off-topic-tech

[pure karma]

if they were killed jsut for the meat then thats tough

[night girder]

Nah.

They had to pull stuff, transport troops, ...

and just got wrecked by bullets, artillery, grenades, tanks, ...

but it was in a way smaller capacity than they were used during WO1.

That was Wo1.

Full on horseback. Crazy.

And this during WO2.

[sharp matrix]

Yeah that would get massacred today💀

[night girder]

The US army still has a donkey.

[sharp matrix]

Lol

[night girder]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Deuce_VII

Some terrain just needs a good donkey 😄

[sharp matrix]

Its funny because this would also get annihilated today

[night girder]

Especially covert ops.

[waxen pendant]

Imma drop a "big duece" once I get home

[night girder]

Nah, it's like for small scout teams that have to go up steep hills with a lot of gear.

[visual tree]

It's amazing how some of those buildings in the back are still standing today. Tells you a lot about build quality back then

[night girder]

not for hot zones.

[visual tree]

"Modern" buildings quality today is a disgrace

[night girder]

If I remember correctly from the documentary, the donkey is used because;

• compact size.
• strong.
• intelligent.
• and easy to maintain, it's less than a horse.

[waxen pendant]

Yup,

[sharp matrix]

I saw a modern building that was just recently build, windows, etc were taken at by tropical force winds recently, modern building quality is in the gutter

I mean i live in a area that hurricanes can hit, lord knows what will happen to these buildings, probably going to be severly damaged at least...

[night girder]

Just build them out of wood. Easier to rebuild

[visual tree]

Real estate agent told me an investor who made a "modern" building in my town used work labour so cheap they didn't even bother to install conduits for electrical wires. This was a huge NO even 40 years ago

They literally covered the wires with cement instead of running them through smurf tubes....

I would have killed someone if they did my electrical wiring like that

[sharp matrix]

How is any of this passing inspections👀

Are they bribing the inspectors to let this pass

[visual tree]

A question probably asked thousand times

[sharp matrix]

Probably

[visual tree]

We hired expert supervisors for fiber deployment in my company for example and we have to correct their mistakes all the time because they aren't doing their job

Most supervisors here only care about signing a contract and earning money, actual inspection is not really their top priority

[night girder]

or the inspectors are also incompetent.

[visual tree]

Which is a disgrace

ChatGPT summary why supervision doesn't work here:

Professional supervision in Croatia often does not work effectively due to several systemic issues:
Conflict of interest – Supervisors are usually paid by the investor, whom they are supposed to control, which can create pressure to overlook problems.
Limited accountability – Although the law provides responsibility, sanctions are rare and legal processes are slow, so consequences are minimal.
Low supervision fees – Contracts are often awarded to the lowest bidder, leading supervisors to oversee multiple projects at once and reducing the quality of control.
Lack of experienced professionals – With many projects (especially EU-funded ones), the same experts work on several sites simultaneously.
Political or local pressure – In public projects there can be pressure not to delay construction even when problems occur.
Weak oversight of supervisors – Inspections and professional controls exist but are relatively infrequent and often reactive.
Result: supervision sometimes becomes more of a formal requirement than a thorough technical control.

[night girder]

Biased

[visual tree]

I actually agree with ChatGPT on this because I saw it firsthand

[night girder]

change the country and see if you get different respond 🤣

"Oh, in this country, supervision is excellent! Nothing wrong"

[visual tree]

Guess supervision sucks everywhere then

[night girder]

I mean, what does chatGPT know about supervision in Croatia 🤣

[visual tree]

These ones are 100% true though: Low supervision fees – Contracts are often awarded to the lowest bidder, leading supervisors to oversee multiple projects at once and reducing the quality of control

Political or local pressure – In public projects there can be pressure not to delay construction even when problems occur.

[sharp matrix]

Chatgpt isnt a source i would cite....

[visual tree]

Proof: firsthand experience

[night girder]

Does it give you sources?

[visual tree]

No but I recognized everything IRL it posted

[night girder]

Just curious on what it based its answer 😊

I believe you more than chatGPT 😄

[sharp matrix]

Chatgpt doesnt have to base its answers on anything, it even makes things up

[visual tree]

Some reasons "might be wrong" but it's 100% correct on low supervision fees and political/local pressure

People here complain supervisors don't do their work but when the deadlines are short, they ask the supervisors to turn a blind eye....

And I noticed a lot of those supervisors sometimes sign too many contracts just to earn profit but then they don't have enough time to actually supervise anything

But that's literally classified as greed

Speaking of bad build quality, is it possible to view older google street view images?

There was an image of a building accross the street where rockwool was literally hanging from the wall....

Also heard from apartment owners they have huge issues with humidity

[night girder]

Euhm, I am not sure. I think there was a time you could go back in time on google street.

[visual tree]

If apartment owners saw their bulding photos during construction, they wouldn't buy anything lol

[visual tree]

Can't find that rockwool hanging from the wall I clearly remember....

Or maybe I saw it from my window and it's been fixed by the time google street view car passed

Old cities here also started removing ancient roman pavement and replaced them with asphalt in the last 50 years which I consider a crime against culture

Roman pavement

Old street with asphalt....

This is a crime imo....

[pure karma]

i love how its imediately dirty

asphalt is such a awful building material its insane

[cold tide]

damn thats horrible

[slow flint]

Its fine for something like a road but a walk way?

[pure karma]

ITS NOT i went in town friday and half of the fucking main road was in some innocent buisnesses parking lot because the aspalt dident hold and the snowplows obliterated it

literally went back to the stone age

it was literally ripped out to the dirt

[slow flint]

That's wild
Is that like a cold weather thing?
I'm in Australia so we don't get snow unless you go up to a couple mountains

[pure karma]

it shrinks from the cold

which makes it crack

then it lifts up at the crack and if plows get caught or enough cars drive over it it crumbles or whole chunks just go missing

and then you just have holes deep enough that if you hit them ods are your rims are bent now so have fun

[glossy glacier]

the asphalt makes it so much more depressing...

[slow flint]

Wow this is all awful
I guess its just the right material for the right environment I guess
Here we don't really have many issues, we get potholes but even on outback roads that do not get looked after you don't see many. It's more super busy roads will get some but as long as it's build to withstand more heavy use and is maintained its not so much of an issue

Have never had major issues with roads here due to damage

[pure karma]

another thing that dosent help is during the spring all the water from the snow turns all the ground into swamp so any roads that arent raissed up like say highways just sink into the ground and the road surface esentially becomes an uneven mess if you have enough cars going over it

now thats less asphalts fault then conditions but its still a soft material at the end of the day

[slow flint]

I mean what other alternatives do you have
Its really concrete or some form of brick/stone from my understanding

We don't do concrete roads here but from memory they're cheap to lay but have a high upkeep and crack more often

With brick/stone roads its more expensive and time consuming to lay and not as suitable for high speeds

[pure karma]

yea no concrete cracks a lot more so its only used for bridges here

there is no alternative but alphalt still sucks so its still a problem

[slow flint]

It's the least and cheapest shit out of the shit

[pure karma]

yep

it gets the job done just sometimes it makes you wish some roads were cared for a bit more

sidewalks are generally a great visual of why concrete is a big no no

[cold tide]

did they give a reason for removing centuries old heritage in favor of asphalt?

[sharp matrix]

This is a abomination

Seriously i cant believe they did that, it looks horrible to

[languid gulch]

have any PSU manufacturers completely gotten rid of molex connectors?

[tall forum]

why do people hat on AMD gpus?

im going with a 9070

[languid gulch]

this generation? AMD's flagship isn't remotely close in performance to Nvidia's flagship

[tall forum]

but a 9070 beforms better then a 5060ti

[languid gulch]

yup

in its tiers AMD GPUs are plenty fine

but you'll always have press and fanbois who will only ever compare in uneven ways

there's no actual justification for it, just weird claims

some of the old criticism that was definitely valid was that Radeon GPU drivers could be kinda shit

[tall forum]

2can 9070 raytrace well?

[languid gulch]

meh

doing ray tracing even today is really only noticeable in cinematic scenes or if you have a 5080 or higher

& imo nobody's done it well enough in games to justify the performance hit

[tall forum]

So 9070 good?

[languid gulch]

definitely

[tall forum]

Cool

For 1440p ultra?

[languid gulch]

oh yea

[tall forum]

4K ultra 🥹

[languid gulch]

in SF my 6800XT was maxxing out my 1440p ultrawide at 144Hz, & TPU lists the 9070 as 31% faster

[tall forum]

Can it run any games in 4K?

[languid gulch]

sure

16gb is plenty for that

[tall forum]

What graphics

I mean settings

[languid gulch]

depends on how well they've done the game, but probably high/very high, maybe ultra on older games

[tall forum]

I will go with 1440p for now

[languid gulch]

to me, 4K is really only a noticeable jump if you're going to a 42" or bigger monitor

[tall forum]

I’m going with a 1440p 32 inch 144hz

[languid gulch]

nice 🙂

i jumped from a 1080UW/34"/75Hz up to a 1440UW/34"/144Hz a few years ago. i'm not young and i noticed the Hz increase & the pixel density instantly

[tall forum]

That’s crazy

I’m also going to buy a small 20 inch monitor 1080p just for discord and google when I’m playing

[languid gulch]

oh yea that's definitely a nice addition

[tall forum]

Is the Ryzen 7 7000x good?

[languid gulch]

especially if it's one you have tilted 90 degrees

uhhhh depends on which one you're going for

but mostly fine

[tall forum]

What is my bottleneck?

