Moose Are WAY Too Tough

[blissful sun]

I grew up hunting moose, I've hunted them since i was 13 and the moose In game Are Unrealistically Tough. they can TANK Broadside shots at sub 100 Metres from a .30-06 which is unrealistic as Hell since they are so tough in game no rifle that goes up to class 8 or up to class 9 can get a double lung shot when they are broadside. Please Rebalance the moose you should be able to get Double lung shots when they are broadside with ANY Class 4-8, 4-9 or 7-9 rifle between point blank and 200 Metres

[merry mesa]

I was just thinking about making a post about this but I see you beat me to it :P

Like we said in another thread, it's ridiculous just how tanky they made moose in-game. Sure, they're tough animals irl (on account of the whole "multi-hundred kilogram deer" thing), but cartridges like .30-06, .300 Winchester/Weatherby Magnum (apparently it depends on which .300 you use), .338 Magnum (Lapua if you go off of the Tsurugi, Winchester if you go off of the Rangemaster iirc), etc.

In-game I feel like I really only get double-lung shots with the .375 H&H Magnum (which works for moose but is nowhere near a requirement for them lol) and occasionally the Hudzik, everything else rarely ever gets past a single lung (and cartridges like .308, .30-06, .50 Sabot, etc. barely make it into that lung)

[blissful sun]

and then theres the fact they actually run when shot in the heart, No moose will walk off a heart shot from a .270 or higher

[merry mesa]

While I've seen plenty of videos where moose run a short distance after taking a shot that smashes the heart and both lungs, I feel like for the sake of the game moose should have a unique animation for instantly dropping from heart shots, kinda like that heavy crash they do where they just collapse on the spot (plus moose do sometimes just drop on the spot irl)

Also, fun fact: if you spine, neck, or brain shot a moose in-game they also actually run a little like they do with the heart shots

[blissful sun]

Unrealistic, a 7MM Rem Mag can topple them inside 250 Metres with a lung shot

[merry mesa]

I do think it's worth considering that there is a level of variation that happens irl, I've had some deer and pigs drop on the spot while others run a little from the same shot placement, and from what I've been seeing online the same thing happens irl with moose

Regardless, moose really don't get far with good shot placement, but in-game unless you nail the heart (or get really close with the .375), they tend to run for a while, and like we mentioned earlier they're really dense and double lungs are near-impossible, except for a few cases

[daring carbon]

Bump because why not

[red quarry]

Bump because I stopped hunt to moose.

[daring carbon]

Bump because this is Nonsense

[blissful sun]

bump

[daring carbon]

Bumpity bump bump

[rare stag]

Tbh I think it's more of an issue with how weapons work in this game

But I'd like a moose durability nerf

[blissful sun]

it isn't the weapons, with the 375 you can frequently get double lung on yaks, buffalo and banteng which are ALL Larger than moose but at those same distances with the same angles on a moose you will never get double lung

[daring carbon]

Bump

[red quarry]

Bump

[hushed rampart]

Moose need a nerf in their durability. How could it be ethical, to shoot an ingame moose with a .308 or .30-06 (which are irl more than viable and ingame the most powerful 4-8 rifles) and have it run for hundrets of meters while suffering. Moose need nerf. Now! Otherwise it does not make any sense to have it in class 8, while no class 8 rifle (except the .375 H&H) can bring them down quickly and with reduced pain and suffering. Right now, it sucks to be a moose in cotw. If you get shot with anything that is not a .375 or arrow/bolt you will have to suffer unethical pain.

Please give moose a realistic tissue hardness and not this insane armour. Give moose an ethical end, and not endless pain! This game is about ethical hunting.

[merry mesa]

Basically every 4-8 cartridge in the game should be more than capable of bringing down moose quickly. .270, 6.5mm, .308, .30-06, .50 cal sabot rounds, 7mm magnum, etc. should all be capable of punching through both lungs of a moose and dropping it fairly quickly

It's genuinely ridiculous that the only cartridges that are capable of killing moose somewhat-quickly are .300 magnum and .338 magnum (both of which still only hit one lung) and .375 H&H Magnum (the only consistent double-lung AND quick kill)

For context, moose hunters have noticed that unless you're aiming for longer distance shots, moose react pretty similarly to a wide range of cartridges, you don't NEED .30 cal magnum cartridges or cartridges designed to take down cape buffaloes to successfully hunt moose

.45-70 should also be a very capable moose hunting cartridge, but it has its own issues alongside moose being ridiculously tough, and the same goes for .30-30 and 9.3x74mmR

