math-and-meta

[frosty owl]

the closest I got was turning 810 oil into 1800 turbofuel? the ratios on all my machines at every step (bar one) were perfect integers, but you can't get 810 oil from oil nodes without overclocking/underclocking
@obsidian sluice I actually found that the ratios fit in pretty well, at least if you use alternate recipes too (don't wanna risk spoiler)
If you have an example at hand, I can help you seeing if there is a nice way to achieve a good ratio

why not going over tho?
@wind spade Because then the miner would fill up and it wouldn't run at 100% anymore. I wanna see that perfectly horizontal power draw sooner or later xD. See it again that is

[obsidian sluice]

this is my turbofuel setup!

[frosty owl]

Top view of the allu sheets input "sushi belts". Silica/copper/coal coming from the bottom and mixing with the all scraps as soon as the belts empties out enough to feed everything (bauxite input is a standalone). All the excess+produced products go to sink/storage and fit on a mk3 belt
@glacial hemlock @bleak coral This represent well the kind of sushi we talked about earlier. With each item on a different conveyor, I'd need 6 input belts, but with mixing I can manage just 2 input belts (1 for bauxite, one for everything else) and even fit the allu scraps feed in. Of course, this is heavily dependent on the VOLUME of things you're inputting, but it does cover a lot of different good combinations of machines

[glacial hemlock]

Scraps do take a lot of space on belts.

[frosty owl]

@obsidian sluice what's the issue with your setup? You don't know what to do with the extra 90 oil or you can't find a good balance to use 900?
I don't quite recall exactly, but I think there is a way to turn 600 oil into as much plastic/rubber AND turbofuel efficienly, alternatively. Should fuel at least 5x the power needed to process all the oil and fuel

[obsidian sluice]

I think this appears to be more of your playstyle then? because you're trying to perfectly consume all 100% of your power and parcel out the correct amount of inputs to each machine by design, rather than allowing it to overflow using manifolds?

what's the issue with your setup?
nothing tbh 😛 I was just mildly annoyed by how you can't get precisely 810 oil using power shards, and how you need a non-integer number of water extractors to feed residual plastic

but I'm personally fine with my extractors cycling on and off

[frosty owl]

Scraps do take a lot of space on belts.
@glacial hemlock Yep, but after taking out the coal and silica, there is still plenty of space: <60(residual coal/silica) + 60ish(silica from allu refining) + 50ish(copper) + 400(scraps) = <600

nothing tbh 😛 I was just mildly annoyed by how you can't get precisely 810 oil using power shards, and how you need a non-integer number of water extractors to feed residual plastic
@obsidian sluice Ahah, I feel your pain. It's part of the reason why I always try to consume all a node can produce before moving on to the next one ^^

I think this appears to be more of your playstyle then? because you're trying to perfectly consume all 100% of your power and parcel out the correct amount of inputs to each machine by design, rather than allowing it to overflow using manifolds?
@obsidian sluice Rather then using all the power I just try to have each machine recieve as much as it needs and no more and not have stopped belts so the power draw doesn't spike. Although the bigger your base gets the easier it is to have a smooth power draw

[obsidian sluice]

I feel one issue with that is that satisfactory only allows you to underclock/overclock your machine by integer %s? so you'll need to install overflow belts at every stage, or find another way to balance your production

you could feed all your overflow belts into a single Mk 5 belt and consume it in a single sink to reduce the number of belts I guess?

[wind spade]

or just use the resources you have on the belt, no overflow, no issues

[obsidian sluice]

producing HMF from EIP could be problematic though? because most of the time, you can't perfectly match concrete production with consumption for your intended factory

in this case, that 0.01 excess consumption means that at some point, either concrete backs up or HMF production sputters out

[ionic thunder]

What do you guys use to do them graphs with ? I use a excel and as handy as it is, it has its limits

[obsidian sluice]

I use https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production !

[ionic thunder]

Now that’s interesting

Thanks !

Actually too easy, planning the factory is a part of the game imo

If someone has a software that lets you easily do the same, but by yourself, please let me know 🙂

[frosty owl]

you could feed all your overflow belts into a single Mk 5 belt and consume it in a single sink to reduce the number of belts I guess?
@obsidian sluice That's what I'm going for. I currently sink about 2 mk5 worth of "good stuff" (overflow from storage) and just 1 worth of misc/raw materials. If I set up a sink at every stage, I'd have over 50 of them all around the place and yet they fit into just 2 belts xD
It's just a bit cumbersome to "drag" a waste-purpose conveyor in each building you make

Actually too easy, planning the factory is a part of the game imo
@ionic thunder Be sure to remember CTRL+N for the in-game calculator if you go that way! 😉

[ionic thunder]

@ionic thunder Be sure to remember CTRL+N for the in-game calculator if you go that way! 😉
@frosty owl now THAT is going to help
Better than building a constructor, an assembler, a refinery and a manufacturer when planning 😅

[dusky dust]

My first step of planning out my (yet-to-be-built, was waiting for fluid update) next factory involved coding some Python to output a graphviz diagram telling me what I'd need to construct to do it

Like this: ```py
from planner.planner import *

Iron Ingots

Machine(refinery, 'Pure Iron Ingot',
[Bit(iron_ore, 35), Bit(water, 20)],
[Bit(iron_ingot, 65)])

Iron Plates

Machine(constructor, 'Iron Plate',
[Bit(iron_ingot, 30)],
[Bit(iron_plate, 20)])
iron_plate.store(60)

Ends up outputting this:

Obvs. you've gotta tell it the details of whatever recipe you've decided to use; it doesn't actually do that for you. But yeah, that's just saying that I want to store 60/min iron plates, using the Pure Iron Ingot recipe to do it

(heh, and I see it assumes mk3 miners in all cases, even though you could easily get away with less in this case.)

And don't ask me why I used Bit for that class name, just couldn't think of anything better. :P

[fierce ruin]

any ideas on how to achieve last space elevator items fast ?

[obsidian sluice]

don't tear down your second space elevator factory immediately? automated wiring is one step away from ACUs and versatile frameworks are needed in both deliveries

[wind spade]

any ideas on how to achieve last space elevator items fast ?
@fierce ruin build a factory that produces a lot of those items? 😛

[quick gorge]

Oh I can't wait for more recipes like refining uranium, 80 acid in 20 acid out

[silent mortar]

Aluminum refining with silica in and out, and water in and out across multiple refineries and smelters. Fun.

[fierce ruin]

build a factory that produces a lot of those items? 😛
@wind spade smart move lol

[fierce ruin]

Hi

I have a question... What would be the most inconspicious way to siphon off my friends oil without him noticing? I was thinking pipe overflow but maybe not. Math powers.

[wind spade]

I must be confused, I thought this game wasn't pvp

[fierce ruin]

well he took my turbomotors.

Without asking... justice must be served.

[wind spade]

just disconnect the pumps from power I guess

[fierce ruin]

I had a stockpile.

I was thinking that or bring my pet gas spider in my base and some nuclear waste and give it too him.

[wind spade]

or maybe just ask him to return the turbomotors

[fierce ruin]

uh... he sank them

rip 3 stacks of turbomotors.

[wind spade]

well what do you want to do with TMs if not sinking them

[fierce ruin]

had a stockpile for mk3 miners

[wind spade]

I think you are able to produce more, resources are infinite 🙂

[fierce ruin]

and what was it, just save them cause i have so many nodes to cover.

[signal nimbus]

Set his clocks to 100% and yeet the powershards.

Bonus points if you hide them between floors in your base.

[wind spade]

why start war when you can play friendly 🙂

[fierce ruin]

i mean i have a pet spider.

An alpha spider at my base. and some waste.

[signal nimbus]

Mhm. And there's any number of ways you can make him think he's going crazy without actually destroying stuff. All those things you forget to do? Just do them on purpose. Unplug a single machine. Disconnect one tiny belt, or even make it look connected when it isn't. Un-do over clocks.

[fierce ruin]

Oh, i was just thinking to stick my alphaspider in his storage.

The alphaspider is vibing in a cage at my base.

@fierce ruin If you move your spider too far from his spawnpoint he'll probably teleport back there.

[signal nimbus]

See, there are pranks easily dealt with, and there are pranks that will drive people insane. Never use the first when the second will suffice.

[fierce ruin]

Dang it.

What about HOR?

[signal nimbus]

?

[fierce ruin]

i mean he has turbofuel, HOR clogs it

lol, just siphon his own oil

turn it into HOR, and repipe it into his turbofuel setup

like the output

[signal nimbus]

Mmm... now that's good.

[fierce ruin]

cause he just has it going into buffers.

its going to clog eventually.

[signal nimbus]

All you have to do then is wait for the power to go down.

[fierce ruin]

How would you feel if i gave you spider in return for your oil?

ive heard recommendations like just siphon his oil use it for HOR and make coated iron sheets lmao

[wind spade]

coated iron sheets are most resource efficient variant of iron plates

[signal nimbus]

Mhm.

[fierce ruin]

...dang it.

[signal nimbus]

That's a good thing.

[fierce ruin]

Petroleum coke into his coal gens?

[signal nimbus]

It'll still burn.

[fierce ruin]

disconnect his turbofuel plant, switch it with 50 biomass generators.

I mean im not dismantling his plant

Im just disconnecting it.

[signal nimbus]

...might need a few more than that.

Also there's a chance he could see the boost from the biomass burners before it happens.

[fierce ruin]

hmm. Oh i know

I have 20 power shards.

I don't use them, I underclock. Just overclock his manufacterers to max.

