#networking | Linus Tech Tips | Page 176

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 3:38 AM

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the copper version is 30m at $60

fresh copper Dec 10, 2019, 3:38 AM

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I would expect fiber to be cheaper in most cases since glass is less expensive than copper

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 3:38 AM

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i see

fresh copper Dec 10, 2019, 3:38 AM

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I know that for short runs, a DAC cable can be a bit cheaper

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 3:39 AM

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oh let me look for that instead

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oh but they dont go long distances

fresh copper Dec 10, 2019, 3:39 AM

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I also think that the logic for the converter from SFP+ to copper is more complex but I don't know for sure

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 3:39 AM

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its like 1m or 0.5m

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aww DAC is too short

fresh copper Dec 10, 2019, 3:39 AM

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Yea, DAC is only meant for inside a rack

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The cables are also huge

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Anything much longer and you pretty much want to go for fiber

deep verge Dec 10, 2019, 3:41 AM

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i think ive mentioned how my servers are at my school, well, half the point is allowing other students to have servers too. so, i said, lets get a US-48 as primary switch here, and it was ordered a few months ago, thx governemnt for being slow

fresh copper Dec 10, 2019, 3:43 AM

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I didn’t quite see that but it definitely makes sense in your case

deep verge Dec 10, 2019, 3:44 AM

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you said DAC cables are huge, i have a couple SFP+ 2m dac cables, they are tiny, is it the longer ones that get really big?

fresh copper Dec 10, 2019, 3:47 AM

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I wish that my school let us have servers. The CS department has some servers that we can use for basic stuff but it would be nice to have my own server. Currently just got one at home and one coloed with someone else.

I was exaggerating a little bit but they are usually thicker than even UTP cables. I think in terms of the really huge ones are the QSFP ones or the 100G

deep verge Dec 10, 2019, 3:47 AM

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i actually have a QSFP+ 40G .5m cable on teh way, so, i guess ill get to see

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yay IB link between a couple servers

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im pretty sure my nics can do 56gbps

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 3:59 AM

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@fresh copper so, I am looking for LC Multi-mode fiber cables?

📎 unknown.png

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what doesn't make sense to me is how they got glass to be flexible

spare bay Dec 10, 2019, 5:19 AM

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Some glass is flexible, some glass is brittle

fresh copper Dec 10, 2019, 5:41 AM

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The actual fibers are very thin which helps as well. Most of the thickness of the cable is from padding

jaunty talon Dec 10, 2019, 7:13 AM

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The answer why SR and even LR is cheaper on 10G than copper, is simple. You barely manifacture any 10G copper compared to fiberoptics which means much more R&D is done on SFP+/SFP28 :)

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@little schooner are you looking for a specific type of MM cable or just a regular LC-LC Patch?

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 1:19 PM

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@jaunty talon I think just regular lc to lc cable

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As long as cable type for sfp+module says MMF, I should be using an multimode lc to lc cable I presume

waxen scroll Dec 10, 2019, 1:55 PM

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OM3

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 2:07 PM

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@waxen scroll I saw that but I didn't know what it meant

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I could Google it I suppose

waxen scroll Dec 10, 2019, 2:08 PM

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aqua colored fiber

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 2:08 PM

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I see it goes up to om4

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But I don't need like long distance

waxen scroll Dec 10, 2019, 2:08 PM

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if you did, why are you buying multimode

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 2:09 PM

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@waxen scroll I was just buying the cheaper one

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Idk

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My fiber knowledge is limited

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I remember a tidbit that said single mode is like 80km reach

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And that the price is basically above 100

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Also I learned that network card interfaces DO make a difference. Like intel's DA, LR, and SR interfaces

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If I bought the wrong card , a cable medium just wouldn't work with it

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I was so close to hitting buy on the wrong thing lol

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@waxen scroll does it make sense to run VMs over network?

waxen scroll Dec 10, 2019, 2:27 PM

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it makes sense to run them whereever max performance is

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 3:07 PM

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@waxen scroll currently it's over 10g and I saw max speed of 212mbps

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But you think it would behave more stable over fiber?

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Like it feels it stutters but that could be because copper is high latency?

jaunty talon Dec 10, 2019, 4:03 PM

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@little schooner https://www.fs.com/de-en/products/41730.html

FS Germany

OM3 50/125 LC-LC Multimode Fibre Patch Lead Duplex 1m (3ft) - Aqua

1m (3ft) OM3 50/125 LC-LC UPC Multimode Fibre Patch Lead Duplex 2.0mm PVC(OFNR) at reliable fibre Cable manufacturer FS.COM. In stock, Custom Service on-line.

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FS has a good pricepoint vs quality :) We use them a lot at Embark and I used them a lot at DreamHack also! :)

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 4:56 PM

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@jaunty talon thanks. And yes I've heard good things about fs. I was this close to buying their poe switch but they were plagued with supply issues during that time

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All the way from August to December it would take to be available

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But cables say they ship next day. That's pretty awesome

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 6:45 PM

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I couldn't find a video online that compared latency between fiber and copper while used in a vmware virtual machine situation

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i guess it was very specific and that I would have to test it myself if I wanted answers

waxen scroll Dec 10, 2019, 6:46 PM

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i dont recall the true answer for that but its nothing someone like you will notice

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its a sub milisecond difference, probably in microseconds

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and that comes down to platform level too

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 6:49 PM

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I see

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So running vm over a SAN is basically similar to copper vs fiber

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Well I wasn't saturating my connection too

waxen scroll Dec 10, 2019, 6:50 PM

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it should be, but like i said its platform specific

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 6:50 PM

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thats good to know

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At least the prof will be happy with the news

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We asked the network administrator for the college to run some new fiber

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quick fast we got declined

waxen scroll Dec 10, 2019, 6:50 PM

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for example, i might have an ASIC that runs 8 copper ports shared 5gbit and then an asic for 2 fiber ports thats line rate

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 6:51 PM

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I love it when things are line rate

waxen scroll Dec 10, 2019, 6:51 PM

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ignoring the platform at short distances theres almost no advantage to fiber

little schooner Dec 10, 2019, 6:52 PM

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Yes. that means I can save some cash

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awesome

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it would be a pain to re-run everything

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especially the junction between upstairs and downstairs

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oof, that was a tough one

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I was about to say something and then I caught myself

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Synology NASes dont do 10G for writes at the small business level

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but for reads, they do. Still...

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it would be nice if they beefed up the NAS a bit

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@waxen scroll ohh, did i tell you? My prof is sending in another quote for new equipment but guess what? it has things in the quote of stuff we already bought

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I tried telling him to send it to me before replying to the email going forward with it but I still didnt get a look at it

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so whats gonna happen is it will be processed and we are getting duplicate things we dont need

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This was said a week in advanced before they needed him to reply back

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sometimes I dont know what to do with stuff like that

waxen scroll Dec 10, 2019, 7:17 PM

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linusPerfect

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 12:55 AM

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📎 unknown.png

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someone, please give me fiber

waxen scroll Dec 11, 2019, 1:04 AM

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no

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 1:06 AM

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and the file size is wrong. It should read like 998 GB

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I deleted a lot of old stuff

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@waxen scroll syncthing is one interesting piece of software.

waxen scroll Dec 11, 2019, 1:11 AM

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i prefer one drive

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 1:11 AM

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@waxen scroll but with my connection, it would barely work

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no fiber

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I have VMs on SL and want to make sure they are backed up every week

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onedrive works great for my mom

waxen scroll Dec 11, 2019, 1:12 AM

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i thought we agreed no fiber needed

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 1:13 AM

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I will still have dreams about it

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Fiber connection.

waxen crystal Dec 11, 2019, 1:15 AM

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Hmmm, fiber

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📎 unknown.png

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Yeah it's pretty allright

waxen scroll Dec 11, 2019, 1:17 AM

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meanwhile im unhappy with 300mb and want to downgrade to 100m

waxen crystal Dec 11, 2019, 1:18 AM

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Yeah after a point the raw speed doesn't do anything considering most sites aren't going to serve you at that rate

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I did try to downgrade a little while ago... and they were like, no no! please let us give you the gigabit for a lower price!

waxen scroll Dec 11, 2019, 1:19 AM

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they keep bumping our speeds for free but raising prices when renewal comes

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if i drop to 100m its only $30/m

waxen crystal Dec 11, 2019, 1:20 AM

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Well that sure can't be here

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📎 unknown.png

waxen scroll Dec 11, 2019, 1:21 AM

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at least its unlimited

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they took unlimited away from everyone and put it behind a $50/m fee

waxen crystal Dec 11, 2019, 1:22 AM

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How much would you get with that $30 rate?

waxen scroll Dec 11, 2019, 1:22 AM

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1TB

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i only use about 350gb/m, but if family is visiting its possible to blow 1TB

waxen crystal Dec 11, 2019, 1:24 AM

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Yeah, same for me. Man I would happily give up unlimited to save some money but that isn't an option

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 2:31 AM

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@waxen crystal I just want better upload speed

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Should I complain to my lawmakers

deep verge Dec 11, 2019, 2:47 AM

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if anyone knows much about the quanta lb4m switch, im having issues with the web console on mine

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portscan shows nothing

waxen scroll Dec 11, 2019, 3:06 AM

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alright boyez i got a big change tonight and im gonna put on the christian music to get right with the lord

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no outage pls

deep verge Dec 11, 2019, 3:12 AM

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got the web interface, appears the new firmware it came with didnt have it, but the older one does, go figure

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 3:14 AM

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@waxen scroll gl, I know that if I told my professor that, he would of said "just leave it the way it is, I don't want to use vacation time to fix something that shouldn't of broke"

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@deep verge well maybe it was a module that had to be installed with firmware.

waxen scroll Dec 11, 2019, 3:14 AM

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no avoiding it!

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 3:14 AM

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I remember Cisco doing that

waxen scroll Dec 11, 2019, 3:15 AM

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its easy to set a classroom and leave it

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 3:15 AM

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Yeh

deep verge Dec 11, 2019, 3:15 AM

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no, its was straight up removed in 1.1

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but 1.0 has it

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 3:15 AM

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@deep verge I guess because they knew casuals probably didn't use it

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I mean...

deep verge Dec 11, 2019, 3:15 AM

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idfk

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vxware 5.5 or 6.6, doesnt really matter, both are old

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 3:16 AM

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I meant to say that it was internal decision

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It was a lot of work to add new options in GUI after adding them in cli

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@deep verge I'm so happy for 6.7, it's all html5

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Finally, something worth using

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Powercli extremely limited without vcenter

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Basically nothing useful can be done with esxi without vcenter

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Not even making clones or snapshots

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That's vcenter api feature with powercli

deep verge Dec 11, 2019, 3:19 AM

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i didnt say anything about vmware

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i said vxware

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which is the wrong name

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its vxworks

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5.5 or 6.6 though, version numbers are correct

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remember, this is a network switch

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now i have a problem where the 10g links aren't working

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 3:26 AM

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Well if no change was made, it shouldn't just suddenly break

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But you upgraded firmware?

