math-and-meta

[unique cypress]

It's quite difficult to get the maximum theoretical throughput of a platform/train, and not just that, the theoretical max per platform isn't equal to 2 belts

[digital wing]

Oh right yeh of course

[versed aurora]

@minor silo like this

[unique cypress]

Same as any other intersection where rails cross - path before, block after

[minor silo]

Asssuming drive right - as KYO says, green is path, red is block, grey is your spacer

[versed aurora]

I did that even with spacers and it still says it loops itself

[minor silo]

Those signals do not look spaced

They're also both on the same side of the track, are you sure they are correct way around?

[versed aurora]

how would I space them?

[minor silo]

Shortest piece of track you can

[unique cypress]

A 1.5-2 foundation long piece of track between the signal and the railway switch (the arrow thingy)

[minor silo]

Zooming in they are not signals, those are the turn indicators, my bad, ignore that

[versed aurora]

so spaced like this?

I must be placing signals wrong then

[minor silo]

First signal is good 🙂

[unique cypress]

That block signal in this image is errored out because the track goes nowhere

[minor silo]

That is correct - they are flashing yellow because end of line

[versed aurora]

ah

I need to loop it to test then

[minor silo]

If you were to put a bit more track and another block signal you'll find the previous one will go green and the next one flashing yellow

[versed aurora]

ah there we go

[hoary pulsar]

I'm proceeding in stages, it's a temporary measure

[versed aurora]

ah thank you, its working now

[hoary pulsar]

@vapid gorge this is the situation now

[versed aurora]

this is my first time doing trains so trying to figure everything out

[hoary pulsar]

I would have to separate 200 from a total of 800 products out of 10 fuel refineries from refiners, does anyone have any advice that does not include retouching at overcook speeds?

[minor silo]

It's a learning curve for sure but looks like you're going to be good at it

[hoary pulsar]

I have 80 fuel for 10 pipe and I need to sent 600 to generator and 200 at the rubber/plastics factory

[bright juniper]

boop

[unique cypress]

Did you optimise for resources?

Because it optimizes for power at the very end (minimum net consumption, with net positive generation being negative consumption)

[mighty fossil]

how do i effecientely recycle 1000 nuclear waste or just 250

[unique cypress]

Efficiently in what way

And which waste

[mighty fossil]

with no backups and 100 percent efficiency on the blenders making non fissile uranium and the particle accelerators making uranium cells

uranium

[mighty fossil]

.

[unique cypress]

That's something basically any calculator can tell you if you tell it which recipes you want to use and how much waste you have

[mighty fossil]

can u recomend me a calulator please

[unique cypress]

http://satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production

[bright juniper]

just maximizing for sing cells

[mighty fossil]

yeah but @unique cypress

[unique cypress]

a) did you input waste and b) are you sure you have enough waste for 10 Plutonium rods

[mighty fossil]

just fixed it thanks

[unique cypress]

Then there's this. List all the resources you care about, give them weights (the higher weight, the more "expensive" it is to use)

[bright juniper]

so would I just list all the raw resources and have water be the lowest?

[unique cypress]

You can skip listing water completely. If it's not on the list, it's not optimized for, so it's as if the weight was 0

[bright juniper]

Doing this makes the optimizer not produce any excess power, and I would like excess power (and ficsonium power because it's cool). How do I do that?

[unique cypress]

set max power consumption to negative whatever you want to make

that'll be net power, though

also, fyi, that'll value all resources equally

[bright juniper]

except water

so it should go for pure recipes

[unique cypress]

it might go for leached because with those settings, sulfur is as cheap as iron/copper/caterium

[bright juniper]

huh

When I optimize for excess power it uses regular iron ore smelting

[bright juniper]

it did not

[unique cypress]

maybe the resource cost of making the extra power required for pure iron is not worth the iron ore savings XD

yeah, making the power consumption 0 makes it use pure iron again

hilarious

[quick gyro]

If I want to maximize how many plutonium rods are produced with 600 uranium/min and I have all alt recipies how should I split it between non fissile uranium and encased uranium?

[unique cypress]

dunno why you'd want max plutonium specifically, but for that you want to use all alts for everything nuclear related

[quick gyro]

Because it’s fun

I just want to split my 600 uranium per minute so I have no annoying surplus

[unique cypress]

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=c8AlnY0VDXdp30Bg62RO

[unique cypress]

oh, and ofc you can choose whichever recipes you want for things that aren't directly a part of the uranium chain

[quick gyro]

Thanks

[steel knot]

I did nuclear on my first playthrough and it was fun but fuel seems more economical. I just hate the idea of fields of generators. Anyone skip nuclear the second time around?

[brisk smelt]

economical ..?

[steel knot]

The supply chain

[unique cypress]

rocket fuel is really cheap and easy to make

regular fuel? idk, it's a lot of oil

[brisk smelt]

yeah rocketfuel is not balanced as is

it needs to be much more complex imo

[unique cypress]

it should at least be more complex than TF

[steel knot]

Yeah. Rocket or ionized were on my mind. Last playthrough rocket fuel was an afterthought. This time I automated it early and it’s incredible

[unique cypress]

ionized is objectively worse than rocket for power

it should be an upgrade to RF too tbh

[steel knot]

Ah interesting. Maybe I’ll just make some for drones/jetpacks then

[rain lichen]

if i were to plan out the entire game from the start (doing the math for each and every major factory i'll need and when to build them), how would i even go about that?

[crystal hatch]

Download a free “game” from steam called Satisfactory Modeler.

[rain lichen]

my first thought was stuffing the phase 5 parts into a calculator and going backwards from there, seeing how many SE parts ill need, but it looks more like a cobweb than anything rn and working with this mess is a no-go imo

[unique cypress]

yeah, that or multiple tabs in SFTools

[crystal hatch]

Type in the type and # of products you want at the end, and backtrack your way to the beginning.

[old hearth]

do we think this is enough for 445 fuel gens, 100 converters, 13 more particle accelerators and 42 quantum encoders?

oh and a train station for 10,000 coal

[unique cypress]

that last one is the smallest of them all lol

[old hearth]

fair

[mint coral]

I have always done nitro rocket fuel. Since they released it. But ya it does require like 240 fuel overclocked to 240% generators for 600 oil /min

[digital wing]

Can anyone help? The stations on the left of the pic are fine, but the stations on the right cant get to their destination because of a signalling issue. I think its the big green intersection causing the problems as if i self drive up to the red, theyre able to autopilot to their destination

[steel knot]

Yeah and I’m fine doing like 24 at a time or something as needed. The nitro rocket fuel blueprint takes up very little space and is easily stampable

[mint coral]

I like that about it. On BP fits one refiner(250%oc) and two blenders(200%oc) perfectly. Using 75 oil.

[digital wing]

This bp is the best thing ever

I love bps which are just entire factories you chain together

[wet coral]

Can someone take a look at my train line I cannot for the life of me figure out what is wrong with it

[mint coral]

please make a thread in #1038092680493801533 its a lot easier to trouble shoot there. Please incude pictures and a detail description of the issue

[wet coral]

What if I have no idea where the issue may be?

[mint coral]

give what info you can ^_6

[rain lichen]

starting a completely new save and decided to plan out EVERYTHING... these are my notes for the night, to be continued tomorrow

i've never dipped my toes into phase 5 before so i think my confusion is quite clear near the bottom there

[crimson moat]

You're trying to get rid of DMR on one step, and trying to make it out of SAM on the step next to it.

Just take that excess DMR and put it where you need the DMR

SAM DMR as a last resort (i used zero of this in my own first P5, but it can be an easy hack after-the-fact to make the numbers work with certain production..)

[rain lichen]

im doing a mix of the two
well dont quote me on that, ill def look into it more deeply later on

[mint coral]

i tend to make plans as i go with only vague bullets of goals when starting.

Like
mix logistics using trains drones and trucks
not leaving floating platforms, After something is functional, Beautify
Go nuclear
only one train station per biome
make a teleportor Mega hub

[crimson moat]

P5 is a bit of a mindfuck in that you're incentivised to keep most of the production in one big dependant blob together to avoid the problem of excess DMR over here, shortage of DMR over there.

after being pushed to not do that for half of the game

[rain lichen]

yup i usually plan as i go
buuuut i do like putting well-planned stuff into action, so we'll see how this playstyle feels for me :)

[rain lichen]

so basically i shouldn't plan for individual P5 parts, but rather all of P5 as a whole

[crimson moat]

yeah

[rain lichen]

gotcha

[crimson moat]

you will have some net DMR at the end of that and you can add it with SAM or take it away with crystals

to balance it out perfectly

[mint coral]

either or is fine. But to each there own

[crimson moat]

Orr you can make more/less of certain parts, and sink them, like AI expansion servers are net positive DMR.

[rain lichen]

ficsonium power's gonna be fun 💔

[crimson moat]

ficsonium is interesting

in a questionable way 😄

[rain lichen]

i can't just simply avoid it either
i've already decided to do like... everything i can do 😓

including automating miners for some reason

[unique cypress]

that's actually a better idea than doing ficsonium

[opaque token]

poor crater man

[shadow sinew]

this is why we need dense, mixed used industrial zones, you need towers xd

I´m making a tower design Imma share tomorrow that I should finish it, it´s a tower to process 1500 limestone and 940 iron ore into iron ingot, and I think it´s pretty

foundries are the best building in the game xd, I haven´t gotten to tier 9 yet, but they are compact, pretty and a joy to work with

[steel knot]

On the planning aspect, this time I just decided I want X/min of each phase 5 part. This kept me from some scope creep in the earlier phases.

[vapid gorge]

did you solve it? and no with fluids you want to keep the sections completely seperate as much as possible. Make a 200 group and an 800 group.

making 2x 400 groups for fuel gens would be a better option

[versed violet]

Game progress question / advice request.
I'm at tier 9, have the AI server and Warp Drive parts to make and send.
Is it better to
rush those, finish the game, then chill out with other projects
OR
rework my lower tier factories for larger output, then build up proper manufacturing for neuro-quantum processor and superpos oscillator (will probably need setting up a new factory for computer/oscillator stuff, something I did not do for quite a while)
I am a bit afraid of burnout once I technically "finish" the game.

From plus sides, I have plenty of power available due to 600 uranium to MW factory already built, with waste recycling included.

[hoary pulsar]

The result did not satisfy me, I probably had to choose a better location to produce this plant, I had to lower the production from 800/min to 600/min because of the problem related to excess, I wanted to use that fuel recycling to produce rubber and plastic... I'm not happy but now I have the necessary energy to fix everything else

[lone parrot]

Trying to understand the basics. Just spent 2-3 hours on the most BASIC factory and it doesn’t work as intended. So I drew that, is there an error somewhere? MK2 Miner at the beginning (120/min), 240 wire/min at the end. I know the number of buildings is right (4 smelters, 8 constructors).