I even remember a moose hunter saying "sometimes moose can't tell the difference between a .416 rigby and a .270 winchester," which he explained as "sometimes bigger doesn't equal better"

if we REALLY wanna get into it, some people (like some indigenous Alaskans and First Nations people) consistently and successfully hunt moose with stuff like .223 Remington and .243 Winchester

moose are big, and they are tough animals, but they aren't so tough that the cartridges that are widely used on them don't work effectively, and it's very frustrating to deal with in-game

[blissful sun]

exactly, Bigger is rarely better with ANY DEER and moose are deer

[merry mesa]

That's ofc not to say you can't hunt moose with stuff like .375 H&H Magnum and .416 Rigby, people do use those and they work, but by no means do you need to break out the biggest, heaviest-hitting cartridges for moose

The most consistent message I've heard regarding moose hunting is "the best gun/cartridge for moose are the ones you're comfortable with"

[fair kite]

They definetly shadownerfed alot of weapons too, both the malmer and 50 cal sabot got double long good bleedrate on moose only, other animals works just the same

*Works like it should

[red quarry]

When I first seen the Gandhare rifle ammunition I decided it will be a moose devastator. It will drop a moose on the spot. But..... no. After that it became clear. Every animals have its own settings for every weapons. I'm suspect this is old, complicated and very confused sistem.

[merry mesa]

I remember someone mentioned that moose were buffed back when they got their TLC and got the Great One variants, so it's a fairly recent thing

[blissful sun]

that is exactly when it happened, their old Health was FINE near perfect actually

[merry mesa]

I don't remember exactly how it was before bc it has been a while, but I do remember them not being completely ridiculous like this lmao

[warm spoke]

Yes, that is correct. There was a time when they were not built like panzer tanks. 😆

Also, the rifles we paid for were not Nerfed. That didn’t last very long.

Both of those decisions smell like grinding related tweaks, but that’s just speculation on my part.

[red quarry]

If I remember right. We got a g1 moose with NEM. But before this map was realize I noticed that that an injured moose could run 250 m after 308 or 30.06 single lung shot. I hunted with these rifles in Revontuli.

[fair kite]

Using the 338 got double lung on the new bison but single on moose for the same angle, like what, bison are so easy to target and irl should be way harder to kill but nuh uh EW playing that ”realistic the way we see fit” kinda game

[merry mesa]

So about that, apparently bison aren't "way harder to kill" than moose. In fact, from everything I've seen, read, and heard from others, pretty much anything you can use irl on moose works on bison (.270, .30-30, .308, .30-06, .300 magnum, etc.)

That being said, I'm okay with them being classed higher for the sake of being a video game and allowing people with only the base game to have access to a class 9 animal, but it's ridiculous that bison, buffaloes, and yaks are all easier to bring down than moose (which absolutely should not be tougher than the class 9 animals like cape buffaloes and water buffaloes)

[daring carbon]

I know a Guy who used his .243 on bison and it worked pretty well

[fair kite]

Yeah and some people hunt moose with 223s

[daring carbon]

I know

[hushed rampart]

Moose need to be de-amoured in order to fit to rest of the species spectrum. Now.

[warm spoke]

https://youtube.com/shorts/-UimvZM_fHE?si=7JnRT_39jYh4S1PH

😆

[fair kite]

bruh 😂

[blissful sun]

that REALLY pisses me off

[hushed rampart]

This should be more than obvious that we need a moose de-buff. When the strongest gun in the game can't drop it fast, than is clearly wrong with that species in the game. Nerf moose armour now, please!

[red quarry]

Devs will solve this problem in December apparently. Will sell us 458 or 416 with a new map or new dlc (maybe autumn). Wait.

[merry mesa]

Look, i get it, but all you do on suggestion posts like these is say stuff like this. We're going to express our criticisms regardless. We've made pushback that resulted in changes before (for example: .577/450 being updated to be ethical for class 9 animals), we can absolutely be vocal about other changes we want to see in hopes that the devs implement them.

And even if you want to make the "make changes that encourage income" argument, that will apply even if they do fix moose, as the .300 and .338 magnums + .375 H&H will be more effective than they are now

With all due respect, if you don't have anything meaningful to contribute to feedback posts like what we've made and only want to repeat the idea that "they won't make changes, they'll only make more DLCs" (which gives the implication that you think we should just stop trying), then simply don't speak.

