math-and-meta

[dusky bronze]

i dont think ima do that on this save

[crimson moat]

cant run anything with it cause you used all resources 😄

[dusky bronze]

well maybe not most efficient but the ones that give the most output

[dusky bronze]

real

[thorn bane]

keep in mind that that uses A LOT of resources
like requiring slooped sam afaik

[dusky bronze]

yeah

i dont think im gonna be doing this anytime soon

[thorny root]

So then this is my non plastic / rubber parts of the oil cycle. The turbofuel is entirely for use in turbo diamonds and nowhere else, the rocket fuel and ionized fuel are for the jetpack only. And the Petroluem coke is used in aluminum reprocessing. That's it. That's my fuel planned. I think.

[dusky bronze]

if at all

[thorn bane]

can always do rocket fuel if you need more power

[dusky bronze]

not to fisconium anyways

[dusky bronze]

i have 230GW rn just need things to do

rocket fuel is cool and all but i want something a bit more complicated

[thorn bane]

make some warp drives :D

[dusky bronze]

aluminum factory is taking care of sink for now

[thorn bane]

im going for 40/min this run for 100 million sink points per minute

[dusky bronze]

if i finish my aluminum build, start and finish a nuclear plant, i think i should have enough for the golden nut by the end

[thorny root]

I have 5356 unallocated heavy oil residue now.

That's whilst generating 11.2k plastic, 11.2k rubber, 550 packaged turbo fuel, 4920 petroleum coke, 30 rocket fuel, and 20 ionized fuel.

[dusky bronze]

i need some of that rubber ngl

[thorny root]

Well the rubber quantity isn't final actually. That's how much rubber I have at the last stage that makes rubber. How much I actually have is going to depend on how much plastic I need, which is going to be limited by how much fuel I have left at this stage.

ATM I'm comfortably within production targets.

[dusky bronze]

im split on making heat sinks with rubber or copper sheets

[thorn bane]

rubber

[thorny root]

Why make heat sinks at all?

Project parts?

[dusky bronze]

copper is nice because i dont need to build a factory but rubber is nice because then i dont have to steal all the copper

[dusky bronze]

bunch of stuff i dont have done yet that i probably should have done

[thorn bane]

rubber uses less bauxite afaik

god i hate the new wiki

[dusky bronze]

i dont really care about the amount of aluminum it uses

ive got like 6k to play with

[crimson moat]

Automating stuff

heat sink for cooling systems for OC supercomputer was my main use

[thorny root]

Right... well I'll just say avoid cooling systems as an intermediate material. The fewer cooling systems you make the better. Super state computer is better.

[thorn bane]

well they are required for thermal propulsion rockets

[dusky bronze]

we'll get there when we get there

[thorny root]

yeah but anymore than that and you hurt yourself on nitrogen.

I'm telling you it's the nitrogen.

So when I was planning super computers and computers, I noticed no matter which chain I went with, it was oil that was my main bottleneck.

Not caterium, not quartz. Oil.

Now the nitrogen is scarce already especially for you rocket fuel nuts.

I'm just saying... Cooling systems are dangerous to go big on.

It will screw your plans up big time.

Small on no problem.

[crimson moat]

i have 180gw(?) of rocket fuel, a substantial cooling systems factory, and am only using like 15-20% of the nitrogen on the map. Probably will change in P5.

[thorn bane]

thats why you go cooling device

[thorny root]

The full nuclear cycle uses 2/3 of the map's nitrogen.

[dusky bronze]

im just gonna sink it at plutonium

[thorny root]

That leaves you like... a thousand. For other things.

[crimson moat]

by the point i am making 3tw of power i will wipe the map first and do it on a save fork 😛

[dusky bronze]

actually 3k nitrogen is quite a lot

[thorny root]

Sorry I mean it as nitric acid... because that's where it all goes in my plans.

so you have 3k nitric acid total from 12k nitrogen

[dusky bronze]

hmm

[thorny root]

and 2k of that nitric acid gets eaten in nuclear processing. Roughly.

[crimson moat]

all of my cooling systems for oc supercomputers etc + automating heatsink+cs uses a total of <600 nitrogen

cause the whole plant fits on one pipe

nitric ACID, yeah, i never use that unless i have to. Which was only a bit for 180GW rocket fuel so far.

[thorny root]

Well nitric acid is just one of two ways to use the nitrogen. The other is directly into the blender.

The actual consumption rates between the alt recipes are not different as far as nitrogen consumption goes.

For cooling systems I mean.

[crimson moat]

endgame i'l probably make ionized fuel for jetpack, drones etc (maybe slooped dark ion or something) and go nuclear for lots of core power

[thorny root]

I'm gonna battery my drones, probably. I've got the aluminum and plastic for it.

But that's going to cut into my supercomputer throughput a bit.

[thorn bane]

4k nitrogen
-720 colling device
-960 packaged nitrogen for turbo pressure motor
-2600 for nitric acid
---1200 rocket fuel
---1280 heat fused frame
--- something small for quartz purification
its really not that bad
enough that i chose to do turbo pressure

[dusky bronze]

realistically i dont think you need more than about 200GW

[thorny root]

that's an absurdly hgh volume of heat fused frames.

[dusky bronze]

thats probably too much even

[thorn bane]

well yeah warp drives are hungry

[crimson moat]

you can do battery, but ionized is a lot stronger

22% more drone zoomy

only plutonium rods can match that, with radiation.

[thorny root]

yeah but I don't need drones they're more of a because I can thing and I've basically been spending my oil first and the most carefully because it sets the pace for most of the rest of the alt recipes I'm going to use.

So basically I have no spare oil because it's the most... fluid of the resources.

It goes where I need it to go in whatever form it needs to take. That's just its nature.

But power is not its purpose.

Not for me, anyway.

it is like the catalyst for all my other products.

I do in fact have 5,356 unspent heavy oil residue... unallocated. But I know that as soon as I want more turbo diamonds, or I need more plastic... Or I decide I want to use a tempered alt. that number goes smaller and smaller.

This is like.. my maximum remainder atm.

It will be very easy to run out of what's left, should I go ham on the plastic alts or the tempered alts. that's why this last slice of it is the hardest to divide.

Certainly no room to burn it as fuel.

But... with my turbo fuel theoretically mostly planned, I can start looking at leeched recipes, as I no longer have pending plans for sulfur. Caterium is the most likely candidate.

[crimson moat]

why not pure?

[thorny root]

Pure is great. It's just not as great as leached for caterium.

For caterium max yield is leeched, and pure and tempered are tied.

Tempered caterium makes 0 sense when 'just add water' is a thing.

[crimson moat]

oh yeah it's a lot higher

(leached)

[thorny root]

I never spell it right either. XD

[crimson moat]

50% more caterium than pure, in half the space

[thorny root]

Yes but this could easily eat 100% of the remaining sulfur.

So I have to be mindful of where any needs to go before I commit to this.

But... should I nail this... that sets my computer numbers.

[crimson moat]

yeah it takes like half a node of sulphur for 1 node of caterium

so it's kind of like converting them 1:1

[thorny root]

I will be making a lot of super computers. I think I can make 240/m without issue which is the target (don't ask) but I might have to settle for a lower number.

But basically I'm going to max out super computers, use some of those for ai expansion servers, and most of the rest will just be 'computer'

Again this is not a points build. It just somewhat looks like one at this particular stage.

How much of these finals I can make will be mostly limited by the oil available. Secondarily by caterium, which will tertiaraily be limited by sulfur.

Plan the sulfur = plan the oil.

[thorny root]

24k plastic, 4.8k rubber, yada yada yada. 4983.2 fuel left.

... I really need to nail down my plastic alts and quit guessing at this. XD

[thorn bane]

just realized my plan has 720 alumina solution/min
does this work?

[wind spade]

if you mean splitting coal to pipes, then no

[thorn trail]

if it's two outputs to two inputs why not just run two sets of pipes with no junctions and clock them to match?

[thorn bane]

i cant really change clock speed since its seperating fresh and recycled alumina

this at clock speed 250%

it would be 504 alumina solution from one but 250% scrap only takes 450 so i cant do that

[thorn trail]

when I did that same exact recipe I actually alternated 3 sloppy alumina refineries in between 4 aluminum scrap refineries ( facing the opposite direction of course ) and just ran one mk2 pipe along all of them. Maybe you could do something similar to avoid overloading the mk2 pipe

[thorn bane]

oooh so scrap solution scrap solution
that might work
good idea thank you

[crimson moat]

This is an even junction split. It doesn't backflow, so it works at full flow capacity of the pipe.

[thin timber]

But what happens if one of the split pipes back flows

[crimson moat]

This is an uneven split, 20 goes one way and 580 the other. It backflows.

[thin timber]

Oookay

[crimson moat]

It counts twice or more against the flow rate of the pipe, so your 600 pipe can't actually carry 600. Instead it will carry less (like 500) due to e.g. 550 flowing forward then 50 back.

For actual flow, 550+50=600. For useful flow, 550-50=500. You get maybe 500 effective flow out of a 600 pipe for example then it can't do any more.

[thin timber]

Got it

[thin timber]

Isn’t this what’s going on after the split??

[crimson moat]

On a manifold junction yeah, with an even split no

[thin timber]

Alright

[crimson moat]

You can split pipes for more capacity headroom like this, i see you already have one split

e.g. these are 100/600 pipes for turbofuel. If you put 600/600 just in a line then it will clog due to backflow, but if you split the 600 into three 200's and then manifold those the backflow/sloshing will only happen in pipes that aren't near their capacity, so it won't affect the system.

[thin timber]

Oh no I’m not the dude in the picture

Sorry I just needed the advice 😂

[crimson moat]

if you have already done that and you still have problems, and you are definitely inputting enough into the pipe, then there could be other rarer flow issues involved.

