You invest money to get more money out of the investment
#cars
fair bronze
eager kite
Not more than a few years out
dense shard
oh yes more than a few years out.
eager kite
it will take longer than that for them to recoup that money
fair bronze
Definitely more
dense shard
Yes, but the money will be recouped.
eager kite
maybe
dense shard
Most certainly.
dense shard
New engines and platforms are only getting more expensive to develop.
Having two massive companies develop one platform vs. 2 companies doing 2... the money saved is epic.
eager kite
drop ICE development, that should save some money
dense shard
Great way to lose money and die in the next 5 years.
fair bronze
^
eager kite
lmao not at all but k
dense shard
prove me wrong.
fair bronze
Keep dreaming
dense shard
Right now catering to a market is the best way to make money.
The market isn't that invested in EVs.
Look at Suzuki as a great example.
They've harnessed the emerging market by making cars people actually want to buy, and can afford to buy.
eager kite
um
dense shard
They now hold something like 50% of the Indian market.
eager kite
not investing in new ICE tech wouldn't put you in the ground
fair bronze
Unless you have made your way up in a certain niche market like, again, Tesla did greatly
eager kite
you might get lower sales over time, but if you came out with compelling EV options within a short period of time then you could recoup those losses
dense shard
Toyota remains invested in ICE, and isn't being hurt by it.
dense shard
Yeah, and they're still investing in gasoline.
fair bronze
Compelling EV options
dense shard
In fact they've signed on with Suzuki.
They help Suzuki meet emissions, and Suzuki helps them get more pie.
fair bronze
They're not compelling to most people in the world
vital glen
investing in one technology doesn't mean dropping a whole other technology
dense shard
yes
fair bronze
Again, hybrids are a great example of how to get the best of both worlds
Better efficiency, affordability and usability
dense shard
And with certain applications... pretty damn fast.
fair bronze
No need to charge all the time
vital glen
@dense shard We will be seeing more mergers in the future
dense shard
I think Toyota has bought a stake in Mazda.
fair bronze
Could be, don't know
fair bronze
Nah
dense shard
Ford's not in a great position at this moment.
fair bronze
They have too many differences
dense shard
nonsense
Both build questionable quality cars, have had PR nightmares in the past, and have a questionable future.
lol
fair bronze
Next to that, VW has no reason to merge with Ford
dense shard
Truck market.
fair bronze
They are one of the biggest automakers
dense shard
But they're still doing a joint development with ford on a new truck and van.
fair bronze
VW and Mercedes have worked on a van and they will never merge
dense shard
Ford and Volkswagen have committed to co-develop vans and trucks that will see showrooms starting in 2022, both automakers announced Tuesday.
oh hey I just found the release date of the new Bronco.
eager kite
hybrids will be banned so
fair bronze
Just stop
eager kite
they aren't a solution long term
fair bronze
Thing is, all automakers have their love affairs but that rarely turns into marriage
dense shard
Between the hefty price of the Wrangler, and the drawn out development of the Bronco... I just don't care anymore.
fair bronze
Hype gets you disappointed
fair bronze
I've had my moments
fair bronze
To be frank that is with anything nowadays
dense shard
The Supra came.
fair bronze
Such a disappointment
dense shard
Was it?
fair bronze
To most people, yes
dense shard
Seems to be well received if you ignore the fanboys.
Which seems well worth the risk here.
fair bronze
I think most people who were interested are fanboys lol
eager kite
ok boomer
fair bronze
That doesn't mean it isn't a disappointment
dense shard
Good dedicated platform, strong engine, and fairly nice styling.
vital glen
@eager kite go back to the floatplane chat, chad
fair bronze
It is a great car
dense shard
I understand it's not based on BMW's CLAR platform.
eager kite
nah not as interesting of convos in there
dense shard
But is dedicated.
fair bronze
It's just not a Supra, let alone a Toyota
dense shard
I think people are too caught up on that.
They're treating the supra like some rarified super car.
It wasn't. It was a nice GT car.
fair bronze
Well it is quite a hyped car overall
dense shard
It had potential, and the new one apparently also has incredible potential.
I've accepted the Supra is going to disappoint regardless.
fair bronze
The new one is just a completely different car
dense shard
I think Toyota should have ignored the fans, and dropped a turbo V6 or V8 in there.
It doesn't need an inline 6.
fair bronze
That would be even worse tbh
dense shard
It's like the BMW fans who whined about the M3 requiring an inline 6 to be a real M3.
Forgetting the OG had a 4 banger.
fair bronze
Why ignore fans of your brand
dense shard
Because the fans aren't going to buy your shit new.
Assuming they're old enough to buy your stuff.
fair bronze
Not necessarily
dense shard
I'm being overly pessimistic here, sure.
fair bronze
I know exactly what you mean
dense shard
But the fans wanted a Mk. IV with android auto.
