And distance between base stations would be around 4 meters
#virtual-reality
carmine wharf
sly falcon
yeah thats fine even for 1.0s
carmine wharf
Ok
And when I move my shelf and stuff my play space will probably be closer to 2m x 2.3m
sly falcon
yeah even better
the only place you run into issues is like dedicated vr rooms that are huge AF
carmine wharf
Yeah
sly falcon
you should be good unless u got one of those
carmine wharf
Very glad I finally measured my room and no longer have to worry
Only part im worried about now is that I actually don't have a drill to mount the base stations and im not even sure the land lord would be too happy
sly falcon
yes, but with holes
@carmine wharf you can remove them, but they leave holes where they were
carmine wharf
well yeah
sly falcon
thats the only issue with removing them
carmine wharf
i can just cover those
digital scaffold
Some of that plaster stuff fills them in easily.
Also, get a drill. They're cheap and really useful.
You'll probably need drywall anchors, too.
carmine wharf
Some of that plaster stuff fills them in easily.
@digital scaffold yep
You'll probably need drywall anchors, too.
@digital scaffold index comes with them
digital scaffold
Good.
carmine wharf
Also, get a drill. They're cheap and really useful.
@digital scaffold my dad can probably get one from his work
digital scaffold
Yeah. It's worth owning one too.
Black and decker sells cheaper ones for like 30 dollars.
carmine wharf
yeah i know
digital scaffold
They're not very good, but if you rarely use them it doesn't matter.
gloomy crater
Huh. When I bought my Index, the previous owner included a few 3d printed plates that the base station mounts slid into, and then you can attach the plates to the wall using command strips. So I got all my stuff mounted without having to drill a single hole, and when/if I move I'll just have to buy new command strips to reattach them wherever I happen to go
haughty thistle
I personally wouldn't trust my lighthouses any type of glue, like ever. But every do their own 
sly falcon
have you seen how thrillseeker hangs his index from his ceiling, it gives me major anxiety
digital scaffold
Yeah, It really bothers me.
haughty thistle
I'ma just gonna go out there and say, there's probably a reason why Thrill has so many problems with his index breaking and whatnot xD
sly falcon
yeah...
digital scaffold
Huh. I didn't notice that he wore nail polish until his latest video.
digital scaffold
digital scaffold
From this video: https://youtu.be/SwCS85BW8NQ
Not judging or anything, do what you want, but I just found it interesting.
sly falcon
yeah, kinda wierd
digital scaffold
He mentions it here.
I don't like digging in this stuff. I don't really care.
His buisness.
sly falcon
probably just bored but I agree, its his buisiness
how do I open the BS editor, im tryna pass some time im bored AF
gentle coral
Huh. When I bought my Index, the previous owner included a few 3d printed plates that the base station mounts slid into, and then you can attach the plates to the wall using command strips. So I got all my stuff mounted without having to drill a single hole, and when/if I move I'll just have to buy new command strips to reattach them wherever I happen to go
@gloomy crater
I have made my own that are similar using pipe, and a piece of wood. I am just too lazy to use one of the many 3d printers or laser cutters I have access to.
digital scaffold
Seems like more effort to me.
gentle coral
I can build simple stuff in a fraction of the time it takes to 3d model and print a 3d printed part.
Though my next version will have a few laser cut additions.
digital scaffold
You could also use someone else's model.
Like this one: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:3525381
regal breach
Mistakes were made:
Trying to play BeatSaber.
On a 30 degree day.
Wearing a cotton tee.
Standing next to the PC blowing out hot air.
😄
pastel echo
mistakes were made:
trying to play Blade and Sorcery.
On a GTX 980.
Using a I7 4770.
In a PC using only the GPU for airflow.
😢
fathom sigil
sly falcon
what brand microfiber cloth should I get for my vive, I dont have one rn
and no way in hell im using my shirt
fathom sigil
i just use the included one with my glasses, its a SpecSavers one
dunno if thats a thing in USA
or even in EU haha
haughty thistle
Good luck making a process for Saphire Glass optics... So far optics have either been cut (fresnel lenses) or molded (glass), but afaik sapphire glass is like grows or something? I don't know the specifics, but it's not your typical mold or cutting process, as both would not result in the clarity expected from glass
haughty thistle
I mean, there are camera lenses advertising sapphire glass, but I'm quite certain it's just a sheet of sapphire glass in front of the actual lense for protection (like it used to be some Android phones)
sly falcon
its not even that on the iphone side its just like blue glass essentially
scummy AF but then again I didnt buy it for the camera lense
haughty thistle
Well, the iPhones's "Sapphire Glass" is proven to contain actual sapphire Chrystals (at least on top of the lens), but it's some sort of hybrid material, which basically nullified the sapphire glass advantages
It was technically speaking however sapphire glass
sly falcon
yeah but it still scratches at a level 6 and 7 making it still glass from a durability standpoint
haughty thistle
which basically nullified the sapphire glass advantages
sly falcon
yep
haughty thistle
The Xtal headset uses non-fresnell lenses. I'm curious whether those are glass or plastic 
haughty thistle
Well, think about it. A fresnel lens is usually plastic, if I remember correctly
It's to make manufacturing easier
sly falcon
ah
haughty thistle
The Xtal uses molded lenses. It doesn't rule out plastic as the lens material, but then again, it's 5k for the headset alone...
haughty thistle
Oculus?
sly falcon
well oculus is a dumbass
haughty thistle
You can tell Oculus didn't care about the PC with the release of the Quest
All the marketing since then was on the Quest. All the software focus was on the Quest. The Rift S was only made in a rush to have something to present for the PCVR gamer while Quest Link wasn't ready
Also, Lenovo isn't completely at fault here. The Lenovo Explorer, their previous headset using WMR tracking was one of the better WMR offerings of the initial release
rustic garnet
why does noone care about entry level vr anymore 
sly falcon
because its all said and done
haughty thistle
Facebook does. Because they want the juicy data, before anyone else steps in
sly falcon
windows MR this quest 2 that
rustic garnet
Facebook doesn't care about the vr they care about sucking people in
haughty thistle
True, I guess...
sly falcon
yeah, the strap is sub par on all their devices, the quest 1 started burning for me after like 20 mins
and it made the back of my head numb
rustic garnet
How heavy is the the Q2?
sly falcon
light
haughty thistle
A big problem is still the manufacturing costs, small user base and interest, and high risks involved with going in
sly falcon
not as light as alot of pcvr things but light
haughty thistle
In the VR market were severly lacking competition, which makes the prices of existing headsets more won the expensive site. Most people with VR interest have the money to spare on an expensive headset
digital scaffold
And the rest probably want something standalone.
Something no other company hasn't really worked on much.
sly falcon
the issue with vr is that its got a bad rep for no reason
haughty thistle
Setting up a completely separate exo system around a small user base doesn't make much sense though
digital scaffold
I bet valve is working on something as it is would be stupid not to.
haughty thistle
Heh...
sly falcon
everyone thinks its not worth it but all they did is watch one video of someone playing job simulator and said no, this is awful
digital scaffold
But, it's valve.
haughty thistle
Valve Index Portable xD
digital scaffold
everyone thinks its not worth it but all they did is watch one video of someone playing job simulator and said no, this is awful
@sly falcon No , they used Google Cardboard once.
sly falcon
lol
haughty thistle
Running SteamOS ofc
digital scaffold
hahaha
sly falcon
I remember I used cardboard because I wanted pcvr
digital scaffold
I remebered I used washing machine because I wanted new monitor.
They're two very different things lmao.
sly falcon
since 2016 Ive always wanted a vive, good thing I didnt get it launch day
haughty thistle
HTC also kinda packed the list for more income
sly falcon
yep, just dont get the older vives because oled degration was a big issue on the old old ones
digital scaffold
That too.
haughty thistle
Of the Cosmos Elite was the one they've released for 700$, they probably would still be around in the VR market
sly falcon
one the newer ones its still an issue but like its a passive thing that will start in like 4 years so its really non issue
digital scaffold
Of the Cosmos Elite was the one they've released for 700$, they probably would still be around in the VR market
@haughty thistle Yeah, they read the market completely wrong
Looked at the popular inexpensive headsets coming out and decided to do the same thing but for 700$. Like 3 times over.
haughty thistle
They probably didn't expect Facebook to hold the price of 400$ for their headsets...
Remember, the Rift CV1 released for 700$, but was the discounted to first 600$ and the 400$
sly falcon
I Was so supprised that they made the quest 2 300 bucks and somehow made it better
its sick
digital scaffold
Single LCD and cheaper accessories
haughty thistle
Yeah, you can really tell Facebook is playing their Data collection card real hard
sly falcon
yeah, but they were pushing for single LCD you know even if it was 400 it would still be that
digital scaffold
Probably have a more refined production process as well.
haughty thistle
I don't think that the single LCD or the accessories played a big role in the cost reduction
digital scaffold
They played a role. Other then that, I think they sell them at a loss.
sly falcon
what exactly is there to sell about your movement data
haughty thistle
I think they're also now subsidizing it through user data and software sales
Most people owning a Quest just buy their games there and never use it with a PC
sly falcon
oh shit! john moved his arm left, start giving safeway advertisements
rustic garnet
You can get usage trends
sly falcon
ahh
rustic garnet
Your day schedule
sly falcon
also vive wands arent that heavy for me whats up with that
digital scaffold
what exactly is there to sell about your movement data
@sly falcon They have all the metrics, you can accurately figure out who someone is solely from their movement patters. They can also see exactly how long someone was looking at a certain advertisement compared to a different one.
rustic garnet
Also not to forget it has four fucking cameras
sly falcon
am I just so used to it that it doesnt bother me anymore?
digital scaffold
Also not to forget it has four fucking cameras
@rustic garnet Cameras are not that expensive.
haughty thistle
Yeah, but scientists have found outy that you can reliably identify a person based on their movement patterns. With just 3 tracking points (head and hands)
rustic garnet
Mby you're just stronk
digital scaffold
Yeah, scary stuff.
sly falcon
Mby you're just stronk
@rustic garnet I mean I sweat at BS with them
haughty thistle
Tbh the Vive Wands were a total no problem for me while I used them regularly. But after I used the Index controllers once, I could never really get used to the Vive Wands anymore
digital scaffold
Yeah, at the time they were great, but they're dated now.
sly falcon
I perfer them over touches, they fit my hands better
but id imagine once I get knuckles that will change
digital scaffold
Which touch controllers?
digital scaffold
I guess I could see that.
haughty thistle
Yeah the Quest/Rift S controllers are tiny
digital scaffold
The new ones are slightly better because they're larger.
sly falcon
out here playing oculus home on my HTC vive
haughty thistle
The CV1 Controllers are still held by many as the most comfortable VR controller out there
I can see where they're coming from
sly falcon
as I said, ive never used the CV1 maybe they will be the best things ive ever used, maybe they will suck ass
haughty thistle
Touch 2 was a disaster, and I heard Touch 3 only fixed it slightly, but not completely
digital scaffold
Putting the ring on the bottom always seemed a little odd.
sly falcon
well you gotta track it somehow
digital scaffold
Yeah, but you have the cameras up high, and the controllers lower.
