Team Fortress 2 Megathread - winter is the most chill time of year

[unborn pecan]

new uncle poopy video

[high current]

Do you mean a way to make a script that can detect what value a conVar is set to? Or are you just looking for a way to provide the user with the value of what a conVar is set to?

[summer willow]

just want to se what is setted

[high current]

i believe if you type the command with no value it will return its setting. like inputting mat_antialias will return mat_antialias = '0' or something along those lines

[summer willow]

ah, i mean, during the gameplay

like hl speedrunners just send in the chat but in a multiplayer game... and thats why i wanted to use party but i cant

maybe theres a way to create a fake party or something

[high current]

theres a command to show console output while in game. I forget what it is, but that plus a console filter plus a bind to trigger the command would give what I think youre looking for

[summer willow]

oh

i just find it

tf_party_chat a

[kind falcon]

say party shouldve worked tho?

[summer willow]

nop

[kind falcon]

developer 1

[summer willow]

do you use scrap.tf?

[kind falcon]

no sorry im banned there

[summer willow]

why

[livid oracle]

scamming

[kind falcon]

yes i scam furries

[summer willow]

i cant craft yer :(

[livid oracle]

played a bunch of different community servers and several times i've encountered snipers that seemed suspicious

like i was almost sure they had wallhacks

but each time i just ignored it and thought that maybe i was just being too predictable

and then eventually they get banned by the server's anti cheat

i guess maybe being instantly headshot as soon as i try to peek any new angle i try is more suspicious than i thought

[livid oracle]

i realise i make it sound like this was one session this was over the course of a week idk why i encountered vastly more cheaters this week than any week before

[limpid panther]

this is the main reason I use a player tagging tool like tf2bd or roto's bd

[kind falcon]

hello kenajcrap

lets gamble money

[limpid panther]

to mark suspicious players suspicious so that I can spectate them when they are on my team

and if I confirm my suspicions I just mark them as cheaters and leave for another server

dont wanna waste more of my time than I absolutely need to in these situations

[limpid panther]

wah?

[kind falcon]

gambling

[limpid panther]

where?

[kind falcon]

uhhh

theres no #gambling-zone unfortunately

let us do hangout.

[limpid panther]

im taking a bath

will be on later today

[kind falcon]

ok ok

👍

[livid oracle]

i dont use that i just try to shoot them instead and think "damn i should try another strategy" when they magically know my position behind a wall yet again

[kind falcon]

just use hacks

u dont get banned for it ..

[livid oracle]

they got banned by ac plugins

[kind falcon]

lol noob cheat

[limpid panther]

the best part is that it keeps them marked forever, so if I join a server with them 1 year from now, I will still know who they are and that they cheat

[livid oracle]

why do you even need anything more than wallhacks its not that hard to click on tf2 guys

walls seems to be the actual biggest thing that gives cheaters an advantage

and i dont think its something that any ac can actually detect

[kind falcon]

its something that they can prevent to an extent

https://cdn.sogfulday.today/gifs/gokittygo.gif

[livid oracle]

how though

with sourcemod at least

[kind falcon]

culling

[high current]

You could maybe track how often a player hovers their crosshair over a person that isn’t currently visible, or maybe track their reaction time to people becoming visible. But you’d need a really large sample size and it’d be quirky. Like what if you’re just staring at the spawn room?

Honestly you could probably just train an ai to review an stv every so often. I feel like most walls are somewhat trivial to catch if you know common patterns.
But that’s probably more resource intensive than community server hosts are willing to use.

[spare obsidian]

https://sigwiki.potato.tf/index.php/Entity_Additions i wonder how much of these could be added to base game

[summer steeple]

a lot of these can be done relatively easily with vscript

[spare obsidian]

you can disable the mvm bomb carry effects in vscript?

[summer steeple]

i’m not sure if you can do that

granted it probably would be easier for people not familiar with vscript if these were just added to the ents, especially considering the fact that they’re already accessible to vscript

[summer willow]

nvm

[drowsy marlin]

https://vxtwitter.com/TF2Emporium/status/1725132557736366177?t=OdJ39xaIuJNvYpOx-JebFw&s=19

[craggy ridge]

This one is so col

[high current]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niO0KEKDMrU
HL1 major update👀

[kind falcon]

rule1. do not post tyler mcvicker

[high current]

then someone else make a content overview for the hl1 update

[kind falcon]

you read the letters written on the official page

[left sand]

https://half-life.com/en/halflife25/

[kind falcon]

thank you masterbombs

[high current]

did senior mcvicker do something naughty or something

[kind falcon]

he wont play fortnite with me

[high current]

well guess he gets my sub

[kind falcon]

goodbye peaches

oh wait this is the tf2 thread

https://tenor.com/view/tf2-soldier-falling-team-fortress-2-gif-4930346012844765886

[livid oracle]

no people just think he's annoying

which is fair

[high current]

oh i dont disagree with that. i just thought it was neat there was an hl1 update

hes many things but the quickest to report on anything volvo, he usually is

[radiant merlin]

i just don't get it. how updating hl1 was really necessary to spend 2 months for no profit but tf2, a popular game in media and, if done right, very profitable, doesn't get any minimal support to at least make some balance changes to 2-3 weapons?

[kind falcon]

itll happen on the 20th anniversary

[summer steeple]

cause valve works in mysterious ways

[jagged pawn]

it's truly not complicated, they care about half life

[radiant merlin]

the only reason of this move i can think of is hl3

[formal dew]

not wanting to work on something and not caring are different things

[small siren]

*not wanting to work

on something and not caring

are different things*

- borealis64

[formal dew]

tho i do vaguely recall something about valve devs not liking tf2 because of its humor

[summer steeple]

cause its a big anniversary thats literally it

[formal dew]

tf2 will remain stable and playable in 2035

half life 1 wouldnt

presumably

[high current]

The fact they updated the default settings for the game was interesting. Maybe they finally update TF2's default fov in 2027?

Other than that my opinion is HL is overrated. But neat something happened

HL can stand for half life or highlander

[kind falcon]

if you had to choose between hldm and highlander

you would pick highlander because you play team fortress

[high current]

I've never played hldm so probably highlander

so yeh you predicted that right

[kind falcon]

exploding head

[high current]

but if i had to choose between highlander and huffing vinegar, id choose the latter

[radiant merlin]

lol

[summer willow]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6MwT1uEtHA

for one moment i thought that was a brazilian map

but also has brazilians making the map, which is cool

MDS

i didnt even notice that the map is about corruption with gold from south america

needs to be in the game.

[high current]

I see someone credited for optimization, they have my support.

Holup there’s a dog on the map?!? Valve add this

[kind falcon]

whats updog?

[next nymph]

https://updogchallenge.com/

there you go

[glass musk]

is trading with this guy safe?