E.g. the picture just now had buffers, they can cause fluid flow problems (going in and out repeatedly), they can cause massive delays in diagnosis (a system might take an hour to fail instead of 3 minutes) and rarely do anything to actually help a system.

just open advice for everyone, it comes up a lot 😄

Also I figured it out, I had a packaged fuel setup going and that was sucking all the fuel up

And this. Not putting as much into the pipe as you thought for some issue or other is a big killer

often when you manifold an output, it happens there - machines can't output fully because the pipe is clogged with backflow, or maybe a stupid mistake like trying to put 800 fuel into a 600 pipe somewhere. It happens

[prisma kraken]

you're drawing gets a thumb's up - made me smile

[thorny root]

I have now folded my aluminum and quartz plans into the nuclear plans, giving me a final maximum available: Quartz, Aluminum, and 3 stages of nuclear fuel.

At this stage... Basically all I need to plan is how to supply this plan, and what to do with the rest of it.

Options are basically computers, super computers, ai expansion servers, and singularity cells. With the AI expansion servers being the thing that's going to eat most of that.

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=tvhlbrN5scOcNc4cVMAh This looks super reasonable for an absurd level of production.

This also factors in most of the nitrogen usage.

The alt recipes I've selected here save all the copper for powder. No copper sheets produced at all. Obviously I'm going to have to have a side line just so I can build pipes but the 'dedicated throughput' at the end is going to be 100% copper powder.

Less ridiculous at this point is the need for coal, since I've realized the turbo diamonds are where those are going, and those were all going to singularity cells via time crystals.

But... that's still where a lot that will probably go, just not part of the current plan.

[thorn bane]

wait you can unlock quartz purification before you unlock nitric acid?

[modern fractal]

yes. quartz purification is in tier 7 and nitric acid is in tier 8

"control system development" allows it to show up in hard dr8ves

[tawdry blade]

@karmic goblet Running the pipes at less than max capacity would save you a lot of pain.

Then overthink how you feed your gens. You would usually want them fed from top, instead of having them all flat

Also long manifolds cause lots of issues with fluids since everything constantly tries to move elsewhere

If your production isn't screwed for whatever reason (bad belt balancing, underfed producers in the chain, etc)
its almost certainly just the usual sloshing

[thorny root]

What's the record for max sink points anyway?

40 sloops doubles the BWDs, 24 doubles the AI Expansion servers...

If I ran that instead of the augmentors... this would not be far off of the current record, would it not?

[prisma kraken]

yeah, it becomes available with blenders. the recipe was a bad penny for me while i was searching for dilluted fuel

[restive sparrow]

I am running into a situation where I have appropriate block and path signals setup but I'm getting trains deadlocking at an intersection. I thought the path signals would tell them that they will not collide so they should be good to pass. Is there anything I can do to fix this or am I screwed cause my intersections are too close together?

[river night]

it looks like the block the one train is waiting in and the other one wants to use as an exit are the same block, despite being two rails, so it cant go on due to that

[restive sparrow]

I thought the whole point of the path signal stuff was that it would allow for simultaneous use of a block if paths do not cross.

[river night]

but there is block signals there

i cant see the whole setup, but you could possibly fix it by using path signals around the entire combined intersection

[restive sparrow]

Yes...My understanding of setting up the path signal system is doing exactly what I did here. Blocks on the way into intersections and paths on the exits

[river night]

it should be the opposite, block on the exit and path on the entry

so it can reserve a path through the intersection and then return to normal block signaling once it leaves it

and if your two intersections are that close to each other, treat it like one big intersection

[restive sparrow]

TBH it's not entirely clear to me how path signals work, I've just been working from this guide:

[river night]

i can see on your first image that there is a block signal where the left train wants to go, but in that block the right train is waiting, so it can never go there

you do have a lot more signals then in that illustration, and if you have a combined intersection like that with two following each other, just treat it like one intersection and follow the rule of path on entry and block on exit - of the entire combined junction structure

[restive sparrow]

Trouble is that things are getting complicated. I'm trying to direct traffic to a dozen stations

If I treat the entire grouping of intersections as one giant intersection nobody will ever get to move

[river night]

with path signals it'll still allow more then one

[river night]

and if there are stations in there you can still cut them out of the system so that trains in the station dont use up room

looking at that, you just flipped the path/block order, with blocks on entry

but it should be path on entry, block on exit

[restive sparrow]

I based this entirely off the guide I pasted above.

When I have blocks at the inputs to the stations and paths at the exits of the stations the intersections have to look like this to work

otherwise it says signals are crossed

[river night]

also cut out the 4 signal tiny thing in the middle between the two intersections, a block that cant fit a train inside of it serves no purpose anyway

[restive sparrow]

so I should just reverse everything?

The only reason I have those blocked off is because the signals end up mismatched if I don't

So I should be not using this guide as a reference? The entire structure of my signals here is based on this:

[river night]

the illustration image above seems to be correct, assuming right hand side traffic, path on entry, block on exit, but you have somehow flipped that

you "exit" the intersection when going into the station, and enter the intersection when leaving the station again

[restive sparrow]

I've followed it exactly. Path on exit of station

[river night]

well except this is a station, and the train is facing a block signal 5 meters in front of it, where is that coming from?

these extra signals are not in the drawing

[restive sparrow]

The drawing has one intersection. I have like 5.

All I did was do the signals from the guide then extrapolate it into more intersections

Ignore anything in the background cause I've been mucking with it as we have been chatting but each station is set up like this, which is a duplicate of the guide:

[river night]

that part is fine, a block before the station and path on its exit

[restive sparrow]

So that puts a path on the entry to the station, which is the exit of the intersection.

[river night]

the two random signals with the roof thing are not, and neither is the same construct with the 4 signals between the 2 intersections, if anything that one is flipped around, but might as well not exist at all

[restive sparrow]

If I swap the signals at the "roof thing" it turns into a signal conflict.

[river night]

the only "open" end of the train line is back at the big stone?

[restive sparrow]

The signals at the roof thing are a duplication of the outter signals in the pictoral guide here

[river night]

all the others have stations and loops?

[restive sparrow]

Correct.

This is going to be a large network of + intersections with a station at each stub

More of the same going left is the plan.
Oddly enough when I just removed a bunch of signals and joined the two far right intersections it started working, but it could just be that I've lucked out and not locked up yet.

I understand that those tiny blocks smaller than a train don't accomplish anything but if I remove any of the signals it becomes a conflict. Or perhaps should I just remove all 4 signals and make the entire center area one giant block?

[river night]

you can keep the 4 signals, but then you need to invert them

block, to terminate the first block, and path to open the new one

not path -> block

with path signals, its often easier to start with less

do treat it like one big block first, see if it works

then you can think about splitting it if needed

[restive sparrow]

TBH I'd start with less if path signals made more sense to me, I was just trying to duplicate the intersection signaling that has been working for me so far.

[river night]

for a very basic setup that should work, take out all the signals with the roof

then it all comes down to the side with the stone to terminate it properly

[north jackal]

I would suggest putting as many stations next to each other as possible (like in the reference diagram). That way you minimize junctions and signaling.

Path signals reserve a line though a block of same colored rails (when you are in build mode with a train signal). Theoretically this allows trains to go past each other in the same colored block. Block signals create a new block. I like to keep my blocks approximately 1.5-2x the length of my longest trains on that track.

[restive sparrow]

I swapped the 4-sets and it seems to be working. This is the termination at the rock. Ignore the one flashing signal, it's going to a dead end for the moment

To be honest I don't know how this plan got to be such a damn mess. I have other bases with multi-tiered stations like the one in the diagram. I just went off the rails a bit on this one trying out some different arrangements (pun intended)

[north jackal]

If it was me I'd rotate your stations 90 degrees and only have one junction into multiple train stations and one junction out. Here's a terribly crude diagram with three stations as blue boxes. And then you could keep expanding to the right if necessary.

[restive sparrow]

I somehow got it in my head that this would be reducing complexity or size requirements and it seems like it increased complexity and size requirements significantly.

Seems I really screwed the pooch on this one

[north jackal]

Bahaha I've been there too many times myself.

[restive sparrow]

I think you're totally right though. Should go back to the tiered approach. This is going to take forever to tear down, nevermind set back up again.

At least I'm noticing the issue now after building 3 of the planned 12. I think I should be compressing the stations a bit too...maybe.

The current plan is a seperate station for each material/part coming in.

[pastel obsidian]

This diagram makes no sense

[restive sparrow]

I've been using it quite a bit because I found it here. If you have a better/more clear reference I'd gladly take it.

[pastel obsidian]

If you are open to it I would be happy to try and make something and get your feedback on it

[robust raptor]

?

Makes sense to me

It's just a standard stack of stations with level intersections

[restive sparrow]

That sounds awesome. I've been struggling to understand path signals so I'd be a good target audience. I'd like to think I'm not a complete dullard (I am an engineer IRL frighteningly enough), it just hasn't sunk in yet.

[robust raptor]

If you understand block signals, path signals are pretty simple

[restive sparrow]

I've just been copying the structure in the picture to the best of my knowledge.

[robust raptor]

Block signals basically tell the train if there's a train in the next block, path signals allow a train to reserve a path through the next block

[restive sparrow]

Blocks, as far as I know, just say "hey bro, someone is in here, don't come in here!"

[robust raptor]

In practice, what this means is that you can have two non-intersecting paths within the same block

[restive sparrow]

I get the idea, but how a path signal makes that reservation is less clear to me.

[robust raptor]

Which is great for level intersections as more than one train can pass through them at the same time

[robust raptor]

The train makes the reservation right before going through the block

[restive sparrow]

It's going before splits and such so what path is it reserving? There are numerous paths available.