I guess it worked.
sly falcon
well if the camera is high it can see you and the floor, if its eye level it cant see shit
haughty thistle
The reason the ring is on the bottom, is for the weight distribution
I guess that's why the CV1s are still better then Touch V3, even though the layout is pretty much the same (different stem though)
digital scaffold
That makes sense.
sly falcon
what ever happened to vr triggers, the wands had such good ones and now we have squeaky messes
haughty thistle
Cheaping out, I guess
sly falcon
dont the touches have a similar cost to the wands
lemme look it up hold on
nope, 100 bucks cheaper
digital scaffold
Yeah, I worry mine will start squeaking.
I mean, if you hit it into the wall, you're pressing directly onto the mechanism.
sly falcon
no joke my controllers were shipped by USPS after being WELL used by their previous owner and the only issue is a slight springy sound on the trigger
meanwhile my quest controllers sound like an entire rat colony got brutally murdered
sly falcon
These are 3-4 year old controllers
meanwhile my touches (dont have them rn) are hurting my ears
digital scaffold
No, in the triggers.
sly falcon
the hinge yeah
digital scaffold
okay.
rustic garnet
This episode is sponsored by ifixt
digital scaffold
I replaced the lube inside my controllers with some nicer ones.
Don't know why they don't use some sort of self-lubricating plastics.
sly falcon
I just deal with it because I use headphones and you dont really feel it
digital scaffold
Unfortunately, it's a pretty involved process on the touches.
sly falcon
its just annoying for spectators
digital scaffold
Well, it's wearing down more.
rustic garnet
get the mahi driver kit with 48 bits and all the tools you need for the low price of your newborn
sly falcon
and for a limited time, you you sell your soul to satin, you can get up to 10% off your purchase
linus should do a vid on fixing the touch controllers
digital scaffold
Ifixit should on the quest 2.
sly falcon
yeah, forgot they had a channel
digital scaffold
The T2 controllers were a pain to open lmao
sly falcon
I dont even know where to start
sly falcon
Im not good with SFF stuff\
I usually stay out of phones and monitors
stick to laptops and desktops unless its already broken
digital scaffold
Phones can be pretty bad, yeah.
fathom sigil
The newer the phone the harder, and not because the adhesive is newer it's because of much worse reasons 
digital scaffold
Yeah, but they at least sell parts and a repair manual.
digital scaffold
it's really annoying to find parts, though.
you pretty much have to search by model number
and then you get like a billion results for capacitors.
fathom sigil
Also that's USA so gg to my bois in EU 
digital scaffold
I think they ship to europe.
fathom sigil
Yeah for like £50 maybe
rustic garnet
Samsung's korean??
digital scaffold
Yeah?
rustic garnet
Why do you think they ship from america
fathom sigil
Imports from USA are really expensive
digital scaffold
There's a different site for Korea IIRC.
rustic garnet
It's prolly stuff from the factory
dry dove
Oculus is weird
I ordered a quest 2, elite strap with battery, carrying case, and the link cable.
For some reason the payment gets declined
So i fixed it
And the Quest 2 came
And now Oculus is refusing to ship the other things
I emailed them and they just cancelled the whole order on me
sly falcon
any other good social vr platforms, rec room is toxic and vrchat performs terribly
haughty thistle
Depends on what kind of rooms your in. VRC performs pretty OK in smaller groups. If you're looking for te best performance in a social VR application, ChilloutVR is a good alternative, but it has it's flaws, especially in FBT and Menu design. The former is the main reason why many who've tried CVR came back to VRC after a few day
digital scaffold
I'm surprised there isn't a fakebook vr.
sly falcon
does chillout support FBT????
haughty thistle
I'm surprised there isn't a fakebook vr.
@digital scaffold There will be. And it will be called Horizons
my guess is that FB will scrap "Oculus Venues" for Horizons, once the platform is ready. And might even integrate it into the home menu, requiring an Internet connection to even use the damn' headset. At least it sounds like pretty Facebook move to me...
digital scaffold
Yeah.
haughty thistle
does chillout support FBT????
@sly falcon Yes it does, but apparently it's quite janky
sly falcon
is chillout even downloadable???
digital scaffold
like the Wii U's menu lmao
sly falcon
I dont see the button
haughty thistle
Rn it's only available to download through ABIs Website
sly falcon
hmm, does it work with steamvr?
haughty thistle
like the Wii U's menu lmao
@digital scaffold Well, the Wii Us Home screen was enhanced by online capabilities, but it wasn't a necessity
hmm, does it work with steamvr?
@sly falcon It actually requires SteamVR. You just have a separate launcher to deal with on the Desktop. But SteamVR has to run when starting up CVR
haughty thistle
I think if you login here, you can download it: https://hub.abinteractive.net/login
sly falcon
nice
white sluice
What's the best entry level gear?
hardy kayak
Aside from Quest 2, are there any bookface-less alternatives that are stand-alone headsets?
rustic garnet
Nop
haughty thistle
Well, it's confimred real, but then again, highly unlikely they're gonna be able to sustain the price of 450$ for wheat they want to offer
Aka. If they ever do sell, then probably for a higher price then originally advertised
sly falcon
nice, id pay up to 600 for it but 450 would be amazing
young marten
dry dove
I hope you enjoy yours!
young marten
same to you bro gonna make my 3070 do some work!
gloomy crater
After three months, I just got my index order payment request
Too bad I got impatient and bought a used index already lol
Idk what I'm gonna do with the order. Probably either drop ship it to someone who wants to skip the line, let it run out, or just outright cancel it
regal breach
If you dont want a new one why not just cancel it?
harsh niche
hey uh
is this legit? $17 for all of these games while saints and sinners alone costs $40?
idk how this website works
only other time i've used it is for a free game
holy heck dude this is an amazing deal
gray aurora
It's legit, humble gives a portion of sales to charity too. You can set your charity % of contribution to 100% like myself if you so desire. The catch is usually that the games at the $1 tier suck. That's it. Oh, and you redeem them on steam.
I have over 100 unplayed games from humble bundles lol. And those are rookie numbers.
digital scaffold
Yeah
There's also humble montly where they give you a few games every month.
Last month they had Tropico 6.b
fathom sigil
Yes humble is legit. Aapb99 explained really well, you can select how much goes to devs, charity or humble themselves and the value is pretty good. Unfortunately most bundles aren't actually game bundles, but rather software or game dev assets or books which for me isn't very exciting but the game bundles are usually overall high quality
celest sphinx
The first VR Humble Bundle in February was a heck of a deal too though, it included:
- Cosmic Trip
- Smashbox Arena
- GORN
- Budget Cuts
- Space Pirate Trainer
- SUPERHOT VR
- Moss
gentle coral
Humble bundles are great, and rally support devs and non profits, i have worked with non profits and devs that used Humble bundle and it works great. I am a long term user, and have been a Humble monthly user since it was in beta. Their store also often undercuts even steam discounts. And their software, book, comic, and asset bundles are great as well. I would definitely disagree that them having non game bundles are unfortunate. I would say that is a very uncommon opinion and demerits their value. I know great award winning games that have had assets that come from those bundles, and use the software they get from bundles.
I now have extra copies for about a hundred games from bundles I get yo support devs.
Definitely going to get this vr bundle.
sly falcon
looking forward to other humble bundles, havent gotten to play these yet but they all look great, I got tier 2
do they do one for winter?
sly falcon
cool
carmine wharf
id buy the bundle for $17 but its only 1 game i want and 1 game ive already played, the rest id never use
sly falcon
nice
harsh niche
how often are the vr bundles? only twice a year?
sly falcon
I would assume not often
haughty thistle
I'd say a 1060 6GB or 970 (or equivalent) should be able to run VR headsets of the first Gen (OG Vive and Rift CV1)
balmy adder
i have a quest 2, i'd be fine with downscaling the res to 1080p per eye tho
pastel echo
The 980 will run VR games on the Rift but don't try to play anything crazy or unoptimized
haughty thistle
With the Quest and Quest 2 you have to keep in mind that there's a larger overhead, due to the image having to be compressed
pastel echo
I'm a blade and Sorcery player and the only thing pushing me to upgrade is that the 980 is on the verge of being obsolete for VR
haughty thistle
I'd say the biggest reason not to get a Quest for PCVR is that you'd need a pretty decent CPU to properly play PCVR with it. I'd say something with at least 6 cores/12 threads with decent gaming performance, should be good enough for Quest PCVR. (aka a modern mid-range gaming PC)
Remember that changing the render scale does not affect the encoding resolution for Quest Link/VD
pastel echo
I'm waiting to see how the new AMD chips and cards will handle the quest 2
Surely there will be at least someone who does a video on exactly this
haughty thistle
There most likely will be
gaunt hull
Quest 2 is cool except for the Facebook data mining bull crap
haughty thistle
Remember that Radeon drivers, at least in the past, have been notorious for breaking VR support. Just a word of caution
balmy adder
what fps would this build get in the average vr game https://pcpartpicker.com/list/VWpJsk
pastel echo
Yeah AMD and VR is iffy. I am hesitant to go ryzen this time around despite the performance because blade and Sorcery has had game breaking issues with and chips
haughty thistle
Hard to say, but if you want to play VR with a Quest on that System, upgrade to at least a Ryzen 5 @balmy adder
pastel echo
Also as a general note you should consider not cheaping out on the PSU and get a gold
I've seen a fair number of computers fall at the hand of lower end PSUs
balmy adder
ill probably wait 2-3 years till stuff is cheaper and i can get a vr ready pc for ~500
cause i get $250 ish for my birthday so i'd have enough by then
haughty thistle
I mean, I used to have an 80+ Bronze PSU, it's fine. As long as you get a name-brand one, it should be fine
haughty thistle
Well, if you have a high power system with like an RTX 3090 or something ,you wanna get 80+ Platinum, no joke
pastel echo
Also @balmy adder I'd look into the used computers and parts in your area
balmy adder
hmm
would a dell optiplex with a i5 + like a 1060 or 1070 (and a new psu) be enough for vr?
