Team Fortress 2 Megathread - winter is the most chill time of year

[wintry marlin]

perhaps underground even.

I made it a rule so that every objective has 3 attack vectors, no more, no less.

with a 4th detour, which just appears under the other main paths.

I guess.

ninja stuff.

I picked a theme.
Japan.
I got lost in thought about sekiro.

[wintry marlin]

I'll see where I'll get without using custom assets.

[heavy solar]

@wintry marlin has leveled up! (77 ➜ 78)

[wintry marlin]

I have to acknowledge that drawing the layout for the map is pretty much top-down approach and it's pretty difficult

for me

but I'm not going to do bottom-up out of principle.

[wintry marlin]

I wish you could make brushes inside the camera viewport.

so that 2D grids were completely irrelevant.

[wintry marlin]

I'm going to use vscript for game objectives and opening and closing entrances.

[rare creek]

there's a scout doing the bumper car emote and mic spamming race car noises

[daring tiger]

good

[paper sluice]

scout had a sleeves layer in his psd

[wintry marlin]

https://youtu.be/ZKNI-j9greI

https://youtu.be/Z3N8PjSuVZg

this is giving me motion sickness

https://youtu.be/lmtyONdAnsM

[daring tiger]

is that too different from cl_first_person_uses_world_model 1

?

[wintry marlin]

it's that but with head movement

accurate to the animations

[wintry marlin]

okay, I just figured out something about the camera that appears at world origin when you load into the map - it points in the direction of the x axis

[rare creek]

is this true

[summer steeple]

yeah

[rare creek]

when will tf2 get support for directx 6

we need b4nny's gameplay to look like this

[slender nexus]

gotta get 10 more fps

[rare creek]

why doesn't b4nny use a hud idk I don't watch him

[jaunty willow]

because stock HUD runs good already

[wintry marlin]

let's play a game of "Is this a real tf2 map name"
Do you think there's a map called hellwater?

[summer steeple]

yes

[jaunty willow]

nay

[summer steeple]

unless you mean in the game

in which case no

[wintry marlin]

not in-game

just in general

I checked google, no results

nothing on workshop either

hellwater is not real

[summer steeple]

how

[jaunty willow]

because bloodwater is real

[rare creek]

b4nny doesn't even use the gigachad no explosion particle mod

[jaunty willow]

no need for hellwatee

[rare creek]

why does he make his game look like garbage but not remove the components that actually take fps

[wintry marlin]

hellwater is free.

let's try another one

Infiltration

Make your bets

[summer steeple]

i’m gonna say yes?

[wintry marlin]

correct.

[summer steeple]

i bet it’ll be invade ctf

[wintry marlin]

you would never guess what it actually is, honestly.

singleplayer adventure map.

[summer steeple]

bruh

[wintry marlin]

Is "Assembly" a real tf2 map?

honestly this game is probably more fun to play with people who never played tf2 and don't know any of the maps

[left sand]

@rare creek his game doesnt look that bad compared to others imo, its gotten slightly worse recently but its relatively tame

but to answer your questions

its because hes used to it

b4nny is the champion of "if it aint broke, dont fix it"

[high current]

Many pros are. Just look at the prevalence of 4:3 aspect ratios or 500hz mouse polling rates in CSGO. It’s proliferated by pros who say “I’ve used it for 20 years and I don’t want to mess up my muscle memory”. Even though it’s almost always objectively worse.

As for b4nny. He wouldn’t use dx6, pretty sure he uses dx9 with mat_specular 0, mat_phong 0, mat_bumpmap 0, and mat_reducedfillrate 1 (commands might be slightly off). Which makes his game look dx8, but you can see that weapon skins work in his game.

As for custom hud, he does use one. iirc he uses an EXTREMELY minor edit of default hud. Honestly he states that “he didn’t see anything wrong with it” as the reason he always stuck with stock, which is valid. But if I were to guess he did it originally to be contrarian because rayshud, or custom huds in generally were almost universal in early comp scene, even more than current. Just having been around comp players, a lot like to use their own gimmick settings as a bit of a signature, I think stock hud is his IMO.

[wintry marlin]

it's a bit weird like, watching b4nny in 2018 and so on and then it's 2023 and he's still playing

[rare creek]

even more than current?

is it just that people stopped playing tf2?

[wintry marlin]

I watched b4nny before mym and tough break even

still playing

he's the kind of person who got his life figured out 50 years in advance I guess

[high current]

Back in like the early/mid 2010s. Almost every single comp player used rayshud. And if they didn’t use rayshud they used a custom hud, like b4nny was the only comp player anyone could name that used stock hud. Now there are people that use stock, largely cuz of b4nny.

[wintry marlin]

I am honestly burned out even thinking about playing some games, especially csgo and anything like it.

15 years is not enough for him.

[high current]

B4nny started playing comp tf2 in like 2008 or something. Dude actually remembers when teams were still trying to figure out the meta so having things like heavy+demo was experimented with in the literal first seasons of comp tf2. I think he’s the longest standing comp player in tf2.

[wintry marlin]

perhaps one of the longest standing esports players ever.

he probably is going to try to be the number one.

his competition is cs players though.

[rare creek]

is rayshud the best tf2 competitive hud

[high current]

Lots of Csgo pros have been around since the CSS or 1.6 days. Many of them of them are starting to retire, but they are still around.

[wintry marlin]

ones that stuck around since 1999.

[high current]

Probably not. Just literally everyone used it. I think it was the first major “minimal”-ish hud.

[wintry marlin]

yeah his competition are either css or cs 1.6 veterans.

that continue to play csgo.

[next nymph]

the big thing that rayshud had going for it was reliable support and frequent maintenance, back in the days when a hud might break a few times a month because of updates

[high current]

If you watch his video on the tierlist of comp players. He drops a TON of history from players that he played along side. Like the invention of sacs, the invention of gunboat pocket, b4nny himself pioneered aggressive demo.

[grim parcel]

the best competitive hud is any that you can comfortably see your health and ammo with, and that you like

[rare creek]

well then that'd be no hud cuz im on a 4k monitor and that makes fonts really small :)

[next nymph]

a combination of hud-breaking updates becoming extremely infrequent + hypno updating tons and tons of older huds really hurt rayshud's popularity

[high current]

SpongeBob hud was the most common hud at Lan tbh. That or Xhud solely cuz my team had 5 people using it.

[hybrid cloud]

spongebob hud

[high current]

It’s a meme but I probably saw 4 or so guys running it.

[left sand]

im pretty sure he recently switched to dx8

[high current]

Ah I haven’t checked his super recent streams since he started doing no mic streams :(

[left sand]

idk if he does no mic

[high current]

I wonder why he switched. It takes a lot to convince him to change things.

[next nymph]

time to convince b4nny of 0 lerp

[high current]

He did when froyo roster essentially got reset. And maybe I’ve just been unlucky with joining when he is doing them.

[wintry marlin]

This is a real tf2 map by the way.
https://tf2maps.net/downloads/assembly.13305/

[high current]

Doesn’t b4nny use 10 lerp?

