cars

[snow mist]

for real i dont understand why someone would do that

like why

[median egret]

tonight on bottom gear

prius

[meager hinge]

Slammed Prius!!!

[autumn mantle]

Yikes

[indigo coral]

🐷

[dense shard]

That color is brilliant.

I love it.

[elder ore]

I do be lovin the grill 😂

[charred depot]

did someone edit it to look actually decent

[autumn mantle]

Yup MentalAce on reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/BMW/comments/ixi9um/what_we_got_vs_what_we_wanted/

[stoic ledge]

I expect amount of people replacing bumpers on BMW's

[wheat hatch]

Same

[autumn mantle]

Has a fancy dick or clam holder/crusher too

[wheat hatch]

That's a big OOF that bump there

[stoic ledge]

[fathom socket]

I think the m3 is an improvement over the m4

But the old 4 series looked way better

[stoic ledge]

I'd get the new M3 Touring

And swap a M340i front on it

[wheat hatch]

Kidney grill and hofmeister kink gang

[stoic ledge]

[median egret]

E55 gang

Not mine but

love it

[fathom socket]

518i still better than alot of cars for that price

and its still an e34

[meager hinge]

Gues what I saw today

🤢

[median egret]

518i still better than alot of cars for that price
@fathom socket Yeah tbh if it's in a nice state, you could even swap an engine out of a higher model, in a cosmetically worse state, into the 518 body

[fathom socket]

if it wouldnt cost me both my kidneys in insurance ye

[charred depot]

its actually pretty decent for insurance

oh yeah but if you swap the engine and declare it not so sure heh

it is like £270/y in road tax though :^|

[stoic ledge]

That's nothing

[charred depot]

yeah it just all adds up for me though

with it being £900-1000 for me to get insurance on it + that tax its more than double the annual cost of my current car

[stoic ledge]

Even my Corsa is double that in tax

[charred depot]

is that on new tax rates

oh wait new rates are constant or something ater the first payment

[stoic ledge]

It's on 🇳🇱 rates

[charred depot]

ah

My Mazda 2 would be £30/y

[stoic ledge]

Corsa converted to GBP 560/y

[charred depot]

They did 2 different tunes or something so some are £125/y which i have

[stoic ledge]

Brother's Volvo 1255GBP/year

So 270GBP is cheap 😛

[charred depot]

yikes

whys it so expensive over there

id of imagined it would be cheaper

[stoic ledge]

Everything is expensive here

[charred depot]

whats your "minimum wage" or whatever

[stoic ledge]

Depends on age

[charred depot]

same here

[stoic ledge]

And hrs/week

[charred depot]

just per age here

[stoic ledge]

€9.69 for a 21y/o

[charred depot]

wow so almost the same just slightly more

[stoic ledge]

Yes

And that's before taxes

So with taxes it's less

[charred depot]

when i was 17 i did 40+ hour weeks at £6.90/h

[stoic ledge]

Lol when I was 17 I went to school

[charred depot]

went straight into work when i finished

[stoic ledge]

I'm 22 and still go to school

[charred depot]

Im at University now, id love to bail but

[stoic ledge]

I'm 22 and still go to school
With school I meant University ^^

[charred depot]

the current job market is delivery driver, delivery driver, delivery driver, delivery driver, delivery driver, care home worker, delivery driver.

[stoic ledge]

Hmmmm

[charred depot]

i dont mind delivery driving but no one wants a 18 year old driving their vans

[stoic ledge]

Lol postal services do that here

I've got a BSc, now going for a MSc

[charred depot]

im on year 2 of a BSc with honours for computing science :^|

[stoic ledge]

Ah no honours because /care

But computer science yes

[charred depot]

if i could get even a semi decent job i would probably drop out

[stoic ledge]

Meh maybe, I'd probably finish my master

Also with just a BSc (at academic level) it's quite hard to get a job, you need a master basically

[charred depot]

dont think i want to be doing this for that long

[stoic ledge]

Ah well what's 2 more years

Imagine all the money you'll make with a master in Computer Science

All the cars you can get

Like, a tuned Mazda 2

Isn't that the dream?

[charred depot]

really pushing the boat out but totally

[stoic ledge]

[dense shard]

tbf

If you get into the post, you're kinda set for life. Government jobs tend to have excellent benefits.

[stoic ledge]

My dad has a government job... Haven't noticed anything of these benefits

[dense shard]

Good pension, job stability, good pay.

It works in the US, and here we have the added benefit of good healthcare.

[stoic ledge]

Good pay meh, pension idk tbh, job stability sure

And 🇳🇱 just requires a heath insurance

Government gets you a 10% discount at 1 specific place, but many employees have that benefit

[flint sable]

In the wild

[stoic ledge]

[fathom socket]

quad centre exhaust anyone?

[dense shard]

why tho

That's obviously coming out of a single muffler.

[meager hinge]

“Quad center exhaust”

C7 moment

[meager hinge]

Which game

[civic girder]

Automation

[magic arrow]

https://youtu.be/fJdbh3r2AR0

[carmine summit]

CAE shifter, nice

I want to get one for my Golf

[severe quartz]

Yeah, that was somebody's rocket-bunnied porsche

Interior was clean

Exterior was... less clean

[indigo coral]

tbh that's just ugly

[dense shard]

I put stickers on my windshield to see less in front of me.

[meager hinge]

[dense shard]

nuggies with a view

Tesla’s Nemesis in China Is a Tiny $5,000 Electric Car From GM

It's called the Hongguang MINI EV.

"the EV retails for between 28,800 yuan ($4,230) and 38,800 yuan -- and its ability to run for as many as 170 kilometers (106 miles) on a single charge."

tl;dr: it offers an alternative to bikes/motorcycles. An attractive proposition to the aged.

[stoic ledge]

nuggies with a view
Noooo no food in the car

[fathom socket]

It's barely enough space to fit my one truck key in the trunk of this car lol

[regal pond]

Just put this away for the winter!