[signal nimbus]

Also a good thing. Overclocking the power plants, though...

[fierce ruin]

wait how is it good? his power is 2,800 out of 3000

That boost to his massive manufacterers will surely crash his power.

[signal nimbus]

...on turbo fuel, only 3000?

[fierce ruin]

he built small.

either small or he is using turbo heavy fuel

He didn't do the math...

[signal nimbus]

Ah... well, yeah. Overclocking to crash his power, then grabbing the shards and leaving would work.

[fierce ruin]

redesigns every one of setups to make 1 item per minute

[frosty owl]

Question:
If I were to develop my base in Satisfactory Experimental after the update, would I still be able to load the file in Satisfactory once the update gets pushed there too?

[hot ginkgo]

Yup.

[frosty owl]

Oh, that is sweet. Thanks!

[hot ginkgo]

You just can't go from Early Access, to experimental, and back again.

But once experimental is pushed to early access you can.

[frosty owl]

What I meant is: can I play on Exp after the update and continue on Early Access once that version gets updated too?

[hot ginkgo]

Yes.

[signal nimbus]

Non-game note: f in chat for all those in California experiencing an IRL power trip.

[glacial hemlock]

Lol? Just buy UPS

If ups is not enough, use a generator

[north forum]

Question:
If I were to develop my base in Satisfactory Experimental after the update, would I still be able to load the file in Satisfactory once the update gets pushed there too?
@frosty owl Another point about backwards compatibility, I hear that once they push the next update. It will change how certain things are created. However, all machines that currently process said item wont break. They'll keep their recipes until destroyed. I thought that was pretty nice to hear about. (I can't specifically remember the item or machine though)

[fierce ruin]

The Pac-it vs Refineries was mentioned.

[thin stump]

I need pipes mk2 it would make my 87gen turbofuel power plant much easier to make

[dull linden]

why is steel so expensive

or rather the things you make with steel

[sand garnet]

Steel is actually pretty cheap

Its why people skip mk2 belts

[dull linden]

well yea

but the steel beams

and also encased steel beams

[sand garnet]

Alt recipes solve many problems

[obsidian sluice]

EIB is kinda slow, but you'll need to automate EIB for HMF production anyway

but yeah, at T3/4, steel production seems enormous

[cedar mica]

If 1 machine is slow, add more. Its that simple

Only reason you dont early game, is power

[dull linden]

i mean

you also need enough coal

[cedar mica]

There is lots of coal on the map, even with mk1 miner

[dull linden]

yea but its really spread out

[exotic isle]

Just make conveyors and join few lines info 1 line from many nodes of impure and keep pure nodes seperated

[willow igloo]

If you plug in huge end-game projects into any one of the calculators, you'll realize that the real limiting reagents of the game are oil and bauxite. coal is plentiful

[signal nimbus]

Wait... when you say "really spread out", are you starting in the Grasslands? Northern Forest, at least the alternate one, it's just over the hill with more across the river. Dune Desert, there's at least five different patches I can think of, some of which are pretty dense. Rocky Desert, literally just up the cliff beyond the three normal limestone nodes.

Grasslands are the only place that I'd say might have "bad coal".

[onyx lintel]

i found quartz to be most limiting

[keen rock]

That really depends on the recipe, quite a few alts remove the need for quartz

[wooden valve]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/474948272784670751/770505589616148510/My_Genie_Setup.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/474948272784670751/770495458732670986/unknown.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/474948272784670751/770503704590811156/unknown.png

[glacial hemlock]

Yeah is silly.

Not silly if you have too many shards

[signal nimbus]

TBF, there's more shards than absolutely required to 3x shard every resource in the world.

[abstract copper]

Something something power plants don't OC like production plants do and are horribly inefficient in terms of producing extra power. So you are better off down-clocking your water extractors to 75% to keep the 2:1 ratio

[wooden valve]

right i see a lot of post about the 2:1 ratio i just had so many slugs and was like hmm i wonder if this is viable

[abstract copper]

Haven't done the math myself but the wiki says it's so

[signal nimbus]

I don't think they use more than 45 Water each, regardless of overclocking, but I've never actually tested it or seen it tested.

In that case... you can still underclock to 75% on the extractors.

I guess?

power trip noise

[bleak coral]

nah it's needs more water and coal if you overclock

not any more per watt than at 100% so it's not less efficient

but not any less either, just the same

[signal nimbus]

You tried this?

[keen patio]

There was a very long conversation awhile back about how overclocking power gens work...

The net result of the convo was.. 3 powershards yields only +100% power (+/-1%) instead of +150% like the display might indicate

and the rate of increase of consumption is 1:1 for the power gain

so the net effect is.. it takes 3 shards to do what 2 shards should do.. and all you save is the parts and space of building more power gens.

as far as overclocking water extractors; same rule of thumb issue as any other production structures; it adds a fuckton of power cost. Just build more buildings unless you are seriously space starved.

@wooden valve @signal nimbus

[vapid tapir]

just build a lizard doggo farm and get infite shards 😄

[cedar mica]

Along with some radiactive goodness

[hot ginkgo]

You tried this?
@signal nimbus

Its a 100% known fact. Jeslis summed it all up nicely. The wiki has extensive information in how overclocking works as well if you want to dive into the math.

[indigo egret]

Dogs also can get iron ore witch is VERRRYYY usefull.

[wispy cradle]

my first dog: iron, iron. limestone, green slug, radioactive waste.

not worth

[magic shadow]

give it time its trying :)

[obsidian sluice]

if you can set up a way to get rid of nuclear waste and move it out of sight, doggos are great! they can bring you mycelia, bacon, and alien organs for inhalers, and they can bring you power slugs

[fierce ruin]

Is there any point in splitting my iron sources into plates, rods, and normal ingots?

Or is that just going to cripple my output

[pearl kite]

I always loose the doggos. They never return 😦

Maybe 'cause I give them only 1 berry.

[muted crypt]

tip: put them in a box

tame them, lead them to a box, forget about them until you want to pick up the inevitable nuclear waste they give you.

keep them safe and secure.

if you die, they forget who their owner is

keeping them in the box at least prevents them from running off

[pearl kite]

True

[obsidian sluice]

there's no real need for ingots, but plates and rods are useful!

[wind spade]

also don't post messages into multiple channels

[pearl kite]

But I just want a friend and you usually don't put friends in a cage.

[wind spade]

makes it hard for people to answer you and discuss it

[muted crypt]

But I just want a friend and you usually don't put friends in a cage.
@pearl kite you can build fences (available in the AWESOME shop) and give them larger playpens

[pearl kite]

^^

[obsidian sluice]

they're not friends they're like infinitely replenishing loot boxes

[pearl kite]

@obsidian sluice In that case we still need an automatic collector for doggo items.

[wispy cradle]

I there any official information about the changes?

[hot ginkgo]

@wispy cradle check #announcements

All the known information and teasers are in there.

[obsidian sluice]

I personally just hop into my doggo enclosure whenever I'm back at the HUB, and I have a storage container connected to a bunch of lifts to send nuclear waste out of sight

there's like 20 doggos though, so they kinda just swarm me like a class of kindergarteners

[wooden valve]

@keen patio yoo thanks man! Guess it’s time to do some wiki searching @hot ginkgo !!!

[oblique hollow]

My prediction was right about this.

if the UI looks exactly like this i will shit a brick

[sand garnet]

lol

[oblique hollow]

** I freaking called it**

[glacial hemlock]

wait... the update is out?

[oblique hollow]

no. this is fanart i made lol

[glacial hemlock]

I hope that the number will be shown on the gauge, like rl gauge, you know, having both a gauge and a bar just to show a single info is like 💩

[upbeat tide]

This update sucks.

Looks at my massive pipe networks...could build that much more condensed!

[bleak coral]

I don't see the point of the of the valve, pipes balance themselves anyway

I guess it's a nicer looking one way valve than a pump

[night dock]

it helps flow backs and weird sloshing if you have multiple fluid storages attached

[wind spade]

Maybe when you are exporting liquids by trains totwo directions?

But even then it balances itself eventually

I guess it's just QOL feature

[hot ginkgo]

Any thing I might use that valve for can be accomplished with a simple pipe overflow section.

[oblique hollow]

i will definitely find usages for them

already, they arent just limiters. they dont let liquid pass through freely and simply cut them off once you reach the limit

they actually act like pipes with reduced flow rate maximums. It makes them really odd with junctions

its a linear reduction scale

alright, nice. most of my circuits can be made with the valves instead, meaning they wont consume as much power anymore

i like this so far. even shows decimals

[oblique hollow]

so far after stress testing the mk 2 pump, 55 m seems to be the limit

yea, 55 is safe, 57 is the drop-off point

[hot ginkgo]

Thats huge. Right around 13-14 walls.

You could go between floors with a single pump.

Even large floors.

[bleak coral]

Is it really safe? Or just the reduced flow isn't noticable until 55m?

[oblique hollow]

reduced flow occurs after the safe zone of 5 m

just as with mk 1 pumps, they have a safe zone of +2m. at 23, theres a heavy drop off in flow rate

so i would rather not try and go above 22m with mk 2, and 55m with mk 2s

with the mk1s its easy: find those new blue maximum head lift rings, and let the next pump intersect with that ring.

that way you can get more than 20 m out of it

[wind spade]

I've updated my tools site to Fluids update

[sand garnet]

hype!

[bleak coral]

doesn't that make it not usable for EA until it gets updated?