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Yes that is breaking change

deep verge Dec 11, 2019, 3:26 AM

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its not a new problem

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its just now i get to deal with it

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 3:27 AM

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I would call it a show stopper if it was reoccurring

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10g should always work all the time

deep verge Dec 11, 2019, 3:28 AM

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neither of the sfp+ ports are working it appears

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could be the cables, i never got them to show up a link either

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regarldess of what they were plugged in to

cedar cradle Dec 11, 2019, 5:09 AM

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I pretty much have the fastest possible internet in tucson thats dsl

📎 image0.jpg

sand temple Dec 11, 2019, 8:41 AM

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Any1 know how to boost LTE router speed?

quick hollow Dec 11, 2019, 11:50 AM

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Yeah install a better antenna.

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Does it have external antenna ports or can the antennas be unscrewed? If so you can buy a large directional antenna if you have line of sight to the tower or a omnidirectional antenna if not.

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Installed on the roof free of obstruction in all directions is best. However you can install it on the side of the building too. Just find out where your local tower is and make sure you put it on the correct side.

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I have an LTE backup router and just by chaning the small antennas to a large omnidirectional one on the outside of the building I went from about 50mbps to 90.

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Make sure to get a mimo antenna. Poynting makes good ones.

vapid dune Dec 11, 2019, 3:24 PM

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anyone run one of these? https://atlas.ripe.net/about/probes/

RIPE Network Coordination Centre

RIPE Atlas

RIPE Atlas, RIPE, Atlas

clear igloo Dec 11, 2019, 3:26 PM

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@vapid dune Yah, I got one

vapid dune Dec 11, 2019, 3:26 PM

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nice. which version did you get

clear igloo Dec 11, 2019, 3:27 PM

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v3 I think

vernal gust Dec 11, 2019, 3:35 PM

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What are the considerations for having LTE for the house? Anything that snags people?

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 3:53 PM

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@vernal gust it makes for a good backup internet connection if copper lines are down or in places where running wire is more expensive than wisp deployment

vernal gust Dec 11, 2019, 4:02 PM

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I'm mainly looking for an alternative to my dsl connection, 6 down .5 up for 5 years isnt doing hot

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Rural area and all that

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I'm assuming I can get some higher bandwidth through LTE, and drop the expensive Directtv plan in favor of internet media services

carmine moss Dec 11, 2019, 4:07 PM

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it should be a small bit faster if you have a good lte connection

craggy parcel Dec 11, 2019, 9:26 PM

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@vapid dune Yeah, I have one of those as well. V3 according to the atlas site. 😛

paper rampart Dec 11, 2019, 9:31 PM

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Is it difficult to get one? I applied, just curious if I will get one

craggy parcel Dec 11, 2019, 9:40 PM

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Well, if you don't have any, it should be a matter of availability. They want as many as they can afford to deploy. So if you apply for the first, there's almost a guarantee that you'll get it. Especially if the network, on which you plan to deploy it, has none already. But they DO priorities increasing coverage in places where there's not already.

vapid dune Dec 11, 2019, 11:08 PM

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I have one too lol. no difficulty imo

little schooner Dec 11, 2019, 11:20 PM

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Just plug it in.

vapid dune Dec 12, 2019, 12:44 AM

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I mean mines not just plugged in but isolated @little schooner

little schooner Dec 12, 2019, 1:01 AM

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@waxen scroll I ran into a confusing concept. If I want to use vlan 1 as native vlan, having an SSID that isn't tagged would mean I have to make sure that the port connected to the AP is tagged for vlan 1?

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Even though it shouldn't be?

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Which is why I stopped pushing vlan 1 onto my switches

waxen scroll Dec 12, 2019, 1:03 AM

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untagged SSID means it goes to vlan 1

little schooner Dec 12, 2019, 1:03 AM

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@waxen scroll but the port is already untagged for ap for management vlan

waxen scroll Dec 12, 2019, 1:03 AM

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then the ssid uses the management vlan

little schooner Dec 12, 2019, 1:04 AM

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Yeah, so in this case, it not work for me

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It was easier to just tag a different vlan as native and get desired behavior

craggy parcel Dec 12, 2019, 10:05 AM

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@little schooner Unless you setup the port on the switch to accept vlan tags from the AP, the AP will behave as any other client, except maybe for the number of MAC addresses on the port. If you configure the AP to tag packets with a VLAN ID, it will do so, and the switch will either accept that, and put the packets on that VLAN, or it will reject the packets.

little schooner Dec 12, 2019, 1:42 PM

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@craggy parcel hmm see that's the thing though. The SSID is untagged BUT because it's an AP, it's technically still "bridge" traffic, which then means if vlan 1 is untagged, that is still valid because SW to SW is tagged traffic as it travels through towards the end point

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Meaning it could still work even if I don't tag the SSID vlan 1

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But it was confusing to think it that way

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Made a typo and fixed it

craggy parcel Dec 12, 2019, 1:47 PM

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I would say, that depends on the configuration of the switch. If the switch is configured to allow and respect VLAN tags, it will pass the traffic on whatever VLAN the AP tags it with. If the switch does NOT allow tagging, eg. the port is in access mode on a cisco switch, it should either strip the tag, and pass it on the default vlan, or reject the packet.

So, if you do setup the AP to not tag packets with VLAN ID, and configure the switch with a default VLAN, the packets from the AP should be passed to whatever VLAN the port has as it's default/native/untagged (Or whatever your switch calls it)

little schooner Dec 12, 2019, 1:49 PM

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Yes. Currently that is 99 for management of ap

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Also yes, there is a setting that controls how switch handles the tag and whether or not untagged stuff in that same vlan is allowed to pass as well

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Vlan filtering I think it's called. I can have it on strict mode or pass all

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I think a combination of that setting would solve my problem

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In edgeswitch, then it becomes a general port

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I'll leave how everything is now but when 10g switch comes in, time to redo

native kettle Dec 12, 2019, 2:19 PM

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I just upgraded my internet.

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📎 Capture_12-12-2019_1-44-00.PNG

little schooner Dec 12, 2019, 2:49 PM

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50 mbps up is a lot better than what I got

charred meadow Dec 12, 2019, 2:51 PM

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My isp will give at most 10 up. But you can get gigabit down.

little schooner Dec 12, 2019, 2:56 PM

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My ideal speed would be at least 100 mbps up and 150 down

charred meadow Dec 12, 2019, 2:58 PM

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That would be amazing. At school I can get 100 mbps up and down if I plug in.

thick minnow Dec 13, 2019, 1:26 AM

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thats fairly normal for old dsl companies they used to do a percentage and have not changed it to match modern times

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100/10 any way

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:05 AM

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Recently i've lost a lot of speed on my powerline adapter
Used to work fine a month ago then suddenly i'm only getting 5mbp/s
and its very unreliable
i've been using the exact same adapter for 3 years and i've only found issues recently

vernal gust Dec 13, 2019, 3:08 AM

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Get any new appliances recently?

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:29 AM

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mmm not in the room im in..

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but we did get a sodastream in the kitchen..

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:34 AM

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I doubt it's the sodastream

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 4:00 AM

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hmm...

vapid dune Dec 13, 2019, 4:32 AM

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Try unplugging it anyhow lol

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 12:18 PM

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ill try unplugging stuff when i get back home to see

young dove Dec 13, 2019, 1:27 PM

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what's a good price for a normal 1gbps network switch?

carmine moss Dec 13, 2019, 1:29 PM

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managed or unmanaged an how many ports

young dove Dec 13, 2019, 1:30 PM

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What does managed do? Can't I just use my router for that?

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8 port

carmine moss Dec 13, 2019, 1:31 PM

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i guess you just want more port's right so 8 port unmanaged

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arround 20 a 30 usd you can find one

young dove Dec 13, 2019, 1:34 PM

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ok

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Is managed if you have like 24/48 port?

clear igloo Dec 13, 2019, 1:35 PM

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Managed is if you have a GUI/CLI to configure it

carmine moss Dec 13, 2019, 1:36 PM

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managed can be had on all port configs but for just having more port's you don't need it it's more for in a business or if you have an complex network

young dove Dec 13, 2019, 1:36 PM

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ok

carmine moss Dec 13, 2019, 1:37 PM

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managed is also a lot more expensive then unmanged

young dove Dec 13, 2019, 1:37 PM

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Like if I have 1gbps line but 200GB cap limit

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so I could cap download speed

carmine moss Dec 13, 2019, 1:37 PM

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not like that it's more if you have vlans

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a vlan is a virtual network on your actual network like you have an entire network for guest and they can't come on your pc's if there is a vlan

young dove Dec 13, 2019, 1:38 PM

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ok

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I was at a Lan and they were managing the switches...we did have an Apex dc ++ server running

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For the average user managed switches are not needed right?

carmine moss Dec 13, 2019, 1:40 PM

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yeah you don't need it as you only want more ports

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 1:42 PM

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So i'm also having issues with my wifi, its been very unreliable as well recently. I only have a modem that has routing capabilities, is it worth investing on an access point? A friend advised me to get one but I just have no idea on what I should be getting to improve signals and not lose speeds

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 2:45 PM

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@drowsy sierra an access point or wireless repeaters can be used to improve signal coverage. But without a site survey, its hard to say exactly how many you need and where to place them

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 2:56 PM

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We technically have 2 floors and a basement, we're hardly in the basement so we need stable signal on first and second floor

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The modem/router is in the 2nd floor

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I talked to one of my co workers and they said its not a good idea to go for an access point and a router should be good enough

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 2:59 PM

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@drowsy sierra well, they are assuming that you somehow have the router in the center of your home somewhere so signal can evenly reach corners of your home or something

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If the router doesn't have a strong array of far reaching antennas, then an access point makes a lot of sense

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In fact, if the walls between floors is not solid and mostly wood structure, one AP closest to the center in your home should be great to reach the 1st floor

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As for the basement, from my experience, it doesn't reach that well or signal is spotty. I'd recommend running a wire to a second access down down there

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My basement has concrete

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:01 PM

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Apparently my modem/router combo is trash lol

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so i need a dedicated router

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:01 PM

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Which router were you thinking of getting

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:02 PM

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I have not done any research...