[manic heron]

it belongs in a museum!

[fathom socket]

Rather drive what's built for and not let a super car unhappy while it sits

It loves the road it loves to go fast like a mad man

[dense shard]

That's easy to say till they start salting the roads.

[fathom socket]

Oh yeah I hate those

Talked to these owners and they daily drive them but not during winter because salt

[indigo coral]

around here salt isn't a concern, water is

[main cobalt]

car's aluminum

doesnt worry me too much

[dense shard]

Never had an issue with water tbh.

[civic girder]

my car sat outside for 15 years and didn't rust due to rain and snow

only rust is where paint and undercoat peeled away and it began to oxidize

[civic spoke]

Road salt is the big bad guy.

[civic girder]

yep

they won't salt here for another month at least

[civic spoke]

They probably will starting October.

[civic girder]

soon as I get my tags and dash cover, I'll be taking it back out. Been almost a week since its been driven now, will probs be another week before I can drive it

they might start late october here, but it depends on how cold it decides to get and when it decides to snow

[civic spoke]

Will be heading up to our cousins in like three weeks.

Likely throwing on my winter tires before heading up there.

[civic girder]

they normally don't salt at all until the forecast has a good chance of snow

[civic spoke]

They do it as soon as freezing point comes near.

[civic girder]

here they don't really do that

but our weather is probably different

[civic spoke]

We have already had down to 2 C here.

So that's what? 35 F?

[civic girder]

damn

we haven't gone below 45F yet, and that's only at night

[civic spoke]

The temp mentioned was at around 5 am

But you kinda want to use winter tires once temp starts to go into the lower single digits for celcius.

And it would also help with my front left tire that is leaking some air.

[civic girder]

you think I can afford winter tires

[civic spoke]

I need to get new summer tires.

[dense shard]

New wheels/tires are a bit pricey tbh.

[civic girder]

I'll be fine on all seasons. I just have to not drive like my brain doesn't exist

[civic spoke]

I'm that mad person who will get Michelin Pilot Sport 4 for a 170 hp car.

[civic girder]

next set of tires for the RX-7 will probably be some sportier tires

and with shorter tire profile, to make my wheels look extra small

[civic spoke]

I'm just happy that I can get a set of four for under $500.

[civic girder]

damn

[civic spoke]

But then I will have to mount 'em.

And probably get new valve stems.

As a precaution thing.

[civic girder]

I got a set of 4 13" all seasons, and mounted+installed, for under $250

[civic spoke]

I'm running 205/55R16 for summers.

Cheap size. Yeh

[civic girder]

wide bois

iirc I can fit 205 on my rims, but the 60 profile looks hella tiny compared to 75 profile of the stock recommended tire spec

[dense shard]

I could go for just tires, and pay the mounting costs.

[civic spoke]

205 is pretty slim for a modern car.

[dense shard]

But 45 profile tires for winter don't sound cheap.

[civic girder]

45 profile sounds like it would suck

low profile tires don't ride as nice has high profile

[civic spoke]

Hah. My winter tires are real baloony.

[dense shard]

The ride quality is fine.

[civic spoke]

195/65R15

[civic girder]

idk, I can notice the difference between the 75 profile on the RX-7 and the 45 profile on my brother's Lexus

[civic spoke]

Hate how wobbly winter tires are.

[dense shard]

800 dollars for blizzaks.

I might be better off buying wheels and tires.

uhhhh... yeah. 100 dollars more.

For that I get tires and wheels.

[civic spoke]

I think it was $500 for my winter tires? Mounting and all.

Nokian Hakkapeliitta R3

[dense shard]

1100 dollars if I go with the OEM. Just the tires.

Call it 900 if I go for the Yokohamas.

400 dollars less if I go for the 16 inch wheels.

[civic spoke]

If I go with cheaper tires. Then I can get a set of summers for almost $250

[stoic ledge]

205/55R16 is one of the most common tire sizes, hence it's so affordable

Got 195/55R16 installed for €296

[indigo coral]

its like 500$ for my tires

for shitty ones

and 1k+ for nice ones

because of a size that pretty much only my car uses, and i need fancy SUV tires

[stoic ledge]

So new tires total your car (economical speaking)?

[dense shard]

Cheaper than a new car at least.

[civic girder]

Depends

My friend has found some decent cars for under $500

His latest $300 find was better than his last tho

RIP Astro Van

[dense shard]

That's not exactly a new car.

[civic girder]

Depends on how you define new in this context

New-to-you used, or brand new

[charred depot]

i want a Astra Van

[stoic ledge]

Cheaper than a new car at least.
I'm not saying that it isn't, but is exceeds the value of the car

[charred depot]

probably expensive for insurance with the clownery people do to them

[stoic ledge]

i want a Astra Van
Buy it

[charred depot]

i would if i needed a van

[stoic ledge]

[civic girder]

You think I need a van? Hell no, I'm gonna buy a Previa because I can and I want one

[charred depot]

mazda van

[civic girder]

Mazda is bae

[wild tiger]

my explorer gets used like a van a lot

it is basicly a mini van on a pickup frame

[stoic ledge]

I've used the Corsa as a van literally once in 4 years

[charred depot]

i do deliveries in the mazda 2 heh

packed to the brim

[stoic ledge]

Fun fact: a Corsa Van as a thing

[civic girder]

I'll just cruise around in a van. Vans are cool

Ain't nobody gonna talk shit if you roll up in a van and unironically think it's cool

[charred depot]

when you cant downshift to second because your load has shifted :^|

[charred depot]

thats just a corsa with some white spray paint

[stoic ledge]

No it's "factory"

[charred depot]

i know but

[wild tiger]

chevy made this

[charred depot]

the boot opening could be more square

[stoic ledge]

No rear seats, divider behind the seats

Basically like the Chevry HHR Panel Van yes

But even smoller

[civic girder]

the HHR is so ugly tho

[stoic ledge]

I'd drive it in SS trim + manual

[civic girder]