@oblique hollow that's interesting, but with the new snap mechanic I'm not sure an extra 2m/5m is worth the extra time of lining it up right, plus the meters stop measuring past 22m (on mk1s I haven't checked mk2s), so it'd be hard to know when you go beyond until you're not getting enough flow

[oblique hollow]

thats why i dont really reccomend stretching it. besides, now they autosnap to 20 m anyways

so far, 3 mk 1s seems to do better than 1 mk 2, but you have to place thrice as many pumps of course

[bleak coral]

it's definitely better power wise, but we produce enough power I'm not really concerned with the extra power cost

also I noticed some weird behavior with pumps point down hill towards a junction, but I need to test it more to figure out what's happening

weird behavior with the headlift indicators while placing

[oblique hollow]

phew, there we go. now just to make some actually useful diagrams with this. might add a small "MK1" and "MK2" tag on them

[fierce ruin]

ooh that diagram is so nice.

[oblique hollow]

the mk1 is old, just made the mk2 one

valve is done too now

[plucky horizon]

anyone know the best drop pods to snag early game if im trying for ticket production?

its a weird question i know, but i need my pretty building stuff!

[dusky dust]

Like, in terms of you'd like to sink the more advanced components found lying around the pod?

[plucky horizon]

yep

[bleak coral]

someone found a spot in north forest a while ago with supercomputers that with the other stuff added up to 52 tickets

I don't know exactly which site it was

[fiery lagoon]

hey anyone mind helping me figure out caterium

basically i wanna underclock all of the smelters for it equally

and i have 3 of them

but it would normally use like the equevalant of 2.6666 repeating smetlers, what should the clock thing be?

[sand garnet]

why would you underclock

[oblique hollow]

Overclock the miner

[sand garnet]

go big or go home lol

[fiery lagoon]

wait then what precentage should i overclock the miner for 3 smelters?

[silent mortar]

Why run 66 refineries to make pure caterium ingots when you can underclock them all to 33% to save power and have nearly 200 of em in a line.

[fiery lagoon]

what

i dont have refineries....

[oblique hollow]

Look at how much a single smelter consumes at 100%, then multiply by 3. Then simply adjust the miner to spit out what you need

[wind spade]

but it would normally use like the equevalant of 2.6666 repeating smetlers, what should the clock thing be?
@fiery lagoon 2x100% + 1x67%

or 3x89%

[fiery lagoon]

thank you greeny!

[loud python]

So I've been crunching the numbers using the calculator the past few days while waiting on the update to figure out my turbo motor setup on the west coast. I'll be able to make 39.92/min. But with that I can also make 1500 turbo fuel, so should i go for that much fuel? Or what else should i do with the extra?

[glacial hemlock]

Produce what you want to. Generally you want to go for items that produce coupons faster.

[upbeat tide]

Im looking forward to tapping my pure oil nodes properly now

[loud python]

well I'll already be making 15 mil a minute lol

after i get that setup going

[upbeat tide]

My 1800 a min plastic and rubber factory is gonna grow by another 900 each

[plucky slate]

is there a list of all the good alt recipes to chose from?

[winged dagger]

@plucky slate https://www.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/comments/f6kova/my_indepth_analysis_of_the_new_update_3_alternate/

[tender pollen]

hey, sorry for this noob question but how much coal does a coal gen use at optimum capacity ? does any1 here know ?

[bleak coral]

15 per minute

[winged dagger]

@tender pollen everything u need to ever know about coal gens: https://satisfactory.gamepedia.com/Coal_Generator

[tender pollen]

oooh thats quite a low ammount. guess i can build lots 😛 thanks

[winged dagger]

compacted coal burns at about half that rate

[bleak coral]

I would never burn compacted coal in coal generators

you're just trading coal for some sulfur, which is much harder to find

[wind spade]

on the other hand, if you have sulfur nearby, it's much better choice than finding another coal 2km away

[glacial hemlock]

And later on you can just redirect the compacted coal to turbofuel

[signal nimbus]

Exactly.

[winged dagger]

yummy turbo fuel!

[glacial hemlock]

Pipeline mk2 is unlocked only at tier 7 which makes coal generator setup mostly unchanged. Nobody want to use coal generator after unlocking pipe mk2 anyway

[dusky dust]

@plucky horizon I don't know personally, but the map at satisfactory-calculator.com should show you items on the ground, if you feed it a save

Though I'm not sure if that stuff populates before you get near the pod for the first time, for some value of "near"

[glacial hemlock]

@plucky horizon they are the same for every game. The loots around the pods are fixed.

Lizard doggo cave is a good place ( near the island oil field)

[fierce ruin]

hmm

[abstract copper]

Are there any calculations for tradeoff between packing/unpacking to transport fluids X distance (vertically and/or horizontally) vs pumps?

[wind spade]

best is to process fluids on site anyway

[signal sky]

so if you were moving 1 mk1 pipe of water, it would take 5 packagers to pack and then 5 to unpack, that's 10x10=100MW of power. To save on power you'd have to be moving it more than 500m into the air to use. Since 100MW/4MW per pump * 20m per pump = 500m of headlift

basically never worth to package for transport

[wind spade]

not sure I agree. You also have to take build time into account

[signal sky]

I guess that's true

Whether you're gonna be connecting the packed stuff to an existing train network vs having to build a pipeline 5000m

But the solution there is build on site

but you still have to have something to bring the empty canisters back, which is its own headache in itself

[wind spade]

or sink them and make new ones 🙂

[signal sky]

that's a lot of oil just to go to throwing away other stuff tbf

[wind spade]

why oil

you can use copper + iron

or steel

[glacial hemlock]

you know, this update doesn't remove the head lift exploit. So pipeline pump power issue is still pretty trivial.

[crystal cove]

You could just use a train for long distance

They are the best thing in the game (my opinion)

[analog oak]

lol how much does nuclear waste stack?

I need to know

[timber musk]

500 i think

[analog oak]

ok

so i need a huge storage facility to store all that waste

is there a way to get rid of it though?

[hybrid creek]

Don;t store it .. get rid of it

[analog oak]

how?

[hybrid creek]

Put all waste in an automated truck ..

Let the truck drive over a circuit which runs over a part " over the deep" , when the truck is on that part .. clear the foundations underneeth it .. it will cost you the truck ,, but it also drops al nuclear waste

[dusky dust]

There's no way but mods to actually get rid of nuclear waste. Storage is the only real option

[sand garnet]

@hybrid creek dont give people this advice

it's TERRIBLE

[analog oak]

wait

[sand garnet]

@analog oak do not do this

[dusky dust]

Driving a truck off the map isn't a good idea, will tank performance

[analog oak]

if i use truks it will lag me out

[hybrid creek]

Trucks are not very expensive. . and the nuclear waste is gone

[sand garnet]

it will lag your game, the trucks that have waste in their inventory never despawn

[dusky dust]

Because the truck never actually goes away

[sand garnet]

@hybrid creek stop giving people wrong advice

[analog oak]

trucks are always loaded

[sand garnet]

trucks do NOT despawn when they have waste

[hot ginkgo]

Theyll just fall forever.

[analog oak]

i know

[sand garnet]

so yes, you're causing lag to your game that will never go away

do not follow the 'waste in truck' advice

[analog oak]

the VOID

[hybrid creek]

Hm,mm i am currently on Tier 4 .. and those doggies keep finding waste..

[sand garnet]

store it, it's the only way

[analog oak]

I have a huge storege facility planned

[dusky dust]

Nothing stopping you from setting up your waste facility near the bottom of the map anyway, of course. Choose a handy void. :)

[hot ginkgo]

100 trillion waste only has a radiation bubble of a little over 1km.

[analog oak]

but i wish we can seperate the fission products from the reaction products

then we can recicle the reaction products

but the fisson waste will stay forever

[hot ginkgo]

100 trillion waste also takes 800 real life years to accumulate. Point being, waste will never really be a problem.

[analog oak]

says you

I am a vampire

I will survive forever

i need a long term selution

[sand garnet]

there isn't one

storing it is the only viable way to deal with waste in vanilla

[analog oak]

Well the half life of uranium is 100000000 years i think

so it may just not be a problem after a while

[dusky dust]

Half life of MASSAGE(2)whatever uranium is infinity years. :)

[analog oak]

WHAT

....oh crap

[dusky dust]

As I say, there are mods which let you deal with the waste; could use one of those if you want

[analog oak]

i am vanilla only

[dusky dust]

Though that's a topic for the modding discord

[analog oak]

although i do like chocolate

so i guess the storege facility is a done deal

thank you all

[dusky dust]

As Bandolier mentioned, it is sort of less of a problem than you might think

Don't have to go that far offshore to keep the storage from contaminating the land areas

And you probably want to be building on an ocean anyway on account of the water requirements

Unless you're building super power-hungry megabases, it'll take you ages to even fill up one ISC

[hot ginkgo]

800 some years is also assuming you're using 100% of all available nuclear energy available.

Which feels very not realistic.

[dusky dust]

I keep thinking I should build a containment facility way high in the sky, visible from everywhere on the map, a threatening reminder of our deep shame at what we've done to the planet

[hybrid creek]

I have seen some movie of a facility i meant it was to be buildi in Finland? to store nuclear waste 400 m underground.. and leave it there for 100.000 years..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aoy_WJ3mE50

[glacial hemlock]

just store the waste far away, the game doesn't care where you store, as the radiation can even bleed through mountains. So only the distance matters

[neat light]

The build height is like 2km up. Since radiation is based on distance, find a corner and go up. Wont ever be an issue

[cedar mica]

Do we have any idea on at what point stuff goes into background render? Based on experience, I will say 100 foundation, but that might just be LOD

[fierce ruin]

doesnt that depend on render distance?

