#breeding-events-and-permanent
1 messages · Page 9 of 1
I'm not that disappointed about not getting talos he's pretty bad imo
I’m sad as I wanted to complete the book
Because you thought you could breed him with just “one more” breed. That happened to me with Helgudin unchained and I wasted 500 gems for nothing
That must've been so nice
Lol
That must've been nice Winthrop
Next event : epic epic epic epic ×14 ! 
Wow that's gonna be so nice.
Ouch Winthrop 😓
Actually not very surprising, assuming a 10% chance, after 10 tries there is a 35% chance of not being successful and after 20 tries it still 12% chance of failure.
5 attempts got voltaik and talos
I hope for pierceid the joker will be galante and not galante jr
27 tries finally got Talos just before event ended
Ok that cool
Ty
I hope it's not galante jr for the joker
bruh he judt showed u and it is
Sorry . . . Deleted the image, it's not allowed to post leaks in the server
You can always dm
Hey Bella

Can i dm for the leak bella
@young valley it's posted on Community server 😝
@stiff patrol do you have a link to the community server? :)
No
@blazing acorn because it's one of the server's rules . . . Just official info is posted in here
@young valley sent it
@stiff patrol can you send it too? Please
Done 🙂
Excuse me
I Want to know who is the breeding joker
Galante or Galante Jr?
In the game it is Galante
And on the Monster Legends Facebook page it says Galante Jr
It galante
Oh
Well that's unfortunate for me
Thanks
I DID IT FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SECOND TRY!!!!!!!!!!
Do the airplane mode trick
what’s that
When turning on airplane mode while in the game the game will have no internet and not save. You can speed up the breed while in airplane mode to see who you get. Once you see who you get you close the app and then turn off airplane mode. You wouldn’t have spent any gems once you log back in