I'd rather drive a PT Cruiser lmao

[stoic ledge]

HHR > PT IMHO

[wild tiger]

i didnt say i liked it

i just said it exist

[charred depot]

i take the rear seats out of my mazda 2, first time i did it i almosted died bolts were tightened to like 400nm

[stoic ledge]

Astra Van = 3d wagon

[wild tiger]

i got a quick anti rust question

[charred depot]

there is no stopping the rust

[wild tiger]

i was told to use rust converting primer then spray a new under coating

[autumn mantle]

https://youtu.be/c7QGXP4nxAs

[wild tiger]

you can slow it

[stoic ledge]

Oil is great rust protection

[civic girder]

I think you're better off taking a grinder to the rust, grind it all away so its actual metal. Then primer and paint it, then apply bedliner

[stoic ledge]

Clubman Panelvan is cool

[wild tiger]

my ford isnt a oil leaking machine

im going to do that on the outside

[stoic ledge]

Bed liner material is quite good for it yes

[wild tiger]

with paint and clear coat

im wanting to do this treat the underside

[stoic ledge]

Idk if Tectyl is a thing in 🇺🇸

[civic girder]

you want to remove the rust first

that way it can't spread under all the treatment

[wild tiger]

i will wirewheel the metal

then spray the prinmer

[civic girder]

primer and paint to protect the metal. And bedliner to protect the paint

[wild tiger]

it is the under side of the truck

so i can just use cheaper enamal paint

[civic girder]

having mudflaps also help protect against rocks from chipping away bedliner

[stoic ledge]

Mudflaps are ugly tho

[civic girder]

depends

[wild tiger]

they exist

[civic girder]

I think they look pretty cool on the RX-7

[wild tiger]

on this

[fathom socket]

gonna love driving in the rain

I can't start accelerating without losing grip or stalling the engine

[flint sable]

Rescued from the scrapyard

That BMW has the sport package, sport seats, and the awd system

It runs

We got it for 200$

[stoic ledge]

[median egret]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6am-neBdpSg

[stoic ledge]

[fathom socket]

Dat BMW looks like a brand new car

Compared to my one

Worse than this VW t3

[wanton berry]

Yay nay?

titanium escape

[fathom socket]

big question does anyone know the name when engines have an intake for every cylinder

[civic girder]

Itb?

Aka, Individual Throttle Bodies

[fathom socket]

ill look it up

oh yeah

thanks

[remote wind]

Photo from 2014

[wild tiger]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/369210665224896524/759915200765231104/20200927_180717_HDR.jpg

they call it speed holes right

[fathom socket]

yeah its weight reduction man

you know how the new ford gt has those big holes in the bodywork to let air through

thats what u got right there

[charred depot]

slightly used mazda 2 rear spring for sale

missing 1 coil diy lowering spring

people put washers on bottom bolts of the rear wheel beings to add rear camber to the mazda 2, cringe

[wild tiger]

my ride has like 0 mods

the only one ppl do is super charger

also running boards

prob be the stock ones fall off

[civic girder]

some sexy Cup car butt

[static canopy]

Lmao

[wanton swallow]

I took my 944 home today. We drove it for the first time in 5 years and she’s fast now.

[fathom socket]

always love an oldish porsche

if i had the cash id get one

[wanton swallow]

I have a lot of work to tweak the driving ergonomics and bolt the interior fully together

And install things like blinkers

But the built motor feels good

[covert geyser]

I got my e class today and it has rgb lol

[wanton swallow]

Ambient lighting lol

[covert geyser]

Yeah

[wanton swallow]

I looked at an A class for my daily driver and Mercedes does the ambient lighting better than Audi

[covert geyser]

But i think ill trade it for a cla amg

Should i do it?

[wanton swallow]

I went with the GTI as a daily though.

Also the CLA is okay, it depends on the year

[fathom socket]

is it an estate e class?

[covert geyser]

Like 2020

[wanton swallow]

I like the new 2020 or 2021 or whatever

[covert geyser]

2020 amg

[wanton swallow]

But the 2019 was in desperate need for an update

[covert geyser]

Its same as the e class in price

But idk

Don't really need a big car

[wanton swallow]

The CLA gets the really angry 2.0T, right?

CLA AMG that is

[covert geyser]

Yeah

[wanton swallow]

I like that motor. I drove a GLA 45 AMG

I couldn’t afford it and would prefer the A45 but oh well

[flint sable]

944 gang

The parts car

[covert geyser]

I meant this one

[flint sable]

And the garage queen

[wanton swallow]

Nice. Mine was a $2700 POS in 2015

Now it’s a POS with too much money in it and almost everything replaced lol

[covert geyser]

What do you guys think

E class or the cla

The e class is amg line

And the cla 45

[wanton swallow]

If the e class is okay then it’s a poor use of money to trade it in, because there will always be a better AMG car every few years

Here’s my motor that looks fancy but only makes like 200 horsepower

[carmine summit]

My philosophy is get something and drive it for years, don't waste money trading up every year

[covert geyser]

Idk i hot the e class today

Like it didn't lose its value

[wanton swallow]

And this is the first start. I’m not sure if I want to add a resonator to the exhaust

[carmine summit]

It already lost value, that's how new cars work

The day you drive it off the lot it loses value

[covert geyser]

There was a return policy bla bla something

I think

Not sure tho

[wanton swallow]

I got t boned in a black 2019 GTI with 717 miles and it lost about $3000 in value

[fathom socket]

return it then re get it for the lower price

[covert geyser]

Lol

Life hack

[wanton swallow]

I got the other guy to buy me a green one

Also dealerships hate him

[carmine summit]

Green is better than black

I have a green MK3 lol

[wanton swallow]

100% agree

[covert geyser]

No but actually what would you guys get an e class or a cla45

[wanton swallow]

I had a green 1995 Passat as my first car and now I have a green GTI

[covert geyser]

Like what if i sell the e class in 2y

[wanton swallow]

I like the e class

[carmine summit]

I'd get an A45 if I were buying a new Mercedes lol

[covert geyser]

Yeah same

[wanton swallow]

Which one do you like more?