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i haven't gotten the time to do so yet

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:02 PM

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Well you either get a nice one and somehow place it near center of your home or

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Buy an access point that can be ceiling mounted anywhere

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And get better results

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:03 PM

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Give me an idea on what to look for

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:03 PM

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That or buy wifi repeaters

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:03 PM

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atleast the type of router and access points

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I have most of my lights connected to my router and some tvs and google homes

clear igloo Dec 13, 2019, 3:03 PM

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Ubiquity has nice APs if you're willing to go that route

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:04 PM

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Ubiquity is what one of my friends told me to get

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but its close to $200 CAD

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:04 PM

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A couple of AC lites can do the trick

clear igloo Dec 13, 2019, 3:04 PM

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Even 1 might do the trick depending on it's location

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:04 PM

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Yes. Like the basement

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I need just two for this house

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:04 PM

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How are access points set up?

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https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B01GBVMIWE/ref=cm_sw_r_fm_apa_i_qLO7DbW7K41PC

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This is the one that was recommended to me

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:05 PM

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@drowsy sierra from their Android or iPhone app. Or with unifi controller you install on computer

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:05 PM

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oh interesting

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:06 PM

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That's the expensive version but that's what I have in home

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:06 PM

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So you're saying I can just get this and not worry about a router?

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:06 PM

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Ubiquiti UAP-AC-LITE UniFi AP AC LITE 802.11ac Gigabit Dual-Radio PoE https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DRM6MLI/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_3J68DbN79DNM1

clear igloo Dec 13, 2019, 3:06 PM

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If you have a decent router now then just the one AP will do

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:07 PM

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welp lol

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i have the modem with routing capabilities from my isp

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It was ok

clear igloo Dec 13, 2019, 3:07 PM

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Ah, yah, then you'll be fine

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:07 PM

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but now its terrible

clear igloo Dec 13, 2019, 3:07 PM

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https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B01DRM6MLI/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_3J68DbN79DNM1

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:07 PM

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Its the whole reason why I've been looking at other options

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speed test on my phone on the 2.4ghz one is only giving me 41mbps

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when i have 1gb

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:08 PM

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I mean...

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Your never gonna get 1gbps on 2.4ghz

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:08 PM

#

it used to give me about 200+

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:08 PM

#

2.4ghz doesn't even go up to 200 mbps

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:08 PM

#

or maybe that was the 5ghz..

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:09 PM

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Probably

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:09 PM

#

but i know it was never 41mbps

#

it was higher before

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:09 PM

#

You tried restart all the equipment?

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:09 PM

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yep

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i've done all the troubleshooting I could before I went to ask lol

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:10 PM

#

I see

#

I'll brb

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:10 PM

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Okay take your time

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 3:10 PM

#

Gotta step out for a bit

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 3:20 PM

#

Ty for the advise though, we can continue whenever you have time

vapid dune Dec 13, 2019, 4:21 PM

#

Ubiquiti APs are nice

paper rampart Dec 13, 2019, 4:38 PM

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I have one at my house, one at my Dad's house, one at my Mom's house, and one at my Dad's company. They are amazing.

vapid dune Dec 13, 2019, 4:41 PM

#

you don't really need to run the controller software all the time. just for setup

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 5:58 PM

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Even the app you can setup ad hoc without controller

drowsy sierra Dec 13, 2019, 8:02 PM

#

how much better is the non lite version

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 8:12 PM

#

@drowsy sierra 2ghz and 5ghz are slightly faster with more streams

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None of the hardware, except amplifi alien , is future proof. They still are on 802.12ac wifi

vapid dune Dec 13, 2019, 9:17 PM

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I mean even the current wifi 6 stuff won't be good for at least 1-2 years

shadow shoal Dec 13, 2019, 9:19 PM

#

Also very few devices that support AX yet

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so hardly worth it to upgrade if your devices can´t use the benefits of it

vapid dune Dec 13, 2019, 9:23 PM

#

it's arguably not that mature yet either

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 9:33 PM

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@shadow shoal all my phones and laptops support ax

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I'm definitely going to benefit from it

shadow shoal Dec 13, 2019, 9:40 PM

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Oh nice

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 10:17 PM

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But yes, like my friends, they only have N or AC gear

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So yes little benefit

shadow shoal Dec 13, 2019, 10:18 PM

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yeah everything AC here

waxen scroll Dec 13, 2019, 11:14 PM

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its gonna take me another 3 years to get AX

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5 if im not feeling it

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@little schooner right?

little schooner Dec 13, 2019, 11:29 PM

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@waxen scroll right, if it's ubnt. Yes

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HP has ax aps and rukus too

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@waxen scroll unless you talking about client adoption, yes

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5 years

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@waxen scroll case in point, only recently did 2gig security panels implement 5GHz wifi connectivity for my alarm company

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And 5ghz has been around for ages

waxen scroll Dec 13, 2019, 11:31 PM

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mine doesnt do wifi

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its serial to ethernet

little schooner Dec 14, 2019, 12:26 AM

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@waxen scroll sounds very legacy

little schooner Dec 14, 2019, 2:28 PM

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@waxen scroll ever use a label maker that requires the battery to not be in the unit in order for it to charge?

waxen scroll Dec 14, 2019, 2:28 PM

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no

little schooner Dec 14, 2019, 2:28 PM

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Bmp21-plus

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A good label maker with terrible engineer oversight

waxen scroll Dec 14, 2019, 2:31 PM

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oh you

little schooner Dec 14, 2019, 2:32 PM

#

I mean, was it really that hard to implement circuitry to detect when you plugged in for AC power or battery?

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It's so dumb that they didn't think of that

waxen scroll Dec 14, 2019, 2:32 PM

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depends on your budget

little schooner Dec 14, 2019, 2:32 PM

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Well it cost like $200

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I would think they would put it in

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I guess I have to always keep expectations low then

#

@waxen scroll but seriously though, that is the least thing I would ask about a manufacturers product

#

Like I expect it to work like other charging devices

#

It's an odd question or trait to discover that doesn't work

#

Amazon would honor the return for me but I have to use persuasion

fervent brook Dec 14, 2019, 7:47 PM

#

if im replacing antennae for an R6700, do i need specific antennae?

shadow shoal Dec 14, 2019, 8:17 PM

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yes

waxen scroll Dec 14, 2019, 9:30 PM

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nope. a coat hanger should work as long as you mount it right

buoyant oak Dec 14, 2019, 10:23 PM

#

my dad has a rack of servers and cisco routers and switches

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but half of it is off

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 10:27 PM

#

what is the difference between a server and a nas?
dumb it super down for me plz. lol. fundamentally, it seems like the size ? thanks in advance for any help

hallow nimbus Dec 14, 2019, 10:28 PM

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A nas is more home based with a simple interface and a server is more enterprice with more advanced options and mostly no interface in 9/10 times

vernal gust Dec 14, 2019, 10:28 PM

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A NAS is a server, but servers are not NAS's

hallow nimbus Dec 14, 2019, 10:28 PM

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And that ofc

vernal gust Dec 14, 2019, 10:29 PM

#

The term "server" is just a broader term

charred meadow Dec 14, 2019, 10:31 PM

#

NAS stands for networked attached storage. It's a type of server that allow for access of a file system over a network. It is essentially a hardrive that you can connect to over a network.

hallow nimbus Dec 14, 2019, 10:32 PM

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Or multiple hard drives

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 10:37 PM

#

thank you that helps. i like the explanation from @vernal gust . thank you all for the help . looks like im on the right track in my research

little schooner Dec 14, 2019, 11:20 PM

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Wait but some businesses use "NAS" as a server. One distance learning platform we used made us download all vms from a synology public facing http server

#

They can be used interchangeable but is more commonly used for storage purposes

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 11:26 PM

#

thats basically the root of what im trying to find out. can i use a nas as a small business server

#

and it seems like the answer is super yes

craggy parcel Dec 14, 2019, 11:28 PM

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@little schooner The fun only really begins, when you use the NAS as a frontend device for a SAN. This industry's terminology is pretty confusing at times.

#

@zealous burrow That kinda depends on what that server would be doing.

vapid dune Dec 14, 2019, 11:30 PM

#

o.o

#

I use a nas to put my files on it

little schooner Dec 14, 2019, 11:31 PM

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@zealous burrow yes you can. Synology sells beefy ones where you can even virtualize things

#

But again that is more expensive than just buying dell server

vapid dune Dec 14, 2019, 11:31 PM

#

too much beef isn't good for you lol

little schooner Dec 14, 2019, 11:31 PM

#

@vapid dune what about turkey

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@craggy parcel yes very confusing

#

Just how SD Wan is confusing

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 11:35 PM

#

im attempting to do it on an old intel that does have virtualization

craggy parcel Dec 14, 2019, 11:35 PM

#

Yeah, I'm not sure I've totally understood how SD networking works, with physical infrastructure.. Every time I read a description, they either talk about VXLAN or make it sound like it's just a central management solution for switches, routers and access points, but still tries to make it sound like it's MUCH more than that. 😉

vapid dune Dec 14, 2019, 11:36 PM

#

needs more network UPS

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 11:37 PM

#

yeah the network switches seems to be a thing of concern

#

ill have a UPS for it for sure

craggy parcel Dec 14, 2019, 11:38 PM

#

@zealous burrow What kind of services do you want the machine to require? Virtualization needs a LOT of RAM and diskspace, so does databases. A fileserver, just needs a lot of network bandwidth (You want the network to be the bottleneck, not the server), while managing a windows domain, needs a Windows server, which can be physical or virtual. So if your NAS can do the job for you, depends on your requirements, and the NAS you have. 😉

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 11:41 PM

#

right right thats what im looking at . a nas seems fine for the duties i need it to do. im researching what would necessitate a big boy server.

vapid dune Dec 14, 2019, 11:41 PM

#

huh

#

what do you need it to do

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 11:43 PM

#

basically what a nas does. file sharing over a network. nothing big. images and docs

craggy parcel Dec 14, 2019, 11:44 PM

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@zealous burrow Images can be QUITE big. I've seen photoshop documents in the gigabyte range...