That wasn't going to happen.
Different era.
Could they have developed their own dedicated car?
Yes.
fair bronze
I know, I'm not saying that
dense shard
Should they have? I'll say yes.
But do I understand why they went with BMW? Yes.
That being said. Now that I know they've teamed up with Mazda to build a new inline 6 I wonder why they didn't do this earlier.
fair bronze
Thing is: it's fine that they developed it together with BMW imo, but they let BMW do way too much
dense shard
I've heard conflicting stories on how much BMW did.
fair bronze
It still feels and sounds like a BMW
dense shard
All the mainline stories I hear it was basically they set out basic parameters, and went their own ways.
dense shard
I'd have to sit in both cars to decide if I'm totally honest.
The interior styling is similar in the pictures.
Can't deny that. I'm not that delusional.
Exterior tho is quite different.
fair bronze
That's why I'm saying it is a disappointment, it is not a Toyota
dense shard
Could have been more Toyota for sure.
fair bronze
Exterior is different but that's about it
dense shard
But how many people will buy it?
dense shard
Likely not enough to justify a new platform and new engine.
fair bronze
BMW isn't exactly known for their reliability while Toyota on the other end...
dense shard
RC-F is old stuff, and the new one isn't due till a few years from now.
Apparently Toyota had a lot to say about the engine's reliablity in the new Supra.
If that's actually the case is to be seen.
fair bronze
I highly doubt it
dense shard
We'll see.
fair bronze
Maybe, maybe not because we will never own one
fair bronze
I don't hate BMW either but I just wouldn't buy one for that reason
They're expensive to maintain too
dense shard
yeah, but that kinda applies to most German cars.
fair bronze
BMW is the worst though
dense shard
I wouldn't mind an E36 M3, but I don't think I'll ever own one.
fair bronze
Same here
dense shard
I'm too impatient.
fair bronze
I like too many cars lol
dense shard
That's why we're here.
fair bronze
Can't have them all
indigo coral
yikes, tesla raised the price of the model 3 performance again
was 62k optioned out for a while, now its up to 65
fair bronze
I thought prices were supposed to go down
fair bronze
@dense shard But that is unsafe
dense shard
Even comes with a V6. 👀
indigo coral
Or a used 2017 GS F 👀
dense shard
Or that.
indigo coral
and save 25k
fair bronze
If you actually like cars
indigo coral
rip, you can't even order a new GS F
Oh nvm
found it
was put at the bottom of the page, seperate from the normal GS
fair bronze
Yes, they are stopping production so you can only buy electric now
indigo coral
Oofy 88,790 for a new GS F
dense shard
Rumors are GS is ending production soon.
indigo coral
i sure hope not
dense shard
Have a good one JD.
indigo coral
its a nicely proportioned car
fair bronze
New one will come soon after
indigo coral
I like the Porsche Panamera Sport Turismo E-Hybrid Turbo S 👀
too bad its 300 grand
well, 200 base + porsche options
Taycan wagon when
eager kite
dense shard
https://practicalmotoring.com.au/car-news/toyota-apple-carplay-and-android-auto-retrofit-available/ yesssssssssss
A step in the right direction.
civic spoke
@stoic ledge MC = Motorcycle
civic spoke
If it wasn't so expensive to lease one, then I'd totally get myself a new 320d as a daily.
stoic ledge
With a manual pogey
civic spoke
Yeah. Only reason I'd get the 320d
I'd also spec is so that I wouldn't get the new silly dashboard.
It would have the bells and whistles. Just not the stupid gauge cluster.
stoic ledge
Idk how but I've seen 3er with the old screen
Like, the screen with the circles drawn on it
stoic ledge
^ same
indigo coral
Much nicer looking than the newer all digital clusters
i've never had a problem with modern analog ones
I'm not a fan of the white writing on gray plastic 90s boring ones, but like my floating one and, for example, the part screen part analog Stinger one is nice
stoic ledge
Yeah I prefer modern analog gauges too tbh
A screen just had no depth in it
Although the latest Peugeot i-Cockpit gauges do, they have like a 3D effect on them
stoic ledge
Yeah idk, that's something Peugeot has been doing since the 2nd gen 308, which is since 2014 (?)
It has s screen above the gauge cluster which is projected on top of the gauges, creating a 3D depth effect
It's kinda cool actually
Much better than just a flat screen if you ask me
indigo coral
yeah
But just like why with the tiny wheel xD
Lol
The audi e-tron steering wheel is slightly too big
Weird nitpick but it is!!
stoic ledge
Basically smaller steeringwheel == sportier drive... And combined with the gauges seen above the steeringwheel instead of though it, it's kinda weird at first but you'll get used to that
^^ you can get the new 3er with that screen fyi
civic spoke
Yeah. You just can't get any of the fancy tech stuff.