[robust raptor]

It's reserving the path it needs to get to its destination

If I had to guess, the shortest path

Because that's how satisfactory trains work

[restive sparrow]

It's just from that path signal to any one particular block signal ahead?

[robust raptor]

Yeah

[restive sparrow]

So it says I'm taking path X, then a train behind knows it's going to head towards block signal Y which is a different exit from that same block so then it knows it's ok to go there because it's a different exit?

[fathom warren]

It probably was already posted, but this is quite awesome map to learn trains and stuff around them. Currently there is even version for 1.1

https://www.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/comments/1jh0vtw/train_bootcamp_40/#lightbox

[robust raptor]

The train behind won't reserve anything because it still intersects with the path from the previous train

But once it no longer intersects, it then reserves a path

Think about it just like regular block signals

A train somehow knows which place to go if you use block signals everywhere, because the path is pre-computed

Path signals are exactly the same, except they allow trains to pass through if their reserved path does not intersect with another train's reserved path

This is most useful for level intersections because you can have two trains passing through in opposite directions without one taking up the intersection, like what would happen with block signals

[restive sparrow]

I'm heading to bed, Like I should have done about 4 hours ago. If anyone is responding to me please ping and I'll see it in the morn.

I'll be interested to see what you have, when you have it, Gill!

[robust raptor]

The more technical reason for using path signals for level intersections is that they don't allow trains to stop in them and thus prevent deadlocks

[pastel obsidian]

For sure

[robust raptor]

But that's not really something to worry about for now

[pastel obsidian]

Ill need to do a little work on it but I'll be sure to get your input

[robust raptor]

Of course, you can also build a network without using any path signals by making all your junctions grade separated

Because splits and mergers don't require path signals, and a grade separated junction (i.e. one where the different directions are on different levels) is just splits and mergers

[lapis jetty]

What can i do to get rid of a bunch of heavy oil residue without making fuel

[frosty owl]

Flush it
Drink it
Consume it
Package it...

Harder, better, faster, stronger...

[thorn bane]

petroleum coke

[wind spade]

Use any recipe that needs it 🙂

[knotty siren]

You can make steel ingots with Petroleum Coke too 🙂

[harsh oyster]

or just dump them into coal gens for power

[fallow siren]

you can use hor to make more cables

[torn plaza]

easy way is to make an overflow pipe feeding a bunch of petroleum coke refineries, then you can sink it, burn it, or use it; or, if you have the alts, turn it to diluted fuel then feed a recycled rubber / recycled plastic loop

[heady vine]

This should be megaprint

[prisma kraken]

the verbs need to make sense with the superlatives... work it harder, make it better, do it faster, makes us stronger

(more than ever, hour after, our work is never over)

if that's you're thing, sure

[knotty siren]

That's true. Coal Gens for extra power

[waxen condor]

is there a way to make a overflow pipe ?

[wary tulip]

What do you need the overflow for?

[wind zinc]

its tiime ...

[wind zinc]

technically yes
(fluids first fill the lowest pipe then they work upwards to the highest pipe)
though IDK how practical it may be

[waxen condor]

just installed Fluid sink mod

[serene plume]

On my planet, I think it's time to build a motor factory

[bleak wagon]

If I have multiple trains that bring resources to a factory go into one station would that make the station receiving take in more items/min? if it does then at what point does it become diminishing returns on it being the same station?

[dusky bronze]

i think so but i would highly recommend not doing that unless its like 3 trains at most

much better to have a station for each train, or a station for each item and run multiple trains through (if needed)

[bleak wagon]

well, I have 35 train stations atm and want to reduce that number some

[dusky bronze]

no harm in having more

i think i have almost 50 rn

soon to be even more once i start finising things

[opaque quartz]

Depends on the trip time of the trains. If the trains are spread out enough then you can get more throughout. But the station has the 30 second lockout that will prevent additional trains from going through

[bleak wagon]

yeah

I dont want to use 10 stations on limestone so Im gonna be messing with this some

I think 2 trains going to one station is the best I can do for one station with the way I have it setup currently

I might actually be able to get 2k limestone going through each freight platform a minute

which would be around 3 stations for limestone since I need 18.2k a minute

I wish I would have thought about using multiple trains for one station before doing this but whatever

[dusky bronze]

is that all the uranium?

[bleak wagon]

its using all but 17 uranium

[dusky bronze]

ahh

where are you pulling all the resources from

i'm trying to plan out a plant with all the uranium rn

[quick gorge]

rookie numbers, get those 17 kek

[bleak wagon]

still working that out

[bleak wagon]

currently most of it is coming from the plains and rocky desert

[bleak wagon]

I want bombs

[dusky bronze]

im probably going to pull most of mine from the red desert but im still not sure because i want to put a space elevator part factory there

[quick gorge]

Just have an underflow to the nobe factory

[dusky bronze]

and the place for the power plant i think is either going to be at the rockey desert or beside the swamp

[bleak wagon]

using that last 17 uranium also messes with numbers a lot, you would have to have underclocked nuclear power plants iirc

[dusky bronze]

this is what i have with all the uranium

[bleak wagon]

Im going through the whole nuclear chain up to ficsonium

I do not have an organized model though

[willow harbor]

So after a good while of hunting down the issue I realized that it was a missing pipe segment. I went through and manually added each of the pipe supports so they would line up nicely and I guess when I did I covered up a 0.5m gap between two pipes. Pic for reference of what it looked like.

[quick gorge]

This is great in theory but actually building factories, unless you want your computer to cook and have all of that processed in the same area is not good in practice.

[oblique hollow]

ah.. yeah that can of course be troublesome

especially when obscured by something else

[willow harbor]

I found it by purging the system and then checking each pipe to figure out where the flow stopped. Super simple can’t believe I hadn’t thought to do it yet

[bleak wagon]

its all happening in the same area, my computer will be fine

[bleak wagon]

I think ive managed to get 8k limestone/min going into one station

[dusky bronze]

this is going to use almost 6k caterium

[quick gorge]

But yee best of luck to you||r computer||

[dusky bronze]

i hope theres enough left over for other stuff

[bleak wagon]

the big thing I have happening is 1/2 the SAM 1/5 of the limestone, 2/3 of the quartz

[dusky bronze]

yikes

i dont think ima be going to fisconium

the 1.5TW is nice but i wont have any resources left to use it lmao

[bleak wagon]

just gonna turn the waste into plutonium and sink it?

[dusky bronze]

yes

the 630GW im gonna be getting from just uranium will be more than enough

[bleak wagon]

I should be alright on my resource costs, Im not planning ahead but I havent really used quartz that much outside of aluminum so I should be alright

[quick gorge]

Am I the only one doing Ficsonium because https://discord.com/channels/370472939054956546/1283457093696749609 reasons? 😈

[dusky bronze]

worry for future me

if needed i could probably just upgrade to fisconium

will need to leave space for it tho

544 water extractors will be fun

[bleak wagon]

Im doing ficsonium because I want to and I plan to use everything on the map so Im gonna need the power

[quick gorge]

I am legit just doing 112 ficsonium and 40 matrixes because that sounds like looping the loop-organ to me

In like a year when it's done I'll ask Hannah if it's looped enough 🙃

[dusky bronze]

594* water extractors

[prisma kraken]

i'll give you a brief rundown of my experience with mass-cheap-silica... first thing is that each train car you have dedicated to a 100-stack item (limestone) can move about 600/min, so you really want 2 train cars for each pure node or one per normal node. second thing is that you can double up delivery to a single station and use 2 mk5 belts out of it to get to 1200/min from a single loading dock. From there, you're probably going to have to resort to some balancing to get the right amounts to where you need it

[odd spoke]

(I'm new) iron pipe or flexible heavy frame thing

or rescan

[quick gorge]

Iron pipe

[odd spoke]

ok ty 👍

[quick gorge]

And if you get the option for portable miner, get those. They are peak in the mid game, they do use steel pipes but oh wait you can use the iron pipe recipe and boom, portable miners from just iron in the magic box so you never have to craft them on site again.

-# No I will not define midgame

[odd spoke]

alr thanks again 👍

[opaque quartz]

The answer always is “whatever recipe is useful to you” - there is no “best”. Alt recipes exist to give you options, there are always tradeoffs

[quick gorge]

🫡 thank you pioneer for contributing to saving all the puppies and/or kittens

[opaque quartz]

If you’re not sure, leave the drive in your library and it will take those recipes out of the pool for subsequent drive scans

[quick gorge]

And since it's Easter.. saving bunnies too I guess

[odd spoke]

took iron pipe already

didn't know u could do that tho ty

[opaque quartz]

For future drives then

[bleak wagon]

Ty i did figure out that 600/min is a good number for loading on my own but good to have it confirmed, doubling up delivery as opposed to tripling has also proved to be the most efficient from my little bit of testing

[opaque quartz]

Iron pipe is handy for letting you cut steel out of some production lines, but it is very inefficient in terms of the amount of iron consumed. That’s the tradeoff

There’s more drives on the map than there are recipes, so you can unlock them all. Plus you can buy drives from the awesome shop in the late game

[odd spoke]

is there a way to locate crash sites?

[odd spoke]

oh that's a bit broken

[opaque quartz]

Object scanner. Research in the MAM

[odd spoke]

what tree is it under?

[opaque quartz]

Quartz

[odd spoke]

darnit

alr thanks so much 🫡

[prisma kraken]

another thing that may be helpful is to think about how you're going to belt stuff out of the train stations into how many assemblers... if you understand that, you may be able to groom the input on the sending side to be exact amounts

[opaque quartz]

If you don’t mind being spoiled, you can look up all the crash site locations on SCIM

[opaque quartz]

Nah, just buffer so you don’t have to find every crash site if you don’t want

[odd spoke]

nah ill just try finish my quartz tree, thanks again tho

[odd spoke]

I suppose

[opaque quartz]

Good luck

[odd spoke]

Thanks bro 🫡

[quick gorge]

Yeah just echoing my experience really. I found portable miners too useful to pass up.
I have not hand crafted miners in over 98% of my playthough and it feels wonderful!