I just want to make sure there's not some Steam exploit that lets people use fake items in trade offers or something

[left sand]

i am not aware of any trade exploit like that, but i would say it's suspicious that a limited account has anything of value in the inventory

it's probably a burner account, if possible you can view the trade history for the item and view the real account

[glass musk]

I'm selling australium black box

[glass musk]

yeah

alright I got the keys

[left sand]

is that rocket launcher really only 18 keys?

damn

[summer steeple]

apparently yes

[unborn pecan]

lol black box moment

that's still like

45 bucks

for a digital item

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/903841969745313863.webp?size=48&name=Smile&quality=lossless

what a steal am i right

[kind falcon]

maybe because black box sucks .

[high current]

Tbh $45 for a weapon skin is pretty standard in games these days. I think that’s similar to the average price of valorant skins.
Overpriced? Sure. But people pay it.

Also iirc keys are usually around $2 in value in the trading market, so it’s closer to around $35-40

[kind falcon]

valorant skins are comical

[crisp cedar]

valorant dragon weapon

[high current]

Nice thing about cosmetics is you don’t have to buy them

[next nymph]

this is false, you do

[high current]

I mean with my level of self control and adhd, pretty much

[craggy ridge]

Who out there thought it was a good idea to name a map cp_hardwood

[high current]

Who thinks it’s a bad idea?

[kind falcon]

pudding does

[high current]

For why

It’s a classification of tree and the wood produced by it. Such as oak and frequently misattributed to cedar

[paper sluice]

extendfreeze got patched https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/831369737186967602.webp?size=48&name=cryaboutit~1&quality=lossless

[potent wolf]

uhhh, that was awhile ago

[paper sluice]

i havent played in awhile

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1129135343103389768.webp?size=48&name=IDK&quality=lossless

is this ping spoofing
it was like 7-8 earlier

[kind falcon]

normal for source games

[paper sluice]

awesome

[summer willow]

what m_filter does in source games?

[mystic turtle]

ragdolls are gold

[kind falcon]

flat textures AND has hud playermodel turned on AND has ragdolls on

[mystic turtle]

you can say I have oddball tastes

[high current]

flat textures are just an aesthetic preference.

I prefer it but if you play projectile classes it makes depth judgement difficult

[grim parcel]

i just shoot red or blue personally

[kind falcon]

https://tenor.com/view/pills-drugs-medicine-blue-pill-red-pill-gif-12463860

fent or fent?

[grim parcel]

i’m literally keanu reeves bro fent all the way

[kind falcon]

https://tenor.com/view/buttsmarnn-gif-26886407

i am literally ryan gosling the way i am j

[grim parcel]

remember talon, you are always kenough

love you bro

[kind falcon]

men kissing gif

[grim parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/kiss-love-is-love-sexy-time-gay-boy-time-gif-17362277

[kind falcon]

bros look like justin tiemblerkae

[fleet kite]

On the price of tf2 skins:
Spending money on game cosmetics is stupid, but at least TF2's prices are dictated by supply and demand, rather than being an arbitrary fixed price

[jagged pawn]

I mean that's still arbitrary

like it's fictional supply, it's not like it takes any actual labor to "create" more supply

so like yes it simulates a real market better but that doesn't make it not arbitrary

[kind falcon]

bla bla words

[stuck locust]

enables/disables mouse filtering

smoothes out mouse movement over frames or something along those lines

[radiant merlin]

.

[limpid panther]

congratulations

[jagged pawn]

?

[unborn pecan]

I installed tf2 on windows

🫡 forgot about alt+tabing, and immediatly did it

😭

[hoary geyser]

Hm? Alt-tabbing works fine for me

[unborn pecan]

https://tenor.com/bEmG6.gif

[potent wolf]

works on my machine

[left sand]

use borderless

[unborn pecan]

alright

do I have to right click on the hl2.exe to do that? cause in tf2 settings, I just see full screen and run in window

[hoary geyser]

yeah I have the master copy of TF2

[hoary geyser]

oh that's probably why it works for for me

[kind falcon]

launch options

-sw -borderles s

[unborn pecan]

oh word

thx

[kind falcon]

no problem

good job on your recovery from the linux illness

[crisp cedar]

does anyone have that video of b4nny trying to kill a medic all the time and he keeps fucking up

[unborn pecan]

nah I just wanna have tf2 on windows

[unborn pecan]

average b4nny moment

[crisp cedar]

i think its captioned by "steps on something, please dont be dogshit, the shoe:"

[small siren]

*i think its captioned

by "steps on something, please dont

be dogshit, the shoe:"*

- rayningforests

[left sand]

@unborn pecan -noborder in launch options then select run in a window

[unborn pecan]

thank u

would running borderless affect freesync in anyway? Cause if I remember, at least on linux, you need an actual fullscreen to do freesync

[livid oracle]

isnt there is no "actual fullscreen" for linux afaik

[small siren]

*isnt there is no

"actual fullscreen" for linux

afaik*

- crawl space

[livid oracle]

at most it toggles the compositor off while the game is in focus

[unborn pecan]

no pretty sure xorg and wayland both have real fullscreen options

[unborn pecan]

that is a KDE thing

[livid oracle]

huh ive never had a game that i couldn't instantly alt tab in and out of on xfce and gnome even when theyre set to exclusive fullscreen

[unborn pecan]

Only times fullscreen alt+tabing is weird on linux is whenever the game is loading

besides that, it is perfect

but on Wayland, running an xorg app on fullscreen has no problems

with alt+tabbing

[livid oracle]

btw on xfce it doesnt turn your compositor off you have to do it manually

its fucked up

[unborn pecan]

yeah

I made a keybind to do it

for me

[kind falcon]

Whaaat… I am a noob

[radiant merlin]

sad that after all these years valve didn't add a borderless windowed in the options

[unborn pecan]

@paper sluice https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/VTFEdit_Reloaded did u make this?

omg u did

🤯

linux release when

[paper sluice]

Not really but kinda ⛄️

[unborn pecan]

🫡 check your issues

[paper sluice]

Joshua Ashton really did all the work I just forked it, he’s the valve contractor guy
I just did minimal edits and released it on gamebanana

[unborn pecan]

swag

[livid oracle]

stolen

[paper sluice]

Yeah

[drowsy marlin]

How come tf2 alt tabs fine, but l4d2 throws a hissy fit when I tab in and out of that game?

Windows 10 btw

[kind falcon]

What are your tf2 launch options.

[drowsy marlin]

I forgor but it's probably whatever is recommended my mastercomfig

*by

Does that have something to do with it?

[formal dew]

the only source game i had slow alt tabbing with was csgo

[fleet kite]

I'll have you know, crying over getting another worthless hat from an unbox is a lot of work

[limpid panther]

that was the 40000th message in this chat

how do you feel having made this achievement?

[jagged pawn]

oh huge

I'm going to universal studios hollywood!

[drowsy marlin]

guys quick

how do I enable low violence in TF2

[crisp cedar]

put this in launch options
-sillygibs +violence_ablood 0 +violence_agibs 0 +violence_hblood 0 +violence_hgibs 0

or just equip pyrovision

[paper sluice]

Or if you’re using mastercomfig use the module

[drowsy marlin]

Ty

[left sand]

will anyone write the guide for fixing tcmalloc crashes on linux?