[vapid gorge]

Sorry, not clear what the issue was? just splitting your fuel into 2 groiups should have been simple

[vapid gorge]

for one, those mergers should be splitters. Whats your final ouitput goal?

[lone parrot]

Shit I still have troubles with splitters and mergers

240 wire/min

So no need for mergers here?

[vapid gorge]

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=S2OF3xgVbbSlCEvSuX8u

[vapid gorge]

mergers merge, splitters split

the ingots and belts shouldn't even be getting connected

[lone parrot]

I’m on it, but it just gives me that

[vapid gorge]

yes thats the basic plan

show an overhead image of the factory that isn't working

[lone parrot]

Yeah but it does not tell me the details

[hoary pulsar]

I have serious production problems, I have done a lot of exploration so I will look for a way to produce in more efficient ways, for now I will start using pure recipes where I have marked the squares to produce basic minerals, while for production I will establish factories in the desert a little further north

[vapid gorge]

eh pure recipes are overrated.
Plan locations for your factory in places with enough ore to do basic or alloy. Alloy recipes are very cool

[hoary pulsar]

I’m scanning like 20 modular for now

I cleaned 3/5 area complete

[vapid gorge]

scanning 20 modular?

[hoary pulsar]

Sorry for my bad English, I mean hard drive from the crash site

[vapid gorge]

ah. And why are you only using pure nodes?

[hoary pulsar]

I didn’t

[vapid gorge]

ah, well that's all that's on your map

[hoary pulsar]

I’m in the desert right now

Is where I’m planning di start to produce some essential material for some new project at nord

But I need to setup a rail networks or a street network

[lone parrot]

I’m trying to draw it but it was so complicated I can’t do it

Since i made modifications

And it’s just a WIRE factory

I really don’t understand the basics

[hoary pulsar]

Are you new? I’m too…I know the feeling 😭

[lone parrot]

@vapid gorge Is this it?

[vapid gorge]

please just take an over head image of what you have built

the drawings don't help because it's not the broken factory

[lone parrot]

I can’t it’s a real real mess, I just want to know if what I’m showing you works

[vapid gorge]

possibly - but you've probably not built it that way so I can't tell you what's wrong

like maybe you have lower mk belts hidden somewhere

or connected thigns wrong

if it's that big a mess you probably shouldn't worry about it and just let it run as well as it can

and build less messily next time

[lone parrot]

@vapid gorge I made it, reloaded, that’s the exact shit, look at that

See how COMPLICATED I went?

For a wire factory?

[vapid gorge]

I mean that sounds like you made life harder on your yourself for no reason

you can make anything in this game stupidly hard if you want

[lone parrot]

I don’t want to 🤣

[vapid gorge]

but all these sketches were also 100x the work than just showing images or keeping things tidy

[vapid gorge]

I mean obviously you do since you're doing it

[lone parrot]

Yeah but that’s because I don’t understand the basics

[vapid gorge]

95% of the work was done for you in this image

you just needed to manage 240 into two groups

walking the dogs, the diagrams still don't help, sorry

[lone parrot]

I’m lost with splitters and mergers I think

And distribution, like with the 4 smelters at the start of the chain

1 smelter goes to 1 splitter into 2 constructors?

[limpid knot]

Just divide the output of the smelter by the input of the splitter.

[lone parrot]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/558721941410807812/1440133674220785825/IMG_4307.jpg?ex=691d0c80&is=691bbb00&hm=130f8252a376b8bc9a68b0cd11b5ac97abe9db60bbb90e196503092af73f10c6&

So this one works?

[pastel obsidian]

What are you making. Not all the ratios are 1:2 or 1:4. is something you need to be aware of

[lone parrot]

Making this

Want to start with the most basic design

[vapid gorge]

except you did not keep it basic

from the top, ore to smelters, ingots to wire - done

[lone parrot]

That’s for sure 🤣

I don’t understand your drawing bro

Where are the 4 smelters and 8 constructors?

[vapid gorge]

don't worry about the number of boxes

replace it with however many you need, I wasn't going to waste time drawing every little line

top is smelters
bottom is constructors
the output is in 2 groups as you only have mk2 belts

[pastel obsidian]

There are different approaches to production. In cobalt's example they have a line of smelters making copper ingots that goes to make a like of copper wire in this example.

In your picture you are making copper wire directly form the ore in one module if that makes sense

[wooden jasper]

In terms of meta, what are some of the best speedrunner-esque shortcuts people have found? So far I've really just come to realize how good getting nobelisks early and exploring the world is, but beyond that I feel like I'm playing the game at regular speed

I guess I could just watch the speedrun record but I don't have the patience or dedication for that

[pastel obsidian]

You can skip the early to early mid game with items you find during exploration

[steel knot]

can someone explain the "limit" in the Satisfactory Modeler Miner setting? it's set to 60, which i thought was just belt speed but when I up it, it's unrealistic to the type of node i specify

trying to get clock speeds given a node quality and miner mark

[pastel obsidian]

Set the number to what you want it to output

The other settings just change how it looks not what it outputs.

I'm not sure if there is any tool that will limit outputs to the belt speed I might be wrong

[steel knot]

yeah i just wanted it to tell me clock speed of a mark 2 on a Normal node. something like that

i can do it manually but thought it was weird

[formal cloak]

Is there an easy way to distribute something like this or is overflow the best solution?

[wind spade]

easiest is not to distribute at all. Make three groups of refineries, each making the desired amount

[formal cloak]

Somehow i genuinely did not think of that. Thank you

This is my first decently big factory so it’s been kind of daunting

[vapid gorge]

clocking groups of machines and selectively merging them to what you need is probably the simplest way to do most things 🙂

[formal cloak]

Yeah I’ll have to rethink my factory a little bit. Luckily it’s just iron and copper and they only go to 3 things

[pastel obsidian]

You can always overproduce three lines of iron and sink it

Really depends on if you need iron for other projects down the line or not.

[vapid gorge]

just think of hte tiers as a tutorial you're learning in 🙂

[formal cloak]

Yeah grouping as opposed to overflow would’ve been nice for phase 3

Oh well

[rain lichen]

wait, is this true?

[vapid gorge]

probably not.

No idea where you found that

[wind spade]

Since pipes are bidirectional, not even the arrows are true

[hoary pulsar]

I don’t understand pipes at 100%

I read the manual😅

[vapid gorge]

mostly - keep it simple, point A to B don't have a lot merges or splits, keep your manifolds flat and don't feed from below

sometimes you need manifold loops

[crimson moat]

Due to a junction bug, kinda.

[pastel obsidian]

Test it out and get 3 water extractors and see which one turns off

[crimson moat]

it depends on which way you rotate the junction

so it can look almost identical but behave opposite if you're not careful with that

[lone parrot]

So quick question, when you have 4 smelters (to distribute equally into 8 fabricators), how do you split your ores before the smelters (meaning from the first belt coming out of the miner), 1 splitter into 2 other splitters into the smelters?

[vapid gorge]

A belt with splitters in front of the inputs

[lone parrot]

So the first belt from the miner goes into 4 splitters each in front of each smelter?

[vapid gorge]

Yup

It’s self balances

[lone parrot]

OK perfect

And then 1 splitter out of each smelter into 2 fabricators since I need 8 fabricators? So 4 more splitters?

[lone parrot]

8 splitters total?

[lone parrot]

@vapid gorge If I understand it right i have 2 choices for distribution , manifold or balancing

I’ll try both

https://youtu.be/BUbNdBT3zPo?si=bwscvndnssDUtuLL

This one just helped me a lot

[shadow sinew]

The scale of the game really is hitting me now that the place I once wanted to use as my main base to produce everything, 4 pure iron nodes, 1 copper, 3.5 limestone and 3.5 coal, isn´t going to cut it just for the 600 motors I need for cooling system and turbo motor production, and I´m getting kinda tight on space (because I want to make it pretty but still)

it´s the ''large'' flat area with the 4 pure irons in the forest spawn if you are curious

[wind spade]

Yeah, game expects you to have factories all over the map

[shadow sinew]

I do, ig I did explain myself poorly too, I was gonna have factories for basic stuff, up to like computers and heavy modular frames and bring in everything there for final assembly, anyway, now just building electromagnetic control rods I´m using a train line going through the entire north of the map

tbf back then I wasn´t planning on mass producing thermal rockets like I now am

[unique cypress]

New cursed valve lore dropped? https://www.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/s/vxrRn8VCCf
(Haven't verified it myself yet)

[oblique hollow]

Glossed over this only real quick:

Valves are accurate, their display isnt

And double throttle is a terrible idea for liquids.
Gasses might work fine

Also "they watched the flow"
... Where?

not even pipes themselves have an accurate enough flow display

They should have shoved that fluid into machines and let it run for a few hours

Buffers are a terrible test

But as for the 4.724 ever x ticks....Perhaps...?

Last time i tested this i managed to have very fine readings on the fluid levels inside machines

So i will get back to you on that later today

What i will say:

I assume its like with machines that have sloops in them but only enough for fractional item outputs

this results in the machines outputting an alternating pattern of more or less items every X seconds

[rain lichen]

feel like everything is "kinda" when you're working with pipes 💔

[wind spade]

@little patio see

(numbers are just example, you will ofc scale it up)

[little patio]

This helps. Because my layout is just confusing me atm

[wind spade]

you can make your own with numbers you need at https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production

[little patio]

Never used the website before, but will use it now.

[shadow sinew]

Is rigor motor generally good?

[wind spade]

no recipe is "generally good" or "generally bad", always depends on situation you're in

or the goal you're aiming for

[shadow sinew]

Can't quite make up my mind if the quartz cost is worth it, I dont think I'll do a lot of heavy quartz stuff in tier 9, but I may change my mind

[unique cypress]

I don't see a point when you can make motors out of just iron, which is basically free

[wind spade]

I don't see a point in making it just out of iron and requiring 168468671747484 iron per motor 🤷

(which again is an example how recipes are useful for some people, but others use different ones)

[shadow sinew]

I'm using real steel, but yeah, I should prob just do pink diamonds, normal aluminum with my quartz

[oblique hollow]

You can turn coal to quartz

And its a pretty big yield (SAM / coal per quartz crystal)

[versed violet]

there is third one, spaghetti.