[odd spoke]

I mean I kinda just place an equipment workshop down craft a few miners and build my miner (idk if it has more use late in game)

[quick gorge]

It's the same feel as when you get the blade runners... you just unlocked the ability to run and losing them/starting anew is agony

[bleak wagon]

I should mess with exact amounts but i need so much limestone i dont care enough, Im just gonna bring more than enough i think

[odd spoke]

crafting miners takes like 10 seconds

[prisma kraken]

yeah, there's some economy of scale involved in just doing it as a massive problem to solve, but there's a few things you can do on the sending side to make your life easier

[near smelt]

How much uranium ore is on the entire map if you fully overclock all the nodes with mk3 miners?

[prisma kraken]

2100/min

[quick gorge]

But the ADHD wants them nowww

[odd spoke]

fair enough lmao

[near smelt]

If this was answering my question, thank you.

[quick gorge]

And the point of automation is to never do X again

[prisma kraken]

3 impure nodes + 2 normal nodes

[opaque quartz]

The nice thing about the automated miners recipe is you can set it up once, feed a dimensional depot, and then never worry about them again

[near smelt]

I don't need mk6 belts right? Just mk5? To make sure I actually get all the ore

[opaque quartz]

There are only normal and impure nodes, max that any one can make is 600/min

[quick gorge]

This is why auto miner is top tier for me,

All recipes are equal, but some recipes are more equal than others

[amber umbra]

As said, with dimensional depots the automated miner recipe is a no brainer.

[quick gorge]

I jokingly put auto miners in top tier before DDs were added.
I just knew something would make them peak!

[waxen crow]

hello i have a question. i am stuck in t8 with nuclear but that is not the point. i wanna know how people not manage (3 out of 100) to get 50 sloops? i mean it is kinda needed to automate expensive parts like control systems 🤔

[opaque quartz]

You manifested it

[amber umbra]

And aren’t the miners used in drones as well?

[opaque quartz]

yes

[quick gorge]

I never knew I had such powers...
I shall manifest train loop-de-loops next!
Choo choo motɥǝɹ ɟnɔʞǝɹ ʍǝǝǝǝ

Up, down, recycle is a very interesting way to denote loop-de-loops but I'll allow it

[quick gorge]

I have no idea honestly, I got all 106 before I got to T7 iirc

[bleak wagon]

Im at t9 and still dont have them all

[quick gorge]

... I mean I did make a very consorted effort to get them all because I'm a lore nerd who needed to know if they was a message for collecting all the Sloops and Sphere
(there was not and I was very sadge)

[bleak wagon]

ive only got like 40 and i dont even know where I put them all lmao

[restive sparrow]

It's kinda weirding me out that the track through the righthand station isn't colored differently than the intersection track. It appears to be working, but none of my other similarly signals stations look like this. The rest of them all have one color for the intersection tracking and a unique color for each of the stations. (note: the left station track is a different color, it's just subtle).

Oh shit I think the blocks are on the wrong side of the track on the inlet to the stations .... durrrrr

Wait no... I'm double mixing myself up. That's all right I think

[bleak wagon]

that looks right to me

[restive sparrow]

So why the heck is the one station lane keeping the same color as the intersection? None of my other stations do this.

[quick gorge]

I do have all of them...
But not all are accounted for.
They are somewhere where I don't know where they are 😅
That is a quest of mine before being able to do my build

[restive sparrow]

The track even works. There is a train going through there right now

[bleak wagon]

maybe its just a lucky pull and its the same color track even though different segment

kinda like this

[restive sparrow]

I think that's what happened. Redrawing the connecting tracks didn't do shit, but I just deleted one of the platforms and rebuilt and it recolored. Horray!

[bleak wagon]

thats pretty nice ngl

[restive sparrow]

Woweee

[bleak wagon]

Likely not gonna keep it the same way it is rn though

the 2 trains get there at the same time so it makes it inefficient

[waxen crow]

so you produce complex parts with like dozens of machines?

[bleak wagon]

yes? Im not gonna have somersloops to use after Im done my power plant lol, all my somersloops are getting used there. Power shards exist as well

[waxen crow]

well yea seemingly i am the only one (3.4%) that rather explores the wild than connecting 20 4-way machines. 🙈

[bleak wagon]

ive been around the entire map as well, Im struggling to see what youre getting at.

connecting manufacturers isnt that bad

if youre playing the game for completion I can understand using sloops for those things, but Im playing with the goal of using everything and making everything

[fierce ruin]

can someone tell me what the red and blue lines should be? considering this is a manifold basically, im wondering what tier the belts should be. the input is 370 rods/min

[bleak wagon]

red belts have to be at least mk4, blue belts have to be at least mk2

[fierce ruin]

yeah i decided to make the blue mk2 and the red mk4

seems good and simple

[bleak wagon]

I personally just use the highest mk belt I can

[fierce ruin]

ill upgrade it if it starts backlogging

[bleak wagon]

it should be fine like that, the only advantage I can think of for using a lower mk belt on the split of a manifold is it would fill faster but imo its easier to build just using all the same mk belt

thats why I do it that way, if it works it works, nothing wrong with doing it how you want to

[waxen crow]

yea that is exactly what i am doing. 🙂

[bleak wagon]

ah then that makes sense.

[prisma kraken]

this, um, borders on insanity

[bleak wagon]

meh

[versed violet]

Train looping is totally possible.

[quick gorge]

You had my hopes up... this hurts my soul

[quick gorge]

I might just use that regardless tbh... the not upside down part is like a knife to my dreams but it's better then just not having a loop in my train network

[versed violet]

you will need a good run up to make the loop tho.

this one was from top of the grasslands stone arch

[quick gorge]

As long as I can

after all;
I want to make sure my nuclear fuel is significantly excited

[pastel obsidian]

That's how you enrich uranium centrifugal force right

[quick gorge]

I think this "recipe" will result in an overall production boost of F=m\omega^2r

[quick gorge]

Hey how do banked turned come out? 🤔

[bleak wagon]

is it worth using ionized fuel on drones?

[wind spade]

anything is worth if you make use of it

[quick gorge]

I think so, if you're already making ionized

[bleak wagon]

I am not making ionized atm, Im thinking about making it for drones/jetpack though

Im not really making any fuel atm

[quick gorge]

I personally plan on having ionized for drones/jetpack in the long run

[open carbon]

I finished pasta for the second time today, still my second favourite spelevator part.

[quick gorge]

I just want zippy lil guys and my plut fuel is going to IKEA lamps

[bleak wagon]

Im probably gonna make ionized fuel and either drone it over to my drone ports or take it by train idk though

I need to figure out how much I need

[versed violet]

Have not tried it. perhaps snapping to banked foundations would work?

[versed violet]

Thats a cool chart. Looks like I should use plut rods with my drones. Does it just take one rod and fly for days?

[quick gorge]

Would kill to see an entire collection of different roller coaster parts.
I will be using them all of them in my transport themepark network

[pastel obsidian]

It's a great fuel for drones

[versed violet]

Youre thinking of belt

[quick gorge]

no?
I'm wanting banked trains for my transport network...

[versed violet]

banking is built into the trains already

[quick gorge]

I have never seen a 45 degree banked turn

I want my train to do this

Well to be more technical I want this

[bleak wagon]

ngl packed ionized fuel isnt even that bad imo

my power grid isnt gonna like this idea but i dont care what it thinks

[quick gorge]

Thank god my power grid can't tal-
TTssssssskkkttttt

maybe she can...

[serene plume]

I think I could probably halve my build time if I managed to place my mergers and splitters down in the proper orientation and alignment the first time every time.

[bleak wagon]

The only reason I can actually make stuff is because of when the machines overflow

[bleak wagon]

I need to finish my resource gathering for nuclear before I can actually start on this though

[bleak wagon]

well, I need to finish this eventually so I think that tonight Im not stopping until all these stations have their 2 trains setup

[versed violet]

Need some video settings help:
I am running TAA as antialiasing method, but I am annoyed by a low resolution "mist" when destroying hatchers. is this caused by aliasing or just base game textures?
I tried using FXAA but whole game area just flickers rapidly and I can't seem to find the xTimes setting for the aliasing in the options (or am I confusing this with the other aa that had the x8 and so opts?)
TSR doesn't seem to be selectable fro menu?
What are my other options? Running at settings maxed, 1440p, 7900 GRE so fps hiccups are not a problem.

[bleak wagon]

not sure, probably a question better for #1038092680493801533

[hazy hill]

How to change Type (style) of Connection in Satis Modeler?

[serene plume]

Just a shot, Maybe try turning off LoD dithering in the options.

[dusky bronze]

do priority switches go from #1 to #8, or #8 to #1

[versed violet]

8 gets turned off first I think

[prisma kraken]

yeah, group 8 is the first that'll get cut off

[versed violet]

almost enough to have tier 1 factory to tier 9 factory on each priority

[serene plume]

Pretty impressive seeing things zip along at 480 objects a second... (Screws of course)

[versed violet]

You are going to love the mk5 improvement later on then, but hate the aluminium manufacturing that leads to it.