[cedar mica]

LOD, probably. The distance trucks and such start teleporting, should not

When planning factorys, its a useful number to keep in mind. Spacing things out, will reduce lag in 1 spot

[dull linden]

what is LOD

i never figured out what it was

[glacial hemlock]

level of detail, means the further away an object from you (the game character), the simpler the object model becomes

[dull linden]

oh is that what LOD dithering does?

[glacial hemlock]

dithering is about the pixel and color i guess? LOD changes the appearance almost entirely. (like smelter loses its smoke stack at 100 meters away), iron ingots become triangles (funny lol)

[dull linden]

huh

I think I noticed that after I turned it on there was one mountain far away that was just really low res

[glacial hemlock]

yeah I am not familiar with the keywords yet. Gonna search googles.

mountain well, terrains at far away are meant to be rendered at lower resolutions (and lower polygons)

[cedar mica]

LOD dithering, is that the game does a transtition between 2 levels of LOD, instead of just changing

[frosty owl]

dithering is about the pixel and color i guess? LOD changes the appearance almost entirely. (like smelter loses its smoke stack at 100 meters away), iron ingots become triangles (funny lol)
@glacial hemlock smoke fading is controlled by "VFX quality" and "view distance"
Fun fact: smoke bends around foundations only with VFX on "medium" or higher

[summer kite]

a normal node is good for two smelters right?

[empty hemlock]

a normal 60/min node is good for 2 30/min smelters yes

[ionic thunder]

Next base will definitely be a mega base with main buses

[cedar mica]

@glacial hemlock smoke fading is controlled by "VFX quality" and "view distance"
Fun fact: smoke bends around foundations only with VFX on "medium" or higher
@frosty owl Or to get rid of smoke all together, put shadow on medium or low.

[ionic thunder]

What’s the highest conveyor tier ? (And how many items/min ?)

Mk5 I take

[cedar mica]

Currently MK5 with 780

It runs into the same barrier, as the pipe line do. Coding prevent it from going higher, seen when FPS drops low enough, you dont get full 780 anymore

[frosty owl]

It runs into the same barrier, as the pipe line do. Coding prevent it from going higher, seen when FPS drops low enough, you dont get full 780 anymore
@cedar mica You can encounter that issue even with 780 or only if you try going over 780?

[cedar mica]

I only remember running into it with the sink not able to sink a full 780 belt

But several people have said that production lines, designed for 780 belt, is not running 100%, as frames drops

[raven island]

Wait so 780 belt=lag? Do I need to rethink my design ideas?

[signal nimbus]

I think lag=sub-optimal performance of belts.

One 780 would likely be fine. 780s in a massive mega-factory may not.

If I'm interpreting that right?

[bleak coral]

I'm not sure how low your fps has to get for it to truly matter though

if it was bad enough they wouldn't have pushed out mk5s at all, like they delayed 600m^3/min pipes

[cedar mica]

780 belts are not an issue, till you start dropping below 20FPS. Even then, you might not have the problem all the time

It has something to do with how FactoryTick updates, based on visible frames. Like it wants stuff on belts to move a certain speed, but the frames dont allow it

Probably the price we pay for being able to pick stuff of belts and zoom along them, instead of it just being visual

[wind spade]

if you get low fps, it doesn't matter which belt you have, everything will go slower

[upbeat tide]

My factory core chugs, but that happens after around 150 manufacturers, few hundred assemblers, and a uncountable amount of refinaries in a fairly compact area, swamps for me

But I get about 109m away from the worst of it and things get alot better at least

[frosty owl]

But I get about 109m away from the worst of it and things get alot better at least
@upbeat tide That's a surprisingly specific number o.O

[upbeat tide]

Eeh a number out my butt

[hot ginkgo]

Butt numbers are always precise, I usualy have a buttload of them.

[cedar mica]

Based on my estimates, 100m is when stuff goes fully into background processing. So probably the reason

[hallow mesa]

steamed copper plates or just regular copper plates?

[bleak coral]

you got the spare power and want to save resources: steamed
want to save power and don't want to deal with refineries and water: regular

[hallow mesa]

yeah my current setup is steamed but now I'm seeing that I can save alot of power which means I can stall fixing the mess I call nuclear

but damn all this water is already being ran into the factory

[nimble ridge]

just finished 1200 baux -> 285 sheets

[bleak coral]

@hot ginkgo play around some with the coated iron plate and coated steel plate

I got it as low as about 50ppm iron/copper each for some extra crude

there's a sweet spot in there using one of those two

[cedar mica]

And if that extra crude comes from byproducts, like resin or heavy oil, then its not a great lose to main production

[bleak coral]

we're playing around with packaging turbofuel using the new canister alts

I like this one as a sweet spot for convenience and resource usage: https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=ya5QKugZRovN94YflV3z

trying to avoid pure recipes and steamed sheets cause I don't want to add more refineries, but technically this is the most resource efficient packaging process now if you do use those: https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=GoP5YvX552d5GLCXS6t2

[cedar mica]

Yes, refinerys are a lot of work, but so is the trip to get more resources

[bleak coral]

All versions I've come up with are low enough you should only need one miner for copper and iron anyway

[glacial hemlock]

All water-related recipes are good. There is no reason not to use them. Also, the introduction of packager reduced the maximum possible power consumption by a bit

Before that it was about 0.5TW

[hot ginkgo]

@bleak coral gotta figure too, while planning for packing the entire 666 turbofuel is ideal, realistically that'll probably never happen because it'll be getting burned. Maybe an 85% sink rate, which means you can sink anything under 18700mw or 566 worth of extra turbo.

As long as you maintain atleast 3300MW of usage you won't have any idle turbofuel.

That might help remove the extra refineries and just use the iron/copper.

[naive ingot]

I really wish there was more prioritization of power.

Specifically, I wish coal and fuel were higher priority than nuclear and biofuel.

Ideally, it should be Geothermal>Fuel>Coal>Biofuel>Nuclear.

[sand garnet]

why would you want to burn biofuel before nuclear

[naive ingot]

They're interchangeable, honestly.

[signal sky]

so you only make nuclear waste whenever necessary, could be the thought process

[nimble ridge]

i just found out you can cut down train docking time -dramatically- by forcing them to go down a slope before the station, the train's speed will stay high until it comes to a sudden stop instead of waiting around to slow down

feign, that makes no sense. can you please explain to me why you're A)using geothermal at all, B) how/why you would go for fuel before coal C)why in the world biofuel is after that

@naive ingot

[dusky dust]

Why wouldn't you have geothermal hooked up?

[nimble ridge]

im sorry correct me if im wrong but doesnt it make a pathetic amount of power

[signal sky]

geothermal is free real estate
Fuel before coal cause need coal for steel and compacted coal

[dusky dust]

(re: biofuel, I assume it'd be because biofuel requires some manual steps in there, so de-prioritizing that might be nice, for folks who are using it?)

[nimble ridge]

like sure its free but time wasted to bend down and pick up pennies is time wasted

[dusky dust]

I mean, it's <4GW, sure. But, like, why not hook it up?

[nimble ridge]

PFF

haha ok

[signal sky]

eh, it takes like 30 minutes to hook them all up, why not

[dusky dust]

Anyway, that already is the one power source that's prioritized like that, so huzzah for that. :)

[nimble ridge]

the reason biofuel is prioritized first is beacuse it -sucks- and requires hand crafting and manual insertion. if it didnt suck there would be no reason to get coal and fuel

[dusky dust]

I mean, I think Feign was just talking about where exactly the game draws power from, in situations where you've got a mixed power grid

[nimble ridge]

you only use it as long as you have to and dont touch it again, its an early game crutch and it should never be more than that

what? that would ruin so many factories if load wasnt equally balanced between all power generating buildings

[signal sky]

well if you never touch it again, it'll just use nuclear then

[dusky dust]

Would it? Coke dependencies, you mean?

[nimble ridge]

i mean sure, but it would just add in a layer of unreliability that shouldnt be there. just design your factories not to scale with the amount of power you're using

[dusky dust]

Mm, guess I'm just not getting what you're saying, sorry. :)

(I'm not personally advocating one way or the other, fwiw, though it would be kind of nice if nuclear power was used "last," to produce as little nuke waste as possible)

[nimble ridge]

and also what you said about having to use coal for steel, thats true but coal power plants dont need anything else and can be built far away. make an isolated power plant and use your closest coal all for steel

example: coal for steel

mid game isolated power plant, only connected to base by power poles

an alternative for more organized people would be to use coal for midgame power, and once you unlock fuel and oil processing either demolish your coal plant to use the coal for steel, or re-route in petroleum coke to take its place so and send the coal elsewhere

[frosty owl]

an alternative for more organized people would be to use coal for midgame power, and once you unlock fuel and oil processing either demolish your coal plant to use the coal for steel, or re-route in petroleum coke to take its place so and send the coal elsewhere
@nimble ridge Unless you're very careful with your planning/expanding, leaving your old power generators up when you "tech up" will save you a LOT of time whenever you miscalculated something and your hi-tech fuel production line stops for some reason

[sand garnet]

@wind spade https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=y7utfJvRkHUJsnTGwTkR why is this, of all things, the most efficient way to make empty canisters lmao

you'd expect one of the new alts to be better

[wind spade]

nah, the diluted loop is super good

[sand garnet]

yeah but how is it beating stuff like iron + copper, or iron + coal?

[wind spade]

uh

maybe you should enable the recipes

[sand garnet]

is it just because of the little amount of oil it needs?