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 11:45 PM

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so big that it would necessitate a big server? with all the bells and whistles?

craggy parcel Dec 14, 2019, 11:47 PM

#

Depends on how the files are accessed. If they are used as a common storage solution, with people working on the files directly from the NAS, you would like lots of RAM and network bandwidth. Also you need a CPU capable of filling the network pipe to it's limit. (Most CPUs made within the last few years, should be able to)

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 11:48 PM

#

yeah i figured out the ram part but how would i increase network bandwidth? a 10gig switch?

#

its an 8600k. not the best kuz it doesnt have hyper threading

#

thank you chano. i appreciate your time. i see you typing. thanks for the information

craggy parcel Dec 14, 2019, 11:52 PM

#

If you've got a few people working with images in the GB range, like for billboards, posters etc. you really need it to deliver the data FAST with random access. I suppose Photoshop would perform well, if you can deliver at least 30 megabyte per sec, which amounts to about 300 megabit per concurrent user. And yes, network bandwidth can be increased with better network cards, and switches. Also remember, that 10 people each needing 300 megabit, will require a server with a network interface able to deliver at LEAST 3 gigabit, however, each individual client only needs to be able to receive and send with 300 megabit. So the NAS and the server, in that case, will need 10Gbit, so will the switches. But your client computers will only need 1Gbit. Just something to remember, before upgrading to 10GBit all the way. 😉

#

As for CPU's I have absolutely no clue what you'd need. When I need gear for my job, I just call my supplier, give them my requirements, and get a quote. 😉

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 11:53 PM

#

very nice. thank you

#

that information helps me a lot

craggy parcel Dec 14, 2019, 11:53 PM

#

My knowledge of PC chips don't even allow me to select a new graphics card for my PC without doing a lot of research to at least make sure it's better than what I have. 😛

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 11:54 PM

#

haha i get that. naming schemes are all over the place these days

shadow shoal Dec 14, 2019, 11:54 PM

#

doing research before buying stuff is also always good

zealous burrow Dec 14, 2019, 11:54 PM

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100%

craggy parcel Dec 14, 2019, 11:55 PM

#

Yeah, and then there's the funny thing about money. I play games from time to time on my PC, but mostly games a few years old. And not enough hours that I'm willing to spend a good chunk of my monthly paycheck on the graphics card. Not making things easier.

#

@shadow shoal Agreed, but for work, the money are usually better spend just paying someone else to do the research, even though we all know their profit on the equipment they sell also influences their recommendation, than me doing my own research. It's just a funny balance of knowing when your time, and the company's money, are better spend on paying a little extra for new equipment, or you doing research to save a few 100 dollar.

zealous burrow Dec 15, 2019, 12:00 AM

#

plus that way you usually are covered in warrantys

shadow shoal Dec 15, 2019, 12:00 AM

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Yeah i would only do that for myself, friends or family

#

But if it was for work they can just pay people for telling them what to buy

zealous burrow Dec 15, 2019, 12:00 AM

#

yup

vapid dune Dec 15, 2019, 12:03 AM

#

I wonder when 10 gig ethernet will become consumer cheap

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:04 AM

#

@shadow shoal Yeah. But it does not ALWAYS go well. I've had a bad recommendation for a firewall, cost us about 2200 USD in equipment, licenses and service, for a firewall that's collecting dust on a shelf. They somehow failed to understand what kind of traffic we had. I specifically stated we had about 40 megabit of constant VoIP traffic, which is very small packets. And they sold us a firewall that could easily handle all the traffic, but not that amount of packets. So not only did we have to pay a consultant to tell us, that the only thing we did wrong, was getting an underpowered firewall, but also had to buy another one, that could actually handle the task.

But at least I had MY ass covered. 😉

shadow shoal Dec 15, 2019, 12:04 AM

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Never buy ASA

#

)))

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:06 AM

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Funny, I don't thing I ever specified the brand... But yeah, an ASA it was.

shadow shoal Dec 15, 2019, 12:07 AM

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lmao

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:07 AM

#

Also the consultant said exactly the same, the architecture of the platform just sucks.

hollow marlin Dec 15, 2019, 12:10 AM

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@craggy parcel 40mb of voice traffic? Call center?

shadow shoal Dec 15, 2019, 12:10 AM

#

yeah ASA is still years behind Palo Alto and Fortinet

#

Just a heap of crap atm

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:11 AM

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@hollow marlin Nope, telephony provider.

hollow marlin Dec 15, 2019, 12:13 AM

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@craggy parcel make more sense. I'd say, 40megs high. Our SRX550s handle our trunks without a sweat.

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:13 AM

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@shadow shoal Yeah, instead of integrating the inspection part, they just bought a software solution, put in an ESX server, and forwards the the traffic to the virtual machine for inspection.. Some bright mind must have thought "Oh, no this can not impact performance negatively, in ANY way!"

shadow shoal Dec 15, 2019, 12:13 AM

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lol

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:15 AM

#

@vapid dune 10 gig fiber is already cheap.

vapid dune Dec 15, 2019, 12:15 AM

#

define cheap

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:16 AM

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you can do it for less than $300

vapid dune Dec 15, 2019, 12:16 AM

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do what?

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:16 AM

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A 10 gig switch, NIC for two PCs, transceivers, and the fiber

vapid dune Dec 15, 2019, 12:16 AM

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that's not cheap lol

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:17 AM

#

@hollow marlin Yeah, we have quite a number of ISP's that needed phone service for their customers, and all those cable modems needs to tell us where they are at short intervals, also as IPv4 is quite limited, we use tunnels and internal IPs for the traffic, and therefore not only the SIP traffic, but also the RTP traffic will pass through our network. And the classification and inspection of all those tiny 20milisecond RTP packets will put quite a load on the firewall. 😉

#

@vapid dune $300 is cheap if it includes the entire network. That is cables, switches, routers and computers.

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:19 AM

#

https://www.amazon.com/MikroTik-CRS305-1G-4S-Gigabit-Ethernet-RouterOS/dp/B07LFKGP1L/
https://www.ebay.com/itm/MNPA19-XTR-10GB-MELLANOX-CONNECTX-2-PCI-E-10G-SFP-NETWORK-CARD-W-BOTH-BRACKET/131634470127
https://www.ebay.com/itm/GENUINE-Cisco-SFP-10G-SR-V03-10-2415-03-Transceiver-Module/182733551590

#

That's $226. Then add the cost of the fiber. (two connectx-2, 4 transceivers)

#

Way cheaper than what 10 Gig fiber was, and still is.

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:21 AM

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@rocky badge There's NO WAY, I'm gonna believe that a "GENUINE" cisco SFP can be purchased for $8.90. A price in that range, for a cisco transciver really sounds fishy to me.

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:21 AM

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I have two :p

hollow marlin Dec 15, 2019, 12:23 AM

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@craggy parcel we're a regional ISP primarily focused on business hosted PBX and have anywhere around 150-200megs of SIP traffic throughout during the day. We had to move our metaswitch off some of the core MXs because the line cards with some of our policies couldn't handle the traffic. I've been there before.

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:23 AM

#

I see they are quite low power, which could explain some of the price. Or the seller stole them from somewhere.

shadow shoal Dec 15, 2019, 12:24 AM

#

is mikrotik terrible or would you recommend?

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:24 AM

#

@hollow marlin Yeah. Too many people focus on the speed rating in bits/sec, when they really should focus on processing speed in packets/sec.

little schooner Dec 15, 2019, 12:25 AM

#

@shadow shoal I don't like there cli

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:25 AM

#

I'm personally a big Ubiquiti fan 😄

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:25 AM

#

I've heard quite a few people, I regard as competent in networking, say mikrotik devices are great. However, never tried them myself.

hollow marlin Dec 15, 2019, 12:25 AM

#

Packets/sec is all we look at anymore. Some vendors are moving that way I'm data sheets as well @craggy parcel

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:26 AM

#

@little schooner Who has EVER made a CLI that's impossible to hate? 😛

#

(Web interfaces are far worse, though.... )

hollow marlin Dec 15, 2019, 12:26 AM

#

Mikrotik is a love hate relationship

little schooner Dec 15, 2019, 12:26 AM

#

@craggy parcel I like Cisco and Edgerouter

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:26 AM

#

@hollow marlin Ya, at school we're moving everything to IP based...The throughput was fine, it was pps.

shadow shoal Dec 15, 2019, 12:26 AM

#

yeah i only have experience with cisco and edgerouter atm

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:26 AM

#

I've not really used the Edgerouter one, but I don't like the cisco one either.

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:27 AM

#

I love UniFi more than EdgeMAX, but I have an ER-X I'm using as a switch.

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:28 AM

#

@hollow marlin Yeah, I've also noticed that trend. However, I've also seen WAY too many datasheets not telling the size of the packets. 😉

shadow shoal Dec 15, 2019, 12:28 AM

#

also its terrible trying to find information regarding cisco shit

#

god

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:29 AM

#

The only thing using POTS in the district now is the intercoms at the high school and the backup lines 😩

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:29 AM

#

Actually I think cisco has quite a lot of easily available data on thier website, that's well indexed by google. 😉

hollow marlin Dec 15, 2019, 12:29 AM

#

@craggy parcel I don't mind it as I can just multiply by 64 and get worse case scenarios

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:29 AM

#

Haha...

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@rocky badge Why keep the intercom on analog?

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:30 AM

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I guess costs.

#

All of the other schools in the district are using IP based intercoms.

#

but those deployments were rather "small"

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:31 AM

#

Well, it's only cheaper till someone needs to service the old system, and no spares are available. 😉

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:32 AM

#

Yeah lol

#

Each school has to have the appliance, each analog intercom has to be replaced, new racks and switches for the intercoms, etc.

#

Even moving from the old phone system to CUCM was troublesome for the high school

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:36 AM

#

Same thing applies whenever my boss says "Well, if you make this feature in our software in this shitty way, it will take less time, and cost less". The answer usually goes like this "Sure, but there are these risks of things going wrong, the chances are ... Is this acceptable for you?" and if he insists on the shitty solution, he gets it, and when it breaks, and he complains, all I have to say will be "Told you so" 😛

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:37 AM

#

😄

#

Just like someone tagging the switch uplinks incorrectly so all of the intercoms go down at a school

hollow marlin Dec 15, 2019, 12:37 AM

#

There is always no time and budget when setting it up but there is unlimited time and budget when it breaks

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:38 AM

#

@rocky badge You can get quite cheap IP phones, that can be placed in classrooms and whereever intercom devices are needed, and for PA there's quite cheap solutions as well, even IP phones with autoanswer, or PA features built in. (Most SNOM IP phones has but autoanswer, and multicast features)

#

@hollow marlin Well, fixing stuff that broke is on the maintenance budget, not the development budget. 😛

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:39 AM

#

The intercoms are from audio enhancements. IP phones are either Cisco or Alcatel Lucent

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:40 AM

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Oh, they have some sort of brand loyalty?