If you just get a more basic one, then you'll get the nice 'round' screen.
stoic ledge
Oof
civic spoke
Just sucks that you can't find any reviews of the G20 with manual.
eager kite
stoic ledge
Yeah all G20 reviews are fully optioned 330i's as far as I've seen, or some M340i's
civic spoke
There are some 320d's as well. But any and all reviews have been with the 8 speed automatic.
vital glen
@stoic ledge ofc they are
dense shard
Unfortunately most new 3 series are automatics. I think any manuals remaining in the line up are hold overs from last generation.
Well... "unfortunately" is a bit strong. Trends are pushing BMW to go for automatics.
stoic ledge
Atleast the ZF 8HP is good.... The new 7DCT (Mini) they are using in the new 1er is bad
Ok not bad... Just not as good
civic spoke
I guess going with an auto means that I can also go with the stop-and-go feature as well...
Making my commute even more braindead.
unreal terrace
autos are better
change my mind
Wait so that means the new 1er is FWD?
Oh man
unreal terrace
Idk what to say, either it's a cheaper BMW or a more expensive fwd euro box
unreal terrace
Ye
I liked the 114i they did, all the perks of a BMW and a pricetag you could justify
unreal terrace
Probs
civic spoke
You can get them from 135 hp, up to 200 hp.
unreal terrace
If it's cheaper than it would have been rwd I'd get it
civic spoke
And it has the 3 cylinder, so it wouldn't sound as bad as the 4 pot.
unreal terrace
But if it's just a more expensive fwd, why does it even exist
civic spoke
The older 218i is still RWD.
unreal terrace
Ye, I was thinking of the sports whatever wagon-hatchback thing they did
civic spoke
Yeah. The thing that was based on the X1
I was thinking of this.
Christ. That was a large image.
civic spoke
The Active/Gran Tourer are just stupid.
unreal terrace
Thats it
civic spoke
I guess BMW wanted an MPV.
unreal terrace
Or
People wanted a BMW MPV
That's just a normal MPV that says BMW on it in crayons
unreal terrace
So an X1 with painted bumpers X)
civic spoke
Also, lets not talk about the 3 series Gran Turismo.
unreal terrace
The 5er GT was so daft I forgot about it
What about the elephant in the room?
The X7
X7M*
civic spoke
Did they ever do a X7M?
I know that the X6M was mental.
And X550d being stupid powerful.
unreal terrace
The x6m was for mental patients
civic spoke
It got great reviews from driving journalists.
unreal terrace
I'm just waiting for BMW to make a 7er estate
indigo coral
X6M isn't that bad
civic spoke
Man. Then only thing that sucks about BMW now is that if you want a 6 cylinder you need to go with the big boy spec engine.
M340i, for example.
And new 1/2 series won't even get it.
unreal terrace
That does suck
civic spoke
Oh, you can get the new 1 series with a manual as well.
But gotta go with the base engines.
So either 118i or 118d
Still gets you 140/150 hp. So alright, I guess.
Looked at the petrol engines for the new 1 series. You have two options.
unreal terrace
Wow the reeee-mini cooper is actually cheaper than a leaf
civic spoke
Leaf is super cheap to run.
unreal terrace
Yeah but still like €40.000
To buy
The mini starts at €35.000
Wut, the model 3 starts at €31.500 in the states and over here it's €65.000
indigo coral
yeah model 3 is only 65k for a Performance with FSD, all the options
idk why it's so expensive everywhere else
civic spoke
Isn't that cheapo model 3 the short range one?
Also, USA prices often don't include taxes and such
indigo coral
still 240 miles of range
civic spoke
Lets hope that I can get to/from work tomorrow in one piece.
vital glen
@civic spoke you get a tax credit when buying electric vehicles
jade gale
Don't use the Plastic part on the body it will damage it.
vital glen
And yeah your cheapest model 3 is the 250mi range, 0-100 5.3s @civic spoke
stoic ledge
Our base Model 3 is the SR+ at €49.900
indigo coral
o.o
stoic ledge
But why buy it when you can have it as a company car for next to nothing >:)
jade gale
I don't know I walk
indigo coral
after all their price hikes recently, our base SR+ is 39,490
stoic ledge
The gasoline saving is BS, to put it on the website like that
jade gale
Thatw was accurate
vital glen
It's 40k now, you save the 1900 dollars when you do your taxes
jade gale
Wait what
stoic ledge
But 1200 destination charges, so it's basically $39k delivered
jade gale
Area dependent
vital glen
I guess if you really want to break it up into counties
There is the federal tax credit
and then you have what your state/local municipalities will give you
jade gale
This doesn't aply to me I'm north of you guys
vital glen
I don't care about you snow Mexicans
indigo coral
Oof
vital glen
I'm talking about the us here
jade gale
U.S of A's economy is dying and very stagnate
vital glen
Ok boomer
jade gale
Okay.