Which is cursed on so many levels

[rare creek]

that got patched

[next nymph]

i think b4nny should get used to bind mouse1 +forward

[grim parcel]

use 4:3 like csgo pros

[high current]

It blows my mind b4nny plays on 4:3 stretch. I feel like on pocket scout if I could use 120fov I would.

[wintry marlin]

I don't think there's something inherently wrong with aspect ratios.
but all things considered, 4:3 is probably the opposite of what you want in a tactical first person shooter where you need information

[next nymph]

just use a 1.85:1 aspect ratio

[wintry marlin]

and about monitors themselves - using a 4:3 monitor with 16:9 game resolution stretched is going to be a fever dream

everything is taller

inversely, 4:3 stetched on 16:9 monitor is like a lifehack that convinces pros that it makes it easier to shoot people

[high current]

isn't that like 17x9?

[wintry marlin]

I suppose they actually used 4:3 monitors back in like late 00's but there's no reason to stick to 4:3 resolution besides the placebo

[high current]

A lot of pros don't even stretch 4:3. A lot use 4:3 black bars

[small siren]

*A lot of pros don't

even stretch 4:3. A lot

use 4:3 black bars*

- peaches

[wintry marlin]

and csgo mongs convinced millions of children in like 2015 to use 4:3 stretched res because it's "so pro!!!"

[wintry marlin]

yeah that makes more sense because they've stuck to 4:3 out of principle at that point

[grim parcel]

it makes heads bigger

[high current]

Eh. Buying a $500+ monitor just to cut off 25% of it is weird to me

[next nymph]

i dont know simplied fractions i aint gonna do that in my head

[wintry marlin]

it's actually difficult to find a modern 4:3 gaming monitor

so I can imagine why they would use 4:3 black bars

but this hesitation to change whatsoever leaves me concerned about their brains more than anything.

they're not willing to adapt, they force everything to adapt to themselves.

[rare creek]

i've heard of quake players doing this unironically

[high current]

Pretty sure that is like a film resolution. 16:9 is sometimes 1.78:1, and 21:9 is sometimes 2.1:1. IDK what 1.85:1 translates to but I have heard of it

[next nymph]

there was a comp tf2 player who did

1.85:1 is 37/20

its only relevant because thats the default maximum for horizontal fov in tf2 iirc

[high current]

Reading up on it, yeh its just "widescreen" 16:9 lmao. Boutta set my game to that👀

[grim parcel]

you're going to shit yourself when you hear about how they put jump on right click too

[wintry marlin]

I want to ask when if ever 1440p is going to become mainstream

[summer steeple]

i kinda doubt it will

most people jumped to 4k

[wintry marlin]

I suppose it's a budget 21:9 option I guess

[grim parcel]

unless graphics cards jump in price-per-frame value at 4k or upscaling tech becomes mainstream, i could see 1440p getting popular for higher framerates

plus it's cheaper

[wintry marlin]

but getting used to 1080p means people don't see a reason to get used to anything else, so it's either that or balls to the wall

4k gaming is still kind of far off

considering that game devs balance graphics per performance around 1080p

and that's what most people use.

[grim parcel]

i mean you can still see a decent visual difference at 1440p, and if prices got just a bit lower, it would be a decent stepping stone towards 4k

because 1440p at high frame rates is possible, even on middle range cards

[summer steeple]

tbh i would rather have 1080 or 1440 with high framerates and good AA

[wintry marlin]

yeah, I would want 1440p to be the upper standard

[rare creek]

they put fire on spacebar

[summer steeple]

unfortunately, good AA on modern games is just fucking SSAA

[grim parcel]

but yeah 4k is pretty out of the question with the exception of upscaling

[rare creek]

jump on right click is a lot more reasonable because right click isn't used for anything else

[summer steeple]

so at that point just run 4k

[wintry marlin]

which would mean that games would perform better at 1080p than expected because game devs balance performance around stable 60 fps on 1440p

[grim parcel]

you don't need good AA if you downscale

[summer steeple]

god i fucking

i miss msaa

[grim parcel]

taa is good enough imo

[summer steeple]

the problem is that most game devs don't do good taa

[grim parcel]

i don't see much of a difference or much of a performance hit

true

[rare creek]

i only play games old enough that they have msaa and nothing else

[summer steeple]

so it just has awful ghosting

[rare creek]

or doom 2016 which has very good TAA

[summer steeple]

i mean idtech is a masterpiece of performance and graphics so

[grim parcel]

yeah i loved it in doom

[summer steeple]

like that shit runs on the SWITCH

[wintry marlin]

if 1440p became new standard for 60 fps gaming then it would benefit everyone who is still stuck around 1080p, meaning that they would get slightly more fps even on older gen hardware though it has its limits.

[rare creek]

except for everything that happened between 2004 - 2015

[summer steeple]

nah even doom 3 looks good

[rare creek]

it doesn't run good

at all

[summer steeple]

oh performance i can't speak too

don't own it

[rare creek]

id tech 5 megatexture technology (the textures look like they're from 2001)

[summer steeple]

this was the best comparison i could find of how doom 2016 looks on consoles (most importantly switch)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9no_CvzuUS4

and like, lower res, 30 fps, but its still damn good looking

[small siren]

*and like, lower res,

30 fps, but its

still damn good looking*

- fiend

[summer steeple]

and i'm gonna say thats probably mostly due to idtech 6 being a damn good engine

like considering the fact that compared to other consoles, the switch version only has lower resolution, lower quality textures (not sure about models, and some lower quality or missing post processing effects

thats a pretty good compromise

the biggest downside really is the fact that its not 60fps

[small siren]

*the biggest downside

really is the fact that its

not 60fps*

- fiend

[summer steeple]

anyway i'd rather have a setup that leans towards 1440p144fps than 4k60

but unfortunately thats not really what GPU companies seem to want

it seems like nvidias next big thing is """"""8k"""""" gaming

where they know that their gpus aren't powerful enough for that so they just use DLSS to get close enough

and i mean sure, considering that they hit that big milestone of real time raytracing i get that there's not really an obvious way to go for graphical improvements from there aside from resolution

[next nymph]

give me 640x480 480hz

[summer steeple]

but i just like...

idk what i want really because asking them to just make faster GPUs for current resolutions is basically like asking them to just make faster GPUs

[next nymph]

i want them to make faster GPUs that only supports VGA

[high current]

NGL it was a sad day when I got my new GPU and had to quit using my VGA second monitor. I mean the thing was on its last leg, I think there was a short in it because it would randomly go black until you smacked the absolute shite out of it.

[cursive peak]

You could get adapters to continue using it.

[wintry marlin]

this is perfect

This is exactly the kind of water texture I wanted

water_coast02

[rare creek]

for what

[wintry marlin]

for the map I'm making

I haven't shown the layout or the rest of it yet.

I'll show when it is in a more playable state.