[small siren]

*will anyone write

the guide for fixing tcmalloc

crashes on linux?*

- mcoms

[radiant merlin]

most commented issue after the vscript one

[summer willow]

just saw that bazzite is telling to use libtcmalloc_and_profiler.so.4 which weird

[paper sluice]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3094412870

This is so

Curse

It’s cool but I don’t know what to feel

[limpid panther]

are these something new? no idea what you are taking about, but I haven't played in a few weeks

[jagged pawn]

it's so weird

like it's well made but

it's

wrong

[paper sluice]

@left sand what was that one video with the Andrew rate thumbnail and it was of a tf2 cheater

How 2 cheat or whatever

https://youtu.be/RHD7JLnAsA8?si=ikA7IPVTqPLiOTFF

Found it

[hoary geyser]

Andrew Rate

[radiant merlin]

i saw that before. sometimes you can't tell if a cheater is trying to be obvious or legit lol

[livid oracle]

that part at 4:43 holy shit

why

[summer willow]

https://gamebanana.com/mods/481234

i really liked

[molten compass]

question is how to reproduce it?

well ill look into it soon™️

[crisp cedar]

the funny has arrived

[unborn pecan]

All I do is just use a libtcmalloc_minimal.so from my system

[livid oracle]

i just run tf2 through a script that auto deletes the FAKE tcmalloc lib that tf2 comes with

[livid oracle]

wtf is thjis

[summer steeple]

i'm guessing quake code

oh its not

[left sand]

looks like unreal engine tf2 recreation or source engine code

[left sand]

where is this called?

[livid oracle]

actually it's from mastercomfig/tf2-patches/blob/changes/src/game/shared/tf2/tf_gamemovement.cpp

[next nymph]

this will calculate the gravity adjustment, based on a wished direction vector. It uses a hardcoded table based on various different values of the delta of the z position, compared against hardcoded thresholds. Most set the modifier to a specific value but at least one case is linear based on z position delta

[summer steeple]

did you feed this into chatGPT

[spare obsidian]

this is mostly used for the cut jetpack mechanic see in asteroid's outher space

[livid oracle]

this is true

[potent wolf]

jargpt, actually

[summer willow]

damn

[summer steeple]

big hud

[formal dew]

tf2 25th anniversary hud

[summer willow]

private branch when

[summer steeple]

i'm trying to figure out if fov is 90 in this image or not

like it feels zoomed it but idk if its just the hud

[summer willow]

its fov 90 but the viewmodel fov is 54 because is better

but also the hud

[summer steeple]

true, I do play with high viewmodel fov + min viewmodels

idk why, I just like seeing arms

[summer willow]

higher viewmodel fov kinda feels better but still with the problem that i have with viewmodel in tf2

[summer steeple]

what is that problem?

[summer willow]

is not very good to see things basically, is kinda viewmodel + animations but idk what would be better

[paper sluice]

viewmodel fov 84 min viewmodels is my perfect combo
feels better and my guns dont cover the screen or feel 50 feet away from me

[summer willow]

i dont like min viewmodel but i use sometimes just because its really hard to see

like with direct hit

[cursive peak]

Higher viewmodel FOV looks closer to what you'd see if you were to actually hold the weapons like the mercs in real life.

[next nymph]

to be honest its pretty far off either way. Like look at medic:

• world model holds medigun at hip level
• viewmodel looks like its coming from his shoulder

[cursive peak]

Just saying, it's way closer with higher FOVs. At the default FOV, it's like you've got your sticky launcher resting against your cheek.

[left sand]

the default fov was actually chosen very specifically

[small siren]

*the default fov was

actually chosen very

specifically*

- mcoms

[left sand]

so youre wrong

[cursive peak]

I still think the positioning looks wrong.

[grim parcel]

"use windows"

[cursive peak]

Like, try holding that so you get that exact same view in your vision.

[small siren]

*Like, try holding that

so you get that exact same

view in your vision.*

- steamworks

[livid oracle]

just use minmode

[summer willow]

cl_first_person_uses_world_model 1

this is so weird

[cursive peak]

That pretty much sums up my point about the different viewmodel FOVs.

[grim parcel]

minmode + a specific bind to disable viewmodels only on the black box is the real setup

[kind falcon]

black box vom

[high current]

Do they mean like 35mm film? If so that has nothing to do with fov. If they mean 35mm lens then 42mm is generally considered the most naturally looking lens length on full size sensors. It's also what a majority of shots in professional films use, despite being a kinda weird lens length outside of pro-cinematography

[high current]

Is this the hud someone made for the steam deck?

[summer willow]

yeah

idk if is good and also i like how it uses min mode as desktop mode

instead of just using min mode as steam deck mode

and desktop mode being the normal and you dont need to do anything

[drowsy marlin]

Anyone who doesn't use 90 FOV is a noob.

[radiant merlin]

finally some tech admin managed to fix the 503 errors in the wiki

for now, for that indonesian bot hoster, rip bozo 😂

[summer willow]

i saw this and im confused

[next nymph]

tf2 people echoing things without understanding what's happening (folders are case sensitive on linux but insensitive on windows, thats the main difference)

[craggy ridge]

fuckkkkk

i lost my config

oh man is that annoying

[summer steeple]

simply get mastercomfig, free cheat config for team fortress 2

[unborn pecan]

so basically

for folders to work on linux

you need everything in the mod to be lowercase and have no spaces

some mod creaters of windows use upercase names for the files, directories, etc

it's lame

if u download a vpk, and it doesn't work

try setting its name to be lowercase without spaces

[potent wolf]

fiendhook best hacks for tf2 working 2023 real

[summer steeple]

free VAC and YOU KNOW

[hoary geyser]

fiend how's the progress on fiendhook v13 going?

[summer steeple]

cancelled (never existed)

[high current]

For things like huds where you can create the file and the filepath, it doesn’t necessarily need to be lowercase, it just needs to be the filepath verbatim, case sensitivity in mind.
So if you had a hud file with #base MyCoolStuff.res, a Linux computer will still look for MyCoolStuff.res even though its upper case in places

[summer willow]

yea i know

was thinking in a script and a utility scripts for tf2 mods that includes "clean vpk", because to every mod i manually rename

i hate that mods ships with sound/sound.cache

and even in .vpk that just gets ignored and makes a ugly file .vpk.sound.cache

[unborn pecan]

me too

[high current]

Mod creators not deleting their sound.cache file before their upload should be punishable by huffing vinegar

[unborn pecan]

🫡 word

[summer willow]

also i was thinking in a way to do priority in mods because i dont have a clue how tf2 works

the only problem is that i dont like using 2 vpk programs, 1 to extract and other to create when the one to create should extract but doesnt work

mostly doesnt have a problem but idk if maybe there is a difference extracting between tools

i mean, who knows

[unborn pecan]

I use gcfscape to extract vpks

and the built in source engine vpk tool to create them

on linux you gotta do some LD_LIBRARY shenagins to get it to work

[summer willow]

is not ideal to use gcfscape in a script and theres also wine in the middle

[unborn pecan]

I don't know how well the vpk tool works for creating vpks

let me try

[summer willow]

tbf, i tested sometime ago using gcfscape, vpk (python) and vpkedit to extract and they seems to extract everything exactly the same

but creating vpk is different

[unborn pecan]

wdym by vpk (python)

[summer willow]

https://github.com/ValvePython/vpk

[unborn pecan]

I found this

https://github.com/panzi/unvpk

never heard of vpkedit

gotta check that out

[summer willow]

https://github.com/panzi/rust-vpk/

[unborn pecan]

🤯

is rust-vpk newer than unvpk?