32 gig ddr5 and 9070 and the ryzen

[languid gulch]

those parts won't bottleneck each other at all

[tall forum]

My friend is running 2070 8gb ddr4 and ryzen 5 2600

[languid gulch]

ouchie. 8gb is the bottleneck on that system

[tall forum]

He plays cyberpunk btw

[languid gulch]

2600/2070 is a decent match tho

it'll game ok, just don't plan on doing too much in the background

i have a 2600/1660S system in another room 🤣

it's not doing anything atm, needs a new psu and then it'll be my living room streaming tv system because every tv UI is dogshit

[tall forum]

I just

🏴‍☠️ shows (legally 😉 )

[languid gulch]

yea, basically. i don't have any streaming service subs, it's mostly for stuff like youtube and when other people come over and wanna log in with their stuff

[tall forum]

Is 1tb fine?

[languid gulch]

SSD?

[tall forum]

Yes

[languid gulch]

yup

[tall forum]

I don’t have the budget right now for a 2tb

[languid gulch]

plus you can transfer the drive from your current system if you need the space

[tall forum]

Current system?

[languid gulch]

unless it's a laptop or something

[tall forum]

High quality system

[languid gulch]

4 of the drives in my current system are all yanked out of my old builds 🤣

once the laptop goes splat in some other way, it's worth yanking the SSD out if that wasn't the cause of death

my dad's old business laptop only had a 128gb NVMe in it, and it had so many overwrites over 7 years that it did end up dying

[tall forum]

Bro im so confused

[languid gulch]

what about?

[tall forum]

nevermind XD

[languid gulch]

oh yea just sharing personal experiences with pc stuff

[tall forum]

i was using a measuring tape thing and read 365mm as 360CM

[languid gulch]

OH

🤣

[tall forum]

and i thought i had a 140 inch laptop

😭

[languid gulch]

see, i'm american but i use metric whenever i can

[tall forum]

my rulers are only metric because australia

[languid gulch]

i even spent extra on some of my tools to find imperial/metric labeled ones

i have some hard science background so i'm comfortable with either

and yes i find it stupid

[tall forum]

ok i have 5 24 inch monitors

is that good?

[languid gulch]

5 monitors?

[tall forum]

yes

all 24 inch\

[languid gulch]

are you using them all?

[tall forum]

no they my parents for work

but until i get other monitors i have 5 24 inch 1440p monitors

[languid gulch]

at that small you won't notice much difference between 1080p & 1440

your biggest concern will be having enough gpu outputs 🤣

at least with ryzen 7000 series all of them have an iGPU so you can plug a non-gaming monitor into that

[tall forum]

holy

nah this is cool

[languid gulch]

if the bezels are thin, flip the top ones upside down to minimize the gap between them

[tall forum]

Ignore cables

[languid gulch]

ooh that's kind of an old monitor 🤣 plenty fine tho

Dell's actually a good monitor brand, hang onto that one

[tall forum]

Wait I’m dumb

I dont need another monitor

I can just turn this mac into one

[languid gulch]

eh, depends. it'll functionally be a 2nd system, laptops tend not to have a "monitor only" mode

[tall forum]

Is this the strat

[languid gulch]

mine's on a mount clamped to the table and kinda hanging off the side so i have more desk surface room

[visual tree]

There is a rumor roman pavement was removed in the 70's so Marshall's wife could walk easily....

[languid gulch]

it's where they buried jimmy hoffa

[visual tree]

Pula is probably the only ancient city in the Mediterranean where the main street is covered in asphalt....

Literally the destruction of cultural heritage

At least they haven't touched the roman amphitheatre, yet....

[languid gulch]

i mean, at least recently

iirc it was used as a barracks at one point

[visual tree]

They organize concerts in the amphitheatre occasionally. It's a miracle sound vibrations didn't collapse any walls

[tall forum]

Peak

[visual tree]

Tells you a lot about roman build quality compared to poor modern buildings

[languid gulch]

kinda weird seeing it fullscreen

[tall forum]

Seeing what?

[languid gulch]

oh sorry, discord

i'm used to seeing the windows bar at the bottom

[cold tide]

their flatout refusal to port fsr4 to previous gens running the int8 model. And i think the hate is warranted

people who bought a 7900XTX not having access to fsr4 is a capital insult

meanwhile playstation gets it through pssr and the steam machine will have it ON LINUX

but AMD refuses to fix it for windows. And if they dont, the 6800xt will be my last AMD card.

[tall forum]

@languid gulch you were right XD

[twin dew]

And Nvidia doing the same isn't an issue?
They just didn't release/leak the backwards compatible versions at any point.
That Int8 version has half the performance on the new cards, and AMD didn't want to support two completely different versions going forward.

So AMD did try to implement the improved FSR for old models, but it wasn't performant enough to be used for both old and new cards with same model, and didn't want to have two different FSR4:s.

PSSR isn't FSR4.
And someone implementing the leaked development version into Linux isn't really supporting it.

[cold tide]

sound like a bunch of excuses to me

they are just a token, so nvidia isnt labelled a monopoly

when they in essence are

[twin dew]

Just pointing out that Nvidia is doing exactly the same.
AMD did at least see if it was realistically possible or not. And decided that it wasn't realistic.

[cold tide]

if they were really trying to gain marketshare they would try and appease the customerbase they have now

and im not sure what youre saying, even rtx2000 series have access to the latest dlss

[tall forum]

so in your opinion is amd good or bad

[cold tide]

again, maybe you missed it, i have an amd gpu and i like it better than nvidia

but this fsr thing is just a giant omelett on their face

[twin dew]

No it doesn't.
Nvidia just rebranded stuff to same name as the newest tech.
And only the newest cards support everything that is branded "DLSS 4".

[cold tide]

they should offer people the option, because fsr3.1 is dogshit

no dude, they have the full suite except for mfg

[twin dew]

So no, DLSS4-FG in any form is only available at 4000-series and 5000-series.
And DLSS3-FG isn't available on anything older than 4000-series either.
Even when it has been hacked to work on older cards.

And the coming DLSS4.5 is probably too slow to be used on older cards:

On RTX 30 series and older, DLSS 4.5 is around 5 times more computationally demanding because "Nvidia is leveraging FP8 precision in RTX 40 and RTX 50 series cards for DLSS 4.5 to lessen the performance impact on newer cards."

[cold tide]

but upscaling is a vital feature

mfg is not

[twin dew]

That was about the upscaling, not frame gen.

For that last part, otherwise it was about FG, not MFG.

[cold tide]

upscaling is required for all modern games due to the necessity of cleaning up the temporal effects

[twin dew]

MFG is 5000-series only.

[twin dew]

Nope.
Temporal effects are result of upscaling, not other way around.

[tall forum]

guys i thing you should just agree to disagree

[twin dew]

Or from TAA as the other alternative source.

[cold tide]

youre being purposefully obtuse and im not doing this. Here you have your fanboy, bye

people dont want to be left in the cold, and feel like their product is being supported, to not have fsr4 on a flagship gpu from prior gen is regarded. And no amount of copium is going to change the fact you read this in every comment section when the same question is asked.

i still like adrenaline 10x more than nvidia app, and AMD has less cpu overhead causing less stuttering. But id be livid too if i bought rdna3. That is my answer and ill leave it at that

[glossy glacier]

to not have dlss4 on a flagship GPU from prior gen is regarded
Same situation

[cold tide]

But they have dlss 4.5 on rtx2000. Nobody uses FG anyway because of how utterly garbage it is. And the older the GPU gets, the less value framegen has. Because it requires a high input framerate. If you barely scrap 45-60fps and turn on FG your native framerate goes to 40 in order to get 80. The ironic thing is, MFG is only useful on highend gpus and high refresh displays

its useful for turning 180fps into 240 with dyn-FG

not 60 into 120

Its wild having basic facts like that pushed back on, even when you caveat it with the fact you have an AMD GPU yourself. Just like with everything, you cannot discuss things on the internet anymore.

The lower the native/input framerate is and the lower the tensor cores, the higher the native/input drop is to generate the fake frames. Because they are not for free.

And the lower the framerate is with framegen, the longer the generated frames are on screen (miliseconds) and the more obvious the artifacts are. Because the frame to frame delta is higher.

but who cares about how tech works right

[glossy glacier]

They did not backport dlss-MFG or the new transformer model that is part of dlss4 (not 4.5!)

[cold tide]

not reading a single f'ing word i wrote. I rest my case. /thread

there is the upscaler, and there is FG.

[twin dew]

Seems they did backport that transformer, just that it is too slow to be actually used in anything realistic based on reviews testing it on 2080.

[cold tide]

yes its the same as far

[glossy glacier]

Same case as AMD and fsr4 then?

[twin dew]

But Nvidia does have much more programmers than AMD.

[cold tide]

older gens have poor fp8 support

or none i think, id have to check

[twin dew]

They don't have FP8 support.
And that 4.0 is still using Int8, but too slow tensor units even for that.

[cold tide]

but they atleast allow customers the option, despite dlss4.5 on older gens running worse than native!!!

[twin dew]

Nvidia has released both Int8 and FP8 versions of that DLSS4.5 upscaling, but that Int8 version is significantly slower.
But again Nvidia has lot more programmers than AMD, because they have much more market share and money.

As result of that market share.

[cold tide]

no doubt, but as a customer you dont care. And if youve bought rdna3 you feel shafted, and dont like AMD for what they did. He asked why people dunk on AMD gpus, thats why.

both companies dont care about you

nvidia shortchanges you on vram, amd lags in features. Both are singing 🎵 ol' sam altman had a farm, AI AI OH🎵 anyway.

[twin dew]

And I have never tried to say that AMD cares.
They keep fucking stuff up, but often there is logical reason why they fuck up.
Not always, often it is just idiotic.
In this case there is real reason behind not finalizing and releasing that separate Int8 version of FSR4, because of human resource shortages (programmer time).

They keep fucking up in idiotic ways mainly on marketing and pricing.

