math-and-meta

[shy mason]

would use T3 belts out of those coal miner nodes straight to a splitter for t2 to carry load from there, that's your main limiting factor atm with energy shards given to those miners on the nodes.

but with that you would have 300 / 270 coal per minute per mk 1 miners that should give you 540 coal per minute that'll power 36 coal generators for you, you'll need 240 coal for your original 16, what you'll get with no energy shards and Mk2 belts

[daring sonnet]

I just now unlocked basically everything, except for every alternate, but soon, so I was wondering if I should begin building final production lines, or if I should wait for changes still in U4?

I mean, are breaking changes still likely to happen from your experience with past updates?

[vast jungle]

what did the UI of the coal powerplant tell you? There should be two numbers with "X per minute"... one for coal, one for water.

[frosty owl]

I missed this mention, but think a clarification is due, even if late: I was being sarcastic.
Love your tool and much appreciate the work you put in it <3

[noble timber]

My first oil set up was just over 1000 mega watts 😂

[signal nimbus]

Two pure coal nodes can make a 16-generator plant for 1200. That's... a decent setup for Tier 4 or so, not even getting into Tier 5/6.

[topaz hedge]

I'm gonna have nuclear power real soon, or a nuclear disaster, I'm so excited.

[noble timber]

Oh no

My current power grid consists of 36 coal generators running off of two over clocked coal nodes to max out two mark 3 belts. I also have two mini setups of 8 generators on the beach

I am using the heavy residue from my oil set up to make fuel so I should hopefully be getting about 2 ish GW from that once I have oil generators

[honest lotus]

stop making me want to expand my coal generators to 36

[inland geyser]

Its all detailed here: https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Coal_Generator

[inland geyser]

I am running my entire factory (10 of each product up until heavy frames) on ONE pure coal node plus plastic waste products.

It works pretty well - needs a few accumulators though for when a plastic/rubber cycle starts

So I have 2.4GW in general plus up to ~6GW from waste products when everything is running...

only works well on experimental though, since the power generation uses resources no matter what the actual draw is there

[noble timber]

That’s insane

I haven’t even got all tier 5 and 6 done and my max power draw is about 4.5 GW

[topaz hedge]

70 >.>

[oblique hollow]

.... mine is around 3 GW.... im at tier 8 xd

[vast jungle]

mine is more than 16.5 GW... thats all I know at the moment

[oblique hollow]

My secret: Ive been running and fixing the same save i had since update 3 (U2, actually)

I also build very minimalistically.....

Bare neccessities of every tier

[warm lagoon]

I did all my math right

i think
and yet im getitng a backlog?

im making exactly as much as im consuming

nevermind im not burning fuel to the capacity that i use

and designs for that only split of when theres an excess?

[proven valve]

Hi everyone

I have a question regarding liquid bio fuel. Is it worth it to use the liquid version in the biomass burners?
I ask this because despite having more energy/unit it takes water and an empty canister that you have to produce. Is the energy wasted in extracting the water and producing the canister (and the plastic) enough to make the burning of liquid fuel less efficient than the solid version?

Thanks in advance

[proven valve]

Answering my own question: Burning liquid bio fuel in the fuel burner is more efficient than burning it as solid in the biomass burner but indeed placing it in canisters makes it less efficient than the solid version just because the production costs (in energy) of plastic are considerable compared with the gain you have from the better efficiency

[magic shadow]

👍

[noble timber]

@proven valve From my experience I just keep the solid biomass. And I don't use it on a large scale... Maybe a 200MW back up at most

As by the time you get the canned biofuel you have other energy methods like coal and fuel

[fierce ruin]

But chainsaws only use solid bio fuel and they're pretty useful. But yeah, you don't need much. (Once you stop using bio fuel for power.)

[bleak coral]

Also the main use of biomass burners by the time you can use liquid biofuel is portable power. Even not considering the energy efficiency of making packaged liquid biofuel, it's worse for that because it can't stack to 200 so you can carry more energy in the same space with solid.

[fierce ruin]

Also, a biomass burner connected to nothing other than a power pole supposedly counts as a powered building for the purpose of deterring spawns and never runs out of fuel.

[bleak coral]

You can just pick up some leaves for that though lol, or kill a thing

[fierce ruin]

Yes, but if it's connected to a power user it will eventually run out and that Elite Stinger you spent so much effort killing can return.

(Obviously it needs fuel to be powered but a leaf will last forever if nothing is using any power.)

[frosty owl]

With the zipline I think one is better off just placing down machines and connecting them to the main grid, tbh

Not much use in having isolated power grids

[fierce ruin]

Yeah, but if exploring with the Explorer you don't always want to stop every 50 meters to place cables.

[bleak coral]

Main thing I was thinking of with portable power was hard drive hunting, like if you forgot a material and automate something real quick if it's easy or to open pods

[fierce ruin]

So, does anybody know, if you have a power cut then mobs can respawn, is that only close to the player or will there be respawns all over the map? (when the player gets there.)

[frosty owl]

You'll probably regret not having placed down the power lines later on anyway :P

[fierce ruin]

Yeah, unless a pod needs LOTS of power I'll generally use bio fuel gens.

[bleak coral]

Everywhere, actually there's another check for respawns that prevents them from happening near a player

Am I the only one who thinks dragging a cable line out to bum fuck nowhere is more work than stringing up 20 biomass burners for a couple seconds of power

[fierce ruin]

Well, yeah respawns won't happen right next to the player but will they happen way across the map if you fix the power before you get to the general area?

[frosty owl]

I think the spawn is calculated when you get close 🤔
I remember going in an area, finding mobs, going a few hundred meters back to restart the power and getting no mobs when going back
Might have been a long time ago, though...

[bleak coral]

I mean mobs won't disappear with power, so that's weird

It just prevents them coming back once they're dead

[fierce ruin]

@bleak coral Yeah, it's a lot of work.
I mainly dragged cables everywhere to power spawn deterents before I found out you could let the biofuel gen run for ever.

But I also like to build coal generators i Bumfuck if there are a few nodes there and connect them to my grid.

I guess my idea of spawns comes from Minecraft where parts of the world far from the player aren't even loaded.
But that can't be how it works here since distant factories continue to produce items.

[topaz hedge]

@bleak coral hey.. how do we deal with recycling water again? do we put a valve on the feed side from the water extractors or a valve on the recycled side.. I've been having issues xD I think that was it.. it been awhile.

[bleak coral]

well personally the one recycle loop I've done I underfeed a tiny tiny bit by underclocking the water extractors some and it avoids problems, but when I do it again I'm gonna just isolate the waste water facilities and not do a loop back

using this as an example: https://u4.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=ljUdsRUVv58ZdPJi6KjU

This needs a total of 1000 water. 333.3333 of which comes from waste and 666.6667 of which is fresh. This means 1/3 of the water is waste and 2/3 is fresh.
So, the machines need to be split in the same ratio as the water. So 1/3 of the 5.55556 machines need to be taking waste water and 2/3 need to be taking fresh water. So you create one set with (1/3) * 5.55556 machines and one with (2/3) * 5.55556 machines. Or one set of 1.85185 machines and one set of 3.7037 machines. Each of those sets exclusively takes waste or fresh water respectively. They share the bauxite line though if throughput allows because there's no penalty for that backing up.

[topaz hedge]

yeah, the underclocking works somewhat, I'm having a bit of an issue with it. it seems like if for whatever reason those machines stop, the extractors will fill the system and it won't restart

[bleak coral]

oh yeah my machines don't stop

all my lines end in overflows to sinks

I think isolating the fresh/waste machines is the only way to avoid that. Cause then it doesn't matter if the fresh water fills up, it won't block the waste water from being used

[oblique hollow]

i solved my recycling pretty well: just feed it back in

actually: if anyone has a refinery setup with feedback water that keeps backing up, i would really like to take a look at that

[manic oak]

I just took my waste water and sent it to my copper ingot facility. Just need to make sure I'm sinking items that use copper ingots so the water doesn't back up (though some of that water makes the copper ingots that are used for making aluminum products anyways)

[topaz hedge]

before the fluid update I never had these issues xD

[bleak coral]

I assume most of the problems arise in inaccuracy of the clockspeeds and backed up water in the extractors taking a while to get used up or never getting used up

that's why I'll just isolate in the future, it's more robust

[oblique hollow]

i just used valves

[topaz hedge]

anywho, I left my game running and when i came back to it my waste recycler had stopped because the aluminum setup stopped. eventhough it was setup so the math was correct for alumia solution and bauxite refinement. I put a valve between the two sections and hopefully that'll fix it

[manic oak]

Valves are a way of life. So easy to guarantee the exact amount of fluid goes to a refinery/blender

[oblique hollow]

ill gladly check that out, i dont have quite large setups so i cant really say how bad recycling is in large setups

[pseudo tangle]

valves help to balance this out. because that goes a little bit out of control

[unkempt acorn]

22 line and 6 rows 4 high = 528 storages
this should last me 528 hours in game for nuclear waste

[versed violet]

did you remember to add easily accessible output?

[unkempt acorn]

how do you mean?

[mossy needle]

lol, a way to get your waste out for reprocessing in U4?

[unkempt acorn]

ohhhhh. yeah... kinda

but tbh that silo will last me 528 hours... my current save is only 120 hours ish... so it might last me all the way upto update 5 hahaha

[mossy needle]

lol, U4 changes how much waste is made per min 😉

[bleak coral]

I mean do you need to? It's not like it'll burn through the storage since it'll fill it as fast as it pulls out

[mossy needle]

best check your math on that

[unkempt acorn]

i know 😉

[bleak coral]

personally I'd just add a smart splitter before the train and have it go to plutonium processing by default once you set it up and leave the storage as a safety overflow, and direct plutonium waste there too

[unkempt acorn]

i did...
20 reactors producing 400 Waste PM
528 industrial storages, which in total have 25344 storage slots.
times that by 500 (max stack size) = 12672000 (max waste it can hold)
12672000 / 400 = 31680 (minutes to fill silo)
31680 / 60 = 528 hours

[bleak coral]

how dare you accuse me of accusing you of not doing the math 😉 (that's some soap opera level drama starting)

[mossy needle]

ok, but in U4, they make 100 waste per min each, not 20....

So 20 reactors times 100 is, how much waster per min?