[prisma kraken]

no pleasure quite like seeing fully saturated belts

[wind zinc]

i recomend that you select FSR as an upscaler in the settings and then set it to the "no downscaling" mode
as thats the best AA for an AMD GPU in this game

besides that it would be nice to actually see the thing you are describing

[autumn skiff]

I am a fairly new player and just started a new save I have compeleted all Tier 1 and most of tier 2 but have no actual factories just random stuff. I want to build factories to automate plates, rods, wire, cable and screws anyone suggest numbers I should be aiming for per min

[wind zinc]

Its enough to have one machine each for producing all the tier 1 and 2 stuff

[autumn skiff]

Ahhh right thanks 👍

[lavish perch]

I may be a little crazy here…

My plan was to produce as much rocket fuel as could be made from the oil at Blue Crater, which is 2550/m

My power grid ain’t gonna like this

I could have nearly doubled it by using nitro rocket fuel alt but I don’t feel like using more than half of all the sulfur on the map before I’ve gotten to synthesis stuff

Got all the resources ready just have to put it all together

I guess I’ll be slapping down a couple hundred batteries before I turn it on, my current like 30k backup isn’t gonna be enough

[rocky mural]

so i am preparing for a new playthrough and trying to organize/plan where to build certain things and curious what you all think is the best computer/electronics factory location

[lavish perch]

I mean unless you’re going for caterium alt recipes you’ll just need iron and copper so most places work just fine

[rocky mural]

my thought was titan forest with the little Caterium cave + 3 quartz nodes

[lavish perch]

If you can find the empty space yeah seems good

We used the quartz for aluminum but it would do well for electronics I’d imagine

[rocky mural]

alright and then same question for nuclear power. swamp or west side of the map near islands/paradise island?

[lavish perch]

That’s beyond my knowledge lol I’m currently only just unlocking nuclear

Making a big rocket fuel factory to hold me over

[rocky mural]

yeah i finished first playthru beforehand on rocket fuel alone

[lavish perch]

How much were you making?

[rocky mural]

i had about 100,000mw power total mostly from one diluted fuel and one rocket fuel plant

[lavish perch]

Lol I guess I don’t need as much as I thought

[rocky mural]

rocket fuel per minute i would have to look up but it was not much actually!

[lavish perch]

Guess I’ll just ship most of it out for drones

[rocky mural]

i think i only had two slooped blenders making rocket fuel

and it was enough for a f-load of overclocked generators

[lavish perch]

Nitro rocket fuel alt I’m guessing?

I’m realizing every minute just how absurdly excessive my rocket fuel plans are

[rocky mural]

i did turbo blend fuel and i think the regular rocket recipe?

was a long time ago

[lavish perch]

Well screw it I’m going for big funny and just making the huge factory

[rocky mural]

but it all ran on less than 300 crude lol

[lavish perch]

Okay yeah maybe I don’t need 5666/m

[rocky mural]

the diluted fuel plant

that one was actually more of a pain tbh

blue crater will be so much better for rocket fuel than islands, i am trying to use the other parts of the map that i didnt use first time around

[lavish perch]

I was planning to ship it all out to the dune desert beach cause I don’t like fog lol

[rocky mural]

i ran a train from northwest corner to get nitrogen + sulfur and haul it down to the islands pretty much

[smoky aurora]

on a regular playtrough nothing special ,.. how much Caterium Barrs are actually a god ammount to have available

i plan to collect Catrium to a plant process with water and distibute to where it´s needed ,.. but just takinf the pure nodes would lead to 350 refinneries prducin 4500 Cat Bar

[versed violet]

Currently trying FSR, yes. The low-res-mist effect happens on all the settings, so may be hatcher animation or lods like someone mentioned above. Havent tried shooting a hatcher since disabling lod dithering, will see if that helps. Recording is kinda tricky, as default windows game bar will likely loose the artifacting in compression and I don't have anything else set up. Will report later if lods fixed it.

[opaque quartz]

Swamp IMHO. has the most resources needed the closest

[opaque quartz]

Just make as many as you need

[smoky aurora]

wow ,.. this answer dosnt help at all 😂

[opaque quartz]

🤷‍♂️

Sounds like you are trying to predict the future rather than building for what you need, so anything anyone here says is going to be as much of a guess as what you might guess

[deft lichen]

put differently, don't produce any until you know exactly what you need, and make that

don't centralize them

this applies to everything, not just caterium bars

[wind zinc]

swamp is the best for nuclear
you get all the rescources you need for nuclear in one place

• you get the added bonus of SF temporarily becoming a horror game

[smoky aurora]

thx guys

[fathom warren]

I didn't make it, you could try suggesting it on the Reddit post. In my opinion it is better as a map.

[vast inlet]

anyone share some knowledge been messing around with this most of the morning.. gone from 70% to 90%

is the gass thats not working right..

[opaque quartz]

The efficiency meter on the console is a moving average. If you fixed an input issue it will take some time for the efficiency to reflect it. All your input buffers are full so it looks like you are good now?

You can also watch the status light indicator on the machine itself for a bit and see if it stays green. If it turns yellow it means that it’s going idle and not running 100%

[vast inlet]

@opaque quartz is that to me? has been at 95% for a while same for the other 2 blenders in the line

[opaque quartz]

Yes I was replying to you

How many blenders total do you have? How much gas does each one take?

[vast inlet]

these 4 at 37.5 each and these 3 at 150 each should be 600m2

[opaque quartz]

Ok so you are trying to supply exactly 600 via a single mk2 pipe?

[vast inlet]

yeaahh.. coming in via fluid train

[opaque quartz]

First of all, remove the fluid buffers. They will not help you here and will only interrupt flow

Oh, are the train platforms buffered then? I can’t tell, the screenshots are too dark

Remember that train platforms stop transferring during the ~30 second loading animation

[vast inlet]

yeahh 1 is connected.... as i said been messing around and cant get it to work

tried bringing it on 1 cart didnt work brought in a 2nd cart still didnt work

right train station loops into the left, left comes out into a buffer

this was me messing about trying anything i could think off to get a full 600m2 mk2 pipe

[opaque quartz]

Train platform->two mk2 pipes->industrial fluid buffer->single mk2 supply pipe

You need two pipes off the train platform into the buffer to allow it to catch up for the 30 seconds the platform is locked out

[vast inlet]

is this end the issue? is set to 1000m2 pm to supply 2 stations one with 400 and other with 600

[opaque quartz]

You are putting lots of buffers everywhere- they are really only needed immediately next to your train fluid platform and nowhere else

[vast inlet]

thats the only place they are

[opaque quartz]

I don’t see the train platform in that last pic

[opaque quartz]

And I see three buffers. But you said you have two platforms?

[vast inlet]

source > buffer > station

[opaque quartz]

Again, you need to connect two pipes from the buffer to the train platform

Every time the train platform loads/unloads, the platform stops transferring fluid for 30 seconds during the loading animation

By using two pipes from the platform to the buffer, it can “catch up” that fluid once the fluid platform is not locked out

The same is true for freight platforms and industrial storage containers

My guess is the missing 5% efficiency on your machines is from the 30 second interruptions in flow from the platforms that are not properly buffered

ok I fired up the game because I didn't remember that industrial fluid buffers don't have multiple inputs

so you need two buffers per fluid platform, one from each platform input/output

[vast inlet]

disconnected 1 station for the mean time.... like this?

[opaque quartz]

(i've literally never used fluid platforms so I'm going based on the principles here not off first-hand experience)

yeah so in that pic, only one of the two platform outputs is buffered

[vast inlet]

yeaa cos the other is disconnected... is there an issue with fluid carts being able to supply600m2 pm ? should only need 1 right

[opaque quartz]

try something like this

[opaque quartz]

a single fluid cart can supply 600/min, but you have to buffer the platform to account for the 30 second lockout

otherwise it will be 600/min except for the ~60 seconds of train loading+unloading where it will be 0/min

you have to buffer the loading and unloading platforms

FWIW I always use drones for nitrogen. much easier to package it because it compresses 4:1, and the drone can handle the return of the empty tanks in a tidy closed loop

[vast inlet]

done this at both ends of the train line.. will let it run for a bit and see what happens

[opaque quartz]

One other thing you’ll probably want to do is downclock your blenders for a bit so that they under consume the gas on the receiving end. This will allow the pipes and machine buffers to fully fill up which will help w flow rates as well

[restive sparrow]

Efficiency meter? I've never seen that. Where is this thing I've possibly been overlooking?

[wind spade]

on each machine 😄

[vast inlet]

the %

[wind spade]

easiest way: #design-and-architecture message

[vast inlet]

minus the pump for gasses?

[wind spade]

pump is always good to have

[restive sparrow]

OH god the bar graph in the middle is showing efficiency? I completely overlooked that.

I've been staring at machines looking for little yellow lights for minutes at a time when I could just open up their menus this whole time?!

That moment when you learn something that actually makes you feel like an idiot.

[opaque quartz]

The chart is a moving average so it can be a bit misleading. The status lights will always give you immediate feedback

[vast inlet]

after 15 minuets they were even worse... below 70%.. turned them off and let it all saturate now re running

[amber umbra]

I’m not troubleshooting it, but they have train -> big fluid storage -> blender transporting nitrogen gas. The problem lies with that setup.

I was doing that but swapped to packaged nitrogen transported by drones due to throughput issues. The numbers are nice for drone transport, packaging/depackaging.

[vast inlet]

was no issues like that on this step up....

[amber umbra]

Yes. These things work correctly or they don’t.

[vast inlet]

can make any kind of belt counter 480 to 352... cant figure out how to get 1 mk2 pipe via trains

[amber umbra]

I didn’t dig into the mechanics of how to transport gasses via train without throughput dips, but the “basic” style setups don’t maintain throughput due to gasses fully filling their pipes/containers. That disrupts normal station buffering setups leading to gaps in throughput between trains for how I do trains.

Idk if that applies to you.

Drones are so nice for it that I didn’t bother troubleshooting.

[vast inlet]

was thinking of doing drones but had no idea how much aluminium needed for the factory... think i have 150 left over but means need to calculate how much fuel i can burn off

[amber umbra]

Could even do a modest packaged fuel from pure oil in the interim. Doesn’t need that much throughput for just droning nitrogen. The Al using canisters aren’t consumed.