And especially in last minute changes in those.

[tall forum]

i ask the question in different places to actually gather a consensus and form a based opinion instead of listening to one persons opionion and so far its only you that dislkies amd this much

[twin dew]

Very emotional reaction to single thing basically, overriding all reason.
And not willing to listen to any explanation of reasoning behind that decision on AMDs part as result of that emotional loop.
Or that Nvidia is not any better even on that for most part.

Yes, they have kept supporting older cards with upscaler updates, even when those updates might be too slow to be actually used.
As they have much more money and driver programmer time available.

[cold tide]

lol, give it a rest with the psycho-analyzing

[twin dew]

But not frame-gen in any way or form.

[cold tide]

again with the not reading, i said they shafted rdna3 users and now have the backlash as a result. whilst still liking my 6800xt

[glossy glacier]

Honestly, if you want to be mad at AMD, dont focus on fsr4, focus on RDNA2 being delegated to second class.
Yes probably the same reason, missing programmers, but it is one of the more popular generations with a lot of potential for future (re) buyers

[cold tide]

its like people are just incapable of understanding someone not picking a side lmao. Its so ingrained into the western culture to pick one. Left or right, green or red.

[cold tide]

this, too, was misinterpreted

most of the driver updates and day one effort is to reduce kernel/driver related inefficiencies on the CPU side

that take up too many MS during a frame

but AMD already has such a low overhead, that for this class of performance and modern CPUs, it isnt necessary

them changing it back is semantics, you can run 2 year old drivers on rdna2 and not notice a difference

maybe if you run a ryzen 1500 or something...

[twin dew]

Only real change seems to be two separate driver installers for two separate branches of drivers, and only releasing updated versions of the "old" drivers when there is actual need, and not every time newer GPU drivers need updates.
Instead of just having single driver installer for two separate branches of drivers like it used to be, and how Nvidia does it.

That was fuckup in PR, even when it didn't actually change anything.

Making the long-standing practice of both companies public to get tiny bit of driver development team efficiency was bad PR.

[cold tide]

yes, it didnt change anything. Again, you can run ancient drivers for rdna2.

in fact, if you want to run fsr4 on rdna2, you have to

because amd broke it

[twin dew]

And they still keep releasing game update drivers as needed.

Just that the need is lesser than the newer, still buggier, driver of new gen GPUs.

[cold tide]

no again, the performance of rdna2 isnt high enough to clip into a cpu limit anymore

so day one drivers arent necessary

for rdna2

look at intel, needing a 9800x3d to get the most out of it, it is the polar opposite

every update they lower the kernel overhead more and more, but AMD is already miles ahead on both nvidia and intel in driver efficiency

last hardware unboxed test, they had a 30% lead

[twin dew]

That is driver optimization.
But there are actual bugs that need to be fixed too, or specific engine or game doing stupid shit that needs to be handled, as large part of driver releases.
And then there is Nvidia doing per game stupid shit to get more performance, which then can bite in the ass if the game changes how it does things.

[cold tide]

yes their cpu overhead, if AMD would have released big rdna4, theyd have taken the crown

nvida can only compete with FG turned on

and RT

buy RT introduces more CPU load lmao

so its catch22

And Vram usage so their old gpus cant run it either

[twin dew]

Yeah, AMD bet the farm on chiplets, and then something unknown came up and made those plans impossible, and they had to drop the two originally planned chiplet designs, and do quick spin of the lowest end chip doubled to get Navi48.

Navi41 and Navi42 were dropped, Navi 44 kept, and Navi 48 rushed through as replacement for Navi42.
And then PR lied that AMD wasn't planning to compete in high-end, when the plans had been there and failed.

[cold tide]

big rdna5 will beat the 5090TI or 6090, whatever they will call it, if AMD releases their AT0 bin to consumers

154CU

just because of the cpu overhead, or lack thereof

[twin dew]

Possibly that the planned substrate tech failed and was dropped by TSMC.
Different from currently being used for the datacenter cards.

[cold tide]

but that is still of little comfort to rdna3 users having to used third party to get fsr4

which 7900xtx user will get rdna5

[cold tide]

keeping up appearances..

[twin dew]

Would have been much more less damaging IMHO to just say that because of long lead time technical reasons, we couldn't do the originally planned chips price competitively.
But that isn't what the fucked up PR department of AMD would say.

Because they do keep fucking up, constantly.

But we cannot know which take would have been more damaging.

[cold tide]

Yes but im tired of genuine mistakes and misinterpretations are lumped in with actual fuckups like fsr4. Fsr3.1 is absolutely horrible, they have to fix it.

especially if nvidia releases dlss4.5 (tmodel2) to rtx2000

even if it runs worse than native lol

[soft bloom]

how should one feel when...
they get reply to their question on a forum in the form of ai-summary of the post?
like, not even an answer. not even a "hey I used llm to summarize your post". just... the summary.
like wtf

[sharp matrix]

Well getting multiple silicon to operate as a single piece of silicon for graphics probably isnt that easy but that would be required for a gpu chiplet design, as all modern rendering apis anyways work mostly on that core basis

[dire igloo]

I'd report that to forum mods for suspicion of botting

[twin dew]

My best guess is that the planned to be used interposer tech development didn't pan out and was scrapped by TSMC completely.

As in IIRC TSMC did scrap one planned intermediate cost & performance interposer tech at suitable time.

And the lower option wasn't performant enough, and the higher option was tapped out for next few years in datacenter GPUs.

But AMD cannot say that and throw TSMC under the bus in a way.

[cold tide]

"im helping"

[cold tide]

is there a question in here?

[pure karma]

i had a lightbulb explode in my face yesterday

warenty must have had expired lol

i had never actually seen a lightbulb burn out before

usually you just go to turn them on and they no longer work but no this one lit up and then imediately burned out, arked, and then exploded like a firework

[tribal kraken]

Wonder whats inside our next China container 😅

24 tons of surprises

When you meet the actual people in China and visit their factory, somewhat increases confidence to the products. Drinking with them is a bonus too

[tribal kraken]

Nah, just small 10ppl. company but networked internationally through and with large Finnish export oriented machine manufacturers in mining and forest sector.

[bronze jasper]

Don't turn around Woah UH Oh!
der Kommisar's in town Woah UH Oh!!

no its after the fire

don't turn around WUH OH OH

[tribal kraken]

I just put a bet in

[tribal kraken]

I have some Bykski coolant fittings already and friends have used their GPU blocks with success.

[tribal kraken]

Also grabbed Fanatec CSL DD wheelbase from their sales. It has option to a "booster" kit to 8nm torque, which is just a AC/DC Power supply and Fanatec official one is 100€.. AliExpress it as well

[visual tree]

You should have placed a bet on this song https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQNMBYSvFVQ

I actually like it more than the winner's song on UMK26

[tribal kraken]

I have friend who plays that instrument too, especially when drunk. He can replicate any Song by ear with it. Just play one from youtube for him to hear it once

[visual tree]

It's confusing how in croatian harmonica is actually an accordion while in english it's a small instrument you play with your mouth

The croatian word for harmonica is "mouth harmonica"

[tribal kraken]

This is the most common type in Finland. Proper ones easily 10k€. Just the instrument you want to be carrying for little summer night adventures

[visual tree]

Same here. We also attach money to accordion if we like the musician

[dire igloo]

Same for German

[dire igloo]

But this is called Akkordeon

[visual tree]

Guess it's not only my language then that has a word meaning something completely different regarding musical instruments

[dire igloo]

I would have to look up Harmonika but I think it also exists as a word for an instrument

[visual tree]

Harmonika = accordion; Usna harmonika = harmonica (mouth instrument)

[tribal kraken]

We call it officially Haitari and Harmonikka, also Hanuri which also is synonym for ass in slang.. As the instrument flex part reminds it for some ppl..

[visual tree]

Guess we simply use the generic term harmonica for everything

[bronze jasper]

Der Kommisar's in town Woah Oh OH

[dire igloo]

Drah di net um

[cold tide]

you know, everyone rags on AI right now. But if hed have taken 3 minutes to ask chatgpt how to safely buy products from unknown buyers abroad, it would have advised you to use escrow services

honestly, it was incredibly naïve of roman to pay up front

especially since the chinese have a bone to pick with western europe, being the US/IL's lapdog

and that is not 2020 hindsight, hes responsible for the salaries of all his employees. He cant be doing dumb stuff like that, when the information is widely available.

[sterile plinth]

What type of cheap appliances should I avoid buying from china? Obviously radiators or stuff that could blow up are a big risk but what about something like a vacuum cleaner? I found some pretty cheap ones on ali

[cold tide]

its a lottery

I would caution anything with a battery, or something that runs unsupervised

burning your house down to save a couple bucks isnt worth it

chinese chargers, ebikes etc have burned many a house to a crisp

[sterile plinth]

so I should ideally charge it under supervision if I do get one?

[cold tide]

yeah, or put it in something where it can safely catch fire. Though watch some videos of li-ion batteries failing to get a clue of the amount of energy that disperses

its incredibly dense

but like a space heater, that you leave unsupervised... yeah i wouldnt.

unless youre technically apt enough to judge build quality and safety.

[soft bloom]

Huh,
Subnauticanon ios and android
Just how much they had to squize graphics down?
Anyone remembers more pc games being ported to mobile while they don't look like total crap?
I men, ofcourse battle royals did a lot of that. But we probably won't see satisfactory do that. Or will we?

[sterile plinth]

It's impossible for them not to lower the graphics

Phones are way weaker than pcs

I think genshin is not too bad on that end

[slow flint]

Genshin was indented to run on mobile from my understanding so it is more optimized for that experience

[cold tide]

Subnautica's issue for me was the pop-in

So its probably worse on weaker hardware. Additionally, the game is 95% about the atmosphere

how does that translate on a tiny phone screen...