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:40 AM

#

One time, someone was like, "Why isn't the gateway 10.0.0.1, it's configured for 10.0.0.3...and they changed the gateway IP.

#

Stuff with their gateways set statically broke...rip that guy

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@craggy parcel Yeah lol

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:41 AM

#

LOL.. Yeah, that's funny, it is USUALLY the first in the IP range, but not ALWAYS.

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:41 AM

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Nothing's actually 10.0.0.1

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10.0.0.2 is the primary DC, 10.0.0.3 is the gw

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:42 AM

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Haha.. Made to annoy. 😉

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:44 AM

#

10.20.0.1 is the gateway configured for the intercom VLAN

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:46 AM

#

I once setup a network using the LAST IP of the scope as the gateway. Lots of comments like "The gateway MUST be the first address" and the like, from people not knowing what they're doing. 😉 Also at the office one of the gateways has .160 or something like that, in a /24. Mostly because it was the first available non-dhcp address in the scope. 😉

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:46 AM

#

Yeah, my guest VLAN gateway at home is 192.168.10.254

#

https://blob.pcmr.rocks/aebb48cb.png

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:48 AM

#

I don't have such a fancy networking setup at home, mostly because I just live by myself anyways, work with IT daily, so when I get home, I can't be bothered messing about with my own network. 😉

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:48 AM

#

😄

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:53 AM

#

Also funny how people don't understand it when you buy a specialized device, instead of "making it yourself cheaper, with a raspberry pi". When you spend 8 hours a day doing systems administration and software development, doing another 4-6 hours when you get home, without being paid, is not exactly the first thing on your mind, when you can get a specialized device for less that what you would get paid for working the same hours.. 😛 Many simply doesn't get that you don't like EVERYTHING that's got to do with IT, and find it all funny. Yeah, I'd gladly spend hours messing about writing a hd44780 decoder plugin for my logic analyzer, that's something I see a fun challenge in, but spending hours putting together something that allows me to send stuff from my phone to the TV? No way, I'll just buy an apple TV for that. 😛

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:55 AM

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Yeah, most of my IoT is stuff like Nest, Hue, etc. But Home Assistant to add more functionality to them

#

https://blob.pcmr.rocks/842bc10b.png

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:56 AM

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Haha.. I spent about 1 hour looking at Home Assistant, realizing that it might do exactly what I wanted (Mostly datalogging from the hue motion sensors), but that it would take WAAAY to long to configure, and I'll just live without the datalogging. 😉

#

Hmm.. What TV have you integrated with?

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:57 AM

#

Roku

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:58 AM

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Aaah... Didn't know they made a TV as well. 😉

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 12:58 AM

#

oh, it's a TCL TV with Roku built in lol

#

it's just using the Roku local device API

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 12:59 AM

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Ok.

#

Hmm... Seems like my Samsung TV might be one of the supported models, as well. 😉

#

Hmm.. I kinda had a planned to get to bed before midnight, which was two hours ago.. So I better go now.. Bye...

vapid dune Dec 15, 2019, 1:36 AM

#

my samsung tv was on the fritz so I had to unplug the smart tv. best thing to unplug imo

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 2:28 AM

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Oof. Only one thermostat @rocky badge ?

#

📎 Screenshot_20191214-203108.png

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@craggy parcel the problem with HA and non alarm sensors is that it might not be instant

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Mine is communicating with a traditional alarm and sensor reporting is instant

#

My buddy tries controlling lights with non alarm for occupancy like in a commercial building and there's a delay before the lights turn on

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@little schooner this is the serial to Ethernet I told you about

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Ghetto but instant

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You don't want hass logging motion sensor data on an rpi BTW. If you're planning on using an sdcard, just walk away

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I don't allow any of my motions to keep a log

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I just do exterior doors, windows, or other sensors that only go off a few times per day

vapid dune Dec 15, 2019, 3:41 AM

#

woah that's a lot of sensors

#

what is that

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 4:10 AM

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@waxen scroll ya just one lol

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@vapid dune home assistant?

vapid dune Dec 15, 2019, 4:11 AM

#

oh I see

fervent brook Dec 15, 2019, 4:56 AM

#

I tried using the antennae from my Cisco AP, but the connector are too large...lol

sterile pasture Dec 15, 2019, 6:02 AM

#

the stuff I have to deal with

📎 Capture_2019-12-15-00-02-18.png

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yes they used emojis in an ssid

rocky badge Dec 15, 2019, 6:04 AM

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but that's 2.4GHz :p

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Use 5Ghz 👌

craggy parcel Dec 15, 2019, 1:03 PM

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@waxen scroll Well, the data I want to log from the motionsensors are not the motion, but temperature and light levels. I suppose they don't trigger quite as often, as motion. 😉

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 2:42 PM

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depends what you want light levels for

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im doing the same with an all in one sensor... i just want it for light level

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i have it at fastest polling (5min) but i dont log it

#

personally i dont use HA as a human interface, even though I made a GUI the whole point is never to look at the GUI xD

#

it should be like an AI and know what you want and when

#

i dont think blobby is using it that way 😦

#

like for example my front outside lights turn off at 9pm but what happens if i have a party and it runs late? simple! if the front door is unlocked, do nothing, then if it locks turn them off 2min later

#

an actual manual process you have to think about automated!

#

not this "i can turn them off from my couch" stuff

#

xD

#

also @rocky badge why hue? whats the benefit of turning your whole room blue for $70/bulb versus normal non-smart lighting (or zwave switch) over LED light strips that provide RGB accent lighting under cabinets, etc?

#

i dont get why so many people want an entire area an obnoxious color and be able to change it instead of actually doing theming light strips that enhance the furniture in the room

#

@clear igloo maybe im too old

subtle glen Dec 15, 2019, 2:59 PM

#

my friend got hue lightbulbs and hue rgb strips to match the rgb keyboard animations

#

a bit overkill i'd say

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 2:59 PM

#

hah

#

arent those strips like $70/20 feet too, and god forbid you cut them shorter and make it $70/5 feet

#

i just use chinese stuff

#

$10/25 feet

subtle glen Dec 15, 2019, 3:01 PM

#

i have a 15$ sonoff switch to turn on my bedroom lights and a blue led strip from google assistant etc

#

happy so far

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 3:02 PM

#

interesting... that fits in the box? i dont see that working in my houses boxes

#

kind of cramped for space

subtle glen Dec 15, 2019, 3:02 PM

#

there are smaller models made to fit inside the switch housing

#

mine is hidden in the storage room

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 3:04 PM

#

its been like 5 years and i havent expanded my switches. i only have two. now they're outdated

subtle glen Dec 15, 2019, 3:04 PM

#

should be easier to install one behind the switches

#

dont you have drywalls?

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 3:05 PM

#

i do

subtle glen Dec 15, 2019, 3:05 PM

#

cant you just slide it in the wall?

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 3:06 PM

#

against code and that also means i need to do drywall repair and repainting which can turn into a big deal... you cant just paint a small area you have to do a whole wall or more

subtle glen Dec 15, 2019, 3:07 PM

#

i was thinking of dropping it in the wall from the hole where the switch is mounted

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 3:07 PM

#

we're not allowed to have high voltage wiring outside of conduit and the boxes here

#

maybe you are, idk

subtle glen Dec 15, 2019, 3:08 PM

#

there are conduits in drywalls?

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 3:08 PM

#

yep

subtle glen Dec 15, 2019, 3:08 PM

#

i didn't know that

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 3:09 PM

#

some places wont even allow you to have cat6 outside of conduits and boxes

subtle glen Dec 15, 2019, 3:09 PM

#

looking at my utp cat5e going into the electrical wiring

little schooner Dec 15, 2019, 3:28 PM

#

@waxen scroll in the lab, it's a wire cable guide that's like a flat tray. It's all exposed

#

I guess our lab didn't fall under this requirement

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 3:29 PM

#

yeah but what happens when it goes through walls

#

probably conduits

little schooner Dec 15, 2019, 3:51 PM

#

@waxen scroll I didn't check specifically that but yeah

fervent brook Dec 15, 2019, 5:41 PM

#

is it a bad idea to adapt different size antennae connectors?

vernal gust Dec 15, 2019, 5:56 PM

#

Probably

#

But antennas are antennas

#

As long as the actual shit going through the wire is compatible and doesnt fry your stuff you're good

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 6:46 PM

#

@little schooner /31 ?

jolly mountain Dec 15, 2019, 6:58 PM

#

Can someone help me. I just got the NETGEAR Nighthawk XR500, and when I try to connect to discord I get a message saying RTC Connecting and then it saying No Route. I also cant load into games, but i am able to connect to the internet and watch videos and browse the web.

little schooner Dec 15, 2019, 7:01 PM

#

@waxen scroll hehe. So technically he hasn't responded back to me yet since he is grading work to submit the final grades for the 4 courses he's teaching

#

Not yet. But soon tm

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 7:02 PM

#

lame

little schooner Dec 15, 2019, 7:02 PM

#

@waxen scroll the tray thing I saw months ago

#

So I remembered it

little schooner Dec 15, 2019, 7:40 PM

#

@waxen scroll on the flip side, the Chem teacher didn't want to fail most of his class, so he curved the grade for F to 53%

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 7:41 PM

#

lmao

little schooner Dec 15, 2019, 7:41 PM

#

So many of us passed

#

With d- or moved up to C

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 8:00 PM

#

@little schooner show us your home assistant install

hollow marlin Dec 15, 2019, 8:35 PM

#

@waxen scroll Just finished final paper work for new home. Soon ill be able to wire shit up the way I want to

#

hopefully closing at the end of Jan

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 8:36 PM

#

o_o

#

sensors on everything

#

@hollow marlin I have: 33 alarm sensors, 1 multipurpose, 4 temp/humid thermostat addon sensors, 4 thermostats, 2 zwave switches, 4 zwave LED appliances, 1 smart lock

#

the system is mostly automating light states depending on many variables like security activity, time of day, inside natural brightness levels