vital glen
@stoic ledge Now look, real men use boosted boards to travel to work
indigo coral
or onewheels
jade gale
I walk and bike (Yes even in the 10 com of snow)
stoic ledge
@vital glen boosted boards?
vital glen
Electric skate boards @stoic ledge
stoic ledge
Yikes
flint sable
fathom socket
You put your left foot down
you put your right foot down
you take your left foot out
and you slide it all about
ebon field
indigo coral
I saw that
dense shard
He lived. I'm more relieved than sad.
indigo coral
Yeah, glad he is ok.
dense shard
I mean... okay is relative here. Genetic lotteries can suck a dick.
indigo coral
well yes.
dense shard
But... yeah. He's okay.
sullen mountain
glad he's okay
wheat hatch
Glad the fella is okay.
hardy osprey
Drove my parent's bmer to college today, it's fun not to use turn signals
fair bronze
Wait, they come with turn signals?
hardy osprey
That's the thing, I don't have to use them because they don't exist !
civic spoke
Fun fact about my BMW. My turn signal stalk has a bit of play in it from using it so much...
stoic ledge
Impossible!
jagged coyote
they aren't designed to be used that much you fool @civic spoke
indigo coral
nah he's just memeing. All that stalk does is flash brights.
jagged coyote
oh yeah, the rage brights
civic spoke
Light horn.
indigo coral
I actually saw some ratty old panther platform that they had messed up the wiring
When they turned on the signal, the whole light assemvly flashed
Instead of just the orange turn signal
Up front
warm sparrow
yes sometimes I see cars like this
turn signal makes everything flash
stop light, tail lights, turn signals, everything
or reverse brake lights (on when not using brakes and off when using brakes)
polar ferry
warm sparrow
XD
dense shard
Even in lego form it needs repair.
indigo coral
wtf, my first gen RX is about the size of the current NX
dense shard
Makes sense.
Current RX is biiiiig.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paySho2UWzg New review up. And the Pilot has no right sounding as good as it does.
civic spoke
TIL - I can fit two sets of tires in my car.
fathom socket
when u gotta practise for driving theory test but u also want to look at memes
and look on ltt discord
night current
What a champ RX7
I really want one, but not sure if I can financially risk getting one.
civic girder
If you get one that has good compression and you take paranoid care of it, it'll last
indigo coral
I wish I could get an E60 M5 👀 But I'm not financially suicidal
civic girder
Rotaries can be reliable, but only if you treat them right and care for them right
they are different from piston engines so you have to adapt the maintenance you do and the schedule you do it on
You also gotta beat on them a little bit. Not redlining a rotary can be catastrophic. Though you don't have to redline it all the time, typically once a drive; or at least shift over 4k whenever you can.
indigo coral
I don't have a rotary, but sometimes I swear that beating on my car a bit makes it seem more perky and drive nicer. Probably just placebo.
civic girder
most piston engines don't really like to rev
they'll rev fine, but it's not doing you any favors
indigo coral
I almost wonder if its adjusting settings in the ECU
I read on the internet (not from Lexus) that the ECU adapts
civic girder
it's probably VVL/VVT
the engine changes cam profiles when you get aggressive
so it'll get perkier and rev more freely
then when you get off it, it changes back to the default profile which is favoring fuel economy
and ofc, VVL/VVT is controlled by the ECU
indigo coral
Well.. it downshifts more eagerly and smoothly and whatnot as well.
Not just horsepower/torque.
So I've no idea. The car has a mind of its own 😂
civic girder
yea, modern ECUs also control the trans
so when it changes engine profiles it also adjusts the trans shift points and what not
it's like driving modes, but automatically selected based off what the throttle position sensor tells the ECU
which VVL/VVT stands for variable valve lift and variable valve timing. Changes how aggressively the valves operate by adjusting the camshaft profiles. V-TEC uses a form of this. Pretty much all cars these days have some form of it; VVT and VVL are different things, and not all engines will have both.
indigo coral
yeah, my car has VVTi
civic girder
yep
indigo coral
(still a poor engine but thats not what we're discussing :P)
civic girder
I mean, it's an econobox, what do you expect?
indigo coral
I've a Lexus RX 300
civic girder
I thought you had a Corolla hatch, lol
indigo coral
That's Monte_Carlo
civic girder
ah, yea
indigo coral
Imo they should have put the powertrain from the Lexus LS instead of the Camry.
There's tons of space up front
The V6 sits like 8 inches below the hood and has a bunch of space around the sides lol.
civic girder
the RX300 is an SUV, right?
indigo coral
yes
civic girder
that's why
indigo coral
ye, but that doesn't mean they couldn't fit a V8 in it
civic girder
They could have, yes. But that doesn't mean it's a good idea 😛
indigo coral
How could it be worse 😛 The V8 in the LS was a damn good engine, plus the 6speed was actually pretty nice too.
