Whats the worst subclass across all 3 characters?

[real lance]

Across all classes whats the worst subclass?

[marsh swallow]

Thats an impossible question, you could say stasis but its pretty good for warlock and titan. Literally every subclass has some use

[junior vault]

there is no worst subclass because they all fill some niche

That being said i thought about this question since last night and as a titan main id say void titan

solely because the supers are outclassed. i only use sentinel shield to res teammates and get out of sticky situations

overshield and controlled demolition is still super duper nice and makes up for the supers being mid

the "worst" classes are quite serviceable now. the worst you get is middling performance which is not necessarily bad

[marsh swallow]

I mean, i’d say void titan is spectacular right now. No backups with acrius and a waveframe is like crack with the right fragments

[junior vault]

it’s absolutely great! super hard to find a “worst class” though

[sonic bolt]

they're all good, but I think it's worst to have a teammate that's void warlock/stasis titan/arc hunter because they don't help you

[bright spruce]

It’s behemoth

Aside from cheesing riven it’s a genuinely worthless subclass when strand, arc, and solar all do its job better, and void at least has a few cool builds

Arc warlock is arguably in the same boat, being horribly outclassed, but at least it can spam pitifully weak abilities, behemoth just can’t do anything

[grand kayak]

Stasis

they have niches but out of those niches they're outdone

[junior vault]

Why Did I Forget About Behemoth yeah behemoth titan isnt very great,,, absolutely worse than void titan

Stasis generally got powercrept by light 3.0

[little sonnet]

Behemoth was usable, but Whisper of Rime/stasis overshield in general gets overshadowed by void overshield and woven mail

currently Behemoth’s only use is some scenarios like Riven where it just puts out insane DPS

[bright spruce]

At least stasis Hunter has a busted pvp super making them great for farming mayhem, and shadebinder is at least slightly better than stormcaller

[wary vapor]

Behemoth is very good with stronghold lament build

[grand kayak]

That's also not a very good build

[junior vault]

You know what else is good with stronghold lament

Literally every other subclass

[bright spruce]

Behemoth and Stormcaller are both debatably the worst

Behemoth probably gets used more in serious speedrun/endgame play due to riven cheese.

Aside from that it’s a good deal worse than even stormcaller, a subclass with a burst super almost as bad as it’s roaming super and the capability to spam some of the weakest grenades in the game

[junior vault]

The only other niche that Behemoth is found in is Lowman DSC but thats about it

[bright spruce]

Yup

Behemoth is essentially the parasite of subclasses

The single best option for like 2 things, and then everywhere else it’s borderline useless

[wary vapor]

I mean have you tried it?

[bright spruce]

Stronghold/Lament is for cheesing shuro chi challenge and for basically everything else there are infinitely better damage options

[solemn spire]

are you guys forgetting nova warp and spectral blades ☠️

literally nobody uses it

and behometh is pretty good in terms of dps

[little sonnet]

how are these relevant

[chilly sorrel]

OP asked for worst subclass, not supers specifically. void hunter and void warlock are good.

[chilly sorrel]

good in terms of total damage, not dps

[grand kayak]

No it isn't?

[livid thistle]

now that we are on this topic, which class is (generally) the best for pve

[real lance]

yes it is, unless it was like a bug but it does hit pretty high damage overall

[grand kayak]

It's bad for dps though

[real lance]

yeah but, not everything has to be about dps

[grand kayak]

It's also good on one boss only

[errant yarrow]

solar warlock for 99% of content

well ofc, little difficult in solo dungeons though

still super good though

[livid thistle]

how potent woudl you say solar hunter is? i have like 40-50 hours in hunter and like 5 in warlock

[bright spruce]

Solar Hunter is decent, about as good as arc hunter

Main usage of Hunter is tether and high damage supers

[livid thistle]

wait wtf is tether lol

[sonic bolt]

arc hunter is so bad in groups i hate it so much
it's like by the time you in melee range your buddies already killed it.
imagine a subclass you dont touch until boss is out or you need amp lol

