Move 5 discussion

[slim bridge]

Please check out Coach Dane’s analysis #1423672613796057211 and discuss move 5 ideas here

[nimble pond]

gotham plays either Bf5 or Nf6

After Nf6 we have two options ( three technically but Nc3 does not make too much sense because black can quickly develop with Bg4)
those options are Nxf6+ and Bd3
Nxf6+ is the standard line and we can anticipate dxf6, but we can go into a proper tartakower per coach’s suggestion

Bd3 is an interesting move, the plan is to massively expedite development after Qxd4 with Nf3! and guarding the e4 knight after the queen moves with Qe2. At the end of the line, black only has a knight developed and we have a knight, bishop, and possibly a queen

Both are lines i recommend looking into

If Bf5 we should simply follow a main line with Ng3, followed by either Be2 or Nf3

[burnt stirrup]

I like the idea of Bd3 after Nf6. I was thinking after 6.Nf3 Qd8 7.Qe2 and after a move like Bg4, we can trade knights on f6 and black has to ruin their king side pawn structure to take the knight. And if black decides to instead play like e6, then the white squared bishop is blocked in by the pawn. Additionally if black moves their queen somewhere else then we can do the same, but black has a third option of moving their king which also does not look that good for black. I'm not a great chess player so not sure if there's a line that I might be missing. And of course black can choose to take our knight first completely nullifying any of those ideas.

Coach Dane's analysis of 4...Nxf6 also looks very appealing so I wouldn't mind going that route also.

And also if after 7.Qe2 Nxe4 we can take back with the queen and the white squared bishop still cannot comfortably develop.

[acoustic socket]

So, after 4 .. Nf6 5 Bd3 Qxd4 6 Nf3 Qd5 (Qd8, Qa4) 7 Qe2 Bg4 8 O-O Nbd7 (e6, Bxf3) 9 Rd1 we have some compensation for the pawn, but is it enough?
Black has no weaknesses and can catch up in development it seems.

[nimble pond]

i dont know if Rd1 or O-O was in the line but i think we should start an attack by then

we might be able to kickstart it with something like Neg5 or forcing weaknesses on the kingside with Nxf6+

Black must defend f7 with a different piece than the queen as there are Bc4 ideas

O-O is probably sound too with similar ideas

[acoustic socket]

Let's see a concrete line we can discuss (whether the d4 sac is sound)

[nimble pond]

so after 7.Bg4 is the main line discussed, there is 8. Neg5 , which essentially forces Bh5. Our plan is to either castle and then attack or to play Bc4 immediately. after 9. Bc4 there looks like either Qd6 or Qf5

If Qd6 our best option is most likely to castle with various open lines and developed pieces that we can use, which i would say is enough compensation

If Qf5 our best option seems to be to repeat, but i think we have h3 with a threat of a fork on g4 that does bot seem easy to deal with (note that after Bg6? we have Nh4! which simultaneously threatens the queen and launching a devastating attack with Bxf7+)

the question is do we run out of steam before then

[burnt stirrup]

Well here my idea was not to castle but instead play 8 Nxf6 forcing the king to move or for black to take with the pawn which weakens the kingside. Then again at that point it seems we are not in as big of a development lead as hoped.

[burnt stirrup]

And I agree with playing this too.

[acoustic socket]

According to our polls at this time, our early recommendations would be something like:

First Draft for Move 5

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**If GothamChess plays 4 .. Nf6, we play 5 Nxf6 capturing his knight that is attacking our knight and causing GothamChess to double his f-pawns while recapturing our knight.

If GothamChess plays 4 .. Bf5, we play 5 Ng3 securing our knight and attack the Bf5. After 5 .. Bg6, we intend 6 h4 threatening h5 to trap the Bg6.

If GothamChess plays 4 .. Nd7 (Karpov Variation), we play 5 Nf3 developing our knight toward the center.**