[shadow sinew]

Nuclear spaghetti would be nice

[versed violet]

there is pasta, just put some on convoluted belt

[oblique hollow]

Btw, i did take a deeper look at the valve bit you shared today.
I did some tests and yep, valve flow limiting still seems very much accurate.
i could not detect any sort of flow stutter / oscillation between multiples of 600/127 or 300/127- the only thing i noticed were display inaccuracies by pipes AND valves

So as far as i know - the display is shit on valves and pipes cause it does average flow rate calc and then rounds that

mk 2 pipes literally cannot show flow rates smaller than 5

and mk 1 pipes show flow in multiples of 2.36, rounded

but thats not the actual flow - its a rounded average of the actual flow per frame with a precision of only 127 bits.
and the reason it is signed is because flow rate in pipes is actually directional (duh - how else could flow go both ways through pipes)

so my guess is they just copy pasted the same display pipes used in pipes onto valves and added a decimal place of extra visibility

but the flow rate they deliver is - by all means - VERY much accurate

i think the reason pipe flow rate tends to be thought of as more accurate is because it does an average calculation over time of a bunch of these low precision readings - and doesnt show you a decimal
it basically interpolates between these points and thats how you get your "closer to reality" flow rate readings

this thing is actually flowing at 6/min

this one actually does 3/min

this one's doing 23/min

[unique cypress]

I tested valves back in 1.0 and concluded that the display has 128 values, so shows values rounded to the nearest multiple of 300/127 or 600/127, depending on which pipe it's placed on.

The actual flow through a valve seemed perfectly accurate - a buffer between a valve set to 240 and a machine set to 240 showed no signs of draining or filling, despite the valve showing a flow of 240.9

What's funny is that the pipe before the valve showed 240.9 and the one after 240.

But that's too high of a flowrate to see any potential bunching and the buffer was obviously sloshing

[oblique hollow]

(this is also why mk 2 pipes sometimes show 299/min or 301/min or 602/min)

[oblique hollow]

dont forget that the input of a valve is still a bidirectional buffer

so the flow rate there can oscillate more

no clue how you got a pipe to show 240.9/min though, given that they dont have decimals

[unique cypress]

maybe it was 241, idk

it was several months ago

but I remember that 1 pipe showed closer to the valve and the other closer to the actual flow

I don't even remember if I was testing at 240 or something else

[oblique hollow]

hmm.
either way, i made a comment on that guys post too describing the same findings.

And also the double valve bug with liquids

btw this was with vanilla pipes - i'll try and see if hydrostatic changes anything

nnnnope, still works the same - but the input pipe into the manifold is just smoother now

[oblique hollow]

New manual when

[crimson moat]

nice chart

[frosty owl]

Look at that graph

[unique cypress]

1.2

[oblique hollow]

(Im still far from done with this thing)

[dusky dust]

Why not just let ChatGPT write it?

I'll, um. Show myself out.

[crimson moat]

I managed to clog part of a mk.2 manifold taking 400 water somewhere. Too much standing water in one part of the pipe prevented machines from unloading into it.

extra funny because i have the same setup twice, mirrored, and one of them breaks itself in that way while the other doesn't

probably some very minor and accidental build difference somewhere

@oblique hollow you should take a look at some of the other cursed pipes i have

where there is less than +44m of elevation, some pumps read +43.6m and work fine, others going to/from the same altitude read +48.3m and DO NOT WORK FULLY, despite that being less than +50m.

that's what was causing the intermittent flow dropouts i talked to you about the other day 😄

[oblique hollow]

have you tried rebuilding the output pipe on the pumps that show 48.3 ?
top to bottom vs bottom to top?

[crimson moat]

will do

[oblique hollow]

also, does that manifold per chance involve bottom feeding

or like, unloading fluids into a manifold thats below the machines

[crimson moat]

nope

I knew of both behaviors but

it's new to me that a pump can have insufficient headlift while reading 48.3m at most, and never warning.

[oblique hollow]

any valves ?

[crimson moat]

nope

[oblique hollow]

hmm

[crimson moat]

it obviously is headlift because i slapped another pump further up the pipe and it works flawlessly now

oh

when i added the second pump

the headlift display changed from max 48.3m

to 16.2 + 37.5

but the actual elevation is literally <44m (i counted with foundations)

so the 43.6 pumps are correct, and these lines, maybe due to building top to bottom instead of bottom to top (or vice versa) are cursed and inaccurate in a way that broke them when they should have worked.

We both verified that can affect the detected size before, but i think it is height too like you said, and it's requiring more headlift than it should.

they are visually the same, it's another way that you can break pipes without changing how they visually look at all so screenshots are of limited usefulness for diagnosing pipe issues

Pretty insidious as well because you get things like one player habitually builds pipes bottom to top, and another habitually builds them top to bottom, and they think they are building the same thing. They each do it in their own similar but different way, even when rebuilding, and they look the same in picture but they are actually not the same to the simulation engine.

Sometimes that results in one working while the other has catastrophic failure.. or worse, one of them might blip occasionally and flow at avg 580/600 instead of 600/600 which can appear to be working just as well, but develop a failure with prolonged usage.

[oblique hollow]

i did some tests with the height some time ago and i cant quite remember the result.
But it was something to the effect of "this error is only for the first pipe segment connected to the pump" or something

btw, i think pumps DO factor in if the pipe is shoved into them or not

aka if you splice a pipe by snapping a pump onto it

if what EtenrnalUnion said is true pumps know about their height and must also know about the offset between their connection port and the pipe thats connected to them

btw, heres the full page for flow rate gauges so far

im still working on the wording of course

i do plan to include more detail in that manual than the other one though

[mint coral]

What if..... 1.2 makes all this irrelevant

Looks good mind you

[oblique hollow]

kinda doubt it

but who knows

i'd be surprised if they actually implemented some suggested tweaks

[dusky dust]

I'm still on the fence about it; that video thumbnail was awfully suggestive, but it could still be that the Fluid Truck was sort of the joke

Time will tell, of course!

[mint coral]

We fixed fluids

Kinda

[dusky dust]

"Fixed Fluids" == "max total pipeline length is 50m; everything longer must now use Fluid Trucks"

[mint coral]

I don't like that at all.

I'd rather have fluid drones. I don't like recording truck paths at all.

[oblique hollow]

need pumps every 50m regardless of angle now

aka old factorio pipes but 3d now

[dusky dust]

Should just let us daisy-chain pumps and do without the actual pipes altogether!

[oblique hollow]

thank you pipe tuner for making flow rate smooth (mk 2 pipe on output)

first time i ever did something like this

and surprise - it works.
it would probably even work with vanilla pipe settings - though it wouldn't flow this smoothly out of the extractor

[mint coral]

This is generally what I do. I always fill from above

[crimson moat]

Wet concrete is one of the most well behaved recipies because it has very high consumption per machine

worst case is the opposite, turbofuel

[oblique hollow]

these guys are using
5.5/min
3/min
4/min
10/min
23/min

[crimson moat]

ah

[oblique hollow]

and the valves have the same settings

well this one IS full... just not going over 300/min

[crimson moat]

Ok i misunderstood 😄

[unique cypress]

who knows what they'll do

But they had so many complaints about fluids from all the people playing 1.0, so if they half-assed the fix, people would be mad. and if they're talking about it, they're working on it

[wooden jasper]

25 hours and I'm done with all the milestones up to tier 8, maybe I'll be done in 35ish hours total

Not a speedrun per se but a huge upgrade to my first W

[sturdy sage]

What is with the recipe for diamonds taking 600 coal so it’s not possible to fully overclock what recipes are alternate for that?

[mint coral]

there is a alt made with oil, Coal limestone, petrol diamonds, quartz diamonds, turbofuel coal,

[mint coral]

knowledge is power, Im doing the opposite lol

[somber crag]

yo cast screws first hard drive🎉

[dusky bronze]

there are a lot of alts but most of them take fairly large numbers

[dusky dust]

What's up with it is that CSS didn't balance the recipes with the goal of "all recipes must be 250% overclockable."

In the end, they wanted the base Diamonds recipe to be extremely coal-heavy, and the only way to do it in the ratios they currently have would be to make the recipe worse, for no other reason than to fit that somewhat-arbitrary goal

[pastel obsidian]

It does have two inputs.....

[sturdy sage]

Yes, but two inputs isn’t reliable in the way. It may have a slight overflow and caused the entire secondary input to back up. Also, some multiple input machines require a designated input for one material IDK if that’s still true though.

[pastel obsidian]

But that's the case for any machine that has two inputs.....

[sturdy sage]

In earlier updates of the game, I thought that specific inputs were specific to what item went into it first, but it does have the time to back up if you do not have the correct ratio

[pastel obsidian]

You can just have two inputs of coal

[sturdy sage]

Then again, I might be nuts

[pastel obsidian]

Both inputs can be coal

[sturdy sage]

OK, NVM

[pastel obsidian]

Does that make sense?

[sturdy sage]

Yeah, that makes sense. I thought it required another item with it, though is what I meant.

[pastel obsidian]

I think you get that with the turbo diamonds

[quiet wraith]

anybody got a 1:15 or 2:15 load balancer blueprint at all?

[pastel obsidian]

What are you balancing

[quiet wraith]

12 smelters to 15 constructors

[pastel obsidian]

And also why, in most cases things will auto balance

You can build 3 more smelters and connect them directly into the constructor. Or look up manifold and let the belts auto balance given enough time, using mk 1 belts can help with spreading out the load too

[quiet wraith]

because im trying to future prrof it as its got 540 incoming but i only have mk4 belts so im trying to remove as many bottle necks as possible for later

[pastel obsidian]

A balancer would just add extra complexity when you need more iron ingot production

You might find a smart spitter useful where each smelter feeds a contactor and the overflow goes to the extra end feeding the 3 extra constructors..

[quiet wraith]

yeah its my caterium factory that ill later add to for computers etc and its running off one node as i hate doing train and truck networks

and balancers are satisfying so

[pastel obsidian]

They are, but imagine playing factorio without blueprints or bots

[quiet wraith]

ive never played factorio

[pastel obsidian]

It might be the game for you if you like belts

[quiet wraith]

na i prefer aesthetics thats why i want to balance the 12 to 15 i like my factories looking good

[pastel obsidian]

4:5 balancer is what you would need

If you under clock the smelter to 80% you would have a better 1:1 ratio

[quiet wraith]

alright thank you ill look into it

[digital wing]

does anyone have an example of a battery production line in tools or smth i could see

[vapid gorge]

Just set the output to batteries

I generally use the classic alt though

[digital wing]

well yeah obviously lol, i just wanted to see if anyone gad any cool ways of making it which use as few types of resources as poss

[vapid gorge]

Mainly the bauxite
Sloppy + electrode cuts out coal and you need oil for the batteries

You coukd do instant scrap I suppose if you have sulfur near you? Though that would cut into the local sulfur for the batteries

[digital wing]

is 500 a minute overkill lmao

i feel like it is, i think ill have like 10-15 drones running w a max length of the gold coast to the dune desert

[knotty hornet]

That's crazy overkill

[digital wing]

lmao

what do u think is a safe number for like 15-20 drones

like 200 seems good

[knotty hornet]

The NW nitrogen to SE blue crater uses 4/min per drone

So you could get away with probably only 100/min for 20 drones

Rounding up for good measure

Also, yeah, do instant scrap, way more fun to use sulfur.

[digital wing]

i always use elctrode for aluminium it makes it way easier to find a place to make it

[pastel obsidian]

you can use regular fuel for drones if you want an alternative.