[unborn pecan]

cool

[summer willow]

is kinda gcfscape and seems to work and getting update, i have issues on wayland and idk how to solves

https://github.com/craftablescience/VPKEdit

[unborn pecan]

I am gonna try vpkedit rn

compiling it

Seems like it compiles libvtflib as a shared library

might wanna make that a static lib

https://github.com/StrataSource/VTFLib

vpkedit uses this vtflib

I use this https://github.com/panzi/VTFLib to package vtflib on aur

looks like I'mma change it now

[summer willow]

what is strata source

[potent wolf]

effectively a community branch of the source engine, used in momentum mod, p2ce, and a few other games

[summer willow]

1 game and 1 mod that will never come out

[unborn pecan]

lol

[summer willow]

but i didnt know that momentum mod used source

[unborn pecan]

i mean

[spare obsidian]

TF2 community user moment

[unborn pecan]

momentum mod is about source engine movement

[summer willow]

i thought that was using other engine but recreating tf2 movement and that will also have other implementations of others game movements etc

[potent wolf]

it's the actual movement code afaik

[unborn pecan]

just look at source engine code to do the movement in like

unreal or unity

[potent wolf]

except for tf|2 (the better one)

[unborn pecan]

fard f 2

[potent wolf]

https://store.steampowered.com/app/601360/Portal_Revolution/ oh cool it's planned for jan 5

[unborn pecan]

oh cool

wasn't there another portal mod

where it's like

recreating it with hdr

pbr

etc

[spare obsidian]

the one that josh helped to add full dynamic ligthing?

[unborn pecan]

i forgot the name

[summer willow]

when i saw about the portal revolution i thought that was this game

[unborn pecan]

Portal 2 Desolation

[summer willow]

but i dont remember the name

[potent wolf]

ooooh yeah that game

[unborn pecan]

https://emberspark.games/desolation/

[potent wolf]

forgot it existed :P

[unborn pecan]

https://emberspark.games/desolation/news/jan2023/

latest news

from jan2023

[summer willow]

🙏

[unborn pecan]

looks cool

guys

is it just me

or

WHenever I click on the page for portal revolution, it ain't loading

Loads in a priavte steam tab

But not whenever I am logged in

🤔

weird

can game devs block people from viewing a page?

[potent wolf]

yeah they banned your steam account specifically

[unborn pecan]

😭

[spare obsidian]

what did you do?

[unborn pecan]

idk

I never knew about this project

I need to play some portal mods

theya re so cool

https://www.moddb.com/mods/draw-me-a-world

this is one of my favorite mods

[summer willow]

never saw this

[unborn pecan]

mod.db has some esoteric stuff

[unborn pecan]

hey

I think I am going to write MIME support for vpkedit

so you can auto open programs with vpkedit

so I can replace gcfscape on my system

and never have to use wine again

[summer willow]

nice

[unborn pecan]

🫡 making MIMEs are so hard

I had to create a source xml file listing the file types, comments, icon, and pattern to look for in a file

then I had to edit the .desktop file of vpkedit to be associated with that mimetype, and ot be able to take arguments in the Exec line

and had to give the .vpk files an icon

but now, you can just double click on a vpk and it opens up vpkedit

[potent wolf]

nice!

are you going to make the changes public?

[unborn pecan]

i mean

I did all of this in my PKGBUILD

I could make a pull request

but I don't know how to do anything cmake related

https://aur.archlinux.org/cgit/aur.git/tree/PKGBUILD?h=vpkedit-git

look at the package()

way superior package to vpkedit-bin

[summer willow]

gonna try

[radiant merlin]

lol

[jagged pawn]

NOOOOOOO

JESSE YOU DON'T HAVE TO GO INTO YOUR BIOS

[summer willow]

man i really prefer the csd of qt applications

i dont want ssd with gnome fat titlebar with nothing related

[cursive peak]

They even go for comanglia's config before mastercomfig.

[livid oracle]

stuff inside a vpk is case-sensitive right

[potent wolf]

i'd imagine it's not (to mirror windows), but i don't remember

[unborn pecan]

yup

[unborn pecan]

gnome csds suck

[unborn pecan]

you can make folders insensitive on linux actually

also _jakez

if you are on arch use my aur vpkedit

[summer willow]

no i mean ssd with gnome title bar

i like csd

[unborn pecan]

do you mean like

libadwaita CSDs?

[summer willow]

i guess?

[unborn pecan]

yeah they are so fat

[summer willow]

im using your aur with distrobox

if i try to use the build from the github it doesnt shows decorations

[unborn pecan]

oh word

The Cmake install they use is stupid

they copy over the qt6 libs into the install folder

on my AUR package, I remove that, and just have it use the actual system libraries

Also, do you see how ever vpk file has an icon and can be double clicked now?

like this

[summer willow]

well no, but i guess is because of im using distrobox

[unborn pecan]

😭

in my PKGBUILD I hacked in mime for vpk

you have to create a mime file, add the mimetype to the .desktop, and create a mimetype icon

I might make a pull request officially getting in mime support

[summer willow]

make it

[summer willow]

i heard about with valve doing something related to this, i see as a feature being sensitive but is something you could always do?

[heavy solar]

@summer willow has leveled up! (34 ➜ 35)

[summer willow]

so much pain

[potent wolf]

iirc its a flag you can set in ext4 for folders, but its intended to be used to improve performance when dealing with programs that expect case-insensitive paths to work (mainly windows apps running under wine/proton)

[summer willow]

hmm i guess i saw valve doing this for btrfs

[potent wolf]

i think there was a talk at fosdem about it but i cant be bothered to look rn

[unborn pecan]

use arch

[grim parcel]

tf2 custom folders love this one simple trick:
for file in tf/custom/*.vpk; do [ -f "$file" ] && mv "$file" ${file,,}; done

[paper sluice]

ir solder my bleoved

[summer willow]

doesnt work for me but what is this supposed to do?

[grim parcel]

make all vpks lowercase

[fleet kite]

Why does mcoms torture us with dreams 😭

[drowsy marlin]

Team Fortress 2: The Last Stand update

[unborn pecan]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/497774656594509836/1136078280848592927/1115272338875879494.gif

[drowsy marlin]

Valve accepts this and the community is still confused on why it isn't the Heavy update

[jagged pawn]

extremely tangential question but what do you use for web design? I've tried a lot of the like template-y sites (squarespace, wordpress.com, wix, etc) but they're all so ass

[left sand]

html

[jagged pawn]

ok sure but like is that it

[summer steeple]

i mean all template sites are is easy to use collections of html and css

[jagged pawn]

right yeah but I guess I'm asking if this is from scratch

[left sand]

yes

using astro, and bootstrap

[jagged pawn]

I see

ty

[burnt dragon]

I was thinking, cant we mail eric together?

