math-and-meta

[oblique hollow]

remember to also evaluate them yourself
At some point it becomes too vague to really say "you should pick this one vs that one"

[sand furnace]

https://www.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/s/9bznrV0GL1

[oblique hollow]

if a recipe looks like it could help you in some of your factories, dont feel afraid to pick it

[ashen girder]

Oh hey, that's actually probably the one I was thinking of.

Yeah, that's definitely the one I was thinking of. Thanks!

[prisma kraken]

the amt of time people spend discussing this all...

[sand furnace]

I'm gonna have to try it on my set up.

[ashen girder]

It's complicated and nobody knows the real answers but the devs.

And I sincerely doubt any one dev could explain the entire system front to back.

[prisma kraken]

i think you are probably correct

which is why it probably isn't worth it once you converge on a working design

[sand furnace]

Also, you made the pipeline guide, McG?

[ashen girder]

The problem is there hasn't been convergence on an actual working design.

[oblique hollow]

People sure like to claim that a lot

[ashen girder]

The guide itself even likes to claim that. 😛

[uncut kraken]

i input my alt receipes and then worked back to see how many uraniam fuel rods I can make.
https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=WI6tzATEDmDt372I1B7f
Whys it wanting me to waste so many extra things?

I have cast screw recipe, but it still wants me to use the Alt Steel rod I have- and then waste those rods on making screws? 😒

[oblique hollow]

hmm yup name still printed on that

[ashen girder]

It's optimizing the number of resources it's using based on how much of that resources you've got on in the inputs.

[sand furnace]

Yup. I just checked myself XD This has been an amazing resource I've used

[oblique hollow]

You have set it to make 1/min fuel rod
so it does that
and the rest isnt used cause you didnt ask for it

[ashen girder]

To be fair, you're @mcgalleon, not @McGalleon#8273 👀 😁

[oblique hollow]

I do plan to sort of rewrite it eventually

[ashen girder]

Authored by "the Genuine McGalleon", no doubt.

[oblique hollow]

Push back the pop quizzes and offer more actual insight

[prisma kraken]

no vip, no buffer, nothing fancy, it just works:

[ashen girder]

Stillll want your thoughts from those reddit posts though.

[oblique hollow]

i might just turn the quizzes into actual quizz pages and then an answer sheet at the end

[oblique hollow]

was it tested with a dead-locked system?

[ashen girder]

They managed to change it to dead lock, if that counts?

[oblique hollow]

no i mean "clog one of the scrap refineres with scrap, let the system drown and then take out the scrap and see if it recovers"

[ashen girder]

I have no idea if they did that or not. Is that a good way to test these?

[oblique hollow]

yes thats the main reason systems fail

[ashen girder]

Sounds like I have more science to do tonight.

[oblique hollow]

stability and resistance vs interruptions

thats one of the main benefits of the "mergeless" solution too

[prisma kraken]

well, i mean, my design doesn't work if you cut the power to it

[ashen girder]

Most things don't, funny enough.

[oblique hollow]

honestly, if you sub-comparmentalize your aluminum processing into just pairs of scrap and alumina refineries with a single junction, it can work too

anyone remember the fun "input priority" behaviour of mergers?

[prisma kraken]

a lot of problems with aluminum can be alleviated with realizing that the refineries should never, ever stop

[oblique hollow]

theres a certain rule to merging belts of different speeds

which describes how exactly the mergers act

that rule also transfers over to pipe junctions, partially

[prisma kraken]

iirc, lower speed belts take priority?

[oblique hollow]

ye

[prisma kraken]

well, effectively so

[oblique hollow]

can anyone think of some cases in pipes where
"Lower belt pipe throughput takes priority" might cause issues?

[ashen girder]

So, that reddit post suppositions that it's not the flow so much as just, each junction assigns priority basically?

So if you draw a line through two junctions to get to something, that thing has higher priority than something that goes through three or four junctions.

If I'm understanding it right.

[ashen girder]

Any time you produce more output than you need fresh?

I have one that produces 220 recycled and needs 80 fresh IIRC.

[gleaming shuttle]

if lower pipe throughput takes priority in merges, is it possible to create a pseudo-VIP in certain situations with strategic intermixing of mk1 and mk2 pipes?

[oblique hollow]

that sure sounds like one of those cases

[oblique hollow]

not sure, depends on the case

havent done too many tests on that

but if you think "300/min in mk 1" vs "150/min in mk 2"
then the mk 2 pipe wins here
because it has the lower throughput

[gleaming shuttle]

ah

hrmm

[prisma kraken]

the one thing that i'd like to know is whether an input to a pipe network with highest headlift takes priority

[oblique hollow]

no

headlift is treated equal

try a mk 1 vs a mk 2 pump

both will have equal priority

if you merge them into a junction

[ashen girder]

Hm. The one that needed 80 fresh was getting 120 fresh, which is higher than the recycled.

I'll have to look at how they're piped.

Like, if it takes lowest first, then you should be able to send a full pipe across and get recycled fine right?

It should just make the extractors stutter.

[oblique hollow]

If you slap together an aluminum setup of like... 2 refineries
and then add one water extractor
and you dont add anything else at all
it should work fine and the water extractor backs up

[trail lion]

just realized at tier 4 i can run aproximately 75.6 coal generators off 1 normal coal node and 1 normal sulphur node. Can anyone verify my math and/or come up with a way to push that further and maybe make the rations nicer?

[ashen girder]

You eventually just give up on ratios.

[oblique hollow]

50/min compacted per 7 coal gens
so i assume you mean fully overclocked normal nodes? also, what miner mk?

[prisma kraken]

it is 7 generators for 50 c. coal

so 600/min should be 12*7 generators = 84

[trail lion]

mk2 miner on normal nodes overclocked to 225% is 270, the current max belt i have available. compacted coal is typically 1:1:1, but if i use somersloops i can double the output to 1:1:2 for 540 compacted coal. 540CC * 7 gen / 50 cc = 75.6

[ashen girder]

I would suggest not slooping CC production.

[oblique hollow]

unless you get better belts theres nothing to improve honestly

[ashen girder]

If you want to sloop power before Nuclear, I would just build APAs.

[oblique hollow]

the numbers will stay weird because its 50 to 7 after all

if you get mk 4 belts you could mine 300/min for a neat 42 generators

[trail lion]

why?

[prisma kraken]

you'll want the sloops for other stuff later, and having to rip them out of your power infrastructure sounds like a 'later' problem you'll be cursing yourself for creating

[ashen girder]

Because those sloops will be far more impactful elsewhere.

[prisma kraken]

using compacted coal for coal power kind of is that way to begin with

[trail lion]

by the point that becomes a problem, won't i have higher tier belts that can pull more resources from the miner, allowing me to run more assemblers to compensate for the removed loops?

[ashen girder]

Slooping 5 Compacted Coal assemblers nets you about 1000 MW of power in total.

[prisma kraken]

when you find that you want to use the sulfur for things that make more power and convert your coal plant back to normal coal, you end up with generators grouped by 7 instead of 8 which is horrible to fix unless you've allocated the extra space for it

[proud totem]

I mean, I'd just suggest going for the turbo fuel setup. I did 50 fuel powered gens using 300 CC

[ashen girder]

If you already have 5 GW of power, a single APA for the same number of sloops nets you 1050 MW of power.

And the APA provides more power as you build out larger power generation.

[trail lion]

well to get apas im gonna need to go hunting for computers

like i said, im at tier 4

[proud totem]

Lol sorry, I keep getting tiers and phases mixed up

[ashen girder]

I definitely wouldn't be touching CCoal that early.

[prisma kraken]

quite a few crash sites have them scattered around, just it is the crash sites that aren't the starter biome gimme's

[livid meteor]

rip, my world is fucked 😦

[snow maple]

do gaseous fluids obey the same priority splits/mergers that liquids do? i know gases don't have headlift

[oblique hollow]

gasses cannot use most methods you are used to

like overflow builds

[ashen girder]

Are there methods they can use?

I thought gasses and nongasses were basically "pray. really hard."

[oblique hollow]

and neither can you use buffers to sustain flow rate at max

[prisma kraken]

i've not really noticed any big differences, but builds for gases tend to be a lot more straightforward

like it is usually nitrogen into a bunch of blenders w/o any byproduct

[ashen girder]

Yeah, it's nongasses where it gets dumb.

[proud totem]

This is the one that makes me sad, because gas on train without packaging is pretty infeasible. Even though packaging is more space efficient, fluid cars are somewhat simpler

[prisma kraken]

i haven't gotten to the t9 stuff yet, but i suppose that's going to be some learning experience

[livid meteor]

Is there a way to fix a save file?

[snow maple]

i'm trying to make an overflow setup for rocket fuel, i have a shard encoder for personal use, but i want to use the shards for ion fuel when my storage overflows, but i don't know if i can do overflow with rocketfuel

[oblique hollow]

its not feasible to transport rocket fuel, ionized fuel unpackaged
and for dark matter residue and photonic matter its just....
no

[feral breach]

Is it better to build alclad sheets in my aluminium factory or ship ingots and build it where its needed?