[covert geyser]

Me?

Idk we only have a 3 member don't really need an e class

I had the c class amg line but sold it

[fathom socket]

if it were me i'd only get a merc if it was an estate sooo

[carmine summit]

If I were to buy any Mercedes right now it would probably be an S123, which is a W123 wagon

OM606 swap with a mechanical pump and a manual trans

Would be a perfect daily

[covert geyser]

Im looking at a copue or sedan

And have a family of 3

Should i buy c63 then?

[fathom socket]

if i absolutely had to buy a current saloon model it'd probably have to be a gulia

[fathom socket]

Eat Good Range Rover

[dense shard]

If you have a family, I wouldn't recommend a coupe.

[fathom socket]

I have one so too late

It's a Genesis coupe got it few years ago lol

[median egret]

@covert geyser CLA45s is a lot of fun, and it looks amazing. I would definitely recommend

[median egret]

Wha?

[fathom socket]

Job1?

I don't get it

its binotto

the real life binotto man

[ionic berry]

binotto crashed irl

[covert geyser]

If you have a family, I wouldn't recommend a coupe.
@dense shard
Idk its just a family of 3

And e class is just too big

[blazing tide]

Hmm
Audi A3?

[blazing tide]

I mean a 240sx is cool and all but have you heard of the

Nissan Laurel Yanny??

But man rescued junk to usable and performance stuffed it is impressive

[blazing tide]

I think I remember that meme where there is a three headed dragon and one of the heads looks silly

Representing Audi's line of cars

Eh I thought imma find that and

[blazing tide]

Thing is, is the A3 that bad lol

[stoic ledge]

It's an Audi, so yes

[fathom socket]

Should I change my oil after 9000 km?

Half of it it's mostly highway driving

[stoic ledge]

Probably not, think Ford also uses an interval of 1 year/15k km

Whichever comes Ford

[median egret]

Volkswagen drink oil like it's fuel tho

[cyan rose]

i had VW, don't recommend it

[charred depot]

hella modified

[charred flax]

yeah, the seats are really uncomfortable

on a VW

[cyan rose]

i don't like the shifting handle

you have to press it down to go reverse, meanwhile at Ford just put it in the gear and you're done

[stoic ledge]

That's not uncommon on cars to go in to reverse

[cyan rose]

i don't like it

[stoic ledge]

Even some Ford's require that, depends on the gearbox

[cyan rose]

on Focus is direct , no extra steps

[stoic ledge]

What engine/gearbox/year?

[cyan rose]

diesel ones

even older work like that

[stoic ledge]

I know new 6spd EcoBoost thingys require to pull a lip

Yeah older yes

Newer no

[cyan rose]

idk about newer ones

also VW is hella expensive here, people want 7,500 BAM (3,750 eur) for 2002. MKIV Golf

what was he smoking

[charred depot]

My mazda 2 just has reverse where 6th would be

has a lockout if you try to go from 5th to reverse though

[stoic ledge]

Corsa has R left besides 1st

[cyan rose]

my brother bought 2008. Opel Astra , 2 weeks later car didn't respond whenever he changed gears

bought it from some lady, prolly she rode the clutch all the time lol

[stoic ledge]

Probably

[charred depot]

alot of old people like to keep their revs high here yeah heh

[cyan rose]

or didn't fully pressed the pedal during shifting

[charred depot]

probably cant hear what they are doing

[cyan rose]

i never went above 2k rpm

actually only once went as far as 3,5k

[charred depot]

my car only starts makeing power above 4000rpm so :^)

[cyan rose]

lol

my friend kept nagging me to get Golf IV, like bro i ain't dumb

[stoic ledge]

Never get a VW

[cyan rose]

3,7k euro for 18 year old car is no thanks

[stoic ledge]

Newer ones suck even more

[cyan rose]

true

i hate new VW with passion

oh hey let's get rid of classic handbrake and use stupid electronic one

[charred depot]

i hate those

[cyan rose]

same

like how am i supposed to know when handbrake is up

[fathom socket]

i dont mind vw but it wouldnt be my first choice above like a polo

[charred depot]

really bad for maintenance too

i thought they just put a motor on the parking brake cable but no no no

[cyan rose]

my brother has like 3rd Opel so far, barely has any problems

i don't like Audis much

[stoic ledge]

gang

Audi's are even more expensive VW's

[charred depot]

theres just too many vauxhalls here

[cyan rose]

also VW is literally #1 brand here

people worship Golf 2 , absolute cliche

[charred depot]

also why do i see so many astras with blown head gaskets heh

[stoic ledge]

[cyan rose]

don't go full Scotty Kilmer and be like 1994. celica good, everything else bad

[charred depot]

every time i go looking for shitboxes i see so many vauxhalls with blown head gaskets

[stoic ledge]

[cyan rose]

i used to work for Renault , and it's pain to assemble

that little turd Twingo has so many parts

[charred depot]

i dont have a car that can take a trailer let alone a trailer so i need a shitbox that still has a MOT and drives.

[stoic ledge]

Besides like the 2.2 16v used in Vectra's and Zafira's, blown headgaskets aren't really common

[cyan rose]

new Twingo reminds me of that blue car with 3 wheels from Mr Bean

[charred depot]

mk5 astras is what i see the most with blown head gaskets

buts its even newer models too

[stoic ledge]

Wtf is a Mk5 Astra

[fathom socket]

its the 5th astra

[stoic ledge]

[stoic ledge]

5th Astra was the Kadett

[charred depot]

2004-2009

[stoic ledge]

That's the Astra H lol

[cyan rose]

my brother has CDTI

6 gears

[stoic ledge]

Diesel

[cyan rose]

i'd take diesel over petrol any day

[charred depot]

i was going to get a Astra but 2 was cheaper for insurance

[cyan rose]

i wanna get 2009. Ford Focus, they're p cheap

[fathom socket]

its all about insurance

[charred depot]

at my age yeah

[fathom socket]

hence why i have a mini

[cyan rose]

2007. Citroen C4s aren't bad as well

[charred depot]

but its french tho

[charred flax]

I hope the new $25,000 Tesla will be a hatchback

[charred depot]

i want to do a ev conversion on a dead rx8 once i have the money

[meager hinge]

my mom has a 2019 golf wagon with a handbrake

[night current]

@charred flax same

I'm pretty sure it will be.