[jagged pawn]

do not do that

[burnt dragon]

that would kinda be spam but if we sign a petition

and then send it thru mcoms

maybe he cab relay that to valve for extra support for one last update to tf2

adding everything mcoms suggests

and made

https://comfig.app/update/

this page has SO MUCH stuff that irritated me over my general playtime, fixing all of those issues would be so perfect

[jagged pawn]

can you tell valve to make this real

[unborn pecan]

Printing this out, taping it to a brick, and chucking it through valve's windows as we speak

[mystic turtle]

Just saw the mock update page
If it actually happened, I'd love to see the firestorm of MvM pyro mains lose their shit over not being able to phlogcancel
Oh, and the engies who use eureka binds as a crutch

and loadout changes only being applied on touching a locker or respawning, blocking a trick also used by engies for convenience
IIRC they also added that to TC2, right?

[jagged pawn]

the locker thing? I don't think so, that would probably be a very controversial change and she tends to avoid those

that's not just an engi thing it's useful for pretty much everyone

[mystic turtle]

hm, I see
IDK, always associated that tech with engie due to his need to resupply more often

altho I can see it used for things like escaping a team trying to spawncamp

[glass musk]

lol a lot of people would be mad

[high current]

Also I got a chuckle out of the fact that someone managed to figure out that reflected rescue range bolts don’t heal friendly buildings, and the thought of someone doing Goliath brain pybro strats to heal their team’s building.

[left sand]

@high current yes thats correct, but there are many more private versions of that exploit which show enemy information

[high current]

Oh interesting. I wonder why the RGL rules haven’t been updated to restrict those exploits.
Do you just sv_cheat restrict the spooky hud command?

[left sand]

yes

[high current]

Neat!

[summer willow]

what is the spooky hud command?

theres was some response from valve about the patches of tc2?

[cursive peak]

I don't see that mentioned anywhere.

[summer willow]

its with mat and antialiasing?

idk xd

[high current]

No it’s not. Without going into too much detail, it’s a command presumably intended for debugging. But well-intentioned hud devs realized it could be used to display neat information about their team. And apparently less well-intentioned people realized it could display information about the enemy team, which gives an unfair advantage.

[summer willow]

hmmm

[high current]

And to my tangential frustration, it falls under RGL’s cheat/exploit rule section of “if we don’t explicitly say something is allowed, then use it at your own risk”.
Which is not a statement I think an anticheat team should make, but🤷‍♂️

Frustrating because the well-intentioned use of it is genuinely really cool, but you could maybe be punished for it unknowingly. But also they aren’t explicitly banning the malicious use of it, so people can use it and get a slap on the wrist for not knowing.

[craggy ridge]

I mean my pitch black skyboxes and solid color playermodels

Orwell

At least i can probably get unbanned from uncletopia now

[next nymph]

i get that its tough, its impossible to really know everything and tf2 is in a weird spot where some stuff is valid (ie. hud modding) but others arent (ie. pure bypasses) but the line can be blurry too (ie. scope removal)

its just not in the cards to have an exact formal criteria because you cant really

[high current]

I get that. I think the issue is with the wording of it. It comes across as “we don’t care to look into things, but if we ban you then we ban you”. I know that’s probably not what it means and I’m sure you could have a conversation with an admin about the circumstances if they put you under investigation, but the wording seems apathetic to me.

Also the specific exploit with the “spooky hud command” was commented on by an RGL anticheat admin on TFTV a year or more ago when the neat well-intentioned implementation was shown off. So they’ve known about it for multiple revisions of the rule book, and just haven’t updated it.

Their unofficial ruling on the tftv thread was something along the lines of “hud modifications that provide an advantage that can’t be obtained without hud modification aren’t allowed”. Which sounded vague enough to go into the rule book to be a bit more narrow than “not explicitly allowed”. But it also didn’t actually apply to the exploit in question since you CAN do it on default hud.

[livid oracle]

we

[left sand]

hm?

[radiant merlin]

[left sand]

???

[radiant merlin]

forget about it

https://github.com/ValveSoftware/Source-1-Games/issues/5102

[summer steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/fresh-prince-we-will-smith-theres-no-we-shocked-gif-17214689

[radiant merlin]

@mcoms can you look if the proxy "InvulnLevel" is hardcoded or smth?

[summer steeple]

hardcoded in what way

@radiant merlin

[radiant merlin]

you can't change the proxy

in the vmt files

i mean it doesn't do anything

[summer steeple]

it looks like its just setup to return 0 or 1 depending on if the player has uber or not

returns as a float i guess so that you can use it for opacity

[radiant merlin]

mmm i guess we aren't supposed to change it in the vmt files i guess

i would like to remove the uber effect for weapons

[summer steeple]

i don't even see that proxy in the weapon vmts i'm looking at

granted i'm only looking at a few

yeah looks hardcoded

[radiant merlin]

is there any extensive list of all the bugs/exploits tf2 has?

[potent wolf]

the source bug tracker ig?

[radiant merlin]

not extensive enough

[left sand]

the source code

[summer willow]

a

[unborn pecan]

erm

is christmas out?

[jagged pawn]

no new maps but the old ones are back ye

[summer willow]

waiting for prophunt

[jagged pawn]

same

[crisp cedar]

wutville's #1 fan (i follow 13 thirteens on twitter)

[drowsy marlin]

I can't wait for prophunt! TF2 IS Gmod!

[high current]

why is the V in SnowVille capitalized?

[crisp cedar]

yeah thats a bit weird, they should edit wutvilles name to WutVille so it doesnt look weird

[high current]

where is WhenvillE though?

[drowsy marlin]

Whenville?

[high current]

whoville > whatville > whenville > whereville > whyville

[potent wolf]

howville

[next nymph]

whomville?

[crisp cedar]

whomstdveville

[tacit flare]

wtfville

[summer willow]

wutville runs terrible

[burnt dragon]

I am not sure where to ask this issue about tc2

so I will carry the issue here

https://polarite.with-your.mom/hl2_ULXKRnNHit.jpg

I get these Xes every time I shoot
is that normal?
I especially took another screenshot in singleplayer

I think it happens in hitscan weapons only?

[potent wolf]

it's a tc2-side thing, wait for a fix

#cafe☕ message same issue (i fixed it by raising the particle string table bits by 1)

[burnt dragon]

cant see :3

[potent wolf]

[burnt dragon]

yes mx replay o7

[burnt dragon]

[cursive peak]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7h3bE79eBfk

I remember watching #10 as it happened.

[cursive peak]

It's now seasonally appropriate for this song. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QF0ACRyNDbM

[summer willow]

theres something that fixes the viewmodel when using higher fov?