haughty thistle
Most likely
pastel echo
I got a (gtx980/i7-4770/equivalent grade parts) machine for $444.44 and it's run everything but blade and Sorcery without issue on my rift
balmy adder
and how much would it cost in total
if the pc was like $150?
bruh
i found a 1gb vram gpu on ebay for 70 bucks
and its almost gone
who bought that
haughty thistle
Just to drop a reference point for PCVR on Quest Link:
I've noticed that framerates are about halved on Quest Link compared to my Index. At the time I tested this, I ran a 1080Ti and an i7 8700k@4.5GHz. Framerates in a people-free lobby in VRC was ~36fps on Quest Link and >100fps on the Index
Games that were less reliant on the CPU weren#t as bad, but similar performance impact through the entire board
haughty thistle
I've seen people play VR on a 1660 before. I'm not saying it's not worth trying, but you'd have to lower the render scale no doubt
balmy adder
hmm
maybe ill just wait till parts are cheaper
cpus and gpus are already getting cheaper & better, just need them to get more cheaper & better
balmy adder
ok then
i can wait, my current pc works for what i do on it (just web browsing basically anymore... i use my quest 2 and nintendo switch for gaming)
gray reef
@balmy adder If you think you can swap the PSU, I’d go for it and save up for a decent Power Supply and a better graphics card
You’ll probably also want another 8GB of RAM and an SSD, but your GPU is probably more important if you’re on a budget
regal breach
Yeah AMD and VR is iffy. I am hesitant to go ryzen this time around despite the performance because blade and Sorcery has had game breaking issues with and chips
@pastel echo why would you have a concern over Ryzen for VR? It's a CPU ffs.
I've had zero issues whatesoever with VR on Ryzen in any way that can be attributed to CPU/Chipset issues.
sly falcon
anyone here have raw data and know if you can use snap turn/joystick turn
pine prawn
anyone want to play a township tale with me? ive got a private server ima bout to wipe so i can play on it
@ me if you do
pastel echo
@regal breach I love blade and Sorcery, blade and Sorcery has had issues on ryzen due to the developer not owning ryzen. That seemed pretty clear lol
gray reef
Are you sure it was the CPU?
regal breach
Yeah, I'm calling BS, if CPUs of any type caused some kind of fundamental issue with instructions behaving differently it would be widespread across millions of applications, not individual games.
pastel echo
The developer at the time that issue presented itself said sorry he was not working with an AMD cpu and then fixed it
I don't think there is a problem currently I just am hesitant to buy ryzen because blade and Sorcery is the only thing requiring I upgrade my computer
stiff hull
@haughty thistle @balmy adder I play on a 1660 super, i7 4790, it works great, :)
gloomy crater
So since I'm running an RX550 right now, VR performance is kinda crap. I've been thinking of getting an older card to use temporarily until the new gen cards have better stock, and to keep as a collector's piece. Found an EVGA 1080 on FB for $265 but idk if I'm gonna go for it. Haven't checked up on VR benchmarks for the 1080 yet
At the moment both the low end GPU and lack of prescription lenses for my index are making it super hard to play anything. So I either have to just tough it out and pray the RX6800XT custom cards come out not too long after the reference cards, or drop the extra dough on that 1080 to keep me satiated in terms of VR, since I have no idea how long it will take me to actually get a 6800XT
gentle coral
The vive rig i usually test on started as a 7th gen i5, 1060 3GB, 256GB sata ssd, and 8 GB single channel 2400MHz ram. It played most games fine, but was definitely the absolute minimum.
Anything above a 1060 3GB should be a good starting point.
I still use that machine to test games very often
gloomy crater
Well, right now I'm playing on a 4gb RX550 and all my graphics settings are dropped to as low as possible. I managed to pass a beatsaber song that had 9 average notes per second with this setup earlier today though. Haven't sweat like that in a while.
gentle coral
I really should record data on all of my vr machines sometime to see my exact settings and share them.
haughty thistle
Yeah, I'm calling BS, if CPUs of any type caused some kind of fundamental issue with instructions behaving differently it would be widespread across millions of applications, not individual games.
@regal breach there are certain Instruction sets on Intel that can be really helpful for a developer, but aren't available on AMD, because their Intel Proprietary.
One example would be that the PS3 Emulator uses some Intel instructions to speed up emulation, but on AMD this is only possible through some workaround which is much, much slower
regal breach
Code will either fail to run entirely if you try to use those opcodes or have alternate paths. If you're not using a library to do this kind of stuff, then I dunno what to tell you other than that's really silly. And from what I'm aware of Ryzen lacks AVX512 and that's about it.
pastel echo
Has anyone seen anything worth mentioning use the Index expansion slot?
haughty thistle
Code will either fail to run entirely if you try to use those opcodes or have alternate paths. If you're not using a library to do this kind of stuff, then I dunno what to tell you other than that's really silly. And from what I'm aware of Ryzen lacks AVX512 and that's about it.
@regal breach It's not just AVX512, although that's the most noteworthy one. There are also a bunch of libraries made by Intel, that have soft locks to only work on Intel, like HAXM (used by Android Studio for emulation acceleration). These look for specific behavior in certain extensions like VT-x, to make sure it's running on an Intel CPU
haughty thistle
Remember that the Q2 has a much higher processing demand
haughty thistle
The Quest 2 has a higher encoding and rendering res then the Rift S and thus is both on the CPU as well as on the GPU harder
sullen linden
1060 rift gang
gentle coral
since I want to start creating a testing method for multiple headsets and computers, what games should I test
My current list is
Superhot vr
Raw data
Beat saber
Vrchat
HLA
Skyrim VR with mods
Minecraft vr modded
Star wars squadrons
Elite dangerous
And a few custom unity scenes
Any other games people here would like to see tested?
pine prawn
A Township Tale
sly falcon
what the hell do I use the usb port on the vive for
and why is it so deep
since I want to start creating a testing method for multiple headsets and computers, what games should I test
My current list is
Superhot vr
Raw data
Beat saber
Vrchat
HLA
Skyrim VR with mods
Minecraft vr modded
Star wars squadrons
Elite dangerousAnd a few custom unity scenes
Any other games people here would like to see tested?
@gentle coral that list seems pretty good, maybe add VI with revive
sullen linden
what would be the cheapest but best gpu for vr
sly falcon
thanksgiving break in 6.5 school days cant wait to tell people to not touch my headset for a whole day
thats gonna be a chore
haughty thistle
what would be the cheapest but best gpu for vr
@sullen linden best bang for buck rn, I'd say is the 3070. Cheapest GPU still really good at VR is the 2060. I'd advise staying away from Radeon cards for VR as their drivers like to break VR regularly, and sometimes massively
what the hell do I use the usb port on the vive for
@sly falcon it's for possible accessories. If you wanna use it as a general purpose USB port, HTC used to offer a short adapter cable
gloomy crater
So I know that systems running the same parts will have wildly different performance depending on if you're playing in native PCVR on something like an Index or playing with the oculus software via link on something like a quest 2. So if I get a 1080 that ppl say plays steamVR good, there's no way to tell if the Oculus software will like it or not
dry dove
Does anyone know how long it takes for the Index to ship after you put in the payment?
gloomy crater
I'd advise staying away from Radeon cards for VR as their drivers like to break VR regularly, and sometimes massively
looks over at the RX550 in my computer hmm
Does anyone know how long it takes for the Index to ship after you put in the payment?
I've heard some say it takes up to 2 weeks after payment to arrive
dry dove
Damn
haughty thistle
Back when I ordered my Index it shipped just a few days after payment. But then again that was during the second batch back in July 2019
sullen linden
beat saber bts pack just came out
green crypt
it depends where you live dyno i got mine after paying for it 2 a 3 days later but i am close to the warehouse not supper close but you could be farther away
@gentle coral the question is how will you test vrc as optimization in vrchat is weird. it depends on the world how many players are in it and the models the players use. also depends on how you have configured your system as on ryzen vrchat runs better limited to 4 cores in frametimes and you feel the lag. i would say it's 3 a 4 hours just to test all the things you can have happen. also the maximum players you can have in a world is 80 as that is the hardcap and then you are at 20 a 30 fps no matter what gpu you have it's all cpu
dry dove
Where is the Warehouse?
green crypt
are you in the us or europe?
dry dove
US
green crypt
in the us i have no idea as i'm in the eu but from what i know of us people it's at least longer then eu
United States located in Carol Stream, Illinois it's on the shipping faq
haughty thistle
In Europe Indexes ship from Amsterdam, I think.
If it's not Amsterdam, the Rotterdam
dry dove
That isn't that far
green crypt
eu is tilburg in the netherlands
haughty thistle
Yeah something like that. Gotta check where mine have been shipped from
green crypt
it will probably ship this evening so i would say look tommorow for sure
dry dove
I hope so
green crypt
oh yeah vr awards are today for anyone interested
signal void
Ayo bhaptics new lineup lookin kinda 🔥 tho
sullen linden
vr awards?
green crypt
it's an award show but this year it's happening in vrchat but you needed to claim a free ticket and today is the event
sly falcon
what avatar should I use in vrc it currently this ugly ass circle guy
harsh niche
The Quest 2 has a higher encoding and rendering res then the Rift S and thus is both on the CPU as well as on the GPU harder
btw vd uses gpu
hard comet
green crypt
vr is better for your eyes then a flat screen as you still have depth perception and i use vr sometimes for 8 hours a day and my vision hasn't gone worse from vr
green crypt
just quit when you get a headache pretty much yeah
it also depends on the vr headset tho i would say 2 a 4 hours max if you are new and you can see if you can build it up
green crypt
yeah not a problem just need to make sure you don't get motion sick if you feel dizzy just take a break
sly falcon
Is VR bad for eyes if I use for 1 hour weekly?