[covert fox]

İs there cross platform in this game
ı am playing on steam and my friend is on the epic can we lay togeather

[vast inlet]

pretty sure u can, wouldnt know how youd go about it tho

[covert fox]

thx

[wind spade]

don't spam please

[zinc bough]

i'm moving the messages from desing to here

[wind spade]

why?

[zinc bough]

i thought that this channel was more of blueprints than the asthetic one

[wind spade]

both are fine

[zinc bough]

welp, i think i'm better of deleteing everything than having it half here half there

[quick gorge]

The fact I had already sent #design-and-architecture message is quite tragic/funny

[zinc bough]

XD

auto connect splitter and merger = auto connect blueprint with invisible conveyor belt connection point

[zinc bough]

beautyfull

[vast inlet]

@opaque quartz none of that worked... what did work was using the 2nd fluid cart running a 2nd pipe in off the 2nd and looping it at the end.... might be easier fixes but this was 1st one came across

[opaque quartz]

Glad you found a working solution

So the two platforms combined are receiving 1000/min nitrogen at the source station?

[vast inlet]

3 platforms 2 production lines 1 line taking 400min doing nitrogen acid 1 cart, 2nd line doing fused frames and cooling systems taking 600min split over 2 carts

[versed violet]

So I am wondering, are the walking blue bugs that fart gas(?) the same creature as gas plants? The plants clearly have eyes. Different stadium perhaps?

[dusky bronze]

now thats a question

curious now too

[bleak wagon]

does anyone know how the item per minute calculation on the trains works? i assume its an average but is it of all the unloads/loads at the station or is it the average of the last X amount of unload/loads

[hazy hill]

Is it possible to Highlight a connections of picked Machine?

[wind spade]

not in this tool

[hazy hill]

thanks

[pastel obsidian]

@hazy hill You can slide the inputs and outputs to reorder them

[thorny root]

next up: 3 unpackagers, 6 refineries doing plastic. Times 72. Clocked at 97.2222%, so it's effectively 420 refineries instead of 432. But I'm doing this so I don't have gaps in the pattern. Cheeky usage of clockspeeds.

BTW 1512 refineries currently built, and this will bring me up to 1944 as a part of the oil processing. After this: Petroleum Coke

[bleak wagon]

Im starting to wonder if I did my trains right for my nuclear power plant and its really making me question some choices

[thorny root]

Trains have.... veeeeeery little to do with nuclear power. You have drones, remember?

Except for the water, it's mostly low volume stuff.

Drones are great for low volume to isolated areas.

Just make sure the fuel lasts a round trip.

[bleak wagon]

Im making everything at my nuclear power plant

so trains are taking raw resources over

[thorny root]

Then you're going to be importing aluminum / bauxite, copper, limestone, and quartz a lot...

[bleak wagon]

Im aware that im taking a lot of stuff over

[thorny root]

Whelp... you can do this but you're going to have to carefully consider your factory layering. It's gotta flow or you're gonna spaghettify your pasta lines.

[bleak wagon]

I know what Im doing once I make sure I actually have all the needed resources

[thorny root]

Also there's no... no fucking way you're going to be able to feed all those train stations using single train track.

Not and keep reasonable timetables.

You'd better buffer the madness out of everything if you keep it like this.

You're gonna have waiting. And waiting. And waiting.

So yes you're right to be wary of your current heading.

I see a dead end / problems.

Re-think now.

[bleak wagon]

Im not really having issues with the times on the trains

I am now thinking about doing stuff in different places and sending it over, but Ive been building this from the start to do everything on site

[thorny root]

Well... my plans are irrelevant to yours but... I'm personally planning on only handling the radioactive stuff on site at the nuclear, and importing everything else as ready-to-adds.

So there will be a large variety of commodities... but in relatively low volumes per.

And I will likely do a smaller number of longer trains that originate in areas of the factory relevant to the commodity types being produced... And drop at the lines where they'll be used at the nuke plant.

Those start and end points are vertically seperated layers with independently planned train lines.

The only way that's going to wait on anything is if I delete train tracks at random.

Also I'm probably going to have my factory 'up side down' with the nuclear near the bottom and the import lines near the top.

The reason for this is... My trains are already sky trains... and for convenience will stay that way... And the water is gonna be at the bottom... at the ocean.

So it makes sense to make my nuclear plants flow in that direction.

So my layering will look like...
Trains and Drones
Import Handling and Processing
Any Necessary Intermediate layers
Waste Handling and Processing
Nuclear Power Plants
Water Extractors

Maybe this gives you some fresh ideas.

[bleak wagon]

Im just thinking about restarting on my trains, its not going the way I thought it would, the resource numbers are all over the place even though every train in the system should have roughly the same items/min, all the stations have 2 trains going through them, ik distance plays a part in how that goes but I have trains going the same distances and they somehow have drastically different resource numbers

[wind spade]

stack size also plays a role

[bleak wagon]

stack sizes are all 100

[wind spade]

as well as train loop time and number of trains on given route/stations

[thorny root]

Ideally... you'll want to try to have your trains not wait very long to fill, and not wait very long to unload... but also not wait on other trains, and never arrive after the buffer has already filled.

This... takes careful planning that just can't be taught.

[wind spade]

or you just do one train per route, with one belt/pipe per car 😛

[thorny root]

One belt per car is a solid rule of thumb.

one train per route is not always going to cut it if you're absolutely pushing your throughput or the distance is long.

I usually do 2-3 long trains on a single route like... All the iron to one location from another.

[wind spade]

yeah you add second train if first one is not enough, but that's kinda rare

[thorny root]

depends on the route time more than anything

I've had to add up to 3.

But that was literally crossing the whole map.

[bleak wagon]

it fucking sucks for me, but Im just gonna replan the project and restart. I really shouldve come to this conclusion a few days ago, but I wanted to keep pushing it and see if I could get it to work and all that did was result in wasting A LOT of my time

[thorny root]

on super small stack sizes like computers you'll end up with more frequent container fills and more trains to cover the same distance as opposed to like... concrete... where you'll get the same number of stacks but a higher item throughput.

[prisma kraken]

nice thing is that adding a train to a route if your rails are robustly built is nearly effortless

[thorny root]

yeah but that's the thing... the rails aren't robust atm. I think he was thinking he could put all those trains on the same line.

And that is just sadly not realistic.

[prisma kraken]

yeah, a single bidirectional rail is something that is more trouble than it is worth

[thorny root]

I mean... even if it were a pair of rails that ensured continous flow, you've still got 6 train stations in a row sharing the IO.

times multiple rows. SOMEONE's gonna wait on someone.

[bleak wagon]

the trains dont have to wait on each other like ever

[thorny root]

If you have one little bugger that makes port frequently, he's going to screw with the timings of someone who has to make port REGULARLY or lose ground.

[thorny root]

Then what is the problem with the way you're doing things?

[bleak wagon]

im not sure anymore

because ive been watching the trains and theres hardly any waiting

[thorny root]

... are you sure there's a problem at all then?

Why the doubt?

are you not done adding trains? Do see the wait times getting longer?

[bleak wagon]

I have like 3 more trains that need to go in currently, what im seeing happen though is that stations have hugely fluctuating numbers even though theres almost no waiting

[near smelt]

What recipe do people use for super computers? Phase 4 and below please

[thorny root]

Double, triple buffering, and verifying your input throughput and output usage if the lights start flickering. If they don't... it's fine.

[bleak wagon]

I currently have all the stations active going into sinks until I start taking the inputs somewhere

[thorny root]

Then that's likely a reasonable representation of the train traffic during operation.

Steady as you were.

If they're not waiting, and shit's not running out / backing up, quit fretting.

Honestly shocked you're not having waiting situations but I'm not gonna call you a liar.

I just hope it stays that way.

[bleak wagon]

it happens occasionally but its normally like 5 seconds of waiting at most

[thorny root]

Well that's... only a hundred items or so.

If it becomes a problem, take your shortest train routes, and put them on a seperate line.

Leave the longer ones on the same line.

The longer ones, being less frequent to make port, are less likely to jack with the timing of others.

[bleak wagon]

Ive been having doubts that Im not even getting enough resources into stations to begin with

[thorny root]

Go watch an input buffer for a while.

You are buffering your inputs right?

[wind spade]

depends on resources I want to use on them, available locations, personal preferences, etc.

practically every recipe in the game is useful in some scenarios, so just pick one you like the most

[bleak wagon]

yes

[thorny root]

I personally prefer 'super state computer' recipe but the base recipe is also decent. It's the OC super computer you should be careful of due to the extreme nitrogen and copper usage. But if you're not short on these things, don't worry about it.

[bleak wagon]

somethign I have been questioning if its actually working the way I want it to is I have 600/min going into all my pickup stations and I have some drop off stations that have had over 2000/min going into them

[near smelt]

I haven't touched my nitrogen yet. 🫠

[wind spade]

"extreme nitrogen usage" when nitrogen is practically impossible to run out of 😄

[thorny root]

Nuclear processing, quartz purification. Oh no, I'm out of nitrogen. Anyway.

[wind spade]

even a max sink point build only uses like 60% of map's nitrogen

[near smelt]

Just a little baby thing in one corner of the desert to make fused modular frames

[thorny root]

at the highest end it does become a delicate balance of alt recipe usage and sometimes even conversion for the final tidbits.

At the highest end, there's no such thing as max if you're not at 100% resource usage.

[bleak wagon]

I have 600 sulphur/min going into a station for loading, but when it drops off its saying 1100 sulphur/min

[thorny root]

It will unload in bursts... faster than it loads... if you're buffering it right.

[wind spade]

it will average over time

[thorny root]

Since you're sinking, you're basically at 100% possible usage and then some.

