds but don’t know why they would make some of the fastest ones faster and others stay the same
clear turret
@ocean vortex What DOES Dondi like? The man is a pissbaby douchebag.
ocean vortex
Every game developer goes through tough crap
He just for one doesn't internally hold back his opinions
Sure though that does offend a lot of others occasionally
barren zephyr
@limpid hornet Cerato is getting a speed buff next Patch and also it's hunger drains slower now all you have to do is just survive the short phase of hunger after you become a fresh spawn adult
still temple
why would Cerato need a remodel tho @limpid hornet
white torrent
It’s not
Where did y’all hear that from?
Oh, nvm
I think the current cerato model is gorgeous, it shows off those massive lipless jaws, and long teeth
Proportionally abnormally long
I agree with it having a higher damage than the allo, but less health tbh, I feel like the cerato’s bite might be a’little more devastating.
white torrent
So agree with the stat changes, but not at all with a remodel. Mostly because it’ll take time away from giving creatures with bad models(aka stego, herrera, and a few others) Plus, the lips look dumb. Lel
Kool m8
Also I found the para segment in don’s clips kinda funny. I mean.. sure, para can be killed by allo’s, I’m totally cool with that, and all
But you don’t have to turn para into the allo’s bitch meat 😂
I don’t think a single kick should kill an allo, that was a’little op, especially when para could chase an allo down. Maybe three kicks can do the job, not friggin seven. And now that para is slower than the allo, and it takes like six or seven kicks to kill ONE. Para’s have no chance, they aren’t viable anymore
One of the most anticipated herbivores ever, is now useless
limpid hornet
@barren zephyr really? speed buff? i waited this so long!
white torrent
We all have :’) all the cerato players
limpid hornet
@still temple actually cera's bite was more powerful than allo's, because of stronger jaws muscles.
Do anyone knows allo stats (for now)?
pearl relic
just looked last night, my adult male allo was 2.8 tons, 300N bite
limpid hornet
I mean HP, damage, spped, stamina, etc.
faint vector
thats a 50N raise from pre-patch. Not the 375 that was told its switched with the sucho
limpid hornet
I hope Cerra would be playable
white torrent
What?
white torrent
It has damage
I’ve slain many adult allo’s
It’s hard, and most the time it’ll just be a suicide on the allo’s part
And I’ll die of bleed
But I’ve killed them and survived
Mostly because they can’t play allo right, lol
limpid hornet
Where we can ask a dev?
white torrent
I don’t think you can personally
limpid hornet
There's a channel, but its locked.
limpid hornet
Which time it will be?
white torrent
Next Tuesday
limpid hornet
Which time?
white torrent
I’m gonna ask about what Dino’s they currently have planned for survival
Uhh, I don’t know that. I usually miss it, because of school
barren zephyr
@manic ibex wonderfully put my good sir
manic ibex
I don't think this is going to change anything tho.
barren zephyr
yea
barren zephyr
@ folks on about the bleed, he did say he is reworking it.
limpid dove
well who knows
maybe some suggestions will steer his ideas
i like that now i won't die to bleed. if a dilo attacks me as a maia, gets me going on 3 bleed but i kill the dilo, at least the threat is gone and i can survive the bleed once it's down to 1
but if i try to heal my bleed and his buddy comes rolling in having thought i'd be fine, he gets the winning blow and a successful meal.
pure copper
Don’t think anyone’s tugging your leg to join a group
limpid dove
be careful who you trust
white torrent
It just really sucks that the Utah, which has always dicked on dilo, can now do it without any fear
limpid dove
naw
if dilo puts 3 bleed on a utah, utah will end up limping and cannot catch the dilo
white torrent
IF
limpid dove
the utah will probably live the bleed, but that dilo will be long gone by the time the utah heals its bleed
white torrent
Utah’s usually come In packs
limpid dove
i feel that a pack of dilos would see the utahs, and would either turn away and choose not to deal with them, or run in, mass bleed them and run away so that they can't follow the dilos
dilo packs vary
dont really need too many. 5 is enough to take out an adult giga.
barren zephyr
Utah v Dilo gang wars
limpid dove
but ive been in packs of 10 or more dilos before
white torrent
I hope trample damage will be worked on
Anything to stop ass riding in survival and realism servers 😂
pure copper
I mean you typically wanna aim for the rear when attacking most dinosaurs
think it’s the ankles you’re worried about
white torrent
Yes, buttt
pure copper
No butts
white torrent
When a big ass tail is the wayuy
You should really be worried
I mean most Dino’s had stiff, strong tails
Good for whackin a bastard
pure copper
Tail is a part of the rear naturally
restive summit
For balance
pure copper
Not propellers
pure copper
Of course they’re stiff , don’t mean they make good weapons
restive summit
They are made to balance the body / fat head torso and such
white torrent
They are still in way 😛
pure copper
Good for biting
white torrent
Maybe if your a rex
restive summit
You swing your tail that is designed to keep you balanced you are falling over. End of story
white torrent
And you can hold onto a Maia’s tail
Not a Utah, which would get dragged around in the dirt
pure copper
@restive summit only if you’re trying to turn like a ballerina lol
restive summit
Utah's tails don't drag?
white torrent
...
restive summit
True @pure copper
white torrent
Just. The tail is in the way, ass riding is a bad feature
restive summit
I'm talking a full force, put your weight into it swing
pure copper
Theoretically large dinosaurs can “swing” their tails it’s just that most don’t make good offensive weapons
white torrent
It should be fixed, by trample damage
And when the Utah’s pouncing ability gets added, hopefully it’ll lead to@less ass riding
restive summit
Well ass riding is all you can do right now other then running directly through the other player, until we get collision and combat mechanics like latching and pouncing
white torrent
Especially for the Maia
pure copper
@restive summit im having a hard time imagining what that would look like, you mean like Disney’s dinosaur ?
white torrent
That’s what I’m saying when I bring up pouncing
restive summit
Yes @pure copper
white torrent
What would I be awesome is grapple mechanics
restive summit
Like Aladar attacking the Carno with his ass and hips swaying in the wind
white torrent
When the allo’s ambush was shown, with its extended claws
pure copper
They could probably manage that , they still have all feet planted on the ground while doing so
white torrent
I was freaking out! What if it could grapple a Maia
pure copper
Realistic graphics help visualization
white torrent
Drag it down and chop it up with that deadly bite
restive summit
What if the back feet fly up into the air with the swing 😂
Does it flip the poor bastard?
white torrent
Whom?