@hard comet I play it for 3 hours daily and ive still got perfect vision, ur good
haughty thistle
I've had bad vision before going in VR. How worse can it get? actually, not at all. Haven't had to replace my glasses ever since going in VR for the first time
fathom sigil
my left eye was bad before vr and hasnt gotten any worse, have a contact lens for it
young marten
Only thing I could think of eye strain from looking at one thing for too long. But that really doesn’t happen when moving your head and eyes in vr.
fathom sigil
id say no dark mode is worse 
young marten
⌨️ ⬜
fathom sigil
trueee
haughty thistle
I can imagine, that when you have the IPD not set correctly on your headset that you might end up with your eyes either being slightly pulled together or slightly spread apart. But this would require a lot of hours in VR. Like if you're a dev and currently are testing a game 8h/day 5days/week
And the chance of not noticing the wrong IPD setting with being that much in VR is borderline impossible, as you'd notice eyestrain similar to when you cross your eyes.
pastel echo
Anyone know any good racing games that support VR?
I've got a wheel and a rift and I kinda wanna use em 👀
pastel echo
Sick wishlisted
haughty thistle
Dirt Rally and Dirt Rally 2 both have VR support. Although the first Dirt Rally required an Oculus headset with SteamVR, Dirt Rally 2 runs with other SteamVR headsets as well
pastel echo
Just checked and I apparently have Dirt Rally 2.0 but it wants 100 GB of space
that's gonna be a no
agile abyss
harsh niche
$8-12 for cameras...?
that's pretty crazy
how are they getting all of this so dang cheap
sullen linden
tfw the plastic faceplate can cost more than both of ur lenses
stone raptor
Seems to good to be true, however valve verified they're legit so...
digital scaffold
Cameras are really not that expensivd.
They're bought in volume and aren't very good in terms of quality.
Plus aren't color
pale orbit
because contrary to what most think the cost of actually making something is really quite low. the markup is huge. so they are probably bulk buying parts direct and then doing very very little markup
more or less making the headset at cost
digital scaffold
Yeah.
The ones on the quest are probably like 5 usd each because they're ordering in massive quantities.
And on the Q2, the cameras probably haven't changed.
sullen linden
how much would you guess the panels on a quest cost?
pale orbit
like example oh those $250 pair of nike sneakers that people are raving about, probably cost them $5 in materials. and then it's nikey so child/slave labour probably cost them another $3 in labour costs
digital scaffold
Molds are the expensive part.
You're paying for brand, design, and owner's cigar addiction.
how much would you guess the panels on a quest cost?
@sullen linden the plastic is probably ABS, so very cheap.
young marten
No one knows how good their support will be even if the headset works well and stays the same price.
Support for products and stuff made me not go with Pimax even though I weighed fov heavily even at the cost of things like distortion.
digital scaffold
Yeah. No small start up will be able to beat the quest 2 at the same price.
Only someone like valve or Samsung could.
Who can afford the RnD
gentle coral
I am starting to get excited for the next gen PSVR, as I almost expect it to work with PC really well. Sony is the only major company that has both a top teir microdisplay division, a high end optics division, and a camera sensor division. Sony could probably undercut anyone in the VR space, due to being the manufacturer of so many of the parts.
young marten
gentle coral
I am doing a talk on privacy and security in XR tech this Saturday at an international hackathon. I hope that the stuff I predict this time for what the industry needs to do actually happens or we are in for a rough ride.
I have been really happy with all the youtubers and media attention that the Facebook / Oculus chaos has brought to the security and privacy in VR and AR.
It is sad that the only way we seem to improve privacy and security is when companies like Facebook try to do it wrong, and we need to fight tooth and nail to give people privacy and security.
carmine wharf
Is the reverb g2 really worth it? Its got higher resolution than the index but the refresh rate, field of view, and controllers are worse
Ig what I'm asking is like, is the extra resolution worth it compared to those other things
young marten
From what I've seen with a lot of reviewers is that it can be kinda opinionated to which of those things is most important.
But i've seen a lot of people say the reverb is a great headset in general. You might have to do some thinking about what you really want to get out of vr to choose I think.
gentle coral
I have found when done well WMR headsets are just as good as any other inside out tracked headset (quest, rift s, Quest 2), and those are only worse then an outside in tracked headset if you actually know how to set up the outside in trackers properly. Tracking should be mostly a non issue in the Reverb G2 (anything that trips it up would probably also trip up the rift s or Quest). In terms of controllers I am hoping they are as good as they look, because there are definitely annoyances with the old WMR controllers.
digital scaffold
Yeah, I've heard of it. Why?
sly falcon
do any of you guys know what edpuzzle is
@obsidian flint yep, im doing them rn, you can right click and copy the yt video into a browser and get the awnsers
digital scaffold
You can also use an extension to increase the speed of the video.
digital scaffold
I actually think it's possible without an extension in firefox for up to 2x speed.
if you right click twice.
But I use video speed controller since it goes to 16x speed.
sly falcon
thatl be usefull for the ones that you just watch
digital scaffold
Yeah, Or where the teacher puts like 5 minutes between questions.
sly falcon
yeah
gloomy crater
So these are my options if I wanna have better VR performance before the launch of the big navi cards: there are 2 VR players in my household, and I could either 1. not buy a new GPU, and just switch my and the other person's GPU, I would get better VR performance, but the other person's card can't even play VR because it's too bad for oculus' software to run well. So I would get better performance on my index, but their experience wouldn't change since they couldn't play VR in the first place. With this option, I wouldn't have to DDU either machines since they're both radeon cards. 2nd option, we buy a GTX 1080 and I switch out my card for it, and get much better VR performance until I get my RX6800XT, and then swap it into the other machine. With this option I would ultimately have to use DDU three times. Last option, we buy the 1080 and the other person gets it, and I get to use their old card. That way I have a card that will work (for me) better than the old card, and they have a card that's good enough to run well with oculus' software. With this option, I would only have to use DDU once, and we would be able to play VR at the same time, which we've never been able to do before
I personally wanna do the third one, but then the other person would be shouldering the entire price of the new card, since they would be the only one using it. so it would be their decision of whether or not to buy it. I personally think it's worth it, but they don't see the point, since they've only ever played on quest natively
spiral tide
just wait?
gloomy crater
I've been trying to do just that, and while my current card plays beatsaber with not-horrible framerates most of the time, if my computer does something in the background that causes my GPU usage to jump at all, I get lag spikes that fail me out of songs. And half life alyx is completely unplayable because my card is so far below the recommended specs. If I just waited until I got my hands on a 6800XT, i would be waiting for almost a month, and both me and the other VR player would be having a horrible time. The reason I wanted to go with the third one is bc then me, the other person, and a friend of ours could play in VRchat together. Would be the first time we've been 'in the same place' since the pandemic hit
haughty thistle
You'd probably be waiting more then a month for the new Radeon cards. Bots are still everywhere grabbing high-end gaminging hardware where they can. And I don't think the new Radeon cards will be an exception...
spiral tide
Chickenbread is right... you might as well get a hold over card till then for one of the computers.... and then sell it once you get the RX6800 you want.
that said a 1080 looks like good value..
gloomy crater
There was just a 1080 FTW ACX3.0 on ebay for $227 plus tax & shipping. Snagged it. This week is gonna be fun. For context, I have an RX550, which runs my index okay but not great, and the other VR player has an RX570 that can't play VR because they have a quest and oculus' software requires higher end hardware. So They'll probably get the 1080 and be able to play their quest with a link or virtual desktop, and I'll most likely get their RX570 which since I'm using the index will probably give me the overhead I need to have a more playable experience.
dry dove
Praying to the VR gods my Index ships today
fair meteor
Hi! So i'm in the market for a VR headset and I'm looking at the Rift S and the Quest 2. Like it's mostly going to be for PC Vr and i know the quest 2 has the link cable, but is it better than the rift s for pc VR?
harsh niche
yeah idk what they were talking about... but the people at VD say that it doesn't decrease fps, they say it used the encoding part of your gpu not the one for processing games
@fair meteor i used to have a rift s, got rid of it a while ago because it was just uncomfortable and blurry, got a quest 2 with the elite strap and it is sooo much better
virtual desktop is amazing
dry dove
I can't really help with that question
harsh niche
once the link cable is full res and full refresh rate i'll use it, I got a third party 16ft usb c to usb c cable for $20
dry dove
I have 4 headsets
harsh niche
virtual desktop is so cool because you don't get tangled in wires
sullen linden
yeah
harsh niche
you don't need a wifi 6 router
fair meteor
wait so the link cable isn't full res or full refresh?
harsh niche
mine's just normal 5ghz
@fair meteor not yet
it will be "soon" along with the actual quest games
fair meteor
what is it currently?
harsh niche
virtual desktop however is full res AND full refresh with some tweaking in sidequest
it's 72hz and the res of the og rift
fair meteor
and why is it $80?
fair meteor
alright so it's still worth getting over the rift s?
harsh niche
yeah
along with higher refresh longer controller battery life more comfortable controllers and the ability to go wireless
and a very noticeable increase in resolution
here's the cable
it also comes with cable management velcro things
fair meteor
oh shit the 64GB variant isn't too bad. I looked at the 256GB and well if i'm buying games from the occulus store then it'll probably only be beat saber
harsh niche
yeah
64gb is more than enough if you're using it for pc
only other things i have stored on the quest are bigscreen, vrchat, and rec room
vrchat is crap on there im going to uninstall it
and i never play recroom... so
I still have 46gb or so left
fair meteor
so i noticed there's an "elite strap"
fair meteor
ohh alright
fair meteor
uhh just realized i don't have a USB C port on my computer
digital scaffold
You can use an adapter.
fair meteor
oh i can use a USB C to A?
fair meteor
yeah
digital scaffold
Yeah, just make sure it's usb 3. USB 2 looks a lot worse.
fair meteor
so can i just buy a 5 meter type c to a cable and it should work?
obsidian flint
for anyone looking for budget vr
quest 2
it’s worth it
i got one it’s amazing
i know 64 gb doesn’t seem like a lot, but most ve games are less than a gb
so don’t spend an extra 100 bucks
haughty thistle
I'd argue against getting the Quest for budget PCVR, as the Quest 2 requires a more powerful PC to get equal framerates to even the HP Reverb G2. The OG Quest already has a slightly higher performance demand then the G2.