[bronze jasper]

one of the first proper ports i can remember was the modern xcom games. they're not bad on phone

a friend of mine was always playing san andreas on his phone. it's the full game from whati hear

[twin dew]

And one of my switches 10G ports has died by itself... Annoying.

[twin dew]

Anyways, FirewallD exorcized from the firewall computer with just manual NFTables replacing it.

[twin dew]

And for some reason it was the only 10G port that wasn't being used at 10G, only 1G...

[left trellis]

i got two side monitors, but that middle one is 52" of lorgeness :)

[waxen pendant]

it does look large.

Im thinking of moving my PC tower off my desk now that im Catless

[left trellis]

yea, went from a 34" 21:9 to a 52" 21:9, its very close to being 4x the screenspace

[waxen pendant]

I have a K70 v1 its that keyboard without the macro pad. TBH any seprate programable numpad would give you the same functionality. You can rip of the key caps paint them whatever colour you wish. then use slide decales to put any number or imagine on them you wish.

[waxen pendant]

for sure i have a large 100+ y/o accounting desk so i have lots of desk space. Currenty my 32" 4k art monitor is on it with my 27" 1440p gaming monitor and my Tower.

as well as a Digital audio interface and studio monitors.

If i put the tower on the floor though i would have more space for non digital art

it bothers me that Corsairs "highend" options were not hot swapable for so long

well hot swapable switches is easy to implament. and would make the Keyboards last longer. If your C switch dies you can just replace it

Ive gone fully modular and user repairable.

to open my KB i need to remove 4 screws thats it.

same with my numpad

[waxen pendant]

🤢

[tribal kraken]

Keyboard cleaning, never

[inner shale]

today i am walking dead

[tribal kraken]

Honeycomb mouse is not nice either

And I dont like to use gloves if grab something from workshop.

[waxen pendant]

this just looks dusty. I clean my KB twice a year. its full of cat and food and general ICK as my desk is used for everything. Dining table Art station Cat worship

[tribal kraken]

Yes its the oxide dust thats everywhere in wokshop that does welding and thermal metal cutting for metals

[waxen pendant]

i can tell. Are you using passive cooling or just not caring about the metal in the air. (it is possible for it to short thwe computer)

[tribal kraken]

Normal air cooled custom built PCs. This office and coffee room are behind fire doors from production but it gets here aswell. Cleaning the PCs with compressed air once or twice a year or when start having thermal problems.

[waxen pendant]

oh thats not so bad then. I was invisioning it out on the floor lol

I built a Passivelty cooled sealed pc for a weilding shop once

bought a case that had half of the case itself as a passive cooler

[tribal kraken]

These were very common on my previous work in a metal factory. But it was a larger company with managed IT and ERP run on serverfarm otherside of the coyntry

And all PCs were leased HP

[waxen pendant]

that makes sense

[winged valley]

I've only ever heard very negative things about ERP

From the IT management side of it

[tribal kraken]

For that company it worked well, at least for me. In numbers that company was 80 million revenue, 400 employees, 8 factories in Finland and one in Poland. Big customers had automated orders input into ERP system, CNC machines get jobs semi automated, and operators then mark jobs done real time into the system for next processing step, prints out pallet labels for delivery and mark jobs ok for invoicing. I think the IT team was about 5 ppl.

[bronze jasper]

"ERP" is just a company's internal database for inventory and resource management i thought. Keeping track of eveyrthing in one database instead of multiple systems that aren't interconnected.

I can see how that sort of thing would be a pain in the ass for IT teams, but that's literally their job to do is this kind of information technology infrastructure.

There's probably certain brands of ERP software that are dreaded in it teams

[winged valley]

Probably a specific software then

Something about it will only run on XP

[bronze jasper]

yeah. legacy support can be important lol. that's why modern windows have an xp VM in them

[winged valley]

Unfortunately

[bronze jasper]

which is kind of IT's job to know. I dunno. kinda sounds like people bitching about having to do their literal job. I get it, but you can get that in any field.

[winged valley]

While I'm all for legacy support, XP in the big 23 (at the time) is ridiculous

I don't care how many airports use it

At LEAST use 7

Can't believe 1-3 days of downtime somehow costs a factory enough to justify paying microsoft out the ass to keep support for XP

[bronze jasper]

ye old idiom. "if it aint broke, don't fix it". Which is why airlines keep using xp in a lot of their infrastructure.

Remember that nation wide outage because of airlines trying to update windows?

if it works, let it keep working

[winged valley]

That's not what happened

They tried to update their critical AV

[tribal kraken]

In my case there was 1 person in the IT-team, who was recruited from the ERP developer companyt, to do the customizations for our company into the ERP

[bronze jasper]

If you try to update every single system for the sake of updating it... you're going to be creating a TON of problems for your business

[winged valley]

Of course. I'm not going to tell a company running LTS on 10 to update to 11 or 12

It's mostly pointless

The disparity between XP and 10/11 is significant though

[bronze jasper]

yeah but one works, and the new one potentially introduces a ton of other infrastructural problems

[winged valley]

Besides, a good IT team is capable of doing long term simulations to ensure a smooth transition when the time comes

[bronze jasper]

good it teams cost money, and the old system still works

[winged valley]

Ugh I hate the "cost" of good IT

Good IT keeps you afloat if not forever then 99% of the time

It's like cheaping out on your power supply

[bronze jasper]

and sometimes good it is "if it aint broke, don't fix it"

[winged valley]

There will come a point in time where x86 is all but left behind in favor of ARM

I wonder how many decades it'll be though

[bronze jasper]

i heard that 10 yeras ago too. i don't think cisc is going anywhere

if anything, intel's efficiency cores will just become more arm like

[winged valley]

That's not possible, is it? I suppose your could modify the scheduler to only send certain instructions to the P cores, with the E cores having reduced instruction sets but like

The number of instructions available isn't the only issue

x86 fundamentally runs hot and slow compared to ARM because of how its instruction set works

[bronze jasper]

kernels used to have no idea how to utilize multi core cpus too. then they were made and software was made to work with it.

[winged valley]

You're suggesting we switch to SOC's with two different architectures on board?

[bronze jasper]

The "slow" argument is largely out dated. CISC out performs RISC for power efficiency in most real world cases.

[bronze jasper]

lol no. arm will remain dominant in teh SOC field

[winged valley]

To parrot your argument, that's only because CISC has been around for much longer and has been much more widely adopted thus mandating optimization

It's only a matter of time before RISC (and particularly, ARM) change that status quo

[bronze jasper]

RISC has been around since the 70s and is now dominant in the mobile space with phones and tablets. Apple's are running on ARM. To argue that they've not had the opportunity to get better than x86 is wrong. entirely.

[winged valley]

x86 itself has not existed since then, but the architecture it is derived from and the ones before that were still first

[winged valley]

RISC is dominant in the mobile space through ARM, and the mobile space demands power efficiency above all else. x86 is dominant in the PC/Server space, which while having split focuses both are more focused on performance than efficiency comparatively

[bronze jasper]

it's a far different beast today than i'ts early days. Multicore architectures with a lot more functionality on the chip. x86-64 has been replaced numerous times. It's all licensed AMD these days because Jim Keller completely rewrote the stack for AMD64 and that's what the market went with.

[winged valley]

At the end of the day, it's still a derivative

[bronze jasper]

it'll probably remain that way, the market split. Heavy uses remaining on more powerful high performance platforms. Lighter uses remaining on more efficient hardware that sips battery life.

Games can run on ARM as proven by Meta Quest and Nintendo. Valve is taking a huge bet on it with the x86 to arm translation layerthat they developed for the steam frame. I dont think this space is going to grow that much though. People don't want to game on android. That's an enshitified market and GTA 6 probably isn't going to be very good on a switch 2

[tall forum]

Im doing it

im going with a 9070XT

i might not have any money left but it will be worth it

[cold tide]

i never spend money i cant do without

[tall forum]

im a kid so i dont have anything to worry about

and i have a good system 90% of what i make goes to savings 10% = spending

[cold tide]

ah, you still live with your parent(s)

thats different

[alpine cape]

Once u lock in u really don't notice 1%lows so spending exponentially more isnt worth it @fickle gust

[fickle gust]

I don't really care for price it's ram I need it

Tho how much cheaper

Also what

Cuz it's going too be watercooled

So if white is cheaper

Oh phone %

I let mine die or get too 1%

Only takes 30 mins for a full charge

Still at 2%

[alpine cape]

I'm consistently below 20%

[fickle gust]

No I have smart charging on

Battery is still about 95% after a year or so

Idk when did one plus 13 come out

Jan 7 2025

So a little bit over a year

Samsung sucks and China has peak tech

I'm so glad I'm off Samsung now

I don't think I'll go back

I do miss my little stylus pen

But 1600 for dogshit battery and charging speed fuck no

Especially when a 900$ phone is faster

I do like the UI tbh

I don't think current UI is bad

[alpine cape]

Little copied(from a fruit) but not totally shit

[fickle gust]

True it's def more iPhone but as a person who had a s7 active too a s23u I love it tbh I don't mind it

Still takes good moon photos

So I'm happy

Charges what 3x faster

Also brighter and last longer

What

That says an hour and 18

That's so slow

My phone charges from dead too full in 30 mins

If only we had Chinese evs here in the us

Id love one tbh

Only ev brand is Tesla and they suck

They suck plus also u have Elon

But also feature wise they're just so much better and cheaper

I think too end ev was like 50k

No it doesn't lol

Okay yeah in the us no

But like top end luxury Chinese ev was like 50k USD so like crazy

I wish I had trains

Id love too ride a train too work or something

But no cuz God forbid public transportation

Ye I def wanna go too the EU or over there at somepoint

But uhhhhhh

Rn ain't the best time

Lol

Valid tho idk if I ever wanna move I love my small town

We shall see

I think my city has 20k people let me check

Yeah like 17k

It's pretty small compared too other places

I enjoy living here but I do wanna visit big Citys

I don't really pay attention too taxes

This made me laugh I look at my TV cuz I'm laying on my bed too just see that notification of do you have family