[limpid panther]

did a long run to test stability of a script and decided to post. This result is kinda cool because it shows that I can probably get away with increasing LOD to high without any performance or variance penalty

although I should probably do an even longer run since its close and variance being notably lower makes little sense

[crisp cedar]

i just use stock hud because most custom huds clash with the tf2 style

yknow

the huds look like theyre from a completely different game

not a fan

[hybrid cloud]

true

unfortunately tf2 hud also has its info really out of the way

[rare creek]

there's some huds that look like they're from tf2

[potent wolf]

toonhud is pretty good at that imo

[rare creek]

also Mannterface

https://mastercomfig.com/huds/page/mannterface/

[rare creek]

everyone in the comments is praising nintendo for making a powerful console lmao

[potent wolf]

lol

nintendo consoles, famous for having cutting-edge hardware

[rare creek]

world's fastest gaming ipad

[slender nexus]

dont tell them what the wii was based on

or the wii u

[rare creek]

most intelligent youtube comments

[rare creek]

its based on the CHAD apple imac g3

runs halo at 3fps

[slender nexus]

[summer steeple]

I can't believe nintendo made such a powerful console that doom 2016, a game which under vulkan could run at max settings at 300+fps (which speedrunners needed to do tricks) around the time of release, can run at 30fps at lower settings

[rare creek]

can't believe that nintendo made a console so powerful it has fps drops in unity games

a console so powerful that another portable system can just emulate the entire hardware

[summer steeple]

honestly i don't think switch hardware is awful but the big problem really seems to be that nintendo just kinda doesn't tell people how to fucking use it

so like every game not released by them tends to suck ass visually and performance wise

[rare creek]

game developers don't seem to be obligated to use any hardware properly anymore in general

because its all just x86 so they just run the same code and give it a pass when it hits 30fps

[summer steeple]

I mean when you're going for multiplat releases on hardware ranging from shit to not so shit to PC

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[rare creek]

i genuinely can't tell the difference between some ps4 games and late ps3 games

[summer steeple]

also that

[rare creek]

they just stopped optimizing code and stopped making better graphics as a result

[summer steeple]

games get more complicated but as we get closer to reality it starts to really blend together

[rare creek]

new games on PC run worse but don't really look much better

[summer steeple]

its ok though they have SSR and RTX

[crisp cedar]

like what

[hybrid cloud]

i have to keep glancing to the side to get any immediate read on hp and ammo

[crisp cedar]

your own hp and ammo?

[mystic turtle]

Yeah
There is the port of the console hud that was preserved in the Mastercoms hud directory
HP and ammo are centered, somewhat

[crisp cedar]

i think thats kinda skill issue

[mystic turtle]

I mean, personally, I don't mind minimal huds

[crisp cedar]

if its your preference thats fine but

it takes really minimal effort to quickly glance at ur hp and ammo

[mystic turtle]

I always found something was off with default, but I can't seem to put my finger on it

[mystic turtle]

Playing TF2C taught me that

[wintry marlin]

mmm...

there's skyboxes on all of the roofs.

[crisp cedar]

either way i thought this meant like

some huds show u info the default hud doesnt but

the default hud does everything u need it to

[formal dew]

if tf2 unlocks the hud from the aspect ratio like other source games got last year, you could have the hud in 4:3 with any resolution and have stuff a little closer to the screen

[rare creek]

what do you mean

[formal dew]

if you have a 4:3 hud aspect ratio and a 16:9 game ratio, the hud will be situation closer to the center of your screen

[rare creek]

you can have hud elements that don't change reguardless of aspect ration by just pointing the m to the center i think

[formal dew]

For the default hud i mean

[rare creek]

I have no idea what yo u mean

[formal dew]

A year or 2 ago most source games got the aspect ratio of the game res and for the hud decoupled for the steam deck presumably

Hold on for a visual explanation

[summer steeple]

i thought the steam deck had its own like custom hud stuff for those games

rather than decoupling

like they're actively in different positions on deck

[formal dew]

hl2 with 16:9 hud and resolution

4:3 hud

[summer steeple]

oh, well thats just a valve moment

[formal dew]

That's for the main menu

[summer steeple]

most hud elements don't care about aspect ratio

[rare creek]

that's a good way to break like half the menus in tf2 bc they depend on the sides of the screen

[formal dew]

f

[potent wolf]

https://github.com/Joshua-Ashton/HL2-GamepadUI @summer steeple

[summer steeple]

like in theory this HL2 hud should be like, 4 units from the edge of the screen

[high current]

nice hud

[summer steeple]

but it looks like they instead did it based on center or exact position

[wintry marlin]

thanks, I think I know who made it

anyway it's 3 am

[summer steeple]

it has its own code? huh

[wintry marlin]

I think I am done for today

[potent wolf]

yeah

[potent wolf]

sleeeeep

[potent wolf]

yeah, just released yesterday iirc

[rare creek]

how the fufk this guy has source code to valve games/???

[summer steeple]

he's a contractor

[formal dew]

bribes

[potent wolf]

Joshie is a contractor

[summer steeple]

they're also 50% of the reason we got vscript in tf2

[potent wolf]

(actually the frog man has frog powers)

[rare creek]

I like the bribes answer better

[daring tiger]

hi

[potent wolf]

no, not you

[daring tiger]

:(

[potent wolf]

[daring tiger]

b-but I'm joshie

[formal dew]

ashton is responsible for vulkan implementations in source 1, the random steam deck goodies source games got in 2021 and 22, and for tf2 updates now

I believe general steam deck maintenance too

[rare creek]

I hope they are able to win thge 2forrt contract

[potent wolf]

lol

[formal dew]

contracker irl

[potent wolf]

you might be a joshie, but are you the joshie?

[rare creek]

what vulkan doesn't have source 1 support

[formal dew]

but blood money is replaced with real money

dxvk

[wintry marlin]

And lastly, this is my layout.
I still got plenty of way to go and I'm not making everything to a T.

[potent wolf]

dxvk

[summer steeple]

what does this mean

[wintry marlin]

also it was exactly 8MB but discord wouldn't let me post

[potent wolf]

It technically doesn't have opengl support either lol

[small siren]

*It technically

doesn't have opengl support

either lol*

- replaycoding

[summer steeple]

oh i just got confused cause like

[potent wolf]

translation layers all the way down

[summer steeple]

vulkan not supporting source 1 was how i read it

not source 1 not supporting vk

[rare creek]

wait I forgot csgo supplorts vulkan

[summer steeple]

also dxvk

[potent wolf]

Yeah, so does l4d2

and hl2 (ep2 only, not sure?)

[rare creek]

wtf l4d2 still gets updates

[summer steeple]

any renderer in source 1 that isn't DX is translation layers

[formal dew]

source games also got a high dpi aware update last year or 2

Not sure what that looks like as i am a full hd peon

[summer steeple]

it was part of a large sweep of dxvk updates to them, also the last stand update a year or 2 back?