[potent wolf]

fiend some custom viewmodel animations that support it

[summer steeple]

didn't skyrym make a mod for this

@paper sluice

[paper sluice]

yes

https://gamebanana.com/mods/285109

[summer willow]

damn, nice

ah but doesnt work in casual?

[jagged pawn]

yeah most mods don't

just use fov 70 and min viewmodels

[summer willow]

hmmm

but why doesnt work

[summer willow]

wutville is just insane wtf is this

[left sand]

https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/March_5,_2009_Patch
https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/March_6,_2009_Patch

apparently one of these 2 patches made it so you cant extinguish yourself when crouching in water in 2fort sewers by the stairs

[summer willow]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EqxdAK2Spq0

video starts with chimarrão

i never drank chimarrão

[limpid panther]

me neither

but I did drink Tererê

which was terrible

[left sand]

https://www.youtube.com/clip/Ugkx_I7H7DMyySfmbHCVJ6K9Ibo-i8YOk3jt

[paper sluice]

The children yearn for rage comics

[hoary geyser]

I said no such thing

[next nymph]

on 11/03/2023 you attempted to do so but fortunately they were blocked

[crisp cedar]

🫢

punishment: superglue

[high current]

It's funny because the vod has 6666 views

[left sand]

are there any videos like solarlights demoknight video

for like another class or subclass

where it goes in depth into the mechanics and bugs and everything

[small siren]

*where it goes in depth

into the mechanics and

bugs and everything*

- mcoms

[jagged pawn]

I mean there aren't really any other subclasses

[radiant merlin]

battle engi

uncle dane

[limpid panther]

uncle dane actively explains and has multiple videos just about how fun and cool being able to teleport to base without having fully deployed the eureka effect is

[unborn pecan]

uncle dane did some stuff

with different engineer playstyles/subclass

[summer steeple]

I think maybe uncle dane did some stuff idk

[livid oracle]

i remember when solarlight told me about the 128-unit range thing

i really thought it cant be fucking real until i tested it and it is real

valve really thought demoknight should have 128-unit range while charging

@left sand you should fix it in tc2 so it applies throughout the whole charge

[radiant merlin]

i would fix it

then nerf it

[high current]

I think there are old spy videos kinda like that. But now spy videos are just about how you should use cl_interp 0

[summer willow]

what is stopping source 1 games, or tf2, of having wayland support?
because you can use newer versions of sdl2 and works, what in the game on the way they implemented that doesnt works? i heard that sdl2 has problems with wayland and sdl3 should be better but even cs2 that uses sdl3 doesnt currently support wayland

im being a idiot, probably, but for games you doesnt have much to do with all that, and mainly when you use something that does everything for you for all plataforms and backends, right?

[potent wolf]

fish: command substitutions not allowed here
unfortunate

[summer willow]

fish ❤️

also kid named systemd-oomd

[unborn pecan]

maybe tf2 calls something x11

indirectly or directly

[summer willow]

someone that knows about it?

[unborn pecan]

@lean cove maybe

I think somebody here did something with wayland on linux with tc2?

also, I've run tf2 on wayland before

a few times

a while back

[drowsy marlin]

What is wayland?

[glass pollen]

TF2 works on Wayland with no problems for me

On Nvidia no less

*With an up to date SDL2 so

[summer willow]

i just spent 10 minutes on wutville spawncamping the last blue team spawn at 30 fps

very cool map

[cursive peak]

And yet people jerk off to it being the greatest so hard their junk catches fire.

[distant mango]

Nothing, I have been using my system's version of SDL2 and it can do Wayland natively just fine, it just has some crashing issues but that is more likely related to KDE

[summer willow]

oh

hmmmm

i tried one time and i could launch but unplayable because weird bugs

now if i tried theres no window

could be nvidia issue??? idk

but what about cs2 with sdl3

[potent wolf]

that's a different engine, probably different issues

[summer willow]

ok

[lean cove]

there's 2 simple issues iirc, I think they fixed them in portal 2 of all games

one is related to transparency which I never bothered to actually fix

the second is they depend on an x11 feature, except they have a check to disable it when it's unsupported, but that check is only enabled on macos builds

enabling that check on linux makes it work normally

nvm i guess they at least fixed the first according to guy above

[unborn pecan]

Wayland is protocol for display stuff on linux

[drowsy marlin]

So like a desktop renderer?

[potent wolf]

It's a protocol that applications use to talk to a "compositor", which is responsible for rendering windows onto your screen

[drowsy marlin]

Is it a new thing?

[potent wolf]

relatively new

[paper sluice]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/843376491056070657/1180247491132792892/1000000_Loophole.mp4

[drowsy marlin]

So is it fast and performant? Who developed it

[potent wolf]

It's intended to replace X11, which is another (older) protocol that effectively does the same job, but has a ton of legacy code and security problems

[summer willow]

so yeah, when i tried seems to have some very weird issues with that, but now, with nvidia drivers, doesnt seems to render anything anymore

[potent wolf]

can't say much about performance since it's not an application, it's a protocol. but in my experience using the sway compositor, performance is pretty good.

it'll eventually replace X, just give them another 200 years

[summer willow]

basically everyone that is working with linux desktop has being helping and developing wayland

[drowsy marlin]

Ohhhh

So it's like the old one but new and shiny, and with security updates?

[summer willow]

i remember seeing that wayland compositors uses 3d acceleration and can use vulkan but im probably wrong but overall it should be better

[potent wolf]

pretty much

[drowsy marlin]

So because it's open source, it'll take forever to get anywhere?

[summer willow]

its completely different because one was made before linux was even a thing and how computer works today but they have the same job of displaying things on your monitor

[potent wolf]

pretty much

[summer willow]

maybe

[drowsy marlin]

Linux should get more funding.

Wait so what does this have to do with tf2? I want to talk about tf2

[potent wolf]

alright, time to talk about weapon balance for the 50 thousandth time 🫡

[drowsy marlin]

I heavy should get a buff

And pyro should have 200hp

[summer willow]

older games and applications doesnt support wayland and maybe never will, you can still play with xwayland but you will not have some features
but because tf2 uses sdl2, an open source library for displaying things, you can use an updated version that supports wayland but the games does little things that has some problems and also nvidia drivers issues

[drowsy marlin]

Oh and nerf rockets and sticky launchers blast radius

[potent wolf]

they should remove sentries from the game

[drowsy marlin]

Sentries are fine

[potent wolf]

no they suck >:(

[drowsy marlin]

Nerf wrangler and rescue ranger

[paper sluice]

remove sniper

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1129173575971127429.webp?size=48&name=Troll_Seal~1&quality=lossless

[drowsy marlin]

Without sentries, engineer sucks

[potent wolf]

good

[drowsy marlin]

Sniper is balanced, but not fun to play against

[paper sluice]

oh are we talking actual balance

[drowsy marlin]

Idk

[summer willow]

i disagree

[potent wolf]

oh no

[paper sluice]

nerf snipers rifle ammo count

to 10 or 8

[summer willow]

for every class in this game you just cant do the same thing and expecting different results

[paper sluice]

best nerf

[drowsy marlin]

Ngl people who complain about sniper have a skill issue

[small siren]

*Ngl people

who complain about sniper

have a skill issue*

- fraklin

[drowsy marlin]

Play faster

I played tf2 for over 7,000 hours. I know what I am talking about. I know what's best for the game.