So while I do recommended it to people who don't mind Facebook knowing you to the tiniest detail and want to play VR standalone, I just cannot recommend it as a budget option for PCVR. PCVR is just expensive. Accept that fact.
harsh niche
virtual desktop is wonderful
you can use either x264 or hvec encoding for better image quality and higher latency or worse image quality and less latency
they claim it doesn't affect performance because it uses the special encoding cores in your gpu, but idk about that
gloomy crater
so if the other person in my house, the one getting the 1080, uses a quest, and we have pretty slow internet already, would it be better to get a link cable, or use virtual desktop? We're gonna have to spend $20 anyway. They prefer the wirelessness of the quest but I'm not sure if our internet can handle it well
harsh niche
do you have 2 routers or just 1 @gloomy crater
gloomy crater
1
harsh niche
5ghz?
gloomy crater
good question
harsh niche
haha
gloomy crater
I have no idea
harsh niche
you can find it out in settings somewhere
go to wifi -> hardware properties
and i'm wired up to this mesh thing so it's even better
it's right next to my pc
harsh niche
oh lmao
you should be fine then
5ghz can push out a lot more data than virtual desktop needs
in virtual desktop mine says 866mbps or something
gloomy crater
noice
harsh niche
if you do math that's like double what the video would actually need
so you should be just fine, but i think at more than 2 people or downloading something you might start running into issues
and also pc hotspots work but they're not recommended
gotta go now cya
haughty thistle
they claim it doesn't affect performance because it uses the special encoding cores in your gpu, but idk about that
@harsh niche I'm happy to inform you, that I even tested this and noticed the same amount, in some cases even worse, loss of performance on my Quest compared to my Index
gray reef
There was just a 1080 FTW ACX3.0 on ebay for $227 plus tax & shipping. Snagged it. This week is gonna be fun. For context, I have an RX550, which runs my index okay but not great, and the other VR player has an RX570 that can't play VR because they have a quest and oculus' software requires higher end hardware. So They'll probably get the 1080 and be able to play their quest with a link or virtual desktop, and I'll most likely get their RX570 which since I'm using the index will probably give me the overhead I need to have a more playable experience.
I saw that, and almost picked it up myself lol
gloomy crater
lol, there were like 40 watchers when I grabbed it. Apparently the guy knew it was gonna sell quick bc I got a notification that it had been turned into the post office for shipping half an hour later
marble oak
hi all, what would be right now the best VR headset (and accessories?) if your employer is buying it for you (so price isn't an issue) on the market ?
haughty thistle
The Valve Index is like the best overall Package of a headset you can get
There are headsets out there that beat the Index in certain points, but do draw compromises with them. The VRgenieers XTAL for example has a way higher FOV and resolution, has automatic IPD adjustment and molded lenses (not fresnel ones), but it's a lot heavier and doesn't have built-in audio. The last downside is also the biggest downside of the StarVR One (besides that it's only offered to businesses right now anyways)
wanton marten
Does not index has quality problems ?
haughty thistle
The Reverb G2 is cheaper then the Index, has higher res screens, but it's controllers aren't as great
Does not index has quality problems ?
@wanton marten Well, the QA issues of the Index aren't as big as always reported to be. Many issues have been permanently fixed by now. Besides that, what other headset offers you full finger tracking controllers, 144Hz screens, higher then average FOV, the best audio solution for VR right now AND the best VR tracking system for consumers out there, all in one Package?
marble oak
as (other than me who will probably get used to it) it would be mostly used by people who do not have experience with VR, I do believe that latency and framerate are the most important specs to avoid motion sickness ?
haughty thistle
as (other than me who will probably get used to it) it would be mostly used by people who do not have experience with VR, I do believe that latency and framerate are the most important specs to avoid motion sickness ?
@marble oak This and also IPD setting. If the IPD is not set up right, it might cause eye strain, even after short usage time
wanton marten
@wanton marten Well, the QA issues of the Index aren't as big as always reported to be. Many issues have been permanently fixed by now. Besides that, what other headset offers you full finger tracking controllers, 144Hz screens, higher then average FOV, the best audio solution for VR right now AND the best VR tracking system for consumers out there, all in one Package?
@haughty thistle I met more people with index problems than happy index users so maybe that's why my perception of index is a little bit wary.
marble oak
@haughty thistle this still has to be set manually for each user right? (haven't looked into VR for the last 2 years or so)
haughty thistle
I met more people with index problems than happy index users so maybe that's why my perception of index is a little bit wary.
@wanton marten Eh. I've talked to a lot of Index users too. Many had at least 1 or more issues with their Index, but they're still all very happy with their purchase, just because they know, while it works it's the best all in one VR experience you can get as a consumer
marble oak
(appart for the VRgenieers XTAL) (for manually IPS setting)
haughty thistle
this still has to be set manually for each user right? (haven't looked into VR for the last 2 years or so)
@marble oak I only know of 2 headsets that have automatic IPD adjustment. The XTAL from VRgenieers (which costs >5k) and the StarVR One (~3k). The XTAL has actual motors inside to physically adjust the lenses while the StarVR One does an automatic software adjustment
If you do end up with a headset that has Eye Tracking, and you're looking for a headset for corporate use to develop your own software for, you could also use the Eye Tracking module to help the user to adjust the IPD to the right setting. But I don't think there's off-the-shelve software for that yet
marble oak
ok ok ok, thanks a lot for the getting up to speed,
and on the "light" side (no cables and all) are there any quest 2 competitors ?
haughty thistle
Not in the consumer space
Unless, you're talking also about Wireless PCVR. In that case the only other option in the consumer space is the Vive/Vive Pro/Vive Cosmos Elite + Vive Wireless Adapter
In the corporate Space, there are many more options like the Vive Focus (+) and the Pico Neo 2
marble oak
The light one would be for a private purchase, I'm not planning on working actively in VR but I do like to tinker and might want to dev some totally amateur experiments (minimal escape rooms and stuff like that), that I might want to share in a multiplayer environment so a "guest" headset might be interesting to have. For that from what you said I believe the quest would be a perfect "guest headset" fit.
Any idea on cross compatibility?
haughty thistle
Wdym with Cross-Compatibility? Like games available for both platforms, or just multiplayer through different eco-systems?
wanton marten
@wanton marten Eh. I've talked to a lot of Index users too. Many had at least 1 or more issues with their Index, but they're still all very happy with their purchase, just because they know, while it works it's the best all in one VR experience you can get as a consumer
@haughty thistle So strange , they have at least 1 or more issues but still happy with purchase. I chose G2 until reliable vr comes out but it's just bizarre that 1 or more issues is acceptable.
i know people who are on 4th index controller and they are not active users, are not using for beat saber.
haughty thistle
Well, There isn't really another option out there similar enough to the Index. The G2 only beats the Index in some points, like screen resolution, but then looses out on Lighthouse tracking and higher Refreshrate. It also comes with worse controllers and I've heard that while matching up Vive Trackers with other tracking systems is absolutely fine, it can be a bit of a hassle with hand controllers
marble oak
@haughty thistle kinda both, if I create a game with let's say UE (not sure yet of the engine yet, but had a bit a experience a few years ago and liked it), can I build the same project for both platforms? and if so, can they play in multiplayer with the build in multiplayer tools.
haughty thistle
I'm totally Happy with my Index, even though I'm on my 5th right and 2nd left controller as well as my second cable and right speaker. The top notch Steam Support is what makes the issues not as bad imo
wanton marten
Steam has decent customer support? I heard horror stories about steam support. 5th ? Yikes
Pretty much why i don't want to deal with it.
haughty thistle
kinda both, if I create a game with let's say UE (not sure yet of the engine yet, but had a bit a experience a few years ago and liked it), can I build the same project for both platforms? and if so, can they play in multiplayer with the build in multiplayer tools.
@marble oak When the engine supports both the Quest Platform and PC, then yeah, you could run the same code base on multiple platforms. Keep in mind that the Quest has significantly worse hardware, so all the assets and game code need to be heavily optimized for good framerates. And Facebook isn't very keen on letting unopitmized games on their store
wanton marten
I don't think lighthouse is real solution to body tracking. It's only acceptable to enthusiast.
haughty thistle
I've been on my left controller for over a year now and no issues in sight. With my right controller I got some unfortunate replacements where on one the trackpad wasn't responsive, and two more which failed about a month after arrival. But I've been on my current right controller for almost half a year now and again, no issues in sight
wanton marten
What you are saying quality seems to be increasing. That's a good sign. Maybe index 2 will be decent.
haughty thistle
Lighthouse Tracking is still the best option. Not just for FBT, but for tracking in general. It's much more accurate and can track anywhere in the room. I'd personally would rather sick with a last gen headset, then having to give up on Outside-In for my Hand controllers. Yes, you have to set up the lighthouses, which makes it unsuitable for many consumers, but I do see benefits of at least having the option to use it
I don't see Valve releasing a successor to the Index any time soon. Unlike Facebook who's always on the lookout to get more people to datamine, Valve is striving for perfection, so a new headset from them I don't see coming for at least another 2 years
marble oak
note to self : buying a few spare controllers is a good idea (as I'm in EU and have to import the index from the US, getting replacements will take long it they tend to break)
haughty thistle
You can get the Index in the Eurozone directly from Valve
And I'd highly recommend going that road. I've heard people who bought the Index second hand had more problems with RMAs then those who've bought it directly from Valve
marble oak
ow yeah, when I VPN to germany it's all fine, perfect, thanks,
haughty thistle
Apparently the Index can also be bought in non-Euro countries that are part of the EU or something, I've seen people from Sweden and Poland who also have an Index and bought directly from Valve
marble oak
not switzerland or serbia which are the two country I checked, but it's fine with every other country I'm checking now. Just wasn't lucky on my first tries,
haughty thistle
The whole situation with the Index is very weird in general tho. Switzerland, smack down surrounded by countries with Index shipments, doesn't get it shipped there. Yet Japan, not even having the Index price listed in Yen, can somehow buy the Index directly
marble oak
Yeah, I'll just take it in Germany or France if I go that road, much easier than the US
haughty thistle
I actually am from Germany. Other then politics and language, can recommend.
marble oak
mostly switzerland these days, can recommend also if you get tired of the EU and german politics (but really like some parts of germany too actually)
@wanton marten if not index, what would you recommend for the "full experience" device ?
wanton marten
@haughty thistle I am really optimistic that engineers will find a better solution because lighthouses just not suitable for masses. I want masses to use it rather than enthusiasts. More users = cheaper, better hardware. Wireless headsets is the future, where you can use it anywhere without a setup. I agree that right now it's ultimate solution for enthusiasts.
@wanton marten if not index, what would you recommend for the "full experience" device ?