[vapid gorge]

Two plutonium rods pm would get you the same results

[knotty hornet]

Blue Crater has hella coal and sulfur for it

[digital wing]

im gonna do nuclear soon, i just wanna finish building my factory that produces all the elevator parts

[knotty hornet]

But it also has hella crude, so I guess it doesn't really matter.

I just like the one step process, though I guess it's technically two still, cuz you gotta make sulfuric.

[hoary pulsar]

I saw that every now and then a tank is placed at the beginning of the pipes for the generators, why?

[gleaming marten]

this is probably a silly question but I'm planning to run 120% overclocked assemblers for rotors to simplify the screw lines, I'm aiming for an output for 40/min, they produce 4.8/min at 120%. 40/4.8 give me 8.33 repeating assemblers, but what do I actually need to set the clock speed to on the last assembler? 39.6%?

[lapis rock]

there's no reason to use fluid buffers anywhere except fluid platforms for trains. they never fix problems and they often cause problems

[hoary pulsar]

ah

so is pure desing?

[lapis rock]

lots of people don't understand what they do and they throw them at problems hoping for a fix. But yes, they can also be decorative. but you have to understand how to not cause problems when decorating with them 😕

[hoary pulsar]

so implementing them can only cause more problems

[lapis rock]

if you don't fully understand how they work in the game you're likely to get behaviors you don't expect. There is like a 27 page PDF on how fluids work in this game and it's that long because it needs to be that long

[lapis rock]

wouldn't you just make 8 at 100% and one at 33 1/3%?

[gleaming marten]

if my belts could actually handle the throughput, yeah

at 100% it would also be different since they produce 4/min then

the reason I want to do 120% is because then it uses 24 iron rods and 120 screws / min which I should be able to pretty easily manifold with mk3 belts

at 100% it's 100 screws/min for each assembler and that sounds miserable to deal with

[lapis rock]

why is that miserable? one cast screw constructor makes 100 screws/min at 200%

or two constructors at 100%

[gleaming marten]

well I don't have cast screws for starters

so i'm working with the 40/min default recipe

[hoary pulsar]

i reed it..but I'm still having a hard time managing everything, I'm new and I'm just getting into fluids, I made a fuel system but I'm going to tear it down because I don't like how I managed everything

[lapis rock]

but yeah this is why it's easiest to just not care if your machines all run all the time. You can trivially make as many as you want and not try to figure this out

If you just stop caring about how much stuff runs and when then you don't have to do any of this.

you just make manifolds and are happy and move on 🙂

anyhow, back to your original question, wouldn't it just be 1/3 of 120 -- so 40%?

where did the 39.6% come from?

[gleaming marten]

it came from me trying to do division at 2:30am

[oblique hollow]

The logical part of the brain was asleep at that time and only the artistic one remained awake

[lapis rock]

but seriously just tell your brain to stop being dumb and stop making you think you care if machines are running all the time. Let manifolds back up and enjoy the power you get from building fast 🙂

[gleaming marten]

gotta have all the lights green

[hoary pulsar]

This game has serious addiction problems

[limpid rain]

Moving my question here as it is likely just a math question I am too tired to reason out. How many coal generators does it take to match a turbo fuel generator? Assuming equal clockspeeds and 100% uptime of both

[oblique hollow]

A turbofuel generator is the same as a normal fuel gen

they make 250 MW each

so its 3 Fuel gens to 10 coal gens

[limpid rain]

Ah the difference is just efficiency of fuel consumption between fuel types?

[oblique hollow]

Yes

It doesnt increase the power output of a generator - it just burns slower

[gleaming marten]

also i don't really understand this thinking. if i didn't calc how many assemblers i needed and how much they're gonna use, how would i know how many constructors to build for plates/rods/screws? do you just wing it? 🧐

like what's the process if you aren't planning everything

[digital wing]

i think he means you should know how much you need, but dont worry about having all the machines run 100% of the time throughout the production line

[hollow vale]

There are online tools that do all that legwork if a person wants just as an fyi , otherwise you can always overproduce and sink the excess easy enough if you just want to wing it.

[unique cypress]

You don't plan nothing, you just don't plan clock speed. Just leave everything at 100% speed and it works fine

[gleaming marten]

yeah I know about satisfactory calculator and stuff, they don't really work well early on because of limited belt throughput ime

"just belt 1032.25/min screws into 10.322 assemblers" thank you satisfactory tools very cool

[unique cypress]

Satisfactory Calculator's Production Planner is by far the absolute worst calculator for this game FYI

[gleaming marten]

I know of 3 and they're all kinda bad

[unique cypress]

Use a balancer or mixer and you basically can

[unique cypress]

Basically all calculators for this game are good. SCIM is the only one that's bad

[gleaming marten]

idk. all of them give the same information, which is the most technically efficient way to maximize production, but that is rarely actually practical

[unique cypress]

SCIM doesn't (and that's just one of the reasons why it's bad)

Also, I often implement SFTools plans directly - no changes from me. It's perfectly practical

[gleaming marten]

a lot of it is also just kinda actually nonsensical information. e.g, SFtools tells me to split my ingot outputs to 371.613/min to iron plate constructors and 588.387/min to iron rods

[hollow vale]

You can change the input amount of material (like ore) to mimic your belt level for early game in sftools.

[gleaming marten]

while i could technically do that just fine with manifolds if i had belts with that kind of throughput, that just isn't relevant information for me

[unique cypress]

And what's the issue with that?

[gleaming marten]

there is no way to balance that (and remain sane) and i don't have mk6 belts

[unique cypress]

I could do this just fine with MK1 belts

[gleaming marten]

explain to me how you would belt 32 smelters into 371.6 and 588.3 lines with mk1 belts, please

not even trying to be rude i am genuinely curious because that doesn't seem at all possible to me

[hollow vale]

What are you trying to make ?

[gleaming marten]

trying to efficiently make 960 iron ore into smart plating

[hollow vale]

With mark 1 belts ?

[gleaming marten]

no with mk3 belts

i have no idea how mk1 belts came into the conversation

[unique cypress]

With this: #math-and-meta message
just expanded to take 16 belts in, 17 belts out. Or belt 1 smelter to 2 plate constructors until I'm left with <2 constructors left, same with rod constructors until I'm left with <4 and then use a mixer (if it's even necessary)

In general, I use mixers whenever I exceed belt speeds, but the ratios match here so well that it'd be a waste of time

[gleaming marten]

respectable but I have no interest in learning to build balancers

I would much rather just manifold than have 100 splitters piled up

[hollow vale]

So like this ? https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=92J4NYgfzrKujUwHvdcY

[unique cypress]

This is not a balancer, it's a mixer. Much easier to build

[gleaming marten]

i don't even know what that is tbh

[unique cypress]

Something that solves all issues with belt throughput which you're complaining about

You only need a belt fast enough to feed/extract a single machine

[gleaming marten]

I honestly don't even understand how this would do anything

You have a giant block of 80 mergers

[unique cypress]

And splitters

It connects every belt to every other belt

Meaning items can flow from anywhere to anywhere

If one belt becomes full, and there's somewhere else for the input to go, it'll go there

[gleaming marten]

so it's an overcomplicated manifold?

[unique cypress]

It can turn any random mix of belts into any other, completely different mix of belts - as long as the slowest ones fill up

Yes, it's made entirely of manifolds

And you need complicated if you want to exceed belt speed limits

[gleaming marten]

fair

[unique cypress]

As an example, I care so little about any individual belt that I once used a balancer to turn 4 belts of 360 into 4 belts of 360. I just saw that I had 4 belts in, 4 belts out, and just pasted a 4:4 balancer without thinking about it

Since then I discovered mixers so I'd use that now instead (much lower footprint)

[gleaming marten]

yeah seems more compact than a belt balancer for sure

i still don't understand wtf i'm looking at though lmao

[unique cypress]

But this just shows how little any individual belt matters (other than actually fitting within the belt limits)

[unique cypress]

A grid of manifolds. In this case, it has 8 inputs, 5 outputs. So it has 8 vertical splitter manifolds with 4 splitters each, and 5 horizontal merger manifolds with 8 mergers each (could be 7, because the last one is just 1 belt in 1 belt out)

You can swap which one is vertical, and which one horizontal

[gleaming marten]

oh I didn't realize the belts on the ground were the input

[unique cypress]

What matters is that there's a path from every input to every output capable of full belt speed independently of the other belts

[gleaming marten]

building this seems like a nightmare

[unique cypress]

Not really. You start with the lifts, which you extend as high as they can go. Then you stack splitters/mergers on it (depending which side you want on the vertical). Then remove the rest of the lift sticking out of the top. Then build horizontal manifolds starting from the bottom, connecting them to the vertical ones as you go (if you build all at once, the belts actually become a nightmare to connect, don't). The last horizontal manifold sticks out 1 above the last splitter/merger of the vertical, and then you place lifts connecting them

You can also easily blueprint horizontal and vertical manifolds of different lengths so you can just combine them

[gleaming marten]

I still don't really understand how to use this but ty seems helpful

[unique cypress]

It is helpful if you want to deal with multiple belts with completely different amounts of items on them.

[frosty owl]

Funfact: while I was mako g a nod to that meme, I never actually understood it 😅

[gleaming marten]

what are you using the one you showed me for?

[unique cypress]

That one's the first one I've ever built (and I suspect the first one in existence, ever), to show Vencam what I came up with. I used it for copper for copper powder because I had some copper refineries already set up in my test world.

Since then, I use them whenever I have/need more than 3 belts of something. With 3 and less, I already have balancer BPs and they're about as compact so I don't bother with a mixer

[gleaming marten]

how do you place the mergers, they just want to attach to the lift

[unique cypress]

The lift is filled with splitters first, so the mergers shouldn't snap to it. Also, nudging helps

[gleaming marten]

yeah the only snap point they have is the lift

or do you like snap them on the ground and then nudge them up into place

[unique cypress]

I don't see why they'd snap to the lift. Never happened to me. They snap to the top of the merger below, but that's perfect, because you lock it, nudge it up once, and it's in place

Unless you mean the first merger snaps to the lift input?

Then yeah, place it on the ground and nudge it up 3 times (I think?)

[gleaming marten]

no it's trying to snap into the same space as the splitter

but yeah nudging it is fine

[unique cypress]

Ew what

[gleaming marten]

yeah idk game is made of duct tape and spaghetti

[unique cypress]

Can't say I've ever seen one do that. But maybe it did when I thought the ghost disappeared because it didn't have any spot to appear

[gleaming marten]

don't think this is actually very applicable to this factory but this does seem handy to have in the tool belt

[unique cypress]

But yeah the vertical thingys have absolutely janky placement

[gleaming marten]

yeah lifts and splitters have always been janky as hell

they're a lot better now than they were before but they still suck to work with

so if I'm understanding correctly you basically use this to manifold your output belts and are then sending those belts to input manifolds for your machines?