[charred flax]

hatch backs are cool

[night current]

Fr fr

[charred flax]

and cheap

people say that the model 3 or y and hatchbacks

but they are 5 door

not the cool 3 door

and since the focus got discontinued, there is a gap in the market.

[charred depot]

focus discontinued?

ah just the US prioritising stupid bigg cars

[charred flax]

yeah

[dense shard]

The 25k Tesla won't be 25k

Just like the 35k 3 doesn't really exist

[charred flax]

if you get base model

but no one wants base model

[dense shard]

I do

Thousands wanted it

It never came

[charred flax]

the "25k tesla" will probably be around 30k-40k speced out

[dense shard]

Which pushes it firmly away from affordable

[charred flax]

only if people will want autopilot

which will probobly cost around 10k by the time the car comes out

[dense shard]

Which might be never

And Elon said 25k car WITH autonomous driving

That's not 25k plus 10k

That's 25k for everything

[charred flax]

oh

[stone magnet]

has anyone seen the new bmw i4 concept?

[dense shard]

Elon is talking out of his ass.

[charred flax]

Elon said autopilot will cost 56k one day, who would pay that much for autopilot?

[dense shard]

No one, because it isn't worth more than a grand

[charred flax]

not yet

he said that eventually there will be 100 grand worth of features

which sounds absurd

and will probobly take decades

[dense shard]

That's fucking stupid.

Features get cheaper over time, not more expensive.

Scale of economies doesn't work like this. It never did.

[indigo coral]

They'll never make a 25k car

[dense shard]

50 years ago fuel injection was radical and exotic. It cost a lot to add to a car. Today it's common place.

[indigo coral]

It'll be 40-50k once you add basic options

Just like the Model 3

[dense shard]

They're pretending that a feature uncommon today will be less common in the future?

As software progresses along with hardware, the cost of development should fall, not rise.

[indigo coral]

At one point a specced out model 3 was almost 90k

What happened to '35k'

[dense shard]

If Elon's stupidity held true, AMD GPUs would be worth 3 times as much on release, because AMD refines drivers over the next two years.

[indigo coral]

Lolol

[dense shard]

It true. GCN saw a 15% improvement in driver updates alone.

And it doesn't change the fact that you can pay 10k for autopilot's continued development, but still have to shell out 5k to upgrade the hardware... oh I guess that wasn't included... oops

[pliant birch]

Huh? Hardware already is included

Hence why you can shell out the (absurd) 10k after you buy the car for the software upgrade

[dense shard]

It isn't as it has changed.

Earliest Model S's required an upgrade

[pliant birch]

Right, but autopilot wasn't 10k in 2013/14

[dense shard]

And it never will be

Elon saying doesn't make it true.

Advancement in tech yields price decreases, not increases.

[pliant birch]

Doesnt make what true? Im out of the loop here

haha not always!

[dense shard]

Such as?

[pliant birch]

as labour and research time adds up, why would it make the tech cheaper? unless its inherent for the type of technology

see: mobile phones

big advancements, bigger prices (bigger than what it would be relative to inflation increases)

[dense shard]

Tech being cheaper means healthier margins at the same price.

Scale of economies as well.

[pliant birch]

Ok what baout this:

[dense shard]

As tech is rolled out, it becomes radically cheaper en masse.

Price of various safety tech has fallen over the years.

ABS isn't so much an option that's cheap, but included in the car.

Same for back up cameras.

[pliant birch]

why would the price of a piece of software that only does basic lane keeping and auto parking (2014 autopilot) be priced the same as a piece of software that is leagues more advanced? where are the costs of R&D to be factored in?

You're talking about hardware.

ABS has been around for much longer than autopilot

[dense shard]

I'm paying for a finished product.

Not for the ongoing development.

Elon said the car has FSD, why does my car not have FSD?

[pliant birch]

Which is why you won;t be buying autopiliot - its not a finished product

[dense shard]

Then why is it an option you pay for right now?

[charred flax]

its like a preorder

[pliant birch]

To support the development

you said it yourself

[dense shard]

Car makers need to have a finished product to release.

Right now it's false marketing.

[pliant birch]

Elon said the car has FSD, why does my car not have FSD?
@dense shard safety regulations

[dense shard]

It's like Toyota saying my car is an EV... development pending.

[pliant birch]

Not at all

[dense shard]

It's not safety regs.

[pliant birch]

Yes it is

[dense shard]

Tesla does NOT have FSD.

Nothing close to it.

[pliant birch]

Right

[dense shard]

Legally, Tesla offers SAE Level 2 autonomous driving.

[pliant birch]

because its pending apprival

[dense shard]

It isn't.

It doesn't exist.

VAG is the closest to full self driving with Level 3.

[pliant birch]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlThdr3O5Qo&ab_channel=Tesla

Sorry? It exists, right here

[civic girder]

imagine believing anything Tesla says

[dense shard]

uhhhh

[pliant birch]

Pending a p p r o v a l

[dense shard]

It isn't pending approval.

Because it hasn't been approved.

The government says Tesla is Level 2. Tesla says it as well.

That guy is technically breaking the law as he's required to keep hands on the wheel.

Fully autonomous driving is decades away.

[pliant birch]

Decades? Dude

[dense shard]

https://www.tesmanian.com/blogs/tesmanian-blog/tesla-supercomputer-dojo-v1-0-will-be-ready-in-about-1-year-says-elon-musk#:~:text=Featured image%3A Tesla,during Autonomy Day in 2019.