[red quarry]

I have almost 5000 h in this game. This a pure time without grind. (I hate grind). During this time I have seen lot of problems with animals, ammo and mechanics. Gandhare to 9 class this is the laziest thing that devs did in the game. Moreover open sight is doesn't have lot of lovers. My pessimism infuriate you. But I know how devs work. They release nothing between dlc. If they will do nothing in the next dlc (rifles)-this is plus 3 months. If nothing again-plus 6 months. If again- plus one year. Its normal if COTW not the most important game in you life. But it very disappointed if vice versa.

[daring carbon]

Spooqi just ignore em

[hushed rampart]

Don't get me wrong, I see your point, BUT: It is not up us users to tell other users to not speak anymore. We all can have different opinions, (And I for myself share your opinion on the facts), but everyone can say what they want as often as they want, as long as it does not harm others.

[earnest elbow]

I have also considered the likelihood that EW doesn't want every animal to drop like a rock. It could be they want players to spend some time in tracking their kill ....

Honestly IRL tracking blood trails is a real life exercise ... Of course don't know about Moose specifically because I've never hunted them IRL ....

[red quarry]

If we stop argue with each other thread is gone. Ye I'm pessimistic. But after I seen how community were mistaken with a new 30-30 I lost hope. Because I knew how will it end. I really want to be wrong.

[fair kite]

I hope you are wrong too, but i get where your coming from

[daring carbon]

If you have to Track a Moose Further than 50 Feet it was likely not a Perfect shot but I see where you are coming from

[merry mesa]

This 100%. Moose don't always drop immediately upon being shot irl, but if you have to really track a moose then you just didn't place the shot well

I'm not even asking that moose drop immediately, I'd just like for it to be possible to punch through both lungs with more than just the .375 and .470 NE, as well as having it be possible for more cartridges to effectively handle moose, like .270 (base game), .30-06 (DLC), .308 (DLC), .300 magnum (DLC), .338 magnum (base game but has a DLC weapon variant), 7mm magnum (also base game with a DLC weapon variant), and so forth

iirc the 9.3x74mmR (a DLC cartridge at that) even says in its flavor text something about "designed for moose hunting," yet it also struggles immensely with moose (granted, it also struggles on anything bigger than black bears and elk iirc, but it's even more noticeable on moose). This issue is also pretty noticeable with the inline muzzleloader's ammo, which mention moose but perform about as had as the 6.5mm

And I know some people keep bringing up "DLC sales," but if anything, adjusting moose would make stuff like .300 magnum and .375 H&H more attractive as purchase options, as they would be inherently even better at killing moose than they currently are

[red quarry]

Tracking blood is a normal part of hunt. Bloodhound do it process easy. Moreover we can make this part of hunt more simple. With help of powerful ammo and rifles. It works with all animals except moose. It annoys. Even Gandhare can't. 375 do it but to 150-170m. I'm passing by moose now.

[fair kite]

True but since it’s a game and the abundancy of the animals and the reason we hunt the animals is completely different from irl, i think they should drop faster than real life

[red quarry]

Yes. Abundance is the main reason. I don't want run almost 500m past many of animals because i did shot (150-200m) in moose from 308 or 30.06.

[earnest elbow]

I understand your reasoning but in saying this you are perpetuating a grinding mentality ... Kill as much as you can as quickly as you can ....

This is already the reason why HCOTW is seen as not a true hunting sim but just an arcade shooting gallery ....

I personally don't want to see the game drift further into that stereotype... I also dont want it to slow down and become too much like IRL hunting ... There are many players who like the faster pace of the hunting ....

Bottom line there is balance to be maintained ... if hunting becomes too run and gun they loose players and if it slows down like we see in other games then they will loose players ....

[fair kite]

Yes yes of course, i didn’t mean for it to sound that way, truth is i totally agree with you, i want the game to be like a game so not too realistic but not in a grinding way because it takes away the immersion and the realism. Because the game is for getting trophies and getting that true experience of hunting, it shouldn’t be easy to kill an animal and it shouldn’t be hard, there’s a healthy balance which i hope you understand is what i’m rooting for. So it should be easier to hunt than in real life but it should also be immersive enough to feel like real hunting, you get what i’m saying? I’m sorry if i am being unclear now and was earlier

[earnest elbow]

Perfectly clear 👍 .... I was also somewhat replying to vlad as well

[fair kite]

Fantastic

[red quarry]

Paradox. Devs punish us if we do unethical kills but can't see how moose run 200-300m before dye. This are 3 football fields. It torture not hunt. About money I won't talk. Here is clearer then ever. Bump.

[hushed rampart]

Exactly my thoughts.... What we see ingame is just unethical. We see how moose are tortured, because they are implemented way to armoured.