[bleak coral]

it's 100 waste per 1 rod per minute

[mossy needle]

yupp

[bleak coral]

20 waste per minute per reactor

[mossy needle]

wait, huh?

[bleak coral]

reactors use 0.2 rods per minute

[unkempt acorn]

20 waste per minute per reactor

so 20 reactors x 20 waste = 400 waste pm

[mossy needle]

oops, yea was forgetting about the 0.2 per-min usage, sorry my bad

[bleak coral]

oh man nuclear would suck if they used 1 rod per reactor lol

well maybe not suck, but be significantly less appealing

[unkempt acorn]

i was considering ditching nuclear... and replacing it with coal generators... but to get 50000 Mwh, id need like 666 coal plants

[mossy needle]

im using/building turbo fuel, much more efficient than coal in my opinion

[bleak coral]

why go all the way back to coal if you ditch nuclear? what have fuel generators done to you? lol

[unkempt acorn]

shudders

I dont want to talk about it...

they did horrible... terrible things to em

[slow bronze]

It's all fun and games until the fuel production seizes up and all the fuel generators run out of fuel...

[keen hemlock]

Gotta bootstrap the refineries with biomass burners ez

[versed violet]

id need like 666 coal plants
You absolutely have to build it, and name it 'BEAST'

[slow bronze]

I've started incorporating a buffer of fuel behind a valve to provide fuel if the production gets pooched. Had one incident and not letting it happen again where I can't have more fuel in.

[versed violet]

I have finally finished my awesome Iron factory.
2 and half pure iron nodes (1950 ore) turned into following:
120 Iron Plate
75 Iron Rod
52 Reinf plate
40 modular fr
44.8 Rotor
15 beacon.

Does this look like a good split?
[Hoping this will cover my iron based item needs for long time.]

[signal nimbus]

Only if you're going to use 120 plates every minute for building. Could probably make due with larger storage and a smart splitter pulling a couple away from one of the other production lines.

[versed violet]

Spoiler: this will be the only iron plate production line, once I demolish 1st floor of my main base
And 120/min because I oten ran short + it made a nice ratio

[manic oak]

What tier are you in?

[versed violet]

Se7en

[unkempt acorn]

id need 9990 total coal input... i dont think theres enough coal on the map for that?

[versed violet]

Nah, plenty left over for steel

[river night]

with OCed mk3 miners on all nodes, there is plenty

[versed violet]

Even non-oc mk3 miners on all nodes provide 150% of that need

And, you are going to mix it with sulfur for compacted coal, so final need will be lower

[unkempt acorn]

ahhhh, i cba to do the math on that so i just eye balled it hahaha

[versed violet]

And, if you change your mind later, you will have plenty of coal for turbfuel

[keen hemlock]

The real pain with 666 coal plants is the water extractors

[versed violet]

"Water is unlimited!"

[keen hemlock]

Yeah but 250 extractors. Plus the pipework. Hard no from me, dawg

[versed violet]

That works to nice even 50 pipes

[keen hemlock]

I guess if its late game enough, mk5 belts and mk2 pipes would make life a fair bit easier

[stable dock]

What is better? Encased Industrial Beam (normal recipe) or Encased Industrial Pipe (recipe with pipes)?

[magic shadow]

pipe uses less steel overall

[glacial tinsel]

what is the consensus on the fertile uranium alt recipe? you get a whole lot more plutonium, but it seems really expensive.

[bleak coral]

the impression I've gotten is it's a better use of uranium if you're trying to maximize power rather than minimize waste, but it's really nitrogen expensive

[deep root]

Sloppy Alumina and pure ingots, or sloppy and regular recipe?

I can't decide which alt aluminum recipes are best 🙂

[stable quest]

how many renforced plates do u need for space ele T1

[static rock]

Space Elevator doesnt take RePlates
It takes

250 plates
500 concrete
400 rods
1500 wire
to build, and that doesnt change by teir

Then the only intake after that is dedicated Project Phase parts, only constructable in machines (no manual creation)

Phase 1: 50 Smart Plates

1 SmartPlate needs 1 RePlates + 1 Rotors
So i guess i could answer your question as

Phase 1: 50 RePlates + 50 Rotor => 50 Smart Plates

[topaz hedge]

but I want to see the beast! come on xD

[static rock]

hey guys, i was wondering if someone could help me come up with a vertical assembler tower blueprint.
I made one for Constructors i really like, but trying to do the same for 2 inputs hurts my head as the vertical converyors get in the way

[deep root]

Feeding the lifts to each floor on opposite sides?

[static rock]

So this is the blueprint at the moment.
The problem i have with feeding in 2 inputs is that the SS -> Spliter lines get in the way of the vertical lines

im trying to see if there is a neat way i can keep it compact.
If there doesnt seem to be anything thats fine, i can make it clunky 😛
Just thought id ask

This is the best ive come up with so far
Having the input lies to the side into a splitter at the center 2 layers high

[vast jungle]

I have done something similar for my "Electronics" factory... in my case it was for 2 and for 3 inputs...

this is the setup for my assemblers (each with two Constructors for producing quickwire locally):
https://photos.app.goo.gl/SqAAHkTijz5ihx4G9

and this is the same for a 3-input Manufacturer (again with Constructors for Quickwire):
https://photos.app.goo.gl/1cxWvyFm3rpd3xY56

[static rock]

the assembler one i get, and that looks like something i might be able to utilise

But the manufactureer one im not so sure about

where does the overflow for this one go?

[vast jungle]

so overflow at all, just standard splitters... the secret is that I use one space in front of the Manufacturer without connecting it for the input... just for getting space for another splitter

[static rock]

OOOOOHHH
this is a 3input

Sorry looking at it i instinctually thought it was a 4input

Thats... Thats nifty actually

[vast jungle]

you see the picture with the two belt lifts sticking up in the air? They are attached to four splitters... but the one LEFT of the belt lift up (connected to a belt lift down) is NOT connected to the Manufacturer

this blocks one Manufacturer input, but allows for a quite nice and symmetric attachment of two of the inputs... and leave one input free

(which is dealt with from the other side)

I produce Caterium Computers in this manufacturer I think

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Computer#Crafting

[static rock]

i like that, nice design mate!

[vast jungle]

thank you

took a while to get it sorted out... I am still unsure how I would do a 4-input design, but it wasn't necessary for this factory...

and don't forget the options you get with the "crawling floor" below the Assembler/Manufacturer... always good to have this option

[static rock]

"crawling floor"?

[vast jungle]

a "1 wall segment" high factory floor (in fact, its 3m high plus 1m foundation for floor) for sorting out some of the belts

[static rock]

Oh that kind of crawling

[vast jungle]

just high enough to get two belts over each other with some tricks... and also high enough for a splitter/merger

I put these below ALL of my factory floors... very good when you connect the last belt of your factory 😉

[static rock]

Yeah, i do that for my external inputs
But atm im having fun trying to see if i can build constructor/assembler/manufacturer towers like the one above just for some interesting design fun 😛

[vast jungle]

same though with my electronics factory... I make (Silicon) Circuit boards on the base floor... and then I have three towers with 4 machines each for Computers, AI-Limiters and Highspeed-Connectors

[static rock]

Dude, that must be wild to setup

The finikeyness of all those belts / verticals

This is my module atm, IW 9 floors high and SP 3 floors
Ive never tried to condense mass-produced items vertically before so its weird how it condenses it haha

[vast jungle]

both Highspeed-Connectors and (Caterium) Computers use a 3-input manufacturer tower with one input is Quickwire... so they have exactly the same design...

the AI-Limiter only has 2 inputs (with one being Quickwire), so thats the Assembler Tower above

most of my factories make 3-4 products thats somehow related... e.g. Stator, Rotor and Motors...

[shrewd yacht]

can we get the calculator back please @wind spade ? 😛

[wind spade]

try looking at the top navigation bar

[shrewd yacht]

LOL

bastard! 😛

[wind spade]

(or you can also change your system's date, but I guess that's a bit harder)

[mossy needle]

ok, it was funny for a few seconds, then got annoying real quick

[wind spade]

well you can disable it as I said 🤷‍♂️

[mossy needle]

missed that, but found the button

thanks!

[fierce ruin]

why disable this beauty?

[vast jungle]

it feels like watching an episode of "Smurfs"... every important word replaced by the same phrase 😉

[mossy needle]

lol, i was trying to change somthing before bed, and lost my mind for a hot second, lol... and now my internet is crapping out, discord is being stupid, and im just giving up with life and going to sleep, haha

[ornate shoal]

am i correct in that 3 big fluid buffers of turbofuel = 40 power storage units in energy?

[vast jungle]

4 x 2400 = 9600 m^3

4.5 m^3 = 150 MWm (150 MegaWatt for 1 minute)

[fierce ruin]

150mw/13.3333s per m^3

[vast jungle]

100 MWh (megawatt hours) = 6000 MWm...

[wind spade]

why not use MJ instead of weird MWm? 😄

[vast jungle]

because its easier to see where the conversion factors coming from 😉

[fierce ruin]

because we're scrubs

[vast jungle]

but we could do it the other way around...

turbofuel: 2,000 MJ/m3

[wind spade]

but power storages already have MJ values and turbofuel does as well

so there's no conversion needed

[vast jungle]

power storage: 360 GJ (100 MW for one hour)

so power storage should be 360/2=180 m^3 worth of turbo fuel... (somewhere I dropped something, I am sure)

[wind spade]

looks good to me

[vast jungle]

so an industrial fluid buffer (2400 m^3) of turbofuel is worth 2400/180 = 13 1/3 power storages?