#

some small HVAC automation as well

#

and even smaller, safety automation. it'll know if theres smoke or a verified fire

#

so like i warned before, if this logging isnt filtered RIP most SDcards

hollow marlin Dec 15, 2019, 9:03 PM

#

Jesus man, I cant wait to do the same

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 9:04 PM

#

RIP your wallet

hallow nimbus Dec 15, 2019, 9:04 PM

#

Rip everything

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 9:04 PM

#

im debating on selling my house in 2-4 years, so im not sure i wanna continue to invest in that

#

i will prob rip all of it out TBH when i move

#

except the hard wired security stuff

#

im not about to support HA or anything else for normies

#

they can put their alexa in and be happy controlling two bulbs xD

hallow nimbus Dec 15, 2019, 9:40 PM

#

😂

#

An yet here are you sitting with ur everything being able to be controlled while having it secured

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 9:56 PM

#

you arent able to override the security portion if you got access

#

its just a service reading and writing to a socket to the security stuff in the background and you cant just tell it "disarm" without credentials

#

so like, you hack it and get the front door lock to open.... thats great, but then a separate system is going to trip if you open that door

vapid dune Dec 15, 2019, 9:59 PM

#

lol this is what I think when people who go all in sell their house: https://vancouver.craigslist.org/van/sys/d/vancouver-home-automation-system-price/7029975201.html

craigslist

Home Automation System PRICE DROP - ONE WEEK ONLY

Used home automation system. Contains the following items: ALL FOR $2500 - 1 x Watchguard XTM 5 series firewall security appliance (NC2AE8) - 1 x AudioTrak 300 stereo reference amplifier - 5 x...

waxen scroll Dec 15, 2019, 9:59 PM

#

lmao

#

that looks like ancient stuff

#

since its brand name that had to have cost a fortune

#

oh i see the prices at the end

#

yep.

#

would have loved to see wtf this system was doing. i can hardly believe it was in a house

#

tons of A/V

#

anyone used homeseer? wondering how that is vs the free stuff

#

looks like crap AFAIK

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 12:09 AM

#

@waxen scroll I have HomeSeer currently. V3 needs some work, but hs4 should hopefully make it better with mobile push alerts

#

Support gets back to me quick when I have questions

#

I didn't see zwave first alert carbon and monoxide detector support for HA

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 12:13 AM

#

link to product?

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 12:32 AM

#

https://www.firstalertstore.com/store/products/z-wave-smoke-and-carbon-monoxide-alarm-zcombo-g.htm @waxen scroll

First Alert ZCOMBO-G Z-Wave Enabled Battery Smoke & Carbon Monoxid...

The First Alert Z-Wave alarm will operate with 3rd party, certified Z-Wave devices. Get notified of smoke, fire or carbon monoxide alarms right when they happen. Photoelectric technology is generally more sensitive at detecting large particles, which tend to be produced in gr...

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 12:34 AM

#

oh really

#

mines ghetto lmao

#

[Smoke Detectors] -> ALARM INTERLINK BUS <- Smoke Alarm Relay Module -> Generic time delay relay board [10sec] -> Alarm Panel -> Serial to ethernet -> Home Assistant

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 12:38 AM

#

Lots of links

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 12:38 AM

#

i dont have carbon hooked up but you can buy a carbon module and do the same thing

#

its a lot of links but its 100% reliable ignoring the points of failure

#

zwave isnt always

#

i also have a water flow device to detect if a fire sprinkler went off

#

if HA notices that one of those things went off it'll unlock the front door and turn off any fan within its control

#

📎 IMG_20191215_184437.jpg

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 12:48 AM

#

How much did the whole system cost you

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 12:49 AM

#

what do you refer to

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 12:49 AM

#

Well everything

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 12:49 AM

#

the sprinklers and interlinked smoke detectors were here when i bought the place

#

the rest of it i estimate about $2k but thats with me doing tons of labor

#

if someone else did it, much more

#

one of the problems was i bought an advanced alarm system and the base unit and the modules for it arent cheap at all

#

this was because i wanted an all in one automation platform with advanced rules

#

i had no idea I would be using something like HA instead

#

for example, each keypad is about $200.... ethernet support, $200-300

#

if i expand the hard wired zones, thats another $100 or so

#

but its wayyyyyyyy more reliable and instant than zwave is

#

since zones are simple and dont communicate actual data, you can basically plug and play a crapload of sensors and then import them as objects into HA

#

as far as i can tell, the speed at which HA realizes a sensor changed state is under 1sec

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 1:02 AM

#

@waxen scroll that's true. I know my zwave units have a delay

#

Like 5 seconds or something like that

#

But it did alert me when I left the stove on

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 1:03 AM

#

bad boy

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 1:03 AM

#

That was a close one lol

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 1:03 AM

#

lmao

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 1:03 AM

#

@waxen scroll had it not been for HomeSeer sending an email, the house would of started fire in kitchen

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 1:03 AM

#

if mine got to the point of alerting the monitoring center would be sending the fire dept

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 1:04 AM

#

At first I tried to sync the fire alarm with the monitoring company but

#

They said they don't support anyone's zwave gear except their branded products

#

It's really stupid and they call it Zwave ready

#

Lies.

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 1:05 AM

#

thats another plus of doing it the way i did it. its supported as long as it connects to the panel

#

if i did this again, i might consider running a honeywell alarm at half the cost since i dont need it to be "smart" other than an ethernet

hardy kestrel Dec 16, 2019, 2:02 AM

#

What happens when I plug a Gigabit switch on a 10/100 Access Point/Router?

#

Does it Gigabit or not?

vernal gust Dec 16, 2019, 2:03 AM

#

The speed of the link is always the speed of the slowest interface

#

1000Mbps --> 100Mbps = 100Mbps

#

If you're asking about the ENTIRE switch, it's a port by port basis

#

Having one port running at 100 won't make the entire switch run at that speed

#

Just that link

hardy kestrel Dec 16, 2019, 2:10 AM

#

I mean, if I connect the input of the switch to a 10/100 Router, is it still gigabit or no?

ornate jungle Dec 16, 2019, 2:12 AM

#

The switch itself will usually still allow gigabit communication between any devices connected to that switch, however, anything travelling along the network cable to the 10/100 router will only operate at 10/100 speeds.

hardy kestrel Dec 16, 2019, 2:12 AM

#

That makes sense, thanks 👍

vapid dune Dec 16, 2019, 2:13 AM

#

assuming the switch doesn't need to go to the router for routing

#

eg vlan

fervent brook Dec 16, 2019, 3:32 AM

#

I'm gonna assume an AC1750 Nighthawk is not a good upgrade if I already have an AC1900 "Linksys"

quick hollow Dec 16, 2019, 11:10 AM

#

I think I cocked something up.

#

I bought a Cisco 3560G switch. Works fine. But the OS was last updated in 2004.

#

So I got the new OS and flashed it on. Switch is working but the web interface requires a username/password now.

#

I tried running this in the console

config
username admin privilege 15 password admin
end
wr

#

But it hasn't fixed it.

#

Anyone have experience with Cisco stuff?

vernal gust Dec 16, 2019, 11:21 AM

#

I'm not particularly experienced, but did you do login local?

quick hollow Dec 16, 2019, 12:00 PM

#

No, what does that do?

#

I used show run | i username to check the account I made exists. It does.

#

I'm just rebooting the switch now. Some suggested restarting the web service might help.

carmine moss Dec 16, 2019, 12:05 PM

#

You need login local and i hope you did copy Running config startup config

vernal gust Dec 16, 2019, 12:06 PM

#

login local instructs the switch to login from the local user database, the combination username and password you entered

quick hollow Dec 16, 2019, 12:06 PM

#

I did. I mean copy running to startup

#

login local just returns Invalid input detected at '^' marker.

vernal gust Dec 16, 2019, 12:07 PM

#

Gotta set it on the vty lines if I recall correctly

quick hollow Dec 16, 2019, 12:08 PM

#

I am using putty and the console port

#

I don't know what vty is

vernal gust Dec 16, 2019, 12:08 PM

#

line vty 0 15, login local

#

vty lines are the virtual terminals used for telnet, ssh and http connections

quick hollow Dec 16, 2019, 12:39 PM

#

Ill try running that then

#

Nah it says invalid input again

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 1:27 PM

#

https://i.imgur.com/tObI7iT.png

Imgur

#

Finally hit 30%

quick hollow Dec 16, 2019, 3:21 PM

#

More widely adopted now since we are running out of ipv4's all the time

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 3:57 PM

#

Yes, but are those stats for external IPs? because I see a lot of places, even universites, still using IPv4 internally

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 4:03 PM

#

yes they are

paper rampart Dec 16, 2019, 4:51 PM

#

Is there a need to adopt IPv6 internally?

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 4:51 PM

#

yep

paper rampart Dec 16, 2019, 4:51 PM

#

Why is that?

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 4:55 PM

#

some companies are running out of internal ipv4 (mine), if you decide to NAT and do protocol translation because you're not deploying it internally, thats a performance hit, perhaps in more ways than one

#

it also likely increases network management complexity as well

#

it makes business to business connections much easier as well since theres plenty of public space available

#

many businesses dont like to NAT and so when you have a private circuit often times they advertise a public IP space to you

#

your problem is then maybe you dont have space to advertise back

#

since IPv4 is gone, getting it is expensive

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 4:59 PM

#

Ripe is also out of ipv4 now

#

Only afrinic and the other one that has ipv4 left

#

oh wait lacnic also has some tiny amount left

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 5:02 PM

#

i keep trying to get places i work for to transition but everyones so lazy and doesnt want to kick off a project that big

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 5:02 PM

#

Most companies are probably going to wait until the last time to implement ipv6 unfortunately

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 5:02 PM

#

yep!

#

i got super close at one job to the point we were placing ipv6 orders with our providers and one person killed it because they didnt want to deal with it

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 5:03 PM

#

Thats also a huge problem, people don´t want to put the effort in to learn

#

But i´ve found that ipv6 isn´t much more complex than ipv4

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 5:04 PM

#

i think its easier

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 5:04 PM

#

hex is great

tender hazel Dec 16, 2019, 5:04 PM

#

Yeah it’s not. People just assume it will be harder.