@marble oak Index is the only full body tracking device for now but next year will be crazy for VR hardware.
haughty thistle
I know that there's a small bit of Germany surrounded by Switzerland, and that tiny little piece of Germany is so weird. You only pay certain german taxes, certain swiss taxes, you can decide between German and Swiss telecom providers, etc. etc. It's like the best of both... kinda...
Index is the only full body tracking device for now but next year will be crazy for VR hardware.
@wanton marten How so? After the G2 release, I don't see any other VR headsets, that will likely shake things up other then the Lynx, which is a business focused headset
I know the DecaGear, but like I said here multiple times, it's unlikely to actually shake up the market, because I don't see how that would be financially possible... (other then they loose money on every headsets sold)
marble oak
@haughty thistle Büsingen am Hochrhein, didn't know about that little particularity, thanks for the fun fact
wanton marten
@wanton marten How so? After the G2 release, I don't see any other VR headsets, that will likely shake things up other then the Lynx, which is a business focused headset
@haughty thistle I think that during pandemic Samsung, Google or Amazon are looking to dip their toes into VR market because Quest 2 are selling quite well. It might not be during Q1 or Q2 but i'm pretty sure we will see refreshes next year. XR chip price will go down due Quest 2 selling pretty well. Repackaged Quest 2 would be a good addition.
zinc timber
decagear looks great in theory
wanton marten
Yeah , I'm suspicious of DecaGear but Quest 2 is driving parts prices lower. More parts produced = cheaper part prices.
haughty thistle
We'll see. I think Google has pretty much turned their back to VR for now, after the colossal flop that was Daydream
wanton marten
to be honest i don't know why I have included Google. Google every attempt is pretty much half ass.
zinc timber
it's like after android, google decided that microsoft's model of "that thing works now, let's jump in too late to gain any market share" was the way to go
wanton marten
It's like they do 1/3 , 1/2 of the project and give up on it 2 months later. I'm looking at you stadia.
haughty thistle
My concern with Deca is not the price of the parts, but the whole sum of the price. Their 450$ price tag is very close to the BOM, which just includes parts. Not the, for VR headsets still, pretty expensive manufacturing and more importantly the R&D costs
wanton marten
Price of the parts are going down. So whatever prices they have named in 5-6 months it will go down at least 10-20%.
haughty thistle
I'd like to doubt that, but sure...
I mean, have you seen how well certain parts keep their prices. It's mostly a demand vs availability thing
(unless it's a manufactured price. Looking at you Apple)
wanton marten
Yeah, during pandemic is hard to tell. Regular business models might not apply in current conditions. I would have to check every part manufacturer and see availability of the parts and location of manufacturing.
And i'm too lazy to do it. 😄
haughty thistle
I wouldn't invest my money into them, but then again, I'm weary of any kind of Startup in general, so yeah...
green crypt
they have said 450 is the preorder price and that they are raising the price later
haughty thistle
I mean, look at PiMax, they still haven't fulfilled all promises of their original Kickstarter, and still owe certain things to their original backers like the hand tracking or eye tracking modules
And instead of shipping their own controllers they ended up giving people the option to "upgrade" to the Index controllers for an additional 50$ or something...
zinc timber
they have said 450 is the preorder price and that they are raising the price later
@green crypt I think they changed that in the interview?
green crypt
they have said that on their discord a while ago
wanton marten
Is not that pretty much every kickstarter, overestimate their capabilities and compromise later. Is DecaGear kickstarter as well, i dont see their kickstarter.
zinc timber
they're apparently holding a kickstarter later?
green crypt
before any youtuber had talked to the deca team they had confirmed that they are gonna raise the price at some point
haughty thistle
Deca is a Startup, they don't have a Kickstarter currently, and are undecided whether they will set up one or not
However, I feel like charging 10$ for pre-orders and then ending up having a Kickstarter as well just doesn't feel right to me
zinc timber
the $10 for preorders is the iffy bit for me
taking money before you're ready is always a bit iffy
wanton marten
I just have hard time believing that during pandemic nobody gonna jump on VR train . It's like best conditions for VR. Pandemic is not gonna go away for next 1.5 - 2 years.
zinc timber
conducting r&d is gonna be a lot harder now, though, isn't it?
haughty thistle
Probably because developing a headset isn't a thing done in a few days. Apparently Valve approached HP about improving the Original Reverb shortly after the launch of the original Reverb. It took more then a year for them to even announce the G2, that was developed in partnership with Valve. Both companies with excessive knowledge in VR (Valve had 2 headsets under their belt, and it's HPs 3rd). As another time saver on the G2, they used an off-the-shelve tracking system. My guess is that M$ was already working on improving WMR behind doors at the time of release of the original Reverb
The more stuff you do yourself on a VR headset, the more expensive and longer R&D is going to be. I have a hard time believing that Deca, a Startup company, has not just developed their own face tracking, but also positional tracking from scratch. The R&D for that must've been a lot. Or we might just end up with a Tracking disaster like the Vive Cosmos was: Works flawless under ideal conditions, stops working the moment a variable is changed.
wanton marten
M$ investing heavily in AR, so any progress in VR also benefits in AR as well. Valve cares about making PC VR a bigger market because Facebook is dominating VR market. Is Valve a hardware company or marketplace? Steam VR game sales is a much better Valve expertise. I could see M$ and Valve selling their research to other companies to benefit themselves.
I thought it's confirmed that Valve helped with DecaGear.
haughty thistle
Well, Valve confirmed Deca approached them for help in terms of SteamVR integration. That's what I know
Which basically just means, the headset will probably be SteamVR compatible, after installing their proprietary driver software. (kinda like the XTAL, StarVR One, Cosmos Elite and PiMax headsets)
wanton marten
I really hope Valve is working with everyone viable. Games on Facebook is outselling 10:1 to steam. What PC VR needs is affordable wireless headset.
haughty thistle
Maybe not necessarily wireless, but an affordable option that doesn't require a high-end PC to run (looking at you Quest)
For me personally, all Wireless solutions I've tried that used a regular Wifi Router kinda sucked in terms of latency. It wasn't too bad, but I definetly couldn't hit most notes in Beat Saber wither both ALVR and VD. The better solution of using 60GHz to transmit the signale however is too expensive, and is very power hungry (Vive Wireless adapter get's very hot and only has about 2h of battery life with the included power brick)
wanton marten
Wireless is actually quite a big thing for movie watching, exercising in vr.
Have you tried Q2 with VD ?
haughty thistle
I only have an OG Quest
wanton marten
Reviewers praised Q2 with VD that's why I have asked.
haughty thistle
I'm not willing to let FB scan my entire personality and what there is to know about me
wanton marten
same
haughty thistle
Because that's basically what you give into with the Q2
wanton marten
I just want someone repackage Q2 , i don't care if it cost 100$ more. I want to watch expanse in VR 😦
haughty thistle
With the Technology we have rn, I think it's much easier, and probably wiser, to just use standalone headsets for wireless VR, and let PCVR stay tethered for now. Unless you have the bills to spend for a proper wireless adapter
wanton marten
Proper wireless adapters are worse (vive) than stand alone with wifi 6 on VD. Latency wise.
haughty thistle
Not from what I've heared
wanton marten
really ?
haughty thistle
And technically speaking, that shouldn't be the case. 60GHz has physically lower latency then 5GHz
Wifi 6 is still using 5GHz
Another problem you have with VD is that it has to go through your local network which just adds more latency to the mix. The Vive Wireless adapter has a direct path from your PC to the Antenna, no Network switching involved
wanton marten
I watch too much shilling I guess. Few reviewers said that it's better solution than vive wireless.
haughty thistle
What he probably meant is that all you need for VD is in the headset, whereas the Vive Wireless adapter requires a seperate Antenna to be set up, has a cable going down from the Headset to the power bank, and adds additional weight to the headset
wanton marten
I'm trying to find some kind of testing vive wireless vs q2 vd
haughty thistle
It also depends on whether he used the Vive Wireless Adapter with an OG Vive, Vive Pro or Vive Cosmos (Elite). Because from what I've heard, the addition of the Cosmos was legitimately an afterthought and doesn't work as well as with the Vive Pro and OG Vive. Probably because the Cosmos has an even higher resolution and the higher camera res that has to be transmitted
wanton marten
Hmm we need actual testing on it. Watching someone right now.
don't know is this guy reliable at all
but it seems that VD on Q2 is good enough.
Good enough usually wins.
Is really hard to tell who is shilling and who is not.
haughty thistle
He seems to put a very high detail on how the Quest "is better out of the box in every way". I mean, yeah, Vive Stuff is very over priced. I don't see him talking about compression artifacts, or blurry-ness due to differences in encoding resolution
And besides what people claim, It's basically impossible to get the full resolution of the Quest (or Quest 2) at a good quality through a Wifi or USB signal. There's a reason why Videos never look as good as playing the game on your PC directly. The better you want the encoded image to look, the higher the latency
wanton marten
What would improve encoded image and latency ?
Latency - wifi , encoded image - a better chip.
So xr 2 might solve those problems.
haughty thistle
The Quest 2 already has an experimental mode with 500Mbit/s encoding bandwidth and different encoding resolution settings. From what I've heard, both settings affect latency in an almost unnoticeable way but still caps the readability of Text at about 1440p level, so about what you'd find on the Rift S
The problem is the encoding, not decoding I'm talking about
The higher detail you want to encode, the more processing power you require. The OG Quest already is pretty heavy on the system (only managing about half the framerate then my Index on my System)
wanton marten
Hmm It would be interesting to test it myself. I understand that it might be good enough by your standards but i'm interested would it be good enough for masses.
haughty thistle
It's ok-ish. I'd still prefer the Link cable. At least on the OG quest, just because of the latency involved. Like I said, I can barely manage any hits in Beat Saber while on VD
wanton marten
@haughty thistle Could it be due to your wireless setup ?
haughty thistle
Heh... I'm using a top-of-the-line Wifi Router as my access point. And my Quest is the only device on that Network (besides my PC)
wanton marten
How busy wireless signals around you ? Do you have like 10+ wireless networks around you.
haughty thistle
A Fritzbox 7490
That router and my main router are the only 2 5GHz networks around here
wanton marten
Also, how many wireless devices are you using in that room which could be interfering with a signal.
haughty thistle
You think I didn't check with my phone?