4.3L V8 iirc, 6 speed auto, 310 ( i think ) horsepower
Instead of 3L V6 and a overstressed 4spd auto
civic girder
the Lexus LS is a higher end car that is supposed to have more performance
vs a lower end SUV that doesn't need performance because they're marketed towards moms
indigo coral
They didn't plan out the RX very well, they tried to panic-change it in '01 and made the transmission even worse
civic girder
I could see a 5 or 6 speed auto vs the 4 speed, but idk about a V8 instead of a V6
indigo coral
'99 - early 01, the planetary gear is weak and the ATF pump is underpowered
civic girder
oof
indigo coral
in 01, they revised it and made the pump too big
and it burns the shit out of the ATF
So lol.
I have a '99, so I just can leave the fluid alone for normal intervals
civic girder
it sounds like the transmission is what they fucked
civic girder
engine doesn't seem like its bad
indigo coral
It has bad sludge problems, but most people use synthetics so
thats not a super big deal anymore
civic girder
be me wondering why there's no conventional oil
indigo coral
My car isn't too dreadfully slow once it hits power, but it takes so long to get there beacuse the gears are so long
indigo coral
4th runs you up to 112
civic girder
that moment when 4th gear is the shortest
indigo coral
(artifically limited at 112)
they call 4th "overdrive" but its actually not
4th is 1.01:1
civic girder
the RX-7 gearing is something like this:
1st - 28mph
2nd - 45mph
3rd - 70mph
I have not maxed out 4th or 5th, so idk what they top out at
civic girder
I don't think I went over 80 in the RX-7. no ABS and not wanting to crash a car made me hold back
the Prius I've almost hit 90
indigo coral
I wasn't vastly exceeding the speed limit though. Not being entirely stupid
Was a downhill in a 75mph zone.
indigo coral
The benefit of 4th being 1.01 is that highway passing power at 70+ isn't too dreadful
(though that means I sit at an absurd ~3200rpm at 75)
civic girder
me going over 80 in the Prius was dumb. Uphill in a 65 zone
dense shard
I either have to be patient, or drop a gear.
civic girder
passing in the RX-7
I'll be lucky if 4th gear is sufficient, but if I have to slow down due to cars keeping me from getting over I usually have to yeet it into 3rd
civic girder
the Prius is easy to pass because CVT
indigo coral
It aint nothing to hit 75 in the Explorer
civic girder
Explorer live axles are OP
civic girder
the modern Explorers are.....interesting
indigo coral
It's a nice car, just drove a Limited yesterday and yuck
If anyones gonna buy one, get the sport.
lower, tighter and overall a better car.
indigo coral
I was stunned at how bad the Limited (still 2014) body rolled compared to our Sport
like wtf?
civic girder
there's a reason I only see Dodge Charger cops on the highway
the Explorer cop cars can't accelerate on the highway
indigo coral
Do you have the interceptor? They're plenty quick up here
indigo coral
The Explorers I mean
civic girder
oh, idk
indigo coral
The interceptor hauls ass, the non-sport/interceptor explorer not so much
civic girder
I know that the Explorer cops can accelerate quick at low speeds
but when they're going on the highway, pretty much anything can outpull them
indigo coral
If i recall correctly the interceptor engine is naturally aspirated
The Taurus SHO w/ performance pack is surprisingly athletic though
for a big sedan at least
stoic ledge
but when they're going on the highway, pretty much anything can outpull them
Lemme try that >:)
indigo coral
in America MK, not europe.
stoic ledge
FeelsBadMan
indigo coral
You'd be 100% screwed.
jagged coyote
in france our police force has mégane 4 rs interceptors, never been in one but it hauls ass
indigo coral
Considering I could catch you MK, I can't recommend trying to outrun the cops. @stoic ledge
jagged coyote
even if you outrun them they've got your plate 
indigo coral
The new Interceptor Hybrid has 450hp O.o
stoic ledge
Not if they all drive like this 😉
indigo coral
LOL
Lowkey I'd learn stick if I could get a E60 M5 manual
If you get rid of the troublesome SMG, and install upgraded rod bearings and vanos parts, you're not in that bad of shape
jagged coyote
mfw i learned on stick
jagged coyote
wait? explorer as in the big ass suv
indigo coral
yes
jagged coyote
used by cops
indigo coral
yes
jagged coyote
some cop cars in the us are pretty nice (maybe not so the crown vics and taurus's, don't really like them)
indigo coral
The cop taurus is meh, the sho is nice.
dense shard
The crown vics have been phased out.
indigo coral
Theyre still being usedf
jagged coyote
the crown vic is good at one thing: rippin'
dense shard
It's less common.
indigo coral
he drew the short straw
dense shard
The only reason anyone got Crown Vics was they were so cheap.
indigo coral
It's Explorers and a few Tauruses for city patrol up here, Malibus and Taurus and Explorer for State Patrol, Crown Vic and Explorer for Sherrif
Oh and city cops have a Chevy Bolt, a Model S, and an F150
the F150 is fucking sneaky
dense shard
It's not like cops drive long distances.