[unique cypress]

Lifts alone are fine. Unless you introduce floor holes, then the lift matches the rotation of the floor hole and rotates itself.

Why floor holes even have rotation when they're perfectly symmetrical is beyond me

[gleaming marten]

floor holes are simultaneously great and absolutely cursed

[gleaming marten]

lifts used to have this fun thing where they would visually connect to something but not actually be belted

[unique cypress]

It'll take absolutely any belts, regardless of origin, designation, or contents.

But yeah, it makes most sense to give it belts that come from/to manifolds

[gleaming marten]

yeah. basically a way to send any number of inputs to any number of outputs as long as the total throughput is correct

[unique cypress]

Also, fun use case for these that isn't possible with balancers (at least not easily): you can swap the splitters/mergers for priority ones to give certain belts priority

Well, the priority has to go left to right, right to left, top to bottom or bottom to top, but still

[gleaming marten]

i haven't messed with priority splitters/mergers yet

(i haven't played since like update 3)

is there a particular reason you have lifts going into the top outputs

couldn't you just have splitters going into those too to make modular blueprints

[unique cypress]

I don't do modular blueprints so idk what you mean?

[gleaming marten]

Like

because there's a lift there, if you blueprinted that design, it wouldn't stack vertically

if you had a splitter there it would work the same and you could just stack blueprints i think? assuming the vertical rows of splitters would actually connect correctly (they probably won't)

meaning you could have e.g a blueprint for the bottom input that could stack horizontally and then a blueprint to stack as many outputs as desired

but idk how the blueprint connection thing would do with vertically connected splitters

[unique cypress]

I don't think you can drag a lift to a splitter. Only from one. So you'd have to have an intermediate lift that connects the 2 lifts dragged from the top and bottom splitters

Unless I'm wrong

[gleaming marten]

easy enough to check, let me make some blueprints

does not work

it would appear you can't actually connect splitters that already exist with lifts like that

you have to place the lift and then the splitter

[frosty owl]

BTW, are there still issues with floor holes chocking throughput?

[gleaming marten]

I have a bunch of floor holes in the iron factory I just made and the throughputs are fine, ymmv

[opaque token]

I use them odten and dont seem to have issues with throughput
You can always just place a lift through the floor and nudge a hole into the spot

[unique cypress]

Not that I'm aware of. They do randomly rotate lifts, though. And so do vertical splitters/mergers

[frosty owl]

Heresy!

[digital wing]

What could be causing a flow rate issue in this situation: i have 2 oil extractors making 300 crude a min each. I connect them to the same junction using mk1 pipes, and then from that junction i use mk2s. Its all flat, even ground so the pipe elevation does not change at any point. The mk2 pipe covers about 300 ish metres maybe more, again w no elevation change. The flow rate issues is apparent from where the mk1 pipes connect to the extractors. I tried putting some pumps around but that didnt really change much

The only thing i havent tried is a pipe loop above the main pipeline, but not sure. I think the issue is that the oil is flowing back into the extractors

[wind spade]

pipe loop usually solves all issues

[digital wing]

How would i do it for the pipes connecting to the extractors?

Would the extractors feed into a junction which has the loop?

[potent pawn]

how would i split 450 ingots into 150 and 300

[mint coral]

Split three ways then merge 2

[potent pawn]

ok thanks

[mint coral]

450/3= 150

150+150=300

[wind spade]

you could also not merge them

have a group of machines making 150 and another group making 300

or you could have a single splitter and let it self-balance

so many options

[potent pawn]

the setup is i have 15 smelters and i need 150 to cables and 300 to sheets so i guess i can just have a certain amount of smelters for the sheets and the rest for cable

[wind spade]

5 smelters to cables and 10 smelters to sheets

no need to split if you never merge

[mint coral]

Simple math and layout. Easy easy

[potent pawn]

ok yea thats simpler and takes less space

[oblique hollow]

The issue must come from the place where you split that mk 2 pipe up again

Not from the merge

[digital wing]

I dont split it again

[oblique hollow]

How

[digital wing]

And the mk1s that lead to the merge just dont get any flow rate

[digital wing]

They merge into a full mk2 pipe, and its just left at that for now

[oblique hollow]

And how did you determine the flow rate issues then

If you dont even have a consumer

[digital wing]

Because the pipe is not filling up at all lol which is why i was so weirded out by it

I tried hooking it up to a consumer and it was the same thing

[oblique hollow]

If it doesnt fill at all (so absolutely no fluid) then its not connected right

Make sure theres no pipe supports wedged in odd places

[digital wing]

Hmm maybe i need to check this

[digital wing]

It does fill a bit, but like the flow rate in the mk1s hovers around 80

I think rebuilding it will probably fix it

[oblique hollow]

Hard to tell whats messed up without some images

If its flat but you dont get any flow into it at all then it sounds like something else was messed up.

A flat pipe connected to an extractor thats set to actually make 300/min and not managing to fill is a problem that basically never "just" happens. the system isnt this buggy

[digital wing]

idk ive had a lot of weird fluid issues where replacing the pipes just fixes it lol

[oblique hollow]

Those sound like build issues. Building things too quickly or whatever

[digital wing]

i havent been unable to self diagnose a fluid problem since my first fuel plant, so i think ive gotten pretty good with them

[oblique hollow]

Have you done a game verification yet?

[digital wing]

im telling you whats happened and you're distorting reality to make it fit ur advice lol

im console

[oblique hollow]

Ok thats important to mention.

... Did you mention that before?

[digital wing]

if you're gonna be this sassy when answering people's questions, i think you shouldn't answer in the first place lol

just not very productive for anything and its a bore to read

[oblique hollow]

Look it was a genuine question and i wasnt sure if you did

I am not on console so i do not know if its really this serious on there.

In which cases - yes - i am unqualified to answer

[digital wing]

idk what its like on pc but i think there are just some odd bugs which just happen randomly w fluids and its just a case of replacing the pipe

[oblique hollow]

On pc there were some issues but most were connection issues where you get 0 flow at all or it was a floor hole involved that killed the head lift and you got really bad flow rates

I've heard of cases where pipes were / are just acting weird but it wasnt that often

I cant speak for console at all though

[unique cypress]

Are you sure you have enough head lift? If you're just barely exceeding it, you can still get some flow

[digital wing]

the pipes dont change in elevation from the extractor. i re did all the pipes up to the merge and now its fine

[crimson moat]

If you're just barely exceeding headlift (even if the pump says that you're below the limit), you can get 570/600 flow lol

[unique cypress]

actually, if you're exceeding head lift, you can still get 600/600 flow

into a buffer that is

and as long as you weren't exceeding head lift when the 600 flow started

[indigo rampart]

Hi, i need help with my new coal production. I use 80 coal generator. I need 1200 coal/min. I have 4 outputs of 300 and i need 480, 480 and 240 inputs, but i don't have any idea of how to do the balancer. I can't do manifold, cause i only got mk4 conveyers. I tried a website to calculate how to split it for me but i can't understand shit

Could someone help me to do it ?

[unique cypress]

you can use something like this #math-and-meta message

or an actual 4:3 balancer, not the mess that this calculator often produces

[indigo rampart]

but this will give me 3 outputs of 400 ?

[unique cypress]

and? the 240 belt will fill up with coal and then it'll overflow to the the other outputs

[indigo rampart]

yeah makes sense

the overflow will split evenly ?

[unique cypress]

probably, but it also doesn't matter, because if one gets too much, it'll also fill up and overflow to the one that got too little

[indigo rampart]

so in theory my electricity production will stay stable

[formal cloak]

As long as I know what it means

[stray tapir]

Hey guys, shamless self promo - https://satisfactoryplanner.net/ got a new production chain calculator. I dare mention it here because it's free, no adverts. Made it for myself and thought you guys might use it too.

[stray tapir]

That's how you get 1200 coal with MK4.

[radiant lance]

hiya yall, could I get a reminder on what the biggest consumer is of SAM in the lategame? I'm tossing numbers around in my head right now and I'm tryna think about what could try and alleviate the issue of SAM not going far enough and the final phase feeling over too fast

[unique cypress]

Ficsonium and Matrices

[radiant lance]

and the ficsonium just straight up isn't worth it to make, yeah? are the power matrices in an okay spot atm in terms of usefulness?

[mint coral]

it may not be "worth it" but you can do it anyways for the fun of it and the hallange

[unique cypress]

Yeah, ficsonium is basically a waste of time, effort and resources, and matrices are kinda meh, but far from a complete waste. They cost a lot of power to make, which means you need to have a lot of power to make them worth it. They break even at about 80 GW at raw production, and become worth it at, idk 150? 200? At this point you likely have enough power for everything, so they're unlikely to be "useful" but they will increase your power generation by a fair amount. Unlike ficsonium

[radiant lance]

this is vv good to know, I'm working on a rebalanced progression mod atm and I'd like to include nuclear and ficsonium in becoming more productive to actually make

[wind spade]

"worth" depends on your preferences really. Some people find it useful, some don't

[unique cypress]

Oh, hey, I made one of those myself

[radiant lance]

you made the rocket fuel and nuclear rebalance mods iirc right? :D

[unique cypress]

No, I didn't touch rocket fuel

[radiant lance]

oh icic, might've been someone else's that i'm misremembering w the rocket fuel

[unique cypress]

I exclusively did tier 9 stuff

[radiant lance]

ohh right

i remember now

for my mod I'm mainly gonna focus on milestones and the space elevator, but I'd like to drastically increase the actual amount of production done post-trains and incentivise actual at-scale automation and logistical integration of as many things as I can

hopefully that amount of increased power draw will make power matrices more valuable compared to just slooping, & i'll probably have to just straight up buff ficsonium's MJs

[unique cypress]

If you increase power draw, you'll also increase the break even point. The reason it's 80 GW is because you need to get at least 5x more than you spent. And with machines running at 100%, that's about 18 GW for 5/min

Oh, and if you're gonna change recipes, I recommend using either SF Modeler or SF Optimizer to see how balanced they are. They're the only calculators I'm aware of with easy modded recipe support

[radiant lance]

oh no I don't mean touching the power consumption of the buildings themselves, I just mean that having more buildings on the map taking power should make it more likely to hit the break even point

[radiant lance]

yeah recipes are something i'm approaching w a light touch, I use satisfactory tools a ton in every playthrough I do so I know how annoying it would be to make recipes either unbalanced or a pain because you can't plan them

[unique cypress]

I like making recipes that are a pain. Exhibit A:

[radiant lance]

the only recipe I've decided to straight up make is an early game mycelia + limestone recipe to make power not complete ass before coal because i hate gathering biomass more than anything on this earth

[radiant lance]

wait you're so based

[eager dragon]

Time after time...

[upbeat inlet]

Wait hold up that's a thing?