[fierce ruin]

stonks

[ornate shoal]

it seems to be better to store turbofuel then

[wind spade]

well yes and no

[vast jungle]

you can build ~4 power storage buffers in the same volume you build one IFB... so I would guess storing turbofuel is more energy efficient... as long as you have the generators anyways

[wind spade]

the point is that power storages allow you to store excess power produced, while storing turbofuel doesn't help much, as you have no way of controlling inflow of turbofuel to generators to produce less/more power

[vast jungle]

together with the generators the power storage wins easily in energy density... unless you want the power lasting a LONG time (then you need mostly fluid buffers and only a few generators)

power storage is definitely much more flexible and easy to handle...

but IFBs are a nice extension to an existing turbofuel powerplant (for restarting if something went wrong)

[ornate shoal]

i want to have 40000 MW for 1 hour, this means either 400 power storage units or 15 fluid buffers

[vast jungle]

plus 266 Fuel Generators 😉

[ornate shoal]

these i need regardless

actually i need 30 fluid buffers then

[wind spade]

fluid buffers can store you power, but power storages allow you to produce more power than what your gens can do 🤷‍♂️ it's not a fair comparison in any way

[vast jungle]

main issue since U4 is that turbofuel powerplants don't automatic produce "leftover"

[ornate shoal]

i understand that, but my goal is to have a backup energy supply for the factory if something should go wrong, so having burst energy is not required

[wind spade]

I see. then I guess just storing some turbofuel high in the air (so that you don't need pumps to get it to gens) is pretty good way to handle that

[vast jungle]

I am doing the same... build 1-2 fuel generators less than I could and use it to fill up a fuel reserve for emergency restarts

[wind spade]

you need to produce slightly more turbofuel than your consumption tho, so that the buffer can be filled

[vast jungle]

because I don't want this reserve to be instantly activating... I have to push a valve by hand

[ornate shoal]

i think i just make some valve system

[vast jungle]

U4 = always 100% consumtion of fuel generators
so you need overhead production for the buffers

[ornate shoal]

i can just split the pipe to storage before it reaches generatot line, that should only starve some generators until buffer is full

it's possible that the buffer never gets full with this method

[fierce ruin]

Is it possible to evenly distribute 5 outputs? Do I just resort to overflow method and let the machines balance themselves over time?

You could have a merger followed by a splitter with 2 outputs each going to a splitter and have one of those 6 outputs looped back to the merger. If the belt between the merger and the first splitter is maxed out consider starting with a 2 way split and duplicate the rest of the setup.

[wind spade]

Well overflow does distribute to 5 inputs evenly... eventually xD

[fierce ruin]

Or just do a manifold.

Thanks for the feedback, I never thought of the possibility to loop it back

I can not adapt that method for the compact build I have right now, at least I don't see a good way to route it without clipping

You can clip belts with no problems, except esthetics.

I could stuff everything in a hidden chamber or a sandwich layer

You could use a manifold and preload the machines with a stack of materials. So you didn't have to wait for them to fill up to balance.

[river night]

I just got used to building my factories in logical order and immediately turning them on, so while i build the next production step, the previous one can already fill up its manifold

[loud acorn]

I have 4 120 lines of iron ingots, what’s the best way to make good amounts of each basic iron part (rods, plates, screws, reinforced plates, rotors and mod frames) I have the cast iron screws recipe so no need to turn rods into screws

[swift robin]

you have have one constructor/assembler for each making parts and put the ingots supplying them on a smart splitter that will prioritize sending ingots to u basicr parts production but otherwise will send the ingots for other production

that way ur basic parts only eat into ur other production when necessary

rotors and frames are kinda slow to make though so 2 assemblers each is reasonable there

[calm flax]

@loud acorn Plates and rods are well you don't need rods that much with certain atl's. If you use bolted frame / bolted plate. You can end up with perfect solutions that can take all plates (at max belt speed) (270 mk3 is required for these) and end up with basically just enough iron ingots and plates left over for building supplies

[loud acorn]

Interesting, I don’t have those recipes so I might need to go drop hunting

[frosty owl]

When you're trying to make a QA post about a recipe and find one more reason to appreciate @wind spade
Happy 1st of April <3

[wind spade]

🙂

[frosty owl]

Btw, "Turbomotor worth less coupons than ingredients" issue is open on the QA, if you wanna upvote:
https://questions.satisfactorygame.com/post/6065c167aa0ba107e3255f09

[calm flax]

But turbo motors mean you can also get more ingredients 😛

[frosty owl]

... What? O.o

[fast urchin]

MK3 miner I guess

[glacial tinsel]

I was looking at max SINK and with the nerfed turbo motor, it seems like the assembly director system now has the greatest awesome points/min

[mystic moon]

That or thermal propulsion rockets.

[night jay]

Thermal Propulsion Rockets give the most sink points now.

637 514 points

Assembly Director System only gives 543 632 points

[glacial tinsel]

But you can only get up to ~200 thermal rockets/minute, whereas you can get over 300 assembly directors/min

[night jay]

Hmm, true. I was looking at direct points for one part, not by the minute.

[glacial tinsel]

Thermal rockets are limited massivly by nitrogen gas

Since it uses both fused frames and cooling systems

[amber basin]

hey guys, I and brother are playing satisfactory since long time and we are confused with productions.. lets say that iron ore place with MK1 has 120,0 a minute, and here is my question, how many smelters can i use to change to iron ingot? about 2 or 4 smelters? (sorry for bad english)
if it says that 120,0 then every smelter for iron ingot is 30 then 120/30 = 4 smelters or am i wrong?

[deep root]

Your math is correct. Make sure you look at the per minute rate and NOT the cost to produce an item

[amber basin]

Do you mean "Target production rate" right?

[amber basin]

Alright, it seems I was wrong with belts, because my miner mk1 with iron ore had 120 but my belts were tier 1 (60) instead of (120 of tier 2). Thanks a lot 😄

[deep root]

Oh yeah thats my fault for not thinking about belt limit

[past prairie]

does anyone here have an optimized bauxite factory schematics? for 1 pure bauxite resource node

aaand utilizing miner mk.2

[glacial tinsel]

Optimized for what?

[past prairie]

i mean, without having any overflow of resources (nor underflow)
I'm trying to make an aluminum ingot factory but my math seems... off

[bleak coral]

you can use the calculators in the pins, in particular https://www.satisfactorytools.com/ lets you set input limits and use a maximize function

[past prairie]

gotcha

thanks

[glacial tinsel]

Make sure to use the correct version for u3 or u4

[severe flax]

is there a reason to keep old coal plants around after you get nuclear? The more I think about it the more I think destroying and replacing them seems like a good idea. The water the coal plants ar we using up would be better used for nuclear and nuclear plants probably lag your game less too.

[bleak coral]

meh, doesn't matter much either way
biggest thing would to be free up some coal for steel

water is basically infinite throughput

cause you can put just an ungodly amount of extractors on the oceans, more than you could ever need

[topaz hedge]

welp, looks like my nuclear setup got axed.

[fierce ruin]

*nuked

[frosty owl]

Lucky me, I only wasted 6h making one without bothering to turn it on :P

[magic shadow]

lucky me, i play update three

i dont have to put up with all of today's shenenigans

[gray kayak]

101 by 101 base gud?

[fierce ruin]

sounds laggy

[gray kayak]

Might be but i have a gud amount of RAM to deal with such

[fierce ruin]

that's cpu power

[gray kayak]

Ye same thing

Memory and such

[topaz hedge]

Hiya @frosty owl besides the bug I had and i posted screenshots in satis-exp it looks like overall it's okay, I'm in the process of emptying all the waste out of it so I can take a good look at nitric acid and heatsinks

none of the ratios changes, ish. 900 waste makes 4.5 plutonium rods instead of 9 and it still works off 135 pellet/encased cells

but, with the increased cost to make heatsinks.. it might be down for awhile D:

[frosty owl]

Ahhhh, I don't hear anything
I wanna see for myself, no spoily! >.<
(Waiting for greeny to update the site since I can't check out the game)

TLDR: I'll come back to this message as soon as I've ran my simulations xD

[topaz hedge]

lol

[frosty owl]

Greeny's codex still not updated
Starting to wonder if the real April's fool was that you have to browse the codex with "April's fool mode" active to be able to get the new recipes

[topaz hedge]

okay so TLDR; my setup is saveable with 1~3 hours of playtime

xD

[frosty owl]

Eh, not too bad
What's the biggest deal, need to change the number of machines or connections?

[topaz hedge]

aluminum changes hurts the most. the recipe change to none-fissile is a trainride and a 5 minute fix.

[magic shadow]

#satisfactory message

@frosty owl go see lol he did update it

[frosty owl]

Checked 2 minutes ago, recipes are the same

[magic shadow]

that specific link tho

[frosty owl]

What about it?

[magic shadow]

greeny is typing

[wind spade]

[magic shadow]

click it

[wind spade]

yeah I haven't updated yet, I'm, working on it now tho

[frosty owl]

Bruh, if you're referring to April's fool mode... That's literally what I was joking about earlier

[frosty owl]

👆 @magic shadow

[topaz hedge]

oof

[magic shadow]

oh ok sorry
i was trying to spread the funni

[frosty owl]

I was too, but than I had to explain my funny

[lavish river]

the rebalance of alclad casing is pretty bad for me, i was using it to produce my batteries because it was very convenient : the recipe before today update avoid the need of quartz because the byproduct of silica from alumina solution was enough in this system. I actually have to deal with extra alumina solution or bring some silica to complete. I thought devs said just minor changes. I dont want to use pure aluminium ingots because it will significantly reduce the efficiency and i do not have any more space in this factory. shall we ask for a rebalance of battery production line ?

[frosty owl]

Bruh, I'm checking out greeny's tool as frequently as I checked out the "announcement" channel when waiting for U4

[lavish river]

a picture of my previous battery setup to explain

[fierce ruin]

U4 at 5pm GMT

[unkempt acorn]

yay. great. so now basically all my hard work has gone down the drain now that practically every new reciepe has been changed 🙃

[fierce ruin]

Proceeds to turbo fuel

[ripe dawn]

has anyone written up a meta guide for how to get to do the 4th space elevator order using alternate recipes (experimental branch)?

My current plan:

as flow'd from satisfactory tools:

make the components in these ratios; which will complete the order in only 1000 minutes! (16 hours!),

I plan to use alternate recipes that:

eliminate plastic
consolidate alternates around "rubber"
eliminate screws
eliminate high speed connector components
consolidate all iron production based on steel alternates (esp pipes)
eliminate the need for steal beams (can't be done entirely, versatile frames have beams as a necessary thing).

Is this a good plan or are there any other good tips in the alternate recipes I should watch out for?

Haven't fully unlocked the tier 8 tech so interested in any favourite recipes the wise ones of the forum know at this level.

[unkempt acorn]

or you could just hand make them?