@lofty ether
Thank you!
Np
😮
I already have her at 110 so it doesn’t bother me that I can’t breed her
thx for saving me the stress @red fog
Changing the breeding pair from the original announcement means now I cant participate, I am extremely disappointed in ML. I now lose out on my favourite denier, AND the maxe coins I needed to finish the 2 pages of the limited time book. Very angry about this
😳
i am mad that alot of people now have a op monster
i got her when she came out
atleast i can try to rank her up
To avoid any confussions by the 2 images, this is the right one with Galante as one of the jokers
I’m glad they changed it. Wouldn’t have bred pierceid if it was Galante jr
Same
First try
noice
Same
I heard elite monsters will be used as jokers in the upcoming VIP breed event. Would someone be able to confirm (with a ss ideally)?
@mortal plinth nobody can confirm as that is a leak
Thank you 🙏🏻
@red fog
Someone on our team said this was a cheat. U dont see how. Do you know?
I dont see why
Airplane mode to see what you breed
I dont see the issue since nothing changes the outcome
Yeah it’s locked in. You just see what the breed is.but I’ll stop in the future and I’m sorry if it was cheating
Idk if it is or not. Since it doesn't alter anything I dont think it matter but I dont know
I’d like to apologize anyway
No worries👌
@red fog
@fickle blade
How the heck is doing that cheating?
You’re not changing the outcome or anything
I agree, a team mate said it was. I dont see the harm because nothing changes
Also, it's all over discord
Got a lil lucky
@red fog
Wut
Turn off your wifi and your data.
When you see the "no-connection" sign, you're good
Well, I didn't have thorder. I guess I'll have to breed tartarus and try during maze. Don't want to miss another breeding event
I'm so mad... I spent over 100 gems on the breeding event and these people are getting Pierced on the first try or two in a row. Why social point!? 😫😫😫😫😫😫😫😫😫
@sinful narwhal dont spend gems
Use hord them and buy a monster chest cell chest herioc orbs
I dont use gems on breeding anymore
Wow
Everyone seems to be getting lucky
But I'm not 😂
But yeah
Don't waste your gems on these events
everyone here is sending screenshots of their successful breeding while i am having trouble >:C
not cool dudes
What am i doing wrong?
Nothing
You're just unlucky
Damn... I already used more gems. I spent around or more than 130 gems... And go nothing. This game sucks...
Yeah, I gave up using gems on breeding events. I still try the few times I can without using gems to speed things up but that’s it. The chance it just to low. They should change it so that you get increasing chance every time you fail. That way even when your unlucky you will eventually get one. Then after you breed one it resets back to the minimum chance.
:"")
should i get violet or galante jr?
@torn mesa violet
mk
@loud ether not sure if it matters at all but I try to put breeding monsters in order they appear in the event add, if that doesn’t work I flop them around. I’m sure this doesn’t actually help but one more thing to try.
16th try... nothing... i hate my life
I have 32 straight attempts without getting the target monster over the last 4 special breed events.
😡
Must be nice
F
In fast try got him😁
How high do you think is the chance to get pierceid?
I got her so it must be higher than usual
20 times. 20 fricking times. You cant be serious social point
its ok social point i forgive you i might of gotten her
i spent more than 200 gems
22 tries
It really is just luck, but dont give up. And using gems gives you more chances but it is really un- necessary. Good luck guys 👍
😳
200 gems for 1,650 maze coins (22 tries * 75) is not bad. You would have had to do 33 PvP wins to get that many coins.
If you were perfect on spins then it would not be worth 200 gems. But as we know the odds of that is insanely high. It comes out to an average of 6 re-spins per win.
Hence why I am doing this breeding event. Elemental cells and maze coins.
You literally bought almost a day and half of work with 200 gems
Vadamagma and thorder are breedable, they're easy to get.
At last after few trys
got friking thorder
same
2 months to get lucky in an event
Anyone know when vip breeding starts?
@keen tartan 27th
Thank you
@warm knoll 😂😂
Nice
Ok SP you win. 34 tries and not a single targeted legendary. Imma stop even trying to breed the anymore. Too frustrating.
Where's my piercid ? 😭
August so nice to me, 😋
i thought its just a myth to get a legendary in a breeding event.🙄
I only breed for coins tbh
it is still cool man
At least you’ve gotten 1800 coins?
nope
e
im curios, did SP remove the parent result in bredding events
No
so someone is still getting vadamagmas
I got Thor
oof
No one has most of those monsters lmao. Who has Petro loa or octex or Kulkan
i have octex
I don’t : (
How the heck were you able to get octex?
idek know where i got him from tbh
@river sundial he was in a maze a few years ago
Those monsters are just available now at the Shop . . . Some for 230 gems because of the Monster week offers . . . They haven't been out for a long while since they're not recent monsters
Use of these monster??
Should i make it ready for next breeding event
Or should i buy this
The Jokers are a good gem investment, they replace some of the parent monsters during breeding event.
And yes, if you can afford to buy the jokers do so. Well worth it in the long run.
I just got a 2nd legend breeding at the moment. And already got 1 Pierceid after 3x try and with the help of Jokers to complete the combo.
By the way, is there advance info on who will be needed for the ViP breed?
Amoung 3 which should i buy?
Well guys 28 attempts 1 attempt was thorder and now with my final chance I got a legendary.
@warm knoll actually rigged haha
thanos
@grizzled canopy Galante > Violet > galante jr.
You gonna wait to breed it out before telling who or you gonna off wifi it?
@past vine thanks a lot
Opps sorry that last bit was for Michael. 😀
That sad moment when you never bred thorder and now can't breed pierceid
@past vine YOU ARE A GENIUS
I tried 18 times got all epics. My teammate apparently waited till the end of the
breeding event and bred twice 1 epic 1 pierceid. I am the most unluckiest person in the whole entire universe. And I wasted 300 gems for nothing
I also bred thorder and vadamagma just be4 the event and also skipped the breeding temple.
Vip breeding should be tomorrow, get ready for more heart break 👌😝😍
At least you can breed a couple of em 😀👌
What are the breeding combos?
i am so mad i got both breeding parents in the pierceid breeding event
something is messed up social
29 tries for nothing?
Is anyone confident in the vip breeding combos, I wanna either go for another Pierceid for maze coins or try save for vip if possible
Pierceid is over fren
Oh u rite
@grizzled canopyTomorrow
But they announced today only it start
Today it will be on, I believe.
Probably after 40 minutes it will start
Lets see
It is live
What are the monsters for Zyla?
Can i use greedy dragon and joker?
Gee, rares not even epics for cells 😜
I know right
At least we could have gotten elemental cells from the epics🙄
I wish they would name the monsters required for breeding. Those pics are too little to make out some of them, at least for me.
Agreed Emmy
can we get elite parents ?
we need another 5 elite cells breeding
i think you might get elite parents if you use them in the breeding
Does joker increase chances?
no
First try
everyone that is first trying is making me depressed