[summer willow]

i dont think ammo is that a big deal that would make a change

[paper sluice]

it could
sniper would have to move from the sightline
or choose sightlines with ammo

or stick to a dispenser

[paper sluice]

or would have to be more mobile rather than stick to a spot

[drowsy marlin]

If a sniper is sitting in the same spot and shot more than 10 bullets, that's a massive skill issue

[summer willow]

well, yeah

some maps are pretty generous and others not so much

[paper sluice]

not all bullets have to hit for a shot to be used

[drowsy marlin]

Like if sniper had 5 bullets, people would still complain about them

[paper sluice]

just punishes not hitting shots

[small siren]

*Like if sniper had

5 bullets, people would still

complain about them*

- fraklin

[paper sluice]

valve did the same for the awp in csgo and i like it

[drowsy marlin]

What's csgo

[paper sluice]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/907131684447735838.webp?size=48&name=murder&quality=lossless

[drowsy marlin]

Let's only talk about games we can play here

[summer willow]

in cs works

maybe

only 10 bullets is very little but with a clip that you need to reload maybe change a little?

[drowsy marlin]

I would lower snipers max health to 100

Super weak to spam, and 99% of the time will die to other snipers in one hit

[paper sluice]

no

[drowsy marlin]

Yes.

[summer willow]

but thats no really does much for the problem that has with sniper

[drowsy marlin]

Huh?

[summer willow]

i mean, the health and ammo isnt the issue

[paper sluice]

Ammo helps the issues indirectly as to avoid changing how the sniper works fundamentally
So it’s not like the balance mod that makes headshots 140

[drowsy marlin]

What is the issue?

[summer willow]

i believe the issue is sniper killing every class in a distance that others classes (excluding sniper) can interact, right?

maybe theres also with quickscoping and headshots

i dont see like an issue because you can do so much to adapt your game

a

[paper sluice]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3102213675

good unusua

[crisp cedar]

need

[stuck locust]

i don't see how this does much given that sniper already kinda is that

it'd probably just incentivize snipers to stay in the back lines even more

[high current]

I think all classes should have the same health, movement speed, weapons (but no unlocks), and the ability to headshot.

All balance issues would be solved

[next nymph]

medic becomes op because of passive health regen

[high current]

Give every class 10hp/second health regen. That way if you don’t track someone till they die your damage was meaningless

Actually that just sounds like overwatch, holup

[next nymph]

pyro becomes op because of afterburn immunity

[potent wolf]

flamethrower headshots 🤔

[unborn pecan]

no

Makes all the healthpacks and the strategy of going for them, consvering health like ammo, useles

[high current]

remove health packs. less entities on the map = better performance. the optimization update we need

[unborn pecan]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/666008714393944064.webp?size=48&name=funkeHmm&quality=lossless

I will remove you

[cursive peak]

Did they ever fix reflected Rescue Ranger bolts headshotting?

[drowsy marlin]

Yes

[livid oracle]

suddenly decided to look at r/tf2weaponideas again

https://preview.redd.it/h5yrdevsvn3c1.png?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=b6b69f70688e6bfedeeae3d71ef402e1c73a2962

why do they think the issue with jarate is that you can spam it out of your spawn

like i think its kinda silly but idk how someone thinks coating spawncampers is what needs to be solved about the jarate

also you can get around this by swapping classes

[drowsy marlin]

I'd make it so health packs can remove all debuffs

[hoary geyser]

I'd make it give critical hits and a 300% movement reduction

[drowsy marlin]

You forgot no random crits.

[craggy ridge]

frostwatch left me speakless

i keep thinking the whole time i was playing it

"how?"

how did this ever get added to the game

did the map creator at no point thought to himself how chokey the map was

how awkwardly it was play on

it's actually difficult to put in words how much it isn't fun to play on without sounding overly mean

we have had 16 years of map making history in this game

at this point we have a grasp on what is and isn't good but frostwatch feels like a map made in 2012

it is so chokey, it is so short, it gives an insane advantage to red, all flank routes are horrible

[craggy ridge]

these problems are less worse in the other stages

WTF they made static

at least one of the creators have

static is awesome

these people are genuinely talented

what led them to create this

[jagged pawn]

I mean they're close, the issue is that you spawn with it. the fact that you get one for free every time you spawn makes it so much stronger than if you actually had to earn it every time like banners

[left sand]

but when you get its a free win

[livid oracle]

i think the main issue is that you can chuck it at a bunch of people and then they're forced to concede ground or get shredded by your team with zero effort on your part

[left sand]

it doesnt matter how often

[livid oracle]

not spawning with it at 100% is definitely better but it still doesnt really solve the main problem with it that it's a free teamfight win

[jagged pawn]

me when I play the medic class

[livid oracle]

watching my team's heavy shred jarate'd players from like a mile away looks very funny though

[crisp cedar]

hot take: jarate isntantly refreshing in resupply lockers is not a problem

very hot take

[summer steeple]

its not a problem

[crisp cedar]

probably

[jagged pawn]

I mean if the claim is that jarate as an ability would inherently be too strong regardless of how you have to earn it, what's the fix then? shrink the range? make it only affect one person? I'm not getting how it would even be fixable assuming this is true (which I don't fully agree with but that's something I don't really want to argue over lol)

[livid oracle]

my favourite part about jarate is that the tf2 community has gaslit itself into thinking that the big issue with it is not that it's an epic win button but rather it's because a sniper can throw it at one person and hit them with the bushwacka

[jagged pawn]

oh yeah that's stupid lmfao

[crisp cedar]

hahaha

[livid oracle]

i dont have a good solution for it that isn't very contrived

[jagged pawn]

sniper famously struggles with killing individual targets, so it's overpowered to give him a tool that does that

[livid oracle]

like my best idea is just making it so only snipers can minicrit jarate'd players

[jagged pawn]

[crisp cedar]

brain transplant is the best solution i think

[livid oracle]

so funny how much of a non issue the bushwacka is

[jagged pawn]

I mean it's still the best sniper melee but that's just because his other ones are all genuinely terrible

"do more damage but only if you're inches from death" and "do no damage but spies turn red for 2 seconds" are such insane pitches

[next nymph]

maybe they think like starts at 0

probably giving tok much credit to how well thought out it is

i should read the full convo before i respond

[craggy ridge]

Any balance discussion is useless because ktbm has solved tf2 balance

[potent wolf]

Any balance discussion is useless because tf2 will never get another balance update

[craggy ridge]

This is what you think

We all thought it would nwver get another gamemode and look at where we are

[crisp cedar]

okay but

[craggy ridge]

We got 2 new gamemodes and possibly a third one coming

[crisp cedar]

try adding

balance changes

with vscript

yeah cant say anything now can you

[craggy ridge]

Idk what this has to do with anything

[crisp cedar]

we got new gamemodes because its incredibly easy and convenient for valve to implement them

valve isnt the type to make balance changes by doing shit like oh we'll change a value here and there

[craggy ridge]

They have done it plenty

[crisp cedar]

*isnt the type to make balance changes that consist of purely that

not when their games arent in maintenance mode

point is

the reason we even got new gamemodes is purely because of how easy it is to implement them

its literally as easy as adding a new map

[next nymph]

dota 2

[crisp cedar]

i just remembered 7.34e thats why i immediately replied with this

[left sand]

all of their games are in maintenance mode, lol

[crisp cedar]

:(

true.