[frosty owl]

If you use steel instead of iron you're gonna need a lot of coal, but if it fits with your numbers yours is a plan that balances between efficiency and speed, leaning more on speed (as in more parts/min from less machines)

Btw, some recipes got balanced today, so you'll have to remake that graph, @ripe dawn ~

[ripe dawn]

oh god

[frosty owl]

In a few hours or however long it takes greeny to update them

[ripe dawn]

what a guy! (/gal)

[frosty owl]

Yeah, a real hard worker 💪

#Praise-greeny

[frosty owl]

No big changes, moslty just numbers (not item used). Check out #patch-notes

[ripe dawn]

thanks for the comments on the plan, I guess I won't be able to max the map but my goal is that mug

[frosty owl]

Maxing the map?
With less then 10 space elevator parts/min each?
Heh, funny man :hehe:

[ripe dawn]

xD

[frosty owl]

For reference, you can go over 60/min and 120/min (for the ones you need a bigger number of)

[ripe dawn]

jeez!, somewhere over my world there's a ficsit overlord tapping his foot and looking at their wristwatch thinking "wtf is that guy doing?"

[frosty owl]

You go build and have fun~~ 😆

[unkempt acorn]

wow. thank god. so it looks like the only thing that the rebalancing has affect in my world is pure aluminum ingots needing more scrap, which can be fixed by removing some existing smelters and heat sinks increasing a bit in size.

[topaz hedge]

Alright, once greenie gets the calculator updated. I'll be able to double check my math with his

but as far as I know, I'm ready to restart my nuke plant. 😄

[frosty owl]

It's still not updated
REEEEEEEEEEEE :evildoggo:

[topaz hedge]

ree.

[fierce ruin]

r

[topaz hedge]

I haven't even checked it yet lol

[twin peak]

Crystal oscillator computer is the best recipe if im making 84 oscilators per min right? It saves hella circuit boards and using assemblers

[topaz hedge]

if you want to make computers without oil, yes it's nice

but for lategame.. you'll need those oscilators for nuclear if you choose. or radio control units

[twin peak]

84 is not enough for everything?

[topaz hedge]

Radio control units eat them like candy, unless you use the alt, then they'll eat something else. but for your question, yeah you should be good, and you'll need that factory for the things I mentioned later on, so you're set

[wind spade]

I'm a bit delayed, will update in like 2 hours hopefuly

[topaz hedge]

take your time. most of the changes they made, are major, but they're somewhat small at the same time

[clear citrus]

for a fuel power factory, how much worse for getting more power is overclocking the whole thing (200%) than just overclocking the oil extractors and doubling all the machines?

[glacial tinsel]

i believe fully overclocking a power plant makes it consume and produce identically to 2 normal power plants

so if you have shards to spare, it saves space and materials

[bleak coral]

overclocking the non-fuel generator parts would you get double production would consume 50% more power compared to if you just doubled the machines though

[clear citrus]

overclocking a machine uses more power than a 2nd machine

[bleak coral]

overclocking to 200% uses ~303% power

[clear citrus]

as Lund said, i wasn't sure of the exact numbers, but point stands 200% overclock single machine is more power than a 2nd one

[topaz hedge]

it's not bad. you can split the difference and get a better gain by only overclocking part of the fuel production

[bleak coral]

formula is on here: https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Clock_speed#Clock_speed_for_production_buildings

[topaz hedge]

ex if you're using heavy oil and diluted fuel, run diluted fuel part at 100% and overclock heavy oil residue refineries to 200%

[unkempt acorn]

ah crud, have to overclock some assemblers for heat sinks and remove some smelters/constuctors for copper sheets

[clear citrus]

my main "fear" was that if I actually overclocked the whole fuel power factory, the refineries and all would actually end up taking more power than the increase gained from overclocking the generators

[bleak coral]

nah it's not that bad

[clear citrus]

but also the more general concern of an immensely smaller increase in net power gain

[bleak coral]

power net gains are good enough for anything in this game that overclocking isn't gonna do that, except maybe like liquid biofuel

[frosty owl]

No rush ahahah
Thanks for letting me know though :)

[bleak coral]

now I'm curious what has the worst net gains in power outside of liquid biofuel

gut feeling says petroleum coke with no alts after the U4 fuel buff, and for U3 it's residual fuel

[ripe dawn]

I have a splitter theory.

I think it's possible to do any pair ratio split: 45/67, 33,21 etc using only a long 3 splitter arrangement

for example, this is 11:13

[topaz hedge]

plz wait until daytime xD

[ripe dawn]

yeah, thought that 😄

[bleak coral]

That's compact, but it's still limited to combinations that can be done by dividing by 2 or 3

[ripe dawn]

ah, but then you allow loopbacks on the second level on the center isle, is the trick 😄

that way you can do any denominator x3, and then -1 and -2

I will do some testing, then probably feel like an idiot

if it's good I will post in the daytime

[bleak coral]

have you read the stuff for prime splits?

[ripe dawn]

just looked at the wiki

looks like a neat reference, cheers!

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Tutorial:Prime_splitter_arrays

[bleak coral]

there's also this here: https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Balancer#Load_balancer

which has a bottleneck-free version for the prime splitters

[frosty owl]

Or at least with your flashlight on 😆
I wouldn't mind a ping, if you come up with something

[unkempt acorn]

so.... i wanted to do a mass power storage building... i aimed for 100 storages, which meant i would of needed 500 stators... i got my math wrong and ended up making 5000 stators... enough for 1000 storages <~>

[bleak coral]

the answer is clear: make 1000 storages

your heart knew what it really wanted to do

[ripe dawn]

i've done the math for you, for power storage you need 100 wire, 10 mod frames and 5 stators each.
So for 1000 storages you should now collect 100,000 modular frames.

(shh don't tell him)

[deep root]

Are alclad casings worth the copper use?

[frosty owl]

He's kidding @unkempt acorn , that would sink your FPS

[deep root]

Would it though, if you put it inside a building and never went inside 🙂

[frosty owl]

I heard over 2/3 hundreads they start to really lag, no matter where

[oblique hollow]

If you can spare it, why not

[mossy needle]

lol, i mean, the wiki does say 25 Power Storages for every 5000MW your making

so 🤷 could need 1000 if your making alot of power

[frosty owl]

It's not like you CAN'T charge them if you go over that :P

[unkempt acorn]

i was actually considering making 1000...

[frosty owl]

Lemme know how the frame holds when you power them
CS might have optimized them since I heard what I know ^^

[unkempt acorn]

eh, what have i got to loose, ive gotten to a point in the game where i really cba to move further on?

[frosty owl]

I heard about very big stutters when looking in their direction (from anywhere) when going over the 3 hundreads or so

[topaz hedge]

we built 300 on ours, and after around 330 or so the audio engine started to lag and kept kicking clients out

[bleak coral]

just looked at the wiki on that, and that's a very conservative building plan, I'm sure you could get away with far less.

[topaz hedge]

so we removed a few and dropped it to 300 and it doesn't seem to have any kind of major performance hit

[bleak coral]

I dare say it's completely unrealistic, cause it's claiming a scenario with only geothermal generators and particle accelerators, which is nonsense

[topaz hedge]

tis was a couple of patches ago

[bleak coral]

even as a "worst case scenario"

[oblique hollow]

Fact is: if your power doesnt fluctuate a lot, or if you dont use nearly as much power as you produce, the storages in large numbers serve you no purpose

[topaz hedge]

yeah, they're kinda useless tbh.

[unkempt acorn]

i made a few in my base and the audio was deafening, luckily that got patch recently

[topaz hedge]

after I get my nuke restarted, I think I'm gonna go and delete 200 of them

[oblique hollow]

I have exaclty 13 storages, thats all i need

Its not like my entire grid will crash anytime soon

[twin peak]

If u are building a new power factory its really amazing

And if u have some failure in that new factory too

[bleak coral]

building storages based on how many particle accelerators and geothermal generators you have is probably fine, those are the things that inherently fluctuate a lot

[oblique hollow]

If you only start building a new one once you constantly run on storages, thats a bit late

[bleak coral]

of course you can build where everything fluctuates, so there's that too

[oblique hollow]

I used to be on the very border of my production, and i also ran geothermal, so 13 were able to keep me afloat for a few seconds there

But it was mostly below my limit

[twin peak]

I was running on 4000/4000 exactly and i had 80 pre made batteries so i had no problem hooking up a fuel generator factory with 2000 mw usage

[oblique hollow]

The best use for the storages i can see: Particle Accelerator, Geothermal, many Trains, temporary spike dampening

[bleak coral]

I don't think using them to start a new power plant is a bad use either, lets you cut it closer than what we used to do

[oblique hollow]

It definitely gives more leeway

If you build enough Storages they crash your game before your grid crashes so thats an upside LMAO

[bleak coral]

oh not sure if you'll care but I fixed my full 600 turbofuel pipe so it shouldn't run into problems when I update to U4 and it runs at 100%

found a way to feed it from both ends

[oblique hollow]

Nice.

So, in general, until the manifold issue is addressed, we should tell people to "feed your manifolds from both ends / multiple spots"

[unkempt acorn]

whats wrong with manifolds?

[bleak coral]

fluid manifolds, there's some error with using lots of junctions (like from a long manifold) while using a very full pipe that leads to fluid loss

[unkempt acorn]

ahhhh, yeah. i kinda ran into a similar issue with my aluminum production

[twin peak]

Did this bug came with u4?

Because my head is exploding from my not working fuel generator factory

[bleak coral]

no, it's been around a while

and you have like thousands of junctions, so.....

[twin peak]

Not thousands

And i changed it to kinda overflow

And no pipes are full so i have no idea why im still losing liquid

[bleak coral]

it's still happening?

[twin peak]

Yup

I made all fuel gens full by standbying them

After a few hours capacity went down

[frosty owl]

I build 60ish or so with coal and managed to empty half before setting powering the fuel generators (had time to unlock plastic and start fuel production with ease :P)

[frosty owl]

You need to check out which generators are starving. A screenshot from SCIM of the piping can help understand (or from the game, if you can show the whole setup at once)

[oblique hollow]

Aaaaalways make the pipes feeding machines into a loop

That kinda circumvents this issue

[topaz hedge]

When I fixed your pipes and sent it back to you, did it run dry after an hour?

[twin peak]

I built it on a different save and then filled the fuel gens up and after some time the weird thing that i told u happened

[oblique hollow]

So they were full, and then not

Right?

[twin peak]

How can i do that?