Anyways yes I do

I might

I wanted more orange but couldn't find and phones about too die

So ig it's time too get up and start factory

Cuz I got more limestone too hook up

Yippie I'm so excited

True should go feed them it do be basically that time

I wanna move out just waiting on a friend cuz like a single bed and bathroom is like 2k here well a 2bed 2 bath is basically the same but split between 2 people

Agreed names are Oscar(orange),wattson(tux/black)

Yeah I wouldn't mind owning a single 1 1 but pricey so

Yeah we shall see what happens

[fickle gust]

Real speaking of started watching robocop again pretty peak

[tribal kraken]

Motorsport documention device upgrade

Old trusty Sony and chinamike Eken H9 actioncam still works too. Maybe get video-in-video projects

[tribal kraken]

I like large pads. That ROG pad is nice pair for Glorious model O

Also like the removable numpad on the Asus Claymore keyboard, sooo many bullets wasted hitting the mouse left button on the numpad corner

[waxen pendant]

I us a Magic the Gathering playmat for my mousepad lol

[waxen pendant]

Ive swiched to a 75% compact keyboard and a seperate Numpad.

It transition was tough. But i really got sick of unrepairable pieces of crap

[twin dew]

Getting out of control:

  1 lo             loopback carrier     configured
  2 switch         ether    carrier     configured
  3 unused10g1     ether    off         configured
  4 unused1g1      ether    off         configured
  5 unused1g2      ether    off         configured
  6 lan            bridge   routable    configured
  7 wan            bridge   routable    configured
  8 iot            vlan     routable    configured
  9 dmz            vlan     routable    configured
 10 guest          vlan     routable    configured
 11 wani           ether    enslaved    configured
 12 wans           ether    enslaved    configured
 13 sit0           sit      off         configured
 15 wlans          vlan     enslaved    configured
 16 lans           vlan     enslaved    configured
 18 6rd-h2S09Y8hn- sit      routable    configured```

[twin dew]

Network interface listing from my firewall/router computer.
WANi is the incoming raw internet.
That is passed onwards as is, through bridge-firewall to WANs to one switch port with fixed VLAN.
And is also NATed for the internal networks

And then five other VLANs are connected with actual VLAN headers through that switch ethernet interface.
Two of them are bridged together with another bridge firewall in between (LANs and WLANs).

6rd-* is the IPv6 in IPv4 tunnel for IPv6 connectivity, and the internal networks have prefix delegation etc. working for public IPv6 access.

Still need to buy that Intel X550-T2 (clone) to replace current Intel i350-T2 clone.
That switch-ethernet is just 1G at this time. Same for that "unused10g1", just set the name already right.

Oehs Noes! I have forgotten to configure CAKE for some of the interfaces!

Also need to configure ingress CAKE for WAN at some point.

[twin dew]

Nice improvement from that in the download 95th percentile:
https://www.waveform.com/tools/bufferbloat?test-id=12c4a31b-9808-482c-9fc0-b94d8ebab3a9
https://www.waveform.com/tools/bufferbloat?test-id=dbed9fd2-7edb-4032-b03d-12e26b1f4c05

Just need to make it permanent, as SystemD NetworkD cannot be used to do that at this time.
Doesn't support configuring TC filters.

55ms to 11ms

Now need to tune that bandwidth limit to be just under ISP limiter, that is causing those excursions.

[twin dew]

But ipv6-test.com never fails to disappoint with random results:

While all the other tests work perfectly fine.
As example:

[soft bloom]

Ipv6 gamble?

[soft bloom]

Mystery time
So i have that script that does network stuff
And laptop were it runs
And for some reason, sonetimes, wifi will just stop connecting. I know it's not the problem with actual wifi router since every other device is fine.
It's just laptop. It will disconnect from it. Maybe try reconnect. Maybe not even try. Maybe it will reocnnect for a and then disconnect.
There are no other variables. Nothing else runs on the laptop.
At some time epriods it will be fine for hours. At other it will not work even if i manually restart betwork manager and reconnect.
Soemtimes it will come back to working for like 0 minutes and start failing again.
I have no way to deal with it other then cehck every now and then, try reconnect, and check back later.

[jagged snow]

Wired connection not an option?

[harsh jasper]

Hi all. I have a huge problem. The game (satisfactory of course) was working fine on Tuesday, but today it doesn't run. It's stuck on the first screen with the game's logo/name. There are no error messages, only a frozen image. I'm run in steam. I tried running it with parameters -dx11, -dx12. I was cleaning the folder %LOCALAPPDATA%\FactoryGame\Saved. I even reinstalled the game. It didn't help. What else can i do?

[jagged snow]

Make a thread in #1038092680493801533

[harsh jasper]

ok, thanks

[languid gulch]

just for fun i turned my 4090 down to 35% power usage, and am still getting 90-100fps in satisfactory at 1440p

[cold tide]

why would you do that

also its probably cpu bound at that point

[languid gulch]

yea prolly

it's hot in this room and i don't want to turn the a/c on yet

it's 95F/35C outside rn

what are you doing with it?

[cold tide]

undervolting and setting a framelimit would be more efficient

powertarget doesnt make the vf curve more efficient

[languid gulch]

yea true, plus i'll always be paranoid about the amperage

[cold tide]

meh, i havent bought PC marketed audio in a long while

i buy studio monitors

[cold tide]

well the amps are determined by the power, which increases with clockspeed and voltage. So the lower the voltage requiered to hit the frequency required for the framecap, the more efficnent it is

Yeah but i cant listen to those 2.1 or 5.1 sets anyway

nah, they sound like mud to me

try listening to a set of tri-amped fullrange speakers

granted they also cost like 20x, so i guess its fair considering. But if i had to listen to 50-80 euro audio id buy a set of IEMs

plenty of neutral IEMs at that range

Lypertek Z3 2.0 for example

60

i linked what i use

🤷‍♂️

Kali Audio In8 Second-Wave in any case. Why would links not be allowed.

[soft bloom]

Technically i can set it up that way ...
Perhaps i should

[jagged snow]

I'd reccomend it
Because honestly that wireless issue sounds like an absolute nightmare to diagnoes

[slow flint]

I need to get a new switch and it's so tempting to get a massive fast switch but so much money and so overkill

[soft bloom]

My switch was 12 bucks

[slow flint]

I need a managed one though at least Level 2 so they cost more
Also would like it to mount into my rack rather than sitting on a shelf
Also if you want more than 1GB ports they go up...

[languid gulch]

lol

[unique smelt]

The pc community in a nutshell, forever never agreeing on anything

[onyx pike]

Yeah for sure

“Your PC is ugly”
“Your PC should be however you want it”

[languid gulch]

this is just fucked up

[lyric wagon]

PC Master Race 💪

[languid gulch]

alienware cases be like

[lyric wagon]

Dirty 64 gigs of RAM PEASANT! I have 128 gigs of RAM

[languid gulch]

i should trigger the nerd rage, i got my 64gb kit for free 🤣

sadly, i'm legitimately tempted to buy one of those ram lighting kits

actually, i should have trusted my instincts and bought the 2nd set of 64gb when it was only "overpriced" at like $250

[lyric wagon]

I have 32 GB of RAM

This is my rig

AMD Ryzen 7 5800X overclocked to 4.8 GHz, RTX 2070 Super overclocked to 2070 MHz. 32 GB of ddr4 RAM clocked at 3600 MHz, and three 2 terabyte SSDs.

Also, liquid cooled

[languid gulch]

any temps issues with the gpu?

[lyric wagon]

nope, it says under 70C wehn under ful load

[languid gulch]

oh good. MSI has been caught in the past cutting corners on their GPU boards and kinda cooking em

oh no like "VRMs hitting temp while at stock" kind of bad

all the rules on thermals get thrown out when it comes to laptops 🤣

ngl i went with that too, mainly because my dad doesn't do games

plus he's old and used to the super thick chassis

yea my dad did that when he retired, just bought his work laptop. then the nvme in it started dying like a month after 🤣

he asked me if he should upgrade it as far as it would go, and then i told him it was a 7 year old laptop in an industry where 18 months is the average lifespan

ouchie

i figured out that his SSD was dying because it was only a 128gb stick, and had actually been overwritten enough over 7 years to kill it

🤣

yea, both my parents' PCs are mostly my old stuff

this new pc i have spoiled them, they both have fairly new stuff

both on 5600X, one's on 6600XT, the other 6800XT

awwwww

i wonder if they temporarily suspend links to add AI filters in

what's the model?

ended up getting my dad an acer nitro 15

🤣

oh yea 100%

i did a blank install too

this pc i had to have fun with when it came to installing the OS

got it sent to me with win11 Pro on it

no key

i still have my disks for that 🤣

fun fact: you can't just downgrade windows from pro to home

since all i had was an old Home key, i couldn't just do win11 Pro to Home. i had to first install win10 Home, then activate it, then install win11 Home. fucking stupid

guess what

all my stuff's in english 😛

i might have a spare windows key

might not work tho, it's from XP

dammit. win7+ only for keys

XP in its last year was amazing

vista hurt

oh yea 7 was way too nice for its time

ngl i'm tempted to do linux

maybe in a dual boot

i wanna hunt down one that doesn't have the old linux feel to it, if that makes sense

would love to try out a "as close to windows as you can get without getting sued" combo 🤣

i didn't know anyone ever made a laptop with 2 disk drives in it

when i got this system, i was almost going to run a dedicated ethernet line across the entire house to it, because the wifi in this room has always sucked. then i actually tried the wifi7

pretty sure it'd be faster than a hard line

[sharp matrix]

Thats awesome😎

[languid gulch]

worst day of my tech life in the last 10 years was my HP printer's main roller motor dying

[languid gulch]

from the "you could kill a man with it" days 🤣

it was one of the "old good ones" of HP's

[sharp matrix]

Well

I remember when hp used to be cool

Now its more you wont own your printer and will be happy

https://tenor.com/view/indeed-tealc-stargate-gif-4496552

Hahaha

[twin dew]

There have been laptops with at least 3x2.5" spaces.
And now with M.2, multiple drives are pretty normal.