No luck on the last breeding event but now I got zyla on first try😃
Joker combo or both parents?
Just to clarify, if you use Elite monsters as a parent, you cannot get them as an outcome. The other parent monsters can be bred, but the Elites can't.
That sucks

Wish I was that lucky on my first attempt
Is it petro loa for zyla??
how to get Kulkan?
How long do those breedings work?
I have a feeling, RNG left for holidays during this event
Total of 5 tries, both of them. Never happened in my game experience.
Are the odds the same if you use the joker combo?
They are yes 🙂
0 for 7, 2 epics and 5 rares
Anyone else getting alot of rares? Now 0 for 8 trying for kaith with 3 epics and 5 rares
Me too, lots of rares .. and that stupid rares which Need a day to Hatch..
Are elite parents breedable theough this?
No
Thanks for the quick answer
can you replace either parents with the corresponding elite monster? or just one?
Just the one.
good to know, thanks 🙂

How long do these breedings work?
🤔
I think under 5 days.
At least legendary
7th try🙂
<--- dying from envy 😳
welp i might of got a v.i.p monster (dont remember his name)
first try
guess i got the luck after pierceid
:C
Fingers crossed
Can i use an elite monster for any of the monsters?
Like gorg and arch knight?
I don't think so
What do y’all think of Scarr the Outcast,
He’s mediocre
10k gold
I remember using only him when we had the VIP dungeon years ago, did the job
You get yourself 250 maze coins at least 
welp got 1st try scarr. if only i would've been able to do the same with the pierceid event.
7th try
3rd try
bruh i got both scarr and hiroim
guess now my luck is working
not cool social i wanted pierceid
Foof
?
Doesn’t matter
Bred 10 times and still no Zyla...
Who?
Isnt it sad that when pierceid breeding comes out it was impossibly hard to breed her
Anyone know what the breeding time would be for a VIP if you don’t have the breeding guardian active
Just like any legendary
1 day and 22 hours
These breeding events are getting ridiculous. Between this one and Perceived I’ve missed 20 times now. With all the long time to hatch but useless Rares you get these days it’s really spoiling the game and taking the fun out of it knowing it’s so stacked against you and just a constant gem burn.
And the rares Need 1 day to Hatch...
I don't spend gems on breeding events. Lots of free stuff that way
Depressed
I’ve got Pierceid in one try but taking forever in this vip one ...
I have gotten lots of Eggnocks and Hedgys 
Make an army of them rares and epics
Pretty fun getting epics for VIP breeding event to farm elemental cells but this breeding event I haven't gotten my ideal epic for farming 
how long does it take to breed a legend in a event without the breeding island

911 why this number
Math.
1 day 22 hrs - 80% = 9hrs 11 mins
14 breedings 10 epics and 4 rares . Breeding events are becoming more and more boring. But I desperately wanted a valgur
congrats

and water cells
Are you sure it isn't an epic?
1 day 22 hrs is a legendary @spare halo
Getting a parent would honestly be a better result
Only if the elites were breedable
Any parent is better than a vip
@fickle gulch breeding a parent is still only 75 coins sadly
The new breeding event has maze coins in the background, but it says nothing about getting maze coins for breeding.
Do you get maze coins or no?
yes i got 75 coins from fail attempt
can you breed singularis? or was it ultrabot i was thinking of
ultrabot
Same
I failed this flash breeding event. Gg
well you a vip so idk wym when you say you failed
@ripe sail separate events for seperate monsters
oh right okay
yeah pretty much.
When does new breed event start?
According to the Calendar, on Friday
Do we know the combo with for Friday
Nope.
I usually get epics 70% breeding Lord of Atlantis and during race I'm getting maybe 1 every 12 breeds, anyone else noticing it's hard to get epics? If not what combo are you using?
ty @undone field
@long zenith It is leaked but it may change
Ok ty
Hey is it lord moltus and galante jr for the joker combo?
Taiga and Galante Jr
:emoji_52:
:feelsderp:
I got double too, but rare😂
Weird flex but ok
^^^tryna get attention?
Here is DETENTION
What
not yet
Nothing now
After an hour a new event will most likely start

When is the event actually starting
I don't know
I see in the news an offer to buy Pixelion and Metalhead
But I didn't see the quest yet
🤔
same @fickle blade
someone has a good breeding for me pls?
W
Sooooo should we start breed or not....?!
What
is it live ?