[pliant birch]

What qualifications do you have to make that claim

[dense shard]

Tesla is admitting it.

[civic girder]

nah, Monte is right here

[dense shard]

And what quals do you ahve to make yours?

[pliant birch]

U of waterloo comp sci graduate, ML major

[dense shard]

And what automotive industries creds do you have?

[pliant birch]

have been developing deep learning RNN's for the better part of 5 years

[civic girder]

[dense shard]

A comp sci major doesn't sound that impressive tbh.

[civic girder]

degrees are pretty useless for the most part

[dense shard]

Appeals to authority fallacy doesn't impress me, try again bud.

[pliant birch]

and what are your creds

[dense shard]

Why do you care?

I could lie

[pliant birch]

becasue i asked

[civic girder]

I've met people decades older than me, with numerous degrees, still know less than I do in a common field in which we both work

[pliant birch]

what i cant questiuon the validity of your claims?

[dense shard]

Am I supposed to blindly accept yours?

[pliant birch]

nope

but you asked

[civic girder]

this is hilarious

[dense shard]

It was a way to call out your "what makes you so qualified" statement.

[pliant birch]

haha by asking the same question that i did? alrighty

[dense shard]

It was a fallacy.

[pliant birch]

that was hypocrisy

[dense shard]

So far Tesla admits they're years away.

[civic girder]

that was hypocrisy
what

[pliant birch]

yeasr != decades

[dense shard]

And their constant failures have proven it.

decades, years.

Not anytime soon.

Tesla has been ready to roll out FSD next year for the past 5.

[pliant birch]

why so negative? they are one of the only companies making autonomous driving mainstream

[dense shard]

They aren't

[civic girder]

fully autonomous driving at the level we all expect, decades away. Functional autonomous driving? Yea, that's probably just years away

[dense shard]

GM, VAG

[fossil imp]

apart from volvo, bmw lol

[pliant birch]

to the capacity that tesla is, they are absolutely

[dense shard]

More so actually

[fossil imp]

any1 else can do it if they want to

[pliant birch]

then why cant my BMW x7 navigate on highways?

its advanced LKAS

[dense shard]

Cause you don't own one?

[pliant birch]

hahah

then hypothetically, as you are so astute in semantics

why cant a brand new bmw x7 navigate on highways for me?

[fossil imp]

why an x7?

[civic girder]

that wording makes me think you're referring to GPS

[pliant birch]

semantics

[dense shard]

Not yet rolled out, perhaps you need to buy a different model.

[pliant birch]

x3, x5, x7 3-7 series sedans

all the same tech

[dense shard]

You tell me Mr comp sci

[pliant birch]

not yet rolled out?

[fossil imp]

obv tesla > than all

[dense shard]

Oh yes./s

[pliant birch]

not at all. tesla makes shitty low qual cars

[normal temple]

because BMW is focused on making cars with uniform panel gaps

[pliant birch]

their tech is industry leading thus far

[fossil imp]

lol

[civic girder]

lmao

[charred flax]

People who took apart a model 3 said that Tesla is 10 years ahead of the competition

[civic girder]

Toyota has been in the hybrid game for over 2 decades

[pliant birch]

yeah and they are still just garbage

[civic girder]

what

[charred flax]

Toyota hybrids should be plug in the first year

[civic girder]

Toyota Hybrids are really really good

[charred flax]

Because whenever they release a new design it's never plug in

[pliant birch]

if we're talking about battery tech, they are not

[civic girder]

the tech isn't cutting edge, but its not inherently bad

[pliant birch]

no, not by itself, but compared to tesla battery cells, it is

well any hybrid compared to an EV kinda will be i guess

[civic girder]

what

[charred flax]

Does anyone know how to activate the touchless opening of the trunk on the rav 4?

Because the instruction manual is extremely confusing

[pliant birch]

is it not kick motion actuvated?

[charred flax]

Yeah

But you have to activate the kick motion

[pliant birch]

near where the trailer hitch would be

ah ok. yeah im not sure then

[dense shard]

Swing your foot about under the bumper.

Might have to activate the feature via touchscreen

[charred flax]

It tells me to activate it in setting and gives a page number, but that page takes about the lights

[pliant birch]

hmmm

[charred flax]

Talks*

[pliant birch]

theres probably a yt tutorial somewhere

[charred flax]

True

[civic spoke]

I heard that BMW was mentioned here.

[dense shard]

New BMW

[pliant birch]

Yep.

[civic spoke]

Can't really say much about the new 3 series facia until I see it in person.

We'll see how I think about it compared to the 2 series.

[stoic ledge]

3 is fine, M3 is

[pliant birch]

I'd agree. The new m3 and m4 have been growing on me

[dense shard]

They look worse each time I look.

[fossil imp]

dat grille doe

[civic girder]

^

[dense shard]

A bit too pog champ pig

[civic girder]

If I wanted to look at kidneys, I'd take mine out of my body

[dense shard]

It looks awkward

[stoic ledge]

M3 Touring + M340i front

[civic spoke]

I honestly don't mind the new grill as much anymore.

[pliant birch]

Again, the bigger kidneys look fitting on their bigger SUVs IMHO

[fossil imp]

but its required for cooling

[civic girder]

not really

[dense shard]

Headlights too big, grill tacked on

It's... Bad

[pliant birch]

7 series headlights are nice n small

[civic girder]

the kidneys look out of place and throw off the entire design. The proportions are all wrong

[dense shard]

Yep

[civic spoke]

The current G20 3 series is noice.

[stoic ledge]

I like this

[pliant birch]

m3 rendered with normal kidneys: https://www.bmwblog.com/2020/08/08/bmw-m3-with-normal-kidney-grilles/

[stoic ledge]

Way better yes

[civic girder]

oh wow, an actual car

[pliant birch]

Less concept-ey

[civic girder]

less ugly

proper proportions

better design

I could go on

[civic spoke]

G20 with the F80 grille.