[oblique hollow]

No long distance transport for those 2 quantum matters

[oblique hollow]

in what way

[snow maple]

ooh packaging it is a good idea, thanks

[oblique hollow]

Dark matter and photonic matter cannot be packaged btw

[livid meteor]

If I dismantle something my server crashes. Right now even my game crashed

[prisma kraken]

you are either going to bring alum ingots to copper or copper ingots to alum, them's the breaks 😄

[proud totem]

Couldn't you technically just do a really long pipeline though?

[ashen girder]

DMCs are basically fancy packaged DMR.

[livid meteor]

I tried to dismantle my blueprint. I thought it's too much at once and tryed to dismantle piece by piece. But even then my server dies

[oblique hollow]

If you wanna die of old age sure

[proud totem]

I either die of old age or die of inefficieny so

[oblique hollow]

just dont transport these 2 long distances

[prisma kraken]

ehh, just afk for a night as the pipes fill 😛

[ashen girder]

There's no reason to move EPM anywhere.

[feral breach]

I guess... 😄 is it better to stop at ingots at the main factory or again finish the production of casings and ship those... or are they similar to quick wire?

[ashen girder]

Honestly. You could just build 1:1 for those if you want. 😂 Probably most efficient solution.

[prisma kraken]

casings aren't nearly as bad, you use some for RCU's and nuclear, but most casings you make will go into making heatsinks

[ashen girder]

If you use that recipe. 👀 😂

[prisma kraken]

those can be made alongside the rest of aluminum if you import copper or rubber

[ashen girder]

My casings entirely go to FMFs.

[prisma kraken]

ahhh, i forgot the default fmf recipe takes them too, yeah

[feral breach]

Well... Ill start by picking which nodes I want to exploit 😄 which will dictate my location I guess 😄

[ashen girder]

Default Heatsinks use Alclad and Copper sheets.

I just have a whole copper node for my aluminum factory.

[prisma kraken]

well at least you don't need it to make wire for batteries anymore

[ashen girder]

So many copper sheets though.

[feral breach]

is the spot above golden coast decent?... not sure I found any other bauxite yet 😄

[ashen girder]

Also fused wire/fused quickwire/copper alloy. You can make copper reeeeally stretch really easily.

[livid meteor]

rip, server dead again

[prisma kraken]

electro scrap. use the resin byproduct from the coke to make rubber 🤷

[ashen girder]

Yeah, if I were building on the golden coast, I'd be using all the oil alts instead of the non-oil alts.

[prisma kraken]

tempered & leached too for copper, they're pretty good ™️

[oblique hollow]

leached has like 5.555% less efficiency than pure

which is funny as hell

[prisma kraken]

yeh, 2.4x vs 2.5x

[feral breach]

Only con about building above gold coast is... that I have to get my trains up the mountain 😄

[oblique hollow]

no, 2.4444 vs 2.5

[ashen girder]

Use lifts to bring the solid goods down to the shore.

[oblique hollow]

2.4 is for tempered

[livid meteor]

why I don't use it to be honest

[ashen girder]

I also just realized you can make circuit boards entirely out of oil, heh.

[prisma kraken]

both are bonkers

[livid meteor]

Sulfur seems way to valuable

[oblique hollow]

which is why you could, technically, turn leached into "Iron alloy Mk 2" by just transmuting iron to sulfur

25/min acid really isnt a whole lot

[ashen girder]

Honestly, I feel like the transmutation recipes are just CSS fucking with us.

[prisma kraken]

that's kind of the idea behind he leached recipes

[feral breach]

Guess Ill start with HDD hunt so I have more time to think about what I want to do 😄

[oblique hollow]

62.5/min Iron to run one Leached Copper Refinery

[livid meteor]

but isn't there better use for sam?

uranium?

[oblique hollow]

its about 2/min Reanimated SAM

[ashen girder]

3.75 copper ingot per water for pure, 4.4 ingots per water+sulfur for leached.

[oblique hollow]

aaaaaand im not about to run out of uranium of all things

[livid meteor]

I just don't see the reason to use leeched recipes if stuff like iron is so abundant

[oblique hollow]

SAM is pretty much "use wherever you want"

[ashen girder]

We're literally discussing turning iron into sulfur to use the leached recipes. 😛

[oblique hollow]

leached iron is not worth it as much

but leached caterium and copper are

[livid meteor]

I mean what would you leech then?

pure ingots seem good enough

[ashen girder]

2.5 iron ore into 1 sulfur..

[livid meteor]

leeched is x2 and pure is x1.85 or so

Per ore

[oblique hollow]

leached is less space so i'll take that

[ashen girder]

Means leached is 7.5 iron ore per 10 ingots.

Also produces 100/min which is nuts.

[oblique hollow]

All Hail Leached Caterium. 66.66% efficiency
vs the 50% of pure and tempered

on that note.... Pure caterium is dead

Tempered took its place, rightfully so

[livid meteor]

Whut. I still use pure

[plain rivet]

is there a reason why the tools calculator is using diluted packaged fuel when i have diluted fuel

[ashen girder]

I wondered that myself.

[oblique hollow]

it just picks one

[livid meteor]

I can't imagine leeched recipes are efficient if you wanna max out sink points

[oblique hollow]

disable diluted packaged

[livid meteor]

I stick to pure, not wasting resources.

[ashen girder]

Yeah, but why does it think DPF is better?

[oblique hollow]

it just stumbled over it first i think?

[plain rivet]

it didn't used to. and I didn't know if there was a setting i clicked and forgot about

[oblique hollow]

ask greeny if you want

[plain rivet]

i've been unchecking packaged, just curious

[oblique hollow]

Not my kinda playstyle so im happy with leached and tempered

[ashen girder]

Can you share the tab using DPF?

Mine defaulted to DF with 10 supercomputers.

[livid meteor]

Hmmm, but then again getting acid is so much harder than water

[oblique hollow]

its just water + sulfur

[livid meteor]

I dunno, leeched seems overly complicated for such a small gain

yea but pure is just water

[oblique hollow]

if i want sulfur i can just use a drone

[ashen girder]

Honestly, one should never judge recipes on that criteria.

[oblique hollow]

I dont wanna use pure recipes because im tired of them

[livid meteor]

depends. I want to max out my points

[oblique hollow]

They can go die for all i care

[ashen girder]

"Maxing out my points" is still meaningfully different criteria.

[plain rivet]

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=YgwhuZmHhXc7NFyZRHYY

i was just seeing how much rocket fuel would spit out

[livid meteor]

I mean ficsonium also seems cool but not worth it

the rods

[ashen girder]

Oh, that's just Maximize being stupid.

[livid meteor]

that's why I will use all my plutonium to fuel drones. I might run into radiation issues tho xD

[verbal lake]

that's what the suit is for

[ashen girder]

...not.. not that not doing maximize makes much more sense.... why's it making computers? 😂

[oblique hollow]

never ask why maximize does something

[ashen girder]

This isn't maximize.

[oblique hollow]

Apparently making computers was just the best use of byproducts

[ashen girder]

I think it's actually that weird error where it just shows a bunch of recipes at 0% usage.

[oblique hollow]

i think yours just errored out yea

mine isnt making computers

[plain rivet]

to be fair, that setup does produce the expected 0 computers

[ashen girder]

Oh wow. The resource difference between 2400 RF and Maximize RF is weird.

[livid meteor]

I'm curious if this lift is crashing my server

seems suspicious when aiming with the gun at it

[ashen girder]

Right side is Maximize, left side is 2400. Both produce 2400RF, 400 CCoal and 400 Resin.

[inner portal]

can the new building fit in a 6x6 areaa?

[oblique hollow]

yes

but not normally

[ashen girder]

It's converting bauxite into nitrogen. How evil.

[oblique hollow]

let me find the pic

[inner portal]

time to do impure only 6x6 challenge

[plain rivet]

i turn off sam

[ashen girder]

Oh, AND converting coal into sulfur. 🤣

[plain rivet]

usually

[livid meteor]

was done dismantling half of my blueprint, RIP

[inner portal]

i'm guessing diagonally?

[ashen girder]

Greeny's tools having too much fun over here.

[oblique hollow]

you bet

[inner portal]

thanks :D

[oblique hollow]

you can even fit 2 in there

[livid meteor]

Oh no

[oblique hollow]

if you stack em

[livid meteor]

I don't like that

[oblique hollow]

Rise of the diagonal blueprints

[livid meteor]

Even putting them diagonally already hurts my feelings

[oblique hollow]

How bout double

[ashen girder]

What is you just don't put it on foundations at all?

[oblique hollow]

you need foundations

[ashen girder]

You might.

[oblique hollow]

else you cant put it diagonally

[livid meteor]

I men I prefer that over diagonally but both kinda yikes

[ashen girder]

Ah. Fair enough.