[wind spade]

you haven't got the alts enabled

[sand garnet]

oh lol

i did click 'all' but maybe i havent used this site since I reinstalled my PC

seems to be different now yea

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=7bLKNJpWuIfxXeMQGMQM new

still wants to use the diluted route but also uses the new iron + copper alt for some weird reason lmao

[wind spade]

probably because you lastly used the site before fluid update

[sand garnet]

it's using ALL the recipes?!

[wind spade]

which added the two new recipes

[sand garnet]

my brain hurts

its mixing the 2 new alts + the old diluted chain

[wind spade]

I only see coated iron canister

[sand garnet]

oh yeah my bad

[wind spade]

diluted chain is because of steel coated plate

[sand garnet]

honestly, your graphs are super weird for someone like me who expects a simple item like empty canisters lol

[wind spade]

if you enable all recipes 🤷‍♂️

[sand garnet]

yeah im just surprised its not as easy as a single chain 😛

thanks for helping!

[bleak coral]

I blame diluted packaged fuel and recycled recipes, those always make the charts harder to read

[sand garnet]

honestly surprised at how little resources it requires though

[glacial hemlock]

about 15 resources to 100 canisters

[bleak coral]

yeah coated iron canister is great, now I won't feel bad if I just shred them

like a non-loop packaged transport by train

[sand garnet]

part of me wants to build greeny's canister monstrosity just to see what it looks like for 1000 canisters

part of me is lazy and will just use the new iron plate + copper sheet alt for it

[night narwhal]

Am I correct in saying that the electrode aluminum scrap alt is better than the default? No oil and it gives 1.6666667 scrap per alumina solution over 1.5 per solution for the default.

you just need more refineries to process.

[muted crypt]

That's the one that uses coal, right?

[night narwhal]

Yeah

Coal instead of petrolium coke and it you get a fraction more scrap per alumina solution.

[muted crypt]

You're only using coal in steel, gas filters, black powder, compacted coal and EAS..

If you're not making turbofuel there's really no reason for CC, black powder is only used by nobelisks and rifle ammo..

In a realistic scenario you wouldn't be mass producing gas filters

🤔 so I guess it depends on how much steel you want

[night narwhal]

I guess if you DO go down turbo fuel route (which I am) you can make a LOT of power with all the alts with out only 300 crude

So oil might actually be of more adundance. But, the big question is does the fraction more scrap scale up to a point it's worth using coal.

with the alt 300 aliumina solution goes to 500 scrap, the default gives 450.

[muted crypt]

I think in my temporary setup my old save was using I set it up to use coal because it was so far out of the way

[night narwhal]

Look it the recipe for alumina solution, getting 300 per min isn't hard. So that extra 50 does add up.

I think the biggest down side is that for every 1 refinery you have making the default scrap you need 2.4 for alt.

[muted crypt]

Oh lord

[night narwhal]

yep.

Default is 360 per min, alt is 150.

[muted crypt]

If you truly wanted to maximize, sure, go the electrode route... but imo I don't think it's worth the space or power to do the alt

Just based on that alone

[night narwhal]

But! You don't need the refineries to make HOR and to turn that into coke.

[muted crypt]

One refinery producing coke from HOR supports two refineries producing scrap from coke and solution

You would have the same number of machines anyway I guess 🤔

2.4 is just 3 unless you overlook, and 3 is.. well.. 3

[night narwhal]

That's why you go for 5.8

😛

[frosty owl]

Why have I made all these iron processing facilities...
Once one starts aiming for turbo motors iron is pretty much useless 🤦‍♂️

[muted crypt]

well not necessarily

if you wanna build a factory you do still need iron

scaling up and out

[frosty owl]

But that's about it... You don't need an "industrial" amount
... Like the 8x720 iron ingots I'm producing now 😩

[stray willow]

Just make em all into iron rods and build ladders

You can never have enough ladders

[frosty owl]

Just make em all into iron rods and build ladders
@stray willow Funfact: i make rods with steel... 🤣
But yeah 🪜 , will have to increase rods production, still . Like bringing the rods constructor to 100% for a start 🤔

[stray willow]

I mean we all build huge pointless factories, you made some iron now have fun with it

[frosty owl]

There's only one sensible step next, after all... : reinforced plates!

[stray willow]

I like the way you think

[bleak coral]

this is why it's recommended you build top down, target an end product parts per minute and build what you need for that

trying to build for all your iron ingot needs ever is a fool's errand, cause it's a nebulous goal with no numbers behind it

especially with alt recipes thrown in the mix

[frosty owl]

trying to build for all your iron ingot needs ever is a fool's errand, cause it's a nebulous goal with no numbers behind it
@bleak coral I'll eventually use it all as I'm aiming for total nodes usage, but I agree on that. It's quite nebulous ahaha

[jolly holly]

Ah yes the 4.6875 Radio control units

and the 8.4375 ai limiters

[bleak coral]

clockspeed, but yes those are ugly numbers

[frosty owl]

Just build more and sink/store the excess. It's pretty valuable stuff anyway ^^

Ah yes the 4.6875 Radio control units
@jolly holly

[jolly holly]

ill just work off of the main recipe

and mess with clockspeeds for the manufacturers

but i wanted to meme it

and by main recipe im referring to the normalized ratios (the whole numbers)

so ill be producing 5 radio control units/min and so on

[muted crypt]

closest you can get would be one machine at 5.00625/min at 178% clock speed

or two machines at 2.503125/min at 89% clock speed

[jolly holly]

i dont have to get 100% eff

99% is good enoguh in my book

[silent mortar]

I have negative efficiency. I am somehow turning rods back into ore at this point.

[jolly holly]

xD

i am staying away from nuclear stuff for now

the problem of waste is scaring me

any thoughts on that?

[naive ingot]

Eventually there will be a use for the waste.

[signal nimbus]

I feel ya. After seeing Kibs make his storage space, though... actually might not be so horrible.

[jolly holly]

i hate temporary stuff

thats why im playing this game

[naive ingot]

There'll never be a way to get rid of it, but there may be a way to use it.

[jolly holly]

to automate stuff permanently

[silent mortar]

You can sink the fuel rods, which sounds like a hilariously bad idea to me. So you can make the entire production chain and just mulch the product instead of using it. Or use the rods to fuel your vehicles so you have roving lines of radioactivity everywhere.

[sand garnet]

theres always mods to fill the gap

[jolly holly]

what about throwing it into the sea like we do irl

[sand garnet]

cant

[jolly holly]

i know but making something require permanent attention in an automation game is really annoying

i get their point

strong but has a drawback

but isnt the production of it already hard enough

besides

[muted crypt]

it should be noted that it would take I believe 400 hours for a single nuclear reactor running at 100% capacity to fill a single industrial storage container.

[jolly holly]

turbofuel i would say is even stronger to some extent

theres more oil around than uranium

[muted crypt]

but uranium has no other uses

whereas oil does

[jolly holly]

i will probably end up giving it a try

[muted crypt]

I've only barely messed with it... in this new save I started with the experimental branch, I plan to give it a shot.

last time I messed with it was when it was added, back in U2.

[jolly holly]

but ill limit myself to like 10 plants at 100?

[frosty owl]

turbofuel i would say is even stronger to some extent
@jolly holly Lemme point one little calculations I made:
You can turn 150 in roughly 7.7 nuclear rods (all per minute). Considering each one provides 2500GW for 5 mins it seems a pretty good deal!

That's about 12500GW*7.7, btw

[jolly holly]

but why would i ever opt for such an effort that far into the game?

maybe for next tier that is coming out?

cuz for what is in this tier

turbo fuel usually will suffice

thats only thanks to the diluted fuel recipe

[frosty owl]

turbo fuel usually will suffice
@jolly holly Agreed. Unless you plan on huge factories, you can go without nuclear quite easily

[jolly holly]

im running at 45% power usage on 300 oil/min

and 600 water but thats redundant

[muted crypt]

yeah there's only like 9682835462304982634285342394 water per minute available on the map, lol

[jolly holly]

and now oil has been buffed with the addition of the mk 2 pipes

you can run a pure node at 250%

[plain plinth]

oh shit yeah

[muted crypt]

which is fantastic 👏

[jolly holly]

it gives straight a full pipe

its so convenient

[muted crypt]

we're up to 9900 crude oil/min availability 😄

[jolly holly]

which can run 4,884 fuel gens at 100%

which is 732,600 MW

and you can make ur plastic and rubber stuff from all the resin you get

AND YOU NEVER HAVE TO LOOK AT IT AGAIN

unlike nuclear

and no hazmat when going near it

just 10000000000000000 refineries and packers

[muted crypt]

that is a lot of resin....

maximize function on greeny's tool says 5255 resin/min

[jolly holly]

if its too much sink it

[silent mortar]

Just one caterium node takes 33 refineries and a few water pumps. I fear my ocean will eventually be nothing but lines stretching off to eternity.

[jolly holly]

we will start having to overclock our water pumps

we thought we would never get there

[muted crypt]

don't let your memes be dreams

[silent mortar]

The water on the east coast eventually stops being water and becomes untargetable air after a few hundred meters, which is not very cash money.