I think the old M3 was the F80?

[civic girder]

idk my BMW lore

[stoic ledge]

3er = F30, M3 = F80 yes

[pliant birch]

wasn't f80 for the 2014 model year?

[civic girder]

uh

probably not just for 2014

[civic spoke]

The reason why they didn't use the F30 for the M3 was because the M group didn't like the front subframe or something.

So they took the front from the 4 series.

[pliant birch]

probably not just for 2014
@civic girder yeah, going forwards

Interesting

[dense shard]

And of course no manual outside of the M car

[civic spoke]

That we know of?

I G20 have a very limited amount of manual cars.

[dense shard]

G80 officially killed the manual outside of a couple of carry over engines

And those are the diesels

[pliant birch]

zf 8hp transmission is so nice, i wouldn't want a manual in anything outside of an M car

[stoic ledge]

Manual ftw

[dense shard]

I'd like it in a lower trim car

[civic girder]

I wouldn't want a BMW at all

[pliant birch]

don't buy a BMW if you can't afford all aspects of it I guess

[dense shard]

I can afford it

[civic girder]

I could afford it.

[dense shard]

But it offers nothing compelling

[civic girder]

^

[pliant birch]

Yeah, likewise

[stoic ledge]

It'll just get stolen again

[dense shard]

No manual, no buy

[stoic ledge]

cries in E91

[civic spoke]

I like my E46. Life was so much simple.

[dense shard]

E46 was probably the last good generation

[civic girder]

What can a BMW offer me that any of the cars I actually want can't? A lot.
But what do the cars I actually want offer that BMW does not? Character, simplicity, reliability, doesn't steal my money

[dense shard]

Maybe e92

[civic spoke]

The last true pure car from BMW.

[stoic ledge]

E91 > E92 'cause wagon ftw

[civic girder]

I would dare say BMW hasn't had much for good cars since the 80s

[pliant birch]

z8

[stoic ledge]

I can name multiple

[civic girder]

I can't

[dense shard]

Rekt

[civic girder]

German cars don't appeal to me much

You have to pull out some real old cars to get me excited in anything German

[stoic ledge]

E34, E39, F20, F3x, G2x, G3x

[civic girder]

and even then, there's not much I actually care for

[fossil imp]

ha

[civic girder]

yea, none of those interest me MK

[fossil imp]

only mazdas

[dense shard]

Anything past 2006 is kinda meh from BMW

[civic girder]

not just Mazda lol

[dense shard]

They lost ground to everyone

[pliant birch]

not even the new audi rs6 avant (for NA)

[fossil imp]

@civic girder bruh u are the biggest mazda shill i've ever seen 😄

[stoic ledge]

I'd rather have a BMW than a RS6

[dense shard]

I'd rather neither

[civic girder]

I mean, I won't deny that. But Mazda isn't the only thing I like 😂

[fossil imp]

lol

[pliant birch]

I'd rather neither
@dense shard whats the dream?

[dense shard]

The dream?

[stoic ledge]

Corolla

[pliant birch]

dream car

[dense shard]

Probably a WRX, but I'm happy with my 'rolla

I wanted a good looking competent hatchback, and I own one

[civic spoke]

As much as I understand it.
I hate how cars are becoming more and more of an appliance.

[civic girder]

I would probably have to say my dream car is either a 1st gen Cosmo, or a 3rd gen Cosmo Turbo

or a modern na rotary sports car

[dense shard]

I would love a 2nd gen Viper

[fossil imp]

n there it is 😉

[stoic ledge]

I like the Cosmo JC

[dense shard]

Maybe the new 400z?

[stoic ledge]

[pliant birch]

I get slight aston martin dbs vibes from the 400z

[civic girder]

Nissan lost my interest after the Z32

[stoic ledge]

Nissan not bringing the 400Z to Europe -> Nissan dead to me

[dense shard]

Oof

[pliant birch]

thoughts on audi sq7? if anyone has looked at it at all

[stoic ledge]

X5 M > SQ7

[civic girder]

Audi is dead to me

[pliant birch]

X5 M > SQ7
@stoic ledge need 3 rows

[civic spoke]

If I had a garage with maybe four vehicles in it. Then I would want a Morgan.

[stoic ledge]

SQ7 3rd row isn't big

[pliant birch]

bigger than the x5 M

[civic girder]

The only thing Audi has that I think is interesting, is the inline 5. But the rest of the car is super unappealing to me in every possible way

[pliant birch]

hm. everything? why?

[stoic ledge]

X7

[pliant birch]

yeah, thats what im deciding between. x7 m50i and audi sq7

[civic spoke]

Just get a VW Transporter.

[civic girder]

German cars just can't pique my interest. I don't think they look particularly great, I don't think they sound very good, and the way most german cars are seen by society also turns me off

[pliant birch]

Just get a VW Transporter.
@civic spoke I want a bit of performance, coming from a vw golf r

[fossil imp]

map the R

[pliant birch]

Done

[civic spoke]

Sticky tires.

[pliant birch]

APR stage 2

[fossil imp]

bigger turbo

[civic spoke]

And send it through corners.

[pliant birch]

haha, audi and bmw have decent ACS (active chassis control)

I've tested both, and while the x7 is super nice and i think looks better, the sq7 drives and handles much better

both are not lookers, id agree with @civic girder

[civic girder]

active chassis control? why not just use strut bars

[pliant birch]

dynamic chassis stiffness is nice to have on a luxury car

[civic girder]

sounds unnecessary to me

[pliant birch]

also help with keeping the car level through corners

[civic girder]

that's what suspension is for

[pliant birch]

I thought the same, but it does make a difference

[stoic ledge]

Get a Toyota Sienna and an M3 for the same money as 1 X7/SQ7

[civic girder]

why not just get the Sienna

[stoic ledge]

[pliant birch]

not on my radar, im looking for something a bit nicer to drive

interior quality, is objectively top notch

[civic girder]

in fact, why not just get a first gen Sienna and a S2k

that makes way more sense to me

[pliant birch]

the 3 rows is what im after

2 different cars isn't an option

[stoic ledge]

Get a Previa

[civic girder]

I will, don't worry

[pliant birch]

hah! my neighbour has one

[civic girder]

is it awd

[pliant birch]

dunno

damn ugly though

[civic girder]

oof

[stoic ledge]

[civic spoke]

I want an EV daily.