[oblique hollow]

this IS diagonally

[livid meteor]

next up you tell me you build power plants in a blueprint

[oblique hollow]

look at the bounding box

[livid meteor]

Oh no, I see it

OH NO

[magic island]

put diagonal foundations, place the encoder, delete foundations and replace with perpendicular foundations

[ashen girder]

I've got a 6 fuel gen blueprint I use.

[oblique hollow]

thats what i did for the actual BP i use

also, since you can fit Accelerators in the Mk 2 Designer...
I had to upgrade my Accelerators with some sick new quickwire coils

[magic island]

I also gave the encoder beam a sunroof. can't block the beam, that wouldn't be aesthetic

[upbeat tide]

Im suffering the wrath of rocket fuel! I either build 480 fuel gens or just 200... with 3 shards each at 240%

[oblique hollow]

second option doesnt sound so bad

[livid meteor]

Yo what the fuck is that

[oblique hollow]

My Mk. 2 Particle Accelerator

[upbeat tide]

600 shards tho... but yup

[ashen girder]

6 in a blueprint. Plop it down 6 times. That's 36.

[livid meteor]

For a sec I thought those where the traveling pipes

[brisk canyon]

hello guys, don't know if this is the right channel but i currently have a problem. i have 2 foundries making 45 steel ingots/min each and wanna supply their outputs to 2 constructors where one is making steel beams at 60 steel ingots/min and the other one is making steel pipes at 45/min, how can i balance that out?

[ashen girder]

I switched my Power Shard encoder over to Superposition Oscillators after I filled up my uploader. 😛

[brisk canyon]

(apologies in case of bad english, it's not my first language)

[oblique hollow]

60 and 45 is more than 90
these numbers dont quite work out

[ashen girder]

Underclock one of them.

[upbeat tide]

Fuel gens m8. Maybe fit two on the bp pad

[ashen girder]

Yeah. I've got 6 in mine.

[brisk canyon]

makes sense

[upbeat tide]

Ooh? Goes to play

[brisk canyon]

its just that its quite hard to find good ratios with only mk 1 miners

[oblique hollow]

6 fuel gens?
in the mk 3 bp?

[ashen girder]

Si senor!

[oblique hollow]

i assume 2 layers?

[ashen girder]

I don't think you can do 7.

Yep! The uprights are just far enough apart to nestle two more on a platform between them.

[oblique hollow]

or is this all on the ground floor

[ashen girder]

All fed from a pipe on the floor and a wire connector on the platform, so I can place, wire, pipe, move on.

[oblique hollow]

oh if only we had the mk 3 designer in tier 3 for coal generators...

[ashen girder]

I wonder how many coal gens you could fit in the Mk3.

[oblique hollow]

gotta be at least... 2

[ashen girder]

Maybe even 3.50.

[ashen girder]

And yeah, Mk1 I think you can do 2 fuel gens if you stagger them. Mk2 can do 4 if you get fancy. Mk3 can do 6.

[oblique hollow]

if you try hard maybe even 2π generators

[upbeat tide]

Yea I normally dont do alot with the bp maker. Maybe need to fix that

[ashen girder]

The Mk2 and Mk3 open a lot of options.

[oblique hollow]

you can cut out a lot of work if you make yourself some modules

[ashen girder]

I have each basic producer with a power pole pre-attached.

[oblique hollow]

see above with my beautiful diagonal Encoder

[ashen girder]

Foundry and Assembler with lifts.

A smelter house that can eat 1200 ore/min.

A pair of blenders that make enough rocket fuel to feed 36 fuel gens out of HOR.

[upbeat tide]

My smelter houses tend to evolve into refineries 🙂

[trail lion]

for the dimensions of a water extractor, is it 19.5 from front (where the output is) to back?

[oblique hollow]

i think so...?

[ashen girder]

S'what Wiki says.

[trail lion]

well wiki just says "length"

is "length" front to back or side to side?

[ashen girder]

I think "Length" is generally assumed to be "Front to back".

[oblique hollow]

find the longest side
20 m vs 19.5 m

[trail lion]

kk

[ashen girder]

Width being side to side normally.

[prisma kraken]

2.5 foundations square, which is more like 20 meters

[ashen girder]

But who knows. Those wiki guys are crazy.

[oblique hollow]

you could just treat it as 20 x 20 you know

half meters arent exactly something you can easily do

[ashen girder]

We got beams baby.

[prisma kraken]

you usually need a little clearance for the ouput pipe anyway

[muted tide]

does fuel type also impact drone speed

[trail lion]

just trying to approximate math

[ashen girder]

(Picture not mine) @oblique hollow given the assumption that junctions favor lower throughput pipes, if I ran the extractors here at full blast would you expect this to work?

[oblique hollow]

kinda

[ashen girder]

Allegedly this works perfectly normally (assuming not full throttle? But I dunno. That's a lot of water extractors.). I haven't tested it myself.

[sterile tangle]

has anyone figured out a realy good production for ||ballistic warp drives|| that uses as few resource variants as possible?

[oblique hollow]

those are hell
the ||pasta|| for it is the worst part

[ashen girder]

So much copper.

Now that's a building worth slooping. 🤣

[sterile tangle]

i need ||200 for the elevator|| and ||they yield the most points in the sink|| so i thought why not make it into a factory...

[ashen girder]

Now you know why not. ✅

I sure as shit didn't.

I've got a small factory chain by my base that I hand feed most of the ingredients to, to produce elevator parts with sloops.

[sterile tangle]

honetly i dont plan to make that much, only 5 per minute with the manufacturer actually being somerslooped 2.5 overclock.

[ashen girder]

I've been slowly replacing my hand feeding with train/drone drops.

[sterile tangle]

i mean i need them regardless.

and i have all the alts

(soon)

[ashen girder]

I know. I just got my golden nut yesterday with probably the smallest power grid of anyone in this channel that's gotten a golden nut. 🤣

Only tapped into my batteries for a little bit!

[sterile tangle]

whats the best item for a sink?

[ashen girder]

5 BWDs/min. 🤣 And going on hunting expeditions and slooping remains and DNA.

I spent the last 3 hours of my game just massacring things.

I also overproduced singularity cells, superposition oscillators, and TPRs and routinely sank those manually.

[sterile tangle]

well i already have 4.46666 pasta per minute...

it was a setup for the ||1000 pasta|| nened for ||phase 5||

[frigid plover]

Is this optimized?

[sterile tangle]

im honestly so paranoid about what is a spoiler and what not,.

[ashen girder]

In here, none of it's a spoiler IMO. 🤣

[sterile tangle]

it looks aweful but if you need 5 per min and ur getting 5 per min its fine.

[ashen girder]

Beautiful.

[sterile tangle]

the duality of satisfactory players

lmao

[ashen girder]

And yeah, we pretty openly talk about all the phase 5 stuff in here. It'd be frustrating trying to spoiler it.

[urban kite]

i wonder if its possible to make 240/min of every building material

[ashen girder]

It is not.

Oh, building material. Sorry.

....maybe. 😂

Last time someone said 240 of every item. PTSD moment.

[urban kite]

if it possible i might make it my goal

and once ive automated everything to build with... ill have no reason to build

[prisma ocean]

How do i get in this cave?
I've looked around the area and couldn't find the entrance to the cave and this quartz node

[vivid escarp]

Can i mark something as "Finished building in this Blueprint website?

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=hvJzMcUbuhRWWk4oshSV

[sterile tangle]

BRO MY URANIUM SETUP IS SO BAD IT CONSTANTLY NEEDS ME TO DUMP THE SULFURIC ACID EVEN THO IT'S LIKE SPOT ON NUMBERS WTF

[versed violet]

did yu properly build the recycling loop?

[livid meteor]

Meh, those 2 pieces make my server crash. I am not allowed to remove them

[sterile tangle]

I have 165/m sulfuric acid going into 2 blenders for uranium pelets, which returns 20+20/m acid, which is combined with the leftover 5/m acid to be 45/m acid for plutonium.

i have a VIP junction to prioritise the uranium output.

[versed violet]

you do realize that any hiccup in plutonium lines will throw the balance out of whack?

[sterile tangle]

even better.
I'm experiencing it.

[vivid escarp]

Why dont you use the Uran setup that dont needs the yellow stuff

[sterile tangle]

i think its cuz i didnt have the recipe unlocked before..

[versed violet]

suggestion: split your plutonium manufacturing into one set of machines using 40 acid and rest

[sterile tangle]

dang that would have been so much better...

[livid meteor]

Ok damn, seems like my blueprints are corrupted

[sterile tangle]

honestly i've spent 3 days at uranium i am so done with it i'll just finnish my current game and start over.

[livid meteor]

Guess no more satisfactory until they fix it 😦

[vivid escarp]

fix what?

why not remove it with this online tool i used to reset this pink balls

[livid meteor]

https://questions.satisfactorygame.com/post/66e344d2772a987f4a8ae191

[sterile tangle]

are you by any chance trying to load mk1 blueprints in mk2 or 3?