[jolly holly]

oh well i over here am slacking with 5 supercomputers/min

but i am well proud

im on my first ever playthrough

[muted crypt]

which can run 4,884 fuel gens at 100%
@jolly holly idk where you got this number

[jolly holly]

well

[muted crypt]

oh wait

I'm dumb, I divided with wrong number

[jolly holly]

300 oil can run 148.14 gens at 100%

you do the rest of the math

i may be wrong but it shouldnt be by much

i did the maths with round numbers cuz im lazy

[muted crypt]

8550 turbofuel/min can come from 9900 crude oil/min

I both am and am not surprised by this, but crude oil and sulfur both hit their caps of availability in the world

but 8550/min would be 1900 fuel generators exactly at 100%

[jolly holly]

I both am and am not surprised by this, but crude oil and sulfur both hit their caps of availability in the world
@muted crypt wdym

[muted crypt]

(8550 / 4.5 = 1900)

the world can supply at most 6840 sulfur/min and 9900 oil/min

maximizing turbofuel with EVERYTHING available in the world uses exactly that much of both

also uses 4880 water/min and 6840 coal/min

[jolly holly]

wait what the max turbofuel you can get from 300 oil

i want to see where my data is wrong

[muted crypt]

oh, wait

trying to see if the calculator doesn't do the diluted fuel thing

..no, it does

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=o3olB8iklpw5asBVNxRe

here, maximized turbofuel

[jolly holly]

so according to my math

300oil-> 666 turbofuel

[muted crypt]

oh this

this does something different, I see now

[jolly holly]

9900/300 is 33

[muted crypt]

yeah you're probably correct, the calculator isn't doing it "perfectly efficiently"

[jolly holly]

and 33* 666 is 21,978

[muted crypt]

yes

[jolly holly]

which is 4,884 fuel gens

[muted crypt]

yeah

again, the calculator was doing something wonky

not doing the "optimized loop", most of the crude oil was being directly turned into fuel

[jolly holly]

well thats not satisfactory

[muted crypt]

lol

but

now something to take into account

sulfur may be your limiting factor

[jolly holly]

ooooooooh

[muted crypt]

actually it probably is your limiting factor

[jolly holly]

i totally forgot about compacted coal

my bad

[muted crypt]

666.67 turbofuel/min is 533.33 sulfur & coal/min (because 533.33 CC/min)

[jolly holly]

well lets do some math

[muted crypt]

with sulfur being capped at 6840/min, that's 12.825x the single 300 crude/min setup

[jolly holly]

so around 17.600

whats the max sulfur

[muted crypt]

6840

[jolly holly]

aaah

[muted crypt]

which what I calculated that to be

[jolly holly]

yes then\

[muted crypt]

is 8550.. which is what the calculator said 😉

[jolly holly]

you are hardcapped by sulfeur

[muted crypt]

so I was right but for the wrong reason LOL

you can get 285 GW from turbofuel

[jolly holly]

well eventually we will run pure sulfur at 250% on mk3 miners

[muted crypt]

eventually™️

[jolly holly]

but thats still not enough sadly

[muted crypt]

(6840 / 533.33) * 666.67 = 8550.096

[jolly holly]

#mk6conveyorsweneedyou

[muted crypt]

assuming we can get all of the sulfur possible, at 8100/min

(8100 / 533.33) * 666.67 = 10125.114

which is 2250.025 fuel generators at max capacity and 100% clock

[jolly holly]

then nuclear mught be more efficient on maxing out power for all the sulfur on the map

[muted crypt]

it definitely is

lol

[jolly holly]

so lets pray last tier will have somthing to get rid of that dammed waste

[muted crypt]

on the bright side, you're only dedicating 3847.52/9900 crude oil/min to power when doing this! 😄

well I think I mentioned this earlier, it takes one nuclear reactor running at 100% capacity and clock like 400 hours of constant running to fill one industrial storage container

[jolly holly]

i guess im overestimating what waste does to you

and your world\

[muted crypt]

reactors use 0.2 nuclear fuel rods/min at 100% clock, so if you just think of it like [rods/min] x 5 = [# reactors]

[jolly holly]

is this a logarithmic rise for the distance?

[violet sail]

i think they mentioned they wanted to give an option to deal with the waste in a q&a
though initally they were against it

and probably not if you i.e. yiet it over a cliff over time the pile will lag you out to oblivion ^^

[muted crypt]

94.5 rods/min = 472.5 reactors = 472.5 waste/min = ~54.18 hours to fill 64 ISCs

[jolly holly]

ok yes im too scared

this is 100% managable

[muted crypt]

but that's 1181474.29 MW of power from that

the odds of you hitting 100% capacity with that is basically impossible due to object limits

(yes, 1.18 TW)

[jolly holly]

ok

thats

OVERKILL

imagine having 1TW grid for no reason

[violet sail]

theres a solution to object limits though
kibitz has mentioned it in one of his vids after reaching the 2million limit

Disclaimer: I'm not responsible if this deletes your Windows partition, causes your computer to explode, and pushes your cat into another dimension.*

First, open %LocalAppData%\FactoryGame\Saved\Config\WindowsNoEditor

Second, find Engine.ini and right click it to select Open With > Notepad

Third, append this to the bottom:

[/Script/Engine.GarbageCollectionSettings]
gc.MaxObjectsInEditor=100000000
gc.MaxObjectsInGame=100000000

not mine 🙂

[jolly holly]

I guess our only real bottleneck is our PC

[violet sail]

jup

[sand garnet]

the limit and pushing it will definitely cause lag though lol

[violet sail]

yeah should at least have a 3-4k buckos rig to do that stuff^^

[fresh elm]

increasing the object limit "works" for various values of works

https://questions.satisfactorygame.com/post/5f5bbe8e6f3c82fe950bd417

here are the problems you start running into later

[violet sail]

thanks 😗

[fresh elm]

my save file is over 25 megs

so I have some experience pushing way past the object limit

I have made this game crash more ways than I can count at this point lol

and kibitz got that solution from me 😉

as well as the one he's gonna have to start using, which is there, since his save file is about to hit 21 megs

I think it started to get pretty unstable once I hit 23?

Tom def heard me griping about it as I passed it though 😉

[violet sail]

hehe looking forward to update 4 i guess with more viable ways to crash the game 😄

[fresh elm]

I am sort of uncertain about playing much 3.5 right now, as my save is ridiculously slow obviously, and I don't quite want to start over

[violet sail]

yip havent hit those limits yet but just the thought of having to go over it all again gives me the chills

[bleak coral]

@muted crypt btw the reason you got a weird setup for turbofuel on greeny's calc is you were using maximize

maximize only solves for most items, it doesn't solve for most efficient

you have to take that number and change it back to items/min to get most efficient

[muted crypt]

Fair enough

[bleak coral]

I think making it solve for both is on his to-do list when he has time

[upbeat tide]

So, wanted to share with you all my level of insanity. And im not even sure im done

Total build

Total

Next up is a ton of steel

And all this is just tons of intermediate production

[fresh elm]

still on a quest to see how much you can build? 😄

err, "consume"

[upbeat tide]

Yup

[spare steeple]

Why is it late-game satisfactory has so many ugly decimals 😩

[upbeat tide]

You aint seen nothin

Thats just the tip of the iceburg

[wooden valve]

Just started my second world, on my first world got to the final tier and everything, but on my new world I just got to coal genies and I’m wondering if the 3 water extractors and 8 coal genies is the b est for beginning my coal power? Any advice?

[dusky dust]

Yeah, 8x3 remains the easiest little modular setup to make

[naive ingot]

Is there a similar small modular setup for fuel?

[bleak coral]

I don't think so cause the whole point of the 3:8 is to be easy to set up for new players and get some sustainable power going *insert joke about coal being "sustainable"*

if you're at fuel you've gotten in far enough to figure out what you wanna do

[naive ingot]

Fair enough.

[bleak coral]

also fuel is pretty easy to skip over and just use coal until turbofuel

[naive ingot]

Point, the progression through the hard drive adventure to turbofuel is a many branched path, and each step can be used to get more and more power no matter what order you get the steps in.

[bleak coral]

the only fuel/turbofuel recipe I'd never use is residual fuel

cause like you can get more energy from coke or straight fuel, so.... why?

[dusky dust]

I definitely appreciated having fuel when I unlocked oil, my coal was pretty tight at the time

Though I've since torn down all my fuel gens, and my old coal setup is still chuggin' along (mostly because it's more work to go over there and dismantle it than it is to let it run. :)

[naive ingot]

Yeah, looking at the numbers, you do get more out of Petroleum Coke than out of residual fuel...

[bleak coral]

I like to the leave things running, as reminder of where I was

yeah, and it's even worse when you throw in the machines for sinking one vs the other

cause you're probably doing it to make use of a byproduct that's needs to not clog the upstream

my nemesis are liquid biofuel and residual fuel, they both need buffs

[naive ingot]

I never saw the use of liquid biofuel.

[bleak coral]

there is none, I could rant about it, but I'm sure I've done that enough for you to find one easily in searches lol

[smoky wolf]

The trade off is the amount of coal powerplants you need to burn that much coke

[naive ingot]

But then you get Aluminum and you actually have a need for the petrocoke.

[smoky wolf]

I prefer to do AL without coke using the alt

[fresh elm]

yeah I don't use it either

[naive ingot]

It took me a while to get the alt.

[smoky wolf]

I difnt get turbo until teir 7 cause I got really bad rng

[naive ingot]

Same.

[bleak coral]

can't have RNG if you get all the hard drives 😉

[smoky wolf]

Lol

[naive ingot]

Point.

[smoky wolf]

I got most of them then my world corrupted

[bleak coral]

speaking of I need to finish getting them so I can get those new alts for canisters

[smoky wolf]

Now I gotta go grab em all again

How many HD's are left now?

[naive ingot]

I haven't gotten them all but I've gotten a lot.

[bleak coral]

11

[smoky wolf]

Is it 12 left unused?