[twin peak]

Yes

[oblique hollow]

Thats the Manifold Issue then

[twin peak]

But no pipes are full which is kinda weird

[oblique hollow]

Exactly! Thats the thing

[frosty owl]

Go on SCIM, load your save in, take a screenshot of the part of the map you want (you can disable the visibility of object you don't want if needed)

[oblique hollow]

It happens most often with full pipes

[twin peak]

Sure ill boot up my pc now

[frosty owl]

Well, there was an issue with a mk2 trying to feed the system that got fixed by using 3 mk1s instead AFAIK 🤔 (on that save)

[topaz hedge]

but you didn't rebuild it the exact same way I had done it.. I didn't have to touch your balancers, nore was I going to repipe 132 generators, but as far as I could tell.. it was working fine when I finished :/

I more or less did everything on there a certain way for a reason X3

[twin peak]

Maybe its the pumps you removed that are fixing the problem? Also how much time did u let it run?

[oblique hollow]

Heck, i fixed GodofHyperDeath's Fuel Blenders and then the 68 fuel gens

I found that using some valves helps too

[topaz hedge]

I only let it go for about an hour

[twin peak]

Ye for me they run smoothly for a few hours too

[topaz hedge]

hm

[twin peak]

Because they were filled

[oblique hollow]

I could take a look at it too

[frosty owl]

Weird flex, but in good context

[oblique hollow]

[twin peak]

Wow u can see how much fuel is in the machines in the map

[oblique hollow]

Picture pls!

[twin peak]

the one with the red has 2 turbo fuel in it while all others have 50. wtf?...

[glacial tinsel]

broken pipe somewhere probably

[twin peak]

nope

[frosty owl]

These are all pipes and junctions, right? No valves or anything else in between?

[twin peak]

also the third one on the same row has 44 turbo which is the only other exception

[oblique hollow]

Is this all Turbofuel?

[twin peak]

no valves.

[twin peak]

yes

[frosty owl]

Well, firstly (though might not FIX it entirely) having your pipes layed out centered between the generators would help

[oblique hollow]

Heres roughly what you need to do

[twin peak]

i kinda went with the load balancing method there as u can see

[oblique hollow]

Also yeah, one center pipe is safer

[twin peak]

all generators are SUPPOSED to get same amount

[oblique hollow]

These are pipes, they dont follow belt rules

[glacial tinsel]

fluids are wonky

[twin peak]

if its one pipe than it will be a full 600 pipe which will cause liquid to dissapear

[frosty owl]

Ei: have your pipes split in halves each time, not like they are now. If your pipe segments have different lengths you're kind of defeating the purpose of the balancing

[oblique hollow]

A "pipe balancer" and a pipe manifold are EXACTLY the same

[twin peak]

what do u mean length?

[bleak coral]

it's all one giant container the fluids fill up according to the simulation

[oblique hollow]

Which is why i made that sketch: feed from both ends

300 one side, 300 the other side, all into one central mk 2

Now that i look at your current layout...... Your Balancer uses more junctions than a manifold would.....
Thats terrible

[twin peak]

ye i already decided that since load balancing is "different" in pipes "logic" ill tear it all down, make the generators much closer to each other cuz i gotta have it perfect in some way and build a normal overflow system

[oblique hollow]

Yeah, thats save, just remember to do what i made in that sketch, thats needed

[frosty owl]

Kinda like this

See the difference?

[river night]

when you do the two-sided-manifold, should you put valves with limits on each end to make sure it does what its supposed to?

[oblique hollow]

Yeah. 50% each

Else flow fluctuates

[bleak coral]

oh you do?

I thought if you let it fill up first valves were optional

[twin peak]

I see the difference but what difference does it really do?

[frosty owl]

Even with no limits its fine. I prefer to keep it unlimited just to be sure :P

[twin peak]

Also do u have any idea why that one fuel gen starves?

[oblique hollow]

Fluctuating flow is my guess

[river night]

my one coal plant is still having very rare drop outs from lack of water, although i didnt have valves when i build it, i might try retrofitting some, or just accept the occasional drop of one plant and hurry towards fuel

[oblique hollow]

I would need to inspect that ingame myself to actually tell

[frosty owl]

If you don't, then it's not balanced anymore, as the shorter segment will take priority and fill the machine sooner, leaving the other to starve before it fills up. That happens for the split feeding that too, and so on until it affects HALF of your whole system
Mind you, what Galleon is saying is true, having more splits does make the system more prone to errors, but the fact that you have more pipes (thus more buffering) can help against that... As long as you shape your pipes correctly. A couple valves to prevent backflow on very long segments can help too (no overdoing it!)

[twin peak]

Wait that one is the furthast from the main pipe

[oblique hollow]

Really? Then its also a problem caused by the pipe design

[frosty owl]

Proves my point above I think

[twin peak]

But the main pipe connected to that segmant is not the shortest one

[frosty owl]

Btw, how much TF/min are we talking here?

[oblique hollow]

Starvation at the end of pipe manifolds, according to what ive been able to find out, is due to fluctuations in flow rate, which kiiiind of is related to viscosity

[frosty owl]

The longest pipes take the longest to feed the machines, opposite for the shorter ones

[twin peak]

Im producing 600 and there are 132 fuel gens so they all take 594

[oblique hollow]

Then it is an issue with the design

[twin peak]

Phff i wish pipes were belts

Belts are so fun to load balance

[frosty owl]

That's what I've been trying to tell the whole time, but you so eagerly jumped on the "balancer bad" wagon

[oblique hollow]

It nevertheless also is related to the "not feeding from both ends" issue

[twin peak]

Wait but still if all fuel gens are full with liquid and im producing more than they take how is it that one of them starved?

[frosty owl]

Balancing for pipes just looks good on map :P
It does allow you to have all machines start at the same time (like with belts) but since you usually work with fluids in overflow (letting pipes fill up) it's completely redundant xD

[oblique hollow]

Magic loss issue due to junctions and fluctuations and whatnot

[frosty owl]

Not really, no need to do that to fix it

[twin peak]

I have 200 hours in the game and ive never, not even once used overflow method

And thats not my first save

[oblique hollow]

I just found it to be the easies applicable fix to most systems

[frosty owl]

You said you allowed the pipes and generators fill up before starting the system. That's what I mean by "working in overflow" since you're not feeding them just with your production/min but with the max amount the pipe can provide, until the overflow ends

[oblique hollow]

You would be surprised how reliable a double-fed manifold is..... You should know! You sent me a test save!

[frosty owl]

I'm a bit confident in how you can avoid using it in other areas too though :P

(I do find it cumbersome to set up compared to 1 pipe)

[oblique hollow]

All i know is too many branches = bad, fluids dont like

And Balancers have by far the longest branches

[frosty owl]

But staying at 200 out of 300 should provide PLENTY of wiggle room, as long as there's ehough fluid to fill up all the internal storages

[frosty owl]

Remember long pipes actually help! (More buffering, smaller deltas)

[oblique hollow]

I'm honestly not too sure on most things anymore

Buffering seems to actually cause issues, in some cases

[frosty owl]

My line usually is: if you're below 80/90% maxf flow, it'll balance out. After that, consider splitting the pipe/double feed

[oblique hollow]

Long pipes = greater delay
Greater delay = greater chance for the internal pressure system to reverse and draw the fluid back out

If you want buffering, connect a buffer.

[frosty owl]

That is system dependant, but if you don't have backflow issues (which depend o design too, ofc) buffering usually helps

[twin peak]

If i overflow the fuel gens from one side only will the system still work? If i take a pipe all the way to the back it will look super messy

[oblique hollow]

Ive seen that, on the upwards feeding manifold, long pipes dont work.
By the time the fluid reached the gen, another gen starts slurping from the pipe and the pressure changes

[oblique hollow]

Thats a 50 / 50 chance.

Vencam says yes
McGalleon say "i dont really think so, but im unsure"

[twin peak]

Hmmm

[frosty owl]

I say yes if you center your junctions as I explained before.
If you don't, it should still work, but require a lot of buffering before it reaches efficiency
Note: if you do not provide enough buffered fluid, the system may reach efficiency in EXTREMELY long times

One buffer before each of the 3 lines would be fine

It's also convenient to check on how things are going, honestly

[oblique hollow]

Honestly i think adding the buffer at the end is better

[twin peak]

I guess im gonna decide that vencam's brain has a 50% larger capacity because he is in my favour

[oblique hollow]

But make sure to fill it first

Yea sure, McGalleons brain is just juice, eh?

[frosty owl]

That's a funny way to judge IQ

[frosty owl]

TURBOjuice

[twin peak]

Vencam's going plutonium lvl juicy

[oblique hollow]

I see it like this:
If it doesnt work, i get to blame Vencam and say "I told you so"

[twin peak]

The line that i will connect buffer the segmant should be mk2 right?

[frosty owl]

My brain can turn into spoiled juice overnight :P
Speaking of, bed time for me 👋

[oblique hollow]

Yeah, why not

[frosty owl]

The higher the MK the more responsive the system, but for it to work you're good as long as you stay below 80% max flow (the lower, the faster you fill stuff and so on)

[oblique hollow]

80%?
Thats only 480
550 should still work, imo

[twin peak]

Maybe ill add a valve to limit it?

[frosty owl]

Wiggle room, you know the details

No more pings pls 👋

[oblique hollow]

Valves are one-way

Ok no pings GN

[twin peak]

Gn

Wdym one way

[oblique hollow]

Valves only allow flow in one direction

[twin peak]

If i connect a pipe to a full buffer it will go max flow rate and u said i need it to go 80%-90% flow

So valve is the answer right?

[oblique hollow]

Then you need to connect it from both sides
One side to fill, the other to empty the buffer

[twin peak]

When u said buffer u meant the storage for liquids right?

I think there is a little missunderstanding

[oblique hollow]

Nono, i mean the Buffer tank, you are not mistaken
You can empty and fill a buffer through a single connection too.

Let me draw a picture

Top is what you need to build if you want to use valves.

Bottom is with no valves

Unless you dont want to refill the Buffer.....

[twin peak]

Id prefer to not use valves

[oblique hollow]

Alright. Then you just need to connect one pipe to the buffer.

First, you fill the buffer, then you connect the main pipe to the generators

[twin peak]

But u said i need to limit the flow?

[oblique hollow]

Vencam did, i think
He said 80%

[twin peak]

Ok, ty

[oblique hollow]

1. fill buffer
2. connect generators.

Thats all. If it doesnt work, ping me or Vencam.

Im off too, i need sleep :zzz:

[twin peak]

Ohh i understand.