[wintry marlin]

aight gn I'm off to eat yogurt and watch spiff beat every fnaf game in one stream with no breaks

[formal dew]

except in tf2

[rare creek]

wtf no they dont it still looks like shit to me

[hybrid cloud]

a lot of old source games get updates

[formal dew]

Portal 2 definitely got it

[summer steeple]

iirc after vscript for tf2 gets finished (yes, its not finished yet), dxvk is planned

[formal dew]

👀

[potent wolf]

spoiler alert: it was joshie again

[potent wolf]

yeah, he mentioned it in the shounic discord

[rare creek]

is there any reason to use dxvk

on windows

[summer steeple]

it can improve performance in some cases

iirc its usually like

better and more consistent fps in fights, but lower fps when there's nothing happening

so you'll get slightly less fps where it doesn't matter and more where it does

plus consistency

[formal dew]

I know someone who would shit if they knew this but loose lips and all

[potent wolf]

both joshie and ficool are there

[formal dew]

Oh

[rare creek]

will it be optional

[potent wolf]

yes

[summer steeple]

of course

[rare creek]

thanj god

[formal dew]

tf2 update:

deprecated directx

[rare creek]

you say that like valve doesn't do stupid shit and then maeks it not optional

[summer steeple]

its optional in all of their games so far lol

[potent wolf]

thats literally impossible to do, there is only a renderer for directx

[hoary geyser]

opengl only?! yes!

[formal dew]

[mystic turtle]

Well, I'll be rolling with Vulkan

[rare creek]

does -vulkan still work in csog

[formal dew]

my favorite recent valve moment was when they added the temp file delete in tf2 without telling anyone, but gave people a weeks notice in l4d2

[potent wolf]

yeah, thats the dxvk stuff

[rare creek]

ohhh

[mystic turtle]

Vulkan helped my PC run Wii U games at Vsync fps with almost no frame drops

[rare creek]

so the downside is that it makes your game stutter a lot but give better fps

[summer steeple]

what

no the opposite

[daring tiger]

@left sand am I?

[summer steeple]

its more consistent

[mystic turtle]

Vulkan has a shader cache lmao

[summer steeple]

it just is worse fps when there's less happening

[rare creek]

when I last tried it it made the game stuter a lot

[summer steeple]

yeah there might be some stuttering at first due to shader cache

[hybrid cloud]

i should be able to run tf2 at max settings with like an intel 300 or whatever

[mystic turtle]

It's compling shaders

[rare creek]

why dont they just compile the shaders first wtf

[summer steeple]

ideally steam should handle shaders?

[mystic turtle]

Yeah

[summer steeple]

idk exactly how it works

[rare creek]

also no -vulkan isn't working csgo is just crashing on startup

[potent wolf]

thats what fossilize does iirc

[small siren]

*also no -vulkan

isn't working csgo is just

crashing on startup*

- 👑 Lucy

[potent wolf]

(oh my god i can't type today)

[summer steeple]

that means its working

[potent wolf]

lmao

[formal dew]

based

[rare creek]

maybe they removed it

[summer steeple]

they did not

[hybrid cloud]

based

[potent wolf]

It wouldn't crash if they removed it

[rare creek]

well whatever they did they broke it 💀

[potent wolf]

rip

[rare creek]

where do I get csgo crash logs

[potent wolf]

funny thing is, i just had an argument with some people in the P2CE discord about if it's possible to get tf2 running with dxvk on linux without source code modifications

[formal dew]

isn't there an automated process for making low lod models

[potent wolf]

(it's not)

[summer steeple]

idk about linux but you can definitely run dxvk, you just might get bonked by VAC

[mystic turtle]

By the way, custom lightwarps can't be used in casual, right?

[potent wolf]

not on linux

[summer steeple]

depends on the tool you're using but yes, but automatic LODs suck omega ass and if possible you should make them yourself

[potent wolf]

due to togl

[rare creek]

nmo

[summer steeple]

ah i see

[formal dew]

Riperino

I remembered that a good chunk of guns don't have lods and thought that might be an easy thing todo

[mystic turtle]

Because I've been thinking of getting one to improve visibility

[hybrid cloud]

yea nah lightwarps are joever in casual

seems the only things that work are huds, hitsounds, custom xhairs and preloaded animations

[rare creek]

where do I get csgo crash logs

[hybrid cloud]

oh and no smoke/no hats

[mystic turtle]

And sounds, to much a lesser extent

[potent wolf]

i don't think you can

[rare creek]

oh yeah vo and ui aren't blocekd in casual

[rare creek]

bro this game fucking stinks I hate counter strike

[mystic turtle]

Wait, UI too?

[potent wolf]

custom huds

[rare creek]

yeaj ui

the folder where hitsounds is in

[potent wolf]

oh yeah

[formal dew]

Pour one out for whitelisted viewmodel animations

2016-2016

[slender nexus]

I was roped into CSGO because of the skins and I forever hate it for that

[potent wolf]

preloading my beloved

[mystic turtle]

Bc I might experiment with this
Perhaps it might allow some things that currently don't work in the sv_pure soundscript to work

[hybrid cloud]

i think valve should put my custom particles on the workshop because i am the greatest particle maker EVAR!!!!!!

[rare creek]

jesse what the fuck are ytou talking about

[mystic turtle]

Bruh

[grim parcel]

they try, but there's a chance certain shaders haven't been compiled on someone with a similar system as you before

[grim parcel]

zink

[rare creek]

what

[summer steeple]

I mean ideally they'd precompile them before starting the game, but the game isn't setup for that

[potent wolf]

ah yes, directx to opengl to vulkan

perfection

[grim parcel]

and then vk back to directx

it comes full circle

[potent wolf]

die

[grim parcel]

that's a feature in dxvk 2 with some cards iirc

[small siren]

*that's a feature in

dxvk 2 with some

cards iirc*

- brodchoo

[summer steeple]

o cool

i wonder how they do it

[crisp cedar]

when is vulkan 2 happening

[rare creek]

why diont they just not compile them at all

[grim parcel]

On drivers which support VK_EXT_graphics_pipeline_library, including the IndependentInterpolationDecoration feature, Vulkan shaders will now be compiled at the time the game loads its D3D shaders, rather than at draw time. This reduces or eliminates shader compile stutter in many games.

because then everyone would need to compile them???

it would just waste time and annoy people

and on slower systems it would be even worse

[summer steeple]

oh for some reason i didn't actually think about the fact that D3D shaders need to be loaded as well and not just at draw time LMAO

[rare creek]

UI dont need to compile shioty when I play with directx why do I have to with vulokan

[potent wolf]

?

[rare creek]

there is no stutter on direcvtx why does there eahve to be on vulkan it makes no sens

e

[potent wolf]

Because dxvk has to translate the shaders

[slender nexus]

I use dolphin emulator and in the shader compilation settings it says lower end systems will likely see more performance issues due to a larger shading queue as opposed to doing compilation as they're needed

[grim parcel]

compilation will still be slower, but yeah that queue is also a massive bottleneck on those kinds of machines

[summer steeple]

i justchecked, it kinda says the opposite?

it says if you have a lowend pc you WANT precompilation

[small siren]

*it says if you have

a lowend pc you WANT

precompilation*

- fiend

[rare creek]

bruh

[potent wolf]

?