Ahhh, I wonder, 11 alts for 3 teirs

I'm going put money on harddrives coming through the sink at some point

[bleak coral]

I don't think we know the number of tiers left, just for sure that there's an 8

also could add more drop pods

[smoky wolf]

Confirmed 10 I thought

[bleak coral]

and take away alts no one likes

that's from some leaked stuff through datamining, none of that is reliable

[smoky wolf]

Very true, very true. Looking at you wood yo coal

[naive ingot]

I've found some blank spaces that could definitely host more crashed drop pods.

[bleak coral]

devs leave stuff in game all the time that are just placeholders and/or stuff they abandon

[smoky wolf]

Ahh, I thought I stand corrected then

I just wanna know what the damn loops do lol

[bleak coral]

also wood to coal and biomass to coal is for a meme biomass only run obviously 😛

[naive ingot]

Hah.

[smoky wolf]

Lol

[bleak coral]

(and also is better than liquid biofuel, I told you it had no uses)

[naive ingot]

Or to get you a little head start on steel while you go on a pilgrimage to the coal on the far horizon.

[bleak coral]

huh hadn't thought of that, could use mk3 belts while setting up steel then

though coal isn't that far from anywhere

like 1km at most

[naive ingot]

It has become a meme, don't fight it.

[smoky wolf]

Except the rocky desert

[naive ingot]

It's a thing, it exists now.

[smoky wolf]

Its annoying getting large coal in there

You certainly can get coal there. Im just saying there isn't a mass amount of it

[naive ingot]

The thing about coal in the Rocky Desert is there's two paths to coal in very different kinds of places.

[smoky wolf]

My world was shook when I found the cave in the rocky desert

[naive ingot]

Either hike up to the blue crater or trek out to the cluster of nodes near the cave complex.

[smoky wolf]

I prefer the cluster. Im using those one for AL production

[naive ingot]

That's a long way for your bauxite to travel...

[smoky wolf]

Yeah it is, but I have a nice rail

[naive ingot]

Fair enough.

[smoky wolf]

I found it easier to collect bauxite and bring it to the coal, copper, and quartz instead of vice versa

[glacial hemlock]

I use coals near the bauxite for al. The coal near the crater for steel, then the coal near the spider cave for power

[naive ingot]

That's a pretty good strategy.

[glacial hemlock]

The distance become a non-issue once you get trains, as they are all within 4m6s

[smoky wolf]

I'm using crater coal plus the nearby sulfur for compressed coal

[glacial hemlock]

Sulfur? Hmmm. I remember across the river there is another coal just beside the sulfur. Else go to titan tree there's more

[naive ingot]

Oh wait, the coal by the spider cave is right up against a pure iron, node (and more normal iron to the West) that's better for steel.

[smoky wolf]

Is there? Are you talking about the small pit

If I keep thinking about this game I won't sleep lol

I'm gonna go to sleep

[naive ingot]

There's an impure and normal Sulphur in the valley right by a Geothermal vent.

[bleak coral]

why do you say go to blue crater from rocky desert for coal

[naive ingot]

Travelling out of the valley, there's a Pure coal.

[bleak coral]

there's a ton of nodes that's closer

[naive ingot]

Might be thinking of different blue craters.

[glacial hemlock]

https://satisfactory.gamepedia.com/File:Biome_Map.jpg

[naive ingot]

Ah, sorry, I meant the Crater Lakes.

[glacial hemlock]

We must first make sure we are using the same biome map. Crater here refers to the orange biome, crater lake

[bleak coral]

crater lakes makes sense

[smoky wolf]

I never knew blue crater existed until I saw it for the first time

I knew about all of the other regions except that one

Also, what is on no man's?

[naive ingot]

It's outside of the map boundary, so you take damage for being there.

[smoky wolf]

Ahh

Better pack inhalers

[naive ingot]

And a vehicle.

But more importantly, there's no resources or items there.

Leading me to wonder why they made it.

[wind spade]

I believe that it's like a developer island for testing

[bleak coral]

I want to build there 😦

[wind spade]

is there not enough space on the map for you?

[bleak coral]

I just like the spot, it's neat

[naive ingot]

It's not about the Space, it's about the challenge.

[dusky dust]

Heh, I'd built a train stop out there on my passenger rail network for the sightseeing, before realizing that nearly all of it was inaccessible thanks to damage

Ah well, good views of the waterfalls, at least

I don't think there's resources/items out on any of the far-offshore landmasses

[naive ingot]

The notable exception of the Islands to the west.

Also, the Spire Coast feels super unfinished.

Which is weird because there's so much oil up there.

[wind spade]

the whole map is unfinished

[naive ingot]

Trust me, the Spire Coast feels more unfinished than anywhere else I've seen.

[cedar mica]

The map is being worked on, its just that the devs dont want to constantly update it. So its saved for the bigger updates

[naive ingot]

Which is especially weird because the Great Canyon feels pretty polished and fleshed out.

[onyx lintel]

this looks like an interesting build that will keep me occupied for a while....

where the hell do I fit the best part of 300 refineries

[cedar mica]

Have you heard about foundations? All the same in the world, with that

[onyx lintel]

ya i just mean its gonna be one mighty platform

[cedar mica]

It depends on if you want it all on 1 floor or multiple floor

[glacial hemlock]

There's too much empty space in the spire coast. Yeah i mean 'IN'

[waxen void]

where are some good spots to set up a foundry near the grassplains area?

[ripe sigil]

There is a spot with a lot of coal and a pure iron node near a mountain lake

[fierce ruin]

all you need is coal, iron and limestone near each other

[ripe sigil]

Screenshot (30 okt. 2020 09:11:52)

On that spot is a normal limestone node as well

[waxen void]

wait why do i need limestone

i thought it was only iron and coal

[analog sequoia]

you'd end up needing concrete for the beams

tho i'd use those 4 coal nodes for power rather than steel, iron isnt rly closeby and its very secluded due to the heigh drop + theres a lake next to it unlike some other coalnodes

[fierce ruin]

Can anybody help clarify why 5 of my 8 caterium smelters are starved for ore? I'm standing on a fully overclocked mk3 miner on a normal caterium node which should provide 600 ore/min.
The three smelters on the bottom left and the two on the top right never have more than 5 ore, dropping to 2 after it produces an ingot, then they have to wait a second or two to get a 3:rd.
I'm aware that the splits are highly uneven but since 8 * 45 is only 360 I'd have expected the system to fill up.
The 3 on the bottom should be getting 1/9 of the flow shouldn't they? That should be 66.6 ore/min?
Originally it was only the belt from the miner, the one going to the right and the bit between the two left splitters that were mk5 with the lifts and belts from them to the 2:nd story splitters being mk3 and the belts to the smelters being mk1.
I've switched to mk5 belts and lifts all the way to the final splitters and mk3 belts to the starved smelters with no improvement.

[lost eagle]

It's a glitch that usually happens to conveyor lifts. Just delete and replace them.

[fierce ruin]

Ok.
But would that affect the smelters at the bottom?

[abstract copper]

Rebuild the belt between those 2 splitters

[sand garnet]

did you attempt to slide that splitter over the belt?

the one nearest to the bottom smelters?

[abstract copper]

I saw yesterday a bunch of belts that were upgraded weren't working, had to rebuild them

[fierce ruin]

I'll check.
All of the smelters are getting ore, just not fast enough.

[sand garnet]

how much ore is the miner outputting

ah 600

can you show the bottom belts between the splitter being mk5 too?

[sand garnet]

can you rebuild all the bottom belts, including that splitter

[fierce ruin]

Good idea, I was going to put it off since I was going to add another floor.

@sand garnet Good thinking!
When I removed the first splitter there was a conveyor pole and a 1 meter stretch of mk3 belt inside!
So that should be the problem.

[sand garnet]

very likely yes

[violet sail]

9/10 hidden belts in splitters 😄

[fierce ruin]

Thanks!
Everything is backing up nicely, I can now go ahead and add the third floor.

[sand garnet]

have fun

[spare steeple]

How does this look for a starter plate/rod factory?

I posted another angle of this in #screenshots but this gives it a better look

For the maths-y bit;
I have 4 furnaces, refining ore from 2 120 nodes (will expand later once I have mk.2 conveyors)
2 of those go to plates for a 1:1 thing
2 of them merge into a 60 line and then overflow into 4 constructors to make 60 rods/m

[lavish bolt]

I usually tend to go horizontally as long as possible, but I guess that's just my building style, you do you :)

[spare steeple]

I'm working in an area where horizonal building would be a bit... inefficient

but there is no limit to how high you can go!

Apart from the world build limit that is

Also this is my dinky little biofuel constructor

[lavish bolt]

Ay I have something similar

For maximum convenience I have 3 boxes in one row

Right one is for leaves, left one is for wood

They get processed into biofuel

And into the middle box

And by box I mean storage container

[frosty owl]

For the maths-y bit;
I have 4 furnaces, refining ore from 2 120 nodes (will expand later once I have mk.2 conveyors)
2 of those go to plates for a 1:1 thing
2 of them merge into a 60 line and then overflow into 4 constructors to make 60 rods/m
@spare steeple The only thing I can point out is to merge the ingots as soon as they're our of the smelters. You waste less conveyors and have the space for it below. You lose some simmetry, sure, but it's not symmetrical on top anyway
Also, a high five for choosing the golden position 🖐️
Love that place

[spare steeple]

lol

@frosty owl You talking about raising up the ingots?