[livid meteor]

It seems like when you place a blueprint there is a chance the items of the blueprint aren't actually placed, therefore causing a server crash if you try to dismantle them

Or well if you interact with them at all

for example touching that foundry or the lift kills my server as you can see

[sterile tangle]

My paralysis demon...

[livid meteor]

Okay, there is no way to fix this issue 😦

Tried many different things now.

[sterile tangle]

I the fertile uranium alt any good?

[amber jacinth]

It's useful for making more plutonium from less uranium, alongside the instant cell alternate recipe.

[wind spade]

good depends on you 🙂
do you like the tradeoff?

[sterile tangle]

idk

i thought someone had the numbers ready

[plush bloom]

my math is not mathing anymore, supercomputers are the hell

[sterile tangle]

like, the tradeoff means less uranium and more plutonium but does the trade off equal more energy?

[wind spade]

that depends on other recipes in the chain, also what you're burning or sinking or whatever. You need to calculate it completely, not just one recipe

@vapid fable see #math-and-meta message for alt recipe choices

[vivid escarp]

why not put both above?

[grand jasper]

wat is happening

[urban kite]

uh oh the irradiated water got you

[grand jasper]

i just wanted water for my batteries man

[vivid escarp]

Happend to me too, its sometimes even pink

Works like normal water, you maybe used Atomic Bob

[grand jasper]

im in the red middle forrest close to radiation protected HD

[vivid escarp]

I've put so many pumps in there that the river shouldn't really be a river anymore, but of all the pumps only 3-4 make this uranium water (320)

[sterile tangle]

Converters destroyed Satisfactory Tools.

[urban kite]

disable them then

[sterile tangle]

Ah yes search every converter recipe in the tool. Why can't they have a button like "Disable ore conversion"

[vivid escarp]

thre is

[urban kite]

you can disable buildings

[sterile tangle]

omg where

[ashen girder]

"Buildings" tab. 😂

[sterile tangle]

but what if u need idk photonic matter too

[ashen girder]

You can also search ( to get only the conversion recipes.

Greeny refuses to make it any simpler. 😂

[sterile tangle]

Oh, thats a good one!

[urban kite]

then idk

[verbal lake]

😆 you'll spend hours and hours making the build, feels like spending a minute or two to adjust the settings isn't too much of an inconvenience

[ashen girder]

It lumps in the biomass and power shard recipes, but frankly, you probably don't want those either.

[amber jacinth]

The computer is only as smart as you tell it to be 😛

[sterile tangle]

true but its still inconvinient when u got like 10 projects and u gotta do it for each...

[amber jacinth]

Tweaking the calculator should be done a decent amount- I love disabling certain alts / main recipes just to make things "easier" for me to build

[urban kite]

computers are insanely dumb, theyre just incredibly fast at doing little dumb things 🙂

[verbal lake]

imagine if you had to do it by hand

[urban kite]

i, on the other hand, am dumb AND slow

[wind spade]

you can literally just disable the converter in the "machines" menu

[proud totem]

Row reduce an 8x9 matrix by hand to solve a simple steel system. Very fun to do

[tired glen]

Wtf is radiated water

[verbal lake]

I don't even know what that means, so...

[rain canyon]

i am having a real issue where with Aluminum scrap building up water and staling the system.

I have 5 Sloppy Alumina: 185Bau/185Water IN >>> 222 Alumina Solution Out
I have 5 Aluminum Scrap: 222 Alumina Solution IN/111 Coal IN >>> 333 Aluminum Scrap OUT and 111 Water OUT.

I have a pipe from the 5 Aluminum Scrap to a junction that heads to the 5 Sloppy Alumina.
1115=555 Water OUT
5 Sloppy Alumina: 1855=925

so thats 925-555=370

I have a 2 pumps pushing 370.

The issue I have is that my 5 Aluminum Scrap water backs up to FULL and stalls the system

[ashen girder]

I do do it by hand. It's really not hard at all.

[verbal lake]

I have a sea of note cards on my desk as well 😆

[ashen girder]

Honestly, I use excel. 🤷‍♂️

You just gotta work backwards and iteratively.

[verbal lake]

There's something about physical pen and paper that I prefer, even if I have 2 monitors and could type it in a blank notepad window.

[proud totem]

This is basically what row reduction is, just with more context

[ashen girder]

"more context" takes a very complex problem and makes it a very simple one, as it turns out.

[rain canyon]

I got a notebook finally, graphing one since I have all these scrap papers with satisfactory drawing all ove my desk

[ashen girder]

(Which, I mean, is more or less a truism.)

[proud totem]

More so you probably have more labels instead of arbitrary numbers in a grid

[verbal lake]

I thought about how cool it would be to have one of those drawing pads like that, even more so with built in calculator and stuff on them...

[proud totem]

The problem is probably still the same difficulty, since often the matrix is relatively sparse

[ashen girder]

Fair enough. Never did any of that fancy schmancy linear algebra stuff. 😛

[proud totem]

My secondary major was mathematics in college, so its my 2nd nature to overcomplicate at this point. But then matlab go brrrr

[proven spire]

how wouldu fix these pipes? they are manafolded out of the refinerys here and manafolded in a hundred meters further back into blenders, but they seem to not do the 600
rather change it to 300-500 per pipeline, depending on the ration of the different destinations (of different 600s pipelines) or is there any better way to fix this?

[ashen girder]

I would suggest starting a thread in #1038092680493801533 with a lot more pictures.

[proven spire]

kk, will do tomorrow, thx ^^

[silent patrol]

these can all be on one manifold right?

mk5 conveyor does 780/min

[vivid escarp]

Has this AWESOM sink a max Input ?

[ashen girder]

It does not, nope.

[proven spire]

seems good (if u set up the machines correct)

[ashen girder]

750 < 780, you should be fine. It'll take a hot minute to warm up though. Would suggest splitting to each branch first.

[proud totem]

Imagine if you had to upgrade the awesome sink speed in the MAM

[silent patrol]

would you not do it on one line? how would you do it?

[proven spire]

yes and no afaik
beltspeed as input, but theres like.. 2 billion sth? whats the max number of points u can generate per minute if Im not off

[ashen girder]

I would merge all of the ingots to one line, put a splitter down, run one line to the pipes, one line to the plates, and one line to the screws.

[ashen girder]

You can break the display, but it doesn't actually limit the points as far as I'm aware.

[proven spire]

interesting..

[silent patrol]

then manifold from there? makes sense

[ashen girder]

Ayup. That way each branch is filling with 250 until it backs up.

[silent patrol]

i can do logistics easier that way aswell

[vivid escarp]

Is it worth to autmate Miners?

[wind spade]

I mean you don't have to deal with them for the rest of the game

whether that's worth to you is a question we can't answer

[vivid escarp]

Im currently more or less handcrafting super computers

for my atom fabric

[lean apex]

Well to start I would try and fix that first

Miners are fairly simple to automate considering it's only steel pipes and iron plates

[ashen girder]

I will say, the fact that when you upgrade miners it returns the miners from the old miner is a little bit annoying.

If you've automated them, you can't put them back in your DD.

[lean apex]

Yeah it is a slight annoyance

But it's not to bad

[ashen girder]

I just made like 60 in one go and shoved them in there. 🤣

But yeah, it could be worth doing.

[lean apex]

Tbh I've probably canned like 10k plates and other super basic rss at this point

[ashen girder]

I never delete anything. D:

[lean apex]

I throw away stuff that is super easy to make

[ashen girder]

If I can't carry it home, I put down a container with my overflow. 😂

I assume you mean, like, trashcan throwaway, not sink?

[lean apex]

Yeah

[ashen girder]

Yeah, nope, not doin' that.

[lean apex]

If I'm out and about I will can stuff to keep my inventory clean

[plain rivet]

you could also put mk3 on the sides and mk4 to the plates to help get the split numbers closer

[lean apex]

If I'm next to a sink I make a little offshoot and do that

[plain rivet]

and get it all saturated faster

[ashen girder]

Yeah, true.

[wind spade]

@quick solar see #math-and-meta message for alt recipe choices

[sterile tangle]

Just found what i think might be the best recipe combo for EMC rods.

I'm open to judgement

[thorn bane]

wouldnt fused wire and def. stator be better

[quick solar]

Ty!!

[wind spade]

cheap silica?

[thorn bane]

also plastic ai limiters and def. EMC. are good aswell but then you need oil

[sterile tangle]

mine vs. def rotor:

[ashen girder]

Take it farther. Turbo Electric Motors and OC Supercomputers. It's glorious.

[sterile tangle]

honestly, rn im just experimenting with alts cuz i realised - i suck at them.

[thorn bane]

is that with fused wire?