I have metal head and pixelion🤪
I thought the breeding event started so I actived the breeding dungeon
Funny
Positron is not in Monstagram either
WHERE IS POSITRON
We have been waiting for hours
Does quests like this need to be anticipated to bore the players out
maybe read his skillset again
I saw

But this thing has been taking so long
Like what's even going on
Bye I gotta play some other game that doesn't waste your time brb
Lol
Positron quest is now live!
#announcements please 😄
Why are metal head and pixelion always in breeding events?
Because most people have them.
You can extract the spare one for cells to rank her up
How much cells gives a lvl 100 monster ?
screech
Very cool. I got the 15 cells and the quest key. That's amazing.
Wow For the past breeding events couldn’t get anything
yea
Finally got a legendary, don't know who it is but I gotta wait. Took 2 tries, I had bad luck on the other breeding events but got lucky for this one.
Congrats 
: D
Lucky 😦
@desert hornet dont be sad, you may get lucky too
Idk about that i only have 1 more try
yEEt
Instead of being jealous why not be happy for the lucky people?
^
niceee
any info on the back to school breeding
yep
what
pm me i’ll show you
School breeding? What is it?
Any info for the back to school breeding event
Tomorrow
@fickle blade it’s Saturday not tomorrow
I thought its friday 😂
buy lottery ticket. win best prize 👌
@ornate ember can you show me ?
Stop flexing @indigo trellis
Weird flex but ok
EPICbreeder bred a legend
Well I simply bread 13 epics, I guess it could be worse
Bred 8 epics before i got that lol😂
This breeding event was a failure for me
So yeah
Congratulations to everyone who was lucky
Same
same
Same
u got 3legendaries yet youre sad
i already had the baroness thats why im kinda mad
elemental cells
@warm knoll how many epics did You get?
something like 14?
but why did the event end 40 minutes before?
i tried breeding one last time in the last 40 minutes
and it didnt accept
?
so gems all in like 400?
or more?
48 for breeding guardian and like 40 for skips
What is even the point in these breeding events, for tha last two, 15 breedings each, I got a bunch of epics and rare, not a single legendary
Yes
Last breeding event I was like 0/20 attempts. This time I was 4/23. All 4 were targeted legends. 😅
Back to school breeding event .. starting time??
In 20 minutes
anyone know how to get a legendary by using common lever r
You can’t. check pinned messages to see the combos
pl
First try omg
Congratulations
Lol
Does the Galantes work for both the monster in the combo it's next to, or just the monster it's on top of?
Just the monster it is on top of.

Guy where can i find joker combos
In the event bar
Gl
GL
someone has 5 positron cells xd
If u join my team yea
Recent breeding outputs I forgot to post :v
Nice teashire bro!
nice
any info about next breeding event?
thx
Nice thunder eagle
Lmao nice
nice donaturtle
lol i Always bad luck at events
When’s this top breeding event coming anyway
What’s the max gems I should spent for maze coins? Getting zunobia to R3 and trying to rank clipium from the breeding event?
gg
Breeding event give also legendaries? Never seen one....
i gemmed (sorry for my english) on epics 8 times no legends so far reeee
Your English is fine 😃
My latest epic from breeding, hoping I can get Clipeum once
Is clipeum even good?
Yes
Lol I gemmed like 23 times and all were epics, even worst my girlfriend got clip on first try 😂
The hell
Got bunch of maze coins tho
Rip
Oh I see now thank you
I never got the intended monster in an unchained breeding
Annnnnnndddddd another cryotan
What are you getting cryotan from
Mmmm, when will another vip breeding events?