[junior vault]

the void bow super; creates a point that tags onto enemies and gives them 30% weakness debuff

alternatively theres one that shoots multiple shots which gives you More Damage but less debuff uptime

[errant yarrow]

solar hunter is good for easier content and decent for raids with stat eaters. itd be better to run arc or void hunter

[low wave]

stasis hunter, nearly every one of its niches has been powercrept
strand has better cc, other subclasses like void have better ability spam
i am saying this from the POV of a stasis hunter main, it needs some love

[errant yarrow]

stasis titan isnt that good either, powercrept by strand like hunter

[bright spruce]

Stasis titan has riven cheese, stasis Hunter has the most annoying pvp super in the game, period.
Other than that both are just absolute trash

And it sucks because you used to have bakris fourth horseman setups

[low wave]

i love bakris with all my heart, but making it a surge exotic was a damn massacre

[livid thistle]

so for solar warlock what abilities and aspects should i run?

[bright spruce]

Sunbracers for neutral game, swapping to a loadout with lunafactions and surge mods during dps

Heat rises and either icarus dash or touch of flame depending on preference

Get melee kill, consume your grenade, and start flying while spamming Solar grenades on enemy spawn locations

You’ll spawn a load of orbs and with the right embers you recharge your melee basically instantly

[livid thistle]

oh cheers, i assume that the ones u mentioned here are fragments which I havent unlocked. do you get them by just playing or are there specific quests you need to do?

[bright spruce]

Buy them for glimmer from ikora

I don’t recall their names but you want the one that gives melee energy on scorch mainly and the other 3 you can just sort of pick out based on what you want to spec into

Radiant on melee for barrier champs, restoration on Firesprite for survivability, and the others have their usages

[livid thistle]

thanks btw how do you get lunafaction boots?

[errant yarrow]

exotic engrams

just the normal world drop ones

[livid thistle]

is that the only way?

or are they like craftable

[errant yarrow]

yeah, but they are super easy to get now

[errant yarrow]

cant craft armour

[livid thistle]

ahh whats the best way?

[livid thistle]

oh right thanks

[errant yarrow]

do all your weekly powerfuls in vanguard, gambit and crucible

[livid thistle]

lmao im kinda new whats a powerful?

[errant yarrow]

click on vanguard and itll say play vanguard ops with a surge subclass

idk what this week is

I think void or strand but I forgot

[livid thistle]

ohh

how can you check what the surge subclass is

thanks btw

[errant yarrow]

when you go to q into the thing on the left above where it says vanguard ops there are modifiers and you can hover your curser above them to see

[livid thistle]

so i completed the hawthorne one which is like to receive commendations or something but i didnt get an exotic? is that normal since the lil icon was yellow

[errant yarrow]

hawthorne isnt one of them

just vanguard, gambit and crucible when you go into your director where are the planets are

[livid thistle]

ahh thanks

[livid thistle]

is there a way to make exotic engrams only give armor or weapons or is it completely random?

[errant yarrow]

random

[livid thistle]

thanks

[livid thistle]

yoo i just got lunafaction boots ty bro how do you create a rift tho? ( @bright spruce this might apply more to u since u told me)

[bright spruce]

Class ability

Mainly lunas is about well of radiance

[livid thistle]

and consuming grens and flying?