There's no machines waiting on buffer filling holding back the flow.

If you expect 600 in, and you're seeing spikes of 1100 on the delivery side during unloading... go build something else. Quit worrying.

[bleak wagon]

im ngl, i think i only have around half the resources going in because this is going to sound stupid because it definitely is ive been acting like sending a second train is going to increase the amount getting delivered over whats actually getting input to the pickup station by a significant amount.

[thorny root]

The actual throughput can only be as fast as the input minus whatever throughput you lose during loading / unloading. If you have 2 mk 6 belts input to platform, and then you put an industrial storage container... And a single Mk 6 belt from that to your source... That's a single buffer. You have a little under 2x more input speed than required. That means your trains can basically spend a little under half the time loading and never outrun your buffer.

Basically meaning you can have a train coming through every 1 minute and not have issues.

If you have more than 1 train coming through every minute to the same station, you begin potentially losing ground on your buffer.

Depends on if you need 1200 through or somewhat less than that.

that's per platform

[bleak wagon]

the hope was I would have each freight platform taking in around 1100 items a minute so I could send the items taken in by that train into a manifold that only needs 1000 items a minute

[thorny root]

You can. 1100 items per minute is entirely within the capabilty of a single platform.

The hard limit is around 2.1k

[bleak wagon]

yeah

I just dont think im loading enough resources to be able to hit 1100 minute

since im only inputting 600/min for each platform

[wind spade]

if you're inputting 600, you will get 600 🤷

[thorny root]

... well yeah you're not going to get 1100 out of 600 in...

Not unless you start combining train throughputs.

Surely this is not what you meant.

Ignore the throughput meter on the train platform.

It's just confusing non information.

The only things to give a shit about are trains waiting, buffers empty, and buffers overfull.

Everything else is irrelevant.

If you really want to whip the meters out, put a programmable splitter before your sink and dictate the throughput at your anticpated machine usage.

It won't let any more through.

Then ignore it for 2 hours.

THEN go look at it.

[bleak wagon]

I think Im gonna restart on my trains for this because I havent been doing it that well from the start is what im realizing now

[thorny root]

... bubba show me your input buffer setup on your trains.

before you go switchin stuff up

where the goods originate

[thorny root]

that is indeed a buffered input.

You're putting 600 in here?

What is the docking frequency at this station?

[bleak wagon]

this station is at its max

the back 2 cars are 450 and the front 2 are 600 which is how i have the inputs

[thorny root]

I see no issues, continue showing me the rest.

Need to know the docking frequency at this station though.

That is important information.

[bleak wagon]

2 trains go to it once every some amount of time

[thorny root]

'some amount of time' is very non specific and does not help me help you.

[bleak wagon]

I have no idea what the time on it is, I can probably do a math to get a rough guess rq

[thorny root]

Math is not what we want here. We need observations.

[bleak wagon]

alright well a trains about to get there so I can track it after it leaves while i head off to the next station to show

[thorny root]

Like... horn honk to horn honk. Watch a clock.

Minutes : Seconds.

Get a couple of samples.

[quick gorge]

Math is not what we want here.
The most https://discord.com/channels/370472939054956546/558721941410807812 comment of them all

[thorny root]

2 trains, I want 4 time samples.

This tells me round trip time, and time between deliveries.

four SEQUENTIAL time samples

[bleak wagon]

we're gonna be here a long time going through these

[thorny root]

If this is the train you're worried about, this is the train we study.

[bleak wagon]

Im not really worried about any of them anymore after looking at a few loading stations, Im realizing my issues lie within unloading and resources input

[thorny root]

What are you jamming up the sinks?

Not accounting for machine usage?

Full unload speed sinks confusing you into thinking you're not getting enough mats?

[quick gorge]

Did I just hear
"While you make your nuclear reactor I'm here studying the train"?

[bleak wagon]

I thought I was loading more than I was

[thorny root]

Its just one part of the bigger machine which all needs to work.

Alls I can say is I'm never going to have to build another oil refinery again.

[quick gorge]

Each gear needs to be milled I see

[bleak wagon]

should 1200/min for each train car should be fine right as long as I have trains going through consistently enough?

cause im likely going to redo my pickup routes

the fun part now is going to be catching all my trains so I can fix their time tables

might be easier to just delete all the trains with SCIM and remake them

[prisma kraken]

soft limits (it depends on the trip time) are about 600/min for 100-stack items or 1200/min for 200-stack items

[bleak wagon]

if i send more trains along the route shouldnt it be alright?

[prisma kraken]

highly dependent on your rail system and how far you are going

[bleak wagon]

I think my rail system should be capable

[violet turtle]

Do small 0.005s of numbers matter

or like this

[prisma kraken]

my rule of thumb is to stick with the 600 & 1200 numbers i listed and then experiment when i deviate

[prisma kraken]

it'll accumulate mismatches over time which will cause machines eventually to blink for a few cycles. that can be annoying for your power graph

[wind spade]

that's basically just personal preference

you can get much closer to the required number if you want, but generally I wouldn't bother with it if you don't mind

[prisma kraken]

such things can be solvable with overflow & sink

[bleak wagon]

could i do smth like 2 600/min trains go back to one station and that station takes in 1200/min

[violet turtle]

eugh

the closest i can really get is 13.332

[bleak wagon]

ew screws

[wind spade]

I'm pretty sure that one is 13.333333 repeating

[prisma kraken]

you can also enter the /min amount, you don't need to move the % slider

[wind spade]

which still isn't the most accurate, that would be inputting the clock speed directly 😉

[violet turtle]

it keeps rounding up or i cant tell

it doesnt show the most accurate numbers

[prisma kraken]

also for numbers like 13.33333..., the clock speed UI accepts expressions like '40/3'

[wind spade]

the UI rounds all values

but the clock speed accepts up to 4 decimals

[violet turtle]

can i make satisfactory calculator app show that?

[wind spade]

which calculator?

[violet turtle]

satisfactory modeler sorry

on steam

[wind spade]

no idea about that, personally I don't like it 🤷

[violet turtle]

mmmhmm okay

[bleak wagon]

i wonder why

[violet turtle]

wait i wonder why

[wind spade]

because it is crap for showing/asking about things, it has no labels on anything

[violet turtle]

That seems to only work for the clock speed

[wind spade]

like the image above, sure, the right box is probably some MF recipe, and I could guess which one by looking at the ingredients, but that would require me looking at wiki for the recipe list... but the left box, you can't tell if it's default RIP recipe or bolted variant, because it just doesn't give you any information to distinguish them

[bleak wagon]

yeah, I was more getting at the fact that you made satisfactory tools so

[wind spade]

that's not the reason

[thorny root]

yes. It matters.

[prisma kraken]

enter '10/3' where i've circled

[violet turtle]

oh i was using 40/3

didnt like the 40 ig

[wind spade]

it can't make that many RIPs indeed

[prisma kraken]

yeah, that would be 13.33/min and that needs some shards

[wind spade]

more than you can input

[thorny root]

thank you for this. I'm going to use this method from now on when figuring my clockspeed for circular configurations. Current clock is 70/72*100

or 97.2222 repeating to infinity

[prisma kraken]

yeah, it makes it a lot more straightforward... i'm not sure if it internally is any more exact, but it takes the guess work and typing out of the equation

[wind spade]

if you care about 0.0001%s then I'd recommend always inputting clock speed directly (not even with formulas)

[violet turtle]

these numbers suck so much

[wind spade]

it's at best same kind of exact, but can be less exact

[wind spade]

don't pick weird production numbers then 😛

[violet turtle]

i need 20!

i already brought the items in

kinda mad at myself

[thorny root]

It's not weird if it's exactly the perfect amount XD

[violet turtle]

already labelled all the belts

[wind spade]

it's not tho 😛 (in this case it's actually 2.499999 )

[tawdry blade]

How about you just distribute the 0,5 across multiple assemblers, achieving a cleaner ratio.

[wind spade]

you still need at least one with "repeating numbers"

[prisma kraken]

83.33333% is a good clock speed, that's one of the repeating decimals that resolves to an integral cycle time

[violet turtle]

a what now

[tawdry blade]

Im not a math guy i thought that would turn out with certain machine counts.

[thorny root]

what'd you say nerd

[violet turtle]

this guy got a+ in all of his math classes

[thorny root]

XD

[prisma kraken]

dude 83.33333 is 5/6

[tawdry blade]

No better praise than ridiculue for achievment

[bleak wagon]

lmao

[prisma kraken]

6 divides 60

[wind spade]

no, because you still need e.g. 266.66666666% repeating in total
you can't divide repeating decimal into multiple non-repeating numbers 🙂

[thorny root]

When calculator comes up with a final product ending in .9999372 you know you did something wrong.

[wind spade]

or you just use the number and don't care

[violet turtle]

yeah im not gonna care about the machine running 99.998 percent of the time

i dont stare at my power graph enough to gaf

[wind spade]

that's completely fair

I'm just mentioning it because some people do care

[tawdry blade]

I wonder if satisfactory was designed as a torture chamber for people with unhealthy fixations

[violet turtle]

only thing i really care about in the grid is stable power production

[tawdry blade]

Because there sure is a lot of stuff that just doesn't fit nicely together

[thorny root]

It's a therapy session for people with certain isms.

[prisma kraken]

i like keeping my power graph relatively flat, and have no problems with certail clock settings that are repeating decimals. things that are fractions of 6 or 3 aren't problematic

[violet turtle]

i do not know how people like kibitz can live with fluctuating ass power productions

[tawdry blade]

I mean you have power storage to flatten any spike.