Thanks a lot, good night

[oblique hollow]

👍

[glacial tinsel]

so ive been doing some math

and i think im pretty happy with this

[topaz hedge]

max nuclear?

[glacial tinsel]

clean nuclear + max sink

its not the absolute max, but 288 assembly directors is as high as you can go without getting super crazy with multiple recipie paths

[topaz hedge]

greenie finished updating his tools?

[glacial tinsel]

he added the april fools thing, but you can turn it off

[topaz hedge]

nope doesn't look like he finished yet

[glacial tinsel]

whats not updated?

[topaz hedge]

the tools.

I'm going off of the plutonium chain. I know for a fact now it uses more nitric acid than sulfuric acid.

[glacial tinsel]

oh, i thought the recipes we all updated

welp

guess i have more math to do

[topaz hedge]

soon he'll be done

I finished my nuclear setup

I did all the adjustment without tools, it was a werid thing. now when tools is updated I can check it. or it'll check itself if something backsup/runsout

[glacial tinsel]

im not using the fertile uranium recipie, if that matters

[topaz hedge]

it does not

so the new total for what this setup can make is 2.25 plutonium rods/min

plutonium fuel rods cost twice the encased cells, and encased cells now take twice as many pellets

as well as sulfur usage and nitric acid usage being swapped. the heatsink recipe was changed as well, but overall the setup now uses less aluminum.

[glacial tinsel]

did they remove instant plutonium cell?

[oblique hollow]

Rebalanced, supposedly

[glacial tinsel]

ok, im looking at the recipies ingame now, unless im dumb, i see pellet + encased is 200 waste to 15 cell, and instant is 225 waste to 20 cell

so instant plutonium is still better

[topaz hedge]

It says they fixed infused uranium cells too.

they didn't touch anything on the uranium side of things other than that. they were kind to those of us who started building nuclear the moment U4 dropped

[glacial tinsel]

5 to 4

vs 10 to 5

[topaz hedge]

and no blender.. damn

so does that just about double the amount of uranium rods we can make and increase the max nuclear power back to where it was? o.O

[glacial tinsel]

its a 60% increase

so 31.5 -> 50.4

not sure how far 5k waste/min will take you though

[topaz hedge]

at minimum it was 100:1 waste/rods I have no idea what it is now

[keen flame]

I just ran a bunch of numbers on uranium. Short version is: Uranium is way better now with iunfused cells being fixed - you can get a net of about 521GW from uranium, sinking the plutonium. The highest number I got was using plutonium fuel units, instant cells, and non-fissile uranium, which got us up to about 1087GW of power absolute maximum. But, it also consumes a pretty huge amount of nitrogen and other resources in the process still...

[glacial tinsel]

im thinking that assembly directors might be the best sink/min, so nitrogen is fine, its sulfur that will probably be limiting

[keen flame]

Fertile uranium is also awful now. It's objectively bad in every conceivable way. Using fertile uranium and infused uranium cells has a much lower maximum output than using non-fissile (or pellets), and consumes an even more vast amount of resources. Still clocking over 9k nitrogen and more than 50% of oil, 70% of bauxite, and 30% of sulfur, and yielding a maximum of barely 900GW

[glacial tinsel]

i wasnt even a fan of fertile before

[keen flame]

Amazingly, using fertile uranium and regular plutonium rods drops your power potential from 800-1100GW (depending on recipes) to only 679GW, at the cost of even more resources than before

It was good before aside from the nitrogen consumption, as it allowed you to maximize power output at the cost of more plutonium waste. now it's just plain bad

[glacial tinsel]

yea, it wasnt bad, but it essentially made you commit you plutonium waste instead of sink, instead of being able to choose and swap as your base grew

[keen flame]

I mean, talking to the other major poster on this, at least it's actually possible to do 100% fertile uranium now 😄

it's just horrifically impracticle and actively reduces your power potential by doing so. I guess I could run the numbers comparing against regular uranium cells instead of infused, since there might be a use case for that that I haven't seen yet, but I don't anticipate any good results

(For all my griping, I do hugely appreciate the fixes to uranium with infused cells being back - it makes a uranium/sunk plutonium setup actually feel viable again, where it didn't feel so before)

[topaz hedge]

Shh, they don't need to know that clean nuclear is what we've always wanted.

[glacial tinsel]

with the power increase to uranium, i might not even need to use the plutonium by the time im done

[topaz hedge]

I never understood the non-fissile alt, like if the yield of it was double what it is, sure it'd be worth it then. but just looking at it it feels like it's not worth it in any kind of setup/case because every way you work the numbers, you always get more power by not using it.

[keen flame]

oh, I SHOULD NOTE, FY: They said in the patch notes that instant plutonium cells now output at half the rate, when in reality it appears to have been changed from 25 > 10, so that recipe might still be bugged (iot should be 12.5 now instead of 10). That would change some of the numbers a little bit, though it would mostly increase resource costs of plutonium power even more, though give a bit more power

[keen flame]

Previously, it was worthwhile to use, you could get a huge amount of additional power oout of it if you really sert it up correctly

[topaz hedge]

you did figure your math on plutonium rods burning for 4x the amount though?

or was it twice. I don't remember lol

[glacial tinsel]

4x the power twice the cost

[topaz hedge]

okay 4x so they should burn for twice as long as uranium

[keen flame]

^ yep I double checked those numbers for the new rate

[glacial tinsel]

they did cut the waste in half also, which if it burns 4x as long, is double

[topaz hedge]

yeah so at the end of the day, mysetup before the update made 9 rods for 22.5 reactors. now it makes 2.25 rods for.... 22.5 reactors lol

[keen flame]

"produces 4x more power", and waste specifically says "1/min" now

[glacial tinsel]

so it lasts 600 seconds and produces 10 wastes

[real locust]

I was wondering if it was possible to make a 1: 7 splitter more simple than this one.
I have to separate 2 mk4 conveyors into 7 smelters (150 ores each) and I need to add 90 ores/min in the 1: 7 separator to reach 1050 ores/min

[bleak coral]

So these are 7 coke steel ingot foundries at 200% clockspeed? You know you can't transport 1050 ore/min across two mk4 belts right?

[real locust]

yes and I know. that's why I built another conveyor for the missing 90 ores/min

[bleak coral]

Also on the splitter question, no there isn't a better way; merge back is the most compact prime splitter as far as I know. The only thing you could do to make it better is move the mergers to after the first split so you have two mergers per line and then split the merge back between those. That way you won't lower the max throughput of the belt you can use. https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/File:Balancer_odd.png

[real locust]

alright! I used this image to help me but I will try to move the merger after the first splitter

[glacial tinsel]

thats the bottom picture, you need to split the loop back if you want to insert it after the first split

[frosty owl]

Welp, that's a lot of good math I won't have to do 😆
Thanks for the hard work~

I guess I'm waiting another couple of weeks to see if they rebalance stuff... 'Cause I feel they will

Still anxiously waiting for the tool to update and crunch some allu numbers

[glacial tinsel]

join the club

[real locust]

So I'm done with the iron now, have to do the same with coke 😅

[frosty owl]

I've been here since the beginning though?

[glacial tinsel]

i didnt realize there was an actual patch today because i assumed it was april fools, and i spent several hours doing math that no longer works

[frosty owl]

... Join the club

That's why I'm waiting a bit more for nuclear, I feel that'll be balanced some more after seeing the numbers Rowan gently shared

I'd like to say allu is safe but... I've yet to check those recipes out

[glacial tinsel]

i dont think they will change uranium that much now

they saw where it was at and fixed the bug how they wanted

[frosty owl]

"That much" would still mean a hundredish machine's worth though

[glacial tinsel]

after you built thousands, whats a hundred more?

[frosty owl]

Just time... The only non-endless resource of Satisfactory

[glacial tinsel]

thats a quitter attitude, just put a MK3 miner on your time node

[glacial tinsel]

Here is an interesting table

this shows the map capacity remaining for the top awesome sink items after constructing a plutonium factory

these % are changing with todays update, but probably not massively

my takeaway is that thermal rockets and turbo motors are cannibalized more by plutonium than assembly directors or pasta

[topaz hedge]

pasta needs lots of power, and copper that's about it, and 30 pressure cubes a minute is the easy part.. all that copper though

[glacial tinsel]

Yea, pasta maxes out copper way tio fast to be competitive with assembly directors

Im definitely going to have to redo some stuff once the calculator and tools get updated, but im pretty sure it goes nuclear -> clean plutonium -> assembly directors

[shrewd yacht]

did @wind spade update tools after last nights patch?

[vast jungle]

it was an unannounced patch yesterday evening... so I would not bet on it. I hope we will get an update of the tools today or tomorrow

[topaz hedge]

Not sure you should really ping the greeny, although he probably doesn't mind. I can tell you that no, he hasn't finished updating it yet. @shrewd yacht

[fierce ruin]

^

[topaz hedge]

When it is updated, if you want to check without asking, use this production plan https://u4.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=T5K7ndNSmfJWSrYU2owM when the output drops from 9 to 2.25, it is updated.

[frosty owl]

Note that pressure cubes can be used for many things: plutonium, pasta AND TMs
Not saying it's the best or most efficient way... But it sure seems damn handy ;) (kinda like using steel instead of iron, where you get a boost in speed and convenience)

[frosty owl]

Yeah, he probably got plenty enough pings yesterday due to April's fools on his tool

[frosty owl]

Worse than the wait is that he pulled a CoffeeStain on us

Who wanna be included for a "me and the boys, waiting for the tool to update" meme?

[keen flame]

I mean I just built my own calculator and pulled the data myself

don't have to wait for a tool to update if you have your own 😛

(I'll be releasing it to the public eventually - it's a spreadsheet based tool instead of flowchart based)

[frosty owl]

But the codex and the overclock settings... Mlmlml

[keen flame]

Mine is set up so that overclocking doesn't matter

[naive ginkgo]

welp i just updated my lines to the new sloppy/coke recipes... 8 less refineries, 24 less smelters and 37.5% less production

[keen flame]

and has the entire recipe database 😛

[leaden glen]

Well over/underclocking is easy, since you just do [needed machines]/[actual machines] and you have the percent

Let's say you needed 7.5 constructors, so you decided to make 8

no, the other way round actually

[tepid gull]

am i right in thinking 13 Refinery's running 100% making turbofuel can run 54 Fuel gens?