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 5:04 PM

#

Yeah i thought it would be if i´m being honest

#

But after i started i realized its not

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 5:05 PM

#

the way you can subnet it and identify regions, countries, sites, then vlans is amazing

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 5:05 PM

#

yeah ipv6 is legit amazing

#

I´ve been rolling dual stack at home now for more than a year and love it

tender hazel Dec 16, 2019, 5:05 PM

#

The thing is that you could just do a partial rollout internally. It doesn’t have to be everywhere right away.

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 5:06 PM

#

Yeah you should definitely do it in phases and plan it well

#

Should not be in just one go

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 5:07 PM

#

for the confused here... <assigned prefix> : <region of world> : <country> : <site/vlan> : host:host:host:host ..... 2001:0db8:0000:0000:0000:8a2e:0370:7334

#

so you just look at it and know if you memorized

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 5:08 PM

#

nibble boundaries are also great

#

https://meetings.ripe.net/see2/files/IPv6 Addressing Plans.pdf

fresh copper Dec 16, 2019, 7:01 PM

#

Even myself with only a /44 for personal stuff can do some pretty decent subnetting. I can carve out a /48 for up to 16 announcements and then still be able to separate those up into as many individual/64 networks as I could ever need. I could split those subnets up in some fancy system by nibbles if I needed to as well. If you have a /32 which is a common end-user allocation then you can do something more complex like LZ mentioned.

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 7:06 PM

#

Yeah i have a /48 and that is enough forever

tender hazel Dec 16, 2019, 7:49 PM

#

it seems like LMG doesn't have ipv6 yet

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 7:54 PM

#

i mean, im pretty sure they deleted all vlans and went with one flat network because their usual network guy wasnt able to do the refresh so they got confused

#

so no, im not surprised that theres no v6

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 7:54 PM

#

yikes

#

very sad

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 7:55 PM

#

it is

#

in some ways it might be better that way though... having editors on the same vlan/subnet as the servers

#

with their limited budget it probably helps to keep it switched

tender hazel Dec 16, 2019, 7:57 PM

#

it's not so safe though

#

if they get hit by say ransomware

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 7:57 PM

#

if all these editors are on 10G sweeping videos and all this other stuff, that would require a super expensive layer 3 switch

tender hazel Dec 16, 2019, 7:59 PM

#

it is cheaper to get a powerful router that can route 10G - something like a mikrotik CCR1036 or CCR1072

#

or you can give the servers with the network drives IPs on both subnets

#

a flat network is a horrible idea from a security perspective

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 8:03 PM

#

also don´t need a layer 3 10g switch

vapid dune Dec 16, 2019, 8:04 PM

#

can you reasonably pull fiber at home for 10g?

tender hazel Dec 16, 2019, 8:05 PM

#

10G is so fast that most customers cannot really utilize it. I work for an ISP remotely and we have many customers who buy 100Mbps service and consistently only use like 5-10Mbps

shadow shoal Dec 16, 2019, 8:05 PM

#

The dream would be to be all layer 3 mm

tender hazel Dec 16, 2019, 8:07 PM

#

I saw their 10G upgrade video and am a little puzzled by why they have an edgerouter and a pfsense

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 8:33 PM

#

They don't now afaik

#

It's some pfsense thing

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 8:35 PM

#

@tender hazel 10G router is not cheap

#

@waxen scroll I'm eager to know what grade I got for physics. I need to know if I passed it or not. My degree is 6 classes away

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 8:36 PM

#

Obviously you passed

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 8:36 PM

#

Then I can go for masters in cyber and info assurance

#

In Chem I passed

#

But physics teacher is quiet

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 8:36 PM

#

Tell them to curve it lol

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 8:36 PM

#

He doesn't respond to. Emails now

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 8:36 PM

#

Oof

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 8:36 PM

#

It's like vacation started for him immediately

#

@waxen scroll this was the Chem teachers response for ppl asking to curve/make it better

Please do not send any personal or group request for 'extra credit' assignments or grading scale modification (such as curving) at this stage. No such requests will be entertained. Also, moving border-line people to the next group is entirely at my discretion.

#

But in the end, he did it anyway

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 8:41 PM

#

Kek

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 8:58 PM

#

You need to graduate and get a job before the market crashes again

#

Don't wait on masters degree

vapid dune Dec 16, 2019, 9:02 PM

#

lol

#

depends on the industry really

#

comp sci is pretty solid pay and job wise

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 9:37 PM

#

hes doing IT

#

aint no "heres 80k" out of college

vapid dune Dec 16, 2019, 9:41 PM

#

eh really

tender hazel Dec 16, 2019, 9:43 PM

#

@little schooner a CCR1072 is $3k USD

#

which is pretty cheap for a 10G router

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 9:45 PM

#

thats bold claiming line rate on all interfaces

tender hazel Dec 16, 2019, 9:48 PM

#

Who said line rate on all interfaces?

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 9:48 PM

#

they have 8x10g, the marketing says 80gb throughput

tender hazel Dec 16, 2019, 9:49 PM

#

Total real world routing capacity of that device is 20Gbps

#

You can get more in certain configs

#

But I would say you can count on 20Gbps total routing performance at least.

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 9:52 PM

#

i guess it depends if it keeps a cached routing table

#

i dont know about their OS

tender hazel Dec 16, 2019, 9:53 PM

#

Route caching doesn’t really help performance like you might think. It was removed from newer Linux kernel versions.

#

The newer routeros beta 7 is on a newer kernel so no route caching.

#

But the FIB lookups are efficient enough that it shouldn’t matter.

#

I’m a mikrotik certified trainer actually.

#

Whenever you look at mikrotiks specs you get the best idea of the real world performance from the benchmark of routing with 25 ip filter rules, 512 byte packets benchmark

#

That’s generally what you can get realistically with that device

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 10:03 PM

#

@waxen scroll I just had a deja vu moment right now. And I recall seeing the exact event happen three months ago

#

It's scary to see into the future like this

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 10:03 PM

#

?

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 10:03 PM

#

The same notifications and mail I received at 5:01

#

I remember going through this already

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 10:03 PM

#

im telling you forget the masters, go get a J.O.B.

#

o_O

#

ping

little schooner Dec 16, 2019, 10:04 PM

#

@waxen scroll oh. I know. I can't start masters right away

#

I will get job

#

PRIORITY

waxen scroll Dec 16, 2019, 10:04 PM

#

@clear igloo get him jr solutions engineer

clear igloo Dec 16, 2019, 10:04 PM

#

@waxen scroll LUL

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 2:02 AM

#

I don't really get why pfsense is so popular actually

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 3:17 AM

#

@tender hazel because it's so simple to use

#

And they sell affordable appliance

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 3:20 AM

#

the appliances don't look to me to be much cheaper than mikrotiks - if anything it is more expensive for a comparable box

#

I can't really comment on the ease of use aspect since they don't have an online demo

#

so all I can see are screenshots

#

and some other admins I trust often complain about how horrible pfsense is

#

I think I tried it once, and the interface didn't impress me, and the ease of use also didn't seem to be there.. but that was a long time ago

#

I'll install the new version in virtualbox

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 3:56 AM

#

@tender hazel well, yeah they are not as cheap as building a small minipc box

#

But for a small business for drop in solution, it works I guess

#

@tender hazel you are talking about the quad core boxes on Amazon?

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 3:57 AM

#

no, in general, compared to the mikrotik boxes you can buy

#

I mean mikrotik will run on x86 too

#

but I'm just looking at the throughput that the box for that price will support

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 3:59 AM

#

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01GIVQI3M/ref=cm_sw_r_em_apa_i_fjf-DbX6HTG70

#

Like that one

#

I didn't know mikrotik sold their own x86 boxes

#

What model are they?

hollow marlin Dec 17, 2019, 4:00 AM

#

They dont, its a CHR image you slap on any box you want

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:00 AM

#

yup

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:00 AM

#

Oh. But then why did you say it was comparable?

#

If they don't make it

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:01 AM

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or you can download the x86 version, but they are trying to replace it with the VM version where possible

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comparable in terms of you pay a certain price for an x86 version of pfsense that can handle a certain bandwidth, but there is a comparable mikrotik (not necessarily the same architecture) that will handle the same bandwidth for the same price

hollow marlin Dec 17, 2019, 4:03 AM

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Agreed. Unless you bring IPS into the picture, hAP ac2 basically destroys any router/firewall up to a gig.

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4011 if you need extra rules or non-fasttrack

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Also dont forget power consumption

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:04 AM

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yup - I wasn't really counting IPS.. I mean the problem is that if you introduce IPS you decrease potential throughput a lot

waxen scroll Dec 17, 2019, 4:04 AM

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@tender hazel I prefer the asr9000 series to mikrotik

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Just personal pref

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😘

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:04 AM

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cisco? if you want to spend a fortune

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we moved from cisco to mikrotik

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for core devices that handle lots of Gbps Cisco still makes sense

hollow marlin Dec 17, 2019, 4:05 AM

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@waxen scroll https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8MWl9UGwQo

YouTube

Cisco

A Special Valentine's Day Gift...from Cisco!

Want to surprise that special someone? Here's an idea: http://cs.co/jlbYTvd.
Subscribe to Cisco's YouTube channel: http://cs.co/Subscribe.

▶ Play video

waxen scroll Dec 17, 2019, 4:05 AM

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We have a massive discount and 400k doesn't make my manager flinch

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:06 AM

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that's fine

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but I work for an ISP that used to have to buy a $3000 Cisco to service <40 customers that a $500 MikroTik easily outperforms

waxen scroll Dec 17, 2019, 4:07 AM

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Lmao I'm passing this around tomorrow

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:08 AM

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so our WISP saved like many thousands of dollars by moving from Cisco and we provide faster speeds for our customers

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our bandwidth usage increased from like 350Mbps for our entire network to like 750Mbps just by replacing the Ciscos with MikroTiks.. because when we used Cisco we had to buy underpowered Cisco that could not handle the bandwidth we needed

waxen scroll Dec 17, 2019, 4:11 AM

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What was your discount

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:11 AM

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discount? I don't think we got a special discount from Cisco

waxen scroll Dec 17, 2019, 4:12 AM

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That's the problem. Current job and others have been over 50% off

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:13 AM

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even with 50% off, still not worth it

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I had wanted to offer VPLS on our network years ago with the Ciscos.. but it turned out we could only do that with their high end carrier gear

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we offer it now to business customers everywhere

waxen scroll Dec 17, 2019, 4:14 AM

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We're doing mpls on ours

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:15 AM

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yup, but you can only do MPLS L3 VPN on most ciscos

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not L2 VPN

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:15 AM

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@tender hazel it's just mikrotik needs to make a better cli

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It's confusing GUI too

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And bridge logic

waxen scroll Dec 17, 2019, 4:15 AM

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You love GUIs don't you

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:16 AM

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@waxen scroll no, just the bridge logic should be done at factory for me at least

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Like how dell, juniper, Cisco and everyone else does

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:16 AM

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@little schooner I don't necessarily understand what you mean there

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:16 AM

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@tender hazel setting up vlans is more complicated

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Unnecessary complicated

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:17 AM

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I used to agree

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:17 AM

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Because you have to make your bridges yourself

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:17 AM

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but once they added bridge vlan filtering

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it made it similar to other products

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:17 AM

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It's backwards thinking

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I never had to do such a thing

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Even on the Cisco switch that isn't even a thing

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:18 AM

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mikrotik switches you already have a bridge with all ports connected

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you add your VLANs there

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where is the difference?