@lusty coral nice thunder eagles you got there

@limpid geode thanks 
Gratz
(:

How many maze coins I need for borjok?
Pinned on #maze-islands
Kek
Wish I had more luck with breeding events, fingers crossed 🤞 this time
i'm never lucky
The Lord of Atlantis and Galante combo does not seem to be working
I got 75 coins for the violet and Vada combo but no coins for the Lord Atlantis and Galante combo. It also resulted in just a C and UC. Not working as intended?
The same here - Lord with Galante is not working! No 75 coins!
See #bugs-reporting It's being looked into 🙂
uhhh what is the "top monster breeding event"?
These are the right breeding combos . . . Galante was changed for Galante Jr
You can also check in game
How many hours with 80% off??
9 hours 35 minutes is a L with 80% off 🙂
9hr11, you mean
👌
35m was with epic🤔
6 hrs '35' mins for epic so he mixed up the '11' and '35' 😄
Nop treied 6 times bad luck
No
Well well we’ll I don’t have luck breeding legendaries in the breeding event but hopefully I can get timerion for my last 2 tries and also I hope I get some legendaries for the next breeding event
No you didn’t 💃
Aaa
I got 46 hours when I bred them did I get Timmy
U got legendary but it could be parent @vivid lintel
Oh I hope it’s Timmy
I just got Timmy
U can turn off your wifi and then gem it and see what u got, then completely exit game and it won’t save
Yeah, I did it to find out
oh
It doesnt change anything
@north tendon good job on the breed but I see you using my pfp 
Wanted makugan though
Oo nice
@stoic dune im jealous
@harsh sorrel try this
Oh lol @warm knoll
ty so much that helped me alot
I wasn't successful in both Clipeum or Timerion, doubt I'll be successful on this one either
LOL I GOT ANOTHER LEGENDARY LOL
Im trying for makugan and saulot
i got either sunblast or that other monster
or a parent
beledig
got sunblast barney
Someone has the names of the monsters we need to use as breeding? I cannot tell who is who in pictures. Thanks
You can see who they are as they are on sale rn
1/3 to R3 :O
Thank u Stallone’s
I got sunblast and sunblast or beledig
Got Sunblast. I wanted him the most
What dinos do I breed to get more legendarys
Monster lol
I see people posting breeding logs that show breeding commons while doing a breeding event. Is there a strategy for this?
If you mean the thunder eagle ones
These are for the maze event
Since the coins refresh every 4 hours, thunder eagles take 4 hours to breed and 4 hours to hatch
A good way to keep track of your maze coins collection and a good way to get your maze coins from hatching and breeding
why does my luck suck so much
😡😡😡
anyone know any epics that you can breed to get legendaries
@waxen prism pinned messages
It be like that sometimes
Nice thunderbirds
Nice thunderbird
Same @tribal garden
I never had any luck on some of these breeding events
hi um i dont know what epics to breed toget legenary
@waxen prism look at pinned messages here on this channel. 👌🏻
Can you breed all of those Just for an spezial Time?
How can you breed darkzul and lord atlantis
Search it on google
Any information on sundays breeding event
Yeah
Ultrabot+Lord Moltus
Aww man i cant get
No he probably means he doesn’t have one of the monsters
Formula for breeding blob?
From step one like how do I obtain the epics
Then which epics
Hint - see the SS above
hint - listen to @ AmStExXeRpT#1895
Hint I AM NEW so I don't know how to breed the epics
@rough storm look pinned pictures with recipes for breedable monsters. or google ML breedable epics/legendaries.
you usually need rare monsters with right elements to have high chance to breed epics
any information on the capitalize breeding
when does al canine breeding starting?
Now
10 minutes ago
Will the vip breeding be for only nox the condemned or for all vips
all vips probably
What do you use to breed vortux the rare?
common metal and cmmon dark for 30% chance.
there is written you can breed all 9 VIPs, but on the picture you can only see 8 combinations. Zyla is missing. What’s happen?
she's in the maze
I believe the 9 is a typo. Zyla isn't available because she's in Master of Paths
can a rune go down a level?
Hi so annoyed
And shes not in it
so lv 10 runes cant go down
Quite literally my first breeding attempt
@maiden pebble at least with the MoP it gives you a better chance at getting close to Zyla instead of the 5 or so percent you have to begin with
Nice breeding event
ty for the vip br pic bell
What’s a good way to have a nice chance of getting a legend from a breeding event?
@gloomy fox use joker combos
Well,good thing I have galante and violent
Nice.👌
2nd try
do we know the flash breeding combos?
@crimson crest Lord of the Atlantis and Rockantium for the flash breeding
okay thanks
Excuse me is this thing bugged?
Got another nox
One for me 
lucky
anyone got any information for devastress quest?
breeding combo, monsters available
sent in pm
No combos but the monsters are devastator gelotron and Bo tai
only monsters
Thorder and Vadamagma is the leaked combo
Grrrrr 3 pairs breeding round #4 and nothing
3×4=12.....= bad luck
Anyone else with prob. Breeding mystery/Mr. Flaky Wolfgang/Goran and metalhead/worker Hulk and nothing
guys what do we need for halloween breeding ??
Nice thunder eagle
nice
oog
😁 😁
So what are the chances with joker combinations? I have all the combinations but dunno if I’m better of with lord of Atlantis + rocktanium or LOA + joker & Rock + joker. If I’m actually getting twice the chances with the jokers than it’s obvious but if not...🤷♂️
you dont get twice the chances
I’ve hatched 22 epics in the last 4 days 11 hours... not having much luck
I mean twice the chances by having both hatcheries running combos instead of just one
This is my result:
What’s the two monsters needed for Devastress Quest Breeding?
^^^^ yes
Vadamagma and thorder
FYI - for jokers it should be Galante and Vadamagma or Violet and Thorder. There is a published graphic that is backwards from what is in game.
it doesnt matter which one is first 🙂
Don’t have much “luck” in breeding events anyway, but seem to hit more often when I DON’T use jokers, which is just the opposite of published “odds” I think
In any case, I don’t use gems to speed up, too expensive for such a small chance...
Anyone else been lucky? Got 2 for 2..
Ok so I have heard conflicting stories... For the breeding even which joker replaces throder and which one replaces vadamagma?
I got bo tai, but at least I got one :l
Finally after 4 months a ledgendry
1st try
:(
You got hookuai as your first legendary!?! Usually I have to pretend that the legends new players have got are decent because I’m not just gonna call there monsters trash but honestly... hookuai is one of the best in the entire game!
success