[fierce ruin]

4.5TF m^3/min per gen

or 243 TF/min

[deep root]

If you make heavy oil, then packaged diluted fuel, then turbofuel, you get more bang for your oil

[tepid gull]

i have about 9000 oil /min coming in to my base

[fierce ruin]

🤔

[deep root]

You will run out of compacted coal before oil

[tepid gull]

naa i have 26 Assembler's making 30 Compacted Coal /minute at 120%

[deep root]

Not enough if you want to make all turbofuel with that oil

[keen flame]

Ok, I can post this here before I sleep: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1jGUXDD5jmpozKs5YRKYCA0N0E71vEr0GayePjiblbxc/edit?usp=sharing
If any of you have any questions, dm me and I'll check when I'm back up! This is not as robust as greeny's, but for anyone like me who prefers the spreadsheet approach, I'm hoping this helps c:

(Managed to put together a very fast "how to use" page)

[fierce ruin]

CSS proceeds to patch

[keen flame]

Thanks for reminding me that I planned to fix that later lmao

It still needs a lot of QoL stuff, but I figured the functional version would still be useful to people, especially anyone waiting on other tool updates. most of the work so far has been in the dark occult magic required to make the formulas in this sheet actually function

[fierce ruin]

=function() that is

[naive ginkgo]

Just making sure, heat sinks from casings and rubber is still the best right?

rubber+casing
3ingots/2casing, 3casing/heatsink => if we need 3 casing we need 1.5 recipes => 3ingots * 1.5 = 4.5ingots/heatsink

rubber+fused casing
4ingots/3casing, 3casings/heatsink => if we need 3 casing we need 1 recipe => 4 ingots * 1 = 4ingots/heatsink

copper sheet + alclad sheet
3ingots/3sheet, 5alclad/heatsink => if we need 5 alclad sheets we need 1+2/3 recipes => 3ingots * (1+(2/3)) = 5ingots/heatsink

[glacial tinsel]

Honestly, the difference is small enough that the answer depends on if you have more copper or oil available

[naive ginkgo]

right now i have more rubber than i know what to do with

[glacial tinsel]

Light it on fire

I hear thats good for the environment

[naive ginkgo]

XD

gonna make the biggest firepit there ever was

[vernal patio]

in either case bottleneck will be aluminium, as far as i can tell.

it'll be a bottleneck for frickin everything.

[glacial tinsel]

Aluminum or sulfur, i still need to see the new nuclear math

[naive ginkgo]

i mean there are still less sulphur nodes than there are sam nodes...

[glacial tinsel]

Yea, i was considering droning sulfur even

[naive ginkgo]

that sounds counter productive

[glacial tinsel]

The battery cost isnt really that much

[naive ginkgo]

must choo-choo harder

[glacial tinsel]

Would love to if i could be sure they would get stuck more than a roomba

[naive ginkgo]

then must belt harder

[unkempt acorn]

new building dedicated to power storage 😉

[stark lichen]

post it in #screenshots

[twin peak]

maf without pure copper, 20 smelters is a nice number

maf with, refineries is also nice number

what should i go with?

[naive ginkgo]

if you want to maximize, some copper to steamed copper sheets and some to fused quickwire and then you get this #satisfactory-experimental message

[twin peak]

im not using fused quickwire, im only in tier 6

im not low on caterium at all

[naive ginkgo]

then it all depends on how much you care about your power usage, the difference is something like 2.5 vs 2.0 efficiency

also iron usage

refineries is the most efficient for copper but uses more power

the fused quickwire is mostly because you can use the remaining copper that you can get out of your nodes

[twin peak]

still with crafting quickwire i like the most is making refinery lines and after them constructor lines cuz they use 12/m and the refineries make 12/m, really comfortable and looking nice

[naive ginkgo]

that's what the whole bottom part of that thing is

[twin peak]

so guess i wont bother with refineries and water for the copper ingots at least, nice

[naive ginkgo]

i mean it's more efficient if you use the refineries for the copper ingots, but eh it's up to you

[twin peak]

well copper isnt really so rare in the world and im not using it at all plus u said it im saving power

and space with smelters

[naive ginkgo]

yep a lot of it

[twin peak]

500 mw

[naive ginkgo]

wait i though you were going to use foundries for a 2.0 efficiency

god i can't read

[twin peak]

foundries ?

thats self turture

[naive ginkgo]

for some reason my brain read foundry and assumed this

[twin peak]

100 per minute

damn

wait ive got a shitload of spare iron and ill only need 6 foundries instead of 20 smelters

[naive ginkgo]

go for it

[glacial tinsel]

the alloy recipes are an improvement over just smelters, but pure recipes are technically the most efficient if you are measuring ore -> ingots

[naive ginkgo]

that's what i was saying

but i get them for not wanting to build 50+ refineries

[twin peak]

yeah and for saving copper

what do i care

[glacial tinsel]

later you will care

but alloy will last you a long time

[naive ginkgo]

i mean i just do it by default, but god i need to start looking a nuclear

[twin peak]

with the foundries im gonna fully use a normal node + take some from an iron node im using for basic stuff

[naive ginkgo]

that whole system i showed you consumes about 8k power

[twin peak]

damn

8k power is what my whole project is gonna use

[naive ginkgo]

takes in 2 pure caterium nodes and 2 impure copper nodes, and god knows how much water at this point

and it makes 215 ai limiter/m

[tardy slate]

Dang you got so much AI itll take over your world for you

[oblique hollow]

btw, do your fuel gens work now?

[naive ginkgo]

do i have a use for them? no, do they make a lot of tickets? it's god aweful for the power cost, heatsinks give me the same ticket/m values but with 1/3rd the power

[twin peak]

earlier this morning one of the fuel gens starved for a bit but for now its a steady 23850

[oblique hollow]

thats great

[glacial tinsel]

who else is refreshing the tools website hoping greeny is awake?

[tardy slate]

Thank god i didnt start aluminum yet on my world

[naive ginkgo]

anyway time to plug my my limiter array back online and start living on the edge again

[tardy slate]

Just gotta get ready for my 1500 Al/m production

[twin peak]

why'

[tardy slate]

Why what

[twin peak]

why 1500 ai

[tardy slate]

AL

Aluminum

[twin peak]

wut

[naive ginkgo]

ingots?

[tardy slate]

Yea ingots

[twin peak]

i hope u have batteries

[naive ginkgo]

quick heads up, coke + sloppy is still best but it's been nerfed by 37.5%

[naive ginkgo]

i can't figure out what's not always active in my factory, but my max-cons never actually occures it's weird, because i have everything hooked to sinks

[tardy slate]

Whats the rate of it from bauxite to ingot?

[naive ginkgo]

there's maybe 1k worth of machines i manually trigger but like idk where whe whole things comes from

[naive ginkgo]

1:1 if you use smelters to turn the scrap into ingots

[twin peak]

trains, overclocked manufactorers for supercomputers, ....

[lavish river]

alclad casing + batteries was amazing, sadly we now have to bring silica

[bleak coral]

trains probably contribute, but I doubt it's that much

[naive ginkgo]

i don't use trains, and my factories are tightly tuned for 100% uptime

i literally have 1 train and it's not plugged into the network right now

[twin peak]

hmmm

[tardy slate]

You can get 1:1 baux to Ingot using base recipes i was hust gonna use a quartz node for the production with cheap silica

[naive ginkgo]

i swear i have ghost machines somewhere

silica aluminum ingots is something like 0.666666 repeating efficient

and smelter is 0.5

it's about a 15% difference

though it's more like half of that because scaling

[twin peak]

cobra im about to send a pic u are gonna be jelous of in 1 sec

[naive ginkgo]

hurt me

[tardy slate]

Just an fyi im on exp

[naive ginkgo]

this is me rn

and i'm about to level up to 1Mil/m

far cry from my old 1.8Mil/m but heatskinks were way too powerfull before hand

[tardy slate]

Ill be lucky if i ever hit 500k

[abstract plume]

Is my math right for the latest experimental update? 14.4 uranium fuel rod from 600 uranium?

[naive ginkgo]

if you can automate 1 pure bauxite node, make about 300 coke and 500 copper ingots you can get 400k points out of that

hmmm i like flat lines

[tardy slate]

How many MWh you got

[twin peak]

23850?

[glacial tinsel]

i belive so @abstract plume i got 50.4 for full map

[tardy slate]

MWh is the battery storage

[twin peak]

oh i have 200 batteries if thats what u meant

[oblique hollow]

200 * 100
..20000

[naive ginkgo]

20000MWh not bad, much better than my 3600MWh

[fierce ruin]

120*1000=120 000

[twin peak]

u dont need that much really

[tardy slate]

Im sittin at like 13500MWh

[naive ginkgo]

though i just play it smart and have backup tanks of fuel that last about an hour

becasue pre-update 4 batteries

[tardy slate]

Im kinda afraid to go higher just because of the bugs ive heard about them

[shy mason]

I'm good with my 8 batteries, enough for me to get to power stations before shutdowns atm when sulfur and coal trains for turbofuel get stuck again with the updates, mostly fixed atm but was a pain last week

[abstract plume]

Thanks, I want to max out just one node for staters

[twin peak]

i built the batteries so i can make this really

this boring charged office building

[tardy slate]

Lol

Is that the east side of the rocky desert?

[twin peak]

its where the 4 normal coal nodes are

[fierce ruin]

looks like the lagoon there

[twin peak]

u can tell by the coal power plants leeching from the left side

[tardy slate]

I think its the best place tbh for coal gens lol

[twin peak]

yup

normal nodes + mk3 belts + lots of water nearby

[tardy slate]

I get my 6k MW from that place asap lol

[wind spade]

tools have been updated btw

[fierce ruin]

6 GW?

[twin peak]

i got only 4050 mw cuz i used one of the normal nodes for steel

[tardy slate]

Yes 6GW

[fierce ruin]

[glacial tinsel]

praise!

[tardy slate]

Ahh i just use the pure node up the hill for my steel. My main base is in the northern forest with the pure iron nodes

[twin peak]

same but i needed more steel for heavy modular frames and stators so...