[radiant lance]

if you mod it in it is :^)

the only thing like that in vanilla is the mycelia -> biomass recipe

[upbeat inlet]

Ahh ok console pleb here ATM so

That sounds awesome tho im thankfully pasted the boimass stage tho

[radiant lance]

yeah biomass is thoroughly unenjoyable, especially on repeat playthroughs

[upbeat inlet]

I can only imagine I've been working on how I wanna skip it as quickly as possible in the future haha 🤣

Got my little notepad will calculations and figured id finally come snoop in the discord and learn from the pc with the wealth of optimizing 😂

[cerulean wolf]

@trail vault mouse over this and tell us what it reports there

[gleaming marten]

I've been using these like everywhere btw, ty 🙏

[azure parcel]

whats a good recipe for heavy modular frames

because i want to make a lot of them but want to minimise screw making

because with my current configuration i need to make like 2800 screws a minute which is doable but annoying

[pastel obsidian]

how much do you want to make

[dusky dust]

!wikisearch heavy modular frames

[glad apex]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/index.php?search=heavy+modular+frames

[dusky dust]

Bah, pluralization strikes again!

!wikisearch heavy modular frame

[glad apex]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/index.php?search=heavy+modular+frame

[dusky dust]

^ wiki would show you all of the available recipes. You can even totally omit screws from the production line if you like

[azure parcel]

right now im looking to make 16 a minute

[dusky dust]

Though with screws, they get a lot easier to deal with if you just make them directly in front of the machine which needs them, in exactly the right quantity

So like even with your 2800/min Screws target, you could literally just make 240/min right in front of each machine (Steel Screws is likely the usual one to use for such a thing) and direct-belt it in

Remember that not everything has to be a manifold, etc. :D

Solvers like https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production can be quite helpful for comparing resource chains, too, btw. The graph will update as you select/deselect recipes, so you can get a feel for the various options. (When the solver ends up really liking one recipe, remember that you can disable even vanilla recipes in there to force it down a different path)

[pastel obsidian]

Look into the heavy encased frame

[azure parcel]

i was going to do heavy flexible frames because then i can just train in rubber and plastics together

but its a lot of screws a minute

[dusky dust]

Well, remember that direct-belting (often from "Steel Screws" constructors) pretty much eliminates screw-handling issues altogether

A lot of folks do like going with Encased just 'cause it lets you do without screws in general, but screws are pretty trivial if you go the direct-feeding route

[azure parcel]

but my steel is kind of limited since im doing it near the starting area so i only have 960 steel a minute so i wanted to use most of my steel for beams and pipe

[crimson moat]

People use Encased because it uses like half the resources of the other recipies

it's just one of the most OP recipies in the game numerically

[azure parcel]

im doing it near the starting area so my concrete is limited

[dusky dust]

It's ironically sometimes a tough mental leap to make at that point; you get so used to just manifolding everything, and a lot of the earlier-game builds don't really develop too many problems by "centralizing" resource production within the factory. But then you run into recipes like this where it really does often make sense to just build 'em in pairs of machines

[azure parcel]

which is why i didnt want to use encased

[dusky dust]

Yeah, Encased does have very good resource efficiency by most folks' standards

[crimson moat]

It particularly pairs well with wet concrete, iron wire, iron pipe, encased industrial pipe

[dusky dust]

But yeah, there's ways to deal with screws which aren't a headache

[crimson moat]

by itself it's not godly

[pastel obsidian]

its not like iron is something we are short on in the game

[azure parcel]

okay this was helpful thank you all :)

[unique cypress]

It's literally half the iron vs default. Just by itself

[cerulean wolf]

just found an optimization issue with game

water extractors still show animations when you're super far away.

[wind spade]

depends on other recipes used, as always

[pastel obsidian]

It uses more of everything

~ 95% more modular frames
~65% more pipe
~ 60% LESSon encased beams but you still need more pipes overall.
~ Screws but its next to nothing if you use steel

Eyeballing it you also need 80% more machines and ~65% more power

but it depends how you look at it.

[unique cypress]

As long as you use the same recipes for the same ingredients in both chains, it's always more, and it's usually 1.5-2x more

[wind spade]

I wonder if that's always the case even in wild scenarios with things like conversion or similar

[unique cypress]

I mean with conversion, both can use 0 iron.

But even if you include stuff like aluminium rod and beam, default still takes more iron

But if you compare SAM instead of iron in that case, we're back to 1.5-2x

Tbh I still haven't found a single reason to use default HMF other than "I don't have encased yet"

Well, and "because I want to", but that's always a reason

[wind spade]

has nicer numbers

[unique cypress]

All numbers are equally nice >:)

[wind spade]

but some are more equally nicer

[unique cypress]

Ig at 133.3333% it's less decimals

[quasi whale]

any changes i should make to my water? my nuclear facility seems to be running out of water really quickly

[floral mica]

Not if you load balance

[vapid gorge]

have dedicated pipes sent to nuclear gens, don't mix the whole thing up

[floral mica]

13.3333 isn't bad but looking at things like crystal oscillators is terrifying

[vapid gorge]

for example, if you over clock your NPP you can OC 2x water extractors to feed 1 OCed NPP

[hoary pulsar]

Is worth the heavy turbo fuel recipe?

[vapid gorge]

it has niche uses

[oblique hollow]

Mk 1 pipes out of extractors are beneficial to keep it all flowing smoothly

[vapid gorge]

but most often people will use more oil effcient recipes

[quasi whale]

each singular pp?

[oblique hollow]

Usually, yes

[vapid gorge]

keep pipes as simple as possible. No reason to connect them all up

[quasi whale]

im im OCing mine cause im feeling a bit lazy

alright thanks

[unique cypress]

The only variable in a load balancer is the number of belts

It doesn't care about the input rate - it just distributes it equally

[unique cypress]

You shouldn't merge the water across multiple reactors

X extractors (usually 2) to 1 reactor, repeat

[pastel obsidian]

2 extractors per reactor is very common pipe it directly no mixing

[oblique hollow]

Then you can still use mk 1 pipes

[unique cypress]

Eh, the extractors produce at a constant enough rate that I don't think it matters

If they produced half the buffer at once every few seconds, then that might cause issues with mk2s

[quasi whale]

why btw

[unique cypress]

It's unnecessarily complicated, completely unnecessary, and doesn't have any benefits.

The ratios are very clean and reactors drink a lot of water

The most I've done is 2 reactors per pipe

Anything more is just pointless

[oblique hollow]

Pipe systems cant handle big networks well where you basically go "there, figure it out yourself"

[unique cypress]

They can, I do it all the time, but with stuff that has such low ratios it's pointless.

With both extractors and reactors clocked equally, you get 1:2. And even if you clock them differently, you'd have to use insane settings to go above 1 pipe to match the ratio

[oblique hollow]

It works best if you either dont ever exceed pipe capacity in any real way or if the ratio is really simple

[unique cypress]

I build janky shit all the time and with the manifolds elevated, it somehow always works.

The only failure I encountered was an end-output 600/min HOR manifold - one like I sent you.

End-input manifolds work fine, even at 600/min, and so do mid-output ones

But if I can easily get perfect ratios below 600/min, I do. Especially easy with fuel gens. 480 or 500 per pipe works with fuel, 400 or 500 with default RF

[indigo rampart]

i said the inputs i got, 4 of 300 cause its two mk2 miners on normal nodes overclocked at max

but i used balancers and it works like a charm

[earnest rapids]

Any tips to make this work nicer? Just making power with a bit of plastic and rubber is super clean, but trying to put jetpack fuel, filters, and ammo in makes it a mess.

[dusky dust]

In the end, any factory grapher is going to start looking awful when you add in multiple products to the same graphs. I'd recommend doing separate factories for the individual products, even if you end up siting them all in the same geographical location. I believe Modeller has the ability to have, like, sub-factories that you can click "into" or whatever, which could maybe help in there specifically

[earnest rapids]

I'm more concerned about it being a mess in game than in modeler

[wind spade]

you're the only one who can make it (not) mess

[dusky dust]

Keeping products as separate factories is also a great way to help ensure your factories stay clean too

And again, a separate "factory" might just be, like, a different floor in the same building. Or even two production lines side-by-side on the same foundation bed

Just because three products all involve making, say, Rotors as an intermediate product doesn't mean that you have to make all those Rotors in one spot and then distribute them around

Making those rotors right inline three separate times, near where they're needed, can be a lot cleaner. (And it'll in general end up being nearly the same amount of buildings anyway, so you're not making any more work for yourself)

[digital wing]

If you’re committed to having it all in one graph, try using straight lines and make use of the infinite space lol.

I try to separate by floors in the factory, or if you like building flat you could go for rows instead. Helps me visualise what it looks like a lot easier

[earnest rapids]

Managed to totally separate them and simplify a bit, I guess the best way of doing it is to shove all the mess into the one factory for personal equipment that way the other factories can be clean

[dusky dust]

I guess I'll just suggest one more time that a "clean" layout is a lot easier if you have separate lines for each product. If you're worried about spaghetti, one easy way to reduce its likelihood is to make each factory "unit" as simple as possible

So, like, have a specific Jetpack Fuel line. Have a specific Filter line. Have a specific ammo line. Some of those may end up sharing the same miners/extractors, sure, but if you keep them all isolated, even if they're at the same general location, you'll find that your spaghetti management becomes a lot easier

[unique cypress]

I suggest using straight lines so you can "project" where a line is going. easier to tell that way

[fleet hound]

Question I have 64 foundries making 375 per min that's 24k?
8 iron ore per min and 2 copper ore per min.

[unique cypress]

64 * 375 = 24 000

but how you even got a foundry to 375/min, idk

[fleet hound]

@unique cypress thx It's for my iron and right door is my copper foundries across the street.
Alternative recipes I got lucky early game I have just hit 57 hours in the game

[drowsy sonnet]

Is it more fesable to Pipe Crude oil a decent distance to my power plant, or use a train?

I've had bad luck using trains in the past

[dusky dust]

It's most feasible to build your power plant right next to the oil

[drowsy sonnet]

Yeah well I didnt do that sadly

[dusky dust]

But if you're going to transport fluids: trains all the way. Either packaged or with fluid freight platforms

You want your pipe networks short and simple -- when transferring via vehicles/trains/drones, you've got two nice and short totally-separate pipe networks instead of one really long one

[drowsy sonnet]

Cool, Thanks. I'll have to set that up later. Adios. Thanks for the insite

[dusky dust]

Although honestly, depending on the scale of what you've already built, you'll probably spend less time rebuilding your power up near the oil than you'll spend learning trains and getting a delivery loop up. :)

Somewhat relatedly, I always end up setting up my logistics first when building out a new factory (assuming it requires said logistics) just to make sure that my plans are feasible, before actually getting into the factory design. I always like knowing that I've got everything I need right there

Though that does kind of impose some limitations on how to integrate the ingestion points into the factory

[sturdy sage]

Somebody should make or update the satisfactory modeler to have one to one ratios of conveyor belts. For instance, you can do lines or whatever but you can also do a type of line that that’s called a conveyor belt and you can set it for any of the mk. types.

allowing for realistic feedback with recipes and everything

Might even run faster too because it doesn’t have to deal with big/complex numbers

[versed violet]

Would still need to deal with decimals, or you start getting wrong results if something needs 233,3 per minute.