For that server stuff, Debian Stable.

For GUI computers, Windows 11.

[languid gulch]

oh no i mean full fat CD drives

check out the full gif 🤣

der8auer would like a word

[twin dew]

Took so long to load I didn't notice it was supposed to be more than a still.

[sharp matrix]

He is to busy buying fake copper sheets

[languid gulch]

ouchie 🤣

[twin dew]

But as there was also doubled audio, front buttons etc. that might be two system laptop.

[languid gulch]

i'm surprised there wasn't full 3 RCA jacks on it

[sharp matrix]

40k € gone...

Think of what else could have been done with that 40k, besides buying fake copper sheets...

[languid gulch]

oh great, onedrive fucked with my system

now my memes & pics won't load properly when it's off

[sharp matrix]

Lol

[languid gulch]

this is actually annoying as fuck

i always have it open for quick posting

[sharp matrix]

[languid gulch]

and now it's just a bunch of blanks instead of the previews

[sharp matrix]

https://tenor.com/view/kittens-oh-look-more-kittys-gif-14325500

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=as2KoDtsS_0

40k € gone....

i wonder where they'll get the copper sheets from now that isnt a scam

https://tenor.com/view/wasting-money-toilet-throwing-money-throwing-money-in-the-toilet-money-waste-gif-21911788

and gone....

[languid gulch]

it's going to go up

[sharp matrix]

pray he doesnt make the same mistake again....

[languid gulch]

ok i heard about it but i hadn't watched the video yet. apparently everyone has those warehouse shelves 🤣

all china has to do is get this area to convert to 1435mm gauge and there'll be a straight shot rail path from Beijing to Calais

[twin dew]

Or just build one extra railway of right gauge.

[languid gulch]

i mean, yes, but they're planning on doing 3 paths to europe if they can

[twin dew]

But unfortunately route going through Iran isn't any better than route going through Russia that was being used.

[languid gulch]

1: avoiding russia
2: avoiding russian winter

i've always wondered if the instability we've seen along that path is either because of china trying to get a railway through these areas, or because people are mad that it's not going through their areas

i mean, look along the path: western china/xinjiang, afghanistan, iran, kurdistan/armenia/azerbaijan, turkey

some serious shenanigans all along there the last 20 years

just looking at it geographically, it's the only way to go if you don't want to go north of the caspian/black seas

i try my best to not talk about anything overtly political because i'd definitely get banned. i'm a 0-100 kind of person when it comes to that 🤣

agreed

what's that?

🤣

it's the standard "this is what the industry is doing right now" stuff

stick around so you can see der8auer get his copper

BlueSky went splat

oh that 🤣

ok i haven't actually seen it yet

i definitely feel that way without caffeine

i remember the original trailer for it

lol

we got to play the score at my school

and we had 7 basses

blondies?

have you been drinking again

[lyric wagon]

I have lol. Been super stressed out 😔

[dire igloo]

Yes. Yes, it is.

[twin dew]

But to this, like many of the video comments said, with China sourced, you always need to use either money escrow or first-party / trusted third party inspections.
Both being better.
Where AliExpress/AliBaba counts as that escrow for most part.
But in this case der8auer didn't use AliBaba for the actual transaction, only to look for possible suppliers.

Buying the same stuff from same suppliers through AliBaba transaction with money escrow held by AliBaba would probably have gone differently.

I have no idea what Diluted Demonic Kit would say.

[cold tide]

As i said before too, its incredibly naïve of a CEO responsible for a dozen employees.

[twin dew]

Not for orders from most countries.

[cold tide]

Yeah but the precarious nature of China now, he had to have suspected shenanigans.

[twin dew]

He did, but didn't have the knowledge to deal with china ones.
That isn't really easily publicly available anywhere.
YouTube comments etc. don't really count.

[cold tide]

If only there was some way to aquire knowledge somewhere. By putting a query into a box, and looking at the results.

[twin dew]

That isn't really easily publicly available anywhere.
So search engines don't really help.

[cold tide]

c'mon man

everyone crying about muh AI, muh RAM gone

10 seconds typing up a question

i'd have known

if you're not using the tech handed to you, that is on you

[dire igloo]

Who is Finnigen?

[twin dew]

Specific fox.

Really Finnegan. Maxeek wasn't in best of coherence when writing.

[dire igloo]

That much is clear

[dire igloo]

Read the disadvantages

Also: LLM accuracy is still a very big issue

[twin dew]

Yeah, that version was actually used, 70% of money was only transferred once the shipping was done.

Need version where they payment is only sent once the stuff arrives and has been inspected.

And is held in escrow for that duration by third party.

So that LLM did even get that letter of credit part wrong.

That is how it works for most countries, but for china you need more.

Didn't even bother reading originally, as LLMs are LLMs.

Der8auer paid 30% up front, and 70% once shipped.

And in this case, even if only 30% would have been paid up front, and 70% after inspection after delivery, you might still have gotten fucked because how large the price difference is between iron and copper/aluminium.

Letter of Credit is just type of escrow where some bank acts as the escrow third party.

[twin dew]

As LLMs are crap output machines, and couldn't be bothered, as trying to argue with anyone using one as primary source is pretty useless.

[dire igloo]

It's bad if people use LLMs like this without knowing how they work.
It's even worse if people use them despite knowing how they work.

[cold tide]

that was the first cursory search, the point was that the services according to you werent known. Dont fking goalpost shift after being proven categorically wrong.

ofcourse youre going to look up details afterwards and not rely on the first spitout

the pount is, a 10 second search wouldve netted you several better options to investigate

not knowing escrow exists was on HIM

[twin dew]

Not about knowing they exist or not.
About knowing what exact kind are used commonly in business with chinese companies.
Because suggesting most western companies the kinds of escrows that need to be used with chinese would end in any attempted business being cut for most part.

And the point is, he had followed the suggestions of that first option basically.
And you cut the exact escrow text off, so cannot know if it would have suggested anything more.

[dire igloo]

And you're making that claim based on what evidence exactly?
You're harshly criticizing Roman for something that according to Baldur isn't even true

[twin dew]

In that exact video, he says they paid 30% on order, and 70% after shipping.

And that LLM says to only pay after shipping.

The issue was when the seller gets the money.
Letters of Credit, Escrow etc. are just ways to make late payment "safe" for both sides.
Where the buyer proves/deposits the money into third partys hands, and they are only released to seller once the stuff has been verified to be what it was supposed to be.
Which commonly is that payment on shipping, no matter how you pay, direct or with third party.
But as shown, with China, you must only pay to the seller once the stuff has arrived and verified.
As both major seller fraud and transport fraud are so common.
Which is very uncommon otherwise.
And trying to get contract where you only pay after full delivery is very uncommon otherwise.
Except for very large corporations who have pushed up to paying only 3 months after delivery in cases.

Like US automakers etc.

Boeing too.

Which is just stupid, but that is MBAs for you.
They get bit less cashflow momentarely when they push those payment times back.
But no positive effect in long run, and lot of negative effects to their subcontractors, which then cause the price to go up.

But when you only care about making single quarters results look better on surface look, not paying any bills for a month will help a lot.

[twin dew]

But Intel X550-T2 network card ordered for 127e \o/

[cold tide]

He paid 100% upfront before seeing the goods. In how many installments he paid this, is irrelevant.
And there was no recourse for the vendor if the goods were defunct, because he'd already received the goods.

[twin dew]

And point was, that your LLM output was ok with that.

It just says to only pay after shipment and documentation for that shipment are in order.
With possible inspection at source before shipment.

[cold tide]

It says after inspection, ofcourse you're going to make sure that said inspection is then in ties with whatever is suspending the payments.

Those are the types of dots that a person in business can connect themselves.

[twin dew]

And point is, even first party inspection doesn't help in cases, even if the inspector sees that shipment leave the company.

As they just move the shipment back in and replace it.

You just keep moving the goal posts constantly.

[cold tide]

You are also laserfocussing on the first of 7 results it spat out.

And missing the point that you yourself are criticising people for trusting LLM as if they're using it as a sole means of information.

When the smart thing to do, is to combine them.

LLM is great for cutting through Google bias

to garner a wide variety of results

and then factchecking them through different means

[twin dew]

And again, I just said that getting actual information about the issues with buying from China are not easy to get.
And even your LLM result you were so proud of, in the visible part tells nothing that is relevant.

And would have just resulted in the same end.

[cold tide]

"so proud of"

god you just cant stop arguing in bad faith can you

its a result that got spat out in 10 seconds to make a point

look at how narrow the question was

you said that knowing of escrow servives is esoteric, i'm saying its clearly not

[twin dew]

No, that the specific use form with Chinese trade is esoteric.

[cold tide]

the LLM result gives you a few pointers to investigate, instead of google showing you 20 times 1 result

[twin dew]

Using them is common, using them to push the payment way back is not.

[cold tide]

the whole issue with google is that it's a self-fulfilling prophecy

[twin dew]

Which is why your LLM results outputted the parameters for common use.
And basically ignored the "china" part.