[sterile tangle]

yes

[thorn bane]

i guess the extra pipes kinda hurt

[quick solar]

I just realized this a factory layout thing.. it scares me :(

[sterile tangle]

oh yeah the decimals sometimes suck. Especially when one recipe wants 12/m and other 15/m...

but it's worth the over/underclock.

[unborn ermine]

Quickwire I can live with being funky, namely to overflow into storage/depot/sink.

[sterile tangle]

btw does anyone else when making space elevator parts just slap the machines for the parts down and the feed them parts from the main storage trough storage containers?

[fringe pawn]

Yes

Sloops make this easier than ever

If you're in a position to let the game run overnight (or at work, or whatever), you can do one and done batches of space elevator parts as you go.

[sly dagger]

Is there a considered best recipe for diamonds?

[fringe pawn]

That's a local resources question

[wind spade]

there's never a "best" recipe for anything

for diamonds it's mostly just "what do you have and can use to make diamonds"

[fringe pawn]

In the context of a planetary build, you're going to end up using crude oil diamonds, turbo diamonds, and pink diamonds.

Cloudy diamonds and default diamonds are nice for casual play.

[plain rivet]

no way, i would never. i totally didn't grab thousands of rubber out of dimensional storage to make flexible frames yesterday

[fringe pawn]

A second table on the wiki with an all sloop everything approach would be interesting

So you only really need to execute all those recipes half the listed number.

So if you can muster 24 stacks of RIPs and rotors you can just be done with smart plating forever.

Though you'll want to keep the warp drive related production going for sink points if you want a nut.

So I would say you can safely batch and delete any production for framework, adaptive control, assembly directors, automated wiring, magnetic field gens, and so forth.

[ashen girder]

Less than, because they're chained together.

[fringe pawn]

True

It looks like I batched 1468 assembly directors on this playthrough, a stupid amount of overkill.

[astral warren]

I’ve just reached phase 5 as of a few days ago and so far crude oil diamonds seem to be my favored recipe for large-scale production lines

Starter factories solely for mk6 belt materials or the like are fine to be made with the default recipe, but I’m working on a 170/min power shard factory rn which needs a fair bit of diamonds

[fringe pawn]

For ionized fuel? Dark matter farm?

[astral warren]

Yeah for ionized fuel

150 goes towards that and the rest is pocketed for overclocking

[fringe pawn]

Assuming 20,000 buildings, you'll have enough shards in under 8 hours I think? So you might plan to just use all of it for ionized fuel eventually. Even fairly quickly.

Yep, 8 hours of production is enough for 9600 buildings to get 3 shards each.

[astral warren]

Actually I probably could use a bit more, I’ve just realized that I forgot to check if there were any oil resource wells next to the nodes I was planning on using

Not uncommon for there to be some

[fringe pawn]

The additional oil well on the west coast is awesome.

The nerf to the western part of the northern forest hurt the rocky desert, but other buffs have more than made up for it.

[unborn ermine]

So i finished with my water moment with that cave I mentioned earlier beside the quartz nodes/water well
I managed to properly squeeze in 7 extractors in the cave and 8 outside
thats like 9000 water when I get mk2 pipes, and 11,100 when you include the well.

Will I need it? probably not

[ashen girder]

Man, this junction priority thing is wild.

[obtuse depot]

does anyone know why my refinerys are not intaking enough heavy oil residue if my output from other refinery is the same as their input. I have 160 going out and into refinery to be refind into fuel. but the intake aprreantly is not enough.

[rain canyon]

I got launched... But i didnt know there was so much additional land

i have spent hours walking around the game area to be shown its super small.

[fringe pawn]

Honestly, the death border and land bridges to the horizon landmasses is sort of an attractive nuisance. Because that's exactly the sort of place where other video games hide cool stuff.

[ashen girder]

Are you talking about the skybox stuff? Only the middle portion there's actually places you can go.

[rain canyon]

i took a few shots of the additional land.

[ashen girder]

Yeah.. the whole top half of that is skybox.

[ashen girder]

Yeah, that one's mostly right.

It's still 2.5km square

[rain canyon]

I was suprised about it, never got launched like that

[ashen girder]

Fun fact, that's how SCIM has satellite maps IIRC.

[rain canyon]

seems so big until....

[ashen girder]

@oblique hollow Spot the difference. One of these backs up. One of these don't. They're otherwise identical. Bottom pipe is 120. Output of the right side is 120. Input on left side is 200.

I sacrificed extra goats today it seems. 😏

[patent lily]

whats the deal with iron pipe?

is it good or nah?

[ashen girder]

You can trade 2-3 iron ore for 1.5 or so coal.

Depends how you feel about that trade.

[wind spade]

depends if you like spending tons of iron for saving a bit of coal

[fringe pawn]

Well, there's lots of iron on the map. So at any particular base, if finding more iron is easier than find more (or any) coal, use it

[ashen girder]

Bearing in mind that where you might only use one pure node for a factory, iron pipes will need two.

[patent lily]

i do have a lot of coal available

[fringe pawn]

If you really want, you can make HMFs and motors using only iron, in combination with other iron alts.

[unborn ermine]

Iron Pipe is defo an "isolated factory" situation imho, where you already dedicated all the nearby coal and dont want/need to send in more.

[versed violet]

and limestone, right? iron AND limestone?

[fringe pawn]

The numbers on iron pipe look monstrous, but iron is one of the most abundant resources on the map.

[patent lily]

im trying to make over 1k pipes

[vapid gorge]

molded steel pipe my beloved ❤️

[patent lily]

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=MQrciE8WulujAucfRFD2

[patent lily]

put some placeholder inputs for rubber, plastic and alu cases

[fringe pawn]

The question of whether to use iron pipes, molded pipes, or default pipes, is best determined by the location of the factory. If you're going to pass lots of iron nodes before you get to any coal, by all means use iron pipe.

[vapid gorge]

I'd go copper alloy tbh

[patent lily]

for all the wire?

[vapid gorge]

yeah, saves you a TON of refineries while still having a huge output

[patent lily]

yeah

[vapid gorge]

and depending on the location you could jsut use reg qw if you have enough cat

[fringe pawn]

Copper alloy remains my favorite copper alt due to the aforementioned abundance of iron on the map.

[vapid gorge]

I tend to view adding iron to something as zero cost yeah xD

[fringe pawn]

I've only used pure copper on my original mega factory that I built back in update 4. Until you get to a point of planetary builds, copper alloy is what you want IMO.

[magic island]

2x yield is PLENTY for such a compact and high-volume recipe tbh

[vapid gorge]

where are the inputs like steel pipe and rubber and plastic coming from/

[patent lily]

different factory

where i made those for personal use

and for the phase 3 factory

[vapid gorge]

ah was thinking you oculd make them on location pretty easily

do coke steel with oil, and make the rubber/plastic as well

depending how far away it is

[patent lily]

ima build part of it here, where i have the old phase 2 factory

tear the old one down and make all the phase 2 items

[past reef]

What are the best recipe (and consideration) in terms of space for crystal oscillator

[patent lily]

got all the oil up the north coast turned into rubber/plastic/fuel

[past reef]

Insulated + plastic limiter and import rubber plastic via train?

[swift portal]

Are any of the nuclear alternative recipes worth considering?

[remote ice]

you can do it intentionally using pulse nobelisks, you put them behind a thin barrier and then whack them to detonate them all at once

the thin barrier means you still get pushed back but you don't take damage

and there's not really a practical limit to how many you can stack in that spot, you can fly so fast you go through the death barrier and reach Project Assembly

[amber jacinth]

The plutonium ones are good for increasing plutonium output for less uranium waste

[swift portal]

Mainly looking at the uranium ones

[fringe pawn]

Every nuclear alt has a use case. Fertile uranium is the most borderline one, where you're sacrificing some of them map's limited uranium to dispose of urnaium waste in a different way.

[old tree]

When making recycled rubber & plastic, is there any upside to using diluted packaged fuel over regular diluted fuel from blenders? I just did some quick math and the energy requirements are almost the same.

[fringe pawn]

But tapping another uranium node to use fertile uranium is probably going to be more work than using default recipes.

[ashen girder]

There is not, no. DPF is 50MJ/fuel, DF is 45MJ/fuel. DPF is more complexity and buildings for more power.

The one possible upside is having a ready supply of packaged fuel, but that's.. not really an upside. 🤣

[old tree]

wow, you just have those numbers on hand like that? 😲

I remember there used to be some advantage to using DPF, but they've probably patched it since.

[ashen girder]

Lotsa weird shit lodged in there. If it makes you feel better, those are the only two energy-per-item values I have memorized.

[ashen girder]

It's available a whole phase earlier, probably.

[old tree]

ah, because of the blender

[ashen girder]

Blenders are T7, Packager's T5/6.

[amber jacinth]

Regular cells are decent with relatively easy components, but with the drawbacks of liquid logistics and byproduct management.
Infused cells require less uranium per cell, but with more complex components needed (and an absolute metric ton of quickwire), but also zero liquids/byproducts.
Default fuel rods are less complex, but produce less parts for the same uranium amount.
fuel units give more uranium power, but with more complicated parts needed.