They just sit around and wait for cars to speed.
indigo coral
they spend a lot of the day driving slow/sitting, so the Tesla is great for that
jagged coyote
you'd be surprised how much you can drive just staying in a city
indigo coral
250 miles would surprise me
dense shard
The thing is cops aren't always driving.
indigo coral
In a single cop's day
jagged coyote
when i was delivering mail i was doing arround 120km a day
dense shard
That's less than 100 miles.
indigo coral
the Model S and bolt could do that easily
jagged coyote
what's the range on a p90D? 400miles?
dense shard
300?
civic girder
Crown Vic interceptors are badass
jagged coyote
yeah, so it's great for cops, but not really in pursuit
dense shard
I imagine most chases end in under 20 miles.
indigo coral
if you're going on a 400 mile pursuit you really need to reevaluate your enforcement strategy XD
Or get a helicopter
indigo coral
😂
dense shard
Or buy a spike strip?
dense shard
A leaf doesn't need to go more.
stoic ledge
Yeah but.... even I can outrun a Leaf
indigo coral
Ok Lol the Nissan Leaf E-Plus is so overpriced
It costs as much as a Model 3 midrange
jagged coyote
i think i saw an electric cop car, well, more like park metering maid car
dense shard
They don't burst into flame.
stoic ledge
Here the Leaf E-Plus is cheaper than the Model 3 SR+ xD
dense shard
They actually have QC.
indigo coral
lmao
stoic ledge
Lol no the Leaf batteries are shite, those of the Model 3 are way better
dense shard
Nissan is a Japanese brand.
indigo coral
yeah those damn watercooling loops ruining everything
jagged coyote
it's because they've gotta import the telsa's in europe, doesn't nissan have factories in europe?
stoic ledge
I do think the Lead isn't built in Europe
indigo coral
but Tesla is probably one of the best quality american manufacturers
controversial opinion but seriously
dense shard
Current leaf is just a face lifted last gen Leaf.
indigo coral
the new Explorer is a complete failure
Ford's warranty costs have quintupled from last gen to the new one
stoic ledge
Current Leaf doesn't have a telescoping steering wheel :LUL:
dense shard
New generations always have teething issues.
jagged coyote
ford and other car companies are just way behind and are falling real quick
dense shard
Even the cost of GM's shutdown and Ford's issues... they both made a profit.
indigo coral
rapidly
dense shard
In self driving... maybe.
indigo coral
in general
dense shard
Otherwise they have the same stuff Toyota does.
indigo coral
none of them are investing in EVs or charging networks, are on ageing platforms
dense shard
Well new Explorer is a new platform.
indigo coral
GM is considering killing the Bolt, and only releasing their new EV in china
dense shard
CD6 I believe.
jagged coyote
ford and their "v6 ecoboost"
indigo coral
hey don't bag on the V6 ecoboost 😛
dense shard
The Ecoboost has been a bright spot.
indigo coral
The ecoboost has been one of the biggest sellingpoints of newer fords
god knows they need all the help they can get
dense shard
could be worse at least.
stoic ledge
1.0 EcoBoost Pogey
indigo coral
The 3.5 ecoboost isn't bad at all. Though I'm strongly concerned about the reliability in a decade or so
jagged coyote
well they killed their v8s for the ecoboost so i guess it really works
indigo coral
Hopefully our Explorer was just a bit of a fluke.
stoic ledge
The should make a F150 with the 1.0 EcoBoost
indigo coral
If the Taurus is going to have the same problem, it better do it by 2023.
jagged coyote
oh, i mean't in non utilitarian vehicules like the mustang or even the gt
dense shard
The 5.0 in the GT remains live and kicking.
indigo coral
the Mustang GT is still 5.0
jagged coyote
oh ok
indigo coral
Afaik theres no real plans to replace it
dense shard
The V6 isn't even an option I believe.
indigo coral
nope
dense shard
It's either that 2.3 turbo or the V8.
indigo coral
only the 4cyl Ecoboost and the V8
The 4cyl Ecoboost is vastly better than the old NA V6
jagged coyote
oh yeah that was it the 4cyl
indigo coral
from the Mustang
dense shard
Chances are Ford is gonna discontinue the V8 for automotive applications sooner than later.
indigo coral
Rip
dense shard
And the Challenger is a boat.
indigo coral
Need a boating licence to drive it in some states
but yeah... the optional warranty on the taurus expires in 2023, so if the engine is gonna have a heart attack it better do it by then lmao
civic girder
If you want a dead car, look at the Chevy SS or the Lexus HS250h
indigo coral
wtf
civic girder
they lasted from 2008 to 2011
indigo coral
Oh I've seen them
I infact see them quite a bit
Usually coming front first though so I figured it was a ES or something.