[bright spruce]

Well is the single best super in the game, period, no contest, no arguments

[livid thistle]

yea i agree, what are surge mods tho?

thats the only thing left i need for the build you told me

[bright spruce]

Heat rises aspect, hold your grenade key

Makes you fly higher and airborne kills extend the duration

[livid thistle]

ohhhh

[livid thistle]

what do surge mods do then? (and how do you get them)

[bright spruce]

Also provides a few other benefits, so just hold grenade key after getting “sunbracers ready” and then jump into the air while spamming grenades on anything that dares move

[livid thistle]

oh i havent unlocked sunbracers yet

ive unlocked lunafaction tho

[bright spruce]

Not super relevant until you’re doing hardcore endgame, but they’re armor mods on your legs that boost weapon damage significantly while you have armor charge

[bright spruce]

What exotics do you have

[livid thistle]

lunafaction, starfire protocol, claws of akhamra, eye of other world, verity brow, and nazarec sin helmet

and a bunch of weapons ofc

[bright spruce]

EoAW is good, I’d suggest that for neutral game

You shouldn’t keep lunas on all the time, only equip it right before popping your well, and then unequip it once you’re adclearing/doing mechanics

[livid thistle]

how about claws of akhmara (2nd mele charge) is that good?

im quite used to using it and i find it useful

[bright spruce]

It’s…. Not great

Problem is it doesn’t provide any benefit to those melees or ways to recharge them inherently

[livid thistle]

oh alright thanks

[bright spruce]

EoAW while very simple offers flat out faster cooldowns for all abilities, which is usually better

Also note that melees are much weaker overall than grenades, so melee centric exotics are a step below grenade-centric ones inherently

Starfire Protocol is really really bad these days, after a deserved nerf it basically just doesn’t do anything well at all, but it’s better than nothing

You’ll have to run empowering rift for it which means you miss out on the “panic button” functionality of Phoenix dive and healing rift, but it does let you spam some of the most stupidly overpowered grenades to grace d2

And verity’s brow is quite good if you have retraced path

[livid thistle]

oh alright thanks, so if i want to use lunafaction boots for dps what abilities should i use to assist me since im not sure i quite understand (i understand the grenade flying tactic but i dont have that exotic yet)

[bright spruce]

When dpsing just swap to lunas, pop your well, and then just dps like any other subclass

Lunas gives bonus range and maxes reload speed, making you and your team deal noticeably more weapon damage overall

Even if you’re using Autoloading holster or the like, it’s still good

A weird quirk of lunas is that as long as you pop the well with them on, you can switch to another exotic while retaining the bonus reload and range on the well

That’s only important if you’re hardcore sweating but it’s something to take note of

Also it doesn’t apply retroactively, if you pop well then put on lunas you don’t get the bonuses

[livid thistle]

ohh thanks do you have any reccomendations on how to get good dps weapons?

[bright spruce]

What dlcs do you have

If you have 30th anniversary, you can use gallahorn as a support weapon to boost your teams damage

Otherwise, tractor cannon is a free option that instead of dealing direct damage massively boosts that of your team

[livid thistle]

forsaken only

[bright spruce]

(If running tractor you’ll want a good shotgun or fusion rifle and to be good at weapon swaps, but you don’t need that to be good)

[livid thistle]

im tempted to buy beyond light as well

u think i should?

i have the season pass as well so are there any season deep dps weapons?

[bright spruce]

Once you get tractor cannon, learn last wish and get Apex Predator crafted, it’s the best dps weapon

[bright spruce]

It’s not a great dlc but the included raid is one of the best for beginners

[little sonnet]

I really wish stasis hunter was better, and I wish shatterdive was useful in PVE outside of shatterskating because it's just so sick to use

[little sonnet]

Do you have the lightfall dungeon pass? Cold Comfort, the rocket from the dungeon is also really good. It and Apex Predator from LW are the two best rockets in the game rn so if you have the dungeon pass, try to get one

It's not necessary though

you can focus Hothead from Zavala, Blowout from Shaxx, and get Apex Predator and be perfectly set on good rockets

[livid thistle]

how do you get tractor cannon?

[livid thistle]

i dont have the lightfall dungeon pass :(

[little sonnet]

All good! You'll be fine with any of the other rockets mentioned!