[patent lily]

ye

[swift portal]

I’m looking at the wiki. What does late game power generation look like? Do you need to have nuke gens burning uranium or can you just swap to plutonium? And the same for ficsonium?

It looks like you can reprocess any uranium waste and then swap to plutonium but it doesn’t look like you can do that for ficsonium

[vapid gorge]

well you need to burn urarium to make plutonium

but you don't have to do plutonium or ficsonium

honestly if you don't go huge, or like making fuel gens you could skip nuclear alltogether

[fringe pawn]

200 fuel generators (80 if you run them at 250%) is more than enough to finish the game and get a golden nut.

Plutonium isn't necessary at all, but you can do if you want. You can safely tuck the waste in a map corner and forget about it. Just blueprint a ton of storage containers for it. Ficsonium is a pointless novelty.

[minor hawk]

brain is not braining, I can't think how to calculate the downclocking for load balancing instead of manifold

[prisma kraken]

7x100+11.1111 = 700+11.11111 = 711.1111111111111; 711.11/800 = 8 x 88.8888%

[fringe pawn]

To enter that as a clockspeed, you'd put 8/9*100 into the box.

[minor hawk]

Why?

[fringe pawn]

That will set the clocks to 88.8~%

That'll get you to the limit of the game's precision for an irrational number.

[prisma kraken]

it lets the program round the number for you which may or may not end up in a better internal number representation of what you want

[minor hawk]

No I mean, the logic behind that, where did you get the 9? Can you explain the math to me so I can use it for future stuff too?

[prisma kraken]

after a while, you just know that 8/9 = .88888888

[fringe pawn]

Yep

[minor hawk]

oh wait

you mean like, the game accepts formulas in the clock speed text box?

[prisma kraken]

he just added a couple of zeros to move the decimal place for a percentage

yep

[minor hawk]

damn

[fringe pawn]

Also in the product target box

[minor hawk]

lol well that's good to know

[prisma kraken]

protip: you can do math in the game's search box too

[minor hawk]

yeah i use that

i didn't know those other places would accept it too, that's interesting

[fringe pawn]

800/9 is another way to get there, but 8/9*100 works better in my head, as someone with basically no math background.

[prisma kraken]

i like 100*8/9 to avoid ambiguity about order of operator precedence

[obtuse depot]

im so confused. If I get a oil extrarter on a pure node with 240 a min and setup 8 refines taking in 30 a min each. how is my last 2 refines not getting any crude oil

[prisma kraken]

takes a while for pipes to fill or you mathed wrong

[obtuse depot]

I waited for pipes to fill and then started them. its been runnning for 30 min and my last 3 refines arent getting enough

[fringe pawn]

Does your system contain a loop? Pipes work better if you loop the final refinery back to the extractor as well.

[obtuse depot]

oh wait im so stupid that pipe is on the wrong extracter

[prisma kraken]

or the problem exists between keyboard and chair 🙂

[obtuse depot]

Yea sounds about right

I was wonder why all my other ones worked but not this line

[prisma kraken]

error code ID10T

happens to the best of us, lol

[obtuse depot]

Ive been setting this up for the last hour

[prisma kraken]

i actually caught much the same error in my stuff earlier

[obtuse depot]

At least it was caught lol

[prisma kraken]

not before i had 96 generators running off of it 😛

[obtuse depot]

oh nah

I just turned them off and waiting for pipes to refill again

hopefully I can get my 8 gens runnning

[prisma kraken]

being fair, i'm not even halfway done with what i'm building, so it just was par for the course

[obtuse depot]

what phase are you on

[prisma kraken]

in phase 4

[obtuse depot]

ooh

[prisma kraken]

building out power

[obtuse depot]

I see

im half done with phase 3 sort of. I wanna get my first nice looking factory with all the oil stuff

everythiong else is rlly messu

[prisma kraken]

yeah, my stuff is a mess too, it isn't really messy, but it is a mess

[obtuse depot]

Yea its like neat but messy

[prisma kraken]

very little so far that i've build isn't in need of being rebuilt

[obtuse depot]

lol

this is my thrid play through but the other ones all have less then 100 hours. im trying to neaten stuff up before phase 3

[prisma kraken]

always good

if you don't do that as you go, i've found it becomes very difficult to do

[obtuse depot]

Yea

Finally stable power

[viral patio]

do i build my first coal plant at yellow or purple(my base is green)

[past temple]

Quick question whats the most efficent turbofuel recipie? I have diluted fuel and everything unlocked but the math is a headache

[hollow egret]

I don't know if it's the most efficient ever, but right now I'm gunning for HOR -> Diluted Fuel -> Turbo Blend

[past reef]

Turbo blend uses least sulfur which is rarest in all combinations

Does use most oil/fuel but you can diluted fuel variants to mitigate that

[tiny leaf]

whats the best recipe for heavy modular frames?

[past reef]

Encased least iron/resources but flexible is more compact

[tiny leaf]

alr ill go with encased even though the numbers are wonky

[past reef]

Rubber is pretty junk later on with the recycled loop

[tiny leaf]

oh

i got recycled recipes too

so would that be better?

[past reef]

Yeah I dont like encased because bad number = bad layout but can make it work

You need a drone or a train for the rubber so I'd set that up for a 2nd frame factory not first one

[tiny leaf]

my only problem with flexible is it needs more screws

and my best belt is only 480/min

[past reef]

Cause you can do steel/aluminum screw pretty much so it's super compact

Yeah belt is a problem for flexible, tier 8 flexible frame is more viable

[tiny leaf]

yeah this is a phase 3 factory

so i have no clue

[past reef]

Encased then, iron + coal/coke + concrete shouldn't need a transport system

[unborn ermine]

I would go encased for now yeah.
I need to redo my setups and stuff after oil as well

[tiny leaf]

yeah oil changes everything

i finally got diluted so now i can make a mega fuel powerplant

[unborn ermine]

I settled for the bare minimum encased frames recipe and went harder on motor production (namely because I almost have a basic storage full of Heavy Frames already)

and that was before I set it up

[tiny leaf]

i made a basic motor factory when i was still on phase 2 lol

[unborn ermine]

I took a while to rehash my setup
along the basic stuff, making 25/min motors with basic recipe.

[viral patio]

how much cal per minute does the 8 genrator setup require?

[tiny leaf]

coal?

[viral patio]

yeah

[tiny leaf]

120/min

[viral patio]

thanks

[tiny leaf]

np

[pseudo cedar]

I'm working on making an aluminum factory where I have the excess water fed into its own set of alumina refineries, and because I've been having feedback problems I changed the clock speeds very slightly so that I'm making sliiiightly less alumina than I need, and I have the water on a VIP junction so that the worst case scenario is that my water extractors for another section of the factory go down for a bit. Still, somehow, the entire system is getting backed up within an hour of starting it. any tips?

[pastel obsidian]

You need the water input to come from the top like the yellow pipe

Orange pipe sorry

[ashen girder]

👀

https://new.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/comments/1dzxgrb/water_recycling_some_surprise_a_little_confusion/

[fringe pawn]

What recipes?

[pseudo cedar]

oh ffs

that will do it

[pseudo cedar]

sloppy electrode pure, as god intended

[fringe pawn]

Always include a sink as part of initial setup.

Otherwise I do pairs of 75% clocked sloppy and 100% electrode, never problems

[pseudo cedar]

I mean I thought I had aluminum ingots sinked, but apparently the smelters were backing up

need to diagnose that but it shouldn't be too big a deal

solids are far easier

[rotund summit]

trying to start a HMF factory producing 10/min, would flexible be better than encased if i have access to mk5 belts?

[ashen girder]

Do you want rubber in the factory? That's the more important question.

[rotund summit]

i currently have rubber sinking so i could include it

[ashen girder]

Then it's worth doing, for sure.

[rotund summit]

i just want the factory to look compact and a smaller footprint

[fringe pawn]

If rubber is easy to route then you could do adhered iron plate and heavy flexible as part of it. Style choice.

[ashen girder]

I have no idea which one has a better footprint.

[ashen girder]

Coated plates, too.

Depending on how you feel about plastic. 😂

[rotund summit]

that would be a lot of rubbers haha

[ashen girder]

Saves a lot of iron and coal.

[past reef]

Plastic/rubber into iron is nice for space especially HMF

[summer mauve]

does anyonw know a good 2:5 or 4:10 balancer? im using the one from the wiki but it seems to limit flow severely on half of the outputs

[prisma kraken]

The meatball with HMF's isn't the manufacturers, instead it is the density of the mod frames you need

as such, heavy encased frame always wins on density b/c it reduces the number of mf's you need to make

[pastel obsidian]

Are the inputs balanced to start with

[summer mauve]

Yeah they're all directly from 250% pure nodes

[pastel obsidian]

so you have 1200 in?

