If after 1. e4, .. c6 is played by Gotham, what should we play on move 2?

[plush schooner]

2. d4 is the main response in the master database. However 2. Nf3 seems to score well against him (13 games)

[turbid willow]

I think it's great to play Nf3 if we prefer to stay in the book as much as posible, instead if we want to play more agressive we can choose d4, maybe other moves we can play are c3 and Nc3

[violet cloak]

Personally in my games, i am still trying to figure out how to play against Caro Kann. I have tried fantasy variation but not sure if it should be tried against a master

[turbid willow]

Maybe is so risky, in my opinion we should play the advance variation and try to find a nice attack over his king, which likely will be at the kingside

[small pebble]

I personally hate the Caro Kann 😅

But imo let’s try Nf3 if he doesn’t do well against that

[turbid willow]

Wait i posted this thinking about the sicilian 🤦‍♂️ I didn't realized sorry

But also works for caro kann i think

[gaunt fox]

Attempt to "Stay in Book":

2. d4 if we want to play the "main-line" move.

Nc3, if we want to play into something like this:
2. Nc3 - d5
3. d4 - dxe4
4. Nxe4 - Nf6
5. Nxf6+ - exf6
6. c3 ...

2. Nf3 is also good for staying in book, and after d5 we would (likely) want to play: Nc3, d3, exd5 or e5^^^

^^^: e5 could possibly be good for "getting out of book" too, as there are not many games in the opening database (when compared to the other moves listed).

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For White to attempt to "get out of book as quickly as possible":

2. f4, Be2, h3, a3, or c3 (see potential c3 line below):

3. c3 - d5

4. exd5 - cxd5

5. Nf3 - Nc6

6. Bb5

Reminder: The above line is probably not optimal (5. d4 is better looking, to me) but it will get us out of book "fairly quickly", and is "not losing" IMO.

[gaunt fox]

Personal Recommendation(s):

I think we should attempt to "stay in book" as long as possible, because:

1. We are playing as White, so we should have "some sort of small advantage, while staying in book in the opening" (especially when following the "Main-Line(s)").

2. Most people on our team are (probably) Beginners to Low Intermediates, and playing from an "Opening Book" (when allowed^^^) is beneficial for everyone, but especially "lower rated players", IMO.

^^^: "... It is OK to discuss opening lines found in game databases (including win/draw/loss statistics) and strategies for using opening databases in club forums. But the same as all games on Chess.com, engines and outside help are not allowed ...".

Note: Partial quote above is from the link below

https://support.chess.com/en/articles/8614177-how-do-i-play-vote-chess

[plush schooner]

So what responses shall we poll? 2 .. d4, .. Nc3, .. Nf3. Anything else?

What are the ideas for these alternatives?

[turbid willow]

I think that there are nice

[gaunt fox]

c4 could (possibly) be another option for the poll - to (likely) turn it into the "Accelerated Panov attack".

Note: Even though I suggested it for the poll, I also don't think it is good for Beginners, so that is why I won't be voting for it (for more info, see "AI answer" below).

"AI answer:

No, the Accelerated Panov is not ideal for beginners due to its sharp, aggressive nature and complex tactical lines that require significant theoretical knowledge. It's a sophisticated attacking opening best suited for experienced players who are comfortable with attacking chess and have studied the concrete variations. Beginners might be better served by studying the main line Exchange Variation of the Caro-Kann, which is more positional and less demanding, or simpler openings..."

[waxen knot]

test

[faint wraith]

can confirm, i can speak here

[placid patrol]

d4 and play the tal variation. So much fun and he recommends it in his courses so it’s peak cobtent

[opaque breach]

i agree with playing the tal, best variation for white to fight for a win imo

[plush schooner]

I am planning to include 2 d4, Nc3, Nf3, c4, d3 in our Move 2 poll for 1 e4 c6. Anything else? These are the 5 most played moves from the Master Game database.

I have not included moves that were not played in at least 1% of the Master Games database. Let me know if you want to see one or more of the sub 1%'ers added. Also, please explain why you prefer that move.

[frosty dove]

d4!

Theres two lines

C5 and Bf5

[plush schooner]

Poll is up for "What shall we play on move 2, if 1. e4 c6 is played?" on #next-move-polls

We can continue to discuss our alternatives here. You can also promote your move here by explaining why you chose it over the alternatives.

[violet cloak]

There are 2 lessons on chess.com on Caro Kann.

1. By chesscom coach highlighting perspectives from both sides https://www.chess.com/lessons/learn-the-caro-kann-defense

2. By GM Sam Shankland from black perspective

https://www.chess.com/lessons/the-complete-caro

The Short variation seemed to be the most challenging for black. But we’re playing a Caro Kann expert so idk