Apex Predator, Hothead or Blowout

[bright spruce]

Random exotic drop

[little sonnet]

You can get Tractor Cannon for free from Shaw Han right now! Go talk to him and he has a key that opens a chest with it

[livid thistle]

oh thanks

[livid thistle]

arent these like roll related tho? dotn u need to get good rolls

[bright spruce]

Oh damn hahaha

[bright spruce]

Yes, apex is craftable and only really requires tractor to get if the rest of your team has good dps

[livid thistle]

it baffles me that destiny gibes away one of the best dps weapons for free but they still sell their stupid anniversary presents and stuff for 30 dollars

[little sonnet]

Yes but for Apex Predator, you can craft it with the roll you want. Suraya Hawthorne has a weekly Last Wish quest that lets you buy a red border you want each week

so if you run Last Wish and get very unlucky on drops not getting any red borders, most you'll need is 5 weeks to craft it

[livid thistle]

five weeks to craft 1 weapon seems a bit extensive lmaoo

[bright spruce]

Tractor isn’t the thing dealing dps it’s a support weapon, making enemies take 30% more damage from all weapons

[bright spruce]

If you wait for last wish to be on rotator, you can join a group farming the first boss kalli and get a bunch of drops, which might take longer but doesn’t require learning the raid

It’s like atheon farming for vex mythoclast or caretaker for forbearance and cataclysmic

[little sonnet]

That's just the worst case scenario

you'll probably also get the patterns for other stuff in the raid

For Precision DPS you can get Sleeper Simulant from the monument, or craft Taipan for free from the Enclave. You need to do the first mission of Witch Queen and then do the crafting quests to get the Taipan pattern

it's a really solid linear fusion rifle

you can craft it in like 2hrs max even if you haven't done any of the required stuff which you probably have

[bright spruce]

Taipan isn’t great but it’s passable for farming kalli, so yeah once LW is on rotator I’d suggest doing that

[livid thistle]

ohh alright thanks

is thunderlord good since i just got the thunderlord catalyst

[little sonnet]

Thunderlord is consistent/easy to use, and has decent ammo economy

It's controversial since some people were praising it as the best DPS in the game when shooting a div bubble but gjallarhorn + rockets were still just better dps. Then they fixed a bug that gave TLord extra dps

[livid thistle]

rip

[little sonnet]

it is still usable especially paired with someone else on your fireteam using Divinity

[livid thistle]

yeah i prob will since i got the catalyst

[little sonnet]

It's also just really fun

[bright spruce]

TLord is the best free dps option that isn’t heavily roll dependent

[livid thistle]

oooh alright thanks ill use it

aaaa i just gto the tractor as well tho and they are the same slot

so how does the extra tractor damage work?

[bright spruce]

Hitting an enemy with tractor gives them a debuff that makes them take 30% extra damage for 10 seconds

Visually it appears odd but in mechanics it’s a normal pellet shotgun, you need to be in close range to use it effectively

To keep uptime high, shoot it once and then swap to a fusion rifle or other shotgun and shoot for about 8 seconds, then swap back to tractor and re-apply the debuff

Don’t mag-dump it, you’ll be wasting ammo

[livid thistle]

are you sure we are talking about the same tractor? mine has a different description

"repulsor force" impulse push that supresses enemy abilities

[bright spruce]

Yup

This game has horrible descriptions 99% of the time

It acts like a weaker arc blind, disabling non-boss enemies ability to attack and reducing their movement

But it’s main usage is against bosses to make them take more damage

[livid thistle]

ohh alright thanks a lot

[livid thistle]

hey man sorry again but how do you craft apex?

[bright spruce]

Get 5 patterns

All Last Wish weapons drop from all encounters

You can do a weekly bounty from Hawthorne where doing all 5 encounters gives a random guaranteed deepsight and after that you can buy one of your choice with 20 spoils

[livid thistle]

is pattern the red border weapon?

[real lance]

yes...

[livid thistle]

so how exactly do you "get" the pattern

like how do you extract it or whatever

[real lance]

you dismantle the weapon

or can go into the weapon and youll find out

[livid thistle]

thank you