civic girder
In Japan they were extremely popular
and got a second gen
but in the US, it died unbelievably fast
indigo coral
Ok nvm I've seen this thing
civic girder
My dad actually just recently bought a used one tho
the Lexus Unicorn next to my smol boi
indigo coral
yeah. I don't think its unreasonable that I just kind of figured it was some variant of ES
What's the deal with the Venza? I see LOADS of those all over the place
civic girder
idk much about the Venza
civic girder
I know the HS is basically a Lexus Corolla with a Camry i4 engine and Prius hybrid powertrain
it's basically a Lexus Prius with big boi engine
civic girder
CT200h did not exist back then, iirc
indigo coral
I've always liked the CT200h
you get the good efficiency of the prius w/o the shudders looks
of the newer ones
the mid 2000s prius wasn't too offensive but what the fuck are they thinking with the last couple generations
civic girder
the new ones look ok
fathom socket
I think they stopped making the CT200h
stoic ledge
3rd Gen was the best looking imho xD
civic girder
2nd gen is best Prius
stoic ledge
Yes
civic girder
civic girder
my 2nd gen Prius
civic girder
yea, 2nd gen ran from 2004 to 2009
indigo coral
lowkey I'd totally buy a CT200h hot hatch
stoic ledge
We also got the 3rd gen Prius as an Auris HSD xD
civic girder
there's no way they would have considered a turbo in the CT200h
stoic ledge
Which is like the normal, less premium CT200h
indigo coral
LMAO WTF
civic girder
a turbo hybrid sounds like the opposite of what they were going for
stoic ledge
OOF
fathom socket
was my first company car 🙂
stoic ledge
Oof
indigo coral
I know eastman but I can dream 😂
stoic ledge
> having company cars
fathom socket
@stoic ledge I've moved up now that i'm independant 🙂
Waiting for the delivery of my new car in February
indigo coral
would be absolutely hilarious if they shoehorned a turbo 4 w/ like 300hp and called it the CT F
but Lexus is too sensible for that
fathom socket
it's already at dealership let me look for some pics
indigo coral
course.. they make the GS F
stoic ledge
Toyota did put a 3.5 V6 in the Auris, which is basically a CT200h xD
indigo coral
Ooooh thats a pretty colour
stoic ledge
Oof nice Volvo
fathom socket
XC90 2020 T8
indigo coral
Dang, nice!
fathom socket
Bursting blue R design
22 inch wheels
but it are the incorrect wheels because they made a mistake 🙂
indigo coral
that's one heck of a car, good choice 😄
stoic ledge
Black interior 😢
indigo coral
whats wrong with black interior?
fathom socket
in the R Design you only have 2 options
fathom socket
Black and brownish
indigo coral
I wish mine had the black interior
but thats cause having 4 shades of beige gets a bit old
fathom socket
if you want the blonde interior you can't take the luxary seating pack for some reason
or at least when I was ordering
dense shard
lame
indigo coral
(is it bad that I like the white interior in the Model 3?)
dense shard
"why doesn't anyone buy this package"
"because y'all don't offer it with an option I want"
"guess we'll discontinue this package because no one wants it"
fathom socket
yes a bit like the white interior
stoic ledge
I was just about to say, I can configure a XC90 T8 R-Design with blond interior atm xD
fathom socket
@stoic ledge then they changed it
When I was ordering it was when they made the change to the 2020 model
Mine is one of the first 2020 models
indigo coral
I like the black and red interior on the Genesis G70
stoic ledge
XC90 B5 264hp: €89.305
XC90 T8 390hp: €91.995
Tough choice xD
Yeah could be, idk
Sometimes trims differ per country too
indigo coral
The white and black interior is nice too
dense shard
I'm super happy with my white/back interior in the 'rolla.
indigo coral
The G70 is a little bit "boy racer"ish though.
fathom socket
the issue with a white interior is when you have kids.... you won't keep it clean 🙂
indigo coral
Not exactly the image you want to put out rolling up to a job interview or whatever
stoic ledge
> having kids
xD
dense shard
I don't have kids.
fathom socket
I have twin girls that are 2y and 9 months atm
stoic ledge
Twin Girls in a Twin Engine Volvo 
stoic ledge
T8 is called Twin Engine, isn't it?
indigo coral
ye but it's only got one actual engine tho 😂
stoic ledge
🇳🇱 only has 390hp 
fathom socket
it got an electric motor too 🙂
dense shard
And it's 200 more than you'll ever need.
fathom socket
if you took the Polestar optimized option you would have 407 🙂
stoic ledge
Ah, nice
indigo coral
Having 400hp isn't a necessity but its fun
dense shard
More power is fun, but at this point we've entered diminishing returns.