@fickle blade what the actual heck? I got Block heart as my first and you got the best attacker in the entire game?
I got darkzgul 
what are the actuall posibilities of breeding teeranok and musu to get a legendary
because on the pinned messages it shows you can get a legendary by breeding them
Got dungeon master as my first legendary
@waxen prism 10% chance
What is the chance of a Legendary during breeding?
Breed two fire legendary but fire lion has low chance
It’s any two legendaries and it’s a 1% chance to breed one of the 3 original commons
@lethal wolf
@proper quarry who did you use?
@fickle blade he was talking in general not breeding I think
What? No, I got her from gems lol, monsterwood take @fickle blade
Was listing it because a few others just said their first.
Guys...Is there gonna be a mephisto breeding event or something?
yes @velvet gust
wait wrong thing lol
Heyy
I just found out I have a Bo Tai that I just bred. Breeding event ends in 4.5 hours. I'm wondering if it's worth spending 49 gems to get the egg onto hatchery to get the devastress cells and quest key. How hard are Survival Dungeons? Do you need level 100 mons to have a reasonable chance of finishing those? Currently my mons are level 71.
Hey. There's no way to revive your monsters in the Quest Dungeon of Devastress?
@hazy wagon rez skills from individual monsters count though, right?
Yes they will work, assuming they're used in the same battle a monster dies
@oak iris Yes, you need level 100 monsters with reaaly good runes to finish the survival dungeon
what magic monster can revive
There isnt any @ornate ember
Is it normal in survival dungeon for a defeated monster for the AI to be at full health and fighting after retrying a node?
it’s never been like that before @south talon
On the second to last node the guy in the middle who hits like a truck says deceased over his name and is grayed out but is still fighting and has full health on re-attempts after I have killed him but lost the fight
it may be a bug
No
The chances are the same as always
I think 10% chance
Might be wrong
But definitely not 100%
@fickle blade @fickle blade @slim holly it’s a 3% chance
Ah I c
@ornate ember really?
Where does it say this?
i seen it when they rolled it out w while ago or maybe i seen someone else say that
This is my idea for a bleeding event
That's my idea for a bleeding event
And yes I made it
does anyone have a list or a larger pic of who to breed i dont see well and my pic on my tablet is so small i cant make out who to breed. ty for taking the time to read and also if you respond
What you mean
the names or a larger pic of who to breed
i can make out the first one its nem and arc knight i believe
This breeding one
yes ty thats a little bigger so i can see violet and jr