[formal dew]

the time is ripe for tf3

dota, steam deck, counter strike, and vr are mature

[crisp cedar]

u mean neon prime

why maintain many games when can maintain one.

easy. like fortnite

epic doesnt need to update their class based shooter, tactical 5v5 shooter and moba at the same time

[jagged pawn]

I don't understand what the gotcha is here, vsh and zi both had balance changes

and I wish valve would universalize them

[crisp cedar]

theyre balance changes specific to the gamemodes

not universal balance changes across the entire game

[jagged pawn]

they shouldn't be

not all of them anyway

mannpower also has some unique stats. they experiment with stuff all the time they're just scared to universalize it

I wish they would commit

[crisp cedar]

noone's left to be afraid of anything

[left sand]

if you touch the general balance of the game, that requires more people to get involved

[jagged pawn]

just sent a very long message that got censored and I have no idea what the trigger word was lmao

is it natascha

damn

[left sand]

spam content

[crisp cedar]

wasnt anything

just emotes

id guess

[jagged pawn]

oh is it just that it's long lol

yeah I did use emotes

tragic

[crisp cedar]

it didnt like that there were so many emotes i guess

[jagged pawn]

was about to send screenshot yeah

[left sand]

theres no way to readd the message

which is so weird

theres just a bunch of actions to ban you

[jagged pawn]

I don't think a lot of people realize just how much those modes change. especially vsh that one's a brand new game lol

[jagged pawn]

I understand what must be done 😔

[left sand]

no one was arguing that vscript cant change things

the argument is that vscript will always limit to adding a new offshoot

[jagged pawn]

wasn't saying otherwise my point is that valve is clearly willing to add community balance changes

[left sand]

not changing the balance of the main game

[crisp cedar]

i dont mean to downplay vscript

[left sand]

valve is willing to add community game modes

[crisp cedar]

its really cool

[left sand]

thats it

theres nothing about balance there

they just dont care, its a separate mode

[jagged pawn]

but they could've simply rejected the balance changes no?

[left sand]

no?

[crisp cedar]

the balance changes

are part of the map

they didnt hcange anything

[left sand]

because the balance changes are for playing the mode

[crisp cedar]

in the game itself

[left sand]

why would they involve themself in dictating how a separate gamemode plays

then they have to do game design

[crisp cedar]

they simply updated all the maps with the balance changes because hte gamemode itself is included within the map

[left sand]

theyve already done their game design for the base game

[crisp cedar]

i think thats how it works

[jagged pawn]

hell mannpower isn't even a community mode and some of those changes have nothing to do with it. I think they're just scared of touching the main game at all so they resort to weird mannpower experiments lol

[crisp cedar]

its just dario

[left sand]

mannpower was adjusted by one person

and it was also a separate thing

again, the moment you touch TF2 for real

a lot of people have to get involved

because the balance of the game is sacred

for all of valves games

[crisp cedar]

plus plenty of expectations are set

[left sand]

literally HL2, they have tried extremely hard over the years to not change anything about the gameplay

like that shit is so precise on how they want to design it

[jagged pawn]

idk it just feels pessimistic to say "oh they'll never balance it because it's dead" when they just dropped a balance patch for half life 1. and yes I know that had a lot of people working on it but my point is that they can always try

it's just about the desire to

[left sand]

hl1 didnt really balance the game?

[jagged pawn]

grenades are fundamentally different now

[left sand]

oh you mean dm

[jagged pawn]

ye

[left sand]

yeah, lets wait for the 25th anniversary of tf2

[jagged pawn]

down

[left sand]

also the other thing is like

i dont wanna say stuff publicly

but

[jagged pawn]

2032 here we come

[left sand]

yeah

[jagged pawn]

don't feel like you have to dw

like if you feel comfortable with it that's cool but no pressure

[left sand]

you cant really change tf2 without a lot of stuff being true and it involves a lot of people

[jagged pawn]

well let me ask this

and besides the obvious "one is backend and one is frontend"

what makes your hope for them adding team comtress 2 different

[left sand]

because those are very selective in how they impact the game

theyre essentially bug fixes. that has been fine to do somewhat

and even those might be too far

but i just submit all the bug fixes i can so valve can choose to implement what they want

[jagged pawn]

yeah like I love the changes you've pitched but some of them are absolutely not just bug fixes lol. live model on main menu and phlog taunt cancel are two that immediately come to mind as big changes that people will complain about

the first because different and the second because how dare you ruin my fun

[potent wolf]

"valve can choose to implement what they want"

[jagged pawn]

I can read lmao

[left sand]

live model on main menu is a qol change

idk how thats balance

performance improvements are also not bug fixes

idk why youre applying something i said about a specific thing to everything

phlog cancelling is scoped as a bug fix

[jagged pawn]

I'm trying to understand what their line is

and I'm trying to do it in a way where I don't back you into saying something you don't want to

[left sand]

the reason being that the uber lingering/flickering is an oversight most likely

because the effect is removed at the correct time, just like before how there was a damage resistance of 90%

[jagged pawn]

obviously I understand the difference between making the natascha slow work properly and giving it lifesteal instead of slow. I'm just trying to gauge where the line is between those two yknow

[left sand]

but they made it uber mainly because they wanted the game to be more readable and have a clear set of status effects

but uber has a linger/stay mechanic

which did not apply to the dmg resist

so basically that is a change to reconcile the differences between the two, and get rid of somewhat of an annoyance for enemies

arguably you could say its an exploit almost

taking something unintended by an oversight for an advantage

[jagged pawn]

so I'm not saying I have any issue with the phlog change. I'm saying that if valve's fear is changing the game in a way that people will complain about then it won't get added. but if that's not the metric then I'm trying to figure out what the metric is. this isn't about individual changes I'm just trying to figure out the criteria

[left sand]

but theres obviously a gray area of what is a bug and what is balance

[jagged pawn]

yeah

[left sand]

no one said that its about the audience complaining

[jagged pawn]

what about the balance is sacred then

[left sand]

within valve

[jagged pawn]

is it respect for the previous devs and not wanting to mess with their vision?

[left sand]

Valve's intention is gospel

[jagged pawn]

so then when you say a lot of people have to be involved, what you mean is that for a change to get implemented they have to run it by the people who were involved before and see if it lines up with their vision

ok I'm getting it now