[summer mauve]

2400

but mk 4 belts so 1920

[rotund summit]

this was what i had in mind for heavy encased frame setup, is there a better way to make this smaller?

[prisma kraken]

if you are going for max density, the recipes you want down the chain are: heavy encased frame, steel frame, bolted iron plate (this one is a nightmare), and coated iron plate

those recipes get you the highest yield/lowest cycle time of any

and it really isn't a very efficient way of making the sub-components

[vapid gorge]

a lot of the visual stuff on belts are changed up for 1.0 - you can only really measure it if the system works or not

[prisma kraken]

first, chuck pure iron ingot in the bin, the recipe stinks for density and power

[summer mauve]

I think I found a shortcut/skip with overfllow splitters where I can just rleay all my left overs to the end

[rotund summit]

i was initially trying to minimize the iron cost with that recipe haha

[prisma kraken]

if you insist on going the iron pipe route, which also stinks for density, you want iron alloy

[pastel obsidian]

something like this

but it would reduce your output

[prisma kraken]

give me a sec to draw something up

[pastel obsidian]

until you got better belts

[rotund summit]

coal is quite far from where i want to have my HMF factory, so i think iron pipe is the only way for me

[summer mauve]

This is pretty much what I did

but I found a workaround using smart splitters

tysm tho

[prisma kraken]

what about coke?

[prisma kraken]

whenever you are looking at a 5 or 10 way split, consider OC'ing machines to 125% or 250% to make the 5 disappear

[rotund summit]

just for reference this was the spot i was thinking of, there is crude oil nearby but im using 1 pure node for turbofuel plant

[prisma kraken]

there's plenty of coal around there

moving coke from the islands may be easier

but take a look at this recipe chain

except for the concrete, everything should fit on mk4 belts

[main shuttle]

ok, what are the rules on where mob respawns occur

[rotund summit]

oh i only need 90 crude oil per minute with this setup

[prisma kraken]

each (powered) buildable has a supression factor, different buildings are weigthed differently. when the additive supression factor is greater than some unpublished threshold, mobs don't respawn

usually a powered smelter is enough to suppress them

[main shuttle]

ah so just plain foundations aren't enough anymore?

[prisma kraken]

plus the oil for the coke

and for the rubber

you can substitute in coated iron plate to use some plastic and reduce the steel, that's up to you

[rotund summit]

yeah i was thinking 90 oil -> 120 HOR -> 360 coke with 60 resin -> residual rubber

[fringe pawn]

I believe I have nullified spawn in a place using only one conveyor line, one pipe line, and one power line.

[tender orchid]

Do you think a Planning Tool with Advanced editing capabilities and realtime feedback could be of value to someone? It is meant to be a detailing tool, after starting with an optimized setup (like from SCIM…)

I am gonna upload a demo until Monday for you to check out.

[prisma kraken]

yep, works out

[rotund summit]

thank you, this helped alot

[prisma kraken]

i'd be interested in kicking it around

what i'm using now is the tool at sp.runesun.com and it doesn't have any conception of belting or routing

[tender orchid]

Gonna try that. Didn’t know about it yet

[prisma kraken]

really it is a glorified domain-specific spreadsheet for hashing out how many machines of each recipe you want

[quiet breach]

This would be awesome

[prisma kraken]

i find it very useful, i know more or less what i want to build, so it just tallies the numbers for me and allows me to keep track of what a factory build looks like. I find tools like sftools & scim's factory planner try to 'help' by min/maxing and i often have to fight them to use the recipes i want vs what they think is best

[quiet breach]

also side note.... I havent built many balancers that are tightly packed its either the stacking of splitters and mergers that look like an octopus or its so spread out

what do you advanced genuises use? like for example that 3x 3 balancer posted from JPD

[prisma kraken]

i enjoy building compact balancers for the belting challenge

really balancers aren't very useful in satisfactory

[quiet breach]

right I agree but its kinda fun

[prisma kraken]

because you control the input rates to pretty much every system, you really don't need them

[quiet breach]

lets pretend we did lol

[prisma kraken]

balancers are more for when your inputs are variable and you wish to evenly consume from each

[quiet breach]

yeah I typically try using them when I didnt have proper belts to carry the input on full belts and had to use 3 etc or something weird situation

[prisma kraken]

in games like factorio or DSP, they find more use to mine and deplete resources evenly, but in SF, you just don't have that problem

[quiet breach]

but say we needed to build a 3x3, is the stacking of the splitters and mergers pretty much the best/most compact way?

[prisma kraken]

about the only problem in SF where balancers actually do make sense is when you have x train cars full of the same item, and you want several production lines to eat what was delivered at exactly the same rate

[quiet breach]

not mine ^^^ something like that

[prisma kraken]

that can actually be solved with just storage contaners

i

i've built better

[pastel obsidian]

We never build anything to the scale of factorio in satisfactory

[quiet breach]

I see a diagram like this and go......uhhhh where do I even start lol

[prisma kraken]

is that a 3->5 that doesn't exceed belt speed?

[pastel obsidian]

Its not worth it

[quiet breach]

I have no idea just grabbed a photo for reference

[pastel obsidian]

find another input and call and have 2:1 mergers

[quiet breach]

yeah

[amber jacinth]

Manifolding W

[prisma kraken]

i've built stuff like that before, but when i do it, it spans an entire factorie's subfloor

[quiet breach]

even smart splitter and just overflow the other side... fill up one side then the other

yeah its madness

its kind of fun trying to figure out and its gratifying though but its a lot of work for no real difference with other workarounds that are easier

[prisma kraken]

before i got wise about overclocking to eliminate 5 way splits, i used to build nuclear that way

[quiet breach]

never got that far

im almost caught up to where I was before

[prisma kraken]

OC'ing to 250 turns 10 into 4 and 5 into 2

[quiet breach]

can see that

I just built 120 plastic and rubber... and some smokeless powder... thinking of trying to turn next door factory into a little ammo depot and then electronics

[prisma kraken]

yeah, i have a date with electronics soon

[pastel obsidian]

what are you doing with so much smoke

i am an idiot

[quiet breach]

not 120 smoke, 120plastic/rubber... smoke I think might be 60

[pastel obsidian]

allg

I thought there might have been an alt that it was used for

[quiet breach]

I need to also do modular engines

ohh no, just thinking of using for ammo factory.. think it would be cool to kinda make an ammo factory

[astral warren]

Yeah I have a pretty large bullet farm making me homing ammo and explosive rebars all the way out northeast

[quiet breach]

mine is south east

water area eith the geyser in the middle

i want that homing ammo just unlocked it

[prisma kraken]

this is my starter oil build. the 3 refineries in the middle make smokeless powder, dpf and heavy tf for weapons, they just steal hor that would be turned into coke otherwise

[amber jacinth]

Blue crater?

[quiet breach]

no idea map names / locations lol

[amber jacinth]

Probably that lol

[quiet breach]

looks nice

[prisma kraken]

the camel hump in the pipe keeps the hor from going to make coke if it is needed for any of the consumables

[quiet breach]

ive seen that before... whats the purpose? something to do with flow / headlift or something?

[prisma kraken]

it's a build i didn't put time into, it was phase 3, lets unlock a bunch of stuff bang-bang

[quiet breach]

fluids drive me mad

[amber jacinth]

Lower down pipes prefer the fluid, so the bump stops the flow unless enough fluid is flowing in the pipe

[prisma kraken]

the hor won't go to making coke if black powder or packaged fuel need it

[quiet breach]

oh got it

[prisma kraken]

it can't rise over the hump

[quiet breach]

so its when theres a huge reserve to make it to the other side

[astral warren]

Pipeline Manual my beloved

[quiet breach]

almost like a dam

[amber jacinth]

Something like that

[prisma kraken]

the black powder & fuel refineries just run until a crate is full

[quiet breach]

im special lol

[prisma kraken]

it just prioritizes that they get the hor first to run at 100% until they stop

[quiet breach]

makes sense kinda like the idea

[prisma kraken]

the hor is oversubscribed

[quiet breach]

the issue for me is the damn headlift... even when using pumps or w/e right it can still screw up...

[astral warren]

It’s super helpful for dealing with byproducts that are being mixed with external inputs

[quiet breach]

also, why do some lines run better when you loop a pipe back around?

or am I imagining that it helps

[prisma kraken]

complicated answer, but you are essentially doubling the pipe's capacity with it

why pipe sloshing happens is that pipes can't transfer more than their capacity in & out of a segment. if the game simulator picks the wrong direction for a pipe segment to transfer its contents, sometimes things just can't ever catch up

[quiet breach]

would deleting a pipe and replacing it "trick" it back?

[prisma kraken]

its kind of like when you output from machines on a 780 belt exactly 780, the machine buffers never can empty out

[quiet breach]

got it

[prisma kraken]

when you loop the pipe around, suddenly you have 2x the capacity

[quiet breach]

because that needs to also fill up

BUT what if you dont have the 2x coming in? then it can drain it, no?