[tardy slate]

Yea im starting to feel that struggle have automated HMFs in my world yet... gonna be a long process

Havent*

[twin peak]

wait so u are making 1500/m ai and u are in tier 7 but u are not making hmf?

u need those for like fuel gens

[tardy slate]

No im not making 1500 ai/m

[twin peak]

and everything really

[tardy slate]

I reached tier 7 but havent started anything there

[glacial tinsel]

@wind spade this looks a bit weird

[twin peak]

i suggest u dont cuz u cant know if they change more recipies

[tardy slate]

Yea thats what im worried about lol

Definetly not starting nuclear untill the full release comes out

[glacial tinsel]

it looks like its calculating correctly, but not pulling the aluminum scrap back into the recipes that require it?

[tardy slate]

What are you using to make this?

[wind spade]

have you refreshed the tool?

[glacial tinsel]

yes

[wind spade]

try again, maybe it's cache

[bleak coral]

oh is the tool updated?

[glacial tinsel]

okay yea, stupid cache

[wind spade]

indeed

[wind spade]

https://u4.satisfactorytools.com/

[frosty owl]

A big thank you <3

[bleak coral]

wait is this right? they said they doubled the resources for plutonium rods, but the calc is saying they quadrupled the waste requirements for regular recipes

[frosty owl]

Hah one pressure cube for 2 turbomotors!
Hell yeah, now we're talking :simon_smile:

[glacial tinsel]

im getting a max of 50.4 nuclear and 22.4 plutonium

[bleak coral]

what are you using for the 22.4 plutonium?

[glacial tinsel]

5040 waste

[bleak coral]

no I mean recipes

[glacial tinsel]

non-fissle, instant plutonium

[wind spade]

try refreshing just to be sure

[frosty owl]

It's still 100 waste per uranium rod, right?

[bleak coral]

not from what I'm seeing, we knew the cost would go up

the patch notes said 4x the power with 2x the resources, but at least for waste and no alts it looks like 4x the power and waste

[wind spade]

waste in codex is hardcoded and probably wrong, if you're looking at that in my tools

[bleak coral]

not in the codex, in the calculator

and not how much waste it's making, but how much uranium waste a plutonium rod needs

[wind spade]

I see. Idk, it was what was in data 🤷‍♂️

[glacial tinsel]

the best waste -> plutonium recipies end up at 225 -> 1

[abstract plume]

@wind spade You should have kept their faces in the gears 😄

[wind spade]

what?

[frosty owl]

No, I meant: does one uranium rod still produce 100 waste?

[deep root]

Greeny doesn't manage SCIM

[glacial tinsel]

yes vencam

[abstract plume]

I meant all the Snutts 😄

[glacial tinsel]

but the new infused resipe means we get more uranium fuel rods = more waste

[deep root]

Different tool

[abstract plume]

I was loading the other site and my brain stuck for a second :))

[wind spade]

you can change date to 1st April so that it'll come back 🤷‍♂️

[abstract plume]

Groundhog day style

[glacial tinsel]

okay, so assuming neither me nor greeny's tools are having a stroke, this update is a pretty big hit to MAX SINK factories

[bleak coral]

if you max nukes too, but there is more nuke power so you probably don't need to max nukes

[glacial tinsel]

after 50.4 uranium and 22.4 plutonium, you basically have to go assembly directors

[bleak coral]

I assume though bauxite changes also hit max sink values

[glacial tinsel]

the bauxite changes hit thermal rockets and turbomotors hard, but assembly directors didnt see much change

here is the absolute max

though with thermal rockets and turbomotors it looks like you can still use oil for turbofuel

[amber basin]

guys, is there maybe mathematical formula for calculating production and time? for example, rate production, time, how many smelters(if is it possible), how many percents?

[glacial tinsel]

CONCLUSIONS:
Uranium: buff
Plutonium: production nerf, power buff, net power gain of 30%
Thermal rockets & turbo motors: massive nerf
Assembly directors: minor nerf/net neutral?

[glacial tinsel]

https://u4.satisfactorytools.com/production use this

[tardy slate]

Whats max nuclear power now?

[glacial tinsel]

50.4 uranium/min 22.4 plutonium/min

i think that gets you up to 1.2GW

without taking into account the power needed to produce

[bleak coral]

All the production rate numbers are in the codex and in the machines

[glacial tinsel]

also, not sure if any of the awsome sink values have changed

so those sink numbers may not be accurate, but i dont think that matters seeing how assembly directors are by far the best now

[bleak coral]

something is still off to me because this:

Plutonium Fuel Rods now produce four times as much power but cost twice as much and are produced at half the rate.

doesn't make a lot of sense with the numbers the calculator or you're getting, so either this note is wrong or they messed up a number

or both the calculator and you messed up something

[glacial tinsel]

the fuel rod itself costs twice as much

its now 30 plutonium cells to 1 plutonium fuel rod

or 20 to 1 with the alt

[lavish river]

That was my perfect battery chain, before aluminium nerf. Any ideas to correct it with the change on alclad casing ?

my first goal is to max produce nodes

[bleak coral]

I found it, they double the cost of both cells and rods, so it quadrupled the cost

so, yeah, that patch note was misleading/wrong or they meant to do one of those and not both and fucked up

I think they fucked up, either the patch notes or the plutonium cells

cause the patch note doesn't mention increased cost for plutonium cells

[glacial tinsel]

its still a net positive in power, so i think the changes are intended

[bleak coral]

still gonna file a QA post on it, but yeah they've messed up patch notes before so that's perfectly possible

[vast jungle]

40.5 GW of turbofuel done... now its time to plan next steps, maybe finally start on the Project Assembly for Tier 7/8 😉

[bleak coral]

but that's also the argument I saw for infused uranium cell being bugged, that they didn't want it anymore

[lavish river]

are you talking about the power storage build or the battery item ?

[bleak coral]

and that was just a mistake

[lavish river]

added a white background

[bleak coral]

<@&370483737957236737> Could we get some clarification on whether the increased cost to plutonium cells is intentional? It's not mentioned in the patch notes.

[glacial tinsel]

dav you definitely want to be using the classic battery recipe

[fierce ruin]

so for iron plates am I correct to say that I need 6 constructors to make the most of my level ones

[lavish river]

Man the factory is already build... i d'ont want to change everything. and it's very far from oil

[gray flower]

i think i will get More water Time to ruin a ocean soon

[glacial tinsel]

any tips on how to make water extractors align to foundations good? i want to fit it in a 2x2 foundation hole

[gray flower]

That idk

[lavish river]

you can build something on plateforms to align with, like a constructor

[glacial tinsel]

yea, im trying to figure out exactly what though

idk if its even possible TBH, but i want it to be

[bleak coral]

@glacial tinsel what was the max plutonium fuel rods before without using fertile uranium?

[frosty owl]

Alright, I finished my analisis. I'll write my 2 cents for whoever cares~

[lavish river]

I'm sorry about my first answer, I shouldn't have gendered it

[glacial tinsel]

31.5 uranium 70 plutonium

[bleak coral]

holy shit, with 31.5 uranium it's now 14

that's a nerf, this is definitely not intentional, the max is only higher because the uranium max is higher

[glacial tinsel]

but you get 50.4 uranium now

[bleak coral]

forget max, most people will never attempt that, balance isn't just about max it's about every level

they were trying to make plutonium more appealing than sinking it, they've done the opposite

[lavish river]

According to the gamepedia "Plutonium fuel rods now burns 4x longer, but roughly 2x as expensive and takes 2x time to produce."

Depending on the recipes used, Uranium Waste is converted to Plutonium Fuel Rods at a rate between 200:1 and 200:6.66. As 1 Plutonium Fuel Rod makes 10 Plutonium Waste, the Plutonium Waste will be between 5% and 33.33% of what the Uranium Waste was. This means that storage will last between 20x and 3x as long compared to if the Uranium Waste were unprocessed.

[bleak coral]

that's wrong, it was made under wrong assumptions

don't rely on the wiki right after a patch drops, we're still figuring stuff out

and I know cause I was the one that wrote that

[lavish river]

no it's good, visibly

the plutonium produce now 4 time energy than before

[bleak coral]

@frosty owl what's your 2 cents?

[frosty owl]

Still writing/calculating, trying to edit it nicely too

[lavish river]

if it was 31.5 uranium * 750 MJ for 70 plutonium at 375MJ, 14 at 1500MJ it is 20% less in this update

[glacial tinsel]

plutonium is now best case 225 waste -> 1 rod

[bleak coral]

The instant plutonium cell alt is what's really scratching my head. The regular doubling in cost + doubled cell cost in rods means that without using instant it both quadruples waste usage and power, so it's the same amount of power per uranium fuel rod compared to the previous update; just now it reduces waste more. That sounds intentional.

Instant plutonium cell had it's costs more than doubled, which means they nerfed the alt. I'm not sure why they would do that.

[hybrid dune]

what is the player high?, because a 8m x 4m platform looks like a 4m x 2m platform, the player is realy big

[bleak coral]

About 2m I believe, she's tall

[hybrid dune]

wow

[bleak coral]

You can tell by standing next to a wall which is 4m high, you see about halfway up

[oblique hollow]

or just stand next to a 2 m tall foundation LOL

those exist too, dont forget

[bleak coral]

I will! just like I frequently forget foundations are 8m wide and get confused about distance/machine sizes!

My brain wants them to be 4m wide, and I do not know why

[hybrid dune]

lol

[glacial tinsel]

and that is why assembly directors will now be king for the SINK

turbo motors and thermal rockets use nitrogen and bauxite heavily

[twin peak]

how the hell can i put 2400 quick wire in 24 different assemblers

[glacial tinsel]

with mk2 belts?

[twin peak]

mk2 carry 120

they each need 100

i have mk4 belts

[glacial tinsel]

you are allowed to have a belt not be completly full

and dont look at is as 2400, break it down into segments you can manage

[twin peak]

i already have it as 5 lines of 480

[glacial tinsel]

make it 6 lines of 400

[twin peak]

ye i just thought of that

would be a bit complicated and ugly tho

[glacial tinsel]

smart splitters

[twin peak]

cant figure out the numbers, bad at math

hehehe

[bleak coral]

5:6 balancer, which is crazy complicated and I'm not sure there's a diagram for, or don't make 5 lines of 480 in the first place, slightly modify your setup so your lines are 6 lines of 400 in the first place

[twin peak]

i already built everything pretty densely

[bleak coral]

whatever is less work lol, anyway just get 1/6th out of each line and combine those lines into a new line

just realized you don't need a true 5:6 balancer cause they're all the same speed