[cold tide]

because it brings up results, and the more people click the first results, the more it keeps bringing it up

until it basically stops bothering to look for anything else, and page 3-4-5 are blanked or left out

[twin dew]

Yes?
And that was my point on this?
That the information on how to do big purchases from china as company aren't easy to get and is esoteric?
Because there is big difference on how you must use the common tools, in a way that is complete no-go for everywhere else basically?
As the seller would just walk away.

[cold tide]

it even comes up with this. Places like SMS Global group, those would have known all the ins and outs.

[twin dew]

Even when it uses the common ingredients.

[dire igloo]

Says the guy advocating for using LLMs to obtain information.
Even with the caveat "double-check everything it says", it's still bad advice to suggest.

LLMs are built to imitate human speech.
Their entire thing is to sound like the output is valuable when in reality, it just doesn't care whether or not it's factual.
So any output you get is no better than a random comment on Reddit.
And sure, you can doublecheck the info you receive, but you'd be already primed and set up for confirmation biases.

[cold tide]

No, I said to use it to undermine google search bias.

[dire igloo]

Some of the worst interactions I've had as a helper in PC hardware servers were with people using LLMs to communicate with me.
It will inherently lead you off track

[cold tide]

I honestly dont have the energy to explain basic shit to midwits

dont use it, please. Just live in ignorance i dont care.

[dire igloo]

Duckduckgo exists.
LLMs are still biased, just differently

[cold tide]

Imagine using more than one technique. Galaxy brained I know.

[twin dew]

And often their results are worse than not reading them at all, like said.

[cold tide]

Truely beyond comprehension.

[dire igloo]

Basic shit like "linguistic predictors can't check for factual accuracy"?

[cold tide]

Again, inferring something that wasnt said. Just stop tagging me please.

Gishgalloping mfo

[dire igloo]

Exactly this.
You're better off not using LLMs unless your request is about phrasing rather than research

[cold tide]

Then dont use them, good. We've al learned a valuable lesson from the midwit. /thread.

[twin dew]

Like your current hole.
Where you think you know stuff because LLM put up terms in wrong context to question you put for it.
And you don't know enough to question the LLMs full output, and are just grasping at the specific terms it did use kind of right, when the complete output is just half-gibberish from wrong context (general world trade, not china trade).

Regurtitating the common stuff for large scale world trade, with errors.
For question about china trade, where it doesn't apply as such but needs large changes to tiny details.

And because Der8ayer didn't know about which tiny details to change, he got scammed.

[dire igloo]

That's what inferring means, yes.

Let's stick to what you did say then:
#off-topic-tech message
#off-topic-tech message
#off-topic-tech message
#off-topic-tech message
#off-topic-tech message
You were very obviously advocating for LLMs as a research tool.
When Baldur called you out on their inaccuracies, you defended them by referring to Google's search bias and brought in the fact-checking disclaimer.

And when I called you out on LLM flaws, you brushed it off and said that responding to my criticism would be to "explain basic shit to midwits"

[twin dew]

Tiny things to change to so extreme amounts that their normal suppliers would just walk away from the negotiations.

But which is needed for chinese trade.

[dire igloo]

Also: gotta love the level of irony in this.
"Google's search results are biased because of engine optimization"
and then recommending LLMs which are trained on random forum crawls and reddit comments

[twin dew]

And are just words after words, large language model.
Emulating human writing/speech, not caring about content accuracy.

[dire igloo]

LLMs outputs will include the appropriate keywords, that I do agree with.
But so will any normal search on the internet.

The AI just flavors it with improvised explanations that are unhelpful at best and in reality, mostly misinformative

[twin dew]

Yeah, point was that in this case the LLM didn't understand the "china" part of question, and just worked on trade in general.
Not trade with chinese companies as was asked.
Leading to answers that completely missed the point, but seemed good on surface pass.

Exactly the worst kind of misinformative answers they can give.

[dire igloo]

My current go-to as an entry point for explaining LLMs: number puzzles.
Stuff like "what number comes next: 1, 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, ?"

LLMs do the exact same thing, just more complex numbers and more complex patterns.
The patterns it was trained to recognize and reproduce are those of human speech.

[dire igloo]

Technically correct but unhelpful and in reality leads to the very same pitfalls

[twin dew]

Where the answer seems good to anyone who isn't already expert and would never ask the question, as they already know the answers.

But is just wrong.

[dire igloo]

The more techy/mathsy I'll refer to this series on the maths behind modern machine learning tech and products
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZHQObOWTQDNU6R1_67000Dx_ZCJB-3pi

[cold tide]

Yeah thank god it does, because otherwise I would have to read endless contrarians and midwits overestimating their value and arguing 20 pages long about shit noone asked for to find the nugget of info I was looking for.

The "irony" is your autism not understanding a simple human interaction.

"A" was said, a simple cursory search stated otherwise. That was it. Then you goalpost shifted it towards undermining the technique that was used.

[dire igloo]

except from everything that was said, that search result would've changed exactly nothing about the outcome

[twin dew]

No, I pointed that the results were crap?
And why they were crap?
Then had to dig deeper into what exactly was crap in that.

[twin dew]

.

[dire igloo]

also, why do I feel like you're trying to use autism as an insult here?

[twin dew]

So the answer was worse than useless, it was actively counterproductive as the contents were not about what was asked.

[cold tide]

Who said it was.

[twin dew]

And without being expert, you couldn't tell that the contents weren't about what was asked.

[dire igloo]

what are you referring to?
my question about autism? read it again, the first six words will provide you with the context you asked for.
Baldur's statement about the AI output being useless? you claimed it was helpful and that it would've prevented Roman from getting scammed. Baldur is saying it wouldn't have.

[cold tide]

What details.

[twin dew]

Like that payment after being sent and papers are ok (LLM and general way).
Vs. payment only after receipt 4+ weeks later and local inspection (China).

[cold tide]

You are now basing this off of the first out of 7 hits it gave

[dire igloo]

you only ever provided two of those seven and none of them in full

[cold tide]

-_-

[dire igloo]

actually, both in full

[cold tide]

why would I post the entire walltext

[dire igloo]

but only two out of seven

[twin dew]

And that was EXAMPLE of ways that it took the question wrong and provided dangerously misleading "answer".

Where it answered on the generic world trade version, not china version.

Because LLM.

I'm not expert on world or china trade, I don't have the expertise to point all the ways it might be wrong.

[cold tide]

Here, for example was the second hit

[dire igloo]

look who's shifting goalposts now. if you were an intelligent debater, you would realize that providing only a snapshot of your information makes everyone focus on just that snapshot.
You don't get to complain about us focusing on one singular output when in reality, it was you who provided only that one singular output.

the number solution proposed by the LLM is already getting dismantled, don't think the other six are any better

[twin dew]

And even that gives option of "after shipment", and not just that "after acceptance"...

[dire igloo]

actually, yeah
Majestic provided an example of the output and received examples of how it stinks

[cold tide]

The point wasnt to provde the full scope of information, the point was he said these services were esoteric when it is not. This is literally the sea lion meme.

[twin dew]

And just gives generics that are commonly known, not the china specifics where they differ from the general world trade...

Again.

[cold tide]

So use a sourcing agent

[twin dew]

No, Letters of credit (bank as third party escrow), non-bank third party escrows, etc. are common.
How they need to be used with China with very long time periods of holding are not.

[cold tide]

so how do they need to be used

you're ascribing esotericism without elaborating

[twin dew]

Said several times already here...
And also what asking for that type of transaction with normal trade partners in western world would end up in.
So if you haven't bothered to read, then that is on you.

[wanton orchid]

llm users "but then we can do actual research to actually find info and confirm if or not llm is telling shit"
just do the actual research already then bro

[twin dew]

And in this case trying to get us to do the research to debunk his claims via LLM.

[dire igloo]

just slap him with a wall of links and call it a day

[cold tide]

This is exactly why people use LLM's to get an aggregate list, and skip forums.

Midwits pretending to be galaxybrain

[dire igloo]

also: go look up anchoring bias, reinforcement bias, confirmation bias

[cold tide]

Using circular reasoning to never have to provide an actual answer. THen pat themselves on the back.

[twin dew]

I actually bothered to read lot of the comments on that Der8auer video, with actual company order department representatives telling about their experiences and what needs to be done to get what is ordered instead of being scammed.
Which is exactly why I said that YouTube comments cannot be considered easy to access source.

[wanton orchid]

the not circular reasoning :
llm -> llm

[twin dew]

Because that stuff isn't commonly known outside the specific circle, and then various comments in where-ever.
No real primary sources available anywhere.

[cold tide]

So for example, why didnt Der8auer contact Steve Burke.

Resident China man.

[dire igloo]

honestly? yeah.
toxicity and gatekeeping drive people away from human sources online, amplified by the fact that LLM outputs are basically instant.
but the issue there is poorly moderated online communities being used as examples

any well-managed online help forum will call you out on using LLMs for giving advice and probably exclude you for it

[cold tide]

And this is again why i'm saying the problem is people having hairtriggers online. They have discussions with people blatantly posting LLM output so many times, that the mere usage or appearances triggers them so much they no longer see:
A. the value that it CAN bring
B. what the person is implying or using the input for

If I merely use LLM to conjure up a list of possibilities then I can then explore. Instead of having google only pointing me towards reddit or some broker who paid the most to arrive on page one, there is nothing inherently misleading about that.

[dire igloo]

what's that process called where you get info from a secondary source, check it against a primary source and end up just referencing the same primary source as the secondary source you tried to crosscheck?

it's not circular reasoning, but it's still very much a thing

[cold tide]

It is much easier to look for ESCROW services, and how to apply them in China, when you fucking know they exist. Because the name isnt even mentioned in the first page of google, I just checked.