[violet turtle]

if im building a nuclear power plant with 100 generators its going to be flat

[tawdry blade]

But I guess the issue here is visual not practical

[prisma kraken]

what does get to be an issue is fractions of 7 11 or 13 since the game doesn't have the internal precision for those repeating decimals

[dusky bronze]

once you get going your power graph fluctuating is only gonna be a few thousand MW which is like nothing

[thorny root]

Fluctuating power production is a sign of you being a less than optimal optimizer... and is... suboptimal. But not a deal breaker.

If you don't run out, that's all that really matters.

[tawdry blade]

If we just had a word for power that is a multiple of 1000 MW

[violet turtle]

But why not

[wind spade]

just fyi, what it internally does is compute the result of the formula, round it, calculate required clock speed for the resulting production amount, round it again, and save it as clock speed to the machine

the game never saves (and never calculates with) anything other than clock speed number, with 4 decimals precision

any other number you're shown is calculated (and rounded in UI, but game doesn't round for actual game tick calculations)

[prisma kraken]

tl;dr the game needs to do a lot of math fast, so it uses hardware to do math instead of the pen and paper way we do stuff to carry calculations out to precisions needed.

[wind spade]

how does that matter? the whole game runs on decimal tick durations anyway 😛

[violet turtle]

its so over

idk if i have gif perms or not

f it im making moroe than needed and sinking it

[thorny root]

That's usually what we do.

[wind spade]

or just clock machines and make "exact" 🙂

[thorny root]

Until we can add it to another line that needs more than we produce.

Or that. Produce exact.

[prisma kraken]

i'm trying to simplify the explanation to something understandable rather than going into integral ring theory

[thorny root]

I'm going to just trust this bro. He uses big words.

[bleak wagon]

Im gonna redo my nuclear plan tn instead of reroute trains because my nuclear plan is a mess and i need to know how stations im gonna need now that ive made some changes

[prisma kraken]

any prime number greater than 5 just ends up resolving to messy repeating decimals

[bleak wagon]

big words = trustable
nothing can go wrong there

[thorny root]

Lemme whip out my refabulated amulite

[bleak wagon]

time to redo this mess

but keep it organized instead of a mess

[thorny root]

Divide that as much as you can into factory groups that use the same resources, and have those be vertically separated.

[bleak wagon]

thats the plan

[thorny root]

That'll help you loads with keeping it organized.

[tawdry blade]

Silly, just go with a clean list display lol.

[thorny root]

Don't forget to leave yourself room for logi alleys next to your machine groups, accessible from your logi layers.

[violet turtle]

ok i gotta t ake a train trip now and fix the miner numbers

[tawdry blade]

uhhh so scary

[bleak wagon]

because I have a big ass platform covering the nuclear reactors in the basement I plan to put stations at the bottom of towers and unload out and start going up into machines likely making use of vertical splitters since 1,1

[violet turtle]

i dont use logi floors rlly

[bleak wagon]

same

just do the belt work nicely and they arent needed

[violet turtle]

i just lay out my stuffs on a flat plane

[tawdry blade]

he think he was talking about actual floors with production on it

[violet turtle]

still in a building

[tawdry blade]

yeah

[thorny root]

No I'm talking about layers for belts under the machines. But if you want to layer it all on top you can do that too. You just end up with less X/Y density and poor Z utilization.

[tawdry blade]

I also enjoy vast machinery

[tawdry blade]

nonsense, you can run belts inbetween machines and also on the ceiling.

[bleak wagon]

I have raised belts plenty in my factories

[tawdry blade]

Most compact designs I have seen do not require any extra floors.

[thorny root]

Oh. Then you just can't see your factory for the belts but that's fine too.

If it works it works. There's varying definitions of clean and efficient.

[bleak wagon]

i enjoy making catwalks going over a lot of belts

[tawdry blade]

I sure do love my octosmelter

[thorny root]

That shit gets to be madness when manufacturers come in. And blenders.

I keep it tucked away.

[bleak wagon]

sushi belts for manufacturers and blenders im still working on

[tawdry blade]

I mean you can always dedicate a lane for stacked belts to keep it organized as well.

[thorny root]

I insist on loadbalancing all my machine groups. No sequential manifolding. So I cannot not have logi layers.

[bleak wagon]

ah

[thorny root]

Like... With the exception of like... 3 machine groups. Tiny stuff that isn't gonna jack with numbers... I don't mind.

[bleak wagon]

I do manifolds so logi layers arent that important for me

[thorny root]

It buffers. It runs. Fine. But for like... A constructor blueprint? All load balanced.

[tawdry blade]

You are just not utilizing conveyor lifts with attached splitters to their full potential.

Balancers can be incredibly compact

[thorny root]

In 1.1 when it's not jank I'll implement them. Current implementation is jank looking.

[tawdry blade]

But perhaps not the look you are going for

[thorny root]

I don't do clippy.

[tawdry blade]

Idk what you mean. Its all nice and flush unless you work with cursed offsets

[thorny root]

... you've got a L shaped box rammed up a non entrance and clipped into another box.

[tawdry blade]

This for example is a loadbalanced compact smelter setup

[thorny root]

That's jank in my book.

[tawdry blade]

You could also have the belts lower, but I liked it this way better.

[thorny root]

I like my logi layers. They're clean, symmetrical, and hidden when I don't want to oogle over them.

[tawdry blade]

hardly any clipping, looks clean, somehow jank. Idk.

[thorny root]

Efficient, sure. Clean, not to me.

All I see is clutter.

Do your thing. I do mine.

[bleak wagon]

is non fissile uranium sinkable?

[wind spade]

no, nothing in the plutonium chain is sinkable (except for PFRs)

[bleak wagon]

shit ig i get some spare fuel rods

how tf did i even pull that off

[prisma kraken]

and uranium ore

[wind spade]

that's... not in plutonium chain

[prisma kraken]

i guess that sorta depends on whether you consider nuclear the plut chain 🤷

[wind spade]

uranium chain (uranium ore to UFRs) -> all sinkable
uranium waste -> not sinkable
plutonium chain (UWaste to PFRs) -> not sinkable, except for PFRs
PWaste -> not sinkable
ficsonium chain (PWaste to FFRs) -> not sinkable

[bleak wagon]

Im really starting to question my previous nuclear plans because my numbers are looking a lot nicer this time around

[violet turtle]

how are you controllers red

also, is it neccessary that i always set my miners that are hooked up to trains to always be +20 more than needed for throughput

[wind spade]

no

make exact, you will get exact

[violet turtle]

its not even clippingggg

[violet turtle]

rlly?

i thought trains never really had exact throughput

[wind spade]

yes, what would otherwise happen with the excess 20 ore?

[violet turtle]

because of travvel time and loading and unloading pausing it

[violet turtle]

i thought it would compensate for travel times

[bleak wagon]

buffer it and it works fine

[violet turtle]

i do dat

[wind spade]

so it would... disappear?

if you put 200/min into a platform, and you get 180/min on the other end, where does the 20/min go? 🙂

[prisma kraken]

you don't need to clip to balance compactly

[violet turtle]

youre right

thanks

[bleak wagon]

istg this game hates nice numbers

[wind spade]

no, it's you who hates "not nice" numbers 😛

[bleak wagon]

I have less than 4 extra dissolved silica being made as a byproduct

nvm its gonna be more than that I had one more quartz thing left to deal with

122.22 extra dissolved silica, ig i can just turn it into silica and sink it until it has a use and i forget i have it

damn im only using 2.8k quartz on this version of my nuclear plan

[tawdry blade]

You can change your colors in the hub

[bleak wagon]

I love accidently making more aluminum scrap than one belt can handle in one machine

[violet turtle]

going insane

[bleak wagon]

same

Im handling absurd aluminum outputs rn though

[lethal mango]

You guys are crazy, I’m still trying to make it through tier 2. The jungle isn’t very flat , might swap to desert for a flatter biome to work with

[violet turtle]

"Im going insane"
"16,018.52"

how many ingots are you making?

[livid turret]

Flat is a matter of perspective, you can build high and everything is flat there

[bleak wagon]

the original number per machine was almost 1800 which is a little more than mk6 belt can handle

[bleak wagon]

8009.4

[thorny root]

Feeling silly. Contemplating actually building my nuclear in the middle of the map after all, and literally piping in 213 pipes to cool the reactors from 5 different points in the map.

[lethal mango]

True but I’m throughout is low since I’m learning/new. that’s a lot
Of resources for foundations

[violet turtle]

whyyyyy

[bleak wagon]

because apparently i like aluminum casing

[violet turtle]

are you using the recipe that uses aluminium and copper

[thorny root]

Aluminum casings are better than alclad sheets. XD

[bleak wagon]

agreed

[thorny root]

Because we need copper for either pasta or computers.

It's always one or the other.

[violet turtle]

can i eat nuclear pasta

[thorny root]

Once.

[violet turtle]

yum

my tummy hurts

[bleak wagon]

Im using the alclad casing recipe, idm the copper usage because im slooping the copper powder production

[thorny root]

It's extraordinarily dense. So if you manage to ingest enough of it it'll eventually just structurally destroy your insides as gravity handles the direction it goes.

[violet turtle]

dw im already extraordinarily dense

maybe even more so :3

[bleak wagon]

Im only at 9.5k copper ore so it seems like im fine doing this

[thorny root]

oh god. XD

[bleak wagon]

try 2 at my nuclear plan is going A LOT better though

[livid turret]

If this is your first run, don't forget that you can always build more and that there is a lot of free space so no need to tear apart things that are already working

[bleak wagon]

Im glad i decided to take a step back and think

[thorny root]

I'm tempted to pause on my refinery stacks for a while and go plan something more fun.

I don't wanna say I'm getting burned out but uh... chatting about it is more fun than building atm.

[bleak wagon]

yeah i feel that

[thorny root]

It's just sooooo tedious.

[lethal mango]

First run, I’m going to start a second run. I could really use a pure node vs all these impure ones