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:18 AM

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That's not true

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:18 AM

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it is true

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:18 AM

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If it's fully blank, it's not there

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No

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:18 AM

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fully blank?

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the factory default config for mikrotik switches is to have all ports connected with a bridge

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with bridge vlan filtering enabled

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:19 AM

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As in even the factory defaults can be deleted by mistake too

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Why is that a thing?

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:19 AM

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um because it depends on how you want to set it up

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if you really want to throw away the factory defaults and set it up in some super custom way, you can

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:20 AM

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Yeah. Im just not used to it

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I'm used to being spoiled by business supported hardware

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:21 AM

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business supported hardware?

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you do know that their support basically gives you free support forever, right?

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:22 AM

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@tender hazel I know, I make a lot of mistakes but I mean vendor support and phone to call

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And get quick response

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And

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Software is made so you don't need to make bridges

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Every port is already in a bridge

waxen scroll Dec 17, 2019, 4:23 AM

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😂

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:23 AM

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and what if you don't want that?

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like I could understand your complaints if the factory defaults didnt have that

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but you are basically complaining that if you choose not to go with the factory defaults that the mikrotik allows you to do that?

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that it gives you the flexibility of not going with the factory defaults if you choose not to?

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I just never viewed flexibility as a negative

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:27 AM

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@tender hazel I only remember my experience setting up the first one

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It wasted more time than I could afford

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:28 AM

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when was that, and what model?

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:28 AM

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Powerbox pro

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Umm... I think that was in July or something

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:29 AM

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oh god, you are talking about one of those models that has hardware switching separate from the software config

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:29 AM

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@tender hazel maybe my mistake was I used routerOS instead of switchOS

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:29 AM

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routeros is better

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but the problem is that if you don't have a crs3xx model you have to deal with the old really confusing way of setting up switching

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which most people could not figure out

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:29 AM

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Yes I couldn't figure this one out

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At first anyway

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:30 AM

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yeah I don't blame you

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that was the old method

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:30 AM

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But that's what I was complaing about

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:30 AM

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they've replaced it in the crs3xx series

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:30 AM

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Nice

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So it should be better now for me to try I bet

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:30 AM

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you can use the new method on the powerbox pro BUT you lose the hardware acceleration, the bridging goes through the CPU

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often I use the new method even on the old devices because it is much easier, it makes more sense

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and usually the throughput loss is more acceptable than the more complex configuration

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:31 AM

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@waxen scroll hopefully I still make a good intern

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@tender hazel true

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:32 AM

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but yeah, any of the CRS3xx models of switches use the new configuration method out of the box

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and it is very similar to cisco or HP vlan configuration instead of the old style

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the old style of VLAN config I was also complaining about for years

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I was thrilled when they came up with the new method

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so if you are considering any CRS3xx model device, I would say yes, the vlan configuration is much easier than anything mikrotik you worked with before

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and in general I would always advise routeros and not swos

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even for a switch

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you lose too many capabilities with swos

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it is maybe easier to set up but it is missing a bunch of crucial features

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@little schooner have you heard of RoMON?

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to me, RoMON is one of mikrotiks best features

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hands down

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and nobody really talks about it enough

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we do networking inside of many schools in rural and remote areas and are replacing our cisco switches with mikrotik ones mostly because of romon

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:45 AM

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@tender hazel what does romon do?

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Also why is swos bad?

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:45 AM

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it is a management network formed over layer 2

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you can access any mikrotik device from any other connected over layer 2 even with completely wrong IP configuration

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so for instance we have had problems where some customer starts to unplug everything and plug everything in into random ports

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and with romon we can actually still get into all the switches and figure out how the customer has connected things

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and how to correct it, all remotely

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 4:47 AM

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Sounds pretty handy

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 4:47 AM

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it especially makes IP changes really easy

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because if we connect to a switch over romon, we can change its IP to a different subnet without losing connection

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even if we delete the IP by accident we are still connected

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so there are a few reasons I don't like swos

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one, it is web browser only, you can't use winbox, and winbox is a really handy tool

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another, it doesn't support romon

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it also doesn't support MSTP, only RSTP at best

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also with routeros you get certain troubleshooting tools in the UI like being able to take packet captures remotely etc.. with swos there is none of that

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and I also find swos quite buggy to upgrade - I try updating it to a new version and most of the time it fails, and routeros is the opposite

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routeros can do CDP and LLDP, swos doesn't support that

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so you lose tons of useful features, and the only benefit is a simplified UI for config

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I have to explain that in our situation, we are so far from our customers that if we have to fly to a school client of ours to fix something it is like over $1000 round trip just for the airfare cost

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so anything we can do to prevent such travel saves us a huge amount of money

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we cover an area near the size of Texas from a single office

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so it isn't like we can just drive a half hour if something goes down

strange silo Dec 17, 2019, 8:57 AM

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Using mikrotik still gives me a brain bleed every time I use one, years and years has totally wired my brain 100% Cisco like so when it's not a Cisco rip off my head BSOD's and takes a good 10 minutes to reboot lol

clear igloo Dec 17, 2019, 12:11 PM

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@strange silo lol

hollow marlin Dec 17, 2019, 9:27 PM

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@strange silo The more I'm working with other vendors the less Mikrotik stands out. Some of their awkward configuration is similar in Juniper, ciena, Calix, Versa... Cisco has simplified the configuration more than any vendor which makes it seem mind boggling when even in Junos I need to specify the same parameter in 3 locations

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 10:37 PM

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@hollow marlin what other config do you find awkward (besides the old VLAN stuff that was mentioned)?

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 11:11 PM

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@tender hazel what's an easy way to get hardware switching performance in routerOS?

hollow marlin Dec 17, 2019, 11:11 PM

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@tender hazel My biggest gripes with Mikrotik is L2 configuration by far. Bridge and switch feel as if I am repeating too many of the same actions. But like I said, Junos and Versa are almost identical in terms of L2 configuration to tiks

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 11:11 PM

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Everytime I did it, it took my access away

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The docs online are not good

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 11:12 PM

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@little schooner newer switch models (CRS3xx) are already configured for hardware switching with vlans etc

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what model are you using? is it the powerbox pro you talked about before?

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 11:12 PM

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But I need to know for powerbox pro

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Because I always had it lock me out

hollow marlin Dec 17, 2019, 11:12 PM

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@tender hazel I am not saying I dont like tiks, I love them. As an ISP we have 1000s of them deployed. Just can be frustrating at times

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 11:14 PM

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@little schooner ok so with powerbox pro there are two ways of setting things up - there is the old way which gives you full wirespeed switching but is more difficult to set up, and the newer way which is easier to set up but will not give you wirespeed switching. Set up the new way you can get 1.6Gbps total switching speed on that powerbox. If you need more than that you'll have to set it up the old way

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the new way is called bridge vlan filtering

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which method are you trying to use?

floral thorn Dec 17, 2019, 11:19 PM

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hey everyone

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which task you are solving?

hollow marlin Dec 17, 2019, 11:23 PM

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@floral thorn Hola, we're solving all the things

floral thorn Dec 17, 2019, 11:23 PM

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sounds cool

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looks like PowerBox Pro has QCA A8337 Gigabit Switch Chip

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https://wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/Manual:Switch_Chip_Features

Manual:Switch Chip Features

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 11:27 PM

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@tender hazel well I want the old way because that's how I get wire speed on all other vendor switches

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Why is wire speed hard to implement?

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 11:27 PM

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ok one sec.. I assume you want VLANs yes?

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 11:27 PM

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Yes and a management vlan

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Last time I tried doing it, always got locked out.

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 11:27 PM

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ok one moment, I just have to refresh my memory of the config

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 11:28 PM

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Call me noivce or something

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Sure

floral thorn Dec 17, 2019, 11:28 PM

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If you has problems with access drop just use

📎 unknown.png

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 11:28 PM

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@floral thorn what does safe mode do?

floral thorn Dec 17, 2019, 11:29 PM

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it rollback all your changes if WinBox lose access to RouterOS

little schooner Dec 17, 2019, 11:29 PM

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@floral thorn I'll remember that when I touch it again.

floral thorn Dec 17, 2019, 11:29 PM

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it's "reload in" as it shoud be

hollow marlin Dec 17, 2019, 11:30 PM

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No shit, I never knew that! Thanks for that

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 11:30 PM

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QCA 8337 supports vlans with routeros, was just verifying that first

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so this should be the correct reference for the config

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https://wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/Manual:Basic_VLAN_switching#Other_devices_with_built-in_switch_chip

Manual:Basic VLAN switching

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yes, safe mode is always good to use when you are doing something dangerous

floral thorn Dec 17, 2019, 11:32 PM

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it's easy to configure bridge thinkin about it as a separate switch with "bridge" as interface connected to the router

tender hazel Dec 17, 2019, 11:32 PM

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the really important thing there is that switch1-cpu has to be added as a port for whatever management vlan id you are using

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switch1-cpu is what connects the vlan with the vlan interface

#

it is like vlan 99 vs. interface vlan99 on a cisco switch

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on cisco they are connected together by default but on mikrotik you have to include switch1-cpu as a port to connect vlan99 wih interface vlan99

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everything on there is safe to do and won't lock you out until you get to /interface ethernet switch port near the end

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so I would turn on safe mode just before you start changing the interface ethernet switch port settings

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you can turn it on before you begin if you like, but turn it off and on again before you get to interface ethernet switch port

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that way you won't roll all your changes back if they were partially successful

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make sure bridge vlan filtering is turned OFF for the bridge

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as an aside, (different topic) the support for ipv6 in consumer routers is really horrendous