[sturdy sage]

Yes, we probably have to deal with decimals, but since you can’t have a decimal of an object just deal with whole numbers entirely if you have a remainder of, however many you want then just have it have the same overflow logic that satisfactory in general just has

[versed violet]

this will be wildly inaccurate, or force the calculator to unly use specific multiplies of recipes to avoid fractions. might not be possible with some recipes altogether.

[stray tapir]

Yeh, that's why I use https://satisfactoryplanner.net/. It models the conveyors and pipeline throughput

[wind spade]

or just plan in the game

[pastel obsidian]

you have so much space on the tool use it

[crimson moat]

I sent you proof that simple end-in manifolds do NOT work reliably due to sloshing

and again, thusfar have not been able to identify (nor has anyone else proven) a method to make them reliable, with the one exception (which is more of a workaround than a fix) of not maxing out the flow rate to leave headroom for transient interruptions and rebalancing.

I have explicitly tested the raised feed pipe solution with a result of failure, just significantly less failure than a simple manifold.

[vapid gorge]

That exists already

It’s called ‘satisfactory’ and when you’re done with the plan you have a finished system as a bonus

[low wasp]

Hello I have a question does anyone have a video on how to work around with the fluids mechanics of the pipes so I dont get screwd up in my factory haha

[steep juniper]

Hello, I'm new here and to the game. I'm looking to set turbo fuel up. I can make 600pm without over clocking. How or where would I place the 50 refiners and 80 generators without it looking awful? It's not even taking into account the 540 polymer resin pm left over. What is the best way to use the resin? I only ask as you seem to have a clue.

[vapid gorge]

I've never actually seen a good actual tute - what exactly are you trying to do? there's some simple basic rules for more reliable piping

[dusky dust]

Hah, I often think I only appear to have a clue. Anyway, I often don't stress too much about aesthetics at that stage of the game apart from some real basic stuff. I find vast fields of fuel gens to be kind of ugly no matter what, so I tend to end up putting them in some way offshore or whatever

[steep juniper]

Or should I be using a different recipe for anything? I think I have the dilated fuel. I'm not use what is the best.

[dusky dust]

As for the resin: sink it for now, just so that your power can run as-is. Have a Smart Splitter with its "Overflow" output pointed towards the sink.

[vapid gorge]

best is subjective - you could jsut use diluted fuel and get tons of power w/o importing coal and sulfur.
some would consider that 'best'

[dusky dust]

When you do want to use any of the resin, take it from an "Any" output. It's good for making Plastic + Rubber; on my 1.0 save my Computer and High-Speed Connector factory used resin byproduct from my Diluted fuel power production as their oil source

Yeah, if you do have Diluted Fuel available already (packaged or otherwise), plus the Heavy Oil Residue recipe, it's almost certainly more worth your time to do Diluted Fuel and leave it there, rather than continuing on to process into Turbofuel

[vapid gorge]

unless your goal is specifically Turbo Fuel.

rather than just 'power'

[dusky dust]

Turbofuel's all right if you meet a few criteria: 1) Don't already have Diluted+HOR, 2) Don't want to go exploring to find them, and 3) Have coal+sulfur already right next to the oil you were gonna use

If you don't meet any of those criteria, IMO it's best to just go Diluted

I'm more of a Turbofuel apologist than most, though; I've done it occasionally

[vapid gorge]

oh I've done it a number of times 😄 I often wait for blended TF though so avoid coal

but if you just want lots of power? yeah HOR > diluted is tops

[dusky dust]

IMO it's pretty niche as a power solution, though. The main "advantage" is that it's a guaranteed MAM unlock; not at the mercy of hard drive recipe rolls

[dusky dust]

If you're really mad you could go HOR > Diluted > Turbo, of course.

Though you'll be positively swimming in fuel gens at that point

Best save that effort for Rocket Fuel, if you decide to do that down the line. :D

[vapid gorge]

it's the most oil efficient path xD

[vapid gorge]

has this back and forth helped at all? any questions?

[steep juniper]

Yeah, I was mostly doing it for the power. I have nuclear unlocked but it's very overwhelming I don't know when I will get around to it. Power is what I had in mind. But there's so many number to keep track of, the different recipes and then the logistics of it. I guess, I'm just looking to make the most of the 1,080 crude oil I am currently tapped into on the west coast (no overclocking #lettheslugslive)

[vapid gorge]

then just using the HOR alt to Diluted fuel seems your best bet 🙂 if it's packaged fuel set up groups of packager > refinery > packager in a loop. Makes youre life easier

[steep juniper]

I love the game, but it's so much work

[vapid gorge]

it has a LOT of options, but I'd not worry about it too much if you're just going up the tiers. Its basically a tutorial. You can get fancy after you unlock everything

[vapid gorge]

and this planner makes your life easier too https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=tbR3kY18eMCsRX9rop7e

[steep juniper]

I'd love to get through phase 4 just so I can unlock everything then take my time going back to make everything nice however, I feel like it will take me longer to get through phase 4 than it did to actually get there.

[vapid gorge]

depends how you go, you could just make sure you automate everything and smoosh things together. It's not efficient but gets you there.
after that? make up your own goals and create entirely new dedicated factories 😉

[steep juniper]

Idk it took me an hour to build the compacted Coal for my last plan but your suggestion for using HOR means I may not even need it now. I would need to do something though. I had a look at that website. I'd need 10k power to make one of each phase object. The amount of things I need is wild and overwhelming.

[glossy delta]

strictly speaking, if you want to make everything nice later, the blue crater has everything you need to speedrun (relatively speaking) apart from bauxite and crystal, which you can ship in or get from conversion

[dusky dust]

Phase 4's a beast, for sure. If it makes you feel any better, Phase 5 (the last one) is actually a bit of a breather in comparison

[steep juniper]

Well, thanks for the advice everyone

[gloomy gyro]

Is there like a list of really useful alternate recipes somewhere? I'm always torn between keeping what I see and trying to rescan

I'm looking at caterium circuit board like maybe it's decent?

[vapid gorge]

they're all useful. They give you different options

Some are Generalist
usually lower tier items like ingots that have a lot of flex in most possible factories

Some are specialist
More niche but powerful in the changes they make.
usually higher tier items like computers

and recipes also benefit from different combinations.
All of them are impacted by location and what other products you're also making 🙂

[vapid gorge]

for example, Caterium CB and Caterium Computers is good if you want fewer types of resources used making computers. (not the only benefit)

I tend to do Caterium CB and Crystal Computer though, because it spreads out demand on those resources and I can make more computers

anyone that tells you there are 'tiers' of recipes is a fool or a liar and you might as well just randomly choose recipes if you don't consider your situation

[gloomy gyro]

I think I used caterium circuit board and crystal computer in my last PC file

Getting used to everything since I last played in like 2022

[vapid gorge]

depending on your goals and location, perfectly reasonable

[gloomy gyro]

Now on PS5

[vapid gorge]

Caterium CB + Cat Computer is also part of the path that makes Super computers only out of caterium and oil.

recipe choice is just very very situational - a lot of it based on your own style

[gloomy gyro]

Yeah I built my oil area in an area I don't know if I've ever built before so its interesting, idk if caterium is really feasible

[vapid gorge]

either modify your recipe choices or factory location then 🙂

[pastel obsidian]

you can always belt, truck or train it in

[queen zephyr]

This is the location from the general chat, it's east of the easy mode spawn point

I can see the sparkles clipping through the floor so I know it's underground, I just don't see the cave entrance anywhere

[vapid gorge]

around here I think

[vapid gorge]

ah it's more like here

[queen zephyr]

I found it, thank you

[unique cypress]

Trying to decide how many shards per min I should automate.

On one hand, I need 10 - 15 k for my next project

On the other, even 5/min will get me there in like 20 hours, even though 5 sounds low

[proper pier]

Shards can be automated?

[unique cypress]

In tier 9

[ivory sparrow]

depends. do you have another project to do? maybe some decorating/troubleshooting?

i started with 5/min, slooped the output to 10/min, converting the extra dark matter to crystals (using the dark matter crystallisation ALT) and sinking them.

anyone got an idea for balancing those 32 MK5 belts (every output needs to be around 735,75/min, inputs are between 780-240/min)

[wind spade]

I'd put the required amount on each belt instead

[unique cypress]

32:32 balancer?

Alternatively a mixer, if it's not going onto a train - that's gonna be easier than a full balancer

[unique cypress]

I feel like I'm trying to justify making more because "5/min" sounds low when I'm making at least 15/min of everything else. But since they can't be sunk, maybe I shouldn't bother making more than 5.

Or maybe I should make 15 to match everything else

Even if it's not gonna be running most of the time

[digital wing]

I just make 5 and have like 10 bins it gets dumped into lmao

I have a lot of shards now

[unique cypress]

Nevermind, I just realised I could probably make a mod to make shards sinkable 😂

If I can, I'm making 15 and sinking overflow 👹

Why does discord not have a demon/devil emoji

Just have to decipher the Dev's spaghetti math to decide how much they should be worth

[ivory sparrow]

yeah something like that, was thinkíng something like the mixer made by ImKibitz for his turbofuelplant, split in 2 layers using 16 belt each

[unique cypress]

Idk what he built, but I doubt it's what I'm thinking about

Because I'm thinking about this: #math-and-meta message

It's basically a balancer but without the "equal input and output priority" part

Just expanded to 32x32

[ivory sparrow]

thats my temp setup, 15 industrial containers and gets deleted when full

[digital wing]

My bins just feed into a couple depots and i dont think about it

But mine is fully automated

[ivory sparrow]

he built this https://youtu.be/rPnbH7E7-OM?si=d_57_4SVFmCMElVc&t=1618

[unique cypress]

God nobody should watch these youtubers for information XD

Belting canisters around in a DPF setup is such a terrible idea

And whatever he used for the canisters is not something I recognise as any standard design

Hell, it doesn't even connect every input to every output, so I suspect it's useless in most cases and I wouldn't be surprised if it eventually broke

Oh, and using regular fuel in the jetpack is a terrible idea too

[vapid gorge]

@hollow rampart something like this works for ports

each circle is a port

the green ports are a dedicated fuel delivery

[hollow rampart]

let me check

[hollow rampart]

A fuel line that splits fuel into 5 roboports (all in the fuel area) and these 5 roboports each one sends fuel into the differents outpost across the world, right?