My phone and my Quest are quite litterally the only devices in my Room using Wifi
wanton marten
I don't know , i don't blame i'm just checking.
haughty thistle
I live in a generally pretty old neighborhood. It feels like many people are still using a router that doesn't even support 5GHz xD
But yeah, my phone isn't picking up any other 5GHz network
I'm confilcted myself
It's better then ALVR, that's for sure
But not as good as the Link cable. That's for sure as well
At least on the OG Quest. I've heard VD supports 90Hz on the Quest 2 already, which is definetly a big plus
Probably
If you do however are used to tethered VR, I think VD is a definitive trade-off. It's not as good as a native connection, heck even Link isn't as good. Both because of the excessive resource requirements compared to the visual performance they offer
If they'd use a GPU encoder, like you can enable on VD, it doesn't require as much resources, but prevents you from streaming. Link used to use NVENC on Nvidia cards, but stopped doing so for an inexplicable reason
Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of wireless as well. But I would never trade-off quality for the privilage of wireless. That's why I have a wireless gaming mouse, and wireless headphones, but still use a wired headset and keyboard for gaming
On Keyboards it's the battery life that annoys me, and with Gaming headsets, I just haven't found a pair, that doesn't have some sort of trade-off in audio quality (for reference my current gaming pair is a Sennheiser GameOne)
I'm fine with Bluetooth, but it's nothing for gaming
I have both the Bose QC35 as well as the Sony WH-1000XM3, and I love both pairs. But in Bluetooth mode, they are useless for gaming
Trust me, Bluetooth versions are just a marketing gimmick for headphones
The important measures are supported audio codecs and wireless range. Both depend on the implementations of the manufacturer, and not on the Bt version
Well, in that case your Bt4 headphones just had a worse antenna then your 5.0 ones
Trust me, I've seen comparisons, and there are 5.0 ones with worse range then even 2.1 ones (which was the first Bt Version to support A2DP, required for higher quality audio)
Bt is ranked into 3 different classes. Class 1 is rated for up to 100m of range, Class 2 up to 10m and Class 3 for around 1m range. The last is usually used for in-ear earbuds to communicate with each other. Class 2 is the most common, although I've seen many devices starting to support Class 1. In many cases as "Bluetooth 5.0"
scarlet dove
In my opinion the Oculus Quest 2 is nearly identical to the first, just with higher resolution
fathom sigil
In my opinion the Oculus Quest 2 is nearly identical to the first, just with higher resolution
it feels way lighter for me also and ive got many hours on both
haughty thistle
So I have bought 35$ headset and I'm able to run around the house without issues, went for upgrade and it was worse even though i payed 5x. It's frustrating.
@wanton marten Let#s take this in #audio-tech, shall we?
fathom sigil
same but the quest1 strap wasnt good enough to balance it stock and well neither is the quest 2 one but it doesnt have to balance as much weight
i also much prefer the new controllers but i think you were just referring to the headset itself
dry dove
Index has been "shipping soon" for 3 days
harsh niche
pog
quest 2 just got 90hz and full res and refresh on link
eh
ngl I would use virtual desktop over this even after it being full res and refresh
soft hound
young marten
dry dove
Index comes monday! 
vast scaffold
poggers
young marten
Mine should get here tomorrow 
sullen linden
damn
scenic hornet
yo im thinking about getting a vr headset but i just wanna know something, is the quest the only headset that runs off itself?
sullen linden
@scenic hornet yeah, Quest and Quest 2 are the only ones worth mentioning
scenic hornet
ok, i might try to get a used quest then, i dont think i will be able to get a quest 2 any time this year
@sullen linden sorry to ping you but would the quest work with glasses?
dapper folio
@scenic hornet I wear glasses and I've owned both the quest and quest 2. Both come with a glasses spacer so you can wear glasses while playing comfortably
scenic hornet
nice
severe quartz
Glasses work with the Vive as well
haughty thistle
The only headset I've tried where I had issues with glasses was the Lenovo Explorer. Any headset with a flip visor will probably have that issue, so stay away from those
gloomy crater
I still have no idea what the difference between the $45 VR lens lab index lenses and the $70 VR optician lenses is other than the 3d printed bits
Like, I'd rather not spend more money if both sets of lenses are going to look exactly the same. If the VR optician lenses are somehow visually better, then I'd be happy to spend extra, but if it's just the shrouds that are different, I don't think that's worth it
haughty thistle
Lens Labs apparently puts the lenses in the wrong way (curved bit in the direction of your eyes)
That causes massive distortions, and I've only heard bad things about them, so I'd advise staying away from them
With VR Optician vs Widmo, the situation becomes more of a Question, whether you want your entire FOV be the sharpest it can be, or your want a slightly larger FOV. The first is VRO the latter Widmo (Widmo files down the edges of their lenses to increase FOV, but it causes slight blurriness at the edge of the FOV). The difference in FOV between Widmo and VRO is supposedly only 1-3°, so not a big deal. In my experience I actually got the larger FOV with VRO, as I was able to crank the lenses closer to my face, but your mileage may vary...
I can highly recommend the VRO lenses, as their adapters are higher quality, so are their lenses
gloomy crater
I would prefer the VRO ones overall anyway, then. Thank. I wanted to check if my prescription changed since last year before I went and bought my lenses, so I just had an eye appointment 20 minutes ago. So I can go ahead and buy them now
open steeple
Anyone know a cheap vr headset that works with steam vr and that’s on sale on Black Friday
Please tag me if you know
haughty thistle
If you don't mind Facebook knowing every bit of information that is to know about you, AND don't mind spending more on a VR capable PC, when playing PCVR, the Quest 2 is a good choice.
Otherwise, the next best option is the HP Reverb G2. And considering that they just started fulfilling pre-order shipments, it's unlikely to go on sale for Black Friday (not to mention the Q2 probably won't either due to it's already ridiculously low price)
Lastly, if you want a headset as cheap as possible, really the only other option is to go on the used market and find an old OG Vive or WMR headset. Those can be had for under 200$ sometimes, but ofc they are used
@open steeple
open steeple
Thank you very much
digital scaffold
ok, i might try to get a used quest then, i dont think i will be able to get a quest 2 any time this year
@scenic hornet I don't think the quest 1 would be that much cheaper.
sullen linden
@haughty thistle, I’ve talked with some others and made some better adjustments
And the only warning I have is a bios update warning, just gotta flash that on the mobo
gray reef
If you don’t mind cheaping out a bit on some parts like getting a 3600 instead of a 5600x, and getting a 1TB Hard Drive with an SSD boot drive instead of the 1TB Nvme, you might just barely be able to squeeze in a 2070/2060 Super, but either way it’s a great system
sullen linden
I think I’ll stick as is
I had those specs before an a ton of people said to upgrade
And the end goal is to upgrade over time but to start good
sorry to ping you but would the quest work with glasses?
@scenic hornet I had quest with glasses, glasses were loose and slid a bit down my face, damaged both Quest and glasses. I was using the spacer
Also how did you get the legendary 1337 tag?
Plus I’ll be getting the parts over time as I expect Nvidia gpus to drop in price, IF they release more 30 series cards to the public
Especially when they release big navi
Amd
haughty thistle
Also how did you get the legendary 1337 tag?
@sullen linden He does have Nitro, so he can customize his tag however he wants. Mine for example is the Hex code forC(43) andB(42)
While I'm still waiting for my G2 to ship, there are already a bunch of videos coming out of the final production units. Here's the most conclusive I've seen so far: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-KNk_wovPXo
Tl;dw:
It's not going to be a problem for Index sales, the headset itself might be better in some regards, but the tracking and controllers aren't stellar
sullen linden
@sullen linden He does have Nitro, so he can customize his tag however he wants. Mine for example is the Hex code for
C(43) andB(42)
@haughty thistle well I figured, but it has to be unique right? And that's one of the most legendary 4 digit numbers, he must have been a really early Nitro member
haughty thistle
The tag has to be unique in conjunction with your user name
sullen linden
Oh...
Well that makes sense now that I think about it, there definitely more than 9999 discord accounts xd
scenic hornet
@sullen linden nitro
pastel echo
Kind of a shame for the 10,000th Snowstorm out there that he has to pick another username
sly falcon
my eyes have recovered from whatever fucking stroke they were having, I can finally play vr for long periods of time now
carmine wharf
An early review i saw of the g2 comparing it to the index said the higher resolution is very good, but the smaller fov and meh controllers make it really only an advantage in sim games like racing and flying
crisp nymph
@sullen linden I'm a bit late but it's overall a pretty well built except for the ssd
P1 is a qlc nvme, I would recommend something like their mx500 (which is tlc) for $30 more
carmine wharf
im replaying half life alyx now without commentary mode just to see anything i missed the first time, and then next time i replay it will hopefully be with my index and ill do commentary
whats weird is the system auto picks medium graphics settings, but i can put them all on max and stuff get 72fps
ill prolly just leave it on high
zinc timber
g2 reviews are very mixed on controller tracking
I assume it's pretty lighting-dependent or something
sullen linden
@sullen linden I'm a bit late but it's overall a pretty well built except for the ssd
@crisp nymph the mx500 with the same amount of storage, 1tb, costs the same
sullen linden
Is there a better M.2 option
zinc timber
pilot e enhanced is solid iirc
crisp nymph
sullen linden
Added some other stuff to, ie thermal paste and wireless network adapter
With wifi six as the quest supports it
I guess it’s time to save up
carmine wharf
Why yall talking about ssd's in the vr channel
sullen linden
I stared talking about it yesterday, making a vr capable pc
sullen linden
I think I’m finished now, just gonna get the components and build
Idk how long it’s gonna take, probably till the end of the year but eh
That’ll give me time to adjust the gpu if prices change and preorder the 5600x
desert fulcrum
sullen linden
Yes, but I went with a 2060, hopefully it’ll be cheaper by the time I get it
sullen linden
True but do you want it to “run” or run well
sullen linden
I think I’ll just go with this
gentle coral
A 1070 can easily run most vr games unless you need more then 90 hz. My 1070 maxQ can run almost all VR games quite well on my WMR headset, or the vive, and Oculus CV1 i often test with (until I crank the settings,or steam).
The hard part will be if I can stream while playing with my Reverb G2. If not, I will have to go in to the non profit I am a part of and use the AMD Thread ripper 1650X / Radeon VII every time I want to stream (and that computer is unstable as all heck).
zinc timber
I kinda doubt a 1070maxq will push a g2 very well
gloomy crater
So apparently me trying to buy lenses from VR optician triggered a bank fraud alert
Also I completely forgot that VRO is in Germany and it says the lenses won't be here until new years. That's $98 for a pair of lenses I wouldn't even get here until two months later. I would be better off just buying a box of contact lenses to wear until the pandemic ends
zinc timber
3090 barely can handle it, but who cares because you can't handle anything with wmr tracking.