[rare creek]

that's just bruh moment

[grim parcel]

directx needs to as well
https://github.com/microsoft/DirectXShaderCompiler

[slender nexus]

ough

[grim parcel]

it's just that they're already shipped with native directx games

[summer steeple]

why do so many games require you to compile shaders before starting now, is it just that they want to save on download size?

[mystic turtle]

Maybe

[grim parcel]

that or they are too lazy to distribute the intermediary stuff

[slender nexus]

most games on steam for linux come with the needed shaders, it's just that they need to be compiled before launch because things like the different gpu driver landscape on linux

[crisp cedar]

i wouldnt mind compiling my own shaders if i didnt have to do it every time i reboot my pc

[summer steeple]

bruh why do you need to do that

linux moment?

[mystic turtle]

Can kinda confirm, Citra runs slower on my PC when compliling shaders on the fly

[crisp cedar]

no it just does that

idk why

[potent wolf]

I don't have to on my system 🤷‍♀️

[mystic turtle]

What
Never happened to me

[crisp cedar]

that being said

i can just click skip

and it works fine

[slender nexus]

I stg it used to say something along the lines of "low ram = bad performance"

[mystic turtle]

Booted FBNeo in DXVK
It compiled its shaders
Ran perfectly fine afterwards

[summer steeple]

it might've andthen they realized it wasn't right or smth

[crisp cedar]

so unless i forget to open steam that doesnt happen to me

cuz it does it in the background

wait

wait

okay

i cnat read

its all good

[slender nexus]

In steam Linux there's a shader menu in the settings
Idk if it's set to compile in the background by default

[crisp cedar]

i dont have a problem actually

[crisp cedar]

yeah

i have that

[slender nexus]

When I used steam on my desktop it would just compile in the background

[crisp cedar]

i just dont have steam open when my pc boots up

so sometimes im like fuck i wanna game

i open steam i try to open the game...oh

it takes like 5 minutes at worst so its fine

but its mildly inconvenient if i forget to open steam atleast like 10 mins before i decide i want to play something

still, i can click skip and stuff works

[slender nexus]

One thing I noticed about the shader precompilation is that you must let it precompile to completion or else it goes back to 0% when you reboot

goofy ahh steam

[spare obsidian]

i just let steam download all shaders for every single game on my library lol

[left sand]

automatic LODs are awesome

[left sand]

LODs are bad anyway nowadays tbh

[summer steeple]

everyone i've asked about it and my personal experience has just shown that automatic LODs usually are just terrible

they don't tend to retain the shape, are too noticeable, etc.

albeit, I don't do characters so i can't speak for that

but for props, stuff with hard surfaces, everything i've tried just gets me bad results, and doing it myself yielded better results

[left sand]

you can make auto LODs retain shape tho

[summer steeple]

it never really worked when i did it

[craggy ridge]

No

I'd probably guess them all correctly

[formal dew]

2fort

[summer steeple]

fake

no mapper would ever name a map "2fort", thats stupid

[potent wolf]

ctf_2fart

thats a real map (not)

[crisp cedar]

okay

[formal dew]

comic accurate

[crisp cedar]

let me give you a good one

okay

ahem

[potent wolf]

ahem

what gamemode is ahem?

[crisp cedar]

ctf_ravelin

[summer steeple]

ctf_ritalin

[formal dew]

fake

[potent wolf]

lol

[crisp cedar]

hmph.

https://tenor.com/view/family-feud-survey-says-strike-buzzer-wrong-answer-gif-16312959

[potent wolf]

It's real lmao

[crisp cedar]

https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/Ravelin_(Classic)

only real tf fans know

ok ok

how about this one

[summer steeple]

thats a TFC map that doesn't count fuck you

[crisp cedar]

gasworks

[potent wolf]

https://teamwork.tf/community/quickplay/map/ctf_ravelin_pt5

[crisp cedar]

just gasworks

[formal dew]

that's a hldm map

right

[summer steeple]

also its not ctf_ravelin

[crisp cedar]

okay yeah it is

[summer steeple]

gasworks real

[crisp cedar]

yes i know its not ctf_ravelin

[formal dew]

I recently saw someone github request that map for hl2dm

and it was closed

[crisp cedar]

but it is a ctf map

[potent wolf]

you said it was ctf_ravelin

[crisp cedar]

so i thought it was appropriate to add ctf

to it

[formal dew]

Here's one

tc_strata

[summer steeple]

real

[next nymph]

gaslight

[formal dew]

Correct

[crisp cedar]

real and i bet its a russian map

[summer steeple]

someone on the tf2m discord wants to make a gaslight map

which actually tries to gaslight you

[crisp cedar]

how about cp_avanti

[summer steeple]

hmmmm..... fake?

[formal dew]

Real

[next nymph]

how about this one: trade_minecraft

[potent wolf]

fake

[summer steeple]

i got one

[potent wolf]

[summer steeple]

arena_chandlands

[crisp cedar]

ok

koth_t2

is it real

[summer steeple]

i think its real

[formal dew]

I mean someone has probably given that name to a random hammer box at some point

[summer steeple]

also no one answered mine

[crisp cedar]

you were right to say real

[formal dew]

Fake

[crisp cedar]

its real

and i made it

[summer steeple]

i'm gonna ask again cause i want answers

is arena_chandlands real or fake

[crisp cedar]

yes

real

i say real

[summer steeple]

100% real no fake no fake
or 0% real fake fake

[crisp cedar]

WAIT

[summer steeple]

you are correct

[crisp cedar]

WAIT

oh what

i was about to say nvm not real

because

who the fuck makes arena maps

[summer steeple]

it was an april fools map

https://tf2maps.net/threads/chandlands.38771/

every time the round started there was a different gimmick

[formal dew]

plr scoville

[summer steeple]

hmmm that sounds like a good name so i'll say real

[formal dew]

You win a prize

[summer steeple]

no way

a prize

what is it

[formal dew]

knowledge of the ultimate fate of the universe implanted into your mind

[summer steeple]

OHHHHHHHHHHH

AAHHHHHHHHHHHHH

FUCK

NOOOOOOO

I DONT WANT IT

TAKE IT AWAY

[formal dew]

[potent wolf]

@formal dew what have you done

poor fiend

[formal dew]

They're in a better place

Truth or consequences, new mexico

real town name

[formal dew]

https://tenor.com/view/will-smith-shades-mib-men-in-black-neuralyzer-gif-17328155

The summer update should add promo items from defunct games into the craft and drop pools

and add a super-genuine quality for genuines for shuttered games

[grim parcel]

the summer update should add sex

[summer steeple]

the sex update

[formal dew]

That gabe video was the final push for the blog post

[rare creek]

the summer update should add half life 2: return to ravenholm (developed by arkane studios)

[next nymph]

summer update adds the 10th class:

https://tenor.com/view/you-fucked-up-my-face-mitchell-hdtf-hunt-down-the-freeman-gif-14720565

[formal dew]

i got in a lakeside casual match and everyone left

its been quite a while and no ones gotten in

i'm gonna see how long itll last

done

[paper sluice]

does anyone know if theres any mod that replaces the mercs with their voodoo cursed skins
like model and all

[grim parcel]

@high current are you on tf2 rn?