[vapid gorge]

no

in this example it's a single fuel drone, the one marked fuel

delivering fuel to a spot with 5 outgoing ports doing other things

[hollow rampart]

Aaaaaah i see

Thanks

[vapid gorge]

a lot of people I think try to group up multiple ports to one location for easier refueling, but .... having just a lot of independent A to B paths that each have their refueling drone is perfectly fine too

the refueling drones won't consume much fuel

[alpine steeple]

can this cause backflow im having innefficency and i shouldnt be

[rocky meadow]

worked for me with some tuning required for the amount in the feed tape, something like a stack per packager was about right iirc

[unique cypress]

just because you can make it work doesn't mean it's a good idea. in this case, though, merging the canisters provides zero benefit and only complicates things

[somber heath]

I have a question and would like some help if someone has a few mins to spare

I’m setting up refinery’s and I got the plastic and rubber going I have 10 refinery’s of each and I have 4 to processes the heavy oil residue to turn into fuel

So I’m making 200 residue on one side and 100 on the other I combined the pipes to feed into the 4 refinery’s I’m using to make fuel but it’s consuming the residue faster then it’s producing but with the numbers I have it should stay even and not do that

The 4 refinery’s are consuming 75 residue each witch equals the 300 I’m producing

I’ve spent the time to let the pipes fill up so the fluid is sloshing back and forth and have a buffer at the end of the pipes

[oblique hollow]

since this is sf+ and that is steam (a gas):
probably not if you arent using the full pipe flow limit

[alpine steeple]

yeah i dont think it was helping but it wasnt the problem

[oblique hollow]

i recommend you directly ask this on the server for SFPlus as the production line or machiney you use there may be important

[alpine steeple]

ok thx

[oblique hollow]

a link to the Kmods server should be in the description of that mod's mod manager page anyway

[tulip fiber]

Should I be worried about the alumina solution? Should I build an overflow, or will nothing happen if it fills up and clogs the pipes?
edit ( yeah i should if wate clogs up the pipes production of aluminium scraps will stop)

[wind spade]

Any pipe can have backflow

[alpine steeple]

added a pump below and it seems to be fixed

[tulip fiber]

will smth like this work ?

[unique cypress]

if those are alumina pipes then you're insane

[tulip fiber]

they are

[unique cypress]

why would you transport alumina anywhere instead of instantly conveting it to scrap

[tulip fiber]

bc im not sane

[tulip fiber]

im not transporting it that far like 20 smelters long

mayyybe 25

[shy ore]

Someone vote on this please i cant choose

[proper pier]

Cast screws

[shy ore]

new game btw

[shy ore]

explain

[turbid bison]

Hey guys I’m new tryna make real friends 🥺

[proper pier]

Skips the iron rod production and is useful for making rotors (i think they use screws) and reinforced iron plates

[shy ore]

rotors i can hopefully get the steel rotor alt

[unique cypress]

stitched plate + iron wire is much better than cast screws

and so is iron wire + iron pipe for rotors (vs default rotor + cast screws)

[proper pier]

Just use the normal wire recipe

[unique cypress]

but then you need copper too, not just iron

[proper pier]

Copper is easy to get, i got plenty from a wire factory from early game

Guys, what do u think are the best alternate recipes?

[wind spade]

flip a coin if you can't choose

if you can choose, choose yourself

[wind spade]

there's nothing like "best" alternate recipe

[proper pier]

What do u think is useful for mid game? I might try get it.

[wind spade]

all recipes are useful for something, it depends heavily on your own preferences, goals, etc.

[crimson moat]

Vertical junctions have a critical bug, best avoid them entirely.

[alpine steeple]

ohh ok ill remove it then

[wind spade]

(sorry for giving non-answer, but it's really like that, every recipe gives you something and costs you something else, and every person's preferences are different, some like to simplify production, some like smaller production, some like cheaper production in terms of power, some like to save one resource, some like to save other resources, some like to reduce number of different raw resources, etc etc. And recipes also don't often do things on their own, they do different things when paired with other different recipes, f.e. stitched plate on its own adds copper requirement to RIPs, but if you also use iron wire, you change the requirement back to iron. And there's practically infinite number of combinations, so it's rarely "this recipe is good for X", but rather "this combination of recipes can do X")

[pastel obsidian]

Cast crews, iron wire, the alt for the modular frames is great.

HOR, Diluted fuel, plastic rubber.

After that anything that gives you flexibility.

Honestly anything that makes it easier to make what you want is amazing

[thin glacier]

Hmm. I got satisfactory modeler to design factories and such. But I dont have my own like log book or quick way to see what a factory is a producing and at what quantity.

Im stuck between making physical documents (which sounds fun and adds some realism to the absolute Job of playing this game)

or making some virtual whether it be a doc or maybe a more unique method of data storage (which would take more time to learn as Im not the BEST with virtual documents but would be nice to learn even for a future REAL job and could maybe take less time in the long run when i learn to use it properly)

What yall think? Yes I know do whats fun but i dont know which one id enjoy more and oddly enough im considering the practicality of both.

[crimson moat]

google sheets

[vapid gorge]

save links to your factories you make on this https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production

keep records forever

[wind spade]

or even export to file

[daring thunder]

Having troubles wrapping my brain around this...

My production line for nuclear requires 1204.48 Cat ore. Obviousle, thats annoying.

46 Quickwire constructors require 24 ore/m ea (12 bars). If I just sloop one of them....will that be enough? Is that effectively increasing my overall output by 24 ore? Or only 12 ore because it would still be requiring 12 ore/m to produce the same amount?

(The line it would be in is saturating a 1200 wire/m belt)

[oblique hollow]

slooping increases your output by 2 x for that one machine

so it lowers your ore demand by 24

[daring thunder]

It wouldnt because the belt is saturated either way - Oh I just remove a machine

I turn 1 machine off and sloop another

Duh

[oblique hollow]

or split it into multiple belts

[pastel obsidian]

You can sloop a machine later down the production cycle

[daring thunder]

That probably makes a lot more sense, hey

lmao

Trying to use a full 600 uranium/m with both the alts

...im not sure if using the alts from the start was the play. but idk it seemed bis

[mint coral]

Are you using the one that gives you the ridiculous amount of nuclear waste?

[daring thunder]

The waste comes from power plants...doesnt it

I dont see any recipe for uranium fuel rods or cells that produces waste as a by producty

[daring thunder]

:3?

[mint coral]

I always figured if I did a monster nuclear setup I'd use that one so I can make a plutonium fuel drone swarm delivering fuel to various sections of the fields of generators

[daring thunder]

Currently trying to max out fuel rods from the 600 uranium im shipping to base, then I plan to create the plutonium assembly line and max that out

Then Ill do the ficksit

and that should last me a long time for power :3

[mint coral]

Do yourself a favor and math it out first..... don't wana find out there isn't enough SAM

[daring thunder]

enough what :3

[mint coral]

Fixed it ment sam

[daring thunder]

Ah

surely that cant be a concern with only 600 uranium, but ill go check it out.

I currently have a massive storage line for the waste underneath the base (Near the world border in a canyon) and its very expandable, so Im not super concerned

This area looks weird when u turn fog off

[modern temple]

Something like this? @vapid gorge

[vapid gorge]

and post an images of your power panels
with the graphs

[modern temple]

It was at 8k, but I realised that I was overusing fuel

so took out slugs

[vapid gorge]

and your power graph for your factory you're connecting?

[modern temple]

How can I show that?

[vapid gorge]

go to your factory, click a pole

[vapid gorge]

I'd guess since your power system in unstable and dips down pretty severely the max consumption of your factory is tripping it

but a bit hard to tell

[modern temple]

ok, that makes sense tbh. It stopped working as soon as I connected it btw.

[vapid gorge]

I'd probably work on stabalising your fuel system first

[modern temple]

alright ty:)

[vapid gorge]

ah well connecting a tripped system to a functioning system will automatically trip it

use a power switch between your power station and factory

[tawny swan]

Hey so I made a rocket fuel power plant off a pure oil node with diluted fuel nitro rocket fuel. The math worked out to 4 mk2 pipes of rocket fuel at 600 each. I run that to 4 floors of 8 x 18 fuel burners. Everything was running great I let the pipes and fuel burners fill up. I have a industrial fluid buffer on each floor of burners. The fuel burners run front to front so each floor has 4 pipes running between front to front fuel burners. With the far right side being the feeder. Split evenly fluid buffer feeds a 2 way split that both feed into another 2 way split each. Someone told me rocket fuel burners are not 4.17 each as they state but 4.166666... And that 144 works per 600 pipe. So I ran them all full power which worked great. Until I updated to experimental so my buddy playing on steam deck would stop crashing which worked. But now my feeder pipes keep dropping down below 600 causing the last 2 rows of my burners to lose rocket fuel. I've tried just about everything I can think of to fix this. Looking at all my production buildings all the inputs are full. I can't figure out why it's happening or how to fix or mediate it.

[vapid gorge]

get rid of the buffers, flood the system.

that's the simplest thing to try w/o seeing the actual layouts

Also very suspicious of it actually running fine before since gasses and buffers do not mix well

[tawny swan]

I can try that I bypassed the buffers with a input to output split around the buffer, weirder it's not all the floors at the same time. The top floor pretty consistently but the bottom never had a problem until just recently. At that point I just threw my hands up

[vapid gorge]

are the buffers still connected in any way?

[tawny swan]

Yes, With the bypass they were split in the line going into the buffer that went to a split in the output line of the buffer

[vapid gorge]

Pls images or yes or no here. 'bypass' could mean literally anything and I've seen people do wild incomprehensible things

[tawny swan]

Fair enough I edited to include the yes

I'll remove the buffer from the line

[vapid gorge]

ok cool, down clock a few generators on each line to like 50% , flood the whole system, once every pipe and machine is full, up clock them again, test the flow

[tawny swan]

To be fair when I laid this all out I didn't know rocket fuel was a gas
🤣

[vapid gorge]

buffers can kill flow with liquids too - don't have them there.
it's just extra murder with gasses

at least with liquids it's possible they won't kill the system. It's almost guaranteed with gasses

[limpid rain]

Can I toggle a drone to only deliver items to a dock and never pick up?

[vapid gorge]

I don't believe so - but the solution to that is don't put anything into hte input

[limpid rain]

Not quite, as I am limited in space and can only fit 1 port. Guess I explore other movement options. Ty

[crimson moat]

Fluid bug i believe: I have a bunch of NPP setups which never stall, BUT if i save and reload they stall intermittently for the next 15 minutes before recovering to flat 100% operation.

If i save and just watch them for 15 mins, they don't stall at all.. but then i reload the save that i made, so conditions should be identical, and now the generators (instead of being at 40-50/50 water) are dipping well below, and stalling a few times each.

They recover in time, but break again if i load.

so there must be some issue with the load process or information saved in the save file which makes the fluid sim change when you load, vs if you don't. I can't think of another explanation

[vapid gorge]

make another port a little ways off? above? just belt it a bit more