@wanton marten uh, no? cards at 1080ti or above meet the minimum spec. reviewers seem to test with 2000 series cards fairly often
haughty thistle
whats weird is the system auto picks medium graphics settings, but i can put them all on max and stuff get 72fps
@carmine wharf HLA has an auto rednering scale. Which means, if you hardwar can't push the framerate at a certain graphic settings fast enough, it just scales down your render scale. As a result, you'll get a blurrier image. I'd highly recommend actually going with more preservative settings on HLA to maximize image clarity
uh, no? cards at 1080ti or above meet the minimum spec. reviewers seem to test with 2000 series cards fairly often
@zinc timber The 1080Ti can barely handle the Index's 144Hz. How is it supposed to handle more then twice as many pixels at a slightly lower refreshrate?
I'd highly recommend to use the G2 at lower then 100% render scale to minimize frame drops. That's what I'm even going to do on my 3090 (although less then on other cards I'd presume)
zinc timber
1080ti is minimum spec
it's obviously not ideal, but saying that a 3090 can barely drive the g2 is silly
haughty thistle
I'm not so sure...
I'm running my Index at 150% renderscale with my 3090. That's still less then what the G2 will require
zinc timber
tomshardware using a FE 2080 got frametimes that were generally above 11.whatever ms
haughty thistle
And 150% is the SteamVR recommended on 3090 + Index
zinc timber
I mean, the only review I've seen with graphs got acceptable frametimes using a FE 2080
which is not a weak GPU, to be sure, but it does mean that using an ampere or rdna2 GPU should get you perfectly acceptable framerates
haughty thistle
I'll wait for my G2 to come, before I do any claims about performance tbh
zinc timber
I'm running my Index at 150% renderscale with my 3090. That's still less then what the G2 will require
@haughty thistle also, isn't index at 150% effectively rendering a slightly higher resolution than the g2?
I might just be completely misunderstanding render scale, but 1440x1600 at 150% is like 2160x2400?
haughty thistle
150% doesn't mean 150% the resolution, but it means 150% the amount of pixels renderd
haughty thistle
Left is the # of pixels renderd on the Index at 150%, right is G2 at 100% render scale
zinc timber
sure, then multiply one by 144 and the other by 90
haughty thistle
This doesn't take into account the additional resolution rendered for lens correction etc. as well as the WMR overhead
You could very well have a point tho. The 3090 will probably the card to get to get the most out of the G2 for sure. But saying it's handling it with it's pinky is also farfetched imo
zinc timber
sure, but I'd bet that even a 3070-equivalent would be a decent experience
not a ton of reviews out, but from what I've seen even a last-gen high end gpu will work
haughty thistle
Yee. But budget systems will have to turn down the render scale for sure
zinc timber
I mean, budget systems probably shouldn't be paired with $600 headsets
haughty thistle
The OG Quest had shown similar performance in that one VR benchmark to a pre-production G2 tho...
Q2 has a larger performance requirement for sure, but the OG Quest already ran worse then the G2, which is quite a thing to say
young marten
sly falcon
pog
sly falcon
anyone feel like their being watched whilst in the valve office steam home??
young marten
The birds are always watching
carmine wharf
@carmine wharf HLA has an auto rednering scale. Which means, if you hardwar can't push the framerate at a certain graphic settings fast enough, it just scales down your render scale. As a result, you'll get a blurrier image. I'd highly recommend actually going with more preservative settings on HLA to maximize image clarity
@haughty thistle the quality didnt seem to be changing at all. Weird
When I go into steamvr settings and change the render resolution, nothing happens
haughty thistle
Yeah, because HLA overwrites this rendering scale, so no matter what you input, it will always render at whatever renderscale it can render the refreshrate of your headset
carmine wharf
ugh help pls
every time i reach a loading zone or load a quicksave in half life alyx, the oculus driver crashes
and i have to restart oculus and steamvr. its very very very annoying
also, sometimes the game randomly lags hard like 30fps, then i quicksave and reload, then have to restart the game because of the issue above, and it runs just fine at 72fps
hoping this is the oculus software being screwed up and not something with my pc that will carry over to the index
im running the repair tool on the oculus software now after i left the public test branch, hopefully this solves some issues.
these issues were NOT happening the first time i played half life alyx
well, the random lagging was but it wasnt as bad
oh boy
oculus repair tool is completely reinstalling the software apparently, hopefully it installs it in the same spot cuz putting it on the d drive was annoying
oh cool
it repaired it in the right spot, but now my headset wont even connect
FUCKING INCREDIBLE
i uninstalled the oculus software, redownloaded the installer, ran the command to install it on d drive, and now it just sits doing fucking nothing
haughty thistle
Just another reason to avoid FB/Oculus. They don't f*in care about PCVR anymore, and all they want is people waste their money in their store, hoping one day, they can make the big buck like consoles do...
The Oculus PC Software has some cool thing going for it. I really like their dashboard, because of how easy it is to use and how customizable it is. But then there are the stability issues...
carmine wharf
I got it working again but now the audio is like reversed its weird
Left is going to right and right is going to left so stuff to my left sounds like its to my right
haughty thistle
There should be a "swap stereo channels" option in either the oculus software or the Windows sound control panel
carmine wharf
Ok
brisk grove
newb question. can the quest 2 link to a gaming pc with an old rx390x? or should i just order the cable a find out?
gray reef
The AMD 300 series aren’t supported by Link. It might work, but if it does, it won’t be a good experience even if it reaches the minimum spec
brisk grove
really haven't felt the need to replace because of pc gaming performance. guess ill get a 3070 in 6 months when they are available.
carmine wharf
thats funny, i was playing half life alyx and i said ill stop playing at 5pm, chapter 7, or the next oculus error whichever happens first and i happened to get to the chapter 7 loading zone, had an oculus error at 5pm
sullen linden
facebook knows man
carmine wharf
cancel preorder? dont be a scalper
i just finished half life alyx for the second time. despite technical issues with my oculus quest it was pretty cool. cant wait to play it a third time on the index
sullen linden
zinc timber
I have waited 2 months to find out that tracking worse than 300$ quest 2. Everyone was, "yeah order G2 it will be good". If i'll get it mid december i'll have to order knuckles to use it properly.
@wanton marten every single review has said that the tracking is worse than the rift/quest, though?
like, no matter how positive the review, every single mention of it's tracking is "not as good as index or oculus"
yeah, but we knew this months ago
being surprised now is like... did you not do any research before preordering?
zinc timber
wdym nobody said anything about tracking
videos about the tracking have been up for 3 months
dunno who told you to order g2 over index, though
index is only worse in image clarity, so unless you only play sims or something it's better
charred herald
i've had no problems with my index controllers and i've had it for 4 months
hexed notch
g2 is image, index is speed
haughty thistle
yes, it's worse than quest 2
@wanton marten It is worse then Q2 Tracking, yes. That was to be expected as the camera placement isn't ideal. It is better then the original 2 camera WMR tracking. But the 2 cam WMR setup already is really damn' good. The main problem there is with WMR is the tracking Volume (the area in which the controllers get tracked). It is better on the G2 for sure, but not on Oculus level, yet light-years ahead of what the Cosmos offers in basically every way
gentle coral
Every headset has growing pains in its tracking when it first comes out, just look at all the other headsets. As long as it is better then old WMR, it will be fine for most use.
I remember the bugs in the first month of quest, vive, wmr, psvr
haughty thistle
Unless you play a social game like VRChat, you probably won't notice the smaller tracking Volume imo
gentle coral
My wmr headset is fine up until 3.5m x 3.5m (11x11), with a greenscreen behind and a window to the side, as long as i have flat lighting for the controllers.
Have no bright spots cast within the tracking volume that could hurt the cameras ability to track the controllers
Nope
Because the cameras track the volume using objects in the volume
Area around the volume
Same as quest
But they track the controllers using visibile light instead of inferred
If you were in a room with no defining features any inside out headset would have issues
I am not sure i remember off the top of my head, I asked at a Microsoft event a few years ago.
Online i have heard thinks like patents, issues with sourcing quality parts, cost of parts, compromises in accuracy.
I just remember them saying it was not an easy decision to make, but they were confident they could make it work well, and make it easy to expand.
Though at more recent events the lackluster VR industry when the first series was launched severely hurt the speed of future growth.
I am quite sure at least a few Microsoft people would say they should have waited another year or two to let the stuff release (and lower the price a bit), and force the headsets to be produced for a longer time, and available in more countries. If any of those headsets came out right now even at 400 dollars, they would be very competitive as they no longer have any competition in their original price bracket.
And if this new headset gets past its growing pains, and tracking gets a bit better through updates. I hope to see a new one from Samsung next year or so.
I think Microsoft could have done the nivida route and produce their own version along side the refrence spec instead of just releasing a refrence design for other companies to make.
WMR does still have some growing pains to solve though
Though it could also be said that the first gen WMR headsets are the reason why VR is as popular as it is now, because of them flooding the market when they did.
They are the reason the CV1 dropped its price the way it did at the times it did. And most modern indie VR devs started on WMR
Since Microsoft gave them out for free
Even well after they went on sale
I think Microsoft could make a standalone if they want (considering the hololens 2)
The computer that Microsoft designed inside the hololens 2 is quite good at feature detection, and could be leveraged in a vr headset if it wasn't so expensive.
If they get the hololens chip price down under 100 dollars it could make the tracking on a WMR VR headset quite a lot better.
haughty thistle
Another problem with the HoloLens Platform is the M$ store. The reason WMR is decently successful on PC is because you can use it without barely any setup in SteamVR
Not really
gentle coral
The WMR tracking is somewhat similar except that it is running on a pc instead of custom SOC (and there are other things).
haughty thistle
But the Oculus software is generally considered a buggy mess, whereas the WMR Portal litterally installs on it's own when plugging in the headset
gentle coral
I am sad about this year because I had a ton of VR events i was supposed to go to and help run. I could have already tried the G2 at events if they were still happening and give an actual opinion.
Also windows has gotten really good at handing stuff to the headset and back. (Sawitching control between the keyboard and headset with (windows key + Y) is a godsend of vr dev work.