[dire igloo]

you are yet to provide evidence of LLMs bringing any actual value
the examples you posted were useless beyond basic keywords that a google search would've also brought up

btw, where does an LLM get its online sources from? there's gotta be some algorithm there too

[cold tide]

And now 5 pages of sperging ensue, becuase LLM was mentioned.

[twin dew]

And Der8ayer did know about escrow services like alibaba?
But didn't think he needed to use one, when the seller agreed to take most of the money only on shipment?

Which is the china specific exception.

[cold tide]

Why would he take that risk lol

[twin dew]

That "has been shipped and papers are ok" doesn't mean shit.

[cold tide]

that in itself should tell you all you needed to know

[twin dew]

When in most of the world at that point everything is ok.

[twin dew]

Because using Escrow that releases the money on shipment would just be waste?

The point is knowing that "pay on shipment" is wrong with China.

[cold tide]

Thats why they take advantage of westerners, they would believe something that is too good to be true.
"oh this chinaman is willing to just float 40K at my behest, seems legit"

[twin dew]

Because paying most on shipment is common?

[cold tide]

I wouldn't, neither as a seller or a buyer.

And it has prevented me from ever getting scammed.

[twin dew]

But in cases with new businesses working together, you might have the seller wanting escrow to hold the money from order to shipment.

So that the buyer cannot scam the seller and not pay.

Buyer wants to pay late.
Seller wants to be payed early.

[cold tide]

but google didnt bring them up. See this is my issue, you acuse me of saying the proof is in the argument but then in the same breath do the same.

[twin dew]

You need letters of credit or escrow in cases where the sides cannot come into agreement on the pay terms.

So that third party act as holder of the money in between the points where seller and buyer wanted to handle the money.

[cold tide]

In the west, because its a high trust society.

Which is why westerners are babes in the woods outside of it.

And they know it.

[twin dew]

Most don't and that is the point in this.
And the actual information how to work then isn't really compiled anywhere as primary source.

[wanton orchid]

the tricky part is not jumping on a llm generated website
which are systematically pushed on front page lately
going llm is going straight to the shit

[cold tide]

Most chinese know it.

[twin dew]

So even your LLM just got the trust version in its reply.

[cold tide]

Indians know it too, which is why their 60IQ scams work on supposedly smarter Westerners, they abuse their high-trust society.

[sharp matrix]

Probably because no evidence really exists, infact based on some actual data from companies that have tried to incomperate LLMs into their work flow and they are seeing little if any actual returns

Which makes sense LLMs make to many mistakes, all outputs have to be checked by a human to correct mistakes, its hard and difficult to get actual value out of it

[dire igloo]

first result obviously unrelated, second one immediately brought comparable results

oh, yeah, forgot to include this screenshot

[sharp matrix]

So its another just google search

I can just google you know....

[twin dew]

That Step 2 and Step 3 were basically done by Der8ayer.
Step 5 wasn't.

[dire igloo]

which I'm pretty sure is what happened with the result I shared btw

[twin dew]

He made the mistake of only looking for the seller through AliBaba, not ordering through it.
And that Step 2 doesn't mention that gotcha either.

And that Step 3 is basically useless, as the common scam is to do that small order right, and then scam on the followup.

Again not mentioned.

[cold tide]

lol, babe in the woods

w-what, people would set up a long con instead of the short?

[twin dew]

The Der8auer sources both had long histories with good review on AliBaba, because AliBaba holds that escrow until the delivery has been confirmed and checked by the buyer.
But many aren't aware of that distinction between normal escrow and china-escrow.

[sharp matrix]

Your assuming people are logical, by and large people are not

[twin dew]

And again Der8auer mentioned that in the video., and why they didn't bother.

As exactly that as the cause.

As he knew it would just be useless extra step with extra costs and time.

When producing right thing isn't hard.
It mainly protects in cases where the contract parner cannot produce what is ordered, so they can't deliver good sample either.

But having pics of the right product with checks done remotely skipped that part.

[cold tide]

Defunct products and sellers can have good reviews, if the platforms remove negative reviews. Seen even on Amazon for example.

The basic rule is never using trust as a basic premise.

[dire igloo]

I think Majestic is assuming that because der8auer didn't use escrow, that means he wasn't aware of it being an option

[sharp matrix]

Cool what did you win?

[twin dew]

Yup. When in fact he wasn't aware of needing to hold escrow until the product has arrived and checked by them.

Which is china-special.

[sharp matrix]

I mean besides scoring really high on a standard iq test

[twin dew]

So getting that deal on 30% up front and 70% on shipment (standard), without need for escrow, was enough for him.

[sharp matrix]

Really thats the award

[dire igloo]

wait, you're supposed to have a high score?
I thought I was in the clear when mine came back negative...

[twin dew]

Where the normal case is to get that, but need escrow that 70% up front already.

[sharp matrix]

I honestly wouldnt know i never took that test

[twin dew]

So you pay 100% up front, but 70% is held up in escrow until shipment.

[cold tide]

Thats because he used trust as a fundemental premise. Which is always an extremely vulnerable position to be in. Especially when you're floating 40K.

That is not hindsight either.

[twin dew]

And again, that is mostly china-special, not commonly known thing, and not commonly documented thing.

[cold tide]

There is no need for it either, because they wouldn't expect it out of you.

[sharp matrix]

Oh ok i never took it. I know its a standard iq test but thats all i know

[twin dew]

So you can keep bashing that YOU know about it, so Der8ayer was idiot all you like.

I did know about it too. Most don't.

[dire igloo]

so if he used an escrow and the escrow held the 40k until the goods were shipped, how would that have been different?
the shipment would've still been bogus goods, the escrow would've still paid the scammers

explains the alcoholism tho

[cold tide]

No, thats not what was said, payment is released upon verification. Not shipment.

[twin dew]

The information Der8ayer was missing is that with china you need to have terms where you only pay after delivery and checking.

But that isn't common or easy to get via good source.

[cold tide]

Anyone expecting you to leave your ass hanging out on 40K worth of merchandise, is a potential scammer.

[twin dew]

As most sellers will not agree to that in west etc.
As that will leave THEM hanging too long.

Without pay for stuff they had to pay already.

"Yeah, yeah, you shipped us 40k worth of stuff, that you had to pay for already. Sorry, we will only pay in two months, suck it".

Normal with china, not normal in general.

[dire igloo]

your very own LLM output stated the opposite.
it does mention "after shipment or acceptance" but accepting the package doesn't make you aware of its content's quality, it just confirms that something was delivered.
which is clearly laid out in the disadvantages - you're protected against non-delivery, but not against bogus product quality

[twin dew]

And with 4+ week delivery time, there is huge difference in negotiating to "after shipment" and "after acceptance".

In general.

[sharp matrix]

So your a genius

[twin dew]

And outside of china trade, trying for that "after acceptance" is much more uncommon outside of very large buyers.

Again, the tiny detail that is super important to know, and isn't commonly known.

[dire igloo]

makes me realize why skonto is a thing here in Germany.
seller gives you a small discount if you pay within a given time frame after delivery

[sharp matrix]

So that 144 iq is really meaningless hmmm

[dire igloo]

you could be a genius if you could utilize your brain like a commoner

[dire igloo]

also, idk how B2B shipping works, but I've had several instances of parcel couriers not allowing me to inspect a package's contents before signing off on delivery.
which would still trigger the "payment upon acceptance" even with faulty goods

[sharp matrix]

So you lost 100 iq

[twin dew]

Yeah, that too.

And in this case the top few layers were ok for one of the senders too.
So cursory check on delivery before signing would have passed too.

Would have needed to unload the whole pallet.

[sharp matrix]

It could be fun to take that test, then i could have a worthless paper with a meaningless number on it to

[twin dew]

And in the other one, the surface was thick plating of right material, only the insides were wrong.
Again would have passed lot of incoming checks.

[sharp matrix]

Dont worry i wont block you even if everyone else does, your to cool after all

And besides i need someone to talk to about mews

[dire igloo]

at which point, the only way to not get scammed would be "payment after in-depth quality testing"

[pure karma]

Alcoholism yay

[twin dew]

Which is china standard, but again, need to know about that to even try to get that kind of escrow set up.
As it would not really fly anywhere else.

[sharp matrix]

Lol i was blocked by marv to, thats normal around here

[dire igloo]

🫂

thank you, I needed that

[pure karma]

Marv?

[dire igloo]

nah, I ain't blocking you, your drunken ramblings are too fun to witness
they do make me concerned for your wellbeing, but I guess you consider your body to be fucked either way, so might as well make it fun by adding neurotoxins to the mix

[sharp matrix]

signpostmarv

[pure karma]

He still exists?

[dire igloo]

many many years ago, I got scammed on Kleinanzeigen, yeah
I got to retaliate many times over by having other scammers banned off the platform

[pure karma]

I havent seen him in what feels like 4 years

[sharp matrix]

That person has no friends, we all know this

[sharp matrix]

My body is fucked up to

[pure karma]

https://tenor.com/view/steven-he-dont-do-drugs-gif-21811942

[sharp matrix]

I do cheap drugs

[dire igloo]

mine only a little bit, most of that by my own doing
biggest fuckup for me has gotta be my neurobiology

[dire igloo]

caffeine >>>

[pure karma]

I would have said none but caffeine inderectly yea

[sharp matrix]

That to

[dire igloo]

even better tho: get ADHD diagnosis, then treat it with speed

[sharp matrix]

Yeah my body is fucked up that way to

[pure karma]

I live off the pain these days tbh

[dire igloo]

wdym indirectly? caffeine fulfills all criteria of a drug
alters your mental state, messes with your neurobiological mechanisms, addictive, etc.

[pure karma]

you would think i fell off a cliff and landed on my head with how sore my neck is all the time