[prisma kraken]

and that allows things to move at half speed in both directions, so you never have a 'full pipe'

[quiet breach]

ahh so that explains why the side i had with plenty of water was fine, but then the one with just enough seemed to work but was struggling

to fill up that is

[prisma kraken]

at some point deep down in the code, there's probably a loop 'for each pipe segment, check if neighbor (1, 2, 3, 4...8) has more than me

the order it looks at its neighbors most likely is indeterminate, and it just picks whichever one is less full that it sees first

that's my theory, no way of actually verifying it w/o looking at the code

[quiet breach]

solid theory thanks for the dig in on the fluid. getting back up to speed with it before doing the fuel facility

semi dreading it... remember it was a pain with package this, unpackage, loop back around, fuell into turbofuel, 132 fuel generators, excess TF used for packaged

proooojjjject

[prisma kraken]

i'm almost functionally complete with my tf plant

[pastel obsidian]

yes and no

[quiet breach]

damn that looks sweet. so you just bring the TF up to the generators then? everything else down below? and is that geothermal?

ive never used that

[prisma kraken]

i'm pumping crude, water and belting sulfer up to the platform

[pastel obsidian]

Think of pipes like give way signs

[prisma kraken]

the fuel making part is actually quite reasonable

[pastel obsidian]

looks like something out of starwars

[prisma kraken]

well, its a big octagon

[quiet breach]

light saber battle

[quiet breach]

never used blenders either, thought I had them unlocked, was going to go down that route but nvm lol

pretty sick

[pastel obsidian]

with jump pads

[quiet breach]

i still need to make blueprint of the full circle

[prisma kraken]

4-input blender recipes are a pita

[quiet breach]

what you mean pita, I do like pita

[prisma kraken]

pain in the a**

[quiet breach]

gotcha - so better to do the packaged water/HOR into packaged fuel to unpackage, loop back cannisters, unpackaged fuel into fuel to send to tf? lol

[prisma kraken]

blended tf isn't very easy to build because you have so many blenders doing different things with a refinery hanging around to make the coke as well

[quiet breach]

might just stick to the cannister loop

[prisma kraken]

ehh, building fuel power with the blenders saves a lot of headache

[amber jacinth]

If you have normal diluted fuel, it’s easier to use that than the packed diluted loop.

Saves a lot of buildings

[prisma kraken]

yeah, i mean, this blender right here makes 50/min fuel

[quiet breach]

i will need to look... diluted fuel as in alt recipe you're referring to?

[amber jacinth]

There’s two diluted fuel alt recipes

[quiet breach]

i dont recall what the other ways produce to compare

[amber jacinth]

Ones an oil/refinery unlock, ones a blender unlock

[quiet breach]

i just remember packaging it and then unpackaging gives more than you would originally have

gotcha

or something in those lines, cant remember it was years ago around update 7?

[prisma kraken]

the ingredients are the same, its just the refinery recipe takes packaged water and outputs packaged fuel, the blender recipe does it all with 2 input pipes & one output pipe

same ration of water to hor, but the batch amts are different, as is the cycle times

[quiet breach]

interesting

so more pipes but smoother and better batch

[astral warren]

I’d probably prefer the blender recipe just to skip the whole packaging step

[prisma kraken]

i try to hang out on coal power until i get the blenders unlocked since fuel power is so much nicer to build with the blender recipe

[quiet breach]

i might do that, trying to avoid doing similar building than last time which was years ago

[prisma kraken]

the APA's have made that a lot easier to do

[amber jacinth]

Advantage to diluted packed is that it unlocks early, that’s kinda it 😛

[astral warren]

I had a pretty decent basic fuel power thing set up in early game, made like 20 GW which is a nice amount to have that early

[quiet breach]

yeah thats solid

[prisma kraken]

the tf plant i'm building is designed to be an easy upgrade to rocket fuel which will triple it's generation, but i'm not sure when i'll be actually needing that:

[quiet breach]

mine produced I think around 32

120 /130 generators cant recall

wonderful - youll be runnning awhile

[prisma kraken]

yeah, well, 5 APA's on the grid right now

[astral warren]

I straight up skipped all the fuel upgrades lol

[quiet breach]

APA?

[astral warren]

I’m gonna be upgrading my regular fuel factory straight to ionized fuel soon

[prisma kraken]

Alien power augmenter

[astral warren]

Powerful building

[quiet breach]

ohhh the new one gotcha

things pretty cool

[rigid fox]

What should I do for these two?

[prisma kraken]

they're a little fricking imba, imho

grab iron alloy, it got way buffed & is super-good now

[quiet breach]

id probs rarely use steel rod, molded steel pipe or quartz one lol iron alloy I have used

[astral warren]

I just use all the water alts tbh

[quiet breach]

they seems really really good

[astral warren]

Since water is functionally infinite

[quiet breach]

yeah

[prisma kraken]

i'd probably reroll the 2nd one unless you are about to build oscillators or want molded pipe for HMF's

[quiet breach]

need to build HMF factory too sheeet

[summer mauve]

My (almost) fully functional 10HMF/min factory

[quiet breach]

OHHH AND trains unlocked soon, never built those yet... break and path lanes or w/e WAY OVER my head, need to watch a vid

dig the look broski

[fringe pawn]

If you've already rescanned a hard drive, and aren't going to use either recipe, don't pick. Just leave them. It takes both recipes out of the pool for future HDDs. And if you ever change your mind about using one of those recipes, you can just pick it.

[astral warren]

As someone who likes making miners/etc produce exactly how much I need for a factory, trains are pretty annoying to work with

[prisma kraken]

idk why people have such a hard time with train signalling, it's like 'didn't you ever learn how to drive a car'?

[astral warren]

Can’t really determine if their throughput is enough without manually timing round trip times or letting it make a whole bunch of trips to see it in action

[rigid fox]

I getcham but what should I do with both?

E.g., for the first, should I leave it or pick a recipe

For the second, should I pick one of those or rescan?

[quiet breach]

ive never done trains just have heard/ read people complain about all of that

intimidated maybe... who knows never built them

[prisma kraken]

sometimes signals are a bit finicky, but its like putting stoplights at car intersections

[quiet breach]

I feel that way with tractors like how do you "know" how much you're getting type of thing? @astral warren

[fringe pawn]

Leave the first HDD IMO. Molded pipe is okay, you do need lots of steel pipes. Fused quartz crystal is probably not useful, stick to default crystal (and silica).

I'd probably rescan the second depending on what you don't have, though.

[quiet breach]

i like the iron alloy one but theres so much iron... do we need it?

[fringe pawn]

I don't do any iron alts, I stick to default ingot.

[prisma kraken]

it lets you make more iron than a belt out of a miner can mine. very useful

[quiet breach]

true

im using it in one of my factories right now

[prisma kraken]

it was also rebalanced to work very well with copper alloy for early/mid game builds

[astral warren]

It would be super easy if they just added the same stats to cars and trains that they have to drones

[quiet breach]

for copper ingots too

[fringe pawn]

I can't remember the last playthrough where I used anything besides default iron ingot. Not that alts are bad, but there's just so much iron.

[quiet breach]

havent seen drones at all so no idea how they operate.

[prisma kraken]

this is the early mod frame factory i built:

[quiet breach]

im probs wasting so much coal in one of my builds from tractors as no idea how long it would take to get there to maintain x amount lol

1500 per min

this is beastly lol

[prisma kraken]

there's a lot of locations on the map with 3 iron nodes and a copper right next to it

[astral warren]

They just have these super helpful stats about their throughput in the drone port menu

[quiet breach]

ohhh thats nice

so you basically know you're getting 700/min

[feral breach]

When it comes to bauxite do you guys build one big factory and bring in as much as possible or do it the same way as all of the previous items and do few smaller separate productions where it's needed?

[astral warren]

Yeah

[astral warren]

Early game I’d do the latter, but now that I have max belts unlocked I’m prob gonna make one huge factory

[prisma kraken]

i've not started using drones yet, but the UI in previous game versions sometimes was a little misleading

[astral warren]

Yeah it might be, but still better than having none at all like the other vehicles

Sadly there don’t even seem to be any mods that add these stats for trains

[quiet breach]

would be wonderful

[prisma kraken]

ehh, vehicles have a UI at the stations that sometimes isn't misleading, lol

[lime mesa]

I did a bauxite collection loop with trains and a big factory in the middle of the map, where there are many bauxite nodes pretty close by

[quiet breach]

I just have 3 mk 2 miners on coal nodes, briing each to a station, trators go to base. unload at 3 different stations, belt each one in

no freakin idea if good bad or ugly lol

sometimes its empty and my tractors are just stopped.... sometimes they are in the air spinning in 360's

[prisma kraken]

until you get to bauxite processing, where you really are wrangling resources from several places, it is probably better to remain decentralized

[feral breach]

So I should stick to something smaller still with only T4 belts? 😄

[astral warren]

I personally would since it’s all gonna get torn down later anyway