[stoic ledge]

Buy it

[pliant birch]

but, pontiac aztek ugly

[dense shard]

A RAV4 Prime would be swell

[civic spoke]

We have no place to charge an EV

[civic girder]

Previa is by far the best looking van ever made. Followed closely by Astro, Windstar, and 1st/2nd gen Odyssey

[civic spoke]

Which sucks.

[stoic ledge]

We have no place to charge an EV
Just use a diesel generator

Wait

[civic girder]

that reminds me of a video

[pliant birch]

ik the video haha

[civic girder]

where someone was on the side of the road in a Tesla and said they were out of gas

pulls gas generator out of the trunk

[civic spoke]

What about the guy with a trailer and a battery pack? Or whatever it was.

[stoic ledge]

Belgian police be like Tesla at generator gg

[civic girder]

you mean the Rav 4 with a VW air cooled flat 4 on a trailer?

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/438484168373043200/753659704680644640/1599696715850.png

[stoic ledge]

Is that one of those Tesla converted Rav4's?

[civic girder]

probably?

idk

[stoic ledge]

Don't know any other EV RAV4

[civic girder]

it could also just be a Prime?

[civic spoke]

That's probably what I was thinking of.

[dense shard]

That's an EV

[stoic ledge]

Don't think that gen had a Prime, did it?

[civic girder]

I mean, post says that, but you never know

[stoic ledge]

Were those clear tail lights also used on regular Rav4's?

[civic girder]

Don't think that gen had a Prime, did it?
yea, I don't think so

[stoic ledge]

Were those clear tail lights also used on regular Rav4's?
I Think that's the clear giveaway

[civic girder]

no that's a straight up Toyota EV

there was an EV Rav4 in that gen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3&v=qj9QXZCfWcI&feature=emb_title&ab_channel=Autotrader

[stoic ledge]

Powertrain by Tesla

[civic girder]

yea

tbh, that's what Tesla should be doing

[stoic ledge]

Only good Tesla ever

[civic girder]

you're not wrong either

[stoic ledge]

I know. I have a computer science degree, so I'm always right

[civic girder]

[pliant birch]

who said that?

[stoic ledge]

[pliant birch]

I was simply commenting on the fact that Tesla has RNNs with far more useful data to build models on, which puts them ahead in the autonomous driving game

recurring neural nets = rnn

[civic girder]

or we could just return to the golden age of cars

[pliant birch]

good option also

[pliant birch]

pop ups are delightful

[civic girder]

best car

[pliant birch]

what was your first car?

[pliant birch]

beauty. can't go wrong

[civic girder]

Yep

Its a fantastic car

[pliant birch]

mine was a mk4 golf tdi. no pics on my computer rn

[stoic ledge]

Golf

TDI

[civic girder]

https://streamable.com/59ghc7

[pliant birch]

loved that thing to death

[civic girder]

rotary is life

[pliant birch]

ive never actually heard one irl before

[civic girder]

they sound pretty good

mine sounds pretty shit tho cause the exhaust is fucked up

[pliant birch]

haha, that gives it character

[civic girder]

ye

[pliant birch]

ive seen the videos of that bananas twin turbo rxx7

[civic girder]

It's gonna get fixed tho

[pliant birch]

rx7*

[civic girder]

the problem is that the rust got to the exhaust, and well, the muffler is just dead weight

[pliant birch]

single turbo* : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQjqImHruJE&ab_channel=RobDahm

[civic girder]

plan is to get that pipe repaired so the muffler actually does something

[pliant birch]

good plan stan

[civic girder]

and then header swap and cat delete

https://streamable.com/d90op2

[civic spoke]

Man. I want an LSD.

[civic girder]

Me too

except I also don't really care since its just a cruiser

[civic spoke]

I want it for winter drives.

[civic girder]

fair enough

[stoic ledge]

Me too
For on the Prius

[civic girder]

pretty sure the Prius is technically LSD already

[civic spoke]

Fun fact.
You can do ghetto LSD by lightly braking.

[civic girder]

oof

that wouldn't work in my car tho since the rear brakes do next to nothing until you give it a pretty healthy amount of brakes

[civic spoke]

It's true. Basically how a bunch of modern cars do LSD without an LSD.
They brake the wheel that's spinning.

[stoic ledge]

That's basically what those electric diffs do, apply the brakes

[civic girder]

lol

[stoic ledge]

Some people even pay extra for such "diff"

[civic girder]

yea

we should regress to 80s car design

but with modern materials and manufacturing

[stoic ledge]

I prefer 90s tbh

[civic girder]

imo 80s and 90s best eras of automotive history

Can't forget cool shit like the Cosmo, 4 and 5 door rotaries, and a lot of other cool shit

but 80s and 90s better

plus you get cool shit like first gen RX-7, Z31, Previa, MR2 with popups and not Miata sized, and an Accord with popups and a carbureted motor

[stoic ledge]

Cosmo JC is

[civic girder]

L10A and HB better imo

but yea, the JC is still lit af

except no manual

[stoic ledge]

Reee

Love the styling tho

And the interior

And the engine

[civic girder]

yea, they look amazing

but personally, you just can't beat the boxy 80s style of the HB

[stoic ledge]

Too bad they were never made as LHD

Or manual

personally I prefer 90s design over 80s

[civic girder]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/601235066055688205/729194631014645770/Mazda_HB_Cosmo_002.png

I would daily the shit out of an HB Cosmo