Balancing .338 Magnum and .300 Magnum

[willow wasp]

Basically these two cartridges need to be buffed, since the .300 Magnum actually has inferior penetration compared to the .30-06, and the .338 Magnum has the exact same penetration as the .30-06.

But it is worth remembering that the .300 Magnum in real life is at least slightly stronger than a .30-06 (more energy), and the .338 is meant to be a BEAST.
Stats are as follows:
(Stats were taken from the store/inventory stats, I am not 100% they are the real stats, but they are the best I can find)

338 Magnum
Polymer Tip: 16 Expansion, 45 Penetration.
Soft Point: 63 Expansion, 22 Penetration.

.300 Magnum
Polymer Tip: 14 Expansion, 42 Penetration.
Soft Point: 60 Expansion, 21 Penetration.

.30-06
Polymer Tip: 13 Expansion, 45 Penetration.
Soft Point: 53 Expansion, 19 Penetration.

.308
Polymer Tip: 13 Expansion, 44 Penetration.
Soft Point: 52 Expansion, 19 Penetration.

[vale panther]

I agree. Maybe the 7mm Mag needs to be buffed as well. The same value as .303 British is not balanced.

7mm Mag & .303 British
Polymer tip: 12 expansion, 40 penetration.
Soft points: 53 expansion, 20 penetration.

[willow wasp]

agree with the 7mm Magnum, but sadly I only remembered of it after already writing and sending the first message.
BTW, now that I think of it the 7.62x54r Mosin should be buffed a bit too (IIRC its stats are identical to one of the bullets of the .243, but I don't have the game open RN so I can't check it)

[late lance]

Actually, the .270 needs a buff too, it needs be roughly the same as the 7.62x54r's ammo with soft nose/hollow points and better with the polymer tipped rounds. Making it and the 6.5 a class 3-7 option would be amazing, no one uses it over the 7mm for moose even with just the base game options

[willow wasp]

well, I agree. I once used tried out the 6.5mm against moose and it completely shocked me: I would heart shot moose and they would still run around a good bit!

[timber seal]

The 270 is pretty weak and does need more penetration

[willow wasp]

but the sad reality is that MANY rifles are UNDER performing in relation to penetration (I would guess probably most of them)

[late lance]

I mean, the .270's stats are BARELY higher than the .243's. It's been in desperate need of a buff for about three years now

[hardy void]

@willow wasp I think the stats for the 338 need to be 50 pentration and 20 expansion. Wait I just saw those are the store stats my bad.

[willow wasp]

well, for the 338 I think it should be changed to between 50 and 55 penetration (although I could possibly understand it being even bumped up to 60, since this is a HUGE rifle round)

[hardy void]

Yeah. It can destroy a lightly armored vehicle like the 50bmg. I would say the 308 needs to be nerfed a tiny bit. Because the 30-06 is around 250 fps faster than the 308 in every bullet weight.

[willow wasp]

I would rather buff the 30-06 a tiny bit, because I'm a bit tired of most rifles having next to no penetration
EDIT:
But also keep in mind that just the projectile being faster does not mean that it will necessarily penetrate as much as you would expect (might not be proportional to the speed increase)

[hardy void]

Okay.

[balmy prism]

I honestly would like for the info parts of the bullets to just be gone or just have bullets weight fps and joules

[late lance]

Yes, that would be so much better

[willow wasp]

that could have the potential to be a lot more realistic, but it could be really hard to have an accurate idea of the real performance of the projectile.

Unless these exact values are directly used (or can be used) to calculate the Expansion, Penetration, and possibly also "Stopping Power" of the projectile.

[late lance]

As a buff to the .270, would anyone argue with Soft Points: 28 Expansion/ 19 Penetraition, then for Polymer tips 8 Expansion/ 40 penetration?

[willow wasp]

no clue for the Soft Point

[hardy void]

The 7.62x54R needs a buff. In real life it has the same amount of power as a 308/30-06.

That or give it polymer tipped rounds.

[willow wasp]

IRL that is the case, I would prefer to see that be the case in game. And I think it could also still receive Polymer tip ammo (and become basically an alternative to the .308)

[hardy void]

Yeah. But keep it at 3-7 class. With out it we have no rifles in class 3-7.

[late lance]

A small buff to rifles in general would absolutely improve the game, the 6.5/.270 could and SHOULD both shift to 3-7 if for no other reason than variety's sake. The .30-30 and .45-70 are so abysmally weak that it feels like there's a hard bias against them.

[willow wasp]

but the 7.62x54r would be way too overkill for class 3 if it were buffed similar to the .308

[late lance]

It's actually a very small buff this way, just enough to make them viable

[hardy void]

The 6.5 more to 2-6.

[late lance]

hoping for a 6mm to do that later on

[hardy void]

True

[late lance]

or, you know, another .243

[hardy void]

Yeah. Be more fun though to introduce some 25 caliber bullets as well

[late lance]

Like a .25-06?

[hardy void]

Yes. Or a 257 Roberts.

[celest knoll]

Honestly with 223 getting buffed, I'm hoping more guns follow especially these 2. The fact that both can't double lung a moose perfectly broadside at over 180m is just weird to me especially since both could before the power pack came out.

[main meteor]

The problem is the Moose, it's not the weapons, the .300 rifle double lungs a Gemsbok at 300mts but with the Moose it does not work the same, no weapon works properly with them

[celest knoll]

Yeah true

But we still could use a weapon/weapon class rework of some kind as the current one was updated in 2020 before alot of animals got changed/added

Also probably should've said slight pen buff and not just buff overall

[late lance]

Moose yeah, but some rifles are just broken

the .30-30 should be fine for black bear but red deer and mule deer almost shrug it off/ the .45-70 should punch right through a bison but it barely gets a lung

[sly spear]

Bump.

[late lance]

Bumping this up. The community weapon pack is giving me some vague hope fora weapon rework

[safe isle]

The biggest area of most of these cartridges needs improvement is in accuracy 338 7mag 308 30-06 should not be less accurate than 30-30. And the range of 338mag 300mag 7mag should all have increased range. All of these cartridges are effective at 1000 yds. Most cartridges should have significantly increased range.