[high current]

I was yeh. My bad I don’t check discord much when playing.

[summer steeple]

bruh

[summer steeple]

i just want to take this in for a second

conc'd, sure

burning, of course

rotting??? hallucinating?????

[formal dew]

Maybe rotting means the mannpower plague

[wintry marlin]

tf_medieval_thirdperson 1 is a real console command, apparently

[formal dew]

Ye

[jaunty willow]

yep

[rare creek]

new crosshair just dropped

[crisp cedar]

why

[kind falcon]

Is not as flashing as the other one

loving it

https://tenor.com/view/tiger-tiger-cubs-you-and-me-cute-gif-15623250

[next nymph]

improved accuracy vs rayne

[rare creek]

what's wrong with it

[crisp cedar]

didnt say anything about it

i just asked why

[rare creek]

becuz it's better than the older one I made

[crisp cedar]

why an animated crosshair to begin with

[rare creek]

so it's easier to focuso n

[crisp cedar]

source?

[rare creek]

yes this is for source

[crisp cedar]

actually no nvm

i get it. placebo effect

[kind falcon]

you just get mesmerized and stare at it blankly while the best time of your life slowly fades away

applicable for anything

[rare creek]

I hate my puter all my enemies are inside it

[kind falcon]

i hate my puter it has made me my enemy

[high current]

There is some merit to it being easier to focus on. Most animals, including humans, naturally gravitate towards looking at moving things, and flashing colors is a pretty good analogy to movement.
Also colorful things tend to be eyegrabbing, I don’t know the exact technical reason, but the reason humans and other primates have relatively developed color vision in the animal kingdom is the amount of fruit that make up primate diets, and color recognition helps tremendously for judging ripe vs spoiled or even just spotting fruit among leaves.

Though there’s been an argument for a long time about how much you should actually look at your crosshair. I think the recent non-scientific mass-theory about it is focusing on your crosshair makes tracking aim easier, focusing on your target and using the crosshair to “calibrate” your intuition on where the center of your screen is makes flick shots easier.

[rare creek]

228 3 3
255 140 0
255 237 0
0 128 38
0 77 255
117 7 135

[potent wolf]

numbers

[high current]

More like funbers

[next nymph]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nimber

[summer steeple]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1039243316920844428/1074811057014587444/2023-02-13_14-54-53.mp4

managed to get the player to not respawn while being revived

normally the game does this for you but because i'm spawning the revive marker and not the game, the player doesn't have a revive marker attached to them internally so the check fails

[crisp cedar]

he's back 😰

[summer steeple]

he's bag

unless i'm missing something else, the only thing that doesn't work now is the "decline" button

but i don't think i can fix that under vscripts current restrictions

[rare creek]

is it possible to overwrite gameinfo.txt with a mod in the custom folder

[paper sluice]

wrong thing i thought it as items_game epic fai l

idk

[limpid panther]

more graphs

changing water changes literally nothing, since the demo is in cp_process mid. Which is good to know, I guess

its interesting how shadows_low almost doesn't affect performance but makes variance 15% higher. So framerate over any given run varies much more

[unborn pecan]

Sup TF2ers

[summer steeple]

tf2bers

[limpid panther]

@left sand I just saw this note on the docs, and I think I might be seeing them not applying on this graph. Could you elaborate on what makes the settings not apply or is it not known?

I've been applying the cvars for each setting by rconning the command in the main menu

[next nymph]

https://tenor.com/view/chad-tf-tf2-soldier-tf2-soldier-gif-21948427

[craggy ridge]

smash

[summer steeple]

grommit mug my beloved

I really gotta watch all of wallace and grommit one day

I watched the original 3 all through my childhood and apparently own a movie, but its been so long since i've watched that one that i don't remember it at all

[next nymph]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CZbOfODJfM here's a good starting point

[summer steeple]

just from the thumbnail i was thinking "is this a porn parody"

[cursive peak]

https://www.twitch.tv/rglgg

About a half hour to Highlander.

[radiant merlin]

stream is ded

surprise big not

[summer steeple]

vscript is sick of my shit

[mystic turtle]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2926612117

Found this, I like the idea

animation could use some work, though

[warped plume]

convince me to play tf2!!

[mystic turtle]

i dunno bro

[rare creek]

@worldly zealot how do u get the dark sky in your frag video

[small siren]

*@fiona how

do u get the dark sky in

your frag video*

- 👑 Lucy

[kind falcon]

focusing on that crosshair really hard

[rare creek]

?

the point of the clip is to show that people were actually coordinating in casual lmao

not to show my crosshair

[crisp cedar]

i would not be able to play with this crosshair

[kind falcon]

im just really jealous of that and trying to move the discussion from it.

[worldly zealot]

lawena has those skyboxes built in

[rare creek]

lmao

this is my scattergun

[potent wolf]

Floating point

[summer steeple]

idk if i'm just bad or what but god vscript is just like

a nightmare

like its object oriented but it feels very inconsistent about how tf it works

like oh, i spawn an entity via a class, then i need to manually add that class to the entity so it can use functions from it

it feels like in trying to make things simple, squirrel just makes things more complicated

I have like 0 clue what something has access to until i try it and it errors out

bruhhhh

I made some of my variables global and now they don't work??

I feel like the deeper i go into this the less i understand WHY DOES IT NOT WORK

i'm fucking dying

[rare creek]

i had no idea what i was doing so i just copied other people's code until it worked

[summer steeple]

the thing is that my code was working until i made it more complex

[rare creek]

but all i was trying to do was make a brainfuck interpreter in vscript

[small siren]

*the thing is that my

code was working until i

made it more complex*

- fiend

[summer steeple]

I added a class so I could try and essentially overwrite a function

and then like everything broke

[rare creek]

i think its less of squirrel being weird and more of source engine being weird

[summer steeple]

i don't think so

cause its like

it just doesn't have access to these things

but giving it access is super tedious and requires me to basically like rewrite my fucking code

I thought "hm maybe if i add my old code to a class and then just give it access to that class it'll work"

but no, that somehow broke my old code

which now reads null data at some point somehow???

like

it clones a table, which is GLOBAL

and that doesn't work

so now i'm not sure where to go from here

because to me the options are either:
A. rewrite a ton of code and have checks fucking everywhere to make sure everything has access to what it needs
B. make literally everything global (why god why)

like at that point i'm missing the point of this being an object oriented language

ok i figured out the error but it literally made no sense because it was leading me to a line which only gets executed on setup phase end

...on an entity with a think calling this error every tick

nvm the error still happens???

this is just straight up lying to me

restarting the game fixed it

huh??? new error that only happens when i'm in bounds???

but like the error doesn't make sense

bruh its literally printing a line, and then erroring out with the line BEFORE the print

HOW

its almost impressive how much stuff has broken

i think i finally fixed everything

[potent wolf]

(5 minutes until something else breaks )

[summer steeple]

yeah...