I could've done that

But I didn't
xD

[frosty owl]

Design choices. I just like not to waste on conv :P

Looks good, though

[plain plinth]

I have 400mL/min of fuel I want to convert to turbo fuel, but I don’t know what overclock % I should set the refineries to in order to get 100% efficiency

[wispy cradle]

Calculators at #welcome .

[upbeat tide]

Easier to underclock as needed than overclock

[wispy cradle]

They give you numbers like 13.4-> 13 at 100% + 1 at 40%

[upbeat tide]

There ya go

Underclock one to 78% and your fine

[plain plinth]

Thank you!

[plain plinth]

I don’t have enough space for 18 refineries

[frosty owl]

I don’t have enough space for 18 refineries
@plain plinth #multifloor

[spare steeple]

@frosty owl I sorta gave up on trying to make screws look nice

I don't understand why I find factory builders so hard

and I'm only in T2

I'm using the casted screw recipe

if your wondering

[frosty owl]

What's unsatisfying in it for you?

[spare steeple]

wdym

[frosty owl]

What part of the screw process doesn't look nice to you?
It seems pretty good to me^^
I personally like how you always keep straight lines and 90' turns so I might be a tad biased by that xD

[spare steeple]

Well

I have issues with how everyone seems to find out planning bases to be so easy

like they have superpowers to know where everything should go

I can't do that

[frosty owl]

I have issues with how everyone seems to find out planning bases to be so easy
@spare steeple I think you're overestimating the average player and underestimating the power of building planners ^^
Could it be?

Also, having played through the game one (ore more) time helps A LOT in knowing what is best placed where

I can't do that
@spare steeple IMO the little I saw of your base was nicer then 70% of other bases I've seen (at a comparable tech level, of course). Don't be discouraged! :D

And of course, if you ever need inspiration or help, you know where to ask, right?

[spare steeple]

Like on YT

I see all these awesome bases

and I'm like, I wanna do that

But I can't as I can't even get to the tech levels they work at

The furthest I've got to before giving up was SE T1

Those SE parts are too much for me

And like I know asking for help is great once in awhile, but I find just watching videos to handhold you through the entire game is really boring

[frosty owl]

And like I know asking for help is great once in awhile, but I find just watching videos to handhold you through the entire game is really boring
@spare steeple I totally understand that sentiment. That's why I suggested you to take inspiration rather then watching full videos. Not that it's easy to reproduce someone's base even if you have the video for it (unless unedited)
Personally, I "gave up" more then a year prior then came back after Update 3 and stuck with since. Once I decided to get a megabase using all the nodes on the map having that objective kinda kept me going

and I'm like, I wanna do that
@spare steeple What I usually do (and may work for you, may not) is: look around for ideas, try them out on my own, see what I like and what I don't, then start building and see what comes out. But I have to say, the BIGGEST advantage there is in making a cool-looking base is experience. Again, having played through all the game (so knowing all the machine's ratios, what takes how much space and so on...) is a major advantage in base planning

I suggest you try finishing the game at least once (even going through quickly without bothering about aesthetics) and trying to build a cool base on the second run. Just seeing how much better you're doing compared to before can be really enjoyable 😉

[oblique hollow]

I cant believe i went through the math for this

[frosty owl]

I cant believe i went through the math for this
@oblique hollow I had a feeling they worked kinda like that after all the troubleshooting earlier today... Thanks for making sure and hurting your brain in the process <3

[oblique hollow]

this was done for my infographs to demonstrate some of the quirks of pipes and such. But im happy to also help with your case on top of that

btw, the formula should work for any Junction - Valve Manifold

[frosty owl]

this was done for my infographs to demonstrate some of the quirks of pipes and such. But im happy to also help with your case on top of that
@oblique hollow Doesn't really help my case, but it certanely clears up some points and will avoid me some useless or wrong valve placements!

[oblique hollow]

if it clears up misconceptions, my job has been fulfilled

[frosty owl]

So long story short with valves: don't use them after a water extractor unless there's a storage in between

[oblique hollow]

actually, dont limit building outputs at all, only limit inputs

heres another picture showing the quirks and irks of them

[spare steeple]

@frosty owl Well its mainly the issue of that I struggle with dedication to stuff. So when I'm playing I just sit there doing nothing for hours trying to think about what to do

For instance, the save I'm on right now is nearly 10 hours old and all I've done is setup iron plates, rods and screws

[frosty owl]

E.g.: If you have 100/min out of extractor A and feed it to B, B will NOT get 100/min if you put a valve set on 100 in between as the extractor spikes over 100 sometimes (which will not be carried) and lower then 100 other times.

[spare steeple]

Not even copper

[frosty owl]

Sure, the pipe may be able to compensate with its own buffer, but not always and especially with high volumes

[oblique hollow]

yep, dont put valves in there

[frosty owl]

Works if you put a storage, though

[oblique hollow]

its still risky to do

its unneccessary limiting

[frosty owl]

@frosty owl Well its mainly the issue of that I struggle with dedication to stuff. So when I'm playing I just sit there doing nothing for hours trying to think about what to do
@spare steeple I feel like laughing out lout, because it's exactly what I do too ahahah
It's just like some people say about writing: you gotta start first, think second. Sometimes you need to build something, even if wrong, and then improve on it. Of course, everyone got their own preferencies, but improving is quite time-efficent in this game, rather then rebuilding completely

its unneccessary limiting
@oblique hollow That depends on what you're feeding. For instance if you want to feed 10 packagers you'd need to regulate the flow precisely unless you let it overflow first. Or even worse if you want to split it for 2 buildings
Although I have to admit there are very few scenarios in which you can't just wait for the fluid to overfow before starting the machines

But with the likes of Heavy oil or other processed liquids, it's not so easy to just wait for everything to fill up

[oblique hollow]

if you want to feed 10 packagers, just feed the right amount of fluid in. Valves are not a replacement for factory math

and splitting for two buildings is done by simply using 2 outputs of a junction

[frosty owl]

if you want to feed 10 packagers, just feed the right amount of fluid in. Valves are not a replacement for factory math
@oblique hollow Of course, but unless you overflow the building with liquid first there is little way to balance their input without valves (especially if it's not a multiple of 2)

and splitting for two buildings is done by simply using 2 outputs of a junction
@oblique hollow That is, if they use the same amount of fluid. It's the same point as before, no way to feed exactly the needed amount without overflowing first
I may be using "overflow" improperly here, what I mean is to let all the pipes AND machines to fill up with fluid before starting the production

[oblique hollow]

if i produce around 300 m³/min of liquid and i have 2 machines, one consuming 30 m³/min and the other 170 m³/min, then i dont need a valve if i have no other machines to feed

[bleak coral]

do any of you know where a new pump takes over headlift? cause there's some sort of bug in experimental with snap to place pumps but I'm not sure the nature of it

[kindred musk]

heres another picture showing the quirks and irks of them
@oblique hollow where did you find those photos ??

[oblique hollow]

find? i made them

[kindred musk]

a ok thanks👍

[oblique hollow]

np

[frosty owl]

do any of you know where a new pump takes over headlift? cause there's some sort of bug in experimental with snap to place pumps but I'm not sure the nature of it
@bleak coral one pump's headlift ends at the bottom of the next pump

[oblique hollow]

or at the blue head lift limit ring

[frosty owl]

if i produce around 300 m³/min of liquid and i have 2 machines, one consuming 30 m³/min and the other 170 m³/min, then i dont need a valve if i have no other machines to feed
@oblique hollow That is true, but only once all the storages of all said machines are filled up. Before that (or if the flow stops for some reason) it's just 50/50

At least the storages of the machines USING the fluid

[spare steeple]

Here is my awful and way-to-long-to-setup copper factory

Producing an amazing!!!!! 60 wire/m and 30 cable/m

Don't ask why I stuck it in a cliff

[frosty owl]

And perfectly squared to top it off. Man that precision can satisfy any OCD

[spare steeple]

I can't stand squiggly conveyors

least I can do is stick to 90 degree rule

[quick pawn]

hold on @spare steeple

[spare steeple]

Holding

[frosty owl]

Don't ask why I stuck it in a cliff
@spare steeple Considering the location, it's either there or hanging on top of the cliff, so... 😂
Though, having it like a protrusion from the cliff doesn't found bad too 🤔

[spare steeple]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

I could've stuck it ontop of my iron base

[quick pawn]

🙂

it's perfectly symmetrical so I love it ngl

[spare steeple]

Nice

Well mine is in a cliff, so beat that

[quick pawn]

builds factory on the moth

[spare steeple]

Also, I've been super duper slow

[quick pawn]

shall we take this to general?

[frosty owl]

shall we take this to general?
@quick pawn Good idea

[glacial hemlock]

https://satisfactory.gamepedia.com/File:Splitting_and_merging.png
Same design, but it's on grass.

[upbeat tide]

Ok, mk2 pipes are making this soo much simpler

[oblique hollow]

the time has come for me to reveal my updated work

and part 3, (part 2 and 4 are mostly unchanged)

(might need to open the original, these images are quite large)

[frosty owl]

Where will these be posted?

[oblique hollow]

the official wiki and probably reddit

though im waiting for an EA release before i put them on the Wiki

[sullen cloud]

tbh, I still don’t get why they introduced valves

[oblique hollow]

niche flow management cases or simply to prevent backflow without limiting head lift

[frosty owl]

nieche flow management cases or simply to prevent backflow without limiting head lift
@oblique hollow So all my talks about fluids up to now were just nieche stuff, huh? Puffs cheeks

[oblique hollow]

you could do everything up to now without valves.

they were only introduced in this update

[frosty owl]

You just couldn't do it as efficiently 🤷‍♂️