stoic ledge
83hp is enough
indigo coral
yeah 400+ is getting a bit excessive but imo 350ish is kinda the sweet spot
dense shard
Over 200 is pushing it tbh.
fathom socket
I don't think i'll use the 400 hp more then 5 times here in belgium
dense shard
It's not like America has the legal means to go faster anyway.
stoic ledge
Belgium
fathom socket
and most of the time it will be when friends drive with me for the first time
and they'll ask
'whats the acceleration like"
indigo coral
Depends on the car though, 200hp in a big SUV isn't all that much while in a Opel Corsa it's a hecking lot
fathom socket
hang on tight here we goooooooooo
stoic ledge
Opel Corsa OPC with 207 HP is fun (:
indigo coral
plaid model S gonna have like 850hp lol
fathom socket
but the issue with a model S is that car has no soul
indigo coral
I know
dense shard
Should mark the end of the Model S.
stoic ledge
Arial hacked falcon eyes
indigo coral
I drove a model 3
fathom socket
it's to steryl
dense shard
At least if we're following conventions of the top nacho models being the last.
indigo coral
I still like the cars, its just a ton of fun to piss arial off
dense shard
I like the cars, but Elon less so.
indigo coral
he's .. unstable
stoic ledge
Everybody knows Dacia makes the best cars
indigo coral
I wonder what the external image of the GS F / Stinger / G70 are
dense shard
Still bummed the US didn't get the new Toyota Yaris.
Instead we got a fairly long in tooth now Mazda 2.
stoic ledge
I'll take a pic for you when I spot it (:
indigo coral
aside of course being that falcon is a huge fanboy about them
stoic ledge
Litteraly 8 Stingers have been registered this year
indigo coral
Lol really?
fathom socket
My wife works at Lexus / Toyota Belgium 😄
Really nice if she comes home with an LFA
stoic ledge
Toyota Belgium had the EU headquarters :Pogey-1:
fathom socket
they have that as test car
stoic ledge
I can, I'm not that far away xD
fathom socket
they also have a new prius 😉
indigo coral
I've not gotten to even see one 😢
stoic ledge
I'll be in Belgium again tomorrow (:
fathom socket
it's funny if you see what cars they have
they also have one that wasn't available in europe
due to pollution
was only buyable in Russia
was registered here as PROTO car 😄
stoic ledge
I've seen 1 LFA on a car show many years ago
indigo coral
aaaaa i want to see one xD
indigo coral
I've seen quite a few LC500s, absolutely stunning
fathom socket
most of the time she comes home in an ES F sport
stoic ledge
FWD
fathom socket
nevertheless
drives crazy good
and now with Russia fighting over land
the Kremlyn or whatever it's called
they are having a custom map for russia
where it's added to Russia
where to the rest of the world it's added to the other country
and to test that
stoic ledge
Lol xD
fathom socket
they are shipping a car over there
to actually drive around and see that it's added in the custom map for Russia
my wife tests ICE units for Lexus btw
so navigation, audio, head units,...
the 4G project that they are rolling out
stoic ledge
Well they work ok, still not great
fathom socket
a 3th party develops the software
and if it's already in production they just say 'nobody complained about that so we won't fix it'
desert glen
Would it be unpopular to say that people who drive a Nissan Altima, generally can't drive?
fathom socket
==> software and UX gets worse over time 🙂
indigo coral
no mk
stoic ledge
That's not how software development works xD
indigo coral
official kia images
fathom socket
@desert glen everyone that drives a car that costs less then 20K you should be aware of 🙂
desert glen
My car was less than 20k
stoic ledge
hides in Corsa
desert glen
But its a manual
stoic ledge
> implying people in expensive cars do drive good
desert glen
I just get scared anytime I get around any nissan, like, they either can't drive, or drive like assholes
fathom socket
and go hide behind a tree
stoic ledge
^ I've got that mostly with Audi and Merc drivers in Belgium
indigo coral
Lool
stoic ledge
Audi's are worst, 100%
fathom socket
I think i'm the only one that actually is using his indicators for what they are meant
yeah here in belgium when I drive like 130 - 140
desert glen
I wonder how much it'd cost me to put a motor and tranny from a Focus ST into my Focus SE
indigo coral
around here its bmws are the worst
most audi drivers are normal
bmws and old shitty cars
desert glen
I'm alriight if they use their turn signal
stoic ledge
Audi drivers think they are special for driving overpriced FWD understeering VWs xD
desert glen
My focus SE identifies as a focus RS
fathom socket
well when I was shopping for my new car
no joke
I went to the audi dealership
and asked price for the Q7
response of the salesman: "you can't afford a Q7 why don't you look at an A4"
stoic ledge
Reeeeeeeeeeeeee
desert glen
oof
fathom socket
went over to volvo... bought the XC90 full option