[high current]

If you’re not breaking things then you’re not trying hard enough👀

[rare creek]

after nine years in d

[summer steeple]

i need a break lol

but, everything is functional

[formal dew]

detox by playing phlog pyro for 2 hours

[summer steeple]

mvm revive marker script is updated

and uhhh

yeah

shameless plug
https://tf2maps.net/downloads/simple-mvm-revive-marker.15222/

I think i've done all i can do to get this as close to the original thing as possible

the one issue is that the cancel button doesn't work but i can't intercept that

[mystic turtle]

https://tenor.com/view/tf2-soldier-smile-smirk-gaming-gif-16547909

By the way, is it just me or do all the VScript files have... funny file extension names?

[summer steeple]

its because they use the squirrel language, which uses nut files because, squirrels

[mystic turtle]

I see

[left sand]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGw5AOtjeKE

[radiant merlin]

valve killed the hype for the next update

good

[radiant merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/walter-white-breaking-bad-walter-heisenberg-crawl-space-gif-19584363

if "community fixes for the game" means tc2

i'll count it as a major update

also, we'll get dxvk in the next updates right?

or was it a ?

[left sand]

👀

[hybrid cloud]

lmao

they knew gamers were hyping it up too much

now hold yer horses fellers we arent making an update update just something smissmas sized

[radiant merlin]

at least they shouldn't name the update as just "summer pack"

they could be more original y'know

[hybrid cloud]

2023 summerpack

[summer steeple]

huh they didn't update the steam version

thats funny that they actually felt like they needed to update it

[radiant merlin]

heavy update has been saved

[formal dew]

I sure hope someone got fired for that blunder

^meme text before anyone asks

[wintry marlin]

Are you gaslighting bestie

[formal dew]

Maybe they expected more internal support than what happened in reality

but still, that's sort of appreciated

[unborn pecan]

HAHAHHAHA

🤣

[formal dew]

Very funny, most jocular

Can't wait for someone to get 2000 reddit karma for posting the final scene from heavy is dead

[formal dew]

Gabe newell is literally going to resurrect the ussr

[radiant merlin]

y'know, that doesn't mean we can't get NEW things

we could get the vsh map that lizard is making

[summer steeple]

not necessarily his, its not like the vscript for that isn't public, but yeah

[formal dew]

https://tenor.com/view/my-disappointment-is-immeasurable-and-gif-20080022

why is there a secret bitcoin logo in that gif

[radiant merlin]

bitcoin disappointed the environment

[spare obsidian]

tf2 fans hyping up shit to find out its just something different challenge

[formal dew]

society if people didn't develop parasocial attachments to tf2

[spare obsidian]

terminally online people be like

[next nymph]

crypto jumpscare

[spare obsidian]

imagine if tf2 gets l4d2's func_evalator

for context: that Entity is basically a func door but counts towards navmesh calculation

[high current]

You think we could convince valve to un-hardcode a few hud things like item charge meter colors or Uber label shadows?👀

[next nymph]

testhudanim my beloved

[craggy ridge]

I wonder why is that sv_cheats 1 only even

[next nymph]

i assume its just making debug commands restricted first, asking questions later

i dont see a valid reason to keep it restricted. I always assumed valve just didnt see a use case for it beyond debugging where you could have cheats on, and figured it's better safe than sorry

[craggy ridge]

A friend sent me this a few days earlier

You have NO FUCKING IDEA

On how much I am laughing at her fucking face

Not going to lie I can not be sad at this news because the sentiment of disappointment is not even close to how much satisfaction I get over being right and correctly predicting that it would just be an out of season holiday update with no specific theme

[rare creek]

If they finally add dxvk, I won't forgive them because it's been 41 days since the last update, is it that hard to add it to the game?

They added vscript faster than dxvk

[grim parcel]

pretty sure they're going to

at least it's supposed to be soon

[rare creek]

https://tenor.com/view/soon-gif-19121692

[crisp cedar]

https://tenor.com/view/fool-poor-edgeworth-phoenix-wright-gif-20480828

i told them

and they thought i was crazy

but i was right that this would happen

and because of that i am not disappointed

i think valve probably noticed people say its a major update and whatever so they decided to do some damage control and edit the blog post before it's too late

[crisp cedar]

hoooly fuck

[mystic turtle]

I already cashed in

too bad it's so hard to find robot money furnaces in this day and age

everyone buys them off of scrap.tf before I can get them

and it's such a hassle to go around backpack.tf

nvm, stn.trading just restocked

[left sand]

hm?

[slender nexus]

Would DXVK actually do anything under windows

idk if there'd be that much fps uplift compared to dx

[left sand]

so you think vscript was started from scream fortress release?

[rare creek]

No, I think it was started on November 5

[left sand]

how on earth would you think that

thats when they released the beta

[rare creek]

I had completely forgotten about that.

[rare creek]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-angry-gif-26570365

WHAT

[radiant merlin]

how tf does this even happen?

[potent wolf]

Bots?

[radiant merlin]

yeah of course bots do it but how

[potent wolf]

Downloading the depots manually?

Or the bots just dont have enough accounts

[rare creek]

By the way, you correctly pointed to scream fortress, because that's where they added maps that use an unhealthy amount of modifiers, and that's why the contractor decided to add vscript

So it took him about 56 days to add vscript

[formal dew]

#savetf22

[left sand]

no

[rare creek]

He had always dreamed of adding vscript, and when he was finally hired to work on tf2, he immediately started working on adding it.

162 days

https://tenor.com/view/robin-hood-fortune-teller-future-prediction-gif-25704815

[left sand]

he wasnt hired to work on tf2 and he wasnt hired 162 days before

[radiant merlin]

he did magic and boom vscript in tf2

1 day

[hoary geyser]

he received the email from valve and the beta was out by the end of the day

[potent wolf]

source for this?

[rare creek]

Trust me

[potent wolf]

why?

[formal dew]

-30 points, failure to provide accurate citations

See me during office hours

[spare obsidian]

didn't ficool was the one who convince the contractor to add vscript?

[high current]

When I was in college if you didn’t include citations it was almost certain expulsion unless you had a real good reason why you couldn’t. Schools really took plagiarism seriously.

Im not familiar with the exact penalty, but I had one scare where a professor called me into their office because my submission was auto-flagged for plagiarism. Turned out my paper was flagged because my lastname matched “a students earlier work without citation”, that student also being me. Needless to say we chuckled and my paper was accepted in the end.

[next nymph]

i would always get my bibliography flagged by the system because other people cited the same stuff before

[high current]

I guess whatever system my school used had figured out bibliographies by then. Tbh I was sorta shocked that the plagerism scare came when it did. It flagged my final paper for a class the first semester of my senior year. That means for 4 years it never flagged my last name, which didn’t change.