Right now, there is almost no gun that will down a moose fast. Yes, we have the .375 (which will hopefully be never hit with the nerf hammer...) for up to 150m, but otherwise we are forced to torture those beautiful animals. Yes, it is a game - But it is game, that is all about ethical hunting. Unless we won't get a buff for all rifles, we need a moose armour nerf.

[red quarry]

Bump

[blissful sun]

bump

[daring carbon]

Bump

[daring carbon]

Bump

[daring carbon]

Bump because a .223 can kill them IRL

[fair kite]

With lung shots then?

[limpid temple]

Ive seen moose take multiple good shots to go down

[fair kite]

With what gun/caliber?

[limpid temple]

30-06, 338, 270 theyre tough asf

[daring carbon]

In my experience they aren't very tough, one of my Cousins almost exclusively uses .243 on them to High Effect at close range and I use .30-30 All the time on them

Moose is the Species I grew up hunting I've hunted them since I was 13 (I'm 24 Now) and it makes me Rather Angry with how Unrealistically Tough moose are in game

https://youtu.be/sWwG_Fyg71s?si=QN9BXYVME5wOA2ON Moose should work like this in game, Fatal hit, Walk a little and drop

[fair kite]

It’s like this in woth but they die even faster irl it seems like, EW gotta lot of work to do, they also need to fix their calls because reverse bear sounds aren’t what moose actually sound like. I’m pretty sure moose had normal sounds before a certain update came along too but i think that was way back

[limpid temple]

Ig our moose built different here

[fair kite]

You in Alaska or smthn?

[glossy path]

I’d be even more tempted to grind moose if they were fixed. The whole point of a well placed shot is that the animal goes down faster. It rewards player skill and knowledge, even if that knowledge is rather basic (but it’s definitely a key part of gameplay). Never really thought about it before, besides briefly with watching content creators grinding moose and seeing how annoying it is when they miss a heart shot, this thread since I haven’t touched moose much but reading through this it’s definitely pretty silly.

[limpid temple]

Maine

[daring carbon]

So Eastern Moose, Which is what I Drop with a .30-30 in Ontario

[limpid temple]

It was a joke i dont actually think theyre any different but ik of several instances where a clean shot didnt drop one

[daring carbon]

Realistically, The Toughest animals in the Game should be, Grizzly, Saltwater Crocodile, And Any Class 9 species everything else should be relatively easy to down as they are IRL

[daring carbon]

Bumping this up

[daring carbon]

Top of Thread

[daring carbon]

Like c'mon EW Moose are not that Much Tougher than Elk IRL

[earnest elbow]

@daring carbon
I beg to differ .... shot yesterday .... Poly tipped 7mm barely pierced the hide into the lung at 89 yards .... Cow ran over 460 yards before giving it up ....

[daring carbon]

I was Referring to IRL

[earnest elbow]

my bad sorry for the misunderstanding ....

[daring carbon]

IRL that Shot would've went through both Lungs and Dropped it

[daring carbon]

It's fine Dude

[earnest elbow]

That cow must have like Kevlar hide ..... If someone has pics of a similar shot with better results I'd like to see them ....

[daring carbon]

The moose used to be Realistically tough before NEM now they are Tougher than Class 9 species....

[fair kite]

No picture but fyi if you want to try it: 45-70 single lung on moose 100m double lung on wood bison 150m

[earnest elbow]

Even a Bison shouldn't run 150m with a double lung hit ....

[fair kite]

Ah no it didn’t it was the range i shot them from

[hushed rampart]

This so far off reality....

[fair kite]

Fr lemme efficently hunt moose with the 270. Layton got so many side missions with that one too

[fair kite]

EW please make this change, you are ruining your game, and you don’t even explain why you make such a change to the ammo? What is up what that? I use to be able to use like 20 different rifles depending on the map, now i can use like 4, it gets pretty tiring and boring

[fair kite]

Throwback

[blissful sun]

please ew fix the bloody moose

[blissful sun]

there is no real need to hunt moose with a .300 mag, 7 mag, 338 mag, 375, 405 etc 30-30, 270, 308, 6.5 swede, 30-06, 7mm-08 are all optimal

[glossy path]

I’d also potentially like to add grey wolves to this, class 6 but feels like they shrug off .300 rounds sometimes, making u track forever if the shot isn’t perfect. Not ANYWHERE near as bad as moose but most people agree they shouldn’t take .300 rounds as well as they do as far as I’ve seen. This combined with how fast they flee make them a bit of a pain

[small turret]

Bump because I also find this annoying. Thank goodness someone got me the bloodhound DLC for Christmas a while ago