I would have thought that if that issue was going to happen it’d happen my freshman year.

[rare creek]

i think valve hates us

https://vxtwitter.com/zenithvx/status/1625733435321876482

[potent wolf]

good

now it's harder for youtubers to clickbait

nothing else has changed

[rare creek]

I dunno about that

[potent wolf]

why?

[rare creek]

wouldn't valve want youtubers to clickbait about it

[potent wolf]

No, because they were making stuff up that wasn't actually going to happen

All that was promised was a themeless holiday-sized update

[rare creek]

it literally said and who knows what else and full update sized update

[potent wolf]

that was the implication from the beginning

[rare creek]

they never said holiday sized update before editing it

it literally said update sized update

holiday updates aren't full updates they're just minor shit like cosmetics and like 3 maps

[potent wolf]

people were saying that they were going to add new weapons, and rebalances

[rare creek]

the post implied that

[potent wolf]

The last few Team Fortress summer events have only been item updates. But this year, ... — with items, maps, taunts, unusual effects, war paints...

where does it say weapons?

or balance changes

[rare creek]

whatever im not gonna argue about this anymore

[potent wolf]

ok

?

[left sand]

literally the tf2 blog is like written like that

bombastic

[rare creek]

i hate this community

[left sand]

and silly

like for comedy

and people overinterpreted it

so they had to tone it down

to clarify

[crisp cedar]

because the tf2 audience today isnt the same audience it had many many years ago

theres people playing the game that were 9 years old when meet your match came out

and argue that competitive tf2 ruined tf2

literally most of these people are children because theyve never witnessed an update release

[high current]

Also saying “update sized update” implies a major update isn’t super correct. Every update is update sized, by definition. People interpreting that as “major update” and reporting on it is precisely why valve doesn’t make promises.

[potent wolf]

potato-sized potato

:O

[crisp cedar]

they never said the word major whatsoever

[high current]

Exactly

[crisp cedar]

large boulder the size of a small boulder

[potent wolf]

b-but they said update!

:(

valve lied to us

[high current]

If I see the word “optimized” one time in the patch notes it’ll make my year🤷‍♂️

[potent wolf]

removed unusuals from the game

[high current]

I meannnnnnn

[crisp cedar]

snakewater snakes

[high current]

Better than sharks. I played on a map is a 3v3 tournament where if you looked at net graph the whole thing was entities because the map had a pit of sharks on it and caused everyone to play at 50fps.

[potent wolf]

ouch

[high current]

Yeh that 3s tournament was rough. Fists of steel and wrangler weren’t banned. You ever try killing a wrangled sentry with 3 people?

Prize pool was 20 keys and iirc every team refused to finish the tournament.

[potent wolf]

lmao

[grim parcel]

no i just need a sapper and a cool trickstab

[high current]

It wasn’t a small tournament either. It was at least 10-20 teams.

Imagine getting that many tf2 players to agree it’s not worth $50

[left sand]

i wouldn't say the update has to be a nothing burger either

just because it's community content and fixes doesn't mean it'll be bad

[potent wolf]

Im personally quite excited for it

[left sand]

yes i think people can still be excited about what could happen

there's lots of cool stuff that the community has already done in terms of game fixes and patches in the past year

including major changes which touched the whole game and engine like vscript

[small siren]

*including major

changes which touched the whole game

and engine like vscript*

- mcoms

[left sand]

so i wouldn't exclude similar extensive changes outside the possibilities

[slender nexus]

the idea of new maps being permanently added to the map pool is good

[left sand]

yes and the fact that we will literally have every thing as in a major update besides some balance changes is cool

and besides, some fixes can affect game balance for sure

so i would keep my eye out, be optimistic

this is a great sign already that the tf2 team communicated on the blog

and listened to the community with the tf2 mods, savetf2 and the workshop letter

[slender nexus]

I'm surprised that blog post didn't say anything along the lines of 'we're not going to ship Christmas-themed maps and war paints going forward because their appeal has worn thin'

There's so many goddamn elf war paints

[potent wolf]

Why would they do that though

[daring tiger]

Holiday updates are the “update sized updates” now

[high current]

I agree with mcoms for sure. I was mostly just saying that people should be happy to get anything, and that was not the sentiment YouTubers we’re setting expectations of in the community

[daring tiger]

They are the updates we are getting

[craggy ridge]

there are people playing the game who weren't even born when the game came out

[wintry marlin]

This goes against their mantra of never cancelling anything.

[slender nexus]

I was 11 when I started playing

[wintry marlin]

There's going to be 30 more halloween updates for the next 30 years.

[high current]

Those people are old enough to drive now in the US.

[wintry marlin]

Consider that valve never has to make another halloween boss because community can make their own.

Never another MvM mission because community can make their own.

[cursive peak]

Every update is an update sized update. I thought that was part of the humor.

[high current]

Honestly I wouldn’t be against valve cutting a few of the past Halloween maps. Namely ones that spam bosses for the sake of “haha goofy spooky”

[wintry marlin]

If Valve ever does anything it gets perverted by greed.

if there's another 4 cities, you bet people will spend their life savings on the pink golden pan.

[daring tiger]

Community hasn’t really made a new boss sadly

They just spam them

[wintry marlin]

unfortunate, I know

it's like silent hill treatment.

[slender nexus]

you become the boss in crasher

[wintry marlin]

each boss had their own place of belonging

but got turned into a party trick.

[spare obsidian]

some people is saying "oh well another updated with broken maps"

yeah

this community doesn't like anything lol

[slender nexus]

feels like I'm in a Minecraft trade server when the horseman spawns

[left sand]

like literally this is how a lot of major updates were

[slender nexus]

crasher is such a good map

[left sand]

like why do we need arbitrary new weapons or reskins or balance changes

why does that make it major

the only problems in the game is maybe sniper but thats just the game unfortunately, and then theres some useless weapons but who cares

like theres way too many weapons

[high current]

I agree

[wintry marlin]

children who don't know that other games exist I guess

[spare obsidian]

they're unironically saying that just let the community make the updates: yeah remember end of the line and invasion and the monetary issues? lol

[left sand]

yeah like idk theyre getting pretty much all they want

[slender nexus]

The bruh moment of EOTL and Invasion

[left sand]

new cosmetics, effects, taunts, maps, and community code fixes

[wintry marlin]

here's a new tf2 challenge:
play every valve game

[high current]

Children want updates the scale of Minecraft. Literally look at Minecraft updates the past 5 years, they’re massive and people still going “this isn’t enough😤”

[cursive peak]

I didn't think EotL was that bad an update.

[wintry marlin]

3% completion rate

[slender nexus]

ricochet moment

[spare obsidian]

the problem was how greedy the guys where

about it

that's the problem

valve gave us trust

[cursive peak]

I meant from the end user side.

[spare obsidian]

and what we did it?

[slender nexus]

Good luck finding a PS2 copy of HL1 to play the exclusive Decay campaign

[craggy ridge]

it would be so epic if there